Episode #103 Featuring Shawn Wells! The MOST TRUSTED Name in Supplements! ASTONISHING INSIGHT from the wide world of supplements! Also discussions on Peptides, SARMS, Scams and MORE!

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for me today. I'm in a very famous setting. I would say at the Soundshed Studios, thanks to my guests today who set this all up and I'm traveling, doing a nice little run here in Austin, Texas, and I am beyond blessed as I was just telling my friend here before, but my guest

today is a close friend, first and foremost, so I can give him every accolade in the world

and give you an intro, but I want to make sure that I say he's my boy, and I met him through a friend of ours named Molly Eastman, and actually it's funny because I was checking out my friend's work, and she wrote me, and so I have a friend that wants to connect with you, and it was, I told my wife, I said, "Whoa!" I said, "This is a guy, it was just, I had my own, because I don't sit around and look and reach out for people very often anymore.

I did that when I got into the space, but it was just, it's God's work, but my friend today, listen, first and foremost, he has known as the most trusted voice and supplements,

“and that's why I was deferring to him beforehand and discussing everything, but I want”

to talk just a couple other things he's done, biochemists, sports nutritionist, he's a clinical dietitian, and he's helped people all over the world for many, many years, super-respected well-known, I can go on and on, but anyway, my friends, Sean Wells, thank you brother, that made it a lot, you're a great friend as well, and I'm looking forward to diving in here and glad it came out to Austin, and I'm stoked right now.

You know, I know that you made some sacrifices for me today, to even be here, cutting

a trip short, that most people would never dream of doing, and I appreciate you, I appreciate

everything more, so I appreciate the friendships and the discussions and the talks, and the voice notes and everything else, it's really nice because you have a lot of friends, but you have very few real friends, so thank you for that more than anything, thank you to him.

“Alright, so I've got a lot to talk about, I've been in the supplement industry since 2011,”

probably in and out, and I've seen a lot, I've done a lot, I've heard a lot, and I've been around a lot, I've seen the good, the bad, and the ugly. But I want to talk to you first about how you got into supplements, it in general, because it's a slippery slope when it comes to the whole game and how it works, and then I just want you to talk about some of the really bad things that have gone on and why you are

a beacon of hope in the industry. Yeah, thanks. For me, I guess I'll go all the way back, I'm 51 closing in on 52, my mom in the 70s was kind of a pioneer with this company shackly, she was obsessed with supplements, had the tackle box way before anyone else I know, and there was like the whole food, it was

called vitally multivitamin, and there's a, you know, vitamin E that she would break open, put on my wounds, a bad wounds, we had vitamin C, because Linus Pauling's work was just coming out on orthomolecular dosing of vitamin C, and the benefits it might have far beyond just scurvy, and vitamin C deficiency. But fast forward, so that was where I grew up with the belief that these tablets, capsules,

was bullying, there was a lot going on, and I became morbidly obese, I became very sick, I was going to school at a very prestigious business school, Bapsen, and getting my business

“degree, because that's what I was told to do, you know, just go out there, make money,”

I didn't know what really sparked my passion at that point, but I started working out, I was reading these magazines, reading these bodybuilding and cyclopedias, like from Arnold, there was these supplement review guides, and all these things that I was at G and C, I was at the time Barnes and Noble, or, you know, Walden books, or whatever reading all the magazines, and I was just obsessed with it, and I would spend like three, four

hours in a G and C just reading labels, and I believed in the power of the supplements, I believed in the power of working out, I started working out, and, you know, especially

when you're first working out, you know, you're moving up like a set of dumbbells every

time you go back to the gym, and it's super exciting, and at that same time of, yes, me working out, yes, protein, creatine had just dropped into the market, and it had radically changed the landscape of sports nutrition at the time, and with that came a lot of other innovation from companies like EAS, and I was just working out like crazy, taking all the supplements, seeing changes, and I went to my doctor in between my sophomore and junior year

for an annual physical, and I was telling them all about like my passion on this, and just how exciting it was, and all the changes, and he saw the changes in my body composition, my health,

“and it was very happy for me, and I remember seeing these ads, where there was this guy who I”

eventually got to meet Dr. Marve Hoyer with muscle tech, and he had like these colored bottles, and there's body builders in the lab with him, and I was like, "Fat's cool, I want to do that, and I was telling him all about this," and I thought he was just going to laugh at me and tell me that's stupid, and instead he drew out a lifeline for me and told me why not be happy between here and here, and that was the first person in my life that gave me permission to not do what's smart or what's

logical, but pursue my passion. You know, I didn't have the Tony Robbins the Oprah Winfrey, the Instagram, all the entrepreneurs, at that time, everyone was doing what they're told to do and working corporate. There were no entrepreneurs that I knew of for the most part, and that shifted

“everything for me. I'm like, "Yeah, I'm going to go back to school, even though it's going to be”

difficult." I'm going to get like two, three years worth of pre-rex and sciences, and then I'm going to get into my master's at a great school and I did at Chapel Hill, and then that led to me becoming a dietitian, and then I had to work as a chief clinical dietitian and long-term care and and acute care, like hospitals, but all the while on the evenings, on holidays, on weekends, I was working at supplement shops, I was working on at that time, a different forums for different

companies, doing white papers, going to be Arnold, the Olympia, doing all these kinds of things, and building my credit, and eventually after about 10 years of working clinically, I got on in industry to become the director of R&D at Dymatize, which is a massive company, and we help

take it to sales, to post for 425 million, and then that just set my whole career ablaze,

because one, I had worked at a top, one of the top, maybe like Vam and Optimum Nutrition, where at the top at the time, supplement companies and sports nutrition, and I helped sell a company. I was instrumental in taking that company to sales, and now all the sports nutrition companies were coming to me, and especially supplement companies that were looking to go to sale to private equity to strategic, we're seeking the out, and then I even started working

on my own ingredients, the background like T-creen and Dymatine were my first, and I've been about 40 cents, and I've formulated about 1200 products since, I've had a best-selling book, since called the Energy Formula, and of course, to go with it, I've been on mind valley with

ultimate guide to supplements, I've spoken 60 countries, like it's been amazing, from just a

absolutely amazing, Dymatize was pretty damn insanely big, I mean like you said, it was

“at that time that I remember optimum nutrition and dymatize, and there were just a couple”

others that were like the top four or five, so well known, that's amazing, man, so are you creating ingredient yourself? I have a team of 100 scientists that I work with in China and a business partner in China and in Beijing, and it is a pharmaceutical level multiple facilities, we work with a number of not only elite brands, but truly a number of pharmaceutical companies, so, you know, you may hear China, but this is like the most elite level of manufacturing and synthesis,

and as I'm saying, when you have 100 scientists, like you can create a lot of things, so I'll dream things up and literally like a week or two later, I have it in my hands, wow, and that's pretty exciting, so when we do synthesis, enzymatic, verbal extraction of a number of methods, fermentation, which I believe is the future, this bacteriologic fermentation, where you can create an ingredient cleanly by, you take like yeast and you modify it genetically, and then the

yeast can make this compound, and so instead of having like a starter material and solvents and all of this stuff, like normally with with the typical synthesis, synthetic ingredient, fermentation, it's just made, there is no like solvent, there's no like other starter products, I mean, besides like maybe glucose or something, so it's a really clean process, a vegan process, a sustainable

“process for the environment and for your health, and fermentations the future, so that's what we've”

been working heavily on, is making ingredients through fermentation, and then I've been very focused at shifting a lot of trends in the industry, like with NNB, the company that I created in ingredients with, we went to a new concept, the pure potent process, we're very focused on ready to drink in the industry, it's called RTD, so that's things like update here or

life cider or things like that, basically cans, bottles, etc, we're also in like ready to consume,

I would say, you know, things like oral pouches, gummies, sublingual strips, we're seeing the market mood shots, we're seeing the market move this direction because the ready to mix powders and then most certainly the tablets, soft gels, capsules are just not as popular anymore, especially with Gen Z and in particular Gen Alpha, they want ready to consume, is that more expensive, is that more complex? Yes, because you're flavoring it, there's stability issues, how well does it dissolve

into things, like with gummies, like is it stable and heat and the moisture and sugar and, you know, whatever it is, there's more complexity to it, but younger people just want to consume, whatever it is, they're having an enjoy that experience rather than choking down a handful of capsules or, you know, having too much powders and all those kinds of things, so with the market shift thing, our company is shifting and we're doing pure potent precise and so we are looking at

no herbal extractions, no extra biomass, you know, when something's a one percent or five percent,

that means that there's 99 percent or 95 percent other stuff than the active, you know, that's

going to settle to the bottom that's going to have what we call organic or basically taste issues, it'll have solubility issues, stability issues, work, putting that to the side, we're just doing pure compounds. Then we want potent, which means tiny doses, a lot of the things that we're working on, have like five, 10, 50 milligrams doses, very small doses, not typically like multi-gram doses. And then precise is around all the technologies that we're using for delivery and enhancing

stability, whether it's liposomes, microncapsulation, amolions, like a lot of these different things

“that we're looking at as well. So we're pioneering, I believe, what's coming next and we're”

setting the tone for that. There's a lot of difficulty, I think people don't understand, like, for instance, like with a creatine gummy or how much you can fit in there to where it actually

things that turn out bad. You guys are pretty precise with how you do that and how it works and

like the sugar contents and all of these things. I mean, I see these everywhere and I sit there

“and I ask myself, why would you sell some of these things with this much crap in there?”

I mean, do you advise people when they come to you? Do you tell them like this or do you say this is how it has to be? Because I'm curious because I see it and I sit there and I say, well, for people in our industry, super low. I mean, things like this that we speak out again, should I see so many of them being sold in front of all of the people that we work with? Tell me about that a little bit. Yeah, so I have another company called Zone Halo and I have a

team around that where we do formulations, QAQC, packaging, innovation, regulatory studies,

patent filings, third-party logistics, all the kinds of stuff and we definitely do

formulations like you're talking about and typically I'll tell you with creatine gummies in particular. You may have seen the data that now foods tested from Amazon as well as sub-co another new company. I knew app. They've looked at creatine gummies and between both of them, about 90, 90 to 95% of the products on the market are a bunk. And the reason this is is because creatine in particular converts to creatine under moisture. And so this is the problem

why you can't currently, you know, we're all trying to work on this. I'm working on this.

“I think the industry is trying to work on this, solving creatine in ready to consume and”

particularly ready to drink beverages because as soon as you put it in moisture, it starts converting to creatine. And therefore it is not stable and you won't deliver active creatine. You're delivering essentially inert creatine. And that was the case in all the testing that's been done. Even companies that have overages, I would say the only creatine candy, if you will, that I would trust that's not, it's not a gummy. I wouldn't trust that. But something that's more like in the

dry sweet tart kind of idea. I know muscle tech, Iovate, they make one. I think animal, which is a brand and sports nutrition, they make some creatine choose or sweet tarts or whatever, you know, smarty, you know, that kind of thing. That makes sense. Anything with significant moisture like a gummy or certainly a drink, it's not going to last, it's not going to test out. Further with Amazon and the testing that was done by now foods, who has been a

“just gold standard for 30, 40 years now. I love now foods, great price. And I think they were”

taking a beating because they've been in retail in particular, the mom and pop shops in supplements. And they've been taking a beating obviously from Amazon. And in particular, the Amazon choice

supplements that are basically whatever's cheapest. Yeah. And they have manipulated reviews.

