From Runway to Reality Check: The ANTM Exposé (w. Cycle 2 winner Yoanna Margaret)

Hi, I'm Danielle Robé, host of Bookmarked The Podcasts by Reese's Book Club. And this week on Bookmarked, we're basically hosting the Ultimate Girls Night. Reese Witherspoon, Jennifer Garner, Judy Greer, Rita Wilson, and Gary Rice and Author Laura Dave. These are the women behind season two of the Apple TV series The Last Thing He Cold

Me. Talking about turning a book into a hit show. And what it really takes to bring a story to life.

The most important metric for me is do I want to share this book with somebody.

“That's what creates community and that's the main thesis of our book club and why we started”

it was just to connect people together. Listen to the bookmarked by Reese's Book Club podcast on the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcast. This is a special agent, regal, special agent, Bradley Hall. In 2018, the FBI took down a ring of spies working for China's Ministry of State Security,

one of the most mysterious intelligence agencies in the world. The sixth bureau podcast is a story of the inner workings of the MSS and how one man's ambition and mistakes opened its fault of secrets. Listen to the sixth bureau on the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.

A shocking public murder. This is one of the most dramatic events that really ever happened in New York City politics. A screen get down, get down, those are shots.

A tragedy that's now forgotten and a mystery that may or may not have been political

that may have been about sex. Listen to Worshack, murder at City Hall, starting on March 25th on the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. People who didn't do what John of God wanted them to do, they usually disappeared. John of God was once Brazil's most famous spiritual healer, but in this limited series

podcast, we uncover the darker truth behind his global empire of faith and fear. From exactly right and a lonely media, this is too faced, John of God. Listen on the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. Movies can make you feel, make you dream, sometimes they even make you appreciate our architecture, who's been hotter, in a doorway, than a list of a tailor?

That's the kind of analysis you'll find every week on dear movies I love you, the new podcast from the exactly right network. Every Tuesday, we break down the films we're crushing on from blockbusters to deep cuts. Listen to dear movies I love you on the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.

Welcome to brief recess, I'm Michael Flitt. I'm Melissa Mabranch.

“Today we're going to be talking about whether or not you should put your likes or say”

in the dishwasher. We should not. Show it to you. Talk about all the cleaning ladies who are also camp girls, Pablo Escobar, Zua Animals, punch the monkey, black market needos, an interview with Yolano from America's next

hot model cycle to the winner about the new documentary on Netflix and the news, and all your questions from our DMs. Just a quick shout out. If you want to please watch us on YouTube, it's a great place to check out the show. You can see all the bronze are wearing that week.

And if you like the show of like the videos, get online.

I finally made social media pages for this podcast, so it really is me behind them posting

every day. Totally, Michael. So it's not me. We can afford like the guy who does that for us, so it is me. So subscribe to brief recess on our YouTube channel and check out those videos and feel

free to leave comments. We really are reading the comments. Yes. So check it out. Use the same pen every.

Ten to steal pens. But you did.

“You almost gave me the Haitian mother look.”

What's she saying? Yeah. Melissa does this face when she's about? Well, it's not. It's not.

It's her imitation of her mother, by the way. Yeah. Who? My mom. I grew up in a household where you got your SB.

And when she would get mad and she was about to hit me if she was sitting, she would always wait. I'm going to do it for you. After bending down together, too. She's slowly bending down with this work.

But like with the eye contact. About to whip a sandal at you. Yes. A slipper. It was always a slipper.

They were called Bata and they were like leather at the bottom and the top and the the song part of it was they came in like multiple colors.

Whatever, I say something crazy, Melissa gives me the book. I know that. I know that look. I know I'm in trouble. Let's get into a sidebar.

Let's talk about what's going on, what's happening this week in our life. So many things. Yeah. Because I said something earlier because something's going on in the lighting in this studio.

And I just have to speak to it because every time we come to the studio, they have a different lighting set up. And it's almost as if I looked hideous the week before. This is how I perceive it that's like, oh wow, it was so bad last week that we actually we flew in a specialist from Canada who created this new light fixture.

It's kind of finally no satellite you are so self-absorbed.

So it's so it's all about you at all times. And number the other thing is, do you think, do you imagine, could I say this to Andre

“all the time when I tell him to wear something like something like that?”

Sure. In what world does it make sense for me to tell Andre to wear something that he's going to look stupid in? Yes, yeah. In what world does it make sense that I let you go out look like a nut job?

True. That's true. Right. Would you let me look? Would you let me look crazy?

No. Never. Yeah. I don't know. I don't know.

I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't like it. Tell you.

I knew it. We have to reset. I'm sorry. I am paranoid, but not, sometimes the paranoia is right. Like a broken clock is right twice a day.

I'm afraid for you. I'm going to bronze or on the mic. I'm going to work on. Okay. So, if you know what is the lighting is different.

We have to break. We have to break. He has to break. He has to break. Sorry.

It throwing things around. He threw a slipper. He threw a slipper. And now the lighting. But again.

No, I know. You are one of the few friends who's not like, oh my god, I do look great. And I look hideous. You will be like, take that off right now. Yeah.

Or you'll be like, we got to, you've got something on your face. Yeah. Let's reset. Let's do it. Let's reset.

What's that in your teeth? Be that friend. Be that friend for someone at least have one person in your life who can do it. No. And you know.

Especially, we do stuff together, I know, and I wouldn't, I don't even think I'd be able to like, look at you and not mention the thing that's not right. I feel like, no, that's a big black schmutz on your face. You don't have a poker face, and every thought is on, don't ever go to Vegas. No.

You'll lose because, yeah, every emotion is right there on your face.

“I mean, I had been known to hold it back, but like, why should I bother with you?”

When someone's saying it like telling you something insane, you are really good at just kind of like, yeah, tell me a little bit more. Why don't you? Wow. Yeah.

That's crazy. Yeah. I don't get a text. My text from a little bit someone's something that's, this is what you say. Yo.

Yeah. That's why. Oh. And that's the text I got. Yes.

It's never like, hey, my goal.

Here's something that's going on. I know. No. There's some fuck shit as happening when I get yo. And I'm like, drop everything.

Here we go. The teeth. Yeah. It's piping. So the yo is like yo.

I need to brace myself.

“So and so has said something that is, so do you remember?”

There was a moment. So I don't know people, people must know this, right? Michael and I used to work together. And I remember we were reading something that somebody who is a professional writer had to remember this, had sent us and I looked at it.

And I started throwing things across the room. I was living, like I cannot believe that this person makes this amount of money. And this. That's what we've got. That's what we've got.

Oh my god. I was so, and Michael had to like talk me down. He was just like, listen, it's fine. Well, fix. Now I'm like, I don't want to have to fucking fix it.

That's her goddamn job. That's a really difficult. I was so mad. You get so, yeah, there's other things you've been totally insensed by recently. Recently, we're living in the world.

It's the world.

But yeah, there are sometimes things and it's never with you.

I've noticed this about you. It's never. It's the roast malice hour. It's not the roast, it is, it's the Doctor Phil show. It is psychologically, I noticed what happens with you.

What is it? It's never the horrific thing, and it's not, it's not like headlines. It's always like the straw that broke the camel's back. And you fixate on the one little stupid thing and you get so mad about that. And I know that whenever you're upset about that, it's because of the year of bullshit,

Well, I was just choking it back.

And then someone coughs and doesn't cover their mouth. And you get out of glock. And the AR is, and it really is, yeah, murder on the dance floor. Do you think that? And then she keeps their car.

Do I think what?

“Do you think that that is a tourist trait, I think that it is?”

You told me once you were like, I was mad at my dad for something and this was a hundred years ago. You were mad at your dad or I was mad at my dad. I was mad at my dad. You were like, Michael, you have to say something, because you and I are the same, we're

both toruses. It's come up on toruses, and yeah, buckle up. But these are two days apart. Yeah. And you said, you need to say something to your dad.

Otherwise, you'll be at the dinner table and you'll just explode. You'll do that service. What's her name? God. God, you heard from housewives, where she throws the table.

Yeah. You try to be, what do you like? Do you dice? Are you ready to be? What is the reason?

Yes. Yeah. And you're right.

You do just kind of have to say something.

You do. But it is a tourist trait, where we hold it in. I do hold it in. And we wait and wait and wait. And then it's that one time my husband loads the dishwasher wrong and he puts the like

for sayings. Melissa. Melissa. No. Yes.

No. No. And he's being brought up on work crime. The Hague, like it's actually so bad. Okay.

So now I'm wondering, what did you not teach him? Melissa, this is the state of education in America. I cannot be left at my feet. You can't lay that at my feet. I'm not going to lay all of it at your feet, but I am going to lay your husband, putting

in the loquezette, in the dishwasher at your feet. And everyone learns in different ways. Right? We have visual learners. We have people who need to be beaten with--

Brad, why are you doing that? I bring it up every time.

And he says, it takes two seconds to wash this.

Yeah. It's the size of the Buick. For sure. To put that in the dishwasher, you can't put anything else in there. It's a one night only engagement.

We've got just the lacrosse cycle going now. And it's not going to clean it. We like burned macaroni in that. It's not coming out. That is an elbow grease situation.

It is an elbow grease. It's a dawn. That saves the ducklings from the oil spills isn't even going to be able to. No. You need like a Carmen's keeper, whatever that one is.

