148 | From Pro Athlete to CEO: The Science of Reinvention with Idris Haroon

This is becoming undone. [MUSIC] It was tough, right?

“Because there were highs and lows, you know?”

I was always a tweeter, right?

Like I was, I was always a guy that was, didn't really have the stats of a Joseph Boyer or a Teddy Brouski. I had a solid year, I was all conference. But the NFL didn't really know. Didn't really see why fit in, but in the end, you know,

draft day came and it went. And, you know, nobody was calling over a free agent contract. So the first call was the Canadian Football League. So I had a lot of success, and then, you know, the cold came and then the injuries came.

I didn't know how to play with everything's turf in Canada, his own natural field. So it was just the environment, my body. It was just a combination of things, I got hurt, and then eventually, you know, they kept me around on the practice roster.

But then they eventually signed some more guys, and then, you know, they kind of weeded me out. No, I'm different. I tried to quit every day for differences. What people need to understand is having multiple voices in your head

is a healthy, you're not crazy. I encourage everyone to have multiple voices in their head. And this is for me, this is what works.

“I have a voice in my head that says, "Drease, what the heck are you doing?”

Quit now. Go back to your corporate America job. Please. Then I have another voice in my head that says, "Drease, don't quit. Don't give up.

Don't ever give up, right?" And that's the coach told me, right? And that's the coach told me, that was the mentality. But for me, I think I was able to treat the real world like my NFF. And once I was able to switch that mentality like, you know what?

I'm tired of saying, I should have been, I should have did. I should be there. I'm going to switch my mentality and say, you know what? I'm going to treat the real world like it's my NFL. Just work that one.

I am your Dresarone, and I am undone. Hey, friend, I'm glad you're here. Welcome to yet another episode of Becoming Undone, the podcast for those who dare bravely, risk mindly. And grow relentlessly.

I'm Toby Brooks, a speaker, author, professor, and performance scientist. I spent much of the last two decades

“working as an athletic trainer and a strength coach”

at the professional collegiate in high school sports setting. Over the years, I've grown more and more fascinated with what sets high achievers apart. And now failures that can suck in the moment, can end up being exactly the push we needed

to propel us on our paths to success. Each week I'll be coming on then, I invite new guests to examine how high achievers can transform from falling apart to falling into place. I'd like to emphasize that this shows entirely separate

from my role at Baylor University, but it's my attempt to apply what I've learned in what I'm learning and to share with others about the mindsets of high achievers. You know, over the years I've been blessed to work

with lots of athletes who were not only great players, they were great people too. If you've listened to the show in the past, you know I did a deep dive on the life lessons and legacy of the late coach, Dick Tellmey.

And I didn't know it at the time, but I got to work with the team as a graduate associate at the athletic trainer in what would be coach's final season at Tucson in 2000.

Although that team never quite lived up to expectations,

it was the season I'll forever be thankful for. Although I got to Tucson in 1998 and I helped out with the team for the 98 and the 99 seasons, 2000 was my first full season assigned exclusively to a major D1 football program as a certified athletic trainer.

And there were some cool perks that came along with that, at least in my mind. The travel, the bag full of Nike gear, tons of learning, but above all else I got to serve a talented group of people, who genuinely cared for one another,

and a coaching staff that loved them and loved us. Team had several players who would go on to pro careers during my time in Tucson. Now familiar names like Lance Briggs and Dennis Northcut, Marcus Bell and Drunk Kennedy,

Brandon Malay Malayuna, all played me in a foul. And there were others who played in other leagues, like Pascal's Brad Brennan, who played in Japan. And today's guest, Idris Haru, who played in the Canadian football league.

How cool it was for me just a few months later to be teaching in a college classroom at UTEP, telling stories about patients I'd worked with just a season before, who were now in pro sports. Not violating any hip-a at the time I promised.

I loved it. However, not every transition is a smooth one. I missed my team, I missed my coworkers. I missed being under the leadership of the head coach who was one of the finest leaders I'd ever be blessed to serve.

And it wasn't just me. From coaches to players to staff members, it's safe to say that everyone from that Wildcat team that I've spoken to since has described a similar feeling of grief for the loss of what was.

And for all involved an incredible part of our young lives.

When Idris Arun first stepped on to the University of Arizona campus as a young defensive lineman, he carried the weight of expectations.

that had promised football could be a golden ticket. And for a while, it was. From the brotherhood of Dick Tomey's locker room to the cold, hard fields of the CFL, Idris chased the game with grit, heart and humility.

But what happens when the roar of the crowd fades in the jersey no longer defines you? In this episode of Becoming Undone, we talk about what it means to let go of the only identity you've ever known.

And how to build something even better in its place. From humble beginnings and inner city Houston, to founding a thriving logistics company, built on purpose and people. A tree shares the brute truth of transition,

the power of discipline, and the quiet heroism of not quitting.

“Even when the voice in your head tells you you should.”

This is a story of re-invention, resilience, and redefining what it means to win. I hope you'll enjoy my conversation with the Dressaroon in episode 148. Let's get into it.

Greetings and welcome back. Becoming Undone as a podcast for those who dare bravely, risk, mildly, and grow relentlessly. Join me, Toby Brooks as I invite a new guest each week. Where we can examine how I achievers

can transform from falling apart to falling into place. Today's guest knows what it means to chase a dream, to live it, and then face the question of what comes next.

I first met a Dressaroon when he was a standout

defensive lineman at the University of Arizona, and I was a lowly-gratchiveness system, athletic trainer. But Dressaroon's carve-out a name for himself, not only on the football field, but has an entrepreneur. But like so many high performers,

his journey didn't stop at the final whistle. Today, he owns and operates a business. He's husband, he's a dad.

“He's redefining what strength looks like on the field,”

and navigating everything off of it. So without further ado, Dressaroon, thanks so much for joining me today. - Thanks for having me, Toby. This is a great platform,

but this is a story that needs to be told, and there's something heroic about it. Everybody needs to hear a row, especially in today's climate, and I think you're providing a platform for athletes to really tell their story,

but give hope, give hope to a lot of athletes out there that are going through this tough transition. - Yeah, well, I appreciate that. You're looking sharp in your U of A gear,

so that's where our path's first crossed.

