2824: Why Skipping Meals Is Hurting Your Metabolism

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That's it. Joy the rest of the show. You want us to lose weight, so you thought fast thing was a good idea, skipping breakfast. Great idea, right?

Easy way to control calories. No, fasting is making you fatter. Stop doing it. Let's get a take. Give him so that in a minute.

We have it. I, this is coming up because I have a friend of mine who, you know, he trains a jiu-jitsu, lifts weights, and, you know, he's, of course, he's sending me the articles. Not articles, typically they're like Instagram posts,

I'm fasting. Oh, it's good for you, dude. I should do this, I should have like, listen. Definitely not a good idea, especially for someone like you, who trains a jiu-jitsu and lift weights.

You already hit, you know, have a trouble hitting your protein and take this, that and the other need nutrients. And he's just, you know, he's just debating and arguing with me and he thinks it's a great idea. So, you know, I'm like, all right, cool.

Let me just show you a study. So, I'll, I'll, I'll kind of go over the study. And we actually have good studies now on fasting and in comparing it to control calorie diets or in other words, diets that are similar,

but the difference being, you know, it's fasted or not. Yeah. And here's, here's one of the ones that I found. And this was done with, I don't know, 1700 individuals. And this is the relationship they found

with skipping breakfast, okay. So, people who skip breakfast more than four times a week had 33% higher odds of elevated fasting blood glucose. 25% higher odds of hypertension, 40% higher odds of reduced HDL and overall, they had 24% of 25%

higher odds of full metabolic syndrome. So, these are the associations with people who skipped breakfast. And so, I just, we need to tackle this because fasting is, again, it's coming around again as this like,

great way to lose weight. It's terrible. It's funny 'cause it's something that it's been around for ever, you know, and it's one of those, another classic example of eating in the space.

(laughs) You know, that we've taken and broke down some of the, positive benefits from it. And then exacerbated it and marketed the shit out of it. And it's sort of, yeah, and then sell it.

And then it's turned into a trend. And then now there's, you know, supplements

“that you should take while you're fasted.”

So you don't, you know, so you minimize the muscle loss and all the, and so it's just like, we totally have bastardized the true meaning of fasting and the intent of it and where that, where it originated from

and turned it into a marketing play to get people to buy more stuff. And, you know, I think there's tremendous value in fasting. In fact, there's many times where I'm like,

you know what, I should get back to where I was like, trying to fast at least once. I'm gonna guess you're not doing it for fat loss. No, no, of course not. I think that's, we all agree that it's a terrible strategy

for fat loss.

And you always will get pushback for some of you

like, well, I didn't, I lost all this weight. It's just like, yeah, it's, okay, great. There's a lot of different things that you can do temporarily, just to lose weight. But there's a couple things why I don't like it

because when I look back at all the people that I've trained and you've heard this probably many times in the podcast,

and our live collars, what we take every single week,

“the same thing, almost everybody under eats protein.”

Unless you've been listening to show when you've now adopted that you focus on that, people that are just kind of eat or do their thing, typically are carb heavy, a lot of sugars, high fats, and don't hit high protein.

And you take somebody like that and you skip a whole other meal or you get right or two. You may reduce the calories temporarily in that person, but you also end up cutting into some of their protein and take that was already low.

So now they're even, now they're getting really low on protein and they're probably if they're fasting for fat loss, doing more activity or lifting weights. You're just over now, over doing it on that, not giving the body the proper nutrients to build and grow.

And eventually the body adapts to that new calorie intake and it shows, okay, I'm used to skipping breakfast and lunch

and eating it too or whatever time you first start

your first meal and you're getting no results, you're low protein, you're training every other day. - And it's dramatically decreases. - Yeah, I went through that whole process because it's a convenience, like a skipping breakfast

is an easy one for people to be able to handle for the most part because you're busy and you're getting ready and I think that the reduction in calories initially for somebody that's like, why need to manage this a bit and reduce calories

to that way, I'm not entaking as much, I'm gonna lose body fat, like all these benefits can happen. You start to find out that, yeah, your energy is really gonna be affected in a negative way. And you're gonna get adapted to that pretty quickly

so it's not really gonna benefit you and your workouts and the thing is it acts as more of a deterrent as you go further along with it towards any kind of progress you remain. - There's three, so fasting does have a long history.

It's actually one of the first documented forms of quote and quote

diet and it was documented early on for spiritual practices. So it's present in the major, the world's major religions, Christianity is long Judaism. It's also recorded as a way to help with seizures.

“And that's what we think they were talking about”

but and we know this because when somebody has epilepsy, many times they respond well to having rising ketones in the system and the old glucose ketones. So that's what happens when you fast, right? You're not consuming anything,

so your body starts to develop energy from ketones. This can also be accomplished with a medicinal ketogenic diet and which is actually one of the first treatments for epilepsy before we had better drugs. But there are a few places that the data shows

where fasting has value. So one is spiritual practices. So fasting for spiritual practices is like fasting for anything. Like you're denying the flesh, you're putting yourself in a state of suffering

in an attempt to get closer to God. So there's value there for sure. There's also value for certain gut health issues. So certain inflammatory gut issues. You may have a functional medicine practitioner

which will have you take a break for meeting to allow the inflammation to come down or have shorter eating windows to allow this to happen. So that's another way. And then the third value of fasting

is for people who are not on the other end of the spectrum of eating disorder or they're actually not, not orthorexia but like bigger rexia. So we know what anorexia is, it's like starving yourself. Then there's like what we used to label

or what they label bigger rexia. This would be maybe closer to what I would do as a kid.

I always felt skinny, so I was stuffing myself.

Yeah, it's just constantly throwing it down. And it was mentally beneficial for me to fast because I didn't eat for 10 hours and realized that my muscles didn't just evaporate. And I was like, oh my God, I was been so attached

to having to eat every other hour. But that's it. Other than that, there's no real value. And the reason why people like fasting as for weight loss is because it's a very black and white

clear, the most simplistic. This is how I cut calories. I was not eating until this time. Now, the data that I showed, people might be wondering, why is it associated with worse fasting glucose,

“worse blood lipids, worse overall metabolic health?”

Well, there's a couple of reasons for this. One, eating protein in the morning controls blood glucose better all day long than if you don't have protein. Okay, and we know this because we have

continual glucose monitor data now, which measures blood sugar in real time. And for the most part, unless you got really bad gut issues, again, if you got really inflamed gut issues and your functional medicine practitioner

it'll probably benefit your blood glucose. But everybody else, eating a high protein breakfast with all the same food all throughout the whole day, versus not eating the high protein breakfast even the same food.

The high protein morning meal controls blood glucose better.

“And the second reason, which I think is the big reason,”

here's what happens with regular fasting

or regular restriction. It results in binging later. It results in disorder, eating later. You're eating faster, and you know this, if you're listening, you know this,

like you break your fast, watch the speed of your eating. It's faster, which leads to higher calories, and then food choices tend to be more difficult. And then add them to your point. Okay, I need to, let's say I'm a woman

that needs to eat 130 grams of protein a day. And in the data on protein's clear, I'll just really quick. High protein or optimal protein for fat loss, muscle gain, athletic performance is around a gram of protein

per pound of target body weight. So you could do less than that, you're okay, but optimal is better, way better, for whatever fitness or athletic performance goal you have, okay?

So I want to eat 130 grams of protein a day. I'm not even a 200-pound male. I'm typical, small, petite, woman, 130 grams. So it's like 40 grams of protein, you know, breakfast, lunch, dinner, 45 grams of salt, breakfast.

So now I skip two meals, and I have an eating window of three hours. What am I gonna do? You need 130 grams of protein and three hours. You get a lot to shovel in.

If I'm dedicated, and I'm like, what come still getting my protein to? That is disorder eating, yeah. You need 130 grams of protein is 130 pound female in three hours, you're stuffing yourself.

Yeah. And so this is why you see these problems. Now we have really good data now. Ever since fasting became popular over the last 10 years, we've compared with controlled studies,

like really good well done studies, where it's calorie restriction. So same diet, both deficit, this one's fasted, this one isn't. Guess what, same results.

In fact, the trend is towards the non-fasting group for muscle gain and for just overall well-being, hormones and stuff like that. The trend, because it's not a huge difference, but it's a difference.

So there's really no benefit. People talk about cellophagey. This is when your cells are clearing out waste,

“and we say, guess what, a calorie deficit does that, too?”

No, you doubt, but it's like if you really are doing it for that, then do it once a month for 24 hours. Yeah. Like don't do it for fat, like if you want all the neurological benefits that you're gonna get from it,

cellophagey stuff, like-- But then what I'm trying to say is psychological benefits and everything, you know, like moving yourself

from the day to day, like I'm always having heat.

But what I'm trying to say to you, Adam, is that the data shows, it doesn't produce any better results than the calories for you. I know, but I mean, and I know that-- But if you want to do it--

I know Volta Longo did the fasting mimicking diet and showed all this research, and just eat 500 calories for a week. But I would just, I would, I personally think that-- You won't hit it hard or something.

Yeah, yeah, 24 hours of no food is easier than 500 calories for first seven days of my cooking. I think we're stricting for seven days in a row, 500 calories worse is like, hey, I'm not eating for 24 hours. Let's get those great benefits that we're talking about

also detach from things, get the spiritual benefits, whatever. And then go back to eating normal. It's the intermittent fasting that I'm not a fan of. It's just like, that's daily. Daily, this is what I do.

And then what Justin Robb, it just becomes like a excuse to just skip breakfast and do it. It's easy to not eat in the morning for a lot of time. The irony is if you're going to put restrictions on your eating, and you're like, I don't care what you guys say,

it's better for me. I need to have hard lines to be better off doing the evening. That's right, later. You're better off eating in the during the day, and then cutting it off.

Which by the way, would present a challenge for a lot of people because a lot of you have a hard time eating high protein for breakfast, right? Or they're on the run or they're on the run? Or they're on the run or they're rushing.

Yes. But you're better off if you're going to do this, but I don't even think you need--

“I don't think you should do this at all.”

But if you're going to in your heart set on it, you're better off eating the high protein breakfast, get that blood glucose control, cutting it off at 6 p.m. I mean, you'll get better sleep now.

Also, just like, OK, I mean, you always

go the research and science of which I think I know are audience appreciates. But just anecdotally with clients. This is why-- and if you listen to my phone for a very long time, I was the big advocate and we used to break up.

We used to debunk the meth about-- Yes, small meals. 6 small meals. And I used to advocate still for an argue for it, not because of the science and it's burning any more body fat.

And what we used to say is 20-year-old trainers that's like stillking the fire. And it's like, that's all bullshit. And I'm very aware of that. Yet, I still advocated for clients doing that.

Because what I found is that when clients were regularly eating every two to three hours, and they never allowed themselves to get really hungry, they just had better self-control.