Yeah. Yeah. The barman's keeper. We need that. Yeah.

Yeah. I feel like there's a fabulous so equivalent. No. Okay. Not for that.

Okay. I had to tell Andre many times that he can't put cast iron in the dishwasher. That is actually wicked. He was--and he was just like, why not? He's like, it's nice.

It takes the black out. It comes out like brown. It's a rust babe. That's rust. He doesn't do any more.

He's learned. He's learned. But it took a while. Mm-hmm. Yeah.

“The thing is, is that I think what's happening in our houses, we alternate night's”

of dishes. So if you walk the dog, you fold the laundry and start to get the bedroom ready. Okay. If you do the dishes, you tidy up the living room and hang up the coats. Wait, why don't you hang it up your own coats?

Every night you square. You're not going to answer me. No, I'm not. Okay. So you guys come in and just throw the coats on the floor.

And you know what? I don't owe you any answers. I do. I disagree. I'm asking you a question.

You should provide me with an answer. If, during the course of a day, there's like the clothing chair. You don't have a clothing chair. It's the chair you throw all your clothes in that. Like I have like a basket, but yes, it's the same thing.

Thank you. Thank you. We're not throwing them. I mean, sometimes on the floor. But not, I worried that it's like the bench by the door we throw away.

I mean, Andre, every, every day, every day. I cut to you in me in divorce court. Like, the two of us are not going to, that's not going to make it. It's not even, it this point is like, well, I just sort of like pick it up now. But Andre, underwear socks t-shirt on the floor in a pile.

Every single hair is it off. Just what, you know what? Yeah. And some days, it do be like that. Whatever.

Some days, we've got to rip your clothes up. It's, if it's August, there's full day. It's full day off of me. But it's every day. Yeah.

No, it's every day. I love that, though. That is like, I think that's great. Do you?

“Yeah, I think it's so liberating and so freeing.”

It's very like upstate commune of him. I love that. It is very much like flower crown energy. Maybe. But I just think, you know, he think there's a magic fairy who comes in to pick up.

That's, oh, this is what I want to tell you. Sorry, speaking of picking up things. I'm sorry. It's all going to make so much sense. Okay.

So, um, I finally caved. Okay. And we have a cleaning person. You do. I love it. Support an immigrant community like I love that. I do know it's an immigrant.

Well, I'm, that's actually great. Thank you for clocking my privilege. Not assuming we had a white cleaning lady growing up. But wait, no, she was Polish. So she was an immigrant.

So yeah.

She is. Okay. Yeah. You fucking bitch. Fuck you.

She is.

“But I just wanted to make a white man uncomfortable for a second.”

You know what to do? You know what to do?

I just wanted to make a white man uncomfortable for a second.

Which means with the accountability, I admitted it. But yeah. It's so nice to like just have a clean place and everything is where it's supposed to be. So that's great. And also, you know, a friend of mine was saying, and you're also hiring somebody.

You're helping putting money into the economy. All that is really true. There is a part of me though that feels guilty about it. Like, it's just the two of us. And Arthur, recently.

There is no reason why the two of us together cannot clean our own place. So the guilt isn't about having someone clean up after you. It's the guilt is over. Like, you feel like you fail. No, no, no, the guilt is the guilt is.

Why do I need someone to clean my home? I am capable of cleaning my home. I feel like I'm not going to do it very well. Like, it's. The apartment right now is as clean as it's going to get with my efforts.

And it's not very clean. Mm-hmm. Isn't that clean or is it messy? It's not clean. Oh.

Like, I'm not like taking a Saturday to like scrub everything and mop and sweep. Okay. Okay. I'm not doing that. Okay.

So I think that's where that is for me. Okay. But for you, you're feeling like I should be doing this. I should be doing this. There are already things that I don't do like I don't really do laundry.

We send our laundry out. Mm-hmm. And I don't even take it to a place. They come to my house and they pick it up and drop it back. Just have a feeling.

Do you feel the way about that though? I think we're great about that. Yeah. We had it. Okay.

So in our old apartment every time the cleaner would come. And it was like once a month or every other month.

The outlet in our bedroom was like always unplugged.

Whatever they plugged in in.

“And Brad and I were like, is she like filming in the bedroom or something?”

It was like always content. I was like, is she like, I don't know. I don't really know her. Like, I don't know if she's beautiful young woman. And I'm like, is she like filming?

Is she like a cam girl? Like, what is happening in the bedroom? And so I called Charmaine who knows everything. She's just like, I just have one of these friends. She's like, fuck down.

She's like, fuck down. Who knows that? Wikipedia. She's just as good. She was like, you're such a stupid idiot.

She's just like, she's kind of plucking the vacuum. I was like, oh yeah, that does make much more sense. Then she's moonlighting as a cam girl in my bed. Like, she's just like, she's like, you know what I'm saying? Shlangin and bangin while in my bed and then cleaning it up.

But why did I think of that? So the vacuuming does.

It was always in the bedroom.

And then I was like, all right. But instead, I was like, well, what was she doing? It's all true. Yeah. We just said boomer bangs that last week was the day.

It was so nice. But then I was like, you're right. There is only one outlet in the bedroom. And she probably just wasn't plucking the lamp back. Yeah.

That's so funny. Welcome to Dirty Rush. The truth about sorority life. The good, the bad, and the sisterhood. With your host, me, G.A. Judice, Daisy Kent, and Jennifer Cessler.

Rush, the recruitment, the ritual, the reality of Greek life, has been a mystery for those outside the sorority circles until now. Is it really a supportive sisterhood that's simply misunderstood? Or is there something more scandalous happening on campuses across the country? In this podcast, we pledge to feel back the layers and spell out the truth. One Greek letter at a time.

An actives, rush chairs, and ritual keepers. Some call it the best time of their life. While others say it's a nightmare. From a perfect rush to recruitment scandals, what is really going on behind the doors of those sorority houses from Alpha to Omega? We're taking you inside sorority row, including the chapter room.

As we explore the fellowship in the front of me, let's get dirty. Listen to dirty rush on the iHeart Radio app, apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

“Remember when you'd walk into your local video rental place, and there were always those two employees behind the counter are doing about movies?”

Well, that's us. I'm Millie de Cherico. And I'm Casey O'Brien, and now we're arguing about movies on our podcast, Dear Movies I Love You, from the exactly right now work. Can I say something about the criterion closet? Go ahead, dude.

They're letting too many people in there. Okay, that's another film right by got to. Sadly, that rental place doesn't exist anymore. It's probably a store that sells running shoes. Or an ice cream shop with an extra pee in an E at the end.

So consider us your slacker movie clerks in podcast form. I would like to establish a timeline of the moment you figured out who Channing Tatum was. Every Tuesday, we dig into the movies we can't stop obsessing over from hidden gems to big screen favorites. New episodes drop every week on the exactly right network. Listen to Dear Movies I Love You on the I Heart Radio App, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Hi, I'm Danielle Robe, host of Bookmarked The Podcasts by Reese's Book Club.

Reese Witherspoon, Jennifer Garner, Judy Greer, Rita Wilson, and Gary Rice and author Laura Dave. These are the women behind season two of the Apple TV series The Last Thing He Cold Me. We're talking about turning a book into a hit show and what it really takes to bring a story to life.

“The most important metric for me is do I want to share this book with somebody?”

That's what creates community and that's the main thesis of our book club and why we started it was just to connect people together. Listen to the bookmarked by Reese's Book Club podcast on the I Heart Radio App, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

China's Ministry of State Security is one of the most mysterious and powerful spy agencies in the world.

But in 2017, the FBI got inside. This is Special Agent Riggle, Special Agent Bradley Hall. This MSS officer has no idea the US government is on to him, but the FBI has his chats, texts, emails, even his personal diary. Here how they got it on the 6th Bureau podcast. I now have several terabytes of an MSS officer, no doubt, no question of his life.

And that's the Unicorn. No one had ever seen anything like that. It was unbelievable. This is a story of the inner workings of the MSS and how one man's ambition and mistakes opened its vault of secrets. Listen to the 6th Bureau on the I Heart Radio App, Apple Podcasts, wherever you get your podcasts.

10-10 shots five City Hall building. A silver 40 caliber handgun was recovered at the scene. From I Heart Podcasts and best case studios, this is Worshack, Murder at City Hall. How could this have happened in City Hall? Somebody tell me that! July 2003, Councilman James E. Davis arrives at New York City Hall with a guest.

Both men are carrying concealed weapons. And in less than 30 minutes, both of them will be dead. Everybody in the chamber is docked, a shocking public murder. A scream, get down, get down, those are shots, those are shots, get down. A charismatic politician, you know, he just bent the rules all the time.

I still have a weapon. And I could shoot you. And an outsider with the secret. He alleged he was a victim of flat down. That may have been not been political, that may have been about 6.

Listen to Worshack, Murder at City Hall, starting on March 25th on the I Heart Radio App, Apple Podcasts, wherever you get your podcasts. Let's continue our algorithm as shown. What's going on? What is it in your feed today? What's in your feed? We've been talking about my feed a lot lately.

“Have you seen punch the monkey at all? Has this like hit your feed at all?”

You were obsessed with the baby hippo. I love hippos so much. Melissa was obsessed with what was the name of it? Fiona. Her name was Fiona.

