2829: Why That Pesky Last 10 Pounds Won't Come Off

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lose weight is that last stubborn 10 pounds, you're losing weight, doing great, and you get about 10 pounds away from your goal, it won't budge, no matter what you do, so what do you do? We have the answer. Check it out.

What do you do? All right, that's time. Why is this so stubborn? Why is it that this? Because this is common.

We often hear about this that last 10, 15 pounds, just won't come off my body. What's out? It's job.

“You got to argue there's an evolutionary reason for this, right?”

I mean, your body is got to be the leaner you get, the harder it gets to get leaner. It's not, you would think, I guess, common thought would be, as I get in my rhythm, and I'm consistent with my training and my diet, it should get easier and easier, but it's actually opposite. It's harder and harder the leaner you get.

I mean, I think the initial weight loss or body fat drop for somebody who say north of 30% body fat is relatively easy, but as you get closer and closer to that, for men, single digit body fat for women, low 20s, it becomes really difficult to every percent to get lower. Yeah, but you know what you also hear this from people who aren't even trying to get

that low. You'll just hear people who are like women who are trying to get like 26% body fat. Guys, who are trying to get to 16 or 17% and then there are 10 pounds away from their goal and then suddenly everything stops. And what's happening oftentimes, because now if you're just doing things wrong and you're

eating more suddenly and stuff like that, that's different. But let's say you're doing everything consistently and then suddenly you get stuck, you've hit a metabolic wall, is what happened.

speaking, when you're losing body fat, you have to be in what's known as a calorie deficit.

“You have to be burning more than you're taking it, okay, you're taking it less than you're”

consuming and your body doesn't like to be in this place. Your body doesn't like to burn more calories than you're taking in, and that's the borough to make up the difference. And it borrows energy from hopefully body fat, just like if you were spending more money than you were making at some point where you look at your bank account and you go, yeah,

we got to figure out how to spend less. And so your metabolism adapts, your body starts to burn less calories and one of the ways it does, this is it, it'll pair muscle down. And in my experience, this is where this happens, is where a person's losing weight and they're eating less, eating less, moving more, moving more.

And then they get in this place where they're like, I got to eat even less, I don't feel

like eating that much at all, I'm really hungry, I'm already working out a lot, I don't

think it's realistic knowing what my schedule is like and my consistency behaviors are like to add more exercise, is that what I got to do, I got to just, I got to cut even more of my calories and exercise even more.

“And a lot of coaches and a lot of trainers would say, yeah, that's what you got to do because”

that's the easy answer, but it's not actually the best answer. And you get stuck in this place where you get that metabolic wall, what you often need to do to get that last 10 pounds off your body is to change gears and try to boost metabolism. We're trying to make your metabolism learn or want to burn more calories. And so often times when I'm working with someone and they're stuck on the last 10 pounds,

we do a reverse diet and start focusing on building muscle so that we can get the 10 pounds off. I mean, it's literally like you're signaling your body, your demand for calories is very high because of that amount of activity you're producing, but the resources are very low. And so your body's like, well, now we need to adjust for this and maintain whatever resources

we can hold on to. Totally. So it's just like we're trying to go against our natural mechanisms there and you just never really hit a wall. So reversing out is pretty much the answer.

I'd say this is pretty obvious when you know the calorie intake for both whether it's be for the female or male. Like so typically if someone's hit this wall and they're a female, they're under 2000 calories, they're you know. And so it's like very obvious.

It's like we usually around 15. Yeah, exactly. But anything under 2000 if they hit this wall, I'm going back the other way for sure. Already at that low, like for me under 2000 for a female, anything really under 2500 for a male would be the same thing, same thing guy who's eating, you know, 2400 something

calories and the he's hit that wall.

“So I think that has a lot to do with it because it's someone came to me and they're like,”

oh, I hit this wall, I can't lose us 10 pounds and she's eating 2600 calories. So all we still have we still have room. That's right. We still have room to cut and still be in a healthy place and a guy comes to me and he's all I've hit in the wall, I can't lose the last 10 pounds and they go, how would your

calories go? 300, 400 calories. Oh, okay. Well, easy. Yeah, we're easy.

We have room. But typically this happens when somebody has already played the cutting, cutting and moving more game and they have now found themselves exercising, you know, four to six times a week plus maybe even cardio or lots of steps in activity and their calories are now in the low 2000s or under 2000 calories and it's like where do we go from here and it's

you're in just why I think so many people put all the way back on because it's just not sustainable. It's not a sustainable place to be for probably 95% of the population unless you are obsessed

with exercise, it's just not a good place to be and so yeah, it's almost always a reverse

diet. Yeah, and this is so common that you even see this in people who use a GLP. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, which are powerful. These are powerful medications that just really grow faster because we saw, we saw people like this.

We worked personally. We worked with a group of 50, 50 plus people and there were people on there who had lost significant weight on a GLP. So they were, they were, they had to lose, I think it was close to the north of 80 pounds initially.

They'd gotten something like 60 pounds off. There was another 30 pounds left. They were at this plateau, there was one person in particular, I can remember, she was at this plateau for like six months and we were asking her, okay, well, let's look at what you're eating.

She was eating 1200 calories or less a day. Some days it was a thousand and she's got 30 more pounds, not to get shredded, but just to get into like a normal healthy place, she had 30 more pounds ago and she was eating.

your metabolic rate has some remarkable ability to adapt and crazy, we got good studies

“on this where there's a few ways your body will do this.”

Some of them are more mysterious than others, but the obvious ones that we can measure, they've done this really well with all, they'll put trackers on people and measure daily activity and as a person ramps up their exercise and cuts their calories, their body will start to make up for it with reduced activity throughout the day. But without them realizing they're sitting more, they're walking slower, they're doing less

movement throughout the day because they're trying to, the body's trying to make up for it. Another obvious one is, our jig, purposely, totally, another obvious one is muscle loss.

So when you look at it, just the calorie deficit with activity minus strength training,

so no strength training, so no protective exercise when it comes to muscle. You look at 30% to 45% of the weight coming from muscle, and is that the body's not that the person's body is burning muscle away because it needs to burn muscle for energy, but rather it's trying to reduce its demands by taking this tissue that's kind of expensive from a caloric standpoint and bringing it down.

And then there's mysterious ways that the body slows its metabolism down. You could have the same lean body mass and have a metabolism that decides to burn more or less calories, and this has to do probably with mitochondrial function, and other mechanisms. Hormone changes can also affect this as well, so the body just starts to stress. It's stress to your health, I mean look at the challenge that Karen and I are having

currently right now, like with just her body not responding the way we would want it to, and it can be very stressful and frustrating for somebody who feels like they're eating really well, training and doing things, and so I don't know, this is the part about

“personal training, I think it's so valuable, and why I think thing tools like AI will never”

replace a good coach who can help somebody through this process because of training enough people to see anomalies like this all the time, which is like this doesn't make sense, you know, and the body sometimes just rebels, and the math just doesn't math, it's like just, hey, based off of the amount of activity we're doing and based off of my macros and what I mean, this is what should be happening yet, it's not because of all these variables.

Yeah, what I used to do back in the day, even before I fully understood reverse dieting, like even because there was a point there where I really understood the concept of reverse dieting, even before that, when I get a client like this, and we're doing the traditional, you know, we're doing some strange training, adding some activity, or tracking calories, and macros, and we're cutting calories, and then they get stuck 10, 15 pound plateau away

from their role, and it would be for a while, and I'll give them a good month or two before

“I decide it was a plateau because you don't get to see this consistent fat loss, typically”

it's like you'll get a little bit, and it'll stop for a few weeks, and it goes down again. Let's say it's the opposite, oh, this is a plateau, before even understood what a reverse dieting was, I just knew this person needed a mental break. So they'd come to me and we'd talk, we're like, okay, we're plateauing here and I'd say,

you know what we're going to do for a little while, we're going to try to stop losing that last 15 pounds, we're just going to focus on getting strong for a little while. We're just going to focus on getting you stronger the gym for a little while, it's a different focus, it feels good, and what tends to happen when we start to get stronger is then

the fat loss starts to happen, here's what everybody wants to do when they're stuck with

that last 10 pounds. They want to increase their activity and cut their calories more harder, here's what most people need to do, build their way out of this plateau, yeah, you don't want to cut your way out of this plateau, you want to build your way out of this plateau, far more successful strategy, I can almost always break through this kind of a plateau through a really structured

level, let's get stronger phase, which typically includes an increase in calories, hitting protein targets, changing the structure, my workouts a little bit, oftentimes I even reduce the volume, and I'm looking at, look, let's just put some, let's see if we can get more weight on the bar, and then that's the plateau buster, whereas a lot of people are like, no, no, I got to run more, I got to eat last, let me cut even more, the reason why I feel

so stubborn is because your old method stop working, and then to make it worse, especially for calories you're already low, here's where it's really frustrating, because I talked about the person who's like, I don't want to cut anymore, I don't want to move anymore. You often times even get the person who's like, fine, I'm going down lower, I was at

of cardio, and they got 10 more pounds of loose, and then this is work that's really crazy,

“and I've seen this more than a handful of times, you'll see them up, so they'll see their”

weight shoot up sometimes. Oh, this is what, this is what's more common, I've seen that too, which is that people are like, I don't understand what's going on, but I've seen this is more common, we'll see like three pounds down on the scale plateau again, then we'll do a body composition test, and we're like, it looks like your body fat percentage went out, how is that possible? I lost three pounds, it was muscle, it lost three pounds of muscle, or our nutrient intake was too

real, and yeah, you're smaller, but you lost muscle, so your body fat percentage actually went out, boy is that really, my favorite story around this atom is washing, when you talk about what

you do with your trainers, I love that story because you have a bunch of trainers, yeah,

that experience this, I mean you've told him before, I'd love to hear that story again, because you're not talking about a bunch of everyday people who don't have an extra, they're our trainers, yeah, no, I mean it was a competition, the Justin was a part of this, and I used to do this on the fairly regular basis annually with my trainers, where we'd have fun, we used to have the hydrostatic way of a relationship with that company and they used to bring the truck,

so we had an outside source, so this was like, what was great about it was that it was very controlled, right, so it wasn't like, it wasn't just the mirror, yeah, it wasn't a mirror, it wasn't a bunch of people that were randomly, like different trainers, they were testing their own calipers, yeah, they were doing their own calipers, it was an outside source that was

scheduled, yeah, third party, and real accurate too, so, you know, and we would we would test,

“and then the goal was to, you know, who could have the greatest body composition change?”

How long was it for? Three months, I think, is what we used to do? Yeah, about three months, is what we would do? 90 days and see could lose the most body fat. Yeah, it was, it was three or four months that we would do it for, and whether it was a prize was a bragging rights, which you guys, we just put money in the pot. Oh, wow, yeah, yeah, everybody put money in the pot, and then of course bragging rights. Yeah, bragging rights. Even though there was money involved,

I think, I think it was just, you know, we're in a jam, you want to be the gov. Yeah, and this was also too, by the way, this is like, this staff and talk about what Justin was my elite staff. There was a period of time where I had trainers, I've shared before, where I had got it down to about 15 trainers, and they were all master level. So these aren't a bunch of like newbie trainers, rookie, these are all multiple sort of occasion. Yeah, multiple shirts, master trainers, everyone's

really good at what they do. And everybody was really fit, too, it was just taking your fitness to another level, and man, the amount, including myself of trainers, where to say, this thing doesn't work. This is accurate. Oh, yeah, that should, doesn't work. And then getting online and like looking for all the air in it, and it's just like, oh, I don't think I let it enough air out when I went under, and I'm talking about extreme methods to get guys doing like burpees in the sauna. Oh, yeah,

all kinds of stuff to lose weight to lose weight rapidly and to cut as hard as they could. Like, so they were doing things like that. And because you have a bunch of trainers who probably are in very healthy metabolic places to keep that in consideration, too, it's just like, these are they're coming from a healthy metabolic place. You're talking about some situations that could have people that aren't healthy, have a hormone issues. These are all very balanced. This is the bias

of fit people. Yeah. So, so if anybody should have an easy time of shredding down, it should be these guys and girls. And, oh, yeah, at least half would come back and be incredibly frustrating. And, you had situations where trainers body fat percentage actually went up because they would lose weight on the scale. Yeah. They're like super encouraged. I'm winning. Yes. I lost 10 pounds. Yes. But, they did it through too much calorie restriction, too much cardio. Yes. Yeah. And, and that's

exactly what happened. And, like I said, like what it resulted in is a bunch of pissed off trainers. It was such an, that I talk about that time in my career. And, I want to, I'm trying to remember what year. I'm at Santa Teresa. So, I'm about eight, nine years into my career at that time. Maybe a little further along. And, so, I'd consider myself a relatively experiences towards the good part of me, the way I said myself good. So, that was a very eye-opening moment for me

that time. And, then, of course, when I got into competing and took that to a whole other level on consistency and also be presenting myself and even lower, really just open my eyes to how easily people can dip into that. How, how the body works. Yeah. Exactly. And, how, how how they can fluctuate. And, I mean, just, you know, I hope, I hope, Corinne, I'll ask her today. I know she listens because she's, she's heard us talking about her. I hope she's

“okay and comfortable with me continuing to share. But, I think she's such a great example because”

she's brilliant. She knows what to do. She's great at coaching clients that are showing this.

where I give her a diet break. And, we have a diet break. And, uh, a cutter like 500 calories a day.

