NTK: We are Witnessing the Collapse of MAGA

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This is Deep State Radio. Coming to you direct from our super secret studio in the third subbasement of the Ministry of Snark in Washington, D.C.

“And from other, undisclosed locations across America and around the world. Hello and welcome to need to know. I'm David or Oscar. If you're hosting this week, like every week, we're going to talk about something we think you need to know about.”

And this month, like we do about once a month, we're going to do it with our friends, the wise, insightful and well informed.

Tara McGowan of Career Newsrooms and Simon Rosenberg of the Hopium Global Worldwide Empire. How are you guys doing?

It's Friday. It's Friday and it's warm today, but it's going to cold over the weekend. Anyway, let's kind of cut to the chase. Yeah, I want to talk about the weather longer. Yeah, okay, okay. So here's a question because I read a couple stories this week and it was like this, Trump's terrible, Trump is failing, the Republicans are terrible, the Republicans are failing.

“The problem is everybody hates the Democrats. And I'm like, is that really true? I mean, is that what polls say? Simon to polls say to everybody hates the Democrats?”

No, I mean, I think that the proof in the pudding is what's happening in these elections, where if there was this mass repudiation of the Democratic Party, we wouldn't continue to be overperforming in special elections and elections of all kinds all across the country. Even just this week, we had this election New Jersey where our candidate in New Jersey 11, overperformed Trump's numbers there by more than 10 points, which has sort of been the consistent thing that we've seen all around the country.

You see what's going on here, Tara, by the way, now Simon's owning the progressive candidates. I'm just, I'm reporting just the facts, man, just the facts, man, and just last week in Georgia and in Wisconsin, we had these huge incredible performances by our candidates. Things have gotten worse for the Republicans since the war. It's part of the reason I'm sure we'll talk about a David that President Trump sort of panicked and went crazy with this Iran. Whatever this Iran announcement was or wasn't today.

But you know, look, there's no question that we have worked to do to close the sale with voters for the fall elections. People need to have a better sense of what we want to do and feel better about us. Right now, the thing that's driving the election outcomes is this fear and opposition to maga and that's the thing that is propelling us into places that we haven't been very often winning statewide races by 20 points and so on. So, you know, but can we improve our position? Can we be improve our brand and be stronger and tougher and all that of course we can.

But I also will take where we are in recognizing seven months out. We still have a lot of work to do and we should be encouraged by what we're seeing here. And even the reputation of maga that we just saw on hungry for example, I mean, this is a I consider that another of our election victories of the pro-democracy movement here and around the world. Well, it certainly is a victory, but but Tara, I mean, our Democrats just go and to worry about it, you know, we're winning races and and that or is there something a flush here or is this line something that, you know, you've got some factions centrist saying, oh, well, they hate Democrats because they mean they leftism, you know, I mean, I just don't understand what it actually mean.

Go for go for a Tara. Yeah.

Winning and winning big despite themselves, but sort of new new caveat, not all Dems, not all Dems, not all men. I think that, you know, we have, it doesn't actually matter whether you are a democratic socialist, a far left Democrat, a centrist or a moderate Democrat, you're overperforming right now in elections. And that is because it is really a referendum on Trump and his Republican party. And that's okay as long as there is still work being done to have a cohesive vision for what the Democratic party is going to do.

“To actually deliver for the American people that can be a through line that gets us through 2028. I think 2028 is going to be the real fight that, you know, we all know we'll start the day after the midterms.”

With many, many, many candidates running. And so I think there is a lot of enthusiasm against this administration, which is very good, a historic level of enthusiasm against. But unfortunately, Tara has trained her dog to cry every time she says 2028. Thank you. Yes. My puppy has been so wonderful all day sleeping.

He's had it. And now he's actually biting my microphone cord. So, okay, we're back. Yeah, so I think that there's a lot to be done. But I do, when I say that, not all done, it's like look at, look at what.

So Ron Mundani did with his first 100 days in office in New York. It was absolutely transformative.

