The #1 Dating Rule That Saves You Months of Heartbreak

for Amazon Leverungen in all Europe. For Leverungen, as well as football players. I don't know, 10,000 electrofahrzeuges and there's a lot more. Based on the plan, our Lever partner

in the EU and Großbritannien was in the 26th century. It's not even about dating and love. It's about yourself. It's about making sure that you are the person that is ready to be loved.

My mama always said, you got to love yourself

“more than you need to be loved by other people.”

You can always be in your growth stage. You can reinvent yourself at any time. People can be disappointed. You can disappoint people, but are you harming them? No, but if your boundaries are in place

and they're offended by it, maybe they're not meant to be in your life. I'm sure you, I'm Jean, and where the Tiger Sisters. We are your Wall Street and Silicon Valley Big Sisters. And we're a top 10 business podcast bringing late night sister talk meets boardroom strategy.

Welcome to the Tiger Sisters podcast. What we're doing in episode with Sabrina Zohar. Woo, woo, woo, welcome. My girl. She is the creator of the top rank podcast,

the Sabrina Zohar show. Could you please introduce yourself in your own words to the audience? I'm so excited to be here. So my name is Sabrina Zohar.

I'm a dating and relationship coach. I got my start because I was the girl that needed the advice. I was a hot mess and I realized by diving and doing the work, understanding myself,

understanding my patterns, and then getting certified as a coach that I was able to help other people. And so I have the podcast of Sabrina Zohar show. I've got the socials, I've got courses, I've got all the fun stuff.

I'm just grateful to be here. Thank you for having me. Yay, so excited. We are gonna be deep diving today and to all of Sabrina's best gems

on dating, love, and relationships. And we're gonna get into the really deep topics. We're gonna be talking about self-regulation, co-regulation, not abandoning yourself when you're in a relationship boundaries,

both in friendship and in love. And in life in general, we are so excited. Today's episode is presented by Sophie, the All-In-One Finance app that helps you bank, borrow, and invest your money

in one place. Okay, Sabrina. So before we get into the archetypes of dating and love advice out there, I want to dive into some of your own teachings

because you put so much incredible content out there

that we've both seen and loved. Some people have described you as giving tough love to the internet, but delivering brutal truths with care and love in the process. We love your content.

I'm gonna highlight the three main themes that stood out most to us in your content. You please do. Okay. (laughs) So the first one is defining self-regulation.

“I think regulating and coming from a place of self-regulation”

is truly the crux of how you'll be in a healthy and secure relationship. I know for me personally, like I started my entire career podcast, all of the things because I was that girl. I was the girl that would have panic attacks

sitting at night. I would wake up seven times a meal of the night. I would look at my phone and if I had a text, I had air for the moment and if I didn't, that was it, it was the end of the world.

And I didn't understand that all of that had to do with our nervous system. That our nervous system is really the lens at which we see things, our nervous system is really the lens at which we how we handle things.

And without emotional regulation, we think about conflict and repair, but we don't incorporate conflict, regulate repair. And regulating is really being able to one, access a place of choice.

When we're dysregulated, our body is sensing that we're in danger, that there's a tiger, there's something coming after us, but oftentimes it's our cell phone. It's a person that we don't really know.

And that just triggers our nervous system causes us to be dysregulated. When we're dysregulated, what goes at the window? You can't sleep, you can't eat, you can't drink. You don't take care of basic functions for survival

because you're in survival mode. So for me, once we strip all that away, once we learn how to regulate our motions, once we learn how to come back to the present moment, in that I can access a place of agency.

I can then understand what are my choices. I can start to get curious about how old do I feel,

“what is this coming up for me, how familiar does this feel?”

And I think the reason that most of the dating advice that we see online doesn't actually apply to a lot of people is because they're not coming from a regulated place, which is really they're adult version, they're coming from all the parts

and all the kids versions of themselves, projecting that onto their people and actually being in the present moment. I love that this is the cornerstone of all of your dating and love advice because it's not even

about dating and love, it's about yourself. It's about making sure that you are the person that is ready to be loved.

Yeah, 100% because my mama always said,

you gotta love yourself more than the need to be loved by other people because if I love myself more than the need to be loved by somebody else, what that means is I'm okay to walk away. I'm okay to say no, I'm okay that if I don't hear

from somebody, I don't turn to stone and not do my work in my whole entire day and nothing is in hell and a hand basket. And I think when we come to, how can I love myself more than the need to be loved

by other people, it goes back to choice. I get to say I'm choosing you, I don't want, I want you in my life, I don't need you in my life.

especially with, as you guys mentioned earlier, there's so much nonsense on the internet, there's so many different versions and variances and most of them are about self abandonment. How can I get you to like me?

How can I get you to validate me? How can I get you to choose me? Well, if you're doing that, you've already lost yourself. So if someone, like you described before,

basically like, you know, if you're like waiting

next to your phone for that text message which is just all too real side note, I do have a friend like in our early 20s, like I remember just like going crazy, not me, but like being like seeing her go crazy

'cause she's like waiting up for a text message for someone like when will they text me back? Oh my God, they texted me like an hour and a half do I have to wait an hour, 45 or before I respond. I go into this whole spiral.

So like if you are in that place, like how do you get to a self-regulated place? Like what do you do? So there's the intellectualization of it and then there's the implementation, right?

So it's like the example is if I were to say, okay, I'm gonna teach you how to do a debt lift. I'm gonna give you all of the understanding and everything and you're gonna know, the minute you go into the gym

and actually do it, you could probably take your back out because you don't understand, what do you mean engaged this and do this and it comes from here because you don't know what it feels like.

“And so I think when it comes to that extreme, right?”

The person that's losing themselves because they haven't heard a text from this person. The number one thing that will change your life especially with a lot of anxiety is the power of the pause. Being able to literally put one minute,

what minute in between the stimulus to actually have a response and not a reaction. So that's the first thing. The second thing is like when we talk about regulating our nervous system, I think there's a common misconception

we see on the internet. As if regulating is like doing this quick like pull on your ear and activate your personal pathetic nervous system and now you're calm. What regulating your nervous system means

is that you are letting your body know that you're not in immediate danger and you can come back and access rest and digest. So what that also means is that's how you access choice. If I'm disregulated, I don't believe I have any choices.

I have to do this. So what regulating your nervous system in practice looks like could be going for a walk. It could be doing the shakes. It could be doing something called the silent punch

for you literally hit the air with your hands. It could be sour candy. Your brain, yeah, my favorite is sour candy and ice cubes.

So one is the million divers response, that's ice cubes.

So intense cold will actually activate your parasympathetic nervous system so that you can come back to the present moment.

“That's why they do ice baths quite often.”

