AI Isn't the Moat in 2026: How Marketers Win with Skills + Context

Because now I can make a few mistakes, but it doesn't cost me anything.

You don't need to run Fable 5 to draft an email to your boss. Anyone can build any app in a matter of seconds with how good AI models are that doesn't mean they're gonna not resonate. It doesn't mean they're gonna work. Just tell Claw to do your SEO.

Just tell Claw to run a paid marketing campaign. But if you don't have the subject matter expertise, that's not gonna amount to anything or move the needle. As a non-technical guy that's killing it with AI, what gave you the confidence to say you could even do this?

What makes you think that you're even capable of using these tools that are so advanced that everything at your wildest dreams,

“but you have to know what you're doing, etc.”

What made you think you were even capable of this? I'll be honest, bro, I think a lot of it comes down to just my willingness to learn and dive in. And we'll just get into Clawed Code here, that's kind of the hot topic now in the AI world. When you hear the word Clawed Code, I think it came out 2024, maybe 2025, somewhere in that realm, your brain immediately goes as a non-technical marketer.

Your brain immediately goes to coding, programming, terminal, and we just want to dismiss it as something that's advanced, and that's for programmers. But when you actually dive into it, Clawed Code is a very bad branding issue, right? So it should be called Clawed Chat, or, you know, Clawed Design, or they have a Clawed Design. But it should be rebranded to something else, right?

Because all it is is it's an AI coding agent where you are essentially speaking in plain English, and then it's doing the coding on the back end, but in a nice interface, that's presentable to marketers, content creators, or really anyone that's non-technical. I will say the biggest remote right now, especially in 2026 and beyond, it's not building anymore, because anyone can build a SaaS tool, anyone can build any app

in a matter of seconds with how good AI models are.

“So the ultimate modes are subject matter expertise, knowing what the hell you have to do,”

and also distribution, understanding how to sell whatever you build, right? So for me, my background is in marketing. I have over 10 years of experience in aspects like

SEO, paid search, email, and other facets of marketing. And at first, I thought that was a

disadvantage because I did not come from a technical background, but funny how things work out. That's actually my biggest advantage now, because everywhere on the internet, it's all the advice you see is, just tell Clawed to do your SEO, just tell Clawed to run a paid marketing campaign. But if you don't have the subject matter expertise, that's not going to amount to anything or move the needle.

I was playing around with mostly from an exploratory standpoint. I have built a few things that I use on a daily basis. My website included, but I built a lot of things and then destroyed them. And one of the things that I wanted to try because I saw somebody put out a thousand UGC variation reels in 15 minutes using this skill and clawed in a Higgs field, MCP. Okay, great. Okay, so I literally walk through verbatim. What this guy says to do. And yes, I got a thousand videos

out the back end or what wasn't a thousand. It was like 200. But which is still a lot. That being said, garbage, nonsense. It wasn't nearly as easy. There were like three steps that he didn't that clawed head to explain to me that he didn't include, you know, long story short, this is a much more intense detail. I don't know what a UGC character is supposed to say in order to drive, you know, demand. So essentially, even though, yes, could I get the videos out to your point?

I could. I could get the videos out, but that doesn't mean they're going to resonate. It doesn't mean they're going to work. It doesn't mean I still, there's like 15 other things I need to do in order to use those UGC that he has to actually drive demand in. So to your point, I think that's this idea that somehow, you know, all of this, we'll call it white collar or knowledge work information or expertise that we've developed. Somehow becomes useless in a world with AI to me is one of the

biggest non-sensical misinformation plays and to your point, just just grifter talking points that exist on the internet right now. Yeah, and I would argue that before December 2025, when Opus 4.5 came out, that was kind of the turning point that me and a lot of others in this space really

pinpoint to as kind of that breakthrough moment where before building was definitely a mode,

because the models weren't good enough to build these sophisticated SaaS tools or anything else going on, but Opus 4.5 fast forward to Fable now and Opus 4.8 as we're talking,

“there is absolutely zero mode in building, right? You have to understand what actually goes into it”

and provide subject matter expertise with skill mark down files and other contexts to direct

no, you know, that's a bigger conversation because I think we're going to see a massive shift towards open source AI models here and we're already seeing this, right? With Fable being pulled

in, you know, now Opunei had GPT 5.6 that had to go through the government first before we could

get access to it. And so what's going to happen is as these big AI companies like Enthropic or Opunei, they keep restricting access to the average person like me or you will guess what, China's going to come out with deep seek version 10 or Quinn or GLM 5.2 was the hot one here recently,

“right? That are 5, 10x cheaper, but can produce similar outputs. And so that's why Opunei and”

Enthropic are kind of holding off on going public because they know these AI Chinese companies can come in and duplicate or replicate their models like we saw deep seek do early in 2025 and sell it for a tenth of the price. I've been playing around with GLM 5.2. I downloaded their version of Codex, which is called Z code. And I just started doing a few like simple tasks, simple kind of mostly I started with debugging just to see like what it would look like. So I said,

hey, you know, I for purposes of both the project and learning as well as there were things I wanted to do, I tore my website down off a WordPress and rebuilt it from scratch using Claw Code. And I said, I was like, okay, well, let me let me take GLM 5.2 and let's just run it through that code base and just just find bugs. We're not fixing anything yet. We're just finding bugs. And I did the same exact thing with a fresh instance of Opus 4.8, right? And just to see compare,

what did they find? And again, non-technical, but my examination was that it was almost

indistinguishable. They basically found using different words and different order. They basically

found a lot of the similar things that would need to be fixed. Except the difference was, I had to pay $7 and 25 cents to run that debugging session with Clawed Opus. And I paid about

“27 cents with GLM 5.2. And I think that to me was an enormous eye opener, which you know,”

from the last couple weeks and so much as, well, if I do maybe a little better job upfront with planning with prep and as you said, skilled design, which I want to get into that concept with you in a couple of minutes, does the slight. And we're talking, you know, to most users, miniscule difference and intelligence between something that's costing me $7 and something that's costing me $27 cents, is it worth just starting to learn and build? Because now I can make a few

mistakes, but it doesn't cost me anything. I can work on a few side projects and see where they go. And I'm not coming out of my pocket for, you know, a couple hundred or a thousand or more to put that in play. And that to me was like, we're in a completely different world here. And all the leverage that the two big frontier models had is gone. At least in my perspective. Yeah, and something, you know, on your point there, something for the audience to understand is that

I would argue that models like Opus 4.8 or Fable or whatever mythos, whatever other sophisticated frontier model that comes out, I would argue that that is actually overkill and a nuclear bomb. I call it for 99% of knowledge work, right? You don't need to run Fable 5 to draft an email to your boss. You don't need to run Fable 5 to fine tune an article or a blog post trying to rank for SEO, right? Their GLM 5.2 and other open source models have caught up to these frontier

models. Am I saying that they're as good as Fable or Opus 4.8? I would argue for my work today, probably not, but they're just about there. And they're only going to keep getting better because you're telling me that, you know, there's no insiders at OpenAI or inthropic who are reporting back to these other open source companies. And they're just, it's this giant game of cat and mouse where the frontier models come out with updates and better models. And then the open source companies

come out and just update their models based on what, you know, inthropic and OpenAI are continuing

“to do on their side. So I don't know how this is all going to play out. I think personally,”

they're going to try to ban open source. But as we've seen in the past, what happens, right?

