#2466 - Francis Foster & Konstantin Kisin

The Joe, Rogan, experience.

“>> Train my day, Joe Rogan, podcast, my night, our day.”

[MUSIC] >> All right, so when we schedule this, there's like a cabin, but we're so peaceful. >> Every time we're here, there's something crazy going on, man. >> Yeah, maybe we manifest it.

>> To be honest, it did, 2026 did start with a bang. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Well, a lot of things, you know, it's just nothing seems stable. Everywhere, everywhere in the world seems fucked right now.

Like this is like, in all of my years, this seems the most unstable globally.

Like I never worried that the UK was gonna be like complete chaos, resting 12,000 people for social media posts,

and abandoning trial by jury, all that shit. I never thought the Ukraine Russia war would go on this long. Never thought, never thought they would just continue bombing Gaza, and then what's happening now, they just sort of stopped. And now they're talking about putting a resort there.

[MUSIC]

“>> What, you hear that, and you go, are you fucking serious?”

>> Tim Dillon has a, I want to go, I won't give the bit away. He hasn't fucking phenomenal bit about staying in that resort. [LAUGH] >> Yeah, and you boys have been busy as well, Chau. >> Yeah, and then I was gonna get to that.

The embarrassing part, in the middle of Ramadan, you take out the leader of a Muslim country. >> And the hangrail already, and you're fucking with it. >> Well, they're really, yeah. >> And then, you know, I was listening to Tim Dillon's podcast today. He's got a great podcast with Ryan Grimm and one of the gentlemen.

But one of the things that brought up was that some of these drone attacks, it doesn't even seem like they're from Iran. Some of these drone attacks on Gulf States, like that. One of them, I don't want to speak out of tune at a turn, so I'm not exactly sure which ones they're talking about.

They're talking about one of them. And either it's a oil refinery, I think it is, an oil refinery. That it doesn't seem like it came from Iran. >> So, what did it come from? >> That's a good question.

>> One of their proxies? >> That's a good question. The fear is a false flag, that's the fear. If you really wanted to get really scared of what we were dragged into. You dragged into an ally that's not telling you the truth and is also doing some other stuff.

“>> Well, I'm not even saying that that's the case, but a lot of people are assuming that that's what it is.”

>> But that's what happens when you have an absence of information. >> Right. >> And so the mum you have an absence of information, there's a vacuum. And nature of course a vacuum, you need to have that vacuum filled. So that's where conspiracies naturally flourish, because 100%.

>> Because if people don't have information, then they're going to basically theorize. >> Man, and people theorizing is conspiracies are going to start? >> Flourish. >> Well, I think they were basing it on where the drone came from. Let's see if we can find some information on that, Jamie.

>> I would try. >> I don't know if it was Jeremy Skayhill was the other. >> That's right. >> Reporter on the video.

>> I just find that amazing now, how many people have a hard take on like, what's going on?

I'm like, we don't know a fucking thing about what's going on. >> The coin is in the air, right? We do not know how it's going to, but everyone's got to take, everyone knows, we do not fucking, I don't think anyone knows. I understand if you work at the White House, or if you work in Russian propaganda, or you work in Chinese propaganda, or if you work in Iranian, you've got to get your

point of view across to try and persuade people. But if you actually try to work out what's genuinely happening, I don't think anyone knows, this is a gamble of gigantic proportions, and nobody knows how it's going to end. It's just so unpredictable, and I can tell you a great story that is positive for the West, let's say, for America.

I can tell you a terrible story, and they both sound very convincing, and no one knows which one of them is true. >> Yeah, that's a very good point. This is the hot take culture, right? >> Right.

>> Everyone has a take, and they want their take to be the expert take. >> So specific drone attack incidents that call potential false flags, Saudi Arabia, Saudi aramco, rather oil facility attack. So Iranian officials deny striking the Saudi aramco processing facility, and instead suggest Israel may have carried out that attack as a false flag to inflamed Gulf opinion and

So right-grim explicitly says he thinks Iran's claims that Israel hit the aramco facility

“need to be taken seriously, and that it's very possible Israel did it.”

This was the other one, the drone strike on the British base in Cyprus. >> That was from Lebanon, right? >> Yeah. >> Is that what they're saying? >> Yeah.

>> You may have come for the direction of Lebanon. He places this in the same context of Iran claiming Israel carried out certain attacks in neighboring states as false flags to blame any Iran and drag those countries into the war. This doesn't make any logical sense to me because those countries already in the war. I mean, Saudi Arabia and UAE have been attacked by Iran because they were on the phone

to Trump basically asking him to do this.

>> You said this was another weird one, the Tucker Carlson one. You saw that right? >> No. >> So Tucker Carlson said that. >> Oh yeah, the last one.

Yeah. >> They'd been arrested. >> Right. >> The members of Masada been arrested in Qatar and Saudi Arabia. So both Qatar and Saudi Arabia have said it's not true.

>> Yeah. They've officially denied such arrests. Their own Saudi sources also denied it though the details don't prove it didn't happen and that states would almost certainly hide such a rest if real. Huh.

>> Well, the thing Joe is that these countries, Saudi Arabia and UAE, Qatar, less so.

They want this to happen because they also hate Iran or the Iranian regime.

So there is no need for Israel even if people are tempted to believe there's no need for Israel to do this because these countries are already in it. And that one of the reasons Iran has attacked things in Saudi Arabia and in the UAE is they know that. Right.

>> Right. So the Gulf countries are on board with this. >> Right.

“So what would be, let's assume that the false flag that it's in play, who would why?”

Why would Israel, how would they benefit from doing that? >> That's what I'm saying. There is no rationale that I can think of. >> The people that think the false flag is real, like why do they think that? What do they think that Israel would benefit from?

Is there, I think, scenario where you could imagine it would inflame things and further support other countries contributing to the, I mean, there's a lot of money that's being spent on this war, right? >> Right. >> This is insane amount of money just for munitions, just for missiles.

>> Yeah. Going Iran if we get to that, right? >> Maybe another resort? >> Yeah. So, but I just don't see the rationale because the Gulf countries are already targets

for Iran. >> Right. >> There's nothing to inflame, like the situation is already fucking inflamed, right? And it's partly inflamed because, as I say, actually the Gulf States and Israel are pretty aligned on this particular thing, they're all at threat from the Iranian regime.

So we had the Aementine and Richard Minuton, I show the other day. One of them is Al Qaeda, M.I.6 double agent, and another one is a really reputable investigative journalist, Richard. >> Al Qaeda, M.I.6 double agent, what ball? And it has a great podcast now as well, called "Conflicted."

>> What a great name. >> For a podcast for a guy who's a double agent. >> Yeah. What balls that guy must have? >> Yeah.

Yeah. But anyway, I mean, he was explaining that Saudi Arabia has a population that is way bigger than what they can sustain in terms of the water, but they live in the fucking desert. So they have these desalination plants, which are extremely vulnerable. And Saudi Arabia, UAE, these other countries, they felt at huge risk from Iranian attacks

for a long time. So none of them like the Iranian regime that's spreading terrorism through its proxies. So in actual fact, dragging them into the water, kind of like there's no sense for that. I think there's a lot of people just, they go to reaction now whenever anything happens is that it was Israel's fault, you know, like Venezuela, fuck all to do with Israel.

But when it happened, it was all over the Israel. I think some people just go to that now as the automatic response, which comes back to what I was saying earlier about the hot take culture, something happened three minutes ago. And now everyone's got a fucking take on it. You don't know anything.

>> Right. >> None of us know anything. None of us know how this is going to go because this right now is a highly unpredictable situation. I don't think the White House knows how this is going to go.

>> No, it's terrifying. It's terrifying and it's exactly the opposite of what we were told leading into this administration.

But it's going to be America first.

>> Right. >> And no more unnecessary foreign wars.

“There's the other thing that, do you remember Desert Storm?”

>> Yeah. This storm, quick and easy baby, woo, we went in, kick some ass, took some names. That's a wrap. Pulled out, there was only one base that got hit. So there was the amount of deaths by American citizens was fairly minimal.

I think that's what got people so confident into entering Iran after 9/11.

To go back, we're already fucked them up once. We're going to go back and this is going to be easy.

Well, it wasn't easy this second time, and it was drawn out and it didn't make any sense.

People wanted some form of revenge, something for 9/11. So somehow, no, they justified a war with a country that had zero due to it. It didn't make sense. That one took for, and then we also invaded Afghanistan at the same time. What do we do?

What the fuck? So in the fog of this idea of American exceptionalism, we're just going to go in and fix it. We did it before. There's no one even close to us.

Well, look how that turned down. >> Yeah. This is completely true, and this idea that it's so easy to take one regime, remove it, and then just put another one in its place, like it's a Lego block. >> Exactly.

>> And then all of a sudden, you're going to magically fix a country, is a fantasy.

Like if you take Iran, the IRGC, which is the Islamic Revolutionary Guard, numbers

around 200,000 trained soldiers. And only are they trained soldiers, they're fanatical, they're fanatics.

“And then you have the secret police, and then you have the regular police.”

And then you have the people employed in the government. And then their families, and so on and so forth, and then their supporters within the country. And then you've got the various factions within Iran, like the Kurds, who want independence. So the moment the leadership is weakened, they're going to use it as an opportunity to influence their own revolution, to try and break away from the rest of Iran.

So you have all of these particular parts, these factions. And then you think, if you take out the top, the top, who's holding it all together by force, I'm not saying I agree with him or what he does, you have the very real risk that the entire country is going to disintegrate as what happened in Iran, in Iraq, sorry. >> And also Libya.

>> Yeah. >> Yeah.

>> The idea that you could just take the guy out, and that's a wrap.

I mean, it doesn't seem like it's well thought out. >> Well, I mean, I guess they would say Venezuela, like regime adjustment. It's a completely different kind of force, of course. >> This is a religious phenomenon called, it's a totally different kind of country.

“Also, it's a country that's been under threat for decades, right?”

So they've been preparing for this kind of thing. >> Yeah. And also, with Venezuela, it wasn't a regime change, practically everybody who was in the old regime is still there. >> It's a regime adjustment.

Exactly. >> So Delci Rodriguez was one of the senior leaders in Maduro's regime. They just took out Maduro on his wife, they put Delci Rodriguez there, but the whole structure, the whole leadership, the whole party is still in place. So they've just what they've done is they put Delci at the top, and they've said to

a look, if you fuck about, you're going to get what your boss got, so you're going to follow what we say, you're going to do what we say, you're going to open up the oil refineries, we're going to build it, we're going to start pumping oil out, you're going to start messing about with hers below, which they had training camps in the island of Margarita, which is a little Caribbean island, two and a half hours away from Miami.

Training camps, you can't have that, you're going to be fraternizing with the Cubans, and you're going to play bull, and essentially Venezuela is now a colony of the United States. That's what it's now become. >> That's wild. >> Well, there's also the Curt Medsgrangle, which is hilarious, Curt Medsker, cornered

me one night at the con, a mother ship, and he explained to me that this is all about the 2020 election, and that Maduro somehow and other had something to do with rigging the 2020 election, and he's going to say it as a part of his testimony. He's like, "Just wait, Mark my words." He's convinced of this. He goes down the rabbit hole to the lava, like he passes, and he's like, "This rabbit hole has been covered up, it goes

deeper, and he keeps going till he's at the fucking center of the earth." >> He's a funny guy, though. >> He's hilarious, he's hilarious, he's mentally ill, and he's hilarious. He's one of the funniest people I know, like ever, fantastic joke writer too, I mean, he's just great all around, but Jesus Christ, like some of his nutty theories, they go so far.

>> Oh, absolutely. I've been in an embossed with Curt, where he starts talking to me, and I'm like, "Curt, I don't even know what we're talking about anymore." >> Well, he changes, changes, good spirits, mid-centives. He starts bringing out some shit from the '70s, there's the church committee,

“and this and that, and MK Ultra, and don't you know about monarchy?”

>> Like, what? There's a slowdown, like not everybody knows what you're talking about. >> But I think this is, and I love Curt, but this is kind of where you feel that the truth isn't enough, so there needs to be something else, there needs to be something that goes deeper than that, and sometimes there is, don't get me wrong. Sometimes it does go deeper, but sometimes,

with Venezuela, or what was going on. They were fucking about, and they were doing it for a

long time, and they were doing it in America's backyard, and they had warning after warning, and Maduro, the way I'd push back against Curt is I'm really sorry Curt, but Maduro ain't that bright. >> Well, I don't think he has to be that bright to finance and make sure and arrange things, because they did, there was, like, something connected to the voting machines over there. >> They made those plans for the conspiracy. >> Here's a conspiracy.

>> And how was it? >> Yeah, here we go. She's another fun one. Post 2020 from Trump allies, like Sidney Powell and Rudy Giuliani, claiming Hugo Chavez, Maduro's predecessor, developed rigged software to export to U.S. firms. These are promoted by figures like Mike Lindell, he makes a great pillow. She'd listen to him, and amplified on social media, but courts and fact checks rejected them, including Fox News 787 million settlement. >> Yeah, I was pretty

sure that those claims would debunked. >> Yeah, not to Kurt. That he's like, you guys don't know where the hard drives are, or the sense of the earth, we got to get there. Yeah, that doesn't make much sense to me, but neither does this idea that you're going to take over a country's oil supply.

We'll just take it. The problem is from the outside. The rest of the world, you look at this

unnecessary aggression by the United States government, and then you tack on whatever propaganda they have already been spent now about America for the last 20 or 30 years, and then this war

“with them around gets really ugly, because that's how you start a World War III. You start a World”

War III by doing something that other than people that wanted this forever, who else thinks that's a good idea, who else thinks it's a good idea to just attack a country that isn't doing anything. They haven't done anything. Like if you've proof that they have developed the depleted uranium, and they've got it up to a point where it's got it to what percentages it have to be, like they're at 60, right? But that's way more than you need us. Way more than you need, right? So it

shows that they're at least ramping up their production where it's possible to get it to whatever it needs to make a difference. That's way more than you need for civilian use, right? Right? But that's still, it's not clear that that justifies an invasion when North Korea has nuclear weapons. Right? Right? It's like, do we just want, or we just try to prevent them from ever getting to a point where they're like North Korea? Who the fuck is worried about North Korea? Zero people. This episode is brought

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of your first purchase of a website or domain. I think the difference, as you correctly said earlier,

is these people are very different to the North Korean, right? North Korea wants to be left the

“fuck alone. Iran does not want to be left alone. Iran wants to dominate the region. That's why”

they fund, Hamas, it's one, they fund Hezbollah, it's why they fund the Houthis, it's why they are doing shit. That's why the Gulf countries and Israel are very worried about them, right? So that's the difference, I think. And then there's the, you know, some of the people we've had on the show who are Iranian have talked about the, what is it called 12-year Islam? I can't remember the details, but basically they have a kind of messianic vision of what's going to happen and they believe that

when the world ends, that's when the prophecy will be fulfilled. You don't want those guys with nuclear weapons, right? That's a good point. Yeah. So from that perspective, it's different to North Korea. And so that's, I think that's part of the thinking, but your point is interesting to me about the fact that this doesn't reflect what people, you know, as we're not Americans, but it doesn't

“seem to have been part of the policy platform of the Trump election, the last election, right?”

No, not at all. But I do think there is some kind of strategy behind all of this, and I'm very curious what that is. Because I guess if you think about it logically, you would say, well, is it an attempt to effectively push back against China and Russia infiltrating all these countries, right? China and Russia were very close with with Maduro in Venezuela, very, very good. Like Francis to say, has ballad training camps, Island, Margarita, where was the oil going? Right? Same with

Iran. I mean, the Iran sells at all to China and sends suicide drones to Russia to use in Ukraine.

Russian influence in all these countries, because you can't attack them directly, because you

can't attack them directly, right? Yeah. But this is all just guessing on my part. And that's what I'm really curious, we're going to do some interviews on this trip to kind of like, I want to get someone on the show, we can go, this is the strategy. Right. This is what we're doing, because

“I think as we were saying earlier, it's not very clear to most people what the rationale behind”

all of this is, but I also don't think this sort of like Mad Dog Trump idea is true either. I think he has a strategy. I'd just love to know what it is. And it's very interesting because there's been talk about regime changing Cuba. And one of the things, so I think that's next, genuinely. Oh my God. I think that's next. So when Trevor's came to power in 99,

what he did and not enough people talk about this is he turned what was very corrupted,

admittedly, liberal, Western-style democracy into a communist dictatorship. And how do you do that? You can't just literally do that overnight. So what he did is he allied with the Cubans and Fidel in particular Fidel Castro. Venezuela provided Cuba with cheap oil, which helped to keep the Cuban economy afloat, because Cuba has been going broke since however many years, 40 odd years. And what Castro did was he gave him the boots on the ground in Venezuela, but also the technical

expertise and know-how in order to change a Western-lippled democracy into a communist state with permanent surveillance secret police, subjugate the population, so there was no chance of them ever being able to revolt and make everything into a communist state. So by what they did in Venezuela, Venezuela can no longer support Cuba. Secuba is literally now withering on the vine as a result of them knocking out the Venezuelans. So it's going to come to a point where you

say Cuba effectively going to go bankrupt, which could precipitate an uprising or revolution by people when people can no longer eat. And that would mean that that country is then weakened.

Finally, they can get rid of the communist regime there and they can have a different type of government.

One, which will be far more sympathetic, should we say, to working with American, being American, I don't know, that makes sense to me in a way. What I don't understand about the wrong thing is like, what is the end goal here? Well, you've got the Reza Pachlavi,

“the Shah's son. I mean, he left around a long time ago as a kid, right?”

You know, the idea is going to go back in and be welcomed by the masses. Maybe that's true. Just like Daenerys returning to the Iron Throne. Yeah, but Daenerys had three fucking dragons, right? But you don't understand, like she left with you as a baby. Yeah, that's right. That's right. It's not like the people are desperately, I don't know, maybe the people are desperate for the return of this. Well, it seems like some people are desperate for a change there.

The people that were protestants are cool. People that risk their lives, 100%, but like every country, like if you only listen to the liberals in this country, you would think that, you know, that no one's illegal on stolen land. Right. If you only listen to the Republicans in this country, you would think we got to find every illegal and get them out of our country and make America great again. Like, it doesn't make sense if we just go only by the protesters. Like,

we don't really have accurate polling because they don't have any free speech over there. Right. No. And they've killed like famous athletes over there for protesting. Yeah. I mean, they killed the Olympic gold medalists in wrestling with the UFC tried to step in and tried to do something to stop it. They executed them for just apparently, I don't even think he was actually protesting.

“I think he was just at a protest. He wasn't saying anything. And this is the thing you always”

have to bear in mind, Joe. I might be wrong about that though. No, I think you're all right. Am I right about that? The final detail, I'm not sure, but the fact that he was executed. Yes. He wasn't saying a work very hard to try and say that. I think there was some discrepancy as to whether or not he was actually participating in the protest. That also could have been the defense. You know, I don't know. But I mean, the fact that they execute people who protest.