His quote-unquote, "Pot-hole politics." There's a lot to be learned from there. Right now it's very difficult to see a cohesive message from the Democrats because they don't need one outside of being a alternative to the horrors of Trump and the Republican Party up and down that I like. Yeah, by the way, I like "Pot-hole politics" better than the term from 100 years ago, which was called sewer socialism. It was. That was the term. They were out there. They were sort of proud of it. It just meant rolling up their sleeves and getting stuff done.

But does it, you know, terror brings up a good point. Does it even matter? I mean, elections are local. They're individual people. It's not about a democratic brand.

Or is there something more to it?

“No, it matters, but there are other things that matter more. It's part of what I think we're both getting at.”

Is that everything matters, but some things matter more. And I think you're right. I've been interviewing for Hopium a lot of the front line, House and Senate candidates that are the ones that are going to flip districts to help us get back into the majority. And I've been really struck by their confidence, their strength, their sense that they feel like they're very much in touch with voters. We have a very strong group of people running in these battleground districts all across the country. I just didn't know that right until I've now spent a lot of time doing these interviews.

And yeah, they're in those districts. They're on the ballot. It's a human being a person, right, with a story and a history and it's not the abstract democratic brand. It's a human being.

“And I think that let me just say that one of the things that's been universal in all the interviews I've done in the last few weeks is in particular people who've run in previous cycles in these districts.”

Some of these people have run before, perhaps, or we're in lower office and have run in other elections that they say that there are voters available to them now and open to them now that have just not been open to them before. And this is particularly true in farm country and we're in agricultural communities where, you know, there's been so much downward pressure on these communities coming from the administration in terms of cutting of health care, the tariffs, the loss of markets, the fertilizer costs, diesel costs, right, there's a sense of real, real trauma that's happening in the agricultural parts of the economy.

And so universally what they're saying is that there's just, there's an openness to us now. It doesn't mean we're going to close the deal, right, this is what Tara is getting at, you know, is what we're getting at is it would be better, if we had, I think it would be better, if we had a four or five part agenda that we could say that if you elect us, this is what we're going to do. And I assume that something like that will be developed and marketed over the summer. It's what we did in 2006, mostly at six or oh six, there were six things.

I don't, as Tara said, I don't know if it's necessary for us to do it, but I think it would be better, particularly in, to reach constituencies that have been more skeptical of us, which is part of the battlefield. I mean, what's interesting is how many of these very competitive house races are in, you know, areas that have large rural components in their districts. And so I think that my hope is that we can lay out a simple agenda, getting rid of the tariffs, refunding health care, right, it's, you know, bringing the war to a peaceful and, and for the country, lowering gas prices.

That would make meaningful changes in people's lives that would be meaningful that I think, you know, the Democratic Party can agree to before the election. This is where I just agree with Simon. Can I? Oh, good. That's the part I've been waiting for. Go ahead. I don't think that would go nearly far enough. Right now, Democrats have an unbelievable opportunity to pick up so many voters that are literally leaving the Republican Party and Trump on mass, even triple Trump voters are leaving because of issues like the Epstein files,

and the Warren Iran, and yet if if Democratic consultants and campaigns and candidates don't understand that rooting out the corruption on both sides of the party, the talking out of both sides of their mouth, Democrats have done forever on issues like corruption and crypto and Israel.

They, I mean, they stand to lose all of those folks to a moderate Republican candidate or a new first candidates in the primaries in 2028.

So I do think that that there has to be an agenda in my hope is that with these mid-Chirks that Democrats, including more moderate and central Democrats learned that economic populism and breeding out corruption and actual structural reform or the things that unify the biggest space of the electorate that are up for grabs both on the right the left end of the vote. Yeah, I look, I'm open to whatever the agenda is that they agree to. I mean, the thing is if you care about affordability and you want to lower prices,

we have a very simple way to do that, which is to get rid of the tariffs, and which are wildly impossible. I'm saying, Tara, what's in front of us? There's a lot. Didn't exist before this term, and people were not doing well.

Affordability was still the number one issue. That's not enough.

