133. A Children's book series for ADHD / Dyslexia

The podcast that shows you how to parent an alignment to your emotions, needs, and goals,

“versus your programming, bad advice, and let's face it, outdated strategies that just don't work.”

You'll get in the trenches support on nervous system and emotional regulation, critical mindset shifts,

stronger communication strategies, and more. In this podcast, you'll gain transformational tools that take you from reacting to every frustration, to responding with clarity, regulation, and finally setting the example you desire for your kids. I'm Becky Jennings, your new parenting coach, and this is the Response Abel Parenting podcast. Let's get into it.

Hello, everyone. Welcome back to another episode of Response Abel Parenting.

I am actually doing a quick little intro here before we jump into this guest episode,

“because I really wanted to share why I brought this author team, this author illustrator team,”

on to the podcast because so often for us as parents of neurodivergent children, we can catastrophize, we can think of all of the futures of all of the challenges that we might face as parents, or that our children might face, and we can tend to get caught up in that fear spiral. And when I interviewed Lynn Greenberg, who you will meet in just a few moments, it really kind of gave me this like exhale moment, this relief just to know that even in the midst of the challenge,

even in the midst of the dark spots, that they were able to find that unique, beautiful strength that her son Jonathan had, and they were able to nurture it to the point where now he is the illustrator of the books that we're going to talk about in this episode. I'm using this not only as an opportunity for, especially if you have young children, these books are really, really helpful to help your kids see themselves. In these books, also it gives us as the parents this beautiful visual of what is possible with our ADHD, our neuro complex kids.

Just a quick intro of who I will be talking to, you get to meet Lynn Greenberg of the Lynn and Jonathan Greenberg duo. They are a mother and son duo behind the creative cab company children's book series. They have two books, Robbie, the dyslexic taxi and the airport adventure, and Susie, the ADHD taxi and the sightseeing adventure. What makes their story extraordinary is that Jonathan, who has both dyslexia and ADHD, is also the illustrator of these books. Together, he and his mom are rewriting what representation looks like in children's books.

Their mission is simple but powerful to help kids who learn differently, see themselves as the heroes in their own stories.

Both books are used dyslexia friendly fonts, they are relatable storytelling to celebrate neurodiversity in ways that are joyful and powering and accessible. I so hope you enjoy this interview that you enjoy Lynn's story and if this sounds like something that would be beneficial for you, go ahead and check the show notes as to where you can get your own copy of these two beautiful books. Thank you and enjoy the episode. So Lynn, welcome. I am so excited to talk to you.

So walk me through how did you and your son decide to write this book. Thank you for having me. This is great. I love talking about the book and our journey. So during COVID, John was home. He is my youngest of four. He was an art major in college. And so it's pretty hard to do everything virtually or most things virtually but especially art. So he was doing, you know, some things on his own and at the same time I was also reading on FaceTime to my grandchildren.

And so we're like, what do we, you know, you do the art? Well, like, make a story and he said, okay, sure. And it grew, you know, what do we know about we know about dyslexia? We know about neurodivergent characters. We know about, you know, what do kids like trains, planes, automobiles, cute little characters.

“That's how our first book, that's how robbing the dyslexic taxi was born.”

And once we sort of wrote the book, I showed a friend who is a book designer. And I said, what do you think? And she's like great. And so she helped us put it together and that's how our journey started. I love it. So walk me through your writing this book and you're starting to bring in these characters. Is Robby Jonathan? Well.

Funny you should that, no. Okay. So his middle name is Robert. So that's Robby. And so yet it does come from a lot of the things that he sort of had to deal with, you know, growing up being, you know, a little different and remember, you know, he's 26 now. So back then you couldn't Google things.

I knew that he was smart. He was my youngest a four. And I knew he was smart, but he wasn't hitting some of the milestones. Even if you take into account, you know, everyone has a different learning style. And so I started asking, have a friend is a pediatrician, and I started asking around and going to the library and researching. And I'm like, I wonder if and the school school didn't care. They're like, oh, he's just slow. He's not that smart. Make him repeat kindergarten. No, that's not it. So found someone who would test him and sure enough, you know,

classic dyslexic with ADHD super smart. He just was going to have to learn how to learn differently. And that started a new journey for us.

Yeah, walk me through that process of, you know, we finally discovered we feel the relief, obviously, of having an answer to the challenge that we've been having.