And users always find workarounds to everything. Yeah. I agree. I think that the lobbying,

particularly that inthropic is done. They got a lot of politicians in their pocket and they're going to come after these open source models for sure. They're going to make the case that China is stealing this or that. And this isn't necessarily an issue for most everyday users and probably most of the people listening to this, but if I'm, if I'm a large enterprise, do I really want to be running my stuff through Claude or OpenAI who have already shown that once they get enough

Claude Design puts Canva, Figma, all these businesses. You've seen their evaluations of drop

to the floor. You have OpenAI comes out with a finance product that now competes with, you can essentially do everything up almost to pure accounting with it. So now like fresh books and these things, you know, are maybe not ready to be replaced yet, but you can see it on the horizon. And

“you don't see any of that with the open source models. And the other thing that I think is interesting”

that I think is a nuance that will be lost on our political class, but is very, and I'd love to know if you're playing with this is the idea of forking and running it on a local, running that on a local machine. We're now, you're using the model, but the model is not speaking to any type of cloud system where it's all contained in house and you can still run it

for just as cheap and, and now you own all of it and know nothing's leaking and it's only getting

smarter to you. Have you played around local models? Are you running anything out of any of your own hardware? So I have a Mac many and I've installed LM Studio and have played around with it a little bit, but I'll be honest, unless you have like some advanced Nvidia device or like a Mac studio, it's going to be very difficult to do the local running LLMs at scale, right? So I just want to be honest here. If you're going to try to dabble and open source models, I would say open router is probably

a really good resource right now while it's still available, right? Fingers crossed because they are just kind of the middle man where you just give it one API key and then you can install, you know, that Z coding app or open code right is another alternative to cloud code or code X and then you can route everything through open router where if you want to try GLM5.2 or deep sea slate a model or quen or, you know, mini Macs or insert new open source model, it's all routed through

“open routers 1 API key. So I think that's the best way to probably test these open source models right”

now. Yeah. All right. Well, I don't want to go to high level for the audience too quick. I just had a few things on my brain and I'm obviously nerding on this as well. So I want to get your takes and these things, but I'd like to pull us back to where we started and let's say I'm, I've played around a little bit. Yeah, maybe I have the pro version to, you know, the paid version to open AI or something or or cloud and I've played around a little, but I want to go deeper,

but I don't know where to start. Like, how does someone who wants to start doing some of the things that you're going to talk about as we go? Like, just level set for the starting point for them, like, is it downloading the cloud desktop app? Is it playing? Like, how does someone start to learn the, the necessary skills to, to start to use these products and, you know, for marketing in particular in sales without feeling they need to go too deeper or learn some sort of intrinsic

knowledge that maybe they just have no interesting. The first thing I would say before you go down

the endless amount of AI rabbit holes out there is I would first distinguish what are the top tasks that are the biggest bottlenecks in my business, right? So what's costing me the most amount of time and what's costing me the most amount of money? Once you establish those top three or five things, then that helps determine your answer going from there versus should I use chat GPT? Should I use cloud, right? That is the wrong framing for all of this, right? But if we want to take it, you know,

a step deeper here of just you're on the paid plan of opening AI, you're on the paid plan of cloud. I would say the next step is I would really encourage people to try cloud code or codex. And in terms of how to use this, okay? It does require a paid plan in order to use one of these things. But how I do it is I install what's called an IDE called Visual Studio Code. This is owned by Microsoft alternatives to this are cursor, which is just got bought out by SpaceX and then also

Google's anti-gravity or kind of those popular IDE's right now. And the reason why I use an IDE,

“if you don't know what an IDE is, I think it stands for like idle development environment is”

kind of the acronym. It is a wrapper, a user friendly wrapper versus pulling up just a terminal and getting lost in the terminal. So make sure life a lot easier where you can just have a nice visual of folders and files. And within Visual Studio Code, you can install official extensions. Whether that's the cloud code extension, the codex extension, I actually use cloud code and codex inside Visual Studio Code at once. And the benefit of using Visual Studio Code is that let's say

codex goes away. Let's say cloud code goes away. I still have all the folders, files, skill mark down files inside that one system. So it's a plug-and-place situation, right? Where I can install another extension that comes around or I can even pull up the terminal inside VS Code and install something through there and just go right where I left off with all the folders and files that I already had. And the reason that this is so important is because you're not locked in to one ecosystem.

And the reason I like VS Code over some of those other alternatives, cursor I think is more paid

more technical developers. And I don't know about you rhyme, but Google's anti-gravity. I've heard it's a good product. I just do not trust them, right? Because Google's incentivize to nerf every other AI model that you use inside anti-gravity and just push Gemini models versus Visual Studio codes kind of more of a, I would say, free to play environment where you can just plug and play different models and not really worry more about the bias. But if you have any like follow-up

questions, that's kind of high level of how I'm running things. Now, I want to dig into the ID. So one, I agree with you on Google, especially because their models are starting to fall behind. And

“actually, I was listening to, I think it may even been the all-in podcast. I'm not sure,”

but I was listening to a pastor talking about this exact topic and how, you know, basically,

the question that was asked was, how soon until Google catches up because they fall in behind in terms of, and the answer to the question I thought was really interesting was this particular person, and I, I think it was the all-in, so it may have been free burger messurer. I don't want to miss quote him. But he said, basically, they're not going to catch up. And the reason is they're too distracted, they're too big, they're too bureaucratic, and they're too Google ecosystem focused

exactly what you said. So I've actually moved away from the Gemini models and all that kind of stuff myself and to your point. So I've been using the terminal, and I like the terminal. I've learned how to use it, but man, for someone who, there are a lot of drawbacks to using the terminal directly.