Let's take it way back even before then though. What did you want to be growing up and why? - Yeah, you know, I grew up in the inner cities at Houston, Texas, you know, fortunate to have a beautiful mother and father

in my life throughout my whole life, and a big family, you know, siblings, two older brothers, younger sister, all in a small space, all in a small little space, and Houston, and we didn't have much,

but we had each other, you know, we had discipline from the pox and loves from the moms, a good balance, and so, you know, it was really to sky as the limit, you know, our parents told us we could be whatever we wanted to be.

And, you know, to be quite honest, you know, with limited resources and a lot of siblings, there was a lot of angry issues that I had growing up, fighting with my siblings, and mad because of the conditions that we had,

and that was just a mad kid angry. And until I found football, football was my cure. Football was my savior, and it just gave me an outlet, a place to release a lot of the aggression. And so, once I put the helmet on at, you know,

10 years old, it was hard to take it off. And so, you know, I just did it as something to do, as to keep me busy and just they had a trouble. But when I started getting those letters from schools, my sophomore junior in high school, I was like,

oh, I could probably go to college and get education with this. And so, focusing more on that in high school. And then, you know, people telling me how good I was. And, you know, the NFL is, is I'm destined to be in the professional, right?

I'm destined. You know, from a young age, people tell you, you're going to the NFL, you're going to the NFL. So, of course, it's like, for young kids, it's like, I'm going to be an NFL player, right?

And that's just what I told myself. I'm going to be an NFL player and all the way up into high school and through college, until I wasn't an NFL player.

“Yeah, I think that's such an interesting perspective”

because that drive to be at the highest level would take you further than if you just, I want to be a standout on my high school team. But the darker side of that is if you don't achieve that, no matter how far it takes you, it can still feel like failure. And so, we'll dig into that a little bit later.

But first of all, in my introduction,

I didn't include all of your flour, so to speak. I mean, you were there for the best season in school history in 1998. You were also there for Coach Tomi's final season and kind of his unceremonious let go.

And that season was just so close to being a great season, but it ended up being a disappointment. So, when you first showed up in Tucson, I spent a lot of time on this show, kind of dissecting Gick Tomi and what he means to people

You know, we got this little fiery white guy

from rural Indiana and he's bringing together Polynesians. And, you know, a guy from inner city Houston and clay heart from Tucson. I mean, people from all different walks of life and they are a brotherhood.

They are connected in a way that I don't think we see any more in this day and age. But 18 year old, he's showing up in Tucson. What was the aesthetic? What were you listening to?

What were your teammates and friends say about young you on campus at you of age? I was very young and I was there was what's interesting is I didn't know that Arizona was ranked 10th in the country

“and playboy as one of the top party schools, right?”

So, I came from a very religious household. I came, I was raised Muslim home in the Muslim household, very strict. And so, going from a very strict Muslim household to the 10th rank party school in the country,

was, oh, it was awesome, right? - Oh, being 18.

- Everything was so new, everything was so green to me. The landscape, right? The mountains and the heat and it's just the palm trees and it was just all of it was different. I mean, I had a chance to stay home.

I was recruited by Texas A&M. I was recruited by Kansas State University. I took trips there, but there was just something about Tucson that attracted me. And I'm a Southern boy, I like the heat.

So, you know, the heat was where it was and 12 months out of the year, walking around the shorts and flip-flops, but it was told me, it was told me. Like it was, it was, you know, the recruiter

for Texas A&M walked into my house, you know, the recruiter from Kansas State walked into my house. But when, coast told me walking to my house, it was different. And it was different because coast told me

“knew how to relate to those kids who had dads, right?”

I had a fan, he was walking in houses a single parent moms, right? So, he knew he was walking in, you know, all kinds of houses, a lot of Polynesians on our team. He was, he was walking into a lot of households.

So, he knew how to deliver the message to the dads, right? Moms, the message to the moms, they just want to know that their boy's taken care of, right? Fed, can they clean their clothes? Are they eating, right?

But dads, right? He knew how to touch the dads. And he did, he set out with my dad, took a shoes off, he set in the live room, he explained to my dad, the benefits of Arizona, but, you know, the culture

and the brotherhood and, you know, all the things that dads want to hear, right? And then he got all to the bells and whistles and all that, all the perks, all that. He just spent a lot of time on that.

He talked about, he talked about the brotherhood, he talked about the coaching staff, the family, oriented atmosphere. And, you know, and that was it, that was it. And for me, family was the biggest value.

I grew up in a big family and a small space. So, family was everything for me. And so, to ask you a question, arriving in Tucson and being in that room, what 120 guys, and everybody was just coming out of the same type

of environment, right? You know, inner city kids, all in Asian kids, three star, four star, scrappy kids.

“We didn't really have a lot of five star kids, right?”

There wasn't egos. We didn't have Coach Tome didn't. If you had a e-go, you're not coming Arizona. You know, if you're a flashy guy, you know, I mean, yeah, we had LA guys were flashy.

We had, you know, I'm not going to name their names, but we asked LA guys, they were like, wow, there they know who they are, right? They know who they are. You probably had them on the show.

But no, he goes, right? And so, just that day, we reported, I remember my parents. We packed up our little Toyota Cam. We drove the Tucson.

And I just remember being dropped off at the hotel. I write off of, I'm a corner there off a camel. And we all just reported there. And then from there, we went to Camco Cheese. And we spent three weeks in the middle of nowhere

that desert, and like, what the hell are we doing here? It was like Mars. For a increase, Tucson was a stark departure from its modest upbringing in inner city Houston. The mountains and the heat of the Tucson Desert

were a far cry from the sweltering humidity. And near sea level of home. But they provided a decrease with two things

that were critical to the next stages of his growth,

opportunity, and community. Arizona was only a few seasons removed from the famous desert swarm defenses. And their peak in the early 90s, but those airs on the defenses of the late 90s were serious too.

And regularly ranked in the top 10 in the nation's statistically. But also the walkouts offered community. Dare I even say, family. Part of the reason for that success on defense

was the way the defense swung to the football and not only created turnover but celebrated them. Famously, one of Coach's five keys to victory was to win the turnover battle. And as a defensive line, when a dress was on one end,

and future NFLer roommate and friend Joe Toffoya, who you'll hear about in a minute, brought the pressure from the other side. And while sometimes a bit uncomfortable at first and sort of awkward at times,

and brotherhood 20 plus years ago, is something I've heard players on those teams reference how they lead in their homes. They're workplaces, their businesses, and their communities today.

For a dress, it was exactly what a young talented and impressionable young athlete needed.

