"The Shape of Jazz to Come" – Ornette Coleman

Dizzy Gillespie said he had no idea what this music was, but it wasn't jazz. And Max Roach once followed him out of the five spot, and punched him in the face. Or net Coleman.

He was divisive, he was revolutionary.

In 1959, he packed the five spot in downtown Manhattan with musical royalty clamoring to hear sounds unlike anything they'd heard before. The music that would define the shape of jazz to come. I'm Adam Ennis and I'm Peter Martin, and you're listening to The Youll Here at Podcast. Music Explore.

Explore Brass in area by OpenStudio, go to OpenStudioJazz.com for Owl. Don't be oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh your jazz lesson needs. I'm trying to be fresh Peter because this album we're listening to today. Inspired new sounds. I thought I would make some new sounds.

That's right. 1959s, the shape of jazz to come. One of the greatest title records, maybe the greatest title record ever. That's a bold statement. That's a bold statement.

What a bold title. Yeah yeah yeah. What great stuff here? What a pivotal record. What a pivotal year, 1959.

How many times have we said that? I mean we said it now.

“I think this is the fifth album we've done.”

Wow. From that year so we did time out we've done really old souls aren't we? We've done kind of loop which by the way we're going to be redoing kind of blue pretty soon. Yeah it's time it's time for a rekind of blue.

We've done Charles Mingus Mingus Ahm and we've done Nina Simone live at the town hall. At town hall and this will be the fifth album and giant step. Well I'm cold train. Is that 1959? It recorded in 1959.

No but you know this is an interesting one. I don't know what your relationship is with the shape of jazz to come. We actually haven't talked about it but for me this is one that hit me at a time in my musical life that was so impactful.

I was a very young man when I heard this for the first time.

“It literally never heard anything like it which is I think probably how everybody else”

must have felt in 1959 you know I mentioned in that intro that Miles Davis was an a fan. Miles would eventually come around and start making music that kind of sounds a little like this album you don't know the influence by the influence by it's and say nice things later on about for sure yeah no it just I think it just hit everybody like a slap in

the face and what I do think about this album is it's like there's no tepid reactions to this album you either have a very positive reaction or a very negative most people I should say I'm sure it's not true for everybody but it seems to like really cause some severe opinions this album or not Coleman is interesting yes as a player he doesn't have the traditional path like almost every other jazz

musician we covered on the show who starts off playing like a lot of sidemen work recording with a lot of people before he does his own thing he did play in like in blues and R&B bands around Texas and South he actually is he from Texas he's from

Fort Worth right I always think about him as a west coast guy but in a way Texas

is yeah but but the Texas saxophone tradition you hear that on here that's so much

“so that totally makes sense I think honestly he was always a one step away from”

jumping up and walking the bar he's a he's a blues musician yeah almost first and foremost and that that is played out on this record I think no but you know we mentioned like the the extreme reactions for some of the musicians but even back in the day there's lower than in 1949 on tour in Louisiana or that was booted off the band's dad he was dragged outside beaten by an angry mob and his horn was

thrown off a cliff that seems like a legend more than it does right a fact but there's all of these stories about him being kicked out of jam sessions being booted off gigs he played a little white plastic saxophone right and he had one on here he had his own thing that was you know for lack of a better word very divisive yeah and I think that's the price you pay for being an absolute

original so here's why his path wasn't very traditional right like usually when we do are build up to these iconic albums there are all these albums that these artists have played on on other people's names not true for one at Coleman he didn't do a ton of other stuff before he made shape of jazz to come in 1959 he made he made an album in 1958 called "Something Else"

yeah that's piano here yeah yeah he made an album in early 1959 called

right up to about you you're mentioning about the 20s even stylistically and

“you hear some of that on the shape of jazz to come I think it's all in chronology”

like the almost like the the the collective improvisation or at least the spirit of it between down cherry in ornamental and New Orleans all as in the roots of the music you just heard it there a little bit of like implied street beat to the way they're phrasing and stuff a real connection with the

tradition of the music so in the late 50s or that was living in California

yeah which is where he met Charlie Hayden yeah and he was working as an

“elevator operator and a stock room clerk in LA while studying music theory on”

his lunch breaks who's hustling he was hustling then John Lewis of the modern jazz quartet heard him called him the only real new thing in jazz since Charlie Parker and got him a deal with Atlantic records the album the shape of jazz to come was recorded in one day and that very same year him and his quartet Donch Harry and Charlie Hayden added by Billy Higgins went to New

