530 - The Great Guy Law-Time Spectacular Part II

This is exactly right. [MUSIC PLAYING]

On the look back at the podcast.

The next is 79, that was Big Mama for me. 84 is big to me. I'm Sam Jay. And I'm Alex Eglish. Each episode, we pick a year, unpack what went down,

and try to make sense of how we survived it. With our friends, federal comedians and favorite others, like Mark Lamont Hill on the 80s. It was a wild, it was a wild year.

“I don't think there's a more important year for black people.”

Listen to look back at it on the "I Heart Radio" at Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. When you feel uncomfortable, what do you put on? Biggie. You put on biggie when you feel uncomfortable?

So I want to get confident. This is DJ Hesterprint's Music Is Therapy, a weekly podcast from me, a DJ and licensed therapist. It's mental health month. Let's figure out what actually works.

I didn't care about my life's circumstance

when I listened to that stuff.

It didn't matter to me. This isn't just a podcast. It's unconventional therapy for you every day. Open your free "I Heart Radio" app. Search DJ Hesterprint's Music Is Therapy

and start listening now. Sometimes a suspect is found guilty before a verdict is ever read in court. On the wicked words podcast, I talk with the writers who dig deep into the cases

that changed history, including Marsha Clark, who went from prosecuting one of the most famous murder cases to writing crime fiction. It doesn't matter that you didn't take part in the murder.

“If you were at the scene at all, you're guilty of murder.”

Every week, the real story is revealed join us every Monday for new episodes of "Wicked Words." Listen to "Wicked Words" on the "I Heart Radio" app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. (upbeat music)

- Hello, and welcome to my favorite murder. - That's Georgia Hardstark, that's Karen Kilgera. - And we have a very exciting extra special guest for you today. That is right, he's back from one of our listener favorite episodes episode 49, "The Great Guy Lock Time New Years"

back to Accular. - Only nine years. - Welcome, Guy. - It's good to be here. I mean, so much has happened for my favorite murder,

since, you know, recording in Karen's living room nine years ago. - Oh, is it my living room? - No, it's not in the mirror, it's just writing. - Don't, Karen had a much, had a house at the time. I had a shitty ass apartment.

- But that's how long ago was it? - Yeah. - Don't remember places. - Yes. - It was a while.

And so much has happened for you since that time. - Yes, but also along the way, like so frequently at shows, I've had people show up and be like, I heard you on my favorite murder, and that's why they showed up.

And so I went ahead and thank you guys. I don't think all the murder renaus who came to my shows. - Oh, that's so nice. - They definitely love you. We've heard about it.

It's such a funny, I mean, we just had a rewind episode where we like go back over an old episode and that episode came up. It came up 'cause you and I were working on Talk Show, the Game Show, which must be syndicated somewhere.

They must be playing it somewhere. - It's on Apple TV. It was for a brief and glorious period of time on HBO Max. - Was it really? - Yes, but then it went away.

- Well, people should watch it 'cause we did a great job. - We did a great job. - We really gave it our all.

“I think it says so much about murder renaus”

that an episode where we talked about the law for like an hour and a half is one of the top episodes we've ever done. And it just like says how smart they are. - Yeah.

- And they're like, can we be on topic? - Yeah, sure, sure. And I are like, no. - No. - Well, it is like, it's interesting to like,

as the show has evolved, just sort of like the deep dive energy of it, and like what it is that is so satisfying about it and created, let's be honest, the true crime revolution of the last decade.

(laughing) It was on Hacks. There was a joke that Madison Square Garden had only been sold out by a live Dungeons & Dragons and of true crime podcasts.

- Oh, okay. - And I was like, will they think this is an attack? Should be clear, it was not my pit. (laughing) - True, that's not a negative.

I don't know, I'm hearing that. I think like, yeah, speaking of Hacks, that's what you've been writing on this couple years and a couple seasons now, right? - Yes, it's very fun, it's the last season of the show

and so it was good. It's very rare that you get to like, land the plane on a scripted show and like, that's really satisfying, but also a lot of, you know, responsibility

and also just like, when you have a show and it's great performers and like all of the craft

people are amazing and everything like,

this year in the neck, in the episode that comes out tonight, we just told them, we described address to them and then they got to create a dress. Like, Rory, one of our costume designers who worked for Bob Goddam Mackie,

got to make a playing card dress and it's like, wow, wow, wow, wow. - Now, can you tell us what Jean Smart is actually like?

Like, I had a very small part in the first season

and it was the first episode that they shot because it was during the pandemic and they couldn't do a pilot. So it was just there in cast holding with Jean, all day long and she was just like, you know,

my mask had flowers on it and she was adoring it and she just, she's so kind and wonderful and then Hannah Eindminder is somebody who I knew from being a scrappy little comic and then she has this job and responsibility

and she's so beautifully like, risen to the occasion and matched her

“and you know, I think we all love those shows”

where you have a female friendship and female contention that is all of the beauty and the complexity of so many other relationships that we have and to watch them fill that up has been really awesome. - It's such a special show, it is so realistic

with that relationship that they have. You're like rooting for at the same time being like, why are they talking to each other? I also want them to be best friends. - Yeah, well, and it's like, you know,

like you have to have these intergenerational relationships for people to be able to grow and change and it really is a show about somebody who had the option of not growing and changing

and then gets shoved out of her comfort zone and those are the kinds of stories I like best. - Now, you've also because you're a Renaissance man, you've done other things like, oh, I don't know, gone on to Jeopardy and won, you won.

- I didn't win the first time to be fair. - Okay, well, but I went on and I lost two people who were like multi-day champions and then they were kind enough to have me back for the second chance as tournaments.

- Okay. - And then I got to win a game and it was thrilling and delightful. And like the first time I was like emotionally wrecked,

“I was just like, I had spent the majority of my life”

waiting to get on Jeopardy and then I did and I failed. And then the second time, you know, as everyone does, I ended up losing but it's like, I got to play so much Jeopardy. - I was just happy that I got into play so much Jeopardy.

- And you knew how to use that button. You know when you watch people and they're like, they're trying to complain or whatever, it's like, you, I feel like you had it. - But also I am a middle-aged man

and it is like, I do not have the responses

and have always been better at arcade skills.

So I was not as on top of it as I wanted to be, though there is like a beautiful world of like at home, zoom, fight club Jeopardy. And I'm much better at that bus or like I'm very, I'm deadly on that bus.

- What was your like category that you were like, I've got this? - Okay, so for me, any time I see a Jeopardy category, I'm like, what is going to be there? And it was fictitious resonances.

And I was just like, Howard Zend is gonna be in there and then I fucking got the daily double. And the daily double was God damn Howard Zend. - Holy shit. - And it was just like, oh yes, yeah, that's a moment.

