(dramatic music)
- This is becoming undone.
- I got humbled with that first ACL.
It was not a typical ACL, it was high speed collision. We were running down the line, ball underneath foot, caught myself with the other foot, and then the rest was history, right? It's pretty gross on.
And that, it was my worst fear. And you don't really think about it, because if you do, you're doomed. But I knew in that moment, I'm like something's terribly wrong.
“And I just remember staring at the wall.”
I'm in the training room, being like, I'm done, like, the who am I? And you go home, and I clearly remember this, and I looked down, and I'm like, I can't even make a quad.
That's when it hit me, I'm like, this is going to be a super, super long journey. But it was the first time that I realized that I'm breakable. I would say the idea of, I don't know if I can do this,
was the only time that hit pre-surgery was my second ACL.
I clearly remember laying your pre-op, and I had my little cap on, I was in the gown, and I was laying there, knee was signed, like, we were ready to go back, and I looked at my mom, as you know, it's coming.
And I'm like, I don't, I don't think I can do this. And word for word, she said, "Well honey, we don't really have a choice, like we're here." I went to that line knowing, I did everything possible.
On the days, I saw no light. I found a light by the end of practice, by the end of the day.
“I stayed next to a session to figure it out.”
I proved to myself that I was strong enough, I was smart enough, and I had to write people around me to be the best version of me. Was I the best in the world, no? Do I think I can get there?
Hopefully, to I'm skating another year, but anyone going into it, and crossing that line just reaffirmed that belief, but it was even before that. I am Sarah Warren, and I am Undone.
- Hey, friend, I'm glad you're here. Welcome to yet another episode of Becoming Undone, the podcast for those who dare bravely, risk mindily, and grow relentlessly. I'm Toby Brooks, a speaker, author, professor,
and performance scientist. I spent much the last two decades working as an athletic trainer and strength coach in the professional collegiate and high school sport settings. And over the years, I've grown more and more fascinated
with what sets high achievers apart, and how failures that can suck in the moment, can end up being exactly the push we needed to propel us on our path to success. Each week I'll be coming undone on by new guests
to examine how high achievers can transform from falling apart, to falling into place. I'd like to emphasize this shows entirely separate from my role at Baylor University, but it's my attempt to apply what I've learned
in what I'm learning and to share with others about the mindsets of high achievers. It's great to be back with you for another installment of Becoming Undone. It's been too long since we connected here,
and I've missed you. I've been so excited to bring this episode to you, ever since I recorded a few weeks back, and I think you're gonna love it. And speaking of love, I'll start off by saying,
as I've said on this show repeatedly before, I absolutely love the Olympics. Summer, winter does not matter.
“As a kid, the first games I remember watching”
were the 84 summer games back in Los Angeles, and I was absolutely enraptured by the thought of being able to not just compete, but to represent America. The Olympics felt like the ultimate stage
to show the world that you could be the best. Over the years I've had more than a few Olympic heroes who inspired me to train a little harder, eat a little better, or dig a little deeper in the search of my own best.
As a group older, I continued to love the Olympics, but a newer and deeper ways as my work and sport. My study of human performance and my connection for the human interest in the Olympics grew and deepened. In the summer of 1996, I was taking
an undergrad exercise physiology class. My professor was a former Olympic swimmer himself, and we oftentimes got out of class a little bit early during those two weeks, just so that we could do what he called research,
which basically meant we were watching in the Atlanta games.
Those same games were past guest Charles Austin from episode 79 captured a gold medal in a high jump. His story of ascending to the top of the Olympic medal stand from not even competing and track until a senior year of high school,
that's a great example of the kind of story that motivates me to expect more out of myself. After I graduated from college and got certified as both an athletic trainer and a string coach, my aspirations were to work
at the high-level sports, which included the Olympics as I started my career. The closest I'd ever get to that dream of wearing the team issued Red White and Blue was starting the summers of 1999 and 2001
when I worked as an athletic trainer for two different USA baseball junior national teams.
I still have some of that gear that I got along
with a world championship ring to show for my time and I have zero regrets.
“This past winter, it was kind of a circle of life moment for me.”
As the 2026 Milan Cortino winter games were held from February 6th to 22nd. And I was, once again, enrolled in another exercise for theology course, the time at the graduate level. This time I'm not so much studying
and preparing for opportunities in sport that I hope are coming my way, but instead simply trying to grow and wisdom and knowledge about all aspects of human performance that can help me help others and still maybe even myself
get a little bit better. It was during those two weeks in February where I wished I could have just canceled work and watched the games full-time,
like I always wish I could have done.
But instead, I had to balance work in school and the Olympics, and that's when I first encountered the incredible story of Sarah Warren. And I went to Olympic games that were literally brimming with 30 for 30 were the stories all over the place.
Sarah stood out.
“There was, of course, Lindsey Vaughn's tragic injury”
near the starting gates and what would likely be her final Olympic moments. There was a heartbreak of American skater Iliam Allen, the quad god, whose plans for Olympic gold were dashed just moments into his free skate.
We're too fall strapped in from serious contender to an eventual eighth place finish. But who could forget the infectious smile, deliberated in free performances, and sometimes our rated celebratory outbursts
of skating, prodigy, turn Olympic champion, Alyssa Lou. She'd endured a rigorous training regimen to the point of walking away from the sport entirely until she finally reconnected with her love for skating, and she found her way back to the ice.
Free from those chains of doubt and expectation and perfectionism, she competed with such, there's really no other word for it, just joy, and you couldn't help but be moved by watching her skate. There was all this and more at the 26 winner games.
But the story I came across set up
on the most inspirational and the most incredible
and the most undone was Sarah Warren. The long-track speed skater had made the team through an unconventional path. She'd been a division once aqua player at the University of Illinois.
It seemed like a curious way to find your cell phone on Olympic ice, but it wasn't just that unexpected path that most made me search for more info on Sarah. It was her story. 10 surgeries, the first at the age of 13.
