Feature: The Lonesome Hearts Column with NPR’s Code Switch (plus an announcement!)

Update number one. I'll just get right to it

Season two is in the works You told your friends about the show they listened and left comments and reviews and sent so many encouraging emails and DMs a lot of them

“Tell me what kind of black they are which I think is very funny and they and you joined the household”

Over the summer this community of donors just grew and grew and now I have so much more help Covering the cost of production and research and all these archival subscriptions that I have to have now We're still an indie production. It's still lean and mean after our day jobs we grind type be you know But thanks to the day ones and the new members. I can say that I will be back with another season of our ancestors were messy in 26 if you would like to join the household and

Support this independent production and access directors commentary for episodes bonus episodes even if you're interested in those You can go to our ancestors were messy. Supercast.com. The link is also in the show notes and For updates and information about this show, you can follow our ancestors were messy on Instagram All right, update number two. I am going to put out a couple episodes before I release season two Starting right now

This is when I did back in 2024 with the team at NPR's code switch

The show's host Jean-Dembe and B.A. Parker. We're amazing

Invite me on to talk about the black press in their society and gossip coverage and I asked if I could just like real quick Like in a casual way Take them through a 1937 singles column and see if Jean and I could find Parker a date

“You know, normal interview stuff and they said they were down. So that's what we did and that's what you'll hear”

You will also hear this version of me that had spent a couple years pitching our ancestors were messy to studios and being rejected Because the whole like black history and comedy and sound design. It's it's a tough sow So the Nicole that you're going to hear she's really excited that anybody cares about this topic She is a little deflated and she has no idea that as she speaks she's already been accepted into the tryback of festival You can hear all about that journey on mini-sode for but for now

I hope you enjoyed this episode and our talk and can appreciate the fact that there is nothing new under the sun Morrison Her name is Nicole Hill and I am a storyteller. I primarily tell stories in audio Nicole tell stories about every day Regular declarative black and brown folks who are looking for Belonging people trying to make sense of their places in the world

She does that on her show the secret adventures of black people and most recently She did that for Tracy Ellis Rossa series. I am America and the coal loves love I grew up in a family of women who love pride and prejudice We love like old black and white movies from the 30s from the 40s from the I love it She said come Christmas time. It's hallmark movies period

I want to see all the Christmas tree farmers get all the big city women to leave their high pressure job and come help them raise their child I don't care. I'm a feminist. I know it's backwards. It doesn't matter to me But as much as she loved those movies, she noticed that there were hardly ever any black folks in them So at a certain point she started looking forward to stinkly black love stories and what she found was a Treasure trove

Thousands upon thousands of these archival black newspapers and they were filled with personal ads from black people Trying to find love and those papers went all the way back to the 1890s and the coal very graciously agreed to share with us Some of what she learned from reading hundreds and hundreds of articles from these old newspapers about What black love looked like in the past and what that can teach us about how we should understand our present and She got into all of that by asking us a very intriguing question

What's the oldest love story you know? I mean the oldest love story I know is my probably my grandparents because they they can think of the 1930s in North Carolina They met as teenagers in a potato field The substance Romance

“That's probably literally somebody they're tired. You're trying to cross the what does a potato field look like?”

I just imagine them both with like a big sacks and just putting potatoes in them and then looking at each other from across the field

They're eyes meet who which grandparent do you think made the first move? Oh my grandpa for sure

This is it's like here in my grandpa Roy right now

“Wait, do you what's yours? So the most important form of love story for me involves”

A fictional human university over the college. I'm talking about different worlds. I'm talking about different way in Wayne Wayne and Whitley Gilbert having this on again off again thing and so Whitley Gilbert was a marry this dude who's run a facinette His name is Barry. It's have the boy Anyway, that getting married is just really dramatic wedding and to Wayne interrupts the wedding and he's like baby, please Please, baby, please

He breaks up their wedding. They run off together

I guess the idea is they split up happy but obviously that's ridiculous now. I was a grown-up as a grown-up who has done some healer