You're causing yourself to be under it distressed but then also calming yourself down with your breath work so that you can handle what's to come. The other thing, the reason I like sour candy is because your brain, what ends up happening

when you're disregulated, is your prefrontal cortex shuts off. You go into your amygdala. When you're in your amygdala, that's the fear center. When you're in your fear center, that's typically childhood, core beliefs,

things that are coming up from the past. The way that we like to look at it is imagine if you had an office building. We will understand this. You had an office building and at the top floor

are all the executives, right? It's all the functions, all the people that are making the important decisions. When you're disregulated, that goes offline. So then the rest of the office building is running the show

and these are all children and parts and none of them know what they're doing. When you regulate your nervous system, like the sour candy, your brain can't be in two places at once. So it can't have this ruminating loop symbol of it

and then have the stimulus of the sour candy that turns your prefrontal cortex on. So the reason that I suggest something like grabbing a sour candy, sitting for a minute, doing 3D breaths is because what it does is it activates

the prefrontal cortex, turns that back on. Then I can say, okay, water my choices. How old do I feel, what's coming up for me? And then I can start to access that deeper place. Otherwise, you're in a limbic loop.

And your brain is doing everything it can to understand how to get out of this comfort instead of being able to sit in it and grow from it. I love that. I'm definitely going to try that.

It's not even in love and dating, but whenever I'm stressed, anxious, pissed, like whatever emotion's coming up for me, I am now in a place where I can recognize that. Love that, that takes huge work.

But now there's the pause and then I'm grabbing a nice cube and putting in my mouth and being like, I need to sit here and that's like a very actionable thing that you can do. You can hold on to them.

You can literally, you could put them on your, you could put, I have, like, ice water on your wrist. Like, if you're at work or something and you're like, oh, I can't do that. You want to be able to just release that to your body.

You could do whim-huff breath work every morning. That really helps activate the parasympathetic nervous system. I think a lot of people here, the, oh, I have to do yoga and meditate and breath work. It's like, oh, actually, I would say

if you're just regulated meditations, the stupidest thing you could do. Because if a tiger were running after us right now, could you sit and close your eyes and try to beat, no, you wouldn't be able to.

You would need to be able to say first,

I have to be safe to access the place where I could get deeper into my body.

“I think you said that I thought was really interesting”

was the concept of how old do I feel? What do you mean by that? Oh, that's my favorite question. So my book comes out on October. Oh, thank you.

It's called, why am I like this? And really the crux of what I speak about often as patterns, right? Pattern recognition. Because we are just a sum of all of our parts.

And so the reason I used to ask, how old do I feel and where did I learn this from?

when you're super, right?

You're super just regulated, right? So we'll use the example of the texting. It's just the easiest. Somebody doesn't text you back. And all of a sudden, the pinch doesn't match the edge.

You're freaking out, you're crying, you're like ventilating, you're been there, you're calling your friend, you're playing FDI, you're trying to understand everything that's going on. The reason we ask how old do I feel is because very rarely

are you going to say, I feel like a 35-year-old woman sitting in my apartment right now. Usually it'll be, I feel like I'm seven. - Yeah. - Or what happened when you were seven? My dad used to pull this.

Ah, okay, so this is nothing to do with the other person. This is my core beliefs being projected onto them. The reason that I like to do that is one, it gives you more agency. You start to realize, oh, it's not about them.

I do have choice. And second, you realize it's not about them. Because oftentimes we obsess and we hyper fixate over people that aren't offering clarity because it gives us dopamine.

And the more I can obsess over somebody, but if I actually start to get curious about how old do I feel and where did I learn this from, and I can start to actually tap into the root of what's causing this?

- I love that because it's once again examining yourself. You're asking, why am I reacting this way?

Oh, it's because I was always the last person

to get picked up when I was a child. And I was like left alone. And this non-response to my text makes me feel, like, I'm in that space again. I'm in the after school.

I'm not being picked up where my parents, right?

“So, I know when it's puttin' in what happens, right?”

For a lot of people, they see that little version, you're like, oh, and for most of us, what's our reaction? Oh, screw them, right? Oh, God, get out of here, stop it, leave me alone.

But when we can get curious and hold space, here's my fun neuroscience fact. When you show yourself compassion and love, you release more dopamine than you do from an external, like person.

So if I can stop and say, oh, yeah, I feel like I'm seven years old again, being in the pickup line, we'll give in if you think I've been through. No wonder this would make me feel like that. You've won, closed the loop in your brain,

you have finality to what's going on. You've understood yourself, you've validated yourself. You showed yourself compassion and you released dopamine for yourself so you're not contingent and waiting for somebody else. And like you said, you've broken the cycle,

you've taken a step, you're waiting to be like, okay, I don't need to feel like that seven year old again. Let me give it a minute, let me give it five minutes. Let me give it 45 minutes so that I can come back into my own as the 35 year old woman that I am.

And the biggest thing for anybody that wants to know, what's the difference between intuition and anxiety, right? Because it's like, if we're trying to understand am I dysregulated, what does that look like? The biggest thing is when we think about our fear of response,

it's fight, flight, freeze, fawn, flop is a new one. I'm not so familiar with it, but we're flopping.

“Fight, fight, fight, wait, we know what fight is, right?”

You're literally, you get argumentative, combative, flight avoidance, right? But out, this doesn't matter. And let me also preface anxious folks are also avoidance. So it's not like it's just the avoidant attachers.

Then you have freeze, right? You could just stop, you don't know what to do, or fawn, you people please, you try to make her. The beauty of all of this is that when you can actually stop and understand where you're coming from

and what's happening for you, then you can make choices. Now, how do you know the difference between them? Intuition is very common. Intuition is very, if I were to say, Gene, do you like that color?

And you went, right? Do you notice how it was in immediate reaction? There was no urgency to it. It was just I don't like that. Versus, if I said, you know, if I do like this color

in your life depends on it, you might be getting really frantic when we see urgency, that's anxiety. So if somebody text you and you're like, or you text the person that you're dating, why? And they called me, why?

And they answered, where are they? That's urgency. That's when we know we're dysregulated. Versus a more secure solid, maybe foundation would be, you know, I haven't heard from them, but they're at work.

So I'm sure I'll hear from them later. We don't assume ill intent in other people because we've given the space for ourselves to understand that their humans and probably have in their own experience.

I love what you just said. It's like sticking in my head, the pinch isn't worth the outch. Pinch doesn't match the outch. The pinch doesn't match the outch.

Like that's really powerful.

And so like with co-regulation, how does that work together in a sense, like when do you share with someone that like, oh, I'm hurt and maybe I'm having like a bigger response than normal or then someone would expect because I do have, you know, history or something

that's like kind of triggering for me.