York and started a residency at the five spot and you know the Laura goes that

“there would be Leonard Bernstein there with his his ear to Charlie Hayden's”

F-hole in the bass like just they're checking it out and all these these music luminaries gone through a cooler and all these people there to check out owner Coleman he jazz intelligence he just even the the music intelligence yeah the avant-garde intelligence yeah and some of the jazz guys were not super happy about this like you know kind of guy who came out of nowhere right playing

it plastic saxophone sounding not like anybody else and that's you know where the story of Max Roach getting mad enough to follow him up and and

try to beat him up basically right comes from right but let's hear that first

track from the shape of jazz come one of the best opening track we say this on every album well yeah one of the best opening tracks it's true Higgins and Hayden yeah come on like one of the great rhythm sections all time one on top of that those two in particular together one hundred percent and what they're twenty twenty two twenty two years old

a staunch area in the corner that Charlie Hayden on the bass Billy Higgins on the drums oh ten or seven Texas ten or five there. you. you. you.

you. you. you.

you. you. you. you. you.

you. you.

“I saw it as a new vocabulary or net call that harmonic for instance if you play drum”

current all the things you are you play the melody and everyone improvises and takes solos what we do in or that's band is create a from a composition of his so that after you play the melody you create a new

court structure that's always different it's never the same it's moving and here's don cherry on that term

harmonics which is what they call that sort of form and when we speak in a harmonic we speak in a melody and harmony and a good example is when our net would write a melody and I would we would learn the melody and play it in unison together then he would write harmony to the melody and as I would be playing the melody in the harmony that he would write the harmony itself would become the melody and the melody that I would be playing would become harmony

flip it to the actual harmony melody you can hear that in there is that crazy alright let's check out the second track Peter this is eventually so good

so swing it yeah oh hey question so it's just off of the melody everything is off of the melody it's the most

“melody focused music I think has been up to the space”

so there's a line between this way especially at this tempo a direct line I'm going to throw out there

and I wasn't planning on I've never really put this together theoretically but with the with the burnout

style of the 80s which kind of was a little bit of a flash and then it went away although it would show it's so what we're talking about really I think went Marcello's forever Marcello's Kenny Kirkland Jeff Watts Kenny Garrett to a certain degree but like that crew and a bunch of other folks

“I think there's a direct connection between this way of playing especially on a couple of the tunes off of you now I'm thinking back I know”

I know a lot of people wouldn't but in fact I remember he was the one who told me like you got to check out the shape of the house I was surprised

I hate this playing and doing doing like way on top of the thing you do like a lot of stuff to Bob Hurs later on Reginaldville, Charnaff it like a lot of influences there but just this approach where it's like

there's no courts right like it's coming off the melody it's coming off whatever you're creating them with the burnout stuff they were doing there was sometimes there was a form

“but sometimes sometimes there wasn't so I got a little chance to play some of that with them over different times very exciting way of playing but I think it's I think it's more connected specifically”

with this record in some ways or as connected as it is with like Hurri Rontoni which is always like plug nickel during that which was definitely a little bit influenced from this to I think this is what I said you know Miles Davis comes around and you can definitely hear some of this I just think like the entire idea of this we take it for granted now because it's been around our whole lives and even if we if I you know I didn't hear it till I was 22 this album but I heard people who were influenced by this album you heard people who were influenced by this album so it's been amongst our musical culture

our entire existence and for the people in 1959 this would have been out of out of space right it would have just been coming down from a place of complete you know never heard anything to like I mean

and in in popular jazz I'm sure there are people doing this and and don't at me in the comments about like actually and this and I don't know they've been weirder stuff but to take like the scene by storm right in a way right he's gaining like like national popularity in America and look a lot of this like the way I had it broken down it's almost like there's two like straight up hardbop you call burnout but that wasn't coined until later two bebop like hardbop tunes or freebop you might want to call it where they're swinging out hard absolutely and then there's two like kind of beautiful

you know clap you know piece and lonely woman I mean it's all beautiful come on but then there's sort of hybrids the other two tunes but we're going to get into that let's take out peace this might be the most beautiful song on the album

and the way it's the most traditional yeah song you know it's a song song yeah but again

but then it has that the implied harmony here without having to piano but you can fill in the bell it's so great

