Liège-Bastogne-Liège 2026 Breakdown | THEMOVE

A lawyer knows how to do that in her custody. But yet, she has a lot of time left.

“The best way to do that is to test the devil.”

She said, "Cheezed it, cheezed it, cheezed it." Yet, at some time, she said, "It's a lot of time." She said, "We have a lot of time, we have a lot of time." She said, "We have a lot of time, we have a lot of time, we have a lot of time, we have a lot of time." Today remind me of the 2019 Volta Spania,

where you could... "Premus Roglic wins?" But you're like, "Oh, this is kind of interesting from this young kid.

One in three stages, getting third place, and then 12 months later."

And I don't know if you guys remember, but July of the COVID year of 2020, you've got your wins, the Slovenian time trial championships, and I remember thinking, "That's kind of weird." And then by the time we get to the Tour de France, he's better than Roglic.

So, today, it reminded me I could see the end... I know I've got your one. It's as fourth Leage win, it's as 13th Monument win. I thought I could squint and see the end of the Pagatcha era, if you can believe it today.

If you get right, it was that impressive. Not yet, not yet. Hey, everybody, welcome back to the move. I'm Spencer Martin. I'm here with Johan Reneel, and Georgetown Kempie.

We just watched Leage best on Leage. Tide Pagatcha wins solo for his fourth career title,

13th career monument with Paul, six hours, coming in second,

and Rimecoev and Paul coming in third, you might look at those results and say, "Oh, wow!" That's, did watch Surace, that's probably what I expected. Well, it was a little bit more complicated than that, because at the very beginning of the race, there's a split in the Peloton, potentially a crash breaking things up.

We're not quite sure because it wasn't televised, but Rimecoev and Paul gets in the front group. You'd say, "Break away, but it was a 50 rider move." So, kind of a Pelt two Peloton's. And with 200 K to go, the gap is up to around four minutes.

Pagatcha is team, UA team has to do a lot of work, polling it back. They do catch 'em with 93 K to go. And then, it looks, Yohan, you're gonna say, "It's not that easy. "Look, they run autopilot until a lot of reduce.

"They knew exactly what they wanted to do. "Pagatcha attacks, Paul six Oscows. "And right on his wheel, perfect position. "Matches 'em. "Pagatcha does not get away clean.

"Everybody else has dropped by a shocking amount "and they ride to the final climb where the Rocha Focon "where Pagatcha finally cracks six Oscows. "Wins with the 19-year-old Frenchman coming in second. "And then Evan will pull winning with a dominant sprint

"for third, a minute and 42 seconds behind. "But Yohan, what was your takeaway from this race?" - Well, take away obviously the favorite one. Maybe a little bit, I mean, people are gonna say, maybe a little bit more difficult than expected.

In that aspect that, you know, for once, he did not get clear solo on his attack on a lot of reduce.

“Everybody knows that a lot of reduce is the crucial climb”

where the big selection is made. And it's funny, actually, because it's actually not the longest climb is not the hardest climb,

but it's still at a crucial point.

And so Pagatcha went full gas. The time, three minutes, 45 is the record. I think they went 13 seconds faster than the best time. - Also four. - I Pagatcha, well, I think it was the first guy

to go sub four minutes in the Strava era. And then they broke it by 13 seconds. - Yeah. So, you know, that shows that Pagatcha went full gas and Pagatcha was able to follow.

I think that's the takeaway of today for me is that this young kid, Pagatcha's really has what it takes ultimately got dropped, but you know, I mean, it's the first time since a very, very long time. If we see somebody following Pagatcha,

I mean, you could say, okay, Pagat, follow them on the Podjo and on Cepressa, but you know, you can't compare. You know, these climbs, you can draft things important.

“On a lot of duty, you have to have the power in the legs”

and say, just follow them. So that's very promising for the future. That's my takeaway. I mean, otherwise, you know, as expected, Pagatcha won, his now, would it have fought?

Four days, Bastonia, I think. Four times. So he's won one win away from Eddie Marx's record. So he's getting closer to Eddie Marx with every single race he's winning.

Also third, third, monument in a season, he already did that once. Eddie Marx is the only other rider who won three monuments in one season in during, I mean, he had to keep it at four or five times.

Nobody has ever won four monuments in a season. So, you know, having in mind that Lombardy is still on the menu, you know, if everything goes okay and Pagatcha races Lombardy, he might be the first one ever to win four monuments in one season.

- My takeaway, well, waking up seeing that there was a 50 man

“break away, which apparently from the first stage interviews,”

like Ramco just sort of found himself there and look, racing is so wildly aggressive these days. Like, if you find yourself in a split of 50 guys, when you didn't even really try to be there, like you kind of have to say there and just play the card.

It's like, I know we were talking about on the pre-meaning, the pre-show meetings that like, what was he doing while he didn't break, but he actually just found himself there and is like, okay, now I'm on the offense,

everybody else is on the defense trying to cast back up. He did the right thing, he had to play that card. Secondly, really interesting to see sex, I was like, okay, you can see the guy climbing with the best in the world, dropping the best in the world.

But we're talking about going on Pagatcha's will, 220 kilometers into a race. This completely different than 140k or 150k, which we see in Stadrists is these days. This is a monument, 220k and 40k to go

in a 260 kilometer day. Like, that is a huge indication of how incredibly talented this kid is.

