S9 E3: Stay

It was allowed to spread, while governments dragged their feet and tech companies shrugged.

“"I'm staring at myself in this video that I know I haven't made."”

"This is what it looks like to feel violated." This season, on understood. If you follow the trail, who does it lead to? These images they would like hunting me, and the biggest platform was Mr. Deepfake's understood. Deepfake porn empire.

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I had some offers from people that we knew that offered

to kill Gringo for me. Asked if I'd like that, and I said no, I did not want to be involved in anything like that. I couldn't live with myself if I cast someone else today. I said no, the justice will come to him one his times do. Things did not go as planned for the Crown's prosecution of Antony Ringo for the murder of

Christine Herron. This despite Ringo's meandering through several consistent confessions to have him killed her. "So, you killed Christine Herron. I need an answer, I guess.

“Okay. So, how do you feel after you told the show better than you got this off your chest?”

A little okay." "We do know the OPP made a mistake." "Did they tell you that?" "Yes." "Yes."

"When did they tell you that?" "After the case was over." "And how did they justify that mistake to you?" "They just come out and said there was nothing more they could do. They were very sorry. They didn't realize."

“Ringo's defense lawyer Stephen Gell outlines police errors at pre-trial for Judge RM Thompson.”

Investigators did not follow normal police or correct constitutional protocols. "You wish to say anything and answer to the charge in our lives to say anything wrong." Ringo was in police custody for 37 hours, but was only properly read his full caution and rights once, five hours after he had been brought in. He spoke by phone to legal counsel on three occasions for less than 20 minutes in total. Ringo told police repeatedly that he had no

comment. Regardless, under command of Detective Inspector Wright, police continued to interview Ringo and elicit statements. "A police officer's place to under us for murder, right?" "Murder Christine Heron and he's given you your rights to counsel, which means he's told you you can call a lawyer and we just got off the phone with one just a moment ago, correct?"

"So you're, you're very aware of your rights, correct?" "And you understand?" "Panning."

Officers didn't always take notes or record interviews as the law requires,

and another agreed to Sarah again overseen by Mark Wright. "Is when officers write in Graham a company wringle in the handover woods to look for Christine's body?" After Ringo repeatedly tells them that a lawyer has advised him not to go. Ringo tells Graham that it is not in his best interest, and that it would only hurt him more. Whereupon Graham says, "That's enough. Let's get going."

"I was very upset with all the mistakes they were making. They know better. There was no need for that. Especially even now that the part nothing was recorded. Nothing was wrote down. What was said?" The attempted search for Christie's remains with Ringo took a couple of hours, even though the terrain demanded something much more thorough. They recorded no audio or video with only Graham making a few notes the next day from memory. "No, that's something that anybody with common sense would have done."

"We do want accountability." "Right, Christie would just want that. She wouldn't want us to do all on the anger." "The Christine would just want justice to prevail." "She wouldn't want it to happen."

statements on a number of occasions. Despite that, Thompson throws out all statements and actions

“from Ringo from the moment Detective Inspector Mark Wright arrives on the scene, including the”

entire search for Christie's remains on the western side of the Sagan River. Ringo's statements to his family and to constable lipski, however, are allowed into evidence, along with only the

first police interview with Ringo where he made no admissions. Detective Inspector Wright said

he did his job by reading Ringo's rights and it was up to him whether he wanted to invoke them. Judge Thompson, however, criticizes Wright saying either he had no knowledge or understanding of the charter of Wrights or he deliberately chose to trample all over Mr. Ringo's rights as a Canadian citizen in defiance of the law. What he hoped to accomplish would be pure speculation, but what is known is that his improvened actions will undoubtedly hinder any attempt to prosecute Mr.

Ringo. After over 20 months in jail, awaiting trial, Ringo was freed after Crown Prosecutor Michael Martin stays the case against him. After a year with a stay in place and no new evidence

brought forward, the case against Anthony Ringo crumbles to nothing, as if it never happened.

Can anything be done to change that? I'm David Rigen and this is someone who knows something season nine, the Christine Herron case, episode three. Stay.

“I think she wondered what the legal system would have to let somebody go like that.”