- And they were, okay, but also I had a real failure. The daily double that wrecked me was it's alphabetically first of the birthstones. And my mind was immediately in the 1980 and World Book and Cyclopedia.

But it listed like multiple alternates for every month. I immediately was like, amethyst, but there was anything that could go before amethyst and then I stayed in my brain too long and then it went for a purpose.

And then I said, agate, like an idiot. Yeah, I mean, it was like, it was, I had the answer and I should have just run, - Was it amethyst? - It was amethyst.

- It was amethyst. I should have just run on a gentleman. - Yeah. - And I didn't, and that thing between like, should you second guess or should you just adrenaline

is always, you know, it's the roughest

in like, stand-up is supposed to teach us you go on the adrenaline.

“- I think it's a different, if only it was stand-up.”

- Yeah. - There are so many other, when I watch it and I watch people who are surprised that other people are as smart as them. - Yes.

- There is that vibe of like, how do you know amethyst when I'm the one that you're saying amethyst? - And like, because it was from LA, they had me come in as an alternate and I had to watch a full day.

And I watched several days where girl categories just went unspent. Like three boys were like fashion. I have nothing and I was just like, - Amethyst.

- Amethyst. - The day before I was there, the final jeopardy was about wicked and no one got it. - Oh my God.

- Yeah, it was just like, it was waste. - It was so waste. - The thing is, as I had assumed, I am in human being who is no longer scared of live television.

- Yeah. - You know, an eye assumed that that would help me in some way. - That's right. - And that answer is no.

Jeopardy is ancient magic. Like that is not television. It is something else there on the Sony Lot. - You know? - It can Jennings affect your performance at all.

I feel like him being the end-all champion is like a big part of it. - He's so good at the job. Like he's so good at the job. He knows how to be funny and charming

and present and effortless. And he did just in that he is so clearly disappointed when people don't know things that they really should know. And there were a couple, like there was one time, God damn Jeopardy guy.

- Yeah. - All they were asking for is for you to say the mors. And I said the avocids, I was trying to figure out, like I was like assuming that they wanted the Muslim caliphates from the era that went into Spain.

- You're going complicated. - Yes.

- I'm sure. - It's like shaming. - Just the look on Ken's face of like, "Ah, what the fuck is this?" (laughing)

- Yeah, yeah. - Disappointed Jeopardy hosts have to be like something that you'll carry with you for the rest of your life.

I've never seen it, thank God.

- Jeopardy? - No. - Oh my God. - No, because you don't have to watch it. - Jeopardy hosts being disappointed in me.

- Oh, yeah. - And I never will. - But I just want to say, we collectively, as a community, have been cold shouldering Ken Jennings on the best game show host, Emmy.

For like four or five years now,

“and I think it's time for us to calm down.”

- Truly. - And just show him proper respect. - I think so too. - It was one of the biggest fights me and my sister got into because my family is a Jeopardy family seven

of clock, like, for 30 years, whatever. And my sister got into the fight when they were running through the different hosts. And I'm like, it's Ken Jennings' hands goddamn down. He earned it on the back end.

He's now earning it on the front end. - Yeah. - What other past champions could come and do that job? Like that, where he is doing it in the spirit of, I'll extra back, but not it's a totally different thing.

And I can't remember she bought into some other guy where I'm like, now I'm mad at you and they're like, every night it was a fight. - Well, I feel like Hollywood would respect him more if he went off and did like a light travel show

or something like that and showed him as I'm a host. - That's not who he is. - No, he's on jeopardy. - And then when he comes to Seattle, raising those kids.

- Yes, that's right. - Being a normal guy, we are stands for him. - Yeah. - We're Ken Jennings' hands, 100%. - Do you remember when Diana Ross,

double-tapped little Kim's boobs at the VMAs? Oh, what when Kyle Hay said that George Bush didn't like black people? I know what you're thinking.

“What the hell does George Bush got to do a little Kim?”

Well, you can find out on the look back at a podcast. I'm SamJet and I'm Alex English. - Each episode, we pick you here. I'm pack what went down and try to make sense of how he survived it.

- Including a recent episode with Mark Lamont Hill waxing all about crack in the eighties. - To be clear, 84 is big to me, not just 'cause of crack. (laughing) I'm down to talk about crackle day, but yeah, yeah, yeah.

- No, no, no, no. - Just so y'all know. - I mean, at this point, Mark, this is the second episode where we've discussed crack. So I'm starting to see that there's a throughline.

- We also have eights on the table. - Okay, that's so cool. (laughing) - Why are you finishing that sentence, man? - Yes.

I don't think there's a more important year for black people.

- Really, yeah, for me, it's one of the most important

years for black people in American history. - Listen to look back at it on the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. - May is mental health awareness month, and your 20s, they can feel like a lot.

On the psychology of your 20s podcast, we unpack the anxiety, the overthinking, the heartbreak, the identity crisis, all of it that comes with being in your 20s, because if you've ever thought, is anybody else feeling

this way, they definitely are. - I feel like my 20s was a process of checking off everything that I was not good at, to get to what I was good at. Oftentimes we take everything a little bit too seriously

and we get lost in things that we later on decide weren't even important to us to begin. - When there was a large chunk of my 20s that I was just so wanting to like the out of that phase out of my skin, and I just like really regret not living

in the present form. - Each week, we break down the science behind what you're going through and give you real tools to navigate it. Your 20s aren't about having it all figured out.

They're about understanding yourself just a little bit better. Listen to the psychology of your 20s on the I-Hot Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or whatever you get your podcasts.

- This season on Dear Chelsea, with me, Chelsea Hander, we have some fantastic guests like Amelia Clarke. - When like young people come up to me, they want to be an actor or whatever.

“My first thing is always, can you think of anything else?”

- You can do better, big. - Because for today, do that. - Dennis Leary. - I wake up, and I'm hitting him in the head with a water ball, and Bruce Jenner is on the aisle

in a karate stance, like he's about to attack me, like making karate noises. And he's been tired, the Kardashian family over there, everybody's going, and the air marsh is trying to grab my arms and scream.

- I immediately know that I've been at Sleepwalk. - David, oh, yellow, oh. - I love this podcast, whether it's therapy, or relationships, or religion, or sex, or addiction, or you just go straight for the guts.

- Guy, Branam. So anyway, no coconut min, broke up with Keith Thurban. - Being half of a country couple

was always a hat she was gonna wear,

not like a life she was gonna leave. - Oh, interesting, I like that. - Did you practice that on your way? (laughs) - Gating moderato from Stranger Things. - Sayon, I'm Moju, Camilla Morone,

Carrie Kenny Silver, and more. Listen to these episodes of Dear Chelsea on the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts,

- We have a podcast to do with this. - Oh yeah, okay, so yeah, this was one

“of the all-time favorite podcasts episodes”

when you were on. The great guy, a lot of time, New Year's spectacular. - Yes. - Erad, December 28th, 2016. - Where were we ever sitting on?

