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On the NPR app or wherever you get your podcasts. My internet went out this weekend. Oh, I'm sorry. It was actually possibly a blessing. It went out, like, it can't be fixed until tomorrow.
So truly nothing, nothing could be done. Oh, like, out, out. Yeah, I don't know what happens.
It was out since Saturday morning.
“So suddenly, the spigot was turned off of information, right?”
Like, I was like, what will become of me? Like, my home suddenly seems like a much different place, too. You know, less avoid where you park your meat bag, so that you can enter the vortex of your phone and other virtual worlds. That was Manush Samaroti, host of Ted Radio Hour.
And I'm Mary Al Segata, you're listening to LifeKit. So I was telling Manush about my analog weekend. And it was like, oh, usually I have the TV on as a companion. Or usually, I'll also have my laptop and my lap and be like, just browsing. Just browsing things.
Well, I'm looking online. And now I can't do any of that. So quickly, I took down my pros translation of Shakespeare. No, come on, you did not. I did.
You were like, if we're going analog, we are going all analog. All the way in. Yeah. And I started reading a fellow. It didn't take long for me to fill in the blanks and look for more information.
But what was nice is it was a limited type of information. It's like, from this book, I can get information about Shakespeare. I mean, I'm impressed that you still have Shakespeare on yourselves.
First of all, and that you knew where it was.
And did you find that you were able to sort of relax with the book in a way that perhaps you
“might not have been had your phone been sitting there pinging alongside you?”
Yeah, there wasn't too much for me in my partner to do. So I was actually reading him Shakespeare. Oh, that's really romantic. It was really sweet. Also, it means that you weren't doing something that, you know, researchers call that
where you're multimedia, tasking. Yeah, like switching from screen to different screen to another screen. If you're chilling and that's fun for you, great. Just don't think that you're actually taking in information properly from any one of the screens that you are flooding to and fro from.
Yeah, there's a chapter of the book where you talk about avoiding information overload. Yeah, and that feels really important to me in my personal life, because I feel like I'm almost getting sick on information. Like, I'm, I'm a little nauseous on information, you know, so much candy. Yeah, it's too much.
Y'all ever feel like this? Lucky for us, Manush has done a lot of reporting on well-being in the digital age. And she has advice for us on this episode of LifeKit. We talk about a chapter of her new book, Body Electric, and it's all about information overload. How would you define information overload?
This is something that I too have struggled with immensely.
“So I really went down a rabbit hole to try to understand, like, what was going on in my brain?”
Was this actually something new and was there anything bad about trying to get all this information into my brain? And it turns out the word for it is infomania, sort of compulsion to take in more information. And it goes back centuries to the 13th century. And there was worries that people would try to put too much information into their brains.
I'm picturing, like, Bell in the library in the castle with the Beast. So many books, so many books and could I actually, because what I felt like I was doing, and maybe this sounds familiar to you, is, like, sure, I could read all of these things or watch all these things or take it all in. But then I was like, what am I actually doing with it?
Like, do I remember what I've read? Am I making connections between them? Am I processing it in a way that it's, like, getting stored in my memory? And also I'm there for applying it in my life? Yeah.
And it just made me realize, like, well, no, because I'm not a computer. My brain is not infinite with RAM. And I can't reboot to, like, when things go scrambled. So, for me, it turned into sort of an understanding of biologically and cognitively and physiologically over the last 10 years.
Like, what is the human body capable of? But I think we need to be smarter about how we take it in, how we synthesize it,
What our expectations are in terms of actually using all of this information.
Yeah. I wonder if there are any symptoms of information overload.
“Like, what to watch out for when you've been taking in too much today?”
Yeah. So, this was, again, a while back. But there was a podcast that I did where we asked people with their symptoms were. And some of the things they mentioned were the eye twitch inability to sleep, because you feel like your head is spinning and you've been looking at screens for so long that you can't just sort of, like, settle down.
Also, feeling like you can't concentrate, having spoken to researchers like Gloria Mark at UC Irvine,
who have studied how we switch our attention.
One of the things that she has seen is that if you have an hour where you're switching from screen to screen, and checking, you know, X, and then going over to Instagram, and going over to email, switching, switching, even if the next hour, everything sort of calms down, and you want to sit down with like a single article or something like that, you will start switching tasks yourself.
She observed that in the lab that people will suddenly look up and go to their email. And she estimated that up to around half of the interruptions that happen to us during the day,
actually, are because of self interruptions.
