Rewind with Karen & Georgia - 90: Peak Experience

This is exactly right. [MUSIC PLAYING] [MUSIC PLAYING] Hello. Hello.

And welcome to rewind with Karen and Georgia. Every Wednesday, we recap our old shows with all new commentary updates and insights. Today, we're recapping episode 90, which we named peak experience.

This episode came out on October 12, 2017. All right, let's listen to the intro of episode 90. [MUSIC PLAYING] Steven, if you have to be like the fucking on the street reporter, when we're being so interesting--

Oh, it's weird. We're recording. A-V-A, everyone knows this.

Always be recording with us.

If we're going to talk about Gerard Depardew, we need everyone to hear it in the world. Breaking news, America, Gerard Depardew admits to drinking 14 bottles of wine a day. God damn, his teeth must be more stained than mine.

I mean, not stained. They're falling out. I mean, perhaps, but he's so drunk. He doesn't give a fuck.

“I think that's how much Andre the Giant would drink.”

Do you know that? Yeah, he'd eat like 12 chickens and drink like 17. Six packs of beer. I wish Vince were going to be going to ask him, because that's what he would actually do.

Vince always hated red wine, and then he found out that Andre the Giant loved Bordeaux. No, I'm sorry. He loved Boozole wine. So he tracked it down.

And now we drink Boozole wine. Oh, Andre the Giant. You know that I love giants, right? No, that's why it's one of my jams.

I had never even thought of that as a thing.

Yeah, I'm upset. Welcome. This is my favorite murder. The podcast. I want to start it.

I'm obsessed with giants. Because the rest of it was all bullshit. I mean, was it? Or was it some of the best podcasting we've ever done? That anyone's ever done?

I'm breaking the ground. America. Robert Wadlow was in the Guinness Book of World Records. And if you are a child of the late 70s or early 80s, like myself, before there was the internet,

before there were cell phones and smartphones, before there really even was that much TV, we just had four channels. You did things like sit in your aunts living room and read the Guinness Book of World Records.

Did that so hard, right? Fuck yeah. Twins on Fat Twins on Motor Cycles. Longest Nails in the world, nail on his hair, giant. I love giant.

I have no idea. Robert Wadlow was in the Guinness Book of World Records. This is Tullsman. I think the Tullsman from America. Yeah.

He was going to say seven foot well. (laughing) And this is my favorite murder book. Hello, now you know it's really us. That was the pin number of proving that it's us

by me saying Robert Wadlow was seven foot 12. Did I ever tell you my broad story in when I was in elementary school? No. I've had flat as chess forever.

Right. Now in the Guinness Book? Yes. As a matter of fact. No, but when I was little, I had no boobies.

Like most kids do. But like sixth grade when girls start to get their boobies. And so everyone was sitting around talking about like what broad size they have now and someone was like, I have a 34A and I have a this night and I went,

well, I have a 35A because they were like, that's not a, I was so embarrassing. Yeah. You're just, you're just trying to compete. You're just trying to get in there.

Yeah. When you just look at my anyways. But no, I just remind you. Every girl in that circle did the exact same thing at a different period of time.

Yes.

“And that's what no one ever talks about.”

And sometimes that's why people are so mean is because people were mean to them when it happened to them. So then when someone says that they could descend like fucking, and they're so happy it's on someone. They attention someone else and not them.

That's what it's all about. Yeah, you know, this is the reason I wish I had had this when I was done is how to laugh at yourself. Yeah, just no one can fucking make fun of you if you're like, oh my god, I can't believe I said that stupid thing.

Yes, it doesn't affect you. But I think when you're at that age, like you can't laugh at yourself until you're around 37 in my experience. That's how old I am. Oh, congratulations.

Thank you. I'm now laughing at myself. It's going to be so much fun. Oh my god, I can't wait. But the thing is you have to drink 12 bottles of wine a day.

You have to day-part do that shit. I got about three more bottles to go today. And then good. Let's get you there. Go there.

I just love that people have these interests, giants.

That you would never think of as a thing that you're really into.

“Have you ever heard of Anna Swan the Giant as of Nova Scotia?”

And of course not, I'm a normal person. She's humongous. She's humongous and amazing looking and she married a giant.

I love them.

“And they look her up because there's pictures where there are people standing in front of her looking up.”

And she's like two grown men standing on each other.

And they're hiding in a dress to get into the movies, dress as ants. But I love her because apparently people, she got constant marriage proposals. Oh my god. That's part of her story where I'm just like, "Where's this world?" Yeah.

I want to go to that world. I want to be a giant? Yeah. That's fucking cool. It's the best.

I'm sorry. I didn't mean to go back to giants. No, I want, that's all I wanted to talk about this all the time. Is Europe's actual giants. I really do love when people have this thing that they know all about in Europe's aspect

with. It's pretty cool. It's so cool. Hey, this is my favorite word of the podcast. That's Karen Calgary.

I'm George Hardstark. That's right. Okay. I have a couple of things this week to talk about. Now we're really being serious.

Before we start the murder, this is all right. Everyone could stop telling us to listen to Dirty John. Yes. It's a new podcast. It's happening.

I've listened to an episode and a half. Here's the two problems I have with it. One, Vince found out the ending and told me for some reason. But I didn't think, I'm not going to listen, just tell me and he told me, oh, then that's your fault.

It's totally my fault. And the other thing is the women, the daughters who are being interviewed in the podcast, they're from Irvine, which is where I'm from, and sound like every girl I'm going to high school with, and it's giving me fucking PTSD. That's a serious problem.

Yeah. Yeah. You don't want that in your head. I don't. But it's a good story.

And I'm excited to listen. I mean, people are going crazy about it. Yeah. It reminds me of Estown a little bit. I'm listening, I got my heart broken by Estown, so dear John, I mean, dear John, I'm in

Anita. Dear John, you mean the judge, her series? Yes. Um, people get obsessed, and here's what I love. I sit back when those things hit, and I just let him go.

I let everything wash over. And then I watch how the first wave is everyone going, this is amazing. You have to listen to it. The second wave is always, it wasn't that good, or it sucked. That's who I am.

Right. And then I wait a little bit longer.

And then there'll always be someone that's like, no, here's what, here's the situation.

Right? Nothing's perfect. But it gets you here, and you'll like it because of this, and it's interesting whatever.

“I think it's just, it's a different, it's such a specific story that it's not going to”

appeal to everyone. So, they're them saying everyone's obsessed with it, where it's like, no, some people aren't that into, like, you know, fraud stories or whatever. Okay, the other thing, and then Steven sent us this, like, a couple of news links, that some new photos from Jones Town came out.

Oh, all right, and it's from when they're in Ghana, right, and it's, it's basically photos that look like, I think this is what most of them are, like, from a brochure. It's propaganda. Like, trying to get people to move to Jones Town? Yeah, look how happy everyone is.

They're smiling, they're working, they're living on a commune, you know, and look how great everyone looks, although, you know, there's nests just in his race here, and everyone works, and everyone loves it, and then children are learning, but it's all fake. And then there's like one photo of, uh, there's a couple photos from the day, they all killed themselves.

Yeah, he killed them. He killed them. Yeah, he killed them. Right. And it's, it's just fucked up.

Yeah. So, if you're into that shit, like I am, some new pictures. Sorry, I had an update. No, please. That's one of lots of people have been sending, and, uh, I appreciate it.

We actually talked about it at L.A. podcast, but, um, the journalist Kim Wall that I did that story about, that the guy, Peter Matson, who built his own submarine, and then she was a journalist who went to do the story about it. She wrote around in this harbor with him, and then she ended up disappearing. She said that she hit her head and that he dumped her body at sea, and then her bag of her

body parts were found floating in the ocean, including her decapitated head with no injuries on it, which means she did not hit her head. And now Peter Matson is being looked into for unsolved murders in Norway and Sweden. Mm-hmm. I don't know that. Yeah, that's brand new. That's a story on AP from 10 hours. Oh my god, that's fucking cruel.

“I love, I mean, I don't love one, you know what I mean?”

No, well, just that this is developing. Yeah. This is unlike so many things where we're like,

and then we just never hear about it again. Yeah. This is still a developing story. And I think

it's because so many journalists loved her, and she was a well-respected journalist. And there's not a lot of murders there. It seems like. It's Norway and Sweden or wherever this is. This was Denmark, I think, right? Listen. Look, there's another show that's out. It's Mike judges tales from the tour bus. Mm-hmm. And this is completely off of any topic of true

who toured, worked for, had any thing to do with country singers of the past, telling stories about working with them. So the first, yes, exactly. We're just in general. Yeah. The first episode is Johnny Paycheck, who is the guy that wrote, "Take this job and shove it." Oh yeah.

And it's amazing. The guy was in, he was a lunatic. It's animated for the most part with

old footage as well. Yeah, it's, yes, exactly. So they'll show you pictures of the album covers and some real things, but then most of it is animation. And it's all these band members, hairdressers, relatives, it's so great stories. So there's so far they've done Johnny Paycheck, George Jones, and Tammy Wineette, and Jerry Lee Lewis, which is crazy. Fuck, and married his child cousin. That's right. She was 14. She's on it. She talked about it. Yeah, I need

“to watch that. She's, it's like, she's in her 60s. I just remember as a kid, Great Paul's”

a fire, the movie about the biopic movie. Sure. I loved him. Like, we went and saw it the movie. It was so great. It was so much fun. I loved it. It was pedophile. Yeah. Why were they letting me watch it? Parents? Well, it was a different time. And that's why we're trying to make America great again. Can I tell you what I did watch the, oh, sorry. That's okay. Speaking of pedophile, when I did watch the other day, and I hadn't

realized how long ago it had been since I watched it, was science at the lambs. Oh yeah,

I've seen the ending a million times, but I hadn't actually watched the first part of it.