“I'm not saying it's enough. I'm saying that there is a lot for us to work with that I think that Democrats can put forward a,”

and it's not up to me to write it, right? I'm not in charge, but I think that we can come up with an agenda that will be meaningful to people to give them a sense of what we want to do when we're back in power. And I think it would be better if we had that than if we didn't, and it's up to Schumer and Jeffries to, you know, pull their caucuses together to bang something out. And I think it will make on already strong hand stronger as part of what the way I would say it as we head into the election.

Let's see where Jeffries have a hearing strong record of doing that. We'll see if they have an opportunity. Let's keep pushing them, Tara. Well, I think of course I haven't. There have been few opportunities that have been right there in front of them that they haven't failed to seize. You know what I'm saying? Did I say that right?

But the point is they've sort of left a lot on the table. You know, Simon, a good example of this is what you brought up, which happened in Hungary, where although the candidate who ran was a center-right candidate, his message was super simple and it was not equivocated. It was Europe, NATO, democracy, and accountability.

And it wasn't like, you know, sort of, and so I don't know that,

“I think sometimes I get too caught up in this as a center-ster.”

This is progressive or this is whatever simple is good, clear is good. And big and meaningful is good. And then follow through is vital, right?

I mean, the critical thing here is these can't be words on a page.

These have to be things that we're going to do, and that we commit to do. And it's why I think that it's why I have been writing that I think we should try to commit to do them now. I think that we shouldn't say we're going to do them in January. These are things we're going to be fighting to do now because the country is off course. We need an immediate course correction from the failed Trump regime.

And here are the things that we're going to try to implement now.

“We may not get them done now, but I think that it's part of this brand question,”

is that a lot of the, a lot of the problem I think we have is that people think our hearts are in the right place, but we're not strong enough to overcome all the obstacles that exist. You know, the oligarchs and the campaign money and the corruption and the lobbying and everything else. And that we have to demonstrate strength and power. And so it's not just that we have a good agenda, but that we're strong enough to actually implement it when we get back into power.

And I think that this is going to be a real test for us because I think, to me, this is one of the, the brand problems is strength and power. Enough to deliver for everyday people, right, to not just promise and to put words on a page, but to do. And, and so I think that Schumer and Jeffries to their credit did one meaningful thing, which is they blocked the funding for ice and DHS, which is still now unfunded. This was a sign of them using their power and strength to do something important.

And, and be much more in his face and, and arguing against what he's doing and then making it clear what we will do. And I think to terrorist point is that we have a lot of room here to cover a lot of ground. But it has to be David, I mean, what I've been impressed by by the new head of the new president of Hungary.

And I'm never going to say his Prime Minister, I'm not going to say my chair.

Yeah, I'm not going to say his name correctly. Is that he immediately started implementing things, right? And he didn't wait. And so, you know, we've got a, I think the American people are looking for us not just to win an election, but to change the course of the country.

“And that's what we have to be focused on.”

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Thank you and enjoy the show. Welcome to my channel with Shoppy Fein and Business, and welcome to our channel. With the check-out with the world for the best conversation, you're right. The check-out with the world for the best conversation. The legendary check-out of Shoppy Fein, just on your website,

a bit to social media and everything else. That's the music for your time. Let's get started with Shoppy Fein. You know, both of you guys are three of us when we were talking before the last election. Keep coming back to this theme that's time Simon talked about then and it's talked about now, which is strength versus weakness.

“But I think how you present your message conveys strength versus weakness.”

So I think if your message is, we're going to undo what Trump did on healthcare. That's one message. I think we're going to give healthcare to everybody in America as another message.

And the second one is strong and the first one is not as strong.

I think simplicity and strength go in and hand. That was my point regarding Majar and so I've taken this softball and put it on a T in front of you, Tara. Now you're doing everything. I think these things are really, really interconnected. Like what Simon saying is absolutely right.

Democrats have to deliver. I don't mean to bring up Zaron again, but I did hear his NPR interview this morning. And he said delivery is the theme of everything we think about doing. We need to, any promise that we make, we need to deliver on. We need to show up, we need to actually serve the people.

