The Fall of the USSR, Pt II

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Hey Chuck, you ended the last one you want to start this one. Hey, welcome to the podcast. I'm Charles W. Chuck Bryant to my left is Josh Clark. Jerry's here in spirit and in reality this time. So this is part two of the fall of the Soviet Union.

Bravo. I hated doing that by the way. How you did? Yeah, this feels like Robin putting on Batman's outfit or something. This is very strange.

How do you know it's not Robin who announces the podcast? Or whatever. Batman putting on Robbins outfit. Although I heard he did that on the side as a king. He did.

But who hasn't? Who among us hasn't dressed up like Robin from Batman?

“That's true or Josh Clark from Stuff You Should Know?”

Which is one in the same. Yeah, I dress up like you. You do. Yeah, I have shirts and cute sweatshirts. I have to say you have stepped up your style game.

Lately and it's it's nice. Hey, thanks. You're traveling outfits or. Yeah.

Well, it was always into clothes growing up.

And then award T-shirts and cargo shorts for 28 five years. And then remember to, hey, I'd like fashion. So I got my product back. Yeah. You're basically the Tom Ford or the podcasting world.

All right. So where we left off December 8, 1991. And the two of us are formally dissolved by decree by the leaders of Russia. Ukraine and Belarus. No one knows what's going to happen next with Russia.

We've kind of covered the satellite states and the Soviet states themselves. What happened there. But everyone was sort of like, all right. Well, Russia's still there. Like what the heck is going to happen?

And who rolls into town? But Boris Yelsten with a bottle of stolen his hand. Yeah. And another one in his belly. Yeah.

So Boris Yelsten was the first president of Russia, which is kind of confusing.

Because we said that Gorbetrov was the president of the USSR.

“But remember Russia and the USSR were not one in the same.”

So for a little while there, Russia itself had pretty much two presidents at the same time for a couple of months. Well, Gorbetrov was still in power. And while Yelsten, who had been popularly elected in June of 1991, while he was, like, I'm president of Russia. So there was a, well, you could call a bit of a power struggle. And despite that, it wasn't until a three day coup was mounted.

And they didn't plan for three days. They didn't know how long it was going to go on. It just turned out to be a three day coup. I guess is what I'm trying to say. It wasn't until that was mounted against Gorbetrov.

That his power was eroded enough to take his position away. And for Yelsten to take over and take Russia straight into the hands of the West, the open arms of the West. And ironically, that coup was by hardliners who wanted to keep, who wanted to save communism and the USSR.

And gave it to the guy who was diametrically opposed to making that happen. Yelta. Yeah. Yeah.

“And it was ended up being a failed coup technically.”

But it had the result of finally sort of getting Gorbetrov out of power.

So in a way, it kind of worked, but it was technically a failed coup. What happened was, you know, Gorbetrov came, came in with all these big sweeping reforms. And so the conservative elites that he had previously worked with were terrified, obviously. Because their existence depended on the Soviet Union being the Soviet Union. Right.

So they were like Gorbetrov is a trader. In 1991, they put him under a house arrest while he was on vacation in Crimea. And they sent tanks in to Moscow and took control of the government. They didn't storm the parliament building, but they lined up outside the parliament building. And then they made a mistake in that they let Boris Yeltsin, I keep saying Yeltsin,

Yeltsin, get on one of those tanks and address the people. And this is a time where they had not jam the TV signals coming from outside the Soviet Union. So all of these Soviets, all of a sudden, are watching this unfold on the BBC or CNN. And they're seeing this Yeltsin guy sitting on top of the tank talking to them.

Yeah, basically saying like, look at what the communists are doing.

They send in tanks to take over your government. Can you believe someone would do that? And it was not a good look for the Soviet party. And not only did it make the party look bad, it made Yeltsin look really good.

“So remember, he'd already been popularly elected, but there was a power struggle between him and Gorbetrov going on.”

When the coup was overrun, the leaders were jailed. Gorbetrov managed to come back to Moscow. But now he came back and like his authority had been directly challenged. And even though the coup had failed, it had had a huge impact in removing his legitimacy. While at the same time boosting Yeltsin's legitimacy.

And so Gorbetrov was like, it's clear, I can't hold power any longer. So he very, very peacefully to his great credit. Very peacefully handed over power and did away with any office that he held. Yes. Somebody else could have come along and filled and tried to challenge Yeltsin.