It's so good. I want to cry. Yeah, they're Martin. If you're safe, I didn't understand any of it back then. You know what I mean? You mean when you first watched it? Yeah, like I didn't understand how she figured out how he knew who Buffalo Bill was and how this and how that because you know why I looked up what Yara came out and I saw it in the theater and I've seen it in a million times. I was 11 years old. Oh, sure. I watched it. But remember, watch science at the lambs and the

fucking theater, that's hilarious. She threw a comment her face. Yes, he did. And I was like, what was that? Georgia, the idea that you, I didn't know how could they let me watch that? No wonder I have a fucking true crime obsession. It's true. That's so funny because you were 11 watching that down in Irvine. I was 21 in Sacramento and we watched it at the tower theater and I remember this thing rolling out in front of me and I had already read the book and I was watching it every

second of it. I was just like, this is my favorite, this is the best movie I've ever had. I was losing my mind. So happy. It was my star wars.

“Oh, I'm a Lee. It was my star wars. I think because I was like, I have started 19. You're like,”

I love, I want to be her. That movie's amazing. That movie holds up. Oh, for sure. Love so charming.

Yeah, sounds of the lambs. Thanks, Mom and Dad. You've ruined me. No, look at me. I'm the best. I pick, I pick loving myself over photos. Do it. I'm trying. It's just a matter. I'd a really good day of loving myself up until I open Twitter and saw this picture where I'm like, am I in denial that I'm going bald and just not seeing it? What the fuck happened? And then I'm like, oh, that's right. It's my gray roots. Yeah. Fuck. Fuck everything. Fuck it. Fuck everything. Fuck it.

Fuck the world. Yeah. Fuck it. I mean, look. Listen. Like I said on the phone the other day. She's like, I mean, the bomb's going to drop, right? Oh, yeah. Let's do this thing. She was so good about like, I was flirting with a burry star or something like that. And then it was just like, oh my god, you're so right. It's, yeah, nothing matters. We're on a talk here, people. Nothing matters,

“but water is currency. Water is currency. Let's have some peak experiences before things go to shit.”

You know, my experience is something like something, someone on their way to a burning man would say. Totally. We're about to have a peak experience. Yeah. Let's try to get out there every day. And if your peak experience is drinking nine bottles of wine, do you like? My peak experience is staying at home and chilling out and watching, oh, I paid, oh my god. Okay, last thing. I sort of got Vince was gone all week out of town. So I was like going to be my fucking natural south,

which just turns out the most disgusting that like person. Like the sheets had been taken off before we left. And I didn't ever put sheets on my bed. Oh, I just slept on the random sheets I threw on top of. So you were kind of squatting in your own house. I was squatting. Okay. It was horrible. And then one night I was like, I'm staying home and drinking whiskey. And I want to watch cold case files. And then I get a text from then saying, you're watching cold case files.

And I realized it was because I had just spent $20 on season one of cold case files on our Amazon. And it's under his name and so it emailed him to let him know that his wife just spent $20. To watch season one, a cold case file. Of a show that probably if you put it into your DVR,

And you're like, no, I'm going to pay premium. No, I want Bill Curtis to have that money.

“I think he needs more brown leather jackets. And I'm going to be the one that buys them for what?”

I owe him. He has narrated our lives. He's narrated my life. He has brought a somber and reasonable attitude. Very reasonable. Terrible. Terrible. Marders and crimes. Yep. And he's been there for us. Thank you, Bill. And he let us know that justice was right around the corner. Oh my god, I love cold case files. Okay.

Was he the host of cold case files? You know what's where Danny Glover was originally the host? No. What the fuck? He's me swear to God, except fact check that statement. Like, swear to almost I think that you know it's going to be some actor that's like super similar,

but I can never remember who's home. Yes. Who's home though? Because you do remember to say home.

I mean, I'm not that stupid. Oh, I should say this. The Northern California wildfires are intense and crazy and huge swaths of where I grew up is burning down. I am obsessed with those photos, which is terrible, but in a fucking the comparative ones of the neighborhood and then it's just like the thought of your house being turned a fucking ash. Yeah. And those people, the people, there's like there's a neighborhood slightly north of the main city of Santa Rosa,

but Santa Rosa is the next city up from Petaluma. That's where we used to go to the mall to get close for school. You had to go to the next city. Yep. And the neighborhood, it's like a little bit

north of the of the main city. The people were woken up at one 30 in the morning with people's

just saying run. They didn't get any kind of emergency. It was just panic, grab whatever you could and run out of your house as your as like the flames were coming. Chivers think about like

“aside from pets, obviously, what you would grab. Yeah. It's pictures, I think mostly. Like my computer,”

that's the good thing is my sister started packing tonight, just in case because they're still more fires. And everybody now just wants to be ready. But we were like everything's on the computer. Like pictures are now on computers, like there's a couple of things. And they love my ship, but it's all just church keys. It's all, let's sort of send to my sister, I go, we can replace any warehouse, grab anything that's irreplaceable if you can. Yeah, I guess there's a photo album,

I don't know, whatever. You guys stay safe. And we are back into 2026. My God, do we're just talking about a brand new podcast called Dirty John? I can't imagine how Vince spoiled out for me. Like how did he know about it? He already known about the story. I doubt it. I'm the true crime one in the family. I don't know, but he just had the instincts where he's just like, yeah, it's that guy. That guy's no good. It's definitely speaking of being that guy no good.

Gerard Dipper do is just like a fucking trash monster turns out. Yeah, that didn't all be. It's so weird having to show this long. You can literally look back for like 10 almost 10 years before and be like, yeah, that didn't, that actually didn't pan out so well. That didn't age. Oh, it's talking about Gerard Dipper, dude. No, it did not. Him, us, nobody's getting out of here alive. I'm telling you that right now. Danny Glover, no way. No, Danny Glover is nothing to do with Colt K's files. What's up? Where did

“I get that from? That would be great though. Can I suggest it? I mean, I think you were thinking of a”

different show and a different host. But that was what it was like back then. I'm saying that we just didn't know anything and it was and that's okay. We really were like, oh well, whatever. It's for what out there. See if I'm keep recording because this is this is brilliant information that they need to do. It's still very funny. Also, sorry. Anybody's going to call me a late comer to this whole giant trend. I was so crazy. How hilarious. I was just talking about it. But I was like, you

like, I didn't know you like giants. What? That's right. We can't remember everything from 10 years ago. That's hilarious. It's actually perfect timing because MFM animated's newest episode is literally called Karen loves giants. I won't drop it. It's on our YouTube page at youtube.com/exactly right media. Well, you shouldn't because it's new information for me every couple years. Yeah, that's well, it's good to update other people about our little, our little preferences and our pecadillo. Sure.

Is it pecadillo? I was just thinking, imagine if they came out with an Italian giant. I'd lose my mind. They came out with this. Just like, there's a line. There's just a fucking apple comes out with an Italian giant that you can have. If you know an Italian giant, please email

it every flavor, right? It's like, there's gotta be someone do something about my needs being met.

I have other stuff to do and I can't do it for myself. It explains it 12 foot tall skeleton now, though. Like, really well. Yeah. You know, it's all been in there. Yeah, just waiting. I like the miniatures and you like enormous things. So oppositesies, we're going to get into this episode now and we absolutely should because oh, man, I can remember you telling me this episode and the information that you were giving about the real story behind the Amityville horror murders.

“Are you first from my first? I think it's you. See, then? I think it's me too.”

Yes. Oh, yeah. Yeah, yeah. Are we counting that? Yeah. We're counting what happens to us.

We're counting what we decide. Yeah, exactly. I'm going to go first. All right. Have a peak experience

with us. All right. It's October. Everyone's favorite month. It's fucking Halloween time. Listen, let's do this. It's like you're giving me a sales pitch in a voice that says I'm not interest. I'm not interested in working with you. Well, I did this murder because I wanted to do it and then I realized I could fucking tag it on to the fact that it's Halloween time. Oh, yeah. But it's very loose. Okay. So I don't, I'm not, I'm not married to it. You know, I mean,

got it. And I also watched this, the way I actually didn't think of doing this is I watched this movie on Netflix. Like a Netflix movie that I had heard nothing about called Little Evil that

ended up being so fucking good. Oh, good. It's basically if the kid from, um, like if Satan's spawn,

the spawn of Satan had a mother and the mother was eventually Lily and she married a man who became the spawn of Satan's stepdad and it is, um, Adam Scott. Oh, and it's so charming and so cute. And funny. I don't know how this just like went under the radar and Bridget Everett is like his sidekick. Wow. It's such a charming movie. So it's like, it's like comedy. It's a dark comedy. That's awesome. It's so good. So please go watch it and then I thought, oh, that's fun. So here it is.

Here's the story, the real story behind the Amityville horror. Yes. You're ready for this? Okay, just really quick. And I know I've said this a thousand times. The hardback book, the hardback book of the Amityville horror. So it shaped like a paperback, but it had a hard white cover. Huh. Was the book in my grammar school library that I checked out so many times Sister Rita Rose got mad at me. I forgot that it was that book. And now I feel like I've stolen a murder from you. You have not? Okay.

And I celebrate this and I'm thrilled. Okay. I want to tell Baby Karen a little Karen about this story. Well, she's right here. Well, I'm going to tell her right now. I don't want you to.

“That's what she's like. All right. So of course everyone knows about the Amityville horror. The”

movie. It's this haunted house. That's like, you know, inhabited by Satan and all this bullshit. But I don't know. People maybe don't know that it's actually based on an actual story that happened before the haunting. That's right. So here's family book, me and Sister Rita Rose. What I loved about the book was the fact or this story, whether or not it's true, is it starts out as they find out this horrible thing happened in their house. But then they find out that there's something

else going on. So they, but that could completely be for like the book and movie. Who knows if that part of the movie? A fucking telly. Sweet. Yeah. There we go. Yeah. All right. So the family, the defaio family, they consist of Ronald defaio seniores 44 and his wife Louise 42. Ronald is a car salesman at the family dealership. Super fucking successful. Mob ties. Maybe her obviously pretty much definitely. I mean, don't don't all the Italians have a mob ties. Oh my god.

