Ep 1327 | She Stood Up for Women’s Soccer. Her Team Called Her Racist | Elizabeth Eddy

she released an op-ed in the New York Post, urging the National Women's Soccer League to define what a woman is to protect women's sports. Her friends and teammates publicly called her a racist and accused her of "bigotry," but she did not back down in her case today to tell us her story and where her courage and clarity comes from, "You are going to love this testimony and be inspired by it so

much." It's brought to you by our friends at goodwillantures, go to goodwillantures.com. Use code allia check out that's goodwillantures.com code allie. Elizabeth, thanks so much for joining us. Tell us a little bit about who you are and why you were in the headlines last year.

First of all, thank you so much for having me.

I chose to write an article October 27th in the New York Post and it was basically asking my league to put a policy in place that would protect the women's soccer for women. And I didn't realize how controversial that would be. I knew it would definitely be controversial, but it didn't realize the gravity or the

“depth it would go, and that's what I would say what got.”

The headlines. And it's funny because I really didn't want that, I knew a little bit of like, "This is gnarly, this gets intense, this is like a lot." But I remember when Charlie Kirk got assassinated, I went to church with my fiancé at the time it was now my husband and the pastor was really clear he was like, "This is actually

a tack on free speech and if people are in positions to speak truth and they choose not to, we'll continue to lose that right." And at that point I was like, "Oh, I know I need to do this." And back story, I hadn't. I had brought up to Archer, like, "Hey, this is going on in our league."

And he's like, "You should probably write an article."

And I was like, "Oh, I got that."

That's your fiancé. Your husband now. Yeah. And so I, for a couple of months, he's like, "Oh, are you going to write this?" And I'm like, "Oh, maybe back and forth, like, totally waffling."

And then eventually I was like, "No, I'm not, I want to keep playing." Which was objectively like a selfish move slash out of fear. And then when that happened with Charlie, I was like, "Oh, this, we're at a point in culture where this actually matters a lot more than my selfish desire to play a sport." So it kind of made my vision get wider and bigger and my perspective.

And then it kind of fast forwarded to, like, the article coming out, and then thankfully, I really appreciate that you, like, made a post of, like, share arrows with this girl.

“Because I remember moving, like, this is really an early, and then all of a sudden,”

I was like, "Oh, some people are, like, kind. This is crazy." And then it totally kind of exposed that, like, wow, like, this is a huge topic, a huge divide and very big controversial issue in America right now. Okay.

Let's go back to why you even felt the need in the first place to write this article.

Some people have no idea what's been going on in the women's soccer league. Are you saying that they're have been men? Okay. So that's a great question. I would say landscape.

There's, like, kind of, three points. First, last year, we'd skirmish the U14 LFC Boys team, and they beat us. And then, but it's also interesting. What age? U14.

Okay. 14 year old boys team, like, Academy about to be pro in, like, three years. They play us at, like, full-grown women, professional sports. They beat us, which is, like, a relatively normal, but we keep scheduling these games because it's really good for our training.

And, okay. So you don't do it for the entertainment factor. It's really just to make you better athletes. Because I remember hearing about this, that the women's team had played, like, UC 15 boys, at some point, a long time ago, and they lost.

So this happens regularly. Correct. Yeah. So the teams try to schedule it because it's good. But they do close, grimage, like, private, trying to make sure it's not a public thing.

Because what we're going to learn and talk more about is the stand topic. And so this happens, like, we get better. We watch the film. And then in the war of line, which a lot of conversations happen in the war of lines on a post-port steam, because you're there 30 minutes every single day.

And one of our captains was, like, oh, I don't think we should do it. The risk to high. And I was like, what do you mean the risk? And she was like, oh, well, if the parents recorded and posted on tick, dog, it looks bad for us.

And at that point, I was like, whoa, news flash, Elizabeth. This is, like, if we're worried about looking bad, but not worried about perfecting our craft, like, we lost the plot. Like, this isn't about competitive sports anymore. A post-port, there's something else happening here.

And I kind of was like, oh, like, dig a little deeper. And then you realize, like, wait, if we're going to hide the fact of why women's categories

“important, like, why do we even have women's sports categories to begin with?”

And kind of that was like a core of this, like, logic framing, I'd say. And then a few other experiences in the past. I was roommates with a player on a team. We were both alone in another country during an off season. And this player had started growing facial hair.

And I was like, that doesn't make sense. And so I was kind of confused. And there's, like, like, a lot more stuff coming out where it's like, oh, like, changing pronouns. And like, we need to change the rules of America.

And I was kind of like, what's going on? And this is like a handful of years ago. So I'm like, a little confused at this point. But like, still not fully grasping. And also, like, where is this going?

And then the next kind of thing is there's some players that, like,

The teams dead last, the player joins.

“They go from dead last to, like, winning the championship.”

And that player's like, leading goes for a by, like, many goals. And you're like, wait, this doesn't fully make sense.

And so there's basically questions being asked.

But like, because at the end of the day, our league in 2020 went took away policy to define and protect the category of being, end of yourself for women. Now you're kind of in this, like, gray area of, like, case by case exception. Like, you don't know if those players are trans.

Yeah. Like, is that what you're saying? Trans or, like, partly not women. Because, like, you don't really know where the definition is. Because there's no clarity of what the, what, who this is for. And what's interesting is, like, you're kind of stuck in this, like,

well, then if that's where we're actually at, then we need to just talk about defining it. So then we can actually, like, live in, like, the clarity and reality of, like, this is a fair competition, which we don't really have at the moment.