But it didn't always mean that it was easy

or enjoyable. - But it was, I mean, I was just very open, very green. And then the competition, right? Like these guys were big and fast and hip.

“And so it was a learning experience really quick, right?”

- It was definitely a different era in college football and you show up on campus and you're there for the duration. You're gonna grow and you're gonna enter as a wild cat and hopefully end as a wild cat and coach Tommy's famous for a lot of tomyisms,

but one is the team, the team, the team. And so for a young kid coming out of Houston from modest means who has dreams of playing in the NFL, the team, the team, the team, may be a little bit different.

And he was able to kind of take those personal aspirations and mold them into team goals. You were there to witness the high and the low really of his career and the release. And after that 2000 season, you're gonna have to play professionally.

What did that seeing him navigate those ties and those extremes and the energy he brought to practice? What did that teach you as a man that you've seen kind of carry over and to even your work today?

- So I have a lot of stories because Tommy's stories, but one of my favorite is when I was freshman sophomore year, so you're a point of the team, the team, the team. This is when I learned that lesson.

“So my freshman year, I think it was my freshman year.”

And I started skipping classes. And so I thought, you know, hey, skip class, go hang out, go do something else, no big deal, but it was a big deal. And it was so much a big deal that I show up to practice one day and we line up for our normal warmups.

And there's 120 guys out there and Coach Tommy gets up and he says, hey guys, before we start warmups today, I need to point something out to you guys. Dress her room, come up to the front. - Oh no, I'm looking around like, oh, okay.

- Did I win something? - No. - Or did it call down about to win a award? - I get up or flat and he's like, "Dress her room thinks is cute to skip class."

So what we're gonna do is, and they brought out a chair and put it right in front of me. Dress is gonna sit in this chair and watch 119 of you guys pay for him skipping class. - Oh no.

And the next thing I know, I'm looking around and everybody's looking at me

“and then there's these things call up downs, right?”

And so you're jogging in place and then the coach blows the whistle and he says, "Hit!"

And you hit the ground and do basically

you're doing like a burpy or something. You're hitting the ground and popping back up. Hit! Up and down, up and down and it's the worst. And after about 50 or 60 of those,

you're gone, you're done. And Coach is going and going. And I'm trying to do them with the guys to show 'em like, "Oh, I'm so sorry, guys." I didn't need to put you in this situation.

Coach Tommy gets me, puts me right back in the chair and says, "No, you don't watch this." And so 119 guys paying the price of me skipping class was the first lesson about being a man that he taught me. He taught many lessons, but the first lesson.

And after that, it was a one. And then afterwards he got up, he hugged me and he was like, "We're one fail, all fail." Dress, one fail, all fail mentality. This is how we're going to operate, one fail, all fail.

And I never forgot that, yeah, I skipped a couple classes here

and there I learned the system, I figured it out. But that was the first lesson that Coach told me really taught me about life. Because when he coached us, he coached us, he had to perform on the field,

but he was preparing us for life. And that's what I love about. - It's tremendous, that's a powerful lesson. And one, especially that young in your career to see seniors and fit your guys have to pay the price

for you, certainly left a mark. So that 2000 season ends, unceremonious defeat. I don't know, we're on the road at ASU. I think that was a home game. - I don't know. - I don't know.

- Yeah, two years in a row, we lost ASU. But either way, your career at Arizona's done, what's your mentality like? Not necessarily in that locker room, but you're still firmly committed to this goal

of playing professional football. Talked me through what the closure of your college career was like and where you were at mentally. - It was tough, right? Because, you know, it was, there were highs and lows.

You know, we played in the very unique defense. It was an Eagle Flex defense. We had, you know, you see a lot of it in the college and NFL now, where these guys are kind of jumping in the gaps,

you know, in between the center and the guards and then they're moving, Michael Parsons, you know, they're moving back and forth. I really doing that in the 90s. And, you know, the skiing we were in, Teddy Brucegee,

when I was getting recruited, they showed me how I take to Teddy Brucegee. Everybody knows Teddy Brucegee. So when Coach Tommy was like, getting to the football portion of it,

he was like, hey, you could be like this guy. This is the guy you were replacing. You're coming to Arizona to replace this guy. And so I was like, whole, that, this guy is getting 22 sex a year.

Like, this guy is an all-American, you know? Like, yeah, I want to do that. And so when we got to the Arizona, our skiing was a little different.

“And it really was built for our linebackers, right?”

And we, and that was the humbling part is when I got to, when Kansas State and Texas A&M were recruiting me, they're like, you're going to be the guy. When we got to Arizona, they were like,

no, Lance Briggs, he's going to be the guy. Marcus Bell, the sound Pope, Antonio Pierce, everybody knows Antonio Pierce. We were a linebacker, you like, our linebackers went to the NFL.

And Brucegee was different. We had defensive linebacker that went to the NFL, but primarily it was our linebackers were supposed to go to the NFL and they'd let it be known. And so with our skiing, it was very unique.

And so we had a lot of success in our, even though we had losing seasons,

the defense was always top 10.

We were always top 10. Even in our last year, that you're just speaking about, we were top 10 defense. And so we got a lot of recognition for that. My roommate in college, Joe Tafoya,

which made my college experience even better because he was on one end, I was on the other, right? He had the, the why side I had the short for side. He was the flip-flop. He was my roommate.

He was my best friend. And we competed against each other. We fought against each other.

“We would fight over cereal in the house, you know?”

Like we were just so competitive. And in the end, he got drafted to the NFL. And so, you know, testament to just, you know, the hard work, the dedication that we put into it. But I was always a tweeter, right?

Like I was, I was always a guy that was, I didn't really have the stats of a Joe Tafoya or a Teddy Bruzki, I had a solid year, I was all conference. But the NFL didn't really know,

didn't really see why fit in. And so I had a lot of interest from like Tampa Bay coming out. My senior year I had private workouts with them. They were the team that was most interested

by the Cardinals. But in the end, you know, draft day came and it went. And, you know, nobody was calling over a free agent contract.

So the first call was the Canadian football league.

And it was thanks, thanks to our defensive line coach, a Marty Long, Coach Long, wet connections up there. And it was the Hamilton Tiger Cats that signed me to a, you know, a free agent contract.