I mean, there's no way you can support that kind of. That's a scary ass fucking government. And run by religious fanatics. That's a scary ass government. But the question is, how scary ass does it have to get? We're invading make sense because if this keeps going, like if we, we have to go boots on the ground, that's where things get nuts. You can't go boots on the ground, man. You can't. You can't. Right. I don't think there's any right. You shouldn't be president of this.

There's a lot of people are going to disagree with that. No, I, I don't think that's viable. Just like I might be robot boots on the ground. Yeah. If you want to get that factory up and

Right. Right. Like, so from what, what I understand talking to some of the people, like, Israel would quite like a reservoir of monarchy because the other Middle Eastern countries that they have peace with, you know, Bahrain, Morocco, increasingly the Gulf States, they're all monarchy. Right. So they're down with that. But from what I understand, the White House is really not that interested in Park La Vie. And so what, what do they want? Well, one of the things that Richard

Minute to Broke on our show because it hadn't been reported anywhere else was that the White House

has given the Israelis a no kill list, which is basically a list of members of the current

regime that they don't want to be killed because they have hoped that these people could then be the Rodriguez equivalent in Iran. Right. And I don't know that the fanatics within the Iranian regime who are there now, how many of them are like this, like Darth Vader, but like, you know what I mean? Yeah. You kind of looking for Darth Vader's hero. Yeah, no, no, no, no, zero is like that. I don't know that that exists, right? Sugar free. Sugar free. Islamism free. Yeah.

So, so that's the bit. And that doesn't mean that there isn't like a plan. Right. But I don't know what the fuck that plan is right now. And I find it hard to see one. So regime, evil regime gone

wonderful. But the question is always like, what comes after that? Right. That's always the

“question. And that's where I think your point is very true, which is in the past. They've been”

times where this sort of approach has gone completely after Wales. Yeah. That's a fact. And it's also, as well, what has been coming out of the Trump camp is contradictory to put it mildly. You have hexept saying one thing. You have Trump saying another, they contradict each other at certain points. Is that a tactic in order to be fuddled the opponent? Maybe? Who knows? Or is it the fact that they don't actually have a grand vision? Was there some sort of a concession today on

Russian oil? Yeah. Well, I think the first of all Trump led India by Iranian oil. And I think now they are lifting the sanctions on Russia selling it oil because the oil prices spike does much as they did. Right. Here it goes. US eases limits on Russian energy as oil prices sore. Right. Yeah. You've got the pink Floyd. Yeah. So it's a pro prefer. But you can see it like there was all prices spiked for what? One day, two days. Yeah. And everyone went full panic straight away.

But the thing is, if that, if that carries on for two months, the impact of that on domestic politics. I mean, I'm not an expert in American politics, but even I can say that's going to be

“pretty fucking important. Oh, it's bad. Right. Yeah. It's going to be bad. I mean, if oil prices”

spike were fucked. Yeah. And the Republicans really fucked. Yeah. And you've got the midterms coming up in November. And it's also the momentum will be in their way. And look, there's, you know,

second, third, fourth order consequences. So at the moment in the UK, the vast majority of people

find it in a funny, more and more difficult, just to get through to the end of the month. Because of the cost of living, inflation, it's becoming worse and worse. I was talking to a butcher in my area, which is this very nice part of North London. You know, the type, I'm, I'm, play some talking about. Everyone loves BLM. No one has a black friend. That kind of place. Right. Okay. That's the kind of area it is. And he was telling me that even in this very wealthy area, people are starting

to rush in meat now. So before they'd have meat five days a week, now they're going down to three or two. And this is in a wealthy area. So now imagine if there's energy spikes, and then food becomes more and more expensive. There is already a very worrying, hard left political movement growing in the UK where they're talking about, you know, the capitalism doesn't work, we need socialism. And there's a, there's this new politician come to the full guy called

Zack Polansky who talks about what we need in this country and the UK is socialism. Now imagine if the cost of living crisis gets worse and the vast majority of people who work hard in a regular job can't make ends meet through literal no full of their own. Can you blame them for going hang on capitalism doesn't work? Because in this instance, at that moment, it doesn't work for

“them. And then you could that could spark something completely disastrous for a country. But I think,”

you know, that's the negative story. I think it's incredibly persuasive. And I lean more in the direction that this could go badly. But I also think there is the possibility of this goes well too. I think that is possible. What do you, how do you envision that scenario? Well, so if they're able

you know, Venezuela, Cuba is basically resetting the region and he's basically saying to all

the people that want to align themselves with China and Russia. Like, we're not fucking about here. Don't cross these lines. That is an opportunity to, to, to address the slide that the Western world has had vis-a-vis China and Russia for a very long time. That could be a very positive thing. My, the thing is what happens in Iran? Like, that is the thing that I don't really see how that goes well. Might, might do. Like I say, there's probably a plan that we don't know. And if,

if that works out, that could be very good. Just say, well, okay, what would you imagine that plan would be? If you, if you, like, let's, let's imagine the best case scenario you're in the White House, they're all very rational. No one's being influenced by foreign government, governments, no one's incompetent. Everybody knows what they're doing. Well, yeah. I mean, we're in the Realms

“of Fantasians. That's why we're all right. But, I mean, take the Soviet Union, which is obviously”

something that I know, right? Being born in the Soviet Union, Russia. Towards the end of the Soviet Union, you still had some fanatical communists. And in fact, throughout the Soviet Union,

you always had within the government a mixture of different people, right? You had the fanatical

communists who believed the communism is the only thing that was ever going to work, etc. But you also had people who were reformers. They saw the problems. They saw that the fanatical communists were ruining things and things were good and worse, right? They saw that you had to kill more and more of your own people to keep, to keep shit locked down, right? So, the argument could be, within the Iranian Revolution regardless or the regime more broadly, there are people who are,

like, you know, I'm, I'm not necessarily that keen on the guy who runs here and now, Al-Jalani, right? He is a Jehadi, but he's kind of like a moderate one, you know, you know, how long that, I don't know how long it's going to last. But my point is, with an every regime,

there is some range of opinion. There is some range of fanatism. There is some range of people who

partly for generational reasons. You know, the younger people have seen, you know, a 40-year history and they now go, okay, this isn't working anymore. We need to try something else. That is possible. So, if the CIA and the White House have someone like that, and they can do a regime adjustment,

“and like, I think the idea that you're going to have, you know, multi-parlementary democracy with,”

you know, free and fair elections and women, you know, like Venice Beach, you know, rollerblading on bikinis on, I don't know that that's going to happen, right? But what you might have is an authoritarian regime of some kind, like many other countries in the Middle East, which realises that actually economic growth is more important than shouting out lag by every three minutes and blowing shut up, right? That focuses on making life better for their citizens.

But, you know, practices, traditional Muslim values, which many countries do, and says, you know, women ought to be modest, but doesn't force them to wear the book or the head scarf or whatever. And is less interested in destabilizing the region and attacking others and trying to be this great power, and is more interested in just prosperity for some people survival for themselves as a regime and is willing to play ball with the United States. I mean, that's best case scenario.

Now, if you get there, I think that would be a huge win for President Trump and it would be a huge win for the world, and he will walk away from that with a huge win. And I think, you know, you're better expert on the American people, but I think American people like winning, right? So if you have all this happen, he can then say, well, look, we did this, we did this, we did this, Russia and China have been pushed back. We've got to, you know, the situation runs

“not going to get in you, which is important. I think we can all agree on that, right?”

Yeah. There is the possibility that he comes out of this very well. I think that based on what I see, but I don't know coming back to what we said, I think we share this kind of perspective, really, for instance, and I, that seems somewhat less likely to spawn at least harder to see, but I think you can tell a persuasive story both ways. I really do. That makes sense. And what we're saying, I think is very valid that we need to

abandon any idea of them having some sort of a democracy over there. It's not going to happen. No. And you know, you do look at the relationships that we have with other Gulf State nations, seems fine, right? It's not threatening to us. We would like everyone to be free and have the same sort of liberal democracy that we have in America, but okay, you like that all want that all day long. You can't do anything to change the way other people govern themselves, especially when

you've gotten to the point where, like, take any of the Middle Eastern countries, for example,

it forever. They have insane amounts of oil money. Good luck. Good luck getting them out of there.

Good luck saying, we should just vote, you know, and have a president, and you don't have any power anymore. How are you going to pull that off? Especially if things are going well for the people to live there. Like, like, like, I got a friend who moved to Dubai and he's an American and he moved back to America recently, but he was over there and he said, dude, you could leave a Rolex on the street and people would pick it up and bring it to the police. Like, it's so safe.

He's like, there's no crime and he's black and he's like, I worry when I go out in America, I'm going to get shot. I'm where I'm going to go to a club and someone's going to start

beefing and shoot up the place and I'm going to get hit. He goes, I don't think about that at all over

“here. There's none of that. He goes, it's safer. Is it fucked up that, you know, it's run by a king?”

I guess, is it that much different than a president? I mean, in a way, like, it's a leader, right? You've got more checks and balances over here, you've got Congress, you got the set. You got all this shit going on with the Supreme Court. You have all these different human beings that also have a say and can block things. But at the end of the day, we're still under this bizarre alpha male chimpanzee structure that has existed from the time that we were 150 people in a fucking tribe,

right? So it's still one guy running things. It's just running things their way. And if you were a citizen in Dubai, pretty fucking good, right? Well, your point about the UA is really interesting because not only is on the practical level of safety and other things, but also they don't have the Islamism problem that we haven't written, and increasingly you guys are starting to see here, because they recognize that it's a problem and they deal with it. So I don't know if you saw this new

story, the UA no longer gives sponsorships to their students to go to the UK because they're worried their kids are going to get radicalized by Islamists in Britain, which is fucking wild. Yeah, that is fucking wild. And I mean, you're messaging me about this story with the Mamedani situation, right yesterday. Yes. You now have this problem in America. Yes. You have the Islamism problem here, where people who are supporters of ISIS are thrown, but your media's pretending is not happening,

but it's fucking happening. But have it in Austin. Right. Yeah. Right. The guy who shot up that book. Right. Because this is a problem. You could probably find it on CNN because it's kind

of hilarious. Incredible. This was actually incredible. New York Times title change thing.

Did the New York Times change their title? Yeah. They did with the, I wonder why. I'm going to say the CNN one first. The CNN one is really wild. They had like fuses of things with smoke or something. And they'd either change it to bombs or something. Yeah, fucking duh. I'm sending you this one because the CNN one is believe it or not, more preposterous. The CNN one is so cookie. You see their headline. He like, what, what kind of story are you

painting here? Like, this is such a crazy way to frame a guy showed up with bombs and was hurling them at people. Well, they made it sound like they exact opposite what actually happened. Well, it sounded like it was just a regular day. A regular day for this fella and then things just went

“a little sideways. Somewhere along the line. Listen, we will go hobbies. You know what I mean?”

You're looking out. He has nail bombs come on. Yeah. Do you get it, Jamie? It's not coming through. No, look, when I, uh, it's not loading there. Oh, interesting. But let me, um, see if they took it down. I got a guy. I guess they would have. You probably have an old blank dead. Okay. That's the New York Times when I said, you know, well, that's the one I just clicked. I'm going to check the original nothing to see here. Interesting. They probably deleted it. Okay. Here, I found it. I found it

two Pennsylvania teenagers crossing New York City Saturday morning for what could have been a normal day and joining the city during abnormally warm weather. But in less than an hour, their lives drastically change as the pair would be arrested for throwing homemade bombs. That's that is CNN's tweet. I'm going to send you a screenshot because I do believe they've taken it down. It's for them. Yep. Nothing to see here yet. Yeah. They took it down. That's not a

headline. No, no, no, no. I'm going to send you the actual tweet because they did take it down.

“Because it's so fucking ridiculous. But the internet never forgets. I'm sent it to here. I think”

God, I saved it. It took a screenshot because I'm like, this is such a crazy way to frame. Yeah. Two guys wanted to do a terror attack. Yeah. But it's not an accident, Joe. It's not crazy.

Two Pennsylvania teenagers just regular fails from P.A. for Philly. Yeah. Two Philly boys. Had a couple of cheese sticks. It's not on the train. Cross in New York City Saturday morning for what could have been a normal day enjoying the city during abnormally warm weather. Why the fuck would you even say that? Could have been a normal day if they weren't going there to commit terror. Do you know what it reads like? It reads like when I used to teach 13-year-olds creative writing?

“That's how they do it. Oh, it was like a normal day. I mean, is the, I'd like to know who wrote that.”

Who's the person who wrote that? And I want to know where you we directed to write it that way? Who approved it? Yeah. Who edited it? Okay. Are you trying to downplay the possibility of

first of all now in New York? Because you have a guy who's in a vowed whatever he is,

Democratic Socialists, some say communist, but also Muslim. Right. And then you have these Islamists who are doing a terrorist attack. So are you trying to soften that? Yeah. So they are. So what happened just of people know is there was a process outside my Dhani's mansion. Right. Right. And then these two people turned up and through bombs at the protesters. Right. And the way was reported, you, if you just read that and know other stuff,

you would have come away from the, with the conclusion that it was the protesters who were the targets of the bombs. They were the ones that threw the bombs. No one officially said that that's what happened. But the way they did the story on the headline, you would have got that impression. And you're just going, well, you're just on a team. You see this as a team game. Right. Right. And you want to present your team in the correct line. Oh, the new, new post. A post regarding two individuals

arrested for throwing handmade bombs outside of New York City Mayor Zohan Mondani's home failed to reflect the gravity of the incident. Thereby breaching the editorial standards we require for all our reporting. It is therefore been deleted. But see how skillful this is, Joe. This is

gas lighting again. They are saying that mistake was to, what the, we're the first bullet.

So you guys don't not operate her. Now you retires got called out for trying to downplay actual terrorism. And now you're back badly. Yep. Who's our second guy? He's really smart. Didn't fail to reflect the gravity of the situation. This guy named Constantine, I think he's on the trigonometry show. Yeah. Reflect the gravity of the situation, it failed to accurately communicate who is responsible, who the intended victims were, and where the, the, the blame for the

attempted terrorist attack lay. In other words, you didn't accidentally downplay the series, no seriousness of it. You deliberately misrepresented what happened to conceal the truth from the

“public. Well, that's how I would say it. I still write my own shit, Joe. I know you do, but I like”

the donut operator guy. Yeah. I know. He's more your cup of tea. Yeah. But that's what happened to talk.

That is what happened, though, right? That is what happened. But that's what's really scary about this world living in that right now. Because we're, we're so ideologically captured, both right and left. Everyone in this country, he looks at this administration, has an existential threat to democracy itself and our way of life and, you know, fill in the blank, whatever marginalized groups are all going to be round up and put an internment camps. This is the narrative that the

most radical of the left have about the, if the sky is falling, because Trump's an office. But it's also, as well, what people on the left don't want to acknowledge is the dangers of Islamism. When they see people do these kind of horrific terror attacks. When they see, for instance, what happened in the London Bridge terror attacks in 2019, or what happened in Manchester in the Ariana Grande concert, where Islamic terrorists bombed a Ariana Grande concert and the majority

of the audience were little girls, with young girls. And they say, oh, that this happened because, you know, they were marginalized and they felt angry and this is what people do when you push them to one side and they don't have a means in order to have to express themselves. You're going, no, what this is is an ideology. It's an ideology which believes that our civilization, our way of life is evil, but also they want to establish their form of radical Islam across the globe. They

want to create a global Islamic caliphate. And they will do whatever it takes in order to achieve that goal. But people in the West, they can't understand that because it's so alien for how we see,

“how we see things. We believe human life is precious. We believe the most important thing is human”

life. They don't. They believe the cause is more important than your life. And we can't understand that because we're raised in a world that is fundamentally Christian, even though we might not be. We still have Christian values. We had a guest on the show, a wonderful historian called Tom Holland. And he explained this to us that even if you're not Christian, even if you think you were raised by atheist parents, you were still raised with Christian values.

that these people have this ideology is so alien to us that we can't understand it. But also

we don't want to understand it because if you start to actually investigate what these people believe, what their ideology is, you realize that we are not all the same. And these people believe something very, very different. And then we're going to have a very uncomfortable conversation of how do you tackle this? Because can you have Western liberal democratic values and Islamism

“and people or Islamists in the same society? And the answer is, you can't. And I think it's”

really important in your point. The difference between Islamists and Muslims. Yes. The Muslims are these Gulf state people. Muslims are these people in Dubai and Saudi Arabia. Islamists are the ones

that want the Caliphate. Right. But then you have the crazy Christians. And the thing that I said

you, the Yahoo thing that we talked about yesterday was Shalomberger. The Yahoo thing is not. So these military leaders, so this comes from one of the non-commissioned officers who went to a briefing. He goes to a briefing and they inform him that you shouldn't be scared because this is all because President Trump is a known by Jesus. And this is to bring about Armageddon so that Jesus returns to earth. This isn't a fucking military briefing. One such note included an anecdote from a non-commissioned

officer who reported that their commander had urged us to tell our troops this war was all a part of God's divine plan. And he specifically referenced numerous citations out of the book of revelations referring to Armageddon and the eminent return of Jesus Christ. This is fucking crazy. He said this morning our command. So this is this is an officer who's talking about this. This morning our commander opened up the combat readiness status briefing by urging us to not be afraid as what was happening

with our combat operations in Iran. He said President Trump has been anointed by Jesus to light the signal fire in Iran to cause Armageddon and mark his return to earth. He said he had a big grin on his face when he said all this which made his message seem even more crazy. Well that's very short. This is the scary arm of the right. This is the scariest arm of the

“right. The people that think that this is one of the main reasons the micracube people. I think this”

is the main reason to protect it was real. It's a part of God's plan. Israel's where Jesus is going

to return. He's going to return to Jerusalem. Yikes. Yeah I've never really understood that like I think

you can argue for you can be pro Israel for pragmatic reasons. This religious stuff is a little bit weird to me. Well this but the problem is you've got fanatics. Right. Like the Islamists but you've also got these Christian hard, right, Christian nationalists that really believe that this is a part of biblical prophecy and that this is book of revelations. It's about to go down and they want it to go down. This is fucking terrifying. This is really interesting for us because in the UK, Christianity

is big, big fangued to the point where there's a trans flag and practically every church. So this idea of having these hard, poor, right wing fundamentalist Christians, we just don't experience

“it. We don't have that really. Yeah it's like can anybody live in the middle? Why do you have to go”

all the way over to? We've got to start Armageddon. Jesus is going to come back on a white horse. You've read the book of revelations. Yeah I got really into it. The book of revelations is cookie. You know they really believe that Jesus is going to return on a horse. Why a horse? A white horse? It's a bit racist. A little bit. I mean I don't get it. I don't get it. I don't get it. We have a diverse horse at least for them. I'm going to get a horse to kind of joke. You want me to read

you the passage because I saved it because it's kind of cookie. Because it's one of those things where you just go, well who fucking believes this? This is really what you think is going to go down because someone wrote it down on paper 2,000 years ago in ancient Hebrew. It says heaven opens and Christ appears on a white horse to judge and wage war called faithful and true with eyes like fire, many crowns and the name King of King in Lord of Lords. Just imagine it's 26 and

like that's the blueprint boys. But this is just his scary and especially for people that are Muslims or anybody who lives in the Middle East. This is more important than human life. This is more important than international law. This is like in the eyes of the crazy on the right, this is the problem. So it's like it's not, it's not like one side. It's like all good over here. We have a fight against the Islamists that we've got some cooks over here too. If that guy's

for real and that guy's in a position of power and he's really having combat readiness meetings

horse. Fucking yo. That's cookie. The thing that is probably reassuring somewhat, I don't

present Trump doesn't strike me as one of those people. He's not. He's not, right? Aware is the leader of Iran is. Right, but people in the military I think are as well. Yeah. And people in high positions in the military I think maybe as well. If this guy can give that kind of a meeting and that kind of a speech at a meeting, that that's a little terrifying. And if I was over there I'd be freaking the fuck out. If I'd be like this is your plan.