Yeah. Okay. So the first thing was, you all played the, uh, boy.

Boy, you 14, y'all lost, which he said is pretty typical. Yeah. He started hearing people saying, "Well, I don't want to post about this because it can look bad because it kind of fuels the whole trans conversation." And women are not as athletic as men and biologically. Like, it forces that fact to be very highlighted, which people don't want to be up there.

People don't want to show that when it used to just be, everyone knows that.

“Yes. Okay. That's why we have different categories.”

And then when you were over in European realized, there seems to be some push. I've got this player over here that's growing a beard. I don't really know why people are talking about changing rules. And then you see these players in the league, the third thing that suddenly are really, really good, like better than everyone else.

So you don't really know what their biology is. It reminds me of a main belief that person, the boxer and people debated whether or not he was a woman, but it really turns out like he has X, Y chromosomes. And that's the importance of defining it in women's boxing. And that's what you're saying needed to happen in soccer.

Correct. And it hasn't happened in our league, and it, or the women's national team. But I think what's interesting as I've kind of kept a pulse on this topic is that the IOC, like the International Olympic Committee, new chair, is made. This is like her number one running point of like we need to define the category of women's sports. Yeah. And they're spending like months of like talking to like biologists, scientists,

chemists, of like what's actually happening here and how do we like take all things,

“you consider them, and then make the most fair decision, which I think,”

well over at the bigger picture, we'll correct everything because the Olympics is kind of a top down approach, like fix it at the top and then the rest of it will shake down. Quick pause to tell you about we heart nutrition. This is a pro life Christian family own supplement company. It's what I use for all of my supplements. I get my prenatals. I get my magnesium.

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In the New York Post, I wrote an article asking for our league to define what a woman is and if that's going to be protected in our league. And also, if there are people that don't fit the category of women that are the weaker sex that need to be protected, then we can build a third category. We can work together to build this because at the end of the day human dignity matters and

got to meet everybody despite whatever they were going through a struggling with. But we have to at least protect women, then we can go to the next thing. But we can't do that order because currently we have an hour kind of in this mess. You said something earlier, you said when you were talking to your fiance, this is before you decided to write it, you said no, I'm not going to write the article.

I want to keep playing. So you knew that that was maybe a choice that you were going to have to make between the two. How did you know that? I was a really good question.

I would say there's a pretty strong cultural current that operates in a post sporting sphere, specifically the NWSL. And as a kid when you're going up playing sports, you're kind of raised of like do everything you can to play to make that contract to get on the next team of at the high school team or the college team or the pro team.

So you're in this mentality of like, I'll do anything to get there. The danger on the other side of that thinking is that I'll go along to get along. I won't speak about things that are true. And I would say what's happened on a macro scale for the NWSL is I would say there's pretty strong extreme political agenda that have built the whole thing.

And so they're kind of in tandem with like women's sports and then a lot of strong

And I guess what I realize is that this topic, specifically in multiple others,

that in the past I hadn't spoken about, but this will go against the group. And there was like no tolerance for a different opinion. No tolerance for even a question. Because I like worked really hard to rate the article with the people that helped

“me of like, how do we do it in a way that brings everybody together?”

We need to sit at the same table. And that was unfortunately not received at all in that fashion. I will say also something I learned. I was like kind of a tough reality is like when you write and it goes into the press, you don't have control over the pictures.

And that was like really, really disheartening because I was like, wait, these people are using what I'm trying to say for their agenda. I'm just trying to like actually have a conversation. So we can like work together to move women's sports where it needs to go for women. Like the started in the '60s started with Thedonine.

Like we're so lucky to have a chance to play sports for our job. But like it's almost getting hijacked and changed into these other really extreme topics. And so that's what was disheartening. And so then that was really hard for my teammates. So like you let this picture be posted.

And I'm like it's not like the whole league should be tested. Don't sing about one person that's so cruel. And so that's kind of where I was like the really sad tough part. To spite that picture being posted. I stand by everywhere that I wrote.

“And I think it's still important to have this conversation.”

Yeah, so you felt like you went to great pants to not be in flammatory. Do not try to make this a culture war to really just about make it about protecting women's sports. Even creating like you said a different category possibly you want everyone to be able to play soccer. But you want the competition to be fair. And you were probably really hoping that people would read the article in the sphere of how you meant it.

But you got a lot of backlash. So talk about that. Yeah, the backlash was pretty brutal. What ended up happening is the article came out. And then I was like I think on the weekend or beginning of a week.

And then we have a game every weekend. So the weekend came up. And then before every game our captains get sent out to like the press to like do media. And before they went to their questions the PR lady announced like hey they're going to address something in the news and the window questions.

And so then they like did the press statement basically and the two captains shared their thoughts on the article.

And they spoke on behalf of the team and the organization. And that was really really hard to hear because I'd had conversations with both of them in the past. And I was really close with them to the point where they were both invited to our wedding. One of them helped my fans say playing the proposal like they're like people that I was pretty close with. And that's where I was like I feel like I've so much of these friendships.