But did you didn't see Melissa's face of your listening to this?

I've never seen such empathy and like,

I have empathy. Heart felt warmth come on an expression from you. It's not true. It's not that it's uncommon. It's just it really shown through when you set Fiona.

You went Fiona. It's like the shoe gacy clay. So just generally I like hippos. I think they're really cute. She just like, okay, so more about Fiona.

Yes, but no, no. I just generally I like hippos. I think they're cute.

“I am well aware that they're not very nice.”

That they kill you just because they can. But I still, and they know what the best. Same. Right back at you talking to the woman who kicked a man on the subway.

And you're talking to me first and he had it coming.

Let the record reflect. He knows what he did. He knows what he did. But yeah, so I just happened to light them. And then there were like this new one that was born.

And she was so cute. She was so cute. She was so cute. And Chubby, her little ears were wiggle. And there are slimy little skin.

It was very cute. It was very cute. I even think the big hippos are cute. Oh, I think they're so cute. There's really nice.

Did you know that Columbia? Sorry. Pablo Escobar. I had like a whole zoo. Had a whole zoo.

Yes. And they didn't know what to do with it. He imported hippos. And then when she got back a Pablo, the hippos got loose in the wild and the jungles of Columbia, where they are breeding like rabbits.

Yeah. They're changing the infrastructure, the ecosystem and Columbia.

They have tours, Pablo Escobar's hippos.

The hippos are killing people, left and right. It's banana. Oh my god. I'm kind of all about it, though. I would do that.

That sounds kind of. I know. But they're not indigenous to Columbia. So it's actually really bad. Is it really bad?

It's very bad. Yeah. It's not like one of these like, oh, they're in a little bit more. And apparently, I think I read. It could be wrong.

But like, their scat is really toxic for the area. Oh, no. I don't know. But whatever. That's what I read.

And it makes me worry because it's like, there's really only one solution to that. You know what I mean? And I don't think it's like where we're, we're, we're airlifting hippos out. And like placing them in zoos.

“I don't think that's how I don't think that's story ends.”

And so there was this movement to get rid of them.

But the local, the people of the area who have now started to.

Make money off of this. They like, please do not do this. You know, send us directly back into poverty. Really fascinating. Interesting.

I know. I know. But do you imagine like, oh, I think I'm just going to get a zoo. And I'm going to get a, I'm going to know his architect. So punch the monkey.

Okay. It has gone viral. Okay. And I already ordered a shirt. It's okay.

It's going to get here in 46 weeks. It's being. It's going to be a hand embroidered. We talked about it already. Let me see what this goes ahead.

Look up the monkey. I'll look him up. So he's, he's very cute. And he is being bullied by all the other monkeys at this zoo. And I believe it's Tokyo, right?

See, Jay. Okay. Let me just say this. When you Google. I was like, what is this?

When you Google punch the monkey. And it comes up. Google sends hearts with a monkey in it. Did you know that? No.

There's a lot of support. Did you know that? I don't think so. I didn't know Google could do that. Neither did I, but it just did it.

Wow. That's weird. You know what though? I got to tell you. My cousin Erica loves monkeys.

I don't know how this was going. And we talk about this all the time about how I don't like monkeys. I don't like monkey. I'm not like. I'm monkey, girly.

They look too much like people. Yeah. I don't like that. And like once they turn around, they've got like gross butts. They've got like, like a bad boon butt.

The bad boon butt.

“But I think the bad boon butt is especially when they're in heat.”

I think. What? I think I think I think I think I think I think I think I think I could be more. Not even David Attenborough could narrate that into like a fun cute moment. I think I think that's what it is.

But I'm not sure. The bad boon butt. When a boon butt. In the bum, he would say bum. He would say bum.

He would write on his bum. So I, so punch is getting bullied by the other monkeys. Apparently, two days ago, he was making friends and fit in them. Okay, that is really, that's actually reassuring because it has kept my household up at night. Brad is deeply invested.

Punched the monkey finally, cut it by his peers.

After primate was abandoned by, I don't know what to do. But with the live coverage, it's a live feed. Oh, wait, wait. We've got crushed on almond poor being worded into the monkey tank. These are the questions that people ask in Google.

Is punched the monkey okay now? Well punched the monkey be okay. What's going on with punched the monkey? What is punched the monkey? I'm here again.

He does. I'm sure he does. And so he was being bullied. Finally, being accepted, it sounds like. But before then, he had a stuffed animal.

I see it. That he was self soothing with. Oh.

“So we won hearts and lives around the world.”

Yeah. And the zookeepers were sort of, and the zookeepers would come into feed the monkeys. And he would jump on the zookeeper shoulders. To kind of like, because didn't have any friends. He didn't have any friends.

Yeah. So that's been hitting my feed. He's very self. Go ahead. Now I'm looking at it.

God, damn it. See, now you're really invested. No, but it's sad. It's like looking at him sort of like cuddling with his plushy is weird. I mean, he makes me feel sad for him.

I saw one tweet that was like, I know that plushy smells ripe. It's disgusting. It's disgusting. I know that thing smells nasty. Anyway, go ahead.

Yeah. He's just been asking me to get her something. This like viral swishy squishy toy. It's like a stress ball. But it's, I forget what it's called.

Is it big? It's called Michael. Rude. Oh my god. I bet it's the toy store.

I'm trying to get my niece. This freaking swishy. Wait, there's like a, like a, there's the line. It's like a beanie baby line to get these stress balls for kids. They're called like something dough.

D.O. H. Nido. D.O. H. And the kids are going wild for them. And so my niece texted me she wanted one. So I've got a local toy store in my neighborhood that I was going to

Anyway, to buy a gift for someone. So it's like, oh, hey, do you have the needles? The woman rolled her eyes in my face. Did she scoff?

Yeah.

“Like I had just asked her for the hope diamond.”

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I was like, what? Like I was just Google. I didn't know that they were sold out. It was a simple bed.

No idea. Stupid. And then she spit on me. She said, get out. You had it coming.

And I was like, sorry. I didn't realize and she was like, you don't understand. The phone's been ringing off the hook all day asking for the needle. She's like, it's only five dollars.

It's basically a stress ball.

And I was like, okay, well, can I get one? And she was like, look, you clearly have no idea what's going on. Right. Right. Right.

So I focused on punch the monkey. Yeah. You don't know anything about what's happening in my world. Of children's toys. Sir.

And she said, why don't you come back tomorrow with cash? Shut up. Four one PM. She said, because the kids at the local public school get out for lunch around 12.45. One o'clock.

So she said, get here before them with cash. Because there's going to be a line out that out the door around 12.45. So you should go there before that.

“She said, you need to come here before them with cash.”

Yeah. Because the FedEx guy arrives between 11 and 3. So you can come back around 11 and try and see. And she wasn't willing to hold one for you. So I was like, oh, you know, did you try?

Yeah. And no dice. No dice. Wow.

I mean, she's got ethics and scruples.

Scruples. Good for her. Rarely are the words. We're both anymore. We go people don't have them anymore, Michael.

Scruples. So it's so interesting. She experienced. There was a so ham net. There was a trashy novel.

I read. That was cold scruples. And I think there was a favorite TV. Tolstoy. No, no, no.

Stop. No, no, no. Stop. How dare you. We hold on.

Let's put some respect on his name. So which size is Maddie want? There's a big. Well, that's the thing. I'm going to get whatever I can get my dirty little hands on.

And then she's going to be like, I don't know. Not one. She's like, that wasn't the one I was looking at. So, you know, I'm going to do my best as the fun uncle. And we're going to see what happens because I did call this morning.

And the woman took the phone off the hook at the toy store. So clearly, someone's people are harassing her. She's like, this bald lawyer keeps showing up and bothering me. So we're really going to see where that goes. I know there's more important things in the world.

Well, that. But it's so rare. And it was actually like kind of fun throwback for me. Waiting for like a Harry Potter book when a younger or Waiting for a beanie baby.

Did you have any babies? I was a beanie baby kid. How many beanie babies? Did you have a lot of them? Not like a lot, but I was like really excited.

It was like, you know, we would get excited about the shipment coming in. Like, would the new beanie baby drop? Mm-hmm. So I did kind of bring me back to the joys of my youth. Before I was a hardened criminal before this life of crime.

Mm-hmm. Before you got jaded. Yeah. This sort of hard knock life. Mm-hmm.

[laughter] Scrupels is a best selling 1978 novel by Judith Krantz. It follows the glamorous life of Wilhelmina Billy Winthrop, the owner of a high-end Beverly Hills boutique. Exploring themes of fashion.

Howlywood and romance. And there were two.

“I think there were like two made for TV movies about this.”

1978. I probably read this book when I was like 10. I should not have been reading this book. Yeah. But a lot of petty coats get lifted up.

Well, it's past. It's past. It's past. Yeah. Yeah.

Women's smell and my glove. Let's bring back petty coats in the word scrupels. I think that's our take from today. I think if I start using scrupels in court. Actually, I know one judge that would love for me.

Yeah. Yeah. You should. Yeah.

He's always commenting on my beer.

So I have appearances before this judge. Yeah. Why is he commenting on your face? Every time I see him, he's like, oh. You shaved.

Like, oh, you shaved. What a refreshing change. It's just an observation. And he's, um, it's never like good or bad. It's an observation.

