The Countess

This is a story about a horrendous lie that destroyed two families.

“Late one night, Bobby Gumpride became the victim of a random crime.”

The perpetrator was sentenced to 99 years until a confession changed everything. - I was a monster. - Listen to burden of guilt season two on the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

- Hey, this is Wells Adams with "By Order of the Faithful's podcast," alongside my fellow faithfuls and co-hosts, Tamarajudge, and Dolores Catania. The three of us have been watching the season of the traders, and we've been inside that castle,

so we have insight unlike many others. This season of the traders may be the best we've ever seen. Listen to "By Order of the Faithful's on the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts." - When segregation was a law, one mysterious black club owner,

Charlie Fitzgerald, had his own rules. - segregation in the day, integration at night. - It was like sippin' on another world. - Was he a businessman, a criminal, a hero? - Charlie wasn't an example, a power.

They had the crush him. - Charlie's place, from Atlas Obsgera and visit Mirdle Beach. Listen to Charlie's place on the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. - Almost 30 years together, four kids, and some of reality TV's

most unforgettable moments, we're taking you behind the scenes in our podcast between us, with me, Heather DeBrow. - And me, Terry DeBrow. - The unfiltered behind closed doors conversations, you wish you could even drop on.

- And plenty of, did they just say that moments? But what's the latest rumor I'm gay, right?

First of all, if I were gay, I would be.

- Jay! - Open your free iHeart Radio app, search between us, and listen now. - Before we begin, please be aware that series contains discussions around infant deaths and other difficult topics. Please take care while listening.

The moment my daughter was born, the doctor's noticed strange markings on her skin. Within hours, someone gently explained she might have a rare genetic disorder.

“I remember sitting in the postpartum room, exhausted and terrified,”

while my fragile, beautiful baby girl had dozens of wires taped to her scalp. I couldn't help her. I couldn't hold her. Like all first-time parents, I had been expecting that cinematic moment. Scan on skin, a warm little body settling into mine.

The quiet breath of relief after months of waiting. Instead, I spent the next six months in limbo,

fearing she might never walk or talk,

that she might go blind, that a tiny hidden defect in her heart might stop it all together. When I became a mother, I knew I would sacrifice everything to help my child. But this was not a problem I could fix, and I was left with no choice but to trust. Trust the nurses lifting her from my arms. Trust the doctors who did test after test.

Trust the specialist who spoke in a calm voice about a possibility that parts of her brain might be missing. Because in the NICU, trust isn't optional. It's the air you breathe. You hand over the most precious thing in your life to people you barely know, believing they will protect what you can't. That vulnerability defines the experience. It's overwhelming, and it's necessary. And then, finally, mercifully, the doctors told us she had tested negative,

“that her brain, her heart, her eyes, they were just fine. I'll never forget that feeling.”

The world opening up again. The gratitude so heavy it almost knocked me off my feet. Most parents with a child in the NICU get that moment. But in 2015, at the countess of

Chester Hospital, some never did.

The historic heart of Chester is like a time capsule filled with everything you expect from a very old, very storied British city. Coupled streets, pubs dating back to medieval times,

by a great big fortified wall. Right at the edge of Chester is the local hospital,

“named after Princess Diana. It's called the Countess of Chester, which was one of the titles she got”

when she married King Charles. But the history of the site where the hospital was built isn't shall we say quite as illustrious as the stuff in the old city center. The Countess of Chester originally was built on the site of a Victorian mental asylum. That's Michelle Warden. She used to work at the Countess of Chester as a neonatal nurse. She started a few years after Charles and Diana's royal visit. Speaking of which, the hospital building itself does an exactly live up to its regal name.

It's, you know, a hospital. It looks like a hospital. Built in the 70s, you can probably picture it, unfussy, functional, lots of concrete. But this run of the mill building and what happened inside has, for the past decade, been at the center of the latest big chapter in the history of Chester. In fact, many believe that what happened here is one of the biggest things to have happened in the history of modern Britain. The country just hasn't settled on what that thing is. History is still

being written. They've clearly found that she's one of Britain's most notorious killers. What to do about a trial, which, in my view, is a clear miscarriage of justice by a judicial system that could not manage. I'm Amanda Knox, and from Vespucci, and I heard podcasts, this is doubt, the case of Lucy Lepby, episode two, the Countess.