I would have like hope they could survive something like this, which I quickly realized at least in the short term period that has not happened. But I would say I still hope for reconciliation because I know like God has a God of reconciliation. And he wants us to like find ways to come back together with compassion. Love not at all discrediting truth but like slowly working through at in life truth. Yeah.

But I would say that that was they basically one of them read like. The other times the article are racist and transphobic and then went on to say quite a few other things and went into topics about like where I grew up. That just didn't really like have fully things to do with it. And then it kind of the other ones shared about like belonging inclusion and then some questions that I had were like. Belonging for who an inclusion to what like it's blind for some but not for like for the not for me situation.

So it was really tricky to be like how do you move forward and you're showing up every day of these people.

“And you need to yeah I would say like what I learned I had a really hard experience a few years prior as well.”

And I feel like I prayed a lot and I feel like I was like love on offense like people can spit in your face. It theoretically didn't do that. Hold the door ask how they're doing pick up their trash like engage because if you go quiet Elizabeth. You're like losing the plot and you're like in contributing to the divide. But if you continue offering them all a branch and like making that effort like that's the right thing to do.

No matter how hard it is, it's at least an action to focus on. So keep doing that. Yeah. We have a couple of those clips just in case people missed it. I was you know staying tuned to all of this at the time, but some might not have been.

So let's just play a couple of those for context. Let's play sought nine first.

I've had a lot of combos with my teammates in the past few days and they are hurt and they are harmed by the article and also they are disgusted by some of the things that were said in the article and it's really important for me to say that. And we don't agree with the things written for a plethora of reasons, but mostly the undertones come across as transphobic and racist as well. Were you shocked to hear that the racist harmful phobic? I was 100% shocked because I was like the words I wrote. There's like no way that could be conceived at least that was my strong opinion.

I am aware though that the picture situation with the way the news works could make people think that. But because there were some black players that were depicted in the pictures that you did not choose and their post chose it. Yeah, and I also say the post wanted like ad names and I was like you cannot name this is about like a bigger topic not cancel out player. So like it was definitely turned into like I don't know like I'm going to do the right thing of the best that I can and then I can't control everything.

Yeah, but yeah it was I would say like heartbreaking and like really I was really really sad for like a couple days.

And so then I ended up going on Fox news and I was like it's felt like God was basically like reminding me like these are the two people that you've had to wait and like offer the all her branch.

So like I hope you come you've already said yes please come it's okay to disagree but we can't resort to bullying and name calling which I would say those that clip shows. And so at the end of the day it's like when I what I really is to is when people try to bully your name call they're trying to deligidimize a person or a topic because they don't want to deal with it and so it's kind of this like.

“How could you ever bring that up it's like well because it's actually important and just because you don't want to talk about it doesn't mean we're not going to talk about it.”

Yeah, which is why I'm like happy to talk to you here and continue talking about this topic more because I'm like realizing this doesn't go away. And if those of us that have a position or a chance to speak on something that's true don't do it we continue losing the rights for women that are weaker than men and a lot of other rights that we have in America today. Were you able to have a private conversation with them and you don't have to reveal anything that you're not comfortable talking about but after they accused you racist transmoving all of these things.

Were you able to have a reasonable discussion to be able to say well no like this is what I meant and this is why it's not racist or was that not able to happen. The conversation with the teammates that went on the news didn't happen but multiple other teammates came to me and said with that our captain said I don't stand by I want you to know that like. Although I don't like the situation like I understand what you're doing and I like respect that and then even other teammates that like really publicly don't agree generally on almost everything.

We're like. I totally empathize with you you're in a really hard spot this is brutal I respect this what you're doing I don't agree with what you're doing at all I would counter you but I still understand what it's like to be under. Be under attack from their press right so that was like really cool to see I say silver linings where it's like and then there was also like.

“Like I care about you but also you should do this there's interesting levels of like out of no strategy happening it's.”

Were you disappointed by any people who said I completely agree with you I support you but I could never do that.

The other is a part of me that's like come on because if you do that snowballs and this thing actually changes in a shorter time frame than not but at the same time I like can totally empathize with them because it was so hard for me to do this like I was waffling for months about it and didn't really. It wasn't like a wanted to do it was more like I felt like I needed to do it. Yeah Angel FC issued a statement in support of Gordon's remarks so the player that called this I think we have a picture of that.

Our captain spoke with courage and clarity well that's his point that that's a phrase that I say on this show all of the time. But they mean it in the opposite way courage and clarity know in our community should be questioned her raster targeted because of their identity.

“Which again, I'm sure is disappointing to you because that is not what you called for you didn't call for anyone to be harassed.”

You know not at all. And what's funny is in light of that I'm like people than being harassed be superior because of people's watching games and having opinions. I'm saying have a policy so people stop getting harassed and this like ambiguity because the ambiguity is what's creating it. Yeah. So like even the captains may have spoke what they spoke. I'm like the leagues choosing to not be clear the leagues choosing to absolve leadership in responsibility of like if you just leave with integrity and say what things are in standby it.

You at least will be able to like not have this type of thing going on and players won't be being harassed because there's no questions. Next sponsor is Javadi. This is where I got my most recent blood work panel. It was by far the most easiest most convenient experience when it comes to getting blood work that I've ever had. They sent a full bottomist who was so sweet right to my studio and before I recorded an episode she drew my blood took a bunch of vials took no time at all. Shit them off. I got my results within days on the Jevadi app everything was broken down really clearly.