500 calories a day. Her steps were like at 10,000, which is increased from 8,000 steps. So, where she's no cardio. But, just increased activity, reduced calories. And, so, we, and really was a more about the diet break. And, every Sunday, we have a check-in photos, weights, I get every all her stats. And, I thought, uh, and we're up two and a half pounds in the scale. Post period, too, by the way. So, so, last way and things of that, we're in the thick

of period, holding water, all things, so that. So, logically, you know, as trainers, you go, okay, there's no way she's gaining fat in this week. But, her, her body weight on the scale is up two or three pounds in a calorie reduction like that. And, so, you know, the body, we expected to work

“on this perfect 24-hour clock, because that's what we've decided a day is. But, it doesn't work that”

way. Your, your hormones and, our fluctuating, your, you know, sodium intake, and the boy or body

storing water. You know, it's just, there's so many things that can, can manipulate, the time you decided to get on the scale that day and hop on it and measure it and can be really discouraging. And, I think the common mistake is the course correction when you're, you're doing a lot of the right things. And, so, it's, it's super common. Trainers are not immune to it. They, they, they, they battle with it just as much. But, again, the, the big lessons that, that I have learned

through that is to, is to trust the process and to continue to stay the course, because what I have found is in a lot of times like what, what, what I'll expect to happen from, like, with Karen is continuing down the path we're going. And then all of a sudden, it seems like the body catches up. And the analogy I kind of give is the way we talk about how children grow. You know, you know, yeah, in these weird spurts. It's not like, you feed, when you,

you feed your kid, he's predictable. When your kid rests and, and, and they grow over years, we all know that everybody knows this, right? And what we used to think with scientists, used to think by today's, it was just this real incremental, slow, gradual, all the time, type of growth. And what we've learned is that it's not like that at all. In fact, they can look flatlined for a period of time. And then also, boom, you know, this like spurt happens. And a lot of

times in the muscle building game and the fat loss game, uh, that your body responds that way. You do it all the right things. And so, that, and it's just like, no results, no results. This sucks. I'm not seeing the results. Maybe you see a little bit of negative results. And then boom, one week you have, and it's like, you look like you lost a percent or two body fat. And so this,

“this makes this difficult for people. I remember for myself, uh, one of the first times I allowed”

myself, I say it allowed, because my challenge was, uh, you know, I always wanted a gain weight,

uh, but the first time I actually stuck through, uh, a diet where I was trying to get myself down to like below 10%. And remember, I got kind of hard towards 9% body fat, uh, you know, appetite goes up the whole deal. But I got there. And then I, bump my calories on that cool I got here. Let me just eat more and bump my calories. Now at this time, I had been doing regular, uh, caliper testing. Okay. So body fat testing, I had somebody testing me. And I remember I bump my

calories was eating more, of course you feel great, more energy, stronger in the gym. And two weeks later, I just had a curiosity. Let me see where my body fat percentage. I went up on the scale, I remember how many pounds I had four or five pounds. And I was down to, uh, just below 8%. And I remember being like, what? How, how did this, how, how was it that I ate more and I got leaner? I built, I built into it. You know, body fat percentage, this is a percentage of your body

that's body fat. So what that means is, if you're listening right now and I snap my fingers and you gain 10 pounds of just muscle, just muscle. So you're 10 pounds heavier in the scale. Your body fat percentage went down. Even if you don't lose a single pound of body fat. So I think, uh, what a lot of people need to do in this situation here, where they've been losing, losing, losing, they've been doing the, what they think is the right thing,

cutting their calories and doing more activity. Now they're stuck with that plateau that's stubborn, last, whatever, 10 pounds, 15 pounds, build your way out of it. Watch what happens. This is when the magic starts to happen. I will. Working with your body. I will add to, to that, though, as you, to mentally prepare you psychologically, because the most difficult part is,

“there's, there's an, there's an uncomfortable phase of that. And I think that's why it gets so difficult,”

which we, we, we've all, whether you're the person who is obsessed with getting big and so the cutting part or, or vice versa, you're afraid to get big. They'll come up, they'll come a time where you're, you're, you're doing the right things and you, you'll feel uncomfortable or it won't feel

building the direction. And, and, and what I have found, so long as you're eating whole foods,

“hitting your protein intake, right, and, and, and feeding the body that way, um, you will be,”

you won't, you won't put on a bunch of body fat. And I'm going to mess up real quick. Yeah, if you

reverse diet, and you're basically calling a, your reverse diet or reverse diet, but you're really

doing just allowing yourself to eat whatever you want, whenever you want, and you're hungry, like, that's where the healthy food. Yeah, but if you, if you do this, where you're, like, you're saying, is reverse diet out when you're hungry, feed, feed a whole, whole natural meal, type of deal, and leave a protein. I can't, I, I don't think I've ever seen anybody not have success. They will probably go through a little bit of a uncomfortable phase. If you're really low calorie and you have

someone bump 300 to 500 calories, that could be a third of their day. You can get some water, yeah, you're going to gain some water weight, that you're going to hold on to a little bit, which will make you feel like, oh my god, I got fatter, but trust me, uh, 500 calories didn't put

a pound of fat on you. Even if it put two or three pounds on the scale, it didn't put a pound of

fat on you, um, and just keep going that direction, and you will, you eventually, uh, speed that metabolism up, you will build your way out of that, that body fat reduction you want, and then kind of what we talked about the other day, so many times too, and this is a, this is a recent lesson for myself, the last body fat test that, uh, discouraged or upset me, but then, uh, which I thought was so, this is the opposite of a situation I thought. I felt like, I look pretty good, you know,

wife's compliment me, I'm feeling pretty good, I'm back to the walking around naked in the house, brushing my teeth, get a body fat test that came back, went, that's not good, yeah, and that, and it messed with my head, and because I'm like, it wasn't the number that I expected, I'm really

“good at being all the guests at, but the truth is, I just have, I have more muscle under the body fat”

that I have this time, and when I actually think about it, I'm like, you know what, I like that,

I don't mind, I don't mind, and so a lot of people are stuck on this scale number or body fat percentage number, but if they would just put more muscle on their body, a woman at 24% body fat, who gains muscle, and even stays the same body fat, so she gains some body fat with it, so 24, 24, more muscle, you'll look leaner, you have more shape, yeah, you've got more scope, same thing for a man, so yeah, more muscle, it looks better at higher body fat percentage than less muscle does.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, so I, I had it, uh, a question for you guys, is there, a recently, have either one of you guys almost got into a street fight? Oh, just, I wouldn't have street fights, yeah, we're like a field fight, I've been holding on. I've been dying, yeah, I was doing it. I'm not a tight thanks right away, so shocking, you know, like, I think, um, you hear a lot of stories of like, little league games and you know, our parents go crazy, and like, just to interactive and they just don't let the

rough be heated, and really like, it's crazy about, so I left the studio and I was like, was it sure us going to make the game, because it's pretty far to get there from here? This is, uh, ever, it's flag football, yeah, so you have a flag football game, so using the playoffs now, so, oh, there's an extra bit of intensity, you know, and so, um, I left and, and I got there a little bit before the half, so I kind of didn't get a lot of the context of like how the games were going, like,

Courtney wasn't like, keep me update, I get in there, and it's like, just, you can feel the tension, like, already, it's got a good game. Very good game. Like, and so we were actually behind by like two touchdowns, uh, when I got there, and then we started making all this progress, like, right, when I got there, and I'm just like, yeah, like, you know, yo and girl looking back at me like, and, um, it was like, the coaches were close to us, the the spectators are on one side, um, our teams on the other side,

“and so, uh, there was a lot of, like, engagement between there. So you're on the visitor side?”

We're on the visitor side with this. So I think that's kind of where, you know, some of the conflict, when you get into the intensity of like, you know, that's my son out there, and you're not making a good call. Like, there was a lot of, um, talking with their coach was very, very, uh, overstepping with the the referees, and he was like, you know, he's flagged already, and he's doing this, like, like every single thing, how much time they're going to have on the field to figure this out,

and he's like counting down the seconds they had in between plays and like saying, like, they're going over, and it was like just overkill, you know, and, uh, and I'm just kind of like, just trying to acclimate and get there and see what's going on, and, um, you know, court is trying to update me with this, and, um, and then there was, like, a lot of this chatter from one of the moms on our side, and their coach specifically, and it was like, rrrr, rrrr, rrrr. So she's in the stand, and she's

barking at him, and he's down in the field. Yeah. So there's no stands. It was a whole field.

so there was a hot day, so there was like a whole bunch of parents, like in the shade,

“then there was parents that were like right there on the field, right next to the behind there.”

Okay. Team. Okay. Ah, and the other part I was funny, because I was showing up knowing that it's the team that, like, I grew up at this school. Uh, and they, so every time we play them, there's just, like, added bit, like, I kind of know the, their kids, and I kind of know the mentality, like, it's really funny coming back to sports now as an adult, and you see kind of like the culture of different schools and like kind of the vibe. Yeah. Like, so we grew up in our fans were like,

really engaged and like very like, uh, you know, vocal. Yeah. And my dad still kind of has that energy and my voice like common and down like dad, you know, like, let's look the the game play,

let the kids have fun with the rest called the game. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And so nobody was like,

checking the fans and, you know, regulating this. And so it just kept getting more tense and more intense. We start coming back. Um, and, you know, the kids were, we're feeling a lot of this. And then they started to kind of like scuffle and like it was getting a little bit violent, like one of the kids like were grabbing for the, um, for the flag and then it ends up tackling the kid and then they're, uh, the parents get all crazy. So anyway, it turns out like we ended up winning the game.

And so you guys came back at one came back one and it was like, it was, it was, it was epic. Like,

“we got like a safety and then like, so we just won by like, I think it was like two points or maybe”

maybe four. I think they missed like some extra point conversions on the way, but um, super close. And it was like a great game. Like I wish it was just the game, you know, with the kids and that was it, right? And we all like, yeah, a good game, you know, good sportsmanship. But it was like, it just got kind of escalated after the game. The coaches kind of came over and they were like, barking at some of the parents. And one of the, one of the coaches is this is where I kind of got

triggered because, um, so one of the moms like was kind of still yelling because of one of the calls and um, even after she won. So this was like, yeah, we're like right at the end. Yeah, she said something and then one of their coaches like, who let this lady out out of the house and like, come back in the kitchen. You know, I said, yeah, dude, like super drug, drugatory.

“I was just like, I was like, I was like, hey, watch your mouth, you know, I'm like, I yell back at”

their coach because I just was like, dude, that's not cool. Yeah. And so they're all just, he turns around and just kind of like, looks back and, uh, he's just, well, it's so, it'll be quite so we have another, uh, parent who's, he's this big jacked like Asian guy and he's, um, you know, one of his kids, like, plays, I've seen him at basketball games, but he was just like calmly kind of walks over, uh, to to their coaches after the game and he just like, trying to like,

like, hey, man, like what, why, like, why are you guys engaging so much, you know, with, let's just let the kids play and he was trying to be kind of like, check them and be a little bit diplomatic about it, but then the coaches like kind of went off the hinges on him. So, you know, at him getting his face, what? And then, like, the other coaches kind of swarming over to the side of him and then some other people were coming this way. And so I was just like, you know, talking

Courtney, I saw this all kind of for me. You know how, when, when they start swarming and trying to kind of like zone in on one person, I was like, not did. So I just, I walked right up, uh, to them and I kind of tapped on the coaches on the shoulders. I was kind of over here. And he just kind of looked over me. He's like, oh, no, no, no, no, no, no, we're good boss. We're good boss. And then he's like, yo, and no, the grabs the coaches, no, no, we gotta go. We got to adjust and came over.