And not just claim to or say that we're going to and then not have them feel the actual impact. So that and feel those impacts very quickly. And so yes, I think it's the combination of very, very bold ideas. I think Democrats, the Democratic Party, the leadership, not the whole party. We are a big tent, but the Democratic establishment and leaders.

They have seemed way too scared to be bold because of fear of not being able to deliver. But when they have like hacksawed into these wonky policies and solutions that are not communicated very well either. Nobody feels the delivery of those, even if they deliver. I mean, the Biden, the last Biden administration was a property example of that. That administration did profound things.

And the American people did not feel the impact of those things in time for the 2024 election and didn't feel the communication. It was solid around it. So you have to do bold. The thing that I am most excited about right now is that we are in the midst of an incredibly energizing primary season. And I think the people that are very irritated by the primary season in the Democratic Party are the ones who are clinging the hardest and the strongest to the status quo.

And to not wanting to have bold change or bold candidates. And that is weakness and the American people can smell that.

“And I think that's what's really exciting is that right now we're going to see through these primaries as we already have.”

And the New Jersey sexual election was a big deal, a really big deal. Because that was a very far left candidate who wanted over performed. That that is actually who wins the primaries and thus the generals in November. They are going to reshape the Democratic Party.

And we need to embrace that is Democrats that the folks who are winning the primaries and thus our general election candidates and stand to win in November.

And as soon as I meet, they're going to be able to actually reshape what we stand for. So I you guys all make a lot of sense. And I'm all for bold, strong, young, new breed of candidates except if they have Nazi tattoos. But you know, I'm certain exceptions I'm going to make for my own personal criteria.

“I think we get we do not we are not well served by the progressive versus centrist debate.”

I think we would be well served by the past versus future debate. They're trying to turn the clock back. They're trying to put us in the 1850s on women's issues or racial issues. They're trying to, you know, undercut most of progress. Nobody is talking about what we've got to do in the future.

When there's, you know, huge dislocations of jobs due to AI and all of a sudden, we're likely, I do AI podcast. I talk people actually care about AI. I got news for you. It's not some like weird, marginal issue. They think they're going to lose their job.

They think it's going to, you know, eat them alive, you know. But I also think, you know, there's out there, you know, competing with China. There's out there, you know, people, you know, looking into their future and getting older. What are they going to be taking care of? Who's going to take care of the?

I just think the party needs to be very future oriented. And that does require boldness. What, I'm not hearing a lot of that. Maybe when I address that side. One of the things I am hearing, which speaks to what both of you are talking about, is started with,

with, um, scratching Whitmer, who was like a hot candidate, then she wasn't.

“But I think she's going to have a comeback.”

I just had to make a prediction here. But, but she was said she gets shit done. And now you've got, which Joshua Shapiro is saying the same thing. Say, I've been get shit done, Democrat. Um, and just not sure if that matters if what they want to get done isn't real and big.

Sign it. I mean, let me, let me go to another real and big, you know, because I think that, um, I think we're in rough agreement in many ways here. I mean, that we need to be, um,

put forward a powerful agenda and what communicate what we're going to do to the American people.

I want to add one thing to the agenda that is often not there, or sometimes is depending on who it is, you know, I, this is a thing I've been talking a lot about. I hope you, um, and it, and it became a little bit more possible this last week, which is, you know, a lot of the general feeling about where the world was going, where it's towards oligarchical and autocratic consolidation.

“Um, and, and I think that we as the areas of the pro-democracy, or the pro-democracy movement in America,”

have to start thinking about the next 10 years being, could be something else. It could be a new birth of freedom. It could be that the awfulness of Trump is creating a global lesson for all the rising populations around the world, that to choose democracy over autocracy in oligarchy, the way that our founders tried to create that lesson, you know, 250 years ago, as of July 4th.

And I think this idea of us placing ourselves in this global movement for freedom and democracy, when it's under such threat, to see ourselves in the same fight as Peter, I can't pronounce his name, Megor in, uh, in Hungary. And to recognize that we, we are, you know, we just had a huge victory. I mean, this, this Hungarian election, I think, was an earth shattering event.

