Caleb Wilson Fever, 2020 NBA Redraftables, and the ‘Odyssey’ MVP Rankings With Joe House, J. Kyle Mann, and Jason Concepcion

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We did Hitch. The Will Smith movie is 21 years old. One of the last really, really killer rom-com. So we had fun breaking that down. Next week, on Monday, we're gonna be doing a live rewatchemals

on Netflix, on Monday, sometime in the afternoon. And I'm not gonna tell you what the movie is yet. I'll tell you over the weekend what we're doing, but there's a really, really good chance you've seen it. So we're gonna be going live, on Netflix, rewatchables,

Monday afternoon Pacific time.

So stay tuned for that. I have no red socks on this episode, because they won 15 straight as a tape in this intro. It's afternoon, Wednesday, they had a double header today. They won one one.

This is one of the craziest red socks experiences in the history of the franchise. The team is dead. The day I had my colonoscopy, the day Jalen Brown got traded.

The red socks lost that day. They were 37 and 48. It was my least favorite red socks season. We've ever, probably ever had in my lifetime. There was not a single thing to like.

Guys getting hurt, Roman Anthony was supposed to be next to Williams, he's out. Crochet got hurt, Trevor's story.

“I think it was the most expensive of the team.”

He's hurt, and things just flipped over the last three weeks.

And it's been incredible to watch.

I think I'm gonna, I'll do something in the last segment on Sunday about it with my dad or my friend Hansher, somebody. But it's been so much fun to watch. And my favorite guy, Wilson Contrares comes in.

And he's carrying him, so he's the new guy, comes in in April. And has this intensity in him? And it doesn't fit in with the rest of the team. They have a bunch like the teams of masks. We can't hit lefties, and Roman Anthony,

and Marcelo Meyer, like they're supposed to be the young guys that come up, and they're doing nothing. And he has this intensity, and he's around. And almost seemed like he was on the wrong team for two months. And then they sweep the Yankees.

There's the stuff that happens with the nationals where he gets kicked out of two games in a row. And something flipped, and he's at the center of all of it. And he's my favorite Redsac player. Probably since they traded Mookie because he's just a maniac.

And this is the boss that fans love him. He's like somebody hits a big home run. He's out of the dugout. He's the first guy. He's doing these.

He's just-- I really feel like he's transformed the team watching him. So anyway, that's been great. And I'm glad the Redsac are good, because there's no sports coming on.

“That's why, for this podcast, it's July 22nd.”

We were doing a redraft of the 2020 NBA draft with Kyle Man and Joe House after we talk a little summary. I haven't done a redraft in a while, but we're going to do that. And then, Jason Ketsepsen came on. I have a big thing about the Odyssey.

I'm going to unleash my MVP belt for the Odyssey, because I've now seen it twice. So if you haven't seen it yet, no problem. If you want to listen to the redraft and then pop out, if you have seen the Odyssey, I would highly encourage you

to listen to that part with me and Jason. So that is the podcast we're going to take a break. Pearl Jam and then Joe House and Kyle Man. This episode of the Bill Simmons Podcast is presented by PayPal.

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It can only mean one thing, filler content.

Joe House and Sarah, Kyle Man is there. We're going to talk about, we're going to redraft. Haven't been redraft from forever.

I'll explain what we're doing in a second.

Quickly, I want to hit some of the league because Kyle Man ingested a bunch of it. Joe House had, I would say a successful wizard, AJ DeBonza, I literally lost no fans, no mojo, nothing. Right? I mean, wildly successful for the wizard, it's not only did AJ come out and cause my text

threats to stopping populated with Darren Peterson clips. Everybody could tap right off as soon as AJ showed up. But on top of that, on top of that, both trade, Johnson, and will rightly showed out. Like, that was to me as an important revelation is anything because that's really, those

are the elemental pieces of the trajectory for this upcoming wizard season. It's going to be hilarious 10 years now when people are listening to this just for the 20-20 redraft.

“And they're like, how's this excited for Will Riley?”

Where is he? Is he in China now? It's funny with that top four, wherever you sit on the top four, you kind of got a win Kyle. Like, if you were a booser guy, big win, he did everything that he normally does that

made the finals. He was consistent and really good. Peterson had moments where it was like, oh, this was high school, Kobe version, Peterson. DeBonza. He had some moments where we would, oh, and then he had some, oh, moments, but overall

it was good. Yeah, he had a six for 18. He wasn't perfect. But he definitely, you know, and I thought it was interesting where he talked about

finally I'm on the ball and there was like some veiled, fuck you, both self stuff that,

you know, it seemed like he was a little more unhappy in the colleges and but then the big revelation, which was not a revelation to any of us. I was on the record as saying, I thought Caleb was the most undervalued guy at the draft even at four.

“I think there was a real case to just trade back and he might be the best for anyway,”

which I don't ever normally feel the way with the draft. And he comes in and he hits three's house, I got to say, we're a little older than Kyle. He looked very team-acquish to me. That was the one that jumped out to me, I was like, I love this. This is like watching team-acquigan, like he's a little taller, it's like six ten.

But same kind of skinny inside outside, but then is adding this explosive, Sean campside too. And if I was a bull's fan, I would have no sperm left in my body. It would just be a jacket in every room on my ass, I would lose my mind. You need a giz room for her, what that man did.

I didn't, it's a complete, it's like when we had the colonoscopy, it was when they gave me the stuff to clean your, you're pulling out, it's that's a cable blouse of what's

for cleaning your first sperm.

Oh my god. I couldn't even, it's in, are we, yeah, it's, it's, it's summer season, we're in the summer season, we're in the summer season, we're in the summer, we're in the summer season, we're in the summer season, we're in the summer, we're in the summer season. Yeah, well, here's my question for JKM, because the thing that jumped off the screen and

he validated it through the sustained outstanding performance, I'm so glad you broke, broke the, the, the, the, the, the fuck label right away, because I want to curse this mother fucker, his shooting stroke is so beautiful, it's so beautiful, and this was not something that we saw at least, you know, us Normies, JKM out of his North Carolina performance, right?

If he had that struck, he had to have had that stroke the whole time he was at North Carolina, because he wasn't there for very long, but holy cow, he can shoot and it's absolutely effortless, he has the best struck, he has a better look and stroke to me, the Peterson,

“and I, I mean, I'll go ahead and fight somebody on the house, Peterson, I think to fight”

you house. Peterson, just like this, it's gone 25 feet, but yeah, but that was the thing with me, where that man was shooting from, and did you see where Kale was shooting from? But people were doing in Wilson with the shooting stuff, and I remember saying this to you a couple times during the pre-drive process, like guys at great athletes competitive,

he's going to figure it out. It's not like he's going to have this broken jumper for his whole career. What we didn't expect was he would figure it out in July. I hesitate to go like, overboard and say, like, oh my god, he's just learned, he just learned with there's a before and then actually kind of like, I think he worked on it in that window

between, you know, he broke his hand, he had some time off that, you know, I know he really wanted to play, I would say this. I was more excited about like the defensive stuff that he did where he was just swallowing up people, his drives and things are a little chaotic, he showed me glimpses, I'm cautious, not even cautious.

I'm very optimistic. I would say I hesitate to like really read into the shooting stuff, because he took

to percentage of solid, there's always been workable stuff to make you have confidence.

I don't think anybody was ever, maybe some people out there who were just like, it's never going to happen, but when you would watch him do his little rip through fake stuff in the mid range and get to his like turn around stuff, it always a good, so it was just kind of an opportunity thing here. I think it wouldn't surprise me if we come out a little bumpy, you know, because this

was just such a crazy first, but I mean, I came out of this event, being like, yeah, this dude is absolutely in the taxonomy of the, I wouldn't, I don't know if I go T-Met, because I don't know that he's quite as, like, T-Metandle, T-Metandle was so polished, you know, like, you're two raptors go back and watch T-Metandle, he wasn't anywhere close to anything that he became, let me, because you were there, how soon I weren't, what was like the

it factor with him, just being in the room with him, seeing his effect like how he carried himself on the court, during free throws, during timeouts, people with their eyes on the GM on him, what was, give us the verdict on that? I mean, he wanted the moment clearly, and I think that's true of all the top guys, all the top dudes were, to the point where they were chasing it a little bit, and it got a little

ugly as a result of that, but I don't really regret, they were wanting to put on a show,

“and that's what Summer League's for, you know, Kim Booser didn't really do that, because”

he just doesn't do that, you know, you remember last year, you know, Cooper, even Cooper is competitive in psychotic as he is, he got caught up in the bright lights and tried to put on a show. But Caleb just has a smiley confidence about him, and he's just very sure of the work that he's put in, even if it's chaotic this year in terms of the percentages and the outcome

and stuff like that, it'd be really hard to bet against him not having just a continued upper trajectory. I was going to say he's kind of in that taxonomy of like a KG type body, and maybe and put the Sean Kimping there too. If you just watch him, I clip this out on Twitter.

If you just watch where he starts and where he finishes without much momentum, without bending his knees at all, Wilson can get to ceilings that other people can't get to and he does it faster, like he doesn't really need much of a load up or a runaway to do it. He's just such an impressive athlete, man, like breathtaking. House, Fandel, rookie of the air odds right now, I'm not allowed to bet, who do you think

it's the favorite?

Uh, oozer, that is correct, plus 290, who do you think it's second, uh, Caleb, Peterson

plus 310, okay, and then Caleb and AJ tied at 4 to 1, but I don't remember a rookie

“of the year where we had four choices kind of clustered together as the top four, and I honestly”

don't know what the best bet is. But I would say from even what we saw in Summer League and what we saw the teams doing the summer, the wizards are going to be a little bit more of a complete team. I don't know if AJ is going to have the usage rate, and they seem, I don't know whether Davis is saying all the right things because they're actually going to trade them and he's

playing the game right now or whatever, but all those guys were there, they made a big show of like, hey, we think we're going to be pretty good this year. See if that, um, booster is going to be on a Memphis team that I think he's going to be exactly what we thought, 19 and 10, 20 and 10 somewhere in there, Peterson who knows. And then Caleb is the one to me that I just feel like he's going to have the ball a lot

and they're going to put everything on him in your one. I don't know, and I don't know why they wouldn't, and I think he wants it, and it's not like something. There's a ton of stuff on the bulls anyway where it's like, oh, that guy's going to take stuff for this guy.

Yeah, I just think fouls and bulls fan, I'd be out of my mind.

They've been waiting for this since Derek Rose got hurt basically.

“So, uh, who would you take out of those four, just add a care acid, Kyle?”

For Ricky the year. Yeah. Right now. I think they're going to be high highs of like scoring output from Peterson. It's going to be pretty predictable.

I think it's probably why they have Cam Boos number one. I just think Cam's going to be very productive and very steady and really contribute to winning. I think he's going to make that Grizzlies team make a lot of sense in a more direct, you know, debates is not going to have the opportunity to do this directly and like be the centerpiece

guy. Right on the ringer and B.A. show, I compared it to the way that Tatum came in, granted, not one to one. It's just, you've got some older players ahead and like he's going to come in and be this very talented dude, but not just like overtly given the keys immediately in the way that

in the way that Boos are well. So I understand have a Boos number one and I'd probably pick him for that reason. Yeah, Tatum was over a lot of times just in the corner like a stretch for three and the deep type guy and they would have to kind of nudge him to be more involved and, you know, I remember you were running a column about it during the playoffs like, yeah, like,

let's give this guy the car keys a little bit. Like there's more here. We need we actually need the offense.

And then the other big winner, you know, Brown did what we would have expected.

I still think the question for him was never talent, but durability will see in December

January. Buries was the one that I think surprised some people, not us. We were we were calm for it, but you know, he had the ball more and guess what?

“Like that's how he played his whole career except for last year.”

House, if you're the cookers, are you, grit your teeth at all right now that you didn't take the obvious two guard that was sitting there and you got seduced by this wogler and now you're playing him and Garland together when you just had this very obvious two guard you could have put in. It's hard to say because the clippers are on a project timeline now, right aren't they

officially like they're we in Adam Sumbers, Ramon and our Bumhols project, what project is

it? They are not poised to be successful this season or next season or any season that I can think of in the next five seasons. So the investment in and I mean wogler so young he still has a little bit of the baby deer look to him the way he's coming at Buries is literally the only shining hope for

for an equally horrible buck's team that is also going to be excruciating over the next five. And Tyler Harrow, a shirt, a little chip on the shoulder and a little tiny weld under his eye after that you're talking about that I just want to make the case for Caleb Wilson the win rookie of the year and I'm going to bet it the little bit now and then we'll see

how everything shakes out. I do agree with both of you guys in terms of AJ not getting enough opportunity usage the the whiz or too far along.