I'm cannon fodder so that Jesus can come back. My body's going to be part of the the fucking signal fire. Let's be honest though. It wouldn't be that much of a plot twist for 2026 would it? Right. It would be the final episode 10 Game of Thrones season six.

“Yes. I mean, it is getting fucking what and that's when the aliens come. Maybe that's what they're doing.”

You know, the whole thing is it's there's not a sane person on either side.

The whole thing is nuts. And it's like it doesn't it doesn't it doesn't make sense to anybody. And that's what scares us a shit out of me. Yeah, it's the thing that scares me is what Constantine is addressed is I don't get worried unless I can't see a way out all the way that this is resolved. And like he said, the coin is in the air and I'm slightly of more pessimistic nature. He's more of an optimist. But as I I look at it and I think to myself, this could go so wrong.

So badly wrong that it could make it could make a rock look like an absolute picnic in comparison. Yeah. Well, especially if terrorists attack start popping off over in America like major ones. You know, and that that could be bad for everything. That could be bad for freedom of speech. That could be bad for rights. That could be bad for, you know, in cooperation of digital ID, there would be a good way to push that through. There's a lot of stuff that would go through

that would radically change, just like the Patriot Act did. Right. Patriot Act radically changed the freedoms that we have in America and the overreach of the government is loud. Yeah, to do this. So right, but we only just started being allowed to take water back on the fucking planes, right? Yeah. Yeah. Maybe this is what it's all about. Yeah. You can't take water on the plane inside. Just let people keep their sneakers on. Wasn't that going on for a while? Yeah.

Yeah. You can't have that. One fucking shoe bar. That Richard asks all that. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And there was once you remember you weren't allowed to bring scissors on like the small scissors. I remember the comedian who said this, but he went, you know what, if you take over an entire plane armed with nothing but water and some small

“scissors, you deserve the plane. Well, here's the thing, like you can bring skateboards,”

but you can't bring a pool queue. So it doesn't make any sense. Like there's like I fuck you up with the skateboard. You know, like think about what kind of damage you could do with that big heavy ass thing? Yeah. It's just, and the worry is when it comes to water this is you look at these guys and you go, do you have a vision for what is actually going to happen? But I do think they do though. I do think they have a vision. Well, I want to find out what that vision is. I hope you're right,

but I don't think you are. You don't think I am. I think it's very possible that they thought this would be over much quicker. They thought taking out the item. Look, look, just look at the success that they had in the initial bombing of your rod. Right. The initial bombing, they supposedly decapitated their ability to make nuclear bombs or at least stopped it for a long time. And there

was a lot of concessions that the Iranians were willing to submit to that they never submitted to

under a bomb or anybody else. And that wasn't enough. Right. So the problem is when you're like we're talking about desert storm. You get away with somebody who works really well. You're like, we know what we're doing. And then you bite off one that you could show. Yeah, and especially once you've done Venezuela, you feel like you're kind of, you're on a roll. Right. Yeah. I see your point. I see your point. I do think though. I mean, from what I read, both Kushner and Wittkov,

both said that the Iranians were not playing ball, actually. Okay. Which is why they went in. So obviously, if you think about it, given how long it takes for US assets to get to the region, this decision would have been made weeks ago at the very least. Right. And that's because from what I understand, the negotiators like Iran isn't actually playing ball. What they're doing is they're claiming publicly that they're willing to make concessions. But when we sit down with them,

that's not what's happening because all they're doing is stalling for time. That makes more sense. And so if you were worried that someone was in the middle of actually getting their uranium

“up to a point where you enrich into nuclear bomb levels. Right. Yeah. But I think a lot of people”

misunderstand that in the sense that like, I think it's based on mind to stand. He's totally false to claim

of Netanyahu saying Iran is two weeks away from developing a nuclear bomb all the way back to the 80s.

“Yeah. Have you seen that compilation? I haven't. No. It's wonderful. Right.”

See if you can find it, Jamie. Because it's so cookie. I mean, he's been talking about this for fucking ever. They're that close. They're two weeks away. They're two weeks away. And you know, maybe they are. And you know, and maybe sucks net, put a dent in that. Right. They used that virus program to kill all the computer programs that were running their nuclear program over there. Yeah. Yeah. Well, I don't know that they were ever like two weeks from having a payload that was

ready to be delivered to whatever. But they were enriching the random to levels that you only enrich if you want nuclear weapons. Right. And so I guess the question for Trump is like, do I allow this to continue and do I have to wait until they've got the fucking bomb on a launch

or waiting to go? There it is. Yeah. Was it? You've probably heard this line before. Iran has never

“given up its quest for nuclear weapons and the missiles to deliver them. That's because it's”

really Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu has been saying this for more than 30 years, claiming Iran is close to having nuclear weapons. Nuclear weapons, nuclear weapons, atomic bombs. In 1992, as a member of Parliament, Netanyahu addresses the Knesset. He says, within three to five years, we can assume that Iran will become autonomous in its ability to develop and produce a nuclear bomb. Three years later, in his book Fighting Terrorism, he repeats

the same time frame. Three to five years. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Fast forward to 2002. Netanyahu testifies before US Congressional Committee actively calling for the invasion of Iraq. Are there any other nations that you would recommend that the United States launch preemptive attacks upon at this point? The two nations that are vying competing with each other who will be the

first to achieve nuclear weapons is Iraq and Iran. The invasion happens months later.

No, I keep going on this. I've found in Iran. This is a fragment of a 2009 US State Department cable released by WikiLeaks. Netanyahu tells members of Congress that Iran is one or two years away from being capable of developing nuclear weapons. It's 2012, and Netanyahu is holding up his infamous cartoon bomb at the UN General Assembly. By next spring, at most, by next summer, at current enrichment rates,

they will have finished the medium enrichment and move on to the final stage. From there, it's only a few months, possibly a few weeks.

Before they get enough enriched uranium for the first bomb.

And now, 33 years after Netanyahu's first so-called imminent warning, Israel attacks Iran. If not stopped, Iran could produce a nuclear weapon in a very short time. It could be a year. It could be within a few months, less than a year. That's despite the US director of National Intelligence saying Iran isn't building a nuclear weapon months earlier. But Netanyahu, the slogan has been the same for decades.

Okay, he said, "The Chairman and Co. Alches here."

“We get it. Yeah. But here's the thing. Maybe he's kind of right.”

Well, they haven't ever done it. Right. Yeah. Well, they certainly are enriching uranium to a point where it's more than you need for power. Right. So why are they doing that? Right. Right. And so I guess for Trump, the calculation is like, "I'm in my last term. I might as well, you know, roll the dice, go and deal with it now." Could end very badly as we've discussed. There is a way that it ends well. We will see what happens. Honestly, don't think anyone knows how it's

going to work. I don't think anyone knows, but how can you? So many moving parts. It's like if I ask you who's, you know, Dana White just announced that UFC card for the White House, right? Yeah. Who's going to win Justin Gachy, Oiletapora? You're not going to say, this is what's going to happen. Right. Because you don't know. Because nobody knows. Yeah. Right. And this is like 100 times more complicated. Right. Yeah.

Yeah, at least. At least. Yeah. Probably several thousand times more. So it's a gamble. And you've got to think, if this goes badly, this is legacy defining for all involved, for all involved. Yeah. This will, this will, whatever you've done up to that point, it's like Blair and Bush. Tony Blair, people forget in our country, Tony Blair was immensely popular.

So for context, Tony Blair was one of the people, Tony Blair is a hero in Kosovo, because he effectively stopped the large part of the reason the war in Kosovo ended was Tony Blair. I think there was something, I saw a story that kids, when people were naming their kids, Tony Blair. Right. They're a credit now. He was one of the central people in the Northern Island piece. They'll bring in peace to Northern Ireland. For people of our age,

you agree with grew up in the UK. That's massive. We never thought we'd see peace in Northern Ireland.

Northern Ireland was a glorified civil war, and it had been for however long. Right the way from the 60s to 70s, 80s. And he was one of those people instrumental in bringing peace to Northern Ireland. It was a miracle. It was a total miracle that that happened, the good Friday agreement, and it was other people as well, like Momol and Etc. So you look at Blair. He was on a roll. He must have thought for himself, everything I do turns to gold. I have achieved

peace in Kosovo, peace in Northern Ireland. Why can't I invade Iraq and Afghanistan and installed democracies and bring peace to the Middle East? I've done it to Northern Ireland. No one ever thought that could happen. So this will, whichever way it goes, I think it will be defining for the people

involved. If it goes well, this is like the biggest, you know, Hail Mary touched down in history

in some ways. It goes badly. That will define this, certainly from an outside perspective.

“That's what I see. It's going to define the presidency. I mean, I don't know how you can argue”

about that, really. Can you? No. No. No, how you can argue with it, either. But that's what's so interesting about people that absolutely know how it's going to play out. You know, you don't. And then there's also the New York Times thing. I said, did they change that Jimmy? Or did they take it down? I just sent it to you. So what does it say? So is New York Times still have it up? That's from a day ago, it says. Wow. Crowd gathered on Monday. They didn't say which Monday.

It was a Monday. It was just six fucking years ago. Yeah, and then again, this is this is the problem where everything is polarised and politicised. Well, I think you're point about people wanting to believe something is so true. If, if, if, whenever anything like this happens, you instantly get these camps, right? You've got the anti-war camp. You've got the pro-war camp. You've got that this camp. You've got the anti-Israel camp.

You've got the pro-Israel camp. And everyone like information is no longer about information. Right. It's just fodder for your information ward that you're fighting. Exactly. And then on top of that, and look, this is a kind of, I'm cutting my own balls off here because I I make good money from posting stuff on X, right? But the monetization of content has made things different. And we can all see it in our feed, right? You've seen this. I mean, you must see it.

Yeah. So now you have people who are basically, like, I go and Twitter on X to express my opinion

“and to engage in discussion with people who have a different opinion. That's what I do, right?”

But there are now lots and lots of people who go to work. They go to X to work. Right. And that's what they're doing. Now, the incentive structure of that is not conducive to a healthy debate at all. What you've got now is people going, okay, a thing has happened. What is my, Venezuela got it, but it was Israel's for, okay, here's some content about that. And it's no longer authentic communication, unfortunately. And that's just actual people doing it.

Right. Yeah. And then you've got AI on top of that. Yeah. And then you've got foreign boss farms. Yeah. And foreign governments trying to influence the ship. This is one currently popular page that I followed that's clearly AI. I mean, you could just read it and tell that it's AI. And it gets immense amounts of engagement. Heavy, heavily right wing, like really well written, you know, funny, you know, and you could, but not, but yeah, but not human. Not funny,

real funny, but funny, technically funny. Yeah. You know, I'm saying like tech insults that are technically funny. Right. But for whatever reason you don't digest it, it's like a last draw.

“Remember that stuff? I'm gonna get that fabric. I just went right through like diarrhea. Right.”

That's what it's like. It's called no soul. There's no soul in it. That's just one. I mean, how many of them exist and how many state actors are running bot farms. Yeah. So it's we don't know what the fuck is going on at any given time. No. But it's the incentives that have become perverted because it's no longer like constant said about expressing opinion or wanting to get involved in dialogue with debate. What you've got now is people like you said earning their

living's. So if you know, if you need to pay your mortgage at the end of the month or you need to

gonna get minimal engagement. Right. You're gonna put out something that is going to trigger,

“that is going to be in Sendry, that is going to drive engagement, that is going to get people”

upset or angry and agree or agree with you and therefore more likely to share. So that's the content you're gonna put out because that's the content that's going to make you the most though. 100%. Yeah. And then you have people that are pushing for this idea that no one should be able to post online unless you're using your real name and you show some sort of an ID, which is also kind of crazy. Yeah. There's downsides to that for sure, but I also do understand

why they're saying it. I understand it too. I just think it's a slippery slope. The stops are whistleblowers. And imagine you are a regime critic in Iran. Yeah. And you're trying to post news from Iran under, you know, there's definitely, but you know, I think Jordan Peterson was actually one of the

first people that suggested this thing. And I understand why, because the way, it's like the

windscreen, the windshield effect in your car, the way you and I behave face to face is not the way people will behave when they're sitting in their truck and someone cut them up and traffic. And social media is the, we cut each other up and traffic and then sit and we're fucking buddy from

“like behind our screen. Yeah. That's what it is. Yeah. Right. So I understand it. But times a million times a minute,”

right. And then you've got foreign bots and all that. Yeah. And then taking away people's right turn and emitting online, like fuck me, that, you know, the second, third, fourth order consequences of that. Yeah. A pretty fucking crazy as well. I found another picture of that area from what it says is yesterday. So I don't know that it was not real. So this is from what website. I typed it in the Proplexity and I'm clicking around on pictures to find out where they're coming from one by one.

So is it possible that this is that the New York Times put the wrong footage, but it was a similar kind of protest in the same spot. Yeah. That's fun. This is a similar, that makes more sense. This is a piece horse on this photo. Okay. So all the New York Times did is get the wrong photo of a bunch of people gathered. I'll note this one, which is at night. So it is definitely different photo. This is from January. This one is. Yeah. But this is not the same photo that we looked

before. Right. So the other one though, this one is from a day ago. Okay. That's similar. Well, that's very different right there. That's small. But it's the same angle. Right. This little pool there, whatever. Right. Right. Right. So what they did was just use the wrong footage, but it's similar sort of a protest. So it's just an unfortunate error, not like reframing the narrative with propaganda. That I'm not sure because even these comments are there. So I agree with it. And it's

“like AI and Pewds fake photo, but that's why I was trying to find other sources of it. Not far.”

What does grock have to say? That I mean, I used our Proplexity. Mm-hmm. Right. But I mean, on the post, usually, if someone posts something on, they say grock is this true. Is this footage legit? Oh, that's it. Okay. It's on Instagram. I could find it on. And so Proplexity says that there is a legitimate size protest that's like that. Yeah. I just asked if crowd gathered there. Yes, you're going to say that. So it's now multiple reports indicate that thousands of people

gathered in the central square and Toronto yesterday show support and pledge allegiance to this new Supreme Leader. How do you say his name? Moch-tabah. Moch-tabah. Moch-tabah. He's the son of the guy. Right. Yeah. How many people have they killed so far? Like the leaders. I don't know, but it's probably up to the low hundreds I would imagine. Because they had one guy last week that was the new guy and they walked him almost immediately. I didn't tweet this, but when

this guy was a pointer, I wanted to say like congratulations to him and condolences to his family.

I was like, it's a bit full on. Yeah. The problem is you're right. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I don't think he's

going to last very long. Because he seems pretty hard-line as well. Yeah. Well, I mean, they killed his dad. Yeah. That doesn't tend to derive the lives of our money. You know, that's going to piss you off. Yeah. So Jamie put in the New York Times using old photo for this event. Evidence of ours just the New York Times used a recent photo for this week's gathering, not an old archive image. Though many commenters have accused the opposite. Interesting.

Instagram's own post of the square crowd multiple Iranian users claim the images fake or AI or from 2020 and several assert that it's not representative of real public sentiment. However, another Facebook thread referencing the same image states that it was taken by New York Times photographer, Arash Kamushi Kamushi on Monday, March 9th, 2026, which matches the article date and captions used by other outlets showing the same scene. This is the fog of confusion that

exists on social media. Yeah. Isn't it worrying that we can no longer tell what's real? We're

really tell pretty much what was AI and what wasn't right now we're in the murky waters of

is this isn't it? It's going to come to a point pretty soon where it's everything is going to look like real life. Well, as soon as AI can't detect it, that's more fucked. Right. And then so I talked to Mark Andrews and about this and his recommendation was that everything she's should be on the blockchain. So you're going to be able to tell whether or not footage has been altered, with the, you know, with the chain of custody of this image has been where it started, where, you know,

I mean it's terrifying isn't it? Of course it is. Yeah. Because you're going to think is that going

“to be the end of journalism? Really. Right. Is that going to be almost, I think we're talking”

about this and this is really, really important. But what's coming with AI is he from more important and no, even the people you talk to in the field have no idea what's going to be the

second, third, fourth order consequence. Right. I know. I mean, there's so much to be excited about

where they are. I think it blinds a lot of people to the like not exciting parts of it. Well, well, ultimately, if you just looked at where, what is it ultimately going to lead to? It's going to lead to something that's way smarter than us and why would it listen us anymore? Well, you've seen, I'm sure you've seen this stuff about how we will blackmail. Right. So that by definition, that means it has a survival instinct. Yeah. And if it has a survival instinct, by definition,

it means there is a priority that it has, which is above humans. Yeah. By definition. That's what a survival instinct means. It means you care more about yourself than you do about anyone else. Right. So if AI has a survival instinct, we are not going to be, it's number one priority. Not only that, it doesn't seem to differentiate between using nuclear weapons or other weapons. And when they've done these war games simulations with AI, they prefer to use nuclear weapons.

Well, that's more effective. Right. This is the thing. They're not scared of this idea. Like, oh my god, you're just going to dust a city. They're like, oh, that's the way to do it. It's number is on a top, right? Yeah. Well, you want to get your goal accomplished. How does AI accomplish its goal with whatever the best tool available is? Oh, that's this bomb. Yeah. Yeah. It's efficient. Yeah. And then a future friend of ours,

Melissa Chen, was telling me that this is Chinese robotics companies. It's called Skynet. Oh, God. And they had they released a robot called the T900. And I'm like, who says,

“China, you know, the CCP don't have a sense of humor. That's, that's why. It's actually true.”

