Inside the Private Stock Market Boom: SpaceX, Anthropic, OpenAI & the Rise of Secondaries

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We see a world where the private market opens up and is accessible to any U.S. and global investor. There's 19 companies in the private market AI basket. These companies are grown on average 300%. Please join us in welcoming Gavin Baker, Manjard Partner and CIO of a Trading. The ROI of AI has empirically, factually unambiguously been possible.

Investee is the search for truth. We welcome in. Brad Burstner, it's good to be back with you. You have a program called "In Best America."

“I think we have a historic moment right now to get everybody into the game of capitalism.”

We have a few slides from Brad to kick this off. Let's get started. Let's get started. This panel, I actually was backstage, I said, Gavin, we're talking about the secondaries.

He's like, "What do you mean?"

And they say, "Okay." So here, let's just set this up for everybody. The rooms full of people who are allocators, people who are looking for distributions. So this is secondary markets over the course of the last decade. Is it a amount of money going into VC each year?

The amount of money coming out of VC each year? The red line represents the net effect of that. So we're in like five years, right? Where a lot more is going in than it's coming out. But the secondary market is at a record volume.

So this is, you know, I call these companies quasi public companies. These are these later stage companies. There's buying and selling that's going on every day. Look at that Jason relative to the 21 peak. We thought that was crazy.

At the end of 21, we're double that now in terms of secondary transactions. This is the amount of employee secondary. So this is people buying into Andrew andthropic SpaceX. Now represents 31% of all primary venture activity is buying into these secondarys in 2025.

Secondaries are now competing with IPOs and acquisitions as the principal way that these guys are exiting. So I thought that was a decent setup to start the conversation this morning. Just to level set how important secondarys have become. And then the final one is secondarys over the last couple of years.

We're trading at a discount to market.

“So if we wanted to sell shares in one of our companies, right?”

To buyers out there, they were willing to give us 80 cents on the dollar in order for us to get liquid. So that we could send DPI back to our LPs today. It's at a hundred and six. So a premium in the market as a keyword. And this does include some of the wild west of SPVs

that have been unraveled recently. People charging 10% load-in fees, double carry, and a lot of gray market off-market stuff. This is also having a profound impact, Gavin, on employees at these companies that I want to hear about

because you've seen it up close and personal with SpaceX. And they have a very orderly process here. So why don't we start there? What impact is this having on the employees, Gavin, and then on the market, how orderly is this?

And who are the buyers? Are the buyers the sucker at the table? Are these family offices high net worth individuals who keep hearing us talk about anthropic or SpaceX or Andrewl? And they just say, I have to own the name and they're not discerning.

So Gavin, maybe we could start about the impact on the SpaceX employees just off-first hand, et cetera? Maybe running beyond SpaceX. I do just think if companies are going to be staying private longer, this is absolutely necessary.

There are a lot of people who are very wealthy on paper, but actually cash for. And if you're making tremendous sacrifices, because you work for a company that you really believe in, and you're contributing a lot to that company,

it's hard if you can't buy a nice house for your family. It's hard if you can't afford to do nice things. Especially in your seven, eight or nine of working at the company,

you tell your spouse where we're 10 million on paper, 30 million on paper,

and you don't own your home. Yeah, are your 15. And so I think this is necessary and important. And you know, whether it is good or bad, I think it is very clear that companies are going to stay private for longer.

What's the reason to stay private longer? Truly. I don't think there is actually a good reason to stay private longer. There here. And I completely agree with you too.

Yeah, and why is it happened? This is founders don't want, let's just call it what it is. Founders don't want to be under a microscope. They want to build an enjoy life and have an easier than being on the public market. Microsoft?

“Yeah, I think there is a perception that life is a private company.”

It's easier and you have more freedom and you can think long term.

I always think about Mark Zuckerberg's commentary that had he been public.

So just, you know, Facebook, I won't call it in your death experience. But long ago, it's difficult to believe, but I don't know, 2011-12, Facebook did not believe in apps. They believed in something called HTML6. It was the cataclysmic debate.

And it was me and Brett Taylor. Me versus Brett. I was like apps. I want to go build a phone. Brett was like HTML5.

Is that pick Brett? I spent the next three years on winding that decision. Absolutely. And Mark Zuckerberg. It basically the idea was, you know, the iPhone comes out.

