A Spurs Fumble, CarusoMania, Brunson’s Mega-Rise and a Knicks Appreciation With Tim Legler and Brian Koppelman

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8-8879-777 or visit ccpg.org/chat, Connecticut. [MUSIC PLAYING] [MUSIC PLAYING] All right, the Bill Simmons podcast. We are live after Game 5.

Our friend Tim Legler is here. Kind of a ghostly massage here for him. Kind of kind of mat. Yeah, definitely, man. It's my queen album cover look.

I like it. Well, matching the weirdness we just had.

“I think it's kind of fitting because it feels like I don't know if the spurs”

can be okay, C2, or we've allowed to discuss. I wanted to mention, I have new rewatchables coming. That came out on Monday, we did Animal House. You must love Animal House. That must have been.

Of course. Here's some way back when you can catch that. And you can hear legs. What's the name of your podcast? The All Things podcast?

All City podcast. All City podcast. All City podcast. Yeah, yeah. And of course, you could see legs on the finals, which are coming up.

All right, Game 5. Hey, here's my big takeaway. Just a missed opportunity for the spurs. Well, yeah. I felt like, you know, it's two, two.

AJ Mitchell gets scrapped. Jalen Williams gets scratched pretty much like an hour before the game. Otherwise, I feel like we're expecting a little bit. And then SJ comes out and was really bad for the first six minutes of the game. He said after the game, he said that was like the worst first quarter has had in his career.

He's probably exaggerating.

And the spurs, I just never really felt the urgency.

They showed that that that one halftime speech when it was like 8771. Whatever was there down 16. And Wemby's got the guys around. And then they came up and played with some passion for, I don't know, four minutes.

“But I don't know, man, did they think this was a 19 game series?”

What's going on with them? Here's what I think a couple of things. I think first of all, you're right about the opportunity. You know, listen, you've got to win another game there to win the series, right? And so you look at this situation.

You don't have Jalen Williams. You don't have AJ Mitchell. It's like their first first game. They're going to get them like kind of like, wow. You know, this is a bit a lot of pressure on us here because we don't win this game.

We're going to have to go to San Antonio with the prospect of being closed out. It's an awful lot of pressure on the home team and a two to two situation. And you're missing a couple of guys. So some guys are going to have to step up. So you would think like San Antonio's approach to be like, this is a game.

Not only that, you know, we can get we have to get. That's kind of how I think their approach should have been going in. I probably felt that way. I think they just didn't play well enough in this situation. You get it done.

And I think one of the things that jumps out right away is you look at Victor Wemby and Yama. And a lot of us being talked about like during the game that, you know, kind of kind of quiet passive didn't get a lot of shots. Think a lot of touches where he wants it. He had some free throws.

So his numbers weren't like horrific early. But the thing that I'm thinking about when I'm watching that bill is this, when you look at the other top guys in his league,

“just go with like the all NBA team if you want to and even guys on the second team.”

Like those are guys because of the nature of their game, like physically, you know, their dimensions. They can get theirs when they want to get theirs a lot of times.

That's not always the case for Victor Wemby.

Yama, it's not going to be. He's seven foot, you know, four, five, whatever you want to call it. He's slightly built seven, six, seven, whatever you want to call it.

Yeah.

I say every time I hear a game with Victor and Yama on it, they say as they say it's high differently. So I don't even know.

“Let's I typically go with seven, five because that's what it looks like to me.”

Yeah. He can't just go get it when he wants to because of that. Sometimes it works against him. If he's not catching the ball in ideal spots, if some of their actions aren't designed,

so he can get a quick roll to the rim from a decent distance, not 28 feet where he's got to take two, three strides. Where he can get shipped and bumped along the way, if he can't find those actions those spaces, or even some of the early stuff sometimes, when he gets some threes going because it's early in transition,

he can't just go put it down, use his live dribble, cross guys up, have a counter move off the dribble and get what he wants. Go to a fade away jumper or an up and under in the mid-range or whatever. It's just harder for him. So there's going to be nights when that offense isn't just going to be automatic.

And most of those guys in this league, when you look at Yoke at you, look at Shay. You look at Luca. You look at Kate the Kate Cunningham's of the world. The Jailam Browns of the world.

When you look at those Anthony Edwards, when you look at those guys,

like, and look, they're not always going to shoot great,

but they can operate in spaces, but they can go get it shot for themselves, most of the time if they're not blessed. And it's not that way for Victor Webbing. Yama said there's going to be nights when that offense

is going to be a little inconsistent. Now he affects the game defensively, he can rebound, he can do all those things. But there are nights, man. We need your best player to go get you 30. And he is not going to be able to do that whenever he wants because of the way he's built.

And that's kind of one thing I noticed about this game early. The way he was being defended, how hard it was for him to get touches where he wants it. He didn't really get involved in a game offensively. And in a game like this, with what sets the stake, he kind of needed Victor Webbing out to be a lot better than he was offensively.