“I wonder about Peterson getting enough opportunities I think the jazz will try a lot of shots”

on that team right and that's a pretty polished team like we all are pretty pretty bullish on their playoff prospects I don't think they're just going to turn the ball over to Peterson. Caleb this is the thing with the rookie of the year it is a narrative award like it's counting stats in narrative. So if Caleb shows us a couple a handful of spectacular games he can some 40 point scoring

output you like Boozer is going to be 19 and 10 and Caleb layers on top of that a handful of these games where these blocks come from absolutely out of nowhere and if he averages like two blocks a game or something like that which feels kind of reasonable to me you made the right point the balls have absolutely nothing to showcase other than this dude and Tiago splitter at the helm who will understand the mission I think and just ushered

in a guy that we're about to talk about on this podcast he knows how to take a guy you know a sending and give it turn the whole thing over to that ascending guy then he have the assertly enjoyed Tiago splitter's time. I know at the helm of this bull's team with Caleb and what they want to do in terms of engendering some enthusiasm I'm just just him at that 4 to 1 range feels like a tiny

bit of value to me. You left out the single best case for Caleb Wilson but here he's going to add a all these guys he's going to be the social media guy he's going to have 50 plays during the season. My son will know happen right.

“That's why I meant spectacular but this is a whole different element to who owns the”

rookie the year it's like can my son Ben Simmons the only working Ben Simmons right now can my son Ben Simmons know you did something because he's not going to be watching bull's games on league pass but if you do something that's going to be on TikTok or Instagram he's going to see it and I think Caleb it's not just like he might have a game where he might hit 10 threes he might have the dunk in traffic he might have the spin boot move double

clutch, Sean Camp dunk he might have some crazy pin block on the backboard but it's going to

kill on all that stuff listen my rule as always is never overact to summer league and we're

trying not to but I do think Caleb hitting threes was the one big picture like oh wow like this is holy shit there's nobody in the league like this guy house really quickly wash them wizards 35 plus wins minus one 10 me that makes exactly perfect sense right there are 35 one team I have a mon record I think they're going to come in last in the southeast division and win between 35 and 39 teams and contend for the play in contend for the play and that's

like the 40 40 wins plus 240 no if you keep Davis all year and it plays like 60 games so that's the bet that's the bet right it's played 65 to 68 games I think you're a 40 win team I don't want

be pretty interesting if you can have if you can have debons a star Davis at your 345 that is a

rangey disruptive defensive group I mean you think about all the the other teams in the east I mean Miami obviously with the addition of yannas I'm just trying to rattle through and think of the teams that can compare or compete with that pretty pretty promising pretty pretty good Boston with Paul George um yeah with with Caleb Wilson that is going to be a very fun toy

“to forget I was just saying one thing gitty can do is throw logs and I think that's going to be”

that alone is going to be a social media phenomenon those two together for sure the other one that jumped out was Yaxo which was no surprise because he's almost 24 years old but um I think if you're a worse fan you know you're at least getting somebody who's going to be playing 25 to 20 minutes a game that you didn't have by share and we'll see what happens with LeBron but um you know but there comes back February and March range still not enough but you know can can

step curry at least get to the playoffs and be relatively interesting Yaxo is going to help but they I still think they need. Did you uh did you like the Yaxo Booser rivalry? I feel like this is a budding thing that people aren't talking about. Yeah there are personalities are just so polar opposite you know Yaxo just can't not say whatever he's thinking and Booser is just quietly intensely staring you can tell they don't I don't I don't know for sure I just I don't suspect

they like each other competitively I'm just keeping an eye on that one and they matched up twice

“in the in the summer league. Well the only thing the only real big picture thing left is wherever”

LeBron goes um and it's just you know I went on game over yesterday with Richard Max because I was in the office and it was there and I'm going on for 45 minutes but um the really red flag thing about this LeBron thing which I don't really feel like is going to swing the title odds in any direction at least for me but it is notable that James Harden hasn't signed and Dream on hasn't signed so you have two teams that are definitely going you know Golden State doing nothing is

also doesn't mean nothing it means they must feel like they're in this so we'll see what happens with that I still I still hope it's gold state but um I still have a feeling it's going to be Cleveland all along I do have a house before we do the reject I had I had a great email for you

this is from Perry who who did a he page conspiracy bill who's always available

do you remember for that no but he's he's he's just every time there's an email conspiracy bill conspiracy bill josses he mentioned uh press the okay c roster crunch they have to get rid of they got rid of as a jewelry they got rid of barren wagons right and then uh we knew they were going to probably get real loot dork which they did they got three second runners for him Perry says I 100% believe same-pressly sought out not one but two

Hawks deals to beef them up this season and knock their first round pick owned by San Antonio down a few spots very good pretty good conspiracy bill like he stamped that one immediately I like that absolutely I mean because it felt like he got a lot for loot dork right he's got a couple seconds I'm sure there were a few themes that would offer that but I wonder so you think press the is that devious sure anything they understand who their their nemesis is of course that doesn't even sound like

conspiracy to me that's not strategy I agree that's right take him is right I want to go on record on the brun I think he's going to Philadelphia just want to say good it out there oh wow I would bet anything against it okay what do you want to bet this bet something but it will be a dinner that has food yeah and then there's another conspiracy bill email Stuart from Perth Australia said this conspiracy bill thing do mars was sent to the pelicans by the NBA where he worked

to make the pelicans so bad that they would have to relocate to Seattle I was watching the movie major league and couldn't help but think they took no it's watching on how to get a team relocated what team goes 26 and 56 and literally does nothing in the off season it's very solid point it went 26 to 56 and did nothing other than they send a journey to

your country Jordan to an amazing contract yeah that's not true there yeah it's a bad on development

“that's what that is that is literally now that it's then going to Seattle makes no sense whatsoever”

because Seattle is going to get one of the expansion teams but what markets are ripe for an NBA team Seattle and Vegas obviously lead but where where should the pelicans go they should go somewhere honestly Kansas cities I think a bigger factor than people trusting they just hosted

Kyle's neck of the woods is another one I think Nashville even though it's too close to Memphis

is possible I wouldn't rely on St. Louis I think there's a lot of cities like we never

would have said Oklahoma City in the mid 2000s you know if you have if you have hungry local rich people and you have some sort of arena you can make a play for a basketball team a conspiracy bokeh another one hmm Mike and New Orleans wanted to know if the blazer's owner did conspiracy build think the league wants to get back in Seattle gave this guy the team he was going to force his way out and barge them to Seattle I actually don't believe that one because I don't think the

Seattle fans want Portland's team I think they would rather have their own expansion team and start over and they know what it's like to have your team rip from you and I don't think they want

“Portland's team and I also don't think that's why he's doing this I just think he's super cheap and”

this is what he did with the hurricanes he he has a specific method of he cut costs all over the place

and you know he's he's basically like you guys should help me buy an arena or I might move

so how much do you want the blazer's here I don't agree with what he's doing it's absolutely the most cut throw thing you can do but I don't think there's some master plan I just think the guy's cut throw across the board and that's why he's handling it well speaking of cut throw we're going to take a break we're going to do our first redraft on the BS podcast I think since the 2018 we did twenty twenty two range so twenty twenty three we did a three years ago

one since then now we did we did one an honor chart so we're going to bring up in this one we're about to do but when we come back the twenty twenty and be a redraft next all right so as you know I remember nothing from twenty twenty or twenty twenty one I have no memory at all apparently I did fourteen and be a redraft podcast you guys were on a bunch of them we did fourteen on my podcast

that on the book of basketball podcast for a lot of them aren't it was super fun and never did them

again and they're in the summer because there's absolutely nothing going out for this couple you're going to do a couple redrafts and I texted you guys when we talked about possibilities and the one we landed on is the single weirdest draft in the history of the league other than maybe 1986 what's weird or nineteen eighty six or twenty twenty house twenty twenty is super weird nineteen eighty six had like not only the tragedy of the land bias but half the guys in that

draft became drug guys or you know it was like the most jinxed weird draft ever but we didn't know that it was this happening twenty twenty we knew right away so twenty twenty covid draft takes place at november eighteen two thousand twenty let's start there I forgot about that yeah that was you yeah that's right six weeks after the NBA finals in the bubble which was even we're there the season started five weeks later they had no march madness to study because

there was no march madness they had no draft combined because they couldn't have draft combined they had for the most part zoom interviews they had prospects only going one on zero workout basically with mass on a lot of times these guys they went from getting ready for march madness to there's no more college basketball too I'm just going to work out by myself and a gym for four to five months basically they kind of ramp up the process near the end and they're basically

“house they're just fucking grasping at straws it's the only draft where we can honestly say NBA”

teams were just like us they're just watching YouTube and just kind of piecing things together and guessing you can't overstate how weird it was I'm glad you know you it's not fair to compare this to 1986 the whole world was upended and every single element of you know an evaluation of talent for a professional sports league it's kind of ass-enine in a way except it's the business it's the industry it's no other way to do it they did it they did it and I'm thrilled that they did it I actually

kind of loved the way that that season played out because we had so much basketball in our in our lives there was no dead moment you know there was no let's say I'll take a breather it went from wow it was really fun to have the bubble that was gave us something to look at and compare notes on and talk about yeah right into this super weird draft uh and then right into a season that began was like Christmas is right after Christmas yeah I think there was a real physical

toll on some of the players that lasted long in the playoffs and then had to start this season that was the only downside for the fans it was great because we'd have to go and on it's like

“oh thank you I think that things to watch again but I remember the burnout among people covering it”

I remember when they came back you know and granted the physical toll's a whole different thing

it extending it to summer league and free abesie I just remember the fried look and people's eyes from from the toll that because we were trying to stay busy during that gap where the season ended I remember we were doing all kinds of stuff like the redrafts and I did a bunch of historical stuff grain of we remember the the wind in our sales of with the last dance and all

“that stuff man I think one of the things with the last dance that people forget is how bad we needed”

that shit man I mean like you just so desperate for anything and that alone kept us busy that big Jordan sort of sweeping wind that came in for a while there yeah we're so and I were doing live podcast after the two episodes of the last dance like they were sporting events because we had literally nothing else going so the actual draft when you look back at who the best players and we're gonna do the redrafts and people can hear it in real time but I think it's the most off

peep teams of band for who actually turned out to be the good players versus where they were drafted like for instance so in the actual draft Edwards was one Lamella was three Tyre's maxi was 21 Desmond Bain was 30 right so Wiseman went to and Wiseman is the guy

I think to think about when you think about this draft because they're basically going off three

Memphis games and nothing else and now you're going back to high school tape and now you're just looking at raw tools and it's one of those things where if we had had March Madness I just think so much of this is different like what if Halbert and goes on a run you know in the tournament and makes like the final four the final eight what if Wiseman gets knocked out in the first run um what if Lamella's terrible oh no Lamella was a New Zealand

yes so that Lamella's even out on that um yeah what if what if Edwards like gets knocked out in the front like I do think March Madness swings this stuff one way or the other but in this case it

“didn't and but Wiseman is the one Kyle that I think we had the toughest time trying to figure out”

I went back in our old friend sharks who did all the draft grades after and the words take

Wiseman second and sharks rights this is simultaneously the safest pick and biggest gamble

at the top of the draft quality big matter easy to find in the modern MBA Wiseman has to be elite to be worth going this high so where did you stand when they took Wiseman? Did you feel like he had a chance to be elite? Um I remember having a similar sort of trepidation that Charks did great because we were talking about the draft constantly around that time I had watched Wiseman a whole lot in high school coming up to that weird Memphis season um

the other thing too is just the fact that it was the Warriors making that pick that was the thing that made me the most suspicious because the things that are the most worried because the things that Wiseman needed to work on um this the Warriors kind of conversation about them extending this window like house I was watching your face as Bill was talking about the Warriors potentially being in the playoffs and he had a like no fucking way look on his face

“uh but I mean at that point we were like hey I think there's still some more soap in that”

rag and there was like they went and won a title despite this not working out but the things that he needed to work on subsequently commingah the following year uh I think it was 21 I was looking at those dudes and just thinking man offensively raw absolutely not ready for the speed of the way the Warriors want to play that worried me and then you can buy it it was a lot of fog if you you're projecting the tape the college development that we didn't really get to see

even at the time it was risky I think I thought that it was I thought that he could become a good player I did not expect him to fall off a cliff the way that he did and you know not even in the league now so house my biggest win from this draft was absolutely loved Haliburton and thought he should have gone way higher than he did and went nuts about that the whole draft so that was a huge W for me my biggest loss was I liked the last pick for the Warriors

how's that great pick like passing center unbelievable specimen the guy a year ago

would have been hands down the number one pick in the draft and this is amazing that they got a

franchise center um and it just didn't work out for a variety of reasons but I think the biggest one is I don't I just don't think that enough tape and you start drafting the premise of a player versus what the actual player is you know would you think of it when that happened at that point the Warriors had engendered so much you know confidence and trust in a kind of approach to both you know player development player acquisition that I didn't know anything

about Wiseman but gave them the benefit of the doubt but there is a throughline all the way up to right now this very moment and my wild skepticism about the Warriors making the playoffs this

been experiencing lost seasons missed playoffs after they won the title they did eat out one more title so God bless them in 2022 with with what they were able to put together change wild and be a champion I feel I feel like we you know we're missing out on something because of the total on Steph and you know the way that Steph's career is is going to end if that pick had been

somebody solid somebody credible what would that have meant for the Warriors franchise and ultimately

for Steph was really the only guy I care about build you see the thing that I wrote in that draft guy did this specific thing that I said about Halberton was like the league should be doing everything they can to not let this kid end up with gold state that's basically said that because that was he would have been perfect for their style of play he was who I wanted them to take

