You Can’t Win With Money Until You Decide What Matters Most

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Start budgeting for free today. [MUSIC] >> Normal is broken common sense is weird. So we're here to help you transform your life from the Ramsey Network and the Bear Wins Credit Union Studio.

This is the Ramsey Show. I'm Dave Ramsey, Kim Coleman Ramsey personality number one best selling author and host of the front row seat fabulous show on Ramsey Networks. Blowin' Up, he's my co-host, Dave. Open phones here at AAA 8255-225, the call is free and some say the advice is worth.

Exactly what you pay for it. Lacy is in Seattle. Hey, Lacy, what's up? >> There you go.

So my husband and I are kind of looking for a little bit of an outside perspective

on a situation around him. >> Okay. >> So my and mom's parents helped us with a down payment on our house. And now we're receiving a lot of on my and unsolicited financial advice about debts and what we're doing with our money. And I guess I just want to know how much influence the college should allow them

to have in what we're doing with our finances as a unit, the two of us. I don't know why they would have any.

“Do you have, do you owe them the money back, did they loan you the money?”

>> Well, they have a weird kind of situation that done this with his, my husband's sister as well. They kind of use it as a business transaction with their kids so they'll help with the down payment on the house and in the future when the house is sold, they would get their down payment back and a certain percentage of whatever profit we would make on the house. >> Oh, that was stupid.

You shouldn't have done that.

>> Oh, no. >> That's horrible. What an abusive mess. >> Yeah. >> How much money did they give you?

>> They put 300,000 down on the house. >> Wow. >> Yeah. >> And how much is your mortgage? >> I'm one of those about 26, 50 monthly.

>> So you borrowed 250,000? >> Yeah, we borrowed from them about the 300,000, the big good damn. >> Okay, I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I didn't think that was alone.

“I thought it had to only be repaid at say, are you paying payments to them?”

>> No, we're not paying payments to them. >> Okay, do you have a mortgage in addition to them? >> Okay. >> Other than the end laws, do you have a mortgage? >> No.

>> Okay, so they pay cash for this house. So you bought a 300,000 out of house. >> The house was 800,000 dollars and they put 300 down for us and we are paying the remainder of the mortals. >> So you have a mortgage other than the end laws of 500,000 dollars.

>> Okay. And your household income is what? >> It's about 80,000 between the two of us. My number is fluctuated there, but my husband is 50,000 and 9,000 to about 30. >> So you also bought a house you can't afford?

>> Yeah. >> I don't know. >> Your payment is over. 30% or 40% of your take on pay, right? >> It's about that, yeah.

>> You guys are not going to do anything I tell you to do, I can tell, but you bought a house that you can't afford and you bought it on terms with the end laws that are absolutely crazy, ridiculous and you got a mortgage you can't afford.

“So you're not going to do this, but what you should do is sell the house.”

And you get out of both problems. The mortgage you can't afford and the end laws that you can't afford. >> There's this, there's what kind of sold to us in like a dream scape like, well, we'll do this for you guys. You guys can stay in town.

They want us close to town. >> I'm sorry. >> I'm sorry. >> You can't afford the house. That's not a dream scape, that's a nightmare.

It's a nightmare, you're broke and they helped you get brokeer. They helped you, but I bet they co-signed on this loan, didn't they? >> Yeah, well, it's technically a least to all in situation until we serve a day.

>> It's in there name? >> I have equity.

>> The houses in their name?

>> Yes.

“>> Honey, okay, so mom and dad, we don't want the house, we can't afford it.”

So we can put the house on the market so you can get your money back out, because we can't pay this. >> I want to say, don't want to do that. How do we? >> It's their problem, because you can't afford it, but you're not going to do that, because

your husband's still, he's totally bought into this crazy family. This is dysfunctional, yeah, he's cut-toddly, yeah.

These people are not a blessing, they're a problem.

I don't know what to tell you honey, but if I were you, I would get out of that as fast as my hair was on fire, there's just everything, every time you bury the lead to start with you, didn't buy a house, hello, you're renting a house and your landlord is interfering in your personal life.

“Well, no duh, these people like control, they got their fingers in everything.”

>> Yeah, I mean, this is, again, parents don't do this stuff, please, you're not being a blessing. >> Yeah. >> You're being a bud. >> That's absolutely right, you're trapping this poor couple.

By the way, the whole house was just a carrot to get them to stay locally, and that's the real freaky scary thing here. And this is tough for her, because if husband doesn't step up, she's not going to step up. He's not going to step up, he's got to rewrite the script in his mind that his parents who are such philanthropists are actually a curse, and he had

to rewrite his script to be able to sell his house and he's not going to do it.

“And instead, what's going to end up happening is this is going to end up in divorce or”

bankruptcy or both, because this is not going to end well, it's not going to end well. These numbers are horrendous, and so, so here's an idea, don't accept gifts that aren't really gifts, number one, number two, when you buy a house and it's not in your name, you didn't buy a house, someone else bought a house. Hello, number three, rent a own is not owning, it's renting.

Okay, I mean, let's just use the words the way they're supposed to be used and get it out from under dream scape, shoot me, oh my god, there's nothing good about this is such as dysfunctional mass, the poor girl, bless her heart, oh man, I can't even imagine. The last thing I want to do in my kids is to put this many wedges in between me and them, and because I got to tell you where I was on Saturday afternoon, I was sitting on my daughter's

back porch and hamburgers that my son and law cooked and everybody was there, all the kids, all the grandkids, all 16 of us were back there, and we had no discussions like this. Right, at all, that's true, none, none yet, none yet, I don't even get to choose where we're having dinner, I just have to go where I'm told, that's exactly true, it's not even close to me having control of that, wow, scary crap, scary crap, people don't do scary crap

with your kids, and then expect them to be hanging around with you loving grandpa, it's not how it works. , I love entrepreneurs, don't forget guys, I started my company on a card table myself, so I know what it's like to have people counting on you, your team, your family, not to mention your customers, and when you're the one signing the paycheck,

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Jason's in Las Vegas, Hydration, how are you?

“Doing well, sir, how are you? Better than I deserve, what's up?”

Well, I'm having a little dilemma, I have some money saved, and I was thinking of potential taking out an auto loan, although I just had a car last year that I was able to sell the positive equity, and I used that positive equity to buy a motorcycle, but now that I'm sure you're where I'm in Las Vegas, the summer is right around the corner of not here, it's starting to heat up, I definitely need to get a car with air conditioning, because riding around is kind of killing me,

and I'm sweating a lot, but I also don't want to fall into a trap where you stuck with the car payment, because I'm not a huge fan of payments, I try to minimize them, but best I can. How old are you 22? I'm 32. 32, really? Yes sir. Okay, and what do you make of your sir? Anywhere from 45 to 55,000. What do you do? I'm in the hospitality industry. Okay, and Vegas, no kidding. Okay, all right. Well, you're obviously new to our stuff into this show. We teach people

the shortest method to wealth is to get out of debt and stay out of debt, because your most

powerful wealth building tool is your income. If you take the average car payment of $700 a

“month and then you invested that from age 32 to age 67, you'd have over $7 million. That's what”

the car payment costs you, and if you want to ensure that you stay at the middle class level or lower of wealth, keep a car payment your whole life, and that will make sure that you stay there. And so that's, that's the framework that you walked into with this question. And so what is the motorcycle worth? Um, I would say anywhere from 45,000. Okay, all right. And I'm assuming you have no money. You have no money. Well, I have about 12 to 13,000 saved. In what?

Just thank account, and then I do have a small, like IRA, but I don't, I had to

withdraw a lot of it during the COVID pandemic, so it's not as much as it was before, but I'm slowly trying to build it back up. Yeah. Okay. Well, um, I mean, you had your little run with a motorcycle and it worked out for a while, and then the heat comes up in Vegas, and it's time to get an air conditioner that's logical. Makes sense. You kind of knew that was coming. If you didn't see it coming, there's something wrong with you. Um, it gets hot there in the summer. And so, um,

the, uh, what I do, if I were in your shoes, giving you the outline, I just gave you the best way to build wealth as to avoid payments, and you need an air conditioner. I would sell the motorcycle. I'd take 5,000 in my 12,000, and I buy $10,000 a car for cash.

“And have no payment. I do actually. Well, pretty good idea. That's why I have a show. Yeah.”

Or my other idea was just tug it out with the motorcycle and then use what I would be making, if I were to take out a call on and just invest it in an index fund and then just let it grow. I'm sorry. No. You mean, I borrow on a car so that you can invest? No. No. I'm saying, like, instead of getting the car like I originally, you know, thought about doing, oh, just stick it out and just be sweaty. Just be sweaty, and then just keep, you know,

using the money like the $5,700 I would be making for that car payment and just, you know, yeah, you're not going to have a car payment though because you're going to pay cash for $10,000 a car. Right. Yeah. Well, but then that would deplete a lot of my savings. Oh, deplete $5,000, you know, I have 7,000 left and you got no payments. And remember, you know, if no payments, you can, if no payments, you can actually build wealth.