Counselor, you have a beard. And I'm like, yes. I noticed. It's on my face. Yeah.

So we're very friendly. You and this judge. Yeah. But I did kind of have to throw down the goblin on him a little bit this week. Because it was, it was today.

It was this morning. Okay. So basically in America, we've talked a little bit about like bond proceedings. And I like people are just like languishing in the on detention centers. And basically judges are saying, like, we don't have to,

DHS, Trump administration are like making up rules. Where it's like, oh, if you're in this type of category and if you carry the one, and if you're wearing red on that day, you don't qualify for bond. Right. And it's just like this weird like back of the serial box maze that they're kind of creating.

But the judges, a lot of judges are like, oh, they're just kind of, I wouldn't say blindly, but they're agreeing and saying, oh, well, I don't have jurisdiction to sort of roll on bond anymore.

because I have scruples. I've been trying to get them on the judges on the record, saying that they don't have jurisdiction. And then I'm like, talking my hair behind my ear, tossing my hair. I'm just like, good.

I'm just like a nice blonde boy from Long Island, beard or no beard. Why don't you have jurisdiction? I don't get it. And they're like, oh, well, because like this rule. And I'm like, oh, okay.

And then I'm like, so if you don't have jurisdiction to rule on bond, I guess I'll file a rid of habeas, I guess.

Like, I don't know. This is my first day. I don't know how to do this.

Control on to lead. Like, I'm not sure what do I do.

“And they're like, yeah, like, I guess if you want to file a rid of habeas in state”

or in federal court, like you could do that, that is like what some counselors are doing. Meanwhile, I've read the entire practice manual on how this works. It's written by the ACLUps, the blasts out practice manuals when they're developing case law.

And so I know exactly what we're supposed to do. And I'm like, oh, judge, for that hearing that I'm going to have in federal court, could you maybe set an alternate bond? So I could tell that judge, if it weren't for your jurisdiction problem, you would assign this bond to Mount,

but you can't because you're not going to rule because you don't have jurisdiction. Give me like a plan B. And does that work? Sometimes it works. So sometimes they're like, oh, yeah, sure.

If we did have jurisdiction, it would be $2,000. Okay. And then I go to federal court and I'm like, it's $2,000. They said it's $2,000. I got them on the record saying alternate bond is to grant. If he had jurisdiction, so your honor in federal court,

rule in our favor that he should be released. And I can get him out for two grand. I already got him to commit to it. So that's how like the ACLU is advising practicing immigration attorneys to handle immigration judges who are like, I don't have jurisdiction.

So there's a little bit of insider baseball. Yeah. But it is like, I'm kind of having fun. I'm kind of enjoying it. Well, because you like messing with people.

Yeah. Yeah. I love just an illegal strategy. Like it's not even like being a shady bitch where I'm like manipulating people like it

until my everyday life. But then I'm in court. And I get to say it's legal strategy. Oh, that's really nice. So it's really fun to, you know, abide by the rules

and certainly within your favor. A certain legal strategy in the courtroom. And then go back to my life where it can be a manipulative slut. And you do that a very, very little mess. Yes.

Yeah. Speaking of your algorithm is showing. I feel like I don't know, Timothy Shalame getting canceled for the ballet opera. That actually, they're like mopping up his mess.

And someone was saying that a cost in the Oscar. Well, okay.

Here's, here's the thing.

I saw that. I also think when you say that that cost him the Oscar,

“I think it takes away from the person who actually won.”

Right? Like the interest to. Yeah. Yeah. Timothy Shalame was never on my mind for an Oscar.

I mean, so special enough for Marty Supreme. So it's really interesting that you're saying that that has not hit my algorithm. Almost that. I don't even know what it's about. I was at an Oscar viewing party and my friend.

Someone had to explain to me what was. What is it? It's about ping pong. Okay. And I said, that's all I need to say.

That's obviously, that's all I need to know. And so thank you so much. Where's the where's the Cudatay? Yeah. I said, please pass this.

There's the Chakudatay boy. Thank you for the Chakudatay. What does Oprah say? I love Chakudatay. Do you remember that?

She's like, I love it. But yeah, Timothy Shalame. I don't know. We're getting. I just don't care.

I don't. Do you know what I'm saying?

“Like in the bet, like not in a way that I host a thing.”

I just, not on my radar. You don't hope he dies in a fire now. I don't know. Me either. I just like, yeah, it was.

I just don't care. It's given his, it's given flop. It's given flop era. I think, and also, I will say, June 3. How many dooms do we need?

The dooms books don't get better as they go on.

Like the first one was fierce.

So I only bent the first one. Great. Third one. Huh? Why?

Who? Like it does get a little bit more wicked and wild. Uh-huh. So I feel like I hope who have the screenwriters are taking. No, they're not.

I hope they're taking it. I'm putting their, they're spin on it. No, I doubt it. Yeah, I give her a glow up. Especially if it's the same.

What I find is that. Many times, not every time. So calm down. But many times when there are, like, sequels of things. Yeah.

It just becomes more water down. Yeah. So more we get into it. Yeah. And now it's like, I'll say this.

What was it that I watched? Oh, masterful beasts or whatever. Oh, it's fantastic.

Yeah.

“I went into that full on Harry Potter person.”

Yeah. Really excited about it. I watched it. Yeah. Hmm.

Yeah. Don't know that I needed it. Yeah. And I'll go even further with the play. Oh, the play.

Yeah. So when I went to go see it, it was the two days. It was the two days. It was the two days. But it didn't do the two day.

I did like the all day. Yeah.

I will never get that time back.

You can't forget. And it's a very nice multiple days. And again, remember. She's going to hit hourly. Well, no.

But you know how much I love those stories. Right. So I wanted this to be. You were looking for the. I was, and I decided, you know what?

know what? I'm gonna go by myself. This is gonna be a Melissa Day. Yeah. No, and that Melissa Day was, yeah. I was deeply disappointed. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So just because something is good. Yeah. Doesn't mean we need to like the dude. We have to make the fifth or even so no whole like ensemble cast on audio book now. Oh, I, you

know what, somebody gifted me the first one and I, I listened to it and I did not

“care for it. Like, I think, and so Timothy Charlie took Clarify. His statements were”

that ballet and opera are like dead or like a relevant. Yeah. Yeah. That was like sort of what he said. And then he said, oh, I guess I just lost one percent of my followers or something. So Cavalier and Matthew McConaughey's face. That's the, that's the clip that I saw. When he's looking at him and he's just like, oh, shit. This guy is really. Oh, just let him take us. Yeah. I'm just going to say he's like, I'm going to be polish ladies now. All right. All right.

All right. I'm happy McConaughey and June 4 because Timothy's contract is about to get done. Yeah. I believe it. Because now not only have you offended like a community of people, you offended a community of people known for being fucking dramatic. Right. So like good luck to you, sir. Good night and good luck on show. You didn't, you didn't offend the quiet librarian. You offended the opera singer who's known for yelling, belting out the notes and who's on TikTok.

You're toast, man. I don't know. It just made him seem more irrelevant. Do you know what I mean? Like, you, this is already not somebody that I cared about. But now I'm looking for more reasons to not like you because you're dumb. Like if you're saying things as if you're relevant. Right. You're saying things as if everyone's like, what, what's Timothy's opinion on this? Well, oh, I can't add, add a film festival a couple of years ago. He was like, oh, societal collapses

in the air. And it was like, what? What are you talking about? See a scholar? Are you just anyone, what? Anyway, let's take a break. We've got a guest coming up. Welcome to Dirty Rush. The truth about Dirty Life. The good, the bad, and the sisterhood. With your host, me, J. Adjudice, Daisy Kent, and Jennifer Kessler. Rush, the recruitment, the ritual, the reality of Greek life has been a mystery for those outside the sorority circles

until now. Is it really a supportive sisterhood that's simply misunderstood? Or is there something more scandalous happening on campuses across the country? In this podcast, we pledge to feel back the layers and spell out the truth one Greek letter at a time. Pledge is an actives, rush chairs, and ritual keepers. Some call it the best time of their life while others say it's a nightmare. From a perfect rush to recruitment scandals, what is really going on behind the doors of

those sorority houses from Alpha to Omega? We're taking you inside sorority row, including the chapter room, as we explore the fellowship in the frenemies. Let's get dirty. Listen to Dirty Rush on the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hi, I'm Danielle Robe, host of Bookmark to the podcast by Reese's Book Club. And this week on Bookmark, we're basically hosting the ultimate girls night. Reese with her spoon, Jennifer Garner,

Judy Greer, Rita Wilson, and Gary Rice, and author Laura Dave. These are the women behind season two of the Apple TV series The Last Thing He Cold Me. We're talking about turning a book into a hit show,

and what it really takes to bring a story to life. The most important metric for me is

“do I want to share this book with somebody? That's what creates community, and that's the main”

thesis of our book club and why we started it was just to connect people together. Listen to the bookmark by Reese's Book Club podcast on the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Remember when you'd walk into your local video rental place, and there were always those two employees behind the counter, are you arguing about movies? Well, that's us. I'm milling a chairco, and I'm Casey O'Brien, and now we're arguing about movies on our podcast,

dear movies I love you, from the exactly right network. Can I say something about the criterion closet? Go ahead, dude. They're letting too many people in there. Okay, that's another film right by got to. Sadly, that rental place doesn't exist anymore. It's probably a store that sells

slacker movie clerks and podcast form. I would like to establish a timeline of the moment you

“figured out who Channing Tatum was. Every Tuesday we dig into the movies we can't stop obsessing over”

from hidden gems to big screen favorites. New episodes drop every week on the exactly right network. Listen to dear movies I love you on the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

China's Ministry of State Security is one of the most mysterious and powerful

spy agencies in the world. But in 2017, the FBI got inside. This is Special Agent Regal, Special Agent Bradley Hall. This MSS officer has no idea the US government is on to him, but the FBI has his chats, texts, emails, even his personal diary. Here how they got it on the sixth bureau podcast. I now have several terabytes of an MSS officer no doubt no question of his life. And that's the unicorn. No one had ever seen anything like that. It was unbelievable.