So, even if nobody else is interrupting you, you will start interrupting yourself. You will start switching tasks, trying to get in information in different ways. It takes time to sort of slow down, marinate, get into the rhythm that is required for reading something carefully, cautiously, and just sort of juice it for what it's worth. Take away one, some signs that you might be experiencing information overload. Your eye starts
switching, you're having trouble sleeping, you feel like your head is spinning with words and numbers and you can't settle down. Also, if you're having trouble concentrating or you keep interrupting yourself, many of these signs are anecdotal, and yours might be different. The point is, pay attention to your body. It's easy to forget they have one when you've been glued to a screen all day. When we're back, minutionite hawk through what to do, if you
are dealing with information overload. DLP ones are best known as weight loss drugs, but they may also help people cut back on alcohol, cigarettes, and opioids. They seem to work for many types of addiction. Maybe these effects are much broader than we previously thought. Ideas about the brain, addiction, and empathy. That's on the Ted radio hour podcast, listen on the NPR app or wherever you get your podcasts.
Okay, so you're driving to work or you're on a walk or you're at the gym or whatever, and you just need to clear your head. That's the perfect time to hit the play button on NPR's all songs considered. It's not the news, it's not work, or whatever else is weighing you down. It's just a good time with good friends and great tunes. Listen to all songs considered every Tuesday in the NPR Music podcast. On a new episode of R We Doomed, we are losing the moon. The moon isn't de-interrupting away,
“and what to do? Yeah, I think that's overkill. The moon, while we might need it, a real plan to”
nuke it, and new space race for it. Join me for R We Doomed, distributed by the NPR network, listen wherever you get your podcasts. I think part of the reason that I end up with information overload is because I feel like the default is to be on your phone all the time and to be just gusling information from it even when you're not intending to. Yes. So I'd love to walk through some solutions for that. Let's do it. One of them you talk about is to prioritize. Yeah, that's
not so boring though. Yeah. Let's call it set an information goal is how I like to think of it. I like to think of people thinking of themselves as information athletes and they have information goals. For example, all that switching that we talked about, you're switching contexts, right? Like, oh, you're looking at, is Ebola still happening? That dog is so cute. Oh, that looks like a delicious recipe. All of the switching contexts, right? It's like an emotional roller coaster and it's exhausting
“and it's burning through your cognitive resources really fast. So you have to think about it this way.”
What is it that you want to get out of the time that you are convening with your phone or with the Google's or wherever you go? And if you can as much as possible, try to choose something that you
Want to get out of it.
You are going to go to trusted sources like, you know, places that you know have good recipes
or an influencer who you love their stuff that they have. And guess what? You've saved some of her stuff for exactly this occasion, right? You're studying the goal to get the information and then once you've achieved it, stop. Yeah, get in and get out. That's the change that I'm hoping to make to be more specific and intentional about the information I take in because we only have this one life, right? Yeah. And it's like, why am I feeling my brain was stuff that I absolutely don't care
about and turning that into a job? It's so true. I'm turning it in the job is called being a human in the world. Yeah, we feel like it means consuming non-stop information about absolutely everything. Take away two. One way to prevent information overload is to set information goals. Think about why you're opening your phone or logging into your computer. What information are you hoping to take in? What info do you really not need? Once you've met your goal for the moment or the day, stop.
Do you think it helps to try to ask yourself why am I going on my phone right now? Yes, and that is not
easy because there is like what? I don't know. A tenth of a second? Between that moment of like,
yeah, before you gonna look because I'm bored. Gonna look because didn't I need to check something
“gonna look because I actually need something gonna look because that's what I always do the minute I have”
a free minute, right? Think of it as like you don't walk into a room. You're like looking for something and sometimes you're like, what's why did I come in here? And then you're like, oh, I can't remember you leave. Same thing has to be with the phone. It is a big room, you know, ultimately an infinite room. But like go in, know what you're there for, enjoy what you find and get out. And if you don't, if you're like, actually, I am not looking for anything and that doesn't feel right to you in the moment,
then okay, put it down. Walk out of the room. You're making me wonder if time boxing
is another good solution for this because often we have so many different things and we can be getting pings from people on Slack like, hey, can you do this? Can you do that? Oh, can you just answer this real quick? And at least for me, I get overwhelmed by that. I'm like, if I'm supposed to be writing, I really need to be in the writing zone and like close Slack completely. Me too. Again, that comes back to the earlier discussion about deciding like that switching between tasks
and setting information goals. If your goal is to generate information, that takes a lot of cognitive work. And it means it's something that you want to do earlier in the day because that is when that part of your brain is firing. The one that really is coming up with the creative ideas, right?
“If you can set aside the time for the hardest, deepest mental labor that you need to do earlier in the”
day. And then you leave it to later when you're tired out and you're kind of just answering emails etc. That uses a different part of the brain that goes on to sort of autopilot. That is the more sort of neurologically beneficial way to structure your day. But, you know, you're also dealing with teams and co-workers and dogs that need to get walked and your mom wants to ask you a quick question and co-workers that only have time between 11 and 1 to talk to you about something else.
