May “8 for ’28” Democratic Nominee Rankings, Plus: Megyn Kelly on Tucker Carlson’s NYT Interview

- Welcome to the next up with me,

“Mark Calperon Editor in Chief of the Live Interactive”

Video Platform 2A and Chief Nexter. Thank you for being here, grateful to you for being part of what is our one year anniversary program and happy for those of you who joined recently and for those of you who've been with us

for the entire year. Two great guests, and then it's the May installment of eight for 28, my look at who most likely eight Democrats are to be the Presidential nominee in 2028. Shout out for our host this week,

ever when I talked to Megan, did it from our friends at the Sweet Linda,

the cocktail bar on second avenue here in Gotham City.

They were wonderful hosts, and if you're in New York and you want a great place to hang out, I recommend Sweet Linda, a wonderful place. And thanks to our guests. Megan Cali is here, host the Making Cali Show, of course,

and Megan, I will be chatting, and Molly Hemingway, Edder and Chief of the Federalist, author of the new book about Supreme Court Justice Alito. It's a look at one justice, but it's also a look at the court and a look at some of the biggest issues America has faced

over his time on the bench. It's called Alito, the Justice who reshaped the Supreme Court and restored the Constitution. A lot of you probably are familiar with Molly. She's very smart, very good talker.

So we have got two smart ladies who are both great talkers here today. Before we get to them, though, I want to talk about the May Edition, unveil the year of 8 for 28. So let's talk about it.

Big changes this month.

Last couple months, there have been fewer changes.

I think these are pretty seismic. So let's take a look at it. Again, these are the May ratings. These are hot off the presses based on my reporting with the most democratic strategists

and operatives and politicians. But some Republicans, number one remains Gavin News. But a change at number two, since we started the rankings number two, throughout has been Josh Shapiro. He falls to three and Kamala Harris moves up

in a big way to number two. I'm going to explain all this, but let me just run through who's on there. Number four, Pete Buttigieg down a bit. Bernie Sanders, a debut on the list.

And that's the most controversial thing on this list. And I'll talk about that. Number six, where I'm a manual, drops a little bit. Andy Bishier added to the list and John Ossoff added to the list. So three new names on the list, Senator Sanders, Governor Bishier,

Senator Ossoff and the big move, I, for some will be Kamala Harris going up to number two. Let's review where we were last month, some, some same, some different last month, it was Newsome Shapiro, Buttigieg Harris, a manual, Ocasio-Cortez, Mark Kelly,

and JB Pritzker. So the three who come off this month are the bottom three from last month, Ocasio-Cortez, Kelly, and Pritzker. And I'll explain all this. My normal caveats, this is about being the Democratic nominee

it's not about, you can put this month back up. It's not about, it's not about winning the presidential general election.

“I factor in heavily who I think is gonna run.”

So people like Westmore who I still think in the end, won't run is not on the list, Gretchen Whitmer, some of my sources said, put her on the list. AOC, I took her off because I don't think she's gonna run. And, and again, this is based on a lot of reporting.

But here's what I have to tell you.

I listen to my sources, but almost every one of my sources said, don't put Bernie Sanders on the list, almost everyone. Said he's too old, he's not gonna run. I'd have to go also with my own, my own spidey sense of what I think's happening.

As I talk to people about the race and what they're looking for. So I'm gonna explain to you why Bernie Sanders is on the list. But remember, I do a lot of reporting, but in the end, this list is my responsibility. And if all my sources, many of my sources say,

the Westmore should be on the list. I just, I just can't put them on the list if I don't think he's gonna run. And I based on all my experience covering these things for a long time.

And my sensibility about about what causes someone to run and, and, you know, in this case, more germane, what causes someone not to run. So that gut versus head thing plays in here. And I know some of my sources will watch the program

and they'll say, I told you not to put Bernie Sanders on the list, now you have them at number five. Okay, but I'll explain why.

“The another thing you have to factor in is, is the establishment”

filter bias. A lot of people who talk about presidential politics, particularly at this early phase, they're, they're in the establishment. Now I talk to people across the party.

But the establishment has certain points of view about who they think's gonna do well, right? The establishment, thanks, technically, that establishment candidates will do better. You've heard me say it before,

I think Bernie would have been the nominee in 16 and 20. If the establishment hadn't arrived, it was enough to kill him. There's a mood right now in the party and in the country for an outsider, someone who's anti-establishment.

And within the Democratic Party, they want to progressive. And if you look at last month's list and this month's list, you'll see, there are not a lot of super progresses on this list.

but I don't think she's gonna run. Now, so on the one hand,

“I think you'd have to assume that the most likely nominee”

is an outsider of progressive. That's the mood of the party. But you gotta remember what the Democratic Party is done. Now granted, it's more progressive now than it's ever been.

But the progressive wing has always been unions

and people on the far left, they've always been a big part of the party. Look at this chart we put together of who the Democrats have nominated in the past. In the years when, there's a competitive primary.

In other words, there's no nomination process. There's no income and president. So in 1984, it was open, running against Ronald Reagan. The party nominated Walter Mondale over Gary Hart and Jesse Jackson. Mondale was, arguably the most electable,

although he didn't win, maybe Hart was, but he had other problems. Do caucus nominated over Jackson and Gore, as the runner-ups, again, Jackson more progressive. Clinton nominated over Jerry Brown and Paul Songus.

John Kerry nominated over John Edwards and Howard Dean. Barack Obama nominated over Clinton and Edwards and then Joe Biden nominated over Sanders and Warren. The point is, if you look at this chart, it's not ironclad 'cause Gore might be an exception there.

Hart might be an exception. But in general, even when the party was dominated by liberals, they tend to nominate what someone more moderate, who's got a chance to be electable, okay?

“So that's the tension, that's what we have to figure out”

of person who's the most likely nominee. Is it gonna be a progressive of whom they're very few? NBC has a story this week that assumes Sanders won't run and says, well, AOC might run or Rokana might run and they're close to the Bernie people.

They both have Bernie consultants working for them, but then they name some other folks like, Critsker, who really aren't from that Bernie wing, strictly speaking. So that's his tension, we have to figure out,

and I don't think anybody can answer it now, but I don't think you can rule out the progressive wing.

So the most important thing for me to convey to you today

is even though almost every source I had said, don't put Bernie on the list. What's his rap against Bernie, he's older. And it's family, I'm sure, you know, having done this before and now that he's older still, thanks well,

he shouldn't run again, he's had his chance, but I can tell you, ladies and gentlemen, if Bernie were 20 years younger, okay? He'd go for it and he'd be the favorite. He'd raise so much money online,

he'd have so much grassroots support, he would touch the magical harp strings of the base of the party. So there are no perfect candidates, right? So is Bernie being older, a problem, of course, but I could list what I would say are bigger problems

for most everybody in the list. Now, this video, that I'm about to show you, is the video that overcame all my sources of objections about putting Bernie on the list. This Bernie Sanders playing basketball S6, please.

