A Positively Legal Summer Special, with Mark Eiglarsh, Jonna Spilbor, and Megyn Kelly

Hello and welcome to Positively Legal.

“The MK True Crime Channel is taking a summer break this week,”

but we want to share a very special episode featuring yours truly, Janna and Megan Kelly. And we also want you to enjoy our past discussions on the Netflix documentary, The Predator of Civil, with Mark's very own client Gabby, and also victim Henry Noac,

and the deadly stabbing by the Seekman in the UK. There'll be so much more, but not for long, we'll be back next week, can't wait to see you then. I mentioned this to the audience the other day when we announced the new show, and Kate you're crying.

That you guys are Kelly's Court. Kendall's Court, OG's. Back when my name was Megan Kendall. At Fox, and so every iteration of whatever show I've had, you guys have been coming on.

We've been doing crime analysis and legal analysis, and that takes me back to 2018 when I was on NBC. And Mark, you came to me and said, "I've got this unbelievable story involving my client who went over to Spain as a student

and something terrible happened to her and not just her, but we need to get the word out because this is happening over and over, and they can't really get the story out." So I'm going to play the trailer for what has now become a Netflix special involving your client.

And we did have her on and we'll show a little of that.

“But do you want to just set up the story and how it first came?”

Here's what people don't know.

The only reason why I met Gabby Vega, the victim in this case, is because her mother was my kid's teacher at a school here in Fort Lauderdale. So she came to me and I'm like,

"Well, I defend people who do this stuff. I don't really represent victims. But you know what? I'm going to see what I can do for you." And she wanted to get the word out.

I said, "Are you sure? Absolutely." And Megan, we made a list. You were the top of the list at the time. And I figured, what are the odds that Megan's going to have us on?

When you said yes, I got goosebumps. I was so excited because I knew things would change for her. At a minimum, the word would get out. This guy would be exposed. But something far greater happened.

And that's where the Netflix documentary explains what happened. So Gabby comes on. I'm going to show that in a minute. But she comes on my show. And she talked about how she was an exchange student.

Or she went over to Spain to study. And she finds herself in the clutches of this tour guide. And this tour guide wanted to be much much more than her guide around Spain. She talks in the following clip. This is from our show.

But from the Netflix show called Predator of Civil, describing herself waking up and finding Manuel. Well, I'll let her tell it here. This is not 27.

“I just remember, like, I woke up at some point.”

A known was in the room. And I felt like shit.

I had never felt that way.

In my life, I have not felt that way in my life since. I was like, there was like a disconnect between my mind and my body. Where it was like my brain was working on such a slow level. And I just remember like leaning up against the wall and like driving my feet. One front of the other to like get to the bathroom.

All right, we went to go open the bathroom door. And I opened it. Nicole and Ashley and Manuel were on the shower. They were in their shirts. And under where he was in his underwear.

I remember I closed the door. They all came out like screwed out. It almost looks like they were like all in there. And so I just went in and I sat on the toilet. And I was facing the door.

And all I remember. And it's like the thing that's haunted me for years. It's like that memory of just like the door swinging open. And seeing his garage come towards me and then him putting himself in my mouth. And then me getting hit in the feet like that.

And then I just like fucked up. Oh my gosh, it's so disturbing. She had gone over there, Mark, as to study abroad. Like so many of us do in college. And she did the thing.

I've done this as a tourist. Not as a student, but where you're in Spain. And then you just pop down to Morocco. And this is her tour guide who's like now suddenly in her room at night.

And the next thing she knows, there's a serious possibility. She was given a drug.

“And she was sexually assaulted by this man.”

It was named as Manuel. I think the last name. You probably have a girl. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. There's a man. Manuel Velah. So here's the trailer for the Netflix special, the predator of civil.

Which without Mark Eiglarge would never have happened.

When I moved to Spain to study, I was in 18-year-old kid. I studied abroad in Siviah. Siviah of the beach. I really loved it. It was like an adventure.

I was really excited by the whole thing. And thinking about all the trips. Discovered versions was recommended. And they emphasized safety. The main tour guide seemed like a nice guy.