In particular, what you just said and what I'm really interested in is, is there's no visual way

of seeing what you've already put in. Like, everyone's in a while. I have to go back and go, just tell me all the skills that I've added to this thing. You know, and then I'll pull up to this, and I can see them. But like, there's nowhere for me to get that get there easy. So cursor, I think a lot of people have probably heard of cursor, but you know, you're looking at 50 to 60 bucks before any model costs or token costs. So, so VS code,

free product allows me to get the visual nature. You know, I get in there, and what am I actually doing? So let's say, I download visual code and I add cloud code. I got

“that. I'm here. I think this. Yeah. Like, what do I do when I'm in there? Like, can I create emails?”

Am I, does it? Am I have to be building an app? Like, I think a lot of people feel like

the clawed chat is for, is for like my normal stuff, and clawed code is for like developers. And, and you know, I don't think that could be more wrong. So like, what are we doing when we're in there? So I just screen shared here. I hope you can see this. Okay. But to give kind of a better overview of versus me, just trying to explain this view of words is going to be very difficult. But what you're viewing inside here, you'll see I have the cloud code extension. You can actually use the terminal

inside visual studio code if you really want to, right? But the benefit of this is you'll notice on the left hand side. And again, I'm not the poster child for, you know, file organization here, by any means. But on the left hand side, what you'll notice is I have all sorts of folders and files and, you know, cron jobs and all sorts of other stuff going on here that make my life so much easier versus like you alluded to the terminal earlier. You don't have this nice looking

interface. And you can customize this for different colors and icons and pictures, however you want. But at one thing I would note about the skill markdown files, that's really helpful. If I zoom in here, you'll see I've kind of put all my different skill markdown files into different folders by category. So image skills, marketing skills, YouTube skills, system skills, like a skill creator skill or an MCP setup skill, right? It would be examples of that. And on the topic of skills here,

one thing I would say and just kind of for your audience who doesn't really know what a skill is, you can think of a skill as kind of a standard operating procedure or SOP for an AI agent or coding agent like Claude Code to follow a particular task correctly with best practices as you define in this markdown file. So it's just a markdown file, right? And so for this instance, I would also say

“that you should have one skill markdown file per one specific task. I'm not saying like for”

SEO, you should have one SEO skill and then fill it with a thousand lines of text and expect that one skill to do everything for SEO. You need to be very granular. So this means a keyword research skill, a local SEO skill, a local SEO designer skill. You know, an SEO blog post skill, an SEO audit skill, right? Notice how I'm getting granular and getting more in the weeds of certain aspects of SEO versus just one SEO skill. That's what I found yields the best results as when you get

very specific with these types of skill markdown files. One thing I think it's hard for billarap

going to get confused. And it doesn't matter how detailed you are, if you like you said, if you have

“a 5,000 line skill with seven different functions that it needs to perform even if they're well-broken”

out and well-ordered. A lot of times the AI will skim to operate fast and it will miss words, it will miss things, it will make a decision to skip a function for some reason or skip a step. And that becomes less and less the case, the more concise and direct and singularly focus these things are guys. So when you're thinking about this, what Ryan just said is, I've made this mistake. I built this huge skill for writing my newsletter, right? This huge newsletter skill.

And it had ears that they'd go out and do, you know, last 30 days keyword, find out relevant stories, ranked those stories, you know, all the way down. And I was getting different output every single time until I said, okay, I have like five things I want to do with the newsletter. Let's break them up. All the way to I have one skill that is a post newsletter committee audit

“and then a separate skill that runs like AI writing and I call anti-patterns is the skill name.”

And it basically has like it has 200 plus AI writing pattern. Now, those used to be in the same

skill. And I become much more, those skills have become much more effective when I split them out and made them separate things that I just run chronologically. So it's like singular focus, singular idea. And I love the word you use granular is it seems to absolutely be the solution when we're building these things. You mentioned the anti-scorer. I actually have a similar one called anti-slop where it gets rid of all those AI sloppards, right? A robust delve. If not this, then that, right? The

M-dashes, the emoji. So every time I'm going through writing, that's actually in my rules here is that it goes through the anti-slop and then it does the checks and balances to make sure that whenever the final output is approved, then it went ahead and passed that. One other thing

I would mention to Ryan is that I actually have a quote on quote second brain or a context memory

system inside Claude Code. Now, you can use Obsidian. You can use Superbase. There's a lot of alternatives and solutions out there. I actually vibe coded by own version of Obsidian and left it in Claude Code and then it does a daily backup to Google Drive. That's a whole other conversation here. But the idea is that every single conversation you'll notice I set this up going back to March, every single chat is automatically saved as a markdown file in this context folder. And if I want

to add other things like after this podcast episode down, I'm going to dump this in my context folder right where it has this endless list of context where if I ever need to pull something, you know, it has this endless library of all the context of things that I've done, chats that I've had. So that way it not only remembers this and knows for future reference, but it's a continuous feedback loop to understand, you know, what I'm looking for is this good.

Is it not? So that's the other thing I would recommend your audience does is make sure that you have some sort of vault to save all this context going forward. Oh my gosh, dude, I could not agree with you more. So I do use Obsidian and I use I have an open claw that I use as well. So open claw is kind of like my blunt force object. And then, you know, I have things set up around it. And I put into my Obsidian, every blog post I've ever written all the way back to like 2014. I have the

transcription of every podcast I've ever done both for this show or for shows I've been on, like you said, like you just said, right? I then had it tap into my X feed of my LinkedIn feed. So every X post I do and every LinkedIn post I make also gets categorized in there. And then one of the things that I did that is changed that has really changed the AI output writing is this is going to sound nerdy, but I'm a nerd. I had a Friday where I'm divorced. So I had a

Friday where both my kids were with their mom and the woman that I've been that I that I'm seeing my girlfriend, she was out of town. So I was all by myself on a Friday night. So like any good nerd

what I did was I had my open claw basically interview me from birth. And literally it took six

hours and four beers and and we went through and it just like then what happened. Oh,

“give me more detail on this. Why did you make that decision? Why do you think this happened?”