“Like, when do you share that with someone to co-regulate?”

- Co-regulation's a beautiful thing, right? If you're super calm and I'm really frantic, if I can use your nervous system to allow me to realize we're safe, beautiful. Really the reason that we want to.

So I'll give you an example. When my partner and I first started dating, we had moved in together. And I said, hey babe, do you want to go do this? Oh, I don't know, I want to go home good or something

to know where me. And he went now and walked off. Now, to anybody else, they might go, okay, he said no. What's the big deal? I was how on a hand basket.

I was hyperventilating. I started to sweat and this wave of heat came over me. Now, how did I just initially in the moment and like, what do you mean no? It's not really fair to him because now I'm projecting

and I'm using him to validate and reassure me. So instead what I had to do was I had to stop and go, whoa, okay, how old do I feel is I do your seven?

And I said, okay, so this is nothing to do with him. And I said, right, my dad's very dismissive. My dad can say, just shut down and entire any. You just spent seven years on a business plan with one flip of the know that's it you're done.

And so when Ryan came back in, I said, hey, can I share something with you?

“And I think it's really important to ask consent”

to make sure that somebody's in a place. And he said, of course, what's going on? And I used I statement. I said, when you said no, I shut down and I got really disregulated.

And I'm going to be honest, I reminded me of my dad. He's incredibly dismissive, moving forward. It's not that you did anything wrong, but could you just at least let me know your why? So I don't feel at loan on an island.

And he was like, oh my God, of course. Absolutely, that makes so much sense. And then I felt seen her done understood. I felt safe.

We've never had that issue since because he understands

what I need. And I didn't project anything on to him. I was able to understand myself that I could express that to him. But if you don't have that regulation moment,

even if it's doing this for five seconds or just like just doing a noise and exhale, humming can activate your vagus nerve without doing any of that. What we end up doing is we just project on to other people. And then that's just not really fair to them or yourself.

Because we're not actually talking about the issue. It did nothing to do with that. He said no, what had to do with it brought up in me. And now I could express that to my partner. Yeah, I really like that you provided that script

that you provided that example of using these eye statements. Because I think when you say it in that way and your partner is similarly well self-regulated, that's not something they should take offense to. That's something that they should be like,

I'm so happy for that feedback because I didn't understand why you seemed upset in the moment, but I wasn't sure if I should ask you. So that's something that I think the more you do that, the more you can build like a really strong relationship.

Oh, and let me preface. The girl you see that had no problem saying that was not the girl I was 10 years ago. That girl was crying on the floor, begging my ex not to leave me.

Was in the most toxic, tumultuous. I married my father relationship. Like this was a replica of that man, just in another body in another form. It took me saying no.

It took me learning to say it boundaries. And above all, you know, how I got here, I learned how to grieve. Because part of growth, you know, we're all in therapy, right?

We're all doing all this work on ourselves.

“The number one aspect is that you have to learn to grieve”

that there are going to be people that benefited from the fact that you didn't have boundaries. There are going to be people that benefited from the fact that you played small. And then when you say, "Hey, I need you to take a count

"a billion ownership, that's terrifying to them."

But that's part of it. And part of growth and part of expanding something, something called our window of tolerance. Your window of tolerance is how much you can handle with flexibility before you go into hyper-arousal,

super anxious, or, hey, bow arousal, shutting down. So if we want to expand that window of tolerance, we do have to have these uncomfortable conversations. But that's going to come with grieving. Because if you and I are best friends,

and I say, "Hey, I'm so sorry. "I can't come pick you up from the airport. "I have an exam in 20 minutes "and you lose your marbles on me. "I need to be okay with the fact

"that maybe the friendships are on its course, "or maybe that's not the type of person I want in my life." That's okay. That's deep. That's really deep.

You know, I think people don't realize how much mental load you're carrying day-to-day when your finances aren't in order. I mean, we talked about this on multiple episodes, and it's a hot topic that listeners ask about all the time.

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That's SoFi.com/tiger. Now back to the show. So Sabrina, I feel like that leads us perfectly into the topic of boundaries,

“which is another topic that I think you do an amazing job”

of exploring in all of your content. So you kind of talk about how boundaries can be the foundation of standards, emotional safety, and even self-trust. So can we talk a little bit about why, you know,

it's often so hard to do this and then where does this difficulty originate from? And then how can you sort of express boundaries in dating? Boundaries don't keep people out. They protect what's in.

And boundaries for me are a way of keeping you in my life. If I'm setting a boundary with you, that's because I want you to stay in my life. But what I'm saying is this is how I can show up sustainably. So an example when I dated, if I told somebody,

I remember a guy, I said, hey, you know, we matched online. And I said, I kind of have like my own thing of, I don't want to talk endlessly on the app. I'd love to meet in person. It's been a full day and his response was,

well, it's the rush to the altar. And I was like, and so he did, he just,

A lot of people would say he crossed a boundary.

No, he didn't. He showed me that he didn't respect my boundary. It's the same as if I said, I don't call, I don't take phone calls after nine. You didn't cross my boundary by calling me after nine.

I cross my own if I answer. So boundaries are for us. And so how for me, how I start to understand boundaries are like, what did I use to accept that I'm no longer willing to? So if I know, and what I also do is my favorite DBT practice

is think of future you. And so if I know how I set my boundaries of, I don't answer the phone after nine o'clock or I put my phone down at eight o'clock and I don't answer. It's because I know that future me in the morning at six a.m.

when I'm already getting ready for my day and I have to go do things, it's gonna be really annoyed that I was dysregulated all night scrolling on my phone. And so I have to think about, what do I need in order to have a fulfilling

and beautiful relationship with somebody? The boundaries are going to be important. Now, anybody that doesn't respect your boundaries

“is just telling you that they don't respect what you have to say.”

And so when we think about boundaries in dating, what we want to look at is a couple of things. Is there flexibility? Because you don't want super rigid. It's not like, hey, I said it's nine o'clock.

It's never changing at nine.

Maybe their response is, oh well, actually I have my friends in wedding. So of course it's gonna change that night. I'm not gonna be in bed by 11. We want flexibility but we also have to learn

and that goes back to that grieving component is that if I'm going to start to say no and I'm going to say that doesn't work for me and I'm going to use my voice that I have to be okay to supporting people.

Now, where does that stem from? Where do we learn all this from? Let's start going back. When we think about people pleasing, not sending boundaries and things,

I want us to look at in the lens of am I being hurtful or harmful? Am I hurting your feelings? 'Cause I can afford to hurt your feelings, right? If you were to say,

"Sab, I'm only in town one day, "can you get lunch?" And I said, "Oh, guys, I'm so sorry. "I have a huge meeting." I might hurt your feelings.