And so it is that constant balancing of like who needs what and what do I need to get this done if I'm going to meet my deadline. If I'm going to eventually cross this off my list. I mean, I see some people pretty successfully use the little icons and Slack to indicate like, "Not available. I'm going to call. Don't take it personally when I don't respond to you immediately." As somebody said to me the other day, "You train people around you how they should respond to you."
And I thought that was really funny and I thought about it. She only responds to emails the next day.
“And I know never to expect any quick response from her because she has, I know her rhythm, right?”
Yeah. But then there's also maintaining your own boundaries around that. Like if you put stop and then someone messages you and you answer them right away, even though you don't need to answer them right away, then your system is broke. Game over. Yeah. Take away three minimize tasks switching. You can try time boxing where you say, "Okay, I'm going to be writing from 10 a.m. to noon and then I'll eat lunch and then I'll be available to
chat with my team from noon to one." And then I'll listen to a podcast mix. The details will change depending on your job. When you time box, you can also signal your availability to co-workers, block certain times on your calendar, even if you're not in meetings. If you slack, put up a status that explains what you're doing. In person, you could close your door if you have a door or an
Office.
yellow means approached, but only was something small or pressing. Or if you have a little piece of
“cookie that you want to share with me, green means talk to me, please. We'll have more life kit after”
the break. This week on Shore Wave. Peptides are everywhere. Influencers claim they help you reduce inflammation, build muscle faster, age slower. And now the FDA looks poised to make peptides even easier to get, but does the science match the hype? It might be fine and rats and mice, but it might be toxic and people. What we really know about how peptides work in your body on Shore Wave. Listen on the
MPR app or wherever you get your podcasts.
So these are interruptions from other people, but you also say that a lot of us are just
interrupting ourselves. Yes, how do we try to not interrupt ourselves? I love this idea that I'm like, hey, you, what? Don't bother me. Wait, no, you. I see it in myself, right? And for me, it's about making a plan. Because why do you interrupt yourself? Well, A, like we talked about earlier, if you get into sort of a bosom where you're constantly switching switching switching, your brain gets used to that rhythm and then continues to want to be in that rhythm. So what it's looking
for is something to look on to, right? So for me, I am obsessed with my to-do list, but it's multiple things. It is the to-do list. Not only is the minute I think of something, is it jot it down,
“because technically you can only hold about four to seven things in your brain that you have to”
remember to do. Then I prioritize, there's color coding as to what are the things that absolutely
have to get done. And then if they're really important, they get slotted into the calendar, right? Like, this is actually when you are going to fill that. And I try to have my calendar be filled with things that need to be done, not because I like to be busy, but because that way I don't have to think throughout the day. It's 1030. What did I decide I was going to do next? Oh, yeah. From now until 12, I am writing. Great. I can complete it. I can feel successful
and then move on through my day. It's about really thinking through, like, where am I going to be when does that work with me with my colleagues? Am I going to need a snack at that point? Be real, trying to think of your own rhythms, your colleagues rhythm, and making sure that you've given yourself time and space to do it. And then deciding like, and if these things don't make it onto the list, or they don't get done, that's fine. They can roll over.
Take away four. Try to stop interrupting yourself. When you find that you just abruptly looked up from a task in order to check Instagram or your email, for instance, pause, decide if you actually need to switch tasks at this moment. You talk about multitasking in the book. It reminded me of when I was in high school. I used to run track in cross country, and I was also, I just was studying all the time. So I would literally be doing sit-ups
with my textbook, right above me, or I would be on the treadmill, come on with the textbook, or in the shower with the clear shower curtain, holding the textbook or the notebook outside the shower to get a little more studying. Oh, girl, you were serious about high school. Okay. I was very serious about it. I was very serious about it. But now that I have this smartphone and the laptop and the TV and everything all at once, it's like, yeah, I feel like I'm
especially inclined to try to do everything at the same time. multitasking is actually just switching between tasks very rapidly. And every time you switch a task, you use glucose, right? Like, that is what happens. And every time you use glucose in your brain, you're burning through a finite amount of it as well as the oxygen that it takes to burn, said glucose in your brain. Your brain is a beautiful system. It has the ability to clear out the CO2 that's the remnants
from burning all that glucose and oxygen. But at a certain point, it starts to build up there if you overload yourself, right? So that is when you start to feel tired and foggy, mentally
“fatigued, maybe even feel it in your body. And so what is the best way to regain your ability to”
focus? It's to take a break. It's to move. Not take a break on your phone because that's burning glucose again, but to literally get up and walk around the room. That stimulates your muscles. Your muscles can then pump in more blood, which has oxygen and glucose back up to your brain,
That you can go back to doing all that tasks, switching that you're doing.
think about it, like, that moment in the afternoon where you're like, "Oh, I just really need
“chocolates so bad." Well, of course you do. Like, literally you are light on glucose in your brain.”