Yeah, you're talking about the concept of feeling somebody throughout a game. Right, the best part is in the league. You just kind of feel them even if they're not having the best game. They're still around there in it. What's weird is they did this in game three.

And they made a big deal after in game four, pop came in and yelled at us after. And we had to go back to being us. And it's like, I thought you guys learned your lesson already. That if you're just the three-point shooting team and Wemby's 25 feet from the basket,

that this isn't going to really work. Now, you could also argue they lost the game because they gave up almost 130 points. But I'm with you. Like, go Casey, because they're able to capitalize on some of the turnovers and some of the some of the weirdness of the game.

And we're able to patch together some stretches. Even when SGA wasn't playing well. I just, when I watch it, because I obviously love watching Wemby as as do you. I just don't really understand how they use them sometimes. Like, when you talk about like how you get a more involved,

they were talking about the broadcast about getting in the paint. See, she would happen when he's in the paint. Isn't really that hard to get him near the paint? Like, you could start him under the basket and have him like drift up. You could have him kind of near the block trying to back in.

But they always seem like they found this habit of he's just set the top of the key.

His three wasn't going tonight. I didn't feel like he had his legs tonight either. He was out from five from three.

“So for me, it's like, are you doing what OKC wants you to do?”

And the answer is yes. This is they're really hoping going into this game that you're going to play this way with him. And that's, that's how played out. I think there are ways to get in the ball and look, they know this. There's a great coach. There are ways to get in the ball.

It's something that happens a little bit more organically for them. They mandate it, whatever, maybe his determination to get it. I love him personally when he sets ball screens inside of, you know, 23 feet, 22 feet. He sets elbow ball screens. He sets ball screens. Yeah.

When he starts at the elbow and sort of heads out toward the sideline sets it. So that when he spins out of it, it's like one stride. It's easier to come off the screen and just quickly throw it to him. Just first start it to move toward the rim. And then it's very difficult for the rotating defender to do much with it because of where he's catching the ball.

If you just think he's going to run down the floor, go into the post area and just kind of put his hand up and get it where he wants. You could see time and time again. He gets in a wrestling match just down there. Even against smaller guys, it's not that easy to do.

“And sometimes I think their guards don't give him enough time when he gets a switch.”

He's got a smaller guy. And he, you know, a lot of guys in this league, if it's your catch, let's just use as an example that obviously wants to touch the ball and the post as well. It's a guy like your catch. He gets to switch. He goes somewhere near the lane and then he just stops camps out and uses his weight and strength and just holds the guy there. Put the hand up and you just lead him and it catches everything.

You know, when you always got good hands too, but it's harder for him to just hold his position and keep.

Keep that defender at bay that's trying to back into him and they're trying t...

Now, he can get there. You've got to give him an extra count and the problem is against OKC.

That means the ball halo needs a little bit more time to pass. He's a little bit more time to promise. They're being pressured like hell out there. So they can't just sit there and hold it and wait for Victor to get his position down there. They end up reversing it. And by the time he now looks like he's ready to receive it, the ball's going to the other side of the floor.

“It's going to the top of the key, then to the other side and now you're asking an awful lot.”

Now is he going to flash from one side through traffic at bunk three times and go catch it on the other side of the lane. That that's just not his game. That's not his physical profile to play that way. So the quick hitters off the ball screens when he sets the screen closer to the rim. And he dies quicker than the ball hits him like right away as he's moving. He can catch it. He can do something really effective with it and actually that's where he draws most of his files. I didn't see him involved in a lot of actions like that in this game.

He was catching it a lot and then turning and facing and trying to figure out what he wanted to do against guys off the dribble. And that's just not going to be there every night for him. The way that it is, other elite scores in this league, who can get lower, they can set you up, get into a step back jumper from wherever they want. They can cross you up, counter, maybe even cross you up and then go back between their legs the same direction and get like a little pull up and operate on one on one space.

That's just not going to be there all the time for for Victor and it wasn't really tonight. And they needed more from him and you know at the same time, Oklahoma City was getting really good performances from some guys that had to be big tonight. One of which you know, you had texted me earlier and said, McKay's got a great game 7 for 90's on a great night, but he was very. Second half. Yes, second half.

Very impactful. It's well, and that's your younger guys usually at home are going to be a little bit of a safer bet. I wrote down maybe playoff experience does matter.

“Question marks. So here's the thing with playoff experience because this was the thing, this was the thing we always talked about during the season with the spurs.”

They're too young. They're not ready yet. What does that mean? You think like, you're too young that means, oh my god, there's so much pressure. I don't know what to do.

I've never been here before. It's like almost like how it would be like with a quarterback like Drake may in the playoffs last year.

