275. Roadmap to Quitting Your Job and Building a Business in 2026 with Sam Vander Wielen

I'm joined today by Sam Van der Wheelin, lawyer turn founder, creator, and bestselling author of "What I Start My Business" I'll be happy. Sam built a multi-seven figure digital products business, survived a brutal corporate law career, paid off massive student loans, cared for dying parents, and weathered more wake-up calls than most people see in a lifetime. All while learning what entrepreneurship can actually give you, and what it absolutely can't. This is a real

conversation for anyone who is wanted to be an entrepreneur, but something's held them back. Confusion about corporate structure, or if you need a lawyer, worrying that your business will solve all your problems and then realizing it won't. And why the stability myth of corporate is just absolutely damning, especially at this time right now. And today's conversation we get into why tying your happiness to income metrics or business launch will

always leave you disappointed, planning a realistic exit from your nine to five, including building

a financial off-fram, and what you really need legally, LLC contracts, trade marks, and what you absolutely don't need a lawyer for. A lot of people want to talk to you about building a business, this episode is the nitty-gritty, how to actually do it in a way that's sustainable. Let's get into it. But first, a word from our sponsors. This newly-end-dependent podcast is brought to you by Squarespace. Squarespace was the first investment we ever made in her first under K, and it is the

thing that I probably recommend most to business owners when they ask me what tools I should use. You need Squarespace because you need a beautiful website that works. You also need SEO tools so that you can get discovered and your business can get out there, and you can post anything on Squarespace

“from courses to coaching, anything that you need to sell, you can do on Squarespace.”

Head on over to squarespace.com/ethfpod for a free trial, and when you're ready to launch your brand-new website, use offer code ffpod to save 10% off your first purchase of a website or domain. I miss school. That may be kind of controversial, I say, because somebody gets like, I hate school,

but I was always the kid who loves school, and I have a feeling you might have run the kid who

loves school too, because you're here learning on this podcast, and masterclass is the best thing I've found sent school. If you love learning, if you love thinking about things in a new way, if you love being the most interesting person in the room, masterclass is incredible. With plan starting at $10 a month, build annually, you get unlimited access to over 200 classes, taught by the world's best business leaders, writers, chefs, actors, and more. You can

strengthen your personal professional relationships with help from renowned psychotherapist, Esther Perrell. That's definitely one that I love. You can look and feel better with courses on gut health, brain health, skin health. You can learn the principles of improv in your life with Amy Poler. You can turn your commute or work out into a classroom, and I love audio mode on masterclass, so you can listen to masterclass, but you don't have to watch it if you can't at that point.

Right now, our listeners get an additional 15% off any annual membership at masterclass.com/FF pod. That's 15% off at masterclass.com/FF pod. Masterclass.com/FF pod. Masterclass.com/FF pod. [Music] When I start my business, I'll be happy at such a pointed title. What made you want to debunk that

“myth? It's so important that people know that that is not true, and I know because I thought it was”

true, and I had my ass handed to me, so I feel like I just had to be like, "Guys, this is like warning, this is not true." What do you wish more people understood about what a business can and cannot do for your life? There's so much that a business can do for you, and I do think a business can provide you with a lot of happiness. In my opinion, not directly through the business. I don't know about you, but when you look at your Instagram account or something,

that's not what's bringing me happiness. The flexibility, the money that I've made from my business, that I've then gone and used to do things like investing in real estate, taking trips, having experiences, helping other people. That has made me really happy. It's not that a business can provide you any happiness. It's just that I came into this thinking. If I had those vanity metrics,

if I made a lot of money, therefore I will just be happy. Can we talk about that for a second

“dot feeling, because I think that is a unique thing for women, especially where, oh, when I lose this”

amount of weight, I'll be happy, and then I'll wear a bikini. When I, yeah, make X amount of money in my career, I'll be happy. When I finally launched that business, I'll be happy. What are we getting wrong about that mindset? That are happiness exists in anything that's outside of us, or probably what we already have, even that our mindset exists in material things. It's kind

material things. I've probably bought less and care less about it to be honest. Yeah, I think

“largely that's true for me. I'm making some lifestyle upgrades, but I think a lot of the things that”

we believe we should be buying when you're rich. Like the fancy car is like at's not really of interest to me. It was I know like for me and maybe anybody listening coming from like a corporate

background, having a first, just like building up enough of a nest egg in my business, like when

it started to do really well, that, that cushion that I was able to build up gave me the greatest amount of happiness because it meant that I could work. I could not work if I wanted to or needed to like if something happened, like a lot of what happened to me. I had brain surgery, both of my parents died within the same year. So I had a lot of time where it was like I actually can't do anything or I don't want to. I wanted to take care of my dad while he was sick. For example,

and become his caregiver, not that I was happy he was sick, but like could you imagine if I had still been working in corporate and I'm making less money and what would I have been able to do?