But the sweating, if they decide, am I going to tough it out with a motorcycle? Or do I not want to sweat very much? But I'm not saying there's no $500 car payment in the equation here. None. No, no car payment at all in the equation. If you're asking us, I mean, that's what I would

I'm getting an air conditioner to start with and I'm, you know, and then build the emergency fund next. Yeah. Right. And then I'm going to start building some wealth and, you know, work more, make more, work more, making more. What's the path to six figures, you know, in hospitality, or if it's not a path there, you don't want to be in hospitality decide, what is it that I want to do? And start to get very intentional at 32. The good news is you've avoided a lot of crazy

debt at this point. Bad news is you don't have a plan and we do have a plan. So welcome to the show in the baby steps. But, uh, uh, all you're going to do is walk this out, you know. What you're going to have trouble doing because you've done a lot of stuff in your life to date on a whim, on impulse is you're going to have trouble avoiding impulse if you don't sit this in stone right now and say, I am not going into debt and I'm going to go pay a cash for a car. You're going to

wander on to a car a lot and some Porsche is going to wink at you and you're going to leave with an

“$800 car payment. That's what's going to happen. She's going to flirt with you and then you're”

done. Yeah. Uh, so you've got to be careful. Uh, it's happened to me. You can tell. I can't, I can't walk by a nice car. They're, they're like, I love a good car. But, um, yeah, but it's, it'll kill you. It's the biggest thing that we all buy in America that goes down in value and they go down in

value like a rock. A new car loses 70% of its value in the first four years. That's turning

30,000 bucks into, you know, just a few thousand dollars in a heart beat. And, um, I mean, think about it. How fast, I mean, go down in value like a rock. That's where Chevy got that like a rock. And so, I mean, it's just crazy. You know, and you just, you got to be careful with these things. There cars or something. You consume only when you have extra money around. And, you know, a situation like that young man's in, he does not have extra money around.

And your right can a whole series of intentionality moves on his part would make the next five years of his life completely different. No question. We can't wander from thing to thing

“impulsively. It doesn't work. AJ's in Gainesville, Florida, hi, AJ. What's up?”

Hey, how are we going guys? Better than I deserve. How can we help?

Hey, so, um, I'm in my lead 20s. Um, we, me and my wife, we bought a house, uh, we closed our first

house in September. Um, and we got our first baby on the way, she's doing me. Hey. Yeah, and so, so we just finished baby stuff. Three working on, um, baby stuff for now. And so I guess my question for you is, um, I've been working for about the last six months now to working, uh, two jobs. Uh, my wife works full time also. We're trying to, uh, you know, grind a little bit all we can. Um, that works seven days a week, 60 hours a week. What do you know

with all the money? Uh, saving it, uh, currently, um, you don't want to go out of bed? Uh, yes, yes, we are, we're on baby set for you right now. Oh, okay. Okay. Yeah. Um, so my question is, do we, uh, we're trying to decide if when the baby comes, if I continue working both jobs, so my wife can stay at home, um, or if it's more beneficial for our family, uh, for me to cut that, come back the

second job, and then she goes back to work full time as well. Well, I put the baby in daycare.

I don't think that's happening, dude. Do you? Well, you, you see her sitting with a brand new baby and her lap going back to work when she doesn't have to, no, no, I don't see that as much. Yeah. Yeah, or, or, or, um, you know, the beat is, but you bought a house you can't afford, unless one of you, unless you work two jobs, or she works one. No, no, no, no, sir, not all. Okay. So what's the one thing we're doing? I can't both that be quit. I mean, you go down to one job.

Can't live on your job? No, we need at least two incomes. I know. Why house payment, right? You don't have any debt? Right. So you bought a house you can't afford on your income. Right. Yeah. We saw that household income, so yeah. Yeah. So there's a third option. You know, you know, we can't live here, but I can work 40 hours and you can stay home. And we have to live someplace else. That's another option.

“You're making choices. You're working to buy a house is what you're working for. That's what is not,”

not to live, but to buy that house.

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doing music, all kinds of fun stuff. So lock in your spot with a $600 deposit before it's too late. We're going this time to the Western Caribbean so Jamaica Mon. Yeah. RamsySolutions.com/events. RamsySolutions.com/events. Actually is in Boston. I actually what's up. Hi Dave. Hi Ken. Thanks for taking my call today. Sure what's up. So sorry it's like a little emotional. But we've been in storm and storm mode for a year and a half and you just aren't really sure what to do next.

“Okay so that means you have a baby on the way. Well he's here. Okay. When was he born?”

I'm curious for him at the beginning of October. Right. How's he doing? But he's having a lot of medical challenges. It was a people were almost lost during birth. So it's been a really difficult recovery. We're both still in the hospital pretty much every week. Wow. So there's a variety of things for me. It's a lot of physical issues related to the birth and some complications and for him there's a variety of things a neurological, his feeding and his intestines and GI on Friday. We had to go

because he stopped breathing and I found out that that's just part of his conditions. So what do you guys? I mean you've been through health since October. This is not even the October before that when I was laid off on my long-term job.

“So it's been a, yeah. It's been a while. Yeah. So what does your husband make?”

He has a full-time job inside households and his full-time job is sales and so he makes at least 65 a year. Some months we're up to 8,000 from his income alone and then side hustles. A lot of reselling and he's delivered things and done things like that as well. Okay. All right.

concentrate on a heal and get baby healed and get back to some level and normal, right?

“Yeah. Yeah. And what did you use to make back in the day?”

My previous long-term job. I made 65,000 a year and then the jobs that I started before I went on maternity leave. I was making it was estimated to be about 40,000 a year. Okay. And how much debt have you guys gotten? Well, we currently have, I'm sorry. Is it okay if I break it down by like credit cards? Sure. And credit cards, totals based on the credit report. It's about 30,000. I'm reaching out

to request details as a lot of them have been sold off to debt collectors. We have a car that we owe

12,300 on the online pay off amount. It shows 12,200. I think most of the interest was front-loaded, but it's worth about 6 to 8,000 private party sale due to the mileage. We have a home that on the home is just under 347,000. What's the house worth? We tried so. We had it listed and the only interest that we had was for under 370,000 and they wanted us to cover. What did the real estate agent think the house was worth?

He thought it was worth 369,000. No, the only interest you had was at 370. What did you have it listed at? 375. Okay. All right. So you don't have much equity. Okay.

So what I'm always looking at when I'm in a situation like you're in is there are some things

I can't control and there are some things I can control. And I get anxiety mostly, not from the things I can't control, but the things I can and I'm not. And so what I'm starting to look at is, okay, what can I control in this situation? What can you do? You can't control the baby's health. That's up to God and the doctors, right?

“You can't control your health exactly other than the things you have to follow the doctors”

directions on both cases, the baby and you, right? But right now, you know, right now the things that are given in this story as I understand it is, we've got a sick child that's trying to heal and a sick mommy that's trying to heal. And that's okay, that's okay. It's not good. It's not fun. But that's not, that's not, that's not anything you can do about that. You can't wave a wand and, you know, fix that. Agreed? Yeah. Yeah. So it's going to take a minute. Give yourself a little

grace and give yourself time, time to heal and so for your husband, it sounds like he's an excellent man. I love this guy. He just, what did he do? He went to work and made sure his family had money. Wow. Yeah, he does. I like this guy a lot. He's a good man. All right, cool. Oh, I'm sorry. I thought you were going to make another point. I will listen. This is all you can't control as his effort, right? So he's going to keep working. Can he get better pain gigs?

We're selling everything. We're going to try to whittle this thing down and get some momentum. Right now, with all the health stuff, it has exacerbated all of the financial stress and Dave just did a great job of really laying this out. You got to make that switch to the best of your ability, mentally and emotionally to focus on what we can't control. So how can we begin to chip away? We're upside down in the car. We need the car. It's not out of control. It's not completely out of

control. That's doable. Yeah. So really, how do we begin to get some real momentum through additional income doubling down on the budget? Making sure that we are only doing what we have to do right now. And you know, your husband, again, is doing the right thing and staying with it. I'd like to see his income get a little higher in that sales role. I'd like to see him approach

“six figures in a sales role. And so maybe, maybe, that's what he's looking for. I know he's working”

like a crazy man right now. And we admire that. But if I was in his situation, I'd be going, how can I double my income in a sales function? That's what I would be trying to do. Yeah. And talk to a Ramsey trusted real estate agent and have someone else come and look at

work or not. It doesn't sound like there's a lot of room there. But if the house payment's bothering

“you and you can get way down on house payment. So here's the thing. If you can retreat back to safety,”

give yourself room to heal. One thing's for sure. It'd be very unusual. And I've been doing this a long time sitting in this thing. I can't think of a single case that I've worked with. The 10 years later, you're an exactly the same spot with your health. Yeah. I mean, you're not going to be the same spot with your health. 10 years from now. So this is a as you said, a rough patch. It's not a destiny. It's not a, it's not the prescription for your

whole life. So you guys keep scratching and clawing and then the sun will start to come out and

then there'll be a light at the end of the tunnel. It's not a train finally. But in the meantime,

you've been through a hard time. And hey, we're with you. I'm with you. I think your emotions are real and I would have them too. So keep pushing. Keep pushing. But also give yourself a little room to say, if we don't make any progress right now, other than healing, that's probably okay for right now. Hey, let's play a quick game of wood. Your rather would you rather keep overpaying your phone company every month or save 600 bucks a year with no contract and no price hikes ever. Easy answer.

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meant to a former coworker of mine and originally started out where I was trying to help her out, get her back on her feet. She was going through a breakup and she had two kids and they were going to be homeless and now it's to the point where I'm wondering if I'm just enabling her poor financial choices. How long has this been going on? Two years, she's been almost two years. Okay. Well, at what point was she supposed to get back on her feet? Well, that's a good question. Right now,

I'm charging her 750 a month in rent and that's including all her utilities. Should the apartment should be about 1200 a month in rent? She was, she was doing all right and then she was in a car accident. Didn't have any insurance. Um, now she's got a bill. A bill for that and then she got into another car with those $40 down deals and she's $20,000 in debt on a car that's only worth maybe six grand. So she's paying more on her car than she's paying me for rent. So I don't see her getting

out of the hole anytime soon. Okay. So instead of getting back on her feet, she dug the whole deeper. Yeah, pretty much. By not having insurance and making a bad car decision. Yeah, I just recently found out, well, she missed December rent. She's caught up now, but she missed that for if you'd buy and Christmas stuff or it gives, then I found out that she's paying 200 a month almost to rent, rent couches for her apartment. Okay. And she only makes about $3,000 in a month,

“I think. Okay. So how does this end? Where does this end? Where does this end?”