This is 16 seconds of pure electoral juice. Bernie Sanders, watch this. So those who list and Bernie gets thrown the ball, nails a jumper. He moves to the thaw line, gets the ball, nails a jumper. Now is he three feet off the ground?

No, nails another one, swish. And these are not lucky bounces, man. He's a good, they banked three clean swishes and one clean bank, okay? Now, Bernie's an older gentleman, but man,

he's got game there playing basketball. And I look at that level of energy and I look at the rest of the field. We've said this before, it's a weak field. And I say, I'm not betting against that guy.

I'm not betting against that guy to run and win

because almost never that somebody look at possibly running

and say, well, I could probably be the nominee. And once I'm the nominee, I got like a 50/50 chance of winning. And I'm not gonna run. It just doesn't happen, particularly for guy who's run before.

James Carvel said running for presence like having sex. You don't just do it once and say, I'm sick of that, I won't do it again. So I'm not sure Bernie's gonna run, but I'm putting him on the list this week.

“Fug this month, Fug's 'cause I think he might.”

And if he does, I don't think AOC's gonna run as I said. If Bernie runs and the other Fug's on that list or the other competitors, he's the only one in the Sanders lane. And the Sanders lane is a powerful lane

in the Democratic party. Who else did I add to the list this week? This month, John Ossoff. John Ossoff, we've talked about him before, running for reelection in Georgia.

He said in a recent interview, he doesn't think he's gonna run, not interested in running. But the pressure on him to run, if he's overwhelmingly reelect in Georgia, I think we'll be high.

And he's a talented political actor. Here's, here's, I could show you a million pieces of video to illustrate that. But here's John Ossoff's new campaign at Super Impressive Add S8, please.

We're told a story. Work hard, play by the rules, and you'll thrive.

the grind will pay off.

“But for too many, this story just isn't true.”

Gross reads, rent insurance taxes,

the car note, the power bill, the math doesn't work. I was so happy to hear. All right, here's Ossoff at a campaign rally. Again, to me, he's manifestly as talented as anybody else thinking about running

for this comes across as young, energetic, authentic, and principled. That's the mood of the thing. Here's John Ossoff at seven, please. The flame of American freedom has grown brighter,

and bolder, and given hope to the whole world. But in the wins that blow today, that light is flickering. And of all the freedoms hanging in the balance, none is more precious than the right to vote. [APPLAUSE]

None. [APPLAUSE] Now, again, just to remind everybody, I'm not endorsing the guy. I'm not saying his policy positions are the best.

I'm not saying he's moderate, because he votes pretty liberal.

What I'm saying is, if you're trying to evaluate who the Democrats are going to nominate for present talent matters a lot, connections to the grassroots matters a lot, a southerner can do very well. He's also on the list.

The other person I'm adding is Governor Bashir. And every month, when I ask my sources, I send him, here's my draft list. Every month of a very high number, say, "Pup Bashir on the list."

Here's why I'm adding him to the list. Even though I don't think he'll be the nominee in the end. He's working it. And as likely as anybody on the list actually run, and he's got a big speech--

“big speeches coming up in some important voting states.”

He's showing up on a lot of things. So I just got to put him on. I'm skeptical as I said in the past that he's ready to do the difficult things involved in becoming the nominee. I'm also skeptical because I'll say it straight.

I'm not going to want to make in this point. He's not the most simulating guy in the world. He is trying to do a lot of social media. He's got a podcast. Be ready to cringe.

Here's Governor Bashir at the Kentucky Derby talking to some young people. S5, please. Hey, everyone, we are on location at the Kentucky Derby for the Andy Bashir podcast for learning Gen Zlingo.

What do y'all have for us today? All right, we're going to teach people bet. OK, so bet. Best, best defined is I'll do it. So if you say, like, hey, let's go to the Kentucky Derby.

If you want to say, OK, yeah, I'll go. You can say bet, I'll go. But just anyone say no to the Kentucky Derby. No, I don't know why anybody would. So it's one of those things where it's

got to be like a 50/50 thing and somebody says bet. Sure. Or do they do it for the plot? So I'm not supposed to mix all these things. No, they're all their individual thing.

You're messing it all up. So it's all right. So he's talking his kids there. And again, I mean, I get what he's trying to do. I just don't think he's going to have the pizzazz

the game to do this. We'll see. A couple other changes I want to explain. I move Camel Harris up to two. Again, my establishment sources think she's

a lot of them. I think she should be off the list. But she is working this hard. And she has so many advantages and fundraising and name ID in connection to the base of the party

and experience as a candidate. So I had to move. I got to move her up. I may even move her up to number one, which some of my sources think she should be number one.

I don't think she'll be the nominee. But right now, as a snapshot of where we are, I got to move her up as I did into the number two slot. I moved Governor Shapiro down. And part of why I moved Harris from forward to two

is because I had to move, I had to move Shapiro down. And here's why I did. Because this week, once again, he demonstrated

“the thing that I think is as a killee seal.”

I won't go into the details because it's too boring. But there was a political flap. Somebody got a tape, an audio tape of a politician in Pennsylvania saying something about Shapiro that if true would be unseemly and embarrassing politically.

And the Shapiro people and the Governor himself

has always happened when he was being vetted

to be a vice president. They just don't handle this stuff well. They don't handle it in this sophisticated way. And I can tell you, if you run this for president, there's going to be more negative stuff that comes out.

And you just see, we've talked about it on the program before, you got to handle this stuff well. You got to handle the stuff that comes at you well. And I just, I don't seem doing it. So he moves down.

Lastly, ramen manual continues to be the most divisive figure in some ways of everybody on the list. The people who think he's going to do well really are bullish on him. But everybody, even the people don't think

he's going to be the nominee. Believe he's winning the ideas primary and he's being aggressive and clever. Here's ramen manual with his latest gambit.

ramen manual's going to bike across New Hampshire.

That's for please.

“- On June 5th, starting in port Smith, New Hampshire,”

I'll be writing all the way to hand over the spin free tour. We have to style. We're meeting people all along the route. As I've done, I'm three different drops here in the United States.

I love biking. And I did as a ambassador for different times to Japan. And I've done also with my daughter and my wife in Europe. I look forward to hearing from you.

See you long route. Enjoying different diners, different bed and breakfasts. But also, most importantly, listening, hearing and seeing the beautiful state of New Hampshire. June 5th, at June 8th, joined.