“but they could not trade back and they weren't going to take them into but I think they knew”

at anybody in this top 12 that's the guy that if he's on our team would fit perfectly with us and could play on the ball off the ball but I don't nobody wanted to you know they tried to trade back nobody was trying to trade up because nobody could figure out the top seven or three in this draft especially like the patch of claims area to Coro nobody could unlock lamello at all the Warriors thought about lamello at two and I've talked about this foreign

the pod but they had a zoom interview with him that was so bad like they felt like he you know was tanking the interview not to go there and he probably might have that might have been what happened I don't think he wanted to play for them so they were kind of stuck they weren't going to take patch of claims or a Coro they were going to take a conglue they were going to take killing haze so if you can't trade back I don't know what you do so they took the swing

with wise men and they're still paying for it can you like think about what an abandonment of philosophy I've said this so many times but you get stuff under these circumstances where this guy is misvaluated in terms of where the league is going level to level and they get so lucky that the con takes you know Johnny Flynn and Ricky Rubio ahead and just with it's backward facing thinking and then you get this opportunity to take this guy Tyrese Halbert and you say to yourself

well two's too high I just feel like anytime you have that type of conversation with yourself about a play where you're like well that's too high to take that guy if you like that person just take him like figure out a way to get him even if it's like go back a couple spots like it just it's such like a shocking remarkable abandonment of philosophy that they would strike gold with Steph and then fail to see what happened there and then not take Tyrese Halbert well there was so

clearly the guy like gonna be one thing no there's one thing that teams didn't like about him I

“remember specifically one team in the top 10 telling me this teams were worried he wouldn't be able”

to get his release off on his shot in the pros and they're like in the college fine in the pros at that hitch it just takes too long known for all it's not gonna happen and you know I remember saying this at the time it goes in like what the fuck do you guys want like the shot goes in it's not like this is a long baseball swing that you get to the majors and you're not going to be

able to catch up at 98 like his shot was weird but it always went in and the advanced stats were

unbelievable for him you know I remember her album I've talked about this he was like doing everything possible to try to get Dallas to try to trade up especially you know the biggest legacy of this draft is Halbert and Falls and keeps falling and then ends up going to ironically Sacramento a team that could never do anything right in the draft so he goes 12 so to recap the top 15 for people Edwards goes to Minnesota wiseman golden state number two lamella ball to Charlotte then we have

the Patrick Williams Isaac Accorio shit sham sandwich combo four five Chicago Cleveland who then I'm getting traded for each other a couple years later and both teams still unhappy after that a cognitive six killing haze at seven shout out to our friend K.O.C. but this was for kids who said so many wins he still carries the killing haze like a scar on letter this was his worst one but he's also had a lot of good ones Oby top and eight to the next and that really should have been

a Halbert and team like first of all Detroit taking killing haze over Tyre's Halbert and his

firebow and everyone did get fire Oby top and versus Halbert and when the next they didn't have

“brunch and yet like oh man they needed playmaking if I remember correctly at that point they”

did not perfect for them he did though to in fairness top and felt like the sureest thing at the moment what did you write about top in J.K.M. I wasn't right in the guide at that point but he

he was he was just this elite athlete that we thought could turn into a big time defender and

“I mean there's more stuff to unpack in relation to Halbert and specifically I think that's”

interesting as we like re-rank these guys but no Kevin Charks were doing the writing at that point on the guys I think Charks said oh then I'm calling it up Charks had a great draft guy he basically all the AZ handed out were the right AZ except for um except for uh killing haze that was the bad one yeah I remember he said something about top and like he's the oldest and most ready for a player but can't guard anybody like he's athletic there's clearly a way for him to

succeed in the NBA but just remember he will not be able to guard anybody in the court and that's out bore out so top and went to uh the next at number nine your wizards house Denny Obdia from a elementary respect great one one of the best of the decade it's too bad to get him away four years later they he was as it was a franchise in in transition man and then right at number

ten the worst and most egregious mistake in this draft and incredible what if a fireable offense

Phoenix takes Jalen Smith instead of taking Tyreys Halbert and when they already had Chris Paul and they had Devon Booker and they go on to make the finals anyway in 2021 and Halbert and could have been the third guard in that team and I'm guessing he swings the finals if he's on the I feel like that's worth one of those six games if you just go from Jalen Smith to get nothing for to Tyreys Halbert and as a rookie coming off the bench and being able to it was terrible

and it happened I can't believe they did it so take him ten and then Devon the sow is 11 which I was okay with just because I felt like he dropped two I would take in Halbert and there too and then finally Sacramento 12 and then after that the draft gets weird cure eluus to New Orleans Aaron Neesmith to Boston and 14 Cole Anthony at 15 to Orlando Stewart at 16 to Portland and then we can end

on number 17 Poku who became an incredible source of comedy all the way around but there's

more stuff coming what's through the redraft which one of you guys wants the number one pick JKM can have it all right so we'll go we'll go snake fashion JKM goes one house goes to I'll take three and four and then we'll snake it back and we'll see who can come up with the best team so who is your number one pick in the 2020 redraft comment this uh this was an interesting back and forth because I'd put these guys into yours there

two guys in my top tier um it's Anthony Edwards is ultimately who I'm going to pick

“although I will say this is very very close for me and the only thing that tipped it”

and it's way is the fact that I'm not sure that Halbert is going to be I don't know what he's going to be after this injury um as I was sitting down and kind of looking at their paths as players like developmentally they're really interesting sides of an offensive coin where Halbert and came into the league as this like super super advanced passer processor who we were like if he can score the ball we just weren't sure about it we were like well you know we know he has all these gifts

but if he's going to be a super star and I don't really keep an answer that question until like a few years into his MBA career there was still doubt about it it was you know once he got to the pastries it was like okay this guy is a system in and of himself and I don't think you can say that necessarily about aunt you know I don't know that aunt's impact on a team like chemistry wise and the way he plays I don't think he elevates an adds value to other places the same way that

“Halbert and does that said aunt is one of the best you know he's I think in this class he's the”

leader in May threes he's when he wants to he can be an on-ball terror he's one of the most athletic creative scores in the league he's ultra competitive it's very very close but just tilting towards

aunt health wise is is what I'll ultimately do here even though it's a pretty tough choice but

those two guys to me are in the top tier I had that as well aunt two conference finals 26 a game in the playoffs two second team on bays on the 24 Olympic team house not 25 years old left yet has scored over 10,000 points 10,854 that's a list of seven guys who scored 10,000 points before they turn 25 the other guys that list are LeBron James Luca T. Mack Kevin Durant Kobe and Carmella nice list pretty good list yes so he's he's on his way he's averaging 25 four and five

than advertised all the physical tools necessary to become an all-star caliber wing and I actually think he's probably had notch above that he's been twice now he's been a franchise

“guy in a final four team which I think is notable so did you have him first oh what kind of question”

is that yeah so you can tell he's facing the league shit I mean it's not falling no I understand the inevitable I mean let's set some parameters here because this will factor into I have my selection for for for for two overall but are we basing this on at the time what the team needed the trajectory to player or we basing this on kind of now we have a lot of information about these players and we know what these players know I'll tell you I've

been front of them we're in a time machine we're going back to November 18 2020 but we know everything that's happened the last six years so what do you do it's still Edward it's not even close to me to me and the reason for that is because he is on another level to me in terms of the the force of will I mean Haliburton was a revelation in last year's playoffs absolutely positively he finally got to the stage he finally ascended to where he could show what he brought to the table all of

those intangibles all of those shots at the end of of game but Edward the he accelerated Minnesota because of who he he was when he arrived with that dog and him with the incredible charisma of leader at his young age taking the team now I mean there's a lot of leadership qualities in Haliburton as well but if you're trying to build you want to cornerstone for franchise

“Edward's to me lot easier call than than Haliburton that's how I think about it if Haliburton”

doesn't get hurt in game seven in Indiana beats okay see can you just play his last season and he's fine see the number one pick in this it's an awesome conversation it is an incredible

conversation I think he had to be at that point but we'll never know it's a great way to follow

you're going to take him second I'm guessing I am but I would just want to make a case for Maxi which I'll take Maxi third I'm going to get talk about it Haliburton Haliburton at number two best guy in a final steam already 38 playoff games in 24 and 25 18 5 and 8 some incredible clutch or a Rolex and then one of the saddest moments in the history of the league when you get hurt in game seven we talked about all the what ifs with him in the draft goal instead of two

Detroit seven next eight Phoenix 10 there's another what if we're fully could have traded Ben Simmons for him instead of how it turned out where Haliburton goes with the Sacramento Indiana straight up fully could have been in on that and ended up with you know subbonus going into Indiana or whatever turned out or they could have just done the straight up and send Ben Simmons to Sacramento and you could have had Maxi who's going to be the third guy in this draft with with Haliburton um

Billy also could have had Shay and Mikhail Bridges if I'm not mistaken they've got some pretty tough yeah they have a lot of this I mean that would take a data they literally drafted Mikhail Bridges they did draft him they did she put him a head on sharks wrote that he's the perfect this is Haliburton

he's the perfect analytical selection in Uber efficient score who never takes bad shots

it turns the ball over and it also racks up defensive stats let me just can I make another case for or go ahead to I cut off the chairboard my bad my bad if you if you look at the way when I was going back and looking at these guys and how we think about them now and you look at knee smith granted I don't know if it's necessarily as true about knee smith as it is about obie top and Haliburton affects other players value in a way that is similar to like a Steve Nash

“or it's it's it's it's a it's a quality that very few guys have and I think he he any situation”

that he comes into I don't think he's as hard to build around because his point fiveness just shot it shines a light he shares the light and it doesn't have to be shining brightly on him all the time so even though and scores more you know I think that they're offensive in point is the same because I think that Haliburton makes everybody better because he's able to make reads and play this like point five style where you get off the ball fast and he produces as much offensive as

it does I think in the end I think the stats back that up so I I think it's a lot closer than you

guys do really I have maxi a three he went 21st in this draft which is incredible last three years

27 points again six assists 45 36 88 percentages so in this draft Minnesota passed on 17

okay see had the 17th pick and took Poku over him they could have had Maxi with SGD

Brooklyn at 19 could have taken them and put him with Kyrie Irving and Kevin Durant that would have been weird and then the crazy one to me house Miami had 20 coming off the 20/20 finals and I think I can't remember if they lost rocket troops heard of whatever but they just could have taken him and added them to that 20/20 final team it did not do that and he ended up being the 21st pick charts loved it called a Macomboguard it could play out enough the ball great combination of

team fit best player available and he said the only reason he's done a lottery pick is that he's six foot three and won't be a primary ballhand or in the NBA well turned out he's a primary ballhand the NBA he fixed that one so why did you almost take him second house because he feels to me like

“he's just scratching the surface of who he can be that's why because I feel like you know these”

guys when we're trying to you know parse the top of this are there still levels to what they're they're capable of and Maxi to me is the easiest to say yes there's still a whole other he just played the most minutes of his entire career was an absolute warrior through it's through all of that yeah single handedly drug a team that that by had no business whatsoever winning 45 games

but they they you know the combination of the incredible good luck the sixiers had

those dogs with VJ Edge calm and they say jay them brown well that's that wasn't good luck that that's your GM's the Steven that's that's his player town evaluation but I would say what what Maxi showed us that there is a whole another element to his game and I I mean I think this is part of why I just love this upcoming Philadelphia season him with with jay like the innings that he and jay them brown and VJ Edge come are going to be able to eat together creates so much room

for joel and beat to be whoever he's going to be in whatever capacity he needs to be and it's

“also why I think it makes the most sense for the brown the brown could land there play 45 50 games however”

many nights if Friday nights or Saturday nights are on prime and NBC Sunday night NBC oh it's a little brown game it's really I understand but I'm just making the case out of all the situations it's the one that made the same case I made the same case house I think the basketball if it's fun and filly with the brown he he got all these guys buzzing around him that he can feed with VJ and with Maxi and those guys tilt towards scoring in with jay and I think it kind of makes a lot of

sense to me but you think it won't happen though if he's gone basketball fit you go to Minnesota I think that's a team where he could actually like they could actually with the title if he went there he's not going there he's not playing with a mellow ball I know he doesn't do clowns he'd be choking him like home we're choking bar half the season just like little mellow's neck there's there's two reasons I think it would be fun if he went to Miami one is that I think that's a terrible fit

of all those guys together and two they're annoying fans they're even more annoying media will be going nuts that they think they're going to win the title and it's going to be really fun to watch that crash and burn so we don't know where media little shots this is my favorite what

“they know it that's only that's the only way they get attention I have the number four pick”

as well Denny Obdia will be my pick at number four he went ninth overall he's an all star

last year 24 seven and seven used to be on the wizard's house is credit he always said Denny