I think it has really weakened maga. Maga, I think, is, in some, is in, is weakening, dying, collapsing, whatever it is, we can talk more about that. But I think that we also have to become great global champions for freedom and democracy and, and to really have it as, as an aspiration that in ten years, the story of this period

will be a new birth of freedom here and everywhere around the world. In this time where, where things are so unsettled and where it's easy to believe that we're going to lose

when it's just as likely as we're going to win, and to recognize that Trump may be teaching the rest of the world a very powerful lesson

about the importance of freedom and democracy because of his just general. I mean, it's amazing to see the comments coming out of the Iranian government now, as they're sort of absorbing the insanity of Trump's post this morning, which have no bearing whatsoever to what's actually being negotiated apparently in, with the Iranians,

And we have to use that, I think, to be great champions for freedom and democracy.

“So David, that's when you talk about big and bold, I think that we have a big mission ahead of us in this movement,”

to not just set things right here, but to use it to create momentum for democracy and freedom around the world. Do you think people care about that, Tara? I think that what they care about, it, like, I believe that the fight here and around the world is about the billionaires, the oligarchs, the elites versus everybody else. And when you have an autocracy like Orban did, what happens, which is what's starting to happen here and get exacerbated here and not starting, it's been moving for a long time, but it's accelerating very quickly under this Trump regime, is that all of the wealth

is for it. All of the policies created are meant to hoard that wealth to the top, there is no wealth that is coming down to the bottom and the corruption is incredibly on the surface. So the reason that they had a huge, like their democracy turned out in the way that they did is because they had nothing left. They understood very clearly the game that was being played against them.

And there was finally a charismatic alternative that could actually capture the imagination at the hope of the people of Hungary.

I do think that's going to be what it takes here. We are going to need a really bold visionary leader in 2028 to get us away from this who can really promise system change away from corruption on both sides of the aisle and the status quo that has not worked for people and people are fed up. If we do not tax billionaires, this is what late stage capitalism gets us.

“That's why I don't want to go back to the old kind of tones of progressive versus centers, but there's no provisiness right now that doesn't have regulation.”

And when you talk about AI, David Wright, we need to be able to regulate it in a way that we failed tremendously embarrassingly to fail social media and big tech and look what that's done to harms society and to children. And the elderly and just democracy in general. And so I just don't believe that this is, we say that every election matters more than anything else. It's not normal any longer. I really do believe that the American people are very awake to what's happening and want a very different type of government run by very different politicians who are unafraid to say,

we absolutely need to tax and relegate and regulate the wealthiest individuals and corporations in this country to create a better system that gives equal opportunity for all and not just blows smoke up people's asses with that talking point and then not to litter when it comes to policy. Frankly, what Democrats have done every time they've been in power in my lifetime.

I think, first of all, this is no surprise to people listening to the three of us talk.

I agree with you, but I also think that this is the flip side of what Simon is saying. Democracy and oligarchy don't go together. The far right has embraced their populist agenda to serve the oligarchs. I think the average American, when they think about all of the, I don't know whether the more democracy resonates or oligarchy, a billionaire resident may resonate a little bit more.

“But I think if you go to the average American, and you say, what's the problem in American now?”

They'll say, systems rigged. It's rigged against me. I can't, you know, I can't get all the good stuff is going to a few people. I don't have my chance. I can't get hurt. The people at the top are, you know, breaking the laws. I have to follow the, you know, it corruption, democracy, oh look at these are all pieces of giving the average person an even break, which they don't feel they're getting right now. Simon. Yeah, I think, look, we could wordsmith this and put it through focus groups and polling everything else.

But we're talking about what we're all saying now is what matters, right? And that, and that, you know, our mission is Americans. There are our historical, our historic role has been to be the great champions of, you know, freedom and democracy here and all around the world. So that's our responsibility, that's our birth, right? That's our, what we've been given as a role. And I think that in this case, we have an opportunity. I, I'm agreeing with both of you that we have an incredible opportunity to connect the dots and everything you're all saying here about why it is that systems that lean towards oligarchy and autocracy are so bad.