He was handsome. He knew everyone. A playful personality. It's the last day of the trip. He was like, oh, well, I can get champagne.

And we can all hang out in the room. I started getting really tired. I woke up the next morning. That's when I realized what happened. NBC said you shouldn't talk to anyone about this.

Second, he told me, no. I was like, that's exactly what I'm going to feel. I started building an investigation. Story just kept getting bigger. I went on the today's show.

I had no idea what I was involved in. You feel like you were in the room with the devil.

“So Mark, what were the legal challenges for her in getting this thing to a criminal trap?”

I was speaking to her today, actually. She told me that they were not very interested in Spain. They, they were not going to do anything. And contrary to what you said before you played the clip. It wasn't me, Megan.

It was you. Had you not given her that format to show the world. That she said unlocked the government folks over there. Because they care way too much about tourism. And they didn't like the way that they looked.

That's what did it. You did it, Megan. And also there's a beautiful part where she gives you credit where she was freaking out. And I remember those moments and I tried to comment down. But you, going over to her and saying, you're going to be fine.

You got this meant the world to her. And she delivered her version of what occurred with courage and dignity and intelligence and passion. And that really opened the floodgates. Well, thank you for saying that. But I'm thrilled that these women found the courage to come forward.

Because it wasn't just Gabby. As it turns out, there were others, Johnna, as we've seen in so many of these cases. When one brave woman finds the courage to speak out. All these other young girls who, you know, they, he was a tour guide. They weren't expecting to get molested by this man.

He was sexually assaulted by this man. But one after the other, they started to come out. So you tell me, like, whether you think the Spanish government did the right thing here or whether they had to be dragged, kicking and screaming just based on the fear of tourism losses. Yeah, I think it is the latter. Because we have all seen this movie for lack of a bit of word.

Time and time again.

Seasoned predators always have a plan, right?

This guy did not just wake up when day and decide that Gabby was going to be his first victim. So first of all, Kudos to her because God only knows how many other women she saved by having the wear with all to come out, come on your previous show, and save so many other people from this particular faith. And when you watch, like I watched the first episode of the documentary.

And of course, we see some signs the way they depicted it. Like, for example, he should not know tour guide. Should ever go to some young girls hotel room to want to play games in his underwear. Number one, red flag. Number two, apparently they show him pouring some champagne.

He came with champagne. She doesn't get me. Doesn't have much of a memory of what happened. It's very, very foggy. So of course, there's a possibility that he drugged her part of being the predator.

So I applaud her very much. I don't know what Spain has been takes sexual predators or sexual fenders of what they intend to do. But then I did hear even after he was convicted. He's out for now, at least while the case is on appeal. So they're not taking it as seriously as we do here in the United States.

And that's shameful. Yeah, let me add some. So he did get convicted.

Yeah, I mean, that's the other happy ending here is that he did ultimately bring charges.

She testified and he was found guilty. And so that's happened, but as you point out, not yet in prison. So a couple of things. One, Gabby has agreed to come on to our first episode for an in-depth interview. Not only about the documentary, what didn't make it into the documentary.

“But importantly, what happened after the documentary?”

Because I was getting a bunch of emails from new victims that I was forwarding to Gabby.

Some people who weren't necessarily victims, what people were like, wait, now I recognize him. He's my landlord over in Spain. He's still having contact with young women.

So us doing the show and us doing it on our show, positively legal, which airs on Wednesday for our first inaugural show.

We're going to get into the weeds with her. And she's going to tell you amongst other things that it was the prosecutors who said it was okay for him to remain out on bond. She goes through his appeals. The prosecutors agreed to that, Megan. Some of the women came on that same show that we did on NBC.

Because you know, she started to realize something had happened to her. The word went out a bit on this, not a good tour company. There's not a good guy. So these young women, women, and this was just just like as the me too, movement was, you know, has had just come underway.

So I think women were starting to realize there was power and safety in numbers. But two other girls came on, Haley Mackelis and Carly Van Austin Bridge. And here's a bit of that from our interview on NBC in April of 2018. Watch this. It's not 36.

We went to his room and realize we were the only people there.