And they did about 14 different single ingredients. And maybe as many as 20 or 30 different products on Amazon per ingredient. So think of like, asked a zanthin, verbberine, maybe it was like ginseng or, you know, something like this. And they tested out all these different products. And about 80% of them tested short of label claim about 30% of them had no active at all. And this is allowed on Amazon. So be careful what you're consuming. Be careful

what you're paying for just because it has a great price just because it has great reviews. I would be very reluctant to buy it. It is not a great company like a thorn, a pure encapsulations, Nordic natural, now foods, designs for health, zymogen, like some of these really great trusted names that have been around for multiple decades and have quality control departments bigger than these companies have employees. Think about that because I've been at these companies where we had

20 plus people in quality control just doing testing. These other companies that are on Amazon,

out dust in a capsule. Yeah. And not only that, what I also worry about is,

“yeah, we're talking about the things that you want in there not being in there.”

But what about the things you don't want in there being in there, like heavy metals, like bacteria, like some foreign substances or even band substances, if you're tested at your job, if you're a pro athlete, be very careful. This stuff can lead to health issues. Even companies that don't have great quality control and their contract manufacturers where they're made, there's been cases where they were off on the vitamin D by 10 or 100 fold. And then

people got very sick because there's way too much. Yeah. Yeah. And so I will just put this out there right now. Just please stop buying 10 bad supplements and just buy one really good supplement and start from there. And that's the scientific method, too, is to do one thing at a time, see how it works for you and then move to the next thing. So if you're going to add one thing, make sure it's the right thing and from a quality company and it's got what you want in there

and doesn't have what you don't want in there and then add another thing. But don't tell me how supplements don't work because you're using crap from Amazon that has saw dust in it and maybe some heavy metals, right? Because supplements absolutely do work and there's thousands and thousands of studies showing that. And I've been behind a number of these ingredients and formulas and I'm very proud of them and I take, I know people are shocked off and I'd take more than 100

“capsules a day probably. You know, almost 52 and I feel very young. I think my metabolic age”

was on a recent test was 33 years old. So I'm doing something right. Would you say then that on Amazon and we're going to just talk about Amazon briefly right now that as long as it's a company like you said a reputable company, you're still going to get what you're supposed to get or is there anything being faked or on their like if it says sold and distributed by Amazon or if it's coming from the said company store like should you even buy anything from there?

Yeah, great question. I love this question because it's very relevant. So be very careful

when some things third party seller on Amazon. You can, there's a lot of counterfitting on Amazon.

I have some of these elite brands that I was just talking about are the ones that get knocked off in sports nutrition. It is like a company like a muscle tech and, you know, in kind of wellness, it would be the now the gyro, the life extension, you know, these really great brands are the ones that get knocked off. In particular in foreign countries like India, it is about 85% of the supplements in India are counterfeit and have nothing in them. That's a whole other discussion.

But on Amazon 20 to 30% of these high quality products are also counterfits that's been found as well. So be very careful when you're purchasing on Amazon even these elite brands make sure you're buying them from a first party seller. So if it's now foods, you're buying from now food, store on Amazon. Or someone who is trusted like if GNC or vitamin shop or on Amazon or someone that's a trusted seller, I don't know if it's a target or, you know, someone on Amazon that

that you know is legitimate. Great. But if it's some company you've never heard of selling the

thorn or pure encapsulations, I would be very of that. And make sure that and people watch you make sure you actually look because it's very easy to just click by by because it says Amazon Prime. I I've done it. I've made that mistake before and caught it and was like, oh, cancel, you know, because it will say right on their sold-inship by Amazon and you can see if it's coming from the actual store. Because that's scary, man. Like I can go back and so many instances where I

know for sure that people have overdosed things and and I'm going to touch on that in a little bit. I'm going to go down down the line on some things. I encountered and see your thoughts on it. But it's dangerous. It's it's actually worse to get too much of it than to not get any at all.

“I mean, and that's what's scary because I mean, it's it's been the wild west out there.”

I remember particularly, I think I was 18 years old and it was called Zenadrin. Yep.

was coming under my chest and I thought it was going to die. Like I remember going to my mom and

“dad panicking like shaking and my heart was skipping beats and all over the place and”

it's these things that they're not and I want to touch on that. The FDA regulated and how do we know if we're getting what we're supposed to was supplements? Is anything FDA regulated? Is it how does this work? So we know what we're actually getting? We are it is a regulated industry. I know it gets said often that it isn't it is the FDA, the FTC, the FTC when it comes to like messaging in print on on radio or voice ads, social media, FTC is part of that

regulation and then FDA would be over supplement products. The problem is the FDA is woefully

undermined. Yeah. And supplement companies are coming out by the hundreds every day and it's an industry that really can't be kept up with. So it has to be pretty egregious for the FDA to red flag it and step in. As you've mentioned, like there are situations with like a fedran or DMAA or some of these ingredients through the years that have been an issue, certain brands, there's been owners that have gone to jail from the FDA like USP labs, speak MDMAA. But it is rare.

It is rare that this kind of thing happens. The FDA typically will do more on the contract menu factoring level with audits of the contract manufacturers though inspect these facilities and make sure that these facilities are doing what's called GMP, good manufacturing practices. So that's where we see the FDA. But by and large, it's it is regulated but woefully

“under-regulated. I will say. Okay, that's what I thought. And there's so many people that run”

their mouth that say things that don't know what they're saying out there. And it only gets worse, especially in bodybuilding industries, things get passed along and then people believe it. And I've been seeing it since since I started doing this. It's been going on forever. Now, you went way back in time. When do you think was this major shift towards supplement use?

Creatine for me was always one of the first things I heard of in high school. I was that was like

later, 1997 was when it kind of became popular to me. Is that when you feel like there was more of a shift towards supplements? Was it prior? Because there was a lot of multivitivins were being pushed a lot. And I do want your thoughts on multivitivins too, as opposed to taking singular things. But what was it? Was it creatine that you think was the biggest thing first? And this is not, we're not talking steroids or PDs. I'm just talking regular

“legal supplements. Do you think that was the first one that really got it really smoke in here?”

It is like mid to late 90s when we saw not only creatine but a Fedron. Yeah, on a Fedron, like shook the country. Like in a good and bad way. I mean, there was, as you mentioned, like Zina dream, but also metabolite and hydroxy cut and ripped fuel and diet fuel. And there was so many things. And everyone was using a Fedron. Everyone was talking about a Fedron. Creatine was something that truly worked. And before then, a lot of products and sports nutrition were

just hype and sawdust. And that was, that was the game changer or sure. Where, and then we started

seeing the ready to drink products. There was American body building that had like that was at your gyms that had, you know, carb drinks, protein drinks, pre-workout type drinks. And then there was the birth of the pre-workout around that time with NO explode. Yep. And that was a game changer too. Pre-workouts became a staple for anyone working out and still is to this day. Those were huge. And then that, we also had the Barry Bonds, Patrick Arnold, Mark McWire, scandals with PEDs, and a lot of

these athletes were starting to delve into steroids or designer steroids, breaking records, becoming like kind of Uber athletes, if you will, that were a generation defining. And then that was the era of pro hormones. And we saw a lot of these pro hormones that, on some levels, were rivaling the steroids that body builders were using for decades. You had ones like Super Draw and Fair plex and methyl one testosterone that were, I mean, people were putting on, you know, 10 plus pounds

that one as well with pro hormones. And then, of course, later on, there were sarms, a kind of

“another era. But I think it was around that time. It was like mid 90s to maybe mid 2000s that we saw”

like a huge boom in particular in sports nutrition. All right, here we go. This is my wheelhouse. And so this is where I really want to go with you. I started to get the fascination studying steroids because of such a massive sports fan. And so in the era of Andro in HGH and steroids and everything else under the sun and all of these stories of them telling you, oh, I didn't know I was taking this or it was flat soil. And I quickly understood the nonsense behind all of this.

But I also understood what they did and what they didn't do. And how crazy and wild the things that you hear in the media are that just clueless, just clueless on what they say about these things.

“And then it became shifted towards the pro hormones like you're talking about. And I want to get into”

all of this with the pro hormones to the sarms because that's kind of where I really got into everything and what I became known for on YouTube. So I want to hear your thoughts on all of this. So it was 20, 20, 10, 11 was when the pro hormones were really, really became popularized. And like you said, super drows, a big one. Episthen was a very popular. Hey, the drows was very popular.

There were many, many, many and some were methylated, some not methylated. And these like you said designer steroids, but you know often more toxic than just taking straight out of our windstraw of 100%. I mean, super drows made me feel the worst of any steroid I ever used to side from trend. I could tell you that was the worst experience of my life where I gained 20 some odd pounds in three to four weeks, but I felt horrible. And when I tell you I felt horrible, I mean, I hated

the world. I mean, that one to get it bad, my liver values through the roof. How how did these get to

“become legal? Like how did, how were these ever legitimately overlooked with what they were doing?”