Even if I'm not practicing intermittent fasting,

if I just miss breakfast, and I don't get my first meal

till like 11 or noon, and I'm kind of behind all day, when my later evening, like 10 o'clock at night, I'm like, ravenous, I'm craving-- Yeah, you're more likely to make beds. And then I'm like, where is if I'm like, I get up,

I make sure I have my first meal early, and then I'm having another meal by 10 or 11. And then another meal I knew. If I'm like doing it every two to three hours, come dinner time, I have a very modest dinner.

I feel satisfied. I can cut it off before bed, and I go-- and I have found that with clients, also. The clients that try and restrict these windows and stuff like that, maybe they have a little temporary success.

But they're also the ones that are more likely to binge and make bad choices later in the evening.

“Yeah, you have to be careful with studies”

is when you look at a-- They're controlling.

And only that, but you look at a study,

and then you see a result, it's important to get into the study and figure out what's causing the results. So like, the benefits that they'll show with fasting are real, but they're not from the fasting. They're coming from the calorie restriction.

So it's not the fasting. It's not that I'm not eating for eight hours. It's that my calorie is really low. And for depending on the individual and how long you do this, because you keep this long enough, not great either.

But for a lot of people, restricting calories for a little bit-- I mean, you get a lot of health benefits, reducing inflammation, higher BDMF in the brain, improved, accelerated cell autophagy, anti-cancer, all those different things.

But it's not the fasting, it's the caloric restriction. So this is what's really important to look at. So fasting, again, in my experience, unless I'm dealing

with those three people that I listed earlier,

like spiritual reasons, bigger rexia, or gut health issues, the success rate with fasting for clients, for fat loss, or anything else, is literally as bad as any other diet. It's got the same fail rate. In fact, I would say, it's a faster track towards disorder eating

than some of the other diets, except for the extreme ones. You're going to create some disorder eating-- By the way, the people even with gut issues. I think even like the elimination diet where you start just extracting one item at a time,

so you can really evaluate what your body doesn't agree with the most, but still the consistency of having routine,

“and I think the body just, it performs so much better.”

We need to just give it that kind of hard-line routine as opposed to this intermittent throwing things at it. - And what makes me really annoyed with this is that oftentimes these articles are presented by scientists, and so they have all this authority.

But none of them have coached and trained people for years. And if they were just took a little extra time and compared it to just regular calorie restriction, they would see there's no real benefit to fasting aside from the fact that it restricts calories.

And again, just for somebody listening, because there's people out there who are like, no, I need hard lines, like you don't understand. I need structured eating for me. That's the best way to get going,

because I don't think it's a great way to live forever. Maybe for you, it's a great way to get going. I'm figuring this out. You're far better off restricting the evening from a health perspective than you are in the morning.

It's actually the worst time to research this. - This is why I advocate for this six-month meal. There's also a psychological part of that.

“I think that there's always that angle too.”

- That's the biggest angle. - You prepped these meals. You have a good choice ready for you. It's easier to make that choice than you're not prepared. You don't have a meal, you're on the go.

You've also fasted now for 12 hours. It's like, man, you want to talk about really having a white knuckle some situations like that. And then heaven forbid, you have one day that week you also had bad nights leap though.

So now you got a bad night sleep thrown in there also. So like, it's inevitable, it's going to break. Totally. And then when it does, it's just-- - And I'll say this, look, if diet was exesnosed,

what's good and what's bad, if it was that easy, there would be nobody would have any issues with their diet. It would be simple. But the thing is diet is so much less of the do this to that. Here's the right diet, and so much more of the behaviors

and psychology around it. I mean, that's just the fact, the guy's like, if it was as easy as like, let me just get the right way to eat. Would anybody have a problem? - No, but all my family, that love chat, GVT,

would all be in great shape. - No, I mean, that was the case, 'cause you could put in all your metrics. - Yeah. - You'll be on the answer as well.

- Yeah, one more warning, one more warning I'll say. This is more common in women than men, far more common, just 'cause our bodies are more sensitive. Fasting repeatedly, even if you're eating enough calories on stuff, does seem to have a stress response on people.

And I've had female clients who just did this, and then over time hormone issues, hair falling out,

because it can cause prolonged periods

“without eating repeated over and over again,”

does cause a bit of a stress response. So you see this in blood markers. You'll see catacomines rise, cortisol rise, and you just do that over time, especially if you combine it with exercise

and a busy lifestyle. Probably not a good idea for most people. Speaking of which, speaking of studies that people don't just misconstrue, another study came out on GLP medicines,

and it's flying everywhere, and people are just so, it's a little bit frustrating. Study came out that showed that there was a significant correlation between GLP usage and bone weakening. Okay, so now people are like,

"Oh my God, GLP's they're bad for your bones." It's massive calories, right? No, man, people on GLP are just not eating enough. Yes, that's very predictable. Everybody, yeah.

If you don't eat enough, you're gonna lose muscle, eventually bone mass, tendon and ligament strength will go down, hair will go down, you'll notice saggy skin. On your face, all this, it was epic face, all this stuff they talk about.

It's just 'cause people are doing it wrong. They're hammering their appetite with GLP's and eating a thousand calories a day. And that's what's gonna happen. Yeah, when you do that for a long time.

I'm watching, I won't name the family member that I have going to this right now, but I'm watching kind of the dark side or the bad side of these GLP ones. I've seen a lot of good examples of like we've obviously

had callers and we took a group through, and so we've seen like the radical change that someone has gone through and how awesome it's been

and how powerful it can be for people

but with behaviors and to break those chains and all those things. I don't know where I stand.

“I think I argued pretty strongly on the podcast early on”

that I felt it would be a net positive for sure from it. I go back and forth, especially when I have situations that are really close to me, my own experience then having a family member that I'm watching I just like drop like 60, 70 pounds or whatever.

The thing that I'm most fascinated with that I should know better. I should know that even though I said when I went through it, I took my trainer brain out of it, there's still part of that that I can't eliminate, right?

Like for example, because who I am and how long I've done this for, I have a healthy relationship with food. So for example, one of the things I was so fascinated with the GLP ones, I thought, is like just no desire

for junk food. In fact, I could feel my body craving nutrient-dense foods because I needed it so bad. Like I felt so deprived. It was just like all I wanted was chicken, steak and rice,

or something that felt like it was a value. Like things that were just garbage, one didn't taste the same anywhere we're bland and didn't feed me or feel it. Watching somebody who was had a really bad relationship

with food for a really long time, it's wild to see that they still keep grabbing the fire cheetos. And it's like, and then like on the toilet, like just destroyed and then come back and then try ice cream.

And then like, and then they're gonna spit away. And then not eat for a whole day because they took the shot, right?

They took the shot, the first two days, no appetite.

So almost no food. And finally day three, they can eat a little something. When they finally do one something, oh, let me try some garbage. And then it's like, and then on the,

there's battling all the side effects. And it's like, how is that not signaling to you? Don't do that. Like go eat and yet still going back and doing that over and over and over.

And I forget that I have a better, a healthy relationship with food. So it was really easy for me. Each try one bad thing, notice it doesn't feel good. It doesn't sit well.

It's like all, and then I thought, wow, that's crazy. How you just, you create the nutrition. I know different than a lot of eating disorders. Yes, but if you have people that are just, it's so insidious, they don't even really.

It's like, I'm watching it and coaching to it and still, I'm beginning to think that maybe, 'cause if you look at the medical system, doctors well intentioned, but not trained in coaching, almost no nutrition background.

And they're prescribing GLP's to obese people. Yeah.

“And I think if you look at that and you look at it broadly”

and the negative effects of just eating too little, including muscle loss, hormone issues, like all those different things, we may end up with a net, like, negative or flat. Because they're no like standard in terms of,

like, physicians when they're prescribing. Well, here's why I'll tell you having specific, all you have to have program with this strength.

And this is more of like what it's unfolding to me.

Doctors happy, you know why? Blood sugars down, losing weight, look at all these other metrics.

“Like all these other markers are showing positive”

because that's person's coming from obesity. And so they're not like, they're not measuring bone density and they're worrying about it going down. Yeah, and strength and asking about that. They're like, weight is down, blood sugar levels are down,

cholesterol's down, like fat is down, like, oh, we're, keep it up. That's the equivalent of like a plastic surgeon, you know, like, oh yeah, I can help you get the weight off. I can help you, like,

there's no like long-term health benefit. You know what's gonna happen? Cause they don't think that way. Well, and also just the way the industry, the whole medical industry organized in the incentives,

what's gonna happen is instead of them,

'cause this is the hard way, the hard way,

and doctors can't do this, and have time. The hard way is, okay, we're gonna put you on this, but we're gonna start with the low dose, we're gonna make sure to hit protein, I'm gonna make sure you strength train,

we're gonna coach you and follow, you're not gonna do that, they can't. So what it's gonna look like is the format industry's gonna come out with more drugs, the stack on top of it, to help fight for sure.

Yeah, the other stuff. Yeah, type of mass, muscle building, the side effect. Yeah, like all that stuff is gonna throw more stuff on top. Well, it makes it even tougher because I think what is it is, it's MontGiro and OZEMPIC both are pre-loaded.

Yeah, and so there's no modifying the dough. Yeah, there's no modifying the dough.

“It's just go up, that's like, that's, that's what,”

the doughs that they had in my family that were on was just like, oh, it's just, and we crushed it. And you know why that was?

Yeah, because even they first put it on it,

still was eating the bad food, so that, not seeing fast enough weight loss, so it's like, wrap it up, you know, so wrap it up. And then finally, it's like crushed the appetite, like doesn't wanna eat for a day or two,

then finally eats a little bit. When they do eat, it's something that's not like, it's like, holy protein, and you're getting this feedback of, you go eat the thing, and then you're tore up on the toilet.

But who cares, the way it's going down? Yeah, like, it just, and but nose, nose, it's making them miserable and still gravity, so I know that I said that I did my best to take my trainer,

right now, and experience that, so I could try and relate to a climb as much for you. But what I didn't realize until this recent conversation was, you know, you're gonna allow yourself to be sick on the toilet.

Yeah, I didn't allow myself to be naive to what I was feeling, and I was just went with how I felt. And so in my head, I was like, yeah, how you feel, and you're how you're connected to how you're right, and I just,

I, I misunderstood the level and the power of how important that is. And what we're gonna see is we're gonna see over the years to take a while, you're gonna see an explosion of osteopenia,

osteoporosis, injuries, you're gonna see IQ drop. You're gonna start to see IQ, 'cause not enough nutrients, your brain starts to also suffer, but it's not gonna be good until, unless people really figure out how to do this the right way.

Yeah, it's true, there is some brittle. It's frustrating. Well, by the way, I gotta say this too. This is my favorite part of the whole thing. Only because there's a part of me that is very,

it's annoyed with Hollywood.

“The whole, you know, what was the movement they were doing?”

Like body, body-septive movement, body-septive movement, body-septive movement through Hollywood, gone. All those overweight actors and musicians who were like promoting, you know, a healthy at any size and button, they're all straight into the campaign.