No, but But as a as a 10 or 11 year old. Yes, yes, absolutely So two very different kinds of love story But Nicole you've been reading about hundreds of different kinds of love stories in your research going through old black newspapers Can you talk about some of what you learned so one of my favorite papers that I found is the Washington Afroamerican

Which is a subsidiary of the Baltimore Afroamerican which still exists today? Yes, it did what I really love about it is

“Of course they're covering all the national and international news headlines all the important things”

But the thing that's unique about them is you know all the black papers around the country Primarily the Chicago defender and the Pittsburgh Courier are really focused on the fight on Helping black people to gain their independence to organize politically and socially and fight for justice But people are people and so you know Sometimes to get people to drink their medicine

You want to give them a little bit of sugar and so what the papers would do is they would publish gossip They would publish love poems They would publish little things that the public might like you know when they're tired of reading about the struggle Now papers like the defender and the courier were hesitant to do those things The Washington Afroamerican they were like let's go give us all the drama give us all the gossip

We will run this right after we do, you know you're important stuff and go vote do all of that But then also flips the back page and so then find out who's getting divorced Come for the drama and the solution to all the tea and stay for the breakdown of the new deal Essentially these newspapers were like Instagram updates back in the day and they're talking about love Love love we're talking love poems love scandals advice on how to find love advice on how to get out of love and people searching for it

I need that now what did a thirst trap look like 1330 some curds okay, so this was no they had them they had them Don't even worry about it. They were there only ever women though of course You know, so it's a lot of bathing soup picks just women at the beach or a beauty contest. Well, this was the thirst This is how they were trying to lay traps for women back in the day was a lot of like girl. I got a job

the end You know That so tough it's still right now, so when I'm reading these papers what was really interesting to me is You know, we talk so much about how dating is really hard. Now our parents give us advice on

“You should do this and it's like you don't understand the context in which we're living in”

I'm reading these papers and I'm seeing like you know what if people in 1937 are talking to their parents

Yeah, their parents were the first generation of people to ever be born free in America

They're not having a good time not everybody I don't want to paint a broad brush but so many the overwhelming majority are just figuring out how to be free in America And their love stories are coming during the tail end of this kind of Victorian era like we're going to get together for Economics because it's socially acceptable You know kind of like a more rigid form of love and then their grandparents were enslaved and their love stories

They're I mean they're hard to even know if they shared them at all and so what they would have imagined for themselves when it came to love May have been pretty limited but by 1937 Black people are in the midst of the Great Migration cities are urbanizing the

Staggy

Religious I mean of course that still exists, but we're introducing this idea of

“You should find a person who sets your soul on fire who makes you feel”

Complete and whole and you should run off with them. You should be with them forever. You should marry for love a worse new concept exactly. I know right But it's new and what it means is we're no longer kind of looking over at Whoever the next sort of neighbor and just considering them We're maybe moving to a new city and looking out at everybody and wanting to go on dates and see how we feel

Are we vibing do I feel connected? Or am I bored

But tell us about this social and political life back then what was going on?

Okay, so it's 1937. That's the year we're gonna focus it on okay life expectancy for men Spot 58 years for women 62 How does like you gotta get in there and do it you got to live your life right now Not a lot of time FDR is the president Black people have voted in mass for him and we've actually been

Voting Democrat for the past 10 years after having left the Republican party or I guess you could say they left us Another way we're breaking for more parents at the summer right mm-hmm. That's exactly right outside of politics

I'm gonna tell you about pop culture. I'm gonna tell you what people are getting into for fun. Okay. Okay, okay

So 1937 there's this new thing that was introduced at the world fair is called television Okay, people are saying it's gonna be huge The most famous person in America is probably Shirley Temple right on the biggest book the Hobbit by J. R. R. Tolkien that just came out Wow, your big pop stars the top of the charts Billy holiday and Duke Ellington and Taste exactly we're living in that time and there's a really really popular dance