And in addition to that, 110 miles, we're going to donate through the foundation in New Hampshire. 110 kids will get a free bike on this tour. I can't wait to see you come along for the ride. - Now, if you know ramen manual, that's a lot of smiling

for guys usually pretty gruff. Biking, athletic, young, energetic, given doing some stuff for charity as part of it, super smart. He is doing a lot of stuff that other candidates,

“I think will eventually start to try to steal and appropriate.”

But as I said, even my sources, including some politicians who don't necessarily think he can be nominated because of some problems with the base, hats off to him for doing the stuff he's doing. So put the list back up just to review again,

this month's rankings for May. Gavin Newsom number one, had an interview with Bill Mar that some people thought was good, some didn't. But that's his hold on to the number one spot. Harris moves up to number two.

Josh Shapiro moves down a notch. If you put a judge moves down Bernie Sanders, until he tells me he's not running, I'm making Sanders strong and if he does stuff, it looks like he's interested in running.

I'm moving him higher. Ramen manual on the list moves down a little bit and then we add the sheer and all stuff. Now, one other thing I want to point out, count him up, Shapiro, Sanders,

a manual, all soft, four Jewish Americans. At a time when the parties turned against Israel where anti-Semitism is a problem of party, I could have put the governor Bill and oil in there. That'd be five of eight, but it's four of eight Jewish Americans.

Interesting. And again, I talked to plenty of sources to say the party will not nominate someone who's Jewish. Now, they're various degrees of Jewishness on this here. Bernie Sanders, for instance, is not a particularly

observant Jew, but it is an interesting fact. I noticed as I was putting the list together. So we'll see what happens next month. I'm eager to see how folks do out on the trail. A lot of folks, Bashir and others,

Ram, manual, out in a bad, but a judge always out in a bad.

Interesting to see how they do. That's our may-ray, so eager to hear what you think about them. See if I got him all in the right place. Again, I'm going to hear from a lot of my sources who do not think the man's solvent is good.

“And I think I should take off Bernie Sanders and put on AOC.”

And if Sanders says he's not running definitively, and AOC says she is, she'll be right on the list. But until then, I think he's got a better chance. To be the nominee than she does. Let me know what you think.

Send me your feedback on Thursday. We plan to do another edition of what we call eight for 28. Hey, tell me what I got wrong. Write me an email and say, Mark, you shouldn't have put this person on her. This person should be higher or you're missing so.

And so send me an email next up, [email protected]. You can be featured on the program. We can use your name or not up to you. But I'd love to hear your thought. Next up, [email protected].

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So every episode comes sailing into your devices if by magic. All right, we're going to take a quick break. Send me an email, 288. After the break, when we come back, the great Megan Kelly will be here,

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Start stacking for just 30 bucks at getacregold.com/mark. Again, that's getacregold.com/mark subscribed today. All right, next up and joining me now, the godmother of soul, the leader of the pack. Our good friend and the champion of the MK Media Network,

Megan Kelly who hosts the Megan Kelly show weekdays from 12 to 2 on the Series XM Triumph channel 1111. Or you can listen of course wherever you get your finer podcast. Megan Kelly, welcome back to next up. Only the places you get the finer ones.

That's it. Yeah, not on the junk podcast networks. Um, you know, I try not to turn every episode of every show I do into media criticism of the, the robust, but sometimes I must. And I'm so glad you're here because I wouldn't talk to you about this topic. Maybe for the whole segment, but we won't do the whole segment.

The media now loves any conservative or conservative who doesn't like to who speaks out against Donald Trump. Yes. And, and, and I, this, I need two hours back because I listened to the entire New York Times podcast with Tucker and she treated Tucker like he was the best ever. And previous coverage in the New York Times, not so much.

So I'm just wondering, these are the Tucker, but just in general, Marjorie Taylor, green, there are many examples. How do you, how, how does this happen? Do you think within a newsroom like that? Where all of a sudden Tucker goes from an enemy to friend? I mean, you know, it's just as shallow as you think.

It's the heat change position. He might be a useful person to them now and taking down a president. They low the, you know, they hate Trump way more than they hate Tucker. So they're perfectly happy to now treat him like he's not a racist, which they've been telling us for seven years.

I mean, I'm dear friends with Tucker.

“And I remember it was 2022, I think, where I opened up my, my New York Times to see”

huge above the fold the lead in the New York Times was all about how racist Tucker was. And they had multiple people weighing in on it. They had multiple shows they'd gone through. They had tons of correspondence who had watched every hour of his Fox News show. I mean, it was insane.

It was like Tucker had just declared for president and emerged as the leader overnight. That's the only thing that would have justified that level of coverage on this guy. And it was all like he's a racist. And it was such BS, the things that they were saying about him. They would say about virtually any conservative who's been talking on TV for a long time.

A great replacement theory. Meanwhile, they're the ones who say it that they want to replace people, with people from south of the border. Anyway, suddenly they're like, is he all bad? I mean, he's got an interesting, he's got some good ideas.

Maybe we should sit with him for a long time and try to get to, we could have been wrong. We needed to get to know him better, really. That's what it was about.

“Now, that same lady I believe interviewed you like several months ago, right?”

Yeah. And she was pretty nice to you also. Yeah, yeah, yeah, I love her. Yeah, she's a little bit straightforward, but, but, but two hours would talk or she asked you some tough questions.

I didn't hear a single tough, she did call him out on denying he said something.

He said, but otherwise it was basically she let Tucker say the president was possessed by demons

or controlled by controlled by Netanyahu. And she just listened to it all and then she said, well, my job's not to, not to criticize, I guess, my job's just to listen information. Yeah, well, yeah, because of course they're like, great. You know, the New York Times isn't a weird place because all of its audience here,

they used to be pro Israel, too. But now, all of its audience, all Democrats have turned on Israel. I mean, they all turned. And so there's absolutely no downside to her in being completely aligned with Tucker's views on Netanyahu.

And yeah, I mean, with me, she wasn't interviewing me at the time because I had said things that the left likes, I don't know why she interviewed me because I wasn't adverse to the president at that point. She really just wanted to know how I could be a journalist and call myself a journalist when I had endorsed Trump. That was her main thing with me, but with Tucker, you know,

she's like, great. And then she kind of dangled at the end, like, how about

“grand platter? She knows Tucker's in Maine. She was interviewing him. I think in Maine,”

Maine or Florida. And she's like, oh, you know, how about grand platter? And he gave her a few nuggets on that one, too. Like, I'm going to be meeting with him. She's like, everything's coming up, roses. Exactly. I want to Joe Rogan. Exactly. I want to talk about, or Marjorie Taylor, green woman of the year.