Versus, "Sab, I'm coming to town. "I need you to drive me to the hospital "because I have one surgery "and I have no one else that I can take me "and they have to have somebody that checks me in."

Sorry, Mom, I need to self-care day. That would be harmful to you. So when we're thinking of boundaries, I can hurt your feelings by saying, "No, but am I harming you or myself in the process?"

Now, the reason boundaries are so uncomfortable is because I'll give you an example for me. I grew up in a narcissistic household. Where when you grew up in a narcissistic household for me and my personal experience

is that the head of the household, the narcissist in the home, we revolve around them. So they are the son and you're the planet's moving around them. So setting boundaries as a child meant

that I could get hit, meant that I would be alienated, meant that I could get in trouble. I wasn't allowed to say, "No, I wasn't allowed to give an opinion." So I learned there's something wrong with me. I'm a bad girl.

If you just play quiet, if you just do what everybody else wants, they're gonna love you. That's maladaptive because here I am in my adult life doing that and these people aren't my parents. So often times we learn that in childhood, depending on

and it doesn't have to mean that you had big tea traumas. I want to clarify that for anyone listening. That doesn't mean that you had trauma, but you had little tea traumas. And little tea traumas could be my mom worked full time

and it wasn't home as much. Okay, let's still impacts you. It doesn't mean there's anything wrong with your parents, but that's still left to mark on you. And so if we learn that's where I go back

“to how old do I feel and where do I learn this from?”

Oftentimes it'll tell us where boundaries feel uncomfortable. - Yeah, something for me over the last year and a half that I've really come into is boundaries, not really in dating as much, but as in friendships. - Yes.

- It's so interesting that boundaries when you talk about your boundaries or set a boundary, where do your friends or the people who are in your life, where do they fall and how do they respond to that? I think it's super telling, because for me,

I'm in my Saturn return. - Yeah. - Yeah. - I know, right? It's crazy.

But like you said, once you set a boundary and you see how people respond, do they respect your boundaries? And we're adults at this point. I just turned 30, and people can be disappointed.

You can disappoint people, but are you harming them? No, but if your boundaries are in place and they're hurt by it, or they're offended by it, maybe they're not meant to be in your life. - Yeah, maybe we should change the relationship with them.

I don't know if we're good at it for 10 years, right? And you think, oh, it's your closest best day. We were together, like if we weren't texting, we were calling, we were calling, we were together, right? Like it was that type of almost code dependency

to the point where most people didn't understand the friendship. They would see us together, and they're like, you're so warm and engaging, and she's so cold and stoic.

“And I think I attached to her just 'cause she was there.”

And I'll never forget, this is 2022,

and that was like the year for me that I started changing the way that I dated, I changed the way I showed up. I started to realize, like, what am I holding onto these people? And we were supposed to go out, and it was like a whole night.

And I, my clothing line software before I started the podcast and everything, before I had this whole career. And I was on like a 14-hour shoot day. It was one of those, like, you're up at five in the morning, and even I was up at four.

We had the whole thing. It was like 8.30 at night, and we were all supposed to go to dinner. And I texted everybody saying, hey, I just finished. I'm so tired. I can meet you guys at dinner really quick.

I'm like 8.30 for me. That's like breath alone, I for me. Like this was a part, I'm in bed now at 8.30. But I texted with the group, and it was a 15 of us. It was a bunch of us.

It was like five of us going to dinner and then a bunch of us meeting after. And one of them was the squirrel.

but I'm gonna call it a day after.

I need to go home and exhausted. Everybody else was fine? No, of course. We'll see you out. She was the only one that wrote me.

You wasted my time. If I knew this whole attitude of like, today was my only day off, if I knew you were gonna waste my time, but not wanting to go out, as I have it.

You know everybody else that's going out. Like your friends with everybody. And that was the moment I realized, like, oh, I don't want this friendship anymore. And I ended the friendship now.

I'm not saying everyone has to be that extreme. That was the straw that broke the camel's back. But it was that type of disrespect towards me being honest, and vulnerable, hey, I'm struggling. I really need to go home.

I don't feel well. I'd like to show up for you in the capacity that I can, but this is all I can give you. And if somebody can't just understand or someone else is coming from and show a little bit of empathy,

that's not somebody I need in my life.

And I have two, three told, I never been better.

I feel like I am currently going through a lot of what you went through in 2022, where once you start to set boundaries for the first time, it's very revealing, like how other people respond to it. And you can be quite shocked and disappointed and sad.

“And I think I might be going through some of that grieving”

that you described. How do you approach it? Is it just like, okay, I recognize that this is how this person is gonna respond, and I'm not gonna try to change them. I can only control myself, and I just need to move on.

Is that it? Like, you just go through the grieving period. Do you have any tips for that? I think, I mean, some valid question, right? Nobody taught us how to grieve.

Who's really ever sat there to be like, there's X, Y, and Z in the side of you get through it. I think it's a few things. I think one vector regulating, right, really having your tools in place,

whether that be when the grief hits like, do I grab a sour candy?

Do I go for a quick walk?

Do I do 20 jumping jacks? Like, what do I do to kind of shake it? Honestly, what I've done before when I get trolls on the internet, I'll punch the air pretending I'm touching them. It's very cathartic, but it allows my nervous system to be like,

oh, look, you fought it off, you're safe now. But I think what it comes with grieving is like, you're not gonna feel better until you feel. So the fun fact about feelings and emotions is it takes 90 seconds for an emotion-torn it's course.

But like, if you really just sat with it, like, let's say right now, both of you were feeling really shitty. And I was like, let's sit with this. If I had you tap in and say, tell me the color, describe the shape, the texture, tell me what it is.

By the end of 90 seconds, I could put all of the money that I have that you would say, oh, it dissipated, it's not as bad, because we have to allow our bodies to feel in order to move through it. Then we can start to listen to the narrative

and say, what do we feel right now?

“Like, if you want to give me an example,”

what is the thought that you've had as you're trying to go through this grieving process? Maybe I thought it's like, oh, wow, I really, I thought we were better friends than that. Like, I feel really disappointed.

I feel, I thought, like, it's like, I gave you so much of myself and now that when I need you, the moment where I need you, like, you're not showing up for me. And context is, as Jean Sister, she is such a giver in her life.

Like, I don't know if it comes across on camera, but like, she's my sister, but like, she gives to me, she gives her a family, she gives her all. And that's like, in every aspect of her life. So I just know that she has just so much love to give to other people.