They're all skinny now, yeah. They all went on on GOP's and lost, hella weight. All those same people, just remind people that Hollywood, they don't give a crap about you.

They're just gonna say whatever they think they're supposed to say, type of you. Along these lines, by the way, this is good news, so RFK just took a bunch of, so there's a bunch of peptides,

I have a list of them here, where they were not available through compounding pharmacies, 'cause the FDA came down and said, "You guys can't compound this anymore." So, for people who know, you can get

GLPs through your physician, brand name, far more expensive, or you could go through, like a company like that we work with, if you go to MPHormons.com. You work with a doctor, you're still work with a doctor,

but they work with a compound pharmacy. So it's the equivalent of a generic drug versus brand name. So it's like ibuprofen versus Advil, same medicine, little more expensive to go brand name, same thing. So compound pharmacies were able to make

all these different peptides, FDA said no more, so they had to band them for a while, RFK reversed that. So now you can get, again, original BPC157, thymus and alpha, thymus and beta, you can get GHKCU, you can get up in Maryland,

up at Talon, KPV, MOTC is back, CMax and Selenker back, Kispeptin, DSIP, all back. Now through real compound pharmacies through doctors. So if you go to MPHormons.com, you can get all those peptides again,

which were for a while, they're FDA-regulated pharmacies, compound pharmacies were able to make them good,

That is critical, that is really cool.

I was recently, I've been reading this book and then these studies on anxiety and depression and how a community's so important and how that's probably the real reason why we're seeing challenges, it's not social media,

it's not tech, it's that, it's replacing, these other important things. So I was listening more and I heard something so, it's obvious, but when I heard it really was like, whoa, that's crazy.

We've confused like breadth of friendships to with depth of friendship. So like I know a lot of people, I have a lot of acquaintances, a lot of people know my name, I say, "Hide of them."

And the data shows better than nothing, that's better than being isolated, but it pales in comparison to having really deep friendship. - It's not even on the same, you know,

“and I think, apparently, we all know that.”

- Without naming names, the amount of people that we have met in the space that are Instagram famous or YouTube famous and they're surrounded by, you know, millions of people, the following them and communicating with the loneliness people.

- Are some of the loneliness people we've ever met? So lonely, a lot of them battled depression and take anti-anxiety medication and, you know, it's really struggle with this. Yet you see this outward personality on line

and they're always doing stuff with people

and it's like, it's all the most social life. - Yeah, you think that they must have the most social life. - Look at all the things they do and all the people around them and all it's like, and then, yet, when you actually get to know them in person

and in a conversation outside of the cameras and it's like, they lack depth, they lack connection, they don't have any really close friend and it's like, wow, it's so wild. - Well, one of the reasons why this hit me so hard

is because I wasn't like that but it was definitely me, like, in the past, I'd have friendships and I'd have family but I would only let them in so far. Like, you can't, I wouldn't let people in on my challenges,

on my struggles, on my real, like, vulnerable chance. So the point when I got divorced, you guys know, when I got divorced, was at 11, 12 years ago, my family was shocked.

They had no idea, they were like, what?

What do you mean? - Not knowing that the last, you know, 10 years was really right because you didn't admit it. - I didn't let them in. - Yeah.

- And so that's the depth, the depth is like, do people really know you and do you really know them? And a few of those friendships is like, that's worth the gold. - What has the, 'cause you've openly shared this

with us and told us this before. - What is that practice or training look like for you to work on that? - What does that look like? - Yeah, well, what does that look like?

- Because obviously, becoming aware of it is step one.

“- That's what I was gonna say, that's number one.”

- Yeah, step one is, you know, become aware I'm this guy who does this. Step two is, how do I get out of that? Like, are there moments where you're like, this is something that I wouldn't share with my boys?

I need to do this and it's like, it's uncomfortable. You don't want, like, are you, are you, are you, are you consciously exercising that? - Still the challenge. And I think it's probably a challenge for a lot of guys

'cause you don't want to feel like a burden, you know what I mean? - Like, I don't want to tell, you know, I got it. I'm gonna handle it. I was like, my M-O. - Yeah, you know, finding faith made a huge difference

on that, huge difference on that. And so now it's much easier for me to like communicate challenges and issues and even do it publicly, which actually it's funny publicly it's easier for me than in private, which is also way of kind of,

you know, putting up a wall, type of deal, right? Like I can tell about, I can talk about it here, but then in person I might get talk too much about it, but it's way better now.

“- What do you think that is right there?”

- What do you think that is right there? - Oh, I know what that is. If I feel like I'm helping someone else, then I can do it. - Oh, interesting, yeah.

- 'Cause it's not a burden, you see? - So I can do this. - This is still feeding how you live. - I don't know enough, but then they're not gonna keep digging. - Well, they also, they can't give any feedback.

- That's why I'm eating. - They're not gonna keep like crying. - Yeah, yeah. - It's not just that, it's the feeling like a burden part. Like I can do what clients, if somebody comes to me

with like an eating disorder early on, I found if I shared that I struggled, it's also, I feel like I'm helping that. - It's also self-serving ego versus true vulnerability. - Well, true vulnerability, true vulnerability

would be putting yourself out there with you, you said in the conversation with your friends, doing it to help others is the makes my ego feel better 'cause I'm helping you. - Yeah, I guess you could put it that way,

the other way to think about it is real vulnerability means you get, I'm not helping you in any way shape or form. So now I'm really vulnerable. - Yeah, yeah. - Yeah, yeah.

- I have no value except for the fact that I'm struggling with this. - Yeah, right. - And now you gotta rely on someone else, you know what I mean? - Well, especially that you said with men

'cause you don't wanna admit like all these things that are failing, you know? And that's a really hard thing to come forward with that. Without any other sort of context of how you're fixing it or how you're having it.

'Cause that's always me, it's like,

"Oh, I'm working on this and I'm gonna fix this." - Totally. (laughing) - I think a lot of guys, I'm just like, - I'm just like, man, they're really good, you know,

I'm sucking it. - I think a lot of guys can relate to that.

“By the way, doing this, I think it's important”

you have a wife and you share with her, but this is also a natural thing for a husband that you don't wanna burden your, like, let's say you're the primary bread winner. It's all give a good example.

You work and your wife stays at home. And man, you're struggling at work and you're like, "Oh my God, I might lose my job." I think it's honorable to not wanna burden her with every one of those problems

'cause now she's stressed out too. You wanna try and make her feel secure. - Boy, I also think that's one of the places where real value relationships with other men come in.

- That's right, you need that.

- You and I have a beard, you're like, bro, I think I'm like, "Fired, that's right." - That's right. - And you and I talk it out, we work about it. - 100%.

- Yeah, yeah, yeah. - And you feel rock when you get home. - Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. - 100%. - Yeah.

- I was having that discussion with somebody and they're like, "Oh yeah, that's, yeah." - 'Cause you're right. - Burning your wife with every challenge at work and now she's at home with the kids

and she's like, "Straight, buddy, and that's all." - You want to protect her a little bit, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. - Yeah, well, no, no.

“- The flipwood, I think is true in her role.”

Like her burning you with all the things that she's doing at home while you're out doing the bread-winning and the money is also-- - It's important for men to have friends. - Yes, that's like, that's, again, that's the ratio

what she has with her girlfriend that goes is like, "Oh my God, the kids today, they were this." That's like, "Last thing you want to hear when you're almost about to get fired from your job in the middle of the day."

- Oh my God, my son, you were just saying, "You're son, just did this and broke the windows." - Yeah, it's like, it's not like, I mean, it goes both ways. - Yeah, you're right, yeah, I think about it.

- That's why there's gotta be value, there's value for both sexes having relationships with people. I think the next layer of complexity is like, healthy good ones. So it's like, that's, it's like, first--

- That sucks if you have to talk to me. - Yeah, because then it's like, 'cause then that's the other layer to this is, it's already important to have those, but then you also want, good, good.

And so I was always, this was an area

that I didn't struggle in. I've always had, network's friend. But what I realized after I got older is how I've curated that circle. So I didn't have a problem, I'm very open,

I'm very vulnerable, I'll share, I'll share that stuff. I wasn't sure, probably it has something to do with being raised by a mother and I have that more of that feminine energy. So I'm okay with doing that.

But also having men that weren't gonna pull me up and push me to be better versus more like, oh man, that sucks, so that's bullshit. Or F her, you know, like, that's not, that's not helping. That's not making me better or really go,

so being able to curate that circle, that's why, I mean, I really do believe you're an average of the five people you spend the most time with. And so, you know what's a good example of that?

It'd be like if I was hanging out with a bunch of, like, meat head, body dysmorphia, body builder guys. That's my friends. And then I go to them like guys, I think I'm overdoing it with my work out.

And I think I'm just, I have a better one. No, bro, go after it, bro, we do something. - Well, that's such a good point to bring up Sal because when we're young, especially in our teenage years, and young adult years, you tend to gravitate to others

who have the same insecurities of bullshit. And then you form these bonds that you have. And so this was me, like I formed bonds and loyalty to a lot of other men that struggle with all the same insecurities and issues

and bullshit and so we're all stuck. - You're commiserating. - Yeah. And you don't realize it and then you justify it because like, oh, what's my boy?

We got into like at least five fights together and he's got my back and like, you know what I'm saying? Like he would die for me, you know?

“That's why good little hunting resonates so much with me.”

That's like, it's all loyalty, yeah, it's all loyalty. It's like you built this, this family unit, that it's based and rooted around these insecurities. - You built a good bull walk against that. So I learned this from our church.

We have a group that we go to. They're really good. The church I go to is got really good communities and stuff. And they said, if that thing this is brilliant, you need to have other men in your life,

but you also need to have men that are in the same life, similar life stage. So you've got young kids, you're whatever you want friends that are like that as well. You also want older male friends who are retired,

they raise the kids, they've gone through all that. And then you want men under you that you can mentor. And they said that, that combination is the best for being vulnerable, offering help and stuff.

And then find things that are different

that you admire about each of them. Like I might have my friend who like just has lots of spiritual wisdom and he's older and he has this. I love that. I can learn from them.

- Yeah, I can learn from them. Then I have somebody who's just physically super responsible and done really well for him financially. Then I have my founder, friends, it's like having a diverse group and seeing characteristics

that you admire about those other men. - Totally. - 'Cause you can also have that too. 'Cause there's, I have, I have really good close relationships where maybe that friend,

there's certain aspects of him that it's like, that's not something I want to get from him. But they have other aspects that I admire that I go like, well that, I do admire that. - Let me try to steer the hangouts around the aspect.

- How do you appreciate it? - How do you appreciate it?

“- That's how you really start curating that.”

And I, too, I always gauge it based off of like,

is this filling me up or is this draining me down? - Yeah. - And like that's, after I leave the hangout, it's like, okay, well I have to evaluate that and what was that?

