BONUS | Inside the Nannup Four police investigation

affecting your world each weekday in just 15 minutes. We input our orbit we export huge amounts

“of gas at the states and the federal government never ensured that we had enough gas”

on shore here during crisis periods like this. Join me for ABC News Daily. Find us on ABC News Daily. ABC Listen. Podcasts, radio, news, music and more. Some of my name is Acting Detective Inspector Jessica Securo. I'm the divisional officer at Major Crime Division. My name is Jeremy Sparvey, Detective Sergeant attached to the missing person team of the WA police. I'm Dominique Bans. And this is a bonus episode of Experts

The Nannup 4. And it's been a really long time in the making. We reached out to please six

months ago because I wanted to be able to take you inside the police investigation into the disappearance of Shantel and Leila McDougall Simon Cadwell aka Gary Felton and Tony Poppitch

“or as some people knew him and Tony O. Poppitch. We haven't been able to make that interview happen”

until now. Today you're going to hear me speaking with the two officers the Nannup 4 case sits with now. They aren't the initial investigating officers, but they are going to open up the police files for us. Also, if you've just heard episode 6, you would have heard the loose thread

about whether or not another search is going to happen based on the information, pedigreeves and

Shantel's uncle Barry McIntosh on Earth. I've got some news on that later, too. We were all over the shop. As I'm sitting down with Detective Sergeant Jeremy Spivey, an acting detective inspector Jessica Securo, I'm feeling a lot of pressure. This interview has been so long in the making and I really want to make sure I get everything. The police officers start off

“by giving me a bit of a rundown about how missing people are reported and then we get to the four.”

As per any missing persons investigation, proof of life checks are conducted and what a proof of life check is to look for footprints that someone would leave, banking records, phone records, things of that nature and those initial checks have been unable to establish where they may be. There was a delay in this report being received and the difficulties with things like that is missed opportunities in relation to let's say CCTV inquiries, witness accounts,

people's recollections and other difficulties that were experienced in this investigation involve the fact of multi-juristicional investigation being the report of traveling overseas and as well as Eastern states and really the absence of any real evidence in the initial inquiry and so what I mean by that is the residents they had been living in had been left in a tidy state. The notes had been left there but there really wasn't anything else to suggest what had happened to the group.

From speaking to witnesses what were you able to find out about the dynamic between the I guess Simon Shantel and Tony. So we were able to determine the group we were living what we believe was a cult type lifestyle where Simon or Winkle and Gary Filton was the leader of that group. So from speaking to witnesses and friends and relatives of Shantel they described her relationship with him as coercive control well or what we would call

our coercive control essentially grooming type behaviours, psychological isolation tactics which adds a layer of complexity to the investigation because for two reasons one being that this information wasn't provided to place at the time by Shantel herself or relatives and given the group or living this sort of isolated lifestyle. No one really knows what goes on behind them that the closed doors or what they're up to. There are a few things that I've wanted to confirm.

One was whether there was any forensic testing of the Blue House. Acting detective inspecta securo says by the time the report came in there were new people living in the Blue House. So the forensic team couldn't make an assessment on whether there are any signs of violence. So that avenue of inquiry wasn't followed up. They weren't able to confirm

significance to the investigation was found on Gary Felton's computer. There was nothing that

we assisted in the investigation located on his computer. Does that mean that he wiped his device? I'm not saying that but all I can say is that he was referred to the fact that there was nothing of interest or nothing that assisted or further the investigation. What about his online footprint? What were you able to find out from that? Sorry I can't come in on that one. Something I've already known from the inquest is that the case was

handed to a detective from the major crime division to review in July 2013.

That led the Amiga investigation starting in 2014. In this instance, the investigation was

later taken on by Homicide Squad. That's not uncommon. We frequently will review each other's investigations and certainly in a case where four people, including a child, had gone missing. That's a very complex investigation. So would rely on the resources from both Homicide Squad

“and missing persons. What were the key theories that place were working with at that stage of”

the investigation when it was handed over to Homicide? So there are a number of theories that police explored whether this was a group suicide, whether it was a Homicide or whether the group had

managed to travel abroad, which is still, you know, many theories that we still explore now.