There's a thread here that if you've joined me on this journey with other guests, you've heard before. And I think it's one worth pulling it, because it can teach us a lot about the razor's edge between high achievement and the darker side

of disappointment. The Dres hasn't his own words a pretty good year, which concludes a pretty good career at Arizona. A bit undersized to be an NFL defensive lineman, and a little too big to be an NFL linebacker.

Scouts gave him a look, but ultimately pass on him come draft weekend and the flurry of free agent signings that tend to follow. So that's the bad news. But the good news is that defensive line coach Marty Long,

who had himself coached in the CFL previously, made some calls, and a Dres got an opportunity to play in the Canadian football league. And that's the good news. You'll hear me rattle off some stats in a minute,

but what you hear in the interview is a man conflicted. On one hand, he'd failed to achieve the goal he'd been working for since around the age of 10 to play in the NFL. On the other, he was a professional athlete,

playing the game he loved and getting a paycheck to do it. So often when we set our sights on the highest goals, even when we get remarkably close, it can feel like defeat. Maybe you just missed out on that dream job you were hoping for.

Or maybe your manuscript didn't get accepted in your dream journal, but it was picked up somewhere else. The world would try to tell us that even we try to tell us that we failed.

“When the truth is that we've done like few others”

could ever even claim. For a Dres, it was the better sweet feeling of achieving a goal, but also not all at the same time. But it wouldn't keep him from making the most of his opportunity up north of the border.

Despite it all, it was a wise decision made during the spring of a senior year that would lead him to not only play pro football, but also graduate from the U of A. And so as disappointing as it was for me,

I took, I looked at it as another opportunity to compete. And I took my talents up north.

And for that first six months, I was destroying those guys.

And then there's no cake. But it was a transition where it allowed me to continue to play. It allowed me to chase down my goal, my dreams. I met a lot of guys on the same path as me.

And you know, there were guys that I played with that ended up transitioning back to the NFL. So they had great careers in Canada and transitioned back into the NFL. But for me, I did two years, and then I was done.

I'd injuries, I dealt with injuries.

And I didn't know how to play in it. And so luckily for me, I wouldn't even back up a little bit to be, I graduated. And that's one of the things I brag about the most was. I remember, I remember specifically being in the locker room

with Antonio Pierce, Brandon Malamani and Joe Chafoya. And there was another. There was someone else coming out that year.

“And we were trying to figure out, do we want to finish class?”

Or do we want to just go all in and pursue the NFL? It was a real discussion with us. And Antonio Pierce and those guys, Brandon Malamani, you want to jump before they all went to the NFL, obviously. But some of us chose to stay in school and commit.

And some of us chose to pursue the NFL, right? And so those that chose to pursue the NFL, obviously, they had great careers. But for me, I didn't have that strong commitment for many NFL teams.

So I had to play it, say, so I had to finish school. And so I was still carrying a full load. But I graduated. I walked across the stage with my degree. So when Canada was over for me,

I didn't have the continue to chase Canada, Canadian football, arena football. I felt so bad for my guys. I were chasing it, right, because they didn't have their degrees. And so I didn't have to chase a arena football and all that.

I was like, you know what? I have my degree. I'm going to answer the workforce. Yeah. So many high achievers that I've had on this show

have told me about their regret of not giving themselves even just a moment to kind of take it in. I mean, for you to pull that tiger cat's jersey

on for the first time and think, I'm a professional football player.

Those dreams that that young and trees had back in Houston had come true. Maybe not in the way you thought. Maybe not in a cowboy's uniform or, I don't know, who your team was back in the oilers or Texans or whatever,

to take that in. In some ways, it's almost like it somehow delutes or pollutes the striving to be your best.

“Like, you're not going to rest on your laurels, okay?”

So taking the moment to take it in in that moment seems counterproductive. But being so consumed with that next level can kind of eat you alive. Less than I did a little research before,

less than 8% of high school players play collegially at any level. That's not to say, pack 10 and D1, 8%. Less than 2% of them play professional football. So by any metric, you are the best of the best. What was your mindset in Canada?

Did you feel like you had achieved long-held goals were you trying to get back and prove people wronged it to make it into the NFL? Where were you at psychologically with this? Some would say, I made it, but there was an asterisk in my mind

that I didn't quite make it. Yeah, exactly, exactly. You know, you want to be grateful. You do, you want to be grateful. But it was like, you know, you knew this wasn't it.

And it was a pass through. And so, you know, lucky for me, I came from a pass rushing conferencing. The Canadian football league is pass rushing. It's three doubts.

First down second down punt. And so, you're likely going to pass on first down. You're likely going to pass on second down. So it's, you know, it's you're doing a lot of pass. But so for a defense event, a pass rushing in,

it was actually a great opportunity. And so immediately, and then, you know, with our style of defense at Arizona and having Teddy Bruce Key, we had these, we had martial arts instructors at where I had practice teaching us different hand placements

and things.

And so I brought that to Canada, and they never saw that before.

And so very quickly, I separated myself during the preseason. And then, I made the team as a practice squad player. And then, the first game, the starter got hurt. And here I go. And then, so as soon as I step in, Joe Muntford

was the top defensive end in Canada at the time. He's a Michael Parsons, right? Like, he's a Michael Parsons of the Canadian football league. And he happened to be on the opposite end of me. And so, very different, right?

He didn't care about me and he showed me nothing. He was like, it was very different from by Coach Thomas experience. He was like, you stay over there. You get your own stacks on that helping. So, but I was competing really against him.

I wasn't competing as any of the other defensive ends in the CFL. I had the best one on my team. And so, that, in my competitive nature, my performance, that, when I stepped in as a starter,

my first game, I had two stacks against Toronto. And then went over to Winnipeg, another stack, another tackle for loss.

I was doing stuff that they never saw before.

These little Canadian running backs are running around. And they got the ball hanging all out, trying to be cute. And I just knocked the ball out, picking up and take off running. Like, you know, it was just, to me, Canadian football,

“like, I want to be respectful, but it's not American football, right?”

And so, I went up there and I let him know. Like, you know, Canadians don't start playing until high school. Like, I was playing since fourth grade. And so, you know, Americans excel in the Canadian football league because of that, we just have a, we have an earlier start.

And so, I had a lot of success, I had a lot of success. And then, you know, the cold came, and then the injuries came.

It's on natural field. So, it was just the environment, my body. It was just a combination of things. I got hurt. And then eventually, you know, they kept me around on the practice roster.