It was so funny dude, because it was like literally on the brink of and he felt it. Like, you know, it's an air, like I felt like they were going to like attack this guy. That's exactly what I picture. When he, when he texted us, I'm like, oh, I know what happened. They started getting loud at each other. And then Justin walked over and they thought, it's probably not a good idea. If we just probably chill out. Well, I was telling

South, South, South and you're on the bathroom. I said, Justin has it when they these moments have it, Justin has that look on his face that's like, I want to use that shoulder press. I'll look for, I'll look for it. Excuse me. I was buried. I've been buried in this shit.

I have some moves on he is. Yeah. I've never like really kicked somebody hard. I was

wanting to do it. Oh my god. What an uppercut. Oh my god. I was thinking about these pieces. It's like, it's just like a switch though, because like, like, we just respected, you know,

you know what's the funny thing about this is that if all four of us were put in the situation like this, the most likely to fight would be Justin and then Doug, probably. And then you were right.

“Yeah. I think it's so opposite of what people would think. I don't know. I think you should”

get disrespect. Well, I think it's right. Okay. I'm quick. What I'm quick about. So if someone was

going to stand in, if one of you guys, I would definitely be the first person in my life. That's

like, and she didn't have, like, her husband wasn't there or anything. She was in, they were kind of, like, verbally attacking her and like, yeah. I was just like, no, anyways, it was one of those things. You know, it wasn't okay with it. You know, it just reminds me of that video you guys showed me. Was it you that showed me from that actor from Jack Reacher? Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That actor's name. Does anybody know? I don't exactly know. Everybody doesn't buy Jack Reacher. Yeah,

he's got a body cam on. And he's writing his motorcycle with his kids with his kids and his kids have, like, motor bikes. And they look young. Well, they look like they're seven, eight, maybe nine, maybe a little kid's. Allen rich rich son. Okay. And they're writing around a neighborhood and his body cam. You can watch the video online. And one of his neighbors stands in front of him to the point where he has to dump his bike. Yeah. Yeah. He's like, you're writing around this

neighborhood. He's like, yelling at him. Yeah. And he's like, yo, man, where are you like, are you drunk? Like, what's going on? And so they go back and forth a little bit. Gets on his bike again, and he's obviously irritated. So we revs it. Yeah. The neighbor gets right in front of him again. And then that's when he snaps and punches the guy. But I'm like, what a, what a terrible situation to be in because your kids are there. Yeah. And I was like, part of me is like, I don't want to

“get violent in front of my kids. But then part of me is all right. I mean, I think he, I think he handled”

it. I think he handled it, right? Yeah. Like, I mean, I think that, like, just through your mind and the role. I think he did it. I think he did it. I think he eventually pushed a guy down and pulled him up. Yeah. But I mean, he first tried to diffuse it. We're like, what are you doing? You know, I'm saying in the guy, I was still, you know, braiding. It was like, it'll be different. If he hops up his bike and just started whipping the dude's ass, right? That's a different story.

He jumped in front of him, which is not that's like dangerous. Yeah. You know, he had to dump his bike as a result. But that's, that's like, the last thing you want to do as a parent, because listen, you might think it's like, you're going to situation like that, lose your temper. It's a terrifying

for your kids to see the dad. Do you know, I guess, never you shared this story a long time ago about

the kid who threw a basketball at the back. Yeah, dude. He threw a ball at our, I was driving when my, my, this is my older kids were little and we're driving. There's a teenage kids playing basketball. And as we drove by, one of them thought it'd be funny to throw the basketball at the car. And it bounced off the back window. My daughter who at the time was little. She was a little, who's like three or four, maybe. And I'm, I'm already feeling the fumes because they did the ball up.

And I was going to keep driving, but then I looked at my view mirror. My daughter looked terrified and I was at a snap. Yeah. That's when I pulled over. They all ran inside and I tore their basketball hoop off their feet. Like you've never forgot that. Yeah. You know, that whole thing. You know, I regret, you know, losing my temper like that or whatever. Yeah. But, man, did I, did I share with you guys the, the, I told you in the whole thing happened with my car.

The, the M.A. getting like, totaled, right? Like, like, like, I was like, trying, what is the lesson that I'm supposed to get from all this? I'd say one of the things that, like, came up for me. That was really interesting. I showed with Katrina. She's like, oh,

I've never heard you tell that story before and I'm like, well, I hadn't, I said, I hadn't thought

about it. I hadn't came up because I was like, really trying to figure out, like, what, what is this supposed to be about? It's supposed to be like, detachment from material things, like, whatever,

“and not care. And, you know, I, I don't know, you guys weren't around. I think Doug saw a little bit,”

but I was like really just so calm about the whole thing and concerned about the guy who hit it and everything like that inside my heart was broken. But, um, really tried to handle it with like, okay, what's my lesson here? And so when I was 16, the first real materialistic thing that I ever obsessed over or loved was my accurate integral was the first call. It was the first thing I ever got that was worth more than a thousand dollars. Um, and I love that car. Every dollar, every paycheck

went into that thing. And so I don't know if you know this or, but I right after I had it for like, maybe six months, I'm, I'm in the middle lane to turn into a grocery store to go left. And it's just pouring down right. It's that kind of rain where your windshield wipers going as fast as possible. And they still can't clear the rain off. That's enough. It's raining like that. And, uh, a lady drifts over and clips me. And what I, I'm in the rain and, and I'm in that, and slides, I, in my head,

think it's like a little bump. And I get out and I see my car. And it's actually smashed in the exact same spot. It looks exactly the same as the M8. And I go, but I go Apeship. I'm a stupid 16 and a half, 17 year old kid, you know, and someone just broke my toy and I'm screaming and yelling and I'm all I rate out the middle of the road, night rain and down and I'm going, and it was an old lady that was in the car. And she was so scared she wouldn't get out of the car until the cops came. The cops

this teenage boy who's, you know, scared guys. Yes, yeah, and I don't, I can't see who she is at,

“you know, I'm just mad. I'm just mad, but I was cussing and swearing and swinging my arms and just”

like so pissed when I saw it. That's so crazy because that was, I mean, I walked up on that situation with that guy and it was the total opposite. It was like I didn't do that at all. It was more concerned about, I was like, bro, we should probably get out of the car because he's in the middle of the street still and he was totally kind of out of it. But I had forgot about that memory completely about that part of that, at least at that part of that moment. Oh, that's right. I forgot that.

When you saw the old lady, did you say sorry or were you, no, totally not. I was still still. No, totally. I was still in my own, my own moment. Yeah. I was in a young, 17 year old kid. I still was mad at her. You know what I'm saying? Like I didn't, the only reason I only thought about that now was like, that's right. I forgot that she was so scared that she stayed in her. I had someone you scared me in my car. Like terrified the hell out of me when I was 16 years old. I was driving

this one. I had a, I bought my first car that was mine. Was a Toyota pickup truck and I put

rims on it. It was just a four-banger. I didn't even have AC or power steering, but, you know, my own car. But you had rims. I had rims on it. And I thought it was fast, which it wasn't. It was like 164 horsepower, you know, 4-400. But I was driving and there was a truck next to me and I thought

“I'd race them because that's what I did all the time. And I took off at the light, went in front of”

them, put my hazards on because that's what you do when you beat someone, right, to show them. And then I break-checked them a little bit. Like, oh yeah, I beat you. Well it turned out to be the biggest human being I've ever seen in my life. He pulled up next to me and he was so mad and yelling at me and he was huge. He was the big, he was jacked and huge and yelling at somebody. That is. And I was looking at him and I kept saying to him, I'm just a kid. I'm just a kid.

And then I had to stop at a stop light. And I stopped and he got out of his car and he was just as big as I thought he was. And he tried to rip my side view mirror off and I kept telling him, what does a kid? And he got his car and took off. And I remember being like, oh man, that was really scary. And years later, so now in 18, I'm the fitness manager at 25 fitness and Hillsdale, one of my trainers was a competitive bodybuilder, brought in his friend, Mr. San Jose. It was

like a, he didn't recognize me. Yeah, he walks in and I know he's a big white dude. Yes, massive white as it goes in. Yeah, I know exactly. Huge white dude. Yeah, this is back in '97 or '98. I said, come Troy. Yeah. So you go look him up if you want. He looks like a guy from Troy. But he walked in and he didn't recognize me, of course, but I looked him up. Oh shit. Oh, no, I had something like that. I was like, and college, you know, I was like pulling out of campus and

there was this guy, like, you know, I could see him in my rear view mirror, like just tailgating everybody behind and like swirling and going all crazy. And then he finally got to me. And so I decided like, oh, I'm screwed. This guy. I'm going to break check him and I just kept break checking him. And they got, they can see the guy's raging and going crazy. And then we get to the stop light. And I'm here. And he's next to me. And he's like, you know, and I'm rolling down my windows.

Like what are you going to do? And he literally takes his gun out of the Senate. He's got it like this. And I, and I just immediately was like, oh, turn right and just spit out to the right, like right as a dude. Like I still think about that today. Like that's all been a huge deterrent for me to ever get in the road rage stuff. And it's like, why? Why? Like why don't you even get involved? Obviously,

he was like running from the cops or like something like he's not you never know. You don't want

to mess. Yeah. Now it's like so hard to get me like in that space. Now like someone's doing something or whatever, whatever. Whatever. It's not a deal. I've even had the thought like, I've even had this thought where like someone's racing and trying to get around me or whatever. I'm like, what if it's like an emergency? What if the dude's trying to get somewhere or something like that? Yeah, I don't know. You know what I mean? Katrina's a master at that. She always has the ability like in those moments

“to like think of, yeah, but what if this? And it's like, oh, okay, what do people feel terrible?”

You know what I'm saying? Like that's like you never, you don't know. You have no idea what that person is. You know what it was going through or on their way to. Yeah. So when I told this story, I just horrible having to do it. I just remembered now. I told this story maybe a couple years later. So I'm 19 or 20. I told the exact story I just said to a friend of mine who then told me it doesn't meet up story and he's like, you know, it's like, let me tell you a story that helped you. He's like a

dad gets on us on a bus with his two kids and they're just acting up and they're just screaming and climbing the seats and throwing things and everybody's looking at this dad like, why don't you do

something about it? Why don't you finally, one of the kids spits and it hits this woman and she stands

up and screams of the dad, what kind of father are you? Why aren't you, you know, helping your kids and it looks that it goes, I'm sorry, their mother just passed away and they don't know how to handle it. And remember when I heard that it crushed me? Yeah. And I like, you know what? You don't know what people are going through. They could very well be massive jerks. But they could also be going through.

exercise for skin, form of exercise for skin. Like what form of exercise improves the way skin looks the best. I'm going to ask not cardio. Yeah. You guys know the answer to this. Yeah. You know this when you've seen fitness fanatics and the kind of exercise they do, there's a difference

in their skin. There is, here's what they found in the study, strength frame by far. Yeah,

as the best because it increases collagen production, systemically. So when you lift weights, obviously if you're building muscle, you're getting lots of protein synthesis. Part of this is collagen production. Okay. I was saying oxidative stress was probably like, well that's the other part of you, but too much of any exercise. Sure. But it was the only form of exercise to really really boost collagen production in the skin. So it's like the best form of exercise with good

looking skin. How's that? Is that like, like every time you're working out, you get this boost from it or is it like a sustained thing by carrying more lean body mass you get it? Both. You get you get this signal that says boost protein synthesis and then over time your body carries more

collagen matrixes, more just muscle fibers, larger muscle fibers. So it's literally, you know,

you think of strength training as muscle building. It's protein building and which includes collagen, which is a protein. Yeah. Speaking of skin, by the way. So Caldera Lab, right? One of our partners, they, one of the reasons why they're so good at what they do, they have a term called biomimetics, biomimetics and essentially what they're theory or their their methodology is is they want to they are trying to find and work with natural ingredients that act like skin. So do our formula's

mimics that I'm reading off their website, the skin's natural pathways. In other words, is this how the body, the skin naturally moisturizes, naturally boost collagen production, naturally reduces damage from UV rays. And that's their, that's the, the foundation of where they look at their, their compounds and the formulations. So they're not trying to like, because there's different ways to look at this. You can look at it from like, let's figure out what chemicals do this. Yeah.

“Yeah, they're, or you could say, how does the skin work and what helps the skin work with the skin?”

I didn't enhance it, measure something like that. I don't know, dude. Yeah. Well, I mean, obviously there's a way to do it because we've, we've used people have used pharmaceuticals to clear skin and do things like that, right? But they're, no, that's normally like something they're killing the bacteria or killing something. It's kind of taking over the job. Yeah. That's a good point. Like you want to get rid of a bunch of bacteria. We could either

antibiotic the hell out of you, or we could figure out a way to improve the microbiome of whatever we're looking at. Right. And that's, and that's got to be the difference, right? Like most of your, your chemical face products are designed to like kill and like start over on it, right? Like a, like an antibiotic where this is doing something more like a probiotic. That's right. Right. I don't know if that's a way to do it. No, that's a good example. Yeah. And I totally,

Doug got picture you pulled up before or by the way, that was not Mr. San Jose, that was Mike Madaroto, who was a, yeah, I couldn't find your Mr. San Jose. Yeah, I would love to see a picture of this kind of training. I think he was, I think he's a total white dude, flat top. Oh, flat top. Oh, he was called the one I'm thinking. Oh, maybe he was bald. He was six foot. He was tall dude for a bodybuilder. Mm-hmm. Obviously, he was jacked. Yeah, I'm pretty sure. I know.