It's called the big Apple dance why people have stolen it from black people same as it ever was The same and then if you're living in the cities you are going out That is what it is about it is about hanging out with your friends hanging out at church hanging out with colleagues Having fun. It's this idea that you could go to cities in the north That were still segregated but had black communities, you know like a city like DC

Let's say which has the highest concentration of black people in the nation you have Howard University and Howard University is the capstone of negro education in America and so all these people the doctors and the lawyers And the great thinkers of that day are going to Howard and then they're settling all around you street Which they called black Broadway at that time and so you get there and you're seeing 200 black-owned shops and businesses

“I think it would be kind of fun to see if”

Maybe Gene and Parker or maybe one of you both of you. I don't know your situation But to see if you could find somebody that you would maybe write to in 1937 to go on another date with I am I'm a perpetually single black woman in America who's looking for love in 1937. I feel like I would crush it in 1937. I feel like I would do great. Are you kidding me with my skill sets? Okay, what are your skills sets? I love this attitude. Um, yes. I can't cook

Probably I can kind of clean but I also have a rumble. Can you like so? I can darn like socks and stuff That's helpful. That's helpful. But like if you need like a dissertation on Titus and Dronicus or um you want to know about Vincent Manelli's film techniques when he made Hallelujah I'm back girl and I'm here and I'm sure there's a nice sensible black man at that time who would love to hear these things while I spend his money

“Okay, and what kind of a man is Parker looking for both today and 1937 or is there different?”

Well, um present day I find you know just a tall big dude to cry a lot and listen to the speed metal But if you go back in time like you know I would love a nice farmer just a kind man funny he could be taller than me. He doesn't have to be and I'm not kind of tall likes art doesn't have to understand it but at least enjoy is it

Nebulus that's so much to ask is it nice um a non-missoginistic for that time

Okay, he's adjusted for the time. He's adjusted for the time. Okay. Okay. Well, I'm going to introduce you to the Lonesome Hearts column which is essentially these are the apps of 1937 It's on page 18 of your local paper in DC the Washington Afroamerican and the editor is a man named Albertine Ash Albertine. It sounds like a chemical Aspiration. Bigly cancer is bigly carcinogen. Okay. So he runs this column. He's been running it for years and he's got some specific

instruction. Okay. This is what Albert said. He said this column is for sincere lonely hearts. Please do not write flowery language and fictitious names lonely hearts are not to be played with. All right now. I missed

“it. I should like definitely like a motel there. I think it's a good idea to check out the competition”

to get a sense of what they're saying. So these are the women who are writing and under the column that says husbands wanted. Husbands wanted not even like you know boyfriend to see what's not a good thing. Well, this is the thing. He's name in the column husband's wanted. People are saying they're open. All right. Okay. So we're reading in between lines here. Modern individuals. I'm going to read you this letter assigned brown eyes. Hello. Mm-hmm. To loan some hearts editor,

I am 19. Light brown five feet six inches tall. Black hair with a medium length wavy bob, play piano, like to keep house, like children, and I'm considered quite good looking and charming. My father left me a legacy, which I can't receive until I'm married. I suppose he thought I would run through it, uselessly, alone. But I will share it with the man that I consider for marriage.

“I could never marry my present boyfriend for reasons untold. All right. I want to know what”

those reasons untold might be. So I want some tall handsome, neat, lovable brown skin man between 25 and 30 to write and send me a picture of himself in credentials. He must be a college man with a good disposition, clean, not drink excessively, industrious, and know how and when to invest. He must be a real he-man of athletic field, but not under six feet brown eyes.

First of all, I mean, maybe some of my 337, you know, the depression is still kind of like,

maybe waning, but it's still happening. Like, people ain't getting enough nutrition. You know what, brown eyes, I understand. I get what she's, where she comes from. I mean, I'm not saying she, her, her standards are too hot. I'm just saying like, why she wants all of the things. I Steve Harvey. No. I'm not saying she should lower her standards. I'm just like, and maybe in DC, you know, maybe use it to find a college educated dude.