“That's what that money bought me time. That bought me expansion with him for myself to take care of”

myself. Yeah, it still does. Can we talk about that corporate career for a second because you started

in law and you had sort of like this harrowing wake up call that your life wasn't what you wanted it to be, which I think we all can relate to. Can you take us through that story that kind of wake up in the middle of the night moment where you realize this isn't what I want? I was working as a corporate lawyer and a big law firm and I had gone out and bought myself like a bang and Mercedes had all the bells and whistles I thought, okay, well I hate this job, but at least

I'll have a nice car to drive back and forth. That's literally what I thought. And I remember one day at lunch I sat in my car eating lunch and crying because of how much I hated my job and I thought how funny is it that this car that I bought to drive me to my miserable job. I'm now sitting in a crying in this career and I hated it. Unfortunately, I was not very familiar with a lot of mindset work at the time. I became a lawyer 23 so I was pretty young. You know, I really adopted this

like victim mindset accidentally of being like becoming a lawyer happened to me. I had a very traumatic, very violent childhood. So I wanted to get out of it as fast as possible and I saw becoming a lawyer as the fastest, sureest, safest way to doing that. I thought lawyers have stable jobs, stable income like all that stuff. Yeah, it was not what I thought it would be. There's news alert. There's no justice in the legal justice system in this country. So that was our

lesson to learn in real time. I was not happy and I wasn't also seeing any way out of it. I had multi-six figure student loans. I was also part committed. Like I've told everybody my whole life. I wanted to be a lawyer. What am I going to do now? It's so embarrassing. And I didn't really have an answer for what else I wanted to do. So I felt very stuck. And then I had this plane ride. I took my first big vacation as a lawyer and I went all around Northern Europe and I was flying home

and we had a really one of those like horrible violent turbulent issues that you hear about on

the news. And it really, I've never had a moment since. It was just like it literally shook me awake.

And it was just like, what are you doing with your life? Why you're acting like you have no control. You actually had a lot more control about my career switch than whatever was happening on that plane and whether we landed safely. And literally within three days I started an online business and was off to the races. Wow. So what did you think you were getting by being a lawyer that instead you ended up giving? I thought I was getting an opportunity to make things right for people.

Yeah, it was justice. I really thought lawyers are the people who set things right in the world. And don't get me wrong. There are plenty of lawyers who I guess get to do that. It's few and far between. If you're one of them reach out to me. There are many lawyers doing good work. I'm not trying to say that. But overall, especially when you work in corporate, like your job is to make other businesses a lot of money and it tends to be that those businesses are not doing fantastic

things. And so it wasn't making me feel great about it. What I ended up giving a lot was business advice because I wasn't in the corporate department. And so when I would see like a new client came in who had a small business, I feel like, oh, can I work with them? Because I'm really interested. I want to work with someone in my community. And we would handle the legal stuff. But I would like, yeah, yeah. So like, what are you doing about the marketing? Like, do you have an email list

of you over? And I started getting really into it. Like, I was just very curious about it. What you just said is so smart that I wish more want to be entrepreneurs understood or side

“hustlers understood. I've said this many times. But I remember working my nine to five that was fine.”

I don't think I hated it. And maybe as much as you hated yours. But I was like, this is fine. I just know I don't want to do this forever. And then there were some

oh, I could be working on my business right now. Or why don't I just quit, right? Because then I have so much more time. And what I realized was my nine to five was both the financial investment into my business. But also, I was learning all of the skills I needed to be a business owner,

even in toxic or bad situations. Because it was like, oh, that's never how I'm going to run

my business. I'm never going to say that to a team member. Or I'm not going to rely on this thing that I see them relying on that cost a ton of money, but does not make a return. And so you're almost like beta testing being an entrepreneur in your nine to five job. And especially the fact that you're like, give me the projects that are going to suit me up to be an entrepreneur. I think is so smart. Yeah. I think that it's, you know, it's also helpful if anyone's currently

in corporate, like, trying to plan their, you know, exit strategy to take this time also as story saying to like, use this time to learn the skills and like observe a lot of what's going on around you. Meet as many people as possible. But I also, I think, became more familiar with what my superpower was even as a worker. And, you know, my superpower was that I'm super

efficient. I get like, I crank out more content than, you know, my friends always like, I don't

understand how you, it doesn't take me a lot of time, right? So I'm just super efficient. And

“efficiency is the worst thing as an attorney. So my superpower was actually like punished, right?”

They'd be like, you need to take more time with the need to build more hours. Yeah. So it was helpful to turn on that like, well, what could I do, right? And then I go on and I start this passive kind of what a quote unquote passive digital product company, where it's like, I created these digital products eight years ago that are selling every single day, like, what a fantastic way to utilize my superpower, you know? I think that's so smart as well. Before we talk more about

your business, I do want to talk about the fallacy of that stable job, because I felt it. I think just personal finance education largely until a couple years ago was like, try to make as much money as possible in your nine to five job even if you hate it so that you can then go out and do more things, right? Pick the stable career. And I think especially younger millennials like myself, people younger than us who are Gen Z are just like, I'm not doing that. Like, I'm not tolerating

things that I don't want to do or work that I don't like, even if it affords me a different life. And I think there is this lie that we were told of take the stable paychecks, take the 401k, that is the stable option when an actuality entrepreneurship, especially for women, can be the