I mean, either I raise the rent and then she gets behind and I have to evict her or, I mean, that's really the only option. I see. I could ask her to leave. I don't know how that would go. I don't agree with you. I think that, um, I think if it just keeps deteriorating, you don't even have to raise the rent. She's not going to be able to pay it. Because she keeps, she keeps making stupid decision after stupid decision on top of each other and they're compounding

and she's going to bury herself. And then she's not going to be able to pay even your reasonable rent. Hello? Hello? Yeah. You agree? Yeah. You don't even have to raise the rent. This thing's going to go down the toilet eventually anyway. Yeah. So the question is, are we just going to stand

So I do, I do have a lease with her that's out in next March. Yeah. I mean, I guess just

I don't know if that's going to make it a year. I don't, I don't, she works the season old job and her hours will go down mid summer. What is her job? We can do this much. Um, we both work in the

“greenhouse. Okay. So we, that's what I'm wondering. Is there an emotional attachment you have to”

this person that you probably have not or would not with other people that are leasing for me? Well, we used, we used to work together and we don't anymore. Um, that ended about three months ago. I no longer work with her. So, and I also, I, I was living in, it's a triplex. I was living there as well. So as long as I was there and seeing her every day that made it harder and I no longer live there. So it's really helped me have more of an emotional break, emotional break from having to see her

and see her there. See her at work and I'm really, you sounded emotional when you started talking to us. I could be wrong, but you sounded emotional. I'm just, I'm just nervous. Okay. Well, you're doing great. By the way, you're doing great. Okay. Uh, yeah. Yeah. I'm with Dave on this when I, but I would be planning, I would be planning on what are we going to do when she can't pay the rent anymore so that you're not stuck with us. Is this doesn't, there's, there's just, you wouldn't do this for anybody else.

It's the feeling I get. I don't think that you can fix her life, because she's using not to, and you're not, you're not going to fix it. If you gave her free rent, she would screw it up. No, I think if I gave her free rent, she would go rent, free more calculus. That's what I meant. She'd screw it up. Yeah. Yeah. Or a hot tub for the back porch or whatever. Yeah.

“And so, yeah. Yeah. So, um, I think we've got to, you know, you need to sit down have a conversation”

with her, human to human and say, all right, we started this so that I could help you.

And here's what's happened since I started helping you. You've gotten worse.

You rented couches. You went around without car insurance and made a mess. And then you bought a car that you absolutely can't afford. That's killing you. And so, I'm thinking this is going to end poorly. Like, you're going to not pay me rent. And then I'm going to have to evict my friend who I was trying to help. And this whole thing breaks my heart. So, you and I need to come to an agreement. This says that you need to go live somewhere else, because I'm not a blessing to you. And I want

to be a blessing to you. I want to be helpful to you. And I can't be that while you're here. Oh, maybe I should ask her to look for somewhere else before the situation gets worse. Yeah, like now. I was talking about this conversation happens next week. Okay. Yeah. I want her to leave now. I want her to go buy, go rent something that she can afford. That's cheaper. And, um, can't get anywhere cheaper. Yes, she can. I don't know where. I don't

either. I mean, I don't either. But it's not your job. Your job is to remove her. That's it. Now, you're right. Because you're not, this is not going to work out. It's not a loving, you're not loving her by just doing nothing and letting this thing go down the drain. If you really do care about her, help her move, you know, I'll give you a free rent. I'll give you a free months rent. Or I'll refund next month's rent if you're gone by the end of the month. And that'll help you get

started on your new thing and give her $750 after she moves out. Okay. I can do that. And then go

“rent the stinking thing for $1,200. And the next time you get ready to help someone, you need to think”

about what help looks like and where this is taking us because you're giving her a place to live, did not keep her from being homeless. Yeah. Hello. That did not, you know, you use that line in your

head and you use it on us, but I'm not buying it. She would have figured out something. She's always

figured out something. And the only way that I help someone in a situation like that is if I get down under the thing and I start going, okay, we're gonna be on a budget. We're gonna work six jobs. There's no rental couches. There's no car payments. We keep insurance in place. And we're going to ride herd on doing smart stuff with your money. And if you do smart stuff with your money after a little while, you'll have some money. It's pretty amazing. It's kind of, it's kind of works like

every time. And when you do dumb stuff with money, you have no money. It works like every time. It's gonna ask you, how do you recommend people like in this situation deal with the guilt?

former coworker, you can't, but your job is not Jesus. That's right. But how do you do this? It's already took the job. It's his job. That's right. You're not, you're not signed up for that. And you don't have skills for it. Your job is not to fix everyone. You can't fix other people.

“The only thing you can do is set up a situation where they can do something. You set up a situation”

where they could do something and they chose not to do it. That's right. I can't make the lady stop doing stupid stuff. So a question could you know, did I do everything in the call here? Right. And someone calls and they, I tell them what to do and then they argue with me and I tell

them what to do and then they argue with me. The third time they argue with me, a hundred percent of

time you all were here, me and the call. I am not going to try to talk you into this stuff. I'll show you what to do. And if you insist on being a stupid but human being, you're gonna be broke and I'm gonna just watch it happen. I am, and I go home with no guilt. I turn off the microphone, get my car drive home. I don't even remember you called because it's not my job to fix your life. My job to help you show you how you fix your life. You're the hero in the story. I'm not the hero.

“I'm just a guy on the sideline showing you what to do. I'm Yoda teaching you how to swing the”

light saber. If you choose not to get in the fight, I can't help you with it. You know,

you got to step into the force yourself. I can't do it for you and she can't do it for her friend.

And just giving her a place to live and calling that, "Oh, she would have been homeless otherwise no she wouldn't." That's bull crap. She wouldn't either. She might have had a hard patch and then worked it out. But you got to stop doing the stuff that you keep doing the same thing over and over again. You expect a different result. It's a definition of insanity. And I got no guilt about that. That's not being challenged. It's just, it's not my job to be Jesus. He's, he's got that job already taken.

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you protect your piece and your freedom. So go to joindeleteme.com/ramsy to get 20% off their annual plans and take back control. That's joindeleteme.com/ramsy. Welcome back to the Ramsy Show in the Fairwins Credit Union Studio, Ken Coleman, Ramsy personality, number one bestselling author is my co-host today. Open phones, a triple eight, eight to five, five, two, two, five. Jerry is in Columbus, Ohio.

Hi, Jerry, how are you? Hi Dave. I had a question for you. I've been I've been married for 11 months and I found out during our joint filing with my wife that she has four years of back taxes with the IRS totaling about $48,000. And I'm looking for advice on how to handle that. Wow, that's a bummer. So did she, uh, is she deceptive or incompetent or both?

Without telling her, I could tell you to choose the latter. Yes, yeah, I mean, like it didn't, it didn't occur to her that this was a problem. No, she thought it would fix itself.

“Yeah, okay. And that's why she didn't bring it up. She wasn't actually hiding it. It just was”

not on her radar as important. Yes. Where you're like in freak out mode and so am I.

Yeah, yeah, like. Oh my god, the IRS of all people, okay. So, um, the first thing I want to

pull the thread on what else don't I know that you don't think is important. Agreed, and um, so I asked her this question about two weeks ago when we were filing and then this kind of

had been penalized and I asked her about that. And if there was anything else, she said no. And then

yesterday she brought up these other things. Well, I mean, three years ago I got a car repode and I didn't bring that up, but they're they're going to come to me for $30,000 on these days. Right. But I don't think it's a big deal. So I thought it take care of itself so I didn't bring it up. I mean, what else is out there that I didn't think is important so I didn't bring it up. Agreed. I really want to dig into that. And, um, and, uh, somehow, okay, so her reaction is not, um,

“it was kind of like a shrug like this is just no big deal or am I missing something?”

She'd be there to the big deal. Um, because she could take care of herself. Oh, okay. All right. So what did that involve? Because what I'm trying to, what I'm trying to do is establish a relationship pattern and go on forward. I agree. Um, uh, so why she brought it all to me. And I, you know, now I know what's on the table. We looked at her credit report to identify anything else. Like you said, um, so I have a view of everything that's happening now. Um, I, I just need need to know

what's the best plan of action to I pay it all as a lump sum. Yes. If you have it, you have it. Yes. Okay. Yeah. Right. It checked. Because the penalties in the interest you can't in a ridiculous and there's no discounting with the IRS. That they get, they're, they're, they're made whole 100% of the time. So yeah, just as fast as you can clean it up the better,

“but I really want to make sure, relationally, that there's nothing else out there writing,”

you didn't see anything on the credit bureau. And I want to make sure that that we're aligned on,

this is the worst financial moment of our entire lives. Relationally, it never gets any worse than

this. Everything is better from here forward. We really need to both be on that page. Because, I mean, I'm, I'm scared that this could happen again if there's not a like, I don't want, an, an acknowledgement that how damaging this is to a relationship, by her. So if that's not the case, then you guys may need to sit down for a tune up going with a marriage counselor just to get things dialed, get some tools in both your belts to get aligned on that this is

like grown up stuff and you can't freaking ignore it and me be okay with that. I'm not going to be okay with that. And so we have to be aligned on that we together are, know everything and together,

we are aligned on every decision going forward so that there's never, I'm never going to be

surprised again the rest of my life if I'm you. I'm not okay with surprises of this type. And so that, and I'm just, go ahead. We just, we have a, we have our first baby coming in two months so it's kind of all called on top of it right now. Yeah. Well, and yeah, and so we're negotiating with the lady and her third trimester too. This is just really not profitable. Yeah. Wow. Okay. Well, at some point in this process and it may not be any time soon given that

last piece of information. If it, if there weren't a baby you're on the way any moment I would be in the marriage council's office for a tune up to make sure I was aligned. But I may, I may wait until the baby's four months old. But she needs to, you guys need to have a conversation of this, that, that she clearly without you shaming her or yelling at her or something like that. But this is just, we're not going to function this way. Going forward. Okay. And then I'd write a check

and pay it off. Because if it comes back again after you write a check and pay it off and something