“And yes, he ended up ultimately getting dropped,”

but he made that selection with Pagatcha, which we haven't really seen that at all in the last several years that anybody can say with Pagatcha on the cold of Laira do. So that was really interesting to see him go.

And the top three favorites finished first, second and third.

So kind of predictable in that sense, but the way they got there was unexpected in some ways as well. - Yeah, I mean, it's, we'll talk about Pagatcha's a little bit later, but that second place

is one of the most impressive rides I've ever seen. For a 19 year old to get not only get a podium at a monument, but match Pagatcha, but we were trying to tally up the riders that have matched him when he attacks.

It's a small list. You said you honed Pagatcha in Rambo this year. That's not really even Pagatcha's terrain. Vanderpool last year, sorry, the last year at San Rambo, then hard at Rubev, then hard in Paris,

not even really Pagatcha's terrain. I mean, really the last time if you go back, it's Flanders 2022, Matthew Vanderpool. That's not even really Pagatcha's terrain though. You'd probably have to go back to 2021,

Lee H. Buston Lee H, what he couldn't get away and had to win in the sprint if you can imagine such an indignity happening now.

But this guy getting second after that

is it is unbelievable, especially the speeds they're going up, love or do that. And it's, it actually reminded me today reminded me of the 2019 Valtas Banjo, where you could pre-most Roglic wins.

But you're like, oh, this kind of interesting from this young kid, winning three stages, getting third place. And then 12 months later, and I don't know if you guys

“remember, but July of the COVID year of 2020,”

Pagatcha wins the Slovenian time trial championships. And I remember thinking, that's kind of weird. And then by the time we get to the Tour de France, he's better than Pagatcha or better than Roglic. So today, did reminded me, I could see the end,

I know Pagatcha won, gets his fourth Lee H win, gets his 13th Monument win. I thought I could squint and see the end of the Pagatcha era if you can believe it today, because that was impressive. Not yet, not yet, Spencer.

Not yet. I mean, obviously it is, and Sajas is the real deal, as we say, he's extremely talented, extremely competent, also, and you can really see that Sajas knows what he's doing.

He doesn't want to burn any steps. That's also the reason, because I've heard some comments saying, I'm criticizing, why is he collaborating? On a lot of dudes, Sajas, I can guarantee you, Sajas knew already he was not going to win.

He already was 100%, he was not going to win. He was extremely happy to be there. And from that moment on, what are you going to do? And you just collaborate, I mean, collaborating. Whenever he, whenever Pagatcha slowed down,

he pulled a bit, I mean, and I don't also Pagatcha are new already then, OK, you know, this guy's on the limit. He's pulling, but there's not much left. Today was a clear example of an upcoming huge talent

being there, but then basically being as fixed, exphyseated, how do you say that? Exphyse, exphyse, exphyse, he couldn't breathe. He was out of breath, exphyseated by Pagatcha. I would say, what was it after 247 kilometers?

That's when Pagatcha placed his attack on La Rojo Focon.

And that's something that Sajas has never done.

I mean, yes, he did the World Championships. He did lumber D, but he was never in this position that he had to stay with the favorite. You know, I mean, you could clearly see, I mean, one of the big highlights also, for me,

and then this incredible huge attack

gap with the third and the fourth and the fifth on La Rojo, I mean, it was unbelievable. How big of the gap these guys had already. So from that moment on, it was game over.

“That's how much better these two guys were”

and everybody else. But then, you know, when really everything comes, you know, it's for real on La Rojo Focon. Pagatcha just knew that he was slowly, slowly killing him and you know, accelerated three times.

The third time he found this flow, I would say, you know, he was on the pedals. And then he basically just on in the saddle, just rode away from him and that was an explosion of, I mean, explosion, I mean, yeah, I mean,

in less than a kilometer, he took 30 seconds on Sajas. And you know, hats off to Sajas that he was able to then

recover a little bit and still maintain that second place.

- Yeah, and yes, you say, did get a little bit of heat for collaborating. He did not hesitate if you noticed after La Rojo in some ways, it kind of helped Pagatcha. I went through his splits last year and he had,

you know, like a 12 second gap at the top of La Rojo. This year, it might as well been five miles. Oh, my Lord. They were so far ahead of the chase group at the top. And then he has a guy coming to work with him.

He did it in his interview, Pagatcha said, I thought I might have to outsprin him.

“That's how serious this guy was writing,”

but as you say, Johan, I think if you gave him true serum, he would say he knew he could drop him on the last climb. But I do, I would defend his decision to work because you're gonna get at worst a second place at a monument as a 19 year old.

And there's nothing good for you behind. If he sets on, I mean, I guess in theory, he could have sat on, Pagatcha pulls him to the final climb, probably still drops him though, right? I don't think it changes the outcome at all.

- No, I agree. And also, let's not forget, I mean, you guys said the race was 44 kilometers an hour and we saw, already before the cold of La Rojo, the peloton was small.

I mean, it was what, the 60 guys, like, and that was just guys just getting peeled off from Seabukop pulling for like 70k. And a hundred guys just can't even hold the wheel. So it's just an indication of how fast

they were actually going before they actually hit the climb.