“exit to so much more. So what do you have to say to somebody who is in their stable job, but knows”

they're meant for more than that? I think it gives the appearance of stability, but there's probably a lot less stability than you realize. Maybe this is also my upbringing of I was raised in a way

that I had to always bet on myself, right? But I would rather bet on myself than relying on a lot of

factors outside my control. Pretty ironically, my department got laid off not that long after I left actually. But I would also encourage you to explore more of an expansion mindset if you're thinking this way that I think about this all the time. Like, when I left being a lawyer, I had multi-six figures in student loans and I was like, making my probably $200 payments or something like this amount of not making a dent in anything. And really wondering, like, how am I ever going to pay

this off? And I paid it off so fast with my own business, right? So I don't even know that I still would have had a paid off as a lawyer. Yeah, I mean, I didn't have six figures of student loans,

“but I had a car loan. That was like my big existing debt. And I paid it off, I think, two, three”

years early. And my car loan was pretty short. And I paid it off way quicker because of entrepreneurship. It was a huge rocket ship towards my financial goals, absolutely. But you said something interesting in the book, which is, most people don't spend enough time thinking about their personal budget before they started business. And I could not agree more. So what do you think is the biggest financial blind spot that people are walking into entrepreneurship with? People think

that when you go and start a business that your business is going to or needs to immediately provide for your personal budget. And I just don't think that's realistic. It takes a lot of time. Yeah. And so I talked a lot in my book about how I built a bit of an offer. Like, I did save up, I cut my spending. I changed my behavior. I sold stuff. Like, I did everything that I could because I really wanted to make this happen. But I didn't rely on my business financially. My business ended

up being able to pay me. But that was like, it was all bonus to me. But this is I think the biggest killer. I get emails every single day from people being like, I can't invest in your legal

you need to do that in order to start a business. So there has to be a plan. There has to be a plan for you as a person of how you're going to support yourself. And then how, like, what little money you have that you can invest in the business to get it started, it's way too much pressure in my opinion to put on a baby business to expect that to support your personal lifestyle off the bat. Yeah, I couldn't agree more. I mean, the phrase spend money to make money. I think is so true for

entrepreneurship. Now, we don't mean spend stupid money because that's not going to make you money.

“But like, truly, I wish more women understood that you have to invest in your education”

in order to be a successful business owner. Like, that is the time to invest in templates, invest in a coach, invest in learning more. And I think it's so interesting that most of us go to college. We spend more money than God getting the degree that someone, so so many of us don't even use.

But then we never spend money trying to learn again. We might go get a message. We might get a JD.

Something else happens. But I think the vast majority of people might go to college or even to get a two year degree spend a bunch of money and then thank, oh, I'm never going to spend money on learning ever again. And I think that's one of the most damaging things you can do, especially as a newbie entrepreneur. Yeah, I totally agree. I mean, I get emails from people all the time saying that they want to start an online business to make money, but they have no money to get started. And I write

a lot about this in my book about how like I'm so happy to report that starting an online business is so much more affordable than if you were starting a bar studio in your town. Like it's a huge investment. You've got to get space and all this stuff. So it's way more affordable. It's not free,

“though. And both in your time, your education that you have to invest, equipment, some basics.”

Like some people, there's been a disservice. I think in the online business industry and like the only marketing, a lot of people yelling at you saying that you have to buy their course on Pinterest and this thing. And that thing in order to get started. But I think what Tory and I talk about is like more of the basics and the foundation. Like there is some upfront investment. And I do think that there's some courses or education that's super, super valuable. I'm biased, but I think right

shit's really good. I think your shit's great. I invested in those kind of things when I first

got started because time was eliminated resource. And I'm like, okay, I could spend six months or a year wasting my time trying to learn this thing. Or I could spend a couple hundred dollars learning from an expert who's already made the mistakes. That's a worthwhile investment for me. Maybe not a $30,000 coaching program. But like a couple hundred bucks to save yourself a bunch of time and stress, probably worth it. Yeah, I think one of the best mindset shifts you can

make around money when you start your business is to start seeing your time as money as well. And so I very quickly started being like, okay, if I collapse two hours because I do this thing, that's two hours I can spend creating something that can make me way more in the long run. So like really switching into that mindset helps. Being a business owner is very overwhelming. There are a lot of things to think about all of the

time between payroll and your competitors and just making enough revenue to survive. Being an entrepreneur is stressful, but it can become less stressful with net suite by Oracle. Net suite is the number one AI cloud ERP and it is trusted by over 43,000 businesses. It is helpful because it brings your financials, your inventory, commerce HR and CRM into one single source of truth. So that you can make decisions that are data backed also using AI

in a way that just streamlines the entire process. And the cool thing about their AI tool is you can ask it any question you've ever had from key customers to how much cash you have on hand to any inventory trends. And so whether your company earns millions or even hundreds of millions, net suite helps you stay ahead of the pack. Net suite by Oracle is one of those things I'm

going to continue to look into as per first under K grows. And if you own a business,

“especially a business doing significant revenue, this is a tool you should look into as well.”