There's been a lot of questions around the force final movements. What were place able to find out? Mr Felton was last sighted around the end of June. And then Tony Poppitch and Suntel McDougall were last sighted around mid-July. So around the, I guess, it's 13th to the 15th of July. They were a travel to Bustleton and then back in Nanop sold more pets, more dogs, to a lady who traveled to the property to buy to the dogs.

So that was around the 15th of July, was the last sighting. And then after that there has been

“no sightings of any of the group. What can you tell me about Tony Poppitch's final movements?”

So an individual has traveled to Perth using the name of Jay Roberts. Mr Poppitch's phone has been used in the Perth area. So that was used to book a combination and to order some food. And then following that movement it appears to have travelled to a train bus depot, where again a ticket was purchased. One ticket was purchased to travel to Bumbry and then further on to Northcloth. And at the same period of time, another ticket

in a similar nine to Jay Roberts was booked to travel to Cal Gully. I actually had some more questions about that ticket to Cal Gully. It was paid for in cash at East Perth train station on the 13th of July 2007. This was the same day Shantel and Tony were in Bustleton, selling her car and sending power of attorney documents to Tony's brother. There's no evidence Simon Cadwell was in East Perth Eba. I put this to place but they say given the ticket was purchased

under the same name and the boarding time was about the same too. It's still relevant. The person believed to be Tony ordered a pizza in King's park on the evening of July 15.

“How were you able to confirm that that person was Tony?”

So the pizza driver was interviewed who delivered the pizza. And of course that was a period of time later that they were interviewed. But that individual identified someone that they believed to be Tony as a person that they delivered the pizza to. Retired detective Greg Balfour, who conducted the Omega Investigation into the disappearance recently gave an interview where he said it a grid search could have been done of the area Tony was last seen in the theory that bodies

could be buried there. I'm just going to jump in quickly here. I did reach out to Greg Balfour also many months ago but he declined to be part of the podcast. He did this interview with a local Perth paper after the podcast started rolling out. Can you explain the rationale behind that and why that grid search wasn't done? I can't explain the rationale was to the final decision in relation to whether the search was done. Obviously Tony was believed to be up in King's park

being that it moved around the next morning. Police identified like you say a male

quarter bus to North Cliff at the time of the disappearance. What have you been able to find out about their movements after they arrived in North Cliff? There's been nothing to show the movements of the individual. Obviously with a passage of time between the investigation and this information being established, things like CCTV and witness accounts were were unable to verify who this person was or the fact that the person travelled the full distance. So unable to establish

any movements or to confirm who the person was. So you haven't been able to confirm that someone did actually get off in North Cliff of that time. As far as I'm aware, the travel was booked. Someone did board the bus for the travel and I'm just saying I don't know if it went the full way and it might be that they have travelled the full distance. Did police ever uncover any links between the four and the North Cliff area? From what I've reviewed, I couldn't understand

this any. I feel like I've got a reiterate at this point that the police I'm sitting down with aren't the ones who were doing the initial investigating or the review for the inquest, the Omega investigation. That was retired detective Greg Balfour. So they aren't able to answer

“all my questions. I think one of the most confusing things about this case is the question of how they”

were moving around in the days after their disappearance after Shantel and Tony both sold her car and his use. What theories do you have around that of how they were getting around? So police were unable to establish how they were getting around postselling the vehicles in July 2007. Around that time there would have been no records of who boards a transport bus or utilizing taxi services. However these were avenues that were explored by the investigation team.

There was this call the inquest referred to. Where Carolyn French, the last person to see Shantel, who bought her last dogs, received a call around the time of the disappearance. The call was from a woman who sounded angry and wanted to know if she knew Shantel.

Detective Sergeant Spivey says police never found out who that person was.

