397: Still Missing at Sea, 48 Stab Wounds & Family Annihilation Plot

>> Hey, true crime besties.

“Welcome back to an all new episode of Seriously.”

[MUSIC] Hello, hello, hello, and welcome back to an all new episode of Seriously, with me, your host, Annie Elis, Happy Thursday. I hope you're having a good week so far, we're almost at the weekend. So yay for that, and happy belated Mother's Day to all the mothers who are listening.

Let's see, a lot has been happening this week, and interestingly enough, there's been like not at ton of updates in cases we've been covering, but a lot of brand new cases that are going on right now. And like some really disturbing odd obscure cases. And look, I know we talked about Hontavirus a little bit last week.

So many of you commented on it with like not only your opinion, but what you've heard, you've been following it, it obviously has progressively gotten, I guess you, I don't know if you would say worse, I guess so. It's evolved over the last week. So I am going to be releasing a bonus episode most likely tomorrow with a full

timeline of all of that, everything that has come up throughout this situation all the way up until today, whenever I record it this afternoon, because now the cruise has disembarked, there's more illnesses, there's more information, and we have a lot to talk about. So I know it's not obviously like in our wheelhouse of true crime and the normal things

that we talk about, but because of how many of you not only showed interest, but we're asking for more information and just still feel a little bit unclear about what's going on, we figured, you know, might as well put all of the information that we have gathered together and give you an episode. So that will be coming out tomorrow, but remember, you're going to want to make sure you're

following the podcast so that you don't miss it. I also can tell right now my voice is getting worse, that sucks. That means I am probably going to be sick soon, which fuck that. All right, so headline highlights today, everybody, welcome to the show, a brand new guest that we haven't ever had before that I am really excited for you to meet.

Her name is Ami Obrine. Hello. Welcome. It's so nice to meet you. It's very nice to meet you, you know, I feel like I've known you my whole life.

“Well, and I feel like you must feel very close to me to come and sick and just chat with”

me so closely. Literally, as I talk about haunted by, I know I thought should I be pulling out a mask right now, like, what's happening? I haven't been about around any road insolently, except me to my knowledge, um, hello. Welcome.

First, we're not going to get into it yet. Did you do your homework? I did. Okay. For those of you who listened last week, I know some of you DM me and said, you did your

homework too. Oh, I'm excited. You're like very excited to talk through this together. I did assign some homework last week on Thursday.

I've never done that before, but I was feeling very future appreciation week.

“And the homework was to watch the Netflix docu-series, should I marry Ami Obriner?”

Because I had watched it, I have a lot of thoughts on it. And so I gave Ami here some homework, all of you listening or watching some homework. So I hope you guys did the work because we're going to talk about it after we get through these cases today. Um, yeah.

So, are you ready? I am ready. Well, I want to start with actually an update in a case because I feel like this shit that's going on in the Bahamas is like the case that is not going away and just kept getting shadier and shadier, which when we talked about this a couple of weeks ago, I remember

I said, I think like straight to camera, I was like, look, I will pay for your airfare, your hotel, get your ass back to the Bahamas, look for your missing wife, which spoiler alert, he still hasn't hit me up to take me up on that offer, which that's not a surprise because I think he is trying to not go back to the Bahamas for obvious reasons. But anyways, you probably remember us talking about the disappearance of Lynette Hooker.

The woman who vanished in the Bahamas back in April, she was on this evening little boat cruise on a dinghy with her husband Brian and according to him fell off the dinghy into the water and it was so dark he couldn't find her and at the time it was described as

basically just this horrific accident that took place out at sea.

Now the case is starting to feel a lot different because there have been a lot of new developments along the way and a specific new one that came out this week and it's something that has a lot of people raising their eyebrows because now authorities have officially seized Brian's little boat as evidence. So really quickly just to refresh everybody again on this case Lynette disappeared on April

4th near Elbow Kay in the Bahamas.

on one of those little dinghy kind of like inflatable looking type boats and Lynette fell

overboard into the darkness. He couldn't reach her. He also said that the water was pretty rough and that when she fell over the dinghy she

“had been holding the key to the dinghy so once she hit the water the engine shut off as”

well. He said that he had tried searching for her in the dark but eventually he lost sight of her completely. So then he had to paddle himself back to the shore alone which getting back to the shore it took him almost nine hours but when he finally made it back at around 4 a.m.

he did call the authorities and he told them what happened. So after that search crews spent days looking for Lynette. They were searching by boat, by air, all means that they possibly could but unfortunately

she was never found and as more detail started coming out a lot of people online just

really started questioning the integrity of what he was saying. His story wasn't really adding up. Not necessarily because there was any sort of proof that there was foul play at that point but more so because there were just a lot of unanswered questions questions about the timeline about the conditions that night and about how exactly this happened because

Brian also was the only known witness at the time which that's huge. Dry at me if the only witness was then paddling for nine hours his wife just so happened to fall overboard it's a lot of you know coincidental stuff. So he ultimately ended up being detained by the authorities in the Bahamas for five days and he was questioned about the situation but eventually he was released without charges.

He also then went back to the United States to which Lynette's daughter was wondering why he was doing that. He said it was a family emergency but like what family emergency is going to trump looking for your missing wife and then once that family emergency is handled why aren't you returning to look for her?

