Episode #107 Featuring Dr. Jeffrey Bland! The FATHER of FUNCTIONAL MEDICINE! The birth and future of Functional Medicine, EPIGENETICS, Immune System and metabolism, BIG BOLD HEALTH and more!

When we think of health, most think of diet, working out, or even stress level.

I like so many others overlooked the crucial importance of my mitochondria.

When you're mitochondria work better, everything works better. Maintaining muscle gets harder with age and cellular energy plays a significant role in strength and function. My world turned upside down when I learned about mitochondria gummies. Mite up here gummies are longevity gummies and the only clinically proven form of uralithine shown in human studies to help renew mitochondrial function, which is designed to support cellular energy, so you feel stronger and more vibrant as you age.

They are my key component to longevity and quality of life. Not only do they taste great, but they are sugar and elegant free, non-GMO and clean label projects certified. Support yourselves and how you age with Mite up here gummies from timeline. Visit timeline.com/dillingemeli to save up to 39% off your Mite up here gummies. That's timeline.com/dillingemeli.

All right, everybody, welcome back to the Dillingemeli podcast. So a quick little bit before I introduce my guest today just to give you a little piece on how excited I am. So I just put out my hundredth episode and I actually was speaking with these representatives in France, and they are wanting to license the show on the airlines. And the point in this is not that I'm something great is that it made me reflect on my guests.

“Because they want to know who's your best guest, who are you looking at?”

And I was looking and I thought, oh, I know exactly what I'm going to do here and who I'm going to pick out. And then I got to look at it and I'm like, oh my gosh, I interviewed this person, this person, this person, this person and it was like, whoa. Wow, what a reflection. My point in saying this is, while I have interviewed some of the most brilliant, most respected, best minds of the world.

I was just interviewing Dr. William Lee, like I was telling you, and I told him, I said, I've never said this out loud.

Excite to my wife possibly in conversation that I have this short bucket list of people that I absolutely have to interview that I want to so bad. And it's very, very short. My point here with this whole story is that my guest today is on that list. So my ultimate blessings that always keep coming true, that the guests keep coming to me. He's here today, so I'm knocking that list down, and I'm so thankful.

So briefly, because there's no introduction that is good enough for my guest, but I'm going to do my best. So he's a globally respected thought leader. He spent more than four decades advancing human health widely recognized as the father of functional medicine, which is true. And, you know, doing research under Linus Pauling, which we'll talk about, authored over 120 peer-reviewed publications, best selling books.

The disease delusion co-founded the Institute or functional medicine. The personalized lifestyle medicine institute in Big Bold Health, like I said, no introduction can do you justice. Thank you for coming to see me, and thank you for making my day. I appreciate you being here, Dr. Jeffrey Blanth. Wow, Dylan.

Wow, wow. Thank you. What a glorious intro. And one that I hope I can live up to in this discussion with you. That's incredible. That is super easy for you, my friend. You are known as the father of functional medicine, which to me, I mean, beyond what that says because of the impact that we see that it has now.

But on someone like myself who, you know, I didn't know what functional medicine was for many years.

Never heard of it, but I know what's been in my head and what I've been doing and researching.

And to know that you've, have been such a key and integral part of that for so many people.

“What is, what is that like, like, what made you at the beginning?”

Look for this and look for something different and not just accept what was being told to you. Well, thank you. This is Kevin, epic moment for me and my life actually. And that question is really the pivotal question because next week I turn 80. Wow. And just to think about that, eight decades, it's almost a little bit threatening actually.

But then when I look back, I say, it's 80 remarkable years in which I have met some of the most incredible people. I've traveled over six million miles. That's, that's I think that's 44 trips around the earth equivalent. And that's over 50 years. So it wasn't all in one year. But that average is out to 125,000 miles a year for 50 years.

Basically, it's what that means. It's not just the hotels and the planes, it's the people I've met over that period of time. People that are thought leaders across all sorts of disciplines. And I've been a professor at a medical school for 12 years. It was a tenured professor.

I started or been involved with 26 companies over my, my years, which I find it hard to believe.

“My middle son asked me, said, Dad, you think you're a businessman?”

And I said, no, I'm really, I'm really a teacher. I don't really think of myself as a businessman.

Across all medical laboratories. And so how does this all weave itself together? And so to answer your question as to how functional medicine came about, I probably have to go back just really quickly to a conversation I had with my, my dear mother who's now deceased and kind of the latter part of her life that we shared together.

“And what she said, you know, Jeff, when I think back to you as a boy, young boy,”

you were always a thousand question guy.

It was it was never enough time to answer all your questions. And it's why your father and I went out and we really couldn't afford it. But we want this encyclopedia Britannico. So we'd have something that we can answer a lot of these questions. And this is a way before the internet, obviously, I was born in, in 46.

And so the thought was for me as to why do people get sick? And it started off with me learning about infectious disease. So that was probably during high school. But then I recognized that there was a great number of people who got sick,

that really never had an infection in the traditional sense of bacteria of virus.

And, and I asked, well, where does that come from? And the answer to that at that time that I'm not speaking about the 60s is what's in their genes. It's a genetic characteristics. So if you have a family with heart disease, you've got heart disease. If it's breast cancer and women, you get breast cancer and so forth and so on.

And that didn't really just stack up for me. Because when I started looking what we were learning about genetics in the, in the 60s, it didn't seem that all these disorders that we're having with heart disease and diabetes and dementia and cancers and arthritis were, what we call mono genetic disorders, meaning they were tied to a specific gene.

They appear to be much more confusion than a single gene.

And then, of course, what happened with the deciphering of the book of life, the human genome, in the Rose Garden review of the fact that we now can say what there's 23 chapters that make up our book of life, 23 pairs of chromosome, half of the stories written by our biological mother, the other half by our biological father. What did they really tell us? And when they told us not as two we are, but they told us who we could be.

“And that's a really important differentiation.”

You couldn't see from the genes from the book of life exactly how that person looked at can felt. But you could understand something about what their potential was for how they could look at and feel. And there was a lot of different plasticity in the way that could be expressed. And that led me into this whole concept of genetic expression. That what controls genetic expression, not you can't change the genes,

but maybe you can change how the genes speak to our body in such a way to create how we look at can feel. And that occurred for me somewhere around the time that I had this fortune of being asked by two time Nobel Prize winner on his following. If I would come in on sabbatical, I was a professor at the time and run a research lab down in Palo Alto in Institute, Stanford. And those two years were like changing for me. I want to set the context, at that point in my life, this was 80, 183.