Right now, get our free business guide to mystifying AI at net suite dot com slash f pod. The guide is free to you at net suite dot com slash f pod net suite dot com slash f pod. I'm at the point now where it is quality over quantity, especially when I am thinking about buying pieces from my wardrobe for my closet. I am not looking for things that are going to fall apart on their third wear. I'm looking for structured pieces that are going to fit me while no

matter what season and no matter where I'm at in my life for years and years and years. And this is why I love quince. The fabrics are elevated. The cuts are thoughtful. And the pricing actually makes sense. Quince makes high quality wardrobe staples using premium fabrics like 100% European linen, 100% silk and organic cotton. Quince was directly with safe ethical factories and cuts out the middleman. They are consistently rated 4.5 to 5 stars by thousands of customers.

outfit. I go to quince because I know I can find it. Right now go to quince dot com slash f pod for free

shipping and 365 day returns. That's a full year to wear it and love it. And you will. Now available in Canada too. Don't keep settling for clothes that don't last. Go to qiu i nce dot com slash f pod for free shipping and 365 day returns. Quince dot com slash f f pod. I think there's this romantic idea that people quit their nine to five and it's completely in their control. And they've done all of this stuff to figure it out. And then they just go for it.

But I think I have this theory that there's two kinds of entrepreneurs. There's one that's like leap in the net will appear kind of entrepreneur. It's not like you and I are both number two, which is I need a net and a backup net and the backup backup net and then six parachutes too. So you were meticulous in your planning. What is a realistic timeline and exit plan from a nine to five

“actually look like? I think that's why it's so important to know what your personal budget is, right?”

If you're like booze you a shit and you have a huge personal budget and you give a huge mortgage to take care of and you don't have a partner who you split expenses with, they're all kinds of factors. But that's why I love starting there because then from there we're like, okay, what kind of money can you even stash away from now till you quit some people in their nine to five could really buckle down and stash a lot. Other people they're already living tight and so you might only be

able to move over a little at a time. So if that I would start with that, I personally like to take that time also to get done the foundational things and getting your business started that you don't get paid for that you're not making any money. So like register your LLC, get a domain name set up like start getting these little things get your business bank accounts set up. Do those little things because those are all a pain in the touch to just get done they cost very little money but you

could maybe use your current income to pay for them and that way when you do leave you can hit the ground running. So whether maybe that's six months for some people I know for me that was

probably about six months but I was I was saving and I'm always honest about the fact that I had a

partner was providing me health insurance so that made my life a lot easier obviously in America and I didn't have kids so I was able to like just stash to stash as much as possible. You have this three step process save sell make that you followed can you walk our listeners through

“that? Yeah so I think like sometimes people will talk about one of these like they'll think”

I have to save money or I should just start selling things that are in my basement but I actually like a little bit of a combo of all three so I started saving by spending less right so I was I was cutting my expenses I was just really buckling down on like even looking at expenses was kind of funny like of what things I was spending money on to make myself happier in my miserable career and I would think like well if I was not in this career six months from now I wouldn't need that thing so I was

going up for these like luxurious lunches every day just get out of the office I started bringing my own lunch like it was like $50 at a time it really added up I also did go through my house and got rid of a lot of things that I knew I could sell off I I think I made enough in expenses like I had a friend who was teasing me it's like oh what's the big deal like you don't people don't really make that much money like I paid for my domain name I paid for my LLC I paid for like a bunch of the original

“startup cost of things and I think I paid for somebody to make me a logo or something at the time”

and so that was helpful and then the other thing I always suggest to people is like is there anything

else you can do to make any more money right now if it's temporary I took on like a part time attorney job just so there was extra income for a short period of time it was about six months I rightfully thinks that hustle culture has been so demonized but what you're talking about is like a hustle season and I do think those are so important to being a successful entrepreneur or getting yourself to where you can quit your business like when I was launching my book and you're probably

feeling similar it's like I am I hustle really really hard because I made a commitment to myself of how I wanted this book launch to go I had spent so much time on this thing and I wanted to be really successful so I worked more hours I did more things than I normally would and then I took a break once it was over can we discuss hustle seasons because if you really want something you are going to have to work for it and I don't want to lie to everybody listening of like you can live

this soft life all of the time and still get the things you want I don't think that's true yeah I completely agree I actually don't think I've been a business for eight years and you know

like I can really chill and still do well and that's very unusual too that people like you and I

can do this I know you and I prioritize like our our health and our lives and we live our lives and that is also not the case even when people are in business for eight plus years right yeah so I very much believe that not only is a hustle period required I don't think it's necessarily a bad thing like I just think as long as we keep it to the period right like I don't not ask

