E1103 - West Wilscam and Scamanda Deep Dive + AOA Reunion with Carlos King and Dylan Nalbandian

What's going on everybody?

Welcome back to another unbelievably like just jam-packed crazy episode. It's going to be crazy. It's going to be crazy. Scamander, I don't know if we've landed on a name, but we're going to workshop again. But so much to get into.

It's going to be a high energy episode at this episode. To see is back with the household. She brought her very special friend, Dylan. Now, Bandian with her. I know many of you already know Dylan.

He's got a lot of great content floating around on the internet. And he's got some great takes. He's bringing into the studio with him today. Mary's also with us.

“Also, I believe Carlos King is going to be joining us momentarily.”

You all know Carlos as a former Real Housewives producer and podcaster friend of show and we all just have a lot to say about the Amanda and West drama in West.

We also have the age of attraction.

We're union that premiered last night, and we appreciate you all supporting and watching lots to get into. So we'll talk a little age of attraction. We're union. We're just going to focus on Teresa and John, obviously, if the rest of the household wants

to break anything down, but we'll be talking about that. But this is going to be full on, scamanda, outside of the age of attraction, union. We're going to give you exactly what you want, what you need. There's just as many layers to this. I don't even know where my brain is scrambled eggs right now.

It's crazy. River was like walking on water yesterday, and I was like, "Yeah, watch River." And he was like, "I can. I'm going to Twitter. There's so many things in the town."

Nick was on Twitter. He was busy because I'm working. I'm like, "Please. I am working."

I was just like, "This is what I-- what kind of thing have carved out a nice little

life for myself?" No, we have.

“It's, honestly, the best kind of work, especially when it doesn't involve--”

Right. Exactly. Oh, my God. It's true. It's the best.

Well, before we get rock and a running and all this contest, a couple of reminders. Don't forget the foul fouls pluses. Again, add free-- if you want to listen all your favorite fouls episodes without any ads, you can do that. Now, on foul fouls plus.

Additionally, we have a red recap deep down. Where are we dive deep into all your reality TV drama? We'll obviously give you some BTS on the age of attraction reunion. Obviously, the Western Amanda and all of that, like, we'll get into the weeds. You know?

We'll get into the weeds. Obviously, we'll do it here. But if you are thirsting for even more, you know we're to find it, and that is on vile files plus. So go to vilefiles.com to sign up.

All right. Before we jump into the age of attraction reunion, I will-- like, Monday was crazy, because as Susie and Mary know, like, when we were talking about West and Amanda, we ended up--

“like, I think everyone just thought it was a joke, you know?”

Today's-- we're recording this live on April Fool's. Like, today is April Fool's. So then there was a lot of, like, this is going to be April Fool's joke. And it was just-- it just seemed so fun. I think especially because everyone, like, KJ and Carl and Lindsay, like, all of these

people were posting just like memes of themselves, which was giving very much trolling. It was like-- It was just trolling the fans. You had West liking some stuff that seemingly confirmed that this was going on, and you thought there's no way.

Yeah. He's just going to be out there. He's going to be that boy. This messy in the comments breaking it this way. But then after we got recording, I got a couple calls, and I got a couple calls, and I found

out Monday afternoon that it was real. Yeah. I've heard from a source, too, that it is also-- I knew, like, I heard that there was going to be a statement coming. And we just-- and we honestly, because, like, our take mostly was this, like, if this

is fake, it's kind of like, this is not a funny joke. You're activating fans in a way that's going to be upsetting. If this is a joke, this is a really bad joke, and it had to wait for the big announcement. They did a joint announcement for seemingly a situation. Oh, my God.

I know. That is so funny. So funny. The joint-- yeah. The joint situation.

The joint connection announcement, as I believe the leader of Anita called it. I started following West and Amanda yesterday just waiting because I knew it was coming. Well, that was nice of you, because most people have been unfollowing them, so, like, you-- [LAUGHTER] He makes the curve.

Well, I'm going to do after this. Yeah. I need to know when it was going to come in. You're locked in for the drama now. Yeah.

All right. Well, we have so much to break down when it comes to the amount of-- and last. But before we do, let's talk a little age of attraction, reunion. Well, we are very excited to announce that we found out yesterday.

Yeah. We are getting a season two. So exciting. Maybe that reunion will be on Netflix. A lot of questions about why this one is not.

And things above--

Listen, it was a first season show.

“We only got eight episodes, hoping for more episodes, second season, you know?”

But we are very grateful for the next Netflix team to allow us to produce host and deliver you the reunion and certainly glad that you all enjoyed it. I want to talk about trees in John for a minute, because I think that was like, you know, I think our favorite couple throughout the show, I think that was the couple. I certainly was most interested in finding out kind of where are they now.

I'm so curious for those of you know, so they seem to be someone on good terms. But going into the reunion, you could-- the cast is overall pretty close. And John is part of the close knit of the cast. And, you know, Trisa, I think is, you know, a mom living her best life. I don't think she is as interested in the, you know, the camaraderie that it comes with,

like, are we just at a reality? She works in fashion. She's busy. She's like, you know. You know, and I think with other people, there's like a kind of a sum, you know,

the summer camp vibe, whatever. You know, a lot of the part of the reunion was like, you know, good age play at role. And your relationship not working.

And it was-- to me, it was always interesting to hear, like, none of the younger guys were

like, oh, no, like, of course it-- no, it's just like our communication. You know, it was like, it wasn't-- it wasn't the fact that I was a lot younger. But I was like, I think the fact that you are a bad communicator is maybe you being this young as part of the reason. Like, it's like they never wanted to acknowledge, maybe they're in maturity.

And because, like, you know, if you watch the reunion, they reference like this voice note, right? And the reason was like, I don't give a shit to talk about it, and John came in very much trying to like paint a-- like, he had all of the cast kind of rallying behind him. Like, it-- to my understanding, everyone's heard this voice memo that Teresa apparently

said in John. And it sounds like she was mad. And I think she came in real hot. And I think maybe she lost her shit. And I don't even think Teresa denied any of that, right?

We don't-- I don't know exactly what it was on it, but like, I think the rest of the cast heard it, and they were all like, that shit was crazy. But my interpretation is, is this like, bro, like, you played with fucking fire and you got burnt, you know?

“And that's what I was trying to talk about when we were, you know, I think two things can”

be true. We'll get into it with us in Amanda, especially when it comes to rally TV. Most people who join these shows, they want to go on TV. You know what I'm saying? Are they open to finding connections?

Of course. Some people are more genuine than others. I think John and Teresa had a legitimate connection. I think there was real feelings there. I also think John initially came on for the club, right?

And then I think he dated Teresa, and he fell in love in this bubble, and he was a supportive boyfriend, and he showed up for her, and he calmed her down when she got activated a little bit in this world. And as Teresa pointed out, when they got out of this world, it's like he was a different person.

And then she got made to feel like she was older by some people. And John's like, we only, like, age is only going to be a thing if we allow it to. He was saying, like, I felt like I reassured her enough in Vancouver.

And it's like, no, that's like your second week of the meeting.

You're also, it's still in that bubble. You're not even in the real world is what she's been so anxious about.

“That is where you need to step up and be like, hey, don't worry.”

My sister's not clowning you. I promise. Like, yeah. But it sounds like he completely shut down and was like, you know, that is an excuse and used Teresa's freak out as a justification to like end the relationship.

And it's like, she warned you. She warned you that this is going to be scary for her. She warned you that she has had bad relationships. She trusted you that you could handle the required maturity that came with dating someone in the in the season of life that she is in.

And he ended up just being a 27-year-old guy. Well, I was going to say, I don't mean, I don't want to put a blank statement on somebody and be like, you're manipulative or whatever, but I do think when somebody has the emotional intelligence to understand how television works a little bit, hearing what happened afterwards. Like, he played his card so well on camera.