Obdia was good he was always a fan never understood why he didn't have the ball more and why they didn't use him kind of unleashing and then when he went to Portland was like I bet he's going to be really good there so house take a bow thank you I appreciate that you always like Denny let Denny take the bow I mean he he's become the version the best version of himself it'll be super interesting this upcoming season for them especially with this this crazy ass owner like you know will he get

that same usage it was really important we saw in those playoff games for him to be the umball though the creative playmaker how does that coexist with genre that that's uh I thought they should have traded for Jalen I don't know why they didn't but if the choices were what they did versus like maybe moving some of the resources differently and getting Jalen and trying I just think Jalen and Denny would have been kind of a bitch to play against wow these two physical downhill

forwards that night after night I think would have been an attack so I had there were two other guys I thought about there but I thought with the way Denny with the aeropointing up with him and he

have I'll take the mellow here I think that's that's that's fair I mean I gotta say he was not next

time my board but go ahead me well did the offensive engine proposition and we get to see it we're going to now is it true I I saw news reports is lo mellow ball living with Anthony Edwards right now is that accurate oh that's like I best thing I've ever heard this is there's some news out there but even if it's not true put it up there as the mellow gets himself you know sort of oriented around his new thing those guys are spending some time together if that's true and there's not a camera involved

“then then you know what are we even doing I think there's a driver involved well that it could be”

Anthony Edwards or his own driver how's the mellow ball played 52 plus games twice at a six years zero playoff wins yes six years through injured three games ninety three ninety two minutes sure by the way we need we should have mentioned this earlier way more fun of gold state just says

fuck it and take some second right like we know you want to be here but that's fine we'll figure it out

we're going to put you in we're going to basically make you what Jordan pool became as this kind of heat check guy up to bench instant offense let's see if we can fit you into our system and it just would have been a fun experiment I don't even know if it would have worked who knows well they had to have had an an opinion you know they they they clearly consulted you know the the vets in the room do we think that we can take a spin with a with a teenager and it's not just a

“teenager but like do you really think they can solve for anyone I don't think they did no I don't”

I to me the lo mellow thing was more he played in New Zealand his family was weird the family they weren't still very in flight it's easy to forget that was still a big and one player or real player like there were some real stuff six years we need this circus yes in this could be a professional yeah which by the way we're still not 100% positive but um so house here you're in on the baller here would you take them higher would you take them for no no no no no no he's not I mean

then he obvious uh for where where he seems to be headed I would I would like to invest in him more than lamella sharks had some interesting thoughts on him six seven point guard with an elite passing ability who will be a triple double threat from day one the question is whether he will ever be a threat to make threes instead of just take them they'll like our ball will likely be an inefficient

offense a pair for the first few years of his career but he will make everyone around him better

all true I mean last year when he played which was only 28 minutes again but he did you know all the offensive stats the i test like I thought he had a really good season for him for them last year but they were very careful about how they used him and Minnesota is not going to be able to be as careful you know that's gonna be a year the 28 minutes a game is out you're up to 35 now and we need 70 and we are gonna need two three or four rounds from you in the playoffs I have no idea if you can do it

I wouldn't have Charlotte in the playing game just saw something they just opened the the patient and saw cancer in terms of their their their chances to be like a because the rim pressure is the thing because I had written you know a dot dove on a lot of these guys and I was a rope down

“that lamello you know sharks mentioned the shooting and I think he he's proven himself over time where”

let's see nine players this past year attempted 300 or more breeze off the dribble and only Jamal Murray had a higher percentage than lamello and that's all that so the wildness was good but just getting to the rim I rewatch some of the Orlando game and it's just like you can't have that guy as like your your primary option and maybe Charlotte thinks that they're not going to lose a ton with her passing and stuff with Miller and Con but he was 46.4% from two and inside the arc he was

like 50 like the restricted area he was like 51% it's really bad so you're not getting free throws he just can't be your primary option so I kind of wonder if he's closer to Jamal Murray honestly in terms of like what we should expect from him like star status wise. Listen there's so many fascinating things about this season that is now one two three months away. The mellow playing on Minnesota with real expectations is in that I mean that you have J. Limbrown and Philly

you're going to have wherever the Brown ends up you're going to have like the new era Luca and Lakers and Kessler and the and the snowtime Lakers the Celtics of pot there's this league I don't know over and over again and they just even mentioned the snow globe the rookies I mean it's a plan of mochi time bro I mean right now mid to lie I'm ready yeah can't wait you know what I'm really ready for them football. I can't wait but it's a bet sound. Kyle Mell has has two picks in a row

big physical wing who gets downhill and you just basically reset with the like Devon says just sort of

the spiritual reset of what you all would have had so you're kind of you turn up pretty well for you I'm sure you're aware of that. Yeah you can't you can't so you can basically get then you have the again. Well that that's the basketball gods shining they're they're good light down on this franchise for that sound decision making because the franchise wasn't ready for this version of Denny it wouldn't have not have made any sense he would not have risen to these heights he was

being held back by the you know the direction that the franchise was was going and I'd give the from office credit for recognizing he was on a different timeline than the franchise was on they they need to be building up with these guys that are all between the age of 19 and 21 we have

“six or seven of them now and they're all in the same contract that's why you know we'll”

we'll make fun of Tray Young's contract for the balance of the season but Tray Young's contract did he Davis the Davis extension that Washington will probably pay for it doesn't really matter because they have everybody else is on a rookie contract they have to reach a certain floor

salary floor has required by the CBA the funniest moment of this season is going to be the third

fourth fifth or sixth game this season Tray Young's going to have like 39 points and hit a big three and do this with the wizards jersey houses going to be like we're back baby I already have his jersey I mean you know yeah we're going to be studying the still frames and in the background yeah AJ's just going to have his hands on his shoulders looking off into the distance I'm going to be I'm going to be magnifying oh and that the blazer should bring marine off the bench I just wanted to throw

that in my next to um I've jade McDaniels he was fifth on my board um Jamie Daniels and

“fifths I might as well comment very fair um this is we get into my second tier I would”

say was playoff level primaries that was Maxine Nadia now we're into elite specialists yeah McDaniels um he became a much better catch and shoot player from three this past year he's one of the most dynamic uh he's he's really really good off the ball chasing defensively like navigating screens and things like that very slinky and spindly and explosive but he's also very good on the ball his matchup difficulty consistently through the roof um and he's also just

one of the meanest fuckers in basketball if you just watch his face I'm I sometimes just want to pat him on the back me like Jane dude it's cool man you're all right like he's he's just such a maniacal competitor I I love the dude that he's one of he's one of my favorite players in the league we should be able to vote on that when we do awards at the end of the year there should be a meanest fucker first team he revealed that in jokers on the rear jokers got a dark side it's like

are you okay yeah McDaniels definitely is is a mean motherfucker that's first series pulled it out of him in a way like it was personal for him uh against Denver as well the thing that I wonder and I will wonder this entire upcoming season is why Minnesota didn't just run it back and I do get the idea of moving on to some random season yeah like getting rid of Randall is kind of fine you can kind of run it back without Randall although speaking of inning eaters he has been

pretty durable he has played and given them you know minutes over the court but it's a very weird decision for them to to go in the direction that that they've gone especially in the face of of a

Wemby West that that's the I hate it I still hate it I'm always gonna hate it I thought they

overreacted to some injuries and some bad luck and underreacted to the fact that they had been too conference finals in a row and had a pretty young team for the most part um McDaniels a couple things with him he charts wrote this the biggest surprise that might be that the thunder traded McDaniels instead of keeping them for himself for themselves he could have been on okay say he's like the quintessential press the guy the lakers ended up with the 28th pick and traded it with Danny Green

for Dennis Schroeder and then okay see flip the pick after that so the lakers also could end now it took a couple years to get going and then the other piece and I certainly made fun with the time when Minnesota gave up all that stuff for Rúdigo Bear and then put out they were they were adamant about keeping Jade McDaniels it's like oh cool congrats you just gave up a hundred first round picks turn that to be the right move I'll tell you who do you have for the other pick

“comment uh I was gonna note an inefficiency I think that was going on along among like Washington”

which is where he played wings they played zone a lot weirdly for those two years and they happen have to the best like perimeter defensive prospects and Batistaible and Jade McDaniels so I think that was maybe a reason why he fell who knows I really liked them in the draft my next guy is Devon Vessel actually yeah I'm going two way guys who can shoot the shit out of the ball

down as this team has gotten better but I actually think it's the sweet spot for him where that

stuff was all invaluable for him but I'd like him a lot I mean he's a he's a shot maker

“I'm gonna be central to what they're doing going forward on a championship level team I think”

we've seen that now shark said he was the best three in the prospect in this year's draft and as more shark's leading him more shark's crazy talent than he showed in college I was really surprised the next didn't take them I thought they were gonna end up with them all right so we have so far we have Edwards Halliburton maxi of the lamello jaden McDaniels and Devon Vessel as our top seven and Devon Bane he's like I have to have another chip on my shoulder I went

30 in this draft you guys are gonna do you're gonna disrespect me again are you taking him here house I am not you're not so disrespectful can you take it I'm taking the Congo I really feel like that guy's got you know there's a ceiling yet to be explored I had him lower on my board just for that I get it I get it yeah so I mean I'm taking him at eight the problem I have with Bane is just watched a lot of him in a playoff series and on a on a team where

just felt like that impact should have been more you know the one of the events going on with Orlando yeah yes he he it should have been a wonderful fit there is a reason that the forecast for Orlando was upper tier of the eastern conference and 50 plus wins and I didn't see it every night from him I went to watch Washington play Orlando and he played significant minutes in that game was it are you forgot he was out there performance the wizard beat Orlando the night that I went

in fact it was right on the precipice of the wizard's traging trading CJ McCollum because it was the wizard's fifth win in seven games I need to get a minute hold up so last five years he was 21 five and five thirty nine percent from three and that was his calling card in the draft was he's gonna be a good three-point shooter he turned out to be a way better player I mean you think about it the grizzly's taken thirty they get five years out of them and some playoff series then they flip

them for four first round picks so that's like you're like I don't know a stockbroker a hedge fund person you're buying low on something and then selling high that's like the ultimate valley you

“ever could have gotten for somebody but I think he's a little better than house I can't I can't say”

he's been on the perfect team the last couple years like we've still never really seen him with

the normal type of point card I speak in of well I'm gonna take him here at at ten and then I or no is it ten yeah nine nine at nine and then I'm gonna take Peyton preacher to ten twenty six next twenty six pick in the draft a little bit controversial it was like a danyan cheat check pick that the Celtics had 14 and 26 and this draft coming off a twenty twenty making the conference I think they made the conference

finals and it felt like this was going to be a really important draft for their depth Richard took him a couple years I always liked him more than it seemed like the coaches liked

him and it was always unclear why he wasn't getting the car keys a little bit more and I think

the team liked him because they gave him a contract even before he had kind of become who he became and then he just became you know one of the best bench guards in the league last year moved into a whole different level or he was seventeen a game and he's really one of the best get into the lane guard scores we have in the league which is just weird he's a little hit or miss there's a question whether there's like another there's there's a second leap for him

I'll allow Jalen Branson leaving Dallas I don't think so but there's really good stats of them Jarks was a big fan Jarks said should instantly be an excellent backup point guard has the confidence in skill to knock down shots and big playoff games so nice job by him but anyway so I have been and preacher to now it's starting to get a little dicey house yeah and I recognize my role in this podcast today as a little bit of an outlier with with some of my

processes there's no wrong picks and a redraft I'm valuing stand strong house yeah size here

“well maybe I really make I loved O'Connor where I took him because I think that his flexibility”

what he adds to a team in terms of front court depth and he shot you know he averaged two three's a game and he shot thirty eight percent from three so that that's floor spacing especially

we don't take a beef stew at the same time you know me better than anybody you're

fucking a right I'm taking beef I had him either hammer one other guy that I'm sure Kyle's gonna take but beef two and 16th in this draft was an excellent bench big guy and then really from the fight last year on just got weird with him in Detroit there's an athletic article talking about you got into it with the coach during the playoff series and he only put 11 minutes

“a game I think in their playoff series so something funky happened and then they basically”

dumped him even gave him away they'd probably be like a shorter article like right like who he hasn't gotten into it with right it'd be better because he's gotten into it with everybody from from what I understand I mean honestly San Antonio should guy it's exactly his San Tony maybe they needed a fuck you guy in their team and he's a fuck you and a half guy so Memphis is gonna have him he's gonna fit in perfectly with them and uh that can work that better

I didn't mind the pickhouse who do you have next cop? I have air knee smith next yeah I did good good player good player play draft up by Boston is that right he just couldn't

many dudes right yeah I had a couple jokes about tweets and podcasts I always liked them

and I felt like they completely marginalized them it's a good example of like bad team wrong fit where you go to the games and he would just kind of run up and down and stand in the corner and do nothing they didn't trust them to do anything he never knew who he was gonna play or not as minutes ago didn't yank their out he just had no confidence and he goes to Indiana becomes this awesome 3d guy and you know people think the haliburton game was the haliburton game but it was

really the knee smith game you know haliburton made the famous shot in the game but it was knee smith making like 4 he checked 3s and proved himself as somebody who could play in a finals at a high level guard the best players in the other team and that's the key yeah he's a real thing he does really deserve to be here well this next pick will be interesting we had started to drop off Kyle who do you have let's see this is my these are my starters my playoff starters and my next

one is and I'm a little waffily on this but Emmanuel quickly was my next pick ahead him as well the 55th yeah funny because you know quickly when he was traded from the nicks was still like a send it and you know everybody was like okay well this guy's on a rocket just going upwards and then has a couple seasons in a row where he misses a lot of time and then he comes back and play it just has a really quiet season this past year so I don't know if the star bet is still there

with him I don't know if the star confidence is still there as much as it was with him they gave him a gigantic crazy contract but he's a starter player he's a good shooter I don't know that I'm going to run my offense through him like maybe people hope that they would but probably already said