But then the advocacy comes into it.

“So you're, what grade was he when you discovered he was in first grade?”

I didn't know enough. I kept trying to understand and how do I had a best approach this. And when I did have him tested, the woman I, you know, was introduced to was lovely. She had a child who was dyslexic and another child who was autistic. So she understood that the testing process was going to be hard for John, and she was kind and really took the time. Yeah. And getting the answer wasn't just a relief to us, but really to John because he's like, oh, you know, it's like not my fault.

I'm not stupid. This is something. Yeah. And for us, the school, no matter what we did, no matter what we said, the school. And it's a good school system was like, said to us, the learning special said, I can't help him. So that started a journey and there's a school about 45 minutes away, a private school. We went there and I thought, if you can get into the school because they only teach kids with language based learning issues.

And they can have ADHD, but they can have, you know, a lot of other things that would make it hard to teach the kids.

“So we made a family decision. It would be me driving. It would be us all eating a lot of peanut butter, you know, like what would this look like?”

And we made the decision. And within a few weeks of him being at that school, saying the alphabet, doing all the things that he couldn't have done a month before. So it was really, we were so lucky. Yeah. Yeah. And it's, you know, it's one of those things where the intuition and the instinct is there.

It's so amazing how many mothers. I mean, I would say arguably a hundred percent of mothers. We know something is up far before we're given the thumbs up far before we're given the diagnosis.

And it really is that advocacy that not taking our foot off the gas until our kids actually get the support that they deserve, that I need. I'm different. Yeah. Yeah. I think you really have to go with your gut just like you said, because so many people are naysayers. And a lot of people are, you know, oh, you know, you're wrong or he'll be fine or she'll be fine. Whatever it is. And, you know, I think I know it's sexist to say, but I think I think the mother often is the one who has the first clue.

Yeah. And even the tester told me that sometimes she'll give this is, you know, going back, but she would give up the parents, the diagnosis and the mother would be like, Yep, and the father, she said, often would be like, not my child. And that's not to say I was so lucky because, you know, my husband, John's father was totally unbored and supportive. But I have heard from a lot of other people since then that it has been kind of hard to get people to listen to that. And it can be an uphill battle, but I would say, like you said, don't take your foot off the gas, just keep trying to get there.

Yeah, I know we're here to talk about the book and I definitely want to, but I want to hear from you, what did you feel like in that process?

“How did you start up overcome those barriers? Like, what tenacity did you have to take on?”

What mindset did you have to take in order to continue to push through and not listen to the naysayers? It was very hard because, you know, as I said, the school wouldn't test in, they told me I was wrong. I knew I wasn't wrong about, I didn't know the diagnosis, but I knew I wasn't wrong about the abilities he had and the shortcomings he might have. Yeah. Luckily, I also, you know, I had other children, so I know everyone learns differently.

I have four kids, one was like an amazing math student, the other three needed math tutors.

And so when I finally had him tested and I went to winward with him, I was so lucky because I found a community when they agreed that he was dyslexic and they would take.

And I found a community for me and for him, every other parent that I talked to had the same story as I did.

“Every other kid at the same story John had and so we each found our people, which is really, really important and back then.”

Nobody was really talking about those things. Yeah. Yeah, that's a really good point too, because you know what, that's like probably roughly 20 years ago that ADHD. It was more just like you have a defiant child, you have a child who has a learning disability. It has nothing to do with ADHD.

And you're in a really unique position, most of the people who listen to my podcast, they have young children. They're still an elementary school age. Maybe cresting around pre-teen age, but there are very young groups of parents. And you have a really beautiful unique situation where you are a mother to a 26 year old boy who has ADHD and dyslexia. I'm curious if he's shared with you some of the things that you did during his childhood that meant a lot to me.

With the needs that he was experiencing or that he had.

“Honestly, I think, without putting words in his mouth, he'll tell you that the fact that I and his family believed in him and believed him capable and believed him worthy and believed that he was struggling.”

Was the thing that really was the most important to him because in school he was teased.

His teacher would call me and say, you know, I don't understand, you know, why can he memorize a story and not read it? Or I understand why is he getting up and wondering, well, you're putting him on the spot and embarrassing him. And I think for John, the fact that we all believed in him and knew that he was enacting out and trying to be unreasonable. He had his people and meant really a lot to him and he did not feel as badly about himself as some of the other kids around him who might have had other issues were feeling.