But then they eventually signed some more guys. And then, you know, they kind of weeded me out. And so, you know, it was psychologically having to, you know, move back home and live in your parents' house after having all of this success was devastating, right? It was, it was my first, I'm 48 years old now.

So, from the time I left Canada to now, I've had devastating moments in my life.

But I don't look at them as devastating, but blessings because it was always a transition

period I was going through. And because of what I experienced in the Coach Tomi era allowed me to get through these devastating situations. But this was one.

“This was one where you were on such a high, and then you have to go home and live with”

your parents. And here we go. Like, you know, like, nobody's petting you on the back anymore. Right? You know, your dad's like, "Son, you can still play, go out there and run some laps."

And I'm like, "Dad, I've got, right?" But dealing with that transition was difficult. But luckily, I was able to start my career in the workforce and start transitioning into a whole new life. Yeah.

That's a great segue into where I want to go next. When I reached out to you, I said I was looking for an eddresser with entrepreneurial skills. And you transition from the field to business. I think for a lot of folks, whether it's collegiately trying to make it into professional sports or for professional athletes trying to get one more contract or one more extension,

it can be kind of a blurry end. You don't know for sure that I'm done. I'm officially done there.

You're always kind of holding out hope that there's another opportunity.

For others, it's just a clear break. Like, I'm done and I'm moving on to the next thing. You've transitioned from the field to business. You've earned your MBA along the way. You've started multiple businesses.

So, kind of talk me through what those years following profile was like for you and how that experience up to that point helped prepare you for the journey ahead for what people would say on paper.

“Like, how is playing professional football going to help you start a business?”

But in many ways, there are some skills that definitely carry over. So, talk me through that transition for you. Lots of transferable skills, lots of transferable skills. And it's interesting because now I'm at a level where, you know, I'm at an executive level in my, in my, in my, my real full-time job.

I have a full-time job and I have a business. I know we'll get to that. But I'm at the executive level of my full-time job and I'm sitting in the room with other executive level folks who graduated from Harvard and Yale and Princeton and all these fancy schools sat in front of the class, raised to hand a lot, but I wasn't that guy, right?

Like, I was the athlete, but I all perform these guys.

And I've always tell the people that I've managed over the years.

I tell them all the time. It's not, you know, book smarts will only get you so far. You know what I mean? And I'm raising my kids the same way, like book smarts will only get you so far. Like, yeah, we went A's and B's, but C's, you know, that's okay, right?

Like, C's are okay. But at the end of the day, it's, you know, common sense, that gets you to the executive level to the C's we level, right? It's, you know, it's discipline. It's grit, it's tenacity, and that never give up attitude and I mean, all those things

that we experienced in college, I mean, all those things we experienced in sports. I'm gonna give you a swimmer, a golfer, I don't, all of those highs and lows, waking up at six in the morning, the training, the effort, the blood, sweat and tears, all of that, get you to the C's we, not because you made A's and we're on on a road. Yeah, that, that, that, that helps, that does, but fortune 500 companies want leaders and decision

makers, right? You know, care, if you were on the, on the C on a road, if you were a leader and a decision maker, if you could lead people, leading people is the most unwritten, recognized skill there is out there. And that's what companies want.

“Can you lead people and leading people comes from your coaches, right?”

Like, that comes from, you know, your, your parents, if you have parents, but it comes from your coaches, the beauty of having coaches in your life, you see great examples of leaders at a young age, you know, our coaches, they're yelling and screaming, because Tommy used to yell and screaming, he was a little guy, he's a grab me and shake me and you know, he's to come up to this high, but he's to yell and screaming and, you know,

and throw things, but I think under the day, he'll come and hug you, you know, sit out with you. You know what I mean? It's all like we learn though, we learn those things early on. And so when it's time to transition into the real world, you don't forget those things.

And so, you know, I think for me, as I started transitioning into the workforce, I've always remember that. And so, yeah, I had to start off with these little jobs and then eventually grew into

But I never figured, I've never figured that, you know, I always treated people with respect. All the things that Coach Tommy talked about, I always treated people with respect, giving respect, receiving respect, you know, working hard and everything I do first, first in the gym, last to lead, right?

First in the office, last one to lead, you know, I've always, you know, just try to do the

“most, try to show value from the very beginning, right?”

I just always, all these lessons, I just carry them through. And before I looked up, I was 20 years into corporate America. And I really found a niche, right? I found a niche. There's, you know, facility operations, the workplace operations, and now it's called workplace

experience. But managing the day-to-day operations of commercial buildings. That's the space that I've been in for the last 20 years. And I really scaled and excelled at that space. And so, you know, and that's just because it's a people you're managing, you're managing

buildings and systems, which I'm good at, and you're managing people, which I'm good at. And so, building effective teams, I've been able to do that.

But, you know, I think over the course of my career, would lead to the entrepreneurship

was, over the course of my career, I noticed managing these commercial buildings. I noticed that there was really a gap missing, right? And so, I'm managing these vendors, I'm managing the electrician, the plumber, the moving company, I'm managing all these different vendors, and I'm paying out these invoices, hundreds of thousands of dollars of services, and I'm, I see the people doing

the work, they look like me, you know, they black and brown people are doing the work. But when I'm writing these $100,000 checks, they're going to white-owned companies. And I've noticed that. And so, I was like, you know, this is interesting. I started paying close to attention to it, and especially the moving component.

We companies do a lot of moves, and our moving vendor was taking a lot of money from the company because we were doing a lot of relocations. And I learned the business. I learned the moving business.

“And so, at some point in my career, which was about three years ago, I think you're leading”

up to this, is at 20 years into my career, I've made a decision to take a leap, and start my own commercial relocation company. There's a lot to unpack here, but I love how a dress frames his transition from the conclusion of his athletic career to the start of his professional and entrepreneurial journeys. Although attempted to go all in on Combine Prep and work to improve his draft stock as a college

senior, he decides to say the course, and he gets that degree. And after injury and even the psychological toll, not to mention the bitter coals and that rock hard turf in the CFL, his pro-career concludes after just two seasons. And while many in his position might struggle to hang on for one more shot somewhere else, a dress is armed with that degree and a plan.

Who decides to enter corporate America and he finds that the very same skills that he honed in the locker room in the weight room in the playing field carry over nicely in the board room. And above all else, he discovers that he's learned from some of the best examples in the form of his coaches, how to build teams and how to lead people.