News of the Ringo case collapsing reverberates throughout hand over and area. It was sort of pushed off to the side. It was big news for maybe a day or two and then it just

sort of went to the wayside again. No idea. What would make somebody say they did that?

I have no idea about that either. They didn't do that. I have no idea. Just when we hear stuff at the time, on the radio, at least that she said what happens by that stealth, I can't comprehend him. From what you know about Ringo, how do you think that situation went played out? I have no idea how they met. I still don't.

And Chrisie's mother Marianne and her stepfather Sean struggle with many questions.

“He was older than her. Christine was 15 at the time and Anthony Ringo, I believe, was 24.”

I did not know where Anthony Ringo myself. I don't believe anyone in the family knew Anthony. I don't recall Christine knowing Anthony Ringo. So how their paths crossed is on being owned to us. This is where I came into the process and where my investigations began. Back in 2010 and 2011, picking up the pieces.

So, that's the ruling of the superior court on the case in Anthony Ringo, September 26th. And the judge is... Thompson? Nothing had happened in the case until Ringo came forward 11 years after, Chrisie disappeared. Then the case against him failed and Ringo was free. Marianne and Sean weren't told much except that Ringo had said he killed Christine.

I'd rather be ever wanting to go talk to Anthony Ringo or to talk to him. Oh, I asked, too. And the police wouldn't let me. Oh, I definitely wanted to. Like, there's no reason he can't tell us what happened. So, I mean, why not come forward, you know, if he didn't mean to and was accidental.

Okay, we just want to know what actually happened.

I said, well, at least ask him, maybe he'd be willing to sit down and talk to me.

And I know his sister and his mother anytime they see me in a store, they laughed. So, but yeah, to this day, I still want to sit down and talk to him. You know, maybe as we go on, I can tell you a couple of things I did, maybe I shouldn't have. Because I was upset. So, tell me, what I did?

Yeah. Oh, he led with his mother, right? My little red neon with the flames on it and whatnot, there's a mirror on it and that car is some one of a kind and there's no way he could have mistaken and for no one else, but me.

I deliberately went over there a few times and I sat there and watched that house.

And what was I after? To hurt him? No. But I wanted him to know that we were not about to forget not for one minute. And then the OPP told me, "Goes, you do that anymore. We're going to have to charge you with stocking, Sean, and you're going to be in jail." So, I was told, "Stay the hell away."

We're just trying to understand what happened and why.

“And then you do it. Yeah, that's where rat, did you do it? Why?”

If you did do it. So, the mirror had tell me what we're doing this morning. This morning, we're going to see if Anthony Ringo will speak to me. Just try to get some answers out of him if he actually did something to Christine or why he confessed if he didn't. Just find out what was in his mind at that time.

What are your anticipations of what England said? I'm hoping he'll explain what happened to her and maybe show that he's sorry for what he did. To see what he says or feel even talk at all to me. I want to talk to him ever since they first arrested him. And if he didn't, why would he confess to something? But he didn't do.

We've never had any answers to any of our questions.

Do you know what really happened? I'm truly hoping that that Anthony Ringo will speak with Mary Ann. On a few him and D.C. he tried to explain what he did. If it's like I said in the earlier and other times, if it's an accident, please try and explain and help us understand.

What happened and why? It's been a long time, but for us even to be able to try to approach Anthony Ringo. So I hope we have a positive outcome today.

“The address I have for Ringo is I think that of a relative his sister.”

Normally, when I want to go to someone's house and knock on the door, I will want to scope things out of it to see how the place works. So that's what we do. Mary Ann is eager to get in front of Ringo and because of her calm and straightforward demeanor, she may be able to get him to say something.

It's a big step for her to take. It's going to be on the brakes. I'll tell you when it's up here, son. I go a bit faster, Sean. They don't want to threaten us, especially. I'm going to be on the right, so we're just going to look at it quickly on the way by. Mary Ann is calm in the back seat and Sean seems like a rock behind the wheel.

There it is right there. Rikos, boycat. Great behind that gray van is good spot. Pretty close to your grandparents. Is it going there?

Yes, son.

“So remember when you talked to Mary Ann, it's what he said, right?”