Near Howard, she's like, let's tell. I feel like she's narrating the playing field. Pre Civil Rights Act, something like, uh, four percent of my people. So, I mean, I'm just saying, maybe education in particular might be a thing that might be like a high threshold across. I catch you. Okay, Jane, you have just one more column, just to give you a sense of feel for what the ladies are asking of the men. Yes. So, okay. This one is from someone in Smiling Peggy

to the loan some hearts editor. I would love to meet some nice gentlemen plural between the ages of 24 and 29. Employed, lover of church and movies, all good clean fun and color doesn't matter. I am brown skin, considered nice looking by my friends, five foot five, weigh 156 pounds, high school graduate, regularly employed, not interested in any man who has been married.

I will answer all letters promptly and give a fuller description of my second composition. Hi, Peggy.

She likes movies, just like you movies, church, a man with sense, an a job, a job. I feel like you and Peggy are looking for something closer to the same thing. You mean, a more rational version of a man? It went brown ass. It was looking for it. It's brown out.

“That's what everything. All right. So, you got the lay of the land. You got to feel for it.”

I should say when people say color doesn't matter what they mean because we are 1937, it doesn't matter if you're light skin or your dark skin or your brown. Well, though, there's more mention of dark skin. They mean light skin or brown skin. Nobody mentions dark skin. These colorist people, I know my people are left out. Everybody just says color doesn't matter. And we all, we should follow those york hands, we all dark brown, all of the three of them.

Chocolatey people. How do you find for a lot? Every day. Even back then. You're back then.

Gina and I have both made selections for you. All right, Gina, you better have done right by me.

I'm trying to always try to do right by you part. All right, Nicole. Nicole, I don't really know you,

but I trust you. Gina, I know you and you going to do me dirty. I'm not going to do that promise again.

“And I am like a producer and a reality show. So, who knows what I want to do?”

I'm most sad. What's gonna happen? What's gonna happen? What's gonna happen? Oh, potster. Okay. All right. Okay. Okay. I'm ready. Let's go. Let's take turns. We'll go one in one. So, Gina, I'll go first. I'll share my first one. Okay, Parker. Please meet bachelor number one. To the Lonesome Hearts editor. X-mailman went wrong. Desires the friendship

of a broad-minded and successful woman between the ages of 25 and 55. I am at present employed

on WPA, but it's spec better, very soon. I am 39, light brown, five feet, four inches, weigh 165 pounds, like medium sized, with a dignified appearance. I once owned my own home in car. I am affectionate

“and will try to be a good husband. Was in government service 14 years before real estate investment”

as well as others caused my downfall. X-mailman. X-mailman. I mean, I was with you, but I feel like that's gonna be some evenings. He and I at a lot. What do you mean? What do you mean? This is being like me trying to take me down? I'm gonna have to hide my money in a loose brick in the living room

and all of a sudden it's going to go missing because he's got a new investment deal. He must

do right. He's gonna be like, I promise. I just need the right woman to turn around between the ages of 25 and 55. He's like, it don't matter. It don't matter. A broad-minded and successful woman. Now, you are successful and you would love it if you had already achieved some of that success and you would just bring it on home to him. Pass. Pass. Pass. Pass. Hard. I just typed it past. As an agent. Okay, y'all. That's fine. All right, Jean, you're up. Okay. To the loan some

hearts at an end. I'm a widow. My wife has been dead nearly four years. I'm on my home, a farm, and six room house. I'm getting old. Where's he old? I'm getting old, but I'm not too old to take care of an honest and kind woman who is strictly a one-man woman. As I'm a one-woman man, I'm an April born man. And if you don't mind, please give me your birth month. No harm in giving out

“our birth dates as the only thing under the sun that makes a good man or good woman is a good”

principal. Signed Eastman. Just boy, what you said, I'm just curious of Parker. Do you have any idea why I thought that person might be a good match for you? Because you know, I'm in a strategy group. Yes. Oh my gosh. You give me a shot. That's how he does something right by you. Oh my god, that's my moon side. I was like, I feel like you'll be on the same page. Oh my god. So he's he's got a job. He's got a farm. He's got a six-bedroom house. He's getting older. So he might get gone soon.