That makes total sense. But if you take a walk, you actually will refresh your cognitive capacity and, of course, protect your physical health as well. Yeah. And standing up and doing just a little bit of movement, it gives you a sort of reset, right? Totally. And it doesn't have to be burpees or sprints or anything crazy. So in the clinical trial that we did, it's five minutes of walking at two miles per hour. Two miles per hour of walking. So you can, like, go get the mail or go
pick up all the dirty glasses that are in the apartment and bring them to the kitchen or vacuum
the kitchen because boy does it need it. Or if you're at the office, go refill your water bottle
and take one extra lap around. Just that reset is not only good for your circulation. What it's been shown to do is if you take those often enough, it also improves your mood, your ability to focus. We saw drops of up to 28% less fatigue levels like imagine ending the day feeling actually good and not drained and exhausted. And really it takes four to five five minutes breaks throughout the day to get those benefits. Take away five, beware, the double or triple screening. It can
burn you out on information quick. And when you do start to feel that burn out, get up and move around. These are all good tips. There was a quote I really liked in the book by the way. It's like
“your brain is a part of your body that you need to take care of. Yeah and I think, you know,”
like you said, other professions like a surgeon is certainly going to pay close attention to how
they care for themselves. Pilots can't work a certain number of hours. And so why are we, like, us information workers? Why don't we think of ourselves the same way? Like, I am only optimizing an able to do the work I need to do for a certain number of hours before I need a break. I would also say that like, it's not just a nice metaphor. Like we're going into this era of AI where human judgment is going to be the thing that we are learning the most. If anything,
information overload is going to get even worse. And so instead of collecting information, what we're going to be doing is parsing that information. Is it good information? Is it missed information? Is it? Oh, wait, that sentence actually makes no sense. Kind of information. Right? It's as constant judgments that we're going to have to be making. And then deciding, do I use that information in some way? So judgment, decision-making, discernment, these are the
“human skills that we are going to be leaning on. I think even more heavily as we go forward.”
And so we need to make sure we treat our brain with the respect that it deserves, because otherwise, rely on the floor, scrolling and not even looking at what we're scrolling up. Yeah. Manush, thank you so much for this. It was my absolute pleasure. I am now going to go for a walk and think about all the things we discussed. Yay! Yay! All right, folks, time for a recap. Take away one. Some signs that you might be experiencing
information overload. Your eye starts twitching. You have trouble sleeping. You feel like your head is spinning with words and numbers and you can't settle down. Also, if you're having trouble concentrating or you keep interrupting yourself. Take away two, set information goals. Think about why you're opening your phone or logging onto your computer. What information are you hoping to get out of it? What information do you really not need right now? Once you've met your goal, stop.
Take away three, minimize tasks switching, and try time boxing. Also, signal your availability to co-workers with your calendar, with a status on Slack, with a closed door. Take away four. Try to stop interrupting yourself. When you do feel the urge to say stop what you're doing and just go on social media, move your body instead, and take away five. Beware the double or triple screening. And when you do it and your brain gets tired, again, try moving. If you love
life kit and you want even more, follow us on Instagram @nprlifekit. There you'll find videos featuring some of our favorite tips, like a recent one where I produce our Margaret Serino demonstrates three exercises that improve agility. You can find those by following @nprlifekit. This episode of Lifekit was produced by Margaret Serino. Our digital editor is Malaga Greb, and our visual editor is CJ Rekalan. Megan Cain is our senior supervising editor,
and Lauren Gonzalez is our executive producer. Our production team also includes Andy Tagle,
Clameration Ider, and Silly Douglas.
Back checking by Andrea Lopez Crusado. I'm Mariel Sagarra. Thanks for listening.
“. On this season of Planet Money Summer School, we follow the money,”
and not just the dollars. We're following the Yuan, the Naira, the Krona, and more.
Every Wednesday this summer, we're taking you on a world tour to meet the people
“trying new solutions to old economic problems. Planet Money Summer School grabs some friends,”
pack your bags, and don't forget the sunscreen. Listen on the NPRF or wherever you get your podcasts.
This is Fresh Air's Dave Davies. Renowned classic scholar Emily Wilson made headlines when
“she called Christopher Nolan's adaptation of the Odyssey of Bismulli Ritten. It's a style study”
cost, and they're doing that absolute best with the script they were given. I talked with Wilson about her scathing critique and so much more. Listen to Fresh Air on the NPRF or wherever you listen to podcasts.