Absolutely. We know that, you know, ADHD kids, they hear no, what is it like 20,000 more times than another child just in like one year. It's like it's absurd the number of negative criticism comparatively speaking. Were there ever times that you felt super overwhelmed with the whole process and how did you cope as a mother of four with one child who had special extra needs that needed to be on top of and focused on how did you keep yourself. Abel to be that believer, able to be that resounding person for him.

The other children are much older. John is eight years younger than the next one.

“In a way it was easier and harder because it wasn't like I had little babies at home, but teenagers, you need to be there for them.”

Yeah, more so than younger kids sometimes. I was lucky. I have an amazing supportive wonderful husband who was there and did as much as he could division of labor.

I was the four kids decided to not work outside the home at that point. It was just too much. And so if he needed to get home for me, he would do his best to do that or I have a good group of friends I would call and say, can you please pick up so and so for me I'm stuck in traffic or it took a lot of creativity and planning. And unfortunately we can't really clone ourselves even though we'd like to try it. Absolutely. So walk me through the co-authoring process with you and Jonathan. What did that look like?

And then, you know, early on we were very sure he was sure that he had a point of view that was important. So we co-authored and illustrated. He did all the illustrations. I say that I do stick figures and he says don't don't discount those. I decided to also honestly to say we have to take our mother's son hats off and we have to be able to be honest with each other because if I wasn't crazy about something in a picture or he wasn't crazy about some of the words we used in the story or we knew we had to be honest with each other else. We were going to have a lot of hurt feelings.

You know, for the child. And so I don't know that every mother and child can do that but we really had the ability to do that. We having spent like so much time and so much time in the car together and we had that ability to communicate with each other which was fortunate.

After hundreds of conversations with fathers, Jeff realized they're not talking enough about what modern fatherhood actually feels like.

The pressures to provide the fear of messing it up. The moments they lose control and the quiet worry that they're not doing enough. On Jeff's show, they get honest about the fears and the stakes and they also share the bright spots, what's working and the small wins that keep them going. Jeff and I have joined forces because we keep seeing the same patterns in both of our audiences, couples who love each other but keep getting stuck in tense loops around their kids and the stress that it causes. So we're hosting a 90 minute couples workshop called from Tense Together. In the show notes, you can register. It is on February 22 and search for ambitious dads wherever you listen to your podcasts.

So walk me through the stories. You talk a lot about the representation of different types of neurodiversity. Walk me through the series. What each book has to share with all of us.

“The first one was Robbie the dyslexic taxi in the airport adventure and that was first we thought that's what we'll do. Just that book.”

But we've been on so many wonderful podcasts and we had so much attention and John went back to the school to the winward school where he went and he was treated like a rockstar. You know, like all these kids are like, yeah, I see myself and I can do this and everyone started saying, well, what are you going to do next? And we went back and forth about it because now John is getting his MFA. He's in Chicago. And we decided that we really would like to try to make a series because there aren't a lot of kids books and when John was little, there were no kids books that taught about neurodivergent issues.

And we thought this is really underserved, but really special in an important community. Robbie works at the CreativeCab company and we decided that we were going to write a series.

And then the second book was Susie the ADHD taxi and the sightseeing adventure. Susie just came out and we have gotten such great receptions. Both books won the creative child awards.

“One in 23 and one in 25. And the feedback we've gotten has been really, I think the reason we decided to do this was to have people feel good about themselves. And I think the fact that that has been happening has been really rewarding.”

Absolutely. Have you received feedback from kids? Have they shared with you like, oh my gosh, I saw blank in me. What have you heard from kids so far? So when John went back to school, he really was, you know, can you sign my book and you sign my autograph? And he, he felt, you know, we're going to go back again with this book in a couple months. And he felt terrific. We did a book signing and this kid came up to him and said, oh my god, no one ever knew what dyslexia was. And you know, I can show my mother, my, you know, not mother, my grandmother, my teacher, my, I went to read this a couple years ago to my, the first book to Robbie.

To my grandson's class and they were at the time in first grade. And that's when a lot of children are learning to read. And it opened up a huge conversation with the kids with the teacher. What does it mean? And I can read fine, but who I'm having trouble. And those are all the conversations that we were hoping to have. And so when they do happen, it makes us both feel really terrific about it.