And have leaders as Tara said, who are willing to do the work to make it so and not just make, you know, opaque promises. And so I do think we're being given a big opportunity here by just the outrageous level of betrayal from Trump of his core promises to help everyday people and to lower costs and to, you know,

create freedom and opportunity around the world and all the things that he's done to try to move the tax burden from wealthy people to middle class people.

All these things he's done is just a wild, corrupt, unbelievable betrayal of his promises and all of us. And we have been given this huge opportunity to make this big case as Tara, I'm echoing Tara's language here about why it is that we have to provide something far better than this. And I don't, and what I'm saying is, and look, I've come out for rescinding all the tax cuts immediately tomorrow, you know, next, you know, we have so much we can be doing that we've been given such a wide playing field here and we need to be ambitious and bold and take risks because the time demands it.

But I think one of those, yes, David, when I'm agreeing to you with agreeing with your point, these things are all connected, how we finally get down to the final mile wordsmithing, I'm sort of ecumenical about that.

But we understand the reality, what we're dealing with here, and we have to become warriors to find a better half for the American people, which I think we can do.

“And I think, you know, look, you know, we sometimes try to have a lively discussion here, the secret that's obvious to everybody who's been listening to us every month or so for the past couple years as well agree on most things.”

We're all on the same team, we kind of love each other and we come out in the same place, you know, and I think what we're trying to do is reflect some of the internal questions that are being asked right now. And you know, at the end of the day, what we're saying here is candidates have got to run and they say, look, I'm going to fight back, I'm going to fight for you, and I'm going to fix stuff and they have to be believable. And, you know, however that gets articulated and it's going to be different different places, that is going to be a successful message. Now people listen to political podcasts, because it they're between pickleball appointments, but also pickleball, this is a revelation I've had this week, the demographics of pickleball and political podcasts are exactly the same.

Which is weird as shit, and I'm anti pickleball, but anyway, well you got listen, you got to work on that brother, yeah, you're fighting against the.

“I really don't know, I believe me, I understand I'm in the wrong place, but they come and one of the things they want is a payoff is, you know, hot predictions and what's going to happen.”

I'm going to start with my hot prediction of what's going to happen, it's going to be so outrageous, both of you are going to probably, you know, never speak to me again, because it's so ridiculous, but I'm going to hear, I'm going to stick my neck out, I'm going to tell you who the candidates will be in 2028. And who's going to win and who's going to win, okay, are you ready or what we're right at that okay, so the big story is going to be both candidates are from one state. Nobody nobody predicted that now you're like, let's say, isn't they're both they're both from Georgia, and it's going to be John Ossoff against Brian Camp.

And that's because Marco and JD are too tainted and they're going to want to have something tolerable as a kind of a Republican that isn't a throw back all the way to Bush is so. And John Ossoff is the purple mom Donnie. He's all right, he's the purple mom Donnie can go, okay, this is brilliant political analysis. And you're both like shaking your head like what I'm doing, I like David so insightful and thoughtful and you know, for Christ's sake, okay, go, I'm, you know, make a prediction or just tell me I'm an idiot either way.

“I think he, I think he very well could run if he has a really big win, which I hope that he does this fall. I, I, I worry that there is.”

A little, I think he's a really good speaker, public speaker. I think he can write up a crowd. I'm a little bit concerned about his ability to to have a bold vision and deliver on that vision. And he's going to be on to the auditory skills and the Trump, right, like we need somebody with vision. That's where I would not compare him to mom Donnie because mom Donnie has vision. I do, I also can't like, I think it's going to be Josh Holley.

Who has a base of support. I mean, it's going to be, oh, it's just, it's going to be as wild a primary on the right as it's going to be on the left.