I want to talk about Platner in a second because he was on my mind this weekend as well. But

but just to stay with Tucker, we're saying Tucker's now done Wall Street Journal in New York Times interviews. Very similar. You know, Tucker, well, I know him less, but I know him a little bit. What is the point of Tucker's media tour do you think? Just to say what his actual views are. That's it. He doesn't like to be misrepresented so frequently. And so ubiquitously. And it's happening now, thanks to people on the right.

He's used to what happening on the left. And I don't think he's ever really cared that much about

center right. But, you know, whatever, Tucker's views are sometimes unpredictable. Not what

standing is this current thing. But when the attacks are coming from our perceived side, you know, that it's so called neocon, right. The Israel firsters, however you want to describe what's happening

“within the Republican Party with this faction, I think it does bother him. I think he's disturbed”

by the anti-Semite charge, which has been used against him now for months. And he's deeply opposed to the Iran war and wants everyone to know why. You know, it's not that he wants them to know Tucker Carlson's against it. He wants them to understand the reasons why so that they might be persuaded. And I think he'll talk to anybody, anybody, about that. I get that. But, but if Tucker said to me, I want, that's my goal. Exactly as you well described it. And he said, should I do it with the

New York Times? I'd say now. Do you come on next up or do it with national review? Why do, like,

what does he get out of doing it with the New York Times? I mean, I think he's casting a wide net. Now, you know, once he said that he's sorry that he endorsed Trump, he regrets it. And it feels like he has to make a men's. And his show is doing fine. It's not like he's hurting for audience. But I think he's understanding there may be some new listeners over here. You know, like, like, he's gotten very, very popular lately. I read with Muslim viewers,

because he's been standing up for Islam. You know, and I have to tell you, Mark, it's been something I've noticed just since I've gotten a sort of moral clear-eyed on Israel, that a lot of the anti-Muslim rhetoric that's put out there originates with people who are very,

very pro-Israel who kind of need us to demonize them. And I've taken a look recently at my own

“rhetoric on this to say, like, have I been manipulated or make sure I'm not getting manipulated?”

But I think he's having a lot of Muslim viewers flock to him. I know for a fact he has a lot of young men flocking to him. And so while he may have lost some contingent of the Fox News audience, that's very, very pro-Israel and, you know, pro-Trump, and you can't say anything about Trump. For every one of those who leaves, there is another newer, younger audience member who does want to hear these traditional lines challenged and hear just new independent thinking.

I mean, I'm experiencing some of that myself and Tucker probably times 10. Yeah, it's so interesting. The whole thing. I mean, it's almost mind-boggling, Eugene. One more thing about Tucker. Tucker called me. Good off. I'd like to talk to Tucker. Platner was on my mind this weekend because again, I try not to make every program about liberal media bias, but Platner has made statements about being, that have perceived as anti-gay,

made statements offensive about sexual assault. And, of course, he had a Nazi tattoo until recently, which he claims he didn't know as a Nazi tattoo. He's now being not just made into a hero by the left and endorsed by every Democrat politician, but when these things are covered, they're not covered the way they would be covered if they were true over a Republican Senate candidate. Their covered, like, isn't this sort of interesting, can he overcome these things?

Yeah. You know, not. I mean, it's so true. No one said anything. But they should have Pete Hexeth with his cost. Right. That was in the week in the news for weeks.

“They're saying you need to resign and they're asking every Republican shouldn't Pete Hexeth resign”

over his tattoo. And with Platner, as all these Democrats, like Chuck Schumer and Chris and Chris and Gillibrand and the pod, save America Bros, they're all endorsing Platner now. And it's like, no one's asked them, well, what about these things? They're just accepting it as, well, we're off for Platner because he's going to beat Susan Collins. So, again, they should, yeah. They skipped down a couple of lines and they were like, wants to pack the Supreme Court, wants to

impeach Supreme Court justices Thomas and Alito wants to add Puerto Rico and DC as a state. We're good. We're good tattoo. Stop being such a gentle. Right. Again, shouldn't there be a corrective in our society for this? It's just not fair. There is. It's you and it's me. We're like our lane that we're doing it, which they hate and, you know, depending on the news, like all they're like, they're so important. It's dangerous or they're totally irrelevant. Nobody listens to

them. But I think it's someplace in between and that enough is very bothersome to whatever constituency wants to shut us up. But yeah, we are the corrective. All right. So, let's play this out. Let's say it's a crazy hypothetical. You and I are working at NBC News again. And we're in the morning meeting and they're talking about Platner like, well, rumors and doors seem to add it up. And you and I say chime in and we say, hey, everybody, like shouldn't we be asking Chuck Schumer? What do you think

of all these controversial statements Platner makes? What would they say at NBC News if you and I stood up on the meeting and said that? It's been done. He's answered them, you know, it's been covered it. You know, they probably will. I'm sure they did cover it in like some one

one way of doing it. But yeah, I think they'll do one piece to sort of get on record with it.

And then they can just keep referring back. Like we covered it. But again, no doubt if it were a public in there, they'd be like, we got to drive this guy from the race. This guy can't be the candidate. But you know, it's something interesting is happening with that now market. So, yes,

“they would absolutely. And I think Republicans have gotten to the point where they realized who cares,”

you know, who cares. In the same way, I'm there just as a media personality. Like I still have leftist papers doing hit pieces on me pretty regularly. I couldn't care less when I was at Fox, that kind of stuff would genuinely rattle me. Like, oh my God, this could be the end of my career. There's some of the worst things about me that aren't true. Now, I literally like, I couldn't care less ago. Right, whatever you want to write. We're good. But, but there's a new danger as you and

I both know, since we were on the air together when Charlie died, which is it's not that you're going to get canceled, it's that you're going to get killed. And they do write so irresponsibly. I think about writing figures who they perceive as having power, that it's crossed over from like disturbing to deadly. So it does bother me. I don't want to say like, it doesn't like, it doesn't cross my mind or I think it's fine where they should keep doing it. If it like, I don't mean like

the later publications. But I mean, when if like the left as an institution turns on you and starts demonizing you, it's dangerous. Yeah. No, I agree with you. In terms of the troubling, I'm saying is you, there are stories to come out now that if it happened 15 years ago, I wouldn't have been able to sleep. And I would have woken up and I would have dashed off an email by PR team saying, we need to push back on this. Now, I don't care. Do you think if we turn

the clock back, that would have been we could have had that attitude back then, or we were at different point in our lives. And there's no way to have that attitude. I don't think so. I don't think you could have turned the clock back. Because I do think people in general were more responsive to the media. You know, they had more credibility, which made them more threatening. Now, it's like, please, you know, it's like, look at that long hit piece that was done by vanity fair on

Susie Wiles and the administration. You know, they all sat with them. And it was so vicious. It was awful. The pictures were so nasty. So Carol and Levitt's lip injections like the nastiest stuff you can hope to print if you're a leftist. The most pick-up it got was from people like

“you and me being like, what a bullshit thing to do. But it was, I had like no impact, you know?”