She just defended a quarter of her. How dare you? So the random fucking card dealership is doing so well in Brooklyn that defaio family is able to move from their apartment in Brooklyn to a three-story colonial in the Charming Town of Amityville on Long Island, about an hour outside of the city. Do the whole thing on that voice. Okay. I was trying to be a real estate agent. Oh, that's fun.

“Yeah. That's why you put that knacker chip on. And beg some cookie. Yeah.”

All right. They chose this home and as you saw on the cover of the Amityville book, it's a piece of Americana. Two stories, plus an addict. It's huge and sprawling. There's a

Basically naming the house. So it's this gorgeous huge colonial house. It has eyes. It looks like

“it has eyes because it has these two windows up in the attic that look like us. Yeah. So the oldest”

of the defaio children is Ronald butch defaio junior. He's born on September 26, 1951. Ronald senior, the dad, is a domineering man. He would fucking pick fights with his wife and children. He was physically abusive and the target of a lot of this abuse was Ronald Jr. I'm going to call him butch. Partly because he was the eldest. So there's a lot of expectations on him and it's said that he would beat the shit out of him. He'd throw him against a wall and hit his head. So there's the

head injury aspect. Oh, y'all know and love. So as Butch gets older, he starts fighting back and he's also known as a bully at school. He's just like angry, mean kid. Yes, get bullied. Bullies are bullied because they've been bullied exactly. So the parents, they try to take him to Butch to Psychiatrist. He fucking refuses to go and so instead they're like, let's just a piece and play kid him and they start buying him anything he wanted and giving him

“money. Like if that's their solution. I bet it worked, right? I mean, you know what? The only way we”

would know if someone would do it to us. That's really should try it. That's all I'm saying. What a bizarre plan. I mean like because I understand that they were rich but that I feel like never in the history of man has that work. Oh, really? It's never worked up, but I understand, especially back in the

70s. It's like, well, here's what we'll do. If he's never unhappy, he's never going to get mad,

right? You know, right? And so they start buying him a bunch of shit, including a $14,000 subede boat when he was 15. $14,000 today would buy you a nice car. Back then, can you imagine? This, okay. So these people something happened and they're swimming in money. Why would the son, the son's own a record dealership in Brooklyn have that much fucking money? I mean quality salesman. Just he's really friendly and he's got a couple pinky rings. Not just one like normal car salesman,

but a couple. Well, that's the other thing. She was, he looks like Tony soprano. Yeah. He's got that big bulky, you know, intimidating presence. He's kind of, you know, he speaks like a long islander which I will refuse to do. Hey, the Parkways over by my pocketbook. I love that cashier. Why is there a parkway by his pocketbook? It's those are the two words that remind me of Long Island. Because my friend Vicki, I used to work with my friend, Vicki, who is from Long Island.

And those are the first, like, two things I heard her say on, like, one of the first days that we

were today. And together, where was like, where are you from? There's no such thing as a parkway out here. Yeah. And pocketbooks? Well, it's stop it. Calm down. She also used to say food shopping. I'm going to go food shopping. Or I'm like, that's just shopping. You know, I don't care. Yes, it's specified. Yeah. No, we get it. It doesn't matter. I had, I just got my food shopping done. How about you? I just went shopping for food.

How about you? Don't tell me about your fucking errands. Yeah. Just how about we all do it. Listen. I love you, Vicki. I love you, Vicki. And Long Islanders. Vicki, aren't the apologies and advance. Um, boop boop boop. Okay. Of course, not surprising. They only made things worse. And by 17, but had become an L.S.D. and heroin user. Oh, which is like heroin in the 70s. Crazy, right? That's when it was really organic. It was just a gorgeous golden brown. It was like a

pure trip. It was more of it was what the Native Americans did around that area. It was like a piece pipe, but with heroin injected into your arm. I do feel like though, people were so naive about drugs

“in the 70s. Like my friend Jerry had a story about doing, I think they called it window pane,”

which is that intense acid from the 70s. She said they were tripping for days. No. Every day, they saw the whole world in a different color. So the first day was red and the second day was purple. And I was kind of cool, but I don't want that. It sounds, it makes me sick to my stomach. No, I was thinking that too. It's just like won't ever end. And that was just like because they walked home from school and a guy was like, hey, do you want to buy this acid? Oh, he loved it. He loved making them trip that

hard. Oh, fuck that crazy. Okay, fuck, fuck, fuck, fuck, fuck, fuck. I crayons as a joke once when I was on L.S.D. It's not talk about it. My friend and I were like, let's choose crayons up and see what happens when we spit them out. That would be really pretty. Oh my god, cut this immediately. Was it pretty? It was gorgeous. I wore a vinyl dress to my own Christmas party. And I was answering the door and

But I was like, this outfit is amazing. I look like I'm from space. Hosting a party on acid,

“not a good idea. Never, ever. Don't do drugs. Okay, don't do drugs, everybody. Um, expelled from school”

as well. So it, so 18 is this fall from school. And they're like, you know what, you know, to fix him, let's give him a job at the Family Card dealership. Yes, let's do that. There it is. Let's not give him a lot of responsibilities and let's give him a large salary. Boom. Sorry, you're reading me the Donald Trump story. What's happening? Ooh, ooh, the liticle, you better be careful. I liked them. Tell they got pellet. Oh.

It's fucking mom. Okay. So he's the boss's son asshole that's coming in on a full salary, but does not have to do anything. The boss is son, and then the boss is boss's grandson. Oh, and he's just like, pay me mother fuckers. How about you pay me? And he looks, he looks,

“and he's probably the original Brooklyn hipster. He looks like this Brooklyn hipster.”

Sideburns. Well, more do you need sideburns? Beard. Like 70s Garb, but it's 'cause it's in the 70s. Right. You know what I mean? It's not just like fucking bedbug news, blah, blah, blah, blah. Okay. Once trying to fight between his, so his mom and dad were fighting, meaning the dad was like fucking bullying them on. Butch points a 12-gauge shotgun at his father and pulls the trigger. The gun malfunction didn't fucking shoot. Oh my god. So this guy's out of his mind.

So in the weeks before the murder, this thing happened where, but it's 1974, butch is given the job of depositing more than 20 grand in from the car dealership to the bank. They're like, go to the bank deposit this. Use your boat. Use your boat. Which is like, why are you giving this kid that money? And not surprisingly, he reports that he had been robbed at gunpoint while he was

waiting at a red light, but he had actually planned the mock robbery and the first the dad seemed

to believe it, but when the police showed up to question him, which is like stick with your story bro, he fucking loses his shit and his super pissed off and refuses to cooperate. And then so his dad realizes something isn't right and he thinks his son was up to it and butch threatens to kill him. So to kill the dad again? Yeah. Now the week later, to the early morning hours of November 13, 1974, the family is sleeping and butch goes around with a shotgun. So the first shot, he goes into his

parents room, they're sleeping on their stomachs. The first shot hits Ronald senior in the back, tearing through his kidney and exiting through his chest. He fired another round into his back and it pierces his father's spine and lodging his neck. He's dead. Then he shoots his mother twice as well. His shoters are ribcage, collapses her right along. And physical evidence shows that Louise's mother was awake when she was shot. Like she went to turn around to see what's going on.

They're both on their stomach. Yeah, they're found. Then butch goes into his sweet baby brothers, Rims, Marcus 12, and John Matthew, who's nine, and shoots them both while they're faced out in their beds. And then he ends by shooting his sister's point blank. First is Allison, who's 13, and he shoots her in the face and then as young and she's killed instantly and then he turns on a sister gone his 18, and shoots her in the head blowing off the left side of her face. So fucking

brutal with a shot then. So just after three a.m. in a span of less than 15 minutes, Ronald butch to fail Junior had brutally slain every member of his family. They were all found lying on their stomachs in bed. Butch showers, trims his beard, gets stressed in jeans and work boots, and then he collects his bloody clothing and the rifle, wraps him up on a pillowcase. And on his way to work, he disposes of the pillowcase and everything in it by tossing them newest dream, a

drur-worn dream. I spelled that wrong tossing them into a storm drain. And that's where the clown from it was waiting. That's the scariest thing I've ever heard in my life. Why did you say that?

“Well that's what I think of when I think of Stormdrain. Totally. That or that or JFK being killed”

because they arrested someone in a Stormdrain. No, not dirt happened. No. Yeah, we'll get, you know what?

Maybe I'll do it one day. Shit, I've never heard that. Yeah. Um, every time I walk George,

her head down in it. No. And every time I'm like, if that fucking clown from it is in there,

I am going to lose it. She's going to get her head chomped off. By what? I don't, the clown. She loves it in there. So many smells. So many reckons. Okay. Then tosses in a Stormdrain. Then goes to work at the card dealership at 6am. Oh, all by himself? Yeah. Yeah. Go to work

“at the family card dealership. And I think they were like, what are you doing here at 6am?”

It's weird anyway. It's like, you know me, but how much I love working? Yeah. Getting along with people. I want to get an early start. Come on. I got my boots on. That's the magic. My beard is trimmed. So throughout the morning, he keeps saying, like, I don't

know why my dad's not here yet. So he keeps calling home. He leaves work around noon and he spends

a day with his friends and to secure an alibi, he tells them that that he couldn't seem to reach anyone at home to let them know that he's like trying. And hey, look, no one's answering. Yeah. He ends up at a bar real close in Amityville, real close to his house. And then it's like, hey, guys, I'm going to go check on my family. It's so weird that I haven't heard from them. And then at 6.30 that night, he burst back into the bar and yells, you got to help me.