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This could be the game changer for you. Invest in your body, invest in your health. That is one of the most important investments that you could ever make. Go Jevadi dot com slash alley use code alley for 20% off go Jevadi dot com slash alley code alley. Okay, we've never had a professional female athlete on the show before. Can you talk about just physically what it is like to play against like a 14 year old boy and soccer you're at the top of your game your super athletic.

That's a great question. I would say at the bottom line it's like a physiological difference in a biological difference that's rooted in chromosomes.

And so when when boys hit puberty they get like their bone density is like grows they're muscle tissue grows they're lung capacity grows and they're born with that and then it just like matures as they grow.

“So even if somebody's like younger they're still going to be advantage just because that's how like the why chromosome shift.”

And I'm a article I wrote like two options of the way to kind of solve this potentially one was doing like people with a risk and play one sports which is what England did and I was speaking with Sharon D. We's about it how like she was spearheading that. I would say thing to get done in England that the FAA which is a football association in England protected women's soccer by that policy which I would say didn't go over well with the group that's kind of running out the American side. But then what the other ways to do the SOI gene test and that as I like read a lot about that it determines if the why chromosome expresses and once it expresses when those kind of it's a physiological difference is take place.

And so then as a person that's like physically live this and how the personal experience when you're out there against a 14 year old boy if he's at all close dating puberty. They're like simply bigger faster stronger so then it forces you to play quicker which basically means you have to think faster and position yourself better. You kind of can kind of hang and we can sometimes talk about your mental aspect of having to think more quickly and I'll just move more quite. Yeah and so a lot of part in soccer is like the most beautiful game ever because the more you play the slower the game becomes because you're aware of the timing and then the spacing and when to go into the time.

When to do things spacing wise and then create spacing by your movement we're 14 year boys are just like let me run fast and try hard. So when we get every get in physical battle they crush us if we can put the tactical game like a chest style we can kind of win or hang once that's what but we don't play over 14 or 15 because at that point they're all bigger faster stronger. And they're so much bigger faster stronger that the tactics don't even help you. Yeah. If you're spacing and timings better those still just over fire you.

Yeah.

So that's it say at the end of the day like from physical personal experience I'm like it doesn't matter like boys will always be girls it's not a bad thing.

And those educations were like and not athletic boy will get be by an athletic girl but that doesn't really help the conversation of like what is fair and what should be based on. Yeah.

“I remember this study from Duke University and it was from several years ago maybe even before all of it became just so hyper polarized.”

And it was comparing track athletes and it said something along the lines of I've cited the exact study before but like. Allison Felix the Olympian runner that her world record has been beaten over 15,000 times by 15 year old boys. Yeah. And who were just you know high school they may be good but they're probably not the best of the best. Oh no.

And they say in the study that the key differentiator the only one is the existence of testies. Yeah. That is like that is what makes the difference in how long and fast you can run that like you said there are some exceptions. Super strong athletic girl maybe not as strong athletic guy but that is the rare exception and we're not talking about the exceptions we're talking about the rules. Yeah.

“And if you're trying to govern a group or set a standard set precedent it's like we're doing this for the majority and what are the majority statistics.”

And it's like and it's even like more than testies I'm like this is like your chromosomes when you're the egg and the sperm meat like this is super early on like once the red chromosomes express the electrons expressed some version of testies will be there and at that point that person is not able to compete in the female category is what the liberal should be. Currently not hopefully we'll get there in the future. Yeah. Identities don't compete biology. Yeah.

And that is the difference maker. And when I'm like people are free will and America to live whatever identity you want you cannot enter a competitive competition that's based on like sex based differences like it just isn't fair. Yeah. And it's I'm almost sometimes like how are we here how are we here conversation but then I'm like well as with that attitude is not helpful. This is where you're actually getting the get in the arena.

And you still play for the same team. And you don't do not play for the same team anymore. I just I didn't time me resine me last year and now I'm just about to announce my retirement and then I actually just started professional surfing. Okay. Yeah. What is your own?

Okay. Let's go back. They didn't resign you. You wanted to be resigned. I would say I was like open to whatever was the best case the new coach they was fantastic and it's a player. I'd say the most fun part the longer I've played is like playing for good coaches because they like build a system of an organization. Have a theory. Have a process to go through and then you grow and the teams crushing it. I watched their last for sure their first game. I haven't watched this game, but I'm like they're playing great football in their winning, which is like fun to be a part of.

So playing underneath that coach, he's amazing would have been really cool.

But I was like, there's a lot of moving pieces I'm having move on to the next season. My career and I talked to like, pro teams like locally state, state side and internationally. And after like considering that, talking with my now husband, it was like this is it's best to retire and move on. And like kind of be settled and have like build a life where you're not living in a suitcase for the last 11 years.

I wouldn't be so quick to say that. I would say that's for sure a piece of it. Because I just know from a pro sports standpoint, they consider like all options. Like how old you are, what their goals are as a club, where they're trying to go. I know for sure what I wrote criticizing league was not helpful in any capacity. And whether or not Angel City, it's like every other team's like, yeah, you might be a good old-wise really competent player.

But like probably not worth shaking the rock in the boat. Yeah, because they might think that you're on some kind of activist care, they don't want negative press. Even though they should be, yes, we love this champion of truth and the protection of women's sports because the existence of the league depends upon the biological category of women.