Ooh, and then well, we have Dave Jacobi here on the Zoom for some reason trying to figure out why. This is exciting. But when I think about playoff experience, sometimes it's just kind of knowing what to do in a game like this, right? He's 22 years old. It's like, hey, they don't have jail and waves. They don't have a jail, bitch. Oh, come out in the first half and have like the game of your life. Have like your ESPN classic game. And that's the youth thing. I feel like when he's 27, 20 years old.

You just approach this game a little bit differently. But I don't listen. Oh, god. No, I was just going to say, now you're right. I look at the like the Dylan Harper component to this. He's such an extractor because he's so physically talented. He's a guy that can play through the pressure, the, you know, the grabbing holding that you're going to get against these OKC guards, particularly in the postseason. He could play through that stuff. He's just got struck shoulders for arms. He can still get to his spots. He's got multiple, multiple speeds he plays with.

“I think he's a little bit like more affected when Deer Fox is out there. Deer Fox is running more of the show. It's almost like Dylan Harper is it is like in a different mindset.”

You know, in a game like this, he plays 25 minutes. He takes five shots from the field. Dylan Harper's two good a player. And he is physically too gifted against this type of defense for him to be some sort of afterthought for them offensively. He needed to be much more aggressive had the opportunity to be aggressive. He could have made up for some of what Wemby wasn't giving you right because not everybody on this team can play through that stuff. Harper can't he can still get where he wants to get on the floor, but he really was sort of quiet and and passive and he'll keep you young player on the road in the biggest game of his life.

Yeah, that probably factors into it. And some of these guys from the Thunderman have been here before their younger players are just a little bit older than some of them. Yeah, I felt like Castle in the first half was like that. Like he was just super sloppy and I thought was hurting them. And then in the second after you could see he's like, you know, I'm going to put I'm going to get my defense going and I'm going to put my head.

I'm going to get the basket and he actually had a really good second half Harper did not and Fox was bad. I don't I think Fox is hurt. I don't feel like he had any left.

I agree. It's for the green. He just didn't have that kind of play through it man. And I wish that I really do man. You know, you're not going to sit there and if you can go you're not going to sit there and watch other guys play like you're, you know, but the guy's only got to take care of the ball.

Absolutely need him.

And it gets the team like the thunder. You really need that because of the way that closed down driving lanes. There's so good at helping on the lane, closing out with speed to the three point lane.

“Like he can match that speed and he doesn't quite seem like he's got all of that and it is what it is. He's going to play through it.”

But, you know, 33 minutes for for 15 from the field. That's not really typical for dear Fox for a guy that's such a natural score. I agree with you. I don't think he's right. Not a lot of coast to coast stuff with him. No, either. Um, with all that said, Wendy's when be kind of sucked for him, Fox, the NAB lift, Harper, didn't really show up and champagne kind of kept in the game the first half.

I kind of liked the shot. San Antonio was getting this game. They had they missed a lot of corner threes in the second half.

I thought there were stretches where I didn't I didn't love the whistle. They were getting offensively. I thought they did a bunch of dumb stuff defensively and some some of the fouls.

“But, um, but it was weird. They were hanging around hanging around and it was at one point near the end of the third quarter. I think it was eight and it was like shit.”

This is they're going to steal this game. I've seen this before. One is going to put the superhero cape on in the fourth quarter, but okay. See, they're a really good job. And heart and stand heart and stand in a chorizo. And then McCain get hot near the end, but I thought heart and stand a chorizo. If you had to pick the number two MVP of okay for okay see for this series. After SGA, obviously, who's the MVP? Who would your number two MVP choice for okay see big? Because mine would be chorizo. Man, it's tough. Honestly, yeah, you probably would be chorizo. The timeliness of his shooting. What he always gives you in other areas, but the timeliness of his shooting and scoring has been immense in his series. But again, you could hand pick some spots for heart and time too. You go where would he be without the way he played.

Check, you know, has not been anything like overwhelming offensively pretty solid. I thought heart and time was great in this game. He really was with his his rebounding his his touch the way he makes you pay with that little push shot, which is, you know, I always refer to his releasing the doves. It's just the strangest looking shot that he has perfected and just he's letting the eggs let's the doves go like a central park somewhere like that's what it looks like.

“He shot one of those by the way, over Wimbledon, Yama on the right baseline. That ball must have traveled like eight, nine, ten feet.”

It was like a weird shot. It was, and for, so you think about the actual disc, it was like a 12 foot shot that traveled a greater distance than most NBA three point shots. Well, the other thing I love with him, he knows how high that ball choke. Yeah, the other thing I love with him. Well, two things. First of all, his fouls are just hard. You feel him fouls that aren't flagrants, but each one is like a foul in a half. Yeah, the other thing, he gets offensive rebounds, but they always feel like they're these big, kind of quarter swinging offense rebounds. Like he had two in a row that led to, I think two three's, I'm going to say it was like an eight point game all of a sudden it was a 13 point game, just because he kept two possessions alive.