“Back in 2015, when you arrive at the Countess, that's how a lot of people refer to it by the way,”

the Countess. One of the first things you'll see is a short stocky building to your left.

That was the women and children's building. I mean, the women and children's department, hospital, was designed for, as it says, women and children. So you've got a pediatric ward, you have an earnatal ward, you have all the maternity. Michelle again. She spent so many years in this building, she could probably recite the layout in her sleep. You've got fetal medicine, you know, anti-natal, post-natal, gynecology, you've got operating theaters, infertility, anything

to do with women and children is within that building. But a lot has changed since Michelle

“first started working there, in many important ways, some for the better, and some for the worse.”

It wasn't until the mid-1990s with the development of a drug which helps to develop premature babies lungs. That really revolutionised the care of the sick and premature babies. Though new drugs helped the infants breathe easier, the same couldn't be said for the facilities. By the time Michelle retired in 2007, the women and children's building itself was coughing and spluttering. It was a lovely unit, but it was old. And with any old building, it had its problems,

which were always going on. I went to work on the unit in 1988 and wear and tear was beginning

to show even back then. Problems with the plumbing, the sinks and the taps sometimes not working, properly. The plumbing system had recycled the Victorian pipes in the foundation from the ground's mental asylum days. So which would back up into the sinks, it would also leak from the pipes overhead onto the incubators. This was a chronically underfunded unit, and often the maintenance crew was forced to improvise.

One maintenance worker described to the telegraph newspaper a time he and his colleagues had to pad the ceiling tiles with diaper lining, a last ditch effort to stem the flow of literal

shit from the pipes overhead. There was never enough time or money to put out all the fires.

By the summer of 2015, the hospital had been begging the public for help,

Everyone threw themselves into the effort. Racing rubber duckies on the river D,

“charging down the streets of Chester in Santa Costumes, and gambling taking part in goofy dance”

videos. Like the one with the pediatrician in charge of the unit, Dr. Stephen Breary, shaking his hips to the tune of twist and shout, and making heart shapes with his hands, all for the cause. On behalf of the doctors and nurses that work in Chester on the near-natal unit, that's him, Dr. Breary.

Soft spoken, self-effacing. Dr. Breary had that pillar of the community vibe to him.

But the real poster boy of the pediatric team was Dr. Breary's close friend, Dr. Ravi J. Ramm. He was thin and sprightly with a shock of curly black hair.

“The local papers called him the TV doctor. And Dr. Ravi J. Ramm is with us now because we're”

going to talk about this a little bit more. I'm a consultant pediatrician and I've worked for the NHS while my career. Consultant is the most senior rank of doctor in the UK. You'll be hearing that word a lot in this series. Dr. J. Ramm was a consultant. And just so we're all in the same page, NHS stands for National Health Service. It's the UK system of free healthcare for all. Making it to consultant level took a long time and a ton of work,

but through all those sleep deprived years, Dr. J. Ramm never forgot to nurture his first love.

Showbiz. He busked on the streets of Chester as a teen, shot a shot at the Edinburgh

“French Festival in college and became a mainstay of British game shows all while coming up the ranks”

in medicine. That's him on the weakest link. He actually won it at one point. I indulge in the occasional karaoke. What can you sing? I could do Honky tongue women by the Rolling Stones in tribute to you. Well I doubt whether you can but you can try. If you started it. In his down time, Dr. J. Ramm played local gigs with his band, the deluded. Here they are at the cavern, a live music spot in Liverpool, where the deluded were a regular attraction.

He's actually got a good singing voice and he is very theatrical. I actually asked him why he didn't pursue a career in drama. And he said, well that's not what nice Indian boys do. I mean his father was a consultant. His brother is a very eminent consultant ophthalmologist in London. But Dr. J. Ramm found a way to make his medical career and his rock star ambitions work for him. In the summer of 2015, he was co-starring in a reality TV show called Born Naughty,

where he and a fellow doctor met parents of badly behaved children and decided if a medical diagnosis was the answer to their problems. As a pediatrician in the GP, Dr. Ravie and Dr. Dorn often meet badly behaved kids, but Naughty must crack some real hard nuts. He spent the early part of that summer, Chris crossing the country, doing promo for his reality show as well as other media work. He seemed to be everywhere, except perhaps the understaffed neonatal unit at the countess

of Chester Hospital. But just as the future's looking bright, something terrible starts unfolding in the neonatal unit. It won't be long before the unit is demanding all of Dr. J. Ramm's attention. There will be little time left for show business. I'm Nancy Glass, host of the burden of guilt season 2 podcast. This is a story about a horrendous lie that destroyed two families. Late one night, Bobby Gumpride became the victim of a random crime.