He made sure that there would be no further political chaos as much as he could manage. Yeah, he was like, I'm not president of the USSR anymore. And in fact, there is no president of the USSR that office that I created no longer exist. And technically everybody on the only guy to have ever done that. So just keep that in your back pocket.

And he said, here's the nuclear codes, Boris. Please take care of those. Any communists that are in public office. Well, there is no communist party. So you're not even a valid member of that party because there is none.

So you're not even if you're elected. Because there's no such thing than you're out of your seat. And Russia is now the Russian Federation. Yeah, I was, I didn't see what happened to those people. Was it just like, I guess I'm independent all of a sudden.

I don't know. Or if they were like, I guess I can't hold this office anymore. Who knows? But like, that was just one small component of the sweeping political changes that took place over the course of a few days.

“I think the whole thing really kicked off on December 25, 1991.”

And by the turn of 1992 was basically over.

I mean, Russia became the Russian Federation and that same anti-communist spirit of renewal and revolution and like change. The wins of change you could even almost call it had swept through Russia itself. Yeah, they were immediately no longer a superpower. All that national identity, you know, we talked about some of the stuff in part one with promise of more. And that's right now because for a lot of the people in Russia,

it was like the follow-up communism was a great thing. But for a lot of others, that was, you know, the Soviet man was labeled, and it was, I guess, a pejorative term. Homo Sovieticus, that was just sort of the average Soviet man who is, you know, probably works in a factory and has lived his whole life with this ideology, this communist ideology and independent thought, like which they, you know, a lot of them voluntarily sort of bought into this thing.

And so once that identity was removed and there was a vacuum in its wake,

Yeah, like the patriotic of the USSR, like everyday citizens, consider themselves one part of this larger collective, the Soviet experiment.

“And that was their identity, that's what a lot of, like the way they thought came from basically like you were saying.”

And so when you pull that out from underneath somebody, especially when it happens suddenly and essentially without warning, it just comes out of nowhere. Like, it's really hard to put yourself in that position, like, how would you handle that kind of thing, you know? And certainly there were plenty of people who will see who were rejoiced at this change. So they were glad communism went away, but there were a lot of people who were not happy that communism had gone away or that the Soviet Union had gone away.

Yeah, for sure. You know, religion helped fill a little bit void that recovered Russian orthodoxy became a little more popular to help fill this moral vacuum that was left in its wake. But there was a guy in Dresden at the time, he was a KGB Lieutenant Colonel in his villa in Dresden, Germany. And this was before a reunification, this was a 1990, just sort of a mid-level officer who, as far as, you know, criticism of the USSR and the Soviet way was very prideful and very much defended it and got really mad.

Apparently, he had a super short fuse when it was criticized. His name was Vladimir Putin. And he saw everything that was going on around and there's a quote from him that kind of sums it up.

“He said nothing different was proposed. That's what hurt is they just dropped everything and went away.”

So, you know, he sensed this vacuum and, you know, over here in the United States, like, it felt like, not felt like it, it kind of was a victory. Like, we want the Cold War as over their experiment failed democracy wins, you know? Oh, yeah, for sure. The problem was is that the West wasn't like, we're going to help. We want to dig in here. We want to help you like rebuild. We want you to be a great nation and, you know, a great partner to Europe and the rest of the West and the rest of the world.

And one of the reasons why the United States didn't react like that had a really, really crucial time, which was 1991, 1992,

was that President George H. W. Bush, who was a cold warrior if there ever was one, who was leading the United States.

“And I saw it described, I think it was on a site called History Guild, which is magnificent, by the way.”

That he follows arms and turned his back. It was basically like, good luck. We're glad you, you're fell over, but we're not going to help you. We hate you. But we've hated you for decades now. So we're not really going to step in and help you rebuild, just figure out how to do it yourself. And that had that gone differently, who knows what Russia would be like right now? Who knows? We have no idea. Could be worse, it could have been better, it could have played out exactly the same. But the fact that the West only helped in the most like specific economic terms,

and didn't, in like a spirit of friendship and cooperation really step in, and basically basically the United States was a sore loser of the Cold War.

Yeah, and I feel like most of that was sort of aimed at Russia specifically because I don't know how much they financially helped the former Russian States and satellite states and things like that. But it seems like the, just the spirit of it all was more aimed directly at Russia and like, hey, these other countries are finally out from under your grip, so like good for them. Right, exactly. I think we failed to say in the first episode, but Kyle helped us out with this arming and great Britain for the UK or England even.