ACLs in both knees, an ankle injury that nearly derailed her 2026 Olympic dreams. I found a scene in article that moved me nearly to tears where a gritty, tough, resilient, collegiate soccer player, Sarah, looked at the facts
surrounding her athletic dreams and made a vulnerable, gutting, excruciating assessment. As the article quotes, she recounted, quote, as she was wheeled back for her second ACL surgery. Warren looked at her mother, Catherine,
and said, "I don't think I can do this." I say, "Absolutely, I have the hurricane that is a purpose to run." In those moments of gripping, crushing doubt, we can't breathe. We can't see, we can't even imagine how we'll move ahead. That'll only be better for it, but Sarah did.
Surrounded by an incredible supporting cast of family, friends, and an orthopedic surgeon who would grow to become the model of who she wants to see. She's a great dancer, a great dancer. And an orthopedic surgeon who would grow to become the model of who she wants to be
when she's done competing for big-ten championships and gold medals or anything else. When all that's over, not only did she do it, she came back stronger. I reached out to Sarah hoping to get a glimpse in our journey and a game in the insights she'd gathered along the way, and I was thrilled when she agreed to come on.
And her interview was no opponent in the absolute goals. I hope you'll enjoy my conversation with U.S. Olympian Sarah Warren in episode 155. Let's get into it. Greetings and welcome back. Becoming and done as a podcast for those who dare bravely risk mightily
and grow relentlessly join me till we brook, 'cause I invite a new guest each week, where we examine how high achievers can transform from falling apart to falling into place. Y'all, I'm so excited about this guest. I can't even begin to tell you.
Today's guest is 2026 Olympic speed skater Sarah Warren. Her path as skaters, speed skaters, it wasn't linear. It was full of twists and turns. She started as a division one soccer player to Illinois, stepped away from that battle through multiple injuries,
and then rebuilt herself into a long track speed skater on the Olympic stage. So Sarah, thanks so much for joining me today. Thank you so much for having me. I'm really excited to be here.
Yeah, I always start off a little bit of a softball.
When you were growing up, what did you want to be?
“And what did you believe that that version of you could prove?”
I always wanted to be the best. And that wasn't always the strongest of fastest I did love to win. I will say I was probably the most competitive kid on the playground. But I just wanted to be the best version of myself.
I knew from a young age what I thought I was capable of.
And for me, if I fell short of that, that was not a success,
“because I knew I had what it took to get there.”
And so even from a young age, I started off in hockey. I would be the best hockey player. Now, it was slowly realized that I did not have good enough of handling skills for that. But it was the goal when I was out on the ice.
And even from a young age, I will discuss it. But I got surgeries at a pretty young age. And I knew then that I want to be an orthopedic surgeon. And so I was a pretty young kid with pretty lofty goals. My parents definitely knew they had their hands full.
But anything I tried, I wanted to reach the highest level. I thought I could achieve. And from a young age, I knew that was the goal. So you're an uped Illinois, where you are a college soccer player. Big 10. I mean, obviously, at a big stage.
How much would you say your identity was tied into being an athlete at that point? And who were you if that were to go away? Let's say at that point, 100%. I don't think I had the mindset I do now that you're more than a soccer player. You're more than the athlete.
You're more than, you know, this division one.
“First and because that is, that's what you stroke.”
Like, throughout my entire playing career for soccer, I wanted to be a division one soccer player. And so you entangle yourself with this idea of that to you are, especially when you achieve it. Because you worked your whole life to become that.
And it's a dangerous mindset to have, to be honest, because again, as we'll talk about, you'll get injured. And when you're an injured, it completely takes that away. When you can't play. When you can't even run, you can't even make a quad.
Then who are you? And it was a tough lesson to learn.
And I always say, my five years at Illinois made me who I am.
Because I came in, not facing too much adversity, right? I was able to achieve this dream of running track at high school, playing division one soccer, and being able to speed skate. So not much got thrown to my path. I was kind of riding this high of, I was unstoppable in life,
threw me a reminder that that is not always the case. So I was going into college. It was a hundred percent who I thought it was. I was Sarah the division one soccer player. Worked with a lot of athletes, not a lot in soccer,
but definitely in college sports soccer.
“I think as unique in that, it almost seems like until an athlete”
gets her first ACL tear like she's not really trying very hard. It's almost like inculturated as part of the sport, right? So from my background and research, it looks like you've had injuries from early teen years and really that magnified as you got into college.
So talking through maybe that first taste of adversity and what it was like
early on in the process and what your thought process was like those initial few injuries. Yeah, when I was younger, I had pretty easy surgeries. My knees, when I was around 10, I think, or 11, I just couldn't, I couldn't do any sports, my knees just kept swelling.
We had no idea it was going on and that's actually where I found Dr. Brian Cole, who did a pretty simple scope to me. It was the world's greatest surgery and he found this plight got, which is an extra lining and it fixed me. Let's hop right in here and learn some things together, friends.
The condition Sarah referred to, "Plyca syndrome" can be very painful. Not to mention somewhat difficult to diagnose. If you think of the joint capsule of the knee as a type of wrapper that surrounds and protects and supports and helps the articulate surfaces of the bone stay lubricated and nourished with
synovia fluid, then the plightca are like small folds or pleats of that tissue. And the present all the way back to our earliest development, human embryonically. Heavy activity like we see in competitive athletes can result in a irritation where those folds can override one another or the condiles of the femur but they become inflame. And it's usually activity mediated, which means the more you do the worse it gets.
But when you rest it gets better, which is maddening for a competitive athlete.
So the problem is when you resume training once you start to feel better,
it gets aggravated all over again. So it makes for this vicious cycle. And making it even more confusing to diagnose is the fact that, oftentimes, plightca will click or pop over the media aspect of the knee in much the same way a cartilage tear or a meniscus injury might. So while the history of a plightca syndrome doesn't
usually involve a specific one particular movement that led to that injury like a meniscus might, clinically they can often present very similarly. The bad news is that plightca syndrome hurts. The good news is, even if conservative measures prove ineffective, the surgical fix is usually fairly quick and the outcomes are usually pretty good.
And unlike some of the other surgeries, Sarah would eventually face plightca aren't really structural.
There isn't much risk in terms of instability or anything that might threaten...