This is a story of the inner workings of the MSS, and how one man's ambition and mistakes

opened its fault of secrets. Listen to the sixth bureau in the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts,

or wherever you get your podcasts. From iHeart Podcasts, and best case studios. This is Worshack, murder at City Hall. July 2003, Councilman James E. Davis arrives at New York City Hall with a guest. Both men are carrying concealed weapons. And in less than 30 minutes, both of them will be dead.

Have everybody in the chambers of dogs, a shocking public murder. A scream get down, get down, those are shots, those are shots, get down. A charismatic politician. You know, he just bent the rules all the time. I still have a weapon. And I could shoot you.

“And an outsider with a secret. He alleged he was affected the flat now. That may have”

been not been political. That may have been about six. Listen to Worshack, murder at City Hall, starting on March 25th on the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Welcome back to Brief Recess. This is under oath. I'm so excited. I'm a huge fan. I'm very happy to have Yau Ana from an extraordinary modeling career. She's very well known in the modeling industry. You may know her as the winner of Cycle 2 of America's Next Top Model. She is right now being featured

in dirty, rotten, scoundrels. It's America's Next Top Model E documentary that was released at the same time as the Netflix documentary. So thank you so much for coming you on over. So thank you, Michael. I'm excited to talk with you and Melissa. Yeah, it's nice to meet you, you're one. Nice to meet you. Coming. I thought it would just be really interesting. I mean, this is a legal podcast, but we cover everything. Everything. Pop culture, news, everything that's going on. And I'm a love being on

social media. So we have so many things that come up on my feed. And you were definitely one of them. I mean, like the things that are going on right now as there is this like reckoning moment in America. The history of America is like some model and really reality television in the 2000s, right? And of course. So I thought it would be so cool to have you and welcome you to the show. And we really just want to like talk to you and get to know you and hear about your experiences. I want to ask

“I think it would be best if we start before you were in our context. Sure, because you have long”

incredible modeling career. And it wasn't like it began with Tyra Banks, right? Yeah, that's true. I

think there's a little bit of a misconception that I identified all of my modeling career from being on the show. But no, I actually, I had lost a significant amount of weight because I did want to break into modeling. I was at University of studying international relations. And I had a chance to kind of test do testing in Miami with a few agencies. And I got discovered by Ford models. And they had given me a contract, but prior to that during the week that I got the contract,

I got the call to audition for the show. So I had assigned it yet. And I remember telling Michelle Mark, who was the casting director, hey, I have this model and she was very like take it or leave it. If you want to come on the show, great, but you can't, you know, I can't tell you what to do,

and that was a very thorough long process. And I decided, well, you know, at least if I try out,

I'll have a broader reach. I also thought there'd be some sort of mentorship and great experience and kind of like somewhat of a boot camp. And I thought, well, I can come home to at least a contract waiting for me with four models. What was that like then? So you went on America's Exxon model. You won spoiler alert. It was not. I was like, oh, so no spoilers here. You won your season. What was that journey like? Do you feel like after America's Exxon model? This was

that was the right sort of path to take. Did you have this moment where you were like, I was thinking like I was wondering in hindsight, if you had to do it all over again, is there any part of you that wishes that maybe you had gone ahead and stayed with Ford or

do you feel like, you know, you were at the right moment at the right time and being on America's

“Exxon model was a good thing for you to do. I think it's hard for me to even answer that because I”

come from Jacksonville, which is kind of a small town, but a big city. And I was really sheltered. And so I feel like my ultimate goal was to live in New York City and to work as a fashion model. And I think, you know, I might have stayed in the Florida market and gradually progressed. But in hindsight, I think the one takeaway from the Holy Experience, I'm not, I don't deal well with celebrityism. And I find because it opens the door to a lot of coolness. And it's very hard for me to even kind of

take a risk to, at the time, I was sitting offers to go back on reality TV. And I really just was adamant about staying the course and being a fashion model and also growing in television.

And that's really where I might, I guess you could say I was able to break out of the debt that

incurred after the show. I wasn't expecting a lot after the when, what was going to happen or what was going to have to be on my shoulders. And it really was, I opening and I kind of had to navigate how to be a business woman. And so after you won the show, walk us through what that experience was like, right? There were certain promises. We're hearing all over the internet. We're seeing all over these documentaries that really what was built as Tyra was going to be your mentor. You were

going to get the Islamalan contracts. You were going to get signed by these agencies. This was your career was pretty much guaranteed, right? We're really learning now that that is not necessarily what the takeaway was, at least that promise, not necessarily that that all of that was promise that you were going to be a superstar if you won the show. But they weren't also dispelling that rumor or letting the girls know like, hey, it's really going to be up to you,

your celebrity, how famous you are, how far you make it in the modeling industry. That's really

“going to be up to you and whether you're an entrepreneur or not. Well, yeah, I think that's a”

question hadn't even happened. I just remember coming off the show, you go away of the way for six months. I was still Danny and I saved up all of my money and I knew I was going to have to eventually move to New York. I didn't know the day they announced me that I had to live in New York. So we've been navigating where I was going to live. Yeah, it's crazy. And on that same day, you know, getting, getting established with an agency that, you know, that was the contract I won.

It was only for one year, but I stayed for several years. And it really was just a right to work. But where there are empty promises, 1,000 per cent. There was, you're going to be doing this. You're going to be doing that. So in my mind, I kept building up, oh, great. Now, I'm going to be self-sufficient and I can take care of myself. They're going to be introducing me to this client and to that client. And they have a lot of pull because of their record, you know, I don't want

to throw names out there. But, you know, certain people very recognize and I thought, okay, they're going to want to, they're going to want to introduce me. I'm going to make introductions. And I'm going to work hard to prove myself after this. And ended up being where I just felt was more about being a jockey for the franchise and having to constantly do appearance after appearance, after appearance, after appearance. And I was getting billed for all those appearances in regards

to hair, makeup, car services. If there was a flight or a delay, and I was shocked. I was shocked that, you know, baby, so now even trusting that I thought I would have gotten taken care of by the network. But no, it was all on me. And that was separate from what was the debt incurring with the agency, because I had to read gold, my whole portfolio. They couldn't use any of the images from the show.

“And so I have to rely on them. And I think it doesn't really sell a model because you have to”

be so tone down. So that day, when I signed, I went directly to go shoot with some of the world's greatest photographers. And I was having to incur which the testing fees. And that would

And then I was having to figure out how I was going to maintain living in New York while doing all this. And a big part of the shock to me was with all the appearances, I did have work coming in. But I wasn't allowed to take some of the jobs because I was indebted to the franchise. And they got seniority over me being able to work. Oh, that's a lot of busy. Yes. So just for people who are listening and maybe don't understand. So you had signed this contract to be on this show.

It sounds like all these terms were in that contract. You're going to do all these appearances.

It's going to be at your own expense. We get first right or for refusal for any if you book a

gig and we have you booked at that same time. They could kill a deal that you got in market because you wouldn't decide that contract. I had two great deals that were like in the works.

“And they were like, I'm sorry, but you have to go up here. And then I started becoming really angry”

because I thought, okay, first of all, how am I going to be able to afford to maintain the title of America's next top model when I'm not even able to take some of the jobs that there are. I can't even just take work that any model could could get a gig. So you're right. So after you win is that when you sign a contract for the year that's ahead of you? And did you get an opportunity to show that contract to anybody else or did you, and you know, and being young and naive or whatever?

Did you just sort of sign it? Thinking that I should trust these people?