And he was like, we're just going to wait for everyone else to show up. And very quickly he started being very sexual and asking really personal questions. And wanted us to dance for him. And she did like this, you know, like a dumb dance. Like to cut the sexual tension.

Yeah. This isn't like-- We've all been there. Yeah.

“And then he was like, no, you need to do like a sexy dance on top of me.”

And that's when I was like, all right, no, we're leaving. And at that point he took us and like pushed us against the counter and tried to like hold us and make a stance the way he wanted us to dance.

And we obviously didn't want you so we weren't making that easy for him.

And then he ended up-- he was like, you guys can't leave. And I was like, no, we're leaving. And he helped me against the wall and started kissing me. And then grabbed her hand and made her touch him. And eventually I like pushed through and got out of like his--

Out of where he was. And I was like, no, like, we're leaving. But he wouldn't let go of her. She went and opened the door and she told Manuel the doors open. Everyone can hear what you're doing.

And only then did he let me go. And then I ran out after her. Mm-hmm. Manuel, Lanko Vela. But here's the question mark.

Is there any liabilities? This is criminal charges of Chakma.

“Is there any liability for the tour company or anybody beyond that?”

The school? Anybody who'd failed to protect these girls? Well, I know that there was an investigation into the schools. For example, my client went to, if you press me, I'll say it. But a very well-known, well-respected Florida State School.

And that's how she picked this company. And that's how most of the girls did. The discoverer excursions marketed these specific universities and targeted them. And the universities seemed to recommend them as vendors. And there's some argument that they knew that funny stuff was going on.

And continued to recommend them as vendors. And so, unfortunately, it's very difficult to prevail in the civil arena. And I don't think anyone's had to pay a nickel. So what's going to happen to this guy now that he's-- Why is he out?

He's just outpending sentence. In fact, it's all the way up to the highest court in the land in Spain. In fact, Gabby said, wow, from a Megan Kelly appearance to now this case being in the highest court in Spain. She was very impressed and also grateful to the other two women who came forward on your show. Technically, we're also my clients.

But what I call them my clients was me just being a mentor and a sounding board to help them get through this whole thing. That's really what I did. But yeah, there's possibly more charges going to be brought against him in Spain. Gabby, you'll learn in our interview is working actively to make sure that that happens. Wow, it's crazy, John, we think about this guy who had access to a bunch of 20-21-year-olds.

You know, college students, they're young. 19 studying abroad, one of the most exciting experiences in their young lives. Your tour guide might flip you a Mickey and sexually, not just harass, but assault you.

“When I interviewed Gabby, remember this moment, we pulled it.”

She didn't know that she'd been in the bathroom with Vela for a half an hour. Because she was, she believed she was drugged. This is the moment here, watch this, not 33. Gabby also spoke with her friends in the morning and asked if they remembered anything from the night before. One told her Gabby had been in the bathroom with Vela for half an hour.

And it's difficult talking about it just because I've talked a lot of girls now who have dealt with this at his hands.

Oh, so now it's like, that's an important thing to see because you see her feeling like really great about the result.

She's feeling more cocky as that happens to a lot of women when they find their voices. But if that is all born out of like a deep, deep unsettling pain that being sexually assaulted against your will, especially while under a drug, possibly can do to a young woman. Absolutely. And a lot of these women probably for a period of time, if not forever. Feel I believe that somehow some way there are the ones who screwed up, that somehow there to blame.

And we have to let women in their position know that no, you're not to blame, right? The world is supposed to be a nice place. You're not supposed to get molested by your tour guide. You're not supposed to get molested by anybody, especially somebody who tries to eliminate resistance by secretly drugging.

“And look, this guy, you know, you have to think about it.”

He didn't just meet these women by becoming their tour guide. I'm sure you have to fill out your name right in serial number when you apply to be on the store. He could have targeted them before they ever ever met him in real life. Like this, this type of predator plans this out, executed it perfectly. And if Spain doesn't do better and put this guy behind bars so that other people do not also get hurt by anybody who's got the same idea than shame on them.

[ Music ] I want to kick this off with this horrific Henry Noak case. So he's a Scott and he was going to college in Great Britain in the English city of South Hampton.