Yeah, yeah, he provided the basis, and then when we started digging in, we were like, there's a lot more to this that we need to double up, and then you finish the job, but he in grand fashion. Thank you. So he found a movie called Goodbye Lenin from 2003, it's a German film, and it's a parody of this time, where it's about a man who tries to keep, he tries to shield his mother, his East German mother from finding out that communism has collapsed. Yeah, and I guess it's probably hilarious. I got to go see that one because I love a good German comedy like anybody else, you know?

Yeah, I should see that too. So let's take a break, and we'll talk a little bit about sort of the economics of this all in Russia right after this.

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On the I Heart Radio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. All right, so we promised talk of economics and finances and the new Russia, or I guess the Russian Federation. Gorbachev at least was trying to, and still like a gradual reform, just kind of funny now looking back because it's nothing gradual about it. But Boris Yeltson was like, he really wanted to hit the gas economically, so he embraced this economist name, I'm going to pronounce it, "Yagor Gaidar" or "Gadar," I'm not sure it's pronounced, G-A-I-D-A-R.

But he, along with some Harvard economists that were like, "Yeah, yeah, I do this." He had an idea called a shock therapy, which was kind of crazy when you look back. This was the idea because, like I said, you can't just flick a switch overnight and be like, "All right, we're a free market now. They had no infrastructure for that, no history of doing that or what that looked like. They didn't know how to manage that." And so out of nowhere all of a sudden they said, "All right, Russia's open everybody. They flipped the sign in the window around and said, "We're open."

Yeah, so here's basically how it worked. There were several points, this is just a few of them, and this is just such a back of the envelope, sketch of this whole thing.

But some of the high points were, remember the rubble was not recognized internationally. The Soviet rubble wasn't. Well, now we had the Russian rubble, and to become recognized as currency on the international market, it couldn't be artificially propped up by the government any longer, had to basically sink or swim on its own. Yeah, with maybe a little bit of monkey, like everybody does, but not 100% monkey with it. So that was a big one, right? Yeah, that was a big one. They needed cash, like immediate inflow of cash.

So they couldn't take their time to ramp up stuff like that just by saying they're open. So the state owned businesses, we talked about them being privatized, which meant they were available for the rest of the world to invest in.

They removed the tariffs on foreign imports, so like trade could flow, and the West did step up. I don't know, did the United States contribute at all of this?

“Yeah, yeah, that's what I'm saying, the very narrowly and economically.”

Okay, and basically in exchange for whatever it was asking for the United States help them that respect. It wasn't like any magnanimous way is what I'm saying. It was about 20 billion dollars of the West in emergency loans, just like an infusion of cash, just to keep them from completely collapsing. Yeah, and I didn't see how much of that actually came through, but that was the proposal, right? So this is all like major high-level macroeconomic stuff. To get more on the micro level, what they came up with was a voucher program. And they basically said, hey, here is a voucher for a bunch of shares or say 10 shares in each of these state owned enterprises. We're going to privatize them.

They're going to start selling the stuff on the world market, and we're going to distribute these vouchers equally among, I think, like 95% of the Soviet citizenry. I didn't see why the other 5% had to sit out, but basically everybody got shares in all of these amazingly soon to be wealthy companies.

And just to be clear, it wasn't like, you know, when they were making TVs, it was like our oil industry, our steel industry, like big big stuff.

Yeah. And so the point was that they could benefit directly from this new amped up-juice-stop-brushing economy. That was about to explode. Yeah. None of this went at all well. The shock therapy went so poorly that a lot of Russians at the time, and probably still today, believe that it was deliberately inflicted by the West to keep the USSR or hobble to that it couldn't possibly come back.

“Yeah. Was it like the, these Harvard economists and stuff that were, was at the deal?”

Yeah. They were very much in league with Yagobar. Okay. For sure. Well, what this led to was hyperinflation, because their currency was completely devalued. And a lot of Russians, like, I mean, I don't know the number, but I feel like a majority of the average Russians life-saving just went away, basically overnight. Uh, we've talked about the hyperinflation. Was it a whole episode on hyperinflation? Yeah. And I know we've talked about it many times, but we did, we did something, I think, just on it. Yeah.

“Yeah. But it was, it was one of the worst cases of hyperinflation, like in World History, consumer goods went up in price by, like, 400 percent.”