“Yeah, I remember when we first got the diagnosis for my son with ADHD, we got a workbook. It was like thriving with ADHD or something like that. And they were kind of referencing like these are the different types of ADHD.”

You can have and go through and check them off and you'll learn like what kind of was a gazelle or was it, you know, a turtle or something like that. And he was like, I got 100% on all of them. And I was like, oh my goodness. Okay. In my head, I'm like, that wasn't the goal here, but okay. But it's so true. It's like, I mean, even just the workbook that we utilize for a brief moment in time is like, he saw himself in the pages. And he was like, that's me, that's me. And that representation. And it was almost like beforehand, it's this external thing, right? It's like something happening to me. It's like something that's a burden on me. It's I'm, you know, saddled with this and I can't change it and nobody understands it.

And how can I explain to my mom like my racing thoughts and why I can't complete a project and why I can't, you know, sit at the dinner table. And it's always a conflict.

That things that go to a resistance and create pressure and create shame in the child, just builds and builds and builds and being able to point to something and say, that feels like me.

Yeah, when John, as I said, when John went to the winwood school, like, within the first few days he goes, they're all like me.

I'm not, you know, crazy. I'm not stupid. I'm not whatever what's thrown at him.

“Yeah, no, I'm not. I have all these people who are just like me and I'm capable and I think that's so important.”

Absolutely. Too many times with any neurodivergent issue, people say, you know, you're less than. And that's, that's not the case. John thinks of it as a superpower. Yeah, but for the fact that he was dyslexic maybe he wouldn't have been drawing so much as a child when he couldn't read. And this is his outlet and I think everybody needs to understand that they all have their superpowers.

So were you always of that mindset? I know that your message now is that every difference is a strength.

These really big challenges that they face ultimately can result in having a tremendous superpower, right? Like you were saying, he struggled to read, sound art and he's an illustrator, you know, and and it's an incredible testament to being able to hone that strength and not feel embarrassed by it and not have it consume you and shame. Was it always your way of addressing it and living it into the family is this is a strength versus a weakness. Or were there times where you struggled or you're like, this is just too much.

Walk me through that. How did you do that? I think we all have to give ourselves grace. We are not perfect. It is not easy. We have our own feelings and emotions in lives and we have other children and jobs and it's just a lot. I would be lying if I said that, oh, every day I got up and I was so happy because you know. It's so hard sometimes.

Yeah, it's hard to give your child what they they need sometimes because you don't know and you're learning about whatever it is.

“And, you know, you have to deal with here.”

Maybe your other children who have their own issues and don't understand what it is yet. And I think it was a journey for me just as much as it was for John and for my family and sometimes with my two oldest grandchildren we were talking about it. What that means they may not have a neurodivergent issue or they may or you know, but what does that mean and why am I struggling to do this at school? And why is this easy for him? And I can't kick a sock. Whatever it is, a soccer ball. Whatever it is. Yeah, I think we all need to give each other some grace and then permission to go, oh my God, I have to go to the bathroom.

I'm lacking the door. Leave me alone for five minutes. You know, whatever it is. Yeah, absolutely, you know, as we're all trying to figure out how to support our children best. We're also, it goes hand in hand with sometimes mourning the loss of the childhood experience you thought you were going to have or the relationship you thought you were going to have. Almost every single parent that I work with, they did not realize this was an option. A lot of the parents and they don't necessarily have the skills or the tools to be able to handle the enormity of it because it often does require more.

ADHD kids talk 20% more than non ADHD kids. Just that 20 extra percent of just talking can be more than we all expected. Was there something that you, because you have a beautiful relationship now. And I think I'm trying to speak to the people who are in the thick of it right now. What is something that you held onto as the mother of a neurodivergent child that kept you focused on the goal? Kept you focused on the support versus trying to fix correct or, you know, just shut it down.

“I think finding your people, whatever that means is so important because sometimes you just need to vent a little or I see this have you seen this.”

Exchanging ideas being supportive, listening, sharing and I think gosh, I think that is so important. And now there are Facebook groups, they're pod wonderful podcasts. There are so many other platforms, but back then I didn't know who to talk to. Yeah, and so I would say really it's so important to find people who are in the same similar boat for you, for your kids, for your family. Everybody is sort of meeting different things and you can't be everything to everybody. Isn't that the truth? Isn't that the truth?