- I mean, almost a decade ago. - I mean, a pandemic, like the number of things that have happened, you know? - Or real, it's hard. - So many, it's hard to wrap your head around.

- But what we thought it'd be a fun to do, we have some emails from listeners

from the year you were on that we just never answered.

And also currently because we just did the rewind episode and talked about you again. So we just wanted to, I don't know, give you some feedback on your poor formats. - Yeah.

- Well, there's just a lot of he's a national treasure, bring him, but demands to bring him back. And then Chronicles of Kathy writes in, and I think that's Instagram writes in, chiming in with everyone saying,

"Bring at Guy Brand, I'm back on." I think it's a demand. And then they were talking about that was because of the rewind. So basically people heard it

“and were like, "Why haven't you done this already?"”

They're just great. If, you know, we love the outside producing. That's always fun. - bureaucracy runs slow at exactly the right media, so it's taking 10 years.

- Well, also to be fair, at that point in time, I was 15 years out of law school, and it was a reasonable thing for me to talk about. Now it's an additional 10 years, it really. (laughing)

- It's even fuzzy. - But you can fake a whole thing. We don't know, we're not Ken Jennings. We don't know the current dancer. - Say any damage to us.

- We'll shake our heads. - Hell yeah. - Well, this one is very, it was emailed in 2018. It says, "Hike, Georgia Karen and Steven wanted to reach out because U3 plus Guy Brandham helped me get into law school."

- Oh, that's so cool. - During the admissions process, each applicant is required to submit a personal statement, a double space to page essay about why you want to be an attorney.

My first iteration got a unanimous sums down from my friends

because the mention of your podcast made me sound creepy, below is the excerpt. I continued my four days into true crime spurred on by the weekly release of the podcast. I came to love call my favorite murder.

Two women hilarious in their own rank, get together and talk about interesting murders. With an audience that feels like it was filled with our closest friends, I felt pulled to join the police force

or look into going to school for psychology until episode 49, when the ladies invited a guest on the show, Guy Brandham, a law school graduate of the University of Minnesota. His responsibility was to correct any of the past liberties

taken with the law and how it operated in the stories discussed. He spoke candidly about the differences between first and second degree murder, the burden of proof, falling to the prosecution, and what was necessary for a murder to occur in the first place.

He challenged their assumptions as a pair

and mediated a disagreement about why statutes

of limitations exist and are fair. He just said, "That was a big discovery." He discussed the law in relation to gruesome crimes in a matter of fact, manner, and it peaked my interest. Much like the ladies of the podcast,

I had strong feelings about how the law should operate, but no base of knowledge of why or how it sounds right. In my admissions essays final iteration, the podcast has a much smaller presence. In the two short pages, applicants are given to describe

their life, their hardships and their motivations. I felt strongly that MFM could not be left out. Thank you all for inspiring your listeners every week. Your podcast has altered the course of my life, much love from an Oklahoma girl chasing her dream

in Boston, SSDGM Zoey Kent. That is so love for me. Oh my God. That is so touching. Also beautiful to know that Zoey, by this point in time,

has a much more like jaded and cold understanding of facts than I could have ever hoped to have. Email update from this week. Oh, no. Kate Shalembach reached out.

No.

“To say, "Hey, we have to remember when you sent this email."”

So she wrote an email back to Kate that said, "I am currently a divorce lawyer in Edmund Oklahoma. "I found, after two years of misery, "that practice in the courtroom is not what I'm cut out for. "It turns out I'm quite non-confrontational

"for a law school graduate." So my boss, a 76-year-old man, or tested in the courtroom, runs the front facing side and I'm his right hand man doing prep work behind the scenes. "All my best to you and the MFM team stay sexy, Zoey."

That's so cool. She did it. You're a law influencer. What? Yes. (laughing)

But also just that thing of like all the real decisions get made outside of the courtroom. You know, the real work is done, especially with something like family law where you are having to solve real problems.

And there is no, it's the best answer, not the right answer. You know? Like, that's so cool. Isn't it good? Yes.

Yeah, there's a couple of those. Yeah, I have a couple of those too. George and Karen, no time for pleasant trees. I'm too excited to tell you my celebrity story. It's deeply known among my family and friends

that I cannot and will not remember celebrity names,

Same.

“My attempts are considered comedic entertainment”

when really, I tried my best. Tonight as I start dinner in the kitchen, my husband put on a TV show for us that we recently started watching called Plotana. (laughing)

As the show plays a realization dawns on me. I yell, I know who that is. And proceed to ask my husband to look up the entire episode cast. Mind you, I wasn't watching the show only listening, husband says you wouldn't know the actor,

and I proudly prove him wrong. That's right, it was Guy Brannam and his un-mastaken voice. (laughing)

I finally guessed a celebrity thanks to your amazing podcast.

The episode 47 Live at the Bellhouse is legendary, partly because Guy is laughing in the audience. And that's just the greatest. Yes, that's right. I've heard a lot of people say sexy and learn your celebrities

through M.F.M. Collab's Jenna Sheer. One of my favorite moments is somebody one said to me, "When you at Sandra Bernhardt's album taping, I was like, "No, I wasn't." And then I was.

(laughing) - You forgot. - Yes, I didn't realize that she was taping an album when I had been the opening act. - Oh my God.

- But it is very fun on Plotana. I get to play a lawyer and the first season, everyone was constantly telling Roe's burn. You know, Guy went to law school, but also our second AD had gone to law school

and also been a Marine. She was like, why is no one ever mentioned. - Wow. - Roe's is very, very nice and very, very lovely. - But she's amazing.

“- I got to do very important work on that show”

because lawyer shows are constantly saying that people were interns and you're not an intern when you're a lawyer, you're a summer associate. And I was like Nick and Summer associate and he was like, "Thank you."

- I didn't. I would know that, right? - Oh, and there was also in the second season, in the second season, one of the characters are like a dumb legal thriller and they afterwards,

Nick was like, oh, if you can come up with something better than that 'cause I'm not a runner on that show. Like, this is just what we had as a placeholder and it was, they had chosen the funniest thing for it to be about.

It was about torcious interference with contract. And it was, no one else thought it was hilarious, but I thought it was the funniest thing on the list. - So sexy, can't beat that, can't beat that. (laughing)

- Well, here's what we can't beat,

is that we basically tricked you into doing the homework for the show today 'cause we know that you love the show and we've already done the kind of going over legal stuff. - Yes. - At this point, we don't want to hear it anymore.