The state owned businesses, and we kind of touched on this in part one, but it was an inside job. They were being pillaged from the inside by these ministers who had overseen them as part of the Soviet Union. And these vouchers, you know, a lot of the citizens were just like, this is, I'm going to trade it for bread. Like, this means nothing. Exactly. And they did. So there were people out there who were like, sure, I've got some bread here. Have some bread, give me your vouchers. And they started getting their hands on as many vouchers as they possibly could.

Because those vouchers were eventually able to be traded for shares, right? They weren't shares themselves quite yet, because things had to be organized a little more. So people ran around collecting these vouchers. And as a result, when those shares started coming out on the market, and parts of these companies, these actually industries were being auctioned off, they ended up in the hands of just a few people who had managed to collect a bunch of vouchers, concentrate this stuff. And then they got together and said, I got a bunch of vouchers. You have a bunch of vouchers. Let's come together for McCartell.

And we'll actually take over this oil company using these vouchers, right? And those people became what we now call the Russian oligarchs who did not exist before this, just did not exist. And now all of a sudden, there were, I poppingly wealthy people who just emerged out of the, the ashes suddenly growing in size exponentially, just like a patchy chief.

The real big, like what sent that over the top was this loans for shares privatization situation, because they feared that if they had a communist victory in 1996, that that would be a bad deal to all of a sudden reverse course on what had been happening. And so the government said, all you new oligarchs, these super rich people, we got to deal for you. We'll loan you shares in our 12 biggest state owned businesses in exchange for like quick cash now, ended up being about $800 million, essentially sort of allowing them to buy pieces of like oil companies and stuff like that.

Yeah, and they were loans, like you said, these, these shares are controlling interests, but they never gave them back, essentially. So the government sold it, like you said, these were oil giants, metal producers, all, like this is where it really got consolidated.

“Before they were using vouchers and stuff, now it was like they were, they were buying directly from the government. They went to the wholesaler, right? And Putin was one of those, those oligarchs. He had made some, they started to make cash.”

I think flipping real estate in St. Petersburg in the very early 90s and then started a bank and then by the time this fire sale went on in 1996, he managed to secure a controlling stake in a nickel mining company by loaning $170 million to the government.

Yeah, I mean, I don't think anyone knows how much money he has today, right? No, in that kind of a mystery.

“We talked about it in our book. Yeah, that's right. Will there ever be a trillionaire? I don't know. Will there?”

So these oligarchs were, were in our greedy because they were like, that wasn't even enough. They were like, you know what? How we can make more money is instead of having these big great industries, like helping out mother Russia and the Russian Federation, we can actually strip these companies of their raw materials and sell them for more money on these international markets. So that made them even richer and then what that did was that that really created a wealth gap like they had never seen before because all of a sudden factories are closing and entire towns and villages that were built around the central factory went into ruin and the safety net was gone and like their their unemployment rate and there was just like unbelievable was like 22% in 1998.

40% of the population was under the poverty line in 1995. Just eye popping statistics because these oligarchs were allowed to basically

kill for the entire Russian economy for themselves. They carved out the middle classes and other way to put it and so like when they figured out like we don't need to make stuff at home we can sell that stuff for we can just sell the raw materials on the market and make more money. Yeah, so many people were put out of work and then bear in mind there used to be a safety net like the Soviet Union was collue G. I heard a joke where like an old Soviet joke that we pretend to work in the government pretends to pay us.

“That's just kind of how things went but you still had child care, you still had health care, you still had a free education like it might not have been very good but the government was still doing what it could to deliver that stuff, right?”

Yeah, after that like you said that safety net was just gone and people were just unmordered and adrift and it was like good luck you're going to have to go figure out what to do yourself because now this is a capitalist economy. Yeah, for sure. I think I mentioned in part one like they they'd slow the rate of having children just because they couldn't afford it. I think by the end of the 90s there were 3.7 million fewer children in Russia than in 1990. So in the course of a decade and alcoholism was you know it's always been obviously a thing in Russia with the the free flowing of vodka but after this it was really really bad heavy drinking accounted for two of every five deaths among Russian working age men in the 90s and their their life expectancy changed like if you can like literally change a life expectancy over a decade.

And something terrible is gone wrong. I think the male life expectancy went from 64 to 57 over the course of three years between 1991 and 1994 because again these you know the Soviet man out of work.