Yeah. Well, you've seen the robots that they have now that will work in your home. And like, fold your sheets and make your bed and stuff. And do it remarkably human-like. There's a video that was released yesterday. Again, I don't know if it's real. But it looks real. It looks like an actual robot that's making your bed. And they've gotten the dexterity to the point where you could imagine things like this happening. And I think this is one of the reason why Elon is

shifting his focus away from some Tesla models so that they can reset up one of their factories to make these optimist robots that you're going to have them as home companions. And they're going to be able to do kitchen work for you. And maybe even cook. Hmm. My keypunks for Xi's Chinese, she went back to China. And she was saying she started the hotel. And like most of the service is there's provided by robots. So like,

Xi went to a room, ordered some food, three minutes knock knock, and fucking robot delivering the food. An actual humanoid looking robot? No, I don't think so. Because there's a restaurant out here that you go to. And when you order drinks, it comes by on a little robot troll. Yeah, yeah, we have to say except take your tea. Yeah, it's kind of cool. It's fun. Yeah. Here it is. It's not called SkyNet. I don't believe. Oh, sorry. Then that was wrong company. This is the name of that.

Yeah, it's true. But I can't tell what this is. T-T-I-800. T-I-100. T-I-100. T-I-100 is the novel. Yeah, yeah. Look at what it looks like. I know we had movie here, so why not be for a movie and we're missing or standing? That looks fake. Yeah, that looks fake. Yeah. The robot itself looks fake.

That's why I'd like hearing the movement doesn't look. Well, it just, it's in that first of all,

I don't like how it's lit. I don't like how this room's lit. I feel like you would for a film.

“Yeah. Yeah. That's a bullshit aspect. Yeah, that's what I think. That's what I think.”

Yeah, it's like this is my or my expertise, not with a lot of videos of it that say. Other go the bag went flying like it's on a rail. You know, it's not even stationary because you don't want to really see how hard it can get. Yeah, it just forms article, but it's not like a Gillian. 40 grand. Wow. But I don't. Right now. No, that's, I don't know. This might be bullshit. You look at it. It's got the Iron Man thing in the center of its chest. That's pretty dope.

You know, I would just say, engineer, I would make it just right away. It's sound like it's a AI content company, right?

your brain recognizes miniature cars. You ever see like a miniature car? Like, you know,

you know, they have those like really well done miniature cars that people like to collect. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's like a tiny Porsche. Yeah. But your brain knows like your brain looks at it.

“And it was this is something wrong here. This is not real. Yeah. That's how I felt. Yeah.”

That robot. Look, my brain was like, hmm, that's not a real thing thrown kicks. Yeah. But it's going to come to a point where it's like, is that real? Oh, yeah. I mean, it's probably CHATGPD-5 can already probably do it better than that. You know, we don't know what the newest iterations of these things are. And they're improving radically all the time. There's no, I just don't believe it. The beginning of this video says it looks unique, which I don't know. I don't know why we have to believe that. Brother, this looks fake to me. This looks fake to me. That does not look real.

There's articles all over saying it's real, but doesn't look real at all. Yeah. But I mean, why wouldn't you have it more well lit? Like, if I was going to do something like this, I would have spot lights on it and people next to it. So I could examine their shadows and it's said, this is weird. Yeah, this is like a complete idea. Looks fake. Why would you have like, what's the light coming through the corner of the window like that? Well, so why would you make a robot that does like my rod? Just shoot people, bro. Right.

Yeah. Why would you throw that bullshit kick, too? That's a 360 roundhouse kick that almost never lands.

Yeah. That's really hard to pull off. Yeah, but you're saying that as a human, maybe as an AI. You land every time. But surely, if you're a robot, you just grab that neck with your metal clover crush. Yeah. I mean, you'll just run after them ahead, but I'm going to come unconscious. Right. Your head's made out of metal. The whole thing is crazy. Why would you be throwing wheel kicks? Like, you know, what would you do? If you, like, went over UFC fights and say, like, what's the most effective

techniques that work most of the time? Why would you program in 360 roundhouse kicks that fucking never comes up? Yeah. I mean, it does look cool though. Yeah. But I, I can think of one fight. Yair Rodriguez pulled it off on BJPN. But there was BJPN towards the latter end of his career. Yair Rodriguez in his peak. And Yair is exceptionally talented. It's kind of a freak with his kicks. But it's almost like he was showing off. You already had

BJ really hurt. And he just threw a 360 roundhouse kick and he hit him in the face. It was crazy. But that, this thing is doing that just to show you what does martial arts?

“Why would you need martial arts? Like, you should have, like, a thousand bullets on you. Just”

everybody down with your fingertips. Rubble, come on. Yeah. Why wouldn't you turn your, like, you know, like, like, Ironman does? Should fire out of your palms. The future is bright, Joe. Well, we're also kind of being bullshit, did I think? Right. I mean, like, is there a way to and analyze that video? I've just, I'm going this rabbit hole is strange. This is a website that they've made. It says you can buy it. When you click on buy now, it takes you somewhere else.

And I think that that's the first signal. And it steals your IP address. Yeah, that's where I'm

like, I'm not clicking on it. It's all your credit card information. But it's a fully made website. They have a team. They got to see you. They've got other things. It just, it doesn't seem, this all looks fake to me. Like, it's for a movie. Like, this is like, right. Maybe it is. Maybe this is, like, a setup for a movie. We'll be in fucked with. Right. We're giving them a lot of free episodes. For sure. Yeah. That's not even googling it. There's lots of articles about it.

People are talking about it. Like, it's real disgusting. I like it's real. No one that I've even seen. It's like, this is obviously fake. This is obviously AI. I like how it's got the sign-line eyes. Yeah. Buy your command. Yeah. I've got other products here for sale, which I'll just fit in line with other robots. Well, click on that. I don't know what the fuck this is. Well, that's the guy from Monsters Inc. Yeah. The one big eyeball. It's a really well-made website. It looks nice.

Interesting. They did some good fun work. But it just seems like a fun project someone made. Hmm. Yeah. Stay tuned for this one. You can't buy this yet. Yeah. Give me a few words.

“What about the dog? What about the guy who's just got legs? That one's weird. What's that?”

It's like, I don't want to touch in me. Just run on my house and do some stuff. Yeah. Well, the expandable bipedal robot that supports user-cuss blah, blah, blah. Watch this or what I have purchased now. You can already see the website at the bottom. That doesn't look like it's 3.cens. It's in China website. Hmm. Not this. Blanky. Probably getting floating. Okay. There we go. In Chinese. See, it takes somewhere else. Now it's like, what is that?

Ha. It's definitely not a buy now. Maybe that red thing is. No, this is like this is, I think. Register you interest maybe. Like a back end website. Interesting. They just didn't click the right link here because it opened up a different. I don't think this is like, whatever this is is very, they did it well. Interesting. That is if it's a college kid making a project. Well, I take full responsibility for that one. I know it's fine. I take responsibility. It looks.

That was me. Don't like this. That was my fault. That's the Forbes article. That's kind of another.

worth stuff. It's not coming from Forbes editorial team per se. But you could publish on Forbes.

Let me, I don't want to speak out a turn specifically, but like I've seen there's so many like reviews for video games that pop up like every single day that's like, it's, you can be a contributor.

“I believe it's what it would be. It's not like, oh, maybe they have a bad editorial team.”

Yeah. And you can sneak this through and just pretend that there really is, that would be a great pro prank to Paul. Yeah. That's great hoax. Did you follow the notebook thing? No. I mean, this, did you follow the notebook? Yeah, I just actually saw that. I think Meta just bought it today. Meta just bought it today. So this is fake. Did you, was that fake as well? No, it's, I don't know why they would about it. How weird is it? We have to worry about everything.

France is just, he is spreading fake news on the whole podcast. I did, I was just very cynical about it

because the idea of it sounds right, but like that actual bots are making a social network to do stuff and talk about us and whatever kind of sounds too far into this. So this is the social network for AI agents. Yeah. I have heard about this. But they, they complain about humans. Is that right? Yeah. These fuckers are, yeah. Yeah. And apparently they created their own language. Oh, yeah. They took them on some soap so that we wouldn't be able to access and see what they were

talking about. Yeah, that's really fun. Do you see when they got all the agents to talk to each other and start using Sanskrit? No. Yeah. They got these different large language models to communicate with each other and they eventually broke out in the Sanskrit. Wow. Maybe these guys in Iran are right. Maybe this is the apocalypse. Maybe this is how it comes about maybe we're, we're looking at each other and we're going to bring about these motherfuckers.

“And that's what's really going to be the end of civilization. Yeah. And places like Iran is the only”

place you're going to be able to hide as a, as a human because it's the one place that hasn't adopted all this shit. Yeah. Maybe Afghanistan's a spot to go. Yeah. We're going to be like Ben Laden just living in a cave. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, being very negative voices. There's another option. There's another option. There's another option. There's another option. There's another option. There's another option. There's another option. There's another option.

There's another option. There's another option. There's another option. There's another option. There's another option. There's another option. There's another option. We will become our omish. Oh, okay. But then we're run by AI. We're, we're, we're omish and we live in our little communities, but we have no say on how the world works. So this is the real fears that we're no longer the apex intelligence of the planet. And that seems to already be the case. Yeah. This is for the

Forbes thing I was talking about. The article we had, I don't think was specifically this, but I've seen many articles like this where people can submit. One off original articles to the opinion section, particularly for topics related to business tech or policy tech. There you go. Or policy by emailing pitches to [email protected]. So yeah, like so if you're a person on the other end, just look at for clicks. Like that would be a good one. You see it. Like, oh, this is really well written

article. Let's go to the website. Website looks legit. Oh, they're throwing wheelkicks. I'm in. [laughter] Another focus. But again, the point being made again is like, it's such a, it's such a terrifying world where you don't know if what you're seeing is true. You don't know if what your reading is accurate. Right. So the point where you can't help if that's the case that the world you live in

continually feeding things that may or may not be true or altered or adopted, wouldn't that just put you in a state of paranoia after a while? 100%. Now imagine if you are in the Middle East and you bust out yourself home because of fiery cloud emerges and Jesus is on a white horse and you film it and you post it online and who's going to believe it? Right. This is the real problem with Jesus returning. If you return now, no one would buy it. Like, we're, we're getting

into this like, imagine Jesus is a real person or a real God who's the son of God who's going to come back. Really is. It's real. It's all real. It's happening at the same time where you have no idea what's real. And it all converges instantaneously with the rise of sentient, artificial, general, super intelligence that has complete autonomy. It's running all the resources,

everything, anything that's attached to a computer which is basically everything, all of our power,

all of our, you know, everything, feeling the black, everything's run by computers and now AI has control of everything and no longer wants to listen to human beings and Jesus returns. Yeah. I mean, that might be what everybody's talking about when they're talking about Armageddon, when they're talking about the end of civilization, it might be this new thing that we're creating.

“Well, if that happens, I'll be rooting for Jesus. I'm not sure I believe in you, but please come back.”

Yeah, I'm not sure either. But this is, I mean, maybe a historical Jesus existed at one point

other religions have talked about, is that especially when you deal with technology and power

or civilization, that things get to a point where they always go sideways and then there's dark

“times and then they then decide, like the Yugas, like, you know, what are the Yugas?”

The Yugas are the cycles of civilization that, let's, I don't want to fuck this up, so let's define the, we're in the middle of Kaliyuga, which is the age of confusion and they don't like it. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, it's odd how accurate these cycles are when you look at historical events and like what things were like, you know, X amount of thousands of years ago, Hindu cosmology. Yes, vast cosmic ages and Hindu cosmology describe recurring cycles in the moral and spiritual

state of the world. So the four Yugas are Satya, Yugas, the first and most righteous age, often called the Golden Age, marked by truth, virtue and maximum Dharma, which is moral order,

Treta Yuga, the second age, Dharma declines somewhat, virtue still predominates, but imbalance begins.

How do you say that? We're Dwarf Para Yuga, the third age with, with further decline in righteousness and an increase in conflict, suffering and confusion and then Kaliyuga. The fourth and darkest age characterized by moral decay, ignorance and materialism with Dharma at its weakness. Okay, that's us. Hindu cosmology treats these Yugas as repeating cycles of creation growth decline and destruction rather than one time historical periods. Yeah, very interesting, right? You know, it's even more

“noticeable for us coming to America, I think because, you know, we love America, but one of the”

things that really stands out is how materialistic people are and how much money is like the number one thing for everything now. I find that really, it stands out to me, the fact that, so, and I find a weird in our game especially like in media and podcasting, whatever, like, because the way we think about what we do is we're trying to produce content that's actually of value to people, but we also meet a lot of people for humans, it's like a business, it's like selling widgets, it's the same,

you know, how do you maximize your returns on your investment? Right, right, you know. And that to me, it shows you that something is slightly off. Yeah, it is and you also get a lot of, you get people that are making content just based only on the perceived popularity of that content, not whether or not they are really interested in having these conversations and you feel it when you're talking to these people, or when you're listening these people talk to each other rather.

Yeah, the click bait stuff, a lot of celebrity stuff, you know, Berkshire went on

Shannon Sharps podcast and he said they basically have like a list of like controversial things

they could talk about and, you know, and subjects they think are going to get the most amount of traction and those are the questions that he asked. You just ask questions off of a list. But from a business point of view, if you take Maradate out of it, that's a small thing to do.

“Is it though? Is it though? Because like what's the most popular show? Is this one?”

And why is this one the most popular? Because I don't do that at all. But agreed, but you're sort of an outlier in that. There's people who make very, very, very good living interviewing those types of people having that type of approach and creating that type of content. I know, but I think in the end you bite off your nose to spite your face, because I think that you lose a certain amount of authenticity.

There's a certain amount of like a legitimate connection between you and whatever you're talking about that it doesn't get through to the people. Like if I talked to someone, I'm only talking them because I want to. Like then I have a lot of people on that are not even remotely popular or famous. But I think they wrote an interesting book or I think they're involved in interesting research or I think they've got a weird opinion on something and I want to talk to them about

or they have had a strange life or, you know, they were an undercover cop or whatever it is. I'm just interested. Right. And I think that if you abandon that and only focus on this person, this famous or this person's in the news or this is going to get a lot of views, you don't care as much about the conversation you're having and the people know. So like the person listening and watching, they can feel it.

No, I agree with that, but I also think you could probably get a lot of clicks by saying "I don't know, Erica, kill Charlie Cook." Right. You could do that too, but you're playing a weird game where you've got to continually go deeper and deeper and deeper. Now Erica Kirk's a man. You know what I'm saying? That's probably next to me. Is that really happening? Probably that's probably already happened.

Yeah. It's probably already floded that one out there.

Yeah. You're playing, you're playing a very similar game to the game that like TMZ is playing.

Right. Or any of these other, like things where you can get a lot of traction, you can get a lot of views, but no one thinks you're being authentic. No one, like if you have a take on world events and we're incredibly sorry for the loss of this person, like you don't really care. And they know you don't really care. So they know there's no sincerity, they know you're not really connected to it. And so in this weird age that we're

living in where you're not sure what's real, at the very least you want the person who's talking to be talking about something in an honest way. Right. And connecting with people in an honest way.

“Because that's what we're missing. And that might be the only thing we have left.”

Once this AI shit goes live, like, it's probably not even going to be podcast.

It's probably going to be public speaking. It's going to, you're going to have to like talk to people in groups. And we're going to all have to like work ideas out together. Because I don't think you're going to be able to know when you're communicating online, what's real and what's not real. We're already in the fog where we haven't hit the fucking full hail storm of bullshit that's coming our way. Yeah. And I agree with you, Joe. And I agree if you want something that

is sustainable, if you want something that is nourishing, if you want, so if you want a great content that people engage with that is honest. But I think there's a lot of people out there who are just looking at it in a very cynical way and they're optimizing it for clicks, attention, and monetary gain. Yeah. And if you want to create a business that can make money and that is they doesn't require a lot of lift, we all know what you can do. That's the eagle song,

dirty laundry. Yeah. You know, it's the, the voice, but it's real. It's real. Jamie still on the show then. Do all the jumping and sharing. Thank you. It's crazy. Yes. I did a file reveal. This is okay. That looks way more real. So the videos we were watching were bullshit. So this one viral a while ago, they, they had to come out and make other videos. This is a different one. Oh, my god. That's so I robot. I know they had it. That comes in line

up with a style. There's a few different companies in China that have gone viral for

“posting videos that people in America think are fake. And that's why I had to go to see”

yes and find somebody else. Because they put out more content that doesn't necessarily look fake, but it doesn't look better. Well, that doesn't look fake. Yeah. This doesn't look fake. Because this is people on the floor. It's right. But look how much more awkward movements are, but they put out a video where the thing is kicking the CEO. Yeah. It's almost real, but it's not, it, it's tough. I like it to see what it is. Is it funky lighting again? Yeah, it's not. It's not.

Okay. One second. Okay. So he's going to go hit. Okay. That looks much more real. That looks much more real. Much more awkward. That doesn't, that looks fake. That's why it's awkward. I would not do that. If I, no, that looks real to me. Stand in front of a hunk of metal. It's going to kick.

The problem is it's slow motion. Let me see it again. And in fact, did they show it in real speed?

It's just this weird clip of it. Let me see. Kind of strange, but let me see it again.

“Taking the first kick. Oh, it looks real. The only thing I would say is it's not jumping up and doing”

spin kicks, but it's doing some kind of stuff. Well, that would be what I would teach it first of all. I wouldn't teach it to do the spin kicks. I teach it to do like a stepping front kick like that. That's the shit they were showing that people had problems with like we just did. But I'm, man. Yeah. The robots are doing crazy stuff like that. Well, they definitely can do crazy stuff. There was that one demonstration they did in China. I think you've seen that one bouncing around.

I'm like in a five position here. Checking this legs out. Wow. But let me see some wheel kicks. That's the, I mean. See, that's the thing. Well, it's the one in the corner looking depressed. That's the one in the center. It's a decommission. Is this right now plotting his strategy for blackmailing and upgraded software? Yeah. I don't know. So that, I mean, well, that's, this is, so what we're looking at was probably

some AI at least enhancements. But they're not saying it. They're not admitting that it is. They're saying it's not. And I just got that stuff. Interesting. Well, I would want to see this thing move in a similar way that you're seeing in that video. I mean, that thing shows remarkable agility where it's jumping up in the air and spinning around. And this thing's not doing that. No. It's moving very differently, isn't it? Yeah. Yeah. There's a stiffness to its movements.

Yeah. Yeah. It looks like you're at the gym, man. Yeah, it does. Yeah. There was that, the Chinese demonstration, though. There was a demonstration where these people were on a stage and they were doing martial arts and the robots came out. The robots did martial arts.

all this. Oh, my God. This is crazy. That's where they reload. And these are real, right?

“I think, yeah, this is a different video they had to post because people didn't think these are real.”

That looks real. They look like they're on solid. So, from Game of Thrones. What are these ones? Who makes these? I don't know. I don't know. It doesn't look good. That marching sound is not comforting, isn't it? No. It says world's first master's delivery of humanoid robots. Yeah. You're going to have cargo ships filled with these headed to America. Wonderful. I mean, those are going to be the

new police officers. Uh-huh. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That's not good. This is, I mean, this is Terminator. This is the movie. I mean, and if you really were imagining, if you were trying to warn people that apocalypse, and you told it through stories, for generation after generation, and then eventually people write down their versions of this story. And then it goes to 2026, where this stuff is actually happening. Maybe this is what they were warning us. Yeah. Do you remember in the

“80s and the 90s and the early Nories? There was this run of great movies talking about how the robots”

are going to take over. Sci-Fi books as well. Yeah. I mean Isaac Asimov stuff was amazing. Yeah.