He pays off, and he quickly climbs the corporate ladder. However, after a while, he does what many entrepreneurs do. He notices something, an unmet need, and within it, a seed of opportunity. The corporate relocation space is one that is needed, but lacking. Particularly when you consider the lack of minority on businesses in the space.

It would take bravery and grit, hard work and perseverance, and a willingness to bet on himself. But those were all things he'd mastered already. Only this time, it wasn't a game. It was real life.

And what a leap it was because my wife loves me and she supports me, but she didn't support this idea. So I did it against my wife's wishes. I did it against my bosses and my mentors' wishes. Everybody told me not to do it, but what they didn't know, which coach told me knew is they

don't know me, right? They don't know this.

“They don't know the measure of the heart of the man, right?”

They didn't know. And so I took a chance, and I jumped out there and risked everything and started this business. And we've scaled tremendously in the last two years, and we've had a lot of success. I've seen tremendous success. I follow you on social media and certainly big contracts with whether it's higher education

or hospitals. I mean, these places, you're not just talking about loading some junk in the back of a U haul. This is highly specialized, you know, six, seven figure equipment that has to be moved just perfectly.

And they don't give those contracts to just anybody with a truck. There's a lot of steps to that. And you've navigated that space well and you've kind of created that niche for your business. So knowing that and knowing what you've been through as an entrepreneur, I see a lot of parallels between competitive athlete who are looking for the edge and, you know, sometimes wrestling

with doubts and fears and trying to prove people wrong sometimes. And in the entrepreneurship space, it's been said that within five years, 90% of all startups

fail and within another five, another 90% of those that succeeded the first five fail.

Talk me through what surviving that doubt and that fear and whether that's nice air

from the outside or sometimes doubt from the inside. What did that teach you about yourself?

“And if you had it to do over again, what might you have done differently?”

Well, you know, a lot of business books tell you when you start your side hustle, keep your full-time job. Right? Build it on the side. You know, some of the most wealthiest, you know, most successful people in the world

tell you, you know, hey, you know, keep your full-time job and then build your business on the side. Well, I just felt I needed to be 100% all in. So I did the opposite. I quit my full-time job.

I quit my high salary, six-figured, executive job to start my moving business. All in, right? So that was scary in itself because there goes six-figure salary, there goes the benefits, all of that is gone.

And I didn't really have a solid business plan.

I knew I needed to get into the commercial, I knew I had relationships, I knew I had the knowledge and the know-how, but I just really didn't have a solid business plan. I thought I was just going to be able to jump right into the commercial space with my network. And that was in the case.

And so the reality was when we started the moving company, it was residential household goods moving. It was, hey, pick up this, you know, excuse my language, pissy mattress, luggage down three flights of stairs, put it in your truck, you know, pick up these trash bags, full of whatever. It was humbling.

It was humbling and it was me and my business partner, Jibari Moore, graduate of Rutgers played football at Rutgers, he was a linebacker. And when I, you know, we were, we were in these trucks doing these low value, low margin, residential moves. And it was, it was humbling, it was so humbling, losing money.

We're not making money. We're losing money. So luckily for us it didn't last very long, but we were so committed to it. We were sleeping in trucks because we couldn't afford hotels. We were sleeping at gas stations because trucks were breaking down on the road.

Stuff was getting stolen from us. I mean, it was this, all the horror stories will be committed. We committed, we committed, we committed, you know, back breaking work in the Texas heat, you know, like, and, and to be honest with you, Toby, I tried to quit every day. See, people tell you, people, you know, you know, I seen this documentary on Arnold Schwarzenegger

and he was like, I never, I never told myself I was going to quit.

I hate plan B because we have so many doubters, but when you start doubting yourself, that's very dangerous. Because now what you're basically saying is, is that if my plan doesn't work, I have a fallback plan of a plan B. That means that you start thinking about plan B and every thought that you put into

plan B, you're taking away now that thought and that energy from plan A. And it's very important to understand that we function better if there is no safety net because plan B becomes a safety net. It says that if I fail, then I fall and I get picked up and I have something else there that would predict me.

And that's not good. And I was like, no, I'm different.

“I tried to quit every day, but the difference is, I think what people need to understand”

is having multiple voices in your head is a healthy thing. You're not crazy. Maybe if you're talking to yourself, I'll lie. Maybe that might be a little weird, but I encourage everyone to have multiple voices in their head.

And this is for me, this is what works. I have a voice in my head that says, "You dress what the heck are you doing? Quit now." Go back to your corporate America job. Please.

Then I have another voice in my head that says, "Drease. Don't quit. Don't give up. Don't ever give up." Right?

And that's the coach told me, right? And that's the coach told me, that was the mentality. Coach told me in our meetings, we used to be in situations where it was tough to give us a visual. In our meetings, he should throw his little body against the wall.

He should say, "Guys, our backs are against the wall, he'll throw his body against the wall." He said, "We gotta fight our way out. We gotta fight. We gotta fight." And I just remember those stories.

And as I was going through top times, like what a full of coach told me to do right now? What would my dad do? My dad passed away some time ago. What would my dad do? Right?

Now, what would my dad tell me? So, eventually you have those voices. You have a voice that tells you to quit. And then you have a voice that tells you to keep going over the years. And this needs to start at a young age.

“You need to feed that positive voice, feed it.”

And there's certain strategies and things you can do to feed it. You don't have to get into that now. But this is what I tell people, youngsters all the time, feed that positive voice. And a lot of times, this wins, right? A accomplishments.

Athletes, we get a lot of paths on the back, that feeds it. But when you get into a situation where you want to quit, there's going to be a voice that

But there's going to be another voice that's been fed.

That's been fed over the years that's going to outweigh that other voice. And at the end of the day, I was like, "I'm not quitting. I'm not quitting." And I just kept with that. I kept with that.

The voice in my head that I'm not going to quit, voice was stronger than the other voice in an overcame it. And one thing led to another, like compound interest, you know, compound interest if you invest. Like compound interest, apartment move, turn into a house move, house move, turn into a high

value house move, a high value house move, turn into an office move. And here we go. Right? And next thing you know, we're moving research labs. Cheers.

Cheers. That's this growth path. For sure.

“As you're talking, I'm kind of thinking, OK, yeah, I think you're absolutely right.”

It's healthy to have those two voices. Sometimes it's damaging to just, you know, if my goal was to play in the NBA, that's a fool's errand. Like no amount of work is going to get me to that level. So there's wisdom in being able to check yourself.