And when did they really first come out? It started, it started with EAS, who I said was like behind

creatine and they had phosphogen, which is their creatine phosphogen HP, which was creatine plus carbs, phosphogen was creatine and protein, but they became huge and eventually abit bought them out and then actually shut them down. But EAS was massive at one point. Really the ones leading the charge in sports nutrition and everyone was following. The first one was a product called andruistendion. Yep. And that was the first thing. And it was a kind of like post cursor to DHA,

a DHA, mild, very mild. But they found that it occurred naturally in Scotch prime. And so they found like a naturally occurring source. And with that you can have disheave the dietary cell, dietary supplements help education act, which means if it is naturally occurring or a metabolite of something naturally occurring in the, quote unquote, food supply, it can be a dietary supplement potentially. So that led to a pro hormone, which was a, this understanddown is a precursor to

testosterone being on the market. And people were stacking it with the HAA and saw Palmetto and,

you know, whatever these things at the time, seeing very minor effects. But that led to basically

other people coming in and saying, well, we'll just release steroids. And it was completely overlooked and underregulated at the time. And it got so extreme to the point that you're talking about where these methylated steroids that absolutely shouldn't have been on the market, they do not occur naturally in any plants or anything in the food supply. We're on the market. And literally killing people. In some cases like what you're talking about with, with super

draw on pharaohplex and these methylated steroids of people are stacking, getting all kinds of liver damage. And people were thinking that they are safe because they're supplements. And that clearly wasn't the case. And at least with steroids, we have, you know, 30, 40, 50 years of data

doctor potentially at a coach, you had just kids going into GNC, invite them and shop, just buy and steroids and saying, more is better and not doing a proper post-cycle therapy or knowing what their labs are, any of that kind of stuff. And certainly stacking it with things like a

“fedron and it became very dangerous for sure. I remember I was testing this out at the time and I was”

writing some of the companies and I was saying, well, what's your protocol and how do you come off of these? You know, many people were saying, oh, just take our post-cycle supplement and or you just don't even need one. And you and I both know, taking these, you absolutely need a post-cycle therapy or you're going to wreck your protection, just has testosterone production. I don't know how many people that were teenagers are in their 20s that probably put themselves on TRT using these

not running a post-cycle and never doing blood work, thrashing their liver, thrashing their blood pressure,

cholesterol, everything through the roof. I mean, that havoc was one that was super popular, or there was an epistain form, but running something like super draw and not taking proper protection and protocols, that's just like running an anadraw. I mean, essentially, and DMZ was another one. So here, here's what happens. 2011, 2012, I was working with several companies. They were producing pro-harmonies and they got me on YouTube and got me to do videos. And one of the things they

wanted me to start discussing was Psalms and peptides and I said, I don't know, shit about

“any of these things. I got to learn them and study them because the only way to get these is on the”

research market underground. So I became known as the Psalms guy at the time because peptides were not popular. Bodybuilders, they were pretty useless. I mean, there was like seven, eight to pick from. GHRP's Milana Tan. There really was next to nothing and they weren't producing size or anything.

So Psalms obviously became a interest, as you know, with what they can do. And the first things

I ran because there was only a few at the time was MK286 and S4. And that was really it. MK677, when I learned about them, then they started coming out with more. Well, then what happened? Prohormones get banned. And then one android, two android, those are still legal. They're looking for loopholes. But what happens? All these people get stuck with all of their Prohormone powders and they find Psalms and start selling those and supplements. Now, one of the things

that I found rather quickly was that people were putting their Prohormone powders in their and selling them as Psalms. And people were getting side effects. They shouldn't get with Psalms. And then all of this stuff compounds. And all of these articles come out about how dangerous they are when in reality they weren't. They are, but not to the extent. What happened there? I mean,

“how did this shift so quickly? And do you remember who the first companies were to start doing this?”

Well, there's a lot of companies that were making a fair amount of money being like a hard core and underground by selling Prohormones as they were getting banned or pulled off the market or the bigger companies removed themselves from the market, either because of lawsuit, bad press, FDA pressure, etc. But the smaller companies knew there was still money to be made. And with that vacuum filled in Psalms, the selective androgen receptor modulators,

I will say that the Psalms, well, potentially the idea was that they were safer than these Prohormones but had the effects of steroids. The promise was the effects of steroids without the side effects.

The problem is the HPTA, this hype of pholemic up to itary access, that you were still getting

suppression because these doses were much higher than they were supposed to be because that's where you were seeing the significant effects. So these like YK11 and Rad 140 and, you know, there's a slew of S23s, like yeah, in a steroid. Yeah, it's just impressive. Exactly. There's a number of them that are out there and they are very potent in their effects, but they're potentially very potent in their side effects and you still need to run post-psychotherapy and all these things.

And they are orals and in some cases are potentially still hard on the liver. So I don't know that they're really at this point any safer than the Prohormone era. I have come to the realization that I, and part of this is the evolution of them because when it started, they were lighter

So it's very, very toxic to the liver, but then we started to see more blood panels where, oh wow,

MK2866 has really hurt the liver and we've seen some estrogen activity. It's aggravating people with kind of comastia, which wasn't supposed to do. And then the S4 side effects with the vision and then they came out with S23 and I started to see, while this was, it was nicknamed, it was like a male contraceptive. That was the nickname of it. It's just completely shutting down testosterone. Well, you can recover from it quicker. Well, how do you know that?

You know, and it's just the marketing trick. I guess that I've seen that evolution go on and it's

scary. You know, it's very scary. The uneducation that people have and what they're doing to

“themselves. And that's why, you know, everybody's looking for an edge. Everybody's looking for”

to build muscle. And that's why I'm transitioning. So we've got all of these. We've got your pro hormones. We've got the sarms. We know what they can do. We also know the damage they can do. For you, where is this gone for something that's natural and safe? Like what are the options aside from creatine, which we know, and I want, we'll go back to creatine on the other benefits. But what else is there that we could potentially build good strength and good muscle without shutting

down our natural testosterone without thrashing our endocrine system and having all of these side effects?

What are the options? Yeah, I have a handful that I would say are actually quite potent and effective. Are they going to be steroid like? Probably not, but radically safer for sure. Dylucine is an ingredient I've helped bring to market. It's a dipeptide of Lucine. Lucine drives

“muscle protein synthesis. The key amino acid, the branch chain amino acid, the essential amino acid”

that drives the creation of more muscle. Very key in your body for this reason when you care about skeletal muscle hypertrophy or muscle growth. And certainly this applies to repair and recovery and athletes in general, not just bodybuilders or people looking to put on muscle, but those that need muscle repair and recovery. Dylucine is a dipeptide and it's much faster than Lucine and uses what's called this peptone transporter in the gut to deliver it about 189% faster.

And what we've seen is 60% more muscle protein synthesis over Lucine and 159% more muscle protein synthesis than exercise alone. And this is really impressive because Lucine is what we would call refractory where it doesn't matter how much you deliver. At some point it just shuts off. That's as much muscle protein synthesis as you can get. We're seeing a dramatic difference in muscle protein synthesis, strength and recovery with dilucine versus Lucine or anything else.

So this has been exciting. This is one that bodybuilder natural or unnatural would would be excited about because this outperforms EAs, BCAs, any like Lucine based anything. So this is the most potent natural anabolic that we know of. How's the safety profile? Incredibly safe. This occurs naturally when you hydrolyze or break down a protein, you get down to die peptides. And it may seem counterintuitive that a die peptide is, which is two amino

acids together, is faster than a single amino acid, but that's the case where this special transporter in the gut takes up dye and tripeptides because of signaling. Actually we now understand that as peptide signaling, where this peptide is going ahead of all the free amino acids

“and telling them what to do and where to go. So that's what's happening with dilucine. With that,”

there's two sides of the equation, muscle protein synthesis, muscle protein breakdown. So to prevent the breakdown of muscle, the champion is an ingredient that's been around for decades, but is great, especially paired with dilucine. So hmb dilucine, and then with that, I love, obviously, creatine, as we've mentioned, that protects skeletal muscle mass increases power, but we're also seeing it be protective to DNA, to traumatic brain injury, reduces fatigue,

improves bone strength and bone mineral density, improves fertility, and protects the ovaries and testies, improves eyesight. I could just keep going down the line of all the benefits

which is that muscle loss, as we age, is called sarcopenia. Everyone should be on creatine. Another

strength enhancer that I like is b-tain. Okay. I'm also called tri methyl glycine. Yep. That's a great one as well. So this is my ultimate stack. There are some of these peptides out there that are claiming to be peptides from like five of being. There's a brand called the pepti-strong thing. And I don't know that the data seems a little confusing to me, whether that works or not. Maybe it helps. Maybe it doesn't. I'm not really sure. I haven't

truly seen compelling data to this point, but maybe that's helpful. I don't think taking additional

B-C-A's or E-A's are that helpful. Unless you're on some kind of extreme caloric restriction.

“If you're getting enough protein, if you're getting enough calories, I think those have little”

to no benefit. I think taking dilucing two or three times a day with HMB and creatine at each of those potential two or three doses is going to have far more impact. So that would be my ultimate stack. So creatine, chim-B, B-Tain, and dilucing. Correct. Okay. Sweet. Can you just stay on those? Do you need a cycle off of them? I believe you can stay. Like it's safe to stay on them. There is an idea. Maybe with pathways, receptor, density, all these kinds of

things. Maybe you cycle off things for, you know, you're on them 12 weeks, it off from for two to four weeks, you know, that kind of thing. Okay. So your body could acclimate to them, but not necessarily.

“Yeah. Okay. I always like to cycle things. Like these 12, 16 weeks on, take a couple of weeks off,”

every introduced. That's just how I've always operated, but I'm always curious. Creatine,

I just stay on. Okay. Let's talk a little bit more about creatine. I want your thoughts on this, because this is one of those things that drives me nuts. Loading phase. What's your thoughts on loading phase or creating? There is legitimacy into the idea of a loading phase. And that you can have what you're trying to do is increase creatine phosphate levels in the muscle. And by taking creatine monohydrate or, you know, some form of creatine like that, you're going to increase endogenous

in the body levels of creatine phosphate. Right. The higher you dose the creatine, the faster you get to saturation levels in the muscle. So with creatine loading, which is typically around 20 grams a day, we see saturation in the muscle at about five days. If you were to do three grams a day, we see it at about 28 to 30 days. And of course, somewhere in between, if you were dosing 10 grams a day, maybe it's, you know, about 10 days, you know, something like that. But that's where the logic is.

Beyond that, there is some really compelling data now that the muscle has active transport of creatine into the muscle. The brain does not. We see a lot of effects of creatine on the brain, but it's a passive transport. What this means is that only very large doses of creatine are affecting the brain. Got it. And that's where we're seeing effects on traumatic brain injury, like literally one being prophylactic or neuroprotective or two being therapeutic or healing

to the brain when you already have a brain injury. But also, and by the way, ketones would actually be really good to combine with a traumatic brain injury with creatine. But also, we're seeing new studies talk about fatigue and resistance to fatigue and those being underselect. There was a study with the 20 to 30 grams where they only got like five hours of sleep, I believe, and they felt as good as and performed as good as those that had eight hours of sleep. And so we're seeing

“creatine be remarkable, truly remarkable. You have to think about how big of a difference that is.”

Mean, that would be being three hours underselect would probably be the equivalent of having like four alcoholic drinks in terms of your performance. Oh, yeah. It has a dramatic effect. So having your brain perform at a well-select level, just because of one intervention,

research and the data's not complete here yet is a precursor to creatine called GAA. And this is fairly new to the market. GAA may help push the creatine to the brain in a way that just taking creatine alone doesn't seem to work. We're seeing one or two grams of GAA with a few grams of creatine, say three, three grams of creatine work as well as 20 grams of creatine, really. So this is very interesting, especially because that's a very large dose of creatine and two, there may be some

GI distress associated with in particular women seem to have a harder time with larger doses of creatine.

This could be a game changer there. So that's been very exciting is this GAA, along with creatine,

for any products that have this GAA in it or any solo product yet.