It feels more like you know you don't want to get locked up in the Bahemium jail system. That's what it's feeling like to me. So last week investigators ended up making another move that started getting people talking. The Coast Guard publicly asked for help identifying another sailboat that had reportedly been anchored right near their sailboat the soul mate and anchored near it the night

that Lynette disappeared so this of course immediately made people wonder if the investigators were possibly trying to find witnesses or maybe if they were trying to verify whether somebody else saw or heard anything at all that night not just a witness to them getting off the boat but maybe they saw the dinghy maybe they saw something but now things with that have escalated even more because over the weekend the US Coast Guard investigative

“service officially seized the soul mate itself which remember that's the sailboat not”

to the dinghy but like the major boat so that's interesting because yes you want to see everything as evidence you want to start building the timeline you want to look for any sort of whatever and just anything that will help tell the story of what happened but could it be that they think that something happened on the soul mate itself and maybe not on the dinghy maybe they did return back from dinner to the sailboat something happened a fight in our

human and he made the whole dinghy story up in the middle of the night and then paddled for nine hours who really knows but obviously they're looking for something according to the reports the boat had left the Bahamas and actually was heading back toward the United States when all of this happened they then decided to intercept it and they brought it into Fort Pierce Florida there's even footage of the boat being towed by the Coast Guard and there's drone footage just

showing it sitting right there at the Coast Guard facility while the investigators are starting to process it and I'm going to play a little bit of that video for you now for those of you who are watching the video version of this and if you're listening to the audio version you can of

course as always pop over to the video version but let me just play you some of that news coverage

now with those visuals thinking tonight a massive development in the mystery of the missing Michigan mother Lynette Hucker her body still not found tonight for weeks the sailboat known as the soul mate sat on a mooring ball in the Bahamas well tonight it's in U.S. custody the Coast Guard intercepting the 46 foot vessel and these exclusive images from the drop dead serious podcast with Ashley Banfield allegedly showing the boat being towed into Fort

Pierce Florida investigators are now scouring the deck for forensic evidence digital data anything that could challenge the story told by Lynette's husband Brian now he claims she fell overboard from a dingy back on April 4th but the Coast Guard investigative service clearly widening

“its net now so honestly this is a pretty big deal because law enforcement generally doesn't just”

seize an entire boat in a missing person's case unless they do believe that there can be evidence on board right so now investigators reportedly have access to everything GPS history navigation

really anything and everything that could either a backup Brian story completely and illustrate

“that he's telling the truth or potentially poke holes in his story I want to be clear though”

as of right now Brian Hucker has not been charged with any crime at all and investigators have not publicly accused him of any crimes related to the case but between the Coast Guard involvement and the search for nearby witnesses and now the actual seizure of the soulmate sailboat it definitely feels like the investigators are taking a deeper look as to what really happened that night I personally think where there's smoke there's fire there's nothing about this story that adds up

to me it could be a horrible tragic accident yes but again what I'm getting caught up on is then why are you returning to the Bahamas why are you hiding out in you know not I guess like in plain sight yes but still evading going back and as of right now Lynette also has still not been found so it will be interesting to see what they discover if anything on the soulmate maybe there's a droplet of blood maybe there's a phone ping from when she was really back on the uh

“boat that night before I would imagine he threw all for devices overboard if he really did do anything”

to her um I mean we'll see what comes out of this but my gut is telling me and it could be wrong I have been wrong once that I can think of off the top of my head about a case I have been wrong once before I could be wrong again I was gonna say in life or about a case about a case yeah but I maybe I've been wrong about more but not that come to mind but there is one that I know for a fact I was wrong about when I thought like the daughter was involved and still I will say this

on my defense a lot of people do still think the daughter is involved it was this case about this woman

Debbie Collier she basically was found nude burned alive in the woods and it was ruled as self-inflicted

but right before she took her life she sent her daughter a Venmo Venmo with the exact dollar amount that she had in her bank account with like a cryptic message about a keeping under the porch like weird stuff I got the daughter had money problems the neighborhood of fight her the neighborhood

“heard a fight between them the night before there was like a shady boyfriend in the mix”

people don't typically burn themselves alive she was seen on camera going and buying camera for it was liquor or what it was to go to a tailgate for like a big game that night and then like veered off course and went okay apparently took her own life in the woods so everybody's like the something's going on here people still think that there's something shady

that went on there but it ultimately was ruled as self-harm and so I will say I have been wrong

hopefully I'm wrong here I mean I don't feel wrong no and like you're saying nothing adds up and the story doesn't add up there's too many things that don't add up and that's the problem I mean if your spouse is missing you don't leave no you're doing anything you can to help aid with the investigation you're pressing the investigators to do whatever they can you're not piecing out and obviously you know I'm just thinking about this now this is something they

obviously are going to put together in terms of timeline I could see let's just say this it took him nine hours to paddle to shore my first question is did he not have a cell phone or maybe there wasn't service out there okay fine nine hours so how far in comparison was that dingy if the shore is here the dingy's here and the soulmates here like how much more time would it have taken for him to get to the sailboat from the dingy versus the shore was he trying to extend it