Unfortunately for Sarah, a simple plightca fix was just the tip of the iceberg of what she would have to face in the pursuit of her athletic dreams. The scope of the scope is pretty, the grand scheme of things pretty easy now, but it fixed, I was able to do the sports I love to me. He was an absolute hero. And it's almost led to the same idea of like, oh, I'm unstoppable. I came back from this injury
and look at me now. And I got, I got humbled with that first ACL. It was
not a typical ACL. It was high speed collision. We were running down the line, ball underneath foot caught myself with the other foot and then the rest was history, right? It's pretty gross. I'm laid went back and that it was my worst fear. I saw my brother go through
“three ACLs. He actually got a double ACL surgery at the same time. And so that's what I was trying”
to avoid my entire career. And you don't really think about it because if you do, you're doomed. But I knew in that moment, I'm like, something's terribly wrong. And I just remember staring at the wall. I'm in the training room being like, I'm done. Like, the wham I at this point. And you you kind of get a false sense though because most people don't know when you tear an ACL, either you get surgery 24 hours in or you get surgery three weeks out because you need to get
rid of the swelling you need to go in. And so you actually go through this three week period where your knee feels great. Like you walk into surgery feeling like Superman. So I kind of had that idea too. And you know, I luckily did have my brother to see his journey through this. And the fact he did get through this. And he had two done it wanted. So I'm going to be fine. And waking up from that surgery, who that was probably the worst pain I've ever been in. It was humbling is probably not a good
enough word, just the pain and the fact of you could not prepare yourself. And you go home and I
“clearly remember this. And I looked down and I'm like, I can't even make a quad. And you're in”
so much pain you don't even want to. And that's when it hit me on like this is going to be a super, super long journey. I will see in the same breath though my mom and dad and brother who were around me for that day. They all came to surgery. They were there when I got home. And my brother may have been in school, but he was on the phone. And it was nothing but positivity. Nothing but like, oh, you got this. Oh yeah, no, this is normal. This is normal. And I'm so thankful I did have John,
my brother who went through this because we did have these milestones to look forward to. But it was
the first time that I realized that I'm breakable. And the identity crisis that occurred was probably
a little bit later because you think you're going to fly through recovery. Oh, yeah, I've had this before. And again, humbled. I'm going to ACL take a certain amount of time. But I would say straight
“out straight away. I could not anticipate the pain. And then the idea was going to be at step zero.”
And the fight it was going to take to come back. Being a step zero, the fight it was going to take to come back. Those are the words of an Olympian friends. An Olympian who's been through the heartbreak and physical pain associated with a gruesome, atypical injury. Not to mention the mental told that it takes each and every time a serious injury must be addressed and overcome. As I'm listening,
I'm taken by three things here. First, Sarah's injury isn't a run of the mill ACL tear that we see
in soccer most commonly. Not that there really is a standard ACL injury, but we know from three plus decades of research that female athletes are anywhere from three to as much as 10 times more likely, depending on where you look, to rupture their ACL from non-contact mechanisms than their male counterparts. Several theories have been investigated over the years, but the one trainable difference is related to neuromuscular strength. Through multiple studies published by Dr. Frank Noise and the Cincinnati
Sports Medicine Foundation and their sports metrics program, it's been somewhat definitively shown that that risk can be equalized between males and females simply through training. But this isn't that. Sarah's injury isn't due to landing or cutting in an open field. It's a high velocity collision involving tremendous force. And in the end, at least in that moment, at least her athletic career endowed. And that's the next thing that impresses me.
Sarah's proof positive of the power of community and support, her brother John had endured injuries of his own, including a rare double ACL. And he'd recovered. He had a credibility in a story that was inspiring to Sarah as she encountered
Her own entry mountain.
support her as well. And truth be told, I'm convinced that Sarah is without question tough enough and greedy enough to overcome her injuries along, but you can hear her voice just how thankful she is today as she didn't have to. Lastly, that quote of hers just resonates. The fight it would take
“to come back. Here's the thing about adversity of any type, injury or otherwise, when we've been”
through before. They can form a callous, calluses form to protect us. They're the result of encountering friction. Feel like me, the calluses on your hands are a source of pride. They tell me and anyone willing to look at my hands, I guess, that I do the work. But mental calluses are different. They're unseen. But for an athlete like Sarah, they're still there. That lived experience can be
held to endure in the moment. But it's critical data when navigating similar pain again.
And while she shouldn't choose to end her season with a devastating the injury in the process, now she realizes that it was forming her for something greater. Right. And I think a lot of people don't really realize that cumulative injuries, like if it's your first, it, I mean, obviously it's foreign to you. You don't know how much pain you're going to go through or how long it's going to take. But you also
don't know your little naive to the fact of how long or how am I going to be able to come and then there's a lot of positivity. Like you said, once you've been down this road three or four or five or ten times, the cumulative effect really starts the way. And I've seen athletes who faced surgery, too, with just this grit and dessert. Like I'm going to beat this. I'm getting back on the floor and the field. By eight or nine or ten, there's like, is this it? Am I done? Am I ever
going to be able to return to the aspect I was? What was that like for you facing kind of the, you know, the cumulative effect of those surgeries? I would say the idea of, I don't know if I
can do this was the only time that hip pre surgery was my second ACL. I clearly remember laying
your pre up and I had my little cap on, I was in the gown, I was laying there, knee was signed, like we were ready to go back and I loved at my mom because you know what's coming. And I'm like, I don't, I don't think I can do this. And word for word she said, honey, we don't really have a choice. Like we're here. And it's something that stuck with me. And that phrase from then on going to every surgery was, we don't really have a choice. There was no choice we went in. I'm like,
oh, this is elective. I just would love to get up and nice clean up. Like they were all necessary. And as I came back to, you know, following the first ACL, we had a cartilage pull off of the knee and able to play the season, but we have to get it cleaned up. Well, that's a necessary so I can
“come back to something else. And then you tear a second ACL and then you have to crisis there.”