Yeah, and I think we put so much pressure on ourselves to be the person that solves it for our children.

And you're right, it's too much to do it all, and ultimately when I found out that my son, well, I just thought, holy cow, this kid has the strongest will of all time.

Like, I didn't know anybody else dealing with this, and you know every person inside of my community is like, that's what I'm dealing with.

Yeah, it really helps to have like, yummy too, me too, that's me too, that's my experience too, absolutely.

“I can't stress that enough for how important I think that is.”

Absolutely. Well, where can people find your book? Is it sold everywhere? You know, we have dyslexia, we have the ADHD books and anything else on the horizon that you're going to be writing about.

We are we're kind of trying to wrap out with some ideas and trying to see what other neurodivergent issue might translate into some sort of vehicle.

There's so many options, and we just trying to decide what best to do next. You can find us on also social media on creativecapcompany.com. You can DM us. We have a website, same name. You can go to Amazon and buy the book. If you go into a bookstore and you might not see it. Everything is like, you can't where is a bookstore. Exactly, but you can, if you do have one, you can ask and they can order it through an organization called bookshop.org.

“We hope people will want to read it, and let us know what they think, right?”

Or review, or just DM us, or email us, so we'd love to hear from you. Well, I'm excited. My son is eight almost nine, and he's moved kind of away from the picture books. But I feel like even still, this would just be fun for him to see, because he'll probably, when he was a kid, everything was truck. Everything was garbage truck. Everything was car. Everything was motorcycle. Everything was scooter. Everything was vehicle. So I still feel like he'll see himself in it, and he'll still be able to resonate and enjoy it.

Well, thanks. Let me know what he thinks. I would love to hear. I will thank you so much for being here, Lynn. This was so wonderful. And for all the parents out there who have these young elementary school kids,

what an amazing way to just give relief, just give like the acknowledgement of ICU. This is normal. This is your superpower.

“A way to see their differences as a strength, and really focus on that. How can we empower this part of you? How can we find, like you said, he had dyslexia, and that was a struggle, but then he became this artist, right?”

Such a beautiful way of transitioning the, quote unquote, diagnosis into something really beautiful. So I applaud what you've done. I admire the relationship that you have. It's such like a, you know, north star and beacon to see that that is so possible, even in the midst of struggle. So thank you for being that for all of the community who's listening right now, who might feel in the trenches, and it's, it's a really beautiful thing to see. Thank you so much. It's really kind of you. And John, we should see could be here, but it says thank you. And, you know, he hopes that everybody finds a way to see themselves in a place of strength and grace.

Enjoy who you are. Be proud of who you are. Absolutely. Well, thank you, Lynn, and everyone I will see you next week. Can I be super real with you, and tell you a personal story? A few years back, my son. The whole reason why I do the job I do today was having one of those fiery moments. He was talking back to Mandy and it be his way. He was refusing to listen to any of our solutions, and the moment was getting really intense. I has been looked at me and said, well, you know all the parenting stuff fixed this. I completely froze.

All the scripts from the books I read, all the strategy from the podcast I listen to completely disappeared from my brain in that moment. But based on the volume of challenges that we were having with our strong will of ADHD son, I knew I had to figure out a different way. Because panicking in the moment and grasping at anything only to not follow through at all and end up yelling just wasn't working. From this experience, I developed a repeatable easy to remember an easy to follow system that literally works with every single triggering moment.

I can attest to it because there are many in my life. Now I can show up the way I want. I can communicate in a way that actually resonates with my strong will child. If this sounds like a solution for what's happening in your home, take these next two steps. Number one, watch the free training about my rewiring process in the show notes and then number two book your free call. On that call, we will talk about what's happening in your home and you will get a customized solution that works best for you.

Thank you for listening to the responseable parenting podcast. If you like what you heard, please take a moment to read, review and subscribe.

“If you know someone who would benefit from this podcast, I'd be honored if you'd share this episode with them until next time.”

Know that you are enough, you are capable, you've made it through all of your hardest days and we will keep growing on this parenting journey together.

This podcast was produced by Kim Kelty in myself, Becky Jennings, and edited by the Kelty method, branding and podcasting.