“you to sign up for this for life but I think it shows that there's some passion and there's some”

grit and honestly sorry I I'm like I think about it a lot like I actually missed those days a little bit like I was hungry oh there's fun I think yeah nothing to lose I was scrappy like I write a lot about my book that I think that entrepreneurship requires a lot more scrappyness than

people want to talk about to resourcefulness like I was reaching out asking for things really utilizing

my resources yeah just seeing like I don't know I almost didn't even know what I was in for and I would encourage you to see that as a really positive fun thing my favorite word in the world is curiosity and I just like recommend going into this process as curious as possible like let's see what happens and if you end up building a business that gives you chill then I feel like you've made it in my opinion I was literally just thinking about this yesterday Taylor Swift just went on this two-year

career defining really intense really physically emotionally demanding tour and now we don't see her like yeah but like that's the idea Harry Styles same thing right wins the Grammy for album of the year does this massive tour worldwide and now we like don't see him and it's like those are the you need both you need both seasons but I like I'm not glamorizing hustle culture but I do think hustle seasons are required and you do have to find the fun and then like it can become a game

“like you have to sprint at times if you want a business to be successful yeah it's kind of a funny”

evolution because I feel like entrepreneurship became my identity which was pretty fun for a while I mean I also started in like the girl boss there was all the time yes it was like cool back then but I do feel like it was kind of fun like I all my friends became like other online business owners it was it was a fun period and then I feel like the next shift is actually decoupling it's like I right now my identity I have like worked very hard to completely remove my identity

from my business or how well my business is doing or how much money or followers or whatever yeah what are the four stages that someone's going to experience when launching their business

the first business phase that you will probably go through is what I call the seed phase which is

in you're probably going to have lots of little seeds and maybe someone listening is sitting here thinking like I could become a health coach or open a flower shop or open a bar studio or be a food blogger

“like I'm sure you're a multi passionate person you know I think everybody kind of goes through”

that phase as an entrepreneur where you try to make your hobby your business and try to like monetize every single thing that you do and I do think kind of again to this like hustle period I think it's cool to explore those and be open to the fact that some of those might not work out some of them might and some that you didn't think were a good idea might be the ones that take so in my opinion the next phase is really that sprout phase where it's like okay a couple of seeds you planted you

tended to some of them actually sprouted they start to grow they can take off this is when you start to actually like get your feet under you in your business now we're looking at like how are we scaling expanding hiring all that and I actually think the final phase is kind of like a propagation phase because it's really it's probably what I'm in and you keep going back to of like okay now what do I want to cut what do I want to stop doing what can I afford to not do any more

how do I get more efficient you know all that yeah I think there's two problems with people who are about to start a business it's either I don't have an idea or I have too many ideas so can you maybe walk us through a framework that helps them identify what that idea should be that they invest in business for yes absolutely so I really recommend you know a nice blend of something that you're interested in because I want you to be interested and have some passion behind it

but I think that I'm a really good example of somebody who started a successful business of something I'm not this is really interested in so I'm a lawyer I would not say I love legal templates it's what I sell right it's like I don't know who does that would be really weird in my opinion but what I do is we call it like contracts or my fashion no I do not but what I am really passionate about is helping other women start businesses if that's the thing that I'm

good at like okay I just want to get educated in this area I can do that in yes I sell you the contract but you're writing to me about your business ideas and you're writing to me about like oh I'm starting

and where is their demand and supply so I don't think that enough people do enough demand and supply research often times people do very quick supply research and they see oh there's a bunch of people on Instagram being money coaches for example therefore there's no space for me and they just like

instantly take themselves out of it instead of being curious about it and thinking well first of all

that shows that there's demand so that's interesting but also are there any differentiators for example that are missing when I started my business I wasn't the first person to do it but I saw a huge huge hole in the market that I thought was missing specifically for online businesses for creators and creators having access to contracts and stuff who also didn't want all the

“fear tactics I'm a really chill person I'm not going to do that and that's how I want to run my”

business and so I started and it was like boom off to the race so there was that mix of like I'm interested in helping you start a business I've got this experience I saw some supply which showed proof of product but I also saw there was a demand for like something that was a little different and so I like to think of it as like building a recipe in that case we did a previous episode about side hustles and we'll link it down below but our guest Janice talked about walking

through the bread aisle at the grocery store and being like that's the experience of starting

to be an entrepreneur right there's a million people making bread there's a million different kinds

of bread and yet you're out there being like I can't make bread because other people are doing it look at the bread aisle there's a million times of bread million different people making bread you can offer something you can be a photographer even if there's a million photographers you can be a money coach even if there's a million other money coaches you just have to figure out your value proposition what is the thing that's differentiating you from everybody else doing that

yes and then as I talk a lot about my book actually be different like I talk my mom used to

“always say be interested and interesting and like you have to actually be an interesting person”

and then show that part of yourself like in your content like if you think you have a spicy take you think you have a different way of doing it I certainly hope you're talking about it okay we can't not talk about some legal stuff when does a business actually need an attorney nowadays a lot of people don't necessarily need an attorney starting off I mean I hope that that's what I help a lot I've helped over 350,000 people start online businesses so