He's showing up for her. He's reassuring. He's validating. Like, watching it back, I was, I thought he was very kind and very reassuring. But a part of me was like, you're doing all this on camera and then watching the reunion

to find out that he literally ghosted her. I'm like, that is the complete opposite of who you showed us on TV.

To me, I'm like, that's a manipulative person.

You're putting it on for the camera and then you ghost this person.

“I will never forget because I was, I was in here at the producer desk during the reunion.”

And when you were trying to get John to, like, when he, when he just couldn't speak, he went mute. He just, like, he went mute and he was like, like, the gag that I suppressed. Because it's just like, say it. We took a break right before we got to Teresa and John, right before we started.

John was like, right to my left and he was like, I'm just like, I don't know, I'm just not feeling well. I'm like, oh, shit. Are you sick? He's like, no, it's just like a really heavy day.

And like, I personally felt like he was trying to garner favoritism and sympathy from me,

knowing that we were about to get into it.

And I'm like, so you're, you're not sick, you know, like, but he was kind of pretending to be a little sick. And it kind of felt a little, again, I, you know, I don't think anyone needs to be vilified on this cast. What I liked about the reunion is like, they spoke their piece.

They confronted each other about like some of the ways they felt like, you know, mistreated, but it didn't end in a way that was like, no one needs to be demonized. But I do feel like, yeah, like, it seemed like John did the classic thing that guys do were like, they don't show up or they push or they, they know how to activate their partner. Their partner gets activated and then they use how they respond as a way is a justification

for like, oh, like, well, if you're, if you're going to just freak out like that, I'm just like, oh my God, I told you, right, I told you that age wasn't going to be a number of if you didn't let it and you were letting it.

So I guess we should break up because like you deserve to be happy and I clearly can't make

you happy and like what am I, it's just like, it's, yeah, manipulative. Yeah, it's like, you could try to make me happy if you wanted to. Yeah, it's actually like not that hard. Yeah, and at the end of the day, manipulative whatever, but like, it's very much giving, yeah, you are every bit of the twenty seven year old man that you are and maybe in some areas

in life, you are mature for your age. Like when when John kept talking about, he's anxiously attached and he said, actually attached three times in less than 90 seconds, I was like, okay, but then also, I was like, well, were you anxiously attached, like, once you all left the retreat or

“was that only something that you experienced in the retreat?”

Because if you were outside, then like, maybe I'll wouldn't have had some of these issues. He's saying like, how, how can you be anxiously attached to someone, but also be like, sorry, I'm just like, not really a texture. I just like don't really like, like, in the test and I'm busy. I don't talk on the phone a lot.

Yeah, he probably has gotten TikToks that he's an anxious avoidant and I think he's really leaned into that. Yeah. All the age gap couples, I think it was like if the girl was older, we ran into communication issues as it was called, but if the girl was younger, it would know, like, a little bit better.

I mean, not everybody, but I think in general, like, there is in general in society, age gap couples, you tend to see like the guys older, the girl is younger. And I love that in the show, you saw a lot of women, a younger man, but I was kind of watching like, and then in the reunion, I'm like, this is why it doesn't work. Yeah.

And even Teresa and John coming back in and having such a positive relationship with each other, I was like, the only reason this is positive is because Teresa is so mature that she's able to come in here and put the BS aside and be like, you're a great person. I'm not going to bring you and talk down to you, like, I respect you and I love you. But like, that's only because she's mature.

That's a great point, Susie. Like, yeah, it's only because of Teresa's maturity that allows them to be civil.

“Because I think Teresa has, Teresa honestly has, I think every right to be like, you”

played me. Fuck that guy. Get fuck. Yeah. What also speaks to, I think of how you guys said she doesn't really care so much about the TV

of it all. Just operating how she would, like, normally instead of amping it up to for television show. Yeah. Yeah. Teresa.

I love her. I told her that went, like, she, like, meeting her to that light she has on TV. Yeah. Who's just like, what I met her, I was like, you just have, yeah. She just is, I don't know, I felt very inspired by seeing her, like, you know, it seemed

like she went on that show really to do something for herself. Yeah. I just didn't like that John clearly had showed a bunch of people this voice note as a way to gardener favor with the cast. And I think he did.

But I think they're all discounting, like, the, like, he, yeah.

He's a fine guy.

“But I don't think you need to point out that, like, if you are going to go on the show”

and you're going to lean in, you don't get to just be, like, oops, we could have communicated

better. I was like, yo, okay, fine. You're anxiously attached. How are you going to work on that so that that doesn't show up in previous, in next relationship?

And he's like, well, I'm just going to communicate better. It's like, it was just kind of giving platitudes and cliches. And like, you know, like, we are protective of the show in the sense that, like, you don't want people coming on and being disingenuous. And I think there was a little bit of that.

I mean, you know, and the reason I want to talk about it is because, like, you know, it's like when you're hosting the reunion, like, I just want to get, we just wanted to give people a chance to speak their piece. It really wasn't the time to, like, debate with them, you know, certainly ask some follow-up questions.

But I think everyone else, I mean, and then Chris, Chris is, I word salad. That's my guy, Chris. Not a goof. He's social media. Leah was very, very, very gracious to him.

Yeah. Yeah. Leah deserves every single award in the world for being as cool as she is with Chris. Yes. Like, I, I don't know how she does it.

She's amazing. She's incredible. I, um, blown away by her. Well, if, uh, if you haven't seen it yet, be sure to go watch it. It's available now on YouTube.

I, I think you'll really enjoy it and, uh, we'll continue. You have any thoughts of Penguins, please share it with us in the comments and, uh, maybe we'll continue to bring it down next week as more and more of you consume the age of attraction reunion. All right.

I think Carlos King is here. So let's bring him in and let's really get into the Amanda and West of it all. I'm so excited. So excited.

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We're really really excited to have you join us to talk about are we officially calling it's commando? No. It has to say it will last. What are you calling our?

Well, they're calling the whole thing. The streets are calling it scommand. The scandal. The scandal. Which already exists.

I feel like we need something new, because scommand is already a scandal in itself outside of this. What's going to get a mandival? A man, who? It has nothing to do with Tom Sandival.

It's just a similar way. It's just a little water gate. It's not like everything was water gate, but once you have something gate, it's like that's perfect. But actually one of our editors Jack and I put together a top 10 list and David Letterman

style of things we think this should be called. If you guys want to hear it. Run through on. I do. So shame.

All right. Which for the record, just want to say, like, love Sierra down. Yeah. Yeah. I agree.

I read for that girl always.

We're team Sierra. Team Sierra. But anyway, these are our top 10 names for the scandal. Number 10, we have skim mandival. Number 9, a mandival.

Number 8, skim or amival. Number 7, skim mandabatula. Number 6, West Will skim. Number 5, skim mandal Wilson. Number 4, skim or house.

Number 3, Kyle got cut. Number 2, West Will son of a bitch. This is a scandal. And number 1, someone gets here again. Oh, okay.

“I think it's like skim or house the best.”

Skim or house. I agree with those things. The devil is kind of irrelevant with it's not. Yeah, it is. It's Tom Kyle.

It feels so good to say it though. It kind of flows off the tongue well. But it just doesn't. Also two, one of the main reasons I got into the whole bravo universe was because of skim of all.

And so I hope that more people get into the, like, summer house. So if we name it, skim or house. It's like the immediate tie. Hmm. I feel like West Will skim works better.

I liked that. West Will skim. That was funny too. That was a Jack Lewis original. I do think it's interesting that, you know, all jokes aside.

And it's focused around Amanda.

And I think it is. To me that like the internet seems to be coming more for Amanda than West.

“And I don't, I think that's, you know, now I know we're talking.”