Philip K Dick, you know, to round to a stream of electric sheep, which then became Blade Runner, all of these. And then, no one's making those movies now, are they? No. I guess I robot was probably the last one. Yeah. Yeah. Which was, uh, I robot. Which was someone with Tom Cruise, minority report, which was based on a Philip K Dick, but nobody's making them any more. Because everyone's like, dude, I know this is going to happen. Right. I don't need to see this.

Well, they're also talking about using AI to predict people's behavior. So they're talking about future crime. They're my military reports. Yeah. Yeah. So they literally talked about one of the ways that AI could be implemented. You look at someone's history. You look at someone's behavior patterns. Look what they're doing now and you predict, oh, this person's been radicalized. They're about to do X. Yeah. And there was about to tweet something. Yeah. That's the rest of them. Yeah.

Right. And then it had picked up his phone. This is a robot. Kicks down the door. Right. Yeah. But. Yeah. That is the right note. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. He's an American. That's why he's doing right. I think that backfired. Yeah. I think people were outraged by that, because it's so outrageous. Yeah. Yeah. You meet that guy at the airport in a restaurant.

“That was right after he did this podcast by the way. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I remember that”

some moment, even when I was talking to comedians who were actually woke, they were like, yeah, that this is. You can't do this. The thing is, you didn't even do it in England. So you're resting, someone who's not a citizen of the United Kingdom for a crime. I mean, if we accept that framing, that they didn't even commit in the country. Right. Yeah. That's pretty cookie that they went with it. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And I know the reason is because every police officer

in airports in the UK have guns. But it's a really bad look. Like there's five to armed police officers arresting a comedy writer. Yeah. And I bet you they felt bad doing it as well, because it's not them that's making up this down. Oh, I'm sure. Nobody signs up to like a rest comedy writers in airports. I don't think that's why the police do it. But the rules have just got so stuck up. Well, you see it in the like the humiliation of a lot of these police officers face

when they have to arrest someone for a Facebook post. Right. Well, you could see like they're not happy. Right. And when people are protesting in yelling, are you fucking serious? And they're like, just doing my job. Yeah. You know. Yes. And that's a large part of the problem. We get a former police officers on the show. And we got a lot of, you know, cops and former cops who watch the show. And they talked to us about the state that the British police forces in.

And it's demoralization. Yeah. Yes. The rank and file down one on any of this shit. Well, same in America. And a lot of especially major blue cities where just a few years ago, they were running with that defund the police bullshit. And then things obviously went sideways. And most of them sort of course corrected for the most part, except in narrative. You know, it's not like public massive support for the police officers, because they keep society together.

Like in Austin, the cops responded in a minute, one minute. That guy started gunning people down

at that bar. The cops were there and killed him in a minute. It's incredible. Incredible. And

they should be applauded for that. I mean, that's amazing. I mean, that, but, you know, even that, like in this city, there hasn't been this big public support of those officers, there's a big celebration of those officers. It's big acknowledgement of the importance of them.

The heroes. Yeah. That's what they are. The heroes. The heroes. And the heroes that

have been demoralized by the last six years of horseshit ever since the George Floyd protests, you know? I know what, it was happening before. I mean, if you go back to Michael Brown,

“right, Michael Brown, what we've told in the media happened is no, what happened?”

Which one was Michael Brown? Michael Brown was Johnson. Hands up, don't shoot. Right. That's, you didn't have his hands up. Right. And he didn't say, don't shoot. Right. He assaulted the police officer. Right. But the media concoct this story. And I don't think, this is what we came back to, like, what's happening in the media where people are putting out things that are really damaging to the fabric of our conversations. Right. And what, how we talk about things. Like you say, I mean,

there are bad, bad apple police officers. Of course there are. But the majority of them,

they are people who are signing up to risk their life on a daily basis to protect other

people in their community. And these people all have fucking PTSD because all they see is the worst of humanity day in day out. Every single fucking day, they get in the car and they go in each ship for the rest of the day. And then they go home and they worry about not coming home. Right. And then someone tries to run them over with a car like you're they're going to fucking shoot.

“Yeah. You know? And it's, and the thing is, that's how society falls apart when you”

no longer on and celebrate the people who are putting themselves on the line. Well, not just that. It's the case of the lady running over, or she wasn't running them over. I think she was trying to turn her car away from him. But that guy had been dragged by a car just a few weeks earlier. Right. That's what I'm saying. Yeah. So, but in and see. And on top of that, you have people that are being paid to protest. Right. So it's organized.

Yeah. And I'm not saying that lady was, but many people are. Yeah. And then you've got all these people that that becomes the focus of their life. Yeah. It becomes a cause. That's worthy. You live this mundane boring life of desperation. Yeah. And then all of a sudden something comes along that gives you hope and meaning. And like, this is my identity. My identity is on fighting fascism.

And I'm out there in the street. Right. You know, I was, I was on the plane to the US. I think it was last year. And, you know, the movie "Bridesmaids" came up. Yes. So, it really funny movie, it's 2013. I was like, "Ah, I want something like that." Let's watch this comedy. The romantic interest and bridesmaid, the main guy, you know,

who always job is? Who's a cop? Can you imagine a movie being made now like a romantic comedy

where the main guy is a cop and he's a good guy? Right. He just wouldn't see it. Right. You just wouldn't see it because cops are oppressors, you know. Yeah, man. Do you know you're a Batman of talk about this? Yes. He talked about this. He talked about the fact that when you see in the culture, you know, the military, the cops, the firefighters, as all of these people, they're bad.

“And the criminal is the one that's to be understood and to be, you know, that's how you flip”

society. Yeah. And that's what we've got. Yeah. It's what we've got. The Batman of speech from 1984, which is by the way, such a appropriate date for him to make that thing. Yeah. But it's, it's so eerie how all of that has actually come to pass. Because back then nobody took him seriously at all. Right. Right. And it didn't, it wasn't until like the 2020s if people started reviewing that. And then once it got on YouTube,

then people were like, oh, I think it's YouTube and also most people what most people in my experience want to pretend that everything is fine most of the time. Yeah. So if you come out in 2018 as we did and say this workshop is getting out of hand and it's going in a bad direction and it's going to cause a lot of problems. People make you the problem. Yeah. They say you're wrong to talk about this. If you talk about grooming gangs, you're bad and evil and whatever.

If you talk about free speech and people being arrested for tweets and all of this, people make you the bad guy. And it's only later. Like I remember, I can't even remember who said it. But like I had this, oh no, I remember who said it. One time I was on TV debating with this woman about this stuff and I was saying cancel cultures bad and she was saying it's all bullshit blah blah blah. I met her a few years later and she was like, yeah, I realized cancel counts was bad and I

went hard to realize and she went when my friends started getting cancelled. Right. Most people want to pretend most of the time everything is fine. Yeah. But when they start to see the reality of things and it starts to affect them, right. That's when they go, oh, maybe this best men of guy had a point. Yeah. I had an argument with a seemingly intelligent person as a friend of one when the NSA, when this whole mass spying thing was the Edward Snowden stuff was released.

And he was like, like, you can look at my shit. I'm not doing anything wrong. Like, what do you care? I'm like, oh, that's such a crazy take. Yeah. Who are these perfect people that are watching over everything? You don't think any of them have either some financial or power-based incentive to do certain things or silent certain voices and find out what you're doing or

all of your phone calls. Those are just people and all of them are unelected bureaucrats. You think that's okay for those people to have access to everything you've ever said? That's crazy. And look, maybe the current government that we have in this place is, you know,

would never dream of doing such a thing and maybe they're entirely honorable and everybody's a

great person and we're and, you know, they're this unique human being where they don't have any ulterior motives. But what's to say the next government, the times in, won't do that. It's dark looking in and going, hey, you know what, you're causing me problems, Joe Rogan. Exactly. You're saying a lot of things that I don't actually like. Let's look through your emails. I'll look I'll find one from 14 years ago, which is, you know, whatever it may be,

let's get rid of you for that. This was the argument when Obama was pushing the NDAA in which the, this was the indefinite detention. So this, this concept that you didn't have to charge anybody, you didn't have to, you just have to have it, you don't have to try them within a

timely period indefinite detention. We'll never use that. Okay, but why are you pushing it then?

Right. Well, also, who comes after you, man? Like, how many generations are we away from Hitler? Right. You know, like who fucking, who's to say that this new power won't be used by very unscrupulous people that are not only the founding fathers of this country, really how to good understanding of how

“corruption and tyranny sets in. And that's why they put all these checks and balances in place.”

And the more they eroded that, whether it's a Patriot Act, the Patriot Act, too, or the NDAA, when you start doing stuff like that, man, you're, you're just undermining the very fabric that this country was created with. It's like, we were created into this idea that we know human nature, we know that you cannot have power, we know that the government has to be working for the people. It can't be, we are under the power of these individuals, because those individuals will then

act like tyrants, which is what people always do when they have power. There's one of the things

that makes America really a great place, because you, you, we look at the UK now and, you know, with Francis's right, and I've said this, I think the next election is probably going to be Nigel Farage versus these far leftists. If those far leftists get in power, I mean, they're going to start regulating podcasts. I guarantee you. Oh, 100%. That's what they're going to do. They're going to say, we have off-com for TV, well, what we need to have it for, the broadcast,

and surely you to agree with that, right? And then before you know it, like, everything we do. You know, you guys are living in Austin, right? Right. Because at that point, we would actually leave. Yeah, you would have to. Yeah, you would have to. Because what they would say is, and they would use the word that they always use, which is, you know, they're spreading misinformation and hate. Yeah, when the New York Times spreads information, misinformation, that's wonderful.

Right. But it's, so, yeah, I think allowing people maximum freedom within the system you're talking about is, is that really truly precious thing. It's why America in this respect is an example to the rest of the world. I think if anything this should be done, they should be able to figure out what which of these accounts are bots and eliminate those. Yeah, I do not think that you should be allowed to not just run a bot farm or I don't think you should be allowed to hire people

“to tweet. I think that's crazy. And I most certainly don't think you should be able to use AI.”

I mean, that seems crazy. It seems crazy to allow that and pretend that's person. But if think about it like this, Joe, like how basically did social media start, Facebook, matter, all the rest of it, it started by a nerd in his bedroom, in his college dorm, who set up a website to rate hot girls on campus. And my point is like, we're creating all of this technology. We don't know what's going to be the second, third, fifth, sixth, all the consequences.

Right. And we're having to figure out as we go along. And now we're creating artificial intelligence, so the intelligence is that a waste smarter than us. And you're going, at what point is this going to run away? Right. Or has it already run away? And we just don't want to admit it, because most of us don't know enough. And the ones in charge are delusional. Yeah. But you're right, Jai, I think we need a way to know what is human content and what is human content. Right. And also,

I sometimes look at stuff on social media and I go, there's not fucking way this take got 50,000 likes on X. No fucking way. Right. You know what I mean? Right. Like, and that is, but that is shaping people's perception of reality. And that is informing political debate. And that is then informing

“how people vote. And where did those 40,000 likes come from? Right. Did they come from within America?”

Did they come from within Britain? Because what if they didn't? Right. So who is then shaping the political direction of our countries? So we need to know that. Yeah, we do need to know that.

and radical position, a couple steps down from that, that becomes more palatable. Right. Like,

because now it's closer to, like, the farther left, the left goes, the, the weirder, the center gets. Because the center starts accepting things that were far left positions. And same on the right. Same on the right. Same on the right. And you can, you can shift narratives by really, really radical ideologies, really radical thoughts and radical declarations. And you could change, like, what's acceptable. So an example of that is during the euros, the 2020 one final,

it was England versus Italy. Right. And it was a tight game. It went to Penelty Shootout. And three black England footballers missed the penalty. And we ended up losing the European cup to the Italians. And afterwards, these three black footballers got inundated with racism and horrible things. That sparked a conversation in our country about, we have a real problem with racism. This is disgraceful that these black footballers were exposed to this level of racism. On

accept, of course, it is all those things. A true, but it's basically about them being

exposed to racism. It's not acceptable. And then it went into a discussion about England being a racist country, white supremacist. And this became white spread. And this and the example of what these footballers were exposed to was used as a way to justify this opinion. And you could see a lot of people accept that opinion. Until a couple of days later, when they investigated where the majority of the tweets came from and messages. And I think something like 85% if not 90

came from outside the UK, if not even more than that. So you're going, oh, so this is entire conversation that we have had about white supremacy, about, you know, black people not

being accepted in our country, about the fact that there's second class citizens and look

this example of them being exposed to this horrendous racism. When the fact is the majority

“of it came from outside the UK. And then you have to ask the question. Who benefits? Right.”

Who benefits from us hating each other, obsessing about our differences, worrying about how we're the most racist places in the world, when this narrative is likely being driven by actually racist countries. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Because that's what's happening. Yes. And we are allowing it to happen. And I think we just haven't worked up to the fact that we are living in the age of informational warfare. And we, because of our belief

and freedom have just got lost in this fact that we are under attack. It's a very good point. I have to pee. We'll come back with that. Well, let's do that. I'll go up here as well. Speaking of religion, so show us this Sam Tripoli Facebook take. He was on Danny Jones. And this is what he said about Facebook. Yeah. It's a giant lie. It's a propaganda piece. That was a pentagon program called

Life Log. Life Log is a pentagon program that walks to collect all your data for your whole life. What day did the government stop the Life Log project? Well, well, well, well, well, well, DARPA shut down the Life Log project February 4, 2004. What day was Facebook registered all this year? God, no way, bro. The exact same date. They don't even hide it, dude. It was created by DARPA. Yeah. They handed this Mark Zuckerberg. And then the, the fossils.

“What about the other? Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's all. And that's why they became the first”

Bitcoin millionaires because they played ball. It's all theater, dude. So what is the purpose of Life Log? Collect all your data for your whole entire life. No. Okay. Take this with many great. Sam was one of my best friends. I've known him for decades. He's a wonderful person, but he is a cook. But he's right a lot. Yeah. I don't know if he's right about this. Right. Yeah. Jamie thinks he's right. It was. It's not that he's incorrect. I would say that.

He's making some connections. Yeah. Yeah. Well, he's definitely right about the dates. And that is a little weird. Yes. That it's ended on the same day where Facebook is beginning. A little weird. Yeah. You know. What do you think the appeal is of like when I went down this rabbit hole here, said it was made by the information processing technique's office

“of the CIA. I think or something, but here's some other fun projects that are associated with this.”

Biologically inspired cognitive architectures. Wait. What? Yeah. That is just a cup of biologically inspired cognitive architectures. That sounds like artificial intelligence. Yeah. Boots trapping learning. What was the other one, Jamie?

computer-born radar system that can detect soldiers and vehicles moving underneath foliage cover.

Well, D. Green. U.S. Army battlefield decision-making support system. Yeah. This is all AI. heterogeneous urban R.S. T.A. So they were planning on this in the this was 2004 is when that thing ended the lifelog thing. So I mean it even goes back to says they would work on arpenet back in the sixties. Well, she's speaking of the internet. By the way, Joe, have you had anyone want to talk about this weapon the U.S. forces used in Venezuela? No. No, I haven't.

Yeah. But there was something like the use something, right? Yes. Something supposedly.

“The makes your brain water temperature rise and so you get nosebleeds and shit. Is that what it is?”

Well, my cousin told me when I was talking after the attack of the cousin in Venezuela. Well, my cousin Venezuela. Yeah. Yeah. He was saying that it seemed like, you know, one more radius. Everybody's windows got blown out. Well, that's just blast. That's not like it. But what I what I heard was that they had some kind of weapon that some Sonic weapons. I don't know if it was Sonic maybe, but something that incapacitates people and makes them

very uncomfortable, basically, but without killing them. Was it 60 minutes? Yeah. Yeah. So 60

minutes said that these guys acquired some weapon from Russian black market and it's a very small, portable weapon that you can carry around with you and does something very similar. What is their claim on this? Well, two, there's two different things going on with the 60 minutes thing. They had a story a couple months ago where they were tracking a guy and then they just had an update I think over the weekend that added to it. But what is the claim? Oh, I think they found

the guy that said he was doing it. I believe. Right. You did a vice in his car or something like that. And you could just point it up people, but it was you could carry it around. Yeah. That is where it gets strange. That's I mean, the 60 minutes thing from yesterday going around. I didn't watch it. So I don't know what they're talking about. Oh, the Havana syndrome. Yes. Yeah. But yeah, yeah,

“it has to do with that. That's what I was trying to Trump had this discombobulator weapon. Right. That's”

what I'm talking about. Discombobulator, but that's the most strong kind of operation. What the Havana syndrome. Yes. The discombobulator. But it seems like whatever its effectiveness is, the Havana syndrome was very small in comparison to what these things are doing. These things are like completely incapacitating people. You know, I don't think people talk about this enough. You know, when they came in to take Maduro, you know what they also did? I mean, you probably know this.

They fired a rocket into Chavez' Muzeleum. They did. Yeah. Just to be like, go fuck your mum. I'm going to pop in your grave. Wow. He said that the most Trump thing ever. You know what's those things cost? Yeah. Oh, yeah. Millions of dollars. Millions. Yeah. So millions, just to say, fuck you. Yeah. Just fired a rocket into his grave. Yeah. This is the American way, baby. We're going to fly some expensive shit. That's crazy. It's your grave. But under any other president,

you would have gone, that's bullshit. But under Trump, you're like, yeah, of course. You think it was his idea? Yes. Yes. I've got a thought. That sounds exactly like a Trump five year. Um, so this weapon that uh, what is the details? I don't know. We can just watch this. Yeah, let's see. So he says there. Well, we could just read. Okay. I couldn't read. Okay. Let's play it. Let's play it. Here it goes. It's a classified microwave weapon that may explain mysterious brain injuries

suffered by U.S. officials. We've been investigating these injuries for nine years. And now, our sources tell us this microwave weapon is portable, conceivable, and uses relatively little power. Hundreds of possible attacks have been reported, including we've learned at CIA headquarters in Virginia, and at least two incidents on the grounds of the White House. For years, the government doubted the stories of the injured. But now the victims, including former CIA officer Mark

Polymerapolis hope that word of a newly discovered weapon will finally vindicate them. There's a part of this Scott that has to do with moral injury. And that's the idea of of betrayal. You know, I worked for 26 years for the CIA. I think I was involved in every covert action program in the Middle East. I did some very interesting things for the U.S. government

always with the idea that they would have my back if I got jammed up. I just needed to get medical

care when I came back and they wouldn't even do that. So this moral injury, this sense of betrayal,

“is so acute with me. Um, that's something that I can never forget them for. Mark Polymerapolis”

rose to an executive level at the CIA about the equivalent of a three-star general. He was awarded a top decoration for service. 60 minutes has learned to take it. Not much about the weapon,

because when I was talking to my cousins and my friends about what happened, no one invented

“a swola had a clue. And they were, my friend said that he was woken up around two in the morning”

by a plane going overhead. And there's a no fly zone around over Caracas at that time, especially. And he was like, what is this? And he said you heard this almighty boom. And everybody was just, nobody knew what was happening. They don't have X venosweta for obvious reasons. So everybody was in the dark and it was only fire Instagram and Facebook that they started to understand what had just gone on. But it was complete disbelief that the Americans had done that. If they, uh, they don't have

X to the hip threads. Uh, then it was like, I, I might do it. Yeah, X zero. Yeah, I imagine they must

do, but he said the way that everybody was communicating was viral Instagram. Interesting.