I mean most of this stuff you can do affordably on your own you can register an LLC get a basic contract in place go get a business bank account which same I posh you right there yes because I've talked with saying hundreds of thousands millions of people who want to be business owners and they hear because I just went through this with my partner a couple years ago I was like you need to have a business for what you're doing and yeah he was like that takes so much work I'm

like you need an LLC and he's like oh but doesn't that cost thousands of dollars and take up on your paperwork so I want to stop you right there what is getting an LLC actually cost and actually mean because I think it's gonna blow everybody's minds yeah this is a big reason why I started my business actually because it infuriated me as a lawyer how I felt like it was so unfair huh so unjust of like it's stopping a lot of people from starting their own businesses so I at least

consider this is just an aside I consider a lot of what I do to be access like I just want to give people access because this is so easy you guys you can all do this so depending on where you live like LLC's typically cost anywhere from fifty dollars to a couple of hundred dollars the only exception to this or the major exception I should mention is in California where we have to file this like what's called a franchise tax when you also file for an LLC which costs like seven

hundred dollars so it's an additional expense but worse it comes to worse we're talking yeah thousand dollars but I think that's a couple hundred yeah in like Jersey and Pennsylvania where I'm from it was like one twenty five one seventy five yeah they're not we're not talking crazy what ends up

“getting crazy is when you hire a lawyer to do it for you so that's why like I the product that I”

created just walks people through and teaches you how to do it yourself it's very easy the same place that this applies that will save you thousands of dollars when it comes to trade marks trade marks themselves are not very expensive they're very inexpensive also copyrights very inexpensive it's like fifty bucks what becomes expensive or all the legal fees you don't have to have a lawyer file those for you a lot of people are really surprised to learn that you also don't have to have

a lawyer draft a contract fee so a lot of people actually think it's like legally required to have a lawyer give you a contract I'm not saying it's not helpful of course lawyers are helpful and they can make sure you do it right and that you don't run into trouble and it says all the right things and all that kind of stuff but a lot of people that I'm dealing with who are starting like such small businesses that's a lot like I I'm very much a fan of let's get the foundation set and then

like I always say to my customers when you become Amazon if you want to do that then you go get the

it's overkill when you're starting out for a lot of people and I will confess this on Mike

“I don't think we did trade marks until maybe 2021 yeah and everybody with the podcast was already”

a thing I already had a million followers so like you need the LLC even the trade marks can come later

and if you're listening and you're a freelancer you work from home as a freelancer that can be your own business that then you can write off part of your rent or mortgage you can write off your desk and your lights or your computer or your software all of these things can start being written off your coffee that you get with a colleague to talk business all of these things are right off so maybe I know you're not an accountant but maybe can we touch for a second on the

power of like having that LLC to save you money in every other aspect of your life not just your business yeah absolutely they force me to take tax classes so I'm happy to talk about my money's worth there's a huge personal financial gain to getting an LLC as well because the point of

“getting an LLC registering your business as an LLC is to personally financially protect yourself”

so you don't want to be financially on the hook for anything that happens in your business and then

I always say that like part two of this conversation is that you then go and get business insurance

because you also don't want your business to be financially responsible for anything that happens either because you know a lawsuit with cripple most businesses so we don't want that to happen so yeah it can be very beneficial to you on the just like liability side to get an LLC but as story mentioned you also get to start capturing all of these expenses I also want to mention because you mentioned about freelancers I see this a lot and I talk about this in my

book that often freelancers don't think about themselves as business owners you are a business owner you're just providing services that that is your product right is your service people often say to

“me oh I don't need to get an LLC I'm just a freelancer it's like that means you're a business owner”

so yes you would get an LLC so that it would legally protect you as a person but also so that you could capture all these expenses if you have income from another job like let's say you work a nine to five or you have a partner and you filed jointly you can reduce your taxable income if your business is even costing you money so I'll oftentimes there can be a benefit even when you're in the red and again to that I'm a freelancer I'm not an entrepreneur if you do

any sort of you know you have a nine to five job and you do any sort of work outside of that for yourself so that could be you know I'm a 1099 contractor who teaches yoga I am a graphic designer my nine to five and I also do some graphic design I design two logos a year for other people and get paid to do it those are businesses and again you can be writing off part of your house or your rent you can be writing off so many other things that are not going to only save the

business money but also save you personally so much money yeah I mean if your home office is 10% of your total square footage you not only get to take that portion of your rent or mortgage you also get to take 10% of all of your utilities like all of the things that you're using so keep that space yeah why if I phone all that kind of stuff so yeah it can be a huge benefit for people and people often don't know that it can reduce their taxable income for their other

job or when they're filing jointly as well totally this newly independent podcast is brought to you by square space I was literally talking to someone this morning who has an in-person business and is trying to do more with her digital business she has crazy goals for this year she wants to make 250k for her business this year and I was like oh then you need square space you need square space square space is the best place to design a website but also to sell things especially

if you're selling digital goods or things that need shipping I love that you can use square space to offer services and get paid so consultations courses events experiences all that can happen inside square space you're not paying like a different payment platform to handle it for you you can also buy a domain on square space it makes it easy to find the best name for your business and you can make sure to sell anything from products to content to time all on your square space site