So I agree with you. I said this in a pot of couple of days ago, like I thought in game one, I was like, man, they're going to play them off the floor. You're not going to be able to keep them.

Now, now you watch and you go, how are they going to let this guy leave the summer because he's got like the 29 million dollar team option.

Jay Dubs contract pumps up, phone grins contract pumps up. They got loot door at they have to figure out, you know, they're going to be in some real tax issues. They haven't shown a huge appetite to pay up it. I don't see how he let heart and stain. I don't see how you let him leave. I also think he'd have real value to, I don't know, eight, ten other teams that have cap space or those to mid level. Definitely because he, one thing he totally understands also is he is the master at finding that late in the possession little pocket that he has to get to to make himself available.

When a guard penetrates and then maybe it's they've already tried a couple of actions wasn't going now. You know, guys, it gets downhill and it's like going to be a bad shot that somebody's about to throw up at the rim and then here comes heart and shine from the baseline and he flashes right into that middle of the lane area, you know, ten 12 feet he catches it and he gets that soft shot out. So he bails out some of their possessions. He gives them extra possessions and he has six offensive rebounds. I don't think you can tangible even quantify how many additional offensive rebound opportunities he creates because they've got two guys trying to keep him off the glass.

Other guys, guards then sneak in and run down a long one. That guard should have been there for the opponent.

They're not because they're helping chip on heart and time because they're ti...

So that's a whole other element to like what he brings to it just because of his activity and I love that your company you're pointed at the fouls.

“You don't play through those for and ones against heart and time that he's going to he's going to hit you in a way. And again, he said it's all it's all legal stuff.”

Shopping down on your arms by steps four arms as guys are trying to get up and then you're going to feel it. And you're not going to most importantly, you're not going to play through it for an end one. You're going to have to go earn them in a lot of cases. Maybe, you know, your arm is like numb when you're like going up there to try to speak well in your arm. So as she had 32 16 for 17 free throws six turnovers, McCain 18, Heart Stein was 12 and 15 and Crusoe was 22 with six deals and four threes. I have two big picture questions for you.

This is the basketball fan just that after game one, which was an all-time all-time all-timeer. It was like wow buckle up. This is a series for the ages. Did we fly a little too close to the sun because we haven't had a good game since the series is not been a classic game one had all of the everything you'd ever want.

And then we've had four kind of probably never watch any parts of any of these games again.

“But where are we with this series now? Because I'm watching, well, that'll lead to big question with you. But I'm watching this one. Like I really thought this was going to be the finals and it doesn't 100% feel that way. So why?”

Most anticipated game of the entire season without a doubt with what's at stake in this game. Because what I said earlier, San Antonio, a lot of people, you know, believe can win the series. What we're going to win the series. This is your chance. This is your chance. They spoke to each split on each other's floor. So now you go, okay, this is what it sets up. This game five. You get it. You get that last home opportunity to close out the defending champion. This is what we grew up with. These awesome game five. This is it. This is a game one that shows on a BATV for 20 years.

Game five is the one and I agree with you. I mean, obviously, what all you really want as a fan when you sit down to watch it as a broadcaster or from calling the game. Just give me some drama late. That's all you really asked for, man. So somebody that has to really rise up and show a lot of nerve to knock down a big shot. Like some great defensive play.

That's all you're asking for, man. That inside of a minute game could go either way, type of field to it. And no, you haven't really had that incredible first game.

It was a great escape. Any of us have ever seen in the playoffs. And you're thinking as we all were, oh, man, we're going to get like five or six more of those. It's going to be incredible. And it's I guess that was too hard to live up to, man. But look, it might have taken something out of both teams. Like we've had a bunch of injuries since that game and a bunch of guys that don't look like they're 100% anymore. Yeah, well, hey, listen, at least it's certainly beat what, you know, we were calling in the Eastern Conference finals with what we want. And we certainly got that same drama in game one of that series.

Yeah, you did with what the nicks had to do 22. Deficit and less than eight minutes. Uh, I'm just putting on an all-time show and then, you know, goes over time next win. And then the rest is history. You know, particularly how those last two ended in Cleveland. So at least, you know, these games, even though the, like Oklahoma City got up 10, 12, 15, 18, whatever it was, you're still sitting there going there's enough time. Spurs are good enough. It like the way the game was kind of going, you like spurs could make an eight-o run here 10-o run. This could still get to a six-point game with five minutes to go. And they just, you know, in both cases throughout the series haven't been able to make that run that really made the other team feel it outside of game one really feel it.

We're going to chase you down and you're going to have to really earn this late in the game. So yeah, I guess so. I mean, I guess from a fans perspective hasn't lived up to it. I don't think anybody in Oklahoma City is pitching about that right now. They're up three two. And that's that's fine with them. And they don't need to have the drama that we're describing if they can end up winning this in six or seven games. Well, that leads to question number two. We headed into the series thinking this was the NBA finals. The next are just playing better than both of these teams. Yeah. It's just a fact. Now, you could say it's the schedule they played, but it's really hard. I think you were there, too. The 2014 finals spurs Miami and the spurs just hit that level where they just put we're playing so beautifully together.