Yeah, that's a great example. So I just, I think they've been really weakened to the point where we, there's no reason to be afraid of their little hip pieces or attempts. And also media is so fragmented. It's like, you have your constituency. They, they believe in you. They love you.

They may not always agree with you. They make it mad at you sometimes. But they're generally

loyal to you because they've seen you so intimately and up close and personal. Day after day on their podcast, you share so much of yourself. They spend so much time with just you. You know, your relationship with them is like, sure, it's not really, it can't be solid by a mean paper. Right. So my latest date for 28 for May is after rankings are out for this month. And there's Gavin Newsom is still number one. Have another California is number two. I moved

Kamala Harris is the number two slot. Even though I don't think either of them in the end will actually be the nominee. But that's, I can't, I can't foresee the future. How would you hand to Cap? If I'm right that those are the top two, how would you hand to Cap? If I just have

“an nomination, not the general election, how would you hand to Cap the fight if both of them run?”

What that will be like? So fun for you and me. Gosh. So fun. Are we that good of people that they'll put Kamala back on the ballot in some way that she actually will throw her hat in this ring? I, we might be. We might, I think we deserve this. As one of our mutual friends says to text me every time she's in the news, he takes me. I miss her every time. It's totally, totally. I like, there was an article just out today talking about how like the Malibu residents

where she just bought a home for eight million dollars were like, this is where you go to put

your sand in the, or your feet in the sand. This is not where you go to launch a presidential campaign. And of course, I was like, you stop that right now, nasty neighbors. I prayed God that this would happen and I deserve this. And I do believe she's throwing her hat back. And this is temporary. This is just the offshoot. This might be the retirement plan, but for later, because I do think she's going to run again. You know, according to the polls, you know, one had them neck and neck.

But one had her like 20 points above Gavin recently. And I think she will be inclined to believe that one and to believe the nonsense she's been spinning about. It was only 170 days. And that's the only reason I didn't win. And she's got some basis for it, right? Like, she's a black woman. Also, she's a black woman. And, um, we've got a big fund. We've got a big fundraising list. And on top of that, one thing she would have this time that she didn't have the last time is

Trump's first term as president. You know, you kind of forget how controversial he is, how he

dominates your whole life, every new cycle. You get sick of thinking about your president. You're like, remember when I didn't have to think about my president, it was just kind of there. And you kind of urge, you know, you're you're longing for that. And then, you know, you get reminded that a Democrat is not the answer. But I do think independence, and I'm an independent, general. You're like, uh, not sure I want so much drama. And anybody who runs for president

as a Republican is going to be an offshoot of Trump, you know, it's going to be JD or Marko or somebody in the administration. So people are talking about a headset. Someone who reminds you of

Trump. So that's an advantage to her because she's like, the same as the old guy. You know,

all this stuff you hit it about Trump, that guy backed. And by definition, that will be true because nobody can challenge Trump if they're in his administration or even a Republican these days,

“or you get excommunicated from the movement. So that's an advantage for her. And I think she'll”

accurately deduce that and probably stay in it until her party kicks her out because they know she can't win. And if you put yourself just like in a mindset, the two of them on a debate stage together, would you think we would come at the on top if they were just debating? It's going to be the weirdest spectacle. It's going to be like a godzilla King Kong situation and they're these two weird blue monsters, you know, like she with the weird accents like we've gone win. And then Gavin Newsom

with the nonstop hands and the everything is a gesture like he's the signer at an angry sign language conference. I like we're not even going to know what to do with ourselves. It'd be so much to talk about. I think that he will wipe the floor with her sort of because he's got charm and she has none. But I'll just put like a 10% discount on my statement because she was decent in some of those debates. She's not a bad debater. She's like, I think she's a good memorizer. So she is and she's smart enough

as a lawyer to like, okay, we're on climate change. I've got two stock answers on climate change, which one's applied applies and and she she'll deliver it. So I'm going to just temper my remarks a little to say, she's not bad at the debate setting and I'm not sure if he's any good. Is there any Democrat who's thinking about running or you think Republicans would see as formidable in a general election and say, whoa, we really need to be prepared to beat that person?

No, I mean, the only one who came to mind when you asked that question is Steven A. Honestly, like, Steven A. Smith, you know, sports commentator. Now he talks about everything. He's charming. He's funny. He can be self deprecating. He's incisive on his commentary. He's not a hard partisan. He's half of what they like. He's a black man. They don't like men, but he'll get points for being diverse. But he's saying now he won't do it. But honestly,

if you did, I'd be scared of him if I were Democrat and a Republican like he's he's guy, that guy to me oozes charm and like ability and he's not a hard partisan. So he could win.

“That's what's really crazy. He could. So anyway, I don't know. I'd be praying and paying him not to”

run if I were on team blue. All right. Lastly, Komi, James Komi, I'm so fascinated by him. I have been for over a decade because there's no one I see in American life where the gap between how highly they regard themselves and whatever one else thinks about is so wide. It's hard in red blue America to have the left and the right to test you. But James Komi's pulled that off, but whenever he appears in public he acts like he's the most popular person in America. So you're a

good student of psychology. Well, what what what allows James Komi to strut around like he's very popular when in fact really no one likes the best I could tell. Maybe outside his family. That is so true. Well, he must not be online. That's the only thing. Well, we know he posts on Instagram. So he's a little limited. Maybe it's only outgoing and there's no inbox for him because otherwise how could he possibly walk around like that. But you're exactly right. So he must just

be believing the people in his immediate circle and the yes men who have surrounded him since his time at the FBI into like the people who buy that Joe Friday thing, you know like he's just just the facts man and he must have diluted himself into believing he has sold that to the rest of

us and that and you know there is still like the never Trump contingent that does like him,

“you know, bit like him a little bit. But then when they remember that he's the one who”

helped Hillary Clinton win more the loose help Trump beat Hillary Clinton literally more than anyone else. True. It's a little hard to be a forum if you're anti-Trump. I have to say the story of how

and it's quite something and and it's he started him down a public path on both sides of just