I've also seen the shock therapy is being labeled as responsible for somebody like Putin to be able to come along and get the kind of support as a

Autocratic nostalgia, just basically in very much the same way that Hitler was able to rise to power because of the deeply punitive like measures in the Treaty of Versailles that just punished Germany made Germany really unhappy with the rest of the world and so somebody came along and said I'm going to restore Germany to its former glory that's how Hitler came to power Putin came along and said

“I'm going to restore Russia to its former glory and so he got support as an Autocratic as well. It's just it's always interesting to me that that you can find so many different”

streams of like events and goings on and just different decisions that can lead to such consequential actions. Yeah, it's like I was thinking about it. It's like nothing is black and white and even fewer things are one sided and that's a good example of that.

Yeah, for sure. So the decade that was the 1990s over there in 91, you know, we mentioned that Yeltsin was elected as the president of the Russian Federation.

Actually, I guess before that he was president of Russia and now the official elected president of the Russian Federation and he was a, you know, he stood up to a corrupt system. So he was very popular. There wasn't a revolution in Russia like happened elsewhere in Eastern Europe, they, you know, elsewhere, the political elites were replaced that didn't happen here. They didn't massively distribute or redistribute wealth and power like a lot of the people from the Nominclature, like they took care of them and they stayed in that sort of, um, it was in elite status, but it wasn't like the oligarchs. It was, it was now billionaires compared to working stiffs whereas before it was more like sort of upper management versus working stuff. Yeah. And so, yeah. So these, these people, the Soviet elite just were like, oh, we're not communists anymore. But we're still going to stay elite, I guess. And so, right.

Yeah, yeah, wink, wink, nunch, nunch. Um, and so the George H. W. Bush turned his back on Russia. Clinton turned around. I was like, hey, guys, let's get it on. We love you, Yelton. Um, he's a lovable guy. He is. He's got big cheeks. He's like smiling all the time. And the reason why is because he was drunk constantly. Yeah, no, but I remember at the time though, it was like, this isn't what, like, the old Soviet style. Like, this is a big teddy bear.

“Like you said, he's smiling all the time. And he wants. He seemed to be very western friendly. And he was also, well, partially because the alcoholism, someone who, I think,”

Bill Clinton and people in the West knew that they could kind of control. Yes. So he was a party in. Well, like, there's no two ways around it. There was, there's this one thing you can look up on YouTube where German chancellor Helmet Cole came to visit Russia after the Soviet Union dissolved.

And it's a state visit. They're standing there watching a Russian military parade go by. And all of a sudden, Yelton just is moved to grab the baton from the military ban conductor.

And he starts conducting the ban too, but like almost cartoonishly larger than life. He's blowing kisses at people. And it's like, when you watch you, like, he's pretty drunk right now. And this is like an official state thing. And this was not unusual for him. Oh, for sure. There was another famous story where when he was on an official state.

“Is it one of the first ones? I think it might have been the first one to the United States. He was all of a sudden turned loose in the US, and he was like, this is fantastic.”

So the secret service allegedly found him out trying to hail a cab and DC on Pennsylvania Avenue and is underwear. So he drunk. So he could go get a pizza. And the secret service reigns a man of course. But he will get you a pizza like come back inside again. That's not a legend like that happened. Oh, yeah. So a lot of people like, so yes, he was a loveable teddy bearer. He certainly looked that way, but in a lot of people point to Putin as the as the person who started autocratic rule or brought autocracy. Yeah.

He because of his antics because of the just general chaos of the transition out of the Soviet economy that he presided over or just failed to preside over.

Yeah. All of these oligarchs first starting to get super rich off of the government and off of what's supposed to belong to the people.

He got very unpopular as we'll see. I think at one point before he left office is approval rating was six percent. Yeah, it was in the tank. And I assume that that was with the margin of error plus or minus six percent. Right. Yeah, nobody liked him. So he was impeached by the legitimately elected parliament and he didn't like that very much. No, he dissolved parliament or tried to as a result of that. And parliament was like, no, we're not dissolving.

“So he had the military come in and shell parliament, which was, I mean, if you want to talk about an autocratic move.”

I mean, that's certainly it. But, you know, it was spun. Well, I don't know about spun. But in the west, it was viewed as more of a like, hey, Clinton's like, look at this guy. Like, he's a hero of democracy. Like, he's shelling communist parliament. Like, that's how much he hates communist. Right. Exactly. That's how useful he was to the west that that they were just like, just tried to save him any way they could. He managed to hang on to power that shares for voucher scheme. The great shares for voucher scheme in 96. That was designed to help yelts and stay in the power.