And initially there was not a big app ecosystem. And there was a thought that, hey, there's no need for apps. You're just going to use the web browser on your phone. And HTML5 was a way of making websites. Look, mobile native.

Dynamic. Yeah, and this seemed like kind of the future to a lot of very smart people, including Google, Facebook, but it was not the future. It was wrong.

“And what Mark Zuckerberg has said, I think several times in public,”

is he profoundly believes that how he'd been a public company when, you know, there was this internal debate between chocolate and bread.

And the detail was actually, I went to Zock and I said, I need a billion

dollars to build this phone. And we are in this moment in 2010 where we can have the third leg of the stool. There's Android. There's iPhone.

Neither have really taken off yet. And he's like, we don't have a billion. And I said, but the public markets will give us a billion. And he said, no, but then we went public a year later. Yeah.

But that year made all the difference. Made all the difference. He has said that had, I had the constant pressure testing from public market investors. It was just a dynamic.

I was talking to another CEO here this morning. When you're the CEO of a private company, you are the most special flower to all of your investors. You're like, you're as important to your board members, particularly if you're really successful.

You know, maybe as the board members, families or parents, you know, the board members think about you a lot. Once you're public, you're one of thousands of companies. And that's its own dynamic. But the consequence of this is that private investors are often selling to management

teams. And at some level, that can mean telling management teams what they need to hear because you want to be able to keep participating in the rounds. Once a company's public, you can buy yourself as you wish. And this means that investors feel free to give companies management teams.

And Zerberg said, had I been public? Had I been getting rigorous detailed questions from really smart public equity investors? I think I would have--

>> And then the second unwritten story of that which has never been said.

He called me. He's like, hey, man, what the f*** is going on over there? And I was like, yeah, I know, because I had just left. And then we wrote a deck.

“And I walked over it, it's not going to be like, here's the deck of what you need to do.”

>> Yeah, well, these things. >> Well, man. >> This is a key point, I think, Gavin. >> Well, no. >> But we never--

>> You do not get clean information as the CEO and the management team, because people want access. And once you give the truth or you ask the hard questions, you might lose access. >> 100%. >> The stochophantic nature of private markets is real.

>> No, an exceptional CEO. >> You ain't-- >> Seeks outside. >> Yeah, I get a feedback. >> Looking for that. >> But not many actively discards.

Not many CEOs maybe are aware of that way. By the way, I do think we have to give Brad credit. >> Yeah. >> That was a very good deck. You sit back in 2012.

>> No, because he did a second one. >> He did the second one. He did the open letter to Zuckerberg at the end of-- >> Was that at the end? >> One, he could do.

>> One, he did. >> October 22. >> What did you call it? >> Get fit. >> What was the time to get fit?

>> Time to get fit. >> That was an impact. Those are two very impactful. >> Okay. >> So look, you're hearing the bulls on going public.

But Kelly, take the red team the other side. Because you're on the other side. You built a private business. You sold it to Schwab. So clearly, one of the largest financial institutions

that was going to ram its way into this market. But then you're seeing a lot of pushback. And droppic is like, hey, dissolve these S.P.Vs. Open AI, I think, was saying today now, dissolve these S.P.Vs.

Should we dissolve the S.P.Vs? >> Where are they coming from? And why are you on the right side of history? >> And have you had to dissolve any of the ones on your market list?

>> No. >> No.

“Look, I think that, first of all, being a private company CEO”

for most of my career and then being a public company CEO for three years, I recognize the job is incredibly different.

You're not doing this. >> What do you mean when you say much less fun? >> Turning into an investment manager, primarily as a public company CEO, is a very different job than being a visionary product first,

first principles business. When you become a public company CEO, everything changes. And I would say in the world we're in now, the kind of capital you can raise, the kind of capital that was represented in the very last discussion,

allows you to extend your private life, SpaceX, a private company for 24 years.

But the reality is, these SPVs that are now emerging,

because these companies are getting so big, is because a market's trying to happen, and a company like SpaceX has done this extraordinarily well. They have run essentially liquidity programs for almost a decade, because there's so much pent-up interest

in both being an investor and getting liquidity for some of the reasons that Gavin was mentioning.

“So I think what we see now is the next phase of this.”