He pulls the gun, tells me to lie down on the ground. He identified Chamaine Hudson as the perpetrator, Chamaine was sentenced to 99 years. I'm like, "Lord, this can't be real. I thought it was a

until a confession changed everything. I was a monster. Listen to burden of guilt season 2

“on the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.”

Hey, this is Wells Adams with by order of the Faithful's podcast alongside my fellow Faithful's and co-hosts, Tamara Judge and Delores, Katania. The three of us have been watching the season of the traders, and we've been inside that castle, so we have insight unlike many others. This season of the traders may be the best we've ever seen. Listen to by order of the Faithful's on America's number on podcast network, iHeart, follow by order of the Faithful's, and start listening on the free iHeart

Radio app today. I went and sat on the little odd of my name in front of him and I said, "Hi, Dad!" And just what I said that my mom comes out of the kitchen and she says, "I haven't cooked these

in milk. There's a bad-ass convict." Right. Just finished five years. I've never cooked these in milk at

a mall. On the Steena Show podcast, each episode invites you into a raw unfiltered conversations about recovery, resilience, and redemption. On a recent episode, I sit down with actor, cultural icon, Danny Trail, talk about addiction, transformation, and the power of second chances, the entire season two is now available to bench, featuring powerful conversations with the guests like Tiffany Attich, Johnny Knoxville, and more. It's the new me and it's the old

them. Everybody's on the edge and your journey is different to this. This woman's history month,

the podcast, if you knew better with Amber Grimes, spotlights women who turn missteps into momentum

“and lessons into power. I think coming out of where I came from, I'm from the Bronx,”

I think I grew up really poor. I didn't know that then because I very much used my creativity to romanticize life. And I'm like my mom did a really good job of like, you step back and you're like, "Whoa, we, I don't know how we made it." So a lot of my life was like built out of like survival to get to the next place. Like my drive, my tunnel vision of like, "I gotta be better. I gotta achieve this." Was off the strength of like, "I want to make a better life for us."

If you knew better, brings real talk from women who've lived it. Unpacking career pivots, relationship lessons, and the mindset shifts that changed everything. Listen to if you knew better with Amber Grimes on the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.

“In the UK, not every NICU is the same. Neonatal units are graded, level one through three,”

depending on what level of care they are equipped to provide. Jenny Harris, who spent years as a neonatal nurse in the NHS helped me understand what those levels actually mean. If your hospital has a level one neonatal unit, that means that you can just care for babies that just need feeding and growing. Maybe a little help with respiratory support, but only like, minor respiratory support like oxygen. Then you have your level two units. They can also take

high dependency babies. So these are babies that need to say CPAP, may need fluids, premature babies up to a certain gestation. And then your level three unit is the unit that does everything, so special care, high dependency, all intensive care babies, whatever they may need. And what they do is say there is a baby in a level one unit that needs to go to a level three, then in the transport team would go to that baby, stabilize the baby, and take it to the hospital,

there's more equipped to care for that baby. Jenny worked on the transport team. She spent years moving tiny patients from one hospital to another, from one level of care to the next. The countess of Chester was a level two unit. My favorite was going to the level ones and the level two's because they were so cozy, quiet, they're all like decorated nice and, you know, got pictures on the walls and selling knitted stuff, a little trolley, like it's just so lovely,

you just go in and it's just, yeah, it just seems more homely. For the parents, the NICU is both terrifying and miraculous.

but also of hope. The unit at the countess in summer 2015, like many across the UK, is warm and

“cozy. It cares for premature babies, babies who struggle to breathe, to feed, to grow,”

and it isn't known for high death rates. From 2011 to 2014, two or three babies died there each year. On paper, it was unremarkable. It's early June and a set of twins has just been born. Their premature, tiny, but breathing. Their mother has a rare autoimmune condition, which made her pregnancy risky. At seven months, her twins are born by sea section and whisked

away to the neonatal unit. Here's Michelle again, the nurse that worked at the countess.