to nine hours like they're going to probably do all of the coordinates to figure out like again map time of like what happened that night but there's something that just feels like we're thinking maybe something happened on the main sailboat and then maybe that he took I know you're saying maybe the dingy was just a made up story but maybe he used the dingy to dispose of her yes possibly and like maybe because it didn't take us phone because we don't want to track

although that would easily be disproven because if his phone and if her phone are last pinging on the soulmate not at the restaurant or wherever they had dinner which I know they were doing an evening cruise so maybe they had dinner went back then decided to go on an evening cruise together like with a drink or like I need to dig in a little bit more here but I mean I could say writings on the wall yeah and I mean obviously there's no way to know what happened but

it feels like there'd be more I don't know I guess this is total speculation but you would feel like there'd be more opportunity for something to happen on a larger vessel than on a small dingy where it's like unless he was planning it because he knew that she was like upset and like kind of not over the relationship but like there was some friction in the relationship so he's like oh let's go for sunset cruise just like oh let's go for a hike I'm going to push you

off the cliff I'm going to push you off the dingy um I mean who knows my voice is getting worse

I think I should start singing smelly cat well when you first introduced me and I mean it's

gonna say you're kind of like low energy today but then as you started singing you felt sick I felt a little guilty that I was gonna call you out for that I did yon right now I recorded

“it's true I think I thought you were just sleepy I literally yesterday injected glutathione into my”

ass cheek so I should not be getting sick I want to refund honestly this is this is bullshit you know smelly cat smelly cat is not your fault um let's not ruin the vocals on this thing I can't say before like there's a car there'll oh somebody crashes right now I did not do my homework for no reason okay oh I'm not okay so I'm work but like the real homework then we're gonna get to yes you know what I think would be really fun when we get to that if I grade you okay

but like it'll be completely subjective okay because like I have my opinion of what qualifies as an A version of that great whatever your opinion is perfect sounds like I'm set up for success speaking of a loser man being rejected beyond okay let us let it rip obrient all right so this next case out of Pennsylvania started with a house fire in the middle of the night but investigators are saying that it wasn't an accident at all because according to police a man allegedly set the home

on fire after a woman living there rejected him and details about this are just awful so this happened in Louis town Pennsylvania where police say a 40 year old man named Robert Zimmerman had gone to this home because he wanted to confess his feelings to a woman who lived in the attic apartment apparently the building where he lived was divided up and rented out by multiple tenants but according to investigators when he got there she rejected him and that's when everything escalated

witnesses reportedly told investigators that they saw Robert setting items on fire inside the

first floor of the home and then another witness said that Robert actually admitted to starting the

fire and is it spread throughout the building witnesses said that they saw Robert eventually walk outside stand in a nearby alley and just watch as everything unfold which is super creepy it actually reminds me of that meme of that little girl where she's like lights the building on fire and she's just standing back watching and inside the house as you could imagine people were desperately trying to survive one man reportedly had a jump from the second story window just to escape the

flames and investigators say he suffered severe burns to his throat along with major facial injuries another woman was reportedly hanging out of a window trying to get away from the smoke when she either lost consciousness or just became completely overwhelmed and fell onto the concrete below

but 44 year old Brandy Felipe the woman who rejected Robert she never made it out a 30 say she

became trapped inside during the fire and her death has officially been ruled a homicide caused by

“arson and when you hear more about who she was it honestly just makes this story even more heartbreaking”

reports say Brandy was an army veteran who specialized in patriot missile systems during her military service before later becoming a truck driver and then there's another layer to this case that people online have been really discussing after Robert was taken into custody police say he admitted to taking fentanyl and actually started showing signs of overdosing while he was there he then had to be transported to the hospital before investigators could even continue questioning him and once they

were able to speak with him again he allegedly made several incriminating statements but he also claimed that he couldn't remember the exact moments the fire started even though he could remember what happened right before and right after the fire which of course already has people wondering whether his defense is eventually going to lean into drugs or memory issues and another detail the investigators noted is that Robert allegedly had with a described as a strong emotional response

after learning that someone had died in the fire and people are taking that in very different ways

some people think that it was the guilt finally setting in and other people think that it was

completely performative and then there were others that think that drugs actually did play a much bigger role in this whole entire situation than even what we know right now so Robert was

“arrested and at the time of this recording his charges have not yet been announced but honestly”

this whole case feels just very unsettling because something that probably just started as a very uncomfortable and awkward situation is this man coming to profess his love to somebody within minutes turned deadly that is so terrifying one of my biggest fears is being burned alive and for everybody involved not just unfortunately her who she was trapped but everybody trying to escape like the poor woman and the audacity of this guy okay you get rejected so you're going to what like

get lit up on fentanyl and then go start a fire well it sounds like maybe he I'm wondering if he

the rejection happened maybe he like obviously reacted and then he will give you courage I thought

“that made you tired I mean I don't know you but like yeah and isn't it like heroin that's what”