I had a family, I had children, my oldest son at that point was in the eighth grade. My middle son was in the fifth grade and we just had an infant son. And so I had a mortgage, I had a family, I had a house, all those kind of things that people have. And I had tenure and I was well respected at the university. I was very lucky the president, the university, most of the like me, because I could teach in different departments at big research grant.

It's over and so on. But my two years at the longest following is to do it in my conversations with Dr. Pauline and his wife, David Helen, Pauline, was a remarkable force of nature. Let me to recognize it, maybe I needed to take my background and interest into a different classroom. And so when I got home from driving back with my family to Seattle from Palo Alto, California, I made my mind up to give up my tenure faculty position and to start a company to teach doctors how to do nutritional medicine in their practice.

I knew nothing about business, I had no business plan, I really say, "Bring the boats."

“That's what happened, I bring the boats, I was now on shore and I had to make a life out of there.”

And so it allowed me to really focus all my energies into how do I take what I've learned from Dr. Pauline and many others and to create something that could be a value that's different and exists. So my wife Susan had a brilliant idea, this was 1987. She said, "Jeff, you know, you've talked about all these people you meet around the world, the thought leaders, these innovators, maybe it would be interesting. We put a meeting on that we've hosted, just an invited meeting, maybe 40 to 50 people that are representing these different people you've seen around the world.

Invite the men if they want to come in and spend maybe a week in with us and Vancouver British Columbia and Vancouver Island up in Canada and just talk about what the healthcare system could be. Let's take off licensure, let's take off reimbursement, let's just talk about what it could be if it were to optimize it. So that turned out to be an unbelievably stimulant, you can imagine when you bring your best friends and colleagues in and you sit around it with a whiteboard and you just talk about ideas for two to three days.

And that meeting, then I got this idea that what we had been talking about was the dividing or maybe creating of a different kind of healthcare system.

There's not focused on disease, but was focused on health. And to do that, we have to ask what is health.

“And if you have to go out and ask people at large, how do they perceive health in their lives?”

It turns out that we've learned that they really talk about function. You talk about physical function, they talk about metabolic function, they talk about cognitive function, and they talk about behavioral function. And so I say, "Where does it get taught in disease care systems?"

Where does that get learned? How does it get incorporated within the concepts that really guide reimbursement and medical intervention today?

And I reckon they didn't. Those concepts were not in no way to codified those concepts of function that were existing in our system. So I came back, and I had this kind of dream at night, on its Saturday night, came back to the group that was Sunday morning of our last day. And I said, "Hey, we've been meeting for two years, and I came up with this idea. Why don't we call this functional medicine?" And everyone looked at me and it were very nice and a little bit patronizing and said, "Yeah, that's not a really good word."

Because, you know, function, at that point, I don't want to remind. This was 1988, '89, yeah. Functional medicine, at that point, was either two words. One is rehabilitative medicine with geriatrics, people that are broken down and injured. Or all in your mind, it's psychology, it meant functional medicine, being a functional illness, was a psychosomatic illness. It wasn't real. And so they said, "We're carrying some bad baggage here with that term." And then I said, "But that's true." But I've been watching the literature, I'm kind of a biblio file, to say at the least,

I follow the medical literature, and they're now new reports coming out from really esteemed groups, talking about functional radiology, functional cardiology, functional interconnectology. Maybe we ought to be skating to where the book is going to use the old hockey in metaphor, and picked that term up, because it's a term that doesn't carry a lot of bad baggage with it. And we can define what that means in the years to come. Well, maybe because my wife and I set up the meeting, people said, "Okay, well, let's give it a whirl."

And so we started in 1990 with my wife forming the Institute for Functional Medicine, which, you know, now that I look back, what is this 35-six years later, I can't believe we've grown up to a couple hundred thousand talks going through the programs and a textbook and approval for continuing medical education in medical school with a Cleveland Clinic Center of Functional Medicine. So it was sticky and caught somehow a missing link that was not there before.

“So for one to become a practicing functional practitioner or doctor, do they have to have a doctorate from college or is that something they can obtain from you?”

Or how does that work? Yeah, I'm thank you. So we set up two principles when we established the Institute for Functional Medicine. Number one is that we wanted to be agnostic to people who had health science backgrounds or interests. So we were not going to discriminate among different degrees. That was number one. Number two is, but we were going to ask for people willing to reopen textbooks that they may not have liked. Cell biology, biochemistry, nutrition, things that they didn't, they probably had to take, but they didn't really like.

We wanted them to reopen it and learn it in a different way. My colleagues, because I would have been an academic medical professor, it said to me, "Jeff, you're never going to find people to do that." You know, when they get through with this stuff and they go out and they get into the world, they don't want to go back and study that stuff. They didn't like it the first time, but I think we've been proven that wrong, that we've now had several hundred thousand people that are willing to do that. So we're not discriminating against individuals with specific kinds of pedigrees. What we're discriminating with people willing to really step up and become experts in this way to think about function.

And in second, or thirdly, we established in the Functional Medicine beginning that the thought that we always wanted to be at the leading edge.

We didn't necessarily want to be at the leading edge, but we wanted to be at the leading edge. And it turned out that that goal is a little bit more complicated. Now that I've come 35 years down the road, because to be approved for continuing medical education for physicians, that's so called category one credit, you have to be approved by a group called the ACC/ME American College of Continuing Medical Education. In order to get approved by them, your curriculum has to be reviewed and it has to follow some principles of usual in customary or standards of care.

That makes it very difficult to teach at the cutting edge, because now you're always balancing how far can we push the envelope to include that material in our curriculum.

“So that's what led me then, but to form a second organization called the Personalized Lifestyle Medicine Institute that we started 14 years ago.”

And that institute, I didn't go after continuing medical education. I said, "No, in this case, we want to be teaching anything we want." And that, whatever we do there, could be a feeder into IFM as it becomes more well-adopted. So now I have the PLMI and the Personalized Lifestyle Medicine Institute, which then is a not-for-credit education institute. And by the way, we have 85,000 professionals in that now. And then that's a feeder into the Institute for Functional Medicine with their curriculum that can be continued and approved.

Yeah, and the way I set that up is I said, "Let's think this is a no-charge course of curriculum." So we set up kind of a different business model there to make it supported. I have a fantastic Nicole Fox who is the manager of that business. And so what we do is we provide 10 to 12 courses a year for, and then we have different experts, I moderate those, and then we have people that are experts in these different fields across the whole range of fields. Those end up on our website that are codified their video, and they can be then looked at for free and downloaded.

It's a PLM Institute.org or is our website. And then we do two on-site meetings a year, one on the spring and one on the fall that are kind of to bring warm fuzzies together, so people can get together collaboratively.

“So how long does it would it take one to become a functional doctor then?”