And so then you kind of start to curate a better environment that brings out more of the positive. - I remember as a young dad, 'cause I have older kids. So at one point I was kind of a young dad. And I'd have buddies that were still single.

And they were the worst for any kind of advice or anything around that because they didn't understand. They had all the quote and quote free to them in the world, yeah, whatever. But being friends with other younger dads was great

because they're in the same thing. They have the same priorities. So now you guys are, imagine you're coaching, you're young, you know, teenage sons that are getting into young, being young men

and young adults. And this is starting to click for them. They understand this and they might not be there yet, but they're starting to. And they go, well, how do I do that dad?

Like, how do you coach them to curate that? What does that look like? Because I know that's what, when we talk about things like this, I could DM's all the time about that.

“It's like, okay, I get that this is important.”

But like, and a lot of people think of it as like, it's this breakup. Like, okay, okay, I realize these are my toxic friends that we grew up in high school together and stuff like that and I need to evolve past that.

But they have they really struggle with it. So what do I have to have a breakup conversation and then how do I get that sort of like, or nutrition conversations where you're seeking out, you know, better nutritious foods.

Like, I'm seeking out better friends that can mentor me or have something to offer. Or let's even better and it's like, it just naturally starts to gravitate more of your time. You're not completely disregarding that friend group

but maybe there's some values still there. But then that's where you look at that friend group. Like, well, how can I create and foster an environment where, you know, the best aspects of them, you know, I can enjoy with them, but like I'm not just doing it

as frequently as I would. Right, I love the idea of giving that analogy like how we coach people with nutrition instead of thinking about cutting out more. Yeah, add more to where it's just,

it becomes a small amount of your time and then that time is focused on maybe the connection that you have with. The thing too with teenage boys is oftentimes the older mentor, it can be dad,

but oftentimes it's a coach. Like, really good coaches do a good job of mentoring younger men. It could also be a pastor. And then mentoring younger guys,

which you could tell them specifically, hey, go get a kid that's two, three years younger than you. Once the player sport or whatever. And, you know, coach them once a week. This is an unlock for guys, by the way.

You take a young man who's struggling and you put him in charge of other younger men. And they tend to rise up. I remember learning, I had a client years ago who got sent to one of those like those camps.

He was got caught smoking weed a bunch and his parents sent him off to one of those camps. And he was just, he was struggling, he had no direction, he was a good kid, but just no direction. And one of the things they did with him

is they put him in charge of a group of six younger guys. And he just rose to the occasion. A suddenly became like, great leader and just totally became a better possibility now. Responsibility, responsibility does.

“I think there's also two like, there's a lot of value.”

And like, we're always trying to like measure our time

and value of dollars or something like that. And like so many young men that I talk to are afraid to go add value to somebody's life without getting some sort of financial exchange for something. So it's like, dude, if you see someone that you admire

in business or something like that, they do. That's going to be a work for friends. Yeah, exactly. I know valuable relationship. Like, you find a way to add value to their life

with asking nothing in return. Because the value is getting close to that person. The value is being of value to that person. Because then that person will want you around and be okay with that being around.

Like, and that may means doing hours of stuff on a daily or weekly basis for free for this person. But the wisdom and that you gain will pay itself tenfold in your life and being okay with that. We're always so cut up and like, well, how much am I going to make?

If I go do all that stuff for him for free, is he going to pay me or shy out? It's like, no, like, you know,

That's if you're not getting any value. Yeah. That's insane. Yeah, that's crazy. All right, I'm going to go in in a different direction.

I don't know if you saw this just then did you see this CIA declassified documents that came out? Just listen, this is real. People are posting the funniest memes and it's like a conspiracy theorist

and they're like celebrating or like kings. Because they're just right all the time right now. They're all right more. Every single one is coming true. Declassified CIA files reveal that under President,

Lyndon B. Johnson, the military sprayed chemicals from planes, also known as stratospheric aerosol injections to modify the weather. So, so can't trail. Yeah, that was funny and like, oh, you're an idiot.

Did tin foil hat loser? Oh, man, you know what's funny too? Cause my cousin, my cousin, he likes, he gets all into this because my uncle was like this. And my uncle was really smart.

So he wasn't like wacky conspiracy stuff. He'd like get into it.

“My cousin was taking, he lives up in Rosville, right?”

And you know, California gets super hot up there, sunny. And he was taking pictures. And he's like, check out the sky right now. Super clear. And then you see planes going across.

And you see the, the control or whatever. And then he was taking pictures of it and those contrasts were spreading. Next to you know, the whole sky is, he's easy. And he's like, that's not a control dude.

He's like, that's a control dude. Why are they doing like total crossing patterns? So they like blank it one entire area. Like, come on dude, what's happening dude? Yeah, aren't there other files that are supposed to be coming

out this year too? Like, more JFK stuff or another, another conspiracy. I can't handle it anymore. I mean, yeah, right dude. I'm releasing them.

Let me just show first that this sort of the,

they may as well just dump it all right now because the fact that the all they have seen stuff came out and like, we're just like, nobody's in jail. Nobody's like, it's just like, why not just throw it all out there now at this point?

Like, just, I heard there's like, so there was like something like 4.9 terabytes of whatever that they've released. Yeah, but there's like a hundred terabytes still. Oh, he just, Epstein. Oh, just Epstein.

Why told you guys that, Epstein staff that I heard that if you were to stack the emails on paper, want one email on top of each other, it's taller than two iPhone towers? Oh, well, I mean, just did you see, by the way, did you see that they, they all the emails?

There was a period of time where there's no, yes, at a redacted 9/11 time. Right around September 11, right before During. Did you see, did you, did I send, I'm pretty sure I sent

“Justin to stuff, if I send Justin all the stuff more?”

The, I don't like it, too. The, I don't know, sorry. I also sent it to you, too. The, the interview of the guy that there's like suppressed interviews from the firefighters that were in the building,

yes, said they saw explosions going through. Well, it's funny because like, you know, when they had happened, it was, you know, I was watching the news like, so it was a big time. Like, and I was sitting there and you,

there was actually interviews that were like very

conscious of that they live and they never should.

That's what I'm talking about. These weren't, these are, these guys are like, covered and just walked out and they're talking about many explosions going through. They're talking about explosions and like how it was like

very much like there's no way it would be. Well, actually, well, after the plane, yeah, especially the other buildings that they would just collapse, like, you know, formerly like, didn't they find there's no way? Is it Thermite?

Is that the name of it? Didn't they find the Thermite and the, you know what that is? No, it's a melt steel. It's a compound that burns so hot. Yeah, they use it for demolition to melt, to melt steel.

Yeah, I know. Yeah, I know. And at this point, it's like, if you get all this to release, there's just people out there that they just will resist it. They don't want to hear it and they're still going to push back

and be like, oh, this is perfect. I have, I'm so like, it's just baffling to me. Like, what, what, like, how do you decipher and determine what is true now? That's just it for people like that.

We've been gas lit so much that the common theme that I'm seeing in like my family and friends that don't go down the rabbit hole or like, it's just like, oh, I don't even know what's true. That's right. It's just, they just like, so they hear some crazy thing that's

came out that prove the conspiracy theory true. And they don't, they're just like, oh, it's probably, yeah. That was a psychological tactic in the Soviet Union is they were constantly changed information to the point where people were just like,

“I don't know, to believe that's what we're at right now.”

We're, that's, we're, when I talked to somebody who doesn't follow any of it or isn't into it and you bring something up. He's like, yeah, is that just another one of those things though? That's not like, I just dismiss it. My favorite, yeah, my favorite part of all the September 11 thing

that I always, I'm so fascinated by was one of the most

surveyed places in the world with audio recording security is the Pentagon. This is, remember, this is like the central hub of intelligence, of intelligence and defense of the United States government. It's surrounded by cameras, okay?

They're just surrounded and we don't have a single video of the plane flying in and hitting the sides. We don't have a single one.

“And they confiscated all this security cameras from like the”

7/11 stuff around there. We don't have a single, the only video they show, you can't tell what it is. It just blown blows up. There's no more video. I'm like, you can't tell me there isn't a, like, there's a

recording of how many birds flew by that building that day. I guarantee you they have the whole place to survey like these people out there that want more government. It's just, it's just mind, it's, it's disgusting to think that one of the most horrific things that's ever happened in our

history was done to ourselves. Maybe, or we just don't know. I mean, that's, that's, that's, that's so evil. Yeah, so evil and, and so bad to think that. But again, like I said, the people that are close in my family

that are just like, who knows, who knows? Yeah, it's just, it's, it's, it's, it's like, tune it out. You're like, you tune it out and you're just like, just, I mean,

and I, I don't know if that was always the strategy.

Like, maybe that was the strategy from day one was just like, eventually, there's going to be so much of the whole. It seems like that's the strategy right now. Yeah, it does feel like that, right? It feels like any, any skepticism that's going to go against like,

you know, some push agenda or whatever, it's like, you know, the only thing they have is to make you look crazy. Listen, why are they releasing, first we get Epstein emails and they're just, but Bobo, tons of them. And it's crazy stuff.

Simultaneously, CIA, declassified documents are showing. We were definitely trying mine control with psychedelics and drugs. Oh, we were definitely even before M.K. Ultra. Yeah, but before, what was that, Operation Art of the Choke?

Yeah, so that was even before, like, I even knew about. That's declassified. Yeah. Oh, and oh, yes, we were bioengineering ticks to spray these. Oh, and yes, we are spraying them. So, oh, yes, we're actually a hundred percent sure.

Oh, and yes, aliens are real. And it's like boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom. I think that's the strategy right now is to make us go, I don't know what to hold. Right, right. It's all, it's all so great.

We're talking about bigfoot finally.

Yeah.

“I think we did, what did you say that we were walking?”

There's hell of sighting this. See, not the cake. This is what they do too though. This is where it gets hanged for me. Yeah, this is what they do right here.

Then they throw some bullshit out there like that. Then you're just like, that isn't true. And then you're like, no, right now there's like a huge amount of reported Doug, look at a bigfoot sightings right now that are happening. That's exciting.

Which is exciting. By the way, you know, one of the main theories, you know, it's funny about bigfoot. There's a big theory that bigfoot is an intranetional. Yeah, it could be more than, yeah, they're trying to figure out why disappears. Wait, so good hide and seek.

Can't be super fast. Yeah, can't be super fast. Like, you know, it's in and out. And so, yeah, Doug, what did you get on with? Yeah, so a lot have been reported early this year, most notably in Northeast Ohio,

which I never thought would be the place you see bigfoot.

Yeah, where several residents and as sheriff reported a seven to eight foot tall, foul smelling creature and then there's been additional sightings in California from March. So, yeah, it seems to be a thing, right? Just say where in a California is Northwest, let me see if I can find more details here.

Um, bro, isn't it about what you're at? Do you know, one in Canyon? Where? We have, we have a bigfoot museum, you know, they're like Don't Street. Oh, also San Bernardino County.

So, we have a lot of sightings. But we got Wisconsin, Italy's right home.