I mean I felt like it was more I don't know but I thought it was more of like a drowsy I mean drug I didn't really feel like it's like a truth serum like where you would want to go and what do you think people do for you if you choose to get high with it we may end up needing to cut this out if it gets flagged but this is educational YouTube so don't come for me oh no it says intense euphoria deep relaxation or sedation that's right pain relief warm heavy body feeling

and drowsiness or nodding off but of course the dangerous side effects are slow or stopped breathing loss of consciousness vomiting all of those things I mean that doesn't align with setting the building on fire no unless it's like just the like then they show you for it and like where did you

have the supplies to do that did you bring that so that would be no question is it always in my taste

not that the drugs make you an excuse for anything I'm just trying to understand more but I can't imagine like you're just a roommate in a building I mean how many of us rent or like living has lived in shared spaces and then it's true it's like what's the saying you never know your neighbors you never know anybody and it's like you never know what kind of danger you could potentially be in because of a neighbor not the term I mean a little bit of the story from last

week which is obviously much different scenario but it's just like people close to home when you're vulnerable and just feeling safe and if I need to say it again don't do fentanyl don't do any drugs because everything is cut with fentanyl now and it's so scary so terrified of me yeah you can't

“do anything not that you should ever but like it's just a very scary thing so don't do drugs”

it's kind of crazy when you think about how much we focus on things like skincare work outs energy levels for me it's obviously like I've been on a skincare journey for a year now I've

worked out so not so much but we never think about our liver meanwhile it's actually the thing

doing the heavy lifting every single day filtering stress process foods late nights basically everything that we put into our bodies and when your liver is overloaded you feel it sluggish rainfall digestion issues midday crashes all of it adds up but that's why I want to tell you about dose for your liver it's a clinically backed liver health supplement but it's simple it's a two ounce liquid shot that tastes like fresh squeezed orange juice and it's not another pill or powder

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functions in your body including energy production digestion even metabolism so look I tried it for small taste really for him good and I personally noticed feeling less sluggish and feeling more balanced throughout the day plus it's zero sugar zero junk and zero calories which win win win win win and it isn't just hype dose has two double blind placebo controlled studies that show positive impacts on liver enzyme levels so are you ready to give your liver the

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okay so this next case is another one of a man where it's like where do you even get the freaking audacity like what is going on here and when you step back and look at the full timeline it really feels like the authorities may have stopped and intercepted a family annihilation from happening like literally getting there right in the nick of time and this too like the story Amy just shared with us it all started with a romantic issue this one was a breakup so it

wasn't a rejection but you know adjacent to that according to reports 37 year old Brian Lanzim had been in a long-term relationship within the mother of his two kids and on April 29 she ended things with him over face time however investigators say that that conversation escalated fast really really fast during that call prosecutors say that Brian allegedly started making all kinds of threats saying things like you don't know crazy yeah and you know if I can't have

you no one can and then after she threatened to go to the police Brian started texting her relentlessly making threats against her family according to court documents he allegedly

quote leave him pulseless in the driveway he also said if you stand between me and my kids

“I'm going to do what I need to do so at one point she says that she heard what sounded like”

a gun click almost like it was being loaded on the other end of the call like he was getting prepared to you know load his weapon get in the car do what he was going to do so immediately with that she got scared enough that she contacted the police and filed a temporary restraining order because she believed that Brian was now driving all the way from Maine to New Jersey with the intent of hurting her family which that would have been an eight-hour drive and based on what Brian was saying

to her even though it's going to be an eight-hour drive she did not think that that was going to

stop him she said he sounded serious and that that kind of trip was not out of the question for him

and according to investigators that's exactly what happened authority say that Brian then drove the roughly eight hours from Maine to South Tom's River New Jersey all while he was armed with multiple firearms and even a tactical vest he also had around 15 large capacity magazines in his truck so like he was ready to reload he was ready to get into a gunfight he was wearing a tactical vest like he was prepared to do some pretty horrific damage he was later described too as being quote

ready for war which hearing about all of the guns and the amount of ammo that he had on him it sounds pretty accurate that you're comparing him to somebody being ready for war thankfully though at that point the police were prepared they already had received that phone call they knew that there was danger possibly coming in and so they were prepared and they were already on the scene waiting for him to arrive and sure enough when he did turn up at the house that's when things turned

violent investigators say that he drove across the lawn directly toward the officers got out with a gun in hand and allegedly tried forcing his way into the house officers of course can front at him ordered him to drop his weapon but when he refused the officer opened fire Brian was shot multiple times but I guess he would say unfortunately in my opinion survived so he's now facing a massive list of charges including attempted murder, terroristic threats, burglary, multiple weapon

offenses and unlawful possession of body armor now here is where the case starts to get a bit more complicated because prosecutors are saying that this was not just somebody spiraling after a breakup and that Brian didn't just snap and have some sort of you know lash out crime of passion type things they said that they believed that Brian intended to seriously hurt or kill his ex-girlfriend's family also that he could get custody of their children and in court prosecutors also said that he had

allegedly been quote spiraling out of control for months especially after losing the job that he had

moved to Maine for in the first place however we know that there's always two sides to every story

or two defensive fence and a prosecution and on the other side of this his defense attorney is trying to paint a very different picture she says the Brian has bipolar disorder that he has been receiving psychiatric treatment in Maine and was in the middle of a severe mental health crisis that was triggered