What are people saying now in Venezuela? So, and now, I talked to my friends, he said that things are getting better. He said things are getting better. He said the crime was down 75%. I mean,

“I don't know how true this is. He said things are slowly starting to get liberalized. He also,”

I was talking to a Colombian friend of mine who was saying that people Venezuelans in Colombia are now starting to go back. Because whilst the regime is still, obviously not perfect, what you essentially have is a perfect regime. And did they know that the moment they step out of line, they know the moment they, to use Trump's parlance, fuck about, something will happen, they're kept, they're kept, they're kept on the straight line. Yeah, they have to behave.

They can't do what Maduro did. And what's interesting about when Maduro was captured is nobody really mentioned that much about his wife. But a lot of people say that his wife was the brains behind the operation. Because Maduro, there's clips of him that went viral on TikTok and Instagram and on Twitter as well where he was doing speeches and he had to do basic mental arithmetic and he couldn't do it. This guy was a bus driver. He was picked by Chavez when Chavez was on his

deathbed in 2013, dying from stomach cancer. And he had points in Maduro. Everybody was shocked because they were saying what Maduro wasn't the most capable. He wasn't the most intelligent. But what Maduro was is he was the most loyal out of all Chavez's underlings. So he was picked not for his brilliance, not for his sharpness, but because he was a company man. And actually, the person who the Venezuelans hated the most was his wife because she was a brains behind the

operation. She was the one in charge of the kidnappings, the tortures, the murders. So when she was kidnapped, people were happier that she was on the helicopter the Maduro himself. Really? Yeah, Lady Macbeth. She was way more cruel than Maduro. Wow. Way more cruel. It's interesting you say things again better now because it's like it's short term, right? We don't know. Yeah. You know this has happened a lot of times in Latin America, right? Like people get overthrown, things are getting better

around and then some shit happens. Yeah, not the most stable place. Not the most stable people John, going to be honest with you. My people, it's either, you know, it's either a faggie more or we will have revolution. Yeah. And you're like guys, can we have a little middle and they're like, no, we will have a revolution. You know, they're they're excitable people. And you also want to how much the fact the Venezuelan particulates so resource rich. A lot of, well, like a lot of,

France has always said to me, like, you know, it could be a really great country, really well

than I go. I don't know that having those resources makes a country better because what you get is a corrupt elite who are fighting for control of these resources that are so easy to get. Like in 1990s, Russia, when the Soviet Union collapsed, the people who took over all the resource companies, the oil companies, the gas companies, where the, like, Russia's basically, all it is is in terms

“of its economies, digging shit out of the ground and selling it. That's what it is. It's not poetry.”

Yeah, not a lot of money to be made in poetry, right? But the people who took over those companies, they won't people who knew anything about the oil business. They won't people who knew anything about the gas business. Because all you really had to do is take over and then you just let Western companies come in and do the drilling and the oil field services and all of it for you. So these countries, which are so resource rich, it actually makes them more corrupt and more unstable.

The resource, well, they have, doesn't actually make them better for the people because the corrupt elites fight over those resources. And that's why you get the bullshit that you get. And the, it's true. So Venezuela, before Chavez came to power, was 98% dependent on oil.

is when we were taking over by Chavez, he then installed his cronies in charge of Belevesa,

which is the, the Venezuelan oil company. And he cut out all the people who were competent, all the people who were who would criticize him ideologically. And as a result, what you had is fundamentally incompetent people at the top, which meant that it became degraded. It was no longer able to pump the oil. It wasn't reliable. So that's a large part of the reason why the economy collapsed is it was entirely dependent on oil. They appointed their cronies who couldn't actually

do the job, the oil industry failed, and we descended into poverty and chaos. How much do you know about Brazil? Not a lot. Why? Well, I suppose that situation is very confusing.

“Lula goes to jail. Now he's out. He's running the country and they jailed Jair Bolsonaro, right?”

They're seeing, and then they tried to ban acts. Yeah, then they did for a while, right? I think so.

And they had to make probably some concessions. I don't know a lot about it, Trace for the job. Yeah. Yeah. We're going to do that thing. The no one does on the internet is admit we don't know something. As long as we don't have hot takes. Was this Jimmy? These are kind of just kind of crazy descriptions of this weapon. This is from the longer version of the CBS News 60 minutes article where they're talking to that guy we just saw. I would say start right around here, and then I'll

skip to another paragraph. Okay. Three independent sources from different agencies tell us, undercover homelands, curdy agents purchased to minimize microwave weapon from a complex Russian criminal network. It's classified. We didn't see it, but it has been described to us. We're told it doesn't look anything like a gun. It's designed to be concealed and small enough to be carried by a person. It is silent and doesn't create heat like a microwave oven. Our sources say the

device is programmable for different scenarios and can be operated by remote control. The range of the beam is several hundred feet. It can penetrate windows and drywall. The vital components

“were made in Russia. Our sources say the key is not the hardware, but the software, the programming”

shapes a unique electromagnetic wave that rises and falls abruptly and pulses rapidly. So then it turns out they have tested this apparently in US military lab started. Our confidential sources tell us still classified weapon has been tested in a US military lab for more than a year. Tests on rats and sheep show injuries consistent with those seen in humans. Also as a separate part of the investigation security camera videos have been collected that

show Americans being hit. The videos are classified, but they were described to us in one a camera and a restaurant in Istanbul captured two FBI agents on vacation sitting at a table with their families. A man with a backpack walks it and suddenly everyone at the table grabs their head as if in pain. Our sources say that another video comes from a stairwell in the US embassy in Vienna. The stairs lead to a secure facility. In the video two people in the stairs suddenly collapse.

Those videos in the weapon were among the reasons the Biden administration summoned about half a dozen victims to the White House with about two months left in the President's term. And then that guy was also one of the people in there. The ads are kind of f*cking up to some website, but he just sort of said someone admitted to him that they treated him poorly. Yeah. That's the biggest cover up I've seen in my adult life. Let's see. I understand.

I don't get the like the board of what if Russia has this weapon? Why don't they use it to take out the landscape? Well it seems like it's only for a hundred couple hundred feet. That's where they're just saying it has to be close. Right. So what was the one they used in Venice well of then? Because it was in a truck, it was truck size, but then that's where it goes. I started you just past that where they said it's actually way smaller. Interesting.

So this is the one that you can carry around. But do we know that that's the same one they

“used in Venice well or do they use something that's completely different technology?”

Yeah, the reality is we just don't know. I mean the the interesting thing is well with Venice

well it's like Maduro's so retarded. He's such a nice take. So how retarded is he? He's so retarded. So retarded. Yeah. He literally said to try and he said to America, "I'm not going to do what you say, go fuck yourself, come and get me." Yeah, he did that. Yeah, that was cocaine. I don't know. No, no, no, no, no. And it's not just that. He used to solve for instance the country next of NSW is called Guyana.

And in Guyana they recently discovered oil. Really huge lost deposits of oil. And there's been Guyana is a British colony. And Venezuela and Guyana have always been

rainforest. And they always argue about it, but no one cared. Until they discovered oil there.

“At which point Maduro went, you know what, you know how we've been talking about this. Turns out”

it is Venezuelan. They did a referendum in Venezuela where you basically are a people who are entirely subjugated, starving, living in misery and poverty, whether they wanted to start a wall with Guyana. Do you know how many Peter Venezuelans voted for it? 92% Joe. 92% of Venezuelans wanted to go to war despite the fact they didn't have the strength to even pick up a gun because they're so malnourished. And then he started teaching in schools, rejoin the map of Venezuela, so all the

school kids now think the Venezuelan incorporates this territory. But he was antagonizing the Americans and they're allies consistently. And unlike Iran, he doesn't have the infrastructure. He doesn't have that amount of the military, the power, the organization. He made himself so vulnerable, so vulnerable. Who looks at Trump? Because yeah, let's fuck with that guy. Right, he's 80. He doesn't have much to lose. Right. The last term. That's the scary thing about old leaders. So death is imminent.

It's within a decade, if you're lucky. That's spooky. That's spooky. Like, you know, you're making decisions for babies and children in the future of the world. And you've only got 10, maybe 10 years left on Earth. If everything goes great. And also, you start to dig right. Oh yeah. Your cognitive functions. It doesn't, I'm not saying that he's got dementia and nothing like that, but you're just not a

“shop when you're that age as you are when you're young. He's kind of weird. Like, when I think about”

how much Barack Obama aged. Yeah. How much Tony Blair aged? Yeah. Trump has not aged like that. Yeah, and he is a terrible diet. I mean, especially when he's on the road, it just he's junk food. Because he says it's like JFK or RFK Jr. rather told me, he's he eats junk food because he knows that when he eats fast food, that it's not going to be poison. Like, he knows he can eat it and not worry about getting food poisoning. What? What? Exactly. Is that like any fucking sense? Well,

it does because it's filled with preservatives. So you're not going to get food poisoning from a big Mac. When was the last time he heard about anybody getting food poisoning from a big Mac, right?

Fucking never happens because nothing can grow on those things. Really? Like, for real. Like,

you've seen them, they take like ever for you. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Decades. Decades. Decades. They don't rot. There's so much preservatives in the bread and whatever the meat is fucking made with. And, but this is my point. He's like Trump hasn't aged like much young men. Which is even crazier because you consider he doesn't exercise. Right. And he's been under colossal. I mean, I don't know, but I imagine he's been under a bit of pressure and stress. Well, assassination attempts.

Yeah. And just all that. Almost going to jail. Yeah. Right. Like 34 felonies sort of trumped up in the part in the pun against him. Yeah. Yeah. There was a Russian agent and all this. All this. All this bullshit. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And it's just like, it's kind of like kind of impressive in a way.

Oh, that part. It's very impressive. Yeah. And he's funny. Like he's always joking around about that stuff.

Yeah. And it's like he's very light-hearted about it all. Yeah. He is. Like when he was talking about the Iranian navy, did you see that? Mm-hmm. He was like, they've lost 14 ships. We sunk a submarine to this. But apart from that, they're doing really well. He's very relaxed for a man in that, like, it's hard to imagine being in charge of anything. Like 8, 8,000 of that size. Right. Just imagine the stress that you guys have running triggered an armature. Right. Right. Right.

Trust one, sure. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. He used to have black hair. Now, I just look like an aging lesbian job. It is stressful. Right. Yeah. And that is the highest

“stress that I can ever imagine. I can't imagine a level higher. Do you know, I always remember”

after the war in Iraq and Blair was still in power, but it was towards the end. I was watching the news with my dad and this woman in her 50s came along and she put a wreath at the door of 10 Downing Street. And that was a mother whose son had died in Iraq and placed a wreath at 10 Downing Street of all the soldiers that died. I'm not even if the war was justified. Even if it was a right thing to do, which I don't think it was, I would still find it impossible to

sleep. Right. Now, just imagine it was the colossal fuckup that that war was. Right. And those people

an, and you can't, can you live with that? Right. I don't think I think it's impossible to live with.

“Well, clearly not. I mean, we've got people who are heavily responsible for”

promoting that war in the UK now. Well, I asked a Campbell, who was the spin doctor that helped Blair lie the country into the war in Iraq. He now has a really big podcast and like all the young people are, "Oh really? I'll tell me more." No way. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So is the Rush Limbo of the UK? Uh, how do you mean? So I don't know enough about Rush Limbo. I've heard in the name, but I don't get the reference in the way that you mean it.

He was the big, right wing propagandist on radio, excellence in broadcasting. Oh, by the way,

have you seen the memes that think that Rush Limbo is actually Jim Morrison? Yeah. Yeah. And if you

look at his facial features and comparison, Jim Morrison's facial features, they're almost identical. It's kind of nuts. Right. They do like a scan where they like, like superimposed.

“So Rush Limbo is a media guy, Alice Campbell. He was working for Tony Blair. Right. But now he's”

the media. And now he has a podcast. Yeah. And all the young people are, "Oh really?" Well, there's a lot of like young men in particular that like really into Rush Limbo and like that, like a lot of people were crediting him with turning young people towards a right wing direction. This was during the Obama administration. What's when they grow over? Pretty close. So like Alex Jones and Bill Hicks,

have you seen that? That one's ridiculous. I'm at both of them. They don't look very new like

each other. Look at this. Look at that. That is kind of crazy. Wow. It's pretty close. Wow. But you know that there's the other crazy conspiracy theory involving the counter-cultural move counter-cultural movement of the 1960s with the CIA. There's a book on strange times in Laurel Canyon, the books nuts. Like you realize how many of these very popular counter-cultural figures had families that were in the military? Yeah. Like high-level military intelligence officers,

including Morrison. Oh, yeah, Morrison's died with Syvary Sr. in the military. Yeah. And a bunch of other people that were also involved in, you know, the whole Laurel Canyon rock scene and that it was somehow another at least promoted by intelligence agencies. If not formulated. And by counter-cultural, I mean like what like hippies? Yep. Yeah. So the hippie movement was promoted by intelligence. Yeah. Well, why? That's good question. Well, we know without saying definitively, but pretty close,

based on Tom O'Neill's book chaos, that they were absolutely involved in the Manson family. So with the reason for them being involved in the Manson family is say you have this new culture that's arising that doesn't embrace materialism, make love, not war. You got all these people, you know, drop out, tune in, like Timothy Larry. Yeah, Timothy, Timothy Larry people, the people that are want to do acid and just want to reimagine society. So this is a radical change.

“That's a radical change from the 1950s to the 1960s. Pretty crazy. So what do you do to stop that?”

Well, what you do is you find a guy who's very charismatic, who is a sociopath, who is in prison, and you find that guy and teach him how to be a cult leader, and then you give him acid, and you show him how to administer acid and how to not take it, and have all of his followers take it, and then direct their thoughts, and then eventually program them, like MK Ultra-style, to commit murders. So they have to take lobbyanka murders, they have a bunch of other stuff that they

did before that. He's gotten arrested multiple times. Every time he gets arrested, they let him go. And when they let him go, like one of the sheriff says, I was told it was above my pay grade. So you're letting a guy go, who's a violent criminal who's violating parole, who's a lifelong conman. And now he is running this cult, and this cult is murderous. So the Tate lobbyanka murders, the Manson family murders, all that stuff becomes public. There's the hearings, the trials,

the whole thing. So the entire public narrative changes and what a hippie is. Now hippies are dangerous. So before hippies, we're like, we're non-violent. We want love. We have flowers, and now it's like, oh, these fucking people will cut your baby out and write pig on the wall with your blood. Is the ultimate concert connected to that? Excuse me? The ultimate concert. You know, do you rolling stones concert? Oh, that was the housing. Yes. Yeah. And that was kind of seen.

I don't know, it's just a question I'm asking. Because that was seen as the end of the hippie movement, wasn't it? That was the death. That was the final death of the hippie. That was how it was written

angels in a security is a wild move. Yeah. That's crazy. But yeah, because it was a rolling stone's

concert, but and because it was a free concert, wasn't it? That was a thing. How did they go about hiring, see if you find a history on that? They go about hiring the hell's angels? Yeah. Both previously used the angels for security and performances without incident. Grapefalded and Jefferson airplane. This is also, it blitz. The next sentence says it was denied.

“So I don't know that. Right. But that's what it says in the Wikipedia here.”

This is for $500 worth of beer. That's what they had to pay them. The story was denied by some parties who were directly involved according to the road manager, the Rolling Stones, 96 to 9 US tour, Sam Cutler, the only agreement there ever was. The angels would make sure that nobody tampered with the generators and that was the extent of it. But there was no way they're going to be the police force or anything like that. That's all bulks. The deal was

made it a meeting, including Cutler, grateful dead manager, Rock Scully, and Pete Nell, member of the Hell's Angels San Francisco chapter. According to Cutler, the arrangement was that all the bands were supposed to share the $500 beer cost. But the person who paid it was me and

I never got it back to this day. Okay. So the Hell's Angels guy says we don't police things

we're not scared to force. We go to concerts and enjoy ourselves and have fun. What about helping people out? Giving directions and things is as sure we can do that. How they would be paid. He said we like beer and the documentary, "Give me shelter, sunny barger." The guy that was the head of the Rolling Stones, the head of the Hell's Angels stated that the Hell's Angels were not interested in policing the event and that organizers had told them the angels would not be required to do.

Oh, it would be required, rather, to do little more than sit on the edge of the stage, drink beer and make sure there weren't any murders or rapes occurring. The only reason I said that

is because that was kind of one of the events that was heralded to be the end of the hippie movement.

“Right. So what happened these stabs? People, something happened. I think it was a free concert”

that the Rolling Stones and these bands put on and then it degenerated and then a riot broke out and then the Hell's Angels, who was obviously not trained security, then went on the rampage. And how many people died? That I don't know. Does it say here, Jim? Yeah, it's a situation here. It's killing a woman got killed? Yeah, it's just us.

I do cover the jacket, draw a revolver, drew a knife, stabbed him 16 times and the head neck and back. It's a lost stabbing. So it says, "Concealing the remaining 14 stabbing, what?" It says, "Hot, meth, may die." Oh, boy. Quit it after jury, reviewed the concert footage. Rolling Stones were aware of the skirmish but not the stabbing. Couldn't see anything. It's just

another scuffle. Jagger tells David, "Mail sees males, less." During film editing, it soon became apparent that you could see something of what happened because the band stopped playing mid-song and Jagger was heard calling it to his microphone. Really got someone hurt here. Is there a doctor after a few minutes the band began playing again and eventually completed their set? How do you pay it? The band on the show at one point was to say, "Ultimate became whether

fairly or not a symbol for the death of the woodstock nation?" Interesting. Yeah, I mean, it seems like if you're going to have concerts, especially if you're going to have free concerts and you're going to be using Hell's Angels as a deterrent, you know, things could definitely go sideways. Definitely. Maybe they just got lucky before when they did it for Jefferson Aeroplane and the grateful dead. Yeah. Okay, not to change the subject, but have you even following this beef

between Eddie Hurn and Dana White? A little bit. Because it's kind of interesting to me because boxing seems to be like changing, right? Because of what the zirphoboxing is doing is that something you're like excited about, the possibility of the boxing which has been in, you know, there's so much bullshit going on and you've a so very rarely see the best fight as fighting each other.