He was so hated that the communists were probably going to sweep the elections that year.

And so I think Kyle put it that people felt cheated twice by Gorbachev first and then yelts an after word.

So there was a not a lot of happiness in Russia in the 1990s. They say we take our second break and come back and wrap it up. Let's do it. On the new podcast Solita, we share the messy reality of traveling alone as a woman. I can wait for hours for the next bus or this random dude is offering me a ride on his motorcycle. I chose option B. I'm Julie Bignetto and I travel by myself because it's a rare space where

I can say yes without asking anyone else first. I'm on a mission to reclaim the word Solita, trading the pity for possibility. Every time I try to be alone, I kept meeting people and they were like, "You smiled at us not a lot of people smile around here." It's when you're alone that you're most receptive to the world as it is and not the lies you're sold about it. It can be a time where you push your limits, change your mind, or wake up to a new version of yourself. So whether you're a

solo travel veteran or you're too nervous to book your first trip, I hope you listen to Solita.

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This is Pro's Society, the weekly podcast that's part book club, part group chat for thought daughters, pop culture obsessives, and anyone who thinks pride and prejudice and love island to deserve the same level of discourse. I'm Eli Rallo and every week, we're connecting the dots between books, the internet, and the conversations everyone can't stop having. I'm going to have to look up this story. I'm a son of a son. From best-selling authors and

your favorite book talk creators to the latest pop culture moments, nothing is off the table. So like, if you can hide some real messages inside compelling characters, and that is of Trojan Horse, whether you're looking for literary deep dives, smart pop culture conversations, or a community of readers who love to think a little too much, you're in the right place. Listen to Pro's Society on the I-Hart Radio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

See you between the pages. Hey, this is Ace Davenport and Sean Clements. We host the podcast Hollywood Handbook on the Big Money Players Network. Our show is extremely accessible to first-time listeners. Each week, we talk to someone in show business, aka The Biz, and try to help them with their careers and see what they have to offer us. Everyone has a good time and no one gets mad at their publicists

for letting them do our show. We've had a lot of great guests like Sarah Sherman, not that great.

“I actually can you help me shape this? How about we flip it on his head?”

How about we flip this around? What does the surprise woman who actually you think is the straight man is actually the one who's acting weird?

I would never let go of that. I would never set expectations for something like that.

Perhaps like if the universe allows for something like that to happen, I'm open to it. I'm always going to accept. You know, Danny McBride, fine. Yeah, it's all this fragile masculinity, exesuding. I could smell it walking on the hallway to be honest with you. I was like, is that what you need? No, it's fragile masculinity. Ben Stiller, no. I think there's a lot of times in out of context, people don't get it or even know what a circle is. You know what I mean?

The girl, I go with the show. It's stupid. Oh, everyone's soaked up. And fake. Right, fake and also not interested, or just like, oh, I've got my wife. I don't care about your life. And a lot of other big shots that wouldn't be where they are without us. Oh, and by the way, Will Ferrell told us personally he loves the show and he wants to be a guest on every episode, but he's just so busy. Listen to Hollywood Handbook on the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts,

or wherever you get your podcasts.

“Okay, Chuck, uh, wrap it up. I'll take it. Do you remember them?”

They were so good though. They're just easy to listen to and fun. It was at the Fabulous Thunderbirds. Yeah, Fabulous Thunderbirds, Jimmy Vaughn? Was it Jimmy and that one? Oh, I know. Yeah, I think it was Stevie Ray Vaughn's brother, Jimmy. Oh, Jimmy Vaughn. I thought you were talking about Jimmy Leban Simon Leban's brother. Yeah. All right. So, I knew we'd get a few laughs in here. You know. Mm-hmm. All right. So,

where are we here? We are with Yeltson. He had banned the communist party. That was challenged. And that resulted in a 1992 trial that was televised. And it was build as like the big Russian

Nuremberg trial. And it was basically like, hey, we're going to reckon with our past as a party

because of all of the crimes committed under the name of communism against the people. The sort of hitched to this Nuremberg was that there were no actual defendants. It was just sort of a sort of a show. It seems like like they didn't actually prosecute individuals. It was just sort of demonstrating the history of criminality of communism. Yeah, like they put Soviet communism itself on trial, not the people who perpetrated it. Yeah. And so that's a really good, um, that's good evidence

of what you're saying earlier that the the the Nomenclature, the party elites just stopped being party members, but stayed elite. They were still pulling the levers of power. So of course, we're not going to let themselves be prosecuted, but they know that, again, the winds of change are moving against communism. So they're going to go along with the show trial. It's also a really good evidence of just how strong the, um, those levers of power remain in Russia. Like the KGB,

it was still around. It just changed the theme to the FSB, the Federal Security Service.