“else pops up or she goes into something else and forgets to tell you because it's not important,”

but it is important, I'm not going to let myself offer whatever the bullcrap narrative was on this thing and it was bullcrap. Then, you know, we don't want to repeat of this. We want to heal this broken narrative. Does that make? Yeah. And one of the things I was going to lean into is if you guys aren't already doing combined finances, that needs to happen today. So that again, as we work through the relational stuff here, the financial stuff is also completely everything is

on the table. This is a tough feeling, you know, to have. But I agree with Dave, I'd stroke the check today. You don't want to be dealing with the IRS on this. And listen, it's going to suck right in that check. But it's going to suck worse, not to deal with it. And to try string this response out with the baby on the way. No, don't do that. I'll take care of it immediately, get on the phone with him, find out what it is and clear that. But we have to make sure that there's

and then you're looking over her income and her withholding and the two of you are doing your taxes together and then there is a shortfall, then it's now your fault. Because you got your fingers in there with it. Okay. And to again, it's point when you combine everything and then it still happens, then now it's on you. So that's the whole process. That's where I would go. But the big

thing is this, financial problems are never the problem. They're always a symptom of something

“else going on. So you've got to go down to ground, okay, what's the problem? What's causing this?”

And what's causing her to not deal with this family of origin, they were, you know, we were shamed talk about money, you know, we talked about money that he yelled. So I don't want to talk about money because I'm afraid you'll yell or I don't know whatever the bull crap is that's under there. But there's bull crap under there, a promise you. This is crazy. And it's not $500. It's $50,000.

That's not an oops. Okay. $500 and oops. 50,000 is woof. Woof. It was bothering me. Yeah. Man, and what a setup,

though. I mean, where the baby coming into humans. Wow. . Hey, guys, George here. Listen, 99 times out of 100 when people say, I don't know where my money goes. It's not a math problem. It's a behavior problem. They're not budgeting. Then they're shocked when their bank account hits triple zeros. Well, here's the deal. Winning with money is about doing the boring stuff consistently. And that includes banking

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that helps you be intentional, open your smart bundle today at fairwinds.org/ramsy. And get the Ramsey B-Wear debit card to go along with it. That's fairwinds.org/ramsy. Ensured by the NCUA. Beth is in Detroit. Hi, Beth, how are you? Hi, am I right? How are you? Better than I deserve. What's up? I'm calling to see if what your advice is to be answering our family home and touch our four kids in order to have a large amount of debt. Okay. And so how much is a larger

amount of debt? So, we owe 145 to the IRS, 145,000, and then we have 100,000 on a home equity line credit and then about almost 50,000 medical expenses and car payments. And what's your home worth? We current our mortgage and for 470, and we haven't offered currently that we just got for 755.

So, it would allow us basically to clear the debt and restart our hesitations with our kids.

Where did all this debt come from? So, my husband was a primary breadwinner. I was home with our kids and he got into day trading. And I emailed you bearing my head in the sand and I'm not getting involved in our finances. So, he, he made quite a bit lost it just as quick and then turned to credit cards and then paid taxes on the capital gain to meet with the trading before losing it all.

Okay. There's not capital gains on day trading. There's ordinary income on day trading. And there's also, there's also a loss you can take if you've lost money against that.

“Okay. Do you really think you have the whole story?”

So, I, I'm not entirely financially literate. This is something that I'm trying to get more involved

This happened about, uh, well, I could think it was happening for quite some time. But again,

I kind of was staring at my head in the sand and he just came to me three years ago. We had a major health crisis and he said, you know, I got a complaint. We owe quite a bit of the money. I cleared out our 401k and cleared out all of our savings. Okay. So, he's been limitless. You've been, you've been limping along with us together for three years with you and you haven't, you haven't knowledge of it.

Yes, sir. Yeah, I was a married from of 20 years, but we three years I've had knowledge of it. And what, what does he, what does he make of you? He makes 180 as a base, but he's a, he's a sales, um, but it's been a tumultuous, very dry couple. And he's not, he's not day trading anymore. Correct. Okay.

Okay. So, your, your question was interesting. You said,

“we would do this except for the kids. I think you have to do it for the kids.”

You have to get your life back for the kids. Your kids, your kid, the definition of your kids having a good life is not where they live. It's who their parents are and how they act. Yeah. You live in a house that's way nicer than you grew up in. So do I. So does Ken. And we didn't die from that.

And it didn't malform our character from that. What? So sell it and clean up the dead gum mess. If the problem has gone away, no more day trading and no more deceiving, and you guys are working together on this, then he takes his 180,000 and hopefully more to 150,000. And you guys work to rebuild your lives and buy another house someday. But in the meantime,

I'm going to be free, baby. Set me free. And I think that I think the stress level in the air of your home will go down and the children will benefit from that far more than they were having that particular set of bricks and mortar. Okay. That's a good word. Yeah. Yeah. I'm just going to add, just do your own research tonight on how stress affects your physical

health. It's not just a mental and emotional. We forget what it does to the body. So I would just add, if I had the chance to fix this and I love the fact that he came forward three years ago. And if you guys are on the same page now, I absolutely agree with Dave.

This is a reset, a reset with with the idea, though, that we never do this again.

Yeah. I mean, he has to say, I lost our house. That's right. This is a day trading. I lost our home.

“That's how big a deal this is. Okay. By the way, I lost everything and went bankrupt”

because of my choices, not my wife's. All right. When I went bankrupt 30 plus years ago, all right. So that's, you know, and I get to own that the rest of my life. But I also never did the things again that put me there again ever again again again, again, never again. You see, I mean, you know, you say, you know, I lost everything. I lost my home. We did not lose our home, but we know, the only reason was there was no equity in it. And so it's for five to bankruptcy. But

and it wasn't that nice of a house anyway. But the anyway, yeah, we just said, you know, we lost everything. We get the opportunity to start again fresh and clean. And in your case,

that's a sale of a house. In our case, it was a bankruptcy. And we're never going back here again.

And we never went back there. And we, from that point forward, we never, I never bought anything that Sharon and I don't both agree to. Investments are otherwise. And so, yeah. So I think it's fair to say, just to outline fair by just to let you guys know out there. This is not a unique situation. Here's the numbers. And this is the most bizarre number I have almost ever heard in the investing world.

“If you day trade for 36 months continuous, 97% of you lose money, that's how stupid that is.”

I mean, if you said 97% of the time you walk across the street, you get hit by a car, you would not walk across that street. Under any circumstances, you wouldn't be the one guy that says, "Proger, I got this." You wouldn't be that guy. You'd be going, "No, that's those are not odds I want to play." And there is something about the arrogance and pridefulness that says, "I've got the stock market figured out." If you hear someone say that, laugh at them. They are funny

lose money. Now, you need to hear that because some of you get a little fish in story where you

hit a lick. And you go, "Oh, I made some money." And it's just like gambling in Vegas. Now, I'm going to go back to the table. And the only part I'm going to remember is the time I won. I'm going

“to forget about the 16 times I lost. And when you add it all up, you lost. That's how they build”

those nice hotels in Vegas. So true. And the same thing is true at day trading. You lost. Poor guy, poor gal. What a horrible thing they're going through. But some of you people man, you're sitting out there what day Ramsey didn't understand. Listen, I understand what I understand is what I don't understand is what I don't understand is what I you don't understand. 97. What other number do you have this 97% of anything? Ever. That's not statistically significant. That's like

a fact. You're going to lose money. Oh my God. And it has the same trap that gambling does. Oh, it's exact same exact. Because it's got a feedback loop. Yeah. It's the same thing as draft kings. Same trap. Same exact thing. It's what sports betting's gone through the roof. It's a feedback loop. A scarcity feedback loop. And you know, our friend Michael, they wrote, come for Christleesser, his second book, Easter, his second book, he talks about that a lot. And he went into great depth

to study on that about the dopamine hits. And how you just keep cycling back into this thing. You cycle back into this thing. And it's, but yeah, it's just pushing the same button. And it's,

but it always has at its core this ridiculous arrogance that I can beat the house.

“It's just it's arrogant. Beyond Pride comes right before you have to sell your house,”

because you lost everything. Wow. Pride comes right before the fall. Wow. [Music] Dave, we got a lot of calls on this show where life happens. One day someone's healthy, they're working, providing for their family, and then a curveball hits. You know, we hear it all time. A car accident, a cancer diagnosis, a heart attack, and suddenly everything changes.

Yeah. And that's why you've always said that having term life insurance from Zander

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“then you need to make sure the money still showing up. And that's why Zander is our go-to.”

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“App Store or Google Play. Zack is with us in Colorado Springs. Hi Zack, how are you?”

I'm doing pretty good. How about yourself? Better than I deserve. What's up? I can give context after the question because I follow you guys and this is going to sound like I had done, but I'm going to find you if there's a trick to increasing some credit problems so that I can get a house within 18 months or if my credit score will go by by in that amount of time. Everything that we've seen, that do not publish this, but everything that we've seen in six

to 12 months of the time you have zero activity on any account, your credit score will disappear.