“I remember being on TV, but being like, I think the series like in game four, like I think this is over. I think that the spurs.”

I've kind of solved Miami and I think they've gone to another level and it was just the selflessness and everything we're watching, which you just watch for four games. And if I'm them, I feel like I can beat either of these teams down. Now, we don't know if okay, say if Jda comes back and Mitchell and they have a full healthy team and they're going to have all these dudes to throw a Bronson.

You know, and try to wear him down and guard him 94 feet.

These teams are just going to beat the crap out of each other and something magical is happening. We can actually win the finals, which I don't think anyone other than them would have thought two weeks ago, right?

“I go back two weeks ago, I probably won't be thinking about they haven't lost a game in a month in the playoff. So I think once they got into that Philly series and started hitting their stride.”

And this was looking this way every night offensively. Somewhere in the Philly series, it started looking like, okay, damn, the next. And like they've really closed that gap with the West because at one point, I don't know how long ago you'd have to go back. Let's say, for me, probably, you know, March, late March or April where you're going. It's a foregone conclusion, whoever wins the West is the NBA champion. And at that time, there was even a time when Denver was even still kind of included in that, right?

But it was really, we were mainly talking at the top two teams. And here's what I'll tell you, that narrative is now completely changed because of the way the next are playing.

Now I'm not sitting here predicting the next one. What I'm saying is, now you've got a series with whoever they play. That's the kind of basketball that they're playing because it was going to take something that was going to be almost mind blowing offensively to think that anybody coming out of the East was going to be able to operate the way you need to to actually win a series against those two defenses. And that's what the next have reached. It's literally a level of offensive basketball that you sit there. It's so overwhelming for their opponents. You can't really even believe that you're deep into the NBA playoffs.

And this is happening. And it was the switch was flipped in the middle of the Atlanta series. They haven't lost the game since 11 straight. Saw some really interesting stat. I kind of had some people dig up for me because I was really curious. I'm looking at this team and I'm going, when have you had five starters at the same time playing this well in rhythm? So I looked at there. I looked at there a field goal percentage as a group. The five starters.

“53% as a group. Okay. So I went and I said, well, who else has done that? You know how far you have to go back?”

The only three group of starters that were this deep into the postseason that had a higher field goal percentage collectively amongst starters than the next team this year, where the 84 85 and 86 Lakers cheeses and they were layups and dunks half the time. That's what I'm saying. That's exactly what I said. It's magic. It's Korean. It's worthy. Yeah. Like this is the, this is the team. And they did it three years in a row a little bit or not to buff that.

And then the next 53% for your start as a group. And it's like, it's, I mean, what bridges finally cooled off.

I was like, okay, you know, because the numbers were getting so ridiculous, at one point he was 67 for his last 97 from the field. And it got to suit's mostly jumpers. It gets a little bit of slashing stuff, a couple layups in transition, but a lot of it is pull up jumpers.

“A couple of three is a game does go to line ever to get rhythm. So at his shooting, he's like 67 for his last 90s. And one point he was 72% in the 11 game stretch.”

Landry sham it comes off to bench. What does he do? Let's go 11 for 12 from the 12 teams. Yeah, it was fully out of funny back and forth Richard Jefferson on the forecast said he's like, you know, man, one guy that's made himself so money.

This lander sham it. I said it is 92% for the three point like I said are good in the conference finals.

I got no. So even that stuff. But it's the starters. That's really what we're talking about here. The flow that they have the way they're sharing the ball. You know what that does, Bill, for me, it means this. You can win on the road now because balance travels defense travels. Their defense is playing almost as well as their offense, but their offense has lots to do with that because it's been so good. You're taking about the net all the time. Their defense is going to be better, but it's the balance balance travels.

You don't need it from one guy on any given night. The guys are picking each other up. And it's just this machine like performance offensively does now thrust them into the conversation of yes, yes, it's possible. The next could be the champions when this is all said and done certainly they're worthy of going toe to toe with whoever they face and be finals. And I don't think anybody thought that going into the postseason there was a worthy challenger to those teams. Well, they have a couple things you want, right?

That the star who can go toe to toe in the last five minutes of a game, they can come from behind. They don't necessarily, they're a little like OKC in this sense that they can kind of survive a bad game from anybody in their top six and somebody else will pick up the slack. They're getting all these fast break points that not sure that's going to translate into play OKC or say an Antonio probably not the same as when like James Harden and some of the calves are out there.

But, you know, I think about like I thought the best two teams I saw this cen...

And then we've seen teams that went on heaters as the playoffs went along, right?

“Not get said a point in 23 where it was like Jesus. Oh, it's it's happening for these guys. There's the spurs 2014 is another great example and then the 11 maps were these teams.”