“by the breakup and that that is what erupted into this entire scenario which honestly though when”

you look at the full timeline here that's part of why this case I think is not only going viral online but also hitting hard for a lot of the people online who are researching it reading about it seeing it in their feed because regardless of the motive people are looking at all of this and feeling like okay this came dangerously close to ending an entire family in an absolute horrific way and we have seen a lot of family and highlighter cases I mean hello Chris Watts is like the number one

mega one right but very rarely do we hear about the police intervening exactly when they should and stopping that from taking place can you imagine what would have happened if the police either said okay come into the station tomorrow morning will file a report will give you a restraining order but you know there's not much more we can do call us if he breaks it or if they just decided not to go on the scene that night at all this could have and probably would have ended so differently

“so I think that this is the blessing in disguise I mean I kind of wish he didn't survive the gunfire”

from being real with you but I mean the fact that he had the commitment to to drive the full eight hours to wipe out this family it's incredibly scary mental health crisis or not it's just diabolical I mean this was such a gods and all the right things happened at the right time like the

and lately we've been seeing cases where these people who are on a rampage go by multiple homes

“and like and it's saying if he's gonna plan to kill the family so get custody who knows where he”

would have stopped how far you go down that line yeah so that you are the one the last one left because if he was that arm and like no offense like you what do you think you're gonna do having custody like that is not the answer here oh you know oh my god so scary that is scary you thank God everyone say yeah all right so this next case out of Washington is one that a lot of

people have been talking about because almost nothing makes sense at first glance you've got a

frantic 911 call in the middle of the night a scene inside a home that investigators described as extremely violent surveillance footage that raised a ton of questions and a story that police now believe was something entirely different than what was first reported this happened in Covington Washington involving a couple named Jodi and Kyle Cathcart and when I tell you the

“details coming out of these documents are horrifying they are extremely horrifying so this all started”

on May 1st when Kyle called 911 saying that someone had broken into their home and attacked both him and Jodi deputies arrived and found Jodi dead inside a bedroom. Kyle also had injuries but were very minor compared to the severity of what had been done to Jodi because while Kyle had some small cuts around his eye and on his abdomen prosecutors say Jodi had been stabbed 48 times almost immediately investigators started feeling like things just weren't fully adding up they looked at how

incredibly violent Jodi's injuries were compared to Kyle's much more minor injuries and that they didn't appear to be obvious signs of a forced break in so as detectives started looking closer at the scene and trying to piece together what actually happened inside that house they decided to take a look at the family's ring camera footage and according to police that footage did show somebody leaving the house dressed in dark clothing but there was no footage showing anyone entering the home

beforehand investigators also noted in court documents that they found blood on the garage keypad and pointed out that somebody familiar with the home and the garage code could have gone in the house and left that way without ever even appearing on the camera which obviously raised a huge red flag if this was supposedly some random intruder breaking in but even more suspicious investigators say that the person seen leaving matched Kyle's height and build and from there the entire home invasion

stories started unraveling fast investigators say that Kyle eventually admitted that he had staged this entire scene to make it look like a burglary gone wrong investigators also found that dark clothing that was allegedly seen in the ring footage tossed into a neighbor's trashcan nearby so now the possible motive here is also something people have really been talking about because prosecutors claim that Kyle had been lying to Jodi for years about receiving a massive financial

payout in fact according to court documents Jodi allegedly believed Kyle's about to receive

around $6 million from a lawsuit settlement but investigators say that money didn't actually

even exist and they believe he killed her before she could find out the truth and then there's another detail from the court documents that has really stuck with people following this case because investigators referenced an incident from last year looking back that now people are seeing very differently according to investigators Kyle had told police about an incident in 2024 where he had taken the over-the-counter sleep aid sequel one night and then woke up the next morning to

Jodi telling them that he had apparently tried to smother her in his sleep using a pillow wrapped in saran wrap now to be clear investigators have not yet said that this incident was directly connected to the case but ever since that information became public a lot of people have been wondering whether it may have been an earlier warning sign that something much darker was happening in that home long before all of the sun folded or if medication could have induced some kind of

“weird sleep behavior that Kyle really didn't remember when waking up. The couple also had”

three young adoptive children under the age of eight living in the home and prosecutors say the children were in the home during the attack which makes this whole thing even more devastating.

So Kyle Kafka is currently being held on a $60 million bond and is facing first-degree murder

charges with a deadly weapon enhancement. So as more court documents are coming out people are paying very close attention to this case because the allegations here are obviously just very disturbing and kind of make you go like what in the actual hell just happened. I have a lot of questions about this case. First yeah what the hell happened why was his bail amount set so high if he doesn't

must be 6 million and then I googled and it was 60 million and I thought I've never heard of bail

that high have you? No but what's in must it's like a crazy case with somebody incredibly wealthy but what I think is also interesting is what you had said he had claimed that he was going to inherit or receive 6 million for a law law settlement which is the 10% that you would need to post for a bond amount so is he really coming into 6 million some more even though they said that's not real