Okay. Are there, are there like any ways to guarantee that it does that? No. My main credit issue is the collection debt. Those will be knocked out within a couple of months and I want to make sure nothing appears again after that. Yeah. Well, if you have settled them, if they're not outstanding, there should be no more activity on the account once it's settled. Right? I believe so. I've just, I've had a couple of pop-up that I didn't know were even

“in collections. Well, I can't, that's why you can't make a guarantee. I mean, if you have something pop-up,”

then the whole clock starts overdue. So, I mean, you can't, but if you've got stuff that's

in collections or been in collections and you're serving to settle it, the last thing you need to

do is go into debt to build your credit score to buy a house. So, you need to freak and do this in the right order, dude. I mean, listen to what you're actually saying here. It's kind of crazy. So, no, you need to clear, you need to clear the debts, get to zero, and zero activity. And if it takes longer than six months or longer than 12 months, because something else pops up, well, that's something else popping up or to screwed up your other plan too, by the way.

If you're sitting there, and the credit score is going up up up, because you have a bunch of healthy accounts that you're paying on time, merely to drive your credit score up, and you have a collection drop in the middle of that, it goes down down down. And so, anything you have pop-up that, you know, that that unexpectedly is going to affect this either strategy negatively. So, now, I would clear everything in count on six to 12 months after date of last activity,

“you should see a credit score disappear, become undeterminable, and you can go to Churchill,”

mortgage, and get the same mortgage that someone with an 850 score can get, same exact mortgage, but they do manual underwriting in order to make that happen. And I just want to point this out, because we take this call all the time. You need to be aware that everybody you know is probably going to disagree with what Dave just said, because they're uninformed. They think that you are most heard Dave wrong, is my guess, because this is such a cultural thing. So, I'll only

bring this up to say, call Zander and talk to them. You mean Churchill? Excuse me, Churchill, thank you. Cultural mortgage and walk through it so that you actually have real data, because most people that you do life with will think that either A, we're crazy, or B, that you heard us wrong. That's how systemic this credit score belief is. So, I just want to point that out that when you got off this call, you might be on the high of, okay, I know what to do, and then you tell anybody,

they're going to look at you like you got horns growing out your head. Tyler's in Atlanta. Hi, Tyler, how are you? I'm doing good. How are you doing, Dave? That was an eye-deserved. How can I help? Are you asking right now? I'm currently a travel for work. I'm a fiber optic splacer, and I make about 130,000 a year. And my wife, we have one little boy and we have a little girl on the way. And I was one that tried to move about home, and my pay will probably be getting cut in half

almost. And she's a stay at home mom. And I was just going to see what y'all saw it on there. What's the driving reason that you are even considering taking a half-pay cut to move back home? Yeah, I know, but I want a little bit more on that. I know what's the driving reason that would make you consider that? Well, I'm going for five days a week, and then once a month, I have to work the way you can shift. And I just want to be home with them, or be more present, and that's it.

Okay, so it's not trying to be near family to make up for the travel. It's I just don't want to be on a road.

Is that your only option to take a 50% cut?

“Probably not. So if you put in my go from 1.30 to like 70 or 80, probably doing what?”

I'm a fiber optic supply. So you do the same thing. Yes, are you? And what made you worried you get that number? 70 or 80? I've just been looking at my jobs in the area live in, and that's about the median for that. Published jobs or friends telling you about stuff. Okay, so that's the median. So what is a path look like for growth?

What forget this move for just a second? If you stay in your industry, what is possible for you to

get to over time? If you look in the next three to five to seven ten years? I mean, it's growing pretty good. If I move my way up, say I go to Supervisor or something like that,

“I could probably reach back over 100,000 a year while at home. Okay, what's beyond Supervisor?”

Probably like regional and stuff or director. Okay, what's that make? I'd probably say well over 120. Okay, is that something you want? Why are you not eligible for that now? Well, I'm 22 right now, and I've been doing this almost four years, which I don't know if I am or not, I haven't really looked at that yet. But I'm just guessing I'm probably just new to new to and I don't really have any Supervisor.

Can I give you some older brother advice? I'm actually I'm old enough to be your dad, sadly. I just realized that.

So here's what I think. I think you're allowing the real raw emotion of being away from the

family, how bad your heart's hurting. And that's because you're a good dude. You're a good dude and a good

“dad. And I totally get it. But I think you're allowing that raw emotion to get in the way of a long-term”

planet at 22 with another one on the way. I would be thinking about the next five to seven years as clearly as I could. Understanding I can't control the future, but I can look forward and I can go, how do I want to take care of my life in these two little ones five to seven years for now? And if it were me, I would let this sit a little bit, get some more wisdom besides Dave and I, some older guys in your life, say hey, I'm dealing with this real emotion because I think

until you have a plan for what the next three, five, seven years could look like in your industry, I would not leave this job. And I would let my heart hurt a little bit more because of babies are little, one baby at home and other on their, they don't even know you'd be present when you're home. I would not make this move right now unless I could clearly tie it to a better move long-term. I'm willing, when I came to Ramsay, I actually went backwards a little bit for about a

year and a half, but I knew coming here was the best long-term play, but it was a part of the long-term. And let me also point out, I was able to do it. We made some changes financially to where we weren't scraping. Yeah, let me add one other thing, okay, do not just because you saw some job listings at one price, don't accept that as your destiny. Right, so you know, I don't think that you have to make less coming off the road. I think you can make almost what you're making now,

but you're probably going to poke around a little bit more to find that one, because you are in a wonderful trade right now, and the trades are very short on help. And I think you're probably in a stronger position than you feel like you are. You do not have to take a pay cut necessarily to come home. It's not mandatory. [Music]

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from a Christian perspective. I understand working for a salary creating a useful product or service or renting housing at a fair price. But I feel conflicted about things like stocks and bank deposits because they seem more indirect and harder to evaluate ethically. For example, when you buy and later sell stock for a profit, it can feel like you're benefiting without really creating value.

And with banks, you do not always know how your money is being used. Am I overthinking this or are some

forms of investing more consistent with Christian convictions than others? Yeah, I do think you're

“overthinking it, but I don't take a shot at you there. I think, you know, you've got a great heart.”

I think you've got to use God-given common sense and also that still small voice of discernment. And I think that when it comes to just your general investing in banks, you don't need to feel guilty about making money on your deposits or making money on your money market or making money on your investment strategy, certainly what we teach here at Ramsey. So I think while you're overthinking it, I appreciate where your heart is and I think you just have to back off to

wait a second. Am I in any way making money through some type of Ponzi scheme? Right?

Now that is dishonesty. That is lying and making money off of evil actions would be your meter. And so outside of that, I think you're overthinking it, but I bring you in my bringing harm to someone. Yeah, that's the other thing. Right? And so, you know, when you deposit money in a bank and they

“pay you interest, you're not bringing harm to someone. You can't control what the bank does.”

Okay, it's the same thing as if you go by groceries at a grocery store. They now have your money. If they go and do something evil with it, you'd bought groceries. You didn't do anything. They did. And so same thing with the bank. If you put a deposit in a bank and they do something evil with it. Now, if a bank is known for screwing people and you put your money in there, well, yeah, you're kind of participating then. But just, you know, if a grocery store is known for screwing people

and you do business with them, you're participating too. Same thing, right? And so, you know, the trick is we're trying to do business with people that have evil intent in any way, because they're going to do that. And that is consistent. Now, and here's another interesting one that comes up also in this thing. It's stocks, you know, buying stock. Now, I don't want to, I've heard people say from a Christian perspective that I don't want to buy stock in

X company, because X company might be doing something wrong. Well, if you buy stock from that company, unless it's an initial public offering or unless it's treasury stock being sold, both of which are very unusual. But if you simply call your broker up and say, I want to buy stock in Home Depot, Home Depot doesn't get the money. You're not buying the stock from Home Depot. You're buying it from Ken, who selling his Home Depot stock. It's an individual to an individual.

It's like my, it's like my buddy has a Chevy pickup up for sale. And you go buy the Chevy pickup. Chevy doesn't get any of the money. Okay. But, you know, but if, so a Chevy, if Chevrolet is screw in somebody somewhere are messing somebody over, you buying that Chevy pickup from another individual is not in any way funding the evil practices. Now, you are driving around a brand that you don't agree with. Okay. But aside from that, there, you know, it's a used car. The new car dealer does not

get it. The new car manufacturer does not get it. This is a used share of stock. You know, they don't get any benefit from it at all. Now, if the, if the stock goes up and value you, and you, you know, that, that benefit that while you, while that, because of that company's doing evil things and screwing people, then you have benefited. But the actual purchase of the stock

“is from another individual. And so there's nothing there. And that's the thing. So you have to be”

real careful about jotting, total here. The details, in other words, you have to be careful about how far down in the weeds, am I going to try to do this? And so, you know, it's, um, there's almost no way that you can have any transactions in the marketplace that at some point, you can't lead it back to something that you don't like. Somewhere, somehow. Yeah. But you're, what, where you have to decide is, okay, how much, what controlled do I have and is my intent to

profit off of this? So for instance, I would never buy or do business with or put money in any way,

anywhere near a payday lender. They're charging 800% they're screwing poor people. Okay? So I'm not,

know about it. Right? And so as a Christian, I'd be screwing poor people. And I saw I'm not going to do the payday lender in any stretch anyway. And, but, but, you know, just because the grocery store, they don't get a pass either because, you know, they sell whatever that I don't agree with in there, you know, and, you know, you could say, well, there's some kind of toxic, what, you know,

what, it's just, you can never get to the end of this if you spend all your time. I'm still crazy.