“And that's why at the top of the cold of La Rojo,”

these guys had 30 seconds. Like, it was pretty much dead men walking after that. And even though there was a pretty strong group behind of, you know, Remko and a lot of strong guys, they were just kind of all their matches working on

and they were just kind of crawling to the finish line, so to speak. - Yeah, I mean, 44.4 kilometers average, you know, the previous record was last year was 41.9 kilometers per hour average.

Automatically, I mean, if you look at the elevation, I mean, this is a big two-to-the-frowns mountain stage elevation rise, 4,100 meters. 44.4 kilometers, that's insane. So obviously there's not gonna be much fighting for position,

everybody's basically that when they get to La Rojo dude. I was a small group already. Obviously, all these guys that were in that 50, 60, man-break away got real back and got dropped already. And then there was so much work to be done in the Peloton.

So, yeah, I mean, I don't speak, man, I mean, yeah. 44 kilometers average in Leetbaston, Leesh. That's, I would like to go back and see what the speeds were, and like, then years ago, 20 years ago, and then 90s and the 80s, it's probably like,

36, 37 kilometers average. That's how much faster everything got. - Yeah, like in 2017, so almost 10 years ago, 40 kilometers an hour. So that's a huge bump in 10 years.

And why was the race so fast? Because there was a huge break away up front with a big favorite and a Rimpco Avenue pole. You know, what Spencer, I mean, with or without Rimpco, I don't think that actually changes a lot.

George, you can contradict me if I'm wrong, but if there's a big group, doesn't really matter who's in there.

I mean, you can never let a big group go far away.

Obviously, you know, UAE, they got caught out, it's been looked at the proof is they had a guy in there. Domain Novangin was in there without trying to be in there. He just happened to be in those positions. But even, you could say, okay, Rimpco was in there,

but you know, there's other riders in there, but now it was in there. There was other riders who can go uphill. You know, if you can't let that group take, I mean, especially not in a one day race.

In stage races, it's different, you know, because there's still time to recuperate in other stages, but in a one day race, I mean, that's insane 50 riders let them go up the road. I mean, luckily, I think, I mean,

And I also showed you how strong UAE is because they did the majority of the work with two riders, you know, with pedigots and this,

I always, I always forget his name,

stuck, standing, or, you know, it's time and log and staying. Yeah, so we should have pulled up. I mean, yeah, it's good, strong riders. So three riders, three riders, controlled that breakaway. That is crazy, you think about it.

Yeah, you're never going to get 50 guys to work together. Well, in the same goal, so, but at the same time, they had to fight with position less. So it was just as hard for the guys in the breakaway, once that was established, as the guys in the back,

because they had to pull pretty hard to keep that gap

“within, I think they got it the four minutes.”

But then we saw that race was on and whether you're in the Peloton at that point or in the breakaway, you're still working super hard either way. Yeah, yeah. Well, we hear it all the time,

but maybe we just hear it from me. Think saying, they've got to come up with different strategies. Maybe try to get in the early breakaway. That's the only way to beat Peloton. And today we got to see exactly what happens.

It's not, maybe not the best idea in practice because it just makes the race super, you have 50 riders up the road. Race is really fast. Peloton catches on, it's so fast.

No one can attack at Irons out all the potential problems. And then everyone's fatigue, so when he attacks, he drops them. Let's just say, are there any scenario? Let's say RIMCO's up the road like he was today. He's, I saw photos of him taking polls.

I saw him have his team up there. Like Nico Dens was taking big polls. Are you really realistically gonna stay away? Is that a waste of energy? I don't think so.

I don't think, if you saw pictures of him taking polls, we'll have been very short, maybe at the beginning to get it rolling, but then you get an overview of who's there. Obviously, Nico Dens, what else is he gonna do when he has Boston, yes, if he's in the break?

Are you burning a political capital, though? Burning what? I don't know if you're UAE, and then you have, there's a split in the peloton because of a crash and then red bulls up front polling.

As UAE happy, feeling good about that right now? Probably not, right?

I mean, I don't know, first of all,

I don't know if it was because of a crash, but it does happen that all of a sudden, there's a huge group. Nobody knows exactly what happened, but you look up and say, oh, wow, that's huge.

The peloton has just escaped. (laughing) But listen, it's part of racing. I think Remko did what he had to do once he was in there, I'm convinced he didn't spend

any more energy in that break than if he would have been in the peloton, as George said, you're relaxed, you don't have to fight for position. You have a teammate that will keep it going, plus there are other teams that keep it going.

And he also had a guy polling for Bernal and then other teams had several riders in there.

“So I think Remko had a really an armchair ride”

in that group, I'm pretty, I mean, okay, he has got dropped on a lot of duty, but for me, the reason why he got dropped is not because he was in that breakaway, for sure not. Why did he get dropped, you think?

Because he didn't have the legs to go on the climb and he didn't have the legs to sit behind six hours and put our chair going another climb. But I mean, he was six or seven places down. I mean, if you would have had no legs, he would have moved up.

If he would have had the legs, he would have straight away moved up. You could see already, okay, he was there. There was room to move up, you know, a lot of boots had no secrets, so, you know,

if you're good, you're moving up and you try to be in sex houses, really, you just didn't have it. I mean, he had to let go.

- I just, if I'm gonna be critical

for the sake of being critical, I would say, if I was gonna give it no, I'd say, maybe a little less energy blowing that gap up to four minutes and maybe we just focus on sitting behind Pagatra going in the lava dude.

- No, no, we have changed it.