And then from there on every surgery, like, well, we need this to hit this goal. And so going into each surgery, I had the ability to see why we were doing it. And that goal was so sweet to me that it was worth it. Now it's a bit naive too, though, because the day in a day out, when you talk about the cumulative. And I think that really hit this last year, you had four surgeries in the pre-alympic season. Not how I wrote the book. You know, the book was I was good enough with two ACLs. I'm like,
this is a, this is great. This is awesome. Look at what I thought through. Even the ankle, I was like, okay, cool. We're coming back. Then the double knee. And I'm like, no, what necessary. If we have to do it, this is the year you have this positivity. And then the meniscus tear is walking three months out of the double knee. I think that that play honestly called my mom and like, is this a sign? Is this like a sign? Like, I got injured walking on a running track, like a flat surface.
And my mom thought you would think about it any which way, but it is what it is. And dad said the same thing. He's like, it doesn't matter why. It doesn't matter, you know, what caused it. It happened. And we need to go fix it. I flew in immediately and got it done. But it's hard on those days. Like, after that fourth surgery, something was different. And I could not balance. And it was kind of hard to describe to people because they look at you when you speed skate and you're on one foot most of
the time. And I, like, I can't balance on my right foot. And I remember finally, I went and talked to my
“strength coat tonight. You need to teach me as if I've never walked before. And we relearned how to”
balance on the right. But it's super frustrating. I mean, it is hard not to look a year down the road,
Which at that point, the surgery occurred in October.
down the road, I would have to be competing for an Olympic team and probably be the top two in the
“nation. And it's hard not to future plan. You're like, if I can't balance, how am I going to be at”
one of the top in the world? But everyone around me did a great job of, we keep the focus. You can't control year and a half. We can control today. We can control tomorrow. And my dad had a great phrase. Because obviously, you have doubts. I don't think I would not be honest if I said here. I'm like, every day I knew I could do it. And I woke up. And I was written. That's not, that's just not true. And any athlete listening to this, it is common to have doubt. It is common to wake up and want to
quit. Because it's just so hard. You fought. You fought. You fought. And you don't see anything out of it.
And I, dad would always tell me doubt's not going to help.
I love this wisdom from pop-a-worn. Doubt is not going to help. Literally moments away from her second ACL surgery drowning in doubts. Sarah's mom shares a truth for her. And you're here.
“We don't have a choice. And there's so much wisdom in that fact. But if you find yourself in your own”
wear here moment, and you too realize that you don't have a choice, it can be all you can muster to move ahead. And it can be all but impossible to do it without doubt. So that begs the question, what's the purpose of doubt? Why do we doubt in the first place? Psychologists would tell us that doubt is that it's core a self-protection mechanism. You hoping to make that elite sports team, but you doubt if you'll be picked. That's doubt trying to lower your expectations,
protecting your mental health and the event that you do fail. Or maybe you applied to your dream school or your dream job as much as you want it. You refuse to allow yourself even for a moment to think about what might happen if it worked out in your favor. That's doubt once again stepping in to try to soften the fall and protect you. But for Sarah, she'd had massive dreams. From the day she was just a tiny little pee-we-hockey player in Chicago. She wasn't just comfortable
chasing down things like a full-ride D1 scholarship even, and eventually a place on the Olympic team,
because she was seeking safety of doubt. No way. Her dad shared an incredible truth
that helped empower her to continue having huge dreams. Doubt is not going to help. And honestly, I love it. I respect it. Take big swings. If you're willing to put yourself in position to do something impactful or important, entertaining doubt is not protecting you. In fact, there's a possibility that it's even poisoning you. For Sarah, I meant avoiding the doubts that might try to tell her what might happen if she failed. And instead, embracing what might happen
when she succeeded. We'll be back after this quick message. You've ever looked in the mirror and thought what in the hell just happened to my life and the career shifts when the relationship ends. When the identity you've built, your whole life around disappears overnight. That's not failure.
“That's what I call a purpose door. And most high achievers aren't prepared for it,”
because no one ever taught us how to train for a comeback. Dr. Toby Brooks and I built the science of the comeback for people who refused to stay broken. Inside the app, you'll find a research back resilience training, daily prompts and guided reflection tools, performance psychology frameworks, identity rebuilding exercises, and personalized structure pathways to move from burnout and confusion to clarity and momentum. It's not hype. It's neuroscience. It's performance
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Self-doubt. You got to believe. You put it in the air. You got to believe. You got to believe. And it made me realize that you can't let a temporary feeling lead to a permanent decision. How many temporary feelings at all? Like, I'm not going to get it. You have this doubt. You have this fear. It's at the end of the day. It's fear. We work our entire lives for 38 seconds that we need to qualify for a team that either makes us an Olympian or doesn't make us an Olympian. And so it's fear. And but that's
temporary. Fear is temporary. You wake up the next day and you feel different. And so Dad's saying
Of doubt is not going to get to there with something that really, really push...
you know what? I thought everything I feel is temporary. And we're not going to have a permanent
“decision based on something temporary. And that's every day. That's just what we thought.”
Love it. That's such a powerful mindset. And it puts the control back in your hands. Like,
hundreds of times you can you can lament what's happened to you or you can focus on what you can do today to get better. So I love that mentality. So I have to wonder you didn't just start speeds getting after soccer. It was something you had done early. But obviously it's dormant. I would say maybe that's the term. I mean, your college soccer player, where are Olympic dreams of being a speed skater during this time? Is it completely foreign? When did that
start to re-enter the equation? So it was on my mind actually the whole time. I went into school. My coaches were great Illinois. Even my freshman year, my offseason I skated because I was still
on a junior world team. So the plan was always I'm going to go play soccer and I'm going to come back
and become an Olympic. Very naive in the sense of I'm going to come back and immediately become an Olympian. I again, you go into college, this idea, I'm unstoppable. I can do absolutely everything. I don't even have an ACL and I don't even have a clean up. I don't even have an ACL and I don't even have a clean up. So at that point six, knee surgery is in and I tore my second ACL, my final game. It was the last regular season game of my fifth year season against Nebraska.