I think that's, I feel like that's centered around like girl code being broken. But I, it's a life of me to me, West is definitely the biggest villain here. In terms of, yeah, he seemingly was most in control of, like, not letting Amanda off the hook at all because it's fucked up what she did. But like, yeah, you could at least be like, okay, she got out of divorce.

And I don't know. Maybe she's not thinking clearly where we're watching a whole season of West. Lead on Sierra again, which is why when we're covering this season, I told you guys, like, I don't buy this shit. Like, it doesn't feel authentic.

And, but yet, here's a guy still, like, fucking with someone's heart. Where Sierra clearly was just like, yo, like, this isn't nothing to me. This is real to me.

And West, clearly stating that he was, like, in control of his feelings.

Where he's like, I don't want her to get hurt again. Which I thought was this, like, a fucked up thing to say at the time. But like, it really goes to show, like, his mindset. Anyways, there's so much to get into Carlos. I want to, what are your just general thoughts around what's going on?

And one of the most interesting topics about the story that you, you are, are thinking about.

“Well, look, I think universally I agree with you, right?”

I think West is kind of getting off the hood. But so we need to unpack that. The biggest thing, though, that I am hearing from the audience, as well, is a fact that, girl coat is something that is so sacred. Female friendships, female camaraderie,

and that was something that we saw with Sierra the Mandak. Is one of those things where, like, girls know that guys are going to be guys. And it's sort of expected for a guy to be a tool, right? For a guy to be a douche, for a guy to be an egghold. But when it comes to girls, is one of those things where I do understand

why a lot of people do feel like a Mandak. You did break girl coat at the end of the day. Is this as big as what happened with Ariana and, you know, Tom? No, because there were in a tinge relationship, and it was happening behind her back in the home.

The shit was disgusting. This one is different because we were led to believe that this friendship was real. And if that's the case for you to sleep with your girl's man, despite the fact that you guys are broken up, it's a man that is the villain.

Sierra is the victim, obviously. But West definitely is sort of getting off the hook, only because the focus has been on the betrayal. Yeah. Well, you know, and then I want to back up a little bit and discuss,

“like, I think a lot of people are talking about this joint statement, right?”

And there's not a lot of clarity right now. Like, our West and a Mandak in love, because now in our talk, like, they have to get married. Yeah. Like, the only way this girl's like,

it's any way makes sense. Mandak has to be like, I know I ruined this friendship, but this was like, he is the love of my life. I'm pregnant with all of his children. We are getting married.

Like, it has to be in game. This can't be something that lasts two, three months. Like, it can't be a situation ship. It's just like your heart. It has to be worth it.

Right? Because like, do we all agree that how this relationship plays out West and Amanda? Because, you know, right now we're overreacting right now. Everyone's just like freaking out because we can't believe it's true.

But like, and there's a lot of discourse about like, you know, people's character. Like, how could they do this? Like, how did this all go down? But like, you guys were breaking news.

Oh, what? Let's go on. Oh, summer house. This is reported by page six. Summer house star West Wilson was in an exclusive relationship

with another woman when a Mandak tool of romance was exposed. Well, look. I mean, it's, it's not surprised there. Yeah. It is publicly referred to as Montana girl.

And I am sure that there will be several more. They'll probably more. But like, yeah, but how this, if they ended up getting married and have kids and lived happily forever, we would, it would be easier long term to digest.

But the fact that it's looking more more like these two made a joint statement like while being in a situation ship, and like not even being exclusive, it really makes it, it really gives it an achy feeling of like how careless and reckless

and how much they, the mental gymnastics they had to do to justify how they moved,

knowing that they were going to ultimately like fuck over Sierra

and in a way that like Carlos, I know like you've talked a lot about just like these relationships on TV, the inauthenticity sometimes that they are and things like that. But no matter what, no matter how inauthentic and how close

that was shitty because Sierra over the years,

whatever you thought about her and West or whatever, what she made very clear is that like when this shit gets aired and we are all talking on the show, it's, it's really hard for her. You know, like it's like it's, it's as vulnerable to be on these shows and have people like judge your dating choices

and things like that and they played her for a fucking fool, you know, and it's just like, and she's not, but like it must just be hard to like watch your, even if it's not your best friend, someone who like is like, cool with you, go behind your back and hook up with a guy

that like you like have been vulnerable about over the years and like I've talked about your complicated feelings about the situation and the way they moved it seems so careless and I just, I'm trying to wrap my brain around like how they justified it to each other, West and Amanda.

“And I also just like the big question is, why, why, why the statement now?”

And I want to talk, I want to unpack that as a producer, right?

Who creates shows, work on shows? I need to explain to the public that that was strategic and there were more people involved in that statement, right? You have publics this. Let's be clear, the network had to, you know, be involved in that too,

because it is a hit show. This was rumored over a week, you know, approximately two to three weeks, right? Where we were sort of led to believe that something was going on but everybody remained quiet.

That is because a lot of people from the network, the production company, the public says the cast, they had to rebuild this story in a way that was appetizing for the show, right? What we now know is this.

I do agree with you. I think this was a situation shift. I think the joint statement was not to say, where together as one,

“I think they had to say, we have one shot.”

Our releasing a statement and we have to be aligned with this. Immediately after the last statement was released, the network said they have no intention of picking up cameras for a summer house, but it will get addressed over a year. We have to be reminded too.

There's a spin-off, starring Kyle and Amanda called in the city, right? So this is a big machine that we all have been involved with our various shows, and that's the reason why nothing has truly been leaked

and the shot of Sierra allegedly finding this news out outside of our math in New York City. Listen, this is all for the attention that will drive the viewership for the reunion and the spin-off. Yeah, I've heard that there are receipts,

regarding West and Amanda, and those receipts have been shown or going to be shown to Andy, and it definitely will be discussed. I don't know if we'll see the receipts. I don't know if they're in a position too.

Show us the receipts. You know what I mean? It's just might not be before television, but I believe that... What kind of receipts?

Well, like, are there photos? Well, there was that rumored video. Yeah. Is it in the city filming currently? I think we already filmed it.

That's going to be back to back, right? Yeah, that's already been filmed, because it was filming the summer. And is Sierra in the city, or is she only doing summer house?

And a pile are sort of like believed in the show. And Lindsay, right? Yes. It's going to be bizarre to watch something, because even watching last night's episode,

knowing what's happening now. It's bizarre to watch that. So it's going to be weird to watch a whole other series, knowing that West and Amanda have now been together.

“Like, how are we going to get through a season of not getting the tea on that?”

Yeah. I'm curious, Dylan, where it just has a big fan of this show and someone who's followed it with your perspective. What are the things that you're most fascinated to discuss and learn about?

I mean, just after watching last night's episode, especially seeing how good of a friend Sierra is to Amanda through her,

about to get divorced, basically.

It just shows how good of a friend she is, and especially since they just had that conversation at that restaurant about race, and like watching it back and how Sierra has had to deal with that, and not being as sensitive now to that shows she's not as good of a friend.

The thing that I think Sierra does, that I've seen on the show is when she does like someone she has a hard time, you know, fully committing, and because she doesn't want to get hurt, and that is hard to watch,

because I was kind of rooting for her in West, through this season to get together. I mean, now she's so much better off with Adam, although she's hurting now, she's going to be getting the Ariana treatment, I think.

And I mean, she already posted like a brand deal yesterday, or she was on the carpet interviewing for her. Yeah, with John Hamm. Yes. And number one Sierra defender, Johnny.

Yeah. And if you know, like, it perfect timing, but it's, I wish if I was Sierra's friend, I would have told her earlier, like go harder for West, just like, not that this would have changed anything,

but what do you mean by go harder for West?

Because she's always kind of keeping him at arms length,

and if she... Thank God. Just put it in. Yeah. It's so hard.