Unless there's any updates you think we should know. - Oh, yeah. - Oh, no. Also, I don't know, the world has changed that look, our laws have changed in many horrible ways

over the course of the last 10 years. - We're really, really happy. - They're primarily to my knowledge, not about criminal. - No, yeah, that's very true. - But ever since the origin of this podcast,

like when you guys were doing hometown murders, I of course went with, there was a serial killer for my town, and I did that as a hometown murder, but I did book end up becoming aware of other murders from my hometown, and it is like,

that of murder that happens in this country, it's really, yeah, people are like, when are you gonna run out?

And it's like, unfortunately, never, never.

- Yeah, 'cause mine is like a little town, but oh, should I go into it? - Well, what's the town, Helen? - No, okay, so I am from a little farm town in rural Northern California called UBC.

We grow almonds and peaches and prunes and walnuts. - And serial killers. - And serial killers, you know, some meth labs, - Was that a sister city to Pebble Luma? - Yes, we share their meth is the same as our eggs,

and we ship them to each other. - I'm from about two hours northeast of where Karen is from. - Okay. - There are mountains in between, you know, she is poultry and dairy, and I am nuts and fruits.

- And with that, we have the full funding. Okay, yay. - And one of the other interesting things about UBCD, my little town, is that there's a really old Indian community

who emigrated like a hundred years ago, like back when Indian and Pakistan were still a British colony, mostly from a rural farming area in the Northern Indian Pakistan called Punjab.

And there were a couple of Hindu and Muslim kids in class, but it was mostly sex. It was mostly like people who practice the religion of Sikhism, which is that religion where all the due to beard and turbines and all the ladies

have braids. And it's a beautiful faith that really teaches that everyone is equal before God.

“And that's what, you know, regardless of race”

or gender or anything like that. And that's what it aspires to, but as with any religion, that doesn't always turn out. And that's sort of what the story is about. So over the hundred years that they've been in this country,

they've built up really prosperous farms, and they truck those fruits and nuts all over the west. And so now, like 40% of the truckers in California are Punjabi, about 20% in the Western United States. Wow, I just stop you really quick.

Because is this why you know so much? Oftentimes when guys on stage do in comedy, you'll do crowdwork where people will say,

that's their background, then you'll go into that thing

“where you know the city states or the counties.”

Yes, you see, be okay. It's like one language they grew up speaking based on what state they're from. Yes, it's like it's, but yeah, I grew up in a town

where it was like one third white people

who from Arkansas, Oklahoma, one third Mexicans and one third Punjabi is interesting. And so it's just something I took for granted. And our story begins with a trucker named Jotinder Singh Graywall. He was a long haul trucker in Uvis city.

Now, before 1965, very racist immigration laws meant that it was very hard for women to immigrate. So pretty much everyone's grandma in that town who is Indian is a Mexican. Mostly they ended up marrying Mexican ladies,

but since 1965, it's been pretty standard to arrange marriages with ladies who were from India. So in the early 2000s, when Jotinder Singh Graywall was around 30, he went back to his family's village and Punjab because his parents had arranged a marriage

for him with a registered nurse in bulgender core who was in her late 20s. They got married and they did not have a direct conversation with each other until the day after they got married. - Wow, really?

- Yeah.

- Wait, do you know anything about why

that wouldn't happen on the day up?

“- I think because you're doing so much stuff,”

there's like, you know, - Celebration, you're just busy. - Yeah, you're busy with it. - So do everybody but the guy, you're just married? - Yeah, like it's a tradition.

Have you seen Bennett like Beckham? - Yes. - They get mad at her sister and Bennett like Beckham because she's happy because she's getting married. And you're supposed to be like,

sad 'cause you're leaving your family's home and you're supposed to be sweet and scared by this whole thing. And so all of that business was taking place and then afterwards they were like, hey, who are you as a person?

- Wow, okay. - All right, and then one more piece of background 'cause this gets a little confusing. But six have this very complex naming rules and so all men have the name sing

which is frequently used as a middle name, sometimes as a last name, and that means lion and every woman has the middle or last name core, which means princess. And so both of the major players in this story

“have been aims and their last name is core.”

So I'll try to keep it from being confusing. The important thing to know is that Belgium, their core, the young nurse bride from India moved to Ubu City into a house with her husband Jitinder,

her mother-in-law, Baljit Core, who was in 63 and her sister-in-law, Keir and Jit man. And that's when the shit started going down. When Baljinder arrived in America, her mother-in-law, Baljit immediately sent back her dowry.

She was like, this is not enough. Baljinder is not enough of a catch to make that dowry worthwhile. She demanded more clothing and jewelry and stuff from Baljinder's parents who complied.

Baljit made her daughter-in-law do all the housework. She made Baljinder eat meals separately from the rest of the family and she was not allowed in the living room. It was a very similar relationship.

Baljinder wanted to study nursing so she could get licensed in the United States but her mother-in-law said her job was to take care of the house and have babies. Then in 2007, Baljinder got pregnant.

She was excited. She was doing her job. She was providing her family with airs. Then they found out she was having twins, even better. And then they found out that the twins were girls.

And Baljit, the mother-in-law, was living. So Jitinder was an oldest son. He was supposed to have an oldest son. Baljinder's sister-in-law told her that Baljit, the mom, was probably going to strangle her

for being pregnant with two girls. I mean, yeah, impossible. And then midway through the pregnancy, Baljinder lost one of the babies and her mother-in-law rejoiced.

She called the dead fetus, a pest from hell. Oh my God. And said they were lucky the baby had gone back where it came from. Oh my God.

Two weeks after having a sea section for the surviving baby, Baljinder was expected to resume doing chores for the family. Baljinder's daughter was considered an embarrassment so she wasn't allowed to socialize with her cousins.

And once Baljinder's daughter was in preschool, she asked if she could spend some time while her daughter was at preschool studying to get her nursing license. And Baljit said that Baljinder's job

was to stay at home and cook and clean. In 2011, Baljinder got pregnant again. And her OB-GYN and meninger Jit at wall

said that she was always quiet and fearful

during her obstetrics visits. And when she, an injured Jit the doctor, told Baljinder that she was pregnant with a girl again. I'll help her close. Baljit ordered her daughter-in-law to get an abortion.

They were not wasting any more time or money on girls. Baljinder needed to have a boy or nothing at all. According to Baljinder, Baljit would put flour or other slippery things on the floor in the kitchen

in hopes that she would slip and miscarried. Oh my God. Baljit regularly mentioned that it was no big deal for men to get rid of their wives

And then, on October 24th, 2012,

“when Baljit was 68 years old and Baljinder”

was 38 years old and seven months pregnant, the women were in the kitchen of their home. And Baljinder was feeding her daughter breakfast. And Baljit, this baby's grandma got mad. She said it was a waste of groceries

to be feeding a daughter and yelled, "All you do is eat at the little girl." Baljinder tried ignoring her. And after the daughter went off to school, Baljinder was studying for her nursing credentials.