“too much about a major quickly honestly well that no there's one of the things he got a stupid”

contract so he's in the worst contracts draft every year and then you start to hang that around your your collar they have this dumb contract but he's still a playoff guy who can come up the bench and you know he just should make 30 million here they missed him I mean he couldn't play in that playoff series this year that's the lingering taste which makes him you know at least for me when I was looking through it's like can I but when you look at his resume for the most

part he's played a lot of basketball he missed like you know he scores two thirds of whatever that season was two years ago but otherwise you know he's between 65 and and low 70s in terms of number of games played yeah I he's a a net positive I had dinner with Doc last night and he was

talking about how he always liked to have one guy one guard come off the bench like the Eddie

House Lou Williams type that was just like no shot is a bad shot I'm just I'm just firing it up and he was like I was love those guys I would never tell them it was a bad shot I would just

“kind of take them out if they didn't have it but I would always tell them go go go go I think quickly”

if Toronto is good quickly could be one of those guys right he comes in he doesn't have it it doesn't have it if he does have it you can ride it for six seven minutes I think I had there was a moment there when we felt like maybe he was more than that but I don't know if he is but it's fine probably two and a one's body you know it likes to score and that's kind of that's his destiny I think I'm taking a obie top in here and he's really the last guy that I think we know for

sure could play in a top seven of a really good playoff team because we saw it in the end two years ago yeah he was really viable for them I like them and especially seeing him in person was not afraid of the moment guy which I think you know for his an underside I don't even know he's a four as a five who who fucking knows he can't really guard anyone but he plays really hard and I think he feeds off the crowd and I just thought he was a really good bench guy for them so

what did house get his turn like does he get his two and a row did we go I don't get two and a row because where I have a right snake yeah I get two and a row and I'm kind of screwed now um well there's only a couple picks left I have uh this is my last pick man I can't believe you guys that are really good that I'm organizing over this I'll take sedique bag here oh wow I don't I don't hold it against the net he got hurt okay I like his

game I thought you know he's buried on that terrible pelkins team last year and I thought he actually played well for them I thought he did I thought a playoff team could have not only traded for him

but he could have really helped them and it just was meant to be I guess but um I love I've always

“liked them I think he's a tough wing I think he's got a little fucking in him and it's not his fault”

he got hurt so that's my next pick I like it I have he could still help somebody now I will take I'll take Isaiah Joe because I feel like that's a guy here's the skill that he possesses this was the fourth consecutive season that he shot north of 40% from three that's an important skill in the NBA that's I wish I had taken him that was a good one yeah that's a good one well the thing is we just don't know right well under choice this year can he play 25 to 27 minutes

a game can you shoot 42% can he actually be somebody they look for in the last two minutes of

okay we have no answers for him because we've never really seen him in big moments who's your last pick

here Kyle if I know Isaiah Joe he's gonna make the Reese he's yeah he's been one of the

“better volumes shooters in the league like he's been great skill yeah this is I mean there's something”

like two guys left that I would take but for me it's between Sam Merrill and Paul Reed I'll lead Paul Reed Sam Merrill here just because we've seen him play in the playoffs it really really falls off though here this we get to the guys who like are on the roster optimistic and on the roster pessimistic those of my next year so but Merrill is a guy I'm just like runs a pick and roll and makes shots he's dynamic he's smart plays hard yeah I had him here too I he was 60 in this

draft house um all right so guys that didn't get taken Cole Anthony which this sort of been shocking two years ago that he didn't get dropped out of the league he's basically how to the league didn't make it he was the 15th pick playoff Paul was the other one Paul Reed yeah people Paul people I'm screwed up my neck then no you can call playoff playoff number 50 pick but we've at least

seen him playing in playoff series and being somewhat relevant and then here's what we have for the

not drafted wise minute number two Patrick Williams at number four is a 90 billion dollar contract right now not drafted I never understood the Patrick Williams thing even as it was happening in 2020 with the draft it was like he's a physical wing but he can't shoot but if he ever learns how to score like it's one thing when it's like a Caleb Wilson is he gonna house his stroke gonna be five years from now but when it's like this guy can't score but if he could score it's like that

usually never works out same thing for Isaac and Coro who I thought was gonna be better as like a

“defensive shutdown guy he's just not killing Hayes at seven she went Smith at 10 I think if we had”

gone 20 picks maybe gets taken he's turned into at least a backup pick cure Lewis at 15 there was a moment when it seemed like he was gonna be the fastest guy in the league and a great change of pace guy it just never happened for him he went into the pelicans volcano poker at 17 who I think could have gotten a championship ring in 25 for his incredible tanking exploits when they turned the entire offense over to him for 30 games one of the funniest

tanking moments about time Josh green at 18 precious a chua at 20 who is he still planned he's virgin on having moments but never totally Zika Ziknaji at 22 Zave your helmet at 35 I think if we did this three years ago we'd have gotten drafted but his knees went on him unfortunate how many players in the league are a senior he's Xavier Tillman's senior and he seemed like he was 40 years old when he came into the league anyway I'm trying to think how many seniors there are in the league

and then the last one we could have drafted was Nick Richards at 42 I think the draft was 25 picks

undrafted in this draft and undrafted in the eight draft in 2020 all right so Koff we had to

grade this draft overall like a B plus we've three franchise guys in this draft and he had it Edwards Halburn Lamello who are all franchise guys I mean I'm sorry Edwards Maxi and Halburn franchise guys on teams that could make a final four with those guys as their best guys so to me that's a huge successful draft and then you throw in a bunch of the roll pairs this is for

“as weird as the covid draft was I think it's a B plus yeah I mean I you like I said I have”

Edwards and Halburn a tier above Maxi and obviously up it's just sort of like these are continuing level franchise players who you know worthy of Max contracts and I think in any draft if you can get that it's just the depth it's not great if it's really funny to think about backdrop what we what we were thinking we were going into that draft it's it's a funny time machine that this is the only covid time machine that I'm willing to go into willingly

how's what's your grade for this draft yeah I think it's a solid B because when I look at how many all NBA uh recommendations are we're going to get out of this draft then I think it's like a

dozen ultimately I think we'll get to by the time these guys are done you add up those top sort of

“four guys I think we'll get to around 12 all NBA teams um out of Maxi and Halburn and I mean so we”

only have we're about five or six now right yeah we have five all stars we have three guys who made an on B a team we have one guy who led a team to the finals and we have three NBA champs can you name the three wise man got a ring from for gold state that made James was Peyton Pritchard Peyton Pritchard hey yeah they're guy got drafted for us as a jow oh oh yeah yeah that's right yeah with the thunder yeah uh we also only had 10 guys you played

10k minutes so far in this draft 10k minutes and six years not a lot right that feels right 1500 a year but we've only had 10 all right so the final redraft Edward's one halibut and Maxi of the lamello ball our top five McDaniels Devon Vasell a congrew bane Pritchard rounding at the top 10 and then we did a steward neismith quickly top and bay Azaya Jones Sam Merrill I don't even think that's the right amount of

somehow that's 17 players we probably skipped a guy at some point but that was uh that was our redraft and then the closest to getting drafted probably Paul Reed he was our bubble guy yeah you guys would like them I was really kind of man is not giving up on a Coro yet

“what they said what I think I think you still hold that hope for him as a defense I”

thought I was I didn't we get valuable playoff minutes from Naji Marshall I feel like Naji Marshall's being overlooked here was he in Israel little flabbergasted by that accusation bit I don't know you you you said I saw a glimmer of hope with when I Coro's name got about up I was just a son reflecting off my goal I was right did not where was Naji Marshall on this draft did I miss this undrafted oh he's an undraft so the undrafted the rhythm and the shantate Naji Marshall could have been picked

I actually think he was aeropointing up out of some of these guys who mentioned Fakundo Compasso you know love um Joe House yeah enjoy the golf thank you come in enjoy the time off before the uh for the playoffs get really kicking here it was a pleasure to re-draft it I have a feeling I'll be seeing the two of you again for another re-draft the summer cause I really enjoy this thank you fellas we're gonna take a break come back with Jace Goodsepsion

Jace Goodsepsion is here for one of the most important moments of the year on the Bill Simmons podcast

I'm I'm gonna unleash my MVP ballot for the Odyssey okay I haven't prepped you at all I didn't send it to you and we're going from 100 to 1 now I'm gonna skip some spots okay okay yeah we're going backwards how many times have you seen this movie once or twice I've only seen a once I'm going uh a second time with my wife uh this week coming up I saw yesterday at 10 a.m. showing at the grove with CR himself Chris Ryan and my son Ben who was completely blown away and tried to get tickets for our last night

and miss like that they're not tickets and I'm like yeah there's not going to be tickets for a while at night yeah back not going to find those but um before we get into the MVP ballot so you're obviously you did binge mode for us with Mallory you're a game at the throne's officially not out

strands together in the sense that this is based on history you know these are epic poems from a period of western history the dawn of history but that within that it's also from an age of

“legends it's your unclear like what actually happened and what was is fantastical um yes I think about”

them in the same way which is something I've been telling people like I I think about this this movie is you know when I was a kid you'd turn on basic cable and it would be like the dark crystal or labyrinth or any any number of movies that this movie reminded me of like this is a movie where if I was 13 years old and I turned on TV and it was two hours into the movie I'm like well I'm here for the rest of the 55 minutes well this is gonna be one of the all-time rewatchables I'm sure

we'll do it at some point this year I gotta wait till it's on streamer cable so I can really study it and take a bunch of notes and stuff but um it's I I love that we're gonna do a lot of spoilers for this so if you haven't seen yet uh no offense you can leave come back left you watch it but one of the things I love about it other than it's just so ambitious and they use technology perfectly and it's almost impeccably cast with a couple of exceptions we're gonna do but uh uh

I have there's one I'm gonna yeah there's somebody that fairs very poorly on the MVP ballot

“and his name rhymes with bomb ballant um oh yeah I tell you but I think what I really love”

and what's great from a rewatchable standpoint it's got four like set pieces where it's like all right okay buckle up 10 minutes get ready and you know when we see we see

cyclops for the first time and the movie's like kind of moving along it's like we're bringing in

all these different characters we're just kind of going along and it's like oh let's get some food hey there's a sheep let's follow him up the hill and you just have no idea what's about to happen and from that point on the movie just it just goes nuts go absolutely nuts yes I love that I can't wait to I I cannot wait to see where we go with this MVP 100 person MVP yeah we're I'm gonna skip some spots okay coming and at number one so just react off me after I give you a chance yeah yeah

you got it after at 100 finishing last bitchy internet people yes there 100 on the MVP ballot complaining that only 41 theaters can show no show i max sorry uh the casting was too woke that's been a big thing no one wasn't faithful to Homer to shut the fuck yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah that we can't complain about everything let's when somebody spends this amount of time and money and makes a great movie like this we can't also bitch about it and find reasons that it sucks

faithful to Homer is hilarious because first of all Homer is not a guy Homer is a collection of

unknown amounts of anonymous poets there was no actual Homer guy yeah and two the you know the things that people choose to be mad about the wokeness of it it's like you know it's not what's barely in the Odyssey the horse the horse is like mentioned in a line and you certainly don't see what goes on inside of it so it's just very interesting to me the stuff that people choose to be upset about and then the people even with the trailer who were like that's not what Aga Memnon's

tell me it would look like it's good yeah it's it's listen there's a lot of people out there who need a nice 24 ounce glass of settle down juice they know who they are all right we're dropping down a number 58 and then VP ballot Benny Safty is Aga Memnon oh wow okay here's why didn't he

miss him the first time I watched it no idea he he he he could have been anybody and then it was

like Benny Safty as in it was like he was so now I'm watching it and I guess you can kind of see him at two different points but I really you just needed like a tall and posing guy I would go on with conkonnipple like you're going so many success of course you would have gone with conkonnipple

“you know here's the thing about the Benny Safty casting you know it was like it's a mythic”

depiction you know Aga Memnon's like a foot and a half taller than everybody he's almost as tall as the giants that they end up running from and it's to me and I'm gonna I'm gonna unveil this theory at the right moment in this podcast to me Nolan has done something incredibly creative and thoughtful with all of his cat with most of his casting choices and I would include Safty because he's

this mythic figure but then when he speaks it's just like a guy so it's like this collision of myth