And I've said this before, and I'll say it again until this person rises from some ash is, but I don't think we know who the Democratic candidate is yet. I certainly and not, wildly inspired by anyone that is eligible to run that that is planning to run at this system. Presumably Eric Swallow is off here to list out very very very very much so I was hoping we were going to get into that today. But well, so, so it's starting to have all of us thoughts if we want to do a bonus bonus research. So, well, wait, we can't, if you want, but I got a feeling that all of us think what he did is disgusting and reprehensible and it is a real indictment of the leadership of the Democratic party that there were whispers and they let it get to where it got.

And, you know, but that goes back to another.

But it also reinforces what a lot of people feel about the Democratic party is that they talk about both sides of their mental.

“That's what I'm saying. In order to actually build trust, it's not really about a brand, it's building trust.”

With the American people and that means you actually have to stand for the things you say you stand for. Yeah, I total, I totally agree with you.

Okay, I could finish that because I could tell you he's going to be this the Senate majority leader.

I appreciate you thinking out of the box there. David, because these, it often is the case that in presidential elections, it doesn't go the way that everyone thinks it's going to go at the beginning of the cycle. No, we're going to have a big field, or at least a big field of people who think they're going to run and will be trying to run.

“And I'm really looking forward to that actually because I think we're going to have a really serious debate about our future in 2028.”

But I think in the short term, you know, one of the things I just, I've been talking about is that I think we, what we have to realize about this election cycle. Which will make this election a little bit different than previous ones is that they're going to have a lot more money than they've had and that we will have. And our candidates are going to have our raising a lot of money and they're going to we're going to again beat our candidate to candidate we will have far more hard, hard dollars and we'll be able to.

You know, beat them in the day to day candidates up, but I think that part of what I've been arguing is that we, you know, the general election is going to start in a few weeks. The Trump super PAC is going to start going up with ads in May. They're going to be up through the summer and then the two party committee super PACs will pick up in August and September and finish for them. And Roy Cooper's already been talking about just the onslaught of negative ads that have started North Carolina, a very significant.

We need to start thinking about how the election is happening now and not in the summer and fall and to help the candidates, whoever your candidate is and whoever you like, whether it's in a primary as Tara was saying or, you know, somebody's already gotten through the primaries.

“The front loading our work and our money to help them now because there's going to be need for them to be communicating and so I think that I'm very optimistic about what's going to happen in the selection.”

But there are challenges ahead that we can't, you know, pretend or it's going to be there. They're going to fight with everything they got to preserve power and I think that, you know, one of the things that's most interesting day in this maybe not a prediction but this is an observation is that. Maga is going through some kind of ideological collapse right now I think that there isn't they have nothing to run on. They are in self preservation mode they're going to try to create things to run on I don't know if that means they'll try to like reverse the tariffs or something dramatic.

But you know, they are what's happened on the hill this week, we didn't really get into we are seeing a level of disarray. And in fighting in the Republican party that is I would argue is unprecedented in all the years that I've been in Washington I think we are witnessing the collapse of the regime right now Trump got beat yesterday on the Haiti TPS which is like this core foundational ethno nationalist issue for him and Steven Miller. He beat on Pfizer last night we got beat again on Pfizer last night they can't get the DHS funding through they can't get the save act done I mean Trump is his losing his grip over the city in a way that is going to be I think material and significant over the next few months they're party he is.

I say if I can say this a fuck up and a lame duck and and the Republicans are not just going to spend a lot of money to try to stay in power I think there is he's going to you know there is rebellion growing in DC against him. He's going to be consequential for the Republican party and which of course we should be encouraging and every moment you know of the law and the step of the way and so I think it's not a prediction David but I think that I think we are.

Totally agree we agree on so much that's why enjoy talking do so much because it doesn't sound like we agree but we do agree and so it's got you know we agree the way that friends agree on exactly well and may that may our example be followed by everybody else who shares our beliefs in any event will do this again. And we'll soon for now thank you very much to thank you very much Simon thank you very much Peter much er in Hungary and thank you everybody for listening and if you're following this need to know the subject please subscribe to the subject if you are following this on YouTube subscribe to YouTube if you're following this on the DSR network podcast then you know sign up there.

And we'll see you all again real soon bye bye.