“I know. I feel like I know. That's why I want to see a picture I remember. Is he still”

personal training? I don't have no idea. I think he's still personal training. Why do like straight up white dude? His face was red when he was yelling at me. I remember that part. I remember that part. Yeah, I feel like we have to know. I mean, what chances that we don't know him will be the higher. Did you guys see what happened with Facebook, Instagram, with Meta? No. Okay, so they just pull it up. Oh, wait. So did they just pull out of their VR? I heard that they downsized because that

was like a huge. Well, that's not a miss for them. I know that they're they're cutting on that, but that's not the article. Okay. So the article shows LA jury came out with a verdict that finds Instagram YouTube and Instagram and YouTube. Sorry. We're designed specifically to add dick to kids. Yeah, no shit. So they had to prove this is court, which that's not good for them at

all. That's not a good ruling because if you are found specifically and here's what my question is,

how do they prove this in the court? We're trying to make kids like it versus make it addicting. Yeah, not only that, but like, because what's the difference? And then does that open the door

“for the all the gaming companies that do the same as I think? If this kind of verdict sticks and”

starts to spread, you're right. And I'm going to say this as a parent. You know, you make if you

Yeah. Because of the way it affects the brain and development. I think it's a problem. I

addictive things for adults. I'm not a fan of you there, but at least for an adult. You can make it on decisions. Yeah. You can, yeah, you can actually discern whether or not you are addicted. Yeah, they're just susceptible to it. But you know, I used to be like this huge, like give people choices, make their own decisions. I'm largely still that way. But more and more I'm realizing that people just humans, we just can't help ourselves. We can't help ourselves.

So some sort of a moral foundation. Well, that for sure. Have you guys watched that documentary? It's about plastics. I saw that I didn't see. I don't want you to help her face. If it has become over the last decade or so, but yeah, it's good. I figured her name,

but she was on Joe Rogan before like hilarious lady. She talks about foul aids and like,

“you know, you should do the study with the teens and all that in the size and like reproductive.”

Yeah, that's right. Yeah, that's the study. The study that what? But she measured the teens. Oh, you brought one of you brought that up a long time ago. They're shorter. Yeah, they just get smaller, smaller area between the, the, the, the front and the back. Yeah, shrinking related just chemicals. Let's show you all these petrochemicals, like you know what? I'm going to measure teens. I have this weird suspicion. I have a hunch. Yeah. Like, how

do you come up with? I have a hunch about your bonch. How do you come up? How many teens do you have to see before the right? It looks like they're pretty smaller. Or you have some sort of correlation that I had to draw to it. I don't know, man, these things are looking smaller than what they're remember. Yeah. But I don't know what websites you got you for that, but yeah, so she, I mean, she was a big part of this movement and you know, trying to kind of check a lot of these petrochemicals

that are just everywhere. And there's literally there's so many regulations that you would hope like, you know, led back in the days and example, right? Like we found out that this,

“everybody's IQ is dropping like a few points. Yeah. And then crime went down. What crime went down?”

Like, so there's all benefits. Once we start removing that, you know, from from gas and from like toys and all this kind of stuff. And it's like, why wouldn't we look at like all these other chemicals that are literally in your everyday life and are not beneficial to you. In fact, are harming, she actually took a bunch of her experiment and this was with couples and fertility, which I thought was it was really interesting to watch. Like, it was like maybe six or seven

different couples and they couldn't, you know, conceive. And so there were literally trying out like to live a life without any of this exposure in everyday contact with what it felt like. It, it, it was, they just had to literally replace everything. Like there's a lot of companies out now that actually are trying really hard, like clothing wise with, you know, drinking bottles, like, everything else like to to start removing all of the plastics and, and a lot of these falades.

But, um, so what was cool, though, was, and it was really like, oh, man, tugged on your heart a bit because they, they, they, they have their story of how many times they've tried how it has been like 10 years for, you know, some of these couples. And then, and then you see them going through a year,

“this process. And it was like, ah, I think maybe five out of the seven couples or whatever,”

like, were able to have a kid. Wow. And it was remarkable. And you're like, wow, this is crazy. And then, of course, you know, there's, you know, there's some stipulations with the other ones why I didn't work for them. But like, five out of seven is not bad for people who are infertile or having those, yeah, it was pretty remarkable. But it just made me think about that, like, how crazy, like, uh, inundated we are clothes, bed sheets, medicine, things we drink from medicine.

Yeah, I was going to say, what are, what do you think are the probably the top five of them? You know, you got it. Here's the deal with petrochemicals. Uh, you can directly, pills, everything. You can directly connect, uh, the use of, uh, petroleum and petroleum based chemicals and the growth of the world's population. They are directly related. Sure. And we're so dependent on them that, uh, this is a way bigger problem than, yeah, we got to get rid of them.

Yeah, so, so my point is though, like, if someone was trying to, to like minimize their exposure,

would, what would be the first five things that you could tell us would be wood, glass, aluminum,

aluminum, you have all cotton. Yeah, but that's unrealistic. So go back to what I'm saying. Like, you're going to look, the things are, I think of you laying your bed for eight hours, right? So that's got to be one of the places. You drink out of a bottle or some of that. So probably avoid in plastic bottles. Cosmetics is a big one. Cosmetics is one. Okay. Yeah, the beauty products.

cosmetics. Yeah, but that's what, that, that's what, that, that's what, that's what, that's what

“that's what they're personally found. That's what they're found in, I would think of what, like,”

like, my son's toys aren't affecting me as much, like, what, what's affecting each individual? Like, unless he's, he's sucking on it, put it on your mouth. I know you think even PVC like the drinking water and all that, you got to replace the like copper and, uh, yeah, it's, it's just, there's so many things that's like, yeah, where do you start? Uh, she kind of outlines like a good outline for that. You absorb it through skin. So it's not like you, you know, you play with it with toy like that.

I know, but okay, but so then something on your skin, like I said, like sheets or something like that, all night long would be something more than something you just touch for five minutes, right? Yeah, cosmetics that stays probably when the worst, yeah, I would imagine. Yeah, because

you're literally putting it on your skin all the way. Yeah. I would think drinking and drinking

at a water bottle, too, would probably be, well, that's a micro plastic, which is a, which is a really big one. Yeah. Did you see that? Well, that doesn't fall in the same category. So nano plastics, I don't care what kind of plastic it is. Nano plastics just get stored in your, your organs. So it could be, it could be fally, free nano plastics, but it doesn't matter. They accumulate, yeah. There was that one, right? One study with people with Alzheimer's, they found like a teaspoon

worth of nano particles in their brain. That's a lot. Yeah, dude. That's a lot for inside the brain.

“Yeah, it is. Like a teaspoon. That's what freaked me out. I started taking, uh, salium husk”

as a result of that. Yeah. Yeah. Is that a supplement to help with that? So they, we think so, things that bind. So salium husk might help, um, you know what else they found? That helps, uh, probiotics. Oh, yeah, I was saving this for a commercial, but I'll talk about it. It is a freebie there. Yeah. No, no, no probiotics, uh, probiotics are shown to, um, because because your gut microbiome can get rid of a lot of, uh, nano, nano plastics. Yeah. And so there's strains of bacteria that do it.

Yeah. But they actually tested it, like specifically. Yeah. And I mean, if you look to, like, a lot of it was, I don't know, dude. It, it, it, the documentary kind of has this bias, right? It's like, kind of anti-capitalist on some level, right? Because it's trying to really pressure the, the companies responsible. But you start looking at it too, like, um, they were misleading the consumer by saying like, all these scenes were recyclable, which there was this big movement there.

And then it boosted sales and it lasted for another decade of, like, really inundating us with more plastic. You know, it's one of my favorite examples. You know, it's one of my favorite examples of, like, uh, we made it, we made a bad stupid decision. Playgrounds, right? The floor on the playground, yeah, rubber, rubber, the rug tires, bro. That's toxic rubber shredded, just given off all the, all the high school, the heat, all the gases, all, all, we used the plan would. It was, it was,

it was timber. All the, all the high school football fields are out of that, too. All the astraterf is the same thing. Yeah. It's all little tiny, eight that kind of, you know, that slide and so, so astraterf, like, that's the, all the high school football fields now that are all the nice and pretty and they're perfect and they don't need water. That, that, that, what they're using is tiny little particles of rubber, rubber feeds. Yeah. Doug, look at how much, uh, like, what kind of

chemical exposure, say, chemical exposure from playground flooring? I'd like to see, uh, with that says, because, um, you can smell it. If it's hot? Oh, yeah. You know, and it's all bouncy, I guess it's safe. Meanwhile, my kids getting, you know, feminized or something. I don't know. I do. I don't even think, you know, that's a bit obscure. Playgrounds, surfaced or does that say, hello, made from recycled tyrochrome poured in place rubber and artificial turf contained toxic chemicals, including

lead. Wow. Are you serious? And I'm going to endocrine disruptors that compose risk to children via inhalation, ingestion, or skin cuts. So, no one's going to eat the flooring, well, I'm sure. Yeah. Well, you think about the kids, but skin contact and breathing. They talked about the kids on playing football. Anyway, you can tackle this. Yeah, it comes flying up.

It's like all these tiny little black dots. I say, I got my eyes and like, yeah, it's always like,

uh, so for sure, it gets ingested. You get in your mouth and get in tackle on a football field.

“What was, what was wrong with tambourk? Why do we switch it out?”

There's just something wrong with tambourk? I think they're funny, bro. Money. Yeah. It can't be recycled type work. You know, they're saying that there's a building of their vouncyness, uh, there's billions of tires and just get thrown away. They found a way to reuse a material. I think Justin's right. What did they be wrong? I bet you, tambourk is cheaper. But no, it's like bouncy safe. I'll bet that all day long. Yeah, tambourk is not cheaper than the recycled over time.

It's artificial, uh, not artificial to work because if it's trash, if it's trash, it's rough. It's the, I don't know. Put down say is the rubberized, uh, playground flooring cheaper than tambourk. Let's see what that says. I think tambourk cheap dude that's like, no, it's not, it's not. You don't think so? No, if you ever use a ever put tambourk in, I mean, I did it for my house. It's not, it's, I mean, it's cheap. It's not like crazy expensive. It's like laying tile, but it's certainly

cheaper than the tambourk. Told you. That's the best solution. I'm googling, bro. I don't. I'm just going to tell you

this. I am now typing in exactly. Exactly. Exactly. Just chill. No, no, scroll down, scroll down. Okay, open that, open that part with a tambourk wood mulch, uh, initial cost low. It's the most

“budget-friendly, often-cross thing about dollar. I don't think that's why they did it.”

I think it's because they thought it was safer. I also want to look up like, you know, the poor did place was definitely. I also'm curious, we're looking from a retail perspective too, just because people are charging six to ten dollars, doesn't it? Uh, that they're not getting it for looking at cost. Yeah. I think you, like, that doesn't mean that they're just because we're getting, that's the retail prices. All right. I hope something retail for sure is no more expensive.

I would bet money. I'll bet you 50 bucks, that the reason why they use the rubber,

port and stuff for the rub is because people requested, quote, unquote, safer. I think you're right. Not because it's, it's cheaper because tambourk is cheapest hell. Now over time, I could see how the rubber stuff might be cheaper because you have to replace it like you do tambourk. Well, it's a feature schools like the highlight, like even mild elementary did that and then they replaced the the playgrounds and then as a replace it, they have the rubber coating everywhere. It looks,

it's the perception of it is definitely like, oh, it's safer this way. Yeah, see, there you go, rubber playground flooring is used over tambourk primarily for superior safety. Lower long-term maintenance and increased durability. It provides better shock absorption to prevent injuries, does not rot or require annual replacement like wood mulch and is accessibility friendly, oh, because you could roll, you could roll in with a wheelchair or something like that probably.

“Yeah, that's, that's what I mean, people. Yeah, so, but I think it's this, it's the whole selling”

it like, oh, look, to me, could fall down and not, you know, plus we used to throw tambourk, you know, what you're doing. I find that really interesting because you would think that stuff that is getting thrown away would be much cheaper. Tires are getting thrown away. Yeah, he's thinking of success. He's thinking of process it and turn it into something else. No, you had to process the tambourk that's it that was a tree before. Yeah, but tambourk is wood that is cheap and easy to process.