“and feet of clay that I think is really interesting I thought it was really I thought it was really”

fascinating but I agree you don't even know it's him would you've gone with Walker Kessler would you've just gone seven footer talk about a guy that we've also haven't seen very much of in recent years James Weaseman talk about another guy that we also haven't seen dark on mythic yeah just go with any seven footer who's not an NBA team anymore because you're going for like a big giant tall guy I don't know why you need Benny Seth anyway I didn't know his name all right number 47

Tom Hall and as Temeculus okay okay um I'll just start here Jason sure good to me this is a 2002 range heap ledger roll where it's like this is somebody I could see someday becoming this badass gladiator but right now he's in you know he's like a pup still trying to figure out the world at Tom Hall and to way too short to be like the next guy who runs a whole thing

to be like this warrior just that cool enough I never bought the American accent the whole time

I didn't feel like he was related to Matt Damon and he's trying and they're trying to make it work but I just find it hard to believe that this is Temeculus um here's here I'll reveal my theory here

“so I think Nolan I think Nolan is playing with our Sean fantasy mentioned this on the pod you”

guys that talked about the the Odyssey in from last week I think Nolan is in a fascinating way playing with our perceptions of these people and the characters they have played for instance Tom Hall and who is almost eternally now associated with Peter Parker Spider-Man who is a teenager forever here plays a character who their entire struggle is why won't anybody see me as a man as a full grown man as a person who could be king she's trying to grow out of that image that we have

placement because of his association with Peter Parker and that's my Tom Holland example for why Nolan picked Tom Holland and personally I think it worked I think it was I think that kind of not in a wink to the way we perceive Holland in this role it it it works for me it works interesting

“people are really split on it that's why I knew putting him 47 I thought there was one scene”

Renee in half away just blew him off the screen it was just it was because she's great in this movie absolutely we'll get to her much later but I had some questions with the age too because the disease was gone for it seemed like 20 years right the dog is like barely holding on at the end but then we have flashbacks of he sees his little kid there who's like four seems like four or five in the flashbacks so that puts to me I'll set like 24 or 25 range yes that would be

but he's treated in the movie like he's 16 I just don't I don't I just didn't this was the one thing that really didn't work for me I will you know it's like ancient Greek culture he can't grow a beard I think they just don't see you as a man until you like until you can grow a full fledged beard okay at number 43 I've Poseidon not a great dad negligent dad leaves his cyclops son just in a cave son has their finally get stabbed and attacked and has to call

out for him is like all right fine I'll do some stuff for you it's a good point I would add that every single Greek god who's a male Greek god from Greek myths is a bad dad all they do is go out sire children like with regular human women after meeting them in disguise and being like I am just

like a really handsome guy I'm not used to it all by the way and then just abandoning them and never

raising them so this is like the culture of the pantheon of the Greek guys this is just what they do they're like he's at a dinner party and they're like what's up with cyclops he's like you know he's doing all right he's you know the cave's gone well set the 12-year career yeah he's got a job he's he's he's making his own way as a sheep herder on on an island he's doing really really well works hot out really hard at it I'm saying one eye is tough but um okay

number 40 bear with me because we're not allowed to be critical of this person on I'm not going to be up all of this explanation number 40 zandaya is a daya um he got us of wisdom warfare and

at the ring yes malle is the goddess of wisdom warfare and handicraft yes listen

“sometimes you can have too much star power in a movie I'm not sure we need her for who she's playing”

in this movie and I get it no one's just like I'm he probably grew up on 70s movies and we're

just getting stars all over the place but she's basically here it feels like she filmed her

scenes in two days she's making the roof face from euphoria and four different scenes and then calling it a day so you have zandaya here she's one of the most famous actions in the world like she barely gets the ball they don't run any plays for I liked it because you're meant to wonder what it could mean that she's she barely speaks throughout the movie she's a couple things you know at one point you know Odysseus is like why can't you just like

why can't the gods speak plainly and just like say normal stuff right and she's like listen this is I don't know what to tell you the gods work a mysterious way as we're doing the best we can and so for me it was like you you want to be star struck by that face it's a lot like the

“Charlize casting where it's like I just want to be dazzled by this character and I think that was”

appropriate and with the end it listen we're spoiling right yeah with the way with the reveal of who zandaya is in the movie which is a woman who is killed during the sack of Troy adding to Odysseus's guilt that reveal after all this time wondering like what you know what is a thing I want like is she gonna be more plain spoken about it but really hits for me and secondarily a lot of the like the talk in this movie between the characters is hey remember the gods can

just show up in disguise like as a as a beggar as a normal person so I think Odysseus at the end is meant to have wondered all these years did go man did we accidentally did we kill Athena in disguise did we insult her like did I insult her with this trojan horse so you're saying we need somebody we need more star power because there's a

“mystery of how important she was and that's not bad because I was going to suggest Sophie”

counting him here where she's just she's just doing the point that's a great idea and by the way yeah like Pat Riley needs to trademark the point yeah no question number 38 James remark

another one I didn't realize it was him the first time I saw the movie and then was looking

from the second time he's in the dead people seen it's after after the earlier page comes back and yeah says all the stuff and then we see remars and bottom I just want to give you his I am the I am DB please please when he's in the movie for 90 seconds which is why he's not higher he's age acts in the warriors he's credible he's getting in for him he's getting in for him he's getting in for him 48 hours one of the great villains in action movie history he's dexter's dad and in dexter

he's sex in the city the best sex Samantha ever had he's in open-hammer once upon a time in Hollywood pineapple express and what lies beneath he's in Miami vice in an episode and he's increasing

James remark incredible like all time turn all time I am DB anyway concudestim okay

down at number 33 I have the giant last dragonians so these are the big giant new robots that kill most of the diseases crew yes no backstory I don't know what they're so upset about I don't know where they came from if I'm gonna cut anything in this movie this might have been where I cut I'm gonna just had a boat capsized instead I don't know here's why I loved it okay because it turns out that Nolan shot that with no special effects they did the force perspective trick

from the you know the Lord of the Rings where they took they replaced Damon and cast with like five foot tall stunt people and then they cast like seven foot two serbian centers as the less dragonians and then shot like from a low angle up so that's all legit there's no CGI in that okay it's not like I just didn't understand what was going on in that scene but that's you're kind of holding on for dear life for half of this movie anyway yeah number 32 I mentioned the

L.A. Page character C.N. on tough job tough one tough coaching here by Odysseus you know it's like hey we're all going to be in the horse you're going to be out there it's going to be

he found out that C.N. on volunteered for this was like whoa whoa why did you do that like away

“right I didn't want it to be you why did you have to do that but there again I think is this”

example of Nolan's really interesting casting here's a character that like is cut loose and sacrifice by their entire community and society lied to and then left to die in order for this mission to like actually work and so I thought that was like yeah that really hit me that was like yeah oh bad I mean who knows C.N. could have been much higher in the ballot but you know who didn't want them want them higher who Odysseus just left about to die I was brutal all right

brutal by Odysseus and then don't listen to it from inside the horse number 30 the spoiler alert people we can't spoil the Odyssey we all read the book we all know it happens there's nothing to spoil it already happened it's not like hey I guess I wonder how this plays out number 27 all right now we're starting to get into some real candidates here number 27 meagoth as the the handmade the untrusty yes in half the ways turns out she's got something going with patents and I want to look more

from her I got to be honest she was she felt like the most game of Throne's character in this movie other than maybe Pattinson and definitely was the only one who seemed like she was a little bit horny this is not a horny movie not at all there's that one moment where you realize that that she is with Pattinson's character when you know he's just come to do a slide because they're just like oh my god yeah and that's about as horny as it gets well you know like there's

there's the entire preamble of Odysseus with you know clips on the beach that feels like like there's more anything like it's been like it's the hornyness was 20 minutes ago and now we're past that and we're just like rehydrating and basking in the glow I'm glad you brought that up there's an already version of this movie there's definitely a clips of scene there's probably a scene

with Odysseus and Penelope in the first 20 minutes there's a hundred percent of Miyagoth and Pattinson

scene and then there's probably some sort of feast/orgy if we went game of Throne's style there's probably a little finger running a brothel right after that yeah there's something like that there's a 1 a.m. on Showtime or Cinemax in 1996 cut of this yeah it comes after like you know the hitch or whatever like red shoe diaries or something Bob Goodgee any produce that right was shot

“in the Netherlands absolutely there is a cut of this movie that is possible yeah I think Miyagoth was”

probably like this is I was ready for more I guess I guess nothing's happened all right at number 25

the dog Argos so I first time I saw this was with your former binge-boat partner,

Mallory Ribbon and the moment we saw the dog she and she was just terrified and and then the dog dies at the end I thought Mallory was going to be reduced to a puddle Odysseus comes back just touches the dog the dog's like you're back oh this is a drop dead from the past story was it was also maybe you're going to drop dead I I think the note I wrote that here is I you know Murphy's now six my dog yes this is how I want Murphy to go age 20 I'm away for a while he holds on to it come back

I touch she then he dies and just this is what a relationship how did she do when they were kicking the dogs like in the in the dinner scene I didn't you know Mallory how do you think she did she she threw up the both she did one of those I will say the reason Argos is in higher is I wonder what more flashback scene this dog was such a great hunting dog let's see it we saw like he was let's say can I that kind of wanted to see him cook a little bit I don't know

maybe no and not a dog guy all right number 24 Cory Hawkins he's polybus he's patting since kind of

“sidekick honestly possible down waiters candidate I thought he really jumped out I thought he was”

really good huge reaction I don't know about you huge reaction in my theater when he buys it hmm the audience absolutely loved it to have that kind of impact in what does he have like three

into an half minutes I got a respected crowd loved seeing him die he kind of came in like he's out of the bad boy pistons he's just got a crazy least just trying trying to get a tech just trying to search it with people right he's like any member of the Argentino world cup squat he's already got a yellow card it doesn't care if you back it kicked out number 22 the Peter Nguango playing twins playing hot twins one as scars on her face the other doesn't the other shanks I could

bend on I don't see need a little more with this this was kind of the untraveled side of her getting the evil sister getting the revenge at the end but there's in the books there's a whole backstory for why she did that and just kind of comes and goes and I I don't know I felt like I could have gotten another ten minutes with it I uh this is for me is the kind of your mileage

“may vary thing I think what Nolan was trying to do here is say through this character”

whose face launched the original Trojan war right is to say like oh Helen has thoughts about this too because she keeps wanting to say something like she tried you she pulls Tom Holland aside at one point and like gives him some very important information and then at the at the feces like keeps trying to interject but uh the minile is just like won't let her speak and to me that was like a metastatement about war and about this entire conflict within this but I agree that you have

Lupita and you just kind of want more I thought that was a perfectly cast because she's one of the most beautiful actresses we have and that's like in your head how on a Troy has to be yes like oh yeah I get it uh number twenty mentor yeah original mentor they didn't everything else after

unbelievable never pretty I never realized they're I or I forgot because I read these books in the

high school but they the original mentor is just kind of oh yeah that's good one here's my uh here's my Nolan casting theory applied to John like was on a mentor um I have like was on a coming later

“if you want to say this oh okay I'll say that I just had the concept of mentor as number twenty yeah”

well we're gonna hit like was ammo in a second number 19 the big lesson of the Odyssey 'cause my number 19 MVP winning isn't everything you know what Trojan Horace great idea you offered somebody a gift yeah you turned it and you ended up winning the war because you shank them with this gift but Odysseus's movie goes on he realizes what's the worth it the most nice thing you can do for another human being is give them a gift and we did that

and then we betrayed them with it and I know if I would do that again I thought he was the proper amount of doubt and skepticism about whether that was the good most I think that's absolutely right I think that you know one of the things that we know about Odysseus is how not only how clever he is which everybody says throughout the movie but also that he is fair like he thrones that bow with that classic Christopher Nolan bass drop sound moment and you know and I'll be asked

“some why he does that and he's like well I want to give I think it's only fair and honorable to give”

the animal I'm hunting like fair warning that I'm coming but he doesn't do that with Troy he plays

it underhanded he never gives them the warning that this is that actually the hunt is still on

and that's a big reason why he's so guilty he feels like he insulted Athena well parallels to Bill Bell Check and Spygate maybe a little bit like how far do you want to go to win and it's sometimes you can never get too much yeah how much is too much sir repercussions coming in at number 18 Matt Damon's beard authentic real beard it's weird because he can't I don't know if they were trimming the upper lip part but the beard itself I'm just going to ask you

because it's one of the most important questions the movie better or worse beard than Tom Hanks and Castaway also a natural beard they're different kinds of beards but this is his beard was more both are wild but it it was more manicured it and it seemed more air quotes Greek

whereas Tom Hanks just had that crazy thing get the survival of beard basically he had the survival

of beard I'm going to give it a push push and I'm going to give it a push with the edge to Damon because of the dedication of how long it's you know it's like a year of your life to do

yes how bad the fake beards are like there's one point when he gets wet in the beard like kind of like stiffens up it's like oh that's a fucking real beard man I knew he grew the real beard but there's moments where this is why he's spending your grown beard can I ask you Bill yeah so I was listening to your um decaprio or Damon conversation and can we just say right now that the Boston connection had nothing to do with it it there wasn't any it didn't factor in it all

yeah maybe a little maybe a little okay I'm not saying I disagree with the with the