“He was walking home after a night out with friends. Yesterday we said this happened in 2023.”

I'd like to correct that. It was 2025. He was December of 2025.

He was walking home first year college students studying accounting from a night out with friends.

He had been drinking but not much. He was not legally drunk. And a man approached him named Vikram Digwa who is Sikh and dresses in traditional Sikh garb. And carries knives as part of that chosen garb. You're not allowed to carry certain knives in Great Britain but there's an exception if it's for your religion. So for example, he carried an eight inch long Shastar which is a knife as well as a Sikh Karpon, a ceremonial blade.

All right. So we're showing a picture of it now and of this particular guy. In the UK, Sikhs are legally permitted to carry a Karpon knife in public as it's protected under religious exemption laws. Okay. So this, they, the two men had an encounter in which Vikram and Henry exchanged words of some sort. And the next thing we know, Henry gets stabbed four times by Vikram. Those facts are not in dispute. That, that is what happened.

What words were said, whether the stabbing was in self-defense as Vikram is now claiming in court, we don't know.

But that's basically what the arguments are.

Unfortunately, Henry is not here to testify in his own defense because he died from those injuries. And the police behavior around his dying moments is absolutely outrageous.

“And one of the things I believe that made this an international scandal because it turned out as he lay dying and handcuffed.”

Because his assailant was saying, he called me a racist name. He was, he shouted something racist at me and the cops believed him, slapping cuffs on Henry. Henry was bleeding out and about to, the reports are basically drown on his own blood that was filling up his lungs where he had been stabbed by Vikram. That I've been stabbed to the police who said, I don't believe you have mate. And this poor 18 year old kid is now dead. So his accused of selling is on trial in Great Britain and is acting the choir boy.

It was self-defense. He called me a racist name. I was worried he was going to stab me with my weird knives. And weirdly, it's actually, there's precious little photography or other pictures of this guy Vikram Digwa on the internet. We've looked, but we were passed a video by a source that shows the defendant in his seek gear.

It's like it has a 90 degree angle on it. I mean, it's absolutely lethal looking.

“And in this particular video, I think you'll see that knife or at least a strap to it on his chest along with a sword.”

The kind of sword that college kids use when they're doing sword fighting, you know, I think they call it an epi. In his hand, in his other hand, I mean, a full sword walking around the streets of England. And what's interesting to me is you will hear him. They are, they object in the beginning of the video I'm about to show you to him being recorded, which is another thing that allegedly happened during his confrontation with Henry.

He took out his phone and started video taping this guy. He reportedly didn't like that.

“And through one act or another, Vikram, the defendant wound up with Henry's phone on him and his mother is accused of helping him hide some of that evidence.”

Now, if Vikram did nothing wrong, you would think he'd say, hey, police, here's my phone and here's Henry's phone. You know, you're going to hear a racial up with that on there. That's not what happened. He didn't tell people they found the phone on him, but listen here carefully and you will also hear him objecting to the recording or his friend. Listen. Come on, come on, record the recording team. Well, let me tell you something else.

My source tells me that this man Vikram was known to police.

And this, this wasn't his first brush with them.

I find that easy to believe if he's walking around the streets of England with an actual sword out. It's not sheathed. It's in his hand. He's having yet another angry confrontation with somebody to the point where that person felt they ought to take out their camera and record what this guy was doing. It doesn't mean he didn't kill Henry himself to fence, but it doesn't look good. So let me start with you on it. John, what do you make of this trial? Because it's underway right now. And unfortunately, our friends in the UK have lost their minds when it comes to race, free speech, and even the possibility of a racist thought or word here in America.

It's not illegal to be a racist or even to say racist things. And believe it or not, that's a good thing, my friends. It's not like we all want to be racist and run around saying racist things. But we don't want to criminalize even those, the most controversial behaviors or statements that it crosses over into a lawful. If you act on it and the employment context and that's your motivation for a decision, et cetera. But over in the UK, you actually can get arrested for being a racist, having a racist thought or behavior or statement could actually get you arrested over there.

“And I do believe that's why Henry wound up with the cuffs on him because they took this guy's word for it, your thoughts.”