I trust me, I, like, if my sister walked into this room right now, I'm not a sister. And she said, I like that shirt. I would have had to take it off to give it to her. So I understand wanting to give everything,

but then at the end of the day, we have to say, who's doing that for me? And if I'm not doing that for me? So I think, like, for instance, if that were me, I would say, you know what, I have given a lot to this friendship and relationship.

And now I'm gonna give that to myself because this no longer works for me. I'm allowed to be sad because given what I've experienced and makes total sense of this would bum me out, we're validating your experience.

But then we look and say, well, can I learn from this? Moving forward, I can't be this giving. They need to earn my trust because I'm feeling depleted at the end of this and this doesn't work for me. Even just that, right, you're allowed to go through your day

and say, my heart feels heavy, cool. You know, when it doesn't work is when we shame and blame and try to get rid of it, that's when it's like, you're just gonna keep cycling because what the brain loves to do? The brain loves to finish things.

And so if it doesn't have something to finish, it's like, oh, what do we focus on? Can we hyper focus on this all day until we have a closure for it? - Yeah. - You create your own closure.

One thing I'm working on, which is exactly what you just mentioned, is that I will feel bad about something. And then I'll feel bad about the fact that I feel bad. That is, I think my worst spiraling habit because I'm like, why am I feeling bad about this?

It's not that big a deal, it's, I should have moved on by now. Like, I've already had my grieving time. So then I'm like, why am I letting myself be dragged down by this? So that's the sort of thing that I think, probably a lot of people who are high functioning

and have some sort of level of underlying anxiety or perfectionism or high-achieving tendencies. I think a lot of people go there. - Yes, you're just hard on themselves.

“- Who taught you that you should be over it?”

Like, where did we learn that? I should be over it by now because that's shame, right? I should have known better. I shouldn't be doing this.

I think it's like you said it's back to your survival tactics, right?

“Growing up, growing up, if you had these big tea”

or little tea traumas, it's something that you have to move past quickly in order to sort of survive your day to day. So then let me ask you this. If she were here, right, if your little was here,

what do you think she would need to hear from you? - Like, it's okay. Everything's okay. Let me try that. And I hope you don't mind me putting on the spot

because I find it fun for people to see how it really is. - Oh, wait, I'm next. I'm going to share with you afterwards. - Perfect, that I need your help with. - So, okay, so if we say if you're a little,

let me ask you that if you came to me really struggling and I went, you're gonna be fine. Don't worry about it. Would you believe me? Or would you be like, "Cool, thanks."

Maybe what we can offer that little is, that was never your job.

Your job was never to figure out how people,

how you're gonna make people happy. Your job was never to figure out. And I'm so sorry if I've dismissed you like people did when we were kids. And I'm so sorry if I did that to you.

That's how we grieve. We grieve by going to the parts of us that are saying but I need you. And we get to say, "I'm here for you." - That's the Minner Child Work.

- I love Minner Child Work. - That's the Minner Child Work shit. (laughing) - Fanning her. - It's okay.

And that's the thing is like you're allowed to feel seen. You're allowed to connect with her and say,

“"You're right, someone taught me that that's what I need to do”

but that doesn't mean I believe it anymore." And I give you permission to let go of that. - Yeah, and I think the other thing, the part two of what you're talking about is setting the boundaries.

And then once you've maybe let go of the relationships that are not aligned with those boundaries, it's going into new relationships with the boundaries already set. - Can you understand?

- And like forming those new relationships based on the basis of these boundaries. - Yeah, what did I use to accept them no longer willing to? That way, if I enter in saying, I used to accept somebody taking advantage

or I used to allow it because it's, I think there's a way that we can say it, right? I think for a lot of us will try to shame and blame ourselves like I'm so dumb, how could I have done this. Instead of, oh, I allowed it.

I made a choice for myself. Maybe not a conscious one, maybe one out of trauma, maybe a right in attachment, right? I can hold that space. But like, I even think back on my really

normally relationship where I was saying was my father, I'll take full ownership that I wasn't doing the work. I was not present, it's not all him. I also played a part in this.

I never walked away, I was terrified and it's at a boundary.

I don't hold shame for that, but what I do is I take accountability of that that at least I can say. Now, what are my choices moving forward? Because to your point, you are very giving and loving

and you have so much to offer to the right people. And to people that earned that place in your life because if they haven't earned it, I'm not giving them the keys to my castle because they say it's a pretty house.

And so they have to earn that place in your life because then they feel reciprocal and you feel like your cup is full. And if not, that's okay, you're making choices for yourself. Thank you, yeah.

All right, next, no. But actually, I love this conversation about boundaries. I'm in my Saturn return. I've had a really traumatic friendship breakup that happened about like a year ago and friendship breakups.

Sometimes hurt more than my big breakup, especially if it's like with a really close friend in this experience, it was with a really close girlfriend of mine who I like let into my life introduce to my family and like stayed at my family's place

and really opened up to her and treated her like a sister. Like I would. And it didn't, she didn't reciprocate that. And when I said a boundary, it was this really contentious conversation where she couldn't accept my boundary

and couldn't really own up or take accountability for what she had done and what had gone down. But my thing is my like shame slash trauma loop that I go through is I should have known better. Or why did I let this person into my life?

Like so quickly and I get mad at myself I'm like I should have seen this coming. Why didn't I see this coming? There were red flags along the way where I was just like oh that was a little bit off

or oh she treated this person this way but not me. So like maybe you won't happen to me. So then after this all went down I'm like I'm still kind of recovering and grieving this friendship because it was very very meaningful to me.

And so yeah, I don't know how to kind of get out of like that narrative where I'm like I should have seen this coming. So when we say I should have seen this coming usually what that is is I have the perception of control. Right because if I had if I could have seen

where this went wrong then I wouldn't be in it. So that and that's where you learn is childhood, right? If whatever the scenario is or whatever the situation is wherever you learned that like I know for me when I used to should should should that

is because I was hyper vigilant around my dad. So if I could figure out when he was going to change his facial expression when is he going to get angry as he get ahead us I can protect myself. You can't so moving target.

And so I think instead what I would say is okay and we're going to do the little's again. If you had your little sitting here you're saying that to her.

“Every time you attack yourself and say you should have known”

better you idiot. Well, could you think you're saying that to a sick girl and then we wonder why we were coiled. But instead maybe we can tell or I'm so sorry I talked to you the way adults did with me as a kid.

I am so sorry that I have adopted that you know what? You have every right to have made mistakes because you're a human.

and you really wanted to welcome somebody

and because you both are giving and maybe you really wanted to have somebody that would reciprocate love to you in the way that you show love. And now you learned just to earn that place in your life and that's okay.