Must win and we won to make it a big ten tournament. But it was as late in the season as possible and I knew immediately. Like I cut, I came out for a corner to block it, cut, knee went,
“typical ACL. And that I honestly was the first time I'm like, I don't know if we're going to”
make it back for the, like this was this was cold red. This was the one thing that could not happen is happening. And my fifth year after the ACL, ACL recovery is pretty hard on that one. I don't know what, there's this they differ. Again, my parents are like I said, if they could have lined up on the line with me, there would have been more indicative of how this entire career has gone and called dad. And I didn't have the mindset I did now. I have to admit. And I said, like hey,
recovery is not going well. I'm not too sure. I'm thinking just straight med school. I think I'm a, you know, research, take damn cat and go to med school. And he said, okay, good plan. But I have to say, I know that feels right now. But how are you going to feel in five years? And again, it's, it's what led to this idea of temporary feelings permanent decisions. And I
“sat there and I was like, wow, like, you're right. Like, I'm scared. I'm scared. I'm not going to make”
it. I know it's going to be hard. I'm going to have to come back and knee. I couldn't get full flexion and coming full of sunshine. I knew it was going to be tough. But like, why not try. And so the Olympic dream was very alive for four and a half years. And about for a month and a half, it almost died. It almost went away. Like I said, like, I'm going to be completely transparent here.
People see me on the line. See 10 surgeries. Like, oh, she always, no, there were some lows.
But so after that talk, I was like, absolutely right. And that's when the eyes went back on to the Olympics. I knew it was going to be a fight. It was going to be a grind. It was going to take every single day. Did not anticipate the ink. Again, you halt from that point on. It's a straight shot. And it wasn't. But all these trials and tribulations that I went through before, really set me up to be able to deal with the ones that got thrown at me at age 27, age 28, age 29,
compared to 21 year old zero. As you're talking, I'm really impressed by the community that's around you, whether that's your brother who's been through that, your mom, your dad, your physician, who's an inspiration for you professionally now. For so many athletes, there's a temptation to withdraw and I'm not on the roster. I'm not contributing on the field or the court anymore. So maybe I don't deserve to be this anymore. What would you say to that athlete who's tempted to
kind of pull within their shell instead of lean into the community around them? It's hard. I would say I told you understand. And that's something over this last year. I expanded my community just for my family. The Warren family is extremely close. That is something my grandparents, my parents have really installed enough, like your family is forever. And so I had I mean the privilege and the honor of having the family that I do. But even this last year, I really
lean into my team. It's I really lean to my friends and realized it is nice to have that community, especially when you're at the rank. And so it is very tempting to not want to be a bother. I think is one. I think two of you point out a great thing. Well, let's say you're on a
Team sport and you're in ACL.
of what can't I do, think what can I do? Right, you're still a member of that team. You still
“can contribute. No, you can't go and kick a ball down the field. But if a teammate is having a bad”
day, can you be the person they go to and you pick them up so that then they can go have a good day. You don't have control over what you can't do. You don't have control over the fact that you got hurt. You don't have control over the timeline. I heard an ACL now is a year. That you're out for a year. And you can either have a year where you, I don't want to say salt. But you just look at the negatives. You look at what you can't do. And I'm going to tell you that recovery process
is going to be rough. Or you can look at the year of like, no, as a teammate, I can work on my positivity. As a teammate, I can work on. So, once I want to go get extra touches, but no one's available. Well, I can't kick ball, but I can throw one. You find what you can do. You find what piece of the puzzle you can fill as a teammate. And you do that to the best of your ability.
And then you add. You always can control your attitude. You always can control what you can do.
So, focus on that rather than the small piece of the puzzle that you can't do. Love that. And I would say as a health care provider, I wanted to make that part of the recovery. If I saw an athlete starting with drama and concerned about them, their psychological health could be suffering. But I also want to encourage team leaders. If you've got an injured teammate and they're not part of the day in a day out, it's easy to focus on kind of what I haven't
front of me. But a good leader recognizes the entire team and maybe can, you know, that invite from the team captain means a heck of a lot more than it means from the strength coach or the athletic trainer. 100% and I do think that is a benefit to having a close team to really cementing that team culture. And at Illinois, we did a great job at that. My best friends came from my soccer team. Actually, three roommates who I lived with for most of my years at Illinois came to Milan.
With, like, as soon as I made the team, they, and they know me as an athlete too. They know I'm not on my phone during competition. They're texting my mom the whole time. I looked at the group chat after I was cracking up. And so they were there with me.
“And as soon as I tore my ACL, the first time, I remember we all just sit in the living room.”
We're like, this is really wild. But they're there. They're there every step of the way. The
second time I came home to give baskets. I mean, everyone was no one left a word on set out, say,
tax calls, cards. And you realize a community, you have around you because as a teammate, yes, it is your job if you're injured to help. But also if you're not injured in your teammate got injured, do help them. You know, in that moment, figure out what they need. If it looks like they're down, which is a part of the injury process, be there for them, figure out a way, ask if they want to help. Make them feel included, make them feel important because,
again, even though they can't contribute on the field, they can't contribute in a different way. And if you find that role for them early, it really helps to recovery process so you do feel like part of the process. Yeah, great advice. Again, talking with Olympian Sarah Warren, former Division 1 soccer player and just overcome her of all stripes. We'll get into a little bit about what's coming next for you. But I really want to kind of drill down on something you said
about, you know, as those injuries mounted. And in the moment, we don't have the benefit of perspective. You don't know that it's all going to end well. You get to go to opening ceremonies, you get to skate and you don't know that in that moment. So now you do. And you can look back on that. And I really try to encourage my listeners to recognize the value of reflection. What we've been through is important. But unless we look back, we really can't understand the gravity of
what was learned. So when you look back at that version of yourself, when your Olympic dreams
“were potentially in jeopardy, what do you understand about yourself now that maybe you couldn't see then?”
I think it's a trust that I would figure it out. I'm pretty transparent as we do talks as forth sites. I think it is a massive part, especially as speed skating. We say a huge part of this is mental. And that's something I talk to with my sports like when you can't balance, there's a huge technical component to speed skating. And I'm a studier. I'm a math brain. Some people are feel, they go out there, they feel it. I am iPad watching video like it is
honestly my job. And you can get wrapped up in that, right? And wrapped up in like it has to be perfect and you have this fear. When you have a practice and it's you know what's not looking right or the queue's not queueing and it's hard not to rabbit hole. And I learned through each day, obviously through making a team. But even before that, I have to say I wasn't lying when I said
Going to that line, I've already won.