“doing whatever he wants and thanking everyone loves him. Oh and to to me it's very clear he”

lied under oath repeatedly and the only reason he didn't get indicted for that man they tried was the statute of limitations ran. But he definitely lied under oath as far as my opinion goes I mean I've watched him repeatedly. One person who has really been watching him very closely there's a couple people but like Victor Davis Hansen can recite to you chapter and verse the lies he's told so good Molly Hemingway over at the federalist. But yeah in terms of the mainstream

media there's no desire to keep tabs. I mean I will say this for the record. I was wood by

Kome when he was in office before Trump. I thought he was an honest guy. I bought the whole routine

you know the story about that Mueller's bedside like they seemed like both honorable men. I was like okay I'm buying all this and then he came his behavior during the Trump administration but the thing for me that really sealed it was the interview with George Stephanopoulos like after the drama and he posted a picture of himself under the cleague lights. Stephanopoulos had brought from ABC just him and it was like a tease for his interview and you could see he was loving it. He loved the

“attention. That's what he wants. He wants to be under the cleague lights. There's nothing wrong with”

that. You and I like being there too but we own it. It's our business. We're open about it. We're not trying to fool people that we're above it. Well still dying for the attention and I just ever

since that picture I was like oh my god I see it. I now I finally see it. It's so glaringly and

everything now everything I've seen is about him and his ego. And what he didn't 2016 to Hillary Clinton violated every bit of what you're supposed to do is FBI director including basically saying I know better than my boss the attorney general and I'm going to come out without telling her and announce this investigation and then he has his cronies including this guy Columbia leak for him in a way in a way that no one in law enforcement should ever even consider doing and for him

it was business as usual because as he said he's the hero of every story he's ever been in. Well and what was he having the his friend at Columbia leak about him all about him. It's not like he'm trying to write the facts or correct the record like oh somebody said something that's disparaging to the FBI or to this case I'm I'm on no it was all about James Komi and his image what he may or may not have done he's so careful about curating just the right look and of course

he doesn't get it right that it's like just doing that is off putting just doing that is undermining whatever connection you think you're trying to make with people you'd be much better off just being like self-deprecating or owning your weird flaws and just how odd you are I tell some story that any normal person can relate to if you actually want to be loved but I don't think he's capable of it he must be extremely fragile. Go back to the psychotherapy like his ego must be

extremely fragile. Totally agree. Well we got to 14% of my questions so please come back and anytime everyone here at next up is very grateful to you for giving us the platform on your platform. The show's doing great as everyone knew it would and I can't wait to see what it does as we gear up for the political celly season. Thank you. You got two options with Megan you can watch your live 12 to 2 listen to her live 12 to 2 on series XM or catch up later on all your best

platforms including the podcast platform and you too Megan thank you. You bad Marcus season. Great to see. All right next up we celebrate our one year anniversary here of the program taking a special look at where we've been and our year ahead that's next up. Did you know that high blood pressure is the number one risk factor for mortality? One and two adults has it that means there's a 50/50 chance that you are a walking time bomb but here's the

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We launched it 365 days or so so it's our anniversary and for that we wanted to take a special look

“at some of the moments that we think to find our first year together. Me, you, nexters.”

Hey everybody welcome to next up on Mark Calperon. Welcome in thank you for coming back. Joe welcome back to the program. Governor Happy Holiday is welcome in new Kingrich. Thank you for joining next up. Patti Seleys Dora Demicrage strategist. She's smart and she's fierce. King of all media Scott Jennings. Scott thank you. Congressman welcome back to next

up. One of the most talented and best people I've ever met. I've never had a better introduction.

James, welcome in congratulations on the book. Our guest next up is my dad, Morton H. Halperon, so in addition to being on the enemies list they also wiretapped our home phone for 21 months. Nixon famously say nothing but gossip and bullsh*t. When I was a kid and we're 19 for there were no two-way television sets you couldn't spy on everybody's home. In the 2017 World Series I took Katherine and my youngest daughter. It's still the greatest game

in the history of the Houston Astros. Can you read a book? I can read. I just have to underline it. I don't go to library because I can never return the book. What is your favorite favorite movie of all time is Willy Wonka in the chocolate factory. You're original. You bumped into the ceiling with now has to be clean and sterilized so you get nothing. You lose.

I don't even know who maddened in summer all are. I've never been serious. That'll be serious.

Thinking that everybody on South Park was like beyond anything I had on my even act this summer I couldn't have imagined it. We on the right have to be able to laugh at ourselves about it.

“I've never been so proud of you. When you have to go to all these different towns in the market”

you got to make all different types of people laugh. You really get a sense of the country. The decision to get rid of Walt has been percolating for a long time. You were called it. He led that signal chat group. Things are growing pretty well. It's interesting. You bring that up Mark. Wow Mark. Thanks Mark. Thank you my friend. We're talking about the man behind the news. Someone as talented as he is nice or maybe it's as nice as he is talented. It's straightforward

and honest and analytical. He's like not like a person. He's like a like an apparition, like an angel. I just love him. All right. We're excited about year two and very happy to have you with us this program relies on your viewership, your listenership and while we had a great first year we're looking for bigger and better things as we head into the midterms and then right on to the presidential.

Greatful to you for being part of it and look forward to keeping the conversation going. All right quick break. When we come back next up Molly Hemingway Editor and Chief of the Federalist and author of the new book, Alito the Justice who reshaped the Supreme Court and restored the Constitution. Molly Hemingway is next up. Are you being lied to? They tell you to defer paying your taxes by saving enough 401k or an IRA

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of the new book, Elito the Justice who reshaped the Supreme Court and restored the constitution. It's a great book and we're going to talk about why that is with Molly now Molly welcome. Great to be here with you, Mark. Has a book tour going? Well, you know, you know how crazy these things are but it has gone so well. When I wrote the book, I knew I wanted to know much more about Samuel Elito but I wasn't entirely sure that other people would share my interest in the topic

and it is just done very well and we hit the best color list and it and I'm just glad it seems like a good moment where people are curious about the one justice that they don't really seem to know much about. Yeah. Well, congratulations and you know the book operates on several

fascinating topics in America now which is this Supreme Court because the dynamics are really different with these nine justices than certainly 20 years ago. Just talk about we'll talk about your main topic, Justice Alito but talking about the dynamics of amongst these nine under justice.

“Chief Justice Roberts what's it like one of the dynamics like is your book reveals them?”