They were supposed to be born in London and the mum had anti-fossilipids syndrome, so they delivered her in Chasta. The twins are placed in a joining cots, tubes for feeding, wires for monitoring. In place of their mother's heartbeat, they now hear something else. Monitors, footsteps, hushed voices, the unfamiliar rhythms of the neonatal unit take over. Unlike many American hospitals, where parents can stay around the clock,

UK neonatal units are often more nurse-led. Parents come and go. Care continues through the night. And like so many parents in a neonatal ward, the twins' parents were most likely offered gentle reassurance. The kind meant to study you when everything feels uncertain. They just need a little

“more time. They're in the best place. I remember hearing a version of that myself when my daughter”

was in hospital. We have our best people on it. You're doing great. No promises. No guarantees. Just something soft enough to hold on to. But when nothing feels certain, you hold on to hope and trust. But for the parents of these twins, that trust became heavy the moment the alarm sounded. Something is wrong. Their baby voice condition has deteriorated suddenly. Hours later, they're holding him, but not in the way they had hoped. In a later victim-impact statement,

his parents would describe how, quote, "we never got to hold our little boy while he was alive."

Dr. Jairam was there that night. There was no clear answer he could give the parents. Years later, during his testimony during Lucy Leppi's trial, Dr. Jairam would recall the awful conversation he had to have with the parents that night. It was a difficult situation,

“he'd say. When the first thing you have to tell a family is that, number one, I'm not sure what's”

going on. And number two, I don't think we're going to be able to bring him back. With their daughter still in intensive care, the parents were forced to do the impossible. To grieve one child while hoping for the other. Baby A's nurse, Lucy Leppi, makes them a memory box, a lock of hair, a footprint, a tiny knitted hat. Years later, in a court of law, these Momentos would take on a very different meaning.

One day later, the alarm sounds again. This time their daughter, the surviving twin, has collapsed. Thankfully, the doctor's intervene in time. Neo-Natal Medicine is a world built on watchfulness. Doctors and nurses are used to things changing suddenly, to alarms, to emergencies, to living in a constant state of readiness. Because these babies are fragile, unbelievably fragile. Here's Jenny again.

Even changing their nappy can cause them to have a bleed in their brain. People just don't realize how sensitive these babies are. Like, they're very rare, but it can happen. Most days, they manage to pull babies back from the edge. And then, they're the days that stay with them forever.

“What happens during those 48 hours, left with the nurses and doctors on the unit in shock?”

Of course, these twins had names, but because the courts ruled that none of the names of the babies in this case could ever be made public, they came to be known as baby A and baby B.

One day, the UK justice system would officially recognize baby A as the first known victim

of a serial killer nurse. Now, I want to be careful here, as it's hard for me to truly grasp what these parents lived through. Although I myself have experienced what it's like to have a newborn in the hospital, to then be told that the person you trusted with your baby's life may have been the one who took it. It's unimaginable.

And yet, regardless of where the truth ultimately lies, this is the reality these parents have been living inside. When I spoke to Dr. Phil Hammond,

“who you may remember from episode 1, we discussed the power of grief.”

How it forces one to search for answers, and for the parents in this case.

The parents as a border by the law is a still absolutely convinced of her guilt, because they've spent so much of their life invested in this, imagine the emotion of the verdict of all that stuff. Tragedically, four days after baby B collapses, baby C dies, a boy, and eight days after that, a baby girl, baby D, three deaths and one unexplained collapse in two weeks.

Even on a unit where the babies are compromised, this was unusual. The staff tended to see three baby deaths a year. Three and two weeks was a crisis. By the end of that summer, the NICU at the countest would be forever changed. There were more collapses, more funerals, parents brought in balloons for milestones,

only to leave with condolences, and quietly a question began to swirl amongst the staff. Why is this happening?

“So I remember within the hospital, within our team at Handover,”

it was a regular topic of conversation. These are the words of Dr. Rachel Lambe, read by an actor. They are from transcripts of her testifying at a public inquiry, which was set up right after Lucy Lepy's conviction. This inquiry had a very specific mandate to figure out if let be the serial killer

could have been stopped sooner. Back in 2015, Dr. Lambe was still a doctor in training. In England, doctors in training are referred to as registrars or junior doctors.

Dr. Lambe was one of the first people on the scene when baby A's alarm went off.

She was there the next night too when his twin sister, baby B collapsed. By the time baby C and D die, everyone is on high alert. Here's an actor again, reading a section of testimony from Dr. Lambe during the inquiry. I remember on more than one occasion, almost a hump, think feeling of, oh gosh, what's going to happen today.