This Schwab deal with forge basically says to the world, this is a real asset class. It's more than just secondaries. We're going to put these companies, the company's equity into fund products,

into very well-managed, regulated SPV structures, because they do serve a purpose in the market. Yeah, but how do you convince Elon specifically to give you access to that when he wants to do it himself? And he has a team and every six months he runs it himself?

How do you get access to that? What's your pitch to the next Elon? Here's the pitch. The pitch is you're going to go from being a private company, eventually, to a public company.

What Schwab represents is 46 million investors,

and $12 trillion. This will change capital access, and the way that you distribute your shares, moving from private to public. How did that work when you pitched them on that?

Well, you should watch out. We got our first SPVs on SpaceX in 2018, in 2019. Were they okay with it? Absolutely. And then, as we got closer to the IPO,

we said, "Guess what? We've got 30 million retail investors that would like to have a $50,000 slice of SpaceX." And he went out publicly and talked about having broad-based distribution. At the IPO price?

At the IPO price?

And Schwab was named one of the IPO allocations.

“How did you think this is actually a very effective pitch?”

I think a lot of these CEOs. They're a little bit ambivalent about, you know, I think they understand that maybe the institutions who are investing in these private rounds. You know, they may represent, you know, unions.

They may represent retirement plans. But I do think they like the idea of democratizing access. And if they're building something that they think is great, giving ordinary Americans an opportunity to participate. I actually think that's a very appealing story to a lot of these CEOs.

And they understand the power of equity, so Brad. What is the downside then? Because you're part of the Go Direct Movement now. BG2 pod. Officially, fifth bestie, Gavin officially, sixth bestie.

That's Gavin, that's new news. We officially made you six bestie today. But does that be a definitively broad-brad? Because that's the real news. I can, you're standing behind Brad.

You're just giving him that big bear hug, right behind him. Wow. So are you set up the big spoon? You have the big spoon now. In the side draw with the extra spoon. But Brad, it's getting very weird very quick.

In all seriousness, with great power comes great responsibility. Sometimes the, you know, the enthusiasm people can have can exceed reality. Right. Going direct, you've become more measured. I've noticed as your profile has gone up.

“I think all of us have to, like, just make sure people don't blindly follow trades.”

Don't, I mean, you were talking stuff down on CMBC a couple of times saying, Hey, I don't think the average American needs to be in some of these companies. There's time. I get worried. I get worried at this point in the market.

It's particularly on CMBC where you're talking to retail investors at home. I was one of those retail guys looking up to everybody on this stage. Trusting everybody on this stage. And when people are telling you to yellow into right double fee structure, SPVs and all this, you know, like it's time to be careful to do your work to be thoughtful.

We're in this because we want this to be durable democratization for a long time.

We want to build trust among those who feel left out and left behind in capitalism.

“We all think that we need to go public sooner, the reason I think we,”

it is destabilizing when you're creating trillions of dollars in private value. And 80% of America think it's a scam where they're left out and left behind. That's when they come rushing in. That they could be. Right.

And it's also not so good cards. Right. So all I'm saying, like I said about, they asked the question on CMBC last week. $30,000 fresh capital and you were sitting at home is today the day that you would shove it all into the market. And I said, no, I think about it in sizes.

Right. We just had two of the biggest months in the last 10 years in the public markets. They've been big months. So if I had a stack of 100, I may put 30 to work today.

I'm never going to pick the bottom.

I'm never going to pick the top. But I certainly wouldn't be putting it all to work. And I'd say the same thing about late stage privates. People who are yellowing into this stuff. And then they feel really disappointed.

Let me hold on a second. I bought the SpaceX IPO and it didn't go up 3x. Let me ask you then. Do you view this as exit liquidity for you? Like, would you shape your portfolio in returns?

And increasingly say, you know what? I don't know when this guy's going to go public. Let me just pump the stuff out. Let me get the distribution. Let me send it to my LPs and just call it a day.

We are selling into this. Right. So I have LPs in this room who say, listen, we invested in your VC5 or VC6 seven or eight years ago. If you can go sell a slice of that at 4 or 5x. And we get DPI.

And it's priced really high. Then go sell some of it. And we often don't talk about this invention land. Half of what we do is in the public markets. Gavin and I get up every morning.

“And we think to ourselves, should we buy today or should we sell today?”