“I think my mother and father are shot. So Bush and a small group of people from the bar went to”

the home and they found the whole family done in their beds. When the detective's question,

butch about who could be a suspect in the murders, he told him that he believed the mafia hit

man named Louis Fellini may have been responsible and that his whole family was like in with the mob and that they had wronged the Fellini family in some way and they were pissed off at him. So he then gives them the alibi if I've been gone all day. And when I left the house this morning, my whole family was, I think they were still alive. So they, the police take him into protective custody while they search for the suspect. But when they search the house, they found an empty box

for a recently purchased 35 caliber marlin gun for you gun people in Bush's room. And when the timeline came together, it placed Bush at home at the time of the homicides, not after he left.

“So when they questioned him, he begins to change his story. He says that Fellini had appeared”

at the house early that morning, put a revolver to his head and dragged him from room to room as they murdered his family. Him and an accomplice murdered his family, making Bush watch. Then eventually under questioning, he broke down and confessed to killing his family, saying, once I started, I just couldn't stop. It went so fast. On trial, his defense lawyer William Weber tried to prove that he was insane, saying that he heard demonic voices at home to kill his family,

but the psychiatrist for the prosecution proved that he suffered from anti-social personality disorder, which doesn't mean you're crazy. The illness made him aware of his actions, but motivated by a self-centered attitude. And even at one point during the trial, he threatened to kill both his own lawyer and the judge. They put him on the stand, and the shoot is just like, fucking crazy as shit. Yeah. It seems like that's his solution to a lot of problems.

Is I'll kill you? Yeah. Which really, you know, as we're learning, is a non-solution. It's this thing of like, people were sending to be crazy to get the verdict of insane. And it's like, no, you're just proving what a piece of shit you are. And you're also understanding that you need to plot this out. So it makes you look sane because you understand reasoning and plotting. Yes, there's not the insanity part, isn't there? It's, but you are, clearly, there are a sociopath

or just the most rotten spoiled child of all times. Like is that where spoiling children can get you? Yeah. Because that should be a PSA. Oh, those kids that are fugging screaming out loud in restaurants. It's like, get a hold of it now. Yeah. Are you going to go the route of the Mr. Blutch to fail? Amen. Or at least on the floor. And it's, or you're just annoying everyone else around you. And like, I'm trying to eat in peace. Yeah. Just no screaming. How about the rule of

no screaming? No screaming. And if you're child of screaming, take them outside. Or how about you glare at your child? No one wants you to hit them. No. But how about a good icy? My father used to stop us in our tracks with the look on his face. Oh my god. Like, keep gone too far. And well, also he was very large in intimidating. So, Mr. He only had to look at us. We'll be like, and you just like, yeah, sit exactly what you were. This is not going well. Stop right now. Yeah.

murder. He sentenced just six consecutive life sentences. But all these questions. And this is like

one of the reasons why this murder is still big to this day. And people still debate it when it's clear that he just, this fucking crazy dude on acid and heroin, who was a piece of shit, narcissistic asshole, just killed his entire family. There are things that are weird that make people question what really happened. And think that it didn't happen that way. So, one of them, which I totally understand and wanted to answer to, is how did he shoot six people in four different

rooms without any of them waking up or trying to escape? Yeah. And they're all on their stomachs when they're shot. So, no one turned over to be like, what the fuck was that? Like, they were drugged?

“Well, that's what I thought too. Okay. No drugs in any other systems. Really hear you. Oh,”

yeah. And no neighbors heard the rifle blasts at all. And this is a fucking rifle. Yeah. The defense

experts conducted an experiment on the Marlin rifle and I found that it's report report report report report report, report report. It's spelled report. Guys, it's just a report. It's noise was so loud that it could be heard almost a mile away. It's a rifle. Yeah. So, how did none of the neighbors hear it? And you can see photos. They weren't that far away the neighbors. They were like, literally next door. I mean, he must have done, I mean, like, then did he put room in something? I mean, like, he must have

affected them in some way, right? But how did the neighbors not hear it either? Oh, oh, like, silencer. No, nothing. No. There's no silencer. There's no drugs in the system. Alcohol, I doubt it, either. Well, but I mean, could there be a silencer that they didn't find? I don't know. Yes. I'm putting it out. I'm going to say yes. I'm putting it out there. Even though I don't know. Rifle silencer. It's probably Satan. It could be Satan. Yeah. It is weird to everybody sleeping on their

“stomachs. Yeah. That's why he's not one person sleeping on their side. Right. And that's what I'm”

taking. Or did he, you know, there's this obvious answer to me is that he went from room to room and it was like, stay down. There's someone in the house and like warn them that like, don't move. I'm going to protect you. Maybe. But then why wouldn't the dad get up and then why would the neighbors hear the

shot first? He went and killed the dad in the mom, went into the kids room. I was like, you guys

stand here. Something's something's happening. Oh, that's fucked. Okay. Stay on your, why'd stand on your stomach? Stay on your stomach because I'm weird. You know, else, he could have walked in the room and they were sitting up and he said, lay down on your stomach and then shot them because he didn't want to see their faces when he killed them. True. But he shot one of his sisters in the face. He didn't. Maybe he was particularly hateful of those. Which is, it is a thing that they

fought a lot to. Don, older sister, it was 18. Well, but then there's also the, oh, sorry, you do more theories. Which one are you going to do? That's very that Don was his co-conspirator and she's shot people. Let's go to that one. Okay. Let's go to the tapes. So years, it wasn't until years later, though, that Ronnie changed his story again while he was in prison and said that his sister Don was involved in the murders. That wasn't wrong. Ronnie makes up so many stories that

you just, they're all bullshit. Yeah, they're all bullshit, but here they are. That she had actually planned the murders with him to kill their parents after they had a huge fight with them. But they had no plans to kill the siblings. And then so she went to kill the parents and when he found out Ronnie found out that Don had also killed the kids. She was so pissed off. He was so pissed off. She had wanted to eliminate them as witnesses that he wrestled the gun from her and shot her in the

head himself. So the only person he was guilty of killing was this murderer, his sister. I mean, that sounds like absolute bullshit. Absolutely. Okay. Yeah. I mean, it's just, it sucks that we

“can't get any information about what their home life is really like from anyone, but”

defeyo and secondhand, you know, boyfriends and friends, saying what it was like. But from out their accounts, it wasn't good. Yeah. So who knows? He, um, and then it was reported during the original police investigation that traces of gunpowder were found on Don's night gown indicating that she may have fired a weapon. But I guess it's also proven that if someone shoots you a close range, you can get that as well. Yeah. Then he claims that his sister Don shot his father

then says a just, their mother distraught over that shot Don and her three youngest kids so that the mother, the Don killed the dad, the mother killed Don, Don and the other three youngest children, then shot herself and then when when butch found out he flies into a rage and fired one bullet

it's just, but all that happens way later. He said he makes these stories up later. No, no,

“I get it. Oh, I'm saying, like the reason that doesn't fly is because of the laying down on the”

stomach thing. Yeah. Like all, you can't have that kind of chaos and then everyone end up in the same position. I mean, it's just like same such a far-fetched theory. It's stupid. Like to believe it is idiotic, especially with only the fucking testimony of a fucking crazy person who's trying to get himself away from it. Any responsibility of what happened. Yeah, it's, it almost sounds like somebody he like was sitting in jail board. And he's totally, maybe they'll listen to me if I just make

up a new story. Totally. Totally. So in 1975, let's get to the fucking hunting shit real quick.

Also total bullshit. In 1975. Now we're in a fight.

Karen the Catholic. This is my favorite story. You can't say it's bullshit. I'm sorry. It's my favorite. I know. I want to believe it's so much to with the more I'm reading the more I'm like, I know. And the movie when I was a kid scared the shit out of me. I also looked up when that was made and I was like, nope, too young. Have watched this. What, like 82? Something crazy like that. I don't want to Steven look it up because that would mean I was only two. That's not your

role in movie, right? Where is the beard? And he's like super mad. A gorgeous movie. They keep going to that digital clock that it's like three, yeah, 12 or whatever time it was that it would be 15 or

something. Yeah, and he keeps waking up. All right. So it's based on the fact that George and

Kathy lutz, they buy about a year after this, they buy the defail house for 80 grand. They knew about the murderers, but they were like, it's cool. We don't believe in shit. Steven. 79.

“The night was boring yet. 79. So I watched it in the womb. I think I watched it on like a”

Friday night. Yeah, we're not going to be classics or whatever. No, it's because I remember watching it in my ants living room and I wouldn't have watched it when I was nine. Yeah, and it was on TV. We must have been home alone turned it on and then I wanted to kill myself. It was like a creature feature thing. Yeah, just like what's this? Yeah, it terrified me. Remember the flies on the window? The flies in the window wasn't there a scene where like all the, they were standing outside of the house when they had

left it and all the lights were flicking on and off and all this crazy shit was going on. So yes, that scared me more than anything I ever had until I watched it. Wow. I mean, it's not that big of a deal. That was a scary cut. That's a big deal. Thank you. All right. Okay, so they're by the house. They're like, no big deal. If we got a good deal on it,

“so George and Kathy and their and Kathy's three kids from a different marriage moved in,”

that doesn't matter. Then weird shit starts happening. What? It doesn't matter. I mean, I don't need to specify that she had three kids from a different marriage. It was just like, it's fine. Okay. Like, I don't want to shame her. Like, she's a, oh, she's a div or say with three kids. I don't know why I did that. Like, I'm not judging her. It seems like information you're trying to convey. I don't need to. It's necessary. And it seems so they were born out of

wedlock. No. Let me tell you about her life. Okay. She was a tramp. Okay. So they have a priest come to bless the house. He said he felt an unseen hand slap him. Yes. In one of the rooms and heard a voice saying, get out, get out. They said that they had a crazy things happen. Like, windows lock, windows and doors would lock inexplicably and then open and close. A devilish creature was seen outside the window at night. George was seemingly, quote, possessed by an evil spirit and green

slime oozed from the walls and ceiling. The family, uh, there was operations of hooded figures, clouds of flies. Think I already said that, um, cold chills, personality changes, sickly odors, objects moving about on their own. And then the youngest, let's child, the little girl, became friends with a devilish pig, uh, evil demonic pig, imaginary friend called Jodie. Yeah. Um, Jodie the pig. Jodie the pig. Good old Jodie the pig. And then Kathy reports that

she was often beaten and scratched by unseen hands and that one night she was levitated off of her bed. Shit. And then, um, George says his wife was physically transformed into an old woman with the face and hair and wrinkles of a 90-year old woman, which I'm like, that's insulting. Keep that to yourself. You know, like, convinces like, you have too much makeup on. It's a shut up. You know, but it was demonic forces. It wasn't just like, I fear you. I fear your old age in the future.

after they moved in, they fled the house. They left all their clothes in the closet and food

“in the refrigerator. Or by the way, when they bought the house, it had all of the defauses furniture”

still in it except for the mattresses where the kids were fucking murdered. No way. So what the fuck is wrong with you people? Like, redecorate, man. Like, the real estate agents like, uh, you can buy this as is. Yes. And it's a bargain. You know, that murder house in those feelings that have been fucking closed up forever. Yeah. Like, can you imagine buying a vehicle? This is quite vintage furniture, just leave it. Yeah. No. Well, you'd have to really sage that thing. Yeah.