I have a sign. We have a funny thing because you're going to turn your microphone. I think anytime you're like, I'm going to get an attorney to look at this. Well, I'm going to do that. You're on grateful. And you don't want this job. And you're right. So it was very like, oh, I have like, okay, so I remember, I remember signing onto the show. And if you won and the fine print was there, however, I do not recall anything in regards to appearances or how many. And I'm not talking three,

four, five, six, seven, eight. No, it was like getting into the dozens. And you know, but also I'm going onto the show. I'm doing all these red carpet events, doing charity events, doing step in repeats for the network. It was like, I mean, in hindsight, it was just so many. And then, you know, and I'll be honest, it was overwhelming. I didn't have the clothes to support the appearances. I don't have the budget to do that. And a lot of the fashion houses did not

want to lend to a winner of America's next top model. Sure. Why do you think that was because you were on an earlier season, the sort of, um, campiness of the show hadn't, they really leaned

“hard into the insanity, right? I think at one point we have images of the models, the contestants”

walking down a runway where there's like a clock pendulum swinging like the knocking girls off the runway. Yeah, yeah, yeah. There was like a runway challenge where they're on a treadmill in eight and chills. Like they've really got truly insane camp with it. There was another runway that I remember where it was on water. And the, the models had to sort of, the steps were on water, but they were like wobbling. Yeah. And these girls were in high heels and they're trying to,

and what I remember, it was fair factor. Pretty much. Yeah. What I, I just remember looking at that and feeling like, and, you know, and Tyra and all the others were like laughing and giggling and, you know, it felt very mean like mean girl to me. Well, I think they prepped us for the wild long west of the internet, didn't they? Yes, they did. Yeah, that's right. I'm kind of, I'm kind of like a great fall for, you know, what I took away from it, which is navigating, not giving

so much energy and, and, uh, responsive and negative, yeah, confrontation. But, you know, it also made me stronger in regards to the business side. But, yeah, it started becoming where it was, uh, they were definitely humiliating the girls. And I didn't watch it after my season because of that. That was my main reason. I didn't want to see girls being humiliated. And I thought that is the seasons went on. The more of the shoots were becoming more and more outlandish and ridiculous.

Right. And they didn't really translate into the fashion arena. So, you know, I kind of just thought a little bit jaded for for what they were doing to the rest of the contestants. And the

“hopeful, I think the thing what people don't understand, I want to the right to work. And a lot of”

these girls on. And we're so naive. And we're so trusting that we're like, okay, this is going to be, this is really going to help us have a further reach. We're going to have more opportunities. We're going to be able to be self-sufficient. And it just, you know, it came at a cost. Yeah. Yeah. So, you won your season. You had this experience. You, you really managed to

build an incredible career after winning your season. It sounds like against all odds.

Oh, the odds were, well, also when I won, there was no social media. So, there was no fact tracking to know what I'd been doing. Yeah. There was no way for people to be like,

I know. It's just, I want to great. But no, I am, yeah, one of the, one of the, I did do a lot of fashion modeling during that time in New York. And I traveled worldwide. I had a cosmetic campaigns. I did a lot of fashion commentating and reporting. And I had my own shiny networks. And I had multiple specials with the Laura magazine. I did a Vogue Beauty TV. I mean, the list was really insane as far as broadcasting. And it was at a time when I think the only other model at the agency

was Heidi Clinton who was getting into television. So, they, they really did believe in me and doing that. And then, when I had left New York, I had, my son, I did so much modeling, much more when I moved to Florida because I, I guess the market for what I, who I was expanded. And it was

and it was amazing because I did catalogs. I booked, um, to be seeing home shopping network opportunities.

I had at least 30 covers within the first two years when I moved back. I did like campaign for while they're for Storia, like a bunch of hotels, a lot of luxury. So, when people say,

“you should have hustled, you should have had a career. Hi, I was working my ass off.”

I was working hard. You want to ask you a question before, um, before you were on America's next top model, and you had signed with Ford, when you imagined yourself being a model, what did that look like to you? You know, that's a great question because in the time growing up, we were in the 90s. So, that whole era of like chic and, um, photography and the quality of fashion as far as, um, was so fascinating to me. And I think putting forth the effort of like really wanting

to belong and having that fashion background, um, I think ideally at that age, I just wanted to break away from the intensity of studying international relations and have a little bit of fantasy. And I loved being behind the camera. I loved, um, I love, I love not being controlled, vice-federal. So, I felt like being able to travel, having, working around artists, working

around creatives is something I've always enjoyed. Um, I'm very free-spirited. So, I like someone

picking up the phone, a manager or a book or a saying, "Hey, your bookdomness, you gotta lead to

“more." That means what makes me feel exciting about life. So, I think, I think that was it.”

And I also think, um, I looked up to the top models. Like Stephanie Seymour to me was like, who I wanted to become. But my own version, you know, and of course, yeah. So, yeah, so it was really taken back. And I, I just, I, I fell in love with the whole idea of just like being a part of that group. So, after America's next-top model, were you paid as the winner? Was there a prize money or what was that like? Oh, sorry. Oh, you're on a laughing. No, I mean, I'm not paid. Oh, no, I mean,

I'm not in the red. I win in the red. I win in the deficit. I win in debt. And I broke out of the debt.

And here I am today. That's incredible. Congratulations. Yeah, that's a thank you.

Okay. So, walk me through these documentaries. What is sort of happening right now from your perspective? Because we're seeing the clips. They're sort of like dueling documentaries. We're seeing the clips. It seems like Tyran, her team wanted to preempt the current one on E by dropping a documentary on Netflix from Tyra's point of view. Right. And I mean, this has been meamed to death. Sure. But there are so many images of Tyran not taking accountability, putting the blame on other

people, showing that she was just really complicit with what was happening to the girls and that, you know, what was being sold to them was a faulty bill of goods. Right. So, then we have the documentary that dropped that you are a part of with E. Tell us about it. Walk us through it. How is it different from when Netflix won? What is going on? Like, it really is dominating the new cycle. Yeah. I'm like, people are people are getting really heated about it.

“Sure. And what was so by participating? What was your goal, right? By being in this?”

Because documentary. Yeah. Because you've gone on to have, like you said, this really wonderful, illustrious career. And this is a long time ago. And you had said that, you know, one of the things that you didn't really love was like that celebrity. Yeah. That's a celebrity news. And so I'm wondering what the goal was by participating in this duck. Oh, gosh. That's a great question. So, I knew about both of the docs simultaneously at the same time. And I was approached

by glass entertainment group. And that's the one that did the e-dock group. Officially, it was going to be on a separate network streaming platform. But I think because the two had separated however, whatever happened. And I did, and I did know about Netflix. They had, I essentially,

couple of the girls did. But I heard initially that Tyra had not signed on to do the Netflix,

that they had reached out to her. And she had heard about the documentaries and her team. So they couldn't get a clear answer. So I guess eventually she committed to the Netflix.

“And I, and I do believe from seeing it, I think it was on the premise of hopefully”

getting people to tune into cycle 25. I think that's the goal. And I feel that the, one of the main reasons that I came out to talk about my experience was because this show has been packaged and sold worldwide. Yeah, over 150 countries. Wow. The same practices are still happening, the same production, the same sort of exploitativeness of what's going on. Right. And at certain

point, I'm a mom now. I have a teenage son, but like, I wanted to also come out and protect

hopeful, naive young people who are thinking this is going to be the solution to their dreams and their goals and hopes. And I just wanted them to know, like, hey, the ones in charge are making the money. Yeah. And I think it was an opportunity to come out. And also, I couldn't talk about what I was dealing with 20 years ago because I wasn't ready to deal with it. I had a severe exercise disorder after winning the show. I, you know, it came so tiny to the point where, you know,

it complicated a lot of things in my health. And I felt like that was also something I wanted to come out there and be very vulnerable and help a young lady or a daughter or a mother who's dealing

with the same because it's, it's not a topic that really gets discussed, especially in fashion.

It's a lot of that is behind closed doors, but they do not want to come to surface. And so I thought it was an opportunity to also kind of set a lot of people that are struggling with the same things that I was free. Yeah. So take us through this documentary. Tell us a little bit about it. What you talk about, let people know what is going on in there? Yeah. So this particular doc,

“I think they had brought a couple of the winners. I do think there's a lot of cultural critics,”

which is good. I do think they gave a lot of perspective of the era of when I was on the show and kind of what their interpretation of Tire is, which I thought was very harsh, especially if they don't really know her that way. I think it's all just assumption. And I think it was also interesting for me from the Netflix doc hearing other contestants and other winners and their stories and what they had gone through. And I think a lot of people vacillate with how positive

it was and how negative it was. It's almost like we were in a cult. So I feel like sometimes they go back to kind of apologize to the main, you know, the main cult leader and then they go back and they said, no, but really it wasn't that I don't know. It's a very strange dynamic seeing the contestants and then them kind of shying away from their truth and then. Well, it's also like you also said that like you went into debt just afterwards. It would in my mind I'm thinking,

okay, if I won that show and I went into a bunch of debt and then there was an opportunity to kind of kiss the ring. Maybe get a deal. Maybe get a contract. Like it makes sense why people are maybe sucking up to Tyrod trying to get at their own thing going with the network. Like I understand it, right? A lot of these women have been put into a position of vulnerability just by virtue of being on that show. People don't want to work with them maybe or they're already sort of, you know,

“we're part of reality TV. I think it's it's interesting culturally to watch what's happening,”

right? I mean, and many of the girls came from a place of poverty before the show. Right. Right. And when on TV got all this attention and we're lowered back into their community without any support systems. Sure. And I think a big part, I felt a lot of shame with the debt partly because, you know, my father was a physician in my hometown and my mother and they had their practice. I didn't want the stigma of like having a daughter who, you know, they were so proud of

and, you know, being in the small town and the way people talk, you know, and coming back with a tale between my leg. I mean, I was like, I'm going to work the hell out of this debt. And I did because I wanted, I didn't want to let my parents down. If they, they wanted me to come home. They, my mother had had enough of the whole setup. She said they're taking advantage of you. This is ridiculous. I don't like what they're doing with you. You know, you don't see it, but we see it as your parents,

you know, come home. They do know. Mom, no. Yeah. And she kept saying, come home and she goes, we know you're not telling us what you're really going through and, and I wasn't. I was hiding it

agency I was with that I just decided, you know what you want it. This is going to be a lesson.