Baljit came into the room and accused Baljinder of having an affair.

The second daughter could not possibly be Jethinder's son.

Baljit started pulling Baljinder's hair. Baljinder testified that her mother-in-law said, "Today is the day we're going to end this. You die with a baby dies." Baljinder snapped.

She went into the garage and she found a small hatchet and she walked back into the house with it. By that time, Baljit had calmed down. So Baljinder put the hatchet down. But when Baljinder tried to leave the house to go study,

Baljit started yelling at her and jabbing Baljinder's stomach with her glasses. Baljinder said she was convinced that she had to do something to save her baby. She later testified, "I was blinded at the moment.

"I was out of my mind." Baljinder picked up the hatchet and hit Baljit in the head with the hatchet seven times. - Holy shit. - Causing four skull fractures.

Baljit fell to the ground and Baljinder took Baljit's scarf and strangled her with it. Once Baljinder realized what she was doing, she said she tried to loosen the scarf. There were no witnesses.

Baljit's daughter later found the body around noon. But Baljinder just left. She went and she hid the hatchet in a dumpster at a park. And then she went to her study session with her study partner

and basically tried to get her study partner

to give her an alibi to save it. She had been there when it happened. - So this is a woman who's basically emigrated here has no family here. - Yes, so she specifically tried to get her family

to start the immigration process for her family and Jeter was like, "No, that's not okay." So this is somebody who doesn't have super confident English, who doesn't have an income of any sort, who's entirely alone in this house

and is having to deal with this constantly every day. And then she just snapped. - Yeah, wow. - Yeah, so that night Baljinder told her husband about the killing.

She told him what it happened. And Jeter said that he was too tired to think about it and that they would deal with it in the morning. - So they had found her already and they didn't call the police.

- They called the police, they called the police, but they were like, "We don't know what happens." We don't know anything about this. - So when she admits it to her husband, he's like, "We'll deal with it later."

- Yeah. - So do you think that was just complete denial? Was he like, just-- - I'm sure it was overwhelming. Like it is just sort of like my mom's dad

and like this is what happens. - But also it is kind of bonkers to just like, it's hard after all of the dismissal that she deals with

“in this story to not just see it as another dismissal, you know?”

- But I wonder if that has been since he's so not present for the other abuse from the mother-in-law or doesn't isn't doing anything

or is basically co-signing it.

- Yeah. - It's almost like does he know that that was wrong and that essentially that's a part of it? - Right. - Two days later, Jethinder took Baljinder

to the sheriff's department to explain what had happened, but he warned her to not drag his mother or his family through the mud. So clearly he was aware enough of what was going on that he understood that if this could be embarrassing.

- Yeah, but also there's a motive. - Yeah. - Don't tell them the motive. - Baljinder confessed to a Punjabi-speaking sheriff's deputy but at her husband's coaching,

she made no mention of her mother-in-law's threats or attacks. - Baljinder was charged with first-degree murder and an enhancement for using a deadly weapon. She was arrested and let's remember,

she was seven months pregnant. - Do you remember when Diana Ross, double-tap little Kim's boobs at the VMAs? Oh, when Kai and Hay said the George Bush didn't like black people. I know what you're thinking.

“What the hell does George Bush got to do a little Kim?”

Well, you can find out on the look-back at a podcast. I'm Sam Jet. - And I'm Alex English. - Each episode, we pick a here, unpack what went down, and try to make sense of how we survived it.

- Including a recent episode with Mark Lamont Hill, waxing all about crack in the eighties. To be clear, 84 was big to me, not just 'cause of crack. (laughing) I'm down to talk about crack, oh, David.

- No, no, no, put it. - Just so you all know. - I mean, at this point, Mark, this is the second episode where we've discussed crack. So I'm starting to see that there's a throughline. - We also have eights on the table.

- Okay, now so. (laughing) - Are you fishing and sensitive? (laughing) - Yes, I don't think there's a more important year

Really, yeah, for me, it's one of the most important

years for black people in American history. - Listen to look back at it on the I-Hard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. - May is mental health awareness month, and your 20s, they can feel like a lot.

On the psychology of your 20s podcast, we unpacked the anxiety, the overthinking, the heartbreak, the identity crisis, all of it that comes with being in your 20s.

“Because if you ever thought, is anybody else feeling this way?”

- They definitely are. - I feel like my 20s was a process of checking off everything that I was not good at to get to what I was good at. Oftentimes we take everything a little bit too seriously and we get lost in things that we later on

decide weren't even important to us to begin when. - There was a large chunk of my 20s that I was just so wanting to like be out of that phase out of my skin and I just like really regret not living in the present form. - Each week we break down the science behind

what you're going through and give you real tools to navigate it. Your 20s aren't about having it all figured out. They're about understanding yourself just a little bit better. Listen to the psychology of your 20s on the I-Hard Radio app,

Apple Podcasts, or whatever you get your podcasts. - This season on Dear Chelsea, with me, Chelsea Handler, we have some fantastic guests like Amelia Clarke. - When like young people come up to me and they want to be an actor or whatever.

My first thing is always, can you think of anything else?

- Yeah, you can do that, they're big. - Because we're gonna do that. - Do that. - Dennis Leary.

“- I wake up and I'm hitting him in the head with a water bottle.”

And Bruce Jenner is on the aisle in a karate stance like he's about to attack me like making karate noises. - And here's the tie, the Kardashian family over there. Everybody's going, and the air marsh is trying to grab my arms and scream.

I immediately know that I've been at Sleepwalk. - David, oh, yellow, oh. - I love this podcast, whether it's therapy or relationships or religion or sex or addiction or you just go straight for the guts.

- Guy, Branham. So anyway, Nicole Kidman broke up with Keith Serban. - Being half of a country couple

was always a hat she was gonna wear,

not like a life she was gonna leave. - Oh, interesting, I like that. Did you practice that on your way? (laughing) - Gating moderatso from Stranger Things.

Sayon, I'm Moju, Camilla Morone, Carrie Kenny Silver, and more. Listen to these episodes of Dear Chelsea

“on the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts”

or wherever you get your podcasts. - After this point in time, Bulgenders has been Jethinder drops her. He does not attend any of the trial. He's given her nothing.

He and his family are horrified by this murder. So Bulgenders alone in this country has no close family. And court records indicate that she needed translators most of the time, so not a super strong English speaker. She did not have an ally.

She was initially appointed a non-punjabi-speaking public defender, but her parents from India found a punjabi-speaking defense attorney in New York City named Mani Sadhu. A punjabi-American criminal defense attorney,

but somebody who had grown up in the United States and lived in New York City his entire life, looks like for law school. There are no law schools in New York City. - That's shocking.