They can call themselves a functional doctor as soon as they've gone through what we call the applying function medicine and clinical practice program, which is the basically intro that overviews the whole curriculum in two to three days. Okay. See, like for me, when you talk about people not wanting to open the books and go back to it, I would be the complete opposite. I would want to know everything. Everybody I talked to, and you know this, I want to know everything. Exactly. I'm like no stone on turn, and I think I think there's probably more people like that, you know, that do want to know things or otherwise they wouldn't be doing it.

That's right. Are be interested? I think the people that are the most interested are the most curious and the ones that want the answers and the ones that ask. You just said it. And that I feel of all the things that have happened in the 35 years of the function medicine movement, the thing that I am most pleased with is that we've been able to show people are a lot more curious and willing to work hard for clinical skills than they were given credit for it.

“And you know, I believe that health care providers across all disciplines in the main are very dedicated and they're very purpose driven.”

And they really are concerned about their patients and they do want them to get better. It's not not all just a bunch of money grabbing individuals and I want to, we want to do is make the system consistent with their goals. When they went into this field, if they felt disillusioned, we want to re-enchant them with being a service to people through health care. And that's the functional medicine model. So if that's the whole objective what we're trying to do.

Do you feel satisfied or gratified or happy with where it's gone now? Do you feel like there's still a lot more work to be done in the teachings or do you feel very good about how quickly that it's come about? Because I mean, in the past five years, I would say if not maybe a little bit more like I would say it's almost exploded.

And it's a, to me, it's a beautiful thing to see people that are willing to ask questions that know that's a good thing to know that there's always things to look for and ways to improve.

And that nobody knows everything. And instead of accepting or be getting offended by being questioned, it's the consistency and the desire to keep moving, keep learning. And do you feel good about that? Do you feel like you've really made that impact into people's lives? You are such a great narrator. I mean, you've captured that was almost like a drop of the mic summary of anything that could spit back to you. That's the whole reason that for it's the whole reason for what we're trying to do.

And I think what's happened is a consequence of some remarkable people that have caught the energy of the functional medicine movement and brought their creative energies into it. That we're starting to get sticking is at all levels. And I'm going to, when we started to, thanks to Mark. I'm in the Dr. Mark, I'm in Dr. Patrick Hanoi to actually have a functional medicine clinic in the Cleveland Clinic, one of the world renowned medical centers.

At first, everybody was saying, well, that'll never last, it'll never survive.

But now it is growing up. It's taken over more space. It's booked out over a year with appointments. It's one of the most active clinics in all of the Cleveland Clinic. And so that then kind of stimulates other individuals to get involved. Now we find out that this most recent Mahabh Make America Healthy Movement has started to embrace the concepts of functional medicine. And there is now in the government money that's been set aside in this next budgetary round.

Several millions of dollars to do functional medicine research. And so there'll be studies that will go on and all sorts of different centers that will really codify and support how this is going to improve patient outcomes. Lower cost and lead to improve function, which rather than just treat the symptoms, it we're really going to get to the root cause and and get people back functioning eye.

“This is where I struggle a little bit is I never understand or grasp why people get so down on the the wants to dig into seeing to learn to how to prevent this and they're so accepting of this is it and this is the only way.”

And I always tell people, I'm not going to say exactly how I say it, but I'm not your half in dad like you do whatever you want to do.

Right, do whatever you want to do, but at least know that there's options here and there's other ways and means to do things. Everybody always wants to say there's more than one way to scan a cap, but there's also.

There's different ways to treat illnesses and sicknesses and every single person is wired differently.

So some people are allergic to something, some people don't do well with anything. So why the kickback on looking into different ways or why the kickback into questioning the way that certain studies were being put out. When it's right there in front of you that some of these are manipulated. My simple answer now, I'm sure that this is a much more complicated story than I'm going to make it, but my simple answer to that having been in this field now for the better part of 50 years is it.

“Well, we all think that what we've learned is the only thing that we should learn because we are codified, we took exams, we got tested, we had to learn things, we had to work with that knowledge.”

And so we want to think that what we learned is the only thing that we needed to know because we might be certified or we might have a license or we might be accredited or we might be have a reputation. And so those things give us an identity and those identities can be really limiting in terms of how we would see ourselves and I want to give a person example of this because I need this transformation myself.

So what happened to me when I started off in my professorship in 1970 was my first real job as a professor.

I was I think I would say was a very very traditional clinical biochemist in a medical world and I've been trained all by medical school faculty and gone through that whole. Rob by fire education system and you know I was a good student progressed nicely and so when I got this job which I consider was really wonderful then I wanted to behave like I should usual in customary but then something happened in my life that open up my ability to kind of look beyond my own limitations some four weeks actually three and a half weeks to be true.

When I and our two sons I had a two year old son and an infant son moved to our first place in this city where we were going to start my career. I really didn't know anybody or anything at that point we just moved in and on and behold unfortunately when I woke up early in the morning I went out to find that my youngest son our infant was dead.

“So I don't want to overly dramatizes but I think anybody who hears that story would say that's a life changer right there.”

I mean there's no taking that back I could go on into more explanation but I think that's just enough to set that as a point where ultimately to try to make any sense of that in my life.

I actually said his name was Kurt that if I can help one set of parents or one individual in the world to prevent this from happening then it's a life full serve so I have to be open to all new ideas. To be open to anything that may sound peculiar at first but I need to look at it before I reject it because medicine could not give a simple answer to why he had at this end up there was no evidence why. I think over the years we now got an explanation this has been you know over 50 years now but it was what changed my whole direction and maybe open to learning at levels that I probably would have not been other than that stimulation.

“So I think that for people they have to get out of their comfort and and recognize that there's there are things on the other side that they may learn that will open up all sorts of business for them.”

And rather than reject out of hand they ought to say well I don't understand then it doesn't seem to make sense but I'm going to look into it. See and like I'm a super spiritual guy and and I understand the concept of there's things that happen in our lives without explanation that are terrible at the time but then there's a reason for it and your reason was clearly to make the impact in the worlds and I can say that without exaggeration for the world in what you've done and not to take away from what happened because that made my stomach sink when you told me that but then to understand why and to know why.

Because it was shaping you for what you're doing and when we figure that out that also makes us become the best we could ever be that that these things that they happen but there's ultimately a reason then when you look back and see it you say wow you know wow I don't want to take away from anything else we're talking about but that just made me. I want to point that out and what you've persevered and what you did because of that and I'm sure still drives you to this day yeah it does. I just want to just take a moment to recognize that because I find that perseverance and vigilance or two of the best of virtues that a person could ever.

have and be bestowed with and I just such a level of respect and gratitude for you for everything. Thank you. I had Dylan really I've had more than my fair share from Markable moments and but one that I wanted to mention because I think it's indicative of what you're saying so. I have three sons now. Kelly is 56. Kyle is 53 and Justin is 43. Our baby when Justin was was born he was born with a cerebral bleed and he ended up having have a shunt put in as reable shunt.