Seven eight guys and they just you can kind of see them figure it out in real time. The interesting piece with the mixes the math is on their side too. Like they're like what do they plus 20 now that reading for the playoffs. I remember doing this before the Dallas Celtic series like at some point the math is the math. If somebody's just killing everybody for a month, you have to take that seriously and I don't think the east was that bad either. You know, that that calf's team. I thought was a pretty pretty tough well rounded team the next were better than them, but they by the end of that series, they were they were tapping out like a UFC fighter, you know, and I don't know, I just I think the next can be either of these teams. I really do. I would not have said that even 10 days ago, but I wouldn't have them favored, but I don't know.

Like 50 50. Yeah, Bill, I think it would be honestly foolish for any person to say that they couldn't at this point. I mean, and I understand you could talk about the path and who they played and I mean, I think also there was some things in the Western conference at the path was a little bit easier than we thought it was going to be for these teams. But listen, you look at the next was no doubt. I mean, you know, Atlanta gave him their their biggest test. Philly was, you know, dealing with the embed stuff, banged up there and they were not right, not themselves. It still doesn't explain what the next did to them. It doesn't explain in this series what the next did to them. Now, look.

I don't think calves calves the way to explain cows are winning that series regardless of what happening game one. You're recovering from that. You're not recovering from that against this team, the way they're playing because that so this team comes into that game. They're already on like hyper drive offensively. All right, and now, okay, man, this is a tough spot. You put them in. It's what do they do. They go have a 44 to 11 run that actually kicked their overall hyper drive into another level for the rest of the series.

“So because they had to find it like in that moment. I look, I don't have this all that's in front of me now. I had it before the game notes going into game four the other night when they swept.”

But it was like number one in all the playoff teams in fast break points per game. Number one in three points shooting percentage overall number one in field goal percentage. There were one or two off in one two offense rating one defense rating and vice versa. I was kept they kept flipping it back and forth every time they play a game. But top two either way on both ends of the floor.

They were dominating points in the paint. They were number one in second chance points like every way you can get it offensively they're getting it.

And it's even more than that even more than a number just sitting there watching them the connection between each other. It's special. It's something special that they've got going on right now. They have lost two games in the postseason in which CJ McCollum had a last like a shot to beat him by one point. Right. Or this team is very very possibly could be 12 and up instead they're 12 and two because of CJ McCollum playing great beginning in Lannis series. But once they figured out how they wanted to play.

They haven't looked back. And it's another long layoff for them. You know, going to be incredibly fresh. When the final son at this thing ends up going seven. These teams are going to get Sunday money Tuesday three days off. Mixer sitting there again for a week and a half. Exactly. They're sitting there waiting now the difference is in this last years they were waiting and then they you had to come into the garden. You're filling coming off of their seven game series to boss it had to come into the garden right away.

That will not be the case in this time. The nicks are going on the road one way or another. So it's going to be a little bit different environment for that game one where you set the tone.

“But regardless, I think it'd be foolish for any person to watch the nicks right now and not say that they absolutely could envision them being NBA champions. This is all set and done.”

The two McCallum shots reminiscent of the old one likeers would have gone undefeated if not for the OT game that I ever send the step over game right. And then the 2017 wears won their first 15.

Had a chance to go 16 and know that was Katie's first year and that that team was incredible.

And that game foreign Cleveland was just a treasures officiating game and just a weird game where you just everything felt wrong about it. But they really had it 16 and no, you know, nobody's done that. And then I look at the nicks and it's like, yeah, they're like two CJ McCallum shots away from being 12 and all right now, which is a whole other level of everything.

You mentioned this earlier, but I think it's important because I haven't gott...

Did they, they've passed all the I test chemistry. They have the secret unselfishness guys poem for each other. It seems like they check everyone of those boxes. What did you see as you were sitting there? 100% they do with the chemistry. The what's being said to each other in whatever, you know moments of adversity you've had within a game or if they're not playing as well as they want to the leadership that's coming in the huddles the way that guys are respecting each other. If they've got a voice for what they want to do. But the most impressive thing about it is I'd watch this team now. I don't know. We saw we did two of the filly New York games. We did obviously all four of the Cleveland games. So that's six we did one of the Atlanta game.

“We did the game in Atlanta when they went up 61 points. So that was pretty impressive. But so we called that game. So I've seen them now seven times. I think in the postseason and the here's what I tell you.”

They are not ever missing the next pass that's supposed to be made. Yeah. It's made every time like every time I call a game. I mean, it's like every third trip up to floor.

I'm thinking of myself just the way my mind works. Oh, I should have gone here. That should have been reversed. That guy's open. That ball needs to go there because it would lead to this. That roller needs to be hit on the short pocket. I don't say that at all with the next. It's every single time because we're supposed to know a lot of that is they're playing with this is surge up the floor. And you can see what it did to the pads. The calves literally just stopped running. They're just like this is just it was a race guys. Yeah, I mean, it really was it. You know, you think about it. Bill they had was a 25 fast break points at a half in a half the record for a playoff game is 38 they had 30 at the end of the third quarter. They could have had 35 if they wanted to keep running. They could have 45 if they ran the entire game for whatever reason.