“and that's why they said it so high because he does have money coming in. I don't know but I was I was”

confused about the 60 million also that felt very high. I mean I'm glad it's high he seems like a tree obviously but like is there money there? I'm wondering. I don't know. That's interesting. I know and then they were trying to blame it on the sleep medication which I obviously know crazy things happen with sleep medication but you're not you're not wrapping a pillow in seran wrap it well trying to suffocate your wife like on Z quill it actually did I probably shouldn't say

this one missing anyway it kind of made me think as you were saying I was like it's kind of a perfect crime because DNA usually is left behind on a pillow case if somebody's like breathing and you can get like the spray of like they're saliva and like what's happening for us advocating them with a pillow with seran wrap you would be able to take the seran wrap off and literally light it on fire and it would disintegrate. Okay I know. It's kind I mean let's not advertise now I know that it's

to not get there. I'm sure there's a way to get caught I still but like you know like I haven't ever heard of a pillow being wrapped in seran wrap and then I took it a step further in my mind. Let alone you came up with the plan while you were under the influence of an over the

“can't sleep they can be in. Well that's what I was thinking I know people have done some crazy”

stuff on ambient like Jay yeah I was thinking of her brother who got undressed on a plane just is sure but like on a trip down on a plane to tangle is not and like I don't remember if it I was sitting next to him I'm like circling please put your shipper back to her. God Jay's kind of a wild flyer but I've heard ambient like do not ever take it if you think there's a chance you might be awake at any point well it's effective you need to go like immediately to sleep

and stay there. So I also should not say this but I'm going to in my 20s when I dated someone that starts at the K. I took MBN pretty regularly to sleep but you would do start hallucinating if you stay awake and there were a couple of times I was in my early 20s okay was I even yeah I had turned 21 where like I kind of tried to fight it a little bit even being in bed not like walking around like a zombie but like tried if I just like feel the like hallucination a little bit

but yeah it's like you do trip out and it can be really scary but would you have the wherewithal to come up with a murder plot? Well no because that's not how my brain works. I was like oh I just want to see things look dizzy and spirally for a minute before I fall asleep to desperate housewives or whatever I was watching at the time you know what you want to say but I'm doing a rewatch now which why that

“that's why it comes to mind okay homework time everybody clock in and get comfy it's time for school”

so the homework was to watch the docu series is a three episode three parter called Should I marry a murder and let me give you a brief synopsis for those of you who did not watch so that you can partake in the conversation it takes place in Scotland and it's a woman

who basically coming out of a really bad breakup I think they were engaged possibly I don't remember

but she comes out of a really bad breakup she doesn't really have a lot of self esteem she's kind of spiraling she's a pathologist so she performs autopsies and you know does all of the emmy type stuff to figure out cause of death and all of those things and she meets somebody on Tinder who she immediately hits it off with he kind of love bombs her if I'm being honest but like they hit it off she drives out to his farm they are drinking a ton they're doing drugs together and like

and I think the drug of choice was like weed and cocaine they're like going off-roading together because the farm has like all this land they're in love it's like this whirlwind romance he ends up proposing to her after just a few months she says yes tells her family tells her friend orders a wedding dress with his mother her future mother-in-law and like it's just super excited which you could kind of think initially like sure you're in love it reads a little desparado because you just

got out of a relationship and now you're like rushing into this new thing but whatever and her friends and family were concerned they were they were kind of like this feels really fast you know like you just got out of something like take a beat we haven't even like not people hadn't even really met this guy yet like it was incredibly fast so then I forget exactly what had happened but he

basically I think he what got really drunk one night and like confessed to her and for one reason or

another how he and his brother his twin brother had been out drinking really late one night we're driving back to the farm on one of those you know two way lane highways where nobody's

I think in his late 50s maybe early 60s writing he was actually writing a charity ride at the time

but it was like the middle of the night and they hit him then he said we panic we don't want to lose everything I didn't want to go to jail he was he died on impact so we buried him on the farm and as it's the story goes on she's like showing she documents everything on snapchat and like would post she's one of those people if you probably have a friend or you follow someone who literally their phone is glued to their hand and they document their entire life through stories or take

talks or whatever and she was doing that as well so a lot of these were playing throughout the episode which I will say made it more of a dynamic episode but she then says that you know she was like shocked she didn't know what to do that she held this information she knew that she needed to come

“forward but she didn't like she loved him she was conflicted then I think a few weeks pass or something”

he says to her we need to move the body because somebody bought the farm and they're going to be doing construction like I need you to help us you obviously already know about this and that that was like the turning point too where she was kind of like look you know I need to tell someone this is bad so she goes behind his back she confides into her family she tells the police she sets up a

wire situation and basically gets all this information against him he gets arrested so this is

brother they don't say anything so the charges are pending for months and months and months or I'm not the charges the rest months and months and months go by meanwhile he finds out she's the one who flipped on him yet they still get back together continue drinking together doing drugs together being in this fantasy world together which she explains is being like in this love pocket before she knew that ultimately he was going to go to jail or like it was all going to blow up and

she was just trying to live in that blissful moment while she could even though she had turned him in he knew she turned him in and she knew he was a murderer during all this too she also finds out as she's there in this love bubble she's continuing to record him without his knowledge and he admits that when he hit this cyclist he was still alive at the time they then the brothers left him on the side of the road and drove to the farm change clothes grab tools came back to where he was

and at that point he was already dead and then they buried him so there definitely was a moment in which they could have called for emergency services they could have intervened they could have done something but instead they chose to wait for him to die which I believe once the medical examiner

looked at the well I'm getting ahead of myself ultimately they realized he did survive up to about