Well for now he's now 43 he's just finished his second masters and he graduated magna cum laude in behavioral psychology and he's just if if you met him you would think this is one remarkable person he is well read he loves people he tells me he's an old soul and I think he is so we we look at these miracles and how do they happen so what happened. But I think is symbolic for anyone about their own life there's this there's a message here so I every year at the Institute for functional medicine and we'll meeting get a chance to give some talk about the state of the union what do I think is really happening so this particular year this is about four years ago the focus of the meeting was on a neurological health and brain positivity.

I was thinking about my talk and I was thinking you know I had to have an expert in the field to share this like a neuroscientist for someone to share the putting with me to talk about what's going on. Who do I know that really knows about neurological plasticity and then of course I thought oh well. My son probably knows more about the city of the world. He's lived through this and he didn't even see in three dimensions until he was six years old he had such matched for business it he was seeing the world in two dimensions.

I think of that and he was compensating for it when we didn't even know it until he was tested and we found out that that was a personal problem that he had and he had which by the way he was able to be trained he trained himself out of by going to a special courses. So I then asked him if you wanted to share the podium with me at this meeting in front of twelve hundred medical people and he said yeah well that would really be cool I'd really like to do that so the night before we were practicing at his flashcards and I came about midnight and I said hey you know you got this down let's let's just call it a night now and tomorrow you'll be already for the talk and so then here it is the meeting starts by that time he's made friends with a lot of people in the convention.

“He really good on names and people so he's kind of something figured out a lot of the important people that were there and so we start I do my introduction.”

And then said I'd like to introduce to my son who's going to speak about really what does brain plasticity means if you're living in that brain and with that brain.

So he steps up and he gives this really absolutely brilliant talk and it was just so moving and so then I knew he was coming to the end because we'd practice and that before so I I started to stand up to take back the podium. So we'd make this transition and he turns to me and he says so dad I'm not done yet and it's like okay so I sat down and then he said.

“So I just want all of you to know out there you know we all travel with with challenges and issues and and it really comes down to often what is your support?”

How do you see yourself through this? How do you define yourself that you can be a victor and now loser?

He said so I just want to acknowledge it my parents I never once in my life thought I was going to be a loser.

They continually told me that I could be a winner they continually supported me they continually brought me into concerts and communication with other people who saw me better than I saw myself and he said. So I just want to give thanks to my father and mother because I would not be here and there was not a dry eye in that whole house and you can imagine. But there's there's a story there for all of us right about acknowledgement about staying to task about looking for the good side to how you amplify those things knowing that we all carry stuff with us sometimes baggage we need to throw off the back and move on.

So yeah I think to me all these are parts of the when you ask me how did functional medicine gain in personality these are my experiences with functional medicine that are incorporated kind of into the into the as I guess that's what I love about it because it's it's remarkable. It's remarkable in multitudes of ways but I think beyond what you just said in the ability to take on concepts that are we're told or irreversible or not curable and to go head on and disagree with that.

And then prove that a lot of these things are incorrect and instead of just sitting back and accepting what we're told because it's the easy thing to do.

Because I've thought about this and I've thought why are people it's not like there's monetary value for just regular old people so why are they so divisive and angry and and it's because it's so much easier to accept and fall in line as opposed to having to work and think and look and understand that there's other areas.

“And it's so easy and it it angers people to think that they needed to do that and they're lied yes and then you have to look at it.”

See I used to look at it from the wrong perspective they're just they're just this group of people and this is just the attitude but it's everybody yeah it's not just one group of people. It's all kinds of different people that are mis programmed misguided and misled and that's why I do what I do with people like you is to try to convey the message of.

It's up to you to decide what you want to do but understand there's a lot of things that were told that aren't necessarily accurate and I just love the fact that we have this alternative and people that are willing to talk about it and do it and now have the balls to say no no more.

“You're not shutting me down you're not stopping me I just love that and I think that you are the backbone of that.”

Thank you.

You will you are I mean because you what you've taught it gives people hope what you've uncovered it gives people that will to look for more and to not give up you know.

And I think that is just beyond commendable and that's it's just why I personally have so much gratitude and why I'm thankful to be able to present you to people so they know. Thank you. I think that you've said something given that I want to capture it because I think it's a really important thing this word hope as a person in the biological sciences there are two paradigms or two concepts that are dominant that everybody learns and memorizes and recites on demand as if it were a given truth.

“And those are Mendelian genetics from the monk regrimindle that we learned about dominant and recessive genes and that we are a product of our genetic inheritance.”

And then the other was Charles Darwin the concept of natural selection survival of the fittest.

Those two principles have guided our society we we have social Darwinism we have social Mendelianism. It's a way of things some people are better than others because they got the luck of the better genes or that they survived it to expensive another person because they're more competitive. Those models are richly built into our whole architecture of our culture.

“And in medicine and as as a as a medical person gone through all these years of training I recognize it when I was a student of Mendelian genetics and and felt that we were already determined by the event of the sperm meeting the egg.”

And then you put on top of that those it's survivor going to be the most competitive now you've got a system in medicine that is really saying doctors are omniscient. They have information known else has they will then give that information to people that are sick that are coming to them as losers to make them winners. So they will give them the right nostrums are the right tools that they're going to rescue them from bad genes. And then they will make them more competitive in life and now now when I say now I mean since 2003 so that's only 23 years ago a new concept was born and when it was born it is now transforming the whole of healthcare.

It hasn't completely saturated it but it will I guarantee it probably not while I'm still on the planet but it will soon and that is the concept of epigenetics.

Epigenetics now epigenetics is a powerful frame shifter let me just quickly give a primer quarries in a minute of epigenetics.

So if we ask a question how is it that when a sperm and an egg meet together to make one cell that that through fetal development will ultimately produce a fully developed female or male that now has hundreds of different cell types in it. There is hard skin all these different cell types and hold it just a minute you're telling me one cell is now going to become many trillions of cells of different personality how can that be. We're in from embryology we study this the the the godfather of neurology was a gentleman by the amount of wanting to now study out of this textbook. And what it says is that as the development of the embryo occurs and it starts to develop the different tissue levels that only portions of the book of life are going to be expressed in certain cell types as it evolves based upon their environment so when that next cell develops it's only going to express information really to the nervous system.