“it doesn't hurt that Charlie Hayden's playing bass on the bass. I think it's interesting because like Hayden and Hayden's are both like master technicians”

like that brush work you know Hayden oh no it comes in all right when he comes here hmm that's so good yeah

“I think the changes on this are there yeah I don't know I mean they're definitely playing a”

harm at home a lot it's but I mean like they're listening there's a total center but when they're like when Hayden moves away that is a given tape there yeah that's the thing man I don't think they're thinking about these as traditional chord change I think it's all around there's a four there's a four obviously there's a head yeah there's a melody and everything and Charlie Hayden is playing a bass movement

extract an entire chord progression from what they're doing I guess suppose you could should we try it but it's really the beginning notice there's no keyboard here today but there's no no chords because the candle was not invited to this party and we want to respect that but no I don't know man you know it's funny too like

you you mentioned like no one pulls out lonely woman at the jam session I'm first of all that people do

how nerdy your jam session is I bet someone does but this which is weird because actually it's that's the kind of tune that should be think about like the complicated tune to learn how to implement it where it's like wait can you the hand you're going to

“like no just everybody listen all you need to do is learn this melody man have great ears and a musical sense so my son Ivan is is”

13 he's learning how to play the bass right now yeah and he's learning how to improvise and we're working on like you know the forms like the blues and satan doll and things like that and he realized trying to teach a 13 year old how to improvise man this is hard on the blues it's actually harder than you might think yes to learn how to improvise I was like I bet he could like play along to lonely woman yeah and just really get into it in a way that would be like just imitate what they're doing like all they're doing is is is listening to the melody and and I'm in all they're doing

you know it's that's just it's a world class what they're doing but like you could get in there in the spirit of this

without having to know a bunch of changes they all of course know how to play changing like that but this is more like I think accessible yes for not just like players but listeners too well it's like the thing like they had to know and understand and learn advanced harmony in order to be able to get to the point where they could like develop their ears to be able to come and play in this way but then they had to to a certain degree

“be able to like push all that out of their mind so it's like you need to have the openness the confidence”

the ear training but then you can't get stuck in that like if he hears you know hate and go down to that low e can't be like oh I could put this like yes you just be able to react but you also can't just be ignorant and be like oh I don't know what I'm doing I'm just playing random stuff because there's definitely a period um I know when that's supposed to say this it's a safe space okay there was a period of free jazz so called free jazz where the the action and the intent was just like play whatever you want

don't listen to each other now this I'm not saying I'm not trying to disparage any movement or anything it's not about that it's just like anything just like there's not good bebop players it's not good blues players there's not good free jazz players but for some reason because it's free you could get away with that more maybe in that era in that arena right but when you're bringing all the skills and you're able to sublimate those two a greater purpose of playing some some shape of jazz to come type of stuff and like you hear different all of them in a way

“like trying to kind of connect and pull things into something they know I think more with Hayden and Higgins in a way”

because of the rhythm section like there's not this a version so like no we're not going to do a four four swing like dang dang you know but then it's like don't don't don't don't don't don't break it up

but like that groove is always there so they're not afraid to be in the tradition

and even to your point from earlier even to jump back a couple of decades as well as to make those connections so to me that's all about the freedom right the freedom that they're bringing into this that's free jazz hey Peter hey since we're talking about how to get to freedom right using the structure you got to transition that's good you know this brings us right back to over studio jazz.com if you're interested in learning how to get those

fundamental skills to get you to be able to yeah to be able to forget and play shape of jazz to come exactly right you got over studio jazz dot com slash y hi start a 14 day free trial we deal with this stuff in a bunch of different courses especially like nuts and bolts music stuff like the basics that gets you into how to be free we start talking about like chords, scales, learning tunes, how to use narratives improvisation, improvisation, rhythm, all that stuff, you can make it in advance

and what's above advanced shape of jazz to come a structure for you to free start your 14 day free trial at open studio jazz dot com slash y hi that's open studio jazz dot com slash y hi four oh your jazz lesson needs back to the show

okay okay let's get away from that rude commercial interruption back to us buddy you know who put this in a really cool way yeah so Charles Mingus around the time that this album came out he did one of those downbeat blindfold test yeah oh I want to know and you can I'm going to read this for you because you hear Mingus Mingus who's one of the great artists of his time especially like pushing boundaries like all the things we're talking about he made a record in 1959 he did and he but he really cared about this kind of stuff about the new right

and he's taken this blindfold test and at the end of the blindfold test he says

we need more people like that in jazz

now I don't care if he doesn't like me but anyway one night Symphony said was playing a whole lot of stuff and then he put on in ornament Coleman record so he did famously DJ at what was the radio station