So you think that they would be like totally supportive, but obviously we know that's always the case.

Which is what's sad to me because I'm like, even if you're so bent to be inclusive, build a second division that's for open. Like you can do that. You built the league, you worked hard, you built something like it's possible. Like why are we saying no, it's almost just like, there's not enough in the world mentality, or we can build more, especially in this country of America, we have a freedom to build more, whatever you want. It's like the best blessing ever, and I'm like the internet, flattened, very entry, come on guys, we can do this.

Like we can't work together, we do need to protect the women's category. You're free with a bit of what you want. Has it surprised you, other like professional soccer players like Megan Rappano, have not only not said anything about protecting women's sports, but have been very outright and say, no, we want everyone who identifies as a woman to play women's sports.

“And I mean, you've got to think like, gosh, how would that have affected your ability to become a professional athlete if that had been the case 20 years ago?”

Yeah, I would say like two things for sure limits the ability to play pro sports because now you're competing not with just what girls, but with whoever else wants to, or is working through their identity or is born with different chromosome expressions. But what I would say is what's interesting is that you have like the LGBTQ+ situation at the moment. And half of that are people like, it crosses a line from like biology tied identity where it's trying to like continue with this like intersectionality of the oppressed group.

And once you kind of get there, like Megan Rappano is like, now like I would say whether or not she's like thinking fully through like has to continue on this path. Versus being like, wait, what's real here? And we're if you even pull people that were like originally in that people group before added all these extra letters. Then they're like, wait, I don't want this. This isn't right. This isn't fair. And even like I've spoken with people that trans community and some very much want to be playing sports, some are like, stop using us as political footballs.

So it's what's really interesting is people are struggling and they don't need to be targeted at her ass. They need to be exported. But they also don't even go, I would say, take away from women who are weaker than men and weaker than people that take this ostrich more have white crimson. So to me, it's like, it's a little bit messy, but it's still really clear. Like it's just hard to enact and people aren't really willing to deal with like, I would say, physical reality. All right. Let me tell you about my friends at Alliance Defending Freedom.

“They're fighting for the rights of girls and women to be able to play in the sports of their sex and not have to play against men that's so important.”

But they're also fighting for our first amendment rights and the rights of religious liberty around the world.

ADF is actually in a hundred different countries. And many of those countries persecute Christians, persecute religious people, especially in a country like Turkey, where people who are preaching the gospel are being jailed. And so ADF is representing these Christians. They are actually representing 20 cases of Christians who have been expelled in the highest court in Europe. But they need our help. They need our support. Our prayers are encouragement and our donations. Go to joinADF.com/alley. All gifts will be matched thanks to a special grant.

Go to joinADF.com/alley. [Music] Professionals surfing has the same issue. We've had Bethany Hamilton. I said we haven't had a few of them. We've had Bethany Hamilton.

“She spoke up about the same issue. And so are you worried at all or thinking about how this issue will also affect professional surfing?”

I definitely thought across my mind because I'd like to read a little bit about her in that topic. But again, I'm like, I think competing in sports are really fun. And it's like a really good thing to do. If I'm able to speak on her share, but I happily will. But I'm also like, I think it'll be good to compete and talk about it because I think people, if talk about it and leave something where I'm like, I'll start trying to support and see how it goes. But the topic definitely is not going anywhere. But again, I think with the Olympic situation and how that leadership is, I would say, trying to lead well with strength and get clarity on this issue.

We'll like really trickle down well. Yeah. Okay. I'm so curious how you even got these convictions in the first place.

Most people in any industry of any background would say, I don't want to rock the boat. I know you talked about Charlie Kirk, but obviously the conviction was before Charlie. So just that might be a really long answer of telling your entire life story.

That's a great question growing up. We would go to church every Sunday. And then I would say, I went to a private Christian middle school called Calvary Chapel. And we had a Tuesday Chapel and the sky spoke and shared his testimony. And his name was Joy Brand. And he shares that he was the best surfer in the world, went to Hawaii when the pipe masters got a perfect ten shot out of the barrel. Like the crowd comes down, carries them on the shoulders, runs to the podium. He gets the trophy and that starts to rain and he's like, this was it.

I did all this worked for this moment. And that was over. And then he tried to commit suicide.

“We'll hook three days later in the hospital bed and it was like, God, you must be real in what you have for me.”

So we share that story and I'm 12 or 13 and I'm like, well, I'm going to be good at sports. I don't want to end up being totally depressed when I get the goal I thought was going to bring any amount of satisfaction. And so then I really kind of like started reading the Bible studying it. And in high school, my mom and I started reading the Bible together in a year. And that time, like just reading the word and slowly trying to figure out what it's actually saying.

And seeing like the throughline story of God's redemptive grace, but also who's like uncompromising truth. Where he actually holds those two tensions like Jesus is like, this is wrong, but I still love you. Like you can't throw the first stone, but go and send them more. Like he actually holds it so perfectly. And so getting to like study that through high school and then through college. And I'd say up to this point, I've probably read them out with through ten times and just trying to like slowly pour truth in is where I was like, okay, this is true, not compromising.

But then what was always kind of a bit of a tricky navigation throughout like my pro career was cool, how does it relate?