You don't really clap those corners. You don't have to light some sage and then like the house on fire with it and burn it to the fucking ground. Go ahead and take that insurance check. Yeah. And buy yourself some mid-century modern furniture. Then figure your shit out. Yeah. And stop. Buy a McMansion. Um, okay. So they ended up publishing the account of the hauntings in a book

“that was written by that they worked on with Jane Anson called The Amityville Horror True Story,”

which we all know in love. Um, published as nonfiction in 1976 sold them more than six million copies.

Um, film version comes out. Huge box office success. The luts has become famous. They later admitted it was a hoax. No. Yeah. When, concocted with the help of butchers defense lawyer William Weber, member him, who was like, no, he's crazy. He heard demonic voices. So they said it wasn't ghosts. They had all these fucking psychics and mediums come in. I was like, there's no ghost here. It's this, it's demonic possession, which I believe in ghosts. Sure fine. Let's, let's have it.

But demonic possession is fucking stupid. I don't know. Famous last words. So William Weber's angle was, it was just turned her head all the way around. When I bomb any of this. William Weber, remember what's trying to say that is you,

basically using this account, who, by the way, they said that they came up with after a few

bottles of wine. Oh my god. What the luts is that to like, to prove that the house was possessed

“and so is butch. And he was not responsible, basically. Yeah. That's why the family was killed.”

So Ronnie still in prison. All of his peels and requests to the parole board to date have been denied. And that's the Amity Vilthor and the murder of the defaio families. It's so family. The question of how he got those that family killed in that manner is so vexing and so fascinating. But which way that they're on their stomachs? Just that like, yeah, how do you take a rifle and shoot six people or five people and have people not here and have the people not wake up

and have, you know what I mean? Like, that's the weirdest part. But the fifth person in the family, they've heard no for gunshots. And they know that their older brothers fucking crazy. Like that's the thing to especially don who is 18 and a group with him. It's like, they know their brother is crazy. And the whole town was like, as soon as they found out what happened was like, well, butch did it. Like, everyone fucking knew he was crazy. Yeah. So, but in the Amity Vilthor book,

they talk about this red room that's in the basement and how it's filled with evil and all this stuff. And I was so fascinated by this. It's almost like they centralized where the evil was coming for you. And like, people tried to go in there and they would get crazy headaches and all this weird shit would happen. I was so fascinated by that. It doesn't exist. I'm sorry. It's just carrying in your mind. Karen, it's just in your heart. It's fine. I feel like at the heart of every story like that

is, is people want to go like, oh my god, the devil has been here and there's flies. Yeah. Sewing room window, but at the end of the day, the truth of it is a spoiled asshole drug at it killed his family, which is the thing people can't face, because it's not a monster. It's a little person. How could someone kill children, right? Who had nothing to do, totally in any of this. It's like you'd rather be like the devil. Exactly. Yeah. It's easier. Oh, honey. I'm sorry. Oh, what a story. I love it.

I can't believe I didn't do that. I can't believe I did. I can't believe I did. I didn't even cross my mind that that was the story. I don't know why I was thinking of the Oman as that story. Oh yeah, because he's the, he's just for you. That's the mark. The book you checked out. I totally forgot it. Oh yeah, but I mean, I didn't even worse that you could check the book out. It was so scary. It was horrifying. It was very detailed. And I mean, the none that was mounted. We was the scariest part of

all, so great. Okay, we are back. Georgia, are there any updates for this case? There are.

you know, old TV shows, and we watched in search of the Amityville horror episode. How was it?

“It's great. It's like, yeah, I think it's so recent to when the quote hauntings happen,”

that he's in the house. But yes, Leonard Newey is in the house, showing you around. It's crazy. I have to look that up. I bet that whole series is so good to be watched. Oh my God, it's excellent. It's like comforting. You know, like the Twilight Zone is kind of, yeah. But anyways, yes, there are updates in 2021. But she died in prison. He was 69. He died of natural causes, as far as we can tell. But no official cause of death has ever been made public. And in 2019,

yet another film inspired by these murders, the Amityville murders was released. I've never watched

any of the actual movies about, like, based on this of you. Yes, I watched that one from 2019 in the theater. Oh, and enjoyed it. But it's all the rehash of the James Berlin original Amityville

“horror. Oh, right. I know that was a movie theater movie. It was a TV movie. I think it was TV.”

Right. There's no way my parents would have taken me to that. But I definitely fucking saw it and couldn't sleep as of it. Yeah. Yes. So disturbing. And so all those things where people are like waking up at 12, 12 and like freaking out. Okay. Let's stop it. Let's get into Karen's story about Neville Heath. I did my usual thing where I was watching on Tuesday. I was watching true crime shows all day. And then I'm like, well, I didn't do anything today. So I'd

better pick one of these. And episode of one of these things I'm doing my murder from one of these shows that I just watched. Great. And actually, a ton of people told me this, and I knew it, but I didn't realize they were saying so there's a show called murder maps on Netflix. And it's

basically all these murders that have taken place in London. Or I think England generally, but mostly

London. And they're most of them are really old. And it's such a good show and the guy that's the narrator hosts. I think his name is Nicholas Day. It's so dramatic and awesome. And it's just great. Love it. And so there was, I'd already watched the first two seasons. So every time people would be like, you've got to watch murder maps. I'd be like, girl, I've been there and back. Well, there was a season

“three. And I didn't know. I think that's what people were trying to tell me. Yeah. I'm going to be try”

to be a better listener. So that's what I was watching. And so this is this is the story of Neville Heath, the Lady Killer. So I'm going to take you. Oh, also I just want to say it. So it's this episode of murder maps. There's a guy that's one of the talking heads. His name's Neil Root and he wrote a book called "Friendsy." Colin Heath, High and Christie. And it's basically about the three British serial killers that were caught after World War II. And they're John Christie. I can't remember if I did him or

not. But he's that guy, I don't think I did. He's really fucked up. I can't remember what the other guy is. And then the third guy's my guy for this. And it's just fascinating because there was, maybe the high guy is there was somebody that during World War II, during like the blitz, when London was getting the fuck bombed out there. I read about him. He was killing people. Like so an alley or something like that. Yes. They would find bodies and they would assume,

oh, this must be another thing from the bombing. Another victim. Thank you. trophy. It's been a long day. Okay. So anyway, these were all really good stories. But this guy was especially interesting. So I'll give you a little history as they do in murder maps to kind of set the scene. May 8th, 1946. It's Victory in Europe Day is what they called it. So finally World War II is over in England and London specifically have just gotten a shit beat now. Oh yeah. It's pretty

amazing. How badly London was bombed and totally and made it. If you go look at there's there's a lot of those photos of before and after. Yeah. And it's the same. It's insane. And what I really loved and what this show is really good at doing is they started talking about how, how it affected the culture because so for like, you know, over six years, basically all of the men left went off to

fight war. All of the women took over their jobs. I never knew this. But in that time,

of all the like, women had like hard labor jobs and they were talking about it in the setup of this.

narrator says that in the show, it cuts to this life, black and white footage of all these women sitting in basically what looks like men's work, your smoking cigarettes and like sitting on the

“bridge. Yeah. As like taking a lunch break from building it. And that's what happened, you know,”

as everybody knows, like all the men were gone. So women became truck drivers, women being worked in factories, made bombs, did all that went into the army themselves. Like, it's kind of

amazing. So then when the war ended and all these soldiers came back, they thought they were just

going to take their jobs again and like everything would be normal. But this culture shift had changed that was so radical where women were like, well, fuck you, we had to do it out of necessity and now we're like, we can do it. And also why didn't you tell us pants were so comfortable? Yeah, how dare you keep pants from us for this long? Only the horse ladies got pants? That's bullshit. So so I think that's kind, that part is very exciting where it was like a woman's

movement purely by necessity, where they were, it's not what we can do it thing where it's like,

“not only can you do it, you're fully going to do it and then you're going to want to keep doing it,”

even though men are back and they're like, now I work at the factory and they're like, get the bug out of here, buddy. They didn't do that. But it was hard, you know, of course soldiers had a hard time reclimating in all ways, but then especially culturally because this was a world that they didn't live in before they left or women were just like, y'all take care of it. And they're traumatized. I mean, they'd seen horrible things and everyone was desensitized.

Now that they had all lived through those who lived through this horrible time in life,

they said that because, you know, like true crime and crime has always been huge, especially in

England and in, I don't know if it's Georgian England, in like early 1800s England, it was really popular. But after World War II, people in, you know, people who would watch their neighbors be blown up by bombs or lost their brothers and husbands and, you know, boyfriends in the war, they'd all become incredibly desensitized. So they weren't, people didn't shy away or, like, death and murder were not taboo anymore. They were very interesting now.