head on over to square space dot com slash ff pod for a free trial and when you're ready to launch

your brand new website use ss pod to save 10% off your first purchase of a website or domain

from the developer floute the sheldon ansai go on sale that's nerfed and is still much too tired stop ross that the recruiting spirale with stepstone all jobs become the all-an-seigen for a year in a package to a fixed price so far they're up to 75% cost-probe-verbal and they're every time flexible yet to mean

all the jobs you have a quote in the book quote these days i love what i do and i love my business but my business is not my passion it's my job and it's a job that allows me to chase my actual passions like cooking outside of my day to day work you mentioned this briefly at the beginning of the episode but talk to me about why it's so important for entrepreneurship or your business to not be all-consuming your complete identity because you're in for a wild ride if it is because there's

it's a roller coaster i mean there are times when your business is picking up steam has momentum then things slow down you have a big sale you feel high three days later you're like what sale i don't care it's you will learn very quickly that this stuff is very fleeting i literally dreamt about getting a book deal and i said oh if i ever got a big five book deal i mean come on that's crazy got the book deal sat there and freaked out about the entire time i i wrote it just so worried

my whole life's problems weren't solved by getting this book deal you know i still had stressors like it will just it'll be a wild ride but also like i mean i get a lot of anti-semitic comments on on social media for example i get nasty emails and messages it things happen and so it's like if i was defined by that i see this stuff now and i'm just like i just i mean i know you

you get the same thing it's just it would be very difficult but i hope like my mom always

used to say that somebody's weight was the least interesting thing about them and i always hope

“that my business is the least interesting thing about me yeah i think about that a lot to especially”

somebody who used to define her worth and her accomplishments i've said this many times on the show but my mentor told me once that i'm a human being not a human doing and i was like why does something so simple uh absolutely fuck with me and change my entire life but it's true it's like i am very proud of the work we do i am so proud of this i do say it's my life's work because i do believe that this is the way i can have the most impact and also uh i hope that this is not

what is listed on my grace tone yeah so i had however many millions followers like i don't think that that's gonna matter in the end that's the way i think about it i think i'm pretty heavily impacted by the loss of my parents i did just lost both of my parents back to back and it's like i don't know it is a wake up that you're just like this doesn't matter you know i have i'm going through my own existential crisis where i'm like none of this matters this is not who i am you

know well and you and i had talked when we met that you know that had happened to you and i'm so sorry for your loss you had that moment and then you know your your your your death airplane moment

“of these kind of we have wake up calls i think a lot of women either experiences wake up calls”

don't see them for what they are it's easy to ignore them or they get the wake up call and they don't actually use that to take action or they do it for a little bit but then life gets in the way one how do we identify wake up call moments for what they are and two how do we actually use them

to spur ourselves into action i think the first thing is just to shift in the mindset of like

everything is an opportunity and like i know i already had my business but it was still pretty early on it wasn't like it was maybe doing multi six figures at that point per year it was not too crazy and then my dot got leukemia and i became as caregiver it was like okay well what do we do now and it became a curiosity like open point for me it was just like well my business is way too reliant on me i saw that if my foot wasn't on the gas the business slow down that if i wasn't

on instagram at that time doing instagram stories every single day like educational teaching things it's low down and i just thought it can't be this way whether he's sick or not i took it as an opportunity i totally retooled my business and i i mean talking about another hospital period right where i was like i'm gonna get this thing in place it was like an investment i'm gonna get this thing in place now so that it pays off later and i was able to take care of him for a long

“time until he passed away from his leukemia so it's like yeah i think seeing those things is like”

what what what is it like what friction is this causing and what could i create out of this that would actually resolve this friction even for the long term we're talking a lot on the show lately about disappointing people and i have mentioned this before that my parents don't fully

understand my business i think for the first time in the past year or two they're at the point where

they are like oh this is actually successful but at the beginning they want to me to keep my job they wanted me to keep my steady paycheck and i think that in order to grow the business the way i wanted in order to do the things that i wanted at times i've very severely disappointed them

it the way we want not aligning with people's expectations for us if it means we're doing the thing that we truly feel is right for us yeah what a great lesson to learn to because as a business owner you're going to disappoint people all the time and yeah even the minute you do things perfectly you know like you nail it and someone still pissed out it's just the way the world

“works so like i think you know it's really important to remember that when you start a business”

or i think make any life change like if you told people you were going to get divorced or cutting off all your hair like whatever people project all their stuff onto you and this is especially true about people who care about you and people are worried about your safety right so it's like they mean well but people start spewing all their stuff onto you and like it's their feeling of insecurity of like that would be unsafe for them that would make them feel unsafe

some customers have told me that parents have told them it's irresponsible or like that you're throwing your life away and throwing the stable job away so i think it's just recognizing that that's a bit of what's going on at least that's helpful for me is like oh this is like your thing that would make you really uncomfortable but i'm i'm deciding to do that it's probably also just like there's no way getting around it of saying like entrepreneurship takes a lot of grit and a lot

of betting on yourself you're going to get a lot of feedback from people i remember when i left the firm the managing partner told me like do you know how many businesses fail in their first year

and like you're always welcome to come back and i was like great i won't need to and that wasn't