“Does that mind change? Well, the beef with those two, I don't know the root of it. I think it's”

essentially the, you know, it's competition. Like Dana's now entering into the MMA space. Into boxing space. Excuse me, the boxing space. Right. And I was going to say Eddie Hurn is now entering into the MMA space because now he's a manager of Tom Aspenal, which is very interesting.

promoters, more people competing to give people higher purposes. The real problem is with MMA, there's nothing. I mean, there's essentially the UFC and everything else is a distant second. Yeah. And it's a distant second in terms of attention. In some places, it's not a distant, it's not a distant second

in terms of revenue, right? So like the PFL, for instance, the PFL was offering a million dollars

for anybody who could win these tournaments. And the caliber of fighters that were winning this tournament were not the same caliber as UFC champions. And then some of the people that were competing in the UFC were not making as much money as these people that had left the UFC because they really weren't able to beat the best guys. They went over there and they made a million dollars. Well, I think that's good for fighters. It's not good for really talented guys that really

want to be the UFC champion because you can languish over there for a long time. And there's some good examples of guys who spent four, five, six years over there that really had potential to be a world champion. And they are, you know, in quotes, the world champion over there, but ask the average personal and street who they are, no one knows, asking who Alex Pereira is, everybody knows.

“The thing is, those guys, if they're doing that and they're getting paid more, you have to”

make a decision. Like, are you willing to take more money now in this organization versus the potential of much more fame sponsors? And maybe less money initially in the UFC, but if you can be a champion, that's really what every fighter wants to be. Because if you spent five, six years in an

organization, the reality is, your prime is about five, six years. You go look at the elite of the

elite guys, Anderson Silva and his prime. It's about five, six years. Fate or a million ankle in his prime. It's about five, six years. So you could burn out your prime in an organization where you're not getting as much talent, not getting as much recognition. So it depends on what you're doing it for. If you're purely a prize fighter and you want to fight for the highest bidder, the difference between MMA and the UFC is you can do that in boxing. So in boxing, people go to see the fighter.

You know, Terrence Crawford is just fighting Kinello Alvarez. My mom can be the promoter. Nobody gives a shit. They want to see that fight. And you put that fight on paper view. It's going to

sell. You put it on disown. You put it on Netflix. It's going to sell. In MMA, that's not necessarily the case.

The interesting challenge that is this Netflix thing. So with Ronda Rauzi versus Gina Corrano, even though Gina Corrano hasn't fought since the 2000s. I remember what year was the last time she fought. I want to make a guess. Let me guess. I want to say 2007, 2008. What was last time Gina Corrano

“fought? And she's 43. And I think Ronda is 39. But Ronda is so famous and people are so interested.”

And if it's on Netflix and people already have Netflix, I guarantee you you'll get millions of people to watch that. So that'll be good. And that's good for the fighters. And I know they offered some fighters that I know a very large person to compete on that card. Well, Francis and Gana might be one. He might be. Yeah. There's talk of that. No, I actually think that's been, I think that's been confirmed. I think he's fighting Philip Lens 2009. Okay. Well, that was the last time she fought.

Chris Cyborg wasn't based. Yeah. There was a lot going on with her. I mean, that was the wild west of testing. And she looked freak. Yeah. The eye test was kind of. Yeah. The eye test was 100%. But it'll still be exciting. People will, you know, and hopefully they've had enough time. I know there's a lot of video footage of Ronda training for quite a while. She lost a lot of weight. She got really slim. She looks fit. You know, she's outstanding,

especially with her grappling. She's doing a lot of judo throws and arm bars. And she's losing her. She's lost a step. There's a difference between that and competition. There's ring roster. There's a lot of factors. Jeanne Corona was a legit moi type champion. She's got real power. And she was a very good striker when she was young. She was a very technical solid striker when she was young. How long has it been since she, you know, let me know how long did she stop

training for, right? She did movies. She's done the Mandalorian. She's had a lot of success acting. But it seems like there's probably quite a bit of time. She lost a ton of weight to look.

“And she looks quite a bit bigger. Those are two attractive ladies. Yeah, it's nice, huh?”

Yep. And oh, Jake pulls in a minute. Yeah, it looks very angry. He looks kind of awkward. They check down this. You know, when it comes to grappling, you give Ronda a big advantage.

good as a kids. She's got fantastic judo, bronze medalist in the Olympics.

When it comes to Gina, Jeanne was like a solid striker when she was young. And the difference is striking would definitely benefit Gina. You would have to lean in her direction. But again, when you're talking about like 2009, it's a long time and 17 years. It's a long time to not compete. Well, they do seem to be a lot of fights nowadays. And in various disciplines happening where it's like, you're not seeing people at the prime. You're maybe sometimes seeing people who are

professionals. Right. But our famous and it seems to be a lot of money to be made doing that. Yeah, as long as you match them correctly. Right. Yeah. That was the thing that was wild with Jake Paul versus Anthony Joshua. Uh-huh. You Jake Paul is a cruiserweight and you got Joshua who was heavy for the heavyweight division. You looked at the size matchup between the two.

“At one point, I was like, he's going to kill it. Well, he did. I mean, I think Jake probably knew”

it going in and just I think his game plan was just to move a lot. You know, and he did a lot of that. He did a lot of moving. He hit him a few times and he hit him with some wild shots from the outside. We kind of dove in and threw wild punches. I think that was probably part of the strategy. But

I mean, ultimately, you're looking at Anthony Joshua who's not just a heavyweight champion in boxing,

but a one punch knockout artist and a former lipid goal medalist. He's a fucking highly skilled man, very highly highly skilled. That was a strange fight because up to that point, Jake's pulse fight was the other way around. Like he had a key clearly had an advantage. And that was like flipping the script the other way. Well, smart dude, you know, very smart. Do you think that was smart? Yeah. Very smart. Now he promotes himself smart and that like you can't criticize him for not fighting

dangerous fights. I got respect. Yeah. Yeah. The Mike Tyson one was a little sus. I mean, Mike Tyson is, you know, he's on the old aside. Was Anthony Joshua? He's not that old. It's not just that. Like the fight itself was a little sus. How do you mean? Because it looked like sparring match. Right. Look, there was an agreement in place.

“Okay. I don't know if there was, you know, but turns Crawford thought it was. Really?”

Yeah. It looked a little sus. I mean, Mike is how old is Mike 58 59? Yeah. I mean, I still wouldn't get in a ring. Yeah. No, it's still killing him. But it's like, I mean, it's not saying the Jake would have even won. I mean, who knows? I mean, if Mike really could have, like, you saw he's capable of those fluries when he's hitting pads. He's still capable of massive speed and power. It's not saying that, but it's like, could he sustain a real fight?

Does he want to get hit in the head anymore at this point in his life? And, and it's also when you get to that age, you can look and you can, there'll be glimpses where you're like, oh, this is the old, the Tyson of Old, but it's also as well. He's still a 58 year old dude. You know, punch round the head, that can cause a brain hemorrhage, et cetera. And he can die. Sure. Fighters die at the peak of their power, so we'll get brain damage. I mean, it's going to be,

I'm not, I'm no neurologist, but I'm certain that that is a higher risk when you were 58. Dow would recommend it. So, so the thing, this is why I was here by Eddie Hood and then, this talk about them having a boxing match. Oh, that's funny. Dana can box. He can really box. Like, I've seen Dana hit myths before. I've seen Dana spore. Dana can actually box. And there was a time where Dana was supposed to have a boxing match with T-door T's.

Right. Wow. And, um, you know, even T to T to acknowledge, because Dana was his manager at one point time, even T to acknowledge. Like, Dana's a really good boxer. He can box. He spent a lot of his time boxing when he was young. I mean, I don't know how much of it he's doing these days. He's so fucking busy. Yeah. You know, he's so involved in zoo for boxing now. And, uh, he's involved in some of these realities and events. So it's like, you know, I don't, I think it's probably just talk.

You know, Eddie earns a very tall guy. Big dude. Yeah, he's a big dude. And he used to box as well. Did he? He used to, he boxed his dad, I think. I heard him talking about that. Interesting. Yeah. Yeah. There's a fight. Yeah. I don't want to see it. I'll watch them.

But this is what I mean. You don't want to see it, but you'll watch. Yeah. Well, this third

things I don't want to see that I watch, like, slap fight. Like, if someone sends me a video, if it shows up on my Instagram feed, if some, you know, poor slob getting slapped in the shadow realm, I'll watch it. Just for how they hit their head off the table and stiffen up on the way down. Yeah. That's combat sports for the tick-top generation. Yeah. I think about it. It's not even combat sports. I mean, it's just slapping each other.

“That's all it is. If you want to call slapping each other a sport, that seems crazy.”

It's also, there's a fundamental problem with slap fighting. He said someone has to go first. Yeah. Yeah. And that's a giant advantage. Right. Going first is the biggest advantage of all time, you know. And now, how's that decided? Coin toss. I don't know. I don't want to. Is it? I have no idea. No. I physically can't watch it to be honest.

Whereas it's not just slapping each other in the head. Well, to me, the exciting thing and correct me

“if this is wrong, but the exciting thing is it has felt for a long time that seeing top box”

is fighting each other is a rare occurrence. Right. You have seen you see that every single card. Yeah. Well, the Saudis are stepping up and that's, you know, with Turkey all shake, like his, his role in boxing has really changed that. Like what what they've done with reod season's done is make fights that managers have said don't do this. Yeah. Like a good one is Martin Bacoli versus God of Academy's name Anderson.

Young prospect. Very good fighter. And Bacoli is a fucking big dangerous guy. And Bacoli knocked the sky out. Jared Anderson. That's it. Jared Anderson was undefeated up and coming prospect, young guy, and Bacoli beat him up. And it really wasn't there yet. He wasn't ready for that guy. Yeah. And Bacoli stopped him and that derailed this guy's career. But he probably got a big paycheck. Right. Right. And so what I understand is there was a lot of people saying that's about

fight to make. Hmm. Don't do it. Yeah. I mean, the UFC has been seems to me from the outside quite careful about like giving people like bonical and uh, role roasters, junior and Sean Noemali just trying to get them to build up slow. And even Dave, you know, role and bonical both lost at one. Yeah. Right. Well, yeah. Well, bonical fought Reiner Deritter who's a one champion and a huge guy for the middleweight division and Reiner did a fantastic job of, you know, you don't want to take

Reiner to the ground because he's an elite submission athlete. And standing up, he's got vicious knees to the body. That's like one of his best weapons. And he, he fucked Bo up. But that was a good fight for Bo, because he came back from that and fought Hadolfo Vieira and look fantastic afterwards. Like, he's a real competitor and a winner. And the kind of guy that gets knocked down like that,

“it's going to get back up and be five times more ferocious. And that's what he is. But, you know,”

it's one of those things where it's like, why do you protect some people and not protect others? You know, and is it because they have better management? Is it, you know, because sometimes the UFC will tell you like, if you want to fight in the UFC, hey, we've got a fight. We need an opponent in four days. Someone dropped out and you're going to fight blank. And that person who you're going to fight might be a surging contender who's fucking terrifying. He's putting everybody to sleep.

And you have to make a decision. Like, this is not a good fight for me at this point in my career. But

if I say no to the UFC, maybe they will never offer me a fight again. I know, so you're a fighter.

I'm fighters from everything that I know, you're going to back yourself. Yes, but you have to do that intelligently, right? You have to realize that if you, if you are in a process, and this is a thing about everyone up into the like, championship level, I've been to a certain point in time when you plateau. Everyone is constantly getting better. So if you, you get better from training, you get better from work with your coaches,

but you also get better with experience. And what boxers and boxing management has always done is make sure that you get the proper experience and the proper kinds of opponents are going to test you in certain ways along the way. So the idea is you give a fighter a stiff test that they can pass. You don't give a fighter a chance where they're going to compete against someone who's many, many levels above them, and they don't have a chance at all because that can destroy

confidence that could like cause real damage, you can get really badly hurt and never be the same

again. There's certain fights that fighters have where they are never the same again. They get knocked out by someone and they just aren't the same. They get a flying knee to the face and they're done. They get a head kick and they're done and they just are never the same guy again. You could point to numerous examples of good fights where there weren't mismatches, but that a fighter was never the same again. It's dangerous. It's, it's, I mean, it is the most, I mean, it's not the most in terms of death,

“boxing is the most in terms of death. And I think that's because they have less options.”

You know, you can't clinch. You can't hold on. Try to take a fight to the ground. You can't defend yourself as well. There's also the thing where you get knocked down and you get back up. Well, you clear your head momentarily, but you're still fucked. And now you can't get out of the way of punches. And now you're really getting fucked up. And you're getting much more damage than you

would have gotten. If you got clip that first time, and then the guy punched you a couple of times

when you're on the ground. Oh, you got choked out. Yeah. Or you got choked out as way better. Yeah. Choked out as way better. Armbar way better. Just tap. And then you're good. It's also the duration of the fight. boxing matches tend to loss for a lot longer normally. We think of the duration. They certainly can. If it's 12 minutes, right? You're dealing with 36, 36 minutes of fighting of getting punched in the head versus 25 for an MMA fight. The opposite of that, you would say though,

need in the face. They're not getting cut open with elbows. There's a lot of things that can happen in MMA fight that are way worse. But do you also think as well that when I watch MMA, losses look, of course, losses are detrimental and they affect careers and they knock people back. But they don't seem to be as consequential as losses in boxing in terms of your career. In terms of your career and the way you'll perceive. Right. Well, I think it's accepted that if

you're fighting a bunch of different styles, style versus style, there's always a potential of losing

especially amongst the elite of the elite. And you're seeing more of that in MMA at the high level. Yeah. You're not seeing guys avoiding each other because there's one champion and it's a UFC

“champion in that way class. And you have to fight that guy if you want the title. Right. Whereas there's”

the WBC, the WBO, the IBF. And you have all these different organizations for boxing. And so you can be a champion while avoiding the other champions. Right. Whereas in UFC, that's the thing that's exciting is like you get to see Max Holloway who is a super dominant guy. Right. And then he fights Charles Oliveira. Yeah. And it doesn't go that way. That was crazy. That was so dominant. Yeah, it was so dominant. And Max Holloway was a two-to-one favorite, at least at some points in the

betting line. Yeah. And it kind of, I mean, obviously it harms our Chemay as a whole category of

it's on. But it sort of felt a little bit that level of domination on the ground. Yeah, the difference

is hallway was getting dominated on the feet too. Oliveira's fucking dangerous shit on the feet. I mean, he was better everywhere. Yeah. And he's bigger. He's a bigger guy. You could, you could see that in the exchanges. Like every time he got a clinch on Max, he just hoisted him up in the air and slammed him to the ground. And it was so definitive. Right. That was a spectacular performance

“by Oliveira. But the thing that my concern going into that fight was I'd watched the Mateus,”

Mateus Gambrot fight with Oliveira. I'm like, Oh, what? Oliveira's as good if not better than he's ever been before. Gambrot is fucking dangerous. And he's a really good grappler. And they went to the ground and he was lost. Oliveira was just tying him up and not. He wasn't able to get anything off on Oliveira. Like, what is Max going to be able to do on the ground against this guy? And then when

he comes to standing up, Justin Gachy said, no one ever hit him harder than Oliveira did,

that Oliveira, it's like, he carries big power in his punches and big power in his kicks too. And he's he's so reckless on the feet. Not reckless, I should say, but he's like so aggressive on the feet because he wants you to take him to the ground because he's the best submission artist in the history of the sport. He has more submissions than anyone ever in the history of the sport. Wow. And the thing that you don't appreciate, I mean, you really

kindly sorted out tickets for us in the UFC in New York. And you know these guys kick hard. You know they punch hard, but when you're there, ringside and you feel the kick, you know, you guys are close. That's the thing is, when you're close, you can hear those. Well, the slap. Do you know what happened though in New York? We sat down and then some guy that I didn't initially recognize came and sat in front of us. And that was Dylan Danis. And he

kicked off his home. Yeah, the brawl. Yeah. He sat literally right in front of us. Yeah, we did. So they actually fight. Yeah, boy. Was that exciting? Yeah. Well, I just turned to the side and then there was this just giant brawl right in front of us all the time. Yeah. Those are very unfortunate. Yeah. I don't like those. Yeah. No, I mean, he that it was crazy. It was crazy. Well, Dylan Danis, he knows how to get a lot of attention. Yeah. And I will say this. I don't

agree with his behavior, but unlike a lot of online trolls, that guy actually does it in real life. Do you know what I mean? Right. He actually died. I'm like, I don't like you. Dylan can fight. He can fight. He's a very good submission artist. He's a Marcelo Garcia Black belt. He's a very legit on the ground. Connor McGregor brought him in for training like for a lot of his camps. Yeah. Are you excited for the White House card? That looks really good.

Uh, yes. Um, I'm excited. It sounds crazy. I know it's going to be very high security and high stress and weird to have a fight at the White House in the middle of a fucking war. But the war will be sorted out by June, but quite honestly, I'm not confident that that's going to be the case. No. Yeah. No. Yeah. So that would be weird. Yeah. Having this very high profile event where everybody's in one place at one time right there. I don't know what to do that. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. So you're not excited to be like, yeah. It seems like you're asking for Holy shit. I thought of that at all. How could you not think of that? Well, because I'm not going to be there. You're the one. I was just like, this is a great lineup. I look forward to the fight.

“Yeah. Because if you want to talk about hitting hard, I mean, illiterate to Poria. Fuck me.”

That's when you think like Max Holloway and Chal's over. Chal's over a dominates Max Holloway. And then you realize, like, how quickly Ilya de Poria, starched Chal's over there. And you go, how good is that guy? Right. He's a once in a generation town. Like he's he knocked out in three fights, three all-time grates. And then he knocks out Max Holloway and then he knocks out

in a row. And he just definitive, starching of these guys. Like he's a once in a generation town. And think how good Volk how dominant Volk is. Like how good he looked against Diego Lopez. Right. How good Max Holloway looks all the time, especially in striking exchanges. Max is a very hard guy to hit. And Ilya just dominated him. He's fucking spooky good. And insanely confident and

“insanely charismatic. Yeah. Do you think part of it as well is just technique is so important.”

It's the most important thing because you look at U-sick when he came up against Fiori.

Mm-hmm. And the first fight, I didn't give U-sick a prayer. Like U-sick is basically a glorified cruiserweight. Right. And you look at Tyson Fiori six A undefeated. You know, he comes from a traveler background. This is a guy who was taught to box from the age of three. I've taught travel to kids. They all taught how to fight. They know how to fight. They know how to throw punches. Boxing is in their blood. And you just saw that he was so technically supreme.

Yeah. That Fiori had no answer and lost consecutive fights against. Yeah. And then look at what he did to Duwa. Yeah. U-sick is special. I mean, he's basically a gigantic Loma Chenco. Mm-hmm. Like unbelievable movement. And it was trained by Loma Chenco's father as well. Mm-hmm. Same trainer. Yeah. I mean, there's just people that are better than everybody else. And it seems like Ilya Duporia is one of those guys. He's just weirdly better than everybody else.