Now, the question of how to defend this case is really, really interesting. In California, self-defense allows you to resist an unlawful act targeted you, or someone else. And it says you're allowed to use the level

of force required to prevent the offense, but for self-defense in California as in most states, it is required that a person have an honest and reasonable belief that it is necessary to use deadly force to prevent peril

to life or grievous bodily injury. So they themselves need to actually have the fear. A reasonable person in their place would need to have the same fear and it needs to be necessary.

While gender isn't a bad situation on multiple counts, she believed that her unborn child was in danger, but it is unclear whether another reasonable person would have had the same fear. It's probably not true that use of deadly force

was necessary to avoid it. It's very easy to say she could have just left. She could have just this, she could have just that. And the threat wasn't really imminent. You know, like the question of eminence,

what is the budget, what was she going to do is uncertain. - Can I ask? - Yes. - The fact that she went and got the hatchet and put it there and then walked away

is that like premeditation, 'cause if she had gotten the hatchet done it immediately, it wouldn't have been premeditation. Like, so one of the things about this is it's really interesting that it wasn't defended in that way with an attempt to lower it to volunteer,

to some sort of voluntary manslaughter or something like that, to say, because like for a heightened state,

or like crime of passion,

“you need that person to be in that state.”

And you're very right that like it would have been very easy to point to that cool down. But one could also argue that like the fight's still going on. - I don't know. - You know, but like going and getting a hatchet

is definitely premeditation. - And also just the weapon of a hatchet, like any time that's the story, it's just so extreme. - And also that it was fractured and that there's no mention of blood

is very fascinating to me because I'm like, why she hitting with the blunt end with a fraught or the edgy end. But also is it like if she were a smaller woman, in my head, it makes me think about that hitting

in a different way. - Like grab something heavy to defend yourself in your baby's that maybe the mentality. - Yeah, interesting.

- The obvious way to defend this case

would have been it thing called "Bettered Person Syndrome." I think you guys talked about it when you talked about the Francine Hughes case in episode 465. And that's exactly what Georgia is talking about,

saying that a person was so freaked out,

“they thought the only way out was an act of violence like this.”

A person is so psychologically distressed by a pattern of spousal abuse usually, that it makes the person believe deadly force is the only way to escape. It usually doesn't completely exonerate you,

but you get downgraded to some level of manslaughter. But that's not what Monty said you did. His defense was really innovative and I actually called him and spoke to him to understand more about it.

- Yes. - Well, the thing is, is like Stanford professors were like, oh, this is really cool, this is really interesting. And I wanted to understand better how he formulated this idea and it was really cool

because as somebody who was a member of that community, when I talked to him, he was just like, wait, I didn't formulate it. It was just my immediate reaction. - Have those guy doing our job better than we do?

A, just be rolling calls, you're investigative journalist now. - That's just like, this is a man from my hometown who is the same age as me. Like, you're not hard to find.

“- I have 100% being to his cousin's birthday.”

- Yeah. - Yeah. - That's amazing. - He said that when while genders family called him and explained the situation to him,

he had two-year-old twin daughters and his wife was pregnant with another girl. And he could only see this situation through the phenomenon of gender side. That is killing children and aborting fetuses

to avoid having girl children. He knew that this was a cultural idea that existed in South Asia and that it was an idea that could have affected his own daughters and it was something that he wanted to stop.

So he took the case and he put together a defense like no one had ever seen before. So gender side is a very significant issue in India and China in India because male children stay in the home. They contribute to the income of the family.

Girls go off to their husbands house. You have to pay for a dowry. Frequently, girl children can be seen as an economic burden. In 1984, a UN study showed that of 8,000 abortions

from six Mumbai hospitals. 7,999 of them were female fetuses. - That's insane. - In 1990, Nobel Prize-winning economist,

Martia Sen, estimated that there are 100 million women

who are demographically not present in the world. That is based on birth rates and life expectancy rates. Things are off by 100 million people because of the huge number of girls who should have been foreign or I also believe to some extent with victims of violence.

Monnings told me that he believes gender side in India is huge and it is trickled out here. - Wow. - And it's the first choice was getting a jury who would understand the problem.

So we got a jury that was 10 women and two men, including one Punjabi woman. And Monnings says that that woman cried repeatedly during the trial. Monnings' defense centered on the idea

that Bauginder defending a fetus inside of her was self defense. And that a reasonable person who understood the culture of gender side would understand that threat as imminent.

The way he proved it was really kind of strange, though. He called two expert witnesses, Sally Sutherland Goldman and Robert Goldman, who are Sanskrit professors at Berkeley. That's like an ancient Indian language

that is used in religious stuff, but nobody speaks. It's like calling a Latin professor to testify about Italian American families in New Jersey. That's very interesting. It's like you come from a town full of Punjabi Americans.

Why did you think that they were the people who were best able to testify? I've got this. But when I talked to Monnings, he insisted that Goldman's were the right experts

because they live in India six months out of the year. In his words, because most of the UBCD Punjabi's have lived in America for generations, the goldmins are more Indian than we are. He, a South Asian man, not me was saying that.

(laughing) The goldmins testified that Bauginder's testimony about her treatment by Baugit was entirely consistent with what we know of similar situations in India

The goldmins quoted a 2007 UN study that estimated

that 7,000 girl fetuses are aborted in India each day. A therapist who evaluated Bauginder said that she had severe depression and PTSD and, quote, "The abuse was escalating and she had no way out."

She felt trapped and afraid for her life. - She's afraid for her life. She's afraid for her children's life. And she hasn't literally no way to get out. Like that thing of when you were talking about

the actual exchange and then I was like,

“people will go, like, well, why didn't you just get out?”

And it's like, what run into the street and go where? - Yeah. - And hope somebody will help you even though you can't speak English. - Like, this place is alien. You don't have resources.

Like, you assume that even the people who speak your language are within your community might be inclined to agree with your mother-in-law instead of you. - Thank you. - Like, it's a terrifying situation.

- I mean, that is interesting why he had the Goldberg's command 'cause it's almost like their outsiders and can see the issue in a way that someone who's grown up in that culture, like, wouldn't necessarily see.

- The PR of this is a huge thing because the other thing to know about the sick community in America is that after 9/11, there was a huge increase in anti-sick violence. Why do Americans blame Muslims for 9/11

and attack Muslims and people they perceive to be Muslims? And since observant six wear visible turbines, the men, they'd been subject to a bunch of attacks and murders, including a murder in Arizona. I mean, like, not long after 9/11

and a shooting at a sick temple in 2012 that took six lives. Like, when I was growing up, it was a relatively insular community,

“you know, all of the communities in my area were.”