But yeah. It's not that this would have changed anything, but before this happened, I was just watching, like, oh, like, if you like him,

“you have to go a little bit harder for it, you know?”

Yeah. But he was West was like, when you, that's what I'm saying. Like, you watch this season back. He's just giving classic fuck boy,

where it's just like 100. He likes the flirt with her. It's a fun, banty relationship. He likes, he likes that she's mean to him, and stuff like that.

But like, yeah. He just treated it like it was a game, you know? Like it was like this, like, and he does this whole like, you know, sheepish.

I don't love with her. Yeah.

But like, I just don't think he was never in West as like,

it was never his plan to really pursue it. And like, then he played the whole like, well, I really care about Sierra, and I don't want to do this to her again. And when, for him to be able to acknowledge that,

in his mind, there's no scenario where he's going to be sad if it doesn't work out. But acknowledges that she could be like, he's acknowledging how much power he feels he has in that dynamic. Yeah.

By by saying that. And it's just like,

“I'm just at what point to this relationship with Amanda start”

is like, a lot of people are questioning now. Because a couple weeks ago, when Kyle was getting drunk and he was like, fuck you a man or whatever. And we all like, oh, West,

wait, actually stand up to Kyle. There was a moment where Amanda walked past him, and he kind of like put out his hand. And I remember being like, I don't know,

maybe Kyle and Amanda are not in good terms. But like, if a guy touched my girlfriend or wife in a caressing way, there was intimacy in that hand grab that West had with Amanda.

That wasn't just like some like, hold on. It was, it was a very... They shared to when Remy Wolf sweatshirt. Yeah.

And now you're going back. And you're seeing a lot of people point out that there's like, there seems to be this intimacy between West and Amanda that we didn't clock before. Which I kind of have forgiveness for up until now.

But watching it, I was kind of like rooting for their friendship because I'm like, she needs somebody right now. Like seeing how their relationship was so volatile.

And I'm curious what Carlos's take is on this because like watching it back, a part of me is wondering like, do they know they're getting divorced while the season is unfolding?

And they're just like holding out for the season to end knowing that we've got a spin-off show coming. Like do you think there's any chance that they kind of knew that that was happening? And they were just hanging onto the last

little bit of this relationship

“or do you think I'm curious like how real it probably was?”

Yeah, I mean, look. In order to drive viewership to a spin-off of this magnitude, you need the audience to enter it with something that they've been following.

So yeah, I think they probably did have some idea that this wasn't going to work. Let's, I'm not going to work. Let's slowly, you know, showcase the sort of end of this so that we give people reason to tune in

to the spin-off and to sort of see how we're able to handle this. I definitely think that I think look, I think Amanda West were messing around for a much longer than people are realizing

and I think this. When it comes to reality stars especially in the Bravo universe, it is like one big holiday. You know what I mean?

It's like one big college. There's a fraternity. This is a wordy. And then those two mix, you know how to kick party.

And that's what we look up. You know, Ashley Darby, who can go with people on some of my house. And you know, you hear all of these stories. Again, not making excuses for all of this,

but I don't believe for one second

that this is a real relationship. I think Carl and Amanda for sure are going to be something real, but I definitely think there's layers to this because as a producer,

you have to tell the story in a way that makes sense for the finale, but also for the premiere of a spin-off that is taking your two stars on this other journey. Now, you know, we watch somewhere house last night.

It felt like I was watching a rerun from a couple years ago. It just felt so outdated with this news, right? And like here we are just like still like getting

into the little Kyle and Amanda divorce. It already was like, we already knew they were divorce or separated at least. And so yeah, it was interesting watching it back. But now we're like, now we see Amanda

already in another relationship or situation ship or whatever it is with West.

I mean, obviously people are going to watch

summer house, but they're not going to be watching summer house for the show that they made. You know, I get him curious as a producer. How would you feel working on this show? Knowing that like, yeah, I mean,

we're going to, people are going to watch, but no one's really going to be paying attention to anything else. Other than West and Amanda. Just agree. No, the thing is Nick,

“you have to think bigger picture, right?”

Summer house is a popular show, but by no stretch of the imagination is it as big as summer housewives? Is it as big and even band-up home rules? So as a producer,

this is a gold mine, because the thing is this, you have your lawyer audience. That's going to watch in regardless. But you also have millions of people

who have never seen summer house.

Don't know what the fuck is going on between this the camera man, the West situation. That is now going to tune in to be like, I don't want thumb up. And I am going to watch this.

It's the reason why I think about it. The statement was released the day the show was airing hours later. They knew they had to get this out because to your point.

The episodes were watching obviously is dated, but they also knew we have to give people hooked. Tell you what's going to happen. We're all going to rewatch other seasons, Nick.

To make sure we're caught up at the time of reunion airs. And I bet you,

“the reunion is going to be the highest rated ever.”

I was going to make the same point that he did about them releasing the statement on the day of the show. They know it's going to get. And it's the same thing how I was saying

how I got into Vanderpump rules with scandal. Yeah. This is going to be what pulls people into summer house. Especially to with also just the more that giggly squad blows up to

with like page disorder. But when Hannah Burner getting that TV show you're going to be polar, it's like all this stuff. They can watch from like the start of how all these people are where they are now.

So true. Do you think that they are going back and changing their edits for the next couple of episodes before we get reunion

and completely kind of show us more of West and Amanda? I think that's a huge possibility because the thing is this. Depending on when the reunion is going to happen,

they do have enough time and post-production to add things in. Let's let's think about it. When Dr. Wendy and Eddie were arrested, we all of a sudden started to see more scenes

of Wendy talking about how much money she spent on renovating the house and hearing her daughter talk about, I got three bones, you know? So yeah, I do think that's a world to where

you're going to see more of things that sort of less us in like the nuances that they may have found in those footage is. That's interesting.

You bring that up Carlos because honestly, for the life of me, and I guess what you mean by how much the network was probably involved in releasing this statement, I'm pretty sure I've heard enough people tell me

“that I think West and Amanda got PR together.”

They were getting outside help outside of the network. But like Dylan, I think you were mentioning it. But like Amanda also the same day released this kind of campaign with this clothing/week company.

Like they posted, like the morning, like yesterday morning, they posted this camp, like premiered it. And then they replaced her. And Amanda must have known

that this campaign was coming out and it, I before see thinking about the network, I was like, what, and what, why would she not give them a heads up and why would they release it this day?

It was almost like to do you think, for the, for Dylan or Carlos or Susie, I'm curious, do you guys, it just seems like they didn't realize or they underestimated the potential backlash

or maybe they, because it just, it almost feels like they didn't think it was gonna be that bad. I don't know because like why would you, that's what I think,

release a campaign on the same day. Or the campaign, the brand is diabolical for what they did because to take her, to post her photo, take it down, replace her with a regular model

or whoever that was. Like if I were an influencer or a, like Amanda or somebody like that in somebody did that to me, like diabolical, like you do not stand beside me. Like we're not,

we're never working together again

which they're probably not working with her either, but I just thought that was such a like slap in the face. One thing to take it down, another thing to replace her with somebody else, I was like, or, or they knew about it,

and they were like, great, release it. And we have a, we have a plan as well to, amp our brand up because people are talking about it, but I thought that was so diabolical to Amanda.

I, I think it was all strategic. I definitely think, because when you have a scandalous magnitude, you definitely have brands contacting your management, your public is saying,

what the fuck is going on? You know, and everybody's semi-automally saying, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. I do think they realize that listen,

all presses good press. What we saw in Jill Xaryn made that abhorrent comment during the Super Bowl and how Xaryn fabrics, you know, posted a picture of Jill Xaryn on their Instagram page with the ex on top of it.