“- I think I think the result, the third place of Ramkel”

is an incredibly good result for him, compared to how he was today. There was a lot of riders on the up hills who were better than Ramkel. We beefed, that's a lot of loot.

A lot of loot is the proof. It's, you know, he was 15th on a lot of loot. So, you know, there was a lot of riders better. So, third place for him is a really good result. - And you think that's a physical limitation,

the climb in, it's not a mental limitation. 'Cause he looks strong sometimes. Like at the end of that race, he looks so strong. - Yeah, yeah, but you think, I haven't seen him do anything spectacular on any of the climbs.

on La Rochefoco. He was also not in the front in that pursuing group. So, he is explosive. We all know he worked on a sprint on his exclusivity and that sprint was impressive.

You know, let's not forget, he still has a huge engine. I mean, after 260k, a guy like that, if he's there, he's gonna be better. But, you know, on the climbs, today, at least he didn't have it. - So, do you think he doesn't have the climbing engine

that the other top one day guys do?

“- So, I think comparing him to Povicar and Saixel,”

is right now, probably not, but, you know, he maybe had a bad moment there to code to Leverdo. I mean, he can climb with, we've seen him win a grand tour and he hasn't done that sort of climbing lately. But, you know, we can't count the guy out.

He's still got there, play, still won. Bamful goal race last weekend, all in all, when I think he's pretty happy with the way his classics have gone up until now. And of course, he's warmly as best only as two times,

and those two times that he's warmly, he's rolled away from the peloton, so there's a bit difference in level in terms of between him and Povicar, right now, Saixel's ass. But, I mean, you can't really criticize the guy too much.

He's still had an incredible last week

with winning him, still in getting third today. - I just can't quite square, because as you say, you want a grand tour, so we know we can do it. I mean, we should say though, the problem with all of this, like, I'm going back to 2022.

He wins actually, and exactly the same spot that Povicar won today, he's rode away with 14 K to go. The speeds are fractions. Like, Pagotcha in 2020, in 2020,

“he went up Loverdo in four and a half minutes,”

today he went up almost in three and a half minutes. So the speeds are a lot higher, so it could be that he was climbing when speeds were slower, was climbing better. But as you say, George, he won a Amsterdam last year.

He looked pretty good on the climbs there. That's what I can't quite square is, why does he look so unstoppable at times? And then seemed to struggle specifically with climbing. Like, has he listened bad, maybe it was?

Or talking here about Rampco as if it's a failure. I mean, listen, let's not forget, I mean, this, he's racing against these two, okay, say Chath is now new into the game, but it's clear that obviously uphill,

he's already, and he's gonna be better than Rampco. There's no question about that.

But let's not forget, you know, he got third in flanders.

He got, he won, I'm still goal-traced, and he just got third in lyesh. It's not bad, you know, I mean, so it's definitely not bad, but it's not, I don't, if you told Red Bull, you're gonna pay this guy, the money you're gonna pay him

and these are the results, and he's gonna look totally lost as a stage racer, do you think they would sign up for that? - Well, I, I really am, he got, he won, Amso. And just think about mentally too,

this guy is a Olympic champion. He's won the edge best on the SC times. The fact that he still stayed there fighting for third place, like mentally on Coach and I Red Bull, he couldn't go with the best two guys.

So then a lot of guys would just say, "Buck it, I'm done, like, my day is over, I'm not gonna win, but he kept fighting." Which, to me, shows how strong he is mentally, because he is one of the best guys in the world.

Yeah, two guys are riding away from him, making him look like he can't go uphill, but he still stayed there fighting away. You know, you saw him really aggressive in the group too. Y'all and that guy's to try to get people movement.

I mean, the guy's a fighter, and, you know, the fact that he still hung in there and got third place, like, really convincingly in that sprint. I got a Zayshapoda him, even though I'm sure he wanted to win, but still very impressive week of racing for him.

Yeah, I mean, he wanted to win, but, you know, deep inside George, he knows that if there's nothing that if nothing happens to Pugachar, that he can't win. Of course, there are racer uncle's chances.

I mean, he was in one of those, you know, he wasn't that break. So, I mean, let's not beat to,

I mean, I'm always, I'm always accused of being a ramco defender

because, you know, I have a preference for Belgian riders, but he's, you know, isn't he, he is a big engine.

“The expectations are, I think, super high.”

Yeah, I mean, in the last six years now, there's, you know, he won twice and Pugachar won four times. He had best on the edge. Okay, yes, he won, Pugachar wasn't there, but still, nobody else won except him and Pugachar.

He had best on the edge. Yeah, I mean, yeah, it is good. I would just say my issue with Ramco is, a, like, the George, the yelling at people. Like, we gotta stop this, okay?

The next, like, if you up the road, if you want people, don't, they're not gonna work with you. All right, he's gotta stop yelling at people and groups. I think it's, I mean, you're, you're, you're 230 K into a world cup. It's not like, you're feeling like you buddy, buddy with people.

Like, you get frustrated, like you're, you're heart rates at 200, like,

I mean, this is like, these guys are on zero. They had like no matches left and they're in survival mode. So I don't, I know that you might not look great on TV,

“but it's just, that's what happens in this.”

And race is five and a half hours into such a hard day. And also, also, George, you know, and Spencer, you know, this yelling thing, it happens all the time. Everybody does it. This Pugachar is not doing it.