Sometimes our dreams are just not attainable for us, maybe even in that season.

But other times, it's that willingness to go the extra mile to be the first to arrive

in the last to leave that makes all the difference. So I'm not one that blindly follows just the, you know, just grind and grit and everything will work out. That's not necessarily true. And I think that can really be damaging to some people.

But the flip of that is don't give up on yourself too soon. Like if you don't give this, this dream and this business, a chance to build some roots and grow and compound success after success, you don't get to where you are. You quit before the fruit is born. Again, we're talking with the Dries Arun former defender at the University of Arizona

played in the CFL now with DWD moving services. A Dries, I've heard it said that when words aren't enough, you're seeing a question I asked of all my guests is, if we were to watch a montage of your life, what song would you pick

to play in the background and why?

Oh, man, that's a good one. That's a good one, man. I don't know. I mean, the way I'm feeling right now, it's probably some real explicit rap music. I just, that's where I'm at, but if you would ask me, you know, I mean, it's kind of

depends, right? It depends. I mean, you know, like, there are some times where, you know, I want to put some loot

“the vandro song, you know, just kind of mood, I mean, or, you know, some shot A, right?”

Or, you know, sometimes I'm listening to some, you know, some country music, some Barth Brooks depending on, but I'm just, it just changes all the time, like, and that's in my, my truck. I'm in my truck and depending on my mood, I'll switch the channel around. But right now, it's just, you know, it's, it's any music that's motivating to me right now.

Brother, if I may be so bold as to suggest let him know, as it's been on repeat all week in my headphones, they call it ball and we just call it living, because it's just, there's a lot going on, and whatever keeps me motivated and energized, that's really what's on my playlist. That's great.

I create a playlist for all my guests, it's like a mix tape of all my guests that I put on Spotify. I had Garfield Bright from shy on the show, if you remember them, yeah, I've had some other artists, because artists like Athletes, I mean, your time to shine is fairly short, and people move on to the next one pretty quickly, but what they don't realize in that

is, you know, when, when you got replaced on that roster, someone's dream came true, someone else's dream just ended, and, and it can be a very narrow window of success in the arts and in athletics. This may be one area where entrepreneurship definitely has a leg up, is that it's not like, you know, you get one or two years and your career's over as an entrepreneur, hopefully

you're learning and you're growing. What for a dream remains undone? That's a great question, you know, there's still a lot for us to accomplish in this space, you know, we, we found something special, you know, my business partner, Japan, I found something special, you know, we, we made it, we, we found a niche within the niche, you know,

the movement, moving industry saturated in Texas, it's saturated in Dallas, it's moving coming, you throw us, throw a rock in any direction, hit a moving company. But what we did is we, we took a saturated industry and made it less competitive, and we found the niche, and that niche for us right now is we're moving research labs, and what we're, we're also doing Toby, we have a new revenue stream that we're starting.

We're moving college coaches, man, and so this is what I'm really excited about.

“This is the part of the business where I think there's a lot of potential for us, because”

here here we go again, here's another nichey area. What we're finding out is there's a lot of money being thrown around in colleges, that's

lot quicker than in the past, and these coaches are relocating an exponential rates, and who's relocating them? Who's moving them? Well, obviously a moving company, but why not? Why can't that be us?

“Why can't that be dad's with daughters moving in logistics?”

DWD stands for dad's with daughters, by the way. Love it. Built a company for like, we built a business to build a legacy for our daughters. That's great. Why not us, right?

And so what we've done is position ourselves to get that opportunity.

So in a week, in a week, on the 31st, we have our first one, we're moving that system

coach from Texas A&M to Kansas State University, which is our right. Because I had college visits the most, and how the world circles back around. But our first is Kansas State, I'm sorry, Texas A&M to Kansas State, the following week, we go to Utah and move a system coach from Utah to a program that building out in Texas Arcana.

So this is the beginning. And what I love about this opportunity is that time of the year is from January to March, we're coaches are getting hired and fired. You can say, you know, November to March, right, because football season's kind of ending. That's a revenue stream for moving companies, moving is in seasons.

And so from January to March, it's typically a slow season. So if we can tap into that market, relocating coaches. Not only is that a revenue stream in a slow season, but it's niche. It's very nichey because the schools pay for those moves. So it's the coaches, the coaches wives really, but the coaches that select the mover,

and then they figure all that out.

The coaches are busy recruiting and doing what they're doing. The wives have to organize to grab the Lou. And so what we're able to do is build those relationships with the universities and they're hiring us to relocate their coaches. And so we want to position ourselves to be that top mover and all of the, all of the

conferences in the United States, we want to be the primary mover for coaching relocations. That's all. And basketball. It's such a great idea.

“It's one of those great ideas is it's like, why hasn't anyone else done that?”

And so like, if I put it out there, almost fear that someone else is going to try to jump into that space, but man, that's a genius idea. And another thing that comes to mind is a turnkey service like this. You know, white glove, because people see that man, it drives me crazy. And in this world, and I think back to, you know, how long would coach tell me, survive

in an era like this, where nobody's interested in growing players.

They just want the best roster they can have from year to year. And if we sign a bunch of portal guys that are 22 years old, then we went a national championship, right? We're not recruiting 17 year old high school kids. So what people don't realize in the, hey, let's fire the coach because we didn't make

a bowl game is the trickle down result of that. The entire staff gets let go. Well, they've got wise. They've got kids. There are staff members who are oftentimes like a strength coaches, even academic folks,

athletic trainers. And those people struggle with that adjustment as well. My wife's a counselor. And we've talked about this, like, you know, high value clients who come and go into town here in Waco, oftentimes are coaches from Baylor and those kids may struggle with a new

school. Those wives may struggle with they don't have friends at church or they, you know, they're not connected. And so if I know anything about people, it's that turn key services, especially for people with means is way easier than going out and trying to all a cart your way to this new

transition. So I want to applaud you. That's such a great idea. And maybe even trickle down is code athletes have money now too. NIL means you could do a niche with with 20 year old athletes as well.

So I'm sure that's on your radar, but man, what a great idea and definitely need it. Yeah. I mean, it's a great idea. We've thought about college athletes.

“But you know, with moving, it's like, they're not going to have much, right?”