Well, it's disgusting. You know, we're here that would not happen because over here, if police happen upon a scene and one guy is brandishing or has weapons on his body.

And another guy is laying in the street bleeding out. The person with the weapons is going to get subdued first, not the victim. So that's number one.

Number two, so many facts about this Megan really rubbed me the wrong way. And for example, I don't care how drunk any college student gets. Do you think that person is going to approach somebody who's wearing knives? I mean, just it wouldn't happen that way. So who really was the aggressor here, who really was the one making the first move, who who set out to possibly stab somebody and make this would could be a false claim of self defense. I have a lot of questions in this case. Megan, Megan, the police say something, we're leaving out. This to me, this is everything. And I'm so glad that both of you didn't say it, so I get to say it.

I don't know what the facts are, but I do know that there are stab wounds to the kids legs, his hind legs, which would indicate that he was turned away from this guy. End of story on self defense. Yes, because police say that Digua, the defendant was, quote, aggressively pursuing Henry, aggressively pursuing him, leaving a trail of blood after the first attack, Henry tried to flee, but was pursued.

I'm sorry, his knife, I'm focused on America, his knife and stab him with it because Henry was drunk and verbally aggressive, and I guess in this guy's story in the mood to commit an assault on this poor innocent seek. Okay, it is so predictable. Maybe it's because John and I do this work all the time. You start with a guy who's not going to say, okay, you got me. I stabbed the college kid because I'm aggressive, and I've got issues, and I didn't like the way he was looking at me or maybe something he said.

He's not going to say that. He knows he's going to the pokey for years if he does. So let's go to the playbook. Let's add in something that's the worst you could say about someone, especially in that country, apparently. So he made some of these racial remarks about me. Ha, let's shift it over and make him the criminal, and we'll also say, he's unarmed, but he was going to use my weapon and harm me. Ha, okay, and it worked. So effectively, this guy played law enforcement like a fiddle because to this guy who's got injuries, he's dying, he's bleeding out, they put handcuffs on him.

“If that happened here, people would be looking for a new job for sure, and maybe we would find themselves in the pokey. They didn't put handcuffs on, on Vikram, the defendant, John, that's what's it's so outrageous.”

They took his word for it that a racial slur had been uttered. They put handcuffs on the man who was stabbed and down.

They clearly didn't identify or examine him to see whether his claims of having been stabbed were true because they were true. Then they were telling him that they weren't a post-mortem reports. News Nation found that he suffered four stab wounds and a cut to his jaw with two of the wounds as Mark points out to the back of his legs. Now I can see how maybe they wouldn't find the back of the legs if it hadn't blooded through, if it whatever, but like you do a cursory examination before you decide whether the man needs medical help or not.

And they weren't interested at all. So like Elon Musk is threatening right now or offering right now to fund the wrongful death lawsuit by Henry's family against the UK police. I mean, separated apart from the legal liability or the guilt or innocence of Vikram, there may be something there in the civil courts. They're very well-made because it's absolutely ridiculous that your hand cuffing somebody who's bleeding out and dying. And what did the police do? I'm wondering, when they approached the scene, did they just say to the defendant, hey, you know what, can you just put that knife in your back pocket for me? Can you not wear it around your neck while we're processing this poor guy who's about to die?

Like, how I don't understand how that works and maybe because I'm not familiar with how they do things over in the UK, but it would never happen here.

And my PD walks up to somebody who's wearing a couple of knives around his neck, that guy is going down, that he might not get back to tell they figure it out. And by the way, Megan, you've got a full sword. That's crazy. I don't know if he had it that night, but like he clearly walked around with it. Go ahead, Mark. I'm putting myself in the shoes of this guy, the victim. If I see a man walking down the street holding a knife outward, one that could kill.

I might be taking photos. I might be videoing because that would look to me so unusual that I would think something's about to go down.

That's all I'm saying. Call me a racist, maybe I guess. Especially in UK. That's a religious thing, okay, kill me, you know, for that. But I would probably think, oh, my, don't say that. Right, something's about to happen and I'm going to pull out my phone and keep an eye on him. No, you know what I was doing? He was reportedly Henry there. Henry was reportedly speaking to friends on Snapchat.