You're going to, you're going to take this as a lesson. You're going to navigate it and you're going to do the best you can. But I do think it derailed a little bit of my mental health. And that's

“why I think it was so hard on myself with my body image for sure. Of course, I mean, sure because”

here you were in front of people who are supposed to know more than you, right? Because they've been in this business. And instead of it, it sounds to me, um, instead of building you up, there was sort of building you up to bring you down somehow, right? Because if you, if you were the ideas, I'm going to be this model, but they're not giving you the opportunity to work. It's

almost like you were this indentured servant. You know what I mean? Like you were having to do

all these things, but you couldn't, you know, make your career go forward in the way that you wanted to at the time. I did want to ask you a question. Sure. Have you seen Tyra Banks in recent times? And if you did, what was that like? And if you haven't seen her, what would you like her to know about you or what would you like to say to her? Have you seen her since you won? Oh, yeah, I saw her a bunch since I won. I'm very different in the sense that,

gosh, how do I say this? She, she travels with the team. And I get very uncomfortable with people live on parages. It's something that I've, I've had to work through with, um, and I had to sign it NDA so I can't say who, but that's something for me, I find very uncomfortable to be around. And, you know, I did get invited to go on her talk shows several times and, you know, I was paid

“then to go on to, but, you know, I just take it for what it is. And I think a big part of it is,”

she's not my buddy. She's not someone I'm going to pick up the phone and, you know, talk about what we're making for dinner tonight. Um, right. I'm not, I'm not really an author. I think a way a lot of people are. I have other people that I look up to and I think of course for her. It's just, you know, she was an extension of a part of my life. Who knows, maybe if I'm down in the land down under, if I see or I'll say hello, but you know, I don't know. What? Okay, so you went through

this whole experience. You now there are these documentaries. What? As you reflect on this part of your life, what is your takeaway? Like, what are you sort of saying to yourself and to people who are maybe watching these documentaries, formulating their own opinions? Like, what do you want them to know? I think we've done a good job just spelling, um, kind of the myth of what it is to be the winner, and what really happened and just the economics of what goes in. I mean, I can't really assume what people

are going to walk away with because I feel like if I try to get into their heads and I did do that after the doc. I was like, I'm going to fight these people online and I'm going to, and then I thought, you, but I'm going to turn into into them. I'm like, you're like, oh, yeah, so then so then I come to you on TikTok and I laugh and I'm like, I don't, you know, I felt like I stopped replying because it just became where you would see so much positive and then it would be people just attacking and

going for it. And I'm like, where's all this emotion coming from? But I will say, there is a rumor that there is PR crisis in the mix. So I would, I would be shocked if there were PR crisis. Sometimes I look at the comment, I'm like, who is this bot? What is bot? What is this, you know?

I mean, because like you said, the house always wins, right? And this is 150 country franchise.

This isn't just Tyra. This is a machine that we're talking about. So I mean, there's there are people freaking out in the comments from somewhere as we speak. I'm sure. Of course, of course. I mean, I think that the idea was to sort of try and explain away what had happened on the show. But now here's this other documentary that is giving what happened on the show from the perspective of the people who were in the trenches. And I like what you've done. Honestly, I've been watching

how you've handled these interviews and how you approach it. A lot of people are, like you said, giving their opinions and judgments of the situation. You have always been really matter of fact of just the facts. You're like, this is what happened. Here are the words. What you do with it is up to you, which I've I appreciate because there are, there's a lot of opinions popping in the comments. Oh gosh. And there's so emotional. I feel, and I wanted to come from a very

“calm matter of fact place. And I think that's why I was one of the main voices that”

Glass Entertainment said, and I said, do I come across complaining? I said, no, you're just very matter of fact. I said, I just wanted to be matter of fact. I just wanted to cut through the fantasy

what really happens after you come off of a show like that? Like, and I think a big part of the

aggression, I think is because I think when you disclose or you share something that is uncomfortable from what they believed in their mind or what they thought, the what they witnessed watching on TV or their perception of what they think the fashion industry is really like. And a lot of these people comment and haven't ever even experienced the business of being fashion. I feel that really is what triggers them because they don't want to look foolish. They don't want to be like,

you're making me look stupid. I have this belief in my mind of how it was supposed to be. And

“now you're putting the little pin in that balloon. And that's what that's what I take away from everything.”

Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Well, is there anything that you're working on right now? You would like the listeners to know about. I think they can check out the documentary if they have an already either anything else you want people to pay attention to as a reward. Well, I'm still, I do, I do a lot of traveling workshops and I'm also affiliate now at TikTok. So I am, I'm with the Russell Hartley team. So learning the whole world of TikTok. I know you're, you're far more advanced

than I am. So Michael is prolific in TikTok. Yeah. I think it's amazing because you just do it so

organcanically and obviously in my head. And you're like, I love listening to you. So thank you. You're very kind. People ask me that a lot. They're like, how do you have time to like curate your TikToks that I'm like, honey, I'm not curating it. It is filmed in the bathroom. Like it is like, I'm running out of court or I'm doing this. I'm doing that. And I really am just switching on the camera. So thank you. That's kind of you. Yeah. How did you choose immigration law? It really

chose me. I mean, I've been practicing, I've practiced criminal law. I've been at law firms before, but once I kind of got one client and then it really snowballed from there. And there really is a huge demand for immigration law for lawyers who know how to do that work. So once you kind of specialize and kind of get to know it, it gets, I love it. You just get really busy really quickly. And next thing you know, you're not working on those contracts or real estate deals anymore.

I will tell you that I remember when Michael started doing immigration law and that we, I remember he was like, you know, I feel like I need to do something to help somebody.

“I was like, go ahead and do that. And I remember him telling me about it. And you know, I think”

one of the things about Michael is like, he comes, somebody was asked for me about this. It was like, he really that way all the time. The way that you see him on TikTok. And I was like, yes, but Michael is very thoughtful. And he, he does really think about what can he do to help somebody do something. So it's been as his friend. It's been really nice to sort of watch him turn into this person over here. It's true. It's true. I wouldn't say if it wasn't true. But like

that's, I think people don't know that about Michael. It was like, he one day was just like, I need to do something to help somebody. And it's kind of like one, I think it was like one case. Yeah, it was one case. So it was that kid who's like, oh, that kid. Yeah. Yeah. So I had a kid who was just like the coolest kid ever. And I love him so much. And now he's almost a grown man. Yeah. Yeah. So I love that. I love that. No. It's great. It's wonderful. Thank you so much. I'm so glad

we got to chat with you. I know. I hope you got the right answers. No, the right answers are whatever your truth is. You want to do you want to give us your social, so yeah, let's talk more. So I'm on Instagram. I'm Yo Mania. And that's Y-O-M-A-N-I-A. And then on TikTok, I'm Yo Mania.

“I think 0-2. All right. Thank you so much for joining us. Thank you. Take good care. Nice to meet you.”

Bye-bye. Take care. Bye-bye. Let's get into tells from the DMs. We've got some incredible DMs. Incredible. Incredible. People, y'all are absolutely. Y'all said, you know what? Hold my drink. I'm going to pop a handstand and work in Michael's DMs. The things y'all are sending me. It's so insane. And let me just say I love it so much. Yeah, I'm going to say he's living for it. I'm on the spin bike laughing. I'm like a looking at the things I'm like. I'm going to jump

your killing me. Y'all are killing me. Anyway, before we get into the DMs, friends, what do I always say?

While Michael is a lawyer, he is not your lawyer. Get your own. Oh my god. Okay. So first of all, I just have to jump in really quick with this one. Jump in really quick. Hey, Michael. I hope you see this message. Oh, I saw this. Go ahead. Go ahead. Go ahead. Guess what? I saw it. I'm one of those annoying cancer survivors that push trauma on others. Okay. We're really happy to survive.

forehead checked. Okay. That's what they say. That's what he says. That's what he says. I know you're

“smart and kept it together. But it reminds me of a tiny spot of cancer I had to have removed,”

keeping who you are. But can you get this looked at, please? I'm going to. So thank you for head talk for getting in my DMs. Where is this little spot right there? Okay. Yeah. It's this. Getting close. Got it on my close. Sure. Because we can, we'll actually do like a right to laugh to reading of my forehead like a palm. Because over here, and I will do it. So this is it. This is a broken blood vessel that I had checked in January. And like this is to check,

clear the record. Our doctor. Our shared doctor. We go to the same dermatologist. I love him so much. And we keep each other accountable. So like, thank you for messaging me this. This is a good

PSA reminder. It's always better to have like a cancer prevention girly bestie where you

hold each other accountable. So like, I have a friend, he and I go to the boy doctor. And we remind

“each other to just go get boy stuff checked. Okay. And that's all I'll say. Oh, okay.”

It's boy par related. Like girl stuff. Yeah. Like do you have a girlfriend where you're like, hey, did you get your. Oh, I'm the most annoying person in my friend group. Like you got to get your boobs, check. You got to go to the gynecologist. Yeah. Do you want to see her? Yeah. You know what the pap smear is named after Dr. Papanicalao or no, Dr. Papadopolis. Papadopolis? Yeah, PAP. It started. So they didn't want to do his whole name smear. So they just did PAP. How do you know that? This is the name.