“I am not sure that this data is pretty new. I think that I think maybe at the time of this”

podcast dropping, maybe there'll be a few companies. So it's very good that there was like a good neurological benefit then to take in the GAA with. Just thought of my friend's company, actually unmatched, Chris Gaffin. Yeah, it was the face of bodybuilding.com back my day, I've loved them for years. He is a product called Cregatine. I've taken it, I love it. And it has creatine, GAA in it is. And yes, so that is a product that you can take and I'm a huge fan of all things,

Chris Gaffin. He's my guy, man. He set me that when he first was coming out with it and I always

telling him, I got to get some more than a mile. I got to get some more. That's one of my favorite products. I love it. Okay, one one secret ingredient I did not mention if you're into working out and maybe it could enhance certainly muscle but like workout adaptation much faster. I think of it is getting more reps, more steps out of every workout is an ingredient I've worked on, that is an exercise mimetic. We've seen ingredients in that star market that you were mentioning

in the past that GW 501, 506, or A-Car, or S-R, exactly. You know, these kinds of ingredients

that mimic exercise. Literally, quote, unquote exercise in a bottle. We can't say that with the

“FDA, you have to say with good diet and exercise and all that. Baby, beta, amino, isobutiric acid,”

especially the L isomer which is sold as mitoburn enhances this extra kind. So as you're working out, your BCAA pool, which is about 50% of your muscle, breaks down to some degree. This was the theory around taking BCAA's while you're working out. And in particular, valene is one of the three BCAA's. valene will convert into an extra kind, meaning like a signal from exercise. It's also called a myocine because it's a signal from muscle breakdown. And this signal says to the body, we're

working out intensely. All the adaptations associated with intense working out, let's ramp those up. So, baba is literally associated with improved VO2 Max, neuroclassicity, bone mineral density,

“muscle, innovation, and strength, increased skeletal muscle mass. All the things that you would”

associate with working out intensely are associated with baba. And we've shown that oral baba, the mitoburn will increase your endogenous or in the body levels of baba around to work out. Quite dramatically. So, this is literally like I said, that getting more reps or more steps out of every workout. So, that's pretty compelling as well. And we're also seeing decreased fat mass improved, the ketone utilization, glycogen, utilization or storage, like all of these kinds of things

that we associate with exercise. We've talked about creating a lot, but I want to ask one more on your thoughts here because you and I have both seen the evolution of creatine and all of the different forms of it and the price of things that have gone up and down and the popularity and all of a sudden is out of this world. Just all of a sudden, the past couple of years when it's been sitting there the whole time. Two part question. One is, is good old monahydrate the best or is

HCl or any of these other forms right on par, what your thoughts there. And two, when did it occur

for muscle and strength and that's really all it was going for water retention because that's like

“essentially that's what was always talked about amongst everybody. It's going to make me stronger,”

it's going to make me bigger and it's going to hold water. Yeah, by the way, I am a fellow in the ISS and the International Society Sports Nutrition and I have my fellowship there and that's it's very prestigious and I'm thankful, but we worked on really like a potent textbook around sports nutrition and I got to be one of the authors around 2010 and at that time I was writing of the neurological cognitive enhancing benefits of creatine really. At that time there was only

some preclinicals which means animal data, maybe some in vitro data and I took so much heat over that you can't even imagine like how much of a beating I took just talking about the theoretical benefits well beyond muscle of creatine. I mentioned bone, fertility, eyesight, you know, brain function and potentially being a tool that we will tap into in the future around traumatic brain injury.

“I was saying that over 15 years ago and I took so much heat from the academic community and I honestly”

forgot all about that until right now. So this is a little bit of vindicated. It was just a little

bird as an indication. It is incredible as I said everyone should be on it. Yeah and it is not just

strength and power and what we've come to think of as a bodybuilder or athletes ingredient like a sprinter's ingredient. It is for everyone. It is for grandma. It is for everyone because it is protecting muscle loss as we age that sarcopenia. It is protecting your DNA. It is protecting against cancer, protecting your brain, protecting your eyesight. Like I said, fertility, all these bones. It's powerful for your full body and how well you're aging. I do believe everyone, everyone should be

taking at least three grams a day of creatine. 100% period the end. So there is over a thousand

published studies. Now this is another place that I took a beating when I was working clinically.

I tried to put all my patients in a nursing home on creatine because of muscle mass loss. As I'm talking about with sarcopenia as well as cacaxia with those just not getting enough protein. We have pressure ulcers from those that were not not being turned or moving enough and we're laying in bed. Literally the skin and muscle breaks down and can become necrotic and infected and they can just die of just their muscle breaking down. And I tried to put them all on creatine and my

rounding physician, the house physician said, there's no good studies on supplements. And I was like buddy, there is 500 plus studies at that time. Now there's over a thousand. And I was like most of the medications you're putting them on. Have one or two studies and quite often they've been manipulated with many rounds to show minor positive benefit enough to push it through the FDA. And you're telling me that's better data than the 500 plus studies that we have on creatine

and this is safe and I could literally prevent the decline of these people dramatically. And that was one of the reasons I ended up getting out of my clinical practice and just going into supplements entirely. I was so frustrated at trying to make an impact on that level. Yeah, it felt like I was just constantly working against intuition or knowledge or innovation,

“it's just so frustrating. Yeah, it's like a barricade. So I believe fully in creatine, I believe”

everyone should be taking creatine. Everyone should be taking at least three grams. Maybe up to five grams a day. Again, cognitive benefits. Maybe up to 20 grams. Maybe GAA at a couple of grams plus three grams of creatine could be the easier the better way. You do have to actually look at and creatine has these other compounds in it. With GAA, you can raise levels of homocysteine. So this formula, Cregatine that I know Chris Gethin has has the B12 and folate and it's

to actually offset that. So that's really important to keep homocysteine levels in check and

as a result. So that's ideal. What about the forms of creatine? Yeah. So creatine model hydrate is easiest to say and most everyone that's a fellow in the ISS and or you know people that I know would say creatine model hydrate. That's the gold standard. That's the one that everyone uses. It's the best price. Be careful what you're buying. I've come out with a form called the purist creatine that's actually purer than the well known German creatine. It's the purist one on

the market. Is that their appear? That is a brand that's well known, but I have one that's called purist that actually exceeds that one. Those are both great creatines though, but there is a lot of creatine model hydrate on the market that has an impurity called DCD in it and we're bringing light to some of these toxins that are present in the creatine. So I would be careful and only by the highest quality creatine that you can. As far as creatine HCl and creatine malades are creatine

citrate or all these different forms that have been on the market. There's probably been 30 form, a radiant ethylester. There's familiar y'all ain't the anti-hydris. There is a lot of

“creatines on the market. You're just overpaying. Yeah, I believe it's it's really just”

creatine has good bioavailability, great conversion to creatine phosphate. So I don't think there's additional benefits in dispending more money on your creatine. One thing I will say creates a monohydrate does not have good solubility. So what I would do is actually take the teaspoon of creatine. Throw it in your mouth, then kick it back with some water, some juice, some milk, your protein shake, whatever, as a way to ensure that you're getting it all. I think that's the

smartest way to do it. Otherwise, if you're just putting it in your shaker cup or, you know, with your pre-workout or those kinds of things, it can end up being something that settles to the

bottom of the cup and you may never drink it. So that would be the smartest thing to do.

What about the water retention myth? Everybody is so fearful of that always wants to bring up.

“And I think that it's gotten better over the years just before that was like the biggest”

fear with it was the GI and then the water retention. So tell me, is that I change a little bit. The higher the body fat and it's so women tend to carry more body fat potentially than men, just for maintaining fertility and all the things. Men like maybe an ideal might be somewhere like 12 to 20% body fat for women, it's going to be like 18 to 26% or something like that. They're a little bit higher in body fat. The more body fat you have, there is a little bit more

water retention that's visible. This is very small. It might be two, three pounds if you're fully saturated. Some of the other weight that you're maintaining is actually intramuscular. There may be a little bit of water weight retention. What we've found through the years is that dividing your doses seems to resolve that dramatically. So if you're taking, you want to take

“10 grams a day, just take three grams three times a day or if you want to take five grams,”

you know, take one and a half grams three times a day or something like that. We tend to see that Brazil also said, okay, all right. So my shift, I would say, well, it's really when I met Dr. Dave Raven. I went from being so focused on fitness and strength and nutrition and muscle, which is all important, obviously. But that's only one piece of the puzzle, really, because for

me, the what I've gathered over time is, and I always talk about this now as a mind and body

connection and you have to have them both. Now, I start from a, like, take it, like, a top and then I branch it down. So I start with spirituality and go then to neurological and, like, nutrition training. I know some people don't want to hear that. I don't care. That's my, that's my belief. We'll just focus today on the, the neurological and then the physical side of things. How important do you feel it is to have those both dialed in? Do you think people are so focused on the physical side

with the supplements, especially that we're taking, that they kind of bypass the importance

in the understanding that if you're misaligned up here, you're never going to be aligned over here.

good neurologically and having a balance between your parasympathetic and sympathetic nervous system

“understanding that there's traumas there that linger and how much of a drastic effect that”

has on all of our blood panels, but stress the anxiety, I don't care how good we train and how we eat and how much creatine and supplement we take. If this is off, I mean, what's your thoughts

because what I am finding is you're just never going to be aligned. Absolutely. One, I had read a

study not too long ago that one use of any type of psychedelic, in any environment in any dose, one use, or more, was associated with a one third reduction in all cause mortality. Wow. And I believe that is because of trauma and stress and these things that are stored in the body that are stored in your operating system, stored in your belief system, your ego of how you play out the routines that you're going through day to day. It's only in these kind of highly neuroplastic

environments that we can rewrite that code that we can go into the operating system like Neo and to change that those lines of code and say that no longer serves me anymore. Otherwise, the ego's very good at justifying your trauma, creating identity around that trauma where you believe

that is who you are. And that's where powerful dissociatives like a ketamine, for example, that

can actually pull you apart from your identity where you can actually see yourself as a spirit, if you will, or a soul, if you will, or something like that apart from this created identity, that you're not your name, you're not your job, you're not all these things. Those are identities and these are routines that we've created on who we are while we've been experiencing ourselves on this planet. When you see yourself apart from that, then you can say, "Whoa, I'm safe.

I am someone outside of that identity." And then once you see that, once you tease that out, then you can, again, rewrite that code and potentially delete that code and say that line of code doesn't work. I've got a lot of deleting. I need to hear other like a lot. So, most people do.