Well, not why did you kill her, but why did you say you killed her? Yes. So pull right up behind that van if you can. Hang on, it's good. They're Sean.

Mary Ann and I carefully leave the van and roll the sliding door shut behind us.

Sean pulls ahead a short distance. He's staying behind, afraid of how we may react in wringles presence. Mary Ann is already moving with purpose toward the house and I catch up. A woman who appears to be in her late forties, hair pulled back, pink t-shirt, opens the door and pokes her head out.

Trying to keep the screen door closed enough to keep her dog in. Hi, is he not going to call? He's still sweet. See? Could you wake up?

I'll just want to talk to him. It's Mary Ann. Mary Ann. Guess what? Do I know you? Thanks, so. I'll think we've ever met.

Hi, Amy.

“I just want to talk to Anthony for a little bit about what?”

I just want to ask him some questions.

I'll do it with Christine. I'm going to say no. Can we be that up to him and see what you talk to him? I already know, he'll say no. Just ask him and see.

That's a sister. This is her. Yeah. The door closes in almost immediately, so does the deadbolt. But once wringles sister realized who Mary Ann was,

I sensed a change and perhaps even some sympathy added in her gaze and tone. She's very protective of him, so I don't think she'll let him die. After a few moments wringles sister returns once again. No, no, it all. Has he talked to you about it at all?

Does he? Yeah.

Because I just need some answers.

That's all I'm after.

“I'm not here to be nasty or anything like that.”

What? So it doesn't talk about it at all. And you will talk to me like I, I'm not here to accuse or anything just trying for my own self. No, no, no, no, no. I'm not standing on closure.

No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. Did you think you were in the future ever? Just sit down. No, no, no, no, no. Just talk to me.

No, no, no, no. No, no, no. Like I say, you haven't come to the door yet. No, no, no, no. He's not afraid.

I don't care. What's there to be afraid of? Is it a ball? What's there to be afraid of if he's not involved? Wringle sister says over the barking dog.

That's all I'm at. Just don't talk to him. Take it some piece for myself. Yeah. So that I can go on.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. [MUSIC PLAYING] I'm work for CBC.

“I'm doing a documentary about the cristine hat.”

It is really just about information. And it's not about accusations. You can understand that it was a pretty difficult case. And Anthony, confessing to murder and cristine is a pretty substantial part of it. Did he ever confess anything to you or I understand he confessed to other family members

since on that night in August? Not the other family members. Not to you. Not to you. So how is it affected you, though?

You may have questions of your own as to why. Yes, but I'm in the same situation. If I want to find anything, oh, I got to speak to his lawyer. Can you just actually talk to him? He will not talk to me.

You're in a sister, right? Yeah. He's lucky he's got a sister. So protective. And nice to him.

Because protective, I don't know what I mean. Well, protective, I mean just, you know, being wary and things like that. But anyway, appreciate your time. And I hope we can sit down and talk to him because it'll help up immensely.

You know, this family. Just give me a minute and I'll tell him that your wife is okay. That's not good at all. She was in Corp with him.

Her and the mother. No, okay. Thanks so much for your time. Okay. Right up and down and all that.

The serving your dog.

Thank you.

We head back to the van and silence.

No, no, go. Try it or pass, but we couldn't get him to... Here we go. So what do you think of that, Maryanne?

“I think it's pretty, it's going to say the wrong thing.”

And I can't walk on charges again. I think it's a parade. You know that feeling when you reach the end of a real league good true crime series,

you want to know more more about the people involved

where the case is now and what it's like behind the scenes. I get that. I'm Kathleen Goldhardt and on my podcast crime story, I speak with the leading storytellers of true crime to dig deeper into the cases we all just can't stop thinking about.

Find crime story wherever you get your podcasts. So what do you have on your mind? Nope. At Chrissy's grandma sacks place again. Grandma has two white refrigerators

“and we're standing between them at a round wooden kitchen table”

where she has spread some pictures of Chrissy. Grandma listens intently as Maryanne describes the attempt to speak to Ringo. When we went to Anthony's place, he's living with his sister. That's where there are a couple of houses away from her grandpa used to live. But he was sleeping and she told us her daughter about that he wouldn't want to talk to us.