By the time this was traced the telco no longer had the phone records.

“What about phone calls made to Tony or Shantel were you able to look into those?”

Yes we were. The phone calls to Tony pop-edge were from his family members and in terms of Shantel and the landline were from Carolyn French in regards to the puppy purchase. There was some calls identified from a company which was linked to an express travel which initially created a false lead for investigators. However that was linked back to Carolyn French calling from a workplace again about the puppies.

So it kind of indicates that they weren't being contacted or they weren't sort of other people contacting them around the time of the disappearance. Does that indicate that there was maybe no one else involved and that they were kind of acting alone? In some circumstances yes it would. However given the lifestyle they were living which was quite isolated it may not be out of the ordinary.

Police managed to speak to a number of Simon Cadwell Gary Felton's followers.

“What did they tell police about who he was and their interactions with him?”

So they told police that Simon or Gary Felton was initially planning a suicide for him and the group however after some back-of-forth communication he shot away from that and

they basically spoke to police about his spiritual beliefs which was beneficial to the

investigation and helped give police an insight to what the group may have been thinking. It seems that he shied away from that after his followers said that if he did that it would be tantamount to murdering Lila his daughter. How likely is that he's still carried out those plans and perhaps just didn't tell his followers that wasn't as open with them after they said that to him? So it definitely is a possibility and did form part of the investigation.

that that did occur. What inquiries did police make into Simon's state of mind around the

disappearance? So police obtained medical records and there was no clinical records supporting any mental health issues with him however police did speak to a number of witnesses who confirmed that in the lead up to the disappearance Simon was increasingly agitated with drawn speaking of electro magnetic interference with the none-up property which is concerning type of behaviour. Other witnesses described Shantel as being more withdrawn as well and Gary acting bizarrely.

“Do you think it's likely he was depressed around that time?”

There's a possibility he was, you know, certainly I'm unsure of what he told

he's doctor in order to get the prescription medication but other witnesses have described him as withdrawn so there is a good chance he probably was depressed. Considering police were alerted to Gary Felton's real identity as well as the fact he ran a cult in 2004, it has soon after the disappearance did police start looking into his background and confirming his identity. So police became aware that Gary Felton was using

false identity during the initial investigation in late 2007 from there that sparked a whole lot of

“inquiries both internationally and nationally to lead the investigation to a different”

certain point. Right but it wasn't until 2009 that you were able to find Simon Cadwell that

the real Simon Cadwell. Yes. Something I really wanted to understand is what police knew about possible illicit drug use given the number of people I've heard from about various members of the four partaking. Did police find evidence of drug use within the group? No we didn't so that was a theory that was explored and there was no evidence to suggest illicit drug use. People I've spoken to have said that Gary Felton was a frequent user of LSD when they knew him and another

person told us about Shantel buying large quantities of LSD is that something police are aware of. So as a set before police made a number of inquiries into illicit drug use however that was we did not find any evidence to suggest that was a factor in their disappearance. When did police conduct a line search in that up? So a line search or a search was conducted and there were between 60 to 70 staff involved in that. Generally a search originates from what you would call the last

known position of someone and in this instance it's difficult to establish a last known position which makes searching difficult because you don't really have a starting point. Very net in mind one was conducted from their residents. Also during the search I can say that water police were utilized to search dams that were on the property and there's a total of five dams that were searched by the water police. And was anything found during that search of

significance? Nothing was located in relation to the investigation. Would you consider using

“drone technology to conduct another search of the bushlands surrounding the blue farmhouse?”

At this stage no search is planned but saying that of course everything would be based on information that is provided. Nothing's off the table. The main reason I wanted to speak to WA police was to find out whether police will do a new search of the North Cliff bushland, where those prisoners found clothing and that smell of death. Detective sergeants by the is actually the officer Shantel's Uncle Barry McIntosh was speaking to about this.