- Yeah. - You're allowed to go through experiences and you're allowed to be sad that it ended. But we can also say, well, let me ask you this. What were you scared of happening

if you did walk away earlier? What kept you? What kept you going in the friendship? - The social structures in place are like friend groups

“and people talking and like maintaining honestly”

like a perception or like a semblance that like everything is okay because there were friend groups and things in place that I didn't want to rock the boat or Russell. - It's funny though right now because now you're on the other side

of it right, how is the friendship group? Did it rock the boat, did it ruffle feathers? - No, right. - It's over and I mean not the friendship group but like the friendship is over and I feel better

because of it and there weren't all these massive consequences social consequences that I had in my head. Like those didn't even play out. It was just like what I was afraid of. When often what I hear is also a little girl saying

if I say something over and the family, or when the household or when everyone in the structure I can't be the reason this doesn't work so I'm just gonna make it work. And now it's the same as when I hear people say like

oh I don't want to be too much right? I don't want to say anything. I want to push them away. Okay well if me saying something to you pushes you away

then I never had you to begin with.

So what am I scared of losing? - Okay this is the third one that we wanted to get into. The third concept of I'm too much. - Yeah I'm obsessed with this because I need to hear what your perspective is.

Like if I'm too much, find less.

“So honestly we've seen your clip on Instagram”

from a few weeks ago where you mentioned this. And it's basically you say if I'm too much then go find less and can you talk about how people often fall into traps in dating because they end up shrinking themselves

or trying to change the person because they want so badly to be chosen. - I'm too much came for me for my dad, right? I was too much for him because he would leave. He had no space for our emotions.

I was always in the household of like God's brain and be quiet, stay small, stop taking up so much space. So I felt like I was too much but not enough. Right that's that fun dichotomy of trauma. Like is there something wrong with me?

Why do you keep leaving? I'm not enough for you but then when you're here you don't have the patience for me so I'm too much. - Whoa. - All right it's the root.

- All of a sudden we're like, oh that's not a fun place to be. But really when we start to date and we feel like I'm too much, usually what it is because you're with people that don't have the bandwidth.

You're with people that don't have capacity. You're with people that might be emotionally and available. So you even having a need is too much for them to handle. And that's why we have to reframe.

So there's something called fusion, right? It's like a part-twork terminology. - I don't know this. - And so I love part-twork IFS, that's one of my favorites. And when we think about fusion.

So let's say we say I am this. Like I am anxious attachment. No, no, no, no, you have that. You are not that. - Okay. - And so when we fuse I'm too much,

no, no, no, there might be parts of me that are. You're right, maybe I'm too friendly. Maybe I'm too this. I could be too beautiful. - I'm too smart. - I'm too smart.

I'm just too sexy. And so like when we're too all of these things, we have to start to diffuse and start to ask like, where did I learn that I'm too much? Who taught me that?

For me was my dad, right? My father taught me I'm too much because he did enough patience for my emotions. But I have a partner now who thinks I'm just enough. Because I stop when we try to shrink

and we try to fit and we try to mold and we try to do the what we're saying is I'm self abandoning. What I want doesn't matter. Who I am, doesn't matter.

But I need to be good for you. Because if you tell me I'm good and you validate me, I'm okay. But that leaves us empty because it's a moving target.

This person's always gonna be shifting and changing

and more thing. But what really makes something beautiful is when I can take up space. Because if I'm too much, then go find someone that's less. That's fine.

You don't need to love me. That's the energy honestly my whole career. When I start first, my podcast is called Do The Work. And then we gotta see synthesis. I hope you trade Markter name.

If I can keep you anything. Then I called it the Sabrina Zoher show. And I have people all the time, I've ADHD. My brain works differently, I talk fast, I curse a lot. Like I'm wippy, right?

And all my life society is told me to play small, delve it down, don't be so big, be a good girl. And now I get to take up space and say, "Oh, if you don't like my show, kick rocks without shoes, "I don't really give you shit.

"You could find another show, not everything is for you." And I think that we've gotten a time where you get a participation award if you did something.

“No, you need to learn that that wasn't a good job.”

And you didn't deserve that, you didn't earn that. And that's okay. And so I think for when we're talking about, if I feel too much, I need to understand how old do I feel in words you learn that from?

Because I don't think the adult us genuinely believes that. And I'd be curious, both of you had your littles here. Do you think they're genuinely too much? Or do you think maybe they just didn't have somebody around a new wood to do with them?

- The latter, yeah. - Yeah, I think the negative loop that I get into or like the narrative is like a version of like, I think I'm too much or like, I feel like my burden to people.

Both in romantic relationships and in friendships. Am I asking for too much? Am I, you know, just am I a burden to you? I don't want to feel like a burden.

like not asking for a lot as like a kid,

but feeling like I'm asking or doing too much. - Right. - And because that was that six, seven-year-old Chery was taught that her needs were too much.

“And it doesn't mean that your mom was a bad person, right?”

You shouldn't have capacity, you shouldn't have bandwidth. She's a single mother raising two kids. As an adult, we can consciously understand that. But as a fatata brain, six-year-old, you can't understand that.

So what we have to remember is our nervous system is formed around those experiences, not around what we have now. And so we have to rewire that part of being able to say, like, even my own doctor now, because I was having blood sugar issues.

Now, guess who has to sit before every meal, I've to sit there and repeat, I have to do three breaths and repeat, I'm safe. Because otherwise it won't eat. Because I get so disregulated in my day,

I can't think about functioning that I have to do what I need to do to come back to the present moment and realize there's no one running after me, dad's not taking everything from me, he's not calling the shots, I'm an adult now.

That takes repetition, that takes small little micro-yeses. That takes time. Yeah, I love how once again, this is a concept that it seems on the surface to be about dating and loving relationships.

But again, it's about yourself. It's about doing the work in yourself. And the term you used was self abandonment, right? Like, that's so powerful.

“When you self abandon, that's me saying, yes,”

when I want to say, no, that's me doing why we've all done that. I know, I don't know one woman, at least to this day that I've met,

that has never said no, or that I've never said yes,

instead of saying no. Whether that be in a sexual context, whether that be professional, personal, doesn't really matter, but it's a side. It's a side.

We are taught to be smaller. Like we talked even on the podcast, the Sabrina Zoher show, were you guys running? When we have this society as women, that we have to be in a specific box, right?

Don't take up too much space, don't make noise, be good. Even does something as simple as, like, go kiss your uncle. You're like, I don't want to go do it.

I don't want to do that. We don't get a choice. You don't have a choice as a kid, but now you do. And so I like to think of it through the frame. Like I have every single day on Instagram,

I post a photo of Little Me, whatever age she is. And I talk about it because I want to reconnect and show the beauty, right? I can look back on the hot mess of me, the girl that slept her way through Manhattan,

that was a hot mess that made a lot of mistakes. And I look at her with so much love, because I know she was doing the best she could. - Yeah. And I know that I have no anger towards her, because if I didn't have her, I wouldn't be right now.