It's not like the baby tree machine. Yeah, but there's, there's like just tires that just get thrown away. Yeah, we got to process it, bro. That's why it's so expensive. Yeah, process it and turn it. I'm telling you, it's those whole like, we got to make things safer oh, by the way, saves water. Yeah. I mean, I can, I can see that that's definitely the selling point. I mean, I'm sure that's how they closed everybody on it. I just feel like that it seems like

“tires that would be given away. Not to mention, I wonder if the plastic playgrounds do the same”

thing. Now, I'm thinking about it. What? All the playgrounds are plastic. The slides, yep, and he's plastic. Is that the same thing? Especially getting in the heat like it's of course expressing the leaking slide that your kids slides out and said the old given up. Also, I'm like, you'll metal one that used to burn you at two o'clock in the afternoon. We got burned. We got burned. Hey, listen, we might have got burned, but our taints are lower. Yeah, we have. Yeah,

there's really wide taints. We got big taints. Big taint in the shot out too. Yeah, metal slides. Yeah, metal's heat to eat. I got to talk about my ketone. Yeah, I cure regimen. It's three a day right now. You guys get to get in? I'm no, I'm okay. So I was going to tell you. Are you sold? So yeah, no. What I like is that I can drink my normal caffeine drink so then I can have the one that's non-caffeinated. Yeah, still get that like mental clarity sharp.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Are you using regularly? I do. Well, I wouldn't say regularly. I'm not. I don't think I do anything as regularly as you do. Although my supplement regime has been cited pretty much. Yeah, no, I've ever since had. I've been pretty good with that. I haven't made my

ketone. I can that consistent, but I make it when we we podcast. So yeah, I do it first thing in the

morning. Before our first episode, then I do it at lunch before our second episode. And then I do a third one, the end is like a pre-workout before I jump. So I'm using, I'm a little, I mean, I've tried it before I work out, but I like it for like cognitive. So I'll tell you how I use it. Right? So we've now done two podcasts basically right now. And then we have a full day left of content shooting. I'll go, I'll take one of those busy days. I'm definitely taking it because after about three podcasts

to say four or five hours of content, whether it's podcasting or we're shooting out there, that's where I should get mental fatigue. Yeah. And so I'll, I'll use it now because I've already drink my caffeine early. And I'm fine right now. But I know that we've got hours ahead of us. And so sharp. Yeah, I'm so sharp. Doug, uh, when is, uh, is this, when this episode released for a while, it's a time of two days, two days, two days maps, pushy. Yeah, legs come down.

Right. Push, pull, leg, top five just to call ground pleaser. Man's version, woman's version. Well, yeah, I hope people will prove me right. Yeah. Yeah, it'll be, it'll be fun. And I'm excited

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better sleep, lower inflammation, try out fatty 15. Go to fatty15.com/mindpump, use the good mind pump, and get 15% off back to the show. Our first caller is Kristen from Oklahoma. Hi, Kristen. Hi. Thank you for having me on. Yeah. How can we help you? I'm just going to go ahead and get to my question. I clearly did not proofread before I sent it. But um, okay. I recently stopped working with a personal trainer. I was with her for about three

years. I learned a lot, but it was a lot of pressure and stress. I kind of decided it was time to move on.

Now, I'm trying to navigate moving forward. I mill prepped the four days I work. I still have some disordered eating habits, such as binging mostly with sweet. So I did increase my calories to about 1900. I've considered microdosing a GLP1 to see if I could help combat the binge eating

“mostly sweets as my biggest issue. I'm currently about 140 pounds in 5/7. I work as a nurse. I have”

a four in a five year old. I'm at the point now with my kids getting older that I can work out consistently. I typically allow 30 minutes a day working out. My brother created me an exercise plan that I shoot four for about four days a week. I do about a six minute cardio circuit just for heart health. I hit about 8 to 10 k steps a day. My current macros are 155 grams of protein, 175 grams of carbs, 64 grams of fat. I would like to gain muscle, but not sure if I'm getting

enough time in the gym for that. I was looking into anabolic for my next program and have been in this program. My brother made me for about three months. I'm just looking for overall health this point maintaining and being able to gain strength to be the healthiest I can be. I feel like I would be leaps and bound ahead if it wasn't for the binge eating cycle. You're way under eating.

Yeah. Let's pause way under eating. But let's pause for a second, Chris, and I'm going to sum this

all up. Okay. You're with a trainer, but you stop because of the pressure. Yeah. You meal prep work out, but you feel like you binge too much on sweets or considering a GLP1, you want to get strong and be healthy. Yeah. So that's your main thing. But then also you're not making progress or at least the kind of progress you think you want to see.

“So I need-- Yeah. Let's get specific. What do we want? Do we want health?”

Less pressure? Get leaner? Stronger? Which one do we want? So obviously I'm like any woman. My husband rolls eyes, but I want obviously the toned look, but I've kind of realized going through all this process that if I want to have a more muscular look, I obviously need gain muscle, and I would have to probably gain some weight with that. So I've kind of decided to shift my mindset and be okay with gaining some weight to get some

muscle and then maybe do, I mean nothing like not an aggressive cut because I don't want to-- I want to be able to eat with my family and you know, I'll be super restrictive. Okay. You're already in an aggressive cut just so you know. Yeah. If you're going up to 1900 calories, would be considered an aggressive cut for a 5,740 pound woman who does 8 to 10,000 steps and is training three to four days a week. That's a massive cut. Right now, Karen, who I'm training right now,

okay, is a hundred and six pounds eating 2700 calories, only getting 8,000 steps into it. Okay. You need way more calories. Now we work our way up to that. Yeah. So it's not like I want you to also need 2700 calories tomorrow, but the reason why part of one of the reasons why you're binging is because your body is telling you, we need more fuel. Yeah. We need way and then you feel like you're white knuckling it trying to be good and then what does it want? It wants

it wants the fastest source of carbohydrates and fuel is possible because you're depriving it. Okay. So if we were in a more balanced, well fed diet, it would also help out with the binging. It would, so instead of going to something like a GLP one and crushing your appetite even more than where you're at, we need to do a proper reverse diet, focus on getting strong and building muscle, not weigh yourself because if you're already in that mindset of, I'm okay with a little, like,

don't focus on the weight. Yes. Silly or angry, focus on the strength and the gym and feeling good.

you to be all, eventually get up to 2,700 plus calories to be able to come back down to say 2,200 calories and that's an aggressive cut and you lean out and you're more fed than you are now. Yeah. I obviously don't have any problem eating a lot of food or a lot of protein. My biggest fear was if I were to increase my calories if I would still have those habits and then I would just be eating, I don't know how many calories you know at that point. No, no. But let's let's pause here

for a second. Adam just gave you all the right answers. But I have a feeling you knew that.

I know that's where it's going. I'm just scared to do it. Right. So we got to speak to that.

“So because I don't think you need answers. I think you know the answers.”

I did just, yeah, I mean, I just wanted to reassure and say yes to increase the calories. I'm just scared that I'll be like, oh, there's the chocolate cake and I'll eat half of it. You know what I mean? And then I'm eating like 3,500 calories. Yeah, let's talk about that because you're like, I want to get stronger and build muscle. But I want to microGLP one. Do you? I know. It's like an oxymoron. Well, not just that, but you see the conflict that's happening there. You speak to that for a second.

Okay. You want to build muscle because you know that's the right answer. Yes. Okay. But but you're scared. Yeah. Because you feel like you're going to go off the rails. Yes. Okay. Okay. So I'm going to, I'm going to help you here. Okay. Because you're probably not going to go off the rails. Yeah. You might a little bit at first because you might be and correct me if I'm wrong, Kristen, but you might be the kind of person that keeps yourself in check with lots of pressure

and shame. Probably, yeah, because I feel guilty about it. And then I'm like, oh, I'm not going to eat as much more than I just eat the same amount of food. And so that's been your M.O. for a little while. And so what happens is you're like, if I let go of that, what's going to happen? Yeah. So I'll tell you what's going to happen. You might go off a little bit. You might test it a little bit. But then you're going to find that it's actually quite freeing. And part of the reason why you binge,

there's the physiological reason, which is what Adam said. And we'll get there. But the other part of the reason why you binge is because if you live in that place where you're putting a lot of print, like you got kids, right? You're turn eyes. Okay. So and your kids, your kids are young. I'm assuming. Yeah. They're four and five. Okay. But you've been around teenagers. Yeah. Okay. And you're pretty young. Remember when you're a teenager? Yeah. What happens when mom and dad put so much

pressure on you? What do you do at some point? Or what do you want to do at some point? You want to what? You want to rebel? Yes. Yeah. So what you're doing is you're rebelling against your own pressure.

“That's what the business part of the reason why you're binging is that it's a release of pressure.”

It's like, oh, God, I live under this tyranny all the time. We just let go for a second. And then you do. And then up right back on the pressure. Now that's truly how I feel. I'm like, oh, this is great. I'm just eating all this. And I was like, I know I'm going to regret this later. That's right. That's right. Yeah. That's right. And the guilt sets in. That's right. So part of it is your your physiologically hungry. Yeah. And then the other part of it is you got to get out of that that like you got to be okay with

yeah, you got to stop beating yourself up. Yeah. Like you got to stop that. This relationship if you

keep it going, you're always going to be this way. Let me also tell you like a more back to like what's

happening to like so let's say, let's say like to to more to South Point like let's say I was coaching you. First thing I do is I move you up to 22, 22, 2300 calories. And we're straight training three days a week. You're doing great. You're feeling good. You're feeling strong. And then all said, you have a day where you hit, you do everything you eat everything normal. And then also you also eat a big bowl of ice cream too. Guess what's going to happen. Pretty much nothing. You're not going

to put a pound of fat on the next day. You'll probably be holding some water. So psychologically, you'll look in the mirror and go, oh my God. I can't know you didn't. You added 500 calories. 500 calories is not a pound of fat. It's not even a half a pound. It's even a quarter of a pound of fat. Well, you'll probably do is end up feeling our strength training workout the next day and you're going to feel strong and have a lot of energy. And we get right back on the horse and we keep going.

And we try to, versus, oh, I can't we did that. And then the next day trying to restrict more or

“what I'm with that or punish yourself. Like so that and some of this, this is where I think I”

feel like a lot of our clients that we work with. This is the hardest part. It's like you get, you know logically what you're supposed to do. Yeah. Having somebody who's there who's kind of reminding you like just coaching. It's okay. Talk to you. Yeah. Yeah. Giving you the tools to handle it. Yeah. If I were to bump your calories, the place I would bump at as fat, 64 is probably too low. Okay. Your protein's great. Carbs are great. I bet you if you went up to you added 20 grams of

fat, maybe a little carbs, get your calories up 200 calories, I bet you would feel physiologically.

Better. Okay. And if you have a binge, here's what you do. Okay. If you have the binge,

or that moment, or whatever, after you're done, this is what you say to yourself, of course you did that. You're under a lot of pressure. Yeah. Of course you did. It's okay. It's all right. We'll try again.

doing afterwards, what you're typically probably doing is like, you idiot, that's it tomorrow.

“We're going to really clamp down. Yeah. That's what's causing more of them because they're now.”

So, so you got to, and I want you to say what I'm saying because it's not natural. You're going to feel like it's silly and awkward. Yeah. But you literally say, out loud by yourself, you can even write it down. It's another way you can do it. But like, of course you did this. Yeah. You're a lot of pressure. You got kids. You got a job. And I just beat you up all the time. And so, of course, you wanted to escape a little bit. I totally get it. We're just going to try again.

You got to say that to yourself. Pump the calories. Do what I said. I think maps at a bulk will be a great program for you. Yeah. Okay. And, and I think you're going to get great results. Follow it to wait. It's laid out. Okay. More is not better. If you do anything else, walk. That's it. Yeah. You want to, you want to do more stuff. You want to be active. I'm all pro walking. That's good. That's it. Let's follow the program the way it's laid out.

And then, okay. And then, here's the other thing. It's, I'll just ask you a couple questions before I give you this. Yeah. How's your husband with all this? Does he, does he tell you look good? Is he encouraged? Oh, yeah. And I, I, I feel like I look great. Like, I have no concerns about how I look. It's, I feel like a lot of it is mental. Like, I read the dopamine nation. I was like, I have to figure this out. Like, why am I doing this? Yeah. But he's super supportive. He's like, stop. Just enjoy it. I'm like, I'm just going to feel guilty that I said.