“And so, that's why we do see alcohol use and other things like that just because people are”

overwhelmed, overstressed, and you know, maybe it's not alcohol, but it's Xanax. Maybe it's not

alcohol or Xanax, but it's great, you know, whatever it is, like people are always trying to

figure out a way to kind of escape their thoughts and these routines that are playing out, especially for those of us, I had pretty severe depression, like roominating thoughts. Like, I would tend to like dwell on things for weeks and weeks and just stay in circles. And, you know, those are, those are definitely counterproductive to your health and well-being. And so, 100% we're seeing, as you mentioned, that mind muscle connection or the gut brain access or we're hearing about

the brain in all kinds of ways. And certainly athletes are trying to tap into new tropics and, you know, cognitive enhancement and all these kinds of things now because, yes, like, pairs and theme, for example, which we can talk about where athletes are talking about things slowing down and, you know, being in a flow state and being tapped in how much easier life athletics performance can be when you're in these flow states. And you

mentioned sympathetic parasympathetic, which is your autonomic nervous system. This is kind of that in and young, if you will, that balance that we need, where, yes, we need to be in sympathetic, some of the time, which is fight flight or freeze, where we're stimulated. You know, and think of like dopamine more on that side of things where it's like the, the get stuff done neurotransmitter. But then you have, like, you know, more on the other side,

the parasympathetic, which is more like GABA and, and some of these neurotransmitters, where you're more relaxed, which is, you know, like rest and digest, for example, like where

“you're recovering. And then I believe flow state is this combination of the two, where”

you're stimulated, but things are coming easily. Like this one composer talked about the Phantom hand, where is like he was like looking at his hand observing his hand, like not even

Yeah, you know, or like a Michael Jordan or Tiger Woods, again, where you know, things get quiet,

“things slow down, things become easier. It's like you're, again, going back to Neo when,”

when he's just kind of like smiling and he's like, you know, moving his body around the bullets, and it's like no problem. And it's like, you know, he's kind of like flicking the bullets out of the air and he's like, oh, this is like nothing. He's in like kind of the ultimate flow state. Yeah. And so that would be how I would discuss that. But certainly we're seeing neutropakes in general go through the roof. There's a lot of similar to Psalms and Pro hormone

says we discussed and we can get into peptides and certainly get into Paris, Anthony. But there's a lot of nitropic sites that are selling research compounds that are not well-researched some of them are some of them are not some of them are very new compounds that are experimental compounds that may have some acute benefits. But we're not sure of what the long-term benefits are.

“We don't know what the polypharmacy effects are, where they're being combined, like no one's”

studied this crazy research compound and this crazy research compound and this crazy research compound all stacked. That's obviously very understudied. And so we don't know what the net effect of some of these things are that people are just stacking. Yeah. There's a lot of people taking a lot of different things. And it's risky. I used to be that way and I won't touch things. It's not without years and years of data because I get that fear unfortunately and fortunately and like that type

one where I never shut off. So when I'm good, I'm great. But when I'm stressed and anxiety filled,

I am like rock bottom because I can't get out of my own way. And in fact on the way the drive here, I was doing like a morning prayer and I was just asking for help to just like stop letting anxiety's and stress us dominate my bad days. Because when like I said, when I'm on, like when you're like my type, you're on. But when you're bad, it's bad. And I I used to use marijuana to calm, but then it got to the point where it was causing me more stress because it

was like over years and years I became to be panicky with it and it was like counterproductive. And I'm trying now to use prayer to calm and like actually took a step back and do like gaming

because I never do it and I want to at night. And that's actually provided me relief.

Even last night when I was worried about, oh, I'm going to be late tomorrow to this and I've got such a stacked day and I sat there and played for an hour. Dude and I passed out.

“And that was happiest. But I think finding something that can do that for you to put you in that”

state is important. That's kind of like the Apollo here. We both were that that helps me stimulate my biggest nerve. And I want to talk to you and I'm going to pull you down now because I look for as you do companies that are smaller, newer, innovative and we you know where I'm going because these are our friends here that we both. But these are tonums products and I want to talk to you about them because I found them in November at Udomonia and they said, oh, we know Sean

and Sean and I said, okay, well legitimacy, I'm sold because if Sean's backing it, I'm going to be introduced to it and have interest in it. Now, these two neuro and modus I want to talk to you about because you brought up parasanthene and I know parasanthene is one of the bigger ingredients in the neuro product. I'm more drawn to the neuro for the personal side and the modus for the client side because I don't, I'm not really focused on weight loss right now but I know and you know

how many people struggle with weight loss in GLP1 use which I want to get into with you too when we get to the peptides but I want to start with the neuro side in this product in particular because the alpha GP sees the one that interests me and the parasanthene. There's great in seven ingredients in here but I want to talk to you specifically about those two especially since you brought up the parasanthene tell me about that how it helps for focus what what for so parasanthene is one of the

three metabolites of caffeine when you consume caffeine your body breaks it down into demethylates it into one of three compounds the ophylene theobromene and parasanthene. Parasanthene we used to talk about as the metabolite of caffeine but said better caffeine is the dirty precursor two parasanthene. Parasanthene is the active that we really want caffeine and in particular the ophylene are responsible for a lot of the side effects we don't want. So getting rid of caffeine

and or at least minimizing it as much as you can I mean we've shown with data that anything

switching to parasanthene you'll see increased neuroplasticity meaning like youthfulness of the brain

“and of kind of regeneration and protection of neurons the brain cells you'll see increased nitric”

oxide to the brain blood flow you'll see increased glutathione and catalyst the master antioxidant and decreased oxidative stress as a result decreased beta amyloid plaque which is associated with Alzheimer's increased acetylcholine dopamine serotonin. What are all the ways we know that the brain ages increased oxidation decreased glutathione decreased nitric oxide increased beta amyloid plaque you know all of these things decreased dopamine those are all neurodegeneration and aging of

the brain literally parasanthene is reversing the aging and so not only is it acutely utropic meaning

we've shown in many studies in the one use like we showed with athletes in a 10k race where they

“took a multitasking test before and after the race that they performed better after they raised after”

they were exhausted because of parasanthene they had 11% decreased mental errors whereas the caffeine group had 23% increase in mental errors. So literally parasanthene is the flow and caffeine is the phrasal and this is where they're just radically different they're they're not the same at all and so we're seeing both that acute nitropic as well as that neuroprotective effect and we actually see the reinforcement of this idea of being neuroprotective and enhancing the brain in an e-gaming

study we did where we saw the e-gaming athletes over the course of six weeks and playing for two hours per session that not only was there an acute time effect where with each gaming session

“we saw that they improved in resistance to fatigue like literally where at two hours they were”

basically playing at the same level they were at hour zero whereas with nothing when they took nothing

they had a steep drop-off at hour one at hour two and literally at six weeks we saw basically they stayed the same across two two hours and so there was a time effect acutely meaning with each session but there was a time effect across the six weeks too where they seem to be getting better and better and better with continued use with caffeine we see a negative time effect where you get worse and worse and worse with continued use so this is just a night and day difference

in how Paris Antheen works but we've been obviously very excited about it and you know I've talked to you about update which is a one brand that I've been involved with and others earlier celebrity that's probably one of the top five most well-known human beings on the planet that is coming on board with update and it's launching into the rebrand is launching into Walmart and a lot of other places there's also another in called life cider X that has apple cider vinegar

and and Paris Antheen that's that's quite delicious as well so Paris Antheen is certainly having its moment right now there's also if you like pouches there's these oral pouches similar to like the idea of at least tobacco or nicotine pouches like as in there's one called ultra that has Paris Antheen in it but alpha GPC is another new tropic that you mentioned in particular our studied version called genius pure yeah yeah and we showed that with the 330 milligrams dose

that we doubled focus literally two extra focus so that is a huge deal that number is staggering number to improve productivity and focus to that degree from just one nutrient and certainly when you have alpha GPC and Paris Antheen together that is the most potent thing I know of that you can you can add for focus and flow so the Paris Antheen because I saw your face when we brought that up so I know it's a big deal to you I'd let let's just make this very simple because you

covered all of the good science part of it essentially it's the good part of caffeine yeah okay and you can take that later in the day without losing sleep or getting jittery or any of that it's not going to have that kind of effect on you right it typically lasts about three hours maybe three

actually shown improved the HRVs whereas with caffeine as I mentioned like even at 2 p.m. it

worsens your sleep at 10 or 11 so let alone working out on a pre-workout in the evening with 400 milligrams of caffeine and all this other stuff like it will jack you up so absolutely much cleaner better sleep you don't have the bio individuality we have with caffeine there's fast and slow metabolizers where the fast metabolizers can have like an hour and a half half life the slow metabolizers which is 60% of the population the majority of us can have up to 10 and a half hour

half life where it's literally taking days to get that caffeine out of your system I wish I I could make my coffee and just pull Paris Antheen and no caffeine at the end of shit so I got to stop I could be calf coffee use the Swiss water method not some chemical method uh get a Swiss water

“you know mold free uh decaf I believe life boost yeah here it is yeah there's some there's”

some good yeah coffees out there that you could find but those would be the ideal way to do it and just take uh Paris Antheen in capsule gummy oral pouch drink you know whatever okay so because I I think that this product is the best one that I've seen for neural products and I haven't seen millions of them but I swear by this one couple of the other ingredients in here that I I know that I like that I'm curious on the alpholipoic acid and then this burberine is a burberine

phospholipid so what are your thoughts on those because I mean touring very well aware of the milk vessel this is a better form of milk vessel in here too from what I understand and then niacin is nicotinimide I want to get into that too but alpholipoic acid tell me about that one

“little bit it is an antioxidant that is a very one of the most powerful antioxidants but it's also”

associated with regulation of blood sugar so it's in there along with some of these other compounds that help to regulate blood glucose keep insulin and blood glucose low which keeps growth hormone

GLP1 etc higher so that's the thought process tonum has done some very powerful research at

Duke comparing the modus product to GLP1 and what they saw is very similar results but the dramatic difference was actually in maintaining muscle mass and most of the weight loss was coming from fat mass whereas with the GLP1s they were seeing most of the weight loss be bone and muscle which is definitely not ideal actually a very small percentage was actually from fat it's dangerous I don't think people realize when they're doing this what goes along with the GLP1 use and why alternative

methods are much better but you know how it is everybody wants stuff right now and they want it now and they want it fast and oftentimes they don't care how they get it or what the side effects

are going to be that was always my problem with bodybuilders they never thought about tomorrow

it was like we want to run these cycles we want to get big and we don't care what's going to happen

“down the road that's why when I was looking at this and when I was getting the explanation on”

the weight loss side of it and how it was preserving muscle with the GLP1s one of the things that I've sat in on that most people have the biggest problem is how do we eat on this we can't even eat because I mean all you're really doing is shutting your brain off for being hungry right well in gastric mortality and yeah like you're talking about it can for some people it can be pretty severe constipation and learn burn and just food essentially is not moving through the

gut especially at higher doses well and then be weight gain when you stop taking it you know what's happening you're gaining all the weight back and sometimes more than what some laws more yeah which is really bad there's signaling there's processes where your body feels like it's been starving and then they don't oddly they don't recommend that you would tie trait down off a GLP1s should take it for everyone people just stop yeah when they're taking like the highest doses

and then they just stop and then they have horrible side effects which is obviously not ideal and so having a product like modus that is natural that's easy to take that doesn't have a habituation adaptation you know side effects and by the way that that burbling is a fight of some and it's very bio-available that they're switching to my version of burbling called

pretty well with GLP1s and again a lot better in some ways in terms of protecting muscle and bone