He should drop everybody, Pugachar doesn't have to yell because nobody can follow him, but, you know, not everybody. Gotcha, but it happens all the time. The thing is, you know, when Remko's on front, the cameras are focused on him.

And yes, he does have this attitude of, okay, being frustrated, but I, I can understand. I mean, it doesn't look great on TV, because, you know, he's in the, in the picture all the time, right? But it happens all the time, man.

It's not just Remko, everybody else at everybody. There's, there, there, once they're racing there, there are no friends. - Okay, okay, so the great result, great result, third place, great.

Here's the thing I take issue with.

These quotes yesterday, I don't like them at all. He says, I've already won here twice. Sex Oz, he's only 19, it's 268. Tadana, Taday and I have more endurance for races, I wouldn't be surprised to be struggles.

Why, why is he saying that? Why is it, there's no need to say that. - About a commander. - Yeah. - Who then stays excited?

- He's a confident guy, and it's also one of his strengths. He never gives up, look today. Today's the proof, I've never been up. - Well, he gave up last year.

“- Luckily, as you remember, just pulled over.”

He, last year, he was, he was, he was a lot worse than this year, but, well, why anyway, Spencer, you're not, you're not a big, Remko fan. - I just, the behavior is not, it totally impressed me the last two days.

I thought that was quote for like, it's fun, I guess it's fun, but Sashas is the real deal, like, I don't know, just sat wrong with me, I really didn't sit well with me. And then, yeah, I didn't know what's going on. - If there was one rider who was maybe going to be able

to follow up with Goucher, it was going to be full success. - Nobody else. - Nobody else, Remko has a point. I mean, if we have not seen success that much after 200 combos, I mean, it's a completely different ball game

from 200 K to 260 K, like there's people that can hang with the best in the world up until 200 K. But once you get that other 60 K, it's a completely different ball game. And Sashas doesn't have that much history

after 200 kilometers. So he did have a point in that sense. He probably didn't have to say it, but then he threw them off. - After the day, we know the answer, George.

- We know the answer.

“I mean, but I think we all had that question.”

Like, hey, we can be able to do this, you know. - I have to take the race.

- The proof is, but basically, and there you see that,

in my opinion, it could come back to the race and to Pugachear. Pugachear felt it already, you know, they attacked on a lot of dudes, Sashas collaborated a bit with Pugachear and by the bottom of La Rochefocone,

they had one and a half minutes, right? And there, Pugachear knew, because, you know, without any doubt, I mean, they didn't start the incline yet. And Pugachear went already. He knew that he was gonna just drag him and a spixiate him.

And I want to, I got to write, I spixiate him. And yeah, I mean, it was nice to see him and say, "Sashas tried and tried and tried." I mean, you could see at his body language, you know that La Rochefocone is usual styles,

standing up, you know, three accelerations, and then Sashas started to really work to bike his facial expression, got worse and worse. And all of a sudden, you know, the elastic broke. And that's where, in for the moment,

Pugachear still has an advantage over a young guy, 19-year-old sexist, with that endurance, and those to be used, those efforts above 220, 230 kilometers. - Yeah, and as a fan, we want to see those guys finish the race together and go toe to toe in a sprint.

I mean, probably Pugachear still would have won, but as a team and as a country, a friend, I like, we just won flesh for loan, and we got second place in the ass. I mean, you're coming up with an incredible week

for a 19-year-old kid, I mean, they got, they should be happy with their performance. - Yeah, and Sashas was also happy, if you listen to his interview, he's happy, he's proud, he satisfied, you know,

what a mature guy, right, in those interviews,

like the way he talks, always straight away thanking his team.

That's, you know, the first thing he says, is always my team, my team. And I mean, with the pressure on the shoulders of that kid, man, I'm being, you know, imagine the stress and the nerves to be there at the bottom of La Redutense.

Okay, everybody expects me to show that I can stay with Pugachear, and he does it, man. I mean, that's, that's nerve-racking, especially, when you're at 18190 art beats, yeah.

that before the colder I do, there's the best teams in the world, the best smile, the teams lined up. I mean, that's the super stressful downhill leading into that, the position battle is massive.

And for a 19 year old kid, just being so composed and fighting for Pugachear's wheel, getting Pugachear's wheel, looks easy on TV. I can guarantee you that it's far from easy. And he's there with no problem.

- Super interesting.

“- I think, I mean, I would have to go back,”

but I saw images of, especially when Pugachear attacked,

which is also incredible, George, you've got to do it,

by the way, it seems that the Americans, the American writers, they call, "The Lord Reduce, The Code, The Later Doot." Later. - Later, yeah, probably.

- Yeah, but Pugachear was small-chaining. Seychelles did it on the big-chaining. - Wow, that's incredible. - Yeah, I mean, obviously we don't know. - It's 10% average.

That's, yeah. - Yeah. - I mean, that means when the attack, when Pugachear attacked first, he was on the big-chaining, I don't know if he should,

they'd turn on, but, yeah, I mean, kind of an interesting idea, actually. Like if you're worried about being able to get over the, like, this Pugachear is just gonna spend away from you. I don't know, maybe that would,

maybe you had a mechanical, we don't know, but maybe that wasn't an idea they had. But young, I was gonna mention that too about the poise, like, I don't, similar to flesh blown. Then nerves, can you guys,

I don't think any of us have ever won flesh blown, but I would be so nervous going into the bottom of that,

“knowing that you have to be in good position.”