Like, so, so, okay, okay, you got your husband, you love him, you trust him, father, your children. I want you to lean on him a little bit. And then, this, which you tell him, hey, honey, I need your encouragement. And if you feel like I need to rain things in, I want you to gently talk to me about it because I'm not going to trust myself because I, I don't, I don't, I don't think I'm trustworthy with this for myself. Yeah. And lean on him a little bit. But, but I go up and fat, maps in the ball. Like, you're going to be totally fine. But, okay, and you think like 200 calories a week, just decrease. Yep. Yeah.

And see how I do. Oh, you, you could go higher in that, but we'll start there. Yeah. Okay. Okay.

Yeah. First of all, do you, do you know that we have coaches that do this too? Do you know that? Are you where that?

Yeah. I just, I had a good coach, but she doesn't have children. And I feel like I was kind of like running in the ground. And if it's going to take time away from my kids, then I'm not doing it to be honest. So, yeah. You don't need another Christian training. You, you need something different. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Well, if you're open, we have coaches. And I have some, I think, work well with what you, what you probably need. Okay. Okay. If you want, I can have somebody we chat and call you.

Yeah. I mean, I would love to talk to somebody who works for it. I could get so. It's only a single call a month virtually. That's it. It's, and they, yeah, that's super low key. I was doing like weekly check it. Yeah. No, no, no, no. It's, you'll get, you'll get plans sent to you. And they're really, their goal is to guide you. And then that, once a week, when you guys get on the phone, check up on how the month went, just meant it. And so it's, yeah, no, we're, we really try and

empower our clients to do this stuff. And we don't need to be talking to you every single week. You'll get stuff that you can open up and read and valuable to you. But there's not just like

“accountability. You need to do this every day to have a deal with yourself, measure yourself. Yeah.”

Yeah. Okay. So we'll have someone call you and they can tell you this. But that would sound laid out for you. And we'll send you maps and a ball. That's the plan. If you find yourself wanting more guidance, then, and then get with one of the coaches, they'll take good care of you. Okay. Well, thank you guys so much. It was nice to meet you. I enjoy your podcast. All right, too. Thank you. Okay. Record. Common. Very, very, very common. Yeah. It's a situation. Yeah. And, uh, you know,

it's a tyranny. Oh, yeah, everybody does it. Everybody does it. And when you do it for so long, you're like, if I don't do this, what's going to happen? Oh my god. I'm going to go in the other

direction. Yeah. Uh, when, when the reality is the reason why you have these little breaks of

whatever you want to call a discipline, or is because you're trying to escape, you're clamping down so. Yeah, dude. It's like, I need to get away from this. You know, that's like a relief. I mean, 5, 7, 140 pounds is a good way. No, she's fidgeted. Yes, she is. She, if she, if she, she just wants to lean, tone, you know, what, like, she, you've built, uh, she's built muscle. She even built, and she just went up to 1900. So it's telling me she was probably at 6 to 0. Yeah. And, and that much activity, uh, yeah.

And then, and then you're already doing the whole, you know, restricting on yourself and tyrannizing yourself. And, but what you're, what you're feeling is that your body needs it. And the other part that we just speak to is this GLP1 situation where, uh, there are definitely situations where it's valuable. And then there's situations where I don't think it's appropriate. And this is one of them. It's not appropriate. And it may give short term success, but it is not going to solve the

root issue. No, I mean, should you take a GLP1 and drop down to 130 pounds and eat 1100 calories,

“a day, that's what we do. Yeah. Someone who's only eating 1900 takes a GLP1, the Michelle”

will be lucky to eat 1100 calories. Yeah. And she'll drop 5 to 10 pounds, but she'll lose almost all muscle. She'll tell me good. Yeah. Our next color is Adam from California. What's up, ma'am? How are you doing?

brother, go ahead. Let me get you. I know you guys hear it all the time, but uh, somebody who has

been in business a long time now, like, I truly do believe like what you guys do is the highest form of entrepreneurship and really helping people solve like what are maybe the most serious problems, right? And so just could as to you, man, you deserve all your success and, you know, I prayed for nothing but success for you guys in the future as well. And then PSA to anybody that's listening, like, you know, these guys know what they're talking about. I, I was skeptical. I went to,

I finally got to a point where I was like, you know, I'm just going to prioritize protein. I'm just going to hit my 200 grams of protein every day. I'm going to see what that does,

“and like literally every aspect of my life is better. Like dropping fat, feeling,”

I feel amazing. Uh, I usually, you know, I go to bed. I'm sore. I've been to usually just after a

long walk through my hilly neighborhood with the dogs and my legs are killing me. I wake up every morning like I've been on vacation for a week. Like, I feel amazing. That's great. And so just to appreciate you guys. My questions, not so much about me. I feel like I'm doing great. And it's about my son. Ethan, he is going to be 14 here in July. You know, he's, he's, I was an athlete. He's an athlete. My daughter's an athlete. He focuses on baseball. He's a very skilled player. He's,

he's a late, I was a late bloomer, developmentally. We think he's just started puberty like right now. So this is actually the first year. He's on a pretty good travel program right now. It's the

“first year baseball's been hard for him. Like, we're facing kids that six, 12 inches taller than him.”

Geez, on Sunday, we faced a 280 pound kid that was doing all the power. And his plan was because

he's a young eighth grader right now. His plan was to do a holdback here. And he's such a social guy that as we got closer to having to make that decision. He was, he was like, you know, I'm going to go to high school next year. I don't want to, I don't want to be away from my friends. And so we kind of turned our focus to, all right, man, you got to get more athletic. You got to get stronger and you got to get after it, right? And he was down to do that. And so let me tell you what we got

I'm doing right now. We got him. He's five four hundred and fifty five pounds. He's, he's got some pudge on him, some baby fat and things like that that he's working through. He definitely needs to

“get stronger, faster, leaner, more agile, just more athletic in general to be able to compete in high”

school next year. And he's, he's getting after it. So right now, we've got him at a, our target is a hundred and fifty grams of protein a day. So that may be a little high that may be, you know, right around the ballpark. He's doing, you know, for speed, he's doing hill sprints a few days a week. He obviously practices all the time. And then for strength, I've got him focused, like trying to keep it simple. He's doing farmer carries, everything he's doing twice a week, farmer carries,

he's doing deadlifts for chest, he's doing, you know, one day we're doing flat bench the next, the next chest workout. We're doing incline dome bell press. I've got him doing front raises for shoulders. I do have him doing military press. The shoulder stuff, we're doing like once a week, because he throws so much for baseball. And then, yeah, I'm just, I'm looking for guidance from, I, I, I, I, I would say that his, I'm feeding him a lot of lean cuts right now. And so I, I am

worried that he's underfeeding. He's probably between 1,700 and 1,900 calories every day. And I'm wondering if if we should boost that up, I give him value or cuts of meat, primarily. And then, you know, my thought is because he's young, he's able to recover so quickly that as long as we keep the weight relatively light and focus on his form, that he should be able to crush volume. He should be recovering pretty quickly. But again, you know, I didn't start lifting

until, you know, I started playing football in high school. It was a, it was a different world. It was a ton of volume, a ton of, you know, just heavy lifting. My focus right now, one is everything we do. I want to make sure it's safe. I don't want to cause any problems for him, of course. And then, too, you know, I want to maximize, you know, his ability to get more athletic and be able to compete with confidence as he kind of reaches the next stage of his athletic career.

So, I want to hear you guys out. I know you guys are all athletes just and I know you,

This is really good. So, there's really good data now that we didn't have back in the day

on young athletes and what contributes to their performance later on the most.

“It's really, really good data. But before I talk about that, is he enjoying all this stuff?”

Yes, he's really getting into it, man. Like his YouTube algorithm now, when I check it, it's all fitness stuff. It's all exercise stuff. It's rad. Because that's number one. Number one. He's so young. You know, you want to make sure he, he's developing a good relationship with it. He likes it. Otherwise, you'll run into the like, you know, scenario where the kid gets pushed and then later on they're like, I don't want to do this any more type of deal. The second thing, and this is the most

important thing to focus on with a young athlete, especially one whose body is going to be changing rapidly, is body awareness and kinesthetic ability. More important than anything. Because so the brain is extremely plastic at younger ages. So a good example, this is like learning new languages. Like if you and I learn a new language right now, no matter how well we learn it,

we're always going to have an American accent, no matter what. But you teach a kid four different

languages when they're young, they'll be able to speak all four of them as adults fluently. And that's because the brain has an ability when you're younger that you essentially lose when you're older. It's this plasticity. And this also extends to body awareness and kinesthetic ability. So what you learn when you're younger with body awareness will last and improve your athletic performance later. So here's what the data shows. Let's say you got a kid that's really

gifted a baseball. Okay. And let's say we could like duplicate that kid. And on one end, we take them and we just focus on baseball because they're good at it. And that's where we place all of our time and energy. And then they get to college and then they, you know, play at that level. Let's say in the other hand, we take this kid who loves baseball. It's still plays baseball, but we also have them run, do gymnastics, do swimming, soccer, play golf, soccer. So you do a

lot of different things up until he's probably a sophomore in high school. Then he focuses on baseball. He's going to be better at baseball than the kid that focused all this time on baseball P because of

“that general body awareness. Okay. So that's the most, it's even more important than getting him”

strong at a particular lift. It's more important. So variety is the name of the game when it comes to your kid. Not getting him hurt very, very important. As long as he loves it, it's great. Strength training is good for that. And his body on top of that is changing so rapidly that body awareness becomes even more important because let's say he's really good at, you know, throwing a baseball right now. And then in three months, he gains an inch in height,

which could totally happen. His body's totally different now. Now as mechanics are off and it's going to be weird. It's like when you see a puppy grow real quick or a kind of awkward. And we've seen that. We've seen that. He's grown an inch in the last two months. Yeah. And, you know, he does pitch and his control has suffered that whole of that process. Totally makes a lot sense. So it's all about body awareness and variety. I love the carries. You know, the traditional

exercise are good too. But have them do lots of different things and get used to his body. Body weight movements seem to be better. I love suspension trainer. So like if they call close chain movements. So like bench presses great, pushups might be better. Overhead press is good, shoulder, you know, handstand pushups might be better. So that, so you want to kind of look at that kind of stuff. Suspension trainer's great. Genastic style exercises are good. And kind of

“like these, these like full body type movement. We'll type earlier type stuff for sure. And honestly,”

you know, going through this with that type of an age range for me, like exposing them at the compound lifts. It's got to be very minimal and hyper focused. So, you know, their mechanics are everything with that. So, you know, like our 15 programs, I was thinking like performance 15, you know, just taking that sort of protocol. But then, you know, the days in between where he does his skill

sessions and he's working on speed. One thing that's one of the most important skills of basically

any athlete is to speed. Speed is going to carry them so much further than most attributes. And you get speed by getting strong. And then, you know, we apply acceleration to that. And so to be able to have, you know, the ability to body control, you know, moving different planes, you know, get exposure to those variables like tells talking about, it's like super important. So, you know, but light doses of compound lifts to really build up that baseline strength

is going to be really important. But like, uh, the mistake I made and mistake a lot of athletes I've worked with make or they overdue that. And they do really long sessions. They do hour long to two hour long or they do it like four or five times a week. I would reduce that down to like maybe

days and that's it. So, it'd be like a 15 protocol, but just like twice a week. And then the rest of it is all just, you know, field work and speed work. So, that would, I mean, that would be my suggestion.

Yeah, I'd send over maps of team performance to them. I mean, you could use those first of all.