You know, to drive the traffic,

“I think all of these businesses understand the power”

of social media. So I do agree they knew this was coming, and they were playing along with the attention that it'll drive, because listen, if they did not do this,

we would not be talking about that brand today. But it does make me like sick to my stomach, because I feel like this is just how it worked.

Like women just are always regardless going to get

the shit end of the stick, and like she did not commit a crime. Like she was a shitty French, she did a shitty thing, and like she's going to have to live with that for the rest of her life,

and she's going to have to either try to like mend her relationship with Sierra, or completely lose that friendship. And like that's something she has to live with. But to like have brands pull sponsorships,

like, and then you have Dakota from Secret Lives in Mormon Wives, he just got a new reality TV show. And literally. How true is that?

How are these two things able to co-exist and happen at the same time? Like West is not West is going to be fine. He's going to continue to do his podcast, and do his thing.

He'll be a sports journalist, and he'll get his brand deals, but like opportunities are being ripped out of Amanda's hands, and it's like wild to me. I think that's true,

but unfortunately it's just like, this is a nasty business that we're in, and the audience drives the sentiment, you know?

Like the fact that we're calling it Scamanda,

and not something that's centered around West, tells you that the internet thinks that Amanda's the top sign of all. And I think that's an interesting, because a discussion,

I think we can hide. I mean, I don't see a world, again, to me, Amanda,

I don't know, girl code like, Susie, or you do,

“and obviously that's an important thing,”

but like, I do have at least some grace for Amanda, and the sense that like, there's no justification. Like again,

they just have to be worth it. Like it's the only way, it better be worth it. Like you better marry the guy, you know?

Because now your character is in question of how you show up for your friends, or how you don't show up for your friends. But you know,

it isn't interesting to see how this plays out, too,

because if like, West, what I've heard, how this season ends, or continues to go on,

just from online stuff, is that they, West and Sierra do end up getting kind of together, or they start like, I don't think so.

There's something like that. So it's like, it'll be, I'm hoping that the, it changes more on West,

on Amanda. Also what you said earlier, Nick is give her a little bit of grace. She just got out of this 10 year roller coaster of a relationship with a guy that isn't great,

and she's, you know, getting back into it, what she did with shitty and messy, but yeah,

like it no way makes it what she did to Sierra. Okay, it's just more like to your point down. And it's like, you can at least be like,

alright, so that she hasn't been in the dating world in a while, Carlos, you know that like this, when you're,

once you're in this kind of real ITV bubble, like it, you just become, it's like you're in high school again. You,

you have a hard time connecting with like people outside of your bubble, like people aren't relating to your experiences. And so here you have Amanda, who's only known like Kyle for 10 years. It's been her whole life.

And then she like, you know, befriends this kind of affable goofy, you know, good looking,

you know, six foot west, and it's just like, I do think Amanda was a little vulnerable,

“and I think West took advantage of that vulnerability.”

Like again, and no way lets her off the hook of what she did to Sierra as a friend. And like, I do think she, she's going to get a shit ton of criticism.

And she deserves the criticism. But to me, West was way more in control. And, and I don't see how you give him any grace,

because again, like now we're hearing like all these other women are coming out of the woodwork, and he's just, he's just kind of, it's crazy.

He's a, fuck boy. Yeah. I think what really pisses me off about West's positioning in this, is that just because he benefits from low expectations,

just because he is a fuck boy does not mean he gets to treat someone. Sierra, the way he has been treating her, of making an entire story line on his show, directed around this will day won't they,

this pining, this like I might be in love with her, kind of like bullshit now that we see. Just to like go around and fuck with her best friend, it's like,

yeah, you can have low expectations for a man, because at the end of the day,

But it's like,

there's a difference between that man being like,

how a man's going to treat you in romance and like, how a man's going to treat you as a friend. And like, you know, you really just think that someone is going to be a better friend to you,

and you really, obviously you expect better from Amanda,

“and that's why Amanda is getting all the heat in this,”

but it's like West, like, get fucked, honestly. Like,

kidding me, for TV, you see how she gets treated on the show. You see how the audience treats her. You see the conversations around it,

and you still go ahead and do that, because your cloud is more important than your friendship with her, and it pisses me off. Yeah. I mean,

the beginning of every season too is West, and the car up to the Hampton, it's being like, well, we haven't talked in a few months,

but like, I really like her, and it's like, well, if you this was real,

and you really did have those true feelings, you do it off the show too. I mean, as a normal human. Yeah.

You know, the person, right? But what is interesting, because I've seen people,

you know, like everyone's having this discourse about like, how does this compare to scandal,

“and then you had other people wanting to downplay all of it,”

because it's like, if you're like an OG reality TV fan, like, and you watch Vanderpom from the beginning, you saw Christ and Doty in Jack's hookup,

when Jack's was, was dating Stasi. But like, what made scandals so intense, and garnered all these people's interest

in why I think summer house does the same, is like, we're talking about adults. We're talking about 30 something else. Like we're not talking about like 21,

22 year old messy people. If you guys go turn on Southern hospitality right now, they're doing this shit on the regular. You know, it's like,

it's a different thing. It's like, it's a really good shove. If you're not watching, you should watch.

But like, we're talking about a group of people who should be above this type of really sloppy behavior, and they should be more considerate with these like relationships in friendships,

and you know, like, when you get older, you realize that like, you know,

real friends are hard to come by, and you value that more. And so the fact that you have this going on, with people who are in their early 30s, that I think that's what's so like,

fascinating for a lot of people, because you expect more from these people, you know? Yeah.

And that's the reason why we always have to look at

as good the lens up. They're in a bubble. Yeah.

“And that's why it's not normal for the average human”

to sleep with their girls man. It's just, it doesn't happen sure, but not at the volume to where you're seeing and I wanted to get back to what Natalie was saying too,

because it is a, it is a big point of contention on TikTok when it comes to how women are being dragged for making this mistake. We've saw with Rachel,

Rachel hasn't worked since, right? Tom Sandeball did a box, you know, competition show,

and he also was on the House of Villains. And trainers. And you know, I was watching the whole place. The whole,

yeah, the whole Coldplay scandal. And the woman said, how she got fired, the company asked her to leave,

and she understood that, but she hasn't worked since the Coldplay scandal. However, the guy has been offered four jobs. And it's really to me,

a study of, and the woman, the Coldplay scandal is woman. So she said how, she had no idea how much women hated other women in this scenario.

And I do think there is something to be said about how women are treated differently when it comes to a scandal of extramarital affairs, or any sort of like scandal like this, opposed to men. West is going to work.

And it's going to be seen as a high guy on the cover GQ. Yeah, maybe it's because we just expect so little of them. I don't, of men are, yeah, he benefits from low expectation.

Low expectation. It's like the whole idea of like weaponized incompetence with men. It's like, that's what West is doing, but with his like heart.

Yeah. And it's just like, that's not an excuse. No. Like,

that is not an excuse to treat people poorly. I saw someone tweet about this and I told it. Like, remember two readings ago, when the first in West and Sierra drama happened.

Yeah. And West kind of clamped up like very sheepish. He almost like, didn't know what to say. Had nothing to say.

It was kind of awkward. And so much so that he had to address it post-reunion. Like, like, what is he going to say now at this reunion?

Like, Well, he can have Amanda speak for him and make a joint statement. Yeah. Or he,

but he, he does that all the time. I mean, even on last night's episode when he's talking to Kyle and confronting them at the table,

he like, he can't look him in the eyes.

He's always just looking down.

He's like, you know, always trying to do what he thinks is the right thing. And very, I think,

aware of how the audience will perceive. Interesting. And that's my take on it. I mean, It does spend a lot of time on those outfits.

Yeah. Here's, I'm curious,

Carlos and Susie and Mary.