Venture capitalists don't think about the sell part. They think about the buy part. So one, if we're going to stay private for longer and we're going to have trillion dollar, you know, private companies and data bricks at 200 billion on this, you've got to think about is today at day we should be selling

some and returning it to our investors. Because I didn't create though as what Jason said. It's very complicated personality dynamics where maybe you get shot out of a new company. Maybe you get shot out of an incremental round. And, you know, there's bad blood because you're a credible investor.

And there's the signaling risk. Whereas in the privates, if you and Gavin decide to sell, nobody knows. Well, no, in the private. Sorry, the public's nobody knows. Yeah, public's.

They don't know until our 13 F comes out. Okay.

But in the private market, it's always a conversation between me and the founder

to say, listen, we're, we're going to sell 30% of our position. They never like it, Chema. They're always like, we wish you wouldn't do that. They don't want it known, et cetera. Yeah.

But my job as a fiduciary to the LPs of the social media is to do that. It does feel Gavin, like we have crossed over for early stage venture to a point in which there is a third way. Either your company had M&A and we saw in the presentation yesterday that during the wrath of Lena Con, there was no M&A.

And it just froze the market. Now it's coming back. IPOs, we did have some freezing of that market for certain periods. But this third way is now fantastic. I can tell you as the earliest of the early.

We are now parapursu selling into every chance we get because our average investment is at 10 to 20 million dollar valuations. When they hit 500 million, I tell the founder,

you're going to start selling a 500 million.

I'm going to sell right alongside you so that I can invest in the next you coming into the market. Everybody's fine with it. But I can tell you six or seven years ago when I did this with a company, they begged me to not participate when they hit peak served.

Twenty twenty-one.

“They begged me, "Jay cow, you have to be loyal to us.”

You can't sell parapursu." And I said, "You guys are clearing 40 million of the 110 million dollar round. I'm just asking to be next to you. Same amount."

Can I ask Kelly a question, "How do you systematize this so that it's like an exchange?" So if we just want to hit the bid, we can do it. Like what I don't like about the secondary markets is, I ask my CFO.

He calls five guys. Then my fund CFO. She calls like four, you know. It's like ticker brokers. Yes.

We get a bunch of bids. None of it makes any sense. And I'm like, "And I'm already dealing with this Brad said the Ajita from the CEO. It's got to be easier than this."

Yes. Yeah. I'll look. 10 years ago, we said there needs to be infrastructure to pull this off. This can't just be a big shadow market. We're sort of in this tipping point now,

where we spent the last three years building this brand new platform so that a company could plug into it.

and say, "We're going to offer liquidity and furthermore if you're a VC." And you're on that cab structure for 10 years and you want to offer LP liquidity. You can do it.

What do you mean? What do you mean?

We would be plugging into Schwab's 30 million humans

that are buying stuff on Schwab's. Yes. There's a platform. We brought a platform with about 3 million investors. And now we're going to add 46 million investors to this.

Yeah, but we hold those.

“Aren't those a credit investor that they need to be?”

Because he just had the chair of the SEC on. So today, if you are trading individual shares, whether it's in an SPV or direct on a cab table, you're a credited, however, there are products coming to market.

We can talk about this in detail later that have 60 companies, including SpaceX, that are listed products for unaccredited $500 minimums and that capital for those funds will be the underlying list. These are Interval funds.

These are Interval funds. Interval funds. I think Nevol just did US VC as one of these. He's going to contribute to them. Now, the closed end funds are very different bet

because you're betting on FOMO. Because if you look at the underlying value of some of the assets and those closed end funds, they have no bearing to reality of what those underlying shares are actually worth. So price discovery is another key component of this structural shift.

But to answer your questions specifically, if a VC's LPs want to recycle or want to get liquid, then a platform like this will allow them to recycle that capital and put it back into the next vintage fund if they want this. I have a question for you based on this.

When these returns come out,

the mean return inventors going to look incredible.

The median return is still going to be shit. So walk us through how people will sort through that and the reality of what's going to happen in the next year.

“So I think there's two very important things.”

One, I observe if you were a venture firm and you do not have material exposure to one of these trillion dollar plus companies, that you had many, many chances to buy into. You're not only your returns, not going to be good,

but you're not going to have DPI on a relative basis, but you're not going to have DPI. You know, great series A firms, they may not have this, but their returns are still amazing with great DPI. But in so I am beginning to see venture firms

who don't have exposure to one of these companies, behave in strange ways, because I think they're starting to feel a little bit of franchise risk, because their DPI and their returns are going to go

from, you know, hey, top quintile, top turtile, turtile, so they're doing unnatural things. They're writing what I see as co-options, like a bunch of these, you know, Neil Labs. Well, I need a story.