“and maybe I think it was a nationwide it was nationwide yeah yeah now he is really an old fashioned alto player”

he's not as modern as bird he plays in c and f and g and b flat only he does not play in all the keys so he doesn't he's not good to go he doesn't take it to all the keys basically you can hit a pedal point c all the time and it will have some relationship to what he's playing right now aside from the fact that I doubt he can even play a C scale in whole notes tied whole notes a couple of bars a piece in tune the fact remains that his notes and lines are so fresh

so when Symphony said Sid played his record it made everything else he was playing even my own record that he played sound terrible wow I'm not saying everybody's going to have to play like Coleman but they're going to have to stop copying bird nobody can play bird right yet but him

now what would fats Navarro and JJ have played like if they never heard a bird or even dizzy

would he still play like Roy Eldridge anyway when they put Coleman's record on the only record they could have put on behind it would have been bird it doesn't matter about the key he's playing in he's got a percussionle sound like a cat a whole lot of bongo's he's brought a thing in it's not new I won't say who started it but whoever started it people overlooked it it's not having anything to do with what's around you and being right in your own world you can't put your finger on what he's doing it's like organized disorganization or playing wrong

“right and it gets you and it gets to you emotionally like a drummer that's what Coleman means to me”

isn't that unbelievable I've never heard so much glaze and shade in the same as you ever but by the tip of the hat to Charlie Mingus Charles Mingus for like putting it all out there and then being open to like a dam he played he's like he's not very good but his music is very good doesn't it make you want to hang with Charles Mingus don't you wish Charles Mingus had a podcast that would be unbelievable that's right man yeah should we do more Mingus that'd be fun

yeah for sure next up is the penaltimate song focus on sanity and I'll do it to the penaltimate woo doesn't see nobody can put a seat paddle to it that's right he wanted this except no this title focus on sanity to be the name of this record an Atlantic side the ship adjusts that's a great name focus on sanity yeah I know can't say that

so I'm say that's the swing and rhythm section right there I don't know by the way or not game space to go ahead listen to this album is like listening to a set yeah this is the point of the set yeah where would they they would put this long extended right they so it works really well wow Charles Mingus what do you actually twenty two others you know what somebody great players

or I don't I'm not gonna say twenty two is young anymore just amazing for somebody

I was doing great stuff at twenty two so I shouldn't be raised

“I was listening to the album that's right man maybe that's why it hit me so hard”

that was the age of these guys when they made it on you know what I mean so Charlie Hayden Charlie Hayden was I actually got a chance to play with them a couple times and mostly yeah totally like you duck early nineties we did a tour in Europe for a while I want to say a couple weeks it might have been like ten days with Roy Hargrove quintet and Charlie Hayden quartet west where we were doing like concerts

and these cool little like three hundred four hundred seat theaters in France and I think we went to Germany a little bit of Italy but it was a really fun tour and for some reason like Charlie insisted on like opening each night yeah he was just like now you guys are young and can't we just I don't even want to do his voice but he had a great we saw like very distinct yeah man so it was very you know that's not a good version of it

but impression of everyone in the play with sometimes it seems like that

no but he was so kind with us it was Roy Hargrove Ramblake Rodney Whittaker what a great Hutchinson yeah no that was Roy's band it's a smoke show of a band and then Charlie had this great quartet and they were Roy and Charlie were both on ver records

“actually I think that Charlie was on jitton tell me that Roy and Charlie played a ballad together at some point”

oh yeah for sure for sure hey a million dollars to hear that for sure oh good because I've got all my followers

actually that I mean you got a jump drive no so basically he would play quartet west which was a great band this was one of the great 90s bands they actually have some records that we should do Lawrence Marable I believe was his name on drums it was all quartet west L.A.Cats Charlie had been out there early Watts on saxophone sure sure sure sure sure sure you know from the tonight show and I'm what was his name I was going to say Andre Watts on piano

it was not Andre Watts it was I remember his name in a great pianist legendary like Hollywood film composer but also great jazz piano John Williams no no really really like serious I'm Allen Allen something I'm space on his name great cat apologies but he would the theme of the band was they would place music of like old Hollywood from the 30s and the 40s and like standards but not like all the things you are like stuff that that