“with where you landed with it I think it's an interesting conversation but I wanted it acknowledged”

at least a little bit you know decaprio later fan well that is true it's funny I got so many emails from the listeners saying like do you realize you've been a lifelong Jordan over LeBron fan

and then you did Leo versus Damon and you picked LeBron over Jordan basically you picked career

resume more movies more minutes more games more everything versus the heights of Leo which was the exact opposite of your strategy with Jordan I'm like you know what checkmate you got me I don't have a counter in that one number 17 Hommish Patel said he says him Hommish Patel officially an old guy congrats to him like Nolan's Bank of the movie he's in I really liked him in this I thought I thought that that is a mute knee it doesn't have to be well yeah like he had a couple really

good moments I thought the way he was like watching Odysseus and you can see him losing faith but I just thought it was kind of not the most exciting part but I thought he kind of crushed it I liked him I loved it as well he just brings up more you know with a guy like Odysseus who's like the mastermind the brilliant guy you need that character who's like okay I'm gonna take all these brilliant plans of yours and somehow make it happen and he you felt that chemistry through

their entire story yeah yeah number 16 this is goes to the crossbow and arrow trick okay so this movie has to hinge on this stupid both thing that he does in the beginning that everybody's

like oh wow he did it again and everybody's like oh my god this is fucking amazing

and to have to plant that seed for later and it's like in all time comes back it's like oh she's gonna have them do it she's gonna have she knows the suitors won't be able to do this and she's kind of secretly hoping that beggars and Thessia's uh I just thought phenomenal and by the way I've watched this as a two-hour experience being a vent just bending the bow and then I want to see

“people bend the bow how many people can do it and then you have to shoot through the access I'm in for”

two hours through the access incredibly underrated totally just be completely glossed over like obviously no one has done stringing the bow except for Odysseus yeah but once you climb that mountain there's arguably an even higher mountain after that it's just impossible I love that they brought it back I love it um okay now we're in the top 15 this is the really good stuff here okay number 15 I put this in partly for you drunken medicine bordering on violent feasts

really this was the most game of thrones DNA here where we just have a bunch of people eating together and people drinking bad wine and just getting bombed and they don't know how to interact what are they talking about that none of them have any hobbies and they can't be like hey what do you think about the playoffs tonight there you only go it's just to get drunk and maybe get in the fight

with somebody and it was just fun to be back it made me brought me back to thrones what an incredible

collection of bad hang individuals that have been hanging out not for a week not for a month three years but for like years they've been here eating Penelope out of house and home bullying her son kicking dogs spitting in the face of beggars and just trying to hook up with her for years terrible that is a maybe just poison everybody kind of moment for her at some point just at some point it's like hey I got some special steak tonight number 14 submit the morning as Cersei

oh my god so another also like thrones Cersei versus Cersei I'm like that can't be a coincidence right

“and then I think that there's significant thematic connections for sure yeah um what performance”

was creepier for you Samantha Morton as the creepy lady who lives on a hill and can turn

who she played in my no-to-report the pot one of the the bald pods and the underwater one of the

“freakiest characters of all time this is clearly a bit an a juicier role I think this is the spooky”

role just because like the eating scene when they're feasting on the food and you're just like this can't be good whatever's about to happen it's gonna be bad and the way they again with the practical effects she's like reaching into their cheeks stretching their mouths turning them into pigs it is so unsettling and magnetic but also like really just gross on a on a base level that I mean I was I was blown away by this this this is a creepier role just because

is she eating the people like she's so she's feeding people to people in the form of animals to eventually and also and also very underrated part of this is she has her sister as a crow just in a cage forever yes so she's a cannibal witch and also an out of great sister not in

I saw this the first time the second time three hour movie I'm gonna trick it in giant water

at some point I got to go to the bathroom time did for when she turned everybody into pigs and like I don't want to watch this because if you add it this I had another question for you turning people into pigs yeah top 10 worst superpower like if you had to pick like oh cool I get a superpower what am I getting well you're gonna turn people into pigs and then you eat them that's your superpower well with regards to your mentor Paul the first mentor is this the first mentor pigs

oh I like it maybe yeah I mean yeah because she's like she's calling her shot too she's like their pigs they're getting what they're deserve right yeah yeah you're right I mean we're really just like in the origin stories of so many tropes it is true number 13 Zeus I wrote down he's a little like Adam Silver he is a bunch of laws we mostly don't know what they are and the punishment is either not nearly enough or way worse than it should be it's like

it's exactly right no notes I have no notes that's perfect that's exactly correct yes did we violate the laws with the aspirations scandal I you will find out I don't know is this king that I have put in place the cheapest king the worst king ever yes oh the Portland king the king of Portland the king of Portland I didn't realize she was so cheap even though he did exactly the same thing in Carolina huh he but he might be the king of Las Vegas very

soon who we have no idea hmm all right now we're really getting there number 12 john burnt thaw our good but good we've been five spots higher he's the king aspired in this movie so I intentionally I mentioned this last week I intentionally avoided all spoilers everything I literally didn't know he was in the movie I gasped when I saw him I got so excited could he have played Odysseus if we were doing like slightly cheaper budget we can't afford

bad damon we need to go second level actors could you but john burnt thaw is Odysseus because I

“would have he could have done it but here's why I think Nolan did it the way he did I've got a”

this is part of my Nolan theory with regards to burnt thaw as a occasional little more than a

occasional listener to his podcast he is always he's a very pro veterans issues figure he's

always talking about the sacrifice of bets he's always platforming you know X delta 4 skies X sealed team six guys on his podcast and talking about the things that uh warfighters go through and here I think Nolan very specifically playing with that cast him as like the character who's like trojan war was awesome man like oh what's it you your dad was in the trojan war come here sit next to me I want to talk to you yeah let me tell you about the horse let me tell you from

inside the horse let me tell you what that was about and he's the guy who's the most concerned with what happened to the trojan war veterans as they left the war and what they're up

“to now and I think this is could he have been Odysseus yes but I think Nolan wanted him specifically”

for this kind of part it's an awesome point number 11 I have Homer who as you mentioned isn't a complete person no it's not great stuff nonetheless and the legend of Homer continues great job by him great job by him them however many over somewhere you have no idea but yeah you know Homer they'll be reading it forever it was enjoyable in high school just really laid down great time back all right number 10

and and Odysseus had a lot of regrets about it but just fundamentally probably the greatest war idea about time it it without it the fact that we're talking about it 5,000 years later proves the point and that it's become the word trojan horse has become the byword for something that contains a hidden poison

“some sort of ambush within it I think you're exactly right and let's be honest Bill if we were there”

like Manalaya sir any of these other characters yeah we'd never stop talking about the horse

ever right that's it I wouldn't even know anything else I would just be telling trojan horse star is to everybody I bet yeah I was every I let me tell you every single podcast the comments would be like guess what Bill managed to tie it back to the horse he did it again he did it again he's fits the horse what's guess what he's in the horse and the water level rising I'll never guess it's the horse I think Kevin Wild's half-baked ideas it the trojan horse is

the greatest half-baked idea ever where they were like all right here's my idea I only have half of it we just build the horse right and we all climb into it and somehow they pull it up and then when we're inside we'll come out of the horse and they're like okay and they try to work with it and somehow

works so the movie lays out a really key point about the trojan because it's been romanticized over

the years like yeah they were in the horse yeah bad times in the horse I mean not fun a bad as bad as it gets where they're just pissing and shitting on themselves there's water in the horse people are drowning in the horse they're suffocated in there they also have no idea how long they're gonna be in there I'm gonna say one of the worst times of all time it might not work at all you're just they might leave it there like you don't know it's a it's a Hail Mary pass for sure

you're getting stabbed in the horse then there's the guy who's like I've got to also wipe the blood off the blade before it pulls out or this whole thing is is gonna be ruined very one of the all-time worst times in the horse which is why again Bill you would not stop talking about the horse it's right it's the worst figuring out how to get kd in 2016 multiplied by like 200 one great thanks ever at the smell by day four had to be all-time worse you think anybody is like yeah I know we're not

supposed to open that little opening that we get out of but what if we did yeah I think it's open anyway I think Odysseus very strategically put himself by that little opening because I think he was sneaking breaths yeah no question all right number nine robber patents as Antony's this is the Billy Zane part we have these big movies and it's like oh you're the Billy Zane part in this and in in Titanic Billy Zane is over the top and just one of the most ridiculous characters in the history of

“movie but it's great this is a really good performance and here's the thing Jason steps in”

this is an actual fact from robber patents and he based his performance on James Woods in casino that's actually a great deal said this in an interview wow I watched casino and I decided what if he was Antony's and I just was lester diamond and that's why it's like holy shit so I found that up to in the first and second movies and I times I watched I watched it the second time him as lester and I was like this is fucking out of control there's a there's a moment in this

performance obviously like he's so almost cartoonishly evil throughout but then they get to the final you know the test with the bow and the ten axis and everybody's failing failing failing failing it comes around to Antony and he's like he does this fascinating thing where he gives the speech or he's like hold on none of us could ever imagine that we could replace a decision oh

this is a giant right oh this is one the Trojan War I would never deem to take his place we can only

hope to be selected by you Penelope so I'm not going to try I'm not going to even try to do it I don't want to disgrace the bow I won't disgrace the bow with that kind of performance that was like man that is on the one hand so slimy and also that would have worked on me I would have been like

“you know what maybe he's not such a bad I think he should get nominated for this if I was going”

to do supporting actor in leg was almost the next person we're going to mention but it it may be both I don't know what the categories look like but you know the the academy and just in

I thought he was awesome and Pat and he's been in our life now for since my kids were young and you know the fucking twilight movies are coming out this is like almost a 20-year career now for him

“he's just a really good actor I think this is the best he's been in a movie he's really good in this”

he's always especially you know post twilight it seems like he's reveled in taking these really

interesting roles and I don't think Bill there is a better actor currently working at that specific kind of sniveling two-faced villain yeah like obviously like a cartoon like moustache twirling villain but also like has the wear with all to understand like my villainy is revolting to people so I need to put a mask on it and then the you know the is there a better actor at these really dynamic physical moments where like the fight is unfolding and he's hiding

behind a pillar like get him you get the shield again with the shields it's like there's nobody better if he's done he's great he's really good in good time I mean he's been in a bunch of good stuff but but I love that he keeps he's all over the map like I don't know if to expect from him anymore with movie parts that he plays and in this one you know 10 years ago you would have said he would have been the Tom Holland part right it's like that's a kind of

creepy but he zags and now it's I just think he's doing a really good chap all right number eight like wasamo another one didn't know he was going to be in the movie saw him and I was like oh like wasama that's cool he got in a scene and it's like now he's actually a big part of this movie and it's probably getting nominated for an Oscar I thought he fucking crushed it thought he was

“so good in this movie and I do think he's going to get nominated right I think that would be my bet”

for this category for him complete agree my favorite role of his since tibult in Romeo and Juliet the 90s Juliet yeah and he's one of those roles where you're like damn like wasama I forgot like he can really do it he can really act and with my no-one casting theory I don't think I don't think it's a I don't think it's a a I think it's very specifically chosen that leg wasama was now in a

second movie where the death of a dog is the huge turning point in the movie

and just like in John Wick and just like in John Wick he is that character in John Wick who's like listen you don't know what you've done when John Wick gets here you guys are fucked he's the same character in this is like listen when Mike when Odysseus gets back you that's really interesting I just don't play the flow with you guys I did not miss the John Wick parallels in this movie but I missed the leg wasama collection that's that's a really good connection I thought he was

tremendous congrats to him and play agree number seven arguably could have been one Charlie's oh my god another one I had no idea was in the movie she's clips so it's a role that probably should not have worked seven years of great sex and lotus flowers and he's like I my heart somewhere else I'm gonna leave I would have stayed I don't know how she got the part to work like it does but she's really great in this and it's like the

perfect kind of heat check she comes off the bench it's a couple threes grabs some boards dunks over somebody and then she's out I don't know that she's looked better in a movie than this movie and I don't know if she's either yeah every movie and with regards to Nolem theory she's been the face of Dior for 20 years this kind of like ageless immoral beauty so from that perspective the casting makes sense she's been very public on numerous podcasts talking

about how she single by choice that it's a source of strength for her yeah that she would in

fact never date in the entertainment industry because that she's been through that it's two

she loves one night's band you say one night's band is great for her that's right and here she is in this movie an ageless beauty who ends up alone at the end and kind of by choice she says to him

“okay I've kept you here long enough like if you want to leave you can leave and so I think once again”

Nolem is playing with our idea of who this person is and using that creatively in the casting and she was absolutely incredible this was the best casting in the movie for me and I don't know what other actress would have been a better sometimes we'll have somebody in this and it's like not quite but this one is like wow and then I I had this in my nose Jason this is for decades now if he check performances from her going back to reindeer games and doubles advocate like we're talking

fast in the furious I mean it just goes on and on like the amount of things that she has done

yeah it's pretty incredible like and to your point career launched you know in a in a basically a