But obviously you're not going to do that in a game like that. So they didn't get to the record, but like it and it's obviously that was a lot about the calves and just a lack of commitment man to turn and sprint run back match up. And they just knew they were overwhelmed and it was it is what it is. But it's not just them that they did it to they did the same thing to the at the end of the land of series. They did the same thing to the sixers.

“And it broke there broke three teams that are out. They really did. I mean, and that's the thing you're watching happen right before your eyes. You're seeing the competitive will be taken away.”

But with what they're doing now, the most shocking one for me by far was Atlanta series because that is a three two series very much up in Atlanta is at home for a game six. You're like, okay, you know, we might get a seventh game out of this right away in the first round, of course, there's a lot of tension still about the nicks and they were down to one at one point.

And they were up 45 points in the first half. Fort in the first half. And so you're like, okay, this team has they got waves that they're hitting you with where every single read is perfect.

Every cut is is with intent. Everything they're doing right now is like literally like if you're any coach at any level man, this is what you want your team look like offensively because they're they're just they're just doing everything on point on time for each other and then at the end of it, which you never know if you're going to get. They're finishing it with shot making like that's the one thing you can play beautiful basketball not shoot well. They're doing that to every single game. So and that's just what it looks like and their defense has been just swarming because again teams have let go of the rope.

They've getting just smashed and so now they get careless with the ball as well and it looks like this, you know, piranha tank and they're just grabbing the ball and going and and it's amazing how fast these games are just turning into an inferno for the other team where it's like not winnable in a period of six minutes. That's what they've been doing game after game and that's like been the most impressive thing of all well, and they have an incredible crowd. And then on the road, they're now traveling like Red Sox style with it felt like it was half the fans of that Cavs game. What was the crowd like in game one because.

If I like ESPN, I'm going to set the lower the crowd mics just so we could hear the announcers. There were some fan videos that came from that game right where it was like 10 out of 10 deafening because I've been in situations like that with those cans on where the crowd is coming through the cans and you almost can't even hear anything how loud was it.

“We're doing the open on the court, you know, myself, Mike Greenrich of Jefferson about to do the open and we're standing shoulder to shoulder and I was having a difficult time hearing Mike Green.”

So, you know, fortunately, I kind of knew the question. So I just watched his lips and when he stopped moving his lips, I started talking, you know, because I got it knew what the question was, but yeah, it was on that level and then it got real nervous in there.

I think the game one.

They were waiting for a run that never came until it happened in that stretch when they, you know, he just kept getting one on one against hardened over and over and it took six incredibly difficult shots that he got well, it's a four incredibly difficult to like sort of tough four really tough shots.

We're just term of staying home with three point shooters, let this guy go after six in a row, the leads been cut in half and there's enough time to win the game now they started making decisions.

I was doing running guy out of halfway at him, what do we do? The rotations weren't good and it shaman it's three bridges hit a couple threes and the rest is history, but there was, there was a lot of nervousness in there, but I'll tell you this though, Bill, we'll say this. When Bronson started making those shots, you're still down 18, 16, 14, it felt to me like that crowd knew right then they were going to win that game. Right, because the history with the guy, they've watched them do it 20 times.

We just needed this, we would waiting, hanging on the edge of us, you were so loud early and then man, they jumped us in the third quarter and it's like, wow,

“we're going to lose this game and it was a little bit of that in the third quarter. They were just waiting, give us one, like 80 run and we're going to be fine and that's what he did.”

He didn't let that run, you know what's funny about it again. Brady was like that, he got to that point as a QB, we could be down the whole game and, you know, they go for it on fourth and one, the other team and screwed up and like you're giving us the ball back. Oh my god, Brady's close it. You just kind of knew. And it feels like the nicks are like, wow, you're letting us hang around. Brunson's going to, do you realize what's about to happen because he said that point, what do we do with him?

There's, there's been very few little guards like this in the history of the week who have been able to be the guy on the team that took a team in the finals.

He's never been considered a top five or six guy in the week. He made second team on BA this time around.

I think we all thought incredible clutch player could you win four straight playoff rounds of them, probably not. And now he's kind of, not going on the door of like that top four, top five in the league just because of what's happening. Is there, can you think of another player in your career playing in the league announcing talking about it?

“Is there another player that you can think of who's been like him?”

There's not a comparison for him for this reason. Other guys that have been smaller type guards that are your teams. High volume shot taker, leading score or that's a hard way to go about it. If you got a guy that's, you know, under six, six even that's like your point guard ish. That takes all most of the shots and like yeah.