So I spend a reasonable amount of time saying, this is God's money. Am I doing something that makes him blush? If it does, and I don't do it. But I'm also not going to spend my entire life trying to live in a cave, click, limp, and avoid doing business out here in a positive way, helping people in the process, and not enjoying the whole process. So there you go. Interesting.

“All right, Jamie is in Memphis. How Jamie, how are you? I'm doing well. How about you, Dave?”

Better than I deserve. What's up? So my question is, how do you enjoy financial peace when the

majority of your net worth with this money that you received, like, through inheritance and

wasn't through your own hard work? Do you have children? No, I'm single. Okay. Will you have children someday? Most like they not necessarily. Okay. All right. Well, I want good things for my kids. Most people do. And so someone wanted good things for Jamie, and they blessed you with an inheritance. Was it your parents, your grandparents? What? Grandparents? Okay. Didn't they deeply love you? They did. Okay. And so they wanted to do

nice things for the grandkids who they love. I don't know why you couldn't enjoy that. You didn't do anything wrong except have grandparents that loved you. Right? Yeah. So I wouldn't be wasteful. I would be trying to multiply the money and do good things with it to make grandpa proud. So he's watching from heaven and say, yeah, I want him smiling. I want to live out the legacy that he built and do good things to positive

things with the wealth and part of that is enjoy it, part of its multiplied, invest it well. Yeah. I've just added, there's a lot going on. We don't have time to dig in.

“I think a practical answer is, how do you start to enjoy money that you didn't earn?”

It's a little bit at a time. I think it's like being afraid of riding a bike. If I could take your way back there, you wanted to ride a bike. Little you was like, I think riding a bike would be amazing. I see older kids doing it, but I'm also equally terrified to try to learn to ride the bike. And I think there's something going on with you and money. Oh, training will.

So I do think training will. I think just go give. Here's what I would do. I would give some

today or tomorrow. Not a huge amount, but just something to make you uncomfortable enough and it's not a crazy amount, but just give it to somebody and watch someone's reaction to you taking that money and doing something and go with it. And then down the line, a day or two later, buy something again reasonable, something that you would like to buy. Maybe it's even a hundred

“dollar purchase, who cares? But I think a little bit at a time to begin to experience something”

positive with money, because my belief is you've not experienced much positive around money at all in your life. [Music] Welcome back to the Ramsey Show. In the Fairwins Credit Union Studio, Ken Coleman Ramsey Personality is my co-host today. Mary is in Washington, DC. Hi, Mary, how are you?

Hi, Dave, fine. Thank you so much for taking my call. Sure, what's up? I'm retired with 8500 monthly pension, $4600, expenses, 0376,000 in my mortgage, and $299,000 in my 401(k) and $40,000 liquid. This should I use my surplus to pay off my home early or keep investing.

376. 376. All right, and so, and your how old?

366. 56, yeah. So I do want your home paid off, okay, going into retirement, and so I don't want to carry a mortgage. I mean, you're early retired at 56, but I'm saying, going into your 60s and 70s, I want the house paid off. So we need to get there, but if we did even 10 years, that's 66 years old, that's $30,000 a year, that's $2500 a month. You could do that and still invest. Okay, or you could back off of our, you could back off the investing and be done in six years,

you know, or five years. Put $5,000 a month to be gone in five years.

“That's true. Okay. Is that what you were working in?”

I don't like doing nothing on investing. So I would do something there. But I'm going to put the heavier part of the excess money on the house, while still doing something. So if I had 5,000 to play with, there's an example, which it sounds like you don't, sounds like you got four to play with, right? Right. Right. Okay. Or about three in one. What would that do for us?

It's 36,000 a year. I get you about, get you out in about seven, eight years, something like that. Yeah, to put $1,000 in investing, it's only $12,000 a year. And you put $3,000 on the house. You'll be done. I think I'm doing this in my head, but I'm pretty close. I think it'll be between

“seven and eight years. You'll be out. And here's the thing. If is your 250 that's in the 401k”

invested in good growth stock mutual funds earning market rates of return? I think so. I return from the government. So I have the G fund. Okay. So it's TSP. It's not 401k. It's TSP. I'm sorry. It's TSP. Okay. I would move it all into the C plan, not the G. Okay. It's been, it's been earning about what the S&P does.

And so it's been earning around 11, 12% a year average. If you're, if you're earning 10%, which the G is not, but the C would be. If you're earning 10% a year, you're lump sum, you're 250 that's in there. We'll double every seven years. You're 56. So that means that

250 will be a million dollars at $70. If you don't add anything to it, if you don't add anything to it.

And if it's in the C plan, now if you're retired, you can roll that TSP into an IRA with a, with a good smart investor pro and pick mutual funds that'll outperform the C. If you're stuck in the TSP, you know, like if you still work there, then I would be in the C plan. Maybe a little bit in the eye a little bit in the S, but mainly the C, if you're working there, but you're not there anymore, you can roll that. You could go on ramsysolutions.com,

click smart investor pro, roll that 250 and sit down with him and say, hey, if I had a thousand dollars to this and it's invested in the four types of mutual funds that Ramsay talks about, growth, growth and income, aggressive growth and international, which is what my personal portfolio is and so is kids. Okay, and we pick good mutual funds that have a better track record than the market,

a better than the S, P averages, then yeah, then you're $250 billion and your $1,000 a month,

they'll be another chunk as well at 70 and you'd have the house paid off at $4,000 or $3,000 a month. And I think seven and a half, you know, eight years will call it. And so, but that puts you, it's like 65 with a paid for house and on your way to a million dollars in NISTIG. Meanwhile, as a house gets paid off, you know, your investments already be on track, you've got some

“freed up money at that point. Yeah, and the only thing I would add, and we didn't get into this”

with you, so I'm not sure if you're single, if you're married or not, but the $4,600, I'd be looking, where, where can we cut there? That feels like that's a little bit high, but I love that you're got the $8,500 monthly pension. That's nice. It is nice, another thing I would also throw out there. I'm not saying you have to do this, but I would think about it. Being young like you are, got a lot of experience, how could I take some of that government skill, go to the private sector

for three years, 24 months, and make some good money and fast forward the entire timeline that

everything shifts quick. Because of her age, I would think about it. You know, between now and 60,

“you could pay off the house with income only, extra income only. Correct. Make 300 grand between”

now and 60, that would be like $120,000 a year or whatever. I mean, yeah, I bet you could. It's possible. I would look at it as an honor. I mean, you don't have to do it as a slave drive. No, take something that's kind of makes you smile. You're happy to go to work. That's right. And go make some little bit of money and it makes me real happy because I'm paying off my house super fast and then I can really do it. Be serious about investing. That's, that's a really good idea.

I don't think about that. Because in 56, you got a lot of gas left in the tank. Yeah, a lot of things you can do. Yeah. That's very cool. Okay. So the TSP has the thrift savings plan for federal government employees has several options. The G is the is like a guaranteed and it's one of the lowest paying of the options. The C is a common stock and it mirrors the S&P. The S is small company and it's like an aggressive growth. The I is international and so that's like an international

growth stock mutual fund. Same kind of thing. The S and the I have underperformed, though, their indexes in the marketplace. So they're not as strong. The C is by far the strongest thing.

Not even a close second in the TSP program. And so what we've always recommended is somewhere around

80% for those of you working there or more in the C plan. And if you want a little bit of spice in the gumbo, you could go 80, 10, 10, 80% see 10% S, 10% I. And that's starting to approximate the four types of mutual funds. We talk about growth growth and income, aggressive growth and international in your TSP. And you'll get a good rate of return there. But I would have zero in the F or in the G either one. And they also have not new life phase plans. I wouldn't be any of those

at all. Not at all. Don't let the government plan you're investing. That would be a bad idea.

“Sorry, if you work for the government, but you should know that. That's true.”

Yeah, no, you want to plan you're investing and you want to look at the track records of these particular indexes that these are modeled after. And they're pretty simple to look at. They've got lots of good information in their website on it. But if you're in the TSP plan, that's what we recommend folks. And I would recommend any time you leave a company or the government that you roll to an IRA because a self-managed IRA through your broker in good mutual funds is going to

outperform the limited options you had back at the old place. Hey, good folks, Dr. John Deloni here. Don't you think life is too short to hate Mondays? Listen, you're worth loving the work you do and where you do it. So guess what? Ramsey Solutions is hiring.

If you're ready to join an amazing team that's all about changing lives and spreading hope,

we want to see your application. Right now we're hiring for technology sales, marketing, writing, copy editing, and creative roles. Check out all our job postings at RamseySolutions.com/curriers. [Music] Brandon is in Fort Worth. Hey Brandon, how are you? Oh, it's another beautiful day and paradise for me, guys. Are you gentlemen?

Just the same. How can we help sure? Good. Good here. Well, my question revolves around a bit of a moral conundrum or me. I'm wondering whether or not I should give back a pro-rated amount of money that was a lump sum given to me by a pretty new employer. Based on the fact that I have pretty much nailed down a new job and whether or not I should

“give any of that back. So that's what you've got. You've got to pay the signing bonus to come with them.”