I think she's protecting him. Yeah, he sent us a mom of dead. Yeah, but now he wouldn't come up and talk to us at all. Disappointed that he wouldn't come talk to us at least faces. What have been nice?

Keep trying. The conversation soon turns to what the family has read about Ringo and documents I provided or heard coming out of the pre-trial. In 1993, when the investigation into Chrissy's case was just getting started, Ringo actually worked for the hand over police,

washing police cruisers. But he lost that job after he followed a woman home and went into her house. He happened to be carrying a starter pistol. This was also in May 1993, about a week after Chrissy disappeared. The woman barricaded herself in a bathroom until her boyfriend arrived and pushed Ringo

telling him to get the hell out of the house. Ringo served two years probation for possession of a firearm. His record also shows two counts of mischief in 1998 for smashing car windows and slashing tires. It's the day before the anniversary of Chrissy's disappearance.

I'm not giving up just yet. Oh, hi. Back at the sister's house. This time alone. There's cameras rolling in the van, tripods duct tape to the floor. Back up audio pinned to my shirt and I'm recording what the phone in my hand. Hoping again for Ringo.

“I'm good. Is this unit two or unit one here for this house or is this one unit?”

It's kind of a little both wide. What do you need? Oh, I'm looking for Anthony. Oh, he's down at his trailer right now, actually. Oh, okay, I'm nervous that. If you go down to the park, just follow our road around and the park dislike, there's an arena or something down here. I saw the arena, but is the park next to it? It's actually back in behind it. Oh, okay. So if you follow the road right around it,

there's a change house on the left and this is the first fifth wheel you come to. It's like a little white

trailer or something? Yeah, it's a fifth wheel trailer. Oh, okay. Good. Let's go talk to him. Thanks. trailer. Tucked in behind the arena and chest Leontario, a small town close to hand over.

and based on the few directions I just heard, I pull in at what I think might be the right

fifth wheel trailer. But no one's home. Not sure if this is wringles place or not. I try the next one. Nothing here, either. One more. A white trailer called a travel air with a green lawn more and a wood pile. Hi, how are you? Are you Anthony? Yep. Anthony wringle in a blue cap and dirty gray t-shirt standing before me, rubbing at bleary eyes. I'm day virgin. I work for a CBC. I wanted to ask you about your confession regarding the murder of Christine Harron,

“an August 2004. Can you tell me a little bit about that? Why, why you confessed to that murder?”

No. I can't hear you through the wall question. No.

Wringle sits down in the stoop. The door that he's holding open with one hand blocks him from the view of the van cameras, but my phone roughly captures him as he continues to stare at me. Seems to have taken a lot out of you. You went in there, you fleece had you in there for a little while and then you had to go to jail, right, for a couple of years. And it's just tomorrow as the anniversary the May 18th tomorrow. So I'm just I'm just wondering if you could talk to me a little

bit about your experience with that. No. You know, I was kind of the metal behind me. Did you know

Christine? No, you didn't know her. Did you kill Christine? Wringle shakes his head, but seems subdued by the question. There's a picnic table next to the door and I find myself settling back on to it to try to relax the tension I've introduced if that's possible, but also press further. Why did you confess to her murder? What happened that day? Like, it seems like such a strange thing to do.

“No explanation? Does it seem like a long time ago, to you?”

Thank you. I noticed I was searching for you on the internet and I noticed that your mother has passed, and started your letter. I'm sorry to hear that. And my understanding is that you had confessed to your mom that night on August 22nd, 2004, or the killing Christine Herron, and you confessed to your cousin in your cousin's boyfriend. And then you went and confessed to an OPP officer. Wringle shuffles in the doorway uncomfortably, says nothing discernible.

It's just seems like you ever think about that time, and then you were in jail for two years

“because of your confession. Hey, you just woke up. Where did you go to jail? Where were you held?”

Did you see Christine in the park that day? Didn't even see her down at the park? Where the river is there? I was down there today. The river looks pretty high. It doesn't look like it doesn't look like you could get over it. Do you have a phone here? Is there a way to communicate with you? Here. No. Okay. What do you up to these days? What do you spend your time doing here in

just like? Not much. Did you find your life changed after your confession? A little bit. How do people treat you around here? I just wonder what it would take for me to go and confess to something I didn't do if I didn't do it. I don't understand what would have happened in your head that night, but made you feel that you had to confess to a murder that you say you didn't do. Have you been interviewed by the police?