But after 9/11, the way that things changed, the way it became come to Vaisaki. Have some Samosas. Like, you know, these fireworks are for you as much as us and it was about an understanding

that communicating what sickism was about and positivity was really important. And in this case, got them so worried about how they were being perceived. Also to be clear, violence against anyone

for their religion is horrible. But these six were killed by people who hated a different religion and couldn't tell the difference. So they got this huge PR push and members of the community freaked out

by what this defense might say about public perception of their community, flooded money to do's phone, saying that he was dragging the community through the mud by highlighting gender side and making it look like abuse by mother-in-law's was common.

Members of the sick community step forward

with statements about how they had never witnessed

such aggression towards anyone who had a daughter and saying their mother-in-law's don't on their daughters as much as their sons. A prominent sick leader from Sacramento, Darshan Singh Mundi, said, "I've never heard of a single confrontation

over the gender of an unborn child." - But he's talking as a several generation in seek American, right? As opposed to culturally seek from India. - Right, and also somebody who is invested

in trying to show the best side of this community. It's like whether you have great sympathy with bulgender or great sympathy with bulgit, like there's the possibility of this looking very, very bad to outsiders in Yiddish.

We call it a "Shanda for the Goe-yap." You're embarrassing us in front of the gender house. And this was such a Punjabi-shanda for the Goe-yap moment and you had this Punjabi-American attorney who was leading it, who was doing the thing that was embarrassing

but he was doing it because he thought it was the most just and reasonable way of defending somebody who had been in a horrible situation. - Yeah, yeah. - So can I ask, 'cause I'm assuming, you know,

I went to college in Sacramento, being from North of California, but you've a city also being like an agricultural area that those kind of 9/11 vibes more intense or do you think because there was such a large Indian population

that there was more balance in you, the city? - I don't think there was more balance in you, the city.

“I think that, you know, it is a rural community”

with a lot of conservatism and a lot of guns. And I think that there is the awareness in the city of just like you went to high school with these guys. You know what's going on, but not everybody is directly from our community.

You have, you know, you go 10 miles in another direction and people don't understand. And so, you know, hostility and racism

that has always been there was even more intense.

And it was very sweet to watch these rural community temples like taking on this PR problem of like, how do we make people understand who we are? - Yeah. - So the trial for Bulgain, they're lasted eight days.

And the jury, the 10 women and two men, took a day and a half to come to a verdict of not guilty. - Wow. - One of the jurors, Michelle Strue, said, we believe she acted in self-defense of her child.

We didn't feel her decision was perfect. We felt she was not guilty rather than innocent.

- And that was for first degree, right?

They never lowered it to manslaughter.

- No, and that's the thing is that it would have made the most sense, like the most straightforward way of doing this is trying to get her eight years of volunteering manslaughter because she had been in a very difficult state.

His strategy was basically saying, if you understood this culture, the way that this woman does, if you had the same outlook as her, you would have reasonably thought

that this person was going to innately kill you or the other potential life that was in your body. And that was a big swing. But it was a big swing that worked all the way.

“- Is that on the prosecutor for not lowering the charges?”

- Oh, that's interesting. - Is it the prosecutor who would have lowered those charges? - Well, I don't know whether you could concurrently charge with both of them. Potentially, you could have offered a plea bargain

for that to just agree to it.

But it may have been on, that's a really good point that it may have been a situation where if, but also, that prosecutor did not understand what was going on. Like when he was interviewed afterwards,

he was like, there was a lot of uncertainty about these details and I think they thought that she was battered. Something along the lines of saying, I think that the jury thought that she had been the victim of domestic violence.

And I think that that prosecutor was seeing it with his law school brain through battered person syndrome and didn't quite understand or counter what money to do was doing.

And I think he probably would have needed to bring in some cultural experts to say this was not reasonable for her to be thinking this way. And he didn't even go at that.

“He was just saying, she hit her in the head with an axe.”

That's murder late, isn't she? - It's like they were trying to totally different trials, yes. - And that was why I was so fascinated and dazzled by what's he just sort of like outthought this guy and in a way that connected with the jury.

And like that's both being a good legal mind and being a good lawyer. - And tough, like it's like, 'cause you're saying only one Punjabi woman was on that, can you swallow this whole narrative?

- Right. - Can you learn this whole new cultural norm except it and then be thinking about this trial? - Yeah, and there is the way from the Punjabi community that this is a bad cliché of what that community is.

Like, and I understand that uncertainty and that fear. But I also, my sympathy is with Buljinder. You know, my sympathy is with this person who had somebody threatening the life of the fetus inside of them every day.

And that's gonna wear on you. - Yeah. - You know, Stanford Professor Robert Weisberg said this is a fascinating case.

“The defense accounting for cultural standards”

and gender science is plausible and obviously worked. Even if the threats weren't direct, given what the daughter-in-law knew about the mother-in-law's attitude towards female children, it's reasonable to believe

that if she was such a horrible, hellish person, post an unusual threat to Buljinder and her unborn baby. In addition to local press, the story was heavily covered by the Indian press for obvious reasons.

But it was also heavily covered by the American Catholic press. - Thank you. - Oh. - Because they like the angle that Buljinder was acquitted from her

to for defending the life of the fetus. - Right, how can we make this about? - Yes. - So life. - And if it says anything about the truth

of Buljinder's accusations, this Buljit car is not the only Buljit car who was killed by her daughter-in-law after years of abuse in 2011 in England, a woman named Rajlinder Corr beat her mother-in-law,

named Buljit car to death with a rolling pin. I found a bunch of cases between parents-in-law and daughters-in-law, going both ways. There was one case where they were like, "Sure, we'll give you the divorce.

"If you go to these two weddings in India, "she showed up to the two weddings in India, "and they took her out." Seeing that stuff for me, substantiated Buljinder's fears,

including a case in Bakersfield, California, where a pissed off daughter-in-law threatened to pull out her father-in-law's beard and shove it up his ass, and he picked up a revolver and shot her three times and said it was reasonable because she had dishonored him.

So that is the story of the murder of Buljit car. - Oh my god, we wouldn't have invited you on if we thought you'd do it better than us. It was so much fun, it really was fun, and it was something that I had found back in the day

when I was just searching around for stuff about one corona. - Right, exactly. - And I was just like,

this is so juicy, and when you first mentioned it,

I was like, "Oh, yeah, I want to do that. "That woman with the axe." Like, 'cause in my head, all I remembered was just a lady on a staircase with an axe, which I made up entirely in my head of the axe.

- The staircase. I love that you're doing a case that's your passion about because of the legal parts of it,

- Well, like the legal parts are so fascinating,

“and the social parts are something that,”

first of all, everything I'm saying is not what,

the opinions of Karen or Georgia or my favorite murder, and also we understand very much that these are delicate and sensitive issues about perceptions of a community, and I have so much respect for that.

But it's also a world that influenced so many people that I loved and grew up with, who saw various other flavors and signs of this perception of women that is at odds with the very fundamentals of sickism.