Well, it's got to be one of the weirdest positions to be in to be a Supreme Court member no matter which era you're talking about. You have a lifetime of appointment. You only have eight colleagues whether you like them or not like those are your colleagues. So because of that I think

they've always worked hard at getting along and there was a time in the country's history where

they actually lived together when they were in session not far from wherever they were meeting. We're not at that level now but they do they have these little practices like they always shake hands when they meet in conference or before they go out on the bench and it just helps reinforce that they are this small team. They don't really care that they disagree with each other. They expect that they're all pretty smart individuals who have strong views but and I also think given what I

report in my book about how 10 things got after the dobs leak I do think they get along fairly well. And you even saw this recently when Justice Sotomayor had what you know many people did not

“like hearing her attacking her colleague Brett Kavanaugh at a speech in Texas I think it was you know”

the other Justice's strongly encouraged her to apologize for that and she did and I think that was good that she did that she understands that this is a tight fraternity and that they should they should keep things going as well as possible. Yeah one of the reasons your book so important is the gap that you close between how influential Justice Alito is in America and how little people have thought about him or written about him or known about him and so

that's an extraordinary and important achievement. Justices are like members of Congress or the White House they don't have social media teams they don't have press secretaries that court itself

has a communications office but they're basically in the business that's saying no comment.

So what what was the challenge to tell the story of someone who's really not interested in publicity? And I mean even among so all of the justice are pretty quiet they're not talking a ton to reporters they they do talk to a few but when you're dealing with already a cloistered group of individuals it can be really hard to to get in there but I'd previously written a book on the Supreme Court with Carrie Severino and we you know I think we we're viewed as having done a very

good respectful treatment in protecting sources we interviewed nearly a hundred people these weren't just people at the Supreme Court but the Senate the White House and that it just went over well and so I think that allowed people to feel more comfortable talking to me but with injustice Alito's case what kind of cracks me up about it. The as Justice Scalia said when he joined the court when when Alito joined the court how remarkable a shy Supreme Court justice and it really is unusual

they're usually really big personalities they enjoy being the center of attention and he does not but being able to talk to so many people from his childhood from his young adulthood from when he worked at the Department of Justice you know just over the years it really helped get a better picture of who he is and then also talking to his colleagues on the court and they were actually the

people who gave me the idea in the first place when we did that previous book on Cabinot they were the

ones who were saying they thought it was weird that nobody had written about him in a most justices have written books or have books about them but he didn't and most of the people who noticed he was this massive figure were people on the left you know people like Linda Greenhouse or Ian Millhizer would talk about what a big figure he is but on the right it seemed like nobody was paying attention. Am I right that he is he is ruled more conservatively than was popularly

thought when he was nominated for the court? Oh no you actually kind of had a reputation for being

“this incredibly consistent and conservative person but here's the thing I think that you're getting”

it. When you're an appeals court judge you are just applying the law that the Supreme Court has handed down so you don't have as much flexibility as when you are on the Supreme Court and he had many clerks left and right and his some of his you know liberal clerks were quite prominent in Democrat circles and they praised him for how he faithfully applied precedent and so even they were a big part of his confirmation effort so he was noticed by the Bush administration for how

conservative and consistent he was but you know he would you know if the Supreme Court had

less about what your own interpretation of the law is than what your vocation is as an appeals court

“judge. Yeah no doubt he was he was known to be a conservative and that's why he was picked but”

I guess my impression is you know for people who don't follow closely this Supreme Court is a math game unless there's a refusal you got to get five votes to win and he has been I would say an aggressive warrior for what he believed into find the five to four majorities to try to craft opinions that come out as conservatively as possible in almost every case I think I think on the

data he votes very almost never with the more liberal justice is the best it's a nine nothing decision

whereas some of his colleagues Roberts and and Coney Barrett and and Kevin on particular will will sometimes vote at course it's as well. Well sometimes vote with any coalition with the moderates the liberal's rather he doesn't really very often do that right? Not he does not and I would say that on the court we've had a lot of attention paid to the more liberty minded or libertarian minded justices men like Scalia and Thomas and Gorsuch and they are interested in this like broad

philosophical arguments related to the constitution and Alito isn't just more conservative than libertarian he's also very practical in how he applies things so it's less about the philosophy and more about the facts of the given case but he is you know I would say he is the conservatives

justice in a way that that even the others on the right aren't necessarily so conservative you

may not know this off the top of your head and I apologize if I'm putting his but he votes with

“justice Thomas a very high percentage of the time I don't know if you know the number but I think”

it's north of 85% it would definitely be north of 85 I don't know the exact number I mean they all actually vote together more than people give them credit for but he he and Thomas are the most closely aligned yes yeah so his careers and over he's not given any explicit indication he's going to retire there's certainly lots of rumors but he certainly on the back half of his time on the court how will he your book does a good job of shaping and framing this how will he go

down in history as compared to justice Scalia justice rank list other justices of the of the conservative movement who have had long and influential careers but most justices aren't really remembered at all you know you get you give him enough time and people don't really remember anything or they'll they'll be lucky to be remembered for a single decision and I think that what's interesting about justice Alito obviously having authored the landmark dobs decision

which had been the skull of the conservative legal movement for literally 50 years that's the thing he's going to be remembered for but as one conservative attorney I was speaking to this week said man you know writing dogs and this VRA decision in the same career is just I mean that's like monumental

“I think what he would like to be remembered for is his work on religious liberty and this is”

something going back to when he was on the third circuit he really cares about the religious

rights of minorities and that they are protected and this is something where he actually differed from Scalia who authored the employment division V Smith decision which somewhat limited the rights of minorities it was about a Native American who was smoking payote and lost his job because it was you know because it's a drug but he was doing it for religious reasons and Alito has done so much jurisprudence intended to to protect those minorities who are not protected now

under employment division V Smith and I wouldn't be surprised if you know there are some cases next year that are dealing with this very same issue that he might he might want to get that done prior to leaving the court. I'll just annotate VRA's of voting rights decision voting rights act decision at Molly reference that he broke this week. I remember when you were probably in junior high school or elementary school but during the board hearings Justice Bork said that

he wanted to be on the Supreme Court because he thought it would be an intellectual feast and that didn't go over so well with some people in the media at least because it's suggested he just sort of was doing it for himself rather than for the country. I find Supreme Court confirmation hearings in the Senate to be an intellectual feast. I love listening to the Justice isn't part because it's almost we're excited the occasional speech that they allowed to be filmed it's it's

amongst the last times you'll ever hear him talk unless they go on a book tour or unless again they allow a speech to be shot or they do a panel. So I'm I was thinking in preparation for time to I've rarely heard Justice Alito talks since his confirmation hearings. He's not been as you said as they're very much and I and I I've impressions of him from what gets written from your book and elsewhere when you say he likes his job does he consider this to be important work fun work intellectual

and always has. I also think he likes structured debate so if you like structured debate what

could be better than being a Supreme Court justice you can hear him and in fact there were clips going around this week of him doing oral argument in that case dealing with whether the president can end temporary protected status for certain immigrant groups or migrant groups and he was the one who led the solicitor down that path the the guy was trying to say that it was a anti or that was a pro-wider and I don't know that the the the policy was anti-white and Alito was the one who

leads him down this path of questioning. He loves to do these hypothetical questions that start off very easy and then get very difficult and he completely undermined the advocates argument by just asking a series of hypotheticals about who is considered white. So you can you can you can

“hear him that way but I think he loves reading law journals more than going to cocktail parties.”