“and almost all the weight loss being from fat but that's uh going to diage or burbling is even”

more exciting that's a metabolite of burbling we don't see any GI distress we see five to 20 times the bio-availability we see it last twice as long in the plasma than regular burbling so it's just going to take modus up another couple of notches and of it and we also see with burbling and diage or burbling that they're a positive, traumatic stress on the mitochondria so by on by working on this amp-k pathway it's enhancing the number of and the activity of the mitochondria through stress

and so that can be powerfully anti-aging for anyone this is like one of the ways that met

form and works and met form and was a great diabetic drug but we also saw people that were eight percent body fat that have been anti-aging using met form and and so it's the same idea that we keep insulin low we keep uh blood glucose low we keep ketones higher growth hormone IGF1 growth factors a topology all these things are much higher when we suppress insulin and

“blood glucose along with inflammation being lower and that's what we see like on burbling and diage”

or burbling we see improved lipids a triglycerides inflammation as well to go with that lower

blood glucose right when you talk about triglycerides and everything like lower cholesterol that's

heart health I mean cardiovascular health so there's multitudes of benefits here that we're looking that's why when I when I saw this and I was like reading over the literature and the makeup in the compounds I just kept on holy shit like this was done well I mean very well because you know this I see a lot of the same types of products out there that kind of pair it off each other and they'll be one ingredient different a little bit higher dose here or there and there's just

not a lot of differentiation and definitely not a lot of money spent on proper studies the nicotinumide niacinus nicotinumide what does that mean? It's a no-flush-formanized so nicotinuc acid would be the the full flush version of niaciniumide or nicotinumide as an amide bound niacin that is going to one be vitamin B5 enhanced enhance your deficiency in potentially nicotinuc acid but it also leads to increased sorry B3 increase in AD levels

as well so this is where we're getting more energy and that was the reason they're including it is is to increase energy production because around weight loss can be a cellular fatigue yeah oh yeah so you have the berbering enhancing mitochondrial biogenesis increasing the number of mitochondria but you also have that a pretty potent dose of niacinimide nicotinumide to increase an AD production which is cellular energy and that was wild was as they were

making the neuroproduct and then found the weight loss benefits through some of the what I love about them is I've been in the industry a long time 25 years probably and I see so many companies I mean that have been around 20 plus years that won't spend 50,000 up instead I know they spent millions I know what's what and millions and you know where they studied at not just some random

“dude universe yeah that's why it was you could if you've been around long enough you know”

like you do I don't know anywhere to the near the extent that you do but I do know a great deal and I know what people do in the shortcuts they take and the money they spend and where it goes and most of it's on tricky marketing it's certainly not on this and that's why I said okay count me in I just gave him my flagship 2026 like this is my company of the year I just put it out yesterday online that's like where I'm at with it and I'm super excited I'm glad that I met them

but like I said when I heard your name involved that's when I continued the conversation was like okay all right let's roll let's do this so okay you know what I wanted to ask you about something I wasn't planning on but because we just touched on it with this you talked about NAD now I've been talking about NAD a good bit here recently because there seems there's not an understanding with the NAD supplements on what works and what doesn't a lot of people are have

one of those trends where everybody's kind of onto it and pushing it I'm more of and I've talked

to many experts of the precursors the NMM especially NR the NAD supplementation itself from what I understand doesn't really penetrate the cell if you're taking straight NAD because it's too large NMM is the easiest to get in there because NR actually converts to NMM and then then it you know increases our NAD levels so what you're thinking there is is it just a prevalent problem and do more people need to be taken NMM or what's what's the deal yes NAD IVs probably do little to nothing

exactly NAD IVs probably do little to nothing they actually may cause more inflammation than

actually do positive benefit right there is very little of that NAD that will get in the cell

“to that point because you have to get into the salvage pathway and all of this when we talk”

about NAD so yes I do believe NMM is better than NR and a liposomal NMM or maybe there is a new form called NMM age that could be potentially better there's almost no data on it so take caution on that that's a maybe but like a liposomal NMM or some kind of protected form of NMM maybe the best form but also delivering it with a Nikotanic acid nice and would be ideal to have both of those delivered and then lastly add in an NADA's inhibitor which is also called CD38 the enzyme that breaks

down NAD yep so this is where all the polyphenols are actually very exciting so things like

api genin, phycetin, quercetin, egcg, rizveratral, terrestrial beam you know these things like that

“and it seems like phycetin may be the most potent at doing this so that would be kind of an ultimate”

stack and then adding some other ingredients like ones that are brought to the market like urgothining which is a potent mitochondrial antioxidant and mitochondrial enhancer and maybe like a coq10 in particular you pick one all and then a pqq now you've got the ultimate mitochondrial formula is a liposomal NMM phycetin the pqq the coq10 and urgothining in high dose like 50 plus milligrams but my hip have spoken could deal with the wonderful doctor Andrew Solzman I interviewed and he

kind of educated me on the NADNMN side of things and they were that's where I learned about CD38 too because I didn't know anything about any of that at all and they have their younger product that addresses CD38 because you brought up respiratory I'm off the top of my head I know that's

“in there but I think people don't understand how much we actually lose as we get older and that CD38”

gives a prevalent issue and has to be addressed you can't just take anything without addressing that that there's NAD related right yeah it's a double whammy where we produce less NAD as we age and then we break NAD down faster as we are so that's the double whammy so it certainly makes sense to try and enhance NAD levels directly and then inhibit the break down of NAD and just stress alcohol, poor sleep, bad lighting, junk lighting you know you can go down the line of

all the reasons why we are making less NAD and breaking it down faster let's discuss peptides now I told you I started researching them it was 2011 there was literally I believe it was GHRP2 and 6 CJC 1295 surmorell and hexarell and and melanotan2 and that was about it that you could buy there was really nothing else that was really being sold on underground markets I'm probably even out of couple but that was about it and I've watched it evolve now into thousands and and

going insane and now more obviously everybody's into it everybody wants to learn about it what I'm curious what are some of your favorites that you lean towards I'm going to give you a couple of mine okay KPV's one of my favorites smots C is one of my favorites and I'm sure you can understand why I'm both of those I tend of course everybody in their mom let's talk about BPC one five seven and GOP ones now BPC rightfully so obviously for multitude of reasons I'll

let you get into but GHKC use another one of my favorites because I'm a longevity skin care guy

the I don't know I would say old reliable because it does a little bit of everything I like that

one as well but those are for me those are my favorites I look more on the cellular side more of the longevity side more the skin side and then the healing and all of that and then SS31 because it's the heart for you what are some of your favorites and why and how do you how do you feel about

“their place now and moving forward I think they're absolutely profound in terms of their effects”

I think there's no going back what's frustrating right now is many of them are getting pulled off these sites so there was 150 page document that went out from the FDA and big pharma to most of

these companies that are selling research peptides certainly around the GLP ones which are medications

but there is a changing of the law that's happening where peptides initially weren't allowed to be patented because they're naturally current compounds in the body think of BPC in the gut or even the old school ones like GH or IG or sorry of insulin that are peptides that are naturally current you can't paten them are they sold by big pharma yes but you know maybe it's in a modified form maybe it's because of the brand and it's in a auto injector syringe or you know something like

that but that's changing really because these things are so potent a big pharma is

but pressure on the FDA to change this and now they will be able to be patented and they are

taking them away from these research sites in particular so not only are the GLP ones getting removed but you're also seeing potentially a lot of the other compounds may get removed and are going to be behind a prescription wall or any that you know of that you would almost all of them really yes there it's being hotly discussed right now certainly the most effective ones that you're mentioning are the ones that they care about so going to the the stacks that I would mention right now

BPC 157 as you mentioned is just I can't even tell you I'm probably in the hundreds now over the last 10 years of people that told me they were going to have surgery but then didn't need surgery because of BPC I agree tendon damage ligament damage bone damage muscle damage I've seen disc damage yeah it's wild like how quickly people are healing with BPC and so clearly there's interest there before you go BPC methods of delivery when we we talk about those

because I've been using a cream honestly that I love and it's a BPC TB 500 cream discussed the capsules like oral form versus injecting site injection yeah capsule think is not systemic I think largely it is peptides are smaller proteins that are very prone to be broken down by the the stomach and certainly the liver and you're just for the most part

“you need to inject these now when we say injection we're talking about subcutaneous injection which is a”

tiny insulin needle which is in your body fats which AC feels like nothing so for those of you that are that are needle phobic we're not talking about I am which is intramuscular we're not talking about which is a big gauge needle and much deeper and much more painful like a testosterone shot or something like that and we're not talking about certainly IV where we're going intravenous and that you need to know how to put it in the blood concerns or whatever this is very easy to do

and yes you have to add bacteria static water to hydrate the peptide powder that's in the little vile and and draw it up and then inject it but this oral capsule I believe is just working more at a local level on the stomach so if there are gut issues I do believe oral BPC 157

“can be very helpful KPV could be helpful TB 500 could be helpful in the TB for fragment I think”

it is yeah that can be orally active to some degree and there may be some systemic benefits but I believe most of it is is working at the gut that if you want the true systemic benefit then you're going to need to inject now as far as site specific this gets argued a lot but I will say anecdotally everyone I've talked to it seems to help to some degree it's certainly not going to hurt if you're injecting in the area that there's been some kind of trauma harm

in that area versus just injecting into like you know your stomach fat yeah example for sure

“so what else I cut you up there because I wanted I needed your answers there what else are you”

looking at that you are really the the ones you mentioned like BPC 157 TB 500 KPV and GHKCU which is like the glow stack or the glow stack like those are all very healing peptides and you know Ben Greenfield used to call it the Wolverine stack with a TB 500 BPC those are very

powerful and then certainly the GHs that create a gogs as you mentioned like Tessa Morale as

my favorite Morale and at CJC no DAC you know those are are very helpful too you know growth hormone is going to be and especially these ones because they're keeping up pulse a tile growth hormone which is actually better than like directly injecting growth hormone