What how were you successful here? I mean, dude, it was six hours and I took that entire file. I had it chop it up into like epics of my life and then and tag it and then put that in there as well. So now not only is it pulling from learning off stuff that I had previously written,

or or stories into the writing that, you know, seemingly only I would know. And my point in saying

“that is when you combine, like I think it's like you need a skill for the basic buildout of the post,”

you know, and then you have your inputs to get you there. I really like this skill that I built and I'm interested in your take. I built a writing committee and it's Alex Ramozi, Courtney, Cody Sanchez, Robert Green and Ralph, Ralph Waldo, Emerson. So it's like make sure it's

concise into the point is basically her Mozi thing. Cody Sanchez is make sure it's either a

contrarian or original idea or something that hasn't just been regurgitated a thousand times. Robert Green is make sure it's the as well researched as it possibly can be. And then Ralph Waldo Emerson is basically like does it sound nice? You know what I mean? It's the pros there. And so it's like initial structure buildout, run it through the committee, run it through any patterns, now go in and inject personal narrative, personal story, et cetera, and the place it needs to be.

And it's like those are four different skills to write one newsletter. And that's the way I said it

“up. I'm not saying that's the best way, but like to kind of hammering on your point of being granular”

and specific with what you want in these things. That's four different skills to write one newsletter

article that I run through every single time. I love that. And something similar, we call this kind

of red teaming, right? That's kind of a more technical term when it's reviewing code or whatnot, but something that I've actually done on to your point is I have what's called an agent's MD, you know, I'm sure your audience might be familiar with the Claude MD, right? That's kind of the brain or the operation of a Claude code setup. The reason that I have an agent's MD is because I'm also using codex in tandem with Claude code and it's more receptive to an agent's mark down

file versus the way a Claude dot MD is structured if that makes sense, right? And so the point here is that in my agent's MD, one of the rules that I have somewhere in this file, I'm probably not going to be able to find it as I scroll through here is that every time I go through and build

something, whether that's like an article or that's code or I'm, you know, vibe coding something,

the rules in this agent MD tell it to red team with codex to go through and criticize something, find things that are broken and then it will provide feedback because GPT 5.5 offers a different and unique perspective than Opus 4.8 and it can often catch some things that Opus misses or drops the ball in some instances, right? And so that's a good little tip here I'd recommend like the AI council or red teaming situation where you can combine Claude code and codex to kind of attack

multiple things at once. And if I wanted to throw Gemini in the mix here and route something to open router or have other open source models, take a look at things, you can add as many models to this AI council or critiquing workflow that you want. I just keep it relatively simple with Claude code and codex. Yeah, yeah, there's a diminished return at a certain point, but like, yeah, now that makes sense. And so maybe talk to the audience a little bit about model selection in

so much as like like, open A, what you're going to get from Open AI in Claude is going to be different. It's going to be different from what you get from Grock from Gemini from each one of these things. And like our you, so I have been toying with the idea of of building in another skill similar to what you do with Agents MD with Grock to make sure what I'm saying is accurate like as a go through and hey, I want you know, because you can, you know, Grock will actually look at

community notes, et cetera. So if someone, if it's looking at information, but then that has been debunked or, you know, maybe the point needed to be narrowed a little bit, et cetera, like it can go in. So when you're thinking about this, you know, like how much time and thought do you put into model selection? Like was it just started with Claude and that's great. And then I went here or are you examining what the expertise is perceived to be from these models and piecing

them together in a thoughtful way and do you think there's an actual return to that and, you know,

“and how deep should you go? Yeah, before I think it used to matter a lot more, but I think the”

models are a lot more sophisticated now than they were a year, two or three years ago. But for most work Ryan, I'll be honest, I mostly stick to Opus by default. And then sometimes I'll throw in Sonic 5 if I'm doing less token intensive tasks. Like if I'm building websites, building landing pages, or a lot of times even general marketing copy, I'll leave it on Opus by default. But Sonic 5, they just upgraded from like 4.6 or 4.75 is a pretty significant upgrade there.

So I mostly stick with Claude models. I've seen those produce better outputs from a marketing content perspective. But I will say GPT 5.5 on medium or high reasoning GPT image 2, which is the image model from OpenAI, I found is the current best AI image model. So a lot of times when I'm going

a blog post, one portion of that loop in my actual workflow, as I say, call the Codex CLI to generate

“a featured image, or generate any other in-body images in that blog post if it makes sense. Right?”

And so in my blog post, and I'm doing for various clients on various sites, that one step that calls Codex actually has it generate the image. And the other thing I would say about Codex, that's good for people to think about, it's a really good insurance plan when Claude code goes down, or you run out of usage on your Claude plan, right? For $20 a month plan with Codex and chat GPT plus, you actually get a lot more usage than you would. I would even argue on a $100

a month, Claude Max plan if you're just running Opus 24/7. But the other thing I would say to rock, definitely the most unbiased model, you alluded to that earlier, so that's good for unsensored outputs. The one thing too for people to know is that Gemini models, yes, they suck, they're not as advanced now compared to Anthropica or OpenAI models, but where Gemini models actually still shine as I've deferred to these as workhorse models, where if you're doing something like scraping

a PDF, that's very token intensive. The biggest benefit of Gemini models is their massive massive context window. So scraping large files, you know, going through a massive YouTube video or YouTube transcript, or two examples that I do all the time, and they're very cheap, right? So using Gemini models for those more workhorse-ish tasks like scraping things, for instance, PDF's videos, I think that's still a good use case for Gemini, honestly. I love that example,

“because I think what you're showing everyone is, and I think this is an important point and push”

back if you disagree, is that we're still very much in a while less time. Like, there is no absolute here, there's no absolute right answer, and I think this is, you know, when we were in the, I guess we'll call it the green room before we went live here, you know, you said that, you know, one of the things that frustrates you the most about where we're at are these like hype grifters, and it's this constant, you know, you can make all your wildest dreams come true

if you just do this one thing. And my point in saying that is like, maybe that's true today,

maybe, right? But ultimately, like, you kind of have to FAFO, like you have to play around and say,

hey, I know that image, image Gen 2 from from Open AI right now is quote unquote the best image model, but, you know, the way I prompt out my images, Nano Banana 2 still produces the great, like go ahead use it, like you don't, you don't constantly have to be moving to the best thing. It's about figuring out what set of tools from that are at our disposal, open source, frontier,