I've done something, and maybe some of these co-options pay off, but I do think they're engaging at some level and maybe they're chasing it, they're chasing, where as the people who have exposure to this, like you're being a lot more disciplined,

because they know they're in a great position.

“I think another very important dynamic is going to happen”

in the world of long-only mutual funds and crossover funds. So long-only mutual funds, you know,

my former employer, fidelity, amazing place, love it.

Bailey Geffer, capital research, well into T-Rout. They all can, per SEC rules, allocate up to 15% of their funds. They do privates. And these are the biggest pools of capital in the world.

They dwarf sovereign wealth funds. But, you know, most firms, because they don't want to get in trouble with the SEC, they say, hey, we're going to cap it at 3% or 5% or 7%. There was a very public, Bailey Geffer,

it was forced to sell SpaceX last year for regulatory reasons. And what's going to happen has these companies go public. All of these long-only mutual funds are by and large, finding it hard to participate in private markets right now,

because they're at the limits of their self-imposed. 3%, 3%, 5%. When a company goes public and lock up expires, it moves out of that bucket. So this is going to be hundreds of billions of dollars

of new late-stage demand that is coming back to the market after kind of being out. That's a lot of dry powder. It's a lot of dry powder. The net weight is up then.

The marginal trade is... So if the founders are going to be in the cap bird seat, people are going to be looking to put money to work. Interesting buzz going around about accreditation rules. We had the head of the SEC on all ends interview show.

And they're going to have a sophisticated investor test something I've been talking about for a long time. That would really democratize the way invest America has access. And then funds I've been getting pitch-free years on, "Oh, put your fund on blockchain

or sell your fund into this ETF." Maybe you could talk a little bit about the possibilities around venture funds being more tradable like secondaries are. Is that on your roadmap?

Obviously there's demand for it. What would that, because I can tell you what that would do for my LPs, you know, Brad, Jamot's LPs and previous funds. If you could come in and out of these funds, the way you can come in and out of Amphropic,

my lower that could be just incredible for folks who,

I don't know, they have a divorce, they have a life event, you know, just a little more fluidity. So there's been secondary fund trading for a long time.

“I think blockchain and tokenization makes it more efficient.”

That world will come. The question we're asking ourselves now is, if you're an LPs in a fund that's holding something as valuable as this, are you really interested in trading your fund position? Or do you just want to get out of that name?

The big winner, that name. And our view is it's probably the latter. And in some cases funds will come to us and say, we've got a vintage fund that has two companies in it that are 15 years old and we can't clear that fund.

And so that's an application of liquidity to the market that we think is coming to the market. Are you worried at all over this next year about this idea of retail being exit liquidity for these three ginormous companies?

Is there any risk like, how do you bucket the risk? How do you manage the risk? Yeah. What is the risk? If something were to happen, what's the blowback? I was talking about this yesterday.

We're watching these valuations in these multiples.

“We had this conversation that dinner last night”

and saying, wow, these are extraordinary and people should come into this market. And not ordinary is a coded word for... It's an aliphate. It's an aliphate.

It's an aliphate. It's a bubble collar ring. You're saying you think they're high at the valuation rate. The retail investor coming into this space needs to look down market

and look at interesting opportunities that aren't the things that are on CNBC every day and have access to them earlier. And we had a bunch of retail investors show up in 2018 in 2019 that wanted to be in space ex.

And they're thrilled that they got in

when the valuation was 30 billion.

And I think if the market opens up, that's what we'll be talking about. What do I want to get into now? That's not, you know, at the very, very top of the market getting ready to go.

Also, proud and Gavin, we're getting better shout out to Gerley. We're getting better at pricing these IPOs and not leaving money on the table. They're fully valued in most cases

when they go public, yeah. Or in some cases. If you still miss price, they're massively miss price. Well, no, we have seen some that have gone down after they go out.

So, you know, nothing good that anybody wants. I mean, listen. Anyway, what do you guys think? Are we closer to public market? Correctly pricing them?