Or to the to the basculer and so you say well how does that occur and it was said epigenetics because it's above the genes it's something that's for causing the genes to be expressed in a different way didn't change the genes. It just changed how they're read then we said well what is epigenetics and for the loss of years it was not a well understood process and but over the last 20 or 30 years with cell biology evolving. We see the actual processes the stuff that is stuck on our genes to change how those genes will express themselves those are the epigenetic modifiers. Now here's the big aha.

In the last 20 to 20 to 20 three and investigator at Duke University and his postdoctoral student Randy Jürtles his name and Robert Waterland decided they would do an experiment. What seemed very maybe trivial at the time. They would take this certain type of mouse it was used in research for diabetes and obesity and cancer called the a goody mouse it had a genetic mutant of a gene called the a goody gene.

So it's full late then be 12 batting and vitamin B6 so they put those nutrients in supplemental level in the diet of the pregnant mother early in her pregnancy. And then the offspring were born people the people working in the study looked down and they rushed to Jürtles often they said we don't understand what's happened you got to come down and take a look at these offspring these these pups they did not look at all like the parents really. The parents have kind of white L of fur and they get very pumping and they're characteristic and many many studies down around the world that everybody knows what in the goody mouse looks like know these were very slender and they had when it were called pseudo a goody fur it was it was a model gray color fur.

“They live 35% longer than their parents they didn't get diabetes and they didn't go to least and they had the identical same genes. Wow how does that happen this birth the field of nutritional epigenetics.”

So since that discovery you talk about hope now we say we are reforming our bodies every time we eat think act or be.

We're sending information to our genes that re packages how our genes are going to be expressed to give rise of a different outcome. So when we talk about ultra-process foods and we see it's relationship to the obesity epidemic how does that happen it's calories it's vitamins and metals and protein's carbohydrate power how does that happen because we're sending information to the genes epigenetically. That is a hostile type that the genes perceive as being foreigners and dangerous and what is our body do when it's exposed to danger it does what it's supposed to do the immune system goes on guard and starts fighting back that's called inflammation.

“Yeah, and what are the diseases we have of today information what is obesity isn't and it's a metabolic inflammatory disease.”

And so what we are seeing is the epigenetic remodeling of the human population by what we've chosen to feed people these ultra-process foods. So what happens if you feed different information from foods that come from natural sources those same genes respond differently because they're imprinted by those messages in an entirely different way. This has opened up the field of nutrition in a way that now we have food is medicine.

What's for the first time in the 2026 dietary guidelines in the United States the first new guidelines we've had since 1971 what have they mentioned food is medicine.

“This is the whole new concept that is going to revolutionize how nutrition is seen and it's going to call question into the way we've been feeding people.”

What I say is we have been engaged for the last 50 years in an uncontrolled experiment called ultra-process foods. Yeah, we didn't elect to be in that study but we're in that study it's not placebo controlled and what are the results that we're seeing is they're coming out now. Yeah, exactly.

We don't need to do big data analysis to see the results of that experiment.

Arcuses cancer diabetes dementia arthritis obesity these are all the outcomes from that experiment so our genes are responding to what they see as hostility producing these effects on our body. What if I told you that one molecule will help keep your body system cleansed supported immune health and cellular protection all at once. I'm talking about glutofion aka the body's master antioxidant it exists inside nearly every cell helping to protect DNA proteins and cell membranes from oxidative stress as well as playing a major role in liver cleansing mitochondrial energy production and immune balance.

Unfortunately, pollution, toxins and stress can rapidly deplete glutofion levels and as we age glutofion production decreases as well and many traditional glutofion supplements do not absorb well, making it extremely difficult to raise intracellular levels where glutofion actually works. And that's why I use glutofil, the multi patented topical glutofion developed by the amazing doctor Niam Patel instead of relying on digestion glutofil absorbs through the skin helping provide a convenient and consistent way to support the body's most important antioxidant system.

So use my link in the description and code Dylan to say 15% off today. I had multiple appearances that I've had on shows recently and I just keep stressing that we can take all the supplements in the world. We can train all we want. We can do everything under the sun, but the food is the medicine and it's taken me a long time to come to that conclusion myself. And I'm talking somebody that has studied nutrition from the age of 11 now granted that was due to an eating disorder body dysmorphia, but I've spent my entire life studying food and understanding every single concept from food labels to where they're coming from to how they're made and what's going on and between and how it's affecting our body.

I am no genius by any stress to the imagination, but when you put your life's work into something you see it and I know exactly what you're saying and I agree thoroughly and that's why I open up about my own struggles and the changes that I've made once I finally figured it out and like I would argue and I'm curious your thoughts on this because I like to personalize some of the things that I've done because I know people struggle with some of the things I've done through and then we can help them with that.

I thoroughly believe that that is one of the reasons I had plaque in my arteries considering I'm an athlete of high level and all the things I've done and they contributed to several things that thankfully I found early enough, but I think the purpose was so that I could educate people.

“But I would argue that things like that and those low fat foods that are made and stripped of every nutrient and then put God knows what into them.”

I would argue that that is a prevalent problem and then the things that you brought up from the seed oils from all of the contaminants and food, the red dyes, the artificial sweeteners and the keywords are artificial artificial artificial and people.

If you get used to saying these terms and you don't realize what they are artificial die, glyphosate, if you break it down, what it actually is, round up.

Well, I mean, rate or whatever the shit is they're put in our food, if you say this stuff and then you sit there and you repeat it, you go. We're eating that, but nobody knows, but you gotta say it. This is so much fun. I can't tell you how much I'm enjoying this up. So I was, I'm around long enough that I was involved as a young man in the Montgomery committee hearings back in the late 60s. Yep. That led to the previous dietary goals in the United States, which were published in 1971, and those of your viewers who are not familiar with what those previous dietary guidelines did is a day chastise fat.

So it basically was a series of guidelines saying we got to remove fat out of the diet, particularly saturated fat, but all calories of fat. So what happened with the food industry is they said, okay, these are going to be the new guidelines and we're now going to have these new regulations called the National Food Labeling Act in LEA. So we are going to abide by these regulations, but we need to do this in a way that's very profitable for us, so we can make foods that are cheap and charged money to make profit. And so the way we're going to do this is we're going to put a lot of refined carbohydrate and sugar, particularly fructose and high fructose corn syrup sweetener in to fill those calories.

Because people were saying that sugar is okay and fat is bad. Now, what were the results of that experiment on the human population? When I was in school in the 60s, early 60s, there was no such thing as metabolic syndrome. In fact, there was hardly any discussion about type 2 diabetes. It was still an artifact. Diabetes when you talked about it was type 1 diabetes, where you lost your insulin secreting cells in your beta cells of your pancreas. But in the starting in the 70s and even in really accelerating into the 90s, metabolic syndrome insulin resistance obesity, dyslipidemia became the principal causes of chronic disease and premature death.