“All these iPhones, do you think we would catch some footage?”

No. I mean, yeah. Well, they have some, but you know, it's so skeptic. I know the latter of the last one, I see it was a totally insane costume. Yeah, yeah.

We even have Florida and Texas, you know, reports. You know, it's weird, by the way, bigfoot and aliens have some interesting things in common. What? Like, yes. So, aliens when people have encounters with aliens, they report a foul smell.

Yeah. It's like wet, dark, or wet dog-type smell, which is the same kind of smell that people refer to with bigfoot. I do not know that. Yeah.

Do you know what else has a bad smell? No. I don't know. Oh, what? Demons.

You know what else is interdimensional, I don't? Demons? Yeah. I don't know, bro. I don't know.

Yeah. I don't be curious. Yeah. I don't be curious. Yeah.

I don't be curious. Yeah. What's a, what's a, D-boat is carbon carbon dating, now everything's on the table now. Oh, no. Everything's on the table now.

Oh, my gosh. I can't wait till we have. Yeah. And he's getting flipped up. Sit down.

Yeah, Steven. Steven Murray will be on at some point where I was supposed to be having a schedule to come on and he breaks down all the science. Oh, that's stuff. I'm actually really excited.

And I tell you what, bro, you were right. You couldn't sell it. I've got a base. He's got no science, dude. This is how Adam said it.

How he sold it. So, were you there?

- I don't know if they're that as jealous. - Yeah, I see you with the speaker. - Did you see it? Did you see a dinosaur yourself? - I'm gonna have to go back, I'm gonna have to go back

and listen to it. - I have a silly better dude. - I think this is me as a trainer too. Like I read the science. - I understand it.

Get me to regurgitate it, probably. Just listen.

“That's why I tell my clients just trust me.”

- Just listen to me. - Just listen to me. - Just listen to what I had to say. - Sorry, I'm sorry. - Yeah, just.

- She know that by now. - I know. I read the books. I saw it. I heard the data that I could not regurgitate it for you.

Like that's your skill, dude. - That's you. - Read some of your stuff. - You tell me what to sell, dude. Hey, speaking of selling, so we're this episode

sponsored by Viori and I gotta say something, dude. I was going through my closet. By this point, 80% of my closet's Viori, right? We've been sponsored by them. - Hello, I'm just sponsored by them.

- Good eight years, I think eight years. - Probably more, actually. - Bro, I got stuff. - Probably since 2017. - That's pretty cool.

- I got stuff that's like seven or eight years old. - Yeah. - Probably, I've washed 'em hundreds of times. - Let's look, Brian, this is the last door. - Yeah, it's the last door, like my old stuff.

- They just don't go, they don't get old. - They last a long time. - You know, I don't know if you guys seen, I've been wearing it. If you go back on some of the episodes,

I've been wearing that, the jacket. I don't know what you call that. I was saying it. - It's like the lightweight black one I have. - Oh yeah.

- It's a Viori jacket. - It's button up. - He got win breakers. - Yeah, yeah, it's like a windbreaker material. - Love, they have a bunch of new stuff.

- Love, yes. - Oh, they're raincoat, dude. I don't know if you guys have seen that one, but I wear that one all the time, dude. It's so lightweight and perfect.

And yeah, I always forget about that,

and then it rains on me, oh yeah, I have. - I love that they're branching out in more style stuff. It was very just kind of a leisureware focus. - Oh, no, no.

“- But I feel, I mean, I think I, they got into snow gear”

and stuff like that, they get in a rain jacket. It's like that, this kind of windbreaker vibe. - They keep you on the slander. - The slander. - No, they got a lot of the cast up there.

- I wanna see what it's called. What Adam has, 'cause-- - Yeah, let me see if I can see it. - I bought the last one in the store, what we just did, we did a shoot for them.

- Oh, that's right. - Just recently. - Yeah, and every time they get me, they would tell us, yeah, it's, which guys come up with this.

- Yeah, they give me, they give me every time I'm in there 'cause there's something new that just got right to the party, you pulling it up right now, no? - Yeah, I'm trying to get it to the party. - What's the name of it?

- I don't know which one you're referring to, exactly. - You have so many jackets. - That's, you haven't seen me wear it. - It's got like a collar, it's got a collar to it. But in button, it buttons up, it's lightweight.

The wrist have like a, like a, I can Velcro, tighter, or loose, like-- - Yeah, let me see if I can get this to cast up here. - Yeah, they come, they've got really, but I will say this, this is what,

and thank God they've been with us for as long as they have and stuck with us for this long. I'm terrible remembering all the exact names of all the, all the gear.

- I know what I like, I know what it is for my suit. - I see it. - Paul Tocino. - Yeah, yeah, yeah, when I got a drop and then someone's like, what is it, what are I, I'm like,

same days, like, some days? - Yeah, some of the joggers, I know those. - Yeah, yeah, yeah. - That was my first favorite with the Sunday joggers. I've got, I want this one.

- That's the C-Side Sweat. - Oh, yeah.

- C-Side Sweat line is amazing.

- Yeah, it's true. - You have any suggestions of what it might be called, Doug? - Do you wish I could-- - You don't have a gas on?

- I don't even have a gas because again, I'm trying to get through all these different-- - That's what I'm putting the shirt on. - Is it considered a shirt jacket? - It's a jacket.

- Well, let me make sure the editor is fine to put it in the, - Yeah, yeah, I can't tell you. I mean, I see one that's called the Coronado shirt jacket, which is a button-up jacket. - Okay.

- With a collar? - With a collar. - That might be a Coronado shirt jacket, I don't know. - I mean, I'm looking really quick right now to see if I can find it.

- In the short amount of time, this is a man. - We'll just go with that. - Or another shirt jacket. - Yeah, yeah. - It was like, you thought it was a look like the one out of was wearing?

- It is a button-up jacket. - Let's keep talking about 9/11. - No, no, no, no, no. (laughing)

I'm always like, oh, we gotta be careful, dude.

- Oh, hey, can spruce it through. - They're crushing right now. - You're like 10 and a hour or something like that. - I think they're gonna get you. - I think they're gonna get you. - What do you think, girl?

- While you guys are looking, well, Doug's confused, looking at the stuff. - Yes. - What do you think the next, let's let's bet some bets. - V, it's a V1 coach jacket.

- Okay, V1 coach jacket. - V1 coach jacket. - V1 coach jacket. - All right, what is that there? - What is the next conspiracy theory that will be proven right?

- Wow. - Wow, there's so many. - Yeah, I can't think of it. - What hasn't? Tell me what's on the table still.

“- That's why I'm trying, that's literally where I'm at right now”

'cause I think they've all been proven right. - Yeah, I think the, I think the power, so I got one, so the pyramids, you know, the theory of it being an actual source of power plant? - Oh yeah, I think that one's gonna be the next.

- I got one, it's gonna be. - All the COVID stuff is already been-- - It's done. - Well, that's already, yeah. The only key that was bullshit.

- Just gonna make people super angry.

I'm about to say, just calm down. But they took a bunch of AI, AI, I'll read it to you guys, and what they did, and they put in a bunch of data. They took super grock, chat, GBT, and Google Gemini, and they gave them federal bunch of data and studies,

and they all concluded that vaccines cause autism. That's what the AI's did. I hope that doesn't come out true, you guys. If that does, that's such a, such a hot topic too. - It is, it would be beautiful, but if that comes out,

by the way, who knows if they're right or whatever, but if it comes out, and that's proven, oh my God, that's gonna be really-- - I wonder how-- - How, what data they were scouring,

is it just a correlation though, would they put there? - I have no idea. - Yeah, like this, I don't know how AI, does it. - I would imagine what led to that,

quote-unquote conspiracy theory, if you wanna call it that, is that there was a high enough correlation that people started connecting, saying that.

“So there was all, I mean, I think the human mind”

had already figured out that there seems to be a correlation there. - And so it must have been a release of a lot of data, 'cause they do internal studies all the time with these medications.

- So it analyzed a 82 page study is what they did, and they concluded, this is what the AI devices concluded. - There you go, Douglas. - That's the one? - Yes.

- That's nice. - Mine's like a chart of the color? - Yeah, it's sick, dude. - Wow. - It's really cool.

- I didn't know there was other colors. - I was not blue on that. - I was so good in other colors. - Look at that, dude. - Yeah, I should be a model for them, bro.

- That's the stuff that you're gonna have. - I don't have that look, dude, I don't have a jawline like that? - No, you never see it. - Show me a model's got a fat face.

- Yeah. - A model's don't have fat faces. - You know what, you kind of, that's weird, that's true. You're like ultra handsome fat face though. - Yeah.

- How does that work? - Thank you. - Good job, dude. - You gotta look confused, like, where is he looking? (laughing)

- Yeah, yeah, I don't know, I don't have the jawline, dude, to be a model at all. So, or the luxury is hair. - Justin has that. - No.

- Okay, I'm not a model. (laughing)

- Zbiotics is the world's first and only

pre-alcohol drink that actually works.

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It's panted. And what this bacteria does when you consume it, it's probiotic, is a breakdown, it breaks down acetaldehyde in the gut. What's acetaldehyde? It's one of the negative lip products of alcohol.

So when you drink alcohol, it breaks down this negative lip product in the gut. So it doesn't get into your bloodstream like it normally would. You feel way better. Prope is the thing you need to have before you drink Zbiotics.

And if you go through our link, you'll get yourself a hookup. Go to zbiotics.com, that's zbiot.com, that's zbiotics.com/mindpump2six, use the code "mindpump26", get 15% off. Back to the show. - Our first caller is Lisa from Pennsylvania.

- Hi, Lisa. - I do at Lisa. - Hi, good, how are you? - Good, how can we help you?

- First off, I want to thank you guys.

I really enjoy your podcast and I've learned a lot. - Awesome, all right, thank you. You got for us. - So I'll just jump right into my question. So my question is, how should I train during pregnancy

and before getting pregnant,

“which should be the goal during this time and what can I expect?”

So for a little context, I eventually want to cut and reach a body fat goal of 20 to 22%. I'm currently five one and around 130 pounds with a body fat around 28%. I eat around 2300 to 2,500 calories per day.

I did a reverse diet at 25. I got up to 2,500 to get my period back and have had a consistent period the past three months. So after having my first baby, I had a tough postpartum. I had an unexpected sea section

and lost a lot of weight afterwards. I was around 118 pounds postpartum. I didn't have a period even after I stopped breastfeeding

and finally realized I had hypotherlamic aminaria.

So I cut back on activity and increased my calories. I eventually got it back at one and a half years after giving birth. So I've been at maintenance and while I really want to try to work towards my body fat goal,

I know I shouldn't try to cut right now. My husband and I want to start trying for a second baby in the next couple months. So should my goal during this time be maintenance? Can I expect to make any gains during pregnancy?

- Yeah, good question. I see it weren't scrubbed by the way. Do you work in a medical field? - Yeah. - Awesome, what do you do if you don't let me ask him?