I can figure it out. As much as it seems like there's no light at the end of the tunnel that
I'm never going to learn to cross over again. I'm never going to be able to do this this and this.
“If I slow down and I believe that it will figure itself out, you still have to work,”
you still have to think. But you have what's in here, you have it to figure it out. And each time was at the base of this mountain and I was like, I got to figure out how to go, I did. And so you through this evidence, you realize like, I have the keys and my coach is fantastic. The people around me are fantastic and they absolutely helped and they're a part of the puzzle that got me there. But I had the pieces to figure it out and that something when you get injured
and you consistently get injured, you kind of lose faith in that. And so hindsight, absolutely, right? It all worked out. Everything was worth it. But even before that, I once had that line knowing, I did everything possible. On the days, I saw no light. I found a light by the end of practice by the end of the day. I sat in extra session to figure it out. I proved to myself that I was strong enough. I was smart enough. And I had to write people around me
“to be the best version of me. Was I the best in the world? No. Do I think I can get there?”
Hopefully, so I'm skating another year. But I already won going into it and crossing that line just reaffirmed that belief. But it was even before that. I have to admit. I was very, very proud of the person in the skater. I'd become over this last year, extremely gracious and was so much gratitude for those around me. And it affirmed to me that the community I have, I affirm to me the belief in the people. I mean, how great people are that surround me and then just in myself that I was way
stronger than I thought I was. And that's a pretty cool feeling. I love that. It absolutely is.
I think it's so critical for people to recognize that when we turn on our television, and we see
whether it's a performer, earn athlete, or an entrepreneur. I mean, high achievers of all stripes. It's easy to think overnight success or, you know, these are the best of them. And it's harder to
“recognize the story beneath that. So in looking back over your story, I think it's important to point”
out that there's more than just a Olympic team membership or championships that you want along the way. What would you say is the accomplishment that you're most proud of? I would say this last year to be honest, and not making the team. I want to clarify like we had, I've won World Championships medals with Brittany Bonaire and Jackson. I do have say a team sprint. It's amazing. That was one of the highlights of my career skating with them. But my process throughout this year, and my
as we discussed, my ability to lean on those around me, when before I would have retreated, my ability to work through the hard times and believe in myself when you look at the odds, and they are all stacked against you. And the ability to take a broader view of things, not all the time. But I would say in those moments, and those reflective moments, my process this year, and how I was able to lean on those around me, I think was what I am most
proud of. And I have said it. It took a village. People have heard me say, say, "Hungry and humble." And that is a hundred percent what I thought this entire year. And it really hit home this year for my grandfather, no. He knew something was telling you, "No, I was going to be facing these trials and tribulations." But that was it. I had to say, "Hungry, I had to keep wanting it." But remain humble. Sarah Warren, 29-year-old college soccer player at the University of Illinois,
and one of the best American sprinters on the outside lane. Ready? Looking to equal that 10-7 that we saw here in Jackson on the other meters, we have a lot of shot.
That's time to be, to move into the second place is nothing. Be well.
For either of these women at 38-8 in front of the side, or look at Sarah Warren, just a hundred of the second off the opening split we saw from American Jackson. And she's going to get a good trap. And she crosses over from the outer lane to the inner lane, moving into the final home stretch for the 500-4 years ago. Sarah Warren just missed out on an Olympic spot. She was forth from the 500 Olympic trials, trying to leave nothing for chats here.
But 29-year-old out of Willowbrook, Illinois, has blown away the pair. She comes to the line. And it's right there. 38-8-8-8-6 in the second.
I say there's this picture on of me on the line.
I would really say this but I was glowing. I mean, I was on the Olympic line. I told myself,
“"No matter what, I was going to enjoy the experience. I'm not usually a waiver."”
Like, I'm usually on the line and I'm like, "I'm locked in." And I was like, "Nope, Sarah." You have worked your entire life for this moment, allow yourself to enjoy it. And so on that line, that was what that was. And so the world sees that picture. The world sees me on that line. Absolutely love this glimpse inside the mind of an athlete who not only knows what she's been through,
the mountains she's scaled, the adversity she's overcome and the people who helped her along the way. And the fact that she allowed herself and them, if only for a few seconds, to drink in this moment. To me, it's the mark of someone who's thankful for the journey, appreciative of the growth and willing to seize even just a moment to drink in the magnitude of what
“she's accomplished before eventually locking in and doing the real work.”
Sarah had taken a line in races, hundreds, or maybe even thousands of times in the past. But for this moment, she realized that taking this line was different. And she gave herself room to feel that satisfaction. Now some might be tempted to criticize someone in the moment like that, that they're being
distractable. But I'd say it was beautiful and befitting the incredible path that it took to arrive,
then and there. Not to mention the fact that it was a show of gratitude and respect to the countless people who had helped Sarah along the way. And that's freaking awesome. But when I looked at that picture, I see a thousand, it's a puzzle, it's a jigsaw puzzle. And you've seen like a thousand piece jigsaw. And especially throughout this last couple of weeks that I've got to go home and you know, give the flowers to the people that's hard to mention
everybody. Every moment, every person who has led me to that story line to that picture is a piece of
“that puzzle. And I think this year I have been able to take an old bird's eye view of this journey”
and really realize that and it's made me love the sport. It's made me love the process and it's made me really realize who I have around me and what I am capable of and for that, I think I am most proud. This has been the best year of skating I've had. And I've said that three months out of the trials. Obviously, now it is tearing out top greatest thing ever, but even before that, like I was super proud of the fight I had, but also extremely just thankful and have so much gratitude for the community
that I had around me. And it makes me smile and almost makes me cry every time I think about it. So that's your really made me realize that. Yeah, that's so beautiful. I love the metaphor of the puzzle. So you're not done skating yet and we'll get to that in a minute. But I've taught graduate
students for a lot of years and when they get injured, I always say, oh, you're doing research
because they're learning about the injury and the recovery process. Well, you have some pretty big goals that you're still working on after skating. So talk to us a little bit about what's cooking for Sarah on the other side of the competitive career. Yeah. So like I said, when I was young, I had the surgeries. And I couldn't do any sports. Actually, we went to a couple of doctors and they recommended the surgeries that would actually put me out completely. She won't really
be able to do a competitive sports. And luckily, my parents were like, that is work. Like, we're going to figure something else out. And so I went to Dr. Brian Cole and it was a broth of fresh air. He was unbelievable in his ability to talk through his process. What he was going to do. And it was a quick fix, which was really nice. It was just like us. But in that quick fix, he saved my career. He made Sarah Warren. Sarah Warren. And no, it's not heart surgery. It's
not brain surgery. It's not these emergency surgeries or someone's on the table and you're immediately saving a life, right? But he did save my life that day. He allowed me to do what I love to do. And I was able to shadow him when I was in high school. He's a superhero to me. He is he is Superman. And he does that not just for me, but for hundreds of patients. And he truly makes a difference. And it was after actually my surgery that I said, I'm going to be an orthopedist surgeon. And that just got reaffirmed
when I got to shadow him every day. He was a superhero. There was no day off. And so for me, that was my path. I knew it. Like I said, when I'm young, I pick something and we're doing it. So plan for me is to become an orthopedist surgeon. I am going to be setting for the amcat this next year finalizing everything I need for medical school. And then we're taking skating you're by year.