Now that I'm playing a sport for my job, now that like I'm somewhat expected to speak on things or have make decisions on things really publicly. That unfortunately, unfortunately, like get over it, that's the job. Are like in the news in the press and you're going to like take heat for it or you're going to get paid for it, but you're in the arena. And so like figuring out how to navigate that, it's been really out a tricky and difficult.

“But I feel like I'm slowly coming into like, you need to just speak the truth and don't hide about it anymore.”

We're in the past. I was like more willing to like go along to get along. And I would say my faith grows stronger as I've seen God be faithful. He like he always provides the always sustained. And I'm like, at the end of the day, I'm going to answer to God not to anybody else around this earth. And I think that conviction and that like focus has grown so much that I now am like, I would almost say, I would almost say, feel strong enough for like God speak to me. I would like to like be obedient to really swear. So it's been like a long, long slow journey.

But I would say it's like just reading the word and like genuinely be like God, what's true and like help me understand. Tell me how that helped you in the couple days after seeing your teammates say, you know, basically she's a racist.

I would say the most important piece was just remembering when Jesus is like, you're going to have persecution.

You're going to have trials. Like it's going to be worse now that I'm leaving, but I'm going to leave you the whole experience and just remembering certain truths like that was like this is expected. And then almost in a weird way like this is good because you're actually doing something that matters because if you were unbothered, then you're probably not making much of a difference. And if you have a position to do that and you do make the difference, then you will have backlash, which is like should be expected.

So I'd almost say it was like encouraging and then also weirdly like confidence building. Yeah. So you're becoming a professional surfer after being a professional soccer player for so long. Tell me what went into that decision. Um, I actually grew up wanting to surf those my favorite sports hands down. I liked it so much that at 12, I begged my mom to homeschool me and I was like, please mom homeschool me.

Draw me off at the beach every day. It's going to be amazing. She's like sure after the younger siblings.

So it didn't really go quite as planned. I'd wake up early. Get all my work done by 10 a.m. I became mom. I'm ready to be dropped off at the beach and she beg well. You're younger siblings are still sleeping, but here's a lot of laundry to fold. So after three months of like that experience, I was like, please send me back to school. I'd rather be social and like hang out friends. So that like didn't go to a pro surfing at the young age, but what it did happen is like, I still love surfing and then I had it joining the surf team in high school.

And I went to a public high school called Nuper Harbor and I won states for like the JV level, which was like pretty cool surfing here and there. And the group tourals ahead of me went pro. And then what I remember happening is the guy Joie Brand, who like spoke when I became a Christian. He watched him play high school girls basketball freshman year and was like, hey, when you're doing pro soccer, so he went 20 grand to get you on the world tour. And I was like, oh, cool. So I just finished soccer. I went met with him a couple months ago. Okay, like I'm looking.

And he saw you play basketball. Yeah, like 12 or like 13 or 14. Okay. And he was like, you're just like like enough. And yeah, like if you love this a lot, I'm happily going to help you out. And like since then, like he's coached the English national team for surfing the US national team a couple other countries.

“And he's like coached them to the Olympic goal and stuff. And so he's like, hey, this is who you should work with.”

He's like, the landscape changed a bit. So like go for it if you want. So I would say I'm pursuing it now. But I would say what's the biggest change is that in soccer and a lot of team sports. It's like push push push and you're like, combatively competing. Or surfing is a totally different chain, like experience where you can't surf with unless you're in flow state because you're writing the wave. Like it's you and the wave and doing art together. And if you don't do that well, like there's no one else on the way with you.

So I would say I'm learning a whole new way of like approaching sport and a competitive space, which has been so rewarding and also like freeing and in a weird way way less stressful.

Yeah. And then I found the coach. So he's starting to coach me and he's probably going to shape me a surfboard. And so kind of getting into like that art and finding out like what's the right dimensions and shape and size for my size height and weight and like kind of building out like.

I would say like my tools to go like play in the ocean better.

“Yeah. I think I don't know how much you are. We're probably around.”

34. Okay. We're around the city. Yeah. We have the exact same age. Had to think of what they did. So I am sure that that's like a little unconventional for starting a new professional sport to be 34. Yeah. Totally unconventional. And I would say it's very much something I'm holding the sea of like God. I would love to do this, but like if you open doors, I'll go and if you was or it's like cool. I'm happy for whatever else. But three weeks ago I did just get back from our beta. So my first person for a surfing contest ever and I served in the I think it was a BTMI Barbados open and it was for the WSL which stands for World Surf League in the qualifying series.

I like lost in the first round, but it was like I got the jersey on. I got it. I was like this is the coolest thing ever. And then I made some friends in the heat who I've served together with the trussles, which is upper's beach and trussles, which is like one of the best surfboards in the world.

So just getting to start surfing and be around people doing it at a high level. I'm like this is so much fun.

And I would say I'm almost approaching from like this is fun. Enjoyed as much as you can versus I have to do it and be the best.

“Yeah. I think the energy you approach things with like totally transformed experience and I'm learning to like really trust God on the how versus in soccer world for 11 years and like my whole life was like”

Optimizing be the best which quickly becomes like very like striving and like effortful where I feel like God's like my yoke is easy my burden is light like that is not the way to approach it. And then when I've been in states of that I'm like oh this is right and then all of a sudden I slip out and do it right. Yeah, but surfing is a choir that that is so cool. Yeah. You just got married and hopefully one day you'll have a family have kids and yeah little athletic kids. Do you think at all about what the future of girl sports will look like if you have a daughter one day?