- Yeah, I'm actually a dentist. - Okay, cool, very cool. And I wanted to ask that question because it seems like

and kind of what you experienced before

that you probably veer more towards stress and do rather than rest. Is that accurate? Would you say? - Yeah.

- Okay. So for people listening, hypothermalic aminaria is a result of, typically it's too much stress, not enough eating. And so your body just doesn't want to be fertile.

So what you did during that period is you probably did less work and ate more and the period came back.

“And now you're saying you got a back for the last three months?”

- Yeah, and also I have a history of an eating disorder. So I think even though my body fat percentage and even my weight was probably at a, like, could be a healthy number, I think,

just given what my body's been through in the past too.

Maybe it's a little more protective. - Yep, I would agree. That's a really, really good observation. - Yeah. - Very good observation.

So your body fat percentage is actually exactly where you want to be to get pregnant. So typically mid to high 20s is where you'll see the best fertility. If you're trying to get pregnant right now,

there is no fitness goal. You're just working out. Now if you get stronger, that's a good sign. - Yeah. - Because that means you're eating enough.

So if you have to have a goal, the goal I would have is to get stronger in the gym. A muscle preservation. - Yeah.

“So because getting stronger typically means”

I'm eating enough, my stress is okay. I'm getting good sleep. So if you need a goal, it's to get stronger. And I would start, I would start back up on the slow reverse diet right now.

- Yeah, I keep in calories around 2,500 for sure. 2,500 in a three day week type of training program or like a map 15 type of protocol. Either one of those two programs with eating 2,500 calories should keep you in that good place.

- Yeah, I like maps 15 a lot, especially with the workload that you probably have. And the responsibilities that you hold,

plus your first child is what you're in a half old.

- Yeah, he'll be turning too soon. - Okay, so you're still in your hands full. - Yeah, he's still got your hands full. So it takes a little while for that to slow down. So I would go maps 15, I would continue to reverse diet.

And then when you're pregnant, the idea is for exercise is to maintain good pain free mobility and health. And so maps 15 would remain to be the best program and walking.

And you want to listen to your body as you probably already know first trimester sometimes really sucks. So if you can only do a little bit and do that, if you can't do anything, then don't do that.

And you're just listening to your body the whole time. Postpartum, once you get cleared, depending on the situation, now you're looking at map starter. And that would be the ideal program postpartum. By the way, what I'm telling you

isn't just the best advice for fertility, it's also the best advice for overall fitness and health. Yeah, they're actually both the same. Because if we go opposite of what I'm saying, not only will you reduce your chances of getting pregnant,

you'll also prolong the amount of time it's going to take to quote unquote get back and shape and all that. So it's actually the same thing. And I'm only saying that to sell you, by the way, when I'm saying it's true, I'm not making it up.

But I'm only saying that to sell you on this because you probably have a tendency to go, yeah, but I want to get to do more. And it's at the same time, yeah. That's right.

Yeah, no. So what you're saying is I can, I should keep increasing my calories right now. Are you at 2500 right now?

“Yeah, and I mean, I think just give or take the type of day.”

It's, it's right around there, but I can eat anywhere from like 2300 to 2500. And it seems like my weight is kind of stable. Yeah, you're probably in a good place right now. What's your activity throughout the day?

How often do you like, we're coming steps. Have you ever tracked how many steps you're at? I'm at like 10,000, about a day. OK, you're moving pretty good there. Yeah, I don't want you to hit in 2500.

That'd be kind of consistently hitting 2500. OK. Yeah. So should I try to bump up my calories and, I guess, intentionally, it's made of bulk.

I wouldn't let you stronger. I would let your body tell you. In other words, I would, the goal would be to hit 25 follow the training program and try and get strong. If you start to build muscle, you'll feel an appetite increase.

And if you're appetite increases, feed it whole foods and go ahead and let your calories come up. But you also might be at a pretty good number. 2500, five one, it's not bad. It's not bad.

It's a good place to be. You're at a healthy body fat percentage. You're probably in a really good place to kind of hover.

But if my appetite increases, because I'm on a good strength training program, I'd let you go up 26, 2800 calories if you feel it. But if you don't feel it, I don't need you to stuff yourself to get over.

But I wouldn't go below. Yeah, I wouldn't go lower. Yeah, I wouldn't go lower. Especially because you just got back your period. Which tells us that you're moving in the right direction.

Yeah, we definitely don't want to try and restricting cut from where you're at. We want to, you want to eat to where you're satisfied. Bye.

“I think you're at a healthy place at 2500 calories.”

If you're appetite increases, it's probably because you're starting to build muscle on the program. And then I would say, go for it, bump your calories a little bit. Okay. Um, during pregnancy, do people still get, like, can they still get stronger in that

time? I mean, you can, but that's not the goal, right? So in other words, if I'm training you through that process, it's, we're, we're following the same program as that you were doing before you got pregnant. And a good goal for us is like, if we were able to maintain that strength through, that

would be an awesome win. But I'm also listening to your body. Like, if you came in and you saw me and you're like, oh, Adam, I'm just, didn't get the greatest asleep. I don't feel great.

I'm going to back off in Tennessee. Yeah. But if you're feeling great, we're going to keep going along the way. We're going. And I've had clients train literally up till the weekday, pop the baby out and maintain

their strength that they did going into pregnancy. But here's always rules.

“Usually you should expect, though, you should expect the first and third trimester to not”

be a strong. Yeah.

Typically first trimester, which may be experienced, not all women do, but it's typically

nausea. I'm not getting enough food because everything sounds gross. And so you're feeling kind of weaker, second trimester, you know, they call it the honeymoon trimester. I'm feeling great.

I'm strong. All good. Third trimester, especially towards the end, I'm out of breath, I don't have the energy. So maintaining strength is a gift during pregnancy, getting stronger is like a blessing. Just remember this, if you've been listening to a show long enough, you've heard

us say this, to maintain the muscle you built, takes very little. So if you do a good job right now before pregnancy, like as you're trying to get pregnant, like building muscle and staying fit and staying healthy, when you get pregnant, the amount of training and volume you need to maintain that muscle is very minimal. It's like one seventh.

So imagine how much you can still scale back during pregnancy and still keep a healthy strong fit body.

“Um, actually to go off of that, is it okay if I ask more questions?”

Yeah. Um, so with this first, with our first baby, like after my surgery, it felt, I had to build from the ground up, like I started, I did pelvic floor therapy, it was body weight, so like in that time, I've come a long way, and I lost all that weight, including a lot of muscle and strength, I guess, is there any, if I'm about to do that over again, like

I'm almost nervous to have to do that all over again. Is there anything, any tips or like things I should keep in mind or what I can do differently? I know looking back, I'm like, I definitely could have ate more, because I mean, that's how I lost my period, but if there's anything else, well, I'm going into going into it or after it, or we're talking about like what you could be doing right now, after, after.

Oh, after you did with pelvic floor stuff is, it's going to be crucial again.

Yeah, and Lisa, I'm going to say this, there's so the information that's out there for postpartum fitness is some of the worst I've ever seen, what they tend to advertise is, you know, you get back in a shape, you know, six months, postpartum, nine months, postpartum. Here's the reality, and you're probably experiencing this, even as someone who exercises, it takes like two years to feel like you're old self, like that doesn't mean you're

progressing the whole time, but like it takes a while before you're like, oh my God, I feel like myself, and then boom, I'm pregnant again, it's typically what happens. So you give yourself a little grace, it's a radical change on the body. Now going into, you know, giving birth at a healthy body weight, feeding yourself well, being strong, the odds that you can have vaginal delivery, especially after having a

sea section goes up, it's better, it's much better, and then there's other stuff that you can look into, like really good duales seem to increase the odds of a vaginal delivery and stuff like that, but go into it, well fed, healthy, don't try to get lean, don't try to overdo it, you're just taking care of yourself, and then postpartum, you know, it sounds like what you did was okay, and it might take a while.

You might happen faster, so this is a second pregnancy, a second birth might be way better,

so my wife had a radically different experience of second time around much better, but the expectation is just what we tend to get from the fitness influence is so crazy wrong, it takes a while. Okay, so it sounds like it's just kind of unavoidable, like it's just hard, like you have to

Yeah, and here's what's in be difficult, I don't know, have you heard me talk about my experience

“with Katrina when she, when she got cleared, you're going to feel like you can do more,”

and I was constantly telling her, you don't need to, like we're staying in a map starter, so she, after like two weeks of map starters, she's like, I want more, but let's get back to map, and they're like, why you haven't done anything for six weeks, you know, plus, like it's, your body very little, it will take to elicit change, and so it's like doing public four exercises, doing map starter is enough of a program and volume to progress your

body over the next three months, and so it was really difficult for her to get that, I'm called, now after a while, she put it together and was like, okay, she listened to me, and but it was, I know what it's like, you feel good, you're sort of feel good, and you'll want to do more. The proper way is probably what you did, which is public floor stuff, then start to

introduce exercise, but when you're coming off a layoff of six, eight weeks of no exercise at all, and also giving birth, you don't need to do very much for your body to start to adapt and change in the right direction, and in fact, doing too much will only set you back, and you take longer to get to where you are. Yeah, there's also two, because these sections are so common, we tend to think of them as like

a minor procedure, that's a big, it's a big surgery, I mean they cut right through, lots of different, you know, core muscle, so if you have another C section, you're going to have to add some time to that, for sure, what you've already experienced, so just keep that in mind as well. As the goal of like a body fat percentage, like 20 to 22% is that realistic one day, like,

yes, yes, yes, so do I need to like, just like redefine and like, no, no, 20 to redefine postpartum, okay, when things start to settle and you start to feel good and your healthy and your babies sleep in, and then you can start chasing it, but the ideal healthy body fat percentage before during and after pregnancy is actually mid to high 20s. It's not low 20s, low 20s is like fitness, I look good in bikini type of deal, but when

it comes out, you need a little bit of that cushion, it's also tends to be, if you're fit and healthy, I should say, that's the context, it tends to give you better hormone profile, so that's, you kind of want to stay there for a little bit and maybe not chase getting leaner until much later.

Also keep this in mind too, which we always try to communicate is 25 to 27% looks different

with more muscle too.

“Sometimes we get this arbitrary number of like, I think that percentage is where I would”

look this way. It's like, I bet if I put 10, 15 pounds of muscle on you right now, same body fat percentage. You would look different, you would look more shapely, you would have, so a lot of times we get hung up on like a body fat percentage and we're far healthier and better off trying to build more muscle on our body and then you can carry yourself at a higher body fat

percentage and still have to look that you're trying to achieve at 22, so don't get hung up on a percentage of a number per say, you're in a better place eating more calories, trying to build muscle and when you come out of the baby, you do that slowly and focus more on that. Focus more on getting a healthy metabolism, building muscle, getting strong and taking your

time and listening to your body and like, you'll get there and if you absolutely want to get to this, like, if you were my client, you're like, I want to see what it looks like, okay, we can get down there and I'll show you, but I could also show you what you loving your body looks like at 25 to 28% body fat too. Okay.