Okay, there's hasn't, and here's why he's different than those other guys. Most of those other guys lightning quick. Right, and so they play to certain way that you're like, okay, that you can see how you can get escape ability. He doesn't, he doesn't have that. Now he's got a, he's got a shiftiness that he can shake you and get by you because he's got to set you up.

But think about it. And I think it's a great, great lesson for young players. If you're not the most, necessarily the most athletic, because I would call this game a grounded game. He's got a grounded offensive game. If you're kind of one of those guys that's got that.

So here's what you have to master.

Footwork balance gets strong, getting the weight room, footwork balance, strength. And then the last component that you can't teach that he has is a certainty of in himself of what the result is going to be. I think Jalen Brunson is more certain in, and especially in big spots when he goes up to release the basketball than any player in this league. He is the most certain of where that ball's going to end up. And, and that is incredible because he's not going to shake you entirely.

He's not blowing by you and getting it to the glass before anybody can react. He's not getting to an area in the floor and elevating 3840 inches for a mid-range pull-up or a lean back. He's not doing that. He's a grounded offensive player that you still can't stop because he uses a strength footwork balance IQ. And at the end of it, he's so sure of himself.

Yeah. It's, that's the really to me, the final component sets apart. He is one of those rare players that like the brighter the lights.

“That's, that's what he's kind of been built for his entire life.”

This is what he knows. And so he was the perfect player that the next acquired at the time. We were sure, is this the perfect player that they just acquired? Because you didn't really know it wasn't his team yet when he left Dallas. Now it was his team and like, okay, let's see what this looks like and man, this is what it looks like.

And the guy, by the way, shoots 46% or up, I think every single year.

He's a smaller guard that's way more efficient than most guys his size of eve...

There's the sustainability with how he does it. Because this has been four years now and it feels like he's just getting slightly better each year. Because like the one great Isaiah Thomas is in with the Celtics, the second Isaiah Thomas. When he had 29 in game, who's an MVP candidate, they made the, they made the conference finals. But you're watching it like man, he's going to get hurt.

He's just flying to the basket, right? And he's like this little guy going against these big dudes and over and over again, felt like he was flying in the basket support.

And I always felt watching it like, ah, there's like a shelf life with this.

I don't see how you can keep playing this way. For instance, almost moves more like yolkage where it's like, I feel like he can do this for 10 years. This is all like footwork and confidence and no.

“So when I think about the guys, there's nobody to compare him to.”

But he's got pieces of different great guys from over the years, right? Like Isaiah was the toughest guy in that piston scene, right? That was the bad boy. Pistence, he was the toughest guy. But also like in the end of games, he knew he could take over and score.

I don't remember seeing Oscar Robertson. I was too young. But they always talked about the way he controlled the pace of a game. It just slowly painstakingly got to his spots. That's what made him special.

So there's guys. But to watch a six foot one guy who can control a game with his footwork basically, who's the toughest guy in his team. And then you hear Mike Brown say this week that Dunkin and Courier, the only two people he's ever seen as leaders like that.

And he does the two best leaders of the past 35 years in the league.

That everybody talks about like if you have this guy, you have a culture, the entire time you're there. So you have that, too. It's just, it's an all-time signing. It's one of the great phrase in signings in the history.

I'm not out about it. I mean, they're talking, listen, there's a lot of people now in New York. And if you see it all the time online or conversations or podcasts, whatever the topic comes up, greatest next of all time. It's played himself with that conversation to the point where if he wins this,

he's able to win this and he puts up the kind of typical jail and runs and numbers in an NBA final and this guy averages like 30 or something and an NBA finals. And they upset San Antonio or Oklahoma City, which I mean, it's be as big of an upset now as it would have been. But I'm saying, you know, these are both teams at one north of 60.

Right. And they're able to pull that off. And also it doesn't have home court advantage of doing that. And he goes in and he shoots 50% from the field and average is 30. And they win a title.

And I can't even, I can't even, I don't even know.

Like where did he get three years of baggage? Yeah. Yeah.

“And I'm saying, where does he, where do you shoot historically?”

If that happens, it's been 53 years. You know, 27 since they just got to the finals. You know. So right. He's a special player man.

They got the right guys around him. Give a give Lee on Rose and that group a lot of credit. Man for what they did and the pieces that they went out and got. Even a guy like Bridges who gave up a lot for it. He was getting beat up or a times this year.

And certainly not land a series. You know, the game before this whole streak started. Remember he had no points in four turnovers in and game five of that series. I'm sorry, he gave three in that series. They got out to one.

Right. And it's, it's completely turned around for him. So even even. And he's figured out where to go on the court. That's what he looked at.

And that took two years. And here's why that, that's subtle change. And he's got to go on the court. And he's got to go on the court. And he's got to go on the court.

And he's got to go on the court. And he's got to go on the court. And he's got to go on the court. And he's got to go on the court. And he's got to go on the court.

And he's got to go on the court. And he's got to go on the court.