So I can get that house and also to the cause point like older. And that's, if you live in a 58, older could be like 30. You know what I'm saying? Yeah, half way. Sure. I know right now. And he did not mention kids. Oh, that's right. He did it. Oh, I can make this work. Oh, a nice, a nice, kind, airy's older man with a life together. He's, I mean, he's up there right now. Okay. We're working through it. Like, I mean, RRP to the wife number one, but I might be wife

number two. I mean, she might have been like a lever or something. You know, I mean, like that's probably why. We don't know what happens. Exactly. That's one vote for Eastman. Okay. Eastman, we can make it work. All right. Next up. To the Lonesome Hearts editor, I am an artist, 43, dark brown skin, 5 feet, 8 inches, 885 pounds, neat with black curly hair and have been in show business over 15 years, owned my home in the West. And I expect to go back as soon as my contracts here expire.

What's the problem? Now, just know that people say what they want, but everybody, you know,

“we have to be flexible with our athletes. All right. I would like to meet a refined widow, 40 to 45.”

I can't, I'm sorry. I'm, I'm not in my 40s and I'm not a widow. Yeah, but this is what he's saying. And he, you know, we can't just rule people out. Like he thinks that's case scenario. Oh, widow. But you might be open. Let's see. Let's see if you would still be willing to write to him. One who can appreciate a nice home with pleasing surrounding. I am willing to marry if I can find the right type, but she must be that type girl or you will be wasting your paper. Color and looks

mean nothing. Character is what counts with me. Artist, don't. All right. Okay, so quick question. What do you think he specifically asked for a widow? Maybe she got money? I feel like that could be

part of it. The stigma attached to a woman who was 40 or 45 and has never been married might be,

“because he's asked for a refined widow. So that also seems to be code of like, I would like you to have”

a little bit of money, a little bit class, it's very specific. And I feel like I could wait out for my neck and cold. Like I don't need, I can wait this out. I don't know about him. Okay. All right, then, Jean. All right, got one more for you there before you, before you make up your mind parker about who you forever choose going to be. Okay. To the most of hearts editor, I'm 36 years old, round skin weigh 138.5 pounds as a very specific barber by trade, a steady

worker and a church man, do not drink or gamble. I would like to get in touch with some refined

girl who was looking for a one woman man for a husband. Color doesn't matter what I want as happiness at home. I would indeed appreciate a wife, one whose ways and ideas are similar to mine. I'm quiet, old fashioned myself. I desire one who enjoys the same things I do. As movies, radio, reading and church, her height five three to six feet, weight 120, age does not matter. We'll exchange photos. Signed Homer. I do like the name Homer. It's a show. Old, sound me well.

All right, we got 36-year-old barber. He likes church. He likes movies, radio. And a barber back then, like, would have been like a pill of the social hub, right? Yeah, and like he would have been connected, you know. Okay, so Homer said that he was old fashioned. What do we think that means? He seems very traditional. I don't know if he would love the independence that I see. Right, because old fashioned in 1937 is like 1901 to get Korean vibes.

They're like, I saw Parker talking to some man on the corner and what were you doing talking to him? Like, I was about to grow. I can't believe they letting these women read these things. Exactly. Like, that would be your right. That would be about or like she went out and she didn't have gloves on her hands. People could see her dirty hands. Like, she's tempting men, you know. Oh, he's going to tear my books and have. No, wife of mine is going to be reading this

still. Oh, my God, my goodness. James Joyce. Lex, the huge, what, what do we know about these Negroes? What? Oh, my God, we had ideas. Is he trying to put in your head? I'm just thinking about, okay, at Eastman's house, I could turn one of those bedrooms into like an office in a library. You could knock that a wall. Oh, my God. You could absolutely knock that a wall. The options are endless. In a farm style house, that's so popular right now. Oh, my God,

HGTV would be on me. They knew. What do you know about farm life? I expect my summer is as a kid

“on a farm. Oh, my God. You know, I've seen, I've seen live stock get, get chopped, you know what I mean?”