In this moment of crisis, a fissure begins to form amongst the staff. On one side are the registrars and the nurses. They're looking to the senior doctors in charge, the consultants for answers. On the other side are the consultants, there are seven of them. Together, they're responsible for all of the children who passed through the building,

from the most premature of babies to the 17 year old with a broken leg. Dr. J. Ramm leads the pediatric department and Dr. Breary, the neonatal unit. The consultants don't have any answers for the sudden spade of baby deaths,

Dear all, Rachel Lambe came to see me this morning.

This is how one of the consultants, Dr. John Gibbs, begins in email to the six others, the day after baby D's death. Here's an actor reading what he wrote. About the recent neonatal deaths in collapses. Rachel also said that all the neonatal nurses are very worried. They feel we ought to be doing something. Although, I've mentioned,

we are looking into this, I'm not sure exactly how this is being done.

“I think a meeting would be useful, even if we have no answers.”

In an effort to put the others at ease, Dr. Breary says that he and the head of the neonatal nursing team have carefully gone over the details of the three recent deaths, to see if there's anything connecting them. But as he would tell the BBC years later. There was nothing in common that we could pin this three deaths on... Well, maybe there is one thing. Dr. Breary has gone through the work schedule for the nurses

and notices one nurse who has been on duty when all three babies died. The stuffing analysis did purm identify that Lucy Letbe was on shift for those three episodes. A pattern starts to emerge. In August of 4th baby dies, Lucy Letbe was his nurse. In September, Lucy Letbe is on duty when one of two babies died. In October,

“another baby, Lucy Letbe is on duty again. In December, another, and again,”

Lucy Letbe was there. 8 deaths by the end of the year. Lucy Letbe is present for 7.

For Dr. Breary, what could be dismissed at first as mere correlation is hardening

into a strong basis for suspicion. I'm Nancy Glass, host of the burden of guilt season 2 podcast. This is a story about a horrendous lie that destroyed two families. Late one night, Bobby Gumpride became the victim of a random crime. He pulls the gun. Tells me to lie down on the ground.

He identified Termine Hudson as the perpetrator. Termine was sentenced to 99 years. I'm like, "Lord, this can't be real. I thought it was a mistaken identity." The best lie is partial truth.

“For 22 years, only two people knew the truth, until a confession changed everything.”

I was a monster. Listen to burden of guilt season 2 on the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, this is Wells Adams with, "By Order of the Faithful's podcast alongside my fellow faithfuls and co-hosts, Tamarajudge, and Delores, Katania. The three of us have been watching this season of the traitors, and we've been inside that castle, so we have insight unlike many others.

This season of the traitors may be the best we've ever seen. Listen to, by order of the faithfuls on America's number one podcast network, iHeart, follow by order of the faithfuls, and start listening on the free iHeart Radio app today." I went and sat on the little Ottoman and front of him, and I said, "Hi dad!" And just when I said that, my mom comes out of the kitchen, and she says, "I haven't cooked these

amul, these have bad-asked congregants, just finished five years. I haven't have cooked these amul, amul. Yeah." On the Steena Show podcast, each episode invites you into a raw unfiltered conversations about recovery, resilience, and redemption. On a recent episode, I sit down with actor, cultural icon Danny Treo talked about addiction, transformation and the power of second chances, the entire season two is now available to bench,

featuring powerful conversations, the guest-like Tiffany Addish, Johnny Knoxville, and more.

I'm an alcoholic, and without this true, I'm a guy. Open your free iHeart Radio app. Search the Seedow Show, and listen now. It's the new me, and it's the old them. Everybody's on the journey, and the old Jenny's different to this. This woman's history month, the podcast, if you knew better with Amber Grimes, spotlights women who turned missteps into momentum, and lessons into power.

I didn't know that then, because I very much used my creativity to romance the size life.

“And I'm like, my mom did a really good job of like, you step back and you're like, whoa,”

we, I don't know how we made it. So, a lot of my life was like, built out of like, survival to get to the next place. Like, my drive, my tunnel vision of like, I got to be better. I got to achieve this, was off the strength of like, I want to make a better life for us. If you knew better, brings real talk from women who've lived it, unpacking career pivots, relationship lessons, and the mind set shifts that changed everything. Listen to if you

knew better with Amber Grimes on the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. I'd like to speak to the families. Sorry, sorry for my part, not being able to protect your babies. I tried my best, and I acknowledged that at times, my best was not good enough. That's an actor reading from transcripts of Dr. Breary, testifying at the inquiry about a year and a half ago. He looks much older now.