I do think about the future of women's sports and I'm hoping to have more to many dollars and that doesn't they won't have opportunities I had unless I do choose to speak up now and then ask my other peers to speak up and ask anybody women's sports to speak up ask followers to speak up ask anyone that cares like share what's going on and stand for what you believe is true and even if you don't believe the same is me have the dialogue and get out there versus like sitting behind closed doors and this whole group think thing and then just saying me things like actually have the discussion and then respectfully disagree.

“I'm like really disheartened by like the choice to like label cut out and then like not engaged and that's happening like all over American all topics and else fears and you're like this is not having a forward.”

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I was like, well, I don't want to do this, like I feel so guilty reading this to this kid and he very kindly and respectfully spoke up to the teacher. The parents went to the school, it turned into this whole big controversy where the entire school had a pink out day to protest him and protest this little boy standing up for the truth and standing up for this impressionable mind that he was reading to his friends turn against him friends parents turn against him and anyway they ended up transferring to a different school.

I was just listening to him. I was sobbing my eyes out as a mom because it just challenged me. I was like, I want to raise brave kids not just safe kids. Yes, we want our kids to be safe, but I want to raise that kind of child. When everyone turns against them, I'm sure you think about that a lot as I have all girls and so was it like a mom of daughters. It's hard because there's so much coming after our girls, but like gosh, I want them to have the courage.

Yeah, and I would say I feel like to your point what's super important is like the parenting and the parent's ability to like create a safe loving place for the kid to learn and grow and like be able to speak up at 12 to be like, I don't want to do this.

“Why I feel uncomfortable and sure that takes so much courage and then what's really interesting is the other side of the conversation saying it takes courage and it's like, yeah, but where's the truth?”

Because at the end of the day unless we see the truth, we're going to get lost pretty far off.

Yeah, totally. How did you meet your husband? We went on hinge, didn't you ask work? Really? Oh, hey. Do you hear that? Do you hear that? Because yes, why isn't it? Yeah, anyway, we've had a conversation about dating apps. I won't get into the details, but we were just talking about how sometimes like the unconditional things really do work. God can use them. I would prefer in person as well to he, but you're like, hey, this is where everybody that is in the psychographic 20 date spends their time when they're looking to date.

So they're just trying out and then I tried it out and it worked. Yeah, but I have heard a lot of bad stories. So, you know, there's both excuses. Of course, you can say it works for everyone, but it only takes one. Yeah, God can use any pathway. Why would we like in pride say I won't do that? Yeah, yeah, and y'all have been married for just a few months now. Yeah, two and a half months. Oh my goodness. Congratulations. I didn't actually realize it had been that recent. And y'all are still in California navigating the craziness there.

Yes, we're in California, but we're in Newport Beach, which is a I would say a city that's a lot more protective towards like I would say common sense.

Yeah, but somebody. Yeah, do you feel the call at all to kind of stay there and be a light in the darkness? Not saying that all of California is dark, but it's very progressive. Oh, 100%. I would say things I was young. I was like, I would love to move back and be put in like help. Even this city be better and also our whole state because I genuinely think California is one of the best places of land in the world. Yeah.

“And it's got so much going for it. And then the current leadership is just running in a direction that I think is very bad.”

Yeah. And so it's like how can you get involved and help and I do not think running away is a good idea. Although a lot of our family friends have moved and I'm like, I understand, but like come back. Like it's worth it if we come back together and are unified and actually choose to show up to like school board meetings and city council meetings and participate. I think that would really go a long way.

Yeah. You spoke on the steps of the Supreme Court earlier this year. I think it was like during the week that we were at the same event for Alliance if any freedom. And this was about a case over girl sports and protecting title nine. Tell me about that experience. That was totally like not on the radar and I would say really cool and was really empowering. And it was the biggest thing that was changed for me is that it made me realize how far.

How bad the situation is. I didn't realize that the polish was so fragile that protect women's sports. And like hearing the at the the gala thing when the people that argued the case came and shared what was actually going on. And realizing that I think it was this this cases to set precedents so 34 of the seats in America are able to protect women's sports. Which then tells you wait right now that can't.

And so the fact that the policies are so bad and so unprotective of women and women's sports. Meaning really oh there's a long way to go and like oh I should probably keep going and share and help and try to get involved. Because this is a whole lot bigger than me or soccer. And so I would say that's it was like a huge pivotal moment for me of like oh time to get in the game. Yeah.

Yeah. Okay if anyone out there no matter what industry they're in sports or not is kind of in the position that you were before Charlie died. They know that they have something to say. They know that something around them is wrong. But they're scared to lose their job lose opportunities lose safety friends or whatever.

What encouragement would you give someone in that situation? Um if anyone's struggling with fear of loss if it's loss of job or friends or or a safety even.

“I would say remember who you're living for and remember that at the end of the day you're going to stand before God any answer for your actions.”

And that will give you the courage to push through and then also remember the God that you do serve. He's faithful, he sustains and he provides and he works a whole lot bigger and better than any of us can think or conceive. And so like trusting in that knowing that and then doing the best you can't you're going to mess up. You're going to say silly things you're going to step on your toes like it's going to not be perfect. But you're obedient and God rewards obedience and God's like I just ask you to follow me.

You don't have to become or do all this stuff just be obedient to me. That's so important.