I don't think he gets nervous. I don't think any of this phasism. And that's, you've come up with some press of thing, don't you? - Now he's super confident, I think I said, and you know, in our show of flesh blown,

I saw these images, you know, the team images of him and the car and the team car after the race being on the phone and going through step by step that lost kilometer of the mood that we, this guy is, this guy knows what he's doing, man.

He's not, he's actually not a blown away. He has complete confidence in his performances. He knows what he can do. - Yeah, let's take a quick break and then I have some questions for you guys

about Mr. Sixus and the Tour de France, and if you think you should go, but we'll be right back. Okay, we're back. Before we get into Paul Sixus, do you guys know the last time,

how many years has it been since Rimpoev and Apollo has beaten Tatted Pagotcha in a one day race that he Pagotcha has finished? - Last year, and so go over it. - I didn't beat him.

- I thought he got second.

- No, he got third. - He got second. - Oh, he got third. - I'm close though. - It's been four years.

- So we're going to be on the same level, they were on the same level last year at Emph度 race. - Which race?

“- It's actually, do you guys want to guess which race it was?”

It's obvious once you know it, which is obvious. - I mean, it's a, it's Liège, but when we go out to a crash, no? - Well, he didn't finish. So race that he's finished.

They're both finished. - Okay, no, I don't know. World championships, 22, the forgotten world championships. - When Remkwell won. - Yeah, okay, yeah.

- And won, well and gone. - Yeah, yeah, yeah. - We didn't have Pagotcha at 2.0 yet. We didn't know what he was capable of. - But that speaks to your point, Johan,

that like just a digesting that fact, then you'd say, yeah, these are very good results, because you can't expect him to beat him, because he's not beating him. So it's unfair expectation

to think he's gonna win these races, probably. - Yeah. - George, you have a, you have a writer in your household about this age. Would you send 19-year-old Paul,

success to the two of France? - Oh, yeah, I think I think I would. We've seen like the trend. Like these guys are winning the tour younger and younger. This guy's, he's got such a strong foundation

that 19-years-old is now what 19-years-old was 10 years ago. I mean, there's so much more advanced and developed and no their body's much more than the kids did 10 years ago, that I think if he wants to go and his team is in need of him to go, I would send him.

- Johan, well, I think they're gonna announce it tomorrow, no, whether he goes or not.

I think the answer is he's gonna go.

I think the team wants it, I think he wants it. Me personally, I would not send him. I would give him some time, prepare a fully, fully team at his service, quality team for the Vuelta. Okay, this year may be also, I mean,

because apparently, Pugachar is going to the house. - I'm just gonna say, I wanna forget to go to the Vuelta. - This isn't really matter, Spencer. - Well, why is the Vuelta better than the tour for?

- It's three weeks, he's never done a three week stage race, he needs to discover that. - What can you show you then, the tour versus the Vuelta?

(laughing) But, especially as a French phenomenon. - Yeah, I mean, that is real concern. - To think, yeah, okay, the thing is, we're just judging from the outside.

They know better and he knows better how he can handle the pressure and it looks like he can handle it pretty well. But the tour is a different game. The tour, everything's magnified times 10,

compared to anything else. And, you know, three weeks in the tour is not three weeks at the Vuelta or not three weeks at the Jero in the tour. There is no time to recover, especially in today's cycling. It's everyday, a classic, it's everyday monument, almost.

And so, if I would be his manager or advisor,

I would advise him to do the Vuelta first or the Jero,

even next year the Jero, that would also be an option. The thing is, he's French, he kind of has to go.

“I think the team, but especially the people, the media,”

they want him at the tour and he will be at the tour. I'm pretty confident. I personally think it would be better if he doesn't order three weeks stage race first. - I guess you could have a simple rule though,

if you can win it, you gotta go and he could win it. - No, he can't win it. - How, but that's not true. - It's not true, 'cause let's say something happens to Pagachar and Jonas, who's gonna beat 'em?

Jonas Vingigar is gonna beat 'em. - No, no, let's say Jonas has a crash with the Jero, which does happen all the time. - Okay, but that's like these are not insane scenarios, you know? - Yeah, okay, but if you're not and today are at the top

of their game, six hours can get third at the best,

which would be incredibly good. - That's not bad, which basically would prove that I'm wrong, but I think the easier way is to do it out of three weeks stage race first, but that's not gonna happen. He's gonna go to the tour.

- Well, you answered my next question. My next question is gonna be,

“is anyone wanna change their opinion on who the second best”

racer against Pagachar is right now? You still think it's Jonas? - In three weeks stage races? - Absolutely. - George?

- Yeah, I would agree with that. And then here's my next question on that. There's all this talk of Kenny handle three weeks. I mean, if you go through the history, actually long one day races are harder for young riders

to handle than three weeks stage races, like think of Egan Bernal. Goes to the tour, does it want? Says, yeah, I think I got this and then wins it. I could see Paul success doing the same thing,

but what's the best rider you can think of that looked this good? And then as a stage racer and one week in one day's that and just totally late in egg at a grand tour. Can you guys think of anybody?

My point being, usually if you're this good, you're good, like even Remko Avenue Paul, he's one out of three week race, you know? Like usually if you're this good in this type of racing, you're pretty good in grand tours.