You know, like sickism, there's a cool holiday about one time when all the ladies had to get together and fight a battle. Like, it is very much a religion about everybody is directly equal before God,

but in practice, as we know from Judaism or Catholicism or any religion, like sometimes that doesn't happen in the culture, and it was really rough, and it's horrible that you went through it, and the other lovely thing is when I was talking to money,

we just talked for like 10 minutes, and he was like, you know, I got a callable gender. - Wow! - He was just like, and to him, you know, this guy is a criminal defense attorney in UBCD,

he's doing stuff every day, and to him, this was just a thing from 10, 15 years ago that he hadn't really thought about, but I was really impressed by what a smart and capable and conscientious attorney he was.

- Yeah, I love that the implications were so obvious to you, and he probably didn't even occur to him at the time. - He was doing the job, you know? - Yeah, I also love that you buried Deli, that there was the exact same murder.

So I like the same name, that's wild. - Well, no, it was really funny because they were a couple. Like, there were some bulgenders, and it made Googling hard, because these other things were popping up in their place,

but it made clear that there was this real, you know, power problem in that relationship,

“that, you know, when I think that's the really cool”

and interesting thing about looking at the world through murder, is like so much of the time, it is about a power and balance that comes to a head. - Yeah, it also like that idea that it's generations of immigrants, and it's like the first generation

is holding the old caste systems or the old ways or the old beliefs. And then every generation, it changes, and it gets, you know, the kids have a de-distenuous use and they're using slang and whatever,

and it's like that distance is part of what makes America great, and then... - It's so funny, I was working on a rom-com with a guy who's one of my new, so-live-as community college professors, who is a Punjabi Sikh, and I was describing a situation

that occurred with some of the women from my age. And he was just like, it doesn't work like that anymore. You know, it's like times have changed. What people, and it was very much about like gender balance and perception of women's value,

and he was just like, that's not the world anymore guy, and I had to feel old, and then, you know, we had to adjust the rom-com. (laughing) - Pre-right, wow, I mean, great, amazing job.

- That was amazing job. - Thank you so much, it was really fun. - You've done it again. - I love it, it was so good.

“Well, you have to come back and do it again, please.”

- Yeah, thank you. - Maybe in six years. (laughing) - Yes, yes. - That's not so long next time, but I just want to say to you guys,

and to everyone listening, how much I have appreciated in a tiny way, being a part of my favorite murder family,

and have always really felt it.

- That means so much, thank you, I love you. - We love you. - And that was incredible by the way. - Yeah, that was so great. Let's plug your things.

- Oh, yeah, that sounds terrible. - Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. - So your new comedy, stop that train. - Yes. - Tell us everything. - I got a small part in the Rebels Drag Race movie.

(laughing) It's very exciting, I play Train Traffic Conductor #1, Train Traffic Conductor #2, of course, played by Charo. - Are you serious? - You do spend time with Charo?

- I spent two days with Charo. There's no off-position on Charo, like she's just, she's never not doing it periodically, Adam Shankman would have to be like, "Hey, quiet down." Because Charo was telling me her origin

with the Roma people of Spain learning to play the guitar, like she's just unstoppable and amazing. - And she looks the same. - Yeah.

- We watch her on television in 1979, and she looks exactly the same.

She dances, she's incredible.

- Yeah. - She was unstoppable and it was so much fun, but the movie comes out on June 12th, and it's very much like airplane or ML Brooks movie, it is very spoofy and fun.

- Nice. - I'm so excited for that. - Awesome. - And then you're also going to do the Edinburgh Fringe Festival.

- Georgia, thank you for bringing that up. It turns out that tickets are now available from my show Be Fruitful at the Edinburgh Fringe Festival. So if people go to my Instagram and click on the link there, if you're going to be in Edinburgh or the UK,

it's a very funny show about fruit and religion and evolution and all sorts of things

But I'm very proud of the show, and if you're a murderer, you know, in Britain, please excuse me. - I mean, congratulations. Getting into the franchise as well as a big deal.

- It's truly terrifying. It's like so enormous, and I'm like, this will destroy me as a person. I'm no longer young, but it's going to let us go. - What a win, I'm going to let you go.

- I'm going to let you go. - The energy and the city is unbelieveable.

It's going to be such an incredible.

- What did you see that was good? - I saw a wrestling show that was about a medieval romance. - Oh. - And it was incredible. - Yeah.

- I mean, the thing I'm most excited for is just to get to be there and like deal with the personalities and see the stuff that isn't the same time as me. - Yeah. - And be in it all.

“- You have to go to the Frankenstein bar.”

Oh, right? Is that the one where like they do the whole Frankenstein? - It's a lot of it's a lot of bar. That's like the Frankenstein theme. - I don't idea, that sounds very fun.

- Well, I am like, well, if I'm there for a month, I kind of have to be in irresponsible child.

It's pretty much just drinking and having a good time

and make friends. - It's okay, it's calling to have to. - So we got platonic, we got hacks. - Yes. - Covered the fun things. - I mean, I'm clearly, we have a professional writer

coming in to play our game with us. Thank you so much for saying yes to this. We love you so much. - Thank you, it was so much fun. And also thank you for going on a ride to my hometown

and the weird specificities of that 'cause that part was really, really fun. - I think we all learned something, everyone. - A lot, thank you. - Well, amazing.

- Yeah, thanks Guy and thanks everyone for listening and hangin' out and we're gonna wrap it up. - Yeah. - Bye, you're saying, "Stay Sachs." - And don't get hurt or hurt.

- Goodbye. - Goodbye. - Elvis, do you wanna clicky? - Ah. (upbeat music) - This has been an exactly right production.

- Our senior producer is Molly Smith and our associate producer is Tessa Hughes. Our editor is Aristotle Acevedo. This episode was mixed by Lianna Squalachie. Our researchers are Mary Maglachian and Ali Alken.

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- Goodbye. - On the look back at the podcast. - The next seminar that was big moment for me. - 84 is big to me. - I'm Sam Jack and I'm Alex E. Grish.

- Each episode, we pick you here, unpack what went down, and try to make sense of how we survived it. - With our friends, federal comedians and favorite artists,

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Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. - When you feel uncomfortable, what do you put on? - Biggie. - You put on biggie when you feel uncomfortable? - So I wanna get confident.

- This is DJ Hesterprin's music is therapy, a weekly podcast from me, a DJ and licensed therapist. It's mental health month. Let's figure out what actually works.

“- I didn't care about my life circumstance”

when I listened to that stuff. It didn't matter to me. - This isn't just a podcast. It's unconventional therapy for you every day. - Open your free iHeart Radio app, search DJ Hesterprin's

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many of the bullets start to pluck your dear craft. I thought we were gonna die then. - The knife is a podcast about the moment or in their lives taken unexpected turn. - Real people, real stories,

and the split second that changes everything.

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