“And there was, um, a, I think a member of the Supreme Soviet parliament who suggested a”

illustration bill, illustration is where you identify and remove public officials who are tainted from their association with the former regime. That member of parliament was assassinated in 1999. So there wasn't a lot of mood among the elites to really actually have some sort of reckoning, which, again, that in and of itself might have helped steer Russia in a different, uh, direction,

but the people who had been in charge were still basically in charge. Outside of Russia, there were,

there were, um, it was a lot easier to do that kind of thing because they could blame Russia, right? Yeah, saying like, you know, we, we were under the thumb of communism as a state. So it was a lot easier to sort of rally people around this idea that they were free and had a new way forward. Yeltson tried, you know, he tried to pull some other levers that weren't like huge economic reforms or whatever that were just like, hey, let me, uh, let me re-adopt the imperial tricolor and

“let me replace the Soviet anthem. Uh, and these were all really divisive moves. Um, I think he was”

trying to sort of, he attempted to close the linen mausoleum and replace Revolution Day. So he was trying to say, like, hey, let's move forward. And like, this past is, is haunting us, but it was a really divided thing because after this pretty horrible decade of chaos and like financial ruin, the, the, I feel like sort of the broad view of your average Russian was like, things were better before and they started pining for the old days and there was a nostalgia that came around, uh,

like, uh, I mean, I think he really believed it, but I think he also really saw an opening there

“to come in and be like, I'm your guy. You miss the old days. Just wait.”

Exactly. Um, I saw there was a Russian joke from the time that said the worst part of communism is post communism. Right. And yes, so Putin came along and was like, hey, I'm going to bring Russia back, baby, just, you know, trust me, he was appointed, um, Prime Minister under Yeltsin. He was the fourth Prime Minister under Yeltsin in 17 months. So Yeltsin was not doing very well

by this time. This is like the very end of the 90s. And one of the first things that Putin did was just

pound Chetna, which was trying to break away from Russia itself. And I guess Russia had had quite enough of breaking away for one century. And, um, they just punished Chetna under Putin. He decided that he was going to make an example of them. And there were a lot of atrocities. And it was just really bad. But in Russia itself, they were like, oh, we like this guy. He gets stuff done. He takes no gut from anybody. And that helped support his ascendancy to the presidency in 1999 when Yeltsin

suddenly out of nowhere was like, I'm not president anymore, this guy is. Yeah. And once he was president, he was like, he started to rain in some of those market freedoms that had been installed. He was like, you know, this, this, uh, this freedom of pressing isn't so great after all. Uh, so by 2010, most of that private media was once again owned by the government. He did kind of rain in the oligarchs, um, but, you know, not completely obviously. Uh, I get the feeling it was

he was sort of picking and choosing maybe, so it seemed like he was. Is that accurate? The impression

I have is that he brought them all the heel. He basically made a deal saying, like, you guys can

“have free reign on your respective industries. But you have to stay out of politics. That's my industry.”

Uh, okay. And they complied. And one of them didn't McCail Codor Kovsky basically was like, now I'm going to generate a bunch of political power and try to remove Putin. He got jailed. His whole asset stripped. The state took over his oil company and, uh, rest of the oligarchs are like, oh, this guy is quite serious. We better listen. And then from those group, through that group, Putin started to develop favorites and all that. That's my location of it. Yeah, that sounds

about right. Uh, and the great thing is, I know that there are people that are real students of this stuff. And I can't wait to get some listener males on this. Uh, but, you know, things started to turn around financially, too, because they had some booming oil expert, uh, exports happening, uh, and experts. And that, you know, all of a sudden that your average living standard was going up, um, it seems like this sort of just the chaos of the 90s, uh, started to, to Wayne and things

started to get a little bit better enough to, to, you know, for people to get behind Putin. And he was like, yeah, I'm restoring Russia in our, in our place in the world, like, get behind me. Yeah, I mean, because of the 90s were shameful to the, to the average Russian. Like, they did not feel good about what they had just gone through. And now there was a guy who was saying he was going to end it all. And he did. I mean, in a lot of ways. I mean, he inherited an economy that was just,

had just started to get back on course. So under Putin, and what his 26 year reign, if you count when he was the, the, um, prime minister of it. So whatever, he has puppet. Um, yeah, 26 years, uh, like Russia definitely came back financially. And their quality of living increased. And he, you know, he did a lot of stuff that he said he was going to do, um, yet it's still Putin. I mean, he keeps winning those elections. All right. Yeah, fair and squares. That's all legit.