20 minutes after the impact so she ends up like throwing a red when he's she's like okay I'll help you move the body or whatever but like we they were out shooting like skeet shooting on the

“farm she's like you need to tell me where it is he said like right under your feet she leaves”

a red bull can behind to identify the marker tells the police it's on the here's the coordinates or whatever there's you'll see a red bull can start you know excavating take some a long time because I'm talking this is like acres and acres and acres and acres of land but they find the remains that's when they ended up doing all the testing figuring out that he could have survived 20 minutes after impact whatever so then he ends up ultimately getting arrested charged all the things just like his

brother however I can't remember what the charges were I feel like they weren't like that intense I can't remember what am I missing so a few things you missed that the brother so one thing I found interesting was that the brother warned Carolyn the girlfriend that the brother wasn't exactly who she thought and then he was the one who said that the gentleman was still alive right so not the boyfriend brother the other yeah the twin brother yeah he's the one who told her

that he was still alive at the time and the reason that Carolyn went back into the love bubble after knowing the information was because the police which I'm sure you're gonna dive into a little bit more were not as supportive as she felt they should be in terms of like taking care of a witness protecting her like helping with her mental health while she was going through this trauma herself

“and she I think felt very abandoned and lonely and like they were kind of the only ones and she”

that like understood what she was going through in this weird way and sorry am I getting ahead of myself here and I felt like also she felt a little even to taking the love bombing to another level because she said here this guy knows that I told on him and did the right thing and doesn't blame me because if you remember he like when he found out he started coming to her apartment and she was afraid for her life but when he got there he was kind of like I understood why you did this like

you did the right thing so she felt a little bit like oh my god this guy is owning what he did he's not mad at me we're kind of like in this together okay well which is a whole thing on its own

will agree or whatever it'll be interesting to see the comments I don't think that she would have ever turned him in had he not asked her to then move the body because in those weeks what when she knew about it but didn't like instead and she says in the interview like I knew I needed to do something which it's like that's easy to say after the fact but she didn't actually come forward and say anything until he asked her to actively participate in it and make her an

“accessory and I think that's what then triggered her I think that had he not asked her to move the”

body she would have stayed with him would have married him and what did she do to the rug 100% so I think one of the details that I forgot we didn't talk about that did bother her tremendously

was in the very so basically they were leaving I thought it was like a family gathering our friend

gathering when they were driving home at night and that's when they had this conversation of well now that we're gonna marry each other we should tell each other the worst thing that we've ever done so that we can like accept each other and know everything about each other I was shocked that he just came right out and said what he did so to me that felt like he wanted to tell that information and then later you hear the brother who's like warning her but when he said the detail of

he poured bleach all over the body I think for her that was also another reminder not only so it was first the bleach because it's like okay you accidentally hit this man you don't know what to do you panic but now you've buried this body you're actively covering bleached that's

“that's in conscious decision you're making so I think I got the feeling that that was a huge”

moment for her and what I think led her to be so scared of him in those certain moments and then secondly to find out he was actually alive and right there was a period where they could have saved him so there were like conscious decisions of where he made some scary choices and I felt like she was scared of him and that was part of why she was going to the police also because when she told her

parents that was the first person she told which kind of was surprising yeah I don't know I'm

can flick through because look and I don't want to sound insensitive everybody deals with trauma differently and like people suffer from PTSD and they like get scared and I get what you're saying too like she felt isolated unsupported by the police so she threw she threw herself back in with the brothers but like I said there were so many pieces of media included that she had been recording in real time that I get it people put on it trauma makes you do crazy things to where you act

a certain way you even think you're happy and it tricks your mind and all these things but when I was watching that seeing those videos even after she learned from the brother that the man had been alive and that they intentionally left him to die for those 20 minutes or whatever she still is sleeping with him happy in these videos doing lines of coke with him partying with him and again I get

“that your mind will do different things and trick you but like I think it was kind of going back”

to like the very beginning of why she've been gotten that relationship a little bit like desperate and looking for something in yearning for something and just so she wasn't willing to let it go rather than I'm going to go undercover and like continue to get information on them and like because the police aren't doing it I'm going to do it and like it felt more like she wanted to still be in this love pocket well 100% but I I don't know I mean who's to say but I don't think

she would have I personally didn't get the feeling that like that was the only catalyst for her coming forward was that he acted as her to participate I think that was definitely probably a huge factor but the going back after she knew about it I think I mean her friends I like she was a shell of a person like unrecognizable the police were not offering her any sort of support and so she turned to drugs and alcohol I think she was self-medicating I think all those videos were more

a function of her like being out of her mind a little bit and like documenting it and like being in denial and I think like you see people and like I mean this is not the same thing but in abusive relationships where they know what they're doing is they're in a bad situation with their posting the happy photos online and they're so I mean I think she was probably a little bit in denial of like well actually you know we didn't even mention this part once it finally came