I mean, Gavin, I've been doing this 25 years. There are moments at the public market as undervalued relative to privates. And moments where privates are undervalued relative to public. Right now, everything in the world of technology

is pretty fully valued. Right? Like, it's, you can't have the parabolic moves we've had and think that everything is cheap. That's not to say that we're not going to go higher.

But when you've been punched in the face as many times as all of us have over the last 15 years in technology, we know it's a jagged line up into the right. So, for the retail investor, so long as they have staying power.

So, if you're going to launch a product, as long as the retail investor can stay in that product through the drawdown, they're going to do fine.

The problem is most of them, you'll low at the top

because everybody gets them all jimmed up and excited. And so, they're, you know, they're leveraging up. They're doing two X-Levered, you know, memory trades and all this shit that Gavin Eirwatt. There are 14 ETFs launching on the day of the SpaceX IPO

that are levered ETFs into SpaceX at like whatever, 1.75 trillion. So, this just tells me that there's a lot of signal. We may not be at the top, but we ain't at the bottom. We're bouncing along the top might be at the bottom.

You know, you got to allocate accordingly.

“And that's what active management is about.”

If we do not, if we're not thinking about that, when people are puking into their garbage cans at the start of the Iran War and the market is down,

"Good God, these hymnthropic revenues are off the charts. We got to get more dollars at risk, shove more onto the table." In both anthropic and public market stocks. But then 75 days later, it's all changed.

Right? Now, the guys have been in the market cycle where these moves are just so concentrated in time, where you take like a year or two's worth of moves and you compress it into 30 days.

60 days? I mean, this is nothing relative to 99 and 2000. Nothing. This is nothing relative to that. Like, I mean, describe it.

Sometimes I, yeah, I pack it. Sometimes I wake up. It was 99,200 in terms of like, if this is a roller coaster, what was that? Yeah.

And what was that? I mean, I don't, you know, this is like a, this is a roller coaster that's kind of a gentle sine wave. Yes. 99 was Vegas on a Friday night after way too many drugs.

Okay. Like it was out of control knots. CMGI had no revenue in the stock went from $2 to $2,000 over the course of, you know, six months. Quite a bit by Foxboro Stadium.

They're on the cover of Time Magazine and they're out of business two years later. Right? Like that is very different than anthropic, open AI and SpaceX or extraordinarily real businesses.

“So I think the better compare is like 2021.”

Yeah. Right? Where valuations get ahead of themselves or they're at the top end of the range. We could have a normal run of the milk consolidation

in the public markets in the semi-index of 10 or 20 percent,

which means high beta would be down 30 to 40 percent. And a lot of people who just got in would be panicking, right? But the people have been in for six months or three years would, would, would notice that that's just a blip. So I don't think it's at all like that.

Okay. I have a question for the three of you. Yeah. Final question. Take the top ten names, private companies off.

Okay? Forget those. You can't pick those. Give me a sub, you know, in the tens of billions, a few hundred billion private companies that you could buy today,

a secondary end that you do not own that you would want to own. I'll start with you, Brad, just go around the horn. Something you don't own. But if you had the chance to buy a secondary, you would. I mean, I take a company, you know,

in that what I call inflection growth,

so these are companies, the thousand companies that are over three billion.

But let's call it sub 50 billion.

“I think it's the trickiest area of the investing landscape.”

Because they're the beneficiaries of high valuations. Yet they still have binary risk, right? Like anthropic, open AI, space X. I don't think these companies have binary risk. But they're a lot in, you know, in that bucket that do.

And so, I mean, we own most of the ones I want to own. I can't give you one that we don't own. Well, one was, if I would've owed it, I should really owe this. It's hard to question. I'll give you, I'll give you the last one.

I'll give you one here. I'd say like Sierra, Brett Taylor's company. I don't think you. So they're building basically sales force, agent native. So sales, marketing, customer service agents that are agent native.

I'll give you the downside in the upside. We also want a company called Parlo and the same space in Europe that I think is really interesting. The downside, opening AI and Anthropics, say we're going to do this. And all the sudden it eviscerates their hundreds of millions of dollars in revenue.

The upside on these businesses is that they actually have already built. Very sophisticated, agentic layers. And that all these guys met a Google space X come along and say we want to buy you. Because we want to accelerate our path into age. I'll give you the name that I was convinced of today.

Yesterday by Thomas LeFont, which was Revolute.

You know, I had always the kind of like I had some early explain what they did.