- Yeah, I mean, Remko has been thirded at the Tour de France also, so you can't say that he can't race if he can clearly ride three weeks. - Yeah, yeah, you know, listen, you have a point, you have a point, listen, there is no question, Spencer,

“that Paul's success is going to be a Tour de France rider.”

There is no question about that. My point is just, you know, we'll give it some more time and let him do another big stage race first. - Was it a bummer that Yona Spinnigrad was not here?

I thought it was a bit of a bummer. - So I think it's clear with his goals that his goal to the jury on the tour. So he's all in for that. They got a plan and going.

- And then also George, you know, I've said it already before, you know, you can't demand that of Yona's because Yona does not have the mentality of these one-day races. He just, he just, just not motivated.

He knows that, you know, if he has a great day,

maybe he can't, but he's never been there.

But, you know, there's many other incredible riders who have never done that, for example. - Yeah. - Two of the biggest, the best Tour de France riders. - I mean, it's not recently anymore, but anyways,

a relatively recent, Chris Froome and I'll be talking to the other one. But, you know, never, never, never, ever, ever on the podium in any, none, none. - Well, in my crazier was considered not at these races trying to win them.

- It might make him, he's right, he's right, he's right. - He's right, he's right, he's right. - He was. - He was. - He's never, he's never managed to win.

- He was oddly, very bad at them. Not like, it is just a mentality thing. I can't quite figure that out from the outside. - I mean, it could be a motivation thing, too.

and he got a podium, does it change his career one bit? No, it doesn't.

“So, these days, you have to be super motivated”

to one take huge risk, and two put it all on the line for one day race, and if your head's not in it, you're not gonna perform to your best anyway. So, I would say it's a matter of motivation, but sure. - You think it's just motivation mentality, Yohan?

For guys like, comfortable and firm in Yona's. - I don't think, you know, there is also something to one day races, you know, compared to riders who are just stage racers. You have guys who just need that effort day after day

after day, which is completely different. I mean, on a one day race, you just have to be super good on that day, and nothing can fail. But usually the big stage racers, like for example, contador and firm,

their strength was the recovery. They recover just much better, and that's how they got out on top after the week, when everybody started to fade, they stay at the same level.

I think it's a physical thing also. There, I've seen riders, you know, when I was a cyclist, and then when I was at the S, who were incredibly good at one day races, and in stage race, and even in, even in,

in Lies Boston, Liesh, and in stage races,

for example, they were, they were never there.

I mean, there's many winners of Liesh Boston, Liesh, who, you know, back in the days, you know, and that nowadays it's different, but that's for example,

“look, I think he actually wanted to ice out a little bit”

teeny. He was incredible. - On what day race day? - I mean, sometimes I'm being, as far as I remember, never top 10 in a, in a,

in a ground tour, never. - Yeah. - You know, Barcelona, a lot of guys like that. - Yeah, I mean, that's partially why it's such a good race. Like I'm just picking a random five-year stretch.

So like 2005, Vinicurov, the next year of Alberta, the Luke of Alberta, Schleck, Vinicurov, those are all grand tour winners, unless I'm free, something. I then the next year, Philippe Jolibar, you know,

like, and then 2014, Simon Garin. So you do get kind of get this mixed bag of riders. It's super interesting. I think that's why it's a great race. A couple of shoutouts before we go, before I forget.

So fourth place, just you got fourth, Johan. This guy, oh, guys, who's been on. - Yeah, guy that, yeah, he got 15, I'm still. - Yeah, and fourth now, I mean, first year, full-time pro on the road, was, you know, combining it with,

I mean, majority soccer cross rider.

“And then he did the tour, I think, because they run,”

they were short on riders and didn't incredible tour,

but man, fourth and he has bust on the edge. That's some result. - It's really impressive. Especially since you told us last week, it was his first year focusing on the road.

And then he can bring off fifth, pretty good result for Bernal. Coming off at tour of the Alps where he looks pretty good and he's going to the zero to 10, yeah. So what do we think about that? I mean, that's one of the better results we've seen

from him, I can, in the Bernal post crash era. - And I think also, you know, what speaks for the form of Bernal, I mean, I don't know if he's gonna be able to fight for the win. Obviously, you guys, you want us, I don't think so.

But, you know, I mean, to finish fifth for him in a sprint, in the other day, in one of the stages of the Alps, he finished third in a sprint. That means you're in good shape. You know, a guy like Bernal, mixing it up with a sprint,

that means that he has something left in the legs at the end of the stage. So it really promising for the zero. - Yeah, I agree. And Bernal is like one of those guys that Johan

was just mentioned, not your typical one day racer. I mean, he's like a total of state racers. So we saw he just finished for the Alps two days ago. I mean, he recovered well from that in fifth place in the Asbestone, as I think he's got to be one of the top

favors for podium at the zero. - You actually, you don't see that as much anymore. Like you mentioned in Furman, Conthroor. A lot like Bernal, as you say, Georgetown, you wouldn't really think of him as a one day racer.

He's very good at one day racing though. He actually gets quite a few good results. Another guy, I don't know if you noticed him you're on. We're just talking about him privately. Jai Hindley looked very good in that chase group.

Also going to the cheer to tie it. So I'm gonna keep an eye on him. - Yeah, yeah. - Those guys are. Jai Hindley did not do two of the Alps, no?