“different companies, et cetera, get you to the result you need to do, and then become more and”

more sophisticated in how you use that set of tools. You don't have to be constantly chasing the next best model. Exactly. That's what the builders and the AI beast that I call it are doing, right? They have the systems, they have the harness, where once you have the systems harness and all the optimized skill markdown files, it's a plug-and-place situation of what's the latest and greatest model for this task. Okay, insert that. I don't care what it is. Just do the job as best

as possible and ideally as cost and token efficient as possible as well, right? So if you have the harness and the systems and the skill markdown files, it really doesn't matter if Opus 4.6 went to 4.7, where if you go on YouTube every face is like this, right? Telling you to drop what you're doing and oh my god, check out this model, give me views, give me sponsors, blah, blah, right? No one cares. The builders and the actual AI beast, they are tuning out all of that garbage while the

top of funnel consumers continue to chase all of this stuff and then wonder why they're behind in the scheme of things. When you sit down and you're working with someone and you're maybe

mapping out, they're basically starting from scratch, right? And they come to you and they're like,

hey, I want to take my marketing to the next level. I know AI can get there. I can help me get there. Like, what is the planning phase look like? Like, what is someone have to start to think about and like right? Like, obviously I have the four skills that I just talked about, you have even more and you're set up just from looking at it is more sophisticated with my which is fantastic, although I do want to talk a little bit about your thoughts on open claw and hermys, but we can

get there. Like, what, what is the starting spot? Should I be before I ever touch the computer? Should I be writing a plan down? Should I be like, how do I get to actually start building? Because it not a lot of people come to me because I don't, I'm not a AI fixer. That's not, you know, that's not what I do. But I do get a lot of questions just because I use it. I talk about it on the show. And a lot of the people who I do talk to, or maybe just try to give some light advice to,

it's usually they went in full bore into something when all the way down this path and then figured out, they have no idea where they actually are. The output isn't what they want and they don't

sidestep finding yourself down some path where you've spent a bunch of money, you haven't really gotten anywhere that you want to go and now you're just frustrated by the output? The first thing

“I would say, and I think I said this before is you first need to determine you can write this down”

on a piece of paper. What are the biggest bottlenecks that you're dealing with right now? Whether that's in your business or maybe you're a nine to five employee, right? And typically it's one of two things. It's what is taking the most time? What's eating five, 10, 15 hours of by week that I know I could use AI or automations to come in and replace? Or what is costing you the most money? Maybe it's this hundred or two hundred five hundred dollar a month sastool. That's not really

doesn't have a boat and not really moving the needle. How can I use AI to replace that, right? Those are two examples. You first need to figure out what you're doing. And then after that, it goes back to what we said about context, right? Make sure you're building up a folder of context, whether that is writing samples, brand guides, other assets, that way AI has something to pull from versus just going to generic cloud or generic chat GPT and saying run my SEO,

“write me a blog post, build me a website, build me an app with zero context and what do you get back?”

You get what we call the popular term AI slot because it has absolutely zero context to pull from. Those would be the top two things I would tell the audience. Understand what you're trying to do so formulate a strategy first and then figure out the systems, the skill markdown files on the context after that and then we can start going to AI once you have those two things and your results will be 10x50x100x better than if you just pull up cloud and say do my SEO, right?

But that's the advice out there because unfortunately that tends to go viral versus what actually moves the needle in the real world. Yeah, you know what's funny is like all those PDFs that I downloaded from different like courses or you know the $47 thing that catches you at 11 p.m. on Instagram that you hate that you bought but you did but has some valuable information in it but it's like 157 pages

you're never going to read it because it's a PDF. Like now there's a use for those. Now you can take

like you know there was this one guy and it was all about storytelling and email and I really liked this guy's philosophy and he had this but again it was 167 page PDF and it's like I'm never going to print that on read I'm never going to read on my computer but there's really valuable information you take that PDF you stick it in a as a file and just in a project folder even and now you can have now now you're your quad when you work inside that project is going to

reference that document if that's your email newsletter builder piece and all that reference material all those SOPs that you built that you're like why am I doing this in your business those are like prime candidates to potentially be turned into skills or build up build a project around it you know like I couldn't believe I had one guy who told me quote unquote he's a power user. Power user of Chad Gbt and I said okay well what's what's the problem and he's like I use it every day all

day but you know it never seems to get smarter it never gets better and I was like I kind of

had a feeling what was the problem he had never touched project you never thought about a project or a folder depending on which platform you're in like he had never even considered that option and I'm like dude you are literally he's like I got an upload like seven documents every time just to give it the contact and like well there's a better way like there's a better way you know it's so it's like it's so it's like okay so I know what my problems are right do you said

I have my context and then it's like it is the next step starting to almost break down a system or a workflow you identify into its individual chunks is that kind of the next step yeah and if you're bringing you to AI honestly I would just start with the quad the web app or chat GPT the web app just to get your feet wet versus diving right into an IDE with cloud code or codex I would start there first and then once you start to figure that stuff out a little bit create a project inside

clouds you understand what a customized version of AI looks like or create a GPT if you're using chat GPT so you understand that side of it and then create a skill mark down file from there and then maybe take the leap into a codex or a cloud code situation once you fully understand how to learn the basics of AI first right I'm not saying to jump right into on the deep end

to cloud code or codex if you've never touched cloud before that would be very bad advice

but start small start to learn workflow start to understand how these things work with context and then move your way into something more sophisticated like a cloud code or a codex and for the skill creation piece like essentially all the platforms can build the skill for

“you the actual markdown skill file the way it needs to be it's not like you need to know how to”

make a mark down file yourself it's like your hand coding this but so say you and I want to push back where I'm wrong I'm kind of laying the scenario for you so essentially what like let's say let's say that committee of advisors on that I had where I told you about her mosey and whatever

it what I wanted and I and I said hey this is what I want to do I want to create a committee

that reviews every post for certain characteristics and and then actually it was the cloud that that said hey can you give me personalities so it could work off of personalities and then I outlined that and I just said I usually whenever I wanted to interview I just say like ask me one question at a time because sometimes it'll hit you like 11 questions and it's overwhelming or whatever but and then at the end you know now I have this it this well this understanding you know that

the AI in this case called understood what I was trying to do with the skill and then all I had to do was say Pat can you package this up and do a skill for me and then the actual skill file it makes for you so I just want to wonder let me know if that's wrong but I want to remove the scary for people because they may not they may be going I don't know how to freaking create a skill file