Based now, it was like, what's not happening to me? That makes sense. So they're finally like, oh, I can read a story where it's not me with the bullet coming at me. It's like this happens. And it's not the fucking battlefield and all this. Exactly. It's like a huge, almost a bigger relief, right? So that's kind of like the world they live in. One of the people, oh, and also this is just the interesting aside and they had video of these guys.

The true crime reporters of the time from all those major newspapers in London, they themselves became famous because the stories they reported were getting so popular. They called them the murder game and they were like, the crime reporter from the sun, the crime reporter from the, you know, whatever the, all those newspapers are, it was kind of the beginning of British tabloid reporting and these true crime guys were like,

“big time. The true crime game. The murder game. Oh, that's what I meant. Yes. I could feel that.”

So they were kind of like local stars. One of the guys that came back at this time was a man named Neville Heath. Now he was not like, he although he was very good looking. He kind of looks like the actor Patrick Wilson, you know, that guy. He's like blonde, kind of wavy hair, cleft chin. He was in like little children. He was in, he was in all the conjuring movies. Yes. He's the, yeah, he's great. This guy looks like that guy. He is a tall,

beautiful, blonde man who had gone off and was in a he had joined the RAF in 1937 when he was still a teenager. But he had, he came from like a nice middle class family,

always had problems with criminal behavior, always petty theft, doing little things here and there.

When the war effort started, he was like, I want to be a pilot. And so he joined the RAF. But then he stole funds from the mess hall. No. And he ended up going a wall because he didn't want face it. And he kind of slowly developed into a con man because he was, he could talk his way out of anything. He got people like, people kind of fell in love with him all the time. Long people with fucking chin cluffs, blonde with a chin cluff and like I bet you had a very deep

soothing voice. Like I used one of those people that just like never didn't have a good thing to say. Watch out for those guys that watch it. He also, so he was he was doing all kinds of like he was

aliases. He sounds like James Bond kind of. Yeah, like a bad guy. James Bond. Yeah. Okay. Like one of James Bond's villain. Yeah. In the making. But good looking. Were there any, were there any James Bond villains that were good looking male? I don't know. I can know. That's a different podcast called James Bonding. Demographic. Yeah. He called himself major rooper. Brook. He called himself Lord Dudley. Oh, mercy. Of course he did. Guy. So he was trying to

“apply for credit in under these false names. Got caught. That's how he got arrested. He went to a”

bore stall, which is, I don't, it's a jail. But I don't know why that's different than a normal jail. I just feed you shitty or food probably. Thanks. That's what it. It sounds like they send you to Russia. It sounds like there's like, hey, on the ground and you're so. Oh, that's a horse stall. Wait, why don't I click this live link and tell you that a bore stall is a type of youth detention center. So he was so young. He was going to a youth detention center. I knew that.

Don't act like I didn't know that person. We were testing you guys. He listened to us. But here's the problem. He flourished in jail. He, he, he, he, he, I was just like a pap test. He, he's a, he's a fluency, a fluency. He flourished in jail. He flourished in jail.

“The, the governor of the jail. They're all the governor. He's basically like the warden of the”

boys jail. Um, keep giving him leadership duties and eventually supported his application for the Air Force in 1939. He sounds like he could have been a really successful person. Yeah. It's just not been a dick. If he hadn't been a cheater, cheater, pumpkin either. Happy Halloween, everybody. We are on thing. This is a famed episode. We are not evergreen. We are of the moment. He tried to re-enlist in the Air Force when the governor supported

out the application. The Air Force was like, no thanks criminal. We, you tried this already, pal. And then you get that one shot. Yeah. He joined the Royal Service Corps and he was stationed in the Middle East. And, um, over there, he did all this his same business. Like he had, he keep doing it.

The second he got there. He pretended to be a man. Oh, no, I'm sorry. When he in the Middle East,

he got court-martialed. He, he basically stole got court-martialed with sent home and disgrace. And on the boat ride home, he jumped off the boat at like the boat docked in South Africa. He got off and bailed and escaped essentially. And then we started calling himself Captain Selway in South Africa. And Captain Selfun, so far. I mean, yeah, I had a good time with it. He had a limp and a medical as Captain Selway. And our guy Neil wrote was like he was just an actor. Like he was,

he got super into these roles and became the people. He was an adventure. Um, totally kills people. And so yeah. So let's see, I lost my spine. People, that's when you say, they do that. It's really hard. It can't steal your bit. No, it's hard. And that computer wise gets me down to my spine. It helps. It really helps. Um, thanks, Steven. He joins the South African Air Force.

Under the name, Lieutenant Colonel James Armstrong. Okay. Um, which is kind of amazing. It's so

long ago that you could join like a government agency and they'd be like, we haven't caught up to you yet. We don't. Or you could be like, here's my title. And I'm like, okay, great. There's no way to check this. Good bye. You but it's like, what was it written on a fucking napkin? Yeah, it doesn't make sense to me. Just like, no, this is who I am and everybody trusts me. But it's like, he's a new talker.

“All you have to be is confident people fucking believe you. If you're beautiful, like the world is your oyster.”

And that'd be nice. I mean, um, let's keep a positive. So, uh, so he flew missions as Lieutenant Colonel James Armstrong. Um, but then finally they found out that he was this criminal guy. I kind of couldn't fight a point. I mean, maybe he's like, no. He was like, into, I get, you know, at the time it was like World War II and it was like, the Air Force pilots were these shit. Oh, they were. They were the hot hotbies. So he just wanted a slice of that.

Amen. He got deported back to England. He arrived in January of 1946. He tried to go to the London School of Navigation because his ideas all be a commercial pilot. And he actually went study their work really hard, tried, and then near the end they found out about all of his court

marshals and all his bullshit from the army and basically being a criminal and they told him

telling the story of like, oh, I was a pilot in the army and now I'm going to be a commercial pilot

and everybody don't worry about it. So now, um, he can't tell them that he, none of that's going to

“work out because he can't keep his hands out of the till. So he lies to them. And then I think that's”

part of like the pressure starts mounting. And what he ends up doing is drinking and going to dance halls all the time. It sounds like a blast. Right. Um, and he, and he's, of course, a huge womanizer because he's beat, he's beautiful, um, or good lucking. Let's say. He's, he's no polymons. Can I just say really quickly? I mean, it's told me a story the other day when we were on the plane on the way home from Australia. And he saw that like, Riz on the, there was like a TV show

with Riz on that on the plane. And he walked by and said, Riz on heads on TV. And you heard him say,

Riz on heads and see one. Yes, that was your shit. Why did you guys tell me about that the minute we got out the plane? I, I had no memory of that until you just said it right now because he was walking by and just said it in that Vince way, like fast and kind of like, did it like a Riz on that? Yeah. And but the excitement he said it like the look on his face was like, Riz on meds here. Yeah. And then I was like in my pod all half asleep and weird. And I just like, we're blind.

It's not like there's a matter. It's not. I mean, I'm sure there are some people that go and squat by their seat. We're like, right on his lap. I wrapped it away home. I not only would not

have sat on his lap. I would have had a mean look on my face in Casey saw me and then looking at the

ground. You know what kind of shitty friend I am, but like the best kind of friend is I would have been like, let's walk by him and then I would push you into him. Yeah. And you know, so it looks like you bumped into him. You're the perfect wingman. I am such the wingman because you're going to

“work against all of my series problems, which is the best way to flirt is to act like you're”

angry and walk away. When men might not pan down. Oh, act like a human and speak to the person. No. So moving on. So Riz on med. Riz on med is back in England. No. So Neville Heath is he's under pressure. He's a failed. He's a failed pilot. He's not he's acting and can, you know, hold himself to be this person, but he actually doesn't have any of the cred. But he's so he's meaning a bunch of women. He takes a room at the Pemberg Court Hotel in

Nonning Hill Gate, which is the street, the main street in Nonning Hill. That one I did look up. Okay. Nonning Hill. The film that makes me crazy because why does he like her? Why? Why? Anything. That's true, too. Okay. So he actually checks into this hotel using his real name. He just added the fake title Lieutenant Colonel. But his real name is on the book. This doesn't even go together. I don't know. I certainly don't know. Can you be a Lieutenant

Anna Colonel? I mean, I would believe him because the he did one of the things he got in trouble for when he was in the army was misusing uniforms and medals, which is like that stole and valor thing in your story straight. I mean, he's like, it's like, go, go be an actor in the theater

“school. That's what you wanted to do. Yeah. All the ladies. You can go the single ladies.”

All the single ladies. Okay. So when he's um, he's up, he's has taken his hotel arm. He's out at a bar one night and he meets a woman named Ivonne Simmons. He takes her to dinner. He starts to romance her and he's trying to get her to come back to the hotel room with her with him and she won't go and so he proposes to her. And so she's like, okay, I will. No. So she goes, Ivonne. She buys it. He sells it. I mean, he sells it in a way that she can buy it.

He goes and thucks him and the next day she goes back home to Bane Bridge, Bane's Bridge, where she lives. Uh-huh. I think either with her parents or her parents also live there, too. And now she thinks, oh, I'm, I'm engaged. And like, I'm, that's my family. This is an episode of Down to Nabi. I mean, it really isn't the, the, the sad, a sad dark down Nabi would not be a bad idea. Yeah. What's it called? Um, Downer to Nabi. I was going to say something else and that's better.