“That's why he had the phone. I don't, I guess it was like a FaceTime kind of situation.”

When he came across Digua, they did exchange words. No, I just heard saying, in it bad man, what bad man, you're a bad man. Say you're a bad man. Go on, digua responds, I am a bad man. And no walk replies are you a, and this is the only way I've seen it reported B dot dot dot before the footage cuts off. And I don't know what that, what that means.

I have no idea what B stands for or what he was asking and I haven't seen it fully reported. At least we're called to the scene. Me, but that, like no one's printing out the word bitch, you know, like,

“I think it might just be able to tell that he said some word beginning with B. I have no idea.”

But police were called, they arrested no act and Digua claimed he had been racially abused. His brother, Digua's brother, says we've just been attacked by someone racially.

The brother says he physically attacked my brother, we're seeks.

“We wear turbines and he attacked my brother.”

The police body camp footage was shown in court, no act repeatedly told officers. I've been stabbed, I can't breathe. They put handcuffs on no act who was lying on his side. He was saying I'm stabbed. The officer told no act he was under arrest for suspicion of assault.

He said I've been stabbed. A male voice says I don't think you have mate. Digua, the prosecutor says did not seek help for no act. Instead he accused him of being a racist and being drunk after he collapsed. Police started rendering aid.

Digua now wants you to believe this is all self defense. If it were self defense, wouldn't he have said that in the moment, Johnna, wouldn't he have said I stabbed him because he was going to stab me. Wouldn't he have said while the guy was lying there dying and his assault charge

was turning into a murder charge.

He has been stabbed. He has been stabbed. The guy's handcuffs that he knows he's not going to get away with this shit. He behaved like a man who had consciousness of guilt.

“He led with, you know, he made a racial slur.”

He led with, you know, he made a comment about my turban. It reminds me a lot of that's the buzzword that he knew he needed to say. Hands up, don't shoot. That kind of stuff was going on and he just spewed it out. And the police bought it, hook line and sinker.

And now we have a dead kid. So yeah, it's really interesting. He says to the police, he came at me, he barged into me. I was racially and physically abused by Henry Noac. I was petrified as he pulled out his phone to record his attack.

But you know what's not in evidence, Mark?

Any video of Henry Noac saying anything, racial whatsoever. Or friends who had been listening to him prior on Snapchat, taking the witness down to say, yeah, I did hear him use a racial up at that and referring to these two seek guys. None of that.

There's been no evidence other than the defendant who's worried about going to prison. Yeah, I suspect that that might not be true. But putting it aside, let's just say as you said earlier, let's say, because even a prostitute can be raped. And even someone who is a racist type of ethetically.

And we're not saying he is, can be, you know, can walk in on the street, not have issues, right? And does deserve to be stabbed. But I keep focusing on, okay, one guy had the knife. The guy who's walking down the street, the alleged perpetrators,

walking down the street. How does he fear that the victim's going to get a hold of his knife?

“Because that's what we're talking about.”

The moment before stabbing, did the perpetrator reasonably, reasonably believed death or great bodily harm? And you can say, yeah, I believe he was going to get my knife. How, though, how is he going to get it? You had it.

It's not like he was grabbing at it and he took it. Be detailed. How is he going to do that? Not just in theory, he could get my knife. So I just stabbed him.

And I think that that's at best what the guy's claiming. Well, there's more to the story because there are some key videos. They're not like our Florida courts. God bless you, Mark, where we have this sunshine lawn that we get to see everything that happens over in the UK.

You see nothing. So they're not releasing even the evidence publicly, at least for now. So I only have descriptions of the videos that they're showing to the jury. But apparently there was a video shown to the jury of NOAC scrambling over a fence to try to escape DIGWA after he was stabbed.

And a separate video shows DIGWA and his brother, accused NOAC of racially and verbally attacking DIGWA. And NOAC can be heard denying that. They're like, you called us a racially up at that or whatever. And NOAC in his dying declaration denies it.

DIGWA is heard saying, "No one stabbed you, bro. You're something up. I presume, F.D. You're drunk." Meanwhile, he knows full well he stabbed him.