I mean maybe the 40s and 50s I'm much sure but like film noir stuff and and it was made I can still remember how they sounded but Charlie was just killing it every night and then he would stay like listen to us and we would hang and was such a all of them it was it was a great experience for Allen broadband Allen broadband of course Allen broadband

“yeah Charlie Hayden one of my all time favorite musicians honestly the album that's”

impacted me the most in the last ten years yeah of all the albums I've I've heard is the duo album with him and Hank Jones that I just you were talking about yeah where they called steal away where they're playing all of these hymns just to hang Jones and Charlie Hayden for like the mid 90s and it's one of the most gorgeous albums I've ever heard and it's been such a huge influence on my playing as a

yeah that's it list. Don Cherry II Peter Don Cherry is an important part of this playing the pocket trumpet the cornnet and such an interesting player such an

incredible sound yeah one of my favorite parts of of the story of the album

and the Don Cherry connection though this is going to seem a little crass but you know Don Cherry had some kids who made music that's right you know that well one of which I knew the other one I've learned about so they he had kids who were musicians two of which had mega pop hits big hits they were big I guess you could call him one hit

“wonders I don't know Nina was I think I don't mean a cherry and Eagle I cherry both had”

huge hits so here's Nina and if you don't know the songs you do know the songs here's Nina Cherry said if you're on the certain age I think this is 89 or 90 maybe I'll be hit so that's Don Cherry's daughter Nina and this is Don Cherry's son Eagle I in the mid 90s this was so popular when I was in high school I just think it's I think it's so interesting I just think it's so interesting after

listening to this album and hearing all this amazing avant-garde playing by Don Cherry

and his two kids have these huge like hugely produced pop hits all of producer all our staff is getting excited like all you do with that record I know they wouldn't wait no I cherry all right so the the last track on the album is congenial wait what about chronology oh sorry the second to last you're putting all to me yeah excuse me that's okay another hard spot yeah I have the song free ball

it is free ball it's free ball it's free ball it's free ball from all oh it's so playful hey yeah I mean at this time the way the way he's phrasing though I could see

like he's going in and out of almost a robotic within the line right

“oh yeah compared to like bird yeah cannon ball sonny train”

but is there a train without or net you know he definitely or these train shape 65 66 shapes the jazz that would come before we get to the categories there's one more track to get out this is this is short record by the way it's like 37 and a half minutes here's chronology what a great song

I always thought this was really the change I don't know if it is

I felt like it was there take on the change it's got the bud yep it's definitely a lot of fun what I don't that's seven bars seven seven eight seven we're a hard group influenced by don't share a bunch I talk about a progressive player yeah what a great part now am I speaking out of time if I were to say that don't share an ornette did not

“have like part of I think the balance of this that somehow works beautifully”

don't share an ornette did not have the technical prowess that Charlie Hayden and Billy Higgins had you think so I think so it's you know but it's not but it doesn't like there's no detriment to the music on this like if I really listen to it and like Charlie Hayden and Billy Higgins were like master technicians and like just great at their instruments right I don't think any of this matters to the

listener actually like how good is your technique or what it's like with a

a painter like certain painters who don't find incredible technique somewhere

not as much but that but the artistic vision and execution can be equal if not greater either way it's just that when you have a quartet there's a symmetry there and a balance you know that I just think works well I think it depends on where you put you in technique right like so what do you what your calling technique depends on what you put technical value on when I just talk about basic stuff like kind of like Megus was saying

how I'm thinking you can play a scale yeah but the artistic vision of Don Cherry or an ornette Coleman is of the highest order yeah that's that's the technique is like the artistic technique you know more than maybe the instrumental technique