“because i thought i was going to be successful i just thought i'd figure it out and i think that you”

have to like yeah you you might face a lot of people doubting you and saying these things and you can't go leave your job or start your business or think about maybe like escalating the business you already have only if everybody is like super nice and supportive because when you get to toy size and you start getting messages and comments on your stuff all the time you're going to have to have some thick skin man and it's like my friend always talks about

being like a tree and that we have to be like a tree and like the like further and further grow our roots and like really cement our roots because then when the wind blows like the tree is not going to fall over but if you just like let it be a little baby tree forever every single time there comes a wind storm you're getting knocked down and so i really think about that is like it's my job to keep working on myself and be like more and more cemented in what i'm doing

i can't get it from everybody else i don't know why i didn't think about it until you just set it i was talking about like disappointed people before you're starting your business or as you're like

growing it you're so right that like you're always going to have a customer who's mad at you

you're always going to have somebody on social media who's mad at you you could be mother Teresa and you're always going to have somebody mad at you and it's like that's just part of this is you're going to disappoint people and the promise i made to myself is like you can disappoint anybody that's fine i gave myself permission to disappoint other people and i have to keep reminding myself of this because i want to be also liked and so that is very hard but i can't disappoint

myself because i have the highest standards for me so if i just appoint myself to make other people uncomfortable i have failed but i have not failed if i disappointed other people but stood in what i know to be true or right or the way i want to do things yeah absolutely like not getting that

“for me some other people yeah and i think you're right like you're also going to piss off into some”

point people when you if you leave your corporate career and people are going to be like it's crazy you left being a lawyer and like so your response will you just i got it all like you spent so much time so much money and so much and it's just what you want it i don't want it anymore so i think what i'm trying to say is like if you're facing that disappointment on the front and now i think it's a good thing because you're about to face it all the way through like that disappointment doesn't

go away it shifts from being other people listeners people in your inbox whatever and you're allowed to change your mind when you have new information like you're allowed to change your mind i thought i wanted to be an actor for so long and at first when i sold out didn't become an artist it was like oh i am denying seven year old me's dream and i'm like seven year old me didn't understand that she was going to have to pay her bills like seven year old me didn't understand what rank costs like so yeah

she had crazy dreams i am still doing something that i love that i didn't even know existed when i was seven years old and didn't really exist actually when i'm saying you're so you're allowed to change your

mind when you get new information yeah and i don't know why this comforts me but i just always think

about how nobody pays my mortgage but me so i'm like well i can't decide at the end of the day like it doesn't matter totally so you've created this sustainable multi-seven figure business what is sustainability actually mean to you now not working like crazy being able to pull back when i want to not having to be on social media all the time that's pretty big for me still having relationships

your level of involvement of how how much you want to be integrated and if you can still do that once i know that level and like oh i can still do this if it gets beyond it then that's not worth it

“for me i think that's what it means for for me and i i don't do anything too crazy or trendy”

or like i try not to run off and do like everyone's saying you have to do this i just kind of stay steady and i like way i've waited out so many trends so many things that people have said like you had to do or couldn't do and yeah i just think like slow and steady has won the race so far

my last question for you what is success look like for somebody in their first year of business

that's a great question i think that success looks like actually trying failing and taking

“a feedback from that failure and someone that keeps going because i think that's the”

senior partner who told me that a lot of businesses fail within their first year i guess that's statistic is true but i'd be curious how many of those people like if they had kept added if they had a more open mindset if they were curious if they had done some of the things we talked about

on the front end being a little bit more prepared like i think that you can get through that first

year getting some experience under your belt just really seeing this all as like you're it's like you're in an internship and you're just trying you're literally learning how to become a marketer a copywriter your your own legal team your financial team your everything your customer service representative so you're just trying it all and like see this as that opportunity and

“i believe a lot in future proofing and i think a lot about what am i building where my”

headed but in order to get there i need to start acting like i'm headed there already and

so i just thought that first year is like that opportunity to start acting like i was

headed in the place that i wanted to go i think that's such a good advice stand thank you for being here plug away my friend you know thank you you can get my book when i start my business i'll be happy anywhere that books are sold i'll make sure to re also has a link to my newsletter stamp sidebar to me weekly newsletter where i teach you marketing advice that actually works and that won't keep you on social all the time and legal tips that will keep you protected i also have a podcast

called on your terms since you like listening to podcast i love it thank you so much thank you thanks so much for having me thank you for listening to financial feminists produced by her first tender care if you love this show and want to keep supporting feminist media please subscribe or follow us on your preferred podcasting platform or on youtube your support helps us continue to bring this content to you for free if you're looking for resources tools and education including

all of the resources mentioned in this episode head to her first under k dot com slash s s pod [BLANK_AUDIO]