That's not even in contention in the court case. But in the moment he's trying to sell the man he stabbed, that he didn't stab him. And the dying man is saying, "I'm stabbed." And I did not call you anything racial.

Another video was played to the court and which DIGWA's father was there. He was traveling around, I guess, with his whole family. Saying he's pretending. A minute ago he was talking to you guys. Now he's trying to get up and going to leave.

Throughout the video, NOAC can be seen lying on the floor as DIGWA's family and neighbors tell him to sit up and listen to this. Two days after the murder reports the South Hampton Times. Police covertly recorded a conversation that took place between Vikram DIGWA and his brother, Gerprit.

And a conversation, a transcript of it was read to the jury. At one point the defendant's brother tells him, "You should say it was self-defense." I mean, this seems open and shut to me.

if it weren't for the crazy attitudes about race in the UK.

“I just want to kick it off with the most bizarre story on the internet.”

It's not legal, but you might have thoughts. It's this mask guy, alleged mask guy. I know you've seen it. He went on Fox News and his name is Robert Hardward. He is of Centcom, formerly of Centcom.

Central Command in the Middle East. He's a military guy. And he was speaking to my old pals Bill Hammer and Dana Perino on my old show, America's Newsroom. And that video has now gone super viral

because if you focus on his neck right above his shirt, it very much looks like the bottom of the mask that has detached from the skin. I don't know what else this could be. There's some speculation by someone lying saying,

"Maybe it's a shadow." It doesn't look like a shadow to me. But it's kind of hard to swallow mask. We have other video of this man from other hits he's done. And I will say he looks a little smoother in his America's Newsroom hit.

Then he does in some of his other videos. So it's like, "I don't. Maybe I have no idea why he would be in a mask."

At first I saw it and I said,

"This is some crazy conspiracy theory. People are nuts." But it's gone so viral with so many people who I consider legitimate reporters. Non-conspiratorial people saying,

"What in the hell is this?" That we got to talk about it. Any thoughts, Mark?

“I saw you shaking your head, yes, or not in your head?”

Yes, what do you make of it? It's just bizarre. I don't know what to make of it. The first thing is, I thought it was a given that it was a mask. Then you're raising, "Well, it could be a shadow."

Oh, wait. Let's give the presumption of innocence here. Maybe it's not a mask.

If it's not a mask, then what the hell are we doing talking about it?

Right? But if it is. What is it? Well, Viva Fry, who we love, he's a lawyer too, he's a journalist, and he said he thinks it's a shadow. He thinks if you watch this mark, which is horizontal across his throat,

right exactly where a mask that you might pull over your head would end. He thinks it's mirroring his lip movements. And I can see what he means there. It is kind of mirroring his lip movements. So I don't know what that tells us, Janna.

I don't know what we do, but Viva Fry is also that somehow it's a reflection of the teleprompter. But Viva, there would be no teleprompter for the guest. You guys have been guests on Fox News countless times. The guest does not get a teleprompter. At best, they get a little camera that they look into.

So, and the camera doesn't cast shadow on the guest. So I don't, maybe it's his shirt causing a shadow. I don't know, Janna, what do you think? Well, I originally thought before I realized that this wasn't the zoom. Sometimes zoom when it enhances your image can make things look really weird.

But I actually think if it's a mask, this guy's onto something, Megan, hear me out. I know this probably doesn't happen to you, but it's happened to me.

“How many times do you wake up in the morning one day?”

And you're like, oh no, my bow top. Wow, right? And then you have TV, right? But some big thing, you got to be confident. Shoot. Okay, let me get the mask. And until you can get to your bow top top.

Objection, unrelated. I love it, you can check. No, what is it? It would be so helpful. Wait, we actually pulled video from the internet of somebody putting on an ultra realistic silicone.

Yes, I still remember. Right. Amazing. Right. Watch this.

Alright, so the listening audience, you got to go to the show at 44 after the hour. And look at this. He's putting on his face. He's pulling it to sort of get it on the nose properly. He's putting the bottom neck underneath his T-shirt.

He's putting on a cap so you can hide the weirdness. Oh, he looks very creepily real. Yeah. Would not know. Megan, any interest of disclosure?