“This is just the beginning of how we dissect this drama”

and how we go back and what we question, you know, all these people's motives. So like, big question is when did this start?

How long has this been going on? We also expect much longer than we realize. Not too long ago, West started posting some political takes, which I thought was new for him.

You know, and I remember saying to the team, I go, it feels performative to me. We live in a culture now that if people agree with us

on certain topics, we will like, we will go to the ends of the earth to try to justify the behavior because we consider them like,

an ally, literally a literal ally. And morally good. And it just makes you kind of wonder, why do this guy a couple months ago

start like spouting off his political point of view

when you never heard it from him before?

You know, maybe, maybe that's a coincidence. I don't know. It's not a coincidence.

I think is, I think it's just that I think, listen, we have to understand. West is not alone in his home,

like the average citizen. He has a team.

“They all knew this was going to come out weeks before”

it came out yesterday. So all of that is a part of the strategy in terms of, do I believe he believes that? Sure.

But why all of a sudden are you now using a platform to address that? Because the thing was this, they knew that they had to do whatever it takes to make it seem like he's a good guy

that made a bad mistake. And that's the narrative that he and his team want to give us. Yeah. Yeah.

And it's just like, I'm curious how Amanda is going to, Carlos would be interested in your take on like, how Amanda is going to go forward playing this because it's like,

she doesn't have the same like, people are going to forgive West because they expect that from him. And we've obviously talked about like the misogyny and going into the way Amanda is being treated.

But it's like, she still is on bravo. It's not like a Rekel situation where she's just going to kind of like go away and she wasn't even that big of a fixture in Vanderbilt

from the same way that like Ariana, sand of all her. Yeah. I'm curious like, where does Amanda go from here?

Well, the thing is this, her reputation is staying for quite a bit. I'm just going to like lay it out. Mm-hmm. The harsh reality for Amanda is this

is going to be a couple of years before people really start to see you outside of this candle. The best thing that she should do and this is what I tell my reality stars when they're caught up in a scandal,

she has to own it. She has to own it. She has to let us in on what went into this. If she kept this a secret from Sierra for so long, it was doing this behind her back.

That's fucked up, but she has to own it. There's nothing worse than people making excuses. You know, again, to not to bring up Jill Zand again, but for Jill Zand to say,

well, Dan, I've got to give me a chance to apologize. It's like, excuse me? You recorded it, hit up low. Made a caption. Yeah.

I'm sorry. When I give you great to make an apology. So I think for Amanda look,

I have never seen a woman go through this

that they came out a bit unscathed within two years. It's going to take more than two years. Wow.

“The reunion two, I think, is going to be worse on Amanda than West.”

Because Sierra is going to be like, I'm not surprised by you. Like, you know, she's going to be way more hurt by the friendship. Amanda has overall a pretty clean slate. I think from her time on summer house.

I mean, she's put up with Kyle, but I don't know, at least from what I remember, she's always had like, she's come off pretty well. Yeah.

Yeah. So this is a big way to come on. Unfortunately for Amanda to all your points is that Amanda is guilty of doing some of the most triggering things that like women can do to other women.

You know? Yeah. That's a good point. And you know, we can sit here and say like West deserves way more attention and criticism.

But, you know, the snake and the grass kind of vibes you feel, you know, it's a bummer. Because yeah, because you imagine West, you know, if you're Sierra, you don't even want to validate your feelings towards West, right?

Like, and I will say like, I think what's kind of say nice about the scandal. But it like, this is not Taylor Frinky, Paul Batcher, at scandal in the sense that like, honestly, it's fascinating as we are.

It's hard to talk about. They're like, there's kids involved. There's some like, you know, people really struggle with some mental health problems. We're worried about the parties involved.

You know, there's a clear hierarchy of like, who are who we have empathy for Sierra, who are rooting for Sierra, who are, you know, we're kind of debating the West

in a man of who deserves more criticism. No one really cares about Kyle right now.

At the same time, Sierra's already out there

living her best life. You know, she did that friends and neighbor premier. It was the iconic moment. We're all rooting for her to have a Ariana Maddox treatment. We imagine she's going to her star is about to blow up.

And so like we, we can have sympathy for her, but no, at the end of the day, she's going to be okay. And I think we're all kind of rooting for her

to be unbothered when it comes. You know, because it's one of those moments where you like you, you fuck around with someone. You don't know why you keep giving them attention. And then something happens when you go,

you know what, what the fuck is I doing? Like what I'm like, this is, this is I should have known better. Now I see it fucking clearly, but with the Amanda of it all,

there's just so much more for Sierra unpacked and you're, I kind of agree with you guys. I think it's just like it's, it's just going to make more sense for her to be harder on Amanda

because like why give West that attention. Yeah, I also just, I really feel for Sierra because it's like, obviously she's, she is going to be okay.

This would be a blessing in disguise. It is a day. Yeah, and as far as her career is concerned,

“this is the best thing that could happen.”

As far as her heart is concerned, like I just, listen, like I think a lot of us have been in situations obviously not on TV, but like, you know, your friends don't show up

for you in the way you want to in those situations and you get fucked over. Yeah. And it's just like, for Sierra to be kind of stuck in this world

where she's still working, she's still us to see them. She's still us to like, you know, have chemistry with all of these people. You know, it's not going away.

She can't go away from it. She has the off season. Thank God to kind of like process this. But it's like she's coming right back and just has to like,

go back into this environment. And there's nowhere for her to go. And I just like, you know, Amanda was like an emotionally safe person for her in that house.

And it just like, yeah, just sucks that she doesn't have that anymore. And my heart goes out to her for that.

“I think Nick made a really good point about,”

he said something about how Amanda did the one thing that kind of triggers people. And I feel like what you're saying as well, how as viewers like, you become so emotionally invested while watching

so many of us have been in that position where you like somebody. And they lead you on a little bit,

but they're actually never taking you serious.

And to be betrayed by somebody that has been there for you showing up for you during that time, and kind of been like the pat on the back. Like it's going to be okay. You don't deserve this or, you know,

supporting you and then that person betrays you. I mean, it is a very like unique scenario, but also like so common. And it's like the most volatile feeling when you're experiencing it and the hatred

and like the disgust you feel for. Honestly, not the person who's been the guy or, you know, in my case it would be like the guy. Like you kind of expect it. You're like, you're a douchebag.

I don't know why I was so into you, but like you're my friend and you were like, petting my head when I was crying drunk on the bathroom floor about it. Yeah, it's like you're mourning the friendship.

Not the crush. Right, exactly. Yeah, it reminds me of the thing I say all the time. Like when it comes to loyalty. Loyalty's one of those things that everyone says they are.

You know, like are you loyal to like, of course, of course.

“Some loyal, like why wouldn't you why wouldn't I be loyal?”

But as you get older, you learn that there's very few people in your life that you can assume they're loyal to you. Like they're loyal to you until like it's a conflict of interest. Like they're loyal to you until the same person. They're loyal to you until it's just like, well,

you know, like I can't support this type of behavior. You know, whatever it is, it's so easy for people for us to justify why we shouldn't be loyal in this moment. And usually that comes down to like, you know, different agendas or, you know, when our when our interest on a line anymore.

And yeah, I think this is a perfect example of like why loyalty is far rare than people like recognize. I think Sierra's intuition is really strong too overall, which is why she kept West at the arm's length. Mm-hmm.

And you know, she never would have seen this coming from Amanda.

Oh my gosh. To have someone pull pull one over and you like when I, I think back to the last time I was cheated on, which was several years ago. But it was it came at such a shock.

But this is very similar where I agree unless Sierra knew, but I agree, I don't think she's not coming, but to have somebody literally pull an over on you. It is such a disorienting experience. And it makes you question your own like ability

to read a situation and coming from a friend. It feels so much worse than coming from a situation chip. I don't, I don't know why, but it's like so much more painful and scary. You know, your friends are supposed to be forever. These guys, you know, are kind of coming go.