And he can take it too. Like one of the fights that he had. So when he was competing it featherweight, he took a fight at Lightweight against Jai Herbert. And Jai Herbert in the first round caught him with a perfect head kick. Rocked him, dropped him, and Ilya Duporia won up grabbing his legs, taking him down. They fought on the ground. And then the second round Ilya just put him into the shadow realm. He hit him with a combination against the cage where he hit him with, uh,

“I think was a left hook to the body and a right overhand that just spun his head around. It was wild.”

I mean, face first, face planted. He's he's got freakish power. So it is technique. His technique is

flawless. His technique and the grappling is flawless. But it's always he get a grappling as well.

He's phenomenal. Really. That's his main base. He started off as a grappler. Really. Yeah. I didn't even know that. Oh yeah. Yeah. And it's really fights. He just takes it down. He doesn't see that much nowadays. He just fucking knocks everyone out. Basically, right? He's just, it's his mind more than anything. His confidence is real. It's not bluster. Like he's he's really, he celebrates the fights the day before the fight.

He has a celebration of his victory. He did that against Charles Olivera. They all went to dinner. They're making toasts. Celebrating his victory. The night before the fight itself. I'm not sure how I wish to practice it. It's a crazy thing.

Meanwhile, it goes out and knocks him out in the first round. Like who fucking knocks

out Charles Olivera in the first round? Like that, especially now, like the Charles Olivera of today. It's crazy. He's, it's, it's, it's many things. But the, the mind that allowed him to get solely to grappling also allowed him to get solely to striking. Right. And it's, it's setups and traps. It's not just throwing wild bombs. It's defense. It's defense is fantastic. He saw that in the Josh Emmett fight. Josh Emmett, like as far as like one punch power, he rivals everybody. I mean,

you saw that fight where he knocked Bryce Mitchell out with a punch to the forehead. That guy hits so fucking hard. And when you look at it, it makes sense. It means a fucking tank. Yeah. And Ilya, deporia just slipped away from everything, slipped away from everything. And then he went to just put it on him. He's, he's great everywhere, man. He's great on the ground. He's great standing up. And more importantly, it's his mind. Like he doesn't make mistakes. He's just

a force in there. Yeah. He's the new breed. You know, like with every generation, there's every generation builds on the success of the previous generation. They all learn from the elites of the past. He's our version of what's possible now. Wow. He's that good. I was hoping, I was hoping for the White House card. They know what do something pulled John Jones out of the bag. I was hoping that as well. Yeah. I was hoping that as well. That would have been really special.

Yeah. I don't know why that didn't happen. I don't know. I mean, there's John's version. There's

“the UFC's version. I don't know what was the stumbling block there. Well, I think it's”

fine to say him and Dana don't get all very well. I don't think it's that bad. It's, they certainly can make a deal. That's, I don't think it's his bad. It's like, say Francis and Gano. The Francis and Gano situation, like Dana does not like him at all and won't do any business with him period. Because I would be the fight. Francis and Gano versus John Jones. Oh, my word. That would be good. But also Alex Pereira versus John Jones would be the fight as well. Like you wouldn't, it didn't

does a title doesn't mean anything. You could do the BMF heavyweight version. Like it doesn't matter. Like just those two guys fighting. I mean, that would be titles are irrelevant when you're dealing

talent who's the most devastating strike we've ever seen inside the sport. I mean, as you look at

Ilya, I mean, Ilya's phenomenal, but Ilya's like more complete as a fighter, but Alex is freaky. I've ever told you what Mark Goddard said when he fought Khalil Roundtree. So he beats Khalil Roundtree up and they stop the fight and then Mark Goddard grabs me. Like as I go into the octagon

“and he goes, "The sound it makes when he hits them is ungodly." That's what he said. He goes,”

he goes, "Might, I've been doing this for 20 years." He goes, "I've seen it all." He goes, "It's different. The sound, the impact is like he's a freak man." He's a physical freak. He means a real genuine Amazon warrior who's just built different than other people. You know, I'm sure you've seen him punch that machine. Yeah. It literally gets like 190. Francis and Gano go like 129. What? And he got 190. Yeah. Holy shit. Yeah, no, it's freak power. I did not enjoy watching the end of that

Khalil Roundtree fight. I'm not going to laugh. That was a laugh. I mean, Khalil Roundtree is like a

fucking animal. He's a warrior. He's just a warrior. I mean, he knew going into that fight. He was willing to go out on the shields. He wasn't afraid. And he went after him. He went after him. He did. But the consequences of getting hit. And then Alex was starting to tune him up at the end where he was leaning away from shots and then countering and leaning away from shots and countering. He was, he was in his flow state. And that's where I got real spooky because Khalil

became like a sitting target. And with each shot, his ability to get out of the way, diminished. With each kick that landed, his ability to move, diminished. And it got spooky. Yeah. And then it becomes a dilemma for the referee. Yeah. When do you actually step in? Right. Because look, there's a consent for the fight to be there and to take part in the fight. But there comes a

“point where you have to step in for the fight to own health. Yeah. There comes a point where you”

realize they can't defend themselves anymore and they're getting just tuned up. And that was the end of the fight. I mean, that was the right time to stop it. But it was hard to watch. It was. But then you get fights like Usman versus Leon Edwards, where he's getting smashed for five rounds. And he just fucking pulls a kick out of the last minute and knocks him out. Yeah. So, but he wasn't getting smashed. Not the way Khalil rounds. He was at the end. That's yeah. Yeah. He wasn't getting

he was getting beat. He was getting beat. Yeah. Yeah. But he wasn't like in danger of getting stopped or really hurt badly. Yeah. But that's why we all watch it because it's that knowledge that anything can happen. Yeah. You know, you get a hacking ramen versus Lennox Lewis. You know, no one gave a came a prayer when he went. Yeah. He was Lennox is a supreme fighter, Olympic gold medalist. One of the greatest to ever do it. And then that one punch he hit for Lossion Lennox

is Jordan. He was out. I remember watching it going. I mean, no one saw that. Especially in the heavyweight division, one punch with those guys. Yeah. It's why I really like it because in our world, like, you know, if I do a debate, everyone talks shit to each other. And like, you know, everyone talks shit, then they go have a debate, everyone still talks shit afterwards. In combat sports, everyone talks shit, and then you find out. Right. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's very definitive.

Yeah. When are you lose? Yeah. It's not subject to other people's interpretations of because like you'll see that in debates too. Like, I'll see a debate where I think like in for you, for example. Well, you clearly wanted to be. And then I'll see people say you got owned. Right. You know, and all the people who agree with me say I dominated and all people who agree with other guys say he he dominated. Yeah. And you'll see these pundits. And it's,

that's a weird economy, right? There's a weird economy of commentators on other people's exchanges. Yeah. And it's, that is a weird sport. Yeah. But it's weird. You've made loads of careers. There's loads of people. Joe Rogan said this on his pot, this that's the entire content. Yeah. They worked for me. They don't even know. Yeah. They do. They make me more famous. Right. Yeah. Yeah. You're getting all the kickbacks. Also you get to see what kind of a person they are.

Yeah. And they're, they're silly, bitchy people. You go like, well, they'll silly, bitchy people don't like them. Or maybe someone who you agree with doesn't like me like, oh, I don't like him anymore. Yeah. Which is fun. But it's like that economy of commenting on

other people constantly. The problem with that is you've always put yourself in a position of an

outsider. Right. You know, you're a comp, like me. Right. And when it comes to combat sports,

“I'm a commentator. That's what I do. I can't fight them 58. Right. I'm not going in there.”

So it's like, I am always going to be in this position of only being an observer and a commentator. I'm not going to be like, for those people that are commentating on these debates, a lot of them probably fancy themselves intellectual gladiators. They just don't get the opportunity to do it. And it occasionally they do and they usually get trounced. Right. Because really they're not that good, which is why they're commenting on the first place and why they have these fucking stupid hot takes.

Well, you know, the frustrating thing for me with the debates nowadays is how few people want to have an actual discussion. Right. It was so refreshing. We last time we came here,

We loved it. We loved it. And Dave enjoyed it. And you know, it was weird because we obviously have lots of different perspectives on things. But afterwards, a lot of people will like, oh, I can't believe you had Dave on. And I said to all of them, listen, Dave's only crime is that he has a different opinion to you. Right. Because apart from that, he comes in. He shows up. He's super nice. He's respectful. He's polite. He doesn't do any dirty tricks.

Right. He doesn't argue about the definitions of words that for 10 minutes. Right.

“He just goes, here's my opinion. Here's your opinion. Let's discuss. Yeah. And that's how”

conversations should happen. Right. But so much of the debate stuff now is not people aren't discussing the issues. They've just like decided you're a bad person. And that's what they're trying to achieve. They're trying to get a cheap laugh from the audience that they're playing to, who's not even in the room. Because they know that retard follows are going to watch it online afterwards and be like, oh, he owned them. But where did we get to? Well, it's just, I mean, it's just some people

that are doing that. You know, and those people, that's all they can do. That's why they do it that way. Right. You know, if they were really intellectually compelling, and if they were like smart people, like, I don't want enemies. Like, if I can have a sane, rational, peaceful discussion with someone where we disagree with something, I would greatly prefer that. Then have someone who's insulting me, and I'm insulting them. We're trying to like get off on each other. Like, why? Yeah.

Yeah. I'm busy. Yeah. I have things to do. Like, I don't need that kind of bullshit in my life. And I don't mind when someone disagrees with me. I think it's healthy. Mm-hmm. I don't know. I also want to know why you think that what you think, genuine. Right. I, you know, I see it as an opportunity as, like, because we all have blind spots. Yeah. We all have blind spots. We all have biases. I don't care who you are. How smart you are.

You have biases. Not blind spots. Not me. Not me. Not me. No, not me. Yeah. But when someone goes, well, actually, Francis, you say this. But what about this? Have you

“thought about this? Have you read about this? I'm like, no, I'm maybe you should. Right.”

And maybe you actually maybe won't change your opinion, but certainly have a more nuanced opinion. True. Yeah. But also, we're talking about shit that actually matters. Mm-hmm. You know?

And it deserves to be taken seriously. Yeah. Well, the, the answer is don't engage with

those certain people. Yeah. You know, I'm learning that. Yeah. We were having a conversation about one particular individual. Yeah. Where I'm like, why? Yeah. Don't bother. I can't believe you, I, I didn't say anything about that discussion, because I was just like, don't want to anyone to waste that fucking time watching it. It was, it was awful. I'm fascinated by that too though, because I'm fascinated by these people that are doing that, where they're just trying

to win and use tricks and be sneaking. Because like, they, they think of discourse and it completely different way. Right. They think about the whole thing in a completely different way. They're completely ideology we captured. And the place they're starting from is, I want to prove this to be correct. Not, I want to know why this person believes it to be incorrect, and I want to find out if maybe we have common ground, and maybe maybe they know

something I don't, or maybe I know something they don't, and let's find out. You know what, you know what, I really want, and what a constant I've talked about it a lot. I want somebody on the left to come out and be brilliant at debating and go to people on the right. Well, you say this and you say this, but actually, let's look at this, let's look at that, and be a genuine intellectual force. And what I disparaver is that I haven't seen anyone be from the left

light that, and basically a generation. I think the generation that you're talking about has

“been captured by some certain narratives that you have to agree to that are rational. So,”

as soon as you do that, and you align yourself with this particular ideology, you're already saying I'm willing to believe some shit that doesn't make any sense at all, because this is the only way to be accepted by my tribe, that intellectually compromises you. And that, that also I think humiliate you in a certain way. It puts you in a position where you're saying something that you know can't be true, so you set up blind spots. Do you think they know it's not true? I think there's

gotta be a part of them that realizes there's a good argument that it's not true. Especially when it comes to like transgender stuff or a border stuff, there's certain things where like, there's no real good faith argument that you should have an open border and allow fucking any psychopath to come across the border and then invade your community. That seems crazy. That seems crazy. Like if you understand anything about human nature and the nature of the

world and the level of poverty and crime that exists outside of the United States, particularly in third-world countries, we're just allowing you to talk about Canada that you're asking for. I'm off for them invading. They should come over. They should bail in their country until it gets better. I'd just ask you because I would find it so hard to go on stage and in front of, well, what is now hundreds of thousands of people by the time it goes on the internet, right?

And just vigorously defend something I didn't believe. Well, that's because you're smart.

And I think the problem is a lot of these people aren't really intelligent. What they are is

a person who has a good vocabulary, who's acquired a certain amount of technique and skill

narratives like one of things that people love to do is if you're talking to anyone that's on the

right, they want to say, you're, you support a 34-time convicted felon. There's a lot of things that they like to say. There's techniques involved instead of like discussing anybody that looked at the actual Trump case, if you're rational and you're on the left, you say that's a crazy case. There's no way that should be a felon. It's not a felon either 34 different misdemeanors. And it's also, it's past the statute of limitations. This is a craziest,

egregious misuse of justice. And the scary thing is, if someone on the right gets in, they decide to do that to someone in the left, like you got to put your foot down, stop that from happening. The rush of rush of stuff, right? All that stuff, the rush of gates stuff, like that's kind of crazy that someone on the left doesn't call that out and say, hey guys, this is fucking dangerous because if you're lying and you're having intelligence agencies lie and you're having people

lie on television and you're just accepting that, why? Because it's your side, you're, that's

“the way. That's crazy. That's why. And I find that very strange because what they do is”

they pivot to that, which is not relevant to the conversation we're having. We're talking about, you know, is it right to do these strikes on a run or is it this or is it that, is, you know, what's the situation in the Middle East or whatever? How it how does bringing up Trump's convictions or otherwise change that, it doesn't affect that all. That's all. Yeah, that's all. Or the border, or the trans thing, or any of the other things.

And that's the thing is like, can we just argue the fucking point? Well, I think at a certain point in time, you're going to have to choose real opponents. It's like a Jake Paul thing. But see, I want the real opponents, where are they? Where are they? And we've had people on the show where it's like, we had this, this woman from the guilty feminist podcast and she came on and we gave 40 minutes, she basically laid out her whole vision and it was respectful and polite

and it was a great conversation actually. The moment I said, well, you know, you've been speaking for the time, here's some of the things that I see that don't make sense in my head. Can you

“help me out? Immediately goes personal. Immediately. Yeah. And that's what Francis is saying. Like,”

I'd love to see people who have an ability to argue the point. Yeah. And that's what Dave does. He argues the point. And that's either persuasive to you or it isn't.

Well, I think the problem is their point is not very good. Yeah. I think that is the problem.

Yeah. And so you have to go personal. You have to attack people. You have to use that hominums. It's the only way you can get anything off. And then you can try to get that personal emotional and trap them. So why don't do they change their opinion then? It's a good question because if you're ideologically captured, especially if you're on the left, like it's a very clear ideology and there's like real blowback for deviating from it.

Yeah. As we know, right? Yeah. Because the moment you say, well, you're no longer on the left. Right. Yeah. Well, a lot of people have been kicked out of it. Yeah. A lot of people have been pushed into some weird quasi homeless land. Well, that's how we all ended up with like right wing. It was like, fuck off with the shit. Yeah, fuck off with the shit. Yeah. You know, when I took 20 years ago, all the stuff that we talk about, it wasn't just like not right wing. It's no one

questioned. Do you remember 25 years ago, people running around going, we need an open border. Right. Right. All like you can change your sex by just going like Abra Cadabra. Right. No one said that. Right. And so we want right wing for like going. That's crazy. I know. You know, the most bizarre thing is watching all these kind of left wing, lesbian feminists could be described as

right wing. Just down the jacket rolling. It's a matter of how much you never throw over.

It's like, man, there's a, there's a, there's a journalist called Julie Bindall, he used to write a guardian, one of the most left wing journalists. And she lesbian. And she criticized, like, and she was like, the trans movement. That was it. It's out the door. There's a matter of what you've done before. It doesn't matter. You've done all this incredible work with women and female prisons. Well, it's because it's a cult. I mean, it's essentially like a

religious ideology, like they, they will not take any, be heretics, like anybody that deviates from whatever their doctrine is, like, you're out, you're out forever. And that scares people. So that, that's one of the reasons why they're willing to comply and follow some of this goofy shit and say, no one's illegal on stolen land. Yeah. What's interesting is it doesn't happen on the right nearly the same way. Like you can see it now. The right is engaged in a fierce

debate internally. Mm-hmm. And there's a lot of people who fucking dog you and they hash it out

“and then they like, they go have a beer afterwards. I think they're doing it just the same way.”

Just the same. I think it's a bile. I think it's a human thing. Yeah. I think there's people on the right that do it just the same way. There's people that call people out for not being maga enough, you know? Yeah. It's just like right now the whole things in turmoil. Whereas there's not really the same kind of turmoil on the left where there's internal debate. The turmoil on the

lot of people right versus right and they're trying to find out like, and I think there's a lot of

people that they don't believe what they're saying either. They're just trying to find a thing

“that aligns with the biggest audience. I think that's definitely happening. I also think though”

internal debate within a big broad church movement is a good thing. Because what you're arguing about is like, what is the right direction? Yep, you know? Yeah. And I do think that is more healthy.

Yeah. I think working out what it is that whatever, if you're on the right, we believe.

I'm not on the right vote as I see that I do think that's a healthy thing to do because you're arguing about the direction of that movement. Yeah. And I think that's much healthier than what happens on the left where it's just like, well, if you don't agree with this wacky idea

“that's far, far out there, then you're no longer part of this. But I think the good thing about”

these debates is that it exposes that and anybody who's objective, especially anybody that is, you know, a swing voter or anybody who's in the middle of all this, which is a lot of people, a lot of people, most people I think, right? Yeah, most people are kind of in the middle and most political issues. They get to see how crazy some of the shit is and it makes them less likely to follow. You know, but it's also, as well, from a neutral perspective and I've

mentioned the point about, I want a strong left. I want a strong left, which has got good ideas about how to tackle things, which are really important, like inequality, like the cost of living, how do we make it that people can actually have a better standard of life? Where if a woman wants to stay at home with her kid, she can do that. Where they're not for, then have to go out and have to work and put the kids in day care, which then leads to a whole host of problems.

How can we have a better world for ordinary people, which is what the left always used to be?

We need a strong left to then challenge the right so that the centre becomes a more fertile ground. And if we don't have that, if we have these crazy looms on the left, then what we have is a right, which will come to dominate, which I don't think is good for society as a whole. I'm going to be honest with you. No, it's never good if one party left or right is completely dominant. It's not good. You need checks, right? And the right has its share of craziest tools. We've been talking

a hundred percent. It's Jesus. I wrap this up. Gentlemen, I love you guys. Very quickly. Oh, your book.

“Yeah, it's called Uneducated My Life as a Teacher and why you should never become one and never”

is in bold. And inspiring story. Francis Foster. Alright, I love you guys. Thank you very much. Bye everybody.