“that the AI creates it you have to give it all the context understanding direction etc but the”

actual creation of the skill file all of these platforms can do for you create exactly right and the

thing I would say first is that anthropic actually has a skill creator skill by default that you can

use for free right so here's a good example if you're brand new to this let's say you want a landing page designer skill this is what I did when I first started I found a landing page that I know from someone else that converted very well and I said use the skill creator skill to make me a landing page designer skill but here's the reference and I want you to copy this architecture this format it's mobile optimized because I know it converts but make sure that you use my branding and

then I gave it my website rindozer.com for it to scrape so that way knows my colors my typography my content my writing style so it took that landing page architecture from the high converting page of someone that I follow that I know does very well but then it mixed my style into it and then

“it built that skill so it knows how to build a high converting landing page but make sure you're”

still using Ryan Dozer's personal brand while you're doing that that's a very simple example yeah I love that example and then guys you know just to kind of finish the story and again Ryan perspective when you were where you want to here or add context like then all you need once the skill is created then all I need to do is go you know hey plot I have a new product coming out here's the product details here's the ICP you know here's maybe a couple ideas on a premise

or a hook use the landing and then literally could just type in slash you know landing page creator and then it it does all the work for you now it knows what it needs to do you don't have to retipe it you don't have to reset you don't have to add all the context that went into what you wanted to look like it already has all that and you can just at that at that point you could pump out landing pages you could point about 100 a day if you needed to because all you don't have to

redo all that work that's that's the beauty of a skill right is not having to redo all of that context work every single time you want to create something you're exactly right and the benefit of using skill mark down files is that they have a real time feedback loop right so let's say I go through a conversation and I give it a bunch of updates on v1 of this landing page where the headers wrong or I actually like the color of that button or you know maybe the call to action

could be this way or that way and then once that conversation's done and you like the final output whether it's v2v3v4 you can say okay now update this skill mark down file based on this conversation that we had and so that way going forward when you build landing pages it understands and learns from its mistakes on what happened in the past and you can keep doing this time and time again the more you use these skills the other point to note about skills right is that they're transferable

they're not just for clawed right I know clawed skills is kind of a branded thing but you can use skills with code X you can use skills with open claw with Hermes with chat GPT right you can use

skills with any form of AI system which was as why I think it is such a revolutionary thing when

they came out yeah I couldn't agree more and you know for the for the audience at home guys like this is about like obviously rhymes a marketing guy maybe he has some intrinsic knowledge feelings expertise around creating landing pages and could he create a landing page from scratch if you needed to most likely but let's assume Ryan didn't know how to do that there's nothing that he just explained that you couldn't recreate right final landing pages that you like that

knows it works tell give clawed basic instructions that to use that as a reference basic instructions to use your branding and where to go get that and then go do your thing like there's there's

“nothing in there that you need to know like the golden circle or the F pattern or you know”

I mean like you don't need to know those things and then if you and then what I love that you just described because I didn't I didn't go there and and and I'm so happy you did is that is this idea of it being living and breathing is that let's say there's a new high converting pattern

you know either I want this to be a potential option that you ask me about or this is the way

“I want them all to look update and that thing just grows with you over time and and now you never”

you can always be you can always have that repeatable process be up to date in a very easy way

it's not like before where if you if a new you know thinking about this in the analog fashion like let's say you had a marketing person in your shop if they didn't understand landing page conversion you just didn't have that ability in your business you had to go pay somebody thousands of dollars to create that for you and now with a little bit of forethought and work you can create a repeatable pattern that allows you to do it at scale in a way that was never possible before yeah and

even before Ryan we people would be on GPT's or projects which are fine right they're better than the analog version like you stated but what's the problem with GPT's or projects right they didn't have a real time feedback loop so if you wanted to go back you'd have to update contacts you

know edit your custom instructions edit your memory right and then you'd have to keep doing this

“and it was super super tedious and if we want to nerd out just for a little bit there's like”

my name Andre Carpathy I'm sure you're familiar with him very big in the AI space he came out with this system called auto research I don't know if you're familiar with this this was several months ago it's a GitHub repository you can install it on your cloud code code codex system whatever you're using and so once you successfully install this what happens as you keep using these skills is they will update in real time so instead of me manually after the end of a conversation saying okay update

the landing page designer skill based on my chat whenever the conversation is over it'll trigger that auto research and it will automatically update the skill so that's like a kind of a nerd it out version but this is only going to get better as time goes on yeah so I love that you just said that and I'd like to go into this space a little bit um the skills that you're disposal are not just the things you create I mean one of the things that I found remarkable about this like error that

we're in right now and I hope it continues is the amount of free of exceptional free functionality

that is available on GitHub in terms of in guys GitHub is basically a repository for all kinds of

code um everything from skills like we're talking about to you know full blown build out projects and all kinds of things like you know the code for my website sits in a private GitHub repository et cetera um so my point saying that is like like there's a skill that I love for a research for my newsletter called last 30 days so again you probably know about this but just letting the audience know what this skill does is before I write a newsletter I can say let's say I was

writing something I have a lot of my home industry is the property housing insurance industry and I do a lot of work in that space let's say I want to know like what are the five hottest stories right now happening like in this space as it relates to commercial insurance and AI functionality

“and this skill will go out in mind tiktok x read it and I think YouTube for the most shared”

most commented on most viewed stories uh on those four platforms in the last 30 days really and then it pulls it back and now and now you have at your fingertips like what everyone is talking about right now and that's just and that is a free skill that you can go into GitHub you copy the link you paste it in your cloud code and you say hey add this skill and boom you have it and now that functionality works for you at your fingertips and you didn't have to do anything so

you don't not only can you build these things yourself as it works specific to your business but there are also incredibly exceptionally valuable functionality that is just sitting on GitHub for free where you don't even have to you don't have to even come up with the idea like it's just there for you and you can implement it into your workflow and it's fantastic so one thing I would say is I'm propic actually offers a free skills repository on GitHub right

and that's actually where I started my landing page designer skill as they have their own front-end design skill and so you can take these skills and then repurpose them with your own context and make them even better and something else that's funny about this Ryan it's I actually sell a digital product called the cloud code skill stack I launched this probably in March and it's made over $10,000 passively through just SEO and YouTube traffic I barely even market this thing

and the reason why someone would buy that versus getting a free skill is because it has my 10 plus years of subject matter expertise inside these skills right especially the SEO skills are kind of the more popular ones on the feedback that I'm getting where you can get my skills with subject matter expertise and best practices and then repurpose that with your own brand asset to your own style and that way you can get better results going forward versus just saying

better results yeah I love that and I'll have guys I'll have that link in the show notes whether

you're watching on YouTube or listening to where every list and just scroll down I'll have that as well as any other resources that Ryan shares because you know this can jump you forward so fast I know for my open claw I downloaded Gary Trends G-Brain and you know that he built that