And then the drug industry said, okay, we have a real opportunity here. We're going to find ways to block these processes. So we'll find the drug for that and the drug for this and we'll just go down the metabolic pathways and we'll find the right things that will interfere with these things. So the person doesn't have high blood sugar or they don't have high blood pressure or they don't have high blood cholesterol. And we'll say, we're a winner. And so the food industry produced these foods and actually I know this is going to sound probably a little bit species, but it's the truth. I was invited in the 80s, probably as a heretic lecture at the annual meeting in the National Food Processing Association, their annual meeting, their big meeting, which was in Florida.

And I know they had invited me because they felt they had one kind of weirdo on the program. And so to look like they had a balanced program. So they stuck me actually as a speaker on the early morning at eight o'clock after their big evening banquet with a lot of celebration. So I expected knowing that it was going to be there. But there were people there in the morning when I came in. And so when I was announced as just introduced and went to the podium and I said, so I want to thank the organizers of this meeting very much for their opportunity to speak on this topic.

“I think it's a very important topic. And I also want to say on behalf of the American Pharmaceutical Association, how much they appreciate all the hard work that this industry has done.”

To reduce low profit margin foods that you've worked so hard for to generate the business for their high profit margin pharmaceutical drugs.

Now you can imagine how that went over. Yeah, it's like I did get people's attention. I think they wanted to hook me out the stage when I was able to get the talk done.

I was being somewhat humorous, but really not. I mean, this is part of what we got ourselves into this duly, which is why I'm so excited about the 2026 dietary guidelines because

“I throw away the whole inverted fruit food pyramid kind of debate. I think that's who cares. But we really care about is that we've recognized the food principles that we were using.”

Since 1971 to 1926 were misappropriating and causing an epidemic, a pandemic greater than that of it certainly greater than AIDS, and greater than SARS-CoV-2.

It's an existential crisis in our society. So to me, what we're witnessing right before is the convergence of all these new bits of information.

Then we can ask that we can put the glyphosate in there. We could put the whole food supply system and help of our soils. And the difference between regenerative agriculture and commercial agriculture that is based on throughput and yield versus quality and nutrition. All these things become part of the equation that we're now dealing with for which, by the way, I acknowledge there's no simple answer. But yeah, the answers will come from asking the right questions and recognizing that what we've been doing is killing a lot of people.

“Yeah, it's killing a lot. And people, one said, one of my colleagues, you know, he said it's somewhat, I think he was like, but I think the substance was very serious. He said,”

"Chef, you know, people are dying to know what we know. People are dying to know what we know. And I've lost friends over the years as a consequence in the fact that they just stay in on track with something you could see was doing them in.

But it was easy, it was customary, it was normative, it was part of their daily behavior and they eventually wrote their own epithet.

So I think that these are really important questions that we're dealing with and I want to applaud you for what you're doing in this podcast because it's all about first being educated to be awake to the fact that there are these things that we can do something about. And it's so prevalent in all things. I think food is probably one of the biggest perpetrators, the more that I've understood, granted, there's a lot when it comes to drugs, of course. But I think it's too obvious. And I think that if you dig deep enough, it's really the food is number one.

And then the drugs, like you said, create the problem, wow, there's a problem there. Now we can give you 35 different things and then you could argue, well, people are living longer than they ever have, well, what's the quality of life? What is the amount of time spent in the hospital? What's the amount of drug use that you have them on? And then you start looking at that and you do the math and it's like, well, how many years of your life were shitty and how many of them were actually quality? And then when you look at those numbers, it would blow your mind one of the things that I've changed and I can and I speak this so that people understand what we're saying.

I was eating like 15 to 20 grams of fat a day if I was lucky. Now I'm eating 130 and you know, I had plaque in my arteries and all of this and everything. And I've up my calories a thousand. It was eating no fat of any kind of an impenetcut or now like shit before I came here, I just had 50 grams of fat in the avocados and butter and everything else. You know what, I have never been this like cognitively just locked in even when I don't sleep my blood panels and everything particle sizes.

“Each DL through the roof the only thing that went up a little bit was LDL but of course it did because of the, you know, the certain fast but is that bad.”

You know, that's another debate, right? But well, if it's not oxidized, it's not bad.

Exactly. If it's oxidized, it's bad. Noxidized comes from when you're eating crap that produces oxidation. Yeah. My LDL small particles were over 6,000 other down the 22. I'd say that's a pretty drastic improvement. But then then poses the question like you said and I'd love that you brought this up. I'll give you an example. And it was about the acceptance of what you were being told and just dying. So when I found the plaque in my arteries, imagine my shock. Well, then I started and this is how I discovered Linus Pauling which I'll get into was digging into it and finding that I had an extremely elevated LP little A and then understanding, okay, this is a different ball game that we're playing with here.

Why me and when I tell you I studied, boy, did I study and then I said, okay, we're going to go to the Mayo Clinic and Minneapolis, which is supposed to be like the end all be all for hearts.

“And you can imagine my disgust upon going up there with my boat load of what I, but I was very respectful. You don't want to go in there and piss off a doctor, right?”

And they, I tell them I want to take a PCS K9 inhibitor. I've already got it laid out. I want repath, I want to take the seep a knowing that the pure form that it is of what you would take as fish oil, which is another topic we could get into. And them to tell me it would be bad practice to recommend that and to only use a statin, which I indicated will increase the LP little A caused me more problems than I've ever had. One of the rare times I got into a fight with my both my mom and my wife was on that right home. Telling me, well, you don't know more than them and they haven't questioned me since.

Because I, the argument of being able to reverse this and that and see in my numbers and what's happened in the past three years because of my resistance to listen to that bullshit. You know, so what you said is dead on, if you don't have the know and understanding or the ability to go seek out what you need, you just take what they give you and think that you're doing right. And it's not, it, it is deadly. So you said so many great things you're doing. I mean, each one of those we could, but let me, let me focus on one that I think so exemplifies what you and I are sharing here.

So you talked about best seepup. So, best seepup is a modified isopinthold derivative of a gas up in denoic and that's it.

You would say, oh, hold it. They've got a lot of fat in their blood. So we need to take fat out of their diet.

“But if you do that in that kind of person, their blood fats will go up. So then you say, well, what's the solution? The solution is to learn something from the innuets in Greenland.”