“Tarantino rip off movie like that's how long she's been at this thing yeah incredible incredible”

performance by her great casting in the concept of clips out like there's seven different movies that could have spun off from this movie and just been like all right let's go there for an hour and a half they're just a concept of clips out just gotten this island waiting for people to wash up pretty great uh number six I don't want to get to film dorky but the editor Jennifer Lame the the person did the score Ludwig Gornson yeah I'm not sure who killed it more so I have them as six A and

six B here um the editing and Chris and Sean talked about that when they did the pod last week about in the later known movies where he does this kind of flashback at it thing that just kind of seamlessly goes into where we are now but I got to say the score in a couple of these scenes the and the sound of cyclops calling for Poseidon yeah um the Trojan horse the music of that scene when they're breaking out and it's like that and just like building up um this is just an A plus

special teams movie I would bet a lot that Gornson wins the Oscar for this I would hope so I also think just like Sean and Chris said what I loved about this movie one of the things is that Nolan put in all of like his classic Nolanisms but in the most creative versions of those things that I've seen yet there is the big you know inception level based drop the boss sound is all throughout but like more creatively with the bow there's the little

little metal tokens that are given to other characters parents and children sad wives circular storytelling all of that stuff is here but at the highest level that I've ever seen from him

“number five in half away who's absolutely tremendous yeah and I think needed this big picture”

just for her yeah I think this this was a little capper this was like making that last first all in the 18 um I don't know if she gets nominated for best actress or best supporting I think it's best right it's probably best actress she's in enough of the movie that she could probably go for it I thought she was awesome I've been a long time season take it hold there same it's interesting if you said the first four movies let's say she stopped acting tomorrow on

50 years now passes away um maybe 80 years from now um what are the first four movies mentioned in her obituary what are the four that popped to mind are we counting this I think this would have to be one of the four I think the Odyssey I think the Princess Diaries is the breakout

“had that as well I think uh lay miss and I think the devil works prodda”

so I had those four you also you on the cuter room floor broke back interstellar dark that rises the ritual getting married which I think she got nominated for I love her but I think you have the right four yeah we're gonna do this later on yeah but those

are the big four for her and she kind of needed this one she's also by mac calculations has never

been in a best picture winner broke back should have won but didn't I think you're right I don't say this too there was a period you remember the half the way heat this must have been 1512 years ago yeah I was like maybe mad I didn't like it so the heat which I never understood was that she loved what she was doing but that was it yeah it was like she wasn't authentic she was like oh it wasn't authentic how much she liked acting and it's like maybe it's like acting yeah

maybe she just loves what she does get like get out of here I'd never understood that

I've always been a long time fan as well I thought this movie used all the best pieces of

her yeah she had I mean that couple really great like woof like Mary's sweet level since there's that um speed she gives telemicus after he tells her like yeah I don't know maybe should marry the guys I don't know where she just like blows up at him about like I've been the queen of this place for 10 years that nobody treats me as the queen and she's like you don't like to do I'd like to shut the doors kill everybody I was like whoa incredible stuff from

gonna work and you're having a good time I used to do this with the NBA when I had my column I've do my I've do a 400 person MVP ballot but really only have like 28 people on it number four

cyclops um this is one of the holy shit it was so fun going in the second time with my son

and the movie's great and it's going along but I'm like I can't fucking wait for the cyclops scene and to just the when it end he just looked at me and he it was like he'd just watch a way more fly in the air with a family of six and just fly around our house for it it was just awesome and also important to note I just don't think it works before we have all the technology we have now I don't think this scene works in 2012 I just think it would have felt fake

“I would have loved to see you know as as we talked about I think Nolan's done a lot of practical”

stuff I would love to know how he did that but I was like blown away not just by the yield of the scale of the giant but the creativity of like you know his face the way that I is like kind of sideways and then at the end you're like fuck man they really screwed that the cyclops I feel bad for the guy very terrible like what that was awful what happened to him he was just at home tenting a sheep yeah he didn't ask for you guys to show up it also has this

great I mean everything about that whole section is unbelievable but it has that great thing of that they also have to figure out how to get the fuck out of there yeah and they're going to kill him they're like wait if we kill him we're just going to die in this cave we can't do that so how do we and they you know then all of a sudden it turns into like a NFL strategy how do we attack cyclops deep I mean classic Odysseus once again like the man with the plan everybody's like

well you got us in here Odysseus you have had how do we get out we all act like sheep and then he figured it out but then makes the fatal mistake of these shoots so I mean that was just pride that was his pride talking he got mad yeah cyclops took a couple away played by Bill Irwin by the way who weirdly played in half ways dad and Rachel getting married and and one of our one of our famed clowns in entertainment like has that that kind of physical presence of of of of classic

clowning what villain clowning so when I saw this the first time I didn't know I didn't make the

Bill Irwin connection I didn't know they used an actual actor to play him and then not only did they but he was you know they really went all in a anyway all right three left number three the 70 70 millimeter slash iMac's experience of this movie which is just been honestly it's as say movies in some ways with making it an experience where you feel like you have to go this is what they try to do with 3D 15 years ago and it didn't work and now it's at the

point where it's now working and I know it's not everywhere yet but and I still feel like if you see this on a normal awesome movie theater it's still an awesome movie yeah but the experience of seeing it the way no one wants you to see it there's nothing like it it's it's so overpowering to see it and that's 70 millimeter iMac's it's words cannot describe the power of it it is like that you know the cinema meme come to life the score says he picture where he's got arms out like

“that's that's what it is see somebody's you know and halfway giving a fire monologue”

with her face 40 feet tall you're just like man this is the movies this is what it's combined with the sound which is also gotten really better in these movie theaters too and there's some great sound in this movie but just just an experience and it's so funny like when you think back to that 3D era where they're like this is how we're gonna have to keep people in theaters and we're gonna have them put these fucking glasses on that give you a headache but it's gonna

feel different than being at home and it's like right now you can actually just have this green be way better and you know spend more money in the cameras the thing that I hated about the 3D the the attempt to make 3D happen like the attempt to make fetch happen was it was so forced

there was always a forced moment where like some bad guy gets his arm cut off and then it the arm

has to float towards the screen towards you there's always had to be that and it was like oh great here's the here's the scene that the 3D manufacturers made them put in to show out the 3D

“work you don't need that with iMacs you just need the power of the movies I remember saying”

Friday the 13th 3D in the early 80s Adam movie theater and they have the what you just mentioned

right toward the camera and it was like the big 3D moment guess what didn't need the glasses for that I uh you know they're talking about a movie tickets get more expensive and all this stuff I would double down on this I would have like the iMacs the 730 showings

I would make them five six times as much in the big cities for the first couple weeks like

I would like these cities movies make more money because then they'll make more of these movies so if they have to rig the first couple weeks with the tickets and drive it up and drive interest like I'm all forward if you're going to make more more of the out of the you know I love this idea let's rig the box office what's doing let's rig iMacs the out for it listen in LA like last night if they had charged for those four for those four rows in the

middle of they just said yeah these are 150 bucks tonight it would happen like my daughter wanted to the red socks game tonight because by the way they won 15 straight and the tickets are through

the roof like you can't find them because everybody wants to go it's like why don't we have that

mentality with movies I would I would just have specific rows where they could make more money because if they make more money they'll make more movies like this I don't think it's rocket science

“and said not like you have to pay for those tickets like pay for them wherever”

I was thinking about how fortunate we are to live in LA where there's multiple iMacs theaters my brother-in-law lives in London there's only one in the whole country right right yeah Kyle Man who was on here before you was saying he would have to drive somewhere just to see it on like a B plus movie screen right in Boston you're still looking right yeah in Boston there's two like if you live in if you're like vacationing and Wyoming right now or

something you're not getting the great experience but I'm sure we'll have more the fact that yeah they're consistently coming out with these now um like spider-man's coming in two weeks that's gonna be an iMacs movie and so there's gonna be a regular cycle of these which makes me think the other more all right last two who do you think was two and who do you think was one between

“Damon and Nolan I think Damon is two I think Nolan is one uh that was what I had them about”

so I talked about Damon and Leo for 35 minutes with CR on Sunday I don't need to keep talking about Damon um but we want to hear your Matt Damon thoughts well here's my Nolan theory this is this is the culmination of everything that Damon has been doing over the course of his career broke out as a young actor as a boy genius right in goodwill hunting here plays the grizzled old genius everybody talking about like how brilliant he is as a guy um in this movie plays like a noted

trickster a liar kind of a con man pulling from his Tom Ripley performance he's also Jason Born the amnesiac trying to get home somewhere and trying to remember who he is with fight scene and he's also the martian the man who is stranded living by his whits who is trying to figure out a way off in this case the island but in that case Mars is is everything that he's been doing up to now in one movie and a little we bought a zoo with the dog a little bit a little bit the

just frankly we bought a zoo his love for animals we worked out it in as well maybe a little bit of in Vickness with the fighting in front of large groups people um all right Damon was just as good

“the second time I'm proud of Matt Damon all right Nolan who I mean this is this is the I think this”

is the best movie he's ever done other people with it but I just feel like degree of difficulty everybody who worked on this movie was like I can't even tell you how hard that was I can't

believe how grueling that was I'm glad I did it I'll never do anything like that ever again

he just went for it which I love but he's hit this point in his career where he's made enough movies now where I think everybody has a different top four for him like mine would be the Odyssey Dark Knight Momento and I think Dark Knight Rises would be my fourth okay but you probably have a different four and I think Sean and Chris would probably have a different four and name anybody or back would have a different four because he's had enough of these now

yeah I would go for me it's the Odyssey Dunkirk Dark Knight Batman begins but you know there's a lot of other you know I think all the other ones are valid it's just incredible I think this is like if you had bought Spielberg stock like after ET this is like the he check that he's on

and I thought Dark Knight is in the running for best movies of the first 25 years

“I completely agree yeah it's at least in the conversation and at some point it becomes”

subjective and not objective but it's in the running this will be in the this will be in the mix for the next 25 years but to have two of those 18 years apart that's awesome not a long last I mean that's you're going into this course as a Spielberg area of did you put to kick ass awesome memorable all-timers but 20 years apart basically that easy I mean you know with the Dark Knight as a as a comics guy that changed the way the Joker was depicted in the comics they

were like and that's never really happened before you know obviously Jack Nicholson iconic Joker

that didn't they didn't change the way the Joker looked in the comics after Heath Ledger's performance they were like actually that's incredible let's let's do him like that in the comic books one of the things I've heard people are talking about this is the movie industry has changed now the directors are the IP now the this is a theme now of like instead of the comic book and the the suits and the capes the directors are now going to be the ones and it's like that's

always been the case man yeah I went to see Jackie Brown in New York City in 1997 because Tarantino had a new movie coming out like that's that's never changed we just have more

“good directors now we're in a nice little run a talent the trailer I believe the trailer for”

Jackie Brown was like one of the first frames was the new film from Quentin Tarantino it's that's

always been like that the latest from Steven Spielberg you know it's Steven Spielberg's jaws

the closure day just now it was that this is the Spielberg movie I think the difference with no one is he's making movies that are big big scale for as many people as possible but also the best possible version of you know reaching the most people basically which is the hardest thing to do this is where Spielberg is the best ever Spielberg was able to make big ass movies for the most people possible that made a ton of money that were also really really really good and this is the

hardest level of this all right that's my MVP about did we leave anything else out um no I think that's it that's comprehensive we did a hundred hundred we did a hundred give her take 50 yeah I didn't think it was possible much like Odysseus's journey oh my did that think it was possible and it was we accomplished it all right just steps down you still basking the glow of the next it will not stop basking until the season starts I'm absolutely basking

I'll be interested see how they screw up the uh the first game the first home game

it's like don't overthink it James Dolan just just throw some pitches down the middle all they what all the fans want to do is see the rings and the band like don't don't don't don't overthink it you think he makes a speech just be careful at the parade at the parade definitely the bike was getting passed around and I just you know you almost can't screw up the night when you raise the banners it's almost an unassailable night it is disconcerting to see him

moving around with this much confidence and freedom where do you want LeBron to go where do you want LeBron to go by the way um you know what I and I said this I said this previously and I mean it

“I think Cleveland makes the most sense and also I want him to go there because it will be incredibly”

satisfying when the next beat clash the Cleveland Cavaliers once again but this time with LeBron James with the ball movement as LeBron and Hardin are just like what's happening yeah the ball just going over there no no it's there um I mean I think at this point they should just like do like the pop smoke for when it actually happens because we're just like waiting just let us know now he's gonna milk in the summer enough all right thanks for doing that with me Jason I had a good time

good to see you thanks for having me all right all right thanks so much to House and Kyle and Conceptsion and how and then Wardo and everybody at Spotify if you missed that I went on the game over podcast with Richard Max by the way it was really fun I was just in the office when they're about to do it so I ended up crashing it I think it would be a mean of times as podcast I think that's running this week as well and I'm probably not going to talk about the ESPN stuff but

pressbox with the pressbox podcast with Brian Curtis and David Chewmaker did a really good job talking about that so I'm going to be back on this podcast on Sunday and then live rewatchables

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