“specifically for for open claw but he has another one I think for claw but I haven't looked into that one”

and it was like a bunch of little things and this is the beauty of these of these skill repositories is like every once in a while it will because that skill repository is added to my open claw every once in a while it will automatically do something up ask a secondary question ask if I want to create like these things will automatically pop in because in this case the G-Brain is more of an operational than it is like a marketing tool but like it it it it it will find errors in the

system it will help me with unhealthy gates you know all these annoying things that I would otherwise have to go create myself it just solves them in a finger snap for me because his expertise was the operational side of open of open claw and you know so you're just downloading it and adding it now I don't have to go create all those individual skills are there for me and like you said now I'm tapping into his his brain for those specific things that I didn't otherwise know how to

“do and in your case it's SEO which I think a lot of people think they know how to do or they may”

think the AI knows how to do but they're you know for my 15 plus years of of being in the marketing

space one it's always updating and two there are so many nuances that someone with your level of expertise

has that I wouldn't even know to put in there someone else wouldn't even know to put into the skill in the first place so I think it's a really good call out to say that there are these repositories that you can go to like yours to actually leap you forward and then you don't have to do all the individual skill creation and the only tip with that I would add is that make sure if you're getting these skills from whether it's my repository yours or anthropics or whoever make

sure you repurpose them with your context right you don't just want to download skills and say go because you don't want to sound like Ryan Dozer or Ryan Handley you want to sound like you and you want to have your actual brand assets and context behind that so that's just a quick tip there for those you just want to get skills and go off running you know off to the races here just

make sure you're always adding your context and repurposing them have you played around with

OpenClarer Hermes agent at all I've installed OpenClarer I'll be honest I haven't had the time to go in and actually dive into it it hasn't been I don't I wouldn't say very timeworthy for me as of lately where I could just go into cloud code set up cron jobs and just have things running through there is it on my list of to-dos absolutely it is just one of those things on a never-ending list so I went OpenClarer first for reasons that I probably can't even rationally explain just

maybe the hype got me and I was excited and I went down that path I will say just for the audience

“so so OpenClarer Hermes especially the people that love those platforms that I I believe they over”

that it was nefariously but I do believe they're overhyped what they can do OpenClarer is a shit ton of work you are maintaining as much as you're using it I do think it has a place but the place isn't what I think it was it was initially marketed as this is all you need right you have this you attach your model you add some skills and then OpenClarer does its thing and you don't need anything else yeah I'm employee while you sleep right that's the pitch it is that and it isn't that

so what I found is I'm starting to move more of my day-to-day work functionality to quad agents like you've done more and more to that and then OpenClarer is more like how did I describe I use OpenClarer is openClarer is more autonomous version of cloud code it's more my random request things so like an example would be I said to OpenClarer it has access it has read only access to both my work email and my personal email as well as read only to all my text messages

in my context and I said I want you to go find every everyone who I've talked to in the last five years about a speaking gig I want you to tag them as you know conversation booked conversation not booked and I want you to build that list and it came back like 278 contacts and then I said okay based on that list you just created I want you to now create a look-alike audience of a thousand contacts and events that potentially fit what these events look like and build me out of that list

and that type of request OpenClarer is very good at because there's no guardrails right so it's

email I'm going to an email and I find what cloud and chat you be tea sometimes probably rightly so don't

get me wrong probably rightly so there's some more hesitancy to doing some of these really deep dive tasks and kind of random exploratory tasks where OpenClarer's not as good at I want you to run last 30 days every day at 6 a.m. and deliver me an email with the top five stories that I can potentially write a link didn't post about and maybe create three hooks for each one of those that I could consider in the day like that is cloud code agent like that's just beautiful for that where open

claw tends to be more like I have this random problem that I can't get my head around and I need something without any guardrails to go figure out the solution it comes with you got to be careful you know but a lot of security issues with this whole thing too well yeah there's that's so early on and the audience may not know this probably maybe you've heard the story or not but early on there was this like cautionary tale or some dumbass marketer was using open claw in a

completely cracked version so by cracked I mean it had read and write access to everything so read access probably makes sense right access is an actually going to email and send an email as you are going to something right so he gave it full reading right access to everything including his bank accounts so he tells the thing I want to get better at and I think it was SEO I want to get better at SEO right go out and research overnight the best you know everything you can find

about SEO so because it's completely cracked and there's no guardrails and as reading right access to every system it determines that there is a $6,000 SEO course that would be the best way for it to learn SEO it taps the credit card pays for the system logs in and the guy wakes up and he's got like $5,997 on his credit card and he's like what the F and come to find out his open claw just decided that was the best resource to learn SEO and just spent the money so it's like

“with open claw you have to be very smart and constrained and understand you know what it can”

and can't do but again going almost all the way back it's not a one size fits all it's a it's one tool of a bunch of tools that we need to start to consider just like we would employ he's like I'm almost you know thinking about these things like his employees like clawed is good at this and

you know open claw is my you know crazy guy that never comes into the office but we give all the

random stuff to and you know chat GBT is my you know whatever is that the right way to think about it like we got almost think about this like we're designing a little team that's a really good way to think about it you know I've heard other stories of like the cracked open claws were one one and it actually wiped this guy's entire computer because it was on bypass permissions and it just deleted everything to clear up space I've heard also other stories of prompt injections right

that have led to very malicious things that go down but what you mentioned about the employee thing

“I think you're 100% correct on that one thing that I actually have on my to do list with open claw”

whenever I get around to it is I'm going to use it as a digital PR agent so I'm going to give it a burner email and then give it a set of skill mark down files and agents MD and all the other harness and systems that I need to so that way it knows okay here's Ryan Dozer's website or here's Ryan Dozer's YouTube channel every time he does a blog post every time he publishes a YouTube video that triggers the signal or the automation for me to scrape through that craft an email pitch

and then email the relevant reporters in all these industry specific marketing outlets with you know a good subject line a good body everything that goes into a good PR email that's going to incentivize someone to open that and maybe that leads to a back link or maybe that leads to a podcast opportunity right so that's something that's been on my radar as a really good you know use case for having something like an open claw or a Hermes is more of that digital PR agent you could

also do something similar for a cold email agent I've seen that thrown around too. Dude so um okay