“maybe that's what I'm saying and there's balance in this and I mean we got a”

little flick a couple weeks ago when we were comparing like Charlie Parker to punk rock

for being underground and it wasn't that was definitely like yeah Charlie Parker is not in punk rock like compared to punk rock in that Charlie Parker was a masterful technician and punk rock musicians didn't give a shit about being more that is a bad job and this is kind of in the middle of that a little bit where it's like part of the art of this is how different it sounds from all of these

flashy technical players that would have been around them at this time. I just think like by the way that's a thing now like this is a genre of jazz of course but I just think that the bat like we shouldn't like when you have a masterful record like this a document that stood this set it's you know test of time and it's just has so many different angles and to enjoy it from I think

looking at the balance of the players like if everybody has the the level of technical you know in terms of the rhythm section that maybe Don Sherry and Ornette Coleman had maybe this doesn't work but maybe you know Charlie Hayden and I'm oversimplifying apology no but Charlie Hayden and Billy Higgins maybe they're being elevated with the artistic freedom you know what I mean

so it because none of this really matters like what is the output yeah what is the whole result one of the greatest that maybe they got lucky maybe ornette was a genius like I'm going to get this kind of the whip but whatever reason it comes out like sometimes having all like master technicians on their instrument of band is not fun you know what I mean and look not

everyone's going to be a master technician it's degrees man yeah and a master but like the whole thing is like from a quartet from a trio or duo anything time you get beyond solo piano okay can I be honest about this I actually find the then diagrams of people who are master technicians and master artists to be almost two complete separate circles like that's my opinion on this

but I mean you know and really the only person who's linking them up is kind of art fatal you know what I mean who's in them but even people think he's too flashy and too as too much fireworks people think Oscar Petersen is too technical right so it is just a matter of taste some people might think that this is this this playing is

BS because it's not you know Jackie McLean it's not technical it's not

ways that like a you know a Charlie Parker is where it's just obvious like holy smokes nobody can do that right so and some ways look or that has such a distinctive sound but like if you put it with like sunny stance on a relance culture around this time like you could you it's just specifically you could say about the roundness of his tone well I mean tone is different

because like if you have a sound you're killing it right but I mean just in terms of like finger technique and and that kind of thing I mean the intonation actually like they have a lot of control of the intonation

and so I'm just talking about like here's what makes this is what makes

bird and culture in I think in particular yeah so special is that they are technical masters of their instruments like right no doubt yeah and they pushed the art that they were making forward ten years both yeah and there's varying degrees of that and all the people that we love and talk about but I think with those two in particular and and I'm sure everybody has

“their favorites that they think that's what I'm saying it's a degree of”

taste with what you like this kind of stuff I just think man this combination I love it I mean not to say that if you took anyone it's not like all they need each other no I'm just saying on this music the balance of this record is is incredible you know just for you this extra track that was added on later is fine I mean it just I was used to the flow of the six

tracks that's all that's why we're not listening to that one let's get to some categories so our categories we have not eight categories yes and we'll start with our desert island tracks if you had one track to take from this album on a desert island which would be I would say peace I love peace but I mean lovely lonely woman is lovely as well pieces are great

call I have lonely woman I think you can make an argument for either you know apex moments what's your apex moment I love Billy hey we didn't get to it Billy hey can solo on focus on your sanity focus on sanity at the end we could maybe just play a little and then the way the way they end it come back with the so called melody really cool I mean it's masterful

this song one of the great three drums jazz drum solo really and really the you know the whole build up we won't get in all that but like where this comes from is like it's kind of the the apex moment of this track and like the whole thing we have to the so good

that's amazing yeah you know what I have for apex moment here's what I wrote

down I mean no I don't that's not what this album is about I have that I really

“think one of the like Billy himself I love this so no I really think one of the”

striking things listening to this now you know like I said this hit me when I was really a younger man and I don't pull this out as much as I probably do other albums at the moment but the way that this hit me listening to this week was that like you talked about like that went and banned with Tane and Kenny Kirkland and Miles is at the plug nickel a lot of those bands have this

amazing way that they apex these solos you know there are these incredible apex moments I mean we were we listen to like Stevie last week and the whole album yeah yeah and it's just incredible what's interesting about this is even though they're doing all this intense stuff and it's so free it stays at this there's so relax yeah and it's so even even as these things are happening it is

not this like intense build of this this intense build of this now we break it down this intense build of this everything maintains the simmer I love it about it that's great and it's like there's ebs and flows but there's not peaks and there's not peaks and valleys but there's like curves and swirves I don't know the