Yeah, that makes sense.

“I think for a long period, I was just, I wanted to look like I worked out because I've lifted”

for several years and I just felt like I didn't look like it, and so I think that was why I came up with that goal or that number, just my mind, I was like, that's when you look lean and fit. Totally. Yeah.

No, totally. I get at least I can ask you a question. Sure. Would your friends and your husband say you look like you lift weights? I don't know, I my husband will, but he's also, yeah, but he's my husband.

Well, he also sees you naked, so he has the best, he has the best man to be honest.

And he's the most important person, when he thinks of how you look as way more important

than other people, but in also look, you said you have a history of challenge around this, you know you can't necessarily trust your subjective, you know, how you view yourself physically. So this is a good time to like ask your husband and ask your friends and they're probably going to be honest with you. And you probably already get comments, I bet you already do get comments, maybe I'll work

or whatever. Like, oh yeah, you look like you work out or you look fit and you might discredit them because like, no, I don't, you're just being nice type of deal, so just consider that as well. We're going to have Doug send maps 15 over to you and then after you have this baby, you

maps 15?

“What do you guys think about what we're talking about?”

No, I don't. Okay.

I don't know, even better, let's go maps 15 muscle mommy, thanks Justin, that's the best

one for you. Thank you guys so much, thanks for taking my call. You got it, absolutely. Thank you. You're in the great.

Thank you. Bye. Yeah, good call Justin. I forgot about that. Yeah, I just thought of that.

I forgot that I fought for that pelvic floor. You remember that? It is. Yeah.

I mean, that's in the original, but then yeah, we definitely put that in them 15.

“I really think it's important for people to understand.”

It's like, it fit and it's so fit, meaning you've got good fitness, okay? So strong, stamina, like good fitness. You compare the typical woman at 20% versus 26%, same fitness. The 26% body fat person, a woman, is more resilient, probably more likely to have a better hormone profile.

Better energy. Better energy, more fertile, more resilient, postpartum, post injury, post illness, post certain, you know. Yeah, so it's just, this is just, this is just for real. Especially when it comes to health, especially when it comes to fertility.

And we get the hung up on like what this like fitness look that we see on social media and think that's what ultimate health looks like. But in many cases, it doesn't, many cases, it's not, we know it's for men. Now men's fertility is not nearly as fragile, but you can look at athletic performance and men typically perform better, athletically, at 15 or 16% than they do at 10%.

You know, I, I'm gonna keep beating the Dr. Gabriel Alliance drum with the, you know, our problem is we're under muscle. Yeah. And I, and I, even like this, I feel so strongly about this right now, because what I personally just experienced to is like it's wild how, how different our body can look with 10 or

15 pounds more muscle. Same body. Same body fat. Yeah.

“And so, and, and I think this is even more true for women because women have been marketed”

to for so long, this kind of skinny, small. Yeah. Yeah. And if, if she, I bet you, if I put, kept her body fat percentage. So we go up fat.

So I put on 10 pounds of muscle and some body fat on her, even more so, more fat on her. But I put 10 pounds of that, more so, more muscle, I bet she would like the way she looks. And, and I think that more people need to understand that, that even these body fat percentage is better than the scale, but even it can be deceiving on this, this number that we get

obsessed with that we think, oh, this is the best my body ever looked at this person. And by the way, like, if you ask, man, what looks the best on women and vice versa, healthy men and women, I should say, they tend to like higher body fat percentage because we are geared to look at things like fertility and health. And so, even women would say, it's noticeable, a guy that's got muscle around 15% looks

better than 9% in real life and men, listen, men for the same thing, a woman with muscle and shape and strength at 26% she looks down good, 20%, most guys would probably go for the 26%. So, and this is just, again, this is not saying that you do it because you're the person likes it more.

But rather, this points to health more than it does anything. Our next caller is Taryn from Pennsylvania. Hi, Taryn. I'm going. How can we help you?

So over the past six years, I have been through a lot medically. I had a radical hystractomy in 2019 for a cervical pre-cancer, found out that I was

a record positive in 2024, and then, in 2025, I had a full-overy removal, first seen me into surgical

menopause at age 39, a double mastectomy and a reconstruction all in a 10 month time period. Dizziness, weight gain, and really to just being disconnected from who I was before. So, my care team was great, but they're all very siloed in their specialties, so I've just been thrown around from doctor to doctor who other than handing me an estrogen patch and telling me to get back to normal, haven't really helped me on a path to this new phase

of my life. So, my question is really for any woman in my position, thrust into surgical menopause in their late 30s, coming out of major surgeries, I'm a busy mom, I own a business, I'm on the road a lot, you know, what should I really prioritize to rebuild my strengths, get my health back and order, get my hormones in track, and then also, how do I know who

to trust in this space when it really just feels super noisy sometimes? Yeah, well first off, I'm sorry you've gone through all that, but I'm really, really grateful

I also have a very good attitude, who probably don't have a lot of people that they can

listen to, and so they're probably like, "Hey, tell me what we can do here."

“You're on hormone therapy now, you've been clear for that, so is that going on?”

Yes, yes, so I am on an estrogen patch, but that's it. Okay, so no progesterone, no other hormones, okay? No, because I don't have a uterus anymore. Got it, okay, so here's a deal, and on top of this, which is lots of stress and trauma on the body, you also said you've got kids, business, so there's a lot of things going on here,

and so what we want to do with exercise is we want to be very gentle. The focus should be on strengthening because muscles vary protective, it also requires

little stimulus to kind of elicit that change, so building strength takes a lot less damage

and stress than if you're trying to like become a marathon runner, so it's just going to be more appropriate. Maps 15 would be the perfect, so we have a series of maps 15 programs, there's maps 15, the original, maps 15 muscle mommy, symmetry, perform like they're all, that protocol for you would be perfect.

On top of that, I would just look at steps to stay active, so if you're not already tracking steps, 8 to 10,000 steps a day, there's a decent amount of activity that'll give you the most benefit or a majority of the benefit you'll get from being active, and that's

“it, that's really it, and so with that protocol, what you should experience is strength”

gains, improvements and mobility, and just general improvements and overall fitness, the mistake you can make, Terran, is if you push over to it, yeah, and you're going to be more sensitive to that than most people, but I will say this, women with children who also have a business are, they're far more sensitive to the stresses of exercise than they realize anyway, most women with kids, job, they're more sensitive to the stress of exercise than they realize

anyway, so my recommendation to them typically sounds very similar to what I'm telling you, just you're going to be even more sensitive to over applying stress, so when you go on to the gym, practice the exercises, when you feel like you're stronger at a little bit, and that approach is going to yield you great results long term. If you, if you'd be open to it, I'd actually love for you to work with one of our coaches

too, I don't know if that's something that's feasible for you or that you could consider or not, but just because you have a unique situation, and as you're going through, I'd love for you to have somebody who you could reach out to that you could trust and just be like, hey, this is what I'm feeling, this is what I notice, and they could make modifications, both in the gym and nutritionally for you as you go to that process, and/or refer you to

someone who'd be, we have just a great network as far as other doctors, professionals, things like that too, so I don't know if that's something that you're open to, but I think you'd be a great person to be able to help through something like this. Yeah, that would be awesome because I can really feel like you're on an island, and there's not a whole lot out here for, you know, I think women who are in this at my age too.

Yeah, yeah, I mean, and just consider this, when it comes to what kind of exercise and nutrition

“advice you should listen to, obviously, of course, of course, you have unique situations,”

so if your doctors say, hey, you know, avoid this or that, then you want to listen to them, but beside that, the approach is going to be balancing the stress from this stimulus and the adaptation. So am I progressing performance-wise? This is a really good measure for you.

Did I get stronger? Do I feel like I'm stronger? Do I feel more stable if the answer is,

yes, you're moving the right direction. Don't add more, because the tendency is going to be like, hey, I'm getting stronger. I feel good. Like, let me just throw more at my body, because there's a line that when you cross over your body and feel like it's shutting down just because the hormone may interrupt sleep, it may kind of impede on other metrics. So yeah, to pay attention, mainly if it's, you feel stronger, you feel like you're energizing from your workouts. It's more

that's for medicine for you. That's that's good. This is why I think the having a coach that you can just kind of bounce this off of as you go through this process, because it's going to be a kind of a week-to-week type of deal on how you're feeling. Some weeks we may feel great in the perfect amount of volume and training other weeks. We may need to need to adjust certain things based off of your lifestyle, sleep, whatever else you've got going on, because it sounds like you're busy.

So yeah, I think you would do great with one of coaches. Like, this is obviously a unique situation, and I think I'd want, I'd want to be talking to you as we go through this process, because this is not like, oh, go, go do these things. See you later. Hope it works out. You know, and I also don't want you to feel that way either. Like, I think sales giving perfect advice on where to go. But it's not, it's not going to be individualized as we go along.

Yeah, I recognize that there will be some, some pivots along the way, too.

Yeah, which is a good reason to have the coach, too. It's just a good coach to be the breaks for you.

Yeah, yeah. So we'll do that. If you have time, I'll have someone call you and reach out to you and tell you exactly what that would look like, and then hopefully we see a part of the family. And again, thank you for coming on and asking this question. Yeah, I know there's people listening right now that just would love to hear advice. And so this was very helpful. I can tell you're going to be successful. You have a great attitude and everything that you've gone through and been through,

you seem very positive and you want to do the right thing. So you're going to be great. It's going to be great help in you. Awesome. Thank you so much, guys. You got it. Thank you. Are you guys familiar with the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the Bricka gym? No, I was going to ask her to explain it depending on the variation, but she probably had the one that's the, the one that will increase your odds most.

“If you have it, your odds of getting a, you know, really aggressive breast cancer in your life is like 70”

something percent. And so when they test you for this gene, they typically recommend removing. Yeah, and and for the, and for the reproductive system, so cancers like ovarian cancer, stuff like that. So the typically be like, yeah, okay, you've got the, this gene, this, and so we're going to recommend double

mastectomy, basically preventative surgeries. And we're going to remove your, wow, so all before you even

actually get, so she already had it, she already had it. Then they test that are, and they're like, oh, it's you got this gene. So the odds that you're going to get it again, especially if you had the first time are really hot. So they go in and they just basically preventative, you know, drastic surgery. One she had a great attitude. It's a remarkable, awesome that she was able to have kids out first, you know, that she's had kids. Yeah, she's had her kids. I mean, my sister had to have her rest,

“her, her, her, has directed me at a very young age, which is, is tough to do that. She did even younger.”