Like I owned some Coinbase, I owned some Robin Hood. We did all of that stuff, it was fine. Kind of ignored FinTech. And Thomas backstage gave me an incredibly together, an incredibly compelling pitch for Revolute. And I actually went.

And I was like, okay, show me what the Revolute chair price is in the secondary markets. I got kind of curious. Maybe I should pick up some. So that would be what does Revolute do? It's a bank.

It's a bank. And what's interesting is it's a Neil bank that has a completely next generation stack. Kind of what Brad said is like that theme of you rebuild it in the modern era. And you unbundle the incumbent. That that has a lot of legs.

And in a regulated market that has a ton of legs. And so, you know, they're doing really well in Europe. They're coming to the United States. The founder seems to be just an absolute star. 10 millions of customers, 14 lines of business.

They're like a million dollars. I'm sorry. But I like that.

“I have Gavin, do you have Sharon that you bought recently?”

No, I would just say, well, you know, two names that we've been involved in publicly as leading our area and drive nets. And they're both in the networking space. And basically has data centers get more specialized and complicated.

It's called the disaggregation of inference and pre-filling decode. And to make all of these chips to work together like a symphony. And I have the kind of the right chip for the right job at the right time. I do think we need to reinvent networking and RIA and drive nets are coming at the problem. And a very different way.

And if you're an AI lab. You've been one of the earliest, I guess.

“I think that you framed this on a podcast that I saw, which is,”

there is an impending supercycle in infra networking silicon. And you've really been at the front of it. I buy into it completely now, too. I have a really, it's really, it's really good. It's really heavy. Any names?

Nero Robotics in Europe. Nero Robotics is a nickname. Yes. What is it? AI powered logistics robotics.

Love it. They're not in the main strip of high value real estate in Silicon Valley. They're in Germany.

Quite company, big investors, 100 million revenue, kicking ass.

Love it. You know, I have a couple of visas that I've been looking at. One is what is Elon helping put into space as the price goes down. And so we did direct on the cap table in SPV for vast, which is building space stations. And we think they're going to win.

The other one is what I'll just call Uber 2.0. You know, we, girl, and I took a lot of notes on that Brad as well. And so we were able to do zip line. And we put a small ticket size into zip line as well. Because if you can take the delivery cost down from $15 to $5 and then eventually two,

that's going to just drive consumption massively. And it's going to happen in the air. And these actual drones had such a false start that everybody gave up on the entire sector. And now it works. And it was just a very simple innovation that Keller told me, which was,

it's the drone stays up in the air and drops it tether with the box in your burrito. If you grab the tether and you pull it, it just comes down. You don't have to land like this giant robot in your backyard with blades spinning to kill your dog.

“Well, I think there's actually a very important like on zip line.”

It's an amazing, it has done great things for the world.

So my, my, my, a tradeys is also involved in zip line. But zip line started. So the hard thing is to make anything autonomous work. You need to get it out into the world and gathering real-world data. This is how AI works.

And it's hard to get approval to fly things around autonomously in American airspace. So Keller had the idea of, we're going to go to African countries. And we were going to, you know, if a delivery to help, we're delivered medicines to these families. And they focused on maternity. And they have cut the maternal mortality rate in some of these African countries by 90 to 95%.

So you're in a small village. There's a one midwife. There's an app. A woman goes into labor. They press a button.

And, you know, an hour later, a zip line drone drops or refrigerated package of modern messing around a lot. And that's incredible. He did it for seven years. And it's had a huge impact on health outcomes in these African countries. And now it's come to America.

This is an incredible story.

And I've basically now reconstructed my firm to do the barbell. I missed the seed investment. I turned them down. Because I was like, we don't invest on that continent. We don't have any insight into it.

We don't understand it. And hard, where's hard. And he has the email, whatever. And I've stayed in touch with them. And he said, listen, I figured it out.

And I said, hey, you know, I have the syndicate. Let me see if I can correct that mistake. May I invest. You're my dream investor. I've wanted you on this all time. And it's just so important.

No, no, we've been friends for all this time. And I have had him on the pod three times.

“And he said, what are you going to be on the cap table?”

And I said, you know what? I learning from you guys, specifically this late state shop. I'm like, well, I can do that. And here we are. And on that note.

Yes. Let's wrap up. Yes. Well done, guys. Thank you so much.

Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.

Thank you.