Downer to Nabi. Thank you so much. Let's just go off everyone's go off. I will explain in the middle ages. Bless you. Bless you. Don't you dare at it. That's you and don't fucking take it now. Oh, leave it. Listen, we are real people. Oh, my God. I have thoughts and feelings and things. Okay. Okay. She goes back to Bane's Bridge. Four nights later, uh, Neville meets a woman named Marjorie Gardner. Now, she's an artist. She's 32 years old.

family, but she has led a what they call a bohemian lifestyle and her. Yes, exactly, right? She wears pants. Exactly. She grew her hair along and put a scarf in it. Um, fuck her. She also, as they quote say in murder maps, they're like, she enjoyed the freedoms. The new freedoms offered to women by the

war. So basically, pants, sex, pants and sex, pants, pants, sex and cigarettes. And if you want

build a bridge, love can build a bridge. So she meets Neville at a bar. Um, same deal. He takes her out to dinner. Then they go to the Panama Club, which is some private club he belongs to, uh, or so he says, they leave the Panama Club at 12th, 20 and they go back to room four at the Pabric Court Hotel. The following day, uh, the assistant manager get enters the room because they, um, made camp get in. And so he comes up opens the door and Marjorie, gardener's body is naked on the bed,

covered to the neck with sheets. Her ankles are still bound. Her, there's marks on a risk to show that they were bound, but that the, um, her strengths had been cut. She, um, had been gagged. There were 17 afterations on her body caused by a whip. Oh my God. She'd been punched in the face at least twice. Oh my God. Nipples savagely bit. No, no, no, no, no. I know that's a good one. Also to me, the worst one where she had

“been raped and then an instrument had been inserted inside her vagina. So I think they said it was like a”

bottle opener. It's horrible looking. Basically a incredibly brutal and savage attack on this woman. Is that

crime scene about all of it? Uh, not that I looked. Okay. Not that I saw. Okay. Um, but there's a very upsetting reenactment because the woman looks a lot like the picture. They showed the picture of of of Marjorie. And then this actress, they got to play her looks almost exactly like her. So it's very real. So crazy that supposedly that was his first murder. Supposedly. Because that's it. It's not. It can't be. Like we all know that that's not your first murder. If it's that. Yeah, there's a gap of time

where he goes from, um, I mean, in Bezer, I steal. I basically know rules apply to me that early kind of psychopath shit of I want to get whatever I want no matter what and I don't care. But then it goes from there and then there's all that time where who knows what he's got in South Africa. He's in the Middle East. Yeah. You know, yeah. He's he's breaking. He's clearly he got, you know, a would, you know, just charge for an army for reasons that they're saying that there are these crimes. But who knows

what the fuck? Right. They could be like, we don't want us. We don't want to advertise what else. Or they just don't know. They just caught him for one thing. Yeah. Yeah. He could be guilty of anything.

Ah, man. That's brutal. So the thing is, uh, ultimately they find she was suffocated with a pillow.

“That's how she actually died. Um, Neville, he there's nowhere to be found, obviously.”

Since he signed in under his own name, no, though. Now he's on the run. And what he's he didn't it wasn't pre-meditated. No. You know what I mean? That's a very good point. Yeah. Why would you? Especially since he's so tricky and uses so many aliases everywhere in his life. And goes so far. It's to pretend to have a limp and wear a monocle that why would he then see or do fuck up. Something pissed him off. And he snapped. He snapped. He snapped.

Um, maybe. Who knows? Well, what he does do is take the train to Bayon Bridge and goes to meet his brand new fiancee, Ivonne's parents. Ivonne. So Ivonne, he's like, guess what? I'm coming to visit. Like everything I said was real. I wasn't just super done. Yeah. Um, he goes to the parents golf club and has dinner with the family. Then they leave and they go out to another club for drinks. Um, and he realizes he has to give her his explanation of what

happened in that room because she was in the room with him and that he knows the story is going to come out that Marjorie Gardner was murdered. Okay. So he tells Ivonne that he met a man who asked

“if he could borrow his neville's hotel room key. So he could go fuck a lady and Neville was like,”

sure, no problem, buddy. Take my key. And I'll just go walk around the streets, whistling with my hands and my pockets online. And then that basically that the murder was some other guy killing Marjorie. And she was just the unlucky fella that gave his key to one of the chances. I mean, the answer and say, um, the next day the newspapers are filled with his picture and pleased

the letter explaining to Marjorie. I mean, explaining that he'd let Marjorie the room key. He went out for the night and then when he came back, he found her dead body. So he's changes the story slightly to the police. Let me all know as a red flag city. He read his life city and also apparently he wrote these letters all the time. The Neil Roo guy talks about how, uh, Neville Heath would write letters all the time after he did stuff, kind of explaining what his deal was. Huh, and oftentimes,

“it would lead people to go, that's okay. I understand now and let him off the hook. That's how”

he got out of things. And, and one of the theories is he had been doing these things for so long and getting away with it. Yeah. That he kind of thought he was untouchable and he didn't ever

bull, he just didn't, he thought everyone would always believe him because they always did because

people want to believe pretty people. They don't believe pretty people. Yes. Or fucking, not pretty people. Absolutely. You get away with shit and people fucking get charmed by you. It's charmed. It's that thing of one, a certain type of person looks at you and presents a thing. Yeah. Like, there are people who just know the power of their own face or their own voice or their own, well, they don't know. That's just what they're used to in life. Right. Well, they think everyone

gets treated like that and everyone can do this thing. Right. It's a, it's quite a combination of like, when you have a psychopath that's good looking, like, you know, all doors are open. You fucked. You fucked. Hello, the devil. So it's my new musical. So. Okay. He in this letter to the police tells them he's, he found the whip that she was injured with and he was going to bring it with him when he came to talk to them. Oh, no. And then just, and that's it. So they're like, okay. But they,

he's now operating under false names again. So he's still, he isn't going back. Yeah. Please. Yeah. So he checks in on June 23rd. He checks into the Tolerary Hotel in Bornmeth under the

name, the fake name, group captain, group, group, group. No. Yeah. It always, he always has to have

two military names before the fake name. Okay. So, and this is like about two, the murders happen. He's on the loose for two weeks, essentially. And he's walking around Bornmeth and he meets a woman named Dorian Marshall. She and her friend are also walking around. It's, I think,

“Bornmeth from what I remember, but this could be wrong. But I think it's a seaside town.”

That's from what I remember from murder ma'am. What's fucking go with this? Steven's going to tell me whether or not. I think I'm right though. But I think it's like, it's like a little, he got out of town, basically. He went to the vacation spot. I'm right. Okay. Thank God. Because I can't have British people angry. I can't. Because they're just stern. They won't yell at you. No, they'll just be disappointed and friendly, which I can't take. I need Irish yelling or nothing. Okay. So,

he goes to Bornmeth to get out of town. He's, he's walking around. But he is like voracious. He's, they call him, eventually they end up calling him the lady killer. Because he's just this womanizer that then, of course, is literally a lady killer. He meets this girl with Dorian Marshall. And he won't leave her alone. He's like, honor all day long. And at first, she's into it, of course, because it's the good looking army captain or whatever the group captain. And then she fucking

senses, he's a creep. Yes, fucking gut failing, tingling. Yes. And also because he can't, I think people like that, they can only keep that certain level of gender going for so long. So, once he's, it's like, if you're, especially if you're not going with the direction he's trying to take you, yeah, then he started getting real pushy and real insistent. And in the hotel room, I mean, in the hotel lobby, he was getting really pushy with Dorian. Yeah. And the night manager of the hotel

actually sought happen and saw her going into a panic about it. And that night manager was the last person to see her alive. So he saw some kind of weird exchange between the two of them. Noticed to notice how weird enough to notice. Yeah, how unhappy she was. And made a note of it. So the next day, the manager of the tallered receives a call from the Norfolk hotel, which is where Dorian was staying like on a different side of town. And they called because she was last seen

at that hotel, getting into a cab to come to their hotel. And she never arrived and never came back.

“And I guess the friend was like, that's what I'm assuming. The friend was like, you have,”

it's like, we have to figure out where my friend went. Yeah. And the staff at the tall and

seeing him, you know, these vibes they were getting from him in the shade of behavior. So finally,

the police meanwhile putting all these things together, put together that level heath and Rupert Brooke are the same person. And so he had, he, he said he was from some, some like Air Force

“base in a place, it's a city in London. No, no, no, it's like Lightchester. But I think it's”

lightster. One of you have a carrot. I know what, suddenly I'm holding my hair about it. I know you are a really trouble. It's being, it's probably light, lightchester, lightchester. Yeah, that's probably what it is. It's probably what it is. Yeah. Oh, they're so mad. I can hear the teaspoon

across the ocean. The police, it's the thing I said of coming back into, the police realized

Neville Heath and Rupert, Brooks are the same person and Rupert Brooks, sorry. And so they also find in his room, a train ticket for a during marshal, the whip with hair on it that was then traced to. What's up with a we have Marjorie Gardner? I know that's fun. That's like a really specific weird thing. Yes. But you had to have it on you. You know what I mean? So like, you didn't just grab something and hit the person with it. You're like, had your whip? Yes. You know,

it's like this is what you're into. Right. Which also then goes like, did he snap or was this a build? What did you? Yeah. Or the thing of like he brought it out and she wasn't into it. And so he attacked her. It's like, no, he got off on. Well, she's and Marjorie was tied up. So like,

“was it fun times tied up? And a look I have a whip or was it like, and then it all goes bad?”

Sure. Okay, honey. So um, um, a waitress walking her dog sees a strange swarm of flies, down near the beach. So then later on, when she sees the story of Marjorie Gardner's death in the paper, she grabs her dad and goes back down to that part of the beach to check out what the swarm of flies are. And their Dorian Marshall's body has found nude arms tied behind her back stabbed to death. That chick was a vintage murdering her. She was the a ridge. A ridge murdering her.