Who do you think made the first move? Oh, I think West. I think West. Or as for sure. Well, yeah.

I don't, I think West like knew that she needs a nice guy in the moment and Amanda got like the nice attention that, you know, she's been craving that Kyle was not giving her. And that's also why I like I said give Amanda a little bit of grace. I think she's getting played a little bit.

But he's in a relationship. When you say it like that, West had a front row seat to like seeing what Amanda needed to feel comfort and support and validation. He's chasing after her like the last couple episodes. Yeah, he'll daughter. And so for this to go down this way, it's like it's more, it's gets itchier and itchier the more you think about it.

Because again, not okay that Amanda from whatever she said to Sierra behind either on camera or interviews or behind closed doors that made Sierra feel like Amanda was a Frenchy could trust. That's fucked up and she's going to have to like deal with that.

But if this is like West making the first move and he has a front row seat to like how Amanda needs comfort.

And he gives her that comfort in a way that like crosses a line of intimacy. Only for Amanda to be left as the one who's the most vilified and he kind of gets away kind of clean. It's you know, I doubt you're going to have a lot of men come forward being like, I was also hooking up with Amanda when this was going on like we're hearing about it. Yeah, I don't think she plays that way.

“Yeah, is there an opportunity to give a little bit of sympathy for Kyle in this moment?”

Sure. I think there is a part of me. I think I was like, I don't know if it was hard on him a few episodes back but watching and I was like he's such a dick and like, I didn't actually say that. But I think that was like the sentiment of like we have of course Amanda's acting this way. Like you've been treating her so poorly blah blah blah, but honestly seeing last night's episode and hearing the stressor of like millions of dollars on the line.

I've never had millions of dollars up against my name and not that it ever justifies treating your partner poorly.

But I think we've all like I know that I've been in a situation where I've had high stress and I've like taken it out of my parents. I feel so guilty and so awful after it's because I'm like you don't understand and you're just like you get a little bit sassy or whatever, but I can't imagine being in his position. I'm not justifying how he's treated her, but I do feel like he's like completely out of the conversation and I do have like a lot of like sympathy and empathy for him after hearing the financial stresses of lover boy.

And now hearing like it is that is his wife like that is his ex wife that is hooking up with one of his best friends and that also is very heavy along with everything going on with lover boy. What do you think, Dylan?

“My thought on it, I think everyone deserves like respect so I feel for Kyle in the moment if he hadn't had all these rumors about him cheating with.”

I want to hand it like I would have a little more sympathy for him. I also think Kyle's out of the conversation because he hasn't said anything. I think it takes. If he wants to start playing into it, I think you would be more involved. But I do understand what you're saying as well. I just Kyle says own worst enemy. Yeah. I agree with that Dylan to the extent that like as it stands now from what we know from watching the show or what they've said or not said, I'm not like out there being like house Kyle.

I guess is what I'm trying to say. I'm worried. Now, if there's more to the story that Kyle adds context to, it's not going to make what he said okay, but there might be a lane where you're like, oh well I fuck. Everyone has to limit. You know, type of thing.

I saw a tweet basically saying something like, oh Kyle saying fuck you to Amanda after she chose to keep hanging out with West that night.

Like, like, hits different now. Now again, like if Kyle was respecting something else going on then and maybe they if they were hooking up then like literally behind his back and in front of his face, I guess then maybe. But I don't think it would be smart for Kyle to in any way justify his behavior as a result of of what Amanda did or didn't do. Yeah, I mean, I feel for Kyle in the way that he's about to be a level of divorced guy that we have not seen on probable in a minute. If it was me producing Kyle coke, I would say lean into that because like he needs to be DJing steely down.

He needs to be like he needs to be less like club guy and more just like, well, the consequences of my actions.

“Don't let's keep going like that's I think that's how like Kyle wins back kind of like some sort of hub sort of and.”

Yeah, yeah, it's just being like, yeah. Yeah, no, this listen, this is the best thing like a half of the aisle. Yeah, because it it Kyle has a big opportunity to change the narrative in terms of how he's viewed and to have this sort of I hate to say the word, but they have this gem. Fall into his lap in order to now take this and in sort of like appear to the audience as a man who is only his mistakes and what he did and and what would make him win.

Like that was shocked everybody. You're expecting to be upset in angry, but I think if he says, I wasn't the best man for you.

And perhaps a year in your need of support this man took advantage of you, not of course sexually, right, but just took advantage of your emotional state. If he's able to talk to that way and take ownership there, I think Kyle has a lot of room to be viewed as the audience has somebody that they will support. Yeah, well, and I think he's maybe already starting to do that because he was on watch what happens live not too long ago and Andy asked him straight up. Do you believe these rumors in Kyle was like, I don't think they're true and then and he's like, but if they're true, how like what will you think and basically Kyle said like, you know, I'll support Amanda.

Yeah, he's he's already kind of following your advice Carlos, so I think that's probably no he listens to reality between two. Yeah, he's a raindrop. I did see something that was hilarious. The butterfly effect of Kyle cooks DJ career because like they probably get divorced anyways, but if he doesn't become a DJ and he like changed his course and decides to become a good husband like this this scandal might not have ever happened, you know.

Yeah, yeah, it is like it is there is a thing with Kyle where it's like, yeah, this is kind of like the content like he basically you kind of see it in the show and maybe it's the edit but it seems a little bit like he's kind of like driving Amanda into west arms. Yeah, that's so true because Jesse's busy.

Yeah, I will say how all this I'm just happy it isn't Jesse because I couldn't do more.

I see him enough on the TV that it's this was the scandal and he was getting he would be writing songs. It would be like, oh my God, you would be in the studio.

“I saw I saw a tweet that was like Jesse Solomon, you need to get out of the studio and in with Amanda.”

This is here again. I saw that. At least Jesse asked permission. I saw that too. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. But again, it's just like, I just hope Sierra can come out of this being like, fuck these people.

You guys are not my true friends, obviously like I am a person.

I am not just a prop for you guys to like have all of your situations. Yeah. It's kind of what it feels like and she just deserves so much better than that. She does. And that's the tough position she's in, right?

She is a character on this show. It's part of her job to kind of lean into these narratives. You know, again, like we talked about it with the Taylor Frankie Paul. Like there's, you know, there's sometimes things that is really TV stars. We're like, you know, fuck it.

Fine, sure, I'll do it. I'll do it. I'll take it for the fucking team. I know I'm going to get a little bit of heat. I wouldn't normally do this.

You know, this is not who I am. But I'll, I'll fucking do it.

“And for the most part, it's, it's mostly in consequential, right?”

But to the degree that Sierra has been a team player. Only for this to result in her being played. And, and, you know, she's not a fool. But like, I think people made her out to, I'm sure she feels that way right now where she feels like she should have known better.

She feels like she should have not trusted certain people. And that just, you feel like that ego. It feels foolish, right? And like, we've, we've heard from Sierra in the past about like what bothers her. And she is like rightfully like, she has a lot of pride in how she carries herself.

You know, and how she moves, right? And I, you know, the thing that she seemed most upset about West and the past is like, how he went on the public and like, spoke on her name and a way that was like, I don't do that to my friends, right? And so I feel like the people she's calls friends or even her co-workers are moving

in a way that she doesn't move and she's communicated like that's not how I roll. And it's like, Pete, they haven't respected how she's communicated that. And, and now she probably feels like foolish for trusting these people in a way that, like, we would all feel foolish if we were in her position.

“Yeah, and that's what makes her so relatable.”

Look at it. Sierra deserves. If not more, the same success areing on a guy, right? Because, you know, the thing is she spoke about race recently on the show. Yeah.