I just wanted to say something. Oh, gosh. Don't break me out. No. You're freaking me out.

He's pretending to fall off his mask. Let me tell you something. So the internet was going nuts with this last night. Yours truly included. And one of the clips that started to circulate was of the, I didn't even know there was such a person.

The former chief of disguise at the CIA.

Who doesn't want that job?

The name is Johnna Mendez. And she went on, you know, the singer Jennifer Hudson. She had a talk show for a while. And this woman went on and we're like, so random. What?

The former CIA chief of disguise speaking to Jennifer Hudson. And talked about how this is absolutely something they do at CIA. A full head mask that you put on over that that has like the neck ending. They used it. And she talked about when she revealed it to a former president in the oval office.

Watch this.

“What's the most memorable moment from being in disguise for you?”

There were a number of them.

But the one, I mean, one that has to stand out. I went to the White House. And I briefed George H. W. Bush, the president at the time while I was wearing a full face mask. So we're sitting like this close together. And I'm telling him that I'm going to show him the best disguise that we have.

And he's looking for a bag like where is it? I said, why I'm wearing it. And I'm going to take it off. And I reached the start taking it off. And he said, stop.

And he got up and he walked. And he looked and he looked and he didn't know as a mask. He wasn't sure what I was wearing. He sat back down. He said, OK.

So I took it off. And I was holding it up in the air so he could sit. My whole head, it had hair and a face and a neck. So you could walk around as someone else. Absolutely. And that would be the disguise. Absolutely. That was a great disguise. Go Jennifer. Go Kelly, Jessica, Jessica, Jessica, Jessica, Jessica, Jessica, Jessica, Jessica, Jessica, Jessica, Jessica. I think her little mask up, like almost like a severed head, sitting in the oval. And it's, it is not impossible at all that this guy for some reason was wearing an actual mask.

We just don't know why. Now if this guy's former CIA talking on America's newsroom, I think I'd be convinced Mark, but he's former sent com. And he doesn't, yeah, he doesn't have, he's bald. He doesn't need to worry about the hair, the wrinkles, maybe he's not bald. And also, unless this isn't him, like I think that's the theory by some. So here's an earlier shot of him on a different appearance where he does look a little bit more rugged and less smooth than in this other one on America's newsroom.

“But I think that the, the question is, guys, was it actually this man Robert Harward on America's newsroom?”

Because, you know, I, I've listened to the audience, many of them thought that Joe Biden had a look alike or sort of a stand-in who wore a Joe Biden mask many, many times. And there would be videos on the internet that they cut were like, you could see the height differential. We had tons of video of Joe Biden next to Jill Biden. And in a couple of videos, you know, and he was in firm, you'd see him much shorter, like almost her height. And people will be like, whoa, what happened? You don't shrink, you know, by six inches.

So can we rule it out or are we just getting pulled into the madness that's in the eat the right now with all the aliens coming out? And like, all the things we were told were bullshit or true. Big foot is alive. We, we, we know that now. It's real. We did a segment on that out of America's newsroom at the time. Oh, no, no.

In the don't rooms of summer, eyeglasses, it's hard. It's hard to fill the two hours of airtime. Can we just talk about a murder? Oh, I know. Something simple to solve.

All right, so we don't have answers. Is that, is that basically where we know now?

“Who, what's your vote? If you have to vote, what, was it a mask or not? What do you say?”

John, uh, it kind of looks like a mask, but if you're that sophisticated, we're going to put on somebody else's face. Wouldn't it be a little bit longer? Wouldn't you wear a scarf like a austen power? Do something to cover that up? There's like an ask. Yeah, I'm going with shadow. This is much to do about nothing. Nothing.

I don't know. Really? You don't know. Woo, just like the bottom of a mask, it really does. I guess I'll go with shadow because, you know, Occam's a razor, simplest explanation is usually the best. And again, why would this guy be wearing a mask? And his voice sounds just like the voice of the actual Robert Harward in other hits.

So I don't believe it was a different person. Um, but will we ever know he's going to have to put out a statement. I guarantee you we are T-minus like two hours from him putting out a statement or doing a hit.