I'm not naive.
Every day is a good day that you can skate. But you know, you know, things are delicate. And so at this point, really want to enjoy skating. Being the best I can be, but also set myself up for hopefully future doctor Warren. So amcat's being studied. And then we'll be applying for medical school in the future. And then the goal is to be an orthopedist surgeon. And hopefully change some lives. Like Dr. Cole changed mine. Fantastic. Well, I will tell you without a doubt,
U.S. Olympian reads pretty well on the Vita as you're submitting those applications for medical school.
I'm always right. It explains the break-in. I was able to hear my master,
which was really nice at Johns Hopkins, a fantastic program. And just I was a bio-engineer in college. And so was able to cement that with the masters. And I absolutely love it. But there has been a little break in school. And so luckily, you know, Olympian kind of helps explain that break a little bit. But I'm definitely a chained to get back to studying too many Netflix series at this point, right? You're trying to relax. But the binging of Netflix needs to stop. So amcat books
are opening now. Yeah, well, you earned it. I mean, your gap your story is better than most. So I love
that. I always ask this question of all my guests. If we were to watch a montage of your life,
what song would you pick to play in the background and why? Oh, that's a great question. The climb by Miley Cyrus. I think with Miley Cyrus. I don't know if it's Hannah Montana. One of the two, I would say the climb. Because it's true. I always relate it to your climbing up a mountain. And I don't think you'll ever reach the top. And if you have, you gotta reach, there's a new summit you need. If you reach it,
what's there to work for? But you know, you have these, it's been uphill. And I live a very
“blessed life. I, it's very hard for me to complain. Obviously, you have to come back from the injuries”
in their fear, but in the grand scheme of the pretty blessed life. But you have these goals. And
you hope you're running on a running track to get there. But for some reason, mine has a pretty steep grade at times. And so as a client, it was, every day was a grind. Every day is a step up hill. But the cool thing about climbing a mountain is that you're still going up. It just takes you a little bit longer. So the climb by Miley Cyrus probably would be the song of choice. Love that. I drop all those into a, a mix tape of sorts as Spotify playlist. And then it'll also
be included in your episode. So I love that. It's very fitting. I love it. Yeah. So one final question here. A lot of times those who don't overcome adversity, they think about it and they think, you know, why did this happen to me? And the, the athlete's time performers that I've worked with who have navigated at the most, they would oftentimes say, you know, this happened to form me. When you look back over the whole career, all the things you've been through,
“all the adversity, what would you say those things did in forming you? How did they work for you?”
I think they completely did. And I, I like how you phrase that because it's very easy. And I say it's the victim mentality and not in a negative way. It's very easy to go in that. But you're in pain. You're taking a path that no one else has to take. It just doesn't seem fair. But once you get through it, you realize it's those trials. It's those challenges that form who you are. If you live a life with no obstacles, how do you find out what you're made of?
With something that's done at you, then how do you know you can handle it? I would much rather be 29 turning 30 knowing I have gone through all of these things. I have because of it. I've realized the community around me. I've realized my strength. I have realized how much gratitude I have to be able to do the sport I love. You have all of these realizations because of the things
“thrown at you. And so it's almost a gift. And it's, I said that before. And I think someone looked”
me crazy. But 10 surgeries were, it was a gift. It was an absolute gift because every time I learned something about myself. And I would not have been on that starting line at the Olympics without it. I truly believe that. You know, you might have gotten complacent. You know, something else might have
Happened down the line.
have to think about things. It might not seem fair. But maybe you, while over that road bump, so you missed a bigger road bump down the road, you can think about it. Why did it happen to me or think goodness it happened to me? Because I got through it. And because of that, I got to be where I am. Whether you make it or not, obviously someone listening to this book. Yes, she was at the Olympics.
“But honestly, if I didn't make it, it was, I was able to get to the Olympic trials. You know,”
I proved to myself that I could get that far at the end of the day. It's point two of a second. You can't control that. And so I would no matter what, whether you achieve the goals that you initially set out or not, you've set those goals without knowing the journey to get there. It's really easy to look at destination. But no matter what, if you, if you're working through that journey and you work through the trials and tribulations and you work through those challenges,
you have proven to yourself, you are that much stronger. And those challenges, or make you
you so always be thankful for that. Yeah, love them and tell me, such a victor's mindset,
not a victim mindset, like you said. Well, Sarah, a lot of people don't know that being on the Olympic team is not guaranteed financial success. It can be tough. So we want to support you in any
“and every way. So share the socials with us. How can we support you and continue to follow”
the work and the competition that you're doing? I really appreciate it. Yeah, it's, we don't do it for the money. That's for sure. We do it because we're competitors. We love to represent our country. And so we honestly are mostly sponsored by sponsorships or really how we fund ourselves. So if anyone does relate to the story, you want to, you know, support the journey. I absolutely would love if you reached out to me social media is probably the easiest. I can drop
my email to that would be awesome. But honestly, eyes on the sport, my biggest thing with everything, obviously we love to be financially supported. But my big thing with the games was I was able to get this platform to show no matter how dim that light seems at the end of the tunnel. It's possible. And if that means one athlete believes in themselves, again, when it seems like they're backs against the wall, and there is no shot. And they actually go and not even achieve it, but they
“try, it will be worth it. So if you want to support it, absolutely, would love that, but more importantly,”
if you are an athlete who's going through something, please believe in yourself. If you don't, please reach out to me. Social media, I'll put my email on here. I would love to be an advocate. I would love to be a resource for any athlete that was going through. Like I said, we have to stay together. It's not a fun group to be in the surgery, especially multiple surgery group or surgery that the wrong time group. So please reach out. I would absolutely love it. But if you
want to follow me on socials, I'll be highlighting my journey throughout the whole next year. And I would love to connect. Awesome. Well, I'll have a page just for this episode. I'll drop all
the socials and links in there so that folks can be amazing to that when they get a chance.