The innuets that were studied by a colleague of mine, Dr. Diaburg back in the 50s, he's Danish. In his colleague, Dr. Bang went to Greenland and studied the innuets in natives. And found that there are triglycerides in their blood were extraordinarily low, below 60. Wow. And these are people who were eating 90% of their calories as fat. What was a fat? Marine oils. They're eating seals. They're eating whales. That's their native diet.

They don't have a lot of green vegetable in Greenland.

And so they basically were living off a diet that was extraordinarily high in fat.

But it was the fat that speaks to the genes in such a way as to regulate how your liver processes fat. Right. So they didn't have high blood fats. This is the paradox of when we try to make complex things simple and we just make a rules thing, no fat. Yeah. And then we get into a problem. And so the whole construct that you're talking about is, this is why I'm kind of concerned right now about this whole pension on protein right now. Yeah. Because we categorize food in these big categories, protein, carbohydrate and fat. But within those three categories are all sorts of difference between different types of protein, different types of carbohydrate, different types of fat.

Each has a different physiological personality. And so if we just both put them together, you could max out your protein of the wrong type of protein for your body and actually do yourself harm. That's right. And so I think this construct of being more intelligent about how we take the message and translate it to our own daily life and our own body and our own habits is really important.

“That's why your program is so important because it's being more deeply into these things not to manipulate people.”

Because what you end up happening, I just was at the National Food's Expo, this 85,000 person extravaganza down at NNHM California. They think they have 12,000 more than that. Somewhere around 20,000 booths, I think. And so all these commercial interests. And if you walk around and these are all supposedly natural foods, some of them are worse than any process food you'd ever see. The ingredients reads like some kind of a schmorgasport of chemical goblings like a cheesecake factory menu. Exactly. Exactly. So I think that we are trying to really bring rational intelligence and again, it comes back to what you are speaking to.

If you're close to nature, if you're close to the soil, if you're close to things that the magic of nature was incorporated into that, it's more likely you're going to end up with something that is closer to your need. Something that's three orders of magnitude more process. And you know, we learned that, I have a partner now in a official company in Dutabra, Alaska up in the Illusion Islands and you know, where the Delhi is catch boats go out of. And we we put together a pharmaceutical grade plant that takes fish caught lining hook, puts them into our special boats that he actually designed.

They're frozen within 20 minutes or 30 minutes of a life fish to might as 20. They come to our short side plant. They never get above 100 degrees Fahrenheit in processing. And we produce an oil then. It retains all the natural stuff that was in the original fish. We didn't quantify winter rise, deacert, verify all the stuff that goes on with fish oil production today. I produce as a chemical product from what was in natural food. So all these things you're part of the learning.

“That's why we're also with regenerative agriculture with our Himalayan territory buckwheat.”

I never thought I'd be in farming. Now we have farms in upstate New York, but for the first time in the history of the United States,

you're growing the 3500 year old food Himalayan territory buckwheat, which has the highest immune potential of any food we know in the United States. This has never been seen. And now it's regenerative and improved. So these are all as I learn, I say, I need to go down to the source. Nature is trying to teach us something here. We need to close the nature. It's the answer to everything. Like I said, I'm not a scientist, but I study science, and I study all of this and what I know. And I don't care if I've got any proof of it.

Not is that we were given everything here that we need to take care of ourselves no matter what is here. We've also created things that can ruin that. That's right. Those are man-made creations. Those are not natural things that are occurring whatsoever. And I know for certain, if utilized properly, there's everything here we need to correct whatever is there. That is exactly right. And, you know, this is so glad you said that.

So now six years ago, I felt that I kind of run the gamut now. You know, I had this company metagenics that we sold.

And then we had the personalized lifestyle in medicine institute.

And I was coming back from a meeting and railing with my colleagues.

“That's how I often do on many morning after being gone. And these are people that have worked with me now for over 25 years.”

So they know me pretty well. And so they both says they said, "Jeff, you know, I think you still have one more plan you before you call it quads here." You know, because you're kind of big and stature, you've got these really bold ideas. Maybe you need one more kind of way to bite it to the apple with a big bold help. Why don't you start something? Because what you're saying is, is the root cause of all these problems. It starts with immune problems. They all relate to immune problems.

So maybe you want to spend the last part of your life really focusing on how do you reeducate team in system? How do you rejuvenate an immune system that's caught up in inflammation? And caught up in chronic inflammatory problems. So we started down that path. It's what led me to Himalayan territory buckwheat. But what's led me into this visual.

So a big bold help now has become kind of the outcome from now the last five years. A really understanding how nature is giving us these tools to reprogram our immune systems upstream root cause before you go downstream and say, "What's the anti-inflammatory I want to take? Do I want to take Boswellia? Do I want to take Where's it going? Do I want to take Ginko? No, upstream is where these foods actually modulate our immune system by epigenically reimprinting it to be friendly to be our friends, not our enemies."

“So that's big bold help. That's what we've been doing with that over the last five years.”

Here's my disappointment with this entire interview. I'll tell you right now is the lack of time. I've covered like the most minute amount of stuff that I want to get into. I've got a couple things because I know we're running down you must come back and see me please by the way. Oh, thank you. Okay, this is something completely off topic. I'm sure you've probably gotten asked but I want to know and I want everybody else to know.

You said you're about to be 80. You have got to be one of the most cognitively enhanced and functional people I've ever met at that. Actually in general, I don't want to stay at your age. I mean just in general with the ability to on a drop of a dime. Because I interview everybody and I can tell you right now. Some of the people that everybody thinks are so brilliant. I'm not saying they're not smart because they are but they start dancing.

“You have to admit that the political answers you could tell them. They don't know.”

You know, and we've all been there. I get it. But you are so sharp and so quick and you like what do you do health wise? What's like a daily thing or something you would recommend to stay cognitively sharp and just mentally like acute.

Yeah, thank you. So that's been that's been my my search. My travel is always interesting to personalize things and say if I'm going to tell other people to do stuff.

Maybe I should do my stuff at the time that. So this is what actually led me into this Emily and turnry buckwheat in this visual story because I found that those were along with pre and probiotics. Those that family of nutrients probably the most important for report programming our immune system. So what happened to me was I started to recognize that if I was to go and actually ask the question, where on the planet, what history do we have? That tells us what people do that more likely live to be hunter and still be healthy.

Yeah, and they don't take a lot of supplements. They don't take new enhancers and send no analytics. They basically live a lifestyle that has certain habits in it naturally. And they eat a diet that is very rich in certain things that are enhancing a brain health. And so I started doing travels. My wife and I over the last couple years have been going to all the Mediterranean companies in Africa. In Asia and really trying to understand what are the characteristics that we these things together and that we could give a recipe that I'm taking that ultimately we talk about in Big Bull Health.