Eat less structured than that. But basically what happened is we during the negotiations

for this new job, we agreed on a salary amount. We walked away the next day they called me and said

on paper. So what they were going to do is put me on paper for a lower salary and a third

“party potentially related to the business would give me a lump sum roughly equivalent to 33%”

of my annual income just upfront. And those two things combined amounted to the amount that we agreed on for an annual salary. How long were you there? I have only been working here for four months. There is not a shred of paperwork that has been wetted with ink that would legally require me to give this money back. But did your handshake and say you would? Yes, I did. Well, I didn't say I would, but I did handshake and say I would work for them and I'm having some mixed feelings

about leaving so soon. Why are you leaving so soon? Because I have, it was someone unexpected, but a job hiring window opened for a job that is kind of the Cadillac job in the industry in which I work within three to five years. I would roughly triple my current income and it's just too much of the improvement to my family's quality of life to say no. Sure. And you've already accepted the new rule. Essentially, yes. What does essentially mean? Yes. Yes, pending a training date

is what that means. So, I don't know how long I'll be working at the current. My how much was how much was the lump sum? It was $50,000. And what did you do with it? Well, we still have roughly half. My family and I are still in baby step two. So, we used a about half of it to clean up two car loans that we had. So, now we're debt rates up our mortgage. But we did shoot through a decent chunk of it, but I have about half and about 12 and a half thousand

dollars, that is obviously earmarked for taxes. So, how, okay, it was a part of your salary.

It was such a convoluted way of doing it. But the bottom line is that was a part of your salary.

They just chose to pay you a different way. It's repaid it. So, how much of the 50,000 over, of course, of 12 months? How much would that represent for over how many months? I've been working for the company for four months. I'm sorry, but was that for a year?

“To make up the difference for one year? Yes, yes. That's what I'm trying to figure out.”

$4,000 a month, okay, $4,200 a month, okay. And so, and you've been there for a month, such 16 of it, and you've got to pay taxes on this. Yes. But there was no, like if we moved someone from another state, and we hired them, we paid X number of dollars, called $10,000, I'm moving expenses. Our employment agreement requires they repay that if they leave within 90 days. Correct. And that is pretty standard in the industry. However, I signed nothing to that

effects whatsoever. And there was no, there was no discussion of if you leave, you've got to pay this back. Not particularly. No, it's just you feel, you feel funny about taking the money, and then not being there the whole 12 months. What was going to happen at the end of 12 months,

by the way? Well, so, well, one thing we did discuss was that, you know, that this third party

would help make up the difference every year. And, no, not every year. So, one thing that we did discuss was that they have to basically allow me to do outside work to make up that difference. You know, so basically, I had about 12 months. So, you were going to take a couple of hardships. Not to go to my new position. No, I'm talking about, if you had stayed there 12 months after 12 months, your pay goes down $50,000. That's correct. That's from that. That's wacky.

I'm right, lawyer. wacky that you took the deal. Yeah, it's kind of a crazy deal. Yeah, but that's irrelevant to this. This is like, you know, we don't want to tell the other people that work here. So, we're not going to put it on paper. This just got, this got as bad smell over the whole thing. Yeah. It's pretty, it's pretty weird. I mean, I make no bones about that. Yeah, I'm not on you, but on them. It's just strange. And a third party has to come to the table.

This is pretty strange. Yeah, I mean, so, um, third party with like a relative. Yeah. Yeah. I, um,

“okay, the best way to answer a business as ethics question is what would you want someone to do”

if the roles reversed? Treat other people like you don't be treated. And so, just switch roles and try to put yourself in their shoes and say, all right, hire this guy. I gave him 50 grand.

I would probably, if I switch, try to look at it through their weird lens, but they have a weird

“lens. But I'm trying to sit over there in their shoes. I think they're going to, I think they're going”

to have, uh, not a moral expectation, or an, I don't think you've breached any ethics. I don't think you're dealing wrong legally. If you kept the money, um, you know, they learned a lesson on how not to structure deals because this was a stupid, but way to do this thing. So, uh, but especially with nothing inked on it, but, um, I, um, how would you want to be treated if the roles were reversed? And that, that's the kind of person you want to be regardless of the kind of people that they are.

And so, yeah, I'm going to, I'm probably, if I'm switching roles, I'm probably going to write them a check for something. And then you just decide, maybe it's the 25 and you got to cover the taxes or whatever. I don't know, you got, you know, you got tax problem out of this, too. This mixed in there, but I'm probably going to go, okay, I worked here four months and I got to pay

taxes on all this and there's, here's what's left out of that. And so, here's what I'm going to do,

and I'm not obligated to do anything, but I'm going to do this just as, uh, because it's the kind

“of person I am. I'm probably going to do something. Yeah, that's why I was asking that question”

of how is it built in so that we could come up with a number. So, we've done four months service out of the 15. That's where I was going. That's 16 of the, that's right. So, that's 17, thousand of the 50. So, that's 33 left. He's got 25 in the account. But he's been taxed on 50. That's the other issue. So, he's not netted out. And I don't want to pay them back my tax money. Yeah. That's why I owe taxes. And I'm not going to do it in a lump sum. I'm going to,

so if you're an idea, what if you said 50 minus or 40, 200 a month minus taxes and did it that way? That feels, I'm so, what I'm trying to get to is a good form of net of taxes. Yeah. The taxes they lost. Yeah. Because they essentially prepaid him. Is that correct? That's how we're looking at that. Is that prepaid work to be done? What they did? And you only did four months. So, I would feel that way too. Yeah. And, and, and I don't think, again, I wouldn't throw

darts at you whatever you do. Because I think they're squirrely. And, and I think that, this is the whole thing's got to smell on it. This weird. Yeah. And so, you know, they get, they get what's coming to him on that. But if I answer an ethics question, honestly, I have to get a tender heart and I have to step on the other side of the desk and I have to say, how would I want to be treated if I was sitting over there? And how would I expect to be treated? And, you know,

that's, that's the thing. So, we had a guy working for us when the internet first started and

cold fusion was the language. And I spent $5,000 on cold fusion class and another $4,000 to send him to class in Oklahoma City. And it was in the early days. That's a lot of money for us in the early days. He came home and, of course, everything's blowing up, you know, brand new internet, right? And a guy offered him $50,000 more a year, three weeks after he got home from class, to go to work over there, more than I could pay or would pay. And he said, I got to,

he said, I got to come in and tell you about this, but I can't take it. Because you just invested all this in me. It's why I got the job offer. And I said, yeah, you got to take it. So, I let him lose with nothing. And I didn't ask for anything back. But that was, you know, again, how do I want to be treated? Yeah, he handled it up front. Yeah. All right, let's cut to the chase. It's easy to get discouraged about crazy house prices and

interest rates. But when you have the right real estate agent to help you buy and sell the right way, you'll have confidence to make smart decisions. Ramsey trusted agents aren't just experts who

guide you through buying or selling. They're people you can trust to have your back from the first

call to closing day. Find a Ramsey trusted agent near you at Ramsey Solutions dot com slash agent. That's Ramsey Solutions dot com slash agent. One of the best things that you can do for your finances is have a great tax pro in your corner. They'll help advise you on the best moves to make for your situation, for your small business,

“or if you've had some big life changes in the past year. If you want to know who we trust,”

who's Ramsey trusted, go to Ramsey Solutions dot com slash tax pro to find CPAs and enrolled agents that have been vetted by the Ramsey team. John is with us over in San Antonio, John, I see on my screen, you're a baby steps millionaire. Wait, it go, dude. Oh, I got a good credit team today for putting that on the past. Well, I'm, you, you walked

Oh, right around 1.7 million. I think I just wrote a check for my house last month.

Way to go. That's fine. Congratulations. Okay. So break the 1.7 down for me. I'm much of it. Your house. Probably between right a little bit over 400. Okay. I would think.

“Okay. So you've got a $400,000 house. Okay. What's the other 1.3 million?”

About 1.2 is probably the 4.1 kilo in retirement accounts. That kind of thing. Let's start it up a couple of those. You know, 100 in miscellaneous? Yeah. You know, emergency fund six months. Yeah. You know, and I keep that in cash and usually just buy like T-bells that, you know, mature within a month. Yeah. How old are you?

John, but I'm 55. 55. And how much of the 1.7 million did you inherit?

Zero. Okay. I inherited my penance knowledge. There you go. I love it. I love it. That's good news. I love it. My mom's still alive too. So very cool. And your worst year of income since you've been working and your best year of income since you've been working. Um, most of you probably 60 best just a little over 200. Okay. What are you doing for a living? I'm a project director and medical research. Okay. All right. Four year degree.

Yes. In one. Got it. Cool. And your GPA when you're going to school? Yeah. Where do you ask? I'm going to say it's close to three, but not quite over. Okay.

“That's what mine was. My mom was a 2.97 and I'm still pissed about that 3.100.”

Yeah. There you go. Good for you, man. All right. So you didn't inherit anything. You start

as zero at age 55. You got 1.7 million, including a paid for house. Very cool. So when you're

out there running around the day and you see these news reports that the American dream is dead that it can't be done today. Do you think there's going to be done today? Absolutely. And not only can it be done, it can be done easily. It's all mental. My dad immigrated over from Germany when he was in his twenties and accomplished the Mac and dream. My parents and still knew that it is absolutely possible. It takes some sweat and just

keep her head on straight. I didn't grow up until I was 32. I just wasn't thinking clearly. And then I was and I applied the principles they instilled in me and your baby steps that gave me the path and it's absolutely possible if I can do it anybody can do it. So if you got a 24 year over in the you listening what would you tell them the key is to be in a million air 1.7 million by the time they're 55. What's the key? Roll up. Roll up and just get over the mental

hurdle. Once you get over the mental aspect and live within your means anybody can do it. By mental aspect you mean believe it can happen or what do you mean? I mean you know it's not hard. You live with what you're with in your means. You have all the tools there. It and don't get tied up in the mass. Don't get it down into the minutia. Just live within your means. Roll your budget. Follow your baby steps and it's done and just don't worry about little stuff. So you

keep your eyes on the big picture and you will take what you learned. There's so much you can read out there but again a lot of it gets down into the breast you know I mean not the breast accent in the minutia. If you just focus on the on the prize just don't worry the things that you just want. Just go with what you need. As in the little calm where you're going to be giving more and your soul's going to be much more for and you're going to be happy. Let's talk about that.