And really, you know, most honest about her experience with the, with the, with the, with the cast and how the Bravo audience, which we, we all have experience, the Bravo fan base good or bad, right? They are extremely opinionated and they won't stop until they feel like they got your attention. So she has snouper through a lot of emotional turmoil outside of this scandal, right?

She was already going to do something that we saw on the show. And that's the reason why for me, she deserves so much success in the sense of,

not only a girl code, not only of douchebag guys,

but also being a black woman over reality television, and how the audience perceives you and being to deal with this. You know, so my hope for her is, in fact, that she's able to really take this and really make something out of this and be a spokesperson, get brand deals, be a brand ambassador.

She's gorgeous to look at. She's so smart. And I just think she has the ability to really be one of the main stays on the network. Yeah, no, I agree. I agree with all that.

It is crazy that you already start seeing the internet trying to justify how to minimize Sarah being upset. You know, it's just like, oh, well, like whatever they dated three years ago, or blah, blah, blah, blah, like that's kind of fucked up. But yeah, I think she's going to be a huge star.

I think this will. And that is because she obviously has the qualities of a star, right? Like, Carlos, you know, there's a lot of people who have star qualities. It doesn't work. It doesn't pop for them, right?

You know, like sometimes it's a little bit of luck. It's a little bit of timing.

“And then at the end of the day, you have to have the talent.”

She also know who she is. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And she's this way easy to root for.

Dylan, curious what, what are some of the things as we, I'm sure this will all. We'll continue to talk about this, you know, the rewings coming up. But what are some of the things that your most curious and learning more about as this story unfolds? I mean, definitely seeing how they do edit Western Amanda for the rest of the season. I was going to say earlier, like, they kind of set it up to make it look like Ben was going to be the one that was to sweep Amanda off her feet.

And obviously that isn't the case.

I'm going to be seeing Sabrina who just kind of is the girl that I think he was always on.

Like, I think they were already talking and he kind of played it to the camera that he was single. That's my opinion. But I do think just if more gets revealed of when Western Amanda really got together could play a big role in how the long-term effects of Amanda, especially. I mean, I want West to get more of the bad rap from this. But is it going to happen? I don't know.

First Sierra, this is kind of jumping ahead a little bit. I know there's been a lot of discussion at who's going to be the next bachelor at. And I think this could be a possible slam dunk. Yeah, I mean, I know more Higgins has been in talks about it. But I think Sierra would be the perfect person because she just seems to be level headed.

“And I think to be a lead, you have to, I mean, you see what happened when you had Taylor Frankie Paul.”

And I don't know if they're going to take another risk like that. Now, I don't know if ABC and Bravo would tie, but there's no way, no. You don't think so? I mean, I was going to say the same thing. Bravo is not, NBC is not.

Like, right now, Sierra is there, I mean, she is so valuable. She is so valuable right now. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. As a viewer. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

No, like, that's it. It's fascinating as fans to think about it. We get into the contracts, Sierra's contracts with NBC, they have the rights to her. They would have to give and, you know, Disney the permission. Also, like, to be honest, if you're Sierra, like, you don't need that shit.

What you want to, you want to, you want a bunch of casting directors cast a bunch of, like, fucking guys for her that, like, maybe she's into a couple. And then at the deal with the nastiness that is bachelor nation. Like, that's the last thing I want for Sierra.

“I know as fans, I think she would be a fantastic bachelor at.”

I mean, honestly, like, what you know about what we love about our bachelor at, like, Sierra would be fantastic. But like, there's this no world in which that would or could happen. And honestly, I wouldn't want that for Sierra. She doesn't need it.

I don't think they're going to be casting people at her level, you know. And I think that Sierra should host a reality show. Where it's a bunch of, like, douchebag guys getting their come up in. Maybe it's pies in the face, maybe it's like, they have to publicly embarrass themselves. You know, it's like people that have gotten called out for cheating.

Maybe it's other reality, guys. Oh. And that's, and they have to compete for redemption. And Sierra able to do that. That's my pitch.

Second to us, did I like it?

Peacock come talk to me. It would, you know, it is fascinating to think about how much, if Amanda did, and if it was Ben, she hooked up with. We would be selling what's here. Everyone would share.

I know. And it's like, makes you just wonder, like, what was, like, that's the thing. Was it worth it? Like, I mean, I don't want to turn like bash on West here. But like, why of all the people? Like, that was the one person that was, this was going to blow up in your face.

I don't think I really don't think they saw it. How bad it would be. Yeah. Yeah. I'm curious if their friendship really was that special.

Like, devil's advocate.

He was that person that was always kind of sticking up for her, being there for her.

And if she was vulnerable, I can see how that would be really confusing. If you're like, finally coming out of something that's super bad for you. Really talks that you've been struggling for years. And then you're like, here's this, if it weren't your husband's also good friend. I could see how you would fall into that trap of like, well, he's my guy best friend.

And like, he's always been there for me. Like, maybe he's the one now knowing that he's been seeing other people. I mean, I think we're like Adami. Clearly, safely assume these people were not as close as they let on in real life. These were. You don't, this was show business, not show friends.

I think I don't. I just, maybe I, again, they are friends. They're also co-workers.

“And I, all I'm saying is like, I think this is such a crate.”

I mean, the fact it's just like these are adults who are like, who are like, wife swapping. I mean, you're just like, it's not since high school. Have I been like, you know what? Maybe I find my, my buddy's ex.

It's like that's, it's such a high school. Yeah, so true. And it's just like, especially when you live in New York City. Right. Yeah.

Right. And again, so like, you clearly Amanda and West had to do these like mental gymnastics to, to, to justify it. Right. And while I'm sure they're friends. At some point they had to been like, well, I mean, it's like, you know,

I'm only sea Kyle when we film. Like, you know, they, they must have sold themselves on the, the passion or the, I don't, whatever they felt by, you know, the wrongness of it all. And then they had to been like, you know, like, Maybe Amanda was like, you know, I'm, I'm friends with Sierra through page.

You know, like, it's, they're not as close as I think we believe. Yeah, I, I, I feel that way too. I mean, it is very much like it's giving a coworker situation.

“The only thing that now though I do question is just,”

and Sierra seems to know a lot about the relationship of Kyle and Amanda, which I think they're only getting told off camera when they hang out in the city,

because we never see Amanda and Sierra really talk in depth about.

So I think they became friends through the show, but maybe Amanda also just didn't value that friendship the same. I mean, clearly she didn't. Yeah. No.

Sierra, I do think really valued Amanda's friendship. Well, this, I mean, we're just at the beginning of this. And they're, we'll be talking to each other. Carlos, Dylan, I want to thank you guys for joining us. Carlos, especially you for jumping on last minute.

Dylan, it was great to have you on. Please come back as we, whether it's talking, what housewives are even more about Schamander, or whatever we decide to call it? I do apologize.

Now, I had to step out. I'm honestly not entirely sure,

“but I think she got some bad family news.”

So keep her in your thoughts. I appreciate you guys coming on.

Susie is always married. It's great to be with you guys.

Dylan and Carlos, before we let you go, can you guys let my audience know where they can find you and enjoy all the great content that you're making? You can find me on TikTok, Instagram and YouTube. All Dylan. Now, Bandia and I post funny little skits and sketches.

And how about you, Carlos? Yes, you can come on podcast, reality with the king. On apples, Spotify, wherever you get your podcast, my YouTube channel as well. And I'm all social media platforms at the Carlos King on the score.

Well, I appreciate you guys. Thanks for having this very interesting conversation. And I'm glad we had the two of you to help us with this. We'll appreciate you all listening as well. I don't forget to check out via files,

plus if you haven't already, we will certainly be diving even more deep in this command or whatever the fuck we're going to call it. We will see you next week. Bye-bye.

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