And I think we have to be able to say, the more we self abandoned and the more I say, I want you to like me, do I even love myself? And that's a really big question, because if I'm dating or in a relationship,

if I don't stay true to who I am, if I don't stay in for something I fall for everything. - Yeah, I think that's something that takes a lot of repetition. It takes a lot of practice.

It takes a lot of the concept of doing the work to look back at yourself and be like, you know what, I did the best I could, with the information that I had, with the capacity that I had at the time.

And that was what I did. And I did the best that I could. - Yeah. - That can be something that's hard for people to do. People might be me.

(laughs) - I've heard of, I met 'em. - I didn't even imagine it was Jane. - Yeah. - And I used to be her.

Like that's why I speak like this. It's one thing, if I was like, whoa, what have been married for 30 years? I mean, my husband had the grocery store, go try it.

No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. - Like I used to not be able to say no. I couldn't keep a job. I was so anxious, I couldn't still, I couldn't form sentences.

I would, it was palpable the anxiety around other people. To where now and even my family sees me, they're like, oh, you really have done the work. Like you're a different person to nine years of everyday. And here's the beauty.

- I'm not done. - I've got until I take my last breath, I hope to work on myself because this is it. If this is it, I don't want it, right? Like if this is all it is, I think we could do better.

But it's more about being able to say, what is my control and surrender to the outcome? That's to me, like dating with detachment, business with detachment, anything. Is not that you detach from feelings and emotions.

It's that you detach from the outcome. And you're someone to do my best and if my best isn't enough in this situation, that's okay too, but I can't control them. I can only control me.

I think that's a very similar theme that we talk about all the time on Tiger.

So this is just podcast, the idea that you can always be

in your growth stage.

“I mean, you should always be in your growth stage.”

You can reinvent yourself at any time. Like I've said before, the person that I am sitting here today is a totally different person in a lot of ways than I was a year and a half ago. Like if you told me two years ago,

you would be doing a podcast and that would be your main job. I would be like, what are you smoking? Like what are you talking about? Like no, I work in tech. Like I'm head of product at Snapchat.

Like this is who I am. I'm corporate girly. So I think that that's such a strong pillar of belief to have for every person watching, to be like, I can change who I am at any time.

I'm always in development. I'm always growing. And if you're not okay to let go, life is gonna be really tough

All right, my whole thing was like, what's my background? I was in fashion. I want to clothing company. And I was supposed to answer our tank.

Like that was my trajectory. At dating that relationships, not any of this, not podcasting, I was on set for Shark Tank. It was my moment. I'm next to present.

Like I went through every step along the way. And then I guess at home. And I was doing my meditation. I'm visualizing it. I literally was holding the set to go out and give it to Mark.

I'm like, this is my moment. And I lost all of it in one foul swoop, right? One moment of, so sorry, we can't fit you on today. And I went home and I lost myself. And then they did again a month later.

“And I remember just being like, what am I going to do with myself?”

And then my dog got sick. And then I lost him a month later. I realized in that moment, I could be one of two things. I could always me. I could lament.

I could do all these things. I could try to take the ashes from this burning building and rebuild ore. I could be the Phoenix that rises. And I could say that this was happening for me, not to me.

And I could take it. That's a huge ACT is exemptance and compassion therapy. And a big pillar of ACT is being able to find meaning in our situations.

Not the like, anything happens for a reason, it always, right?

I didn't step my toe for a reason. I just did it like I just hurt myself. But if I can extract and say, but when I step my toe, instead of screaming and yelling, I was able to take a breath and come back down to the moment.

Wow, look, it's working. Wait, it's the little moments that we start to see you grow. It's not that you're going to wake up tomorrow and be like, oh, I'm holier than now. But you all of a sudden realized, oh my God,

I didn't freak out like I normally do or that guy cut me off. And I didn't even notice. It's the small little things. Yeah. I just want to say, you don't need

to hear this from me, but I am so proud of you. And just like hearing your whole story, like I knew bits and parts of it, but just hearing you say it out loud and the journey you've been on and all of the self-interspection

and now you sharing it with everyone sharing your tools. Like, I am so proud of you. You're also amazing. You're amazing. And because you're being so vulnerable and sharing

not only like your wisdom, but your personal stories and anecdotes and your pain. And your pain, your fuck-ups. Yeah, yeah, yeah. (laughing)

- My skin's here. - I love it. - It's helping so many people out there. - Yeah. - I think it's feel-seen.

- I myself included. - Thanks guys. - I was gonna say you guys are an inspiration too. (laughing) - But that's a beauty of like rowing and evolving

together, cumulatively. Like I'm a bigger fan of like longer table not a higher fence. Like, what is it? The ships that rise in the tide, the horizon tide, the horizon tide.

- Yeah, the ships and all that. - Yeah. - Because when you're on a loan in Ireland, you feel like it.

“I think that's why truthfully told the reason”

I started TikTok, which is like my, it was my hand on Tehran on my least Irish moment of like, no one's ever gonna see this. They did. And I remember my brother's friends called him

and we're like, what is she doing? Like, is your sister like lost her shit? And he was like, I'm gonna go visit her.

And then he came and at first he was like,

what is that? And he sat down and he was like, oh my god. Wait, you've like built this whole thing because when you start to realize like you're not alone, here's a harsh reality.

You're not a snowflake. And like that's the thing is we're not all these like unique things. We all have all of us have had different life experiences in this room, but we can all relate to the same core feelings and beliefs of,

is there something wrong with me? Do I belong here or might too much? That doesn't mean that there's anything wrong with you. That just makes you human. I love that.

- So Sabrina, I love how all of your advice comes from your lived experience and comes from this all this like really deep work you've done. There are a lot of, I guess self-declared dating gurus on the internet who have a lot of catch phrases.

There's the daddy academies, there's the sprinkle sprinkles, sprinkle sprinkles. - There's the, if you wanted to, he would. What is your general take on all these different like schools of thought?

- To me, those are outcome driven, right? And that's to me why I don't like them. It's very like do this to get this. Do this to have this outcome. The one thing you can't do is control other people.

And that's why for a lot of people, business might be really good for them, right? I know how because in business, there's no emotions in it. If I do X, I get to Y, I get to Z, right?

If I do this, I work hard, I get a promotion, I get my money, I get my job, I keep climbing the ladder. And that's not how relationships work. And so when I hear like the daddy academy

or the sprinkle sprinkles, if you wanted to, what I really hear is like one, you're teaching people how to self abandon, right? If you wanted to, he would. Well, first of all, want and do or two different parts

of the brain, I could want to be a millionaire. But here I am not being one. Is that because I don't want it bad enough? No, that's because I have trauma, I have different things that are out of my control.