I am Sarah Warren, and I am Undone. Sarah's story is a masterclass and what it actually takes to live through a purpose tool, and I'll just survive it, but be shaped by it, to be formed by it to be better from it. And let's be clear here. Her story isn't inspiring simply because she made the Olympic team. Although it is, it's inspiring because of who she became before that moment even arrived.
10 surgeries setbacks. It didn't just threaten her performance, but her own identity. And yet over and over and over again, she chose to keep showing up. Not because it was easier certain, but because she refused to let a temporary feeling make a permanent decision. And maybe that's the thread to ties this whole conversation together.
The realization that the win wasn't always the podium. It's the person you become in the process.
The calluses, the community, the courage to believe when doubt feels louder than truth. Sarah didn't just chase a dream. She learned how to trust herself in the dark, how to lean on others when it would have been easier to withdraw and how to find gratitude in the grind. That's the kind of growth that lasts long after the race is over. I'm thankful to Sarah for dropping in and I hope you enjoyed our conversation.
For more info in today's episode, be sure to check it out on the web. Simply go to nnonpodcast.com/ep1555 to see the notes, links, and images related to today's guest.
Sarah warns.
and self-improvement number 8 in education. We are still out of apples top 200 for the time being,
but I'm hopeful that is a semester clears out. And the time to get some new episodes out like this one
“will be just what we needed to get back in there. If you want to follow along and see your progress”
for yourself, you can now go to nnonpodcast.com/rankings and cheer me on. In the last month, we had more than 41,000 downloads, but we aren't done yet. If you'd be so kind as to share the show with a friend and leave a comment or a review, it would help a ton and I would sincerely appreciate it. Last few episodes, I've continued something new that I've been including in each episode. What I'm calling the Teal of the Week, now stay with me. I know it could maybe sound a little weird,
but follow along. I like to consider myself a performance scientist and I like to let the data do my deciding. And over the years and my data backs me up on this, I've learned that the environments that we create, I down how we decorate our space, what we choose to wear, all of that can influence how we show up. For me, Teal has become one of those cues. It's a subconscious signal that
“represents clarity and energy and focus. It's a small but consistent way that I use to signal to”
myself. It's time to be present. It's time to be intentional. It's time to do this. Well, so each week on the show, I wear a different Teal shirt. Usually tied to a team or a program, just as a way to keep that rhythm in that consistency. For this episode, I'm wearing one of my favorite new hoodies. It's a Teal and Black fan cover Grizzlies 2XL job from Mitchell and Nest.
I was never much of a Grizzlies fan back in the day, but the retro stuff is insanely cool.
Anytime I see Grizzlies stuff from that late 90s, early 2000s, I'm taken back to a simpler time. And I've always been a sucker for any kind of expansion team. And that Canadian NBA expansion era of the Grizzlies and the Raptors made it feel like my sport hoops was taken over the whole world. Now I admit I don't get to wear warm fleece hoodies as often as I'd like living in central
“Texas, but I can tell you when I put this one on a switch is flipped and I am ready to perform.”
So I want to encourage you whether it's a favorite color or a curated playlist or some custom lighting or any of a hundred other potential adjustments you could make to your workspace or your gym or your practice area. Give it a try. It doesn't have to be teal. Matter of fact, I'd probably mad at you if it were because that's my deal. Get your own. That just happens to be my Spectrum adjacent love. But whatever it is, find it. Collect data on it and learn to use it to your advantage.
A couple of quick shoutouts this week. First a word of thanks to my youngest fan, my guy,
the one and only Cooper McNally. Cooper's an incredible dude who I met back at my old church
back in Lubbock and his mom sent me a message the other day that he's a regular listener to the show. Cooper's a catcher on his little league baseball team this season. And I'm pretty stoked to say I'll be heading to Lubbock next week just to watch him play. So Cooper, if you're listening, thank you. I love you buddy. I also want to shout out my fellow classmates at Baylor and the exercise physiology graduate program. Eagle or Kwame Michelle has mean. He's got Ryan, Mahima, Blake, others,
finished wrong. We are almost there. In two more weeks, I will officially be halfway done. And I'm thankful to have gotten the chance to learn alongside each of you. Coming up on the show, I've got world-renowned traumatic brain injury expert and former student Dr. Sean Eagle coming on. Hear about how his career as a college athlete was impacted by concussion and how he's turned that experience into a globally impactful research platform that's helping to shape
how we care for injured athletes. Then I've got former all-American gymnasts turned on Springer and Professor Dr. Courtney Beck. Hear how she went from walk on gymnasts at the University of Florida to a professor of sports management with the podcast and a platform of her own today. All this and more coming up on becoming undone. Becoming undone is a nitro-hot creative production written and produced by me, Toby Brooks.
Tell a friend about the show, follow along on Facebook, Instagram, and LinkedIn. That becoming undone pod. And follow me at Toby Brooks PhD on Facebook, Instagram, and LinkedIn. Check out my link to eatbackslash Toby Brooks PhD. Listen, subscribe, and leave me a review on Apple podcasts. Spotify. I heart rate you. Or wherever you get your podcasts. Till next time friends remember, doubts are going to help you. Keep in better.