The specific words of that email written to Barry in October 2025 were quote police are currently reviewing the information and conducting further inquiries to determine the exact location identified by prison staff. It is proposed a further search will take place, however time will be needed to appropriately prepare and ensure the correct area is searched. When I ask about this, Detective Sergeant Spivey says the police did actually go back to the area in November 2025 with the

all along. When WA police visited the North Cliff bushland in 2015, they were in the wrong place.

“The coordinates they were given for that search were from one of the original police officers”

who attended the location in 2007. He says the exact coordinates of that 2007 visit

were never recorded, so the officer was just going off his memory. But if the officer's memory

was correct, this means when police said they visited the area and found a t-shirt that looked like it had been there for years, that was a different item of clothing to what the prisoners saw. And when they said they couldn't smell anything, well that's because they wouldn't know where any of the spot where the prisoners picked up that smell of death. When Barry McIntosh and Peter Graves conducted their search in 2024, they brought a team of cadaver dogs with them and a number

of those dogs picked up a scent in the ground. What would that indicate to you? I couldn't comment

on the cadaver dogs and their ability to detect scents. I don't know enough of the science of

of the dogs. I understand that they are a tool that are used to indicate that yeah I can't comment on the time since the disappearance and the abilities of the of the dogs. Would you consider most poor cadaver dogs giving an indication that they found a

“scent of human remains new evidence worth investigating?”

What depends on that location? There's a number of variables that we have to assess with the use of the cadaver dogs. We would have to seek the expertise of our forensic division

and the yeah assess this specific location of whether the dogs were deployed.

Without any more specific location or information as to where a search could could isolate or commence it's a bit difficult to comment on on what the dogs had picked up. Have you has spoken to the team whose dogs picked up the scent? The team's there. I actually took a map with me of the area Barry and Peter think need searching and I followed up with detective Sergeant Spivey after that interview because this seems important.

He said the police wouldn't do their own search of the area Barry and Peter went through in 2024 because Barry and Peter have already looked there and they wouldn't search the new area Barry and Peter have identified based on the cadaver dogs because they say it's irrelevant as it's not the spot the prison officer identified. I've actually spoken to the man from human remains detection dogs of Western Australia who coordinated the 2024 search to understand

how significant or not it is that the dogs picked up a scent and he said all the dogs there indicated a scent as he put it they don't react to meat pies and they don't react to dead ruse. They only react to dead bodies so he thinks it's pretty significant. Barry Macintosh shantel's uncle and retired Victorian copper with 35 years largely in major crime investigations remembers it as pretty significant too. One of cadaver dogs went crazy at a particular spot.

In the last few days in light of where things are fallen with police Barry has told me he's going to do another final search. I estimate the search cost $10,000 once I've knocked that out I pretty much done everything I can do. The search is planned to happen in late 2026 depending on where the Barry can crowd fund the money needed in that time. You might recall their previous search only got off the ground because Peter grieves and Barry sunk their own cash into it.

Barry started investigating his niece's disappearance during COVID and he's not super impressed

“with how things were handled. I think the investigation by the police on the”

in Western Australia was not thorough and the juncture conclusions have been too much. I found a lot of things that were missed primarily they didn't interview the prisoners or the prison officer at all in both investigations so I put one email and one phone call from the other side of the country to speak to the prison officer and got the correct coordinates of the where the prisoners were. And from that information and what you read in the police investigation

where do you think they might be? Shantel and Leila Simon and Tony. I'm working on the assumption

new final search comes back without answers just like the last one. It was horrendously difficult

“just to explain to Catherine Jim that we file. But also what if it does unearth answers?”

Because that'll just be another version of heartbreak. Some closure, the peace of knowing,

but the grief of letting go of any last hope. This has been a bonus episode of

“expanse, the none up for. I'm host Dominique Bands. If you can keep adding to this picture,”

particularly if you can shed more light on who they were, their travel movements or last contacts,

please get in touch. This episode wouldn't have been possible without Meghan Woods's life more peer worth to Hiana Norton and has been edited by Grant Walter.