Like, I know, I know that it's some of the ins and outs. I would, I would have to learn but, oh, oh, my God. We have made a hallmark movie for me in my relationship with Eastman. Oh, my God. Okay, so I thought like you made your final decision. I feel like I, I mean, Eastman, I could take him on leave him. He seems well adjusted for the time. He could be a partner. He's an aries. He's an aries. So he's an independent thinker. As no queries. You already know as no queries.

I already am, I know you know, you know the vibes. Um, and I as a convivial isolationist,

best case scenario. Best case scenario, and I'm not that far from DC if he's sitting on lettuce

“to the paper. Uh-huh. I, I can see the vision. Jean, I, this is the most kudos I will ever give you.”

He did it. He did it. He did it. He did good. This is the most, I mean, I found you. Well, I have a blue like it. You found me, if I have a blue, you found me a farmer who's into astrology. That is like taught to you. I, I want that net. All that means to me is that you're a, uh, a thirteenth of the woman who lives in Brooklyn. There's so much to be said about the beauty of everyday life and in particular what fascinates me about this time, about the, the people who came

right after slavery, who were born free. This first and second and third generations,

“they're imagining what being black could be. And they're trying on a lot of different”

identities. They're trying real estate investments, maybe they're failing. Farmers and businessmen and trying out traveling. There's a lot of people that papers, especially in Chicago, would tell stories that it's in their correspondence around the world. And they would just write back stories of this is what life looks like in London. Did you know there are black people in Italy and people are wondering could a black person travel, could a black person be a writer? Some of

these papers publish short fiction. I love to read these papers and see them imagine what black

life could be. I, I'd never imagined that they were dreaming so big. I think my pictures just

that they're suffering, but they're imagining so much for us and we're living that now and

“that's what I really love about visiting the past in this way. Are you saying that I'm going to hate”

myself a saying this? Do it. I know. I know. Go ahead. We are ancestors while this dream. There it is. Nicole Hill is a storyteller who hosts the podcast, the secret adventures of black people. Thank you for coming over. This is so much fun. Thank you for having me. I'm sorry that I didn't find you a better boo. It's okay. It's all right. This was an absolute delight. I've learned

a lot and I've learned not to underestimate you or the stars. And that's our show. You can follow us on Instagram @nprcoastwitch. If email is more you think ours is code switch at npr.org and don't forget to subscribe to our newsletter. You can do that at npr.org/coastwitch newsletters and subscribe to the podcast on the npr app or wherever you get your podcasts. We just want to give a quick shout out to our code switch plus listeners. You appreciate y'all. Thank you for being subscribed.

When you subscribe, the code switch plus it means you can take us into all of our episodes with outsponsor breaks and it also helps support our show. So if you rock with us, if you like our work, please consider signing up at plus.mpr.org/coastwitch. This episode is produced by Jess Khan, who is edited by Leah Denala. Our engineer was Maggie Lufar. And a big shout out to the rest of the code switch massive Christina Calla, Xavier Lopez,

Dalian Matata, Violin Williams, and Loyalisa Aga. I'm B.A. Parker. I'm Gene Demby. Be my valentine. D.E.C. Share Glass and I.J. Oh, somebody's going black. Okay. I know. There's some in. Oh, okay. So this is... I don't get you much away. I'm sorry. It's so fun. So it is like the BLK app after all. Have you been on that, Everrow? Yeah, it's all sudden a random ass white man is in the mix and I'm like, where did my code come from?