He was, uh, I know his cousin. Okay. Yeah, listen to me. I know. And I was like his flex. I was like, I was like his flex. Get your own flex. His uncle invented the pap smear. I was like, okay, if you're, anyway, so this is a broken blood vessel. And this over here, you might have seen last week. I scratched my head with my bike helmet. Okay. So, so he's okay. From the eye down, we're not sure. So we are doing reviews, which we love. Thank you so much for doing that. It actually

really doesn't mean a lot to us. And we're going to read some because you guys are hysterical. Here's one. Um, I kind of stumbled into listening to this podcast, but I'm so glad that I did

not only is it incredibly informative in these wild times, but the hosts have such an amazing and

comedic chemistry like so good. It almost makes me want to crawl out of my introverted shell and find friends almost. But until that moment of bravery happens, it is truly enjoyable to kick back and enjoy their banter and learn something along the way. Highly recommend. Thank you. That's so we appreciate that. Um, yeah, I, I like it inside personally. So I'm not mad at you for staying inside. You like an inside? Mm-hmm. Okay. Stay inside. I do like it inside. Yeah. I do. You know,

I like it inside. I'm out in these streets, but I'm also in the house. No, I'm definitely more in the house. Yeah. Yeah. Unless it's in a state sale, which it's someone else. I want to in the state sale this weekend. I did. There's so lot. I know. Oh my god. I think the reason why I like it inside is because

um, Gen X was always outside and no one gave a shit. And nobody ever knew where we were. Tell the

“streetlights come home. Come on. That's when you're doing. That's when you have to be home. So I like”

it inside. Hey, Michael Melissa. Hi. I was looking for some help because I was summoned for a federal jury service. It's a 12 week case from May 11th to July 31st. And if I'm chosen, I'd be the question for the duration of the trial. Part of me is like super excited for this. And I kind of want to be chosen because this is such a cool side class. And like it'll feel like summer can't have no phones. And like I'm living for this like courtroom drama and tea. But I'm really worried

about paying my rent for the duration of the time. I'd be serving, especially because it's over two full months. I work two part-time jobs and girl. They don't pay for jury service time. And it's especially not for a case that's so long. I'm also turning 25. And like I only have so many hot girl summers left. And I don't want to waste a whole pride month when I'm hot and single. Yeah. So I just want to advice on how you think I should go forward because I fill out an excuse

to be dismissed and they still said I'm considered eligible. I was also curious of what you think the case may be. My friends and I thought that it could be the Rob Reiner case. But we are wondering if you had like any inside tea and what's happening in California federal court soon. Oh she's in California. I'll say okay. Okay. So I don't think it's the Rob Reiner case because it's July 31st. I don't think

Nick Reiner. Oh yes. The Reiner case. Yes. Oh my god. And I keep mixing out that name. Yeah. And I did it on TikTok and everyone in the comments was like how dare you? Yeah, Rob was the dad. Yes. Nick was the son. Yes. Yes. And truly how dare me. Yes. I should have picked him

“names right. Anyway, I think that's too soon. I love how messy you are though. And it really makes my”

heart saying that like you are someone who's following this show and listening and sending in your message because you sound adorable. So I'm so excited that you're in the pod. The the fact that you're thinking about the number of hot girl summers you've got left. That is dedication to the whole life. I'm so proud of you because the the hot girl summers you only got so many and it's what you do with them that kind of. I don't know that hot girl summer means that she's dedicated to

honeness. I think that I so easy and we're not shaming anybody but hot girl. Right. Not equal. Yeah, that's true. You could do like a hot girl in like a bonnet or a rabbit. Hot girl is like some might say of mine. Someone say would be Goldberg in the sister act

and sister act too back in the habit. That was a her hot girl summer. Maybe. So you never know

that. If you are in the sister had you can just let us know in the comments. But I do want to talk a little bit of that real jury service because you don't have paid. Okay. You can pay $50 a day. Okay. And let me just say as like I have my stepdaughter is your age and as feeling like I'm gonna be your bonus mom as well. Yeah. You already said that you're working two part jobs,

“two part time job which I think is sort of what you need to do in order to keep yourself alive.”

I don't know that your desire for messiness is sort of the way to go this time around. Yeah. I think that once a messy girl deep down always a messy girl there will be time in the feature when you are establishing your career where you can afford to be off for a month and it won't be fun. You're gonna get call to jury duty a bunch in your life and the cases are I mean if you're

going to trial it's usually because there's like a real critical issue that needs to get

litigated 90 something percent of cases settle. So the fact that you're gonna get call to an eventually serve on a on a jury it's almost always going to be messy tea. You'll write that tell all it's just wait until you've got a stable gig and you can be a salaried employee who takes a week off for jury duty. Right. Cover your ass. Yeah. Yeah. The only other thing I want to say about jury duty is just because you qualify for jury duty and they're telling you you're qualifying.

Doesn't mean you're seated on a jury. You got about five more steps before that happens. So you got to go the case actually has to go to trial. You got to sit there and wait. They have to interview you. They've got it. They've got preemptory strikes. There's so many things that happen where you can explain and articulate. You're working two part time jobs. You cannot be sequestered for twelve weeks. Right. You're gonna be on Skid Row on the Breadline. Yeah. So you've

you'll have an opportunity to tell a judge and tell the lawyers and hopefully likely get out of jury duty. Yeah. You truly doesn't sound like you can afford to do this right now and as far as things being like messy and fun I was on a federal jury duty once and it wasn't fun at all and it was actually really boring. I got called for one and it was a building bricks for flying everywhere and it can win people. No. This is the one that I got in was just like you guys tried to rob a

garaka parking garage and he took the attendant and he put the attendant in the trunk of the car

“that he stole and drove him across state lines and that's why it was federal. Melissa that is so”

interesting. It wasn't. I mean it wasn't. I mean it wasn't. No it wasn't. You were like some guy got a free Uber ride. You don't know. I mean it was. It was a little bit worse than for gas. It was the 90s before Uber. But it just took forever and I remember thinking I really thought it was going

to be more exciting. Like that's so amazing because it was your hot girl summer. You were missing

out on to deal with this guy's trial. No. Okay. Thank you so much for writing and please keep sounded. You truly bring me so much joy and entertainment throughout my day when I take a little of all brief recess from court and major dams. So thank you so much. This is brief recess. We'll see you next week or in court. You won't see me in court. Unless you sound your jury. You don't want that.

This has been an exactly right production recorded that I Heart Studios posted by me, Michael Foot. And me, Melissa Malbrant, our producer is CJ Faroni. This episode was edited by Nicholas Galucci. Our associate producer is Christina Chamberlain and our guest booker is Patrick Cotner. Our theme song was composed by Tom Briefogel with artwork from Charlotte Delareo and Vanessa Leilac with photography by Brad Obono.

You can find me on Instagram at Department of redundancy department or on TikTok at Michael Foot.

“And I'm on both Instagram and TikTok as Melissa Malbrant.”

Got legal questions. Reach out at Brief recess at exactly right media.com. Listen to Brief recess on the I Heart Radio app. Apple podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. And of course, we're a podcast with video. Search for Brief recess on YouTube. Hi, I'm Danielle Robe, host of Bookmarked at the podcast by Reese's Book Club.

And this week on Bookmarked, we're basically hosting the Ultimate Girls Night.

Reese Witherspoon, Jennifer Garner, Judy Greer, Rita Wilson, and Gary Rice and author Laura Dave. These are the women behind season two of the Apple TV series The Last Thing He Cold Me. We're talking about turning a book into a hit show and what it really takes to bring a story to life.

“The most important metric for me is do I want to share this book with somebody?”

That's what creates community and that's the main thesis of our book club and why we started it

was just to connect people together. Listen to the bookmarked by Reese's Book Club podcast

on the I Heart Radio app. Apple podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. This is Special Agent Regal, Special Agent Bradley Hall. In 2018, the FBI took down a ring of spies working for China's Ministry of State Security. One of the most mysterious intelligence agencies in the world. The Sixth Bureau podcast is a story of the inner workings of the MSS and how one man's ambition

and mistakes opened its fault of secrets. Listen to the Sixth Bureau on the I Heart Radio app, Apple podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. This is one of the most dramatic events that really ever happened in New York City politics. A screen get down, get down, those are shots. A tragedy that's now forgotten and a mystery that may or may not have been political,

that may have been about six. Listen to Worshack, Murder at City Hall, starting on March 25th on the I Heart Radio app, Apple podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. People who didn't do what China's got wanted them to do, they usually disappeared. John of God was once Brazil's most famous spiritual healer, but in this limited series podcast, we uncover the darker truth behind his global empire of faith

and fear. From exactly right and a lonely media, this is too fast, John of God. Listen on the I Heart Radio app, Apple podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. Movies can make you feel, make you dream, sometimes they even make you appreciate our

“architecture. Is there anybody who's been hotter in a doorway than a list of a tailor?”

That's the kind of analysis you'll find every week on Dear Movies I Love You, the New Podcast from the Exactly Right Network. Every Tuesday, we break down the films we're crushing on from blockbusters to deep cuts. Listen to Dear Movies I Love You on the I Heart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.