We always talk about doing the next right thing which obviously I didn't come up with that quote.

But doing the next right thing in faith with excellence and for the glory of God. That's really all we're asked to do like God didn't ask you when you wrote the article to speak on the steps of Supreme Court. You didn't know that and maybe if he had showed you okay like are you willing to lose his friend and do all of that. Maybe you would have said no but he doesn't reveal the entire path at once. He just says just like take the next step and trust me and then sometimes we look back and really go my gosh.

I had no idea that I was going to run that far or go all of those places. It takes care of it. And even like sometimes it's a place that I don't really want to go. But then he's like no I'm going to lead you then you're like wait this is actually really purposeful and way more important than things that I would wouldn't have even conceived of.

I saw this analogy the other day on axe and it was Tim Keller.

“I don't know if you ever like read any Tim Keller stuff.”

But he was talking about when he was a young pastor speaking to an older woman in his church who had gone through a lot a lot of hardship.

And he would always try to talk with her through the hard things that she went through.

But she would always answer with well, God's going to do this. Jesus is coming back. One day God is going to take care of everything that has ever been done wrong. Always would point back to Christ and what she'll get in heaven. And he thought of you know she really had this kind of watch tower approach that when you're in the midst of battle.

And it looks like the enemy is winning and around you it just looks bloody. But if you could go up to the watch tower and you see like the Lord's army or the other army like coming over the horizon and you know that victory is on its way. You're going to have a very different perspective of the pain and the bloodiness that's right before you. It seems like we're losing down here. But if you can climb up to the watch tower and see that okay.

God's got it. I don't know how that he's got it. It really changes our perspective. I don't know that I always had that perspective. Yeah.

But it's comforting. I totally agree. I feel like whatever kind of you focus on grows and the more I focus on like reading the word and just praying in that asking God for guidance direction. The more I'm getting clarity of like make this call this person. So yesterday's go to this and then I'm like this is like kind of crazy doesn't make sense.

I feel like I'm just like saying yes without full understanding and then it just gets better and better. It still gets I would say more painful at times. But it's like I know that I have peace that like I'm doing what God wants me to do. But I totally agree. All right.

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“Have you forgiven the friends that in the moment you may have felt betrayed you?”

Yeah, it's crazy because Archer was like hey, I think you're maybe still some bitterness towards soccer and you're team. And then I was I went to the prayer mountain recently. Like we went, took back packs, buyables and journals and spent like eight hours just in nature like praying and journaling separately. And then I came back and I felt like God was like just studying my work and like know me more. So every morning I get up and do that for a few hours.

And then one of the days you just had their first game and I like watched it and then I texted one of the friends who said that stuff.

And I was like great second to say a great job like I was had no like bitterness. And I feel like it was totally different from God because it is so easy to be like they hurt me. I'm mad at them. And then then I'm like angry and then all this energy is going towards this terrible emotion that like no one's getting hurt with me. And I'm like this is just silly.

But I can't get rid of it. And then I have to pay God please pure my burn this out of me like I can't change it. And then he does. But it's like I have to be able to call it what it is and like it's something a spirit in me that I can't change. Like please God take the spirit of bitterness like remove it from me.

And then he does and I'm like I'm free again.

“And I feel like this whole our whole life is this like dance where you're like totally submitted to God.”

And like I think it's Romans 12 1 through 2. It's like you're living sacrifice at his feet. And then all the time since we're still living we get up from walk away. Because I come on back. It's way better here.

And then you're like in this whole tension. But I would say I forgive in them and I'm like I hope that we can reconcile. And I'm like excited for whenever that it will be. Yeah. I mean I might not ever happen and that's okay.

But like trusting that like God can ordain that if you want.

And if he doesn't like he'll still work in his powerful ways to do what's good.

And then are you optimistic about the future of Roman sports? Yeah. I really am optimistic about the future of in sports. I think that just speaking and learning to speak. Because I even think I struggle with.

I swear I'm in this pool for 11 years. Like I would be like I feel bad to say these things. And it's like I was told in like group things until like you can't talk like this. Because you're from this background or you're this skin color. And I'm like wait what?

And now like slowly learning to articulate myself and use words of like no. That's not true. This is what's true. And I'm okay for you to be upset with me. And I think just being able to have that confidence do that.

And like help me refine that so I can stand on what's true.

Yeah.

“And so I would say like as I start to do that more like I know that it.”

What did somebody said at that? Gallo. Courageous contagious. Yeah.

And the more you speak up, the more you speak truth.

The more like people will also be able to speak truth. And that's like the only way forward. Yeah. Amen. We say that on the show a lot.

Okay. Final thing. Someone's listening to that like gosh I just want to support her. Like I just want to support her voice. I want her voice to be even louder.

“Is there a way that they can do that even if it's just through prayer?”

I would say prayers for sure the most important.

And like. I guess I guess follow along and like see what happens. I don't know if it was her where that goes. But it's like wherever God you lead. I want to follow.

And I would yeah just say mainly prayer and like.

“And then I would even say the best way to support is to like join.”

Like go to your city council meetings, go to your school board. Means like pay attention to like topics you care about. And if you don't care, don't go. Yeah. But like if you care go and speak up and actually let help the policy move in more positive direction.

Praise God. Well thank you so much. I hope that they really appreciate it. Yeah. Thank you.

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