No, he was I didn't see him there. - No. - So he must have been preparing differently, but definitely ready for me.

He's always pretty good at the zero.

- Yeah, that's like something I was at pretty good. He did win it. So that's, that's second to bad. - Second to the first. - Yeah, and he got quietly got forth to the well to last year.

I'm quite curious to see what he does is your to tie this year, but do you guys have anything else before we take off? - Yes. Let's not forget about Leigh's but only as women,

demonstration of demi-volaring. Alah Poghachar, she just took off on another dude.

Everybody was trying and just finished it with one and a half minutes. Impressive performance. Second to pack Peter again. Second time she's, she's second in this race.

Third, Cassia New Adomi, Louis Adoma, so the expected strong women and then fourth, Alah Poghachar,

“who I think has won this race already before.”

I know she won flesh for a long seven years in a row

before her retirement, but it's now back on an incredible level.

- Is this the best spring of allorance career in terms of wins? I'm just trying to think about that probably, right? - No doubt about it. - Yeah.

- She wins opening weekend. Flanders flesh, Leigh. The only one she doesn't win was Amstell. Kind of a bit of a biff there on the breakaway. I mean, 2023, she was very good.

She wins Amstell flesh, Leigh. But she had, I mean, 2024, she didn't win a single one day race and then she didn't win a single classic in 2025. So it's kind of like a return to and exceeding her best results ever in the spring one day race.

So she's extremely dominant and her team is also, it's the best team. She has the best team and they'll doubt about that. - Which was it the best team when she went there, kind of interestingly and now they do it amazing.

- In a long way, yeah. - Yeah, anything else, George? - No, it was a great race to watch or so. - Who was the top American?

“- Did we have George on American watch at this race?”

Do I ever think of American in the race? - We lost your Arkansas in the last week, so he probably would have been up there in the top 10, but no, I don't think. - Yeah, they had it.

- And it's all men feel when? - They all came to the Larradut and they said, "Cool, the later dudes." (laughing) - Yeah, there actually was one American, Larry Warbus,

working for Tutor Procycling. But yeah, we'll just assume a tale of one congrats Mateo on your theoretical age. - Already said, already back on the bike, by the way, after his question, we won't fracture,

and I'm still already, I saw the images of, he's already back on the home trainer. And when do we think he comes back to racing? Do you think it's just all Delphine to our now? - I mean, yeah, I don't think it or do this with,

or something, yeah. - Yeah. Well, this was kind of crazy to think about. I'm exhausted just thinking about it. So in two days' time, Tatic Pagutcher races

again at the Tour of Romantic. - Tour of Romantic, yeah. - Why is he doing that? Just 'cause he's not won it before, and he wants to win it.

- He does Tour de Romantic in Tour of Switzerland for a reason. He's two races he hasn't won yet. (laughing) The guys on the mission, man,

the guys on the mission, the click, click, you know, like every check, check, check, whatever he hasn't won. - Pretty crazy. I wrote this down, I don't know if I said this earlier,

but last major one day race has been Olympics, or Olympics, World Championships of monuments, and his last 14 starts, he has 14 podiums and 10 wins. So, you know, I can go back and count that for Pagutcher, or Merx for later today,

I don't think anyone's ever done that. - But he did, he did five races this year, Spencer, five won they races, one, four, and one second. (laughing) He won, so he wants to have a Bianca,

Milana Ramos, Duroflander, Second Indrube, and first in the Asia, I mean, it's pretty, it's unbelievable, he's only race monuments, plus strata. - Yeah, that's crazy.

- Yeah, don't try that at home, don't get the wrong idea, kids. - That's not the work for you, okay?

“- That's the only thing that Pagutcher can do that.”

- Well, I think today, we still definitely, I mean, of course, everybody's super excited and enthusiastic about Paul's success, and we should be, but at the same time,

I think we saw a Pagutcher always,

still, I would say, better than last year. The way today, he rode away, man. I mean, he's has this ability to ride away in the saddle. I mean, that acceleration was just impressive. When you saw the images from behind,

Paul's exhaust, and the way Pagutcher disappeared in the distance, like in no time, I was crazy. - That was crazy. - In the saddle, and what's crazy about that, you're hungry, he's stronger this year.

And he had to, he had to get stronger, or else he wouldn't be dropping a 19 year old. Like that's how high the level is at the top. It's almost overwhelming to think about. - But it's universal, Spencer.

We can finish with this, you know, I don't know if you saw. We always say, okay, you know, they go faster and faster and faster and faster. It's the human, it's the athlete, you know? Don't know if you saw it today.

- Yeah, the moment. - The moment. - Yeah. - One hour, 59 minutes, 30 seconds.

And the guy who got second also went below two hours.

I mean, imagine that running for two straight hours and more than 21 kilometers per hour. That is in some time.

(laughing)

“- If you put the treadmill on that speed,”

it actually is mind blowing.

- It's insane. - Yeah.

“- You cannot comprehend someone running that fast,”

but yeah, you're right, Johan, it is universal

across different sports, many different sports. But forgot chair, congratulations, not as fourth,

“but he's probably gonna win four monuments this year.”

Eight out of the last 11, not bad.

We're excited to see it to a Romendi and Johan, you and I will be back on Friday to talk about his Romendi excursion. - Okay. - All right, all right, thanks guys.

- All right, thanks guys. - Thank you. (upbeat music) (upbeat music)