“which is not pulse a tile it's just a big bowl of growth hormone whereas your pituitary releases”

growth hormone about six times a day so you actually want this rhythm because all of these hormones and peptides are and neurotransmitters are all tied into like this angelating circadian rhythm of your body and having things be more pulse a tile is ideal behind growth hormone is growth hormone releasing hormone and so like working on that level allows your body to produce more but in a natural way so all that to say that that's that's a

better way of of doing growth hormone yeah Tessa Morale is one of my favorites because of the ability to lose fat and maintain muscle and even build upon the muscle that's like a recomposition in a bottle type of thing I look at it as if you're eating right you know with it of all the GLP ones like semigluitide you know which is Montgiro and and Ozympic and then Tersepotide which is the

second generation redotroutide smokes everything it is by insane like that one is incredible but

it's right now it's gone from almost all the sites incredible compound I have seen tremendous benefits from myself and other people I've worked with whether you were lean or overweight you'll see benefits with redda if you're already lean and I would use kind of more microdosing level and you'll see like that metabolic advantage because it's working on three mechanism levels it's working on yes GLP one but also working on GIP and then glucagon and glucagon is kind of the new one

and it just keeps your blood sugar super stable all day long it helps maintain muscle mass whereas the other GLP ones as we talked about can be terrible when it comes to muscle mass and that's going to improve information healing in general you know give you that metabolic advantage similar to like when you were 18 20 years old in the way you could eat so at least on the microdosing level for longevity we're seeing a lot of people love redda and then certainly if you're overweight maybe

four to six milligrams the 12 milligrams in the study is way too much of the side effects increased dramatically so I don't think you really need to go above four milligrams a week yeah or is not

always right next up in terms of peptides let me think here I forgot to my other two okay tell me

the link in c-max okay great yeah let's go cognitive peptides yeah so c-max especially the nacetyl c-max amadate is actually the kind of the acetylated versions of c-max and silenker actually a little bit better in terms of bioavailability these are nasal sprays super easy and

“c-max is honestly as experiential parisamping for me like it is awesome I feel like a huge cognitive”

lift I feel much sharper it's a link is almost like kind of your anxiolytic like it really reduces anxiety like helps you feel like more at ease relax this is going to be something like a thinnine or rotiola or maybe like a magnolia bark or you know something like that verbally like where you just feel like a kind of wave of relaxation and ease and then of course some people love

this is just like how all the studies that have shown caffeine paired with Athenine

are very powerful together because it smooths out the negative side effects of caffeine

I don't know that c-max needs like smoothing out per se but the flow state as we mentioned is kind of that relaxed versus stimulated and really the two works so well together here there are other peptides that are nitropic peptides like cerebrolyce and dihexa I mean there's there's a number of them that they're probably forget a penny along like there's some really good ones but I would say the most experiential like the best ones are those two yeah in particular if you use that the

anocidal form and the energy yeah they seem key they seem to have great synergy when you're talking

“nasal sprays one benefit that you can have is one you should know how much the concentration is”

because you could just get a bottle from someone and it could be a tenth of the concentration

of someone else's you it's good if you clean or rinse your nasal passages first because

for the spray to adhere and then pass through the nasal membrane to these vascular tissue and nose it's ideal if you're getting rid of kind of excess mucus or you know what have you so like doing like a saline rinse right before and then maybe you know giving it 10 minutes and then doing the nasal spray you're actually going to maximize it more and be careful if you have 10 or 15 nasal sprays from some peptide company one a lot of these peptides will not work

in your nasal there are a lot of them being sold but there are two big of peptides to actually cross internationally so saline can some acts do but just be careful and you know trying to do too many peptides or too many sprays like malanotan actually does work yeah internationally I love that one especially malanotan too I had the worst for it was on people at multiple times some people have nausea oh yeah some people don't but it just it's it seems by own visual so

you do have nausea with malanotan malanotan too does have some like thermogenic benefits that are kind of like along with the tanning you can like lose a little bit of fat so if you can use it malanotan too if you can't go malanotan also you explain a little bit on how to use the nasal sprays for people that are wondering like because I I've had that question now this is a great question yeah this is true with like you know internal nasal ketamine this is true with like

some of these other research peptides that are coming out to the market that a compounding

“pharmacies using like PE to I believe maybe there is even like a test of fencing and like some”

other things that are that are more like research drug level compounds that are being delivered internationally so one clean the nasal passages that's ideal to don't stick the whole thing up your nose you're going to get like that post nasal drip it's going to go behind your sinuses and then just drip into your throat and you're getting very little benefit from that literally just barely have it at the opening of your nose the tip of the comb if you will and then

make sure that you're pulling down and it in a pretty firm way so you're getting a full spray if you kind of pull down slowly or not as firmly like you won't get as good as spray so don't go too deep make sure you're pulling down firmly and then don't breathe in I think it's like a natural idea to like like when you do it I think everyone does that you're pulling it back again like to

you're getting that post nasal drip just don't breathe for a second let it kind of coat

the nasal passages and hit that vascular tissue and and that's ideal okay all right yeah because I mean that's a it is different and they can't explain how to do it on research sites because the minute they start doing that it's it's over right right soon as somebody sees it there shut down because of research I think a lot of people don't understand that those research sites they can't market it and they can't tell you what to do or how to do it up then it's not research anymore I mean

“that's why it says not for human consumption and so many people don't understand”

yeah these sites aren't supposed to say anything about the ingredient but then you'll see some of these sites saying all the benefits and they get shut down yeah and that's clearly no longer for research use only that's what are you oh means yeah research use only if you see that term

oh so mott see I'm a huge fan oh yeah mott see especially if you're using redda like that's the

ultimate combination that reddit true tide you'll keep your your mitochondrial function up you'll keep your cellular energy up it actually works like via that amp k like chromatic stress as well that is a really powerful one and as you mentioned SS31 really powerful as well those are like

“I think we've mentioned all the ones that I would definitely put towards the top of my list there's”

some other ones that are interesting along the lines of NAD and anti-aging five amino one mq yeah vat loss but also increasing NMNT and NAD levels really compelling that one is actually effective orally in the right dose and then there are some ones if you dose high enough the SLU P or BAM 15

that are exercise mimetics thermogenics will slow that was always told to be used at a really

really small dose or low dose and it does nothing does nothing they've been selling it like orally at 50 micrograms 500 micrograms does we're seeing that 50 milligrams or 100 milligrams I wouldn't go above 100 there are some people playing with mega mega doses but a hundred

“is I think where I'd max out but 50 milligrams so you're talking about literally a thousand x”

difference in the dose here so no one was seeing banners fit in the microgram levels so yes so SLU P332 very potent for fat loss and I like what you exercise thermogenics say it's combo with BAM 15 is mean if long as you're getting the right dose that's another one that I would say about 50 milligrams so 50 milligrams for each that is a really awesome combination yeah it really is and a lot of these have multi benefits you know I mean like modc for example multi

beneficial I like was drawn to ss 31 because I had a low ejection fraction issue and I think that people don't know or don't understand like that that can help with potential heart failure or

“lowering of the ejection it can raise your ejection fraction make your heart pump more efficiently”

stronger I do question then moving forward since we're talking about heart and everything so what's your opinion on sglt2 inhibitors like guardians do you have any opinion or thought on those because a lot of the people in my realm disagree on a lot but they all agree on guardians and I'm taking guardians for specific need and I I've noticed though too it's inhibited some of the things for me I'm urinating frequently and I'm pissing out glucose and what it's done I already had

low potassium from all of the training and not eating enough and now I've noticed like when I start to have a funky heart palpitations I just go slam potassium it stops because I'm going to transition into electrolyte importance but I am curious as you're thought on these medications it is a new frontier this pathway that you're talking about is well some of the pathways like with a metformin or insulin are kind of capturing blood glucose after it's happened sgl2 inhibitors

are preventing the absorption of glucose in the first place and literally just as you said

pushing it through urinary pathway yep so for anti aging there's been some excitement around that because it does seem like while we all talk about like hypoglycemia my blood sugar's crashing it does seem like especially when we look at ketogenic models lifetime models and animals and things like that the lower the blood sugar the better where we're just not seeing that like oh it needs to be in this kind of normal glycemic range I mean obviously you don't want it to be like below

like 25 to 30 or something like that right I'm saying that like where the body can regulate and make its own blood glucose irrespective of diet glucose that the lower the blood glucose the lower the insulin the lower the inflammation the higher the growth hormone the higher the IGF1 the higher the autophagy the reduced oxidation and oxidative stress the higher the glutathione catalase etc like

so that's where a lot of people are using the SGLT to inhibitors and it's compelling but certainly I would agree like what's the kind of longer term side effects like we don't know and certainly

there's always a price to pay when you're messing with a pathway chronically there's always

downstream effects of other pathways we know that the body's so great at homeyostasis and what we like call like cascades like you know the endocrine cascades this hormone effects another hormone effects another hormone like they're not working in isolation their bodies working in this beautiful concert of hormones and peptides and neurotransmitters and all these signals that are happening and it tends to be when you inhibit something chronically that something else

is affected and I think you were seeing that to some degree and so I guess if I was to use it then I would certainly not add other things while I was using it you just do a kind of self-experiment

work with your doctor work on keeping labs and use the kind of minimum effective dose instead of

“max dosing things see that's what it's just one of those things where it was designed for one thing”

and then I was prescribed for the low ejection fraction and I will tell you I had that episode in June and I got that the echo down in my ejection fraction was 44 and I had it tested again about three and a half months after I started jardy and so then I'm taking D ribos powder and hire you back when all with it and I was up to 50 I want to be a normal range which is 55 to 70 but that was a pretty significant increase in the short amount of time but you know like I said

I get those bunny heart palpitations then I started to panic and then I was trying I kept trying to piece this together and I kept getting low potassium readings which I was already getting anyway before the jardy ends and so it's like okay I got to eat more because that you you piss out 500 to 600 calories a day automatically with the jardy ends and then you're losing electrolytes you're losing potassium with all the frequent urinating and like I said I have

potassium pill where glucose / glycogen goes and like you know this anyone who's done keto it when you lose so much weight like the first week yeah a lot of that's that water weight yeah

“like where glycogen / glucose goes water follows so yeah absolutely and that's why on keto as”

well like you need to keep your electrolytes up in particular sodium but as you're mentioning sodium potassium play a role together they're the plus one ion and and you know there's the sodium potassium cellular gates you know the voltage channels and and all of that where it's

absolutely critical that to have those levels up and most people on their diet eat way more sodium

than they're supposed to and not nearly enough potassium than they're they're supposed to get I've encountered that time and time again and a lot of HGH retention revolved around sodium potassium ratios because I mean realistically you should be getting close to like 4500 milligrams of potassium a day some people will say 353600 yeah I think but for somebody like me that sweats a lot that trains a lot and then also on these medications need to be closer to that 4700 and then it's

fine the right foods that you know for that which is not the easiest thing always to get I do a lot of avocados that have a lot and it cause I eat a lot of avocados like probably way more than the normal human but like the zucchini a big zucchini I have a thousand milligrams of potassium but it's just

“finding the right foods and balancing agreed and and sodium honestly I believe should be”

much higher level than you know 2000 milligrams yeah that's not enough especially if like what you're saying like you're shedding a lot of fluid and and glucose and electrolytes that you know I probably be looking to get a similar level of sodium I said sodium is plus one but it's plus two and tassians plus one but make sure you're getting something like yeah four or five grams of sodium if you're an athlete and losing a lot of electrolytes if you're certainly a diabetic

if you're someone who's doing a lot of sweating maybe doing sauna work and it's very important to replace fluid but also electrolytes you mean it cardio sessions like come out pretty dry and scrub my feet that's impressive yeah it's it's probably over-training but I've toned it down but in Arizona even inside even in the winter you're sweating a lot man you know and

chapel hill my teacher told me maybe don't think of it as overtraining but under recovering