Does he play, does he, is he, is he, no, they're sports tours. It's just a baseball season too. You, you know, he was, he played basketball in soccer. And then, you know, once he was done with his 12 year old seasons, he really just wanted to focus on baseball. So, it was kind of his call. We kind of push him to do other things and try to get him into flat. He's going to be huge, right? So, I'm like,

“you know, football is always there. But, you know, he just, he loves baseball. And that's what he wants to”

focus on. We did a really cool interview years ago. Uh, it was. Chad Wixley Smith. Yes. You'd love it. It's all about like, we, we, we go and deep, the whole thing is about childhood sports and sports development from beginning to end all the way to the professional level, what the ideal kind of

programming and volume and all that looks like really, really good. I'll have Doug look up what

episode number it is, and I'll give it to you. Awesome. You'll enjoy that conversation. But the guys are right, like, the, the, the amount of like strength training, like traditional, deadlift squatting, like movements like that is, is actually pretty minimal. And, and you're doing, your mindset is right, like mechanics is out, like just teaching him good form and strength. And if he gets a little bit stronger in it great, but just, and don't fool yourself because he's so young and can recover. Well,

doesn't mean we want to do much more with him as far as strength training is concerned. He be far better off doing speed agility type of work and multi-planar stuff and working on being quicker and picking up a basketball still and playing basketball, like those things will serve him and baseball actually even more than hyper focusing on that. That hype and Chad Wixley Smith goes through this. You do start to hyper focus, but not until later in his career. Early on diversity

wins diversity and sports diversity and his movement patterns and that is like, that's a lot of

“what you want going on more of that the better. We didn't touch this, but you were, I think you're”

already a looting the right thing with his diet. Yeah. Definitely bump failure meets, like he for sure can handle more calories. And I would put, and that's an easy way to do it. Let him enjoy try tip and rib eyes and go, go that, you know, chicken thighs, go that direction for sure for more calories and higher fat. But yeah, 952 is the episode. Yeah. So episode not how is that long ago? Yeah, definitely have to like sophomore year, like really start like increasing that intensity

and like adding that baseline foundation strength with the console list will be, will be great. So three sports that are really good at kind of full body awareness and kind of aesthetic ability would be like wrestling, uh, Brazilian jujitsu is another one, rock climbing is another one. And so, and now this wouldn't be where he would spend his time, like really trying to be the best. It would be fun. Sure. So wrestling might be difficult because if he goes in wrestling school,

you know, wrestling coaches are pretty damn intense. So that's a different one. But if like jujitsu, he might go to Brazilian jujitsu once or twice a week. Uh, that's really a good body awareness.

“Rock climbing is your own interest in that stuff. I think I think that's uh, that's a great”

idea and something that we can offer for him. Perfect. So that would be great. Right? Because it's great for body awareness. Yeah. It's athletic. It's different than baseball. You got to learn how to move and use your body differently. It's very similar to wrestling. A lot of hip power. Yeah. Rotation. It's just really, it's the body awareness dude. That's everything. And then rock climbing is the other one is if like, hey, you want to have fun. You want to try doing some rock

climbing or whatever. But if he's interested in jujitsu, I bet you, you know, you know, and I don't know how much practice he's doing with baseball, but like one or two days a week of jujitsu would just make him a better athlete. Yeah. Awesome. Yeah. You're doing good dog, bro. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. A lot of, but we'll send over the last 15 performance. 15 performance. So you got that. Listen to that episode, 952 and 952. Yeah. 952 Chad Wesley Smith. And then uh, and then yeah,

I think literally like if you could get him in jujitsu once or twice a week, he'd rad. Yep. Yeah. Awesome. Guys do a shit. So much man. Thanks guys. You guys. Thank you. Yeah. That, that was a

long time ago. That episode. Yeah. First of all, when I talk about it, it makes perfect sense.

But I didn't think that. Yeah. So when he said that to me, it was like, you know, saying when those moments of light bulb goes off, like, of course. Well, yeah, of course that's the best thing is funny. I just thought of him because um, I was kind of constructing a bit of a plan for some some athletes to the athletes at my son's school. And, you know, Chad, Wesley Smith, that's you got involved. I think in his kid's school, he's like the head coach for their

football team and they're really crushing. Yeah. They're like, oh, break in records. And I mean, he implemented like his entire uh protocol and workouts. I wonder what he's been up to. We haven't

still does that. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. I had popped up in my feet in a long time. I wasn't sure if

“they were still doing it. It's so counterintuitive, right? You think, oh, my kid's gifted. I'm”

going to focus all so counterintuitive. Yeah. And it's just not how the brain, uh, when you hear examples of this, right? It's like you have uh, you know, a Tiger Woods, you know, who's three years old, he's focused on and they focused his whole life on that and he becomes this, the one of the best call for his ever. So it seems logical, like, oh, of course, the more time I spend doing this better, I'm going to be. But uh, it when he breaks it down and this is where our trainer bridge goes,

like, of course. And also, you want studies are good because it's, they're looking at large

sample sizes, general performance. What seems to work best because obviously Tiger Woods,

serving the Williams and sister, well, those are like phenoms. Yeah. I mean, Tiger Woods even had a changes entire swing. That's well, and because of the, yeah, repetitive, overuse injury. Well, and, and who knows what it, like his, we'll see right now in professional sports is what is this playing out, likely classic samples, Patrick Mahomes. Patrick Mahomes was a superstar baseball player and football player. Yep. And if you watched the way he can, he can, he can

contort his body and throw the ball. Yeah. Nobody can throw him. Yeah. And so you're starting to see these kids that are that grew up understanding this philosophy in an edge. And they have a total edge. And so it's, it's evolving sports. But we, we, we, we talk a lot of players like Tiger Woods, like Michael Jordan. This science hadn't came up yet. Yeah. And so it was like, it, so it was how much better. Exactly. How much better would Michael Jordan have been or how much better

“would Tiger Woods have been if he actually diversified that younger, you know what I'm saying?”

But still kept playing golf, but diversified it more. Who knows, he might even been in better when it was. Our next color is Brandon from Oregon. Brandon, what's up, dude? What's happening? Hey guys, how's it going? Yeah, how can we help you? Well, I guess what I'll do is I'll probably just read my question that I sent in because if I don't, I'll either miss some details or I'll get along, wind it in, or forever. So I sent and I said, hey, guys, I'm looking for some

guidance and clarification on my training and nutrition. I'm currently 34 years old, six foot, and I'm about 215 pounds. I don't know my exact body weight or body fat percentage, likely mid-20s, but my goal is to get down around 15%. For context, I've been lifting since I was about 14, I've mostly followed the traditional body building or bros split. We're doing, you know, one muscle group per day, five to six days a week. As I've gotten older, I've started to feel

like this amount of volume might be too much. And mentally, I started to struggle dialing it in first, downing it back, as I feel like I'm not doing enough on a daily basis. I worked with a virtual coach for about 18 months and made solid progress going from about 230 pounds down to 200. While I wasn't improving my body composition, I was lifting very high volume six to days, six days a week, eight to nine exercises per session, usually four sets each muscle, or four sets

each lift, and I was doing 30 to 40 minutes of incline treadmill walking. I was eating around 2400 calories a day, extremely high protein about 280 grams of protein a day, 64 grams of fat, and 180 grams of carbs. After about a year, I burned out. I struggled with adherence, especially with nutrition at

night. I've actually fell off the plan. I've always had difficulty sticking to strict nutrition,

and tend to look for instant results. I started with body dysmorphia and being overly Artemis self, which makes consistency challenging. This has been my biggest hurdle for as long as I can

“remember. I never give myself enough credit, and I'm probably the most in-patient person I know.”

All this combined with an intense sweet tooth and bad habit of bingeing junk food in the eating, especially ice cream, as made it incredibly hard for me to be where I'd like to be. I struggled with all or nothing mentality where I feel like I have to be perfect or I'm feeling, so when I fall off a meal plan for even one meal or a day, I tend to de-relp completely. Going back to my previous nutrition plan, I wanted to if my calories were too low and not

balanced well enough, specifically my protein. I've also questioned whether under-eating for my training, volume contributed to burnout and nighttime overeating or if this is more of a mental thing. My mind tells me that it's a mental thing, because it tends to be my sweet tooth that could spin shrubble in the evenings. Right now I'm coming off of a hernia repair, which is getting,

opportunity to reset and rebuild smarter. Looking ahead, I'm hoping to join my local police department.

Hopefully, we're all soon be working 12 hour shifts, that'll make gym sessions difficult, so I'd like to transition to more sustainable plan, ideally lifting four days a week with a good balance of strength training and mobility. In the past, I've really enjoyed lifting heavy, especially

“squats, deadlift, and bench, however my lap of recovery and mobility, I believe has given my”

progress and led to some persistent tightness in this comfort throughout my body. Actually, believe it was because I didn't and still don't do much mobility work in my routine. So, my main question is, while I do focus mostly on Whole Foods and hitting a protein target, I'd like to know what you guys recommend. My clerk intake be regarding my training volume or to appropriate training volume, I should say, and I have not, I mean, I've listened to you guys

for about six months, maybe a little more than that, and I've finished a ton of episodes. I've heard all about all of you guys as a mass program, but I have not actually purchased one yet, because I was like, I don't know exactly which program would be ideal for me, specifically so I was hoping maybe some guidance on that, something that maybe balance is strength and mobility,

recovery, and just long-term sustainability for me. Yeah, let's talk a little bit first about

“your 280 grams of protein and only 60 grams of fat. You must be heating to Lopia or”

two days, you should lean and chicken breasts and ground lean turkey. Is that, is that the diet or what? Pretty much. And I think that that's part of the reason why I struggle to adhere to it. After a while, I'm still calling boring. Yes. And I was like, I tried to spice it up, but, you know, it's hard to do that. Sure. Chicken dies. Have some chicken dies. Have some rib eyes. Enjoy a try dip every now and then. Yeah, your protein would be better if you brought it down

like 230, and 50 grams of carbs, and then added like 30 grams of fat. Your calories need to be up higher, too. Yeah. You should be up to like 27, 20, 100. Your intuition is on point by the way. Everything that you're feeling is because you've been overtrained and underfed. Yep. And that includes your lack of mobility. It's not that you need to do more. It's your body stiff and overtrained. Yeah. Yeah, you got it. So training wise, very easy. Maps on a ball could be a great place

to go. Gump your calories. Your proteins really high. You didn't need to be that high. 200, 20 grams, 20, 30 grams would be plenty. Yeah, since dropped it since I was that high. If you just, if you just switch the meats out to the higher fat meats, it'll take care of both. Yeah. If you literally get rid of the ground turkey bullshit and the chicken breasts and switch for chicken thighs and rib eyes or ground beef, it'll bump the calories and it'll lower the,

it'll lower the protein and increase the fats. I know. I'm so rare that I find a guy your size who can do well on anything less than 80 grams of fat. It just doesn't work. It feels like crap and it causes binging. Yeah. Well, and I can't say that I felt great throughout the entire, I mean, there was days and weeks, even when I'm like, I feel like I'm just dragging and I was like, I don't know if that's overall volume in the gym and I'm just overtrained or underfed or

combing both. Right. Yeah. And the more I listen to you guys and like, man, it's got to be a combination of both. Yeah. Well, you'll feel so different in like two weeks. If you bump your calories and your fats, you know, do maps and Ebola. That's your strength training three days a week. That's it.

“Nothing else. If you want to walk, if you want to do mobility in between, then go for it.”

And that's it. And your body composition is going to change. And be patient because going through that your your body has been used to getting beat up with that much volume and underfed that.

So it'll take a second for you to kind of recalibrate. So I was tell somebody when I switched this.

It's like, if you trust us, trust the process. But that is the plan. The plan is a maps and Ebola three day a week program. A great program to follow up. That would be performance. It will draw some of your mobility stuff that you're talking about. And you're going to be perfect from Belize Academy 2. So a great goes maps and a ball. They go to mass performance right after that. And then and then a cal-- literally the way like I wouldn't even overthink the calories to be honest with you. It would literally be cut out all this

extra lean meat and just switch it out for higher fat meats. And it'll take care of bumping your calories and take care of your healthier fats. And you'll be more satiated and you'll feel better. You're just fast for them. We'll probably go up to you. Yeah, all those things to it. Like the funny brother-up. So I just had my testosterone. My total TU is down to two 90s. Yeah, that's like low fat.

sleep probably crappy too because it's hard to sleep well when you're underfed and over-trained. It's probably so. So yeah, you're testosterone will go way up just from the other things. Yeah. I mean, so that like the things that I'm like if I'm coaching you through this process because it will take a time for your body to recalibrate. It's like, how is your sleep,

how's your libido, how's your recovery? And those are our three first markers and then strength,

right? So those are the four things that we're kind of like talking about. I'm not really tripping about weight. I'm not even really hyper focusing on calories. It's like, I'm switching out all those lean meats to higher fat meats, letting you enjoy yourself and be fed when you want. And when you're if you're hungry, go eat but just make good choices. Eat the, you know, go eat another serving of the rib eye and rice or whatever. Like that just that's your body

probably telling you it needs more feel because it's trying to build and try to build strength. And so but those are the things that we're looking at. We're like, how's libido, how's energy, how's recovery, how's strengthening the gym? Let those be your guide. Once you start checking off all those saying, yeah, that feels good. Yeah, that feels good. Yeah, that feels then comes the composition. That's right. Then all sudden muscle starts packing on, waistline starts coming in. But focus on