And so yeah, that brings us to today. Chuck.

“Yeah. I mean, is that it? Are we done? I think we're done. You did fantastic.”

You did too, man. I really, and super psyched about this one, because this is one of those, it, I knew so little about because, again, it was the end of high school and early college for me. And those, those were days where I just wasn't paying attention. And I was, uh, you know, I was trying to score pixie tickets. It was kind of like, if this part of history were an ice sugar cookie, as kids, we had just kind of nibbled the sugar cookie part. And now we've been into the,

the first bite of icing and consume the whole cookie. And we're just in sugar heaven right now.

Yeah, agreed. Enjoy these. Yeah, that's a better way to put it. Chuck just laughed. So I think we should end this episode. There's two part episode and say it's time for a listener mail. Uh, this is about our episode on the UK, our shorty. Uh, hey guys, and um, this isn't,

Hey guys, listening to the episode and I thought, uh, and I was thinking about that, they'll do it. And you did. Guys, England, Wales, Scotland, Northern Ireland. No cornwall. Got about cornwall. To think, come up in our research. Oh, I know you guys will see things, uh, official websites saying cornwall is a county in England. But for one, it is a dutchie, which is a different thing. You got to pass it on the left hand side.

Secondly, Cornwall is a Celtic nation, guys, like Scotland, Wales and Ireland, including Northern Ireland.

And finally, the UK government formally recognized the Cornish as a national minority under the

Council of Europe's framework convention for the protection of national minorities, granting them the same status as the Scotts Welsh and Irish. Wow. No, we did not come across that at all.

“I know, uh, guys, Cornwall has its own language, uh, Kurnewick. I think is how it's pronounced.”

No, but it's closely related to Welsh and barely distinguishable from, uh, Britain. Yes, Brittany is a Celtic nation too, guys. It has its own flag, uh, St. Piran's flag, which is Irpirans. I'm not sure how you pronounce it, which is a white cross in a black background. And there are strong calls to establish the Cornish assembly, um, similar to the other Celtic nations in the UK. I hope you give this a mention to correct the record. Uh, I love

your respectful and open approach to what you do, guys, so I figured you'd be interested, uh, and then he post this, uh, Kurnewick beast, which is Cornwall forever. And I don't think he's talking about the game hen. Yeah. And this is from G. Thanks, G. That was brand new info for us and we appreciate

it big time. Um, I've always wanted to go to Cornwall because they have a witchcraft museum there

that I've always wanted to see. Nice. So I'll see you eventually, G. I'll let you know when I'm

“there and we can go to the witchcraft museum. Uh, if you want to be like G and give us some brand”

new information, we had never heard before and didn't run across in our research. We love that kind of stuff. You can wrap it up, spank it on the bottom and send it off to [email protected]. Stuff you should know is a production of iheart radio. For more podcasts, my heart radio, visit the iheart radio app. Apple podcasts are wherever you listen to your favorite shows. Dancing with the stars is looking for a new pro, and since last season, I came in eighth place.

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called Stepping On Toes with Danielle and Val. Every week we're breaking down dancing with the stars the next pro. To find out who will be sharing the borne with next season. Listen to Stepping On Toes on America's number one podcast network iheart. Follow Stepping On Toes and start listening on the free iheart radio app today. Hi, I'm Dr. James Stout. You might know me as a host of the podcast it could happen here. But I'm hosting a brand new show now called Natural Courses. What we explain

how going outside is political and look at how we can live together with nature and take care of one another in a world that's on fire. You know, we feel uncomfortable saying something like

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And how a lizard might be able to help you. What mountain lines could teach us about zombie deer? You can see the very faint out my into the aurora. What a magical place. Listen to Natural Courses on the iheart radio app. Apple podcasts wherever you get your podcast. Hello my love. I'm Ryan Weiss and for the past 15 years I've been an emotional intelligence coach and a spiritual guide and I'm sharing with you my new podcast waking up with Ryan. Weaking up with Ryan is a daily audio

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