I mean, yeah. You know, coaches, coaches like the family were moving next week. This is her, this is her sixth move that family were moving in Utah. This is her 12th move, right? Yeah.

And so like I think we found something special, especially if we can build those relationships with the wives. As you know, the wives, they're going to share your information. They're going to brag about you, wearing a mouth, your business will spread there. But we're just excited about the opportunity because also we're athletes, like, we're

college athlete guys. And so this is a space we need to be in. I mean, I have this vision, right? We're touching research labs and we're touching college code three locations right now. And I just have this vision that, you know, you say university Arizona or Baylor University

where you are, you know, I'm going over and meeting with the head of the life sciences department or the bio lab department and we're talking about a potential lab relocation, right? And we're going over the scope of work and we're talking about, you know, logistics and how things work. And then I shake his hand and then I leave and I walk across campus and I walk into the athletic

department. I walk into the coaches office and we start talking about relocating his staff members, right? Like, that's my vision. That's where we want to be. That's very nichey, high value, high margin work.

and brown companies doing that. Yeah.

“And that credibility that you bring from your professional and collegiate pedigree is something”

that no one else can compete with.

And so for any athlete out there, I always just want to shine a light on the fact that you

don't, you don't really understand the impact of just being on a roster and that immediate credibility and that recognition that people have is it's impossible to replicate. No, I'm working on my sixth college degree, but I've never played college sports. And there's no amount of work or one or hope that whatever allow me to be able to compete with you on that.

So that's certainly something to be proud of and to lean in on. If listeners want to connect with you, if they want to check out the business or follow you on socials, we're going to point them. Yeah. Well, we're on LinkedIn.

You can just look up. I'm on LinkedIn. I have a profile. I'm more of a LinkedIn guy at DWD moving on logistics as a LinkedIn.

“We also have Facebook, we're on Instagram.”

You can find best. We're easy to find.

You can just always email me, eDreeStoutHeroon at DWD moving services, but yeah, I'm easy

to find. Connect with, you know, opportunities like this Toby have brought more business for me. So I really appreciate this platform. I did a, I did a, I did a show. I told you with the, when I best lead us at Arizona history, Kelvin, he found.

And as soon as I got off the show, I got a couple calls. So, you know, you never know who's listening. You never know who's listening. This we're in the relationship business, right? And that's, at the end of the day, athletes need to understand we're in the relationship

business. And so as long as you can understand that, treat people respect, leave with empathy, be a good human being, like all of these things that we've learned from Coach Tomey, like as long

as you can do that, then you'll be fine, right?

Psychologically, the transition from sports to the real world, whether you're transitioning from sports to corporate America, just sports into the real world, it's going to be hard, right? It's going to be tough.

“But I think athletes need to realize being a professional athlete, that's not reality, right?”

Like, that's not reality. You shared, you shared the percentages, like it's, it's, it's not reality. Those who make it, it's a gift and a blessing from God. But the majority don't, the majority end up having the transition and be part of the normal workforce and live your day to day, and that's fine too.

You know, but for me, I think I was able to treat the real world like my NFL. And once I was able to switch that mentality, like, you know what? I'm tired of saying, I should have been, I should have did, I should be there. I'm going to switch my mentality and say, you know what, I'm going to treat the real world like it's my NFL, you just work out for me.

I'm very suspended real treat. I appreciate the chance to reconnect. It greets a road. I am undone. Awesome.

As we close today's conversation with a dresser room, I'm struck by just how clearly the coaching of Dick Tomey still echoes in his life. It's more than memory. It's more than nostalgia, it's legacy. What coach Tomey instilled any young defensive in from inner city, Houston, accountability,

grit, humility, brotherhood. Those are all the same values that drive the executive, the entrepreneur, and the leader that a dresser is today. The lessons the dresser learned under that desert son, one fail all fail. Don't skip reps, lead with heart, not with ego, the team, the team, the team, the team.

Those have all shaped the way he shows up in boardrooms and business strategy sessions. And on the front lines of relocation projects that bear his name, whether he's managing a high stakes lab move or relocating a division one coaching staff, the ethos is the same. Come in fully, respect the team, and own the result. Even though it's been a minute since I finished the coach Tomey documentary, this interview

alone tells me that coach Tomey built men, not just football players, and a dresser is just one more example, living proof. A dresser's journey from Tucson to Toronto to Texas is more than just a pivot. It's a purpose and motion. It's a life that continues to echo that formative freaks, the team, the team, the team.

The dresser room isn't done, in fact he's just getting started. And thanks to the seeds planted by a coach who knew how to reach both the mom and the dad, the heart and the head, the boy and the man, those lessons are still leading him forward today. I'm thankful to a dresser for dropping in today, and I hope you enjoyed our conversation

for more info on this episode, be sure to check it out on the web. We'll go to unden podcast.com/ep148 to check out the show notes, images, links, and even the raw video of my conversation with a Dressa Room. Some quick updates about the show with your help, the numbers keep climbing.

and we continue to do especially well on Apple Podcasts, where we're currently sitting at

#8 in the world in self-improvement and education. We snap back into Apple's Top 200 briefly this week, charting at #172 on Wednesday and Thursday before dropping back up. For those of you listening who help make it happen, thank you.

“If you want to follow along and see the progress for yourself, you can now go to unden podcast.com/Rain”

Kings, R8NK, IMGS, and here's our.

My goal for 2026 is to get back in that Top 5 within the education category and hit the Top 100 for all shows across the board, and with your help, we can do it. If you enjoyed this episode, if you'd be so kind to share it with a friend, maybe leave a comment or a review, all that would help, and would be sincerely appreciated.

“Coming up on the show next week, you will not want to miss my conversation with former”

high-powered A-list entertainment business manager Jonathan Schwartz, who previously worked with acts like Link and Park, along with more set Beyonce and Halsey, before he was imprisoned

for him bezling over $7 million, due to a crippling, gambling and substance use disorder.

Since then, he's completed a prison sentence, and then turned his life around, and is now a counselor who helps others dealing with substance use disorders and gambling addiction themselves.

“Click this out and more, coming up on Becoming Undone.”

Becoming Undone is a nature of creative production written and produced by me, Toby Brooks. Tell a friend about the show follow along on Facebook, Instagram, Linkin, and Becoming Undone Pod. And follow me and Toby Brooks, PhD, log Facebook, Instagram, Linkin, and X. Check out my link to my link to link TR.de backslash, Toby Brooks, PhD.

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