Cassie had it even younger than that. So it's tough. But this is something where it's like we could say here and give like all the, the, the, the, what we think is the best advice. Well, you're right. I mean, she's, you know, through this process, it would be great to have someone there. Yeah, because especially busy lifestyle, all these things that's going through, very likely, even with the, the best prescription we can give right now in this 10 minutes, she's going to have a week where she's like,

hey, I'm hearing how she feels. Yeah, I feel this way or this was going on, or even like, I'm glad she said it. Like, I feel great. Can I do the, I'm going to do this, or should I do the, like, and having a coach like, no, no, no, no, no, no, we'll just, yeah. So, the will help her out. Our next caller is Vanessa from Georgia. How have you, Vanessa? I'm doing Vanessa. Hello. Hey, all how are you? Yeah, what's happening? Good. Well, I have a question about the belly and, like,

how to unblode it and all that kind of stuff. So, I thought y'all would be the first, uh, people I want to ask. All right. Yeah, let's go. What's here? Okay. So, a little backstory. I'll go ahead and just read the email that I sent. I'm a tall woman, 5/11, and I put on muscle pretty easily, even at 47. But I also see chunky, looking especially, uh, chunky looking, especially in my belly.

It's always puffy, no matter if I'm 137 pounds, which is me in Marine Corps, boot camp.

When I was 23, or I shot up to 200 pounds at one point when I was more sedentary. Currently, I'm about 166, 167, and I'm lifting four to five days a week. By 2028, I'd like to compete in my first natural bodybuilding show in the bikini division. And I'm confident about everything else, but the belly just, I'm really concerned about that coming in lean enough. So, um, I eat low to super low carb, and I definitely get my 150 grams of protein, I sleep well.

“So, what would y'all recommend for finally leaning out my mid and low-Eli area?”

I'm curious, first, do you have you, have you body fat test? Because I'm willing to bet that you're at a really good weight, or if you build muscle pretty well, like you say, your 5/11, uh, your belt similar to what my ex was built like, and that's about where she carried her weight, 165 to 175 pretty much is where, so, where's your body fat percentage right now? The only body fat measurement that I've had was one of those, I don't know if I can really trust something,

you hold it with your hands and you stand on the scale, and supposedly, it said I was at 24 percent. Okay, yeah, so I figured you'd be in a good range. I had a feeling you weren't, and specifically this stomach area, it could all be below from something we're eating, too. Is it, is it blown or is it belly fat? So, that's why I've restricted my diet for the last

I'm staying away from any of the fog maps, so, um, you know, tomatoes and stuff like that,

“I do well with rice and potatoes, but even then I'm having trouble eating enough, so that's why”

I have mostly cut out the carbs, so I'm just focused on like really nutrient dense foods like beef, lots of steak, lots of, you know, hamburger, things like that. Well, so Vanessa, to be clear, it's not belly fat, it's bloat, because you know the difference, right? Do you know the difference between the two? So maybe I don't, I mean, I got jiggly. So belly fat, you can grab and squeeze like this, blow, it feels hard, it's kind of digestive, so my stomach's protruding. Yeah. So I would say that there's

a little of both, because I can still pinch. So there's two, so there's two directions here,

because if you, if you notice digestive issues, like a lot of digestive issues, with certain foods,

then the direction you want to go is with a functional medicine practitioner, and I identify what's really happening, is it seabull or seafo, a test that you can get tested for parasites, heal your gut, like that's all digestive stuff. Belly fat, there's two, if it's belly fat, there's two directions I typically look at with someone like you. One, you, you know, you're in the Marines, boot camp, you're competed, you want to compete again. There's, there's pretty high odds that you may

be viewing yourself a bit distorted, and I don't see a picture of you, so I can't determine that, but based off of those right there, the odds that you see yourself in a distorted way, oh, I will pick yourself apart. I'm almost, I'm almost certain of that. I, I'm looking at, she's 47, she's 5/11. I know, if she says she puts on muscle good, I'm pretty, pretty confident, I can envision what you probably look like. You probably look really good. Yeah, you probably look

really good. Maybe not to yourself, but I'm, I'm pretty sure you look pretty good. 5/11, 47, and 167, and probably around 22 to 24% body fat, is a good look. Now, the issue on somebody who says they can build muscle, what are your lifts like? Tell me about like squatting, dead lifting, like, what are your numbers? What can you, what can you use? I don't actually know what PR's are, because I don't ego lift. I did that before, and it didn't work out so well

and it getting hurt. So yeah, to avoid all of that kind of stuff, but let's see,

“just to give an idea, like, I can deadlift like 190. Yeah, that's what you work out with.”

Yeah, you're good. Yeah, so you're strong. Now, here's the other side of this, okay.

Were you always an athlete? Did you always find that you were good at sports?

No, I wrote horses, so that's what I did. Well, that's a sport. So here's a thing too. Some women have what's known as an athletic body type and body fat distribution. And so what this typically looks like is hips are a little born narrow, and there's a little bit more storage in the belly than what you would see traditionally where it looks like a pair. And so sometimes you'll run into this with female athletes, where once they go above 25%, they'll have a little

bit more belly fat than another woman who's at 25%, which actually lends itself well to athletes. So a female athlete that is really well is going to have more narrow hips going to make them faster, a little more belly fat, it's my main store body belly fat in the belly because yeah, so so there's

“that as well. But I would guess I would go in the direction of what Adam said. I think you might be”

kind of picking yourself apart. If you do have actual digestive issues though, you want to get to the root and going into a bikini composition would not be an ideal situation in that. No, in that either. So if you find eating, you know, the fod map foods cause digestive issues and blow and you gotta stay away from too many carbs because it hurts your stomach. That's a gut issue. That's a gut health issue. Have you found any foods that are like, you know, or inflammatory

for you? So far, it's been like tomato sauce and jalapenos. Okay, that's not too out of the ordinary. I mean those are, you know, you have your night change. Yeah. But if you find digestive, like what happens when you eat too many carbs, do you just feel super disdained and painful? It depends if they're really clean like potatoes and just plain old white rice. I don't have any problems. In fact, I blow through those very easily. Okay. It's the preservatives, I think. Brad is what it was.

Okay. Yeah. You're probably fine. Yeah. You're probably fine. There's really no way to spot

at right now? Do you track? Uh, I do. Yeah. I average just 1600. Oh, yeah, two. Oh, two, way too low.

Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. Yeah. We need your first diet. Yeah. You got a lot of muscle on your tall. You're

“lifting weights four to five days a week. You should be up to like 23 24. Okay. Yeah. So if you, if you”

came to me to, to, if you hired me to be your coach for competing, I wouldn't let you do compete a bikini until we were in the high 2000 calorie range, maintaining your weight. So that would be before we, before I would let you get ready for a prep or pick a show, I would reverse diet. You all the way up to a good at least 28 2900 calories. Your height, muscle strength that you have on you, you should be, we need to get our calories up. We got to get our calories because you,

you have nowhere to cut. Mm-hmm. If you're right now, where we're going to get our calories? Yeah. You're, you're, you know, okay. I mean, that, I'm so glad I said that the, I've asked that question,

because there's no way I would want you to get ready for a bikini show from a 1600 calorie

maintenance. That's, that's, that's all bad. There's nowhere to go. Yeah. Yeah. All bad. You'll feel feel horrible. You'll feel horrible, and then you won't even get close to the, the physique that you're trying to attempt to get. You'll, you'll be disappointed on both ends. And so it's like the move right now, reverse diet would be to reverse diet slowly and just, and keep focusing on getting strong. And since that's, what's, what's exciting, because you're already somebody who's strong and you put

muscle on, don't shy away from that. It's easy to let the lose muscle. If you stop lifting weights, don't worry. Don't go away. So don't, don't shy away from building muscle, letting the scale go up, because we're building muscle, but focusing on getting those calories up to put us in a healthier place.

And I, I'm willing to bet, you, you're going to feel better. You'll look better. Definitely from

1600 calories. All, all the things. Yeah. You'll feel way better. I would bump you 200 right out of the gates.

“Yeah. Right out of the gates. Well, yeah. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. Are you, are you, are you, are you, are you, are you listening?”

I don't know how regularly you listen to the show. You listen to my journey with Karen right now, coaching her. Yeah. Yeah. I listen to you guys a lot. But thank you so much. I work night. So you just get me through the night. Okay. Cool. Okay. Cool. Yeah. This is what we're going through right now. I'm, I'm reverse dieting her. And, you know, she's, she's a tiny, tiny little petite thing. And we're, we're up to 2,700 calories. So I, and I want, I still go in. So I want, I want to keep pushing her in that

direction before I let her come back down in calories. So, yeah, I'd want you up much higher. So that's same focus. And you work, you work not, so you, on your feet a lot, what do you do? Yeah. Yeah. I stock shelves right now. Okay. Lots of movement, bending, moving constantly. Your calories are way too low. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Oh, yeah. Yeah. I don't feel depleted though. That kind of where I thought maybe that too. No. Just wait to start feeding yourself more and then

you'll know. Yeah. Then you'll be like, Oh, yeah. I was way, I want you as way better. I want you on a program like maps 15 and I want to reverse diet you. This is a very similar kind of protocol. I got Karen on. So I love to send maps 15 to you. I take sales advice at least 200 calories right out the gates. Right out the gates, 200 more calories a day and then a good goal is to every, every week or every other week, bump 100 and keep going that way. And only in just maps 15, that's all you

need. Okay. Not the more more training harder isn't better. Stay away from the scale of that messes with your head. So like I'm okay. Cool. If you're cool with it, then that's fine. But I expect I expect some of that as we as we do that. I think you're going to put muscle on and I think we're

“going to get a place where we get our calories up and you should be feeling strong and and good”

energy and then I'll give us some room to total manipulate calories. Where should I bring those 200 calories in from carbs? Yeah, rice rice. If you like, I love rice. Yeah, because I'm assuming your protein is good. You're fat. Okay. Are you okay with your fats? What are you at? Yeah. I'm 120 grams of fat. Okay. Yeah. Bump hearts. Yeah, carbs 200 grams. 200 grams of carbs. You know, I love to, especially since you said rice and potatoes, you literally just use that as you're just

keep, you know, a half a cup per cup a day is what you're, you know, whatever that is. And then just the next week, add another half a cup. Yeah. The next week or that, add another half cup and just keep doing that. Yeah. Okay. All right. Yeah. Awesome. All right. Thanks, y'all. Yeah. Keep us posted. Absolutely. Okay. God, I'm glad you asked that. 16er calories is if you're working out four or five days a week in your active, and you're not, she's five 11. She's built like my ex. Yeah. And there's no way,

you know, she's deadlifting on almost 200 pounds. She works out with, that's not PR numbers. She works out with almost 200 pounds deadlifting. She says she puts on muscle good. She's five 11. Well, that's a, do that's what my ex walked around at 165 to 175 year round as a fit personal trainer.

And then when you get, she'd hit stage at 150. Yeah. So she's not far off from like a stage

“way, but she's a build muscle builder metabolism up before she comes back down that, that direction”

for shortly. Totally. Look, if you like the show, come find us on Instagram. It's my input media.

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