I have a book coming out in January of 27. Actually, it's going to kind of codify all of this into food plans. But to make it simple, the proof of all of this has to do with a study that would be large enough with enough people in it. So you could say with some assurance that this is a general principle that could cut across many people. So I decided to do something that was told to me was not a good idea as it would be a waste of time and money to put together an 850 person double blind placebo control trial.

The largest study ever done anywhere in the world on a single food looking at brain and cognitive health outcomes coupled with epigenetic changes of their immune system. We had a lumina build out a special gene chip for us.

It has 1.2 million epigenetic sites that we can then study in the blood of people before and after.

What's being epigenetically tagged and what pathways in their body are being amodulated and then we couple that together with looking at all sorts of behavioral and brain outcome using the NIH instruments for evaluation.

I'm totally committed my research team to that and now I'm recommending to everybody two teaspoons of Himalayan Tartary Buckwheat's proud powder a day gives a doctor where it's a kind of where we're heading.

“Does that have any like metabolic benefit or anything? Yeah, fat burning wise.”

It's immunomatabolism and one of the things that people understand is that there is a triangle of engagement and a physiological level. The immune system and the nervous system are the two systems of our body that are 24/7/365 speaking to the outside world and translating it inside information. And they're cross talking all the time. The nervous immune system and they're influencing them metabolism. So this is called immunomatabolism. It's the most rapidly growing field right now of study in basic sciences is how the immune system is controlling or communicating is probably a better word with the metabolism and how metabolism is is then reciprocally communicating back to the immune system.

So now we put the gut microbiome in there because that's where 70% of the immune system is located. Now we put the lungs in there because that's another site where you're taking information on the outside world and you have all these immune sites on your lungs that are sending messages to your whole body. And you have all these things you're starting to be pulled together and it starts with this interconnection between the immune system and the nervous system and our metabolism. This is the master class on everything that I love and like uncovering some of these things that I was not aware of.

Just like the biggest blessing today for me. So thank you for that it really is because now I can instead of resting and I go home and start looking into all this and do it because that's what I do man and I get I get things like this and I can't stop. So I thank you because that now you just gave me a whole load of things to start getting into and please do share the results of that study with me and we can maybe even go over them together and piece it out a little bit and discuss what you found.

“The reason I think this study is going to prove fruitful is that we did a preliminary trial that we published results of a year ago November.”

That was a smaller trial only 50 subjects it was an open label trial but again surprising to my colleagues in the academic world.

They said and Jeff you're never going to get a signal that's strong enough with that small group of people because you're not also putting them on a metabolic word diet.

You're allowing them to eat whatever they want and you won't get a strong enough signal from just adding this similar integrity buck. We little bit it'll be lost in the noise. Well, surprising is it was the data which has been published in a top tier of your journal. We showed that some of these sites that relate to immune cell aging were changed by 20 fold. Wow. 20 fold.

And we've reduced the rate of immune aging by 47 percent in some of these people.

And that's within 90 days. So nature has these extraordinary tools that if we harness them, you can be very, very valuable. Here's my hope. This is my direct hope and I mean this. So Dr. Elizabeth your it's like a mentor to me. She's a three time guest right here. She's got the record for guests. I want you to break that record.

But I mean that and that's saying something because she's means a great deal to me. And so I yeah, this was the most fun because of the enlightenment, the interaction, your knowledge base, the way that we got to go back and forth on this and the way that you convey the message because you make it so palatable with such eloquence and understanding and ease even though it's like in depth because a lot of things are so confusing now.

But you know, I don't tend to ever get into comments too much, but I do want to know what's bothering people or what they want and the main thing is I see a million comments.

“That's what I do right and the main thing that I see in complaints of everything is what exactly are we supposed to do.”

There's so many things going out there and one of the things that you said before we wrap the protein thing. I'm not going to say any names because I respect some of these people, but they're so like it's all about the protein and you've got to just throw it down and they never explain anything. But what types, what's good, what's bad, what how much, you know, and yes, more for people that are weightlifting, but don't necessarily that much for people that aren't training for something and there's there's just not enough there's so much throwing down the throat and not enough of this.

Let's do more of that sometime. Yeah, there's a whole story there that and I like to also talk about the different types of carbohydrate because carbohydrate got in the bad reputation and I think we need to be a little more balance in that discussion.

It's it's very hard to be metabolically flexible if you're not eating everything to make it flexible.

“Exactly right, so man, I could go on all day. So okay, one, you're coming back please.”

Oh, I'd love for ease, but to let's tell everybody the best ways to find you, which I will link and these beautiful products that you're gracing me with that my wife hands off, these are mine that she can get her own, but but tell everybody about all this, I'll link everything for you and then we're going to get into more detail on this later. Thanks, so for the discussion about the that chart for officials and I talked about how you'll make a threes that are like nature and for the Himalayan Turkey buckwheat products that are the immune active products.

“That's big bold health.com and you can find my have a whole page on there with all sorts of stuff that you can depending on what you want to be geeky, you can dig deep.”

If you want information as it relates to me in this broader field, it would be the personalized lifestyle medicine institute website, which is plminstitute.org or just plmi, you can find it in Google. And lastly, if you want a virtual Jeff, I do have all of my two terabytes of data that I've ever published or ever presented. It's in a virtual Jeff form on my own website, Jeffplan.com. So you can ask Jeff a question and you know, it's funny, my family's kind of freaked out about this because the virtual Jeff land remembers better than I do.

It doesn't create some of those synthesis that I might create, but it remembers the facts really well.

“So yeah, I had one of those created for me and me and Queenie were looking at it and I asked it question, I said, well, should he answer that better?”

I know, it's really amazing. Yeah, why are you? Well, man, this was so great. I am just so sad that it's wrapping here, but I appreciate you coming down and seeing me.

I appreciate your knowledge and I really appreciate your life's work, which I fully intend on carrying on as long as I possibly can and encouraging and helping others to do the same for you. So I want to just throw back at you what you're doing to run understanding to get people to see some light that may have been dim or blocked and to be able to make more intelligent decisions about the most valuable thing that we own, which is our body. There's nothing, there's no better thing that one could put their life to work to. So thank you for what you're doing.

Absolutely, man. It's my pleasure and true honor to have been given that task and I take it very serious and I always will.

So all right, everybody. Thank you so much for listening. I truly hope that you listen to every second of this intently because there is so much here that will change your life and I can't say thank you enough for coming and seeing me. So that wraps up today. Stay tuned for Plain Morticum, Dylan Jamelli and Dr. Jeffrey Blan. Sign it off. [Music]