Older perhaps than you might expect, the rosy-cheeked doctor and the light-hearted fundraising videos to be. The toll of the last 10 years is clearly visible in his appearance.

Dr. Breary was the first of the consultants to notice a correlation

between Lucy Letbe's work shifts and the deaths of babies. The way he says he remembers it, and it actually bend the head of the neonatal nurses, Arian Powell, who had pointed the correlation out to him, and that his instinctive reaction had been to say, "Oh no, not Lucy, not nice Lucy." He was asked about this at the inquiry.

“Well, your mind jumped to something to say, "Oh no, didn't it?" Yes. What did it jump to?”

The concern that there might be somebody harming babies. Yeah. As the number of deaths kept climbing, and Lucy Letbe kept being there when they happened, the association, as he would take to calling it, would come to dominate Dr. Breary's mind. It would also put him at loggerheads with the nursing leader who he had said had originally pointed out the association to him, and who was Lucy Letbe's boss.

To the nursing leader, Arian Powell, the correlation with Letbe's shifts told them nothing about why these babies had died. In an email to Dr. Breary after yet another death, she wrote, "It is unfortunate that she was on." However, each cause of death was different, some were poorly prior to their arrival on the unit. As more and more babies die, there are more meetings and more views by Breary and Powell.

These discussions grow to include others, the nursing manager for the whole hospital, a neonatologist from a top hospital in Liverpool who his friends with Dr. Breary.

But always with Breary and Powell arguing from opposite ends, which Powell was grilled about

at the inquiry. Letbe was protected because she occupied an intersection between two things. She was a nurse who was being criticised by the doctors, and she was a nurse who you liked.

“And that's why she was protected. Isn't it? I think Elm is taking liking with actually”

supporting Elm stuff. Paul points to other factors. Several of the babies had unservivable birth defects. Many others had serious worsening infections by the time they died. All but one of the babies had autopsies, none of which flagged anything suspicious. In those meeting rooms, two stories kept colliding. And for a long time, the discussions continued.

But then, in June 2016, just over a year since the death of baby A, a set of triplet brothers are born at the Countess. They've been naturally conceived and are identical, sharing the same placenta, an incredibly rare thing. The kind of thing that only happens once every

200 million births. The triplets are born at 33 weeks by sea section and sent straight to the

neonatal unit. Their parents are told not to worry. The babies just need some time to grow. But on the brothers' second day of life, their parents are confronted with a scene of total chaos.

His dad would later say during his testimony in court that it was like E.T. stomach, like a pot belly. The doctors tell the parents they don't know what's going on, but they are trying their best to save him. At one point, the dad would recall. It was like they were trying anything.

The doctors aren't able to save him, and the baby boy dies. The next day, the second of the triplets die.

In a scene so similar and chaotic to the day before, that the mother, during the trial,

“would later describe it as deja vu. She would remember a young doctor "gugling" what to do.”

In two days, two of their babies have died. The parents plead to have their surviving son transferred to a different hospital. For Dr. Breary, it was obvious what had happened. Lucy let be, had murdered both boys. She'd been on duty both days and been put in charge of both babies. Dr. Breary would later tell the police about the way Lucy let be had smiled

and said hello to him the morning before the first triplet had died. He would wonder out loud

if she'd been taunting him. After these two deaths, the management knew they had to make changes. There was no more discussion to be had. They agreed to get let be off the unit. She shift

“off to a back office in another department at the hospital and given an excuse to cover up the”

real reason for the move that all the neonatal nurses would be moved out for a period of time and she was just the first one up. So the consultants get what they want. Lucy let be off the unit. But the hospital executives aren't finished. They too are concerned about the spike in baby deaths but think the explanation lies elsewhere. They see an overburdened unit and believe they should hit the pause button on taking in so many babies, especially ones that are so vulnerable.

The manager is agreed to remove let be on the condition that the unit also be downgraded.