“and I think that's a that's a good going that's a potent thought shift or thought”

experience experiment right there is to think about how you're nourishing your body to recover from that difficult training it's so true I under eight for so many years like just eating disorder and struggling with how I look and everything and I'm talking burn in four and five thousand calories a day and eat like 15 to 1800 even now eat 3000 and paper I'm still under eating but I don't know how to eat anything now you know it's it's hard but you're right one of the

things that even as a teacher of this for years that a lot of times we're hypocrites or at least

me it was the lack of recovery rest taking days off sleeping better I have really had to force myself and now come to the realization because as hard as you get older to accept I can't this like I used to but I can do it smarter and I can actually be better by resting and doing these things how important is the rest part of the training in your view the rest theme massive like

“massive I think foundational you know you were talking about Molly Eastman who's a friend of ours”

sleep as a skill I believe it's the most foundational part of bio hacking is to get enough sleep

and there is data to show that seven hours or less which is probably what most people think is normal

or a great night sleep for many people you start to see a dramatic increase like a x increase in hard attack risk and a 5x increase in diabetic risk and why is that because you're increasing the stress on the neurons on the neurons become acutely insulin resistant and when you're underslapped and this becomes what they call type 3 diabetes or essentially acute Alzheimer's and then you need it's setting the tone for your whole body and actually increasing inflammation because there's not

enough cellular energy and the brain uses a ton of energy and all kinds of things are happening you're not getting the autophagy mitophagy kind of defragging of the brain that's supposed to happen at night and so brain health suffers dramatically and with that a lot of the neurotransmitters and signals and hormones that are in that milieu are having downstream effects throughout the body like where you're seeing increased oxidation inflammation glycation lack of cellular energy

and when done chronically and chronically underslapped that's when you're seeing just horrible net effect like really just a terrible net effect there's no like cortisol is going to be increased epinephrine or epinephrine which is adrenaline nor adrenaline all these things will be increased and you're just struggling to make it through your day and then you're compensating with lots of caffeine or at or all or you know whatever and this is having an impact and then add to it I would say

in from men in particular that are already overweight or maybe of use steroids and you know

“have like thicker necks and you're seeing sleep apnea I think a huge thing just that snoring that you”

think is normal is not normal you're going sometimes over a minute without breathing and you're having these apnea episodes where you're choking and gagging and you wake up and you know you think someone's been attacking you and it's nightmares and or your your spouse can't sleep next to you like all of this is you're not getting enough oxygen to the tissues and that leads directly to heart attack and stroke or you lower testosterone from not sleeping enough harder more difficulty losing weight

obviously inability to focus probably shitty your attitude I can attest to that yeah a lack of resilient yeah just a yeah more agitation frustration anxiety absolutely lower testosterone estrogen you know all the things whether male or female growth hormone anything that's ideal is going to be impaired you will not be optimized period the end if you're not getting a dollar so sleep yeah totally so give me your list of what you would say are just like absolute

in comparison to a multivitamin what you're thoughts on taking a multivitamin versus

supplementing each thing separately that we need I do think a multivitamin is ideal for most people that are there is a lot of pillow fatigue and I don't like entities all in one age one kind of powders that are like jack-a-law traits master of none but I do think that you know some of these super high end multies like a thorn appearing capsulations they make really good products I will say that the testing I've formulated some multies

“you have to look at the each nutrients interaction in their stability meaning like what”

overages you put so that they stay stable across the life of the product the two years of the product that takes so much work in a multi because you're not talking about a couple ingredients you're talking about 50 ingredients or whatever it is and I've taken three years of spending hundreds of thousands of dollars in testing to try and figure all that out so it is very complex to work on a multi and and do it well so I would only trust like a really elite brand

you do want to look for like the methylated b vitamins organic forms of minerals

the right doses I don't think you need like 10,000 percent of anything like I think I would keep it in

the sub one thousand percent look at some of those in my brain myself what like why yeah yeah I think

“some of them are too high and don't need to be that high let me ask you this wouldn't that be like”

just not eating all day they'll can't you get some of those from food you can you can get some from food but you know the argument is that what's different now is there's soil depletion there's EMF there's all these toxins that are in the food supply the air that are in our clothing there you know endocrine disruption you know G whatever there's all kinds of stuff that we're being assaulted with on a daily basis and we're not getting the nutrients that we used to be getting here's a big one

actually this is one of the most exciting things that I've really stumbled into in terms of research and is right in line with this and a good multi hopefully should have this if not by this right away lithium or a tate now you might think lithium like uh someone has you know what would be called schizophrenia multiple personnel you know all these kind of stuff all these right no that is literally 1000 x the difference of what I'm talking about lithium at low levels and again 1000

the level of a medication has been shown in a recent study they looked at all the minerals and how they associate with brain health and they were plotted along the line and they were all kind of going here like along the line and then way up in this kind of north star other side of the graph was lithium it has a profound effect on cognitive health preventing Alzheimer's cognitive

resilience it is a game changer and our soil is all but depleted of it our water supplies all

but depleted of it and maybe even some of the other things that are in our soil and water supplier actually preventing what small amounts are even left there from even getting absorbed so if we look at lithium or a tate game changer so five milligrams really potent profound dose take it at night take it consistently and you'll see incredible benefits I have won from parent capsulations that has NSEL system with it which I'm a huge fan of

that boost glutathione levels at night so that word I was looking so so that would be the the one that I would that I would suggest you add if it's not in a multi what else then I mean we need magnesium we need potassium we need so we need our magnesium you're probably not getting enough of an multi it just needs to be bigger doses I'm a big fan of magnesium biz glycinate magnesium glycinate or magnesium 3 and 8 those are really the two best forms are both amino acid

kulates meaning the amino acid helps the bioavailability glycine or 3 and 8 but the 3 and 8 tends to be better on a cognitive level and the glycinate might be better on kind of a relaxing levels maybe magteen mag 3 and 8 during the day maybe mag glycinate at night something like that

“obviously you're going to see there's a huge percentage of the population I think it's up to”

70% of the population is magnesium deficient and we see that it improves obviously bowel how

effects and regulation and insulin control better certainly bone health stress and resilience like

“there's so many things that magnesium is helping with it's more than 200 chemical reactions”

in the body and that's where we see magnesium just be kind of the the gold star of all supplements everyone wants magnesium seeing benefits of magnesium it works you feel it you see a difference in your life so that would be one I would certainly add I mean severe problems if your electrolites are off obviously yeah like I would say at heart rhythms one big one hydration right heart rhythm yeah exactly for sure magnesium yeah so many places what about D3 and K2 did you put those up there

as essentials I would and I do think this is another one that I may add separately from the

multivitamin the D3 we've seen in data that oil based is better than the dry I've seen as much as like a three or four X difference in terms of bioavailability where the soft gel the oil based D3 is better in in particular if you have your oil based D3 with a fatty meal then you see the best uptake and yes K2 not only for bone health but as both have been shown to improve bone health with D3 and K2 but also D3 has a co-participant in K2 and a number of its reactions

we're delivering them both together as been shown to really have true synergy yeah other and so

there's the MK4 yeah MK7 has more studies last longer MK4 maybe actually more potent but is very

short acting if I was to use just one or the other be MK7 that way too ideally you could get both together and that's even better but I don't know who's selling that that way but that would be cool if you could get MK4 and MK7 together I took one I can't remember off the top of my head it was just four and a seven together and I for the life and me I don't know I'll figure it out and I'll let you know later but I know I was taken one that way I was turned on the K2 for the heart

health and everything with it what about selenium iodine those how we central are those

“to supplement like trace minerals yeah I think they are important you don't want to get too much of”

them and they can end up becoming toxic or kind of interfering with the absorption of other minerals I do think this in particular when we're talking about soil depletion and kind of over farm soil and all of that that you're seeing a lot less of in particular those trace minerals and those are going to have the greatest effect when you reduce something that's already tiny and make that half as much or attempt as much it's going to have more of an impact so honestly there's

probably not enough research on the trace minerals selenium yes there's some good data like especially around vitamin E and how it works with vitamin E and heart health and antioxidant activity and and things like that but I do think that this is where a multi is good insurance in particular on the trace mineral aspect so make sure that it does have some of those trace minerals and iodine as you mentioned is really interesting because salt used to be iodized yeah

yeah like the typical Morton salt or iodized salt but now everyone wants their you know dead sea salt sort of you know whatever like this salt from here or there and it's not iodized anymore it's quote more natural which is cool it may taste better and all that but it doesn't have the iodine that the salt that was highly distributed before had and so we are seeing like a greater increase in thyroid dysfunction and coiters and things along those lines

“so again just making sure you're getting some of these trace minerals is important okay”

well I just looked at the clock and I said 90 minutes that we went tell we're longer I got another probably 10 hours of questions I want to go over with you so we're going to have to do several parts to this I can't tell you how much I enjoy this that mean not just cuz we're boys but this conversation is I can I can talk about this all day and especially with you I have had such a blast doing this man and I really appreciate you leaving a trip with your fiance

early for me in Mexico setting this all up for me here having me down here making the time for me just the daily interactions that I have with you are weekly however they make her I value the

this especially for your work ah thank you brother I appreciate that it's an it's an honor to be

“sitting here with you and to share my heart and my knowledge with you and you're you're following”

and anyway I can help anyone listening please DM me if you have a question I answer all of my DMs follow me on Instagram and all of the different things just at Sean Wells SHA WNW ELLS go to

Sean Wells doc again SHA WN and I have everything about my formulations or various companies but also

like a lot of cool free downloadable guides newsletters that are all free everything's you know free I have a different list of cool supplements that that I think are good stacks or whatever and where to buy them and all that good stuff so should be anything you need on the site and should be

“all free as far as I know the only thing I I charge for out there is my book and and I have a”

course around the book but that's it well I can say this without a shadow would out most trusted name and supplements is an understate and and it sounds like it's the highest level that you could get but I think there's even more to it and I already knew how much you knew but sitting down here and talking with you and doing it face to face and going back and forth and everything and the

“quickness and the efficiency of your answers without hesitation the way that you just go boom boom”

boom boom boom boom without doing the political politician answer to dance around the fact that you

don't know you never did that in fact you had an answer for an answer for an answer every single time

and that shows me not only the credibility but the amount of dedication and just time that you put into this that I can see so I just want everybody we'll see this video but if you're only listening to audio you can hear it but when you see it it's totally different so my friend thank you for everything for all of this like I said it's been the pleasure and honor and everything in between not thank you yes so all right everybody that wraps up another one I will have

all of Sean's info in the description thank you for watching I am sure that this has been the best episode I've ever done so take as much as you can from this that being said stay tuned for playing more to come Dylan Jimelli and Sean Wells signing off