time for the trial she was the number one witness and she didn't show up to testify she fled on drugs and drinking went to the farm which was far like hours away from her house went to the farm stole the tractor was determined to find what was she was in the water fall because he

disposed of it in the waterfall and they never were able to find it so she's like I'm going to

find this too like thinking that that was going to be the smoking gun even though she was set to testify that day and that actually is why the because she didn't show up to testify they reduced the charges because she was an unreliable witness and that's remember they dropped the murder

so then my mind like I agree to I think she was out of her mind I think she was on under you know under the influence of a lot of substances and like losing her mind a bit especially to like there was a man hunt then for her when she didn't show up at court and she gestured all these things but part of me was kind of like felt like she's been in love with him this whole time and even staying with him after all this is she now doing this to intentionally

taint the case and is that why the boys are acting so smug in court because she's trying to how I don't like something just didn't land for me well that's where I feel like she was I don't I don't I don't think she was even like in a battle with herself I don't know if she was that conscious of it but it was crazy because yeah she's in this like love bubble we're again I think it's like we all know how this is going to end but let's just enjoy the moment while we can if you will

and then when it came down to it and they were going to get when they went to court I think they didn't have enough evidence or they're that missing piece in order to get their sentence and their confessions on tape but they needed the bike or something but they didn't need the bike the bike would have just like sort of like secure it made it more secure because she the reason she fled was I felt like she had a plan was to go get that bike and it was to

then further the case to get them in trouble so then I'm like but if you were trying to reduce you I don't know I do you don't believe she was actually going to get the bike no I think maybe she was or maybe she was like pretending to look for the bike or like going off on like what like that's that you're not showing up as like in a witness and your the key witness who has

who heard the confessions first hand who has the recorded confessions after the fact all these things

and you're not showing up and then you're going all the way to the farm on a tractor drinking and like doing all these things I get she's saying it was to like help the case and yeah it likes to cure it and secure their conviction but like you are not the one who is going to like that's definitely a lot of crazy thought I don't know there's something about it I just cannot put my

“interesting I don't think we're seeing the whole story so that's what I wanted to ask you and I do”

my opinion maybe it's oddity I think she would have married him and kept his secret and taken it to the grave had he not asked her to help him move the body okay well I have another question for you okay I thought it was going to end in a completely different way I thought and they were going to get married when he like yes I thought the sentence was five years and then that's why the question is the title should I marry a murderer like he's accepted because that was another thing

it was like he completely owned up to what he did he I felt they were remorseful and sorry I think

they never blamed Carolyn in fact they were still friendly with her and yeah on good terms both

the brother and him so I I almost felt a sense of relief from them that they were caught and this was out in the open so it's like if they truly just made this tremendous air in judgment and they did their time and they owned it and they're not denying anything and now he wants to marry her that's what I thought the question was and so I was like oh my gosh like what a crazy position to be in I

“would not be shocked if when he's released she married someone else she did yeah that's why I was so”

shocked because I thought that's what it was yeah she's with somebody else and she's like I'm going to happy relationship now and she's like so thankful that interview is over so that's what I was thinking I don't know there's something you guys tell me if you've watched it or if you're going to watch it after this there's something that makes me feel like we're not and of course

we never get the full story we're getting one perspective one narrative but like there's something

off about it to me and I can't quite figure it out it was good that was very good I think you guys should watch it you know like yeah no I liked it I felt like in the beginning it was a little hard to watch but I think that's because I usually multitask and I needed to focus but like it kind of yeah maybe I really thought at the end that's where we were going with it and I was thinking not that it would be a difficult decision for me but I could imagine people who are really looking for love

and they have this person who owned it and served their time like would they consider to why I didn't we need any more homework and is he I mean is he a murderer yes 100% what do you

“mean what yes I mean I think they said he's I can't remember the charges but it was like they”

pulled that one off and I think it was something like not like the disposal or hiding a crime and lying to police and yeah these things but yeah he's a murderer he left him there to die yeah and then buried him for years like yeah years went by where people were looking for yes I mean that's what I think I think of his poor family and I to me I mean there'd be a lot of motivators to come for it until the truth but his family would be the number one yes that they deserve to know and

right put him to rest absolutely so I mean I think God they got that I know well there you go let me

marry a murderer and it's on netflix and that's what we've got for you for headline highlights today

“but I do I will have that hunt of Iris bonus episode for you tomorrow it will be right here on this”

feed and we'll go we're gonna go through everything like the timeline the what what the virus

even is how you contracted the symptoms all of those things and then I will be back with you

“with a deep dive on Monday morning as reminder if you missed it we also put out a brand new episode”

on Tuesday of this week but it's on my second podcast feed 10 to life so go over there it's the

case of Mariah Wilson we went way deeper than Netflix did sorry Netflix no shade kind of but it's about love triangle plastic surgery to go in hiding you know a sinister plot all sorts of crazy stuff so that is available right now for you all right guys until the next one be nice don't kill people take rejection if it comes your way just take it humbly and move along don't do fentanyl don't do fentanyl and don't go to the bomb as I guess and I love the bomb as don't take a dingy out

“don't you're on bad times just keep the word dingy more than anything honestly like I hate it”

don't go out in nature if you're in a tip with somebody just stay home just stay home all right guys bye