“I think you'll find this interesting and um here we're at the end so we're at the storytelling time”

but uh so I just got my first um traditional publishing book deal. It's uh that's I was too

sure yeah thank you through Simon and Shuster in print Ben Bella very excited um and I'm I'm I'm very excited so I want to explain to you how I got this because it's what you just said. So um open claw helped me you know with structuring different things coming up with a book pitch coming up with the the overall outline and stuff I mean obviously when you do a traditional book deal you you do have to write every word um they're going to really heavily scrutinize

after AI writing and I'm not going to I use it for research but but not for the actual writing that being said I had the book proposal and the outline and I then said okay I want you to analyze

who are actively in the market looking for books who have published books in the kind of leadership self-improvement space um have published a best seller in the past something that is hit at least the USA today list but either or New York Times and I want you to create that list I then want you to rank order them by your belief that the previous books they publish a line in terms of disposition to to the book that I'm writing okay so it goes out and it does that and I have it

connected to Apollo and rocket reach um APIs to get contact information so it searches for

contact if you can't find it then it'll go into those that and between those two you can basically

find almost anybody I find what you just said there I'll stop you quickly that was really good context right versus what do most people do they just say go find me emails but what you just lying is like really really good context for an AI agent to figure out so just one of the kind of applaud you on that quick I appreciate that thank you and not so okay so it creates that list so here's the part that gets that that like makes me really excited so we have the list awesome

let's email them okay he goes well I'm going to craft I need to craft an email like okay so we craft an email come back read through it looks good couple edits couple questions whatever and I go okay let's start sending he goes no no no no this is this is the this is the AI tell me this and this is why when you guys at home when you go deep on context you can have a real conversation with these things

“but you have to again to your point you got to go deep on the kite it doesn't understand what you're”

trying to do it can't help you and so it says we're not emailing the entire list we're going to email five at a time starting from the back from the least from what I determined are the least likely to do a deal with you okay why we're going to iterate on the email over time as we get feedback

yes or no that's great sends out the first three batches you know we're staggered like every

couple days then really get much feedback yeah it was early but ever and I just asked the question like how come we're not attaching the book proposal through the email and it comes back and says it is a commonly held understanding inside the book publishing world that if you attach a book proposal to your initial email that you're an amateur and they'll just bypass you oh yeah let's go right so long story short I have it is created a custom list rank ordered

right with a with a email that is then custom designed for each individual person that's going in an incremental basis all set up through cron jobs and you know I got I got about 55 emails in the publisher I ultimately decided you know a couple had responded yes I had a great conversation

with them and at the end I have a book deal right and you're like I could have never done that

work I mean that would have taken me six months to do that work if I could have even found the people like but when you that's the level of like sophistication automation like that's where you can go when you to your point you've made over and over again when you've thought through what it can do when you've given it proper context and direction when you spend the time to build a plan

“and have it understand that's how you leverage the full power of this tool but to your point opening”

up a random you know zero context even paid strategy between though and asking it to help you you're you're going to get 20% 30% of what that thing can actually do yeah I loved your story and I've a really quick one two and they kind of couldn't put this so in my world of SML I do run several cron jobs and I don't know if you follow like Google's latest algorithm updates or being or whatever but they the thing they are cracking down on the most right now is mass generated

AI spam or AI slot because you have all these people running programmatic systems that pump out hundreds and thousands of different blog posts every single day right and so with this cron job it's actually monitoring all the Google algorithm updates and so it gives me feedback of hey maybe let's post two three five times a day and cut back on 10 like we were previously right because that's gonna send negative signals to the Google algorithm and all the LLMs if we're mass generating

content they're gonna penalize us regardless if that content's high quality or not it just sends negative signals to the algorithm so that was like a super super quick example there how I'm running a cron job on the SEO side of things no dude this is all so valuable and I love these stories

“because I think what it does for the audience is I think if you're if you don't”

if you're not the type of person who dives in and learns it with your hands which I get not everyone's like that and maybe you know thinking through these things in this way is not necessarily your expertise we're just haven't done it I think these examples give people the ability to go oh I might not want to update I might want to not know about SEO updates but I really want to know

for my industry or insert like I think it cracks open ideas for people and they can start to see that like this isn't just an email tool it's not just a better blog post tool or a video

script tool like yes you can do those things and you can do them at scale and they can be amazing

but like you can there are so much that you can do with these tools if you're willing to take

“a little bit of lead time just I think that's like the the biggest takeaway from this is one”

it hopefully it's not as scary as maybe you'll think and I I feel like we've gotten there with them but like just a little bit of lead time a little bit of planning time a little bit of that up front work and the value that can come out the back is just absolutely insane um with that said dude I know my audience is gonna want to go deeper in your world I know you have a badass YouTube channel we're gonna have that linked up where else should people go to go deeper into your world to learn

more about what you do and and maybe just finish with a little um you know I guess doesn't have to be a pitch but just let people know exactly how they can work with you and the different things that that you're up to yeah Ryan I appreciate you having me and I would say another good places Ryandozer.com and then also I run a community on school called the AI marketing insider is I'm over 1500 members now at this point so those are some pretty good places to find me

the last thing I would say is this is kind of someone's pitch to whether to work with me or even to follow me on YouTube or whatnot is that I would argue that I'm in the top one percent of people in this AI marketing world that are actually doing the real thing with AI and then learning what

works and what doesn't versus 99 percent of other people are pure theory they're just looking

what's the latest and greatest thing pumping out a video doing the packaging with the clickbait thumbnails and titles trying to hook you hook line and sinker you in versus with me I'm gonna tell

“you the truth because I'm actually doing things in reality that's what I would say I love it I think”

it's and I think that was obvious from our conversation dude which is why I appreciated this so much I appreciate your time this has been great and dude if you want to come back on in a few months and do an update talk more about cool shit that's happening I'd love to have you I appreciate you going screen share too that I think that helps a lot and guys if you're just listening to the audio make sure you jump over to the YouTube video because a lot of what Ryan was discussing when he was

getting into the detail of VS code etc how he was setting up the folders you can see him do it he was you know if you're just on audio you wouldn't have seen it but like you can go over to

“a YouTube video and actually watch how he has he set up how clean it is and how I think”

not scary this has to be like there was nothing that you showed us that was like oh my god I

could never do that right it was you've put a lot of work into it but like over time that's a very

achievable and accessible thing even for someone who's very non-technical and I appreciate that very much I wish you know them at the best bud hopefully we'll chat again I have a feeling we We will, and with that we're out of here guys, Pooch!