“describe it but that's how I truly feel about it but what do you got for a”

bespoke playlist title I mean I'm going to just go to the classic well this is classic 1959 you know like you could you we've talked about and debated but you could just have a playlist of all music from nineteen fifty nine and it was the jazz from nineteen fifty nine and it would be quite varied yeah I have music that starts a riot and you could put this

with some Stravinsky and I put this with a little bit of the clash you know what I mean like put it with a little bit of like oh this is dangerous music right and people are pushing back and it that's a good way to get a quibble bits quibble bits I mean you disagree with even no matter how my noot I mean just I mean this was silly what no piano

that's for selfish reasons it doesn't need that I had a similar just a funny one which is like could you some cords it's not true harmonomics is great but what about harmonie a little you've heard of a diminished court guy's come on snobometer I mean how snobby is this this is

one not snobby at all ten more me to go first you want to go first I

got a ten you got a five this is a classic five if this is that okay

time it's one of the scobbets dude this is on like every top ten jazz albums it's like checking the box that's the free weird word everybody knows it what's not I'm not gonna disagree with even if it's even if you say when I count Coleman is snobby you'd be like free jazz over shape jazz to come this is a very commercially successful okay I mean I

think this music if you don't like you you even said it in the beginning

“of the show you can't come into this unseason you have to have listened to”

a lot of jazz to even understand where this is coming from and there's a better measures well that's how easy I want to get like you a lay person who has

never heard this music if this was the first jazz they heard they'd be

like I don't understand what's going on I know but a snob would be like ah that's not even as best right okay so that's why I said five but on Linda would not like this record that's why I can't go on so she would she would get violent she would start to write is this not a quiet right no is this better than kind of blue no no it's damn good it's damn good

but I don't I don't prefer it to kind of blue no of all though think better than it's so stupid this category because it's so different than kind of blue it's so ridiculous to compare them okay but we talk if I'm just talking about my own personal listing habits which kind of I listen to more in my life kind of blue wins yeah for sure

a couture mouse going eight and I would almost go nine but this the the topography or the font of the crazy for me that's a feature not a bug I mean it's so I mean everything and the pictures are great but to me that takes away a little bit it's good though I got a

“nine I think it's really good I really fit that the vibe of the album so”

well so that's good the only reason I don't have a 10 is because I wonder what it would be like if they let or not name it focus on sanity I know I mean I'm including first of all I just love his sweater yeah this sweater with shirt tie yeah and the tie is kind of hidden under that combination that's not a man or net even though

you know I mean he's playing this this avant-garde music incredible

dresser yeah incredibly well dressed as snappy dresser I mean I would almost push up to a nine if we're taking the title into the couture once because this is one of the I would give the title a ten of the jazs that's up next what you got um I don't know oh free jazs perfect yeah actually so this is one thing I would think about and this is why

almost uh a quick-cated on kind of blue better than kind of blue this

“kind of music I remember like once you get into it listen to this whole”

album like I've been doing on the LP the last few days yeah like it makes me want more like I can't listen to this and then be like oh let's go listen to time out let's go listen to KLB you want more like it seems yeah I want to go to free jazs yeah I mean I know well I want to go to Eric Dolphys out to lunch out to lunch one of my great albums of all

time yeah I just covered around the same time I discovered this album I love them both they're like family to me at this point you know what

I'll my truly love but I would never listen to after this but I need

a baker's rapture I don't know why I'm thinking of that but we're going to throw that coming up next uh hey by the way did you know that we have a love letter if we had a newsletter what would we call it from the you'll hear a pocket uh you'll hear it written addition dot com snappy snappy title no it's called you'll read a Peter oh you'll read it

okay we're going to get insights in behind this go to you'll read it dot com no just click the link in the description to sign up for the newsletter yeah and yeah oh we have some some more notes oh no that's from the record yeah hey we aren't we were nominated for an ambie I know we need an ambie it's an ambie it's an ambie ambience we did not win

shout out to uh twenty thousand hearts yeah twenty thousand Dallas and the crew yeah we were we were we were some good people there I mean I watched the we're going next year is this show good it's good it's pretty good I don't know I wish I had to take an ambie right before watch the that kind of threw me off a little bit yeah your text got super dark

all right until next time you'll hear it [BLANK_AUDIO]