Since then? They haven't come to talk to you since you got her jail? No. Just trying to stay normal. Yeah.

know to say that you had killed her? Because she had disappeared in 1993 and then you could

confess to her murder to the officer on August 22nd, 2004. I was quite a few years later.

“That's like years later. So you must have remembered the name from somewhere.”

You ever talked to anybody in your family about that time? No. And then at that party on August 22nd, 2004, where you told your mom and your cousin, then your cousin's boyfriend that you murdered Christine Harman. Did they ever talk to you about

why you had said that to them? Did your mom ever talk to them about why you said that?

They just let it go. They just said, "Oh, Anthony, he's just, he's just saying that, is that what they said?" No. They didn't say it word to you. Did they come visit you in prison?

“And the people come in. Your mom came to see you? Yeah.”

Did you have a chance to tell your mom before she died? But what you say that you didn't kill Christine, did you ever tell her that? So she died thinking that you might have murdered her. Pardon? I mean talk about it. No, you didn't talk about it. Nobody. Any of your friends ever come and talk to you about it? No. Christine disappeared somewhere.

This never came home. Her mother is wondering what happened. She doesn't know either.

Well, I thank you for your time. Maybe I'll come and talk to you again sometime. I pull away and park a short distance away to collect myself. I felt surprised that Ringo would engage for so long like he wanted to talk or needed to. It's hard to determine if someone is being evasive in the short term, but I remember feeling that just below the surface there was much more to be pulled. Something catches my eye and I look toward the arena I'm park near.

“It's Ringo on a bicycle and he's coming toward me. At first I think he wants to talk more”

and I rolled down the passenger window but it startled him. I think he was trying to watch me from a far. Ringo trying to do a bit of his own investigative work. He races by and I try to drive up aside him. But Ringo keeps moving and disappears down the road with whatever knowledge he may carry. What happened to 15-year-old Christine Herron? One man said he knows. A few months later, I've edited my 20-minute TV documentary for the CBC together and it goes to air across the country.

It's called Confession to Murder. Tonight, investigative filmmaker David Rigen shows us what happened and confronts the man who once made a confession to murder. In it, I present everything I can find about the case. It's thickly forested and swampy. On private land across the soggy river from Hannover's public park. One of Christine's favorite places. I go through police mouth-feasants that stay attempts to speak to Ringo and as much of

his story as I can. According to the available documents, including interviews with Ringo, police testimony and other courtroom statements, this is what is alleged to have happened the day Christine Herron went missing. And then we wait and watch, ready to act again. Hoping the documentary will move the investigation forward. I have to learn patients over the years. I have a lot of patients now with the case.

You learn it over the years. You learn how to deal with it your own way so that you can move on.

Just deal with it a different way. Somewhere we either at the guilt will get to them and eat away out of them. Day by day by day that a little slowly eat on them and bring him down to

where he just can't take it anymore. Where he's compelled to finally tell the truth.

He's going to know that everybody's keeping an eye on him.

“So how are you going to set your patients to work and as a nurse to have to eat?”

It's just going to wait patiently and sooner or later. Just just want to have it. I believe that.

I believe it too. On all the cases I've worked on, I've seen firsthand that sometimes

the only difference between a so-called cold case and a conviction is time.

“And this time, the patient's pays off. Nine months after my documentary is released,”

Anthony Ringo is arrested again for the murder of Christine Herron.

Coming up on someone knows something.

An inside look at Ringo's re-arrest and how it all happened. Someone knows something is hosted written and produced by me, David Rigen. The series is also produced by Katie Swires, sound design by Evan Kelly. Natalia Ferguson is our transcriber, Emily Canal is our digital producer. Chris Oak is our story editor. Our executive producer is Cecil Fernandez.

Tonya Springer is the senior manager and RF Nurani is the director of CBC Podcasts.

“If you want to help new listeners discover the show, please rate and review wherever you listen.”

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