Because she had to make that connection where she was like, I'm sure there was a weird smell, too. If there was a skin of flies. But she had to still be like, I think it's a bird. I don't know if fuck that's right. But she was like, let's dad. Let's make sure. And he's like, and she's smart enough to knock out. I'm going to go make sure by myself. Yeah. She's like, hey dad, father power. So what he what now he's had done when he was out of his hotel room, um, he went back

by climbing up the outside of the hotel up with what they say called a builders ladder on the

side of the hotel. And he basically snuck into his own hotel room. Probably because he was covered

in blood and had shit all over him and knife and all that stuff because he had he had murdered Dorian. But he then the next morning told the story in like the lobby with other hotel residents as if it was I pulled this prank on like the door man. So he tried to make it. He was basically trying to establish this motive of I was doing this fun, funny crazy thing with the door man.

“That's what I was doing last night. And that's what you're going to remember. So, um, when the”

police questioned him, uh, he claims that he blacked out, he has no memory of what happened during that night. He says that he came to on the beach looking at his bloody hands, that he washed his hands in the sea and then walked back to the hotel. Um, but what it turned out happened was he took her down to the beach, attacked her murdered her there and before he murdered her, he took off all his clothes. So that one who he was because he knew he would be covered in blood. So when he was done

stabbing her to death, he went in, washed himself in the sea, and then came back out and put his clothes on. That's how you know he knew what he was doing exactly right. Yeah, not a snap. No, in this situation anyway. I am pretty pretty. When you're you're like, I want to murder somebody, but I don't want my clothes to get dirty. Yeah. Fuck you, dude. Yeah. Okay. Absolutely, fuck you, dude. On September, oh, then he of just posed of the night, the ultimate proof that you're

insanity. Um, and they, they did it by revealing his previous crimes and then saying this is a

“progressive mania that then built to murder. Um, uh, and then the Neil Rook guy explains that you”

have to know what you're doing as wrong to cover it up, and that's the proof that it's not, and you can't do. If you, if they can prove you try to cover it up, then that proves you're not insane. I love that rule. Yeah, because it, it applies to so few actual murders. Yes. Yeah. And it's so clear. It's like, it makes so much sense. Um, so he was found guilty and he eventually was hanged for the murder. Um, holy shit. But up until the end, and this is kind of an

amazing, like, final moment for that show that I loved. Apparently, the thing they used to do before

they hung you was they gave you a shot of whiskey. Really? Like a glass, you know. It's like they're going to give you dental surgery. They're going to hang you. You're right. So you kind of got like one quick thing before you went, and he said to the hangman, considering the circumstances, you might want to make it a double. Oh my God. Like, to the end was this insane phony lunatic. 'Cause that's the coolest line I've ever heard. I mean, it isn't bad. I'll say that.

Is clearly a charmer. Yeah. The Lady Killer, Neville Heath. Thank you. We don't do that. We only do that live. I forgot. Oh my God.

Um, I think 'cause I really buttoned it, and I felt like you felt like you had to do this.

Yeah. I was like, "Wow, shit, tough." You say the title at the beginning and the end. Yeah. Whoa. Oh, but I am going to tonight in my car by Neil Roots book frenzy, because this story, and then those other three, like, the way all that information was coming out, we were like, this is why people, it's like, when that, that explanation of people during World War II, becoming desensitized to fear and horror and death, and then when the war's over,

they still want to know the bad shit, 'cause they've already known the bad shit. Distraction. Yeah. Is it distraction from your own woes? Yes. And they were saying, like, for the soldiers,

“it's a celebration that it's not them. I think that's what it is for us today. You know? Like,”

we know these things can happen, and all this horrible shit can happen, and hearing about it, makes it a little legitimizes it, makes it true, and we're aware of it, and we're not trying to fucking shelter ourselves from shit, because man, life's a bitch. Life's a bitch, and we're so lucky. We're so lucky, and there was, there's another book that I'm reading that's about murder in, like, the early 1800s in England. That's when it, like, they would put it out on the

broad sheets, and it was really popular. There would be, like, a picture. Here he, here he. Yeah, they blew it up to a wall or whatever, and it's a, I'll get the title of the book for next time, but in that, the author was saying that it was, it's, like, sitting inside a house when there's a, a thunderstorm outside, where you enjoy the rain drops on the window pane. That's exactly because you're inside in the warmth with protection. That's exactly it. Or, like, when you're in

an earthquake, and you know, it's not going to be that bad, and you're just, like, this is so fucking cool and fascinating. Yeah, because you, because there's boundaries. Yeah. Yeah. Wow. Yeah. That's fucking cool. Okay. We're back, Karen. Any updates on this epic World War II story? No updates for that story specifically, but we did get this email from a listener in 2017, and it's written a very British person wrote this email. So please bear with me as I do this

incorrectly. It just starts family dinners. You never know what exciting little tidbits will be

disclosed during code in the whole. And then in parenthesis it says, we probably weren't actually eating that, but doesn't it sound so deliciously British of us? Just jump right in. It says, "There I was listening to stories about my cousin's new boyfriend, Neville, when my aunt pipes up with isn't it funny that his name is Neville?" I say, "Why? Because of Neville long bottom in Harry Potter." I mean, how many other Neville's do you know? And then she says, "No,

because of your granddad's cousin, Neville Heath, the serial killer." And then it says, "Wait, excuse me, picture shock followed by thoughts that this might be the best in her ever." And then it just says, "SSDGM by E. Terran." Terran, I love like no info, no details, just letting us know that

“it's like that's what we want. Terran recaptured the moment where she heard the craziest piece of”

news of like your potentially related to this horror show. Right, you just heard about. And this is the

Why do you understand what you mean? All right, let's head back in for good things of the week. One happy thing. Should we end on that? Oh, yeah. Botox, no, can you pause? No, don't pot, don't edit that out, but that's not my thing. I mean, it really is just, um, oh, I'll say one. Okay, we did the L.A. podcast last weekend. It was super fun. We did a great show with um, case here, W where we got to be guest DJ. So fun. Um, we did our own live show. I did the stand-up show.

It was like a hangout at the built-in. Yeah. And we got to meet all these listeners that came specifically to the podcast. And people drove in from far away. People from Arizona.

“Remember the guy last year that we met at L.A. podcast? His name was Joe and he gave us those L.A.”

Corners office mugs. Yes. Yeah. I still have mine. Well, he came back again and gave us a travel mug and an apron also from the Corners office. And I went, sorry, remind me, do you work at the Corners office? You guys know, I just love that they have a gift shop. And there was just like, we met so many cool people and actually got to like, yeah, for a second and talked to people. It was really nice. It felt very much like a um, like world just chilling. Yes, situation. Right. Very fun.

And those, and I will say for that stand-up show, which I don't love doing anymore just because I don't work on it, whatever. But that was fun because it's an audience of people who really love and care about comedy for the most part for that podcast anyway. So it was like, they were with you the entire time. Yeah. It was, it was so fun to do a set like that because everyone had the

best sense of you. It's almost like they weren't waiting for you to make them laugh. They never

like let's all enjoy this. Yeah. It's like how when we do ours where you already have the benefit of the dough. Yeah. So everyone's ready to just go where you want to go. Right. No, I love that. That's great. It was, yeah. So thank you, L.A. podcast. Yeah. Dave Anthony Grimmell would Chris Mancini. I was super fun. Yeah, it definitely was. Give me one second. What do I like about this world? It just can't also be like selfish. Like what? I don't know, because yours was

very sweet and giving. Like being alone. No, I think that's really good. So you, of course, you can leave this at least part in. So Vince was gone last week. Missed him. Love him. It's so quiet and weird here without him. But God, there's something that being alone and just like watching whatever you want to watch and lots of farting and drinking, you know, drinking, having a drink and talking to your cats and like singing stupid songs and I just really enjoyed that a lot.

Yeah. In a way that's like, doesn't mean I don't love Vince. Oh, of course not, you know. No, no, no, I think it's, um, it's almost like a resetting. Yeah. When you can just get a little, I mean,

“I've gone, you have to be careful, though, because then after a while, like, I think I have”

thin scan about it where I mean, now I'd be coming that kind of person where like, I need things

to be a certain way because I'm so used to always only having things exactly how I want them,

which isn't good. Yeah, but then when you meet someone you really like, you're like, oh, I like the way he does that stupid thing. Yeah, that's true. Now it's like, there had some, I had some greeting or some like saying, I saw a long time ago that said, like, when you don't like someone the way they eat pisses you off when you like someone they could spill food on you and you'd be so thrilled about it. Like something like that where it's just depends

on the person. Yeah, that's very true. But there's, there is something very zen about just like being in silence or just kind of doing what you want and not always for so long. I really

always had to have like three people around me. Yeah, and just kind of knowing yourself, too,

and knowing what you would be like alone and your schedule and like how you would fall asleep at night, which is apparently on a fucking naked bed with my fucking vintage computer just and no, she's then no, she's covering me and you know, it's kind of cool to check back in with yourself,

“like that. Yeah, I think that's really good. Yeah, and then when Vince came home, I was like,”

great, I got to be a human again. I actually have to shower. Yeah, he's very strict about that stuff. Yeah, thing alone, consider it, consider it for a hot second. And we're back. Okay, so we originally titled this episode Peak Experience. But if we were naming it today, based on the episode that just happened, maybe we would call it, we could call it swear to almost,

so instead of saying swear to God, that means I was right, because I wasn't right. It was right

“for you to backtrack. That's right. Okay, we could also call it giants for you because I love that.”

You have that interest, Karen. Giants for you. Of course, me and sister Rita Rose,

who might foundational memory of M.D. Phil Horrors, with that old old nun who also taught my mother.

“We've got insane phony lunatic. Love, love that. And then of course, down or tin Abbey.”

That's the really dark sad goth down to Navi. I still think that's a great idea. That's funny.

All right. Well, let's have Elvis say goodbye back in the pod loft in 2017. All right. Well, thanks for listening. Stay sexy. And don't get murdered. Bye.

“Elvis, these are microphone. Elvis, want to come in?”

Ah! Whoa, the vignettes. You're just blue doors on that one. Bye. Bye. Yeah, we heard you.