I'm worried about the next bill that comes along. So I love it. You're talking about delay gratification right this idea of mentally get over wanting all the stuff keep it up with the

“juniors. I think it's a great word. I want to ask you this because you're a young man. 55 you got”

a 1.7 million net worth. How has pain off that house a month ago come into grips with what you're telling us today of where you're at now at only 55. What is the future look like and feel like to you? Or ignore it gives me options. I'm technically could I return now? Sure. But I don't want them. But I have options now. I mean when people call it and yell to the top of their lungs they have freedom. It's no lie. It's no joke. It is that you are getting freedom to have much more control over

your own life and what you can and can't do. And I I saw it my daughter's eyes when she looked at me when I told her I wrote a check and just paid off the house. Is the proud Cuban she had for me

and you feel like you're a winner and it's just that the world's my oyster now. What do I want to

do? I mean I enjoy my job. I love doing what I do and I get paid well for it but now I can do much do whatever I want. I love it. What do I do? I do a lot of this but a lot of what I'm trying to look for the word just so much I could see in our future and I believe my kids are growing up getting on the same burn ragging and you know there's just so much I can do now. I don't know much potential. Hey man. What do you drive? I got a S1/50, the 2011 S1/50, the 2011 S1/50.

2011, everyone 50, what's your wife drive? She has a kid, I'm sewage. How old?

“It's about two years old. Okay okay okay so folks if you want to know what somebody's worth”

$1.7 million drive. That's what they drive. That's an actual thing. That's not a video. It's not an

MTV reality show. It's not a divorce housewives of the moon or whatever. That's my favorite fake sew title of all time. And it's trying to think of some bizarre place but they're all taken I guess but anyway yeah way to go John proud of you man. You're living the American dream doing it right. Starting from nothing he's sitting there. So let me help you guys with this. He's 55 years old. He's making $200,000 a year and he's continuing to invest. If he doesn't do that, this net worth

will roughly double every seven years because it's invested in 401k and good mutual funds the way we teach and it's invested in real estate. Okay and so if that means at 62 3.4 if he does nothing else

and that means at 69 7 million if he does nothing else and that means at 76 14 million if he does

nothing else the average death age of a male and so this guy passes away at 80 years old with a 25

“or 30 million dollar net worth. That's what this says. That's where he's gonna be just with what he's”

done so far and he will be adding to it as he goes along and will have given away hundreds of thousands of dollars he talked about generosity along the way and changed his family tree completely permanently and his mother he says dad immigrated from Germany, right? He didn't say his mom so he's gonna say his mom's proud and very very cool stuff very cool stuff. So is this possible? Yes this is possible but you have to quit buying crap you can't afford with money you don't have

to impress people you don't really like you need to quit playing a game for everyone else to start playing the game for you start playing the game for your family when you play that game it's a different game. It's right when you take the blinders and put them on and say I don't care what anybody else thinks all I care is where we end up and that's where John is very cool stuff guys

“very few wealthy people are concerned about one of the people think that's how they became wealthy”

Hey guys Dave Ramsey here every day on this show we help people work through real money problems and figure out what to do next. Now you can get that same kind of help anytime with ask Ramsey ask your money question and get answers built on Ramsey principles we use on the show whether you're making a decision or just want something explained ask Ramsey is here to help it's fast simple and free to use go to Ramsey Solutions.com and try ask Ramsey today

that's Ramsey Solutions.com our scripture today Luke 923 then he said to them all whoever wants to be my disciple must

when you can't win by being better you can win by being different oh there's a better idea

“I like that one a lot don't be normal in a world where normal sucks there you go I like that”

Michael and Dallas what's up how are they going sir better than I deserve how can I help hey I owe sixty three thousand dollars on an RV that's worth about eighteen to twenty thousand dollars how did that happen? Well I'm twenty five and when I was about twenty three I made a dumb decision and bought an RV and lived in it for about six months and now I've bought a house and I have nothing to do with that RV now I'm I'm saying the RV actually you bought it for how much

so when I bought it it was sixty eight thousand dollars how long ago and it three years ago so in three years it lost fifty two thousand dollars in value yes sir okay based based on what calculation

“what they offered you forward at the dealer or what the actual market value is if you try to sell”

it to an individual. I've done both I've looked at selling it on Facebook those type of things and nobody's willing to give over twenty thousand dollars in the RV dealership the two that I've taken it to only offer me about between eighteen and nineteen thousand. Well if they're willing to give you nineteen thousand dollars for it they're able to sell it for twenty seven somewhere yes sir they're

not gonna give you nineteen for it when nobody is giving more than twenty for that so your first

Facebook thing that part of the test failed but we know what wholesale is because two dealers have offered you basically the same thing yes sir and you owe how much? I owe sixty three thousand

“dollars there's a little bit of complications on the why I owe that much you know only a five thousand”

dollar difference they just added some more on to my loan we had some in complications with insurance I didn't realize I didn't have insurance so for about a month and they decided to throw on an extra five thousand dollars on my loan so for forced place insurance yeah yes sir have they taken that back off now that you've gotten in policy employees yes sir it's it's not off

I still gonna have to pay that five thousand dollars is what they told me no matter what the first month

yes sir I don't know what calculations or how they came up with that number but yes what do you make of your my wife and I we make about a hundred and thirty thousand dollars how much money do you have in savings not very much we are we're at the very bottom of the the debts no wall right now and you borrow a house yes sir while you're broke yes sir where we're not doing too good right now

okay I don't know how to get you out of this Michael I mean you'd have to borrow the forty three thousand dollars and just have an unsecured loan of forty three thousand dollars who holds the loan

on this a client credit union and what's the interest rate? 10 percent time

the the bad part is I'm not only paying the monthly payment which is seven hundred twenty two dollars I've also got a hundred dollar storage fee and then a hundred and fifty dollars for insurance every month so I'm saying about approximately nine hundred fifty dollars a month for something that I'm not using at all you know yeah I I truly do I'm I'm stumped I don't know how you get out of this other than you just pay it down

or or sell it and if you can if you have any credit left at all and you can borrow the difference or work with a credit union to sign a note for the difference at least the bleeding would stop because you have no insurance and no storage fee and sell the thing for twenty grand and sign a note for forty three and you know maybe negotiate some of that away because they got they they don't have any collateral I mean their collateral is gone and so and it's going it's going away really

that have wheels and motors go down in value but apparently RVs are the worst of everything out there

it was already five years old when I bought it so it was just a it was just all around bad so that means there's a hundred grand when it was new approximately eight years later it's worth twenty talk about burning money I like lighting hundred dollar bills on fire woo just and they're holding them to your hands

“get hot wow yeah the only thing I know to do I think I would stop the bleeding by selling it”

you know and signing a note for the difference if you can talk the credit union doing that and the way you do that is just say hey look guys I'm getting ready to hand you the keys to this

thing back y'all can have it you can have your little five thousand dollar insurance charge for

place insurance is valid but I'm not paying it and you guys can just sue me and or I'll sign a note for the difference and work my way through it because I'm the idiot signed up for this trip and I'll get to take it with you but you're going to have to help me by letting me get rid of it and whatever it brings we'll put that on the note and I'll sign a note for the difference and that gets rid of the insurance bill and that gets rid of the storage bill and everything else

but also you've got to start thinking more clearly on your next moves on things because you wouldn't bought a house in the middle of this and that really puts you at further risk it's added to this mess and you bought a house by the way where you can't park your RV yeah that's right you know that you already owned before you bought the house so a lot of work in your future the good news is you're young and you guys need to be working multiple jobs

and get after this thing a long time to clean up $43,000 it's like $43,000 in credit card debt how fast can you do it making 130 you can do it in a year and you don't pay it off in a year and be done with it and then you just get to look back and go yep the dumbest thing I ever did in my life was that RV thing and the good news is I don't have to do that dumb thing again I'll have to find something new to do dumb why why is the we've talked about this many many times

you have a hint as to why they drop in vise because they're bringing out new models all the time what would it cost the market is large enough I think the resale market is very limited aha the number of people buying a in this case eight-year-old RV that's what it is you're right would be there's no demand there's no demand and so it's not you know it'd be like a 20-year-old ski boat you know I mean it's really difficult to move that product I'm not going to talk about

an expensive ski boat like a mastercraft I'm talking about just a you know a stern craft baby you know your old brands or something like that I think just deteriorates and nobody wants it there

“I've just been a little bit more go get a new one and so that's I think that's what's going on here”

but I good Lord all of you listening that we're thinking about ever buying an RV you should have just went I don't think so it's right man I just want I mean I've bought almost everything else with wheels and motors at one time or another and have done some really really dumb deals on those processes

but the one I've never bought I never bought a never bought a camper never bought an RV

somehow managed to avoid that one mistake I just can't see you hauling down 65 and a gentleman bago you know what I mean people drive a bike on I think go stay crazy driving that one a bago you're waving at people is a drive by Chevy chasing it yeah I don't know I I'm not a snob I just never had that one and I never bought a trailer and I never bought a mobile home either this another one I've seen concept on the mobile home as well most people are buying something new so therefore

low demand so and they just go down in value like rock they're horrible horrible you can't get out I'm gonna get stuck in I'm in poor Michael's just stuck stuck stuck man well you you are wise to be asking questions about it and to be gathering information and try to make the best decision you can and then just roll up your sleeves and live on nothing and click no no eating out no vacations until we get the RV paid off that's an irony no vacations until we get the RV paid off

I put this out of the ramps you show in the books we'll be back with you before you know it

“in the meantime remember there's ultimately only one way to financial peace and that's to walk”

daily with the Prince of Peace cries Jesus