He loves oral argument. He loves writing. He's always loved writing. So I think he enjoys that

part of it. He just he's he's just less flamboyant than maybe some of the other justice are. I should say now of course we're are like to hear their voices when they do arguments we don't get to see them though and and so the image is a little bit different. What's the future of the court? John Roberts has done his best I think if if you're an institutionalist and you want the court to be respected you want the justices to not be undermined and and really the whole judiciary. I think he's

it you know I do you might people might disagree with some of his rulings but I think he's been a pretty fierce advocate for the the the prerogatives of the court and and and to try to defend it from attacks including from the president who picked a lot of the justices who are there and there now. What do you think the future of the court is is it going to change institutionally in ways? Is it is it is it up to the next chief justice to define it? How would you see the future of the court?

Well chief justice John Roberts has always been open about one of his big goals being

protecting the integrity of the court he has wanted the court to rule in more universal ways you know all of with one voice rather than all of these different opinions and dissents. He himself has struggled with that most notably in the Obamacare decision but one of the things that was finally like going back to his confirmation hearings sometimes people complain about him that he has no judicial philosophy that he just seems to kind of do what he thinks in a given moment but I think

“what's interesting is if you go back to his confirmation hearings that's what he said about himself.”

He said you know they said what is your what is your philosophy and he's like I don't have one you know maybe I should but I don't have one and so I think people sometimes put on these justices what they what they want them to be without listening to what they actually say they are and whether he he's been successful in his efforts I would say that some of his decisions have opened the court up to more media pressure you know people view him as becoming to media pressure sometimes and he

might be thinking well I'm doing this for the integrity of the court but I think some people think well that actually just makes it more likely that we will face political campaigns or media pressure campaigns but it's also impossible to know how things would have gone had he ruled in different ways or had he handled himself in different ways so I think jury is out but I but I do appreciate that you're hearing more and more people talking about the importance of respecting the integrity of

the court that it's you know yes it is a conservative court right now that's true we also had decades of it being a liberal court and understanding that the court has this authority and also

“you know that that's that is important for people who want to live under rule of law and I also think”

the court's probably going to have to do something to deal with these rogue district court judges who are part of this campaign to undermine presidential authority through nationwide injunctions they've already done some work but they'll probably have to do much more to deal with that not just for the current presidency but for all the future presidency as well so again you mentioned a couple of decisions that he authored that are obviously hugely consequential dobs in the voting

rights act decision from this week what what else makes justice to Salito such an important historical figure well in addition to the religious liberty cases and he's done a lot you know he also authored the hobby lobby decision which protected the religious rights of family owned corporations and he's you know he's done a lot on statutory issues criminal law he's one of those loan dissenters sometimes on free speech cases we've had a court that has a very broad view of free speech he's also a free

speech absolutist but sometimes you know he famously descended in that Westboro Baptist case where that so-called church was protesting the funeral of a of a marine and doing really awful things against the family and they'd want a defamation suit and the court eight to one said

he's known for and he realized they weren't making broad political statements they were making very personal statements against this man and his family that had nothing to do with politics and he thought that without broaching the first amendment issues in play you could have dealt

“with the simple damages caused the family so as we move into the future I think the conservative”

movement in particular is having this problem they're either like all that matters is our principles and who cares how that works out and then on the other hand you have people who say we just have to win and who cares about the principles what have they gotten us and I think with the leader you see

someone who balances these and puts them together in a way that's quite powerful and I think the

Americans in general but I see the conservative movement in particular needing to understand that that principle and pragmatism are not in conflict with each other and that you and that and he's really the model on that for a lot of people do you have a hunch of whether he plans to stay on the court to he's no longer with us as has happened on occasion but more recently folks have retired some in order to go on and do other things do you think he'll stay on the court as long

as health allows him to and mortality or do you think he might retire and and move on to do other things. I was funny I had a strong feeling he was not going to retire this term soon and I don't technically know I just had this strong feeling I don't really know going in the future I will say that justice prior keeps telling his colleagues not to retire because nobody cares about you when you when you're when you're off the court so this is possibly something

that Americans could do a better job of is continuing to honor people who are who are no longer serving and you know either the court or in other capacities so they can feel more comfortable leaving but I don't even know I don't think that's an issue for Alito who doesn't really care if people and if he cares about people talking about him and said he would prefer they don't talk about him so but for for some of the justice that might be an issue. Have you sold a movie right

yet? No no no no you got any thoughts you got a lot we've got a lot to play Alito. Oh man I

“don't do. If Ernest Board 9 we're still alive I think he'd be pretty good. De Niro I think would be”

pretty good. Oh De Niro we hate that role though yes. He might. No but also Sam Alito is a tall man I don't know it's like he's over six feet and I feel like De Niro isn't wouldn't be able to because that's one of the things the clerk say you know they don't know much about Alito when they get there in other chambers and they leave just they call him big Sam because he's so tall compared to the other justices you know you wanted to play baseball and he wanted to be baseball

commissioner and he's got that athletic prowess so you need that as well. All right we're probably yeah I could do that. Really lastly I you have another book and you come in soon or to soon

to think about that. Yeah I'm in that phase where I'm saying I will never write another book

ever again although I did a lot of reporting we actually won an award at the Federalist this year for our reporting on the Russia collusion hoax we were really standing against everybody when we started reporting that we thought it was a hoax but we've done great reporting over the last 10 years a lot of that I was involved in and so I've still thought about you know covering the FBI or explaining what happened there now that we have a better picture of who all was involved

and how many agencies it dealt with so maybe that'll be in me. Okay again the book is called Alito the Justice you reshaped the Supreme Court and restored the Constitution it's a great it's a great work of history it's great work of journalism it's a great biography of the justice

“but for a lot of you I think understanding this co-equal branch and the dynamics with”

the court it's just it's brilliantly reported and really a great story well told my congratulations on the book and thank you for coming on next up. Thank you so much Mark. All right that's it for today's show we'll be back on Thursday with a brand new episode subscribe to the program wherever you get your podcasts or here if you're watching on YouTube we'd love to have you also recommend the

program to others so they will know what you always know what's coming next up.