“And I think a lot of people throw bumper stickers on”

because it makes them feel like, oh, 140 characters are less. It's the same thing I hear a bit like avoidance, or there were people. Like they're not trauma gotches.

These are human beings with their own lived experience that we have to hold space for. And I think like, for instance, the sheer of seven, sprinkles, sprinkles, sparkle, whatever her stick is.

I had to block her because I never attacked her.

I never went after her. I never, because I don't have time to, right? I am too busy doing my own thing to give a shade about what other people are doing. And she loved to make content because apparently I was teaching

Because there's a difference apparently in her world. I was teaching them to be low value by being independent thinkers, by because I said coffee dates were acceptable, because here's my thought process. Sure, you're basing the value of your worth

based on what you do with somebody, but not who you are, not fundamentally what you believe. And the reframe I had was okay, well, if me going on a coffee date is low value, then that means that if I go on a dinner date,

I really don't value myself.

Because I've never met this person.

And if I'm gonna spend two to three hours and let somebody take me out when I don't know them, that sounds like a waste of my time. Versus, I'm giving you 30 minutes of my time. And let me see if I wanna see you again.

“That's how I determine value is based on my morals,”

my ethos, and my ethics. Not based on clickbait, and not based on views. And I think a lot of the dating advice is keeping you stuck in single or than you need to be, because it's about the outcome and not about the inside.

It's not about who we are and what we are and challenging our thoughts. It's about if you do this, you'll get this. You know what you'll get? You're probably going to get dick pics.

I'm sure. I'm solicited. Oh yeah, but I don't think that by, if I do this, and if I tell a guy that he has to take me to dinner instead of drinks that all of a sudden he's gonna see me

at more valuable, person might just see you as a nuisance. That might just see you as rigid.

They might see you as stuck up,

and they might see you as the princess treatment. But I don't actually think that that has anything to do with your worth. I think who you are is your morals, your ethos, your ethics. Not if you're gonna go to dinner or coffee. You're gonna get the worst of all the stress,

the pain of this school, just relax and then you're gonna get it. No, no, not like that. Like that, it's my taste base. Hmm, you're gonna get it all right?

Yeah, exactly. Like that, it's like that, the one who just understands. The one who just understands the job or the one who understands. That's right, I don't feel like I'm going to get it. - You're gonna get it? - Save.

With this, you're gonna get it. Yeah.

“I think the most toxic or pernicious things”

like coming out of the TikTok gurus in that way is the wanting to control someone or wanting to control the outcome. Because it sounds really good for a sound, but if you wanted to, he would or all these sprinkle sprinkle stuff.

But I think, again, in reality, like we are all humans and trying to control someone else, or being controlled by someone else, is just not good for anyone. It's like we are strong independent individuals

in our own right. That's like self-healing. We're both two pillars, and we put two pillars together, and we can like effectively communicate, we'll be stronger together.

But like the second, that like, I don't know, any idea of like trying to control another person's actions, whether like manipulating them, or like trying to get them to do what you want,

like it just never works out.

It's too calculate. Right, like I went against all those rules. My partner and I slept together on the first day. I left and I was like, "No, never seen that again." To be fair, before we left, I looked him in the eyes,

and people were shocked that I said this to him, and I said, "Hey, "I had such a great time with you, "and please know like, you're girl needed to get some." I said, "But I'm gonna be honest. "I don't do casual, and I don't do friends with benefits.

"If you call me, that's because you wanna build something, "and if not, I won't take a fence to it, "just don't waste my time." And I remember, people asked him like, "Why did you like that?"

And he was like, "Oh, she wasn't afraid to lose me." She was more afraid of losing herself, and not being true to herself. And he was like, "I love the strength and the way that you showed up, "not being afraid that feet didn't like it."

“I did it allu, I wasn't losing anything, and that's what I think is missing”

from a lot of this content, is it's very... Here's how to don't text them back, wait this, don't do this, you're not high value in that, no, there's even it. Have you seen the dating coach on TikTok that says in her bio, seven years, no, not one fight with my husband,

and she, oh wait for it, oh here it is. She tells you to wait three months to kiss somebody. 'Cause it's only gonna get four kisses a year, and my kid is, it's not like, I'm sorry, but here's a harsh reality, not everybody wants to do that.

I wouldn't. - And I'm a woman saying that, if a man told me moving three months to kiss you, like that, find somebody else, go to church, I don't know what to tell you, like, this isn't my vibe, you're allowed to be who you are,

that doesn't make a knock against you, and I think too many of these things are, you have to fit in this corner, in this square, in order to be right, and I look at it as, like, let me expand your perspectives,

and if you want to expand your perspective, come on in. I think the difference is that a lot of these dating gurus kind of give you these formulaic things to do, that would be an expression of a value system, but they're not really teaching you the value system itself,

or like teaching you how to build your own value system. - Agreed. - Whereas, like, I feel like a lot of your work is like, inward looking to be like, okay, what do I truly believe?

Like, what do I value? Who am I? And what kind of partner fits me? - Yeah. - As opposed to a lot of stuff out there,

is just very like one size fits all. Like, do this, do this, these are the rules, and if you do these rules, if you follow this blueprint, you'll get this outcome. If I had listened to it, I wouldn't be with my partner.

He didn't text me every single day. He wasn't super overly, he wasn't obsessed with me off the bat. Like, it wasn't any of that. We were too grown-ass adults,

having a grown-ass relationship and being honest and transparent and having hard conversations from the get.

because there's no point in us being together,

because we're making a conscious choice every day that we're choosing each other. Not that I'm waiting for him to choose me, or that I have to be something to be chosen. - So if I'm too much, go find less.

- I love that.

“And on that note, I think we'll wrap up.”

- Yeah, incredible, oh my God.

You're so wise, Sabrina. - Thanks God. - Thank you for being with us. - Thank you very much. - And for everyone who's watching

where can they find your content?

“- So the Sabrina Zohar Show on Spotify Apple,”

you can see you gals on there as well.

And TikTok Instagram, Sabrina Zohar, this is the Sabrina Zohar Show, my name. Somewhere along the lines, we'll find you too, but all the fun stuff. - Great, and your book coming out in October.

- Yay!

“- Pretty order, not you, but soon enough.”

- Yay! - Awesome. We'll see you guys next time on Tiger Sisters podcast. - Bye! - We're doing big things this year on Tiger Sisters podcast,

and we absolutely want you around, and on the ride and journey with us. If you guys are watching this right now, and you're not subscribed yet, what are we doing? Let's make it official.

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