“those four as you're guiding principles of like what you need to be focused on and then the other”

shit follows right behind that. If I just again, just for the testosterone, because you're probably like, what the heck, man, you know, that's a scary thing. If I were to give a man three steps to

crush his testosterone, here's what it would look like over-trained, under E to low fat,

like guaranteed to destroy your testosterone. Yeah. So you're hitting everything on the head of like, I don't sleep all that well. I mean, some days I go, you know, I'll go, we come doing okay. I track it and it's usually I 70s, low 80s. So it's like it's not awful, but it's not optimal. I wake up every night, like at 2 o'clock on the dot and I'm just awake for like an hour. Yeah, stress too. Yeah. It's too much too much, too much stress on the body with the exercise,

not enough eating and not enough fats, your body's hurting. Yeah. Yeah. Here's what you'll notice right out the gates. More energy better sleep in your stronger and recovery. And recovery. And then what Adam saying, trust and then stick with it, because then you'll start to see the strength gains and then you'll start to see the body composition change. Yeah. Which takes a little longer. Yeah. Okay. Okay. Once all four of those are in line,

because you're doing all those things, then you'll see. You'll be good. Yeah. Then it's then we'll be rocking and rolling, but just trust the process. It is not a calorie thing, dude. Like, obviously, if you go in an egg like an asshole, like I said, and you start binging 4,000 calories, that's not going to serve us. But if you, if you're hungry and you eat and you told natural food, just good. And I don't care if it's a fatty or cut of meat with a, with a good carbohydrate,

right, potato, sweet potato yet, like, stuff like that. Go for it. Eat it. Eat it because you're hungry. That means your body is. It's it's rebound is recovering. It's rebuilding. It's wanting to build muscle. Like, you'll be fine. And it, but just trust that process. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. I'll do that. We'll send over a map Santa Bollock. And then, like I said,

“after anabolic, follow it up with performance. Okay. Perfect. Guys, I think that”

thank you so much. I appreciate your time and everything you guys do. That's great. Thank you. I've got a man waiting to run it. It's, it's what I do. I swear to God, bro, the, the ultra low fat sources of protein. I knew it. It says like 280 grams with a lot of. Yeah. Yeah. That's a oil. That is, that is chicken breast, extra lean ground turkey to lobster. Yeah. That's your, yeah. Yeah. And I'm going to say this right now. Like those ultra lean, super lean cuts of me. If that's,

it, when that should not be not even close to a predominant source of your, of your animal sources of protein unless you're a competitor and you're 12 weeks out and you're measuring everything. If that's usually what you eat for your protein, oh, your life sucks. You feel like crap. You're not able to recover. Your hormones are probably off. It's like, like, just eat, just eat to me. I'm not talking about going like, you know, 60% ground beef or, you know, in sausages all the time.

But like, you know, chicken thighs, you know, regular ground beef, right here, rib eye,

casual right back. Yeah, you need essential. Our next color is Ferrin from Ontario.

“Hi, Ferrin. Hey, doing Ferrin. Hello. Hi. How are you, guys? Good. How are you?”

Good. Sorry. I'm sitting on the floor because I was having issues using my computer. So I'm on my on my phone. So that's not that works. I'm going to read my email. I did short knit a little bit just for sake of brevity, but I think it has all the information that you'll. So hello, my name is Ferrin. I'm a 38 year old stay at home. Mom, I have two little boys. And over the past three years, I've lost more than 30 pounds through cardio, back row tracking, and then eventually strength training.

But after working with a coach to rebuild a healthier relationship with food and training,

“I'm now in a much better place. But I'm unsure how to move forward with my goals.”

So a little bit of background. I started my fitness journey in 2023 when I bought a popular spin bike and he ended up doing classes at home every day. My youngest son was utterly confused and kept asking why I was riding a bike and not going anywhere. And he was right because lost 15 pounds and then stopped going anywhere. I plateaued really quickly. That's when I found the carbon diet coach. I started tracking macros, dialed in on calories, started eating enough protein,

and then the weight began to drop off again. So at that time, I also started strength training, and I gradually built up the home gym, and by the fall of 2024, I had reached my lowest weight of 122 pounds and 19% body fat. So I looked slim, but I didn't have the physique I wanted. So I kept pushing harder, strength training, five days a week, doing cardio almost every day, and then fell into just a cycle of dysmorphia and restricting and binging. I felt awful,

and I knew something needed to change. So I'd been listening to you guys for a little while, and I decided to hire a coach. She helped me rebuild balance. She increased my calories from 1800 to 2400, reduced my training to three days a week, until me I could do cardio, but it was optional. Not mandatory. So my weight went up, and stabilized at 134 pounds, and I felt really great. So at my request, we ran an eight week cut last fall, so I could practice doing it in a more sustainable

way. I reached 127 pounds, but I felt really crummy, and I was really hungry, so I returned to maintenance, and that's where I've been ever since. So now, my weight has stayed the same. I'm probably about 22% body fat, 2200 calories stay, 130 to 140 grams protein, three or four strength days.

I do one lower, one upper, and two full body days. I use this second full body day as optional,

so I don't force myself to do it, but I do completely the most of the time, and I trained at home with a home gym. I homeschool my kids, and I run our household, so I'm pretty active during the day. But my main struggle now is my lower body. So my upper body swims out really easily, and then I carry most of my body fat around my hips and glutes, and I have cellulite, which I hate, even at my lowest body weight, I still had cellulite. So my coach explains that achieving the look I wanted,

would require a level of restriction that probably wasn't going to be sustainable from me long term, and I understand that, but at the same time, I do want to continue to improve my physique. So my question for you guys is, is it realistic for me to continue improving my lower body composition while eating maintenance, or would pursuing the school likely require a deficit that risks pushing me back towards enough unhealthy habits? How can I focus on building more muscle in

my lower body through adjusting my training structure, or is this mostly a matter of genetics, and just false expectations for women? The biggest win for me over the last year has been rebuilding a healthier relationship with food and training, so protecting that progress is really

“important to me. Thank you for everything you do. I've learned a lot from your show, and I would really”

value your perspective. First of all, you look great. You're doing a great job, you look great,

and you're doing a great job. That's first and foremost. I'm curious to what, do you know what your squat deadlift numbers are? How strong is your lower body? Tell me. Yeah, so I have been gradually building my home gym. I just got the courage to buy a barbell in a squat stand for myself. At home yesterday, I did my first round. I squatted 120 pounds for eight reps, so I've been doing that, and then I'm still using the program that my coach had me on, so I'm doing

like 8-8 and then 12, so I can do 110 or 12. Fair and you're doing great. Yeah, and your trainer was your coach did a good job. It was actually rare that I hear someone on here to tell me about a coach, and I think they did for a whole. I think your coach did a really good job with you.

“I think you're doing great, and you need to cut yourself some slack and get your two hard on yourself.”

Yeah, I know, but. No, no, but you're doing really well. Body fat percentage 20 percent,

between 22 to 25 percent for the rest of your life. That's where you're going to want to sit.

You're at the right body fat percentage. I think you'll obtain the look when we build more muscle in your legs, and I think that you're just now starting squatting. This is your first time bar no squatting. A year from now, a year from now, your lower body is going to look radically different after squatting and deadlifting for a year. You're fine. Yeah. You could get away with bumping your calories about 200 more calories just so you know, I think it would be better. So I would I would

feed you a little bit more, and I would try and get strong in the squat and the deadlift like let's keep going and watch what your lower body ends up shaping up. And honestly, I want your body fat percentage about where it's at. I don't really want to get, but it'll look different when we put

five to 10 pounds of muscle on that body. That's right. It's going to look way different. That's right.

So I think the look you're trying to achieve in the lower body will come from squatting for the next squatting and deadlifting for the next year and getting strong there and eating 200 more calories and kind of hovering where you're at, doing what you're doing. Your calories probably would be about 24 to 25 hundred calories through this process and just kept strong. And I think four days a week of strength trainings. Okay. You're better off doing three and three. Okay. So that's I'm not,

I don't want to get leaner in a sense that I want to like lose weight or even lose body fat. I'm I'm happy the way I am in that sense. I would just like more muscular. Yeah. That's right.

“I heard that. I heard that. I got that from the message. That's that's what I'm telling you. That's”

the prescription. Bump your calories. Do you know how many grams of, I'm assuming you'll get you there.

I'm assuming you're hitting good protein. Do you know where your, where your fats are at? Yes. So I have, I've religiously track, which is another thing that my coach was getting me off of. So I have done times without tracking, but I feel more comfortable tracking. My proteins, yeah, 130 to 140. My fats are between 70 and 80 and then the rest are carbs. You do a good coach, Faren. Yeah. You get pretty rare out here about a good coach. Where's the coach?

Where's the coach from? So she's now she works for a prime revival. But at the time, I actually found her through searching on Spotify for a podcast on how to stop tracking macros. Okay. Okay. Going crazy with it. And I just started listening to her podcast. And then I added her on Instagram and she reached out to me and said, Hey, how can I help you? And it was just a beautiful kind of relationship that we got me into a really good place.

“Yeah, she's great. If you want to reach back out to her for a little short stamp, probably good.”

But bump your calories to 24, 2500. And let's get you strong. The fact that you just started barbell training, that's like, that's like, that's going to unlock a lot of gains for you. The next two years around, you're going to see consistent progress and change in your lower body. Just from getting just from that. Just from that. I'm going to send you maps at a ball. That's the program I want you to follow. It's three days a week. It's three days a week. Do that. Yeah, that was my question because

I'd like to just maintain my upper body. But I can, I guess I'm a little bit, um, I don't want to overtrain and volume. If I want my focus to be on my lower body. Well, let's do this. I'll give you muscle mommy. Yeah. I'll give you muscle mommy. It's a little, it's more lower body focused. Very similar maps and a ballic. Follow that program. Bump your calories two to 300. Don't drop them down and let yourself build. Build into the look that you want. Don't try to cut into the

look that you want. Yeah, no, I'm done with that. It doesn't make me feel very good. And it just gets me back into a bad place. And listen to your body. There's a good chance that when you start really hitting straight. You're appetite will go up. So don't fight that. If you get hungry, eat, but go eat a good balanced meal. Go have some steak and rice or whatever your favorite meat and rice or yam or sweet potato is. Go have a balanced meal or whatever whatever that is. Like

“feed it. If because that's what I'm like, what I'm listening for if I'm coaching you is as we're”

going through this program. You, you're telling me like, wow, you're feeling strong and you're like, Adam, I'm getting hungry. And I'm like, yes, feed that. Then we'll go up again. So if you're not, then we'll be fine with a 200 calorie bump. But even at 2,400 calories, if you start getting hungry from lifting this way, that's a good sign. That means you're, you're trying to build muscle. Okay. So, um, is this something that I should focus on for the next? Well, I guess forever.

Well, at least the next three months because the program's three months long. So follow that, let the way it's laid out and with the advice we're giving with calories and just let the program do the work. And I'll tell you this, Farron, if you just started barbell training,

Yeah. That's the best focus. For the next two years, just try to get stronger. Yeah. Be smart about it.

“You know, don't hurt yourself. But, but just try to get stronger feed yourself to do so.”

And you'll get the look that you're looking for. Okay. Yeah. You got a really cool, you got a really cool year ahead of you. You got a good coaching that sets you up well. You're in a good place right now. That program's going to be

incredible for you. And just like Sal said, just you know, what do you want to get back on here after

you're finished with muscle mommy? Yeah. I love you. I love to hear where you're at three months. Yeah. That would be really cool. Okay. Cool. We're going to set. Yeah. We're going to send it to you. And then, and then reach back out and then we'll do a follow-up with you. Okay. Perfect. So, muscle mommy is good. So, at home, I have dumbbells five to 50 pounds. I have a squad stand and barbell. And I have a cable tower, too. You got it. You got everything you need.

You're covered. Yep. Okay. Okay. And no, so I've stopped doing cardio. I just don't.

“That's fine. That's fine. Walk. If you want to do anything else, walk. But follow the”

program the way it's laid out. Any other activity, walking. Yep. Just walking. Okay. Well, when it's negative 15 years, it's like the seven years of winter that won't end. So. Okay. Thank you so much. This has been, I've been wanting to call in and talk to you guys for a few weeks and months probably. And I finally mustard up the courage to do it. And you've given me the reassurance that I hear you say all the time. But it's really nice to hear it directly from you guys and to get positive

feedback. Awesome. We're seeing three months. Yeah. Can't wait to keep it going. Yeah. For sure.

Thank you so much. Thanks for that. Hey, that never happens when he talks about their car. I'm almost

always like, this is going to suck. Yeah. Yeah. They're coaching a great job. Well, listen to how she found her. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That even that podcast episode is not a, that's not a calm. That's a, that's a, obviously a coach has been coaching for a long time. Do you even have a podcast episode titled how to stop tracking macros? Totally. Yeah. I'll definitely send her an email. I'd love to get the name of the podcast and find out who this trainer is. That was great. Yeah. No, I definitely

“male will steal her. Yeah. That's what I was thinking. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That's awesome. Yep.”

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