They downgraded the unit to a level one, which was in June 2016. A level one unit is basically

“just special care. So you're not taking any sick babies at all. You do of course always still”

get sick babies because you can't predict what's coming into the maternity doors. But the sickest babies and the ones who are especially premature would now be transferred to bigger more specialized hospitals straight after birth. It's really frustrating for me when I hear people saying well after they took Lucy off there was no more deaths. Well that's true but there was no more sick babies either. On top of this, management invites the medical body responsible

for all pediatric care in the United Kingdom to come in and investigate. These are not easy compromises for the doctors. Downgrading the unit would be a hit to their reputation and they worry they will lose skills. They also feel they already had an answer for why so many babies are dying in their unit. Lucy let be was murdering them. This didn't need more medical reviews. It needed the police. Despite the consultant's

allegations that Lucy let be was on shift for each death, the review finds those beliefs to be based on gut feelings. The report states that, quote, "there was no other evidence or history to link nurse L to the deaths and her colleagues had expressed no concerns about her practice." This was a subjective view with no other evidence or reports of clinical concerns about the nurse beyond the simple correlation end quote. Rather than supporting the doctor's suspicions,

the final report points out other issues that needed to be dealt with on the understaffed, underfunded and overwhelmed unit. For the consultants, things seem to go from bad to worse.

because the consultants thought she was murdering babies. She files a grievance saying the hospital

“has not been honest about the reason for her redeployment and that the doctors had bullied and”

harassed her. She wins that grievance. The doctors are forced to apologize to her. They are told that she will be coming back. That is more than they can accept. The same month that Lucy let be is set to return, Dr. Jayram asks for a meeting with the head of HR. And in that meeting, he tells her a hair-raising tale that changed everything. "That is a night that is touched on my memory and will be in my nightmares forever."

This is Dr. Jayram on ITV News, describing how he had once walked in on Lucy let be,

trying to murder a baby. "Part of me was saying you better go in and just check everything's okay because you know what's happened before when Lucy's been on duty." It had happened a year earlier, but Dr. Jayram hadn't told anybody in management until now. Lucy let be was standing over a baby and the baby was struggling to breathe.

“As the baby was gasping for air, Lucy let be was doing nothing to help. "What was she doing?”

What was she just doing? She was standing there." This scene right out of a horror movie

is finally enough to get the police involved.

"What was clear at that point was that Lucy let be was the consistent in all of this. She was there the thread running through the mall." "Just take a seat in that formulate suit." "That's next time." "On doubt, the case of Lucy let be." "Doubt, the case of Lucy let be is brought to you by Vespucci, I-Heart Podcasts and Knox Robinson Productions. I've been your host Amanda Knox." This episode was written by Joe Meek,

Clucy de Oliveira and Natalia Rodriguez. The co-producers were Clucy de Oliveira and Lucy Richmond. Senior Producer is Natalia Rodriguez, audio mix by Tom Bittle. The theme music was written by Tom Bittle. Story editing by Kathleen Goldhard, legal advice was provided by Jack Browning, the producers at I-Heart Podcasts are Chandler Mays and Katrina Norville. The executive producers were Joe Meek, Amanda Knox, Christopher Robinson, Daniel Turkin,

and Johnny Galvin. Thank you for listening. I'm Nancy Glass, host of the burden of guilt season two podcast. This is a story about a horrendous lie that destroyed two families. Late one night, Bobby Gumpride became the victim of a random crime. The perpetrator was sentenced to 99 years until a confession changed everything. I was a monster. Listen to burden of guilt season two on the I-Heart Radio app,

Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, this is Wells Adams with, by order of the Faithful's podcast alongside my fellow Faithful's and co-hosts, Tamara Judge and Dolores Catenya. The three of us have been watching the season of the traders, and we've been inside that castle, so we have insight unlike many others. This season of the traders may be the best we've ever seen. Listen to by order of the Faithful's on America's

number on podcast network, I-Heart, follow by order of the Faithful's and start listening on the free I-Heart Radio app today. When segregation was a law, one mysterious black club owner, Charlie Fitzgerald, had his own rules. "S aggregation in the day, integration at night."

“It was like Cephan on another world. Was he a businessman, a criminal, a hero?”

Charlie wasn't an example, a poem, they had a crush in. Charlie's place, from Atlas Obsjura and Visit Mertal Beach. Listen to Charlie's place on the I-Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Almost 30 years together, four kids and some of reality TV's most unforgettable moments, we're taking you behind the scenes in our podcast between us, with me, Heather DeBrow. And me, Terry DeBrow. The unfiltered, behind closed doors,

But what's the latest rumor I'm gay, right? First of all, if I were gay, I would be. Jay! Open your free I-Heart Radio app, search between us and listen now.