James Murdoch & Vox Media, SpaceX IPO Predictions, and Bezos Gets Defensive

why does this feel like a second job? ATO is worth a look. ATO is the AICRM that builds itself. If you connect your email and calendar and pulls in every company, every contact, and every interaction already organized in one place from there, it keeps itself up to day. It understands your customer calls adapts to how your business works and the AICRM takes action

“in the background so you can focus on what matters. If you need an intelligence CRM that scales”

and grows with your business from day one, that's ATO. Go to ATO.com/PIVA and you get 15% off your first year that's ATTO.com/PIVA. With Finn, we've built the number one AIA agent for customer service. It solves up to 90% of queries for businesses, tops all the performance benchmarks and the G2 leader boards and it comes with a million dollar guarantee. Check it out at Finn.ai. Everywhere you look, AI is expanding what we thought was possible. And at the center of it all is

CoreWave, medical research and diagnosis, education, complex visual effects for movies, science and technology breakters. CoreWave powers AI pioneers around the world with purpose-built tech,

building what's never been built before. CoreWave is the essential cloud for AI, ready for anything,

ready for AI. To learn more about how CoreWave powers the world's best AI go to CoreWave.com/Ready for anything.

“Remember, we work? Its mission was to elevate the world's consciousness? That sounded grounded.”

Hi, everyone. This is PIVA from New York Magazine in the Vox Media Podcast Network. I'm Cara Swisher. And I'm Scott Galloway. Scott, things are happening at Vox Media. We're going to do something a little different today and start with a voicemail from a listener who's going to explain the situation. Let's play a clip. Hi, after listening to PIVA today, I saw that Jim Smirdock is buying part of Vox Media and I was curious how that might change the freedom you guys have on your

various podcast. Anyway, love your shows. Just finish burn-gloat and listen to all your podcast. Keep up the good work, Jenny, from Texas. Oh, that's a very good question, Jenny from Texas. So, in case people don't know what she's talking about, James Murax Company, Lupa Systems is a acquiring Vox Media Podcast Network, New York Magazine and the Vox site. The other parts of Vox Media including Eater, the Verge, SB Nation, becoming a different company, a new independent company.

The deal is expected to close in the coming weeks. There's a few legalities in this and that I want to understand. Lupa Systems is not disclosed. The purchase price, but it's reportedly around

300 million. The podcast network is the more attractive asset that we love New York

Magazine and it does rather well. And love jocks. And so, Scott, people want to know what we think about this because a lot of people have bad information. First of all, Jim Bank off the staying is CEO of this unit. It's a spin-off essentially of these assets and which have been fast-growing. So, explain Mr. Business, explain the situation. Well, about a decade ago, people thought wouldn't be great to aggregate kind of this alternative media or build alternative media companies

for a new world. And so Buzzfeed, Food 52, CNET, VICE, was a called Mike, a Mashable, and Vox. And back when they thought probably six, seven years ago that if we bring together sort of these good little media assets, some digital, some not, and grouped them together, we can spack it and it'll go public at one to three billion dollars. And so, Jim logically, the CEO of Vox thought this is a good idea about New York Magazine, had a bunch of very, you know, fast-growing websites,

eat or verge, you know, vulture, and then started some nascent podcasts, right? And then essentially

what happened was the market never said okay, there was never the bloom came off the rose. And

basically, of all these companies, they're competing against monopolies who extract grants. And then their margin was, you know, the margin of all these companies is Google and Meta and Amazon's opportunity. And they've slowly but surely sucked the oxygen out of the room. And Buzzfeed, from peak valuation to sales prices, off 86% food 52, lost 96% of its values, CNET, lost 94% of its

“value. Vice was, I think, basically went bankrupt, but sold some assets, it's down at least 93%.”

Mashable of 80%, I mean, just on and on and on and on and on, Tumblr, my favorite, 1.1 billion to 3 million. If you're an investor in New Square Ventures, thank God, that the Caesar's haircut

buy his bag of shit for 1.1 billion Tumblr. That was more a Samarit Yahoo.

“So effectively, this is this not worked out. Now, Jim R guy, who we like as it was said, Scott”

be honest and it was told us to be honest, so let me be honest. They spent a lot of money to create a company with negative synergy. There's some real assets there. New York magazine is a trophy iconic asset. The sights themselves, the digital assets are actually do pretty well, but again, see above their swimming upstream against giants. And then the smaller division that started out as an afterthought has become the growth engine in the crown jewel. And Jim is a smart guy and

realize that the hole was less than the sum of its parts and basically decided to break them up into what was going to be three buckets. But my understanding is, and I do not have insight information here and I don't want it, is that Jim Murdock or James Murdock who wants to be in the media business said, I'll take New York magazine because I think he likes it. It's an iconic asset. And what I really want is the podcast network, which is growing. I'll stop there. Where did I get that right

away? No, you got that all right. And I think Jim, of all of them, has can't only move that into a space, obviously, BuzzFeed, just bought by Byron Allen. You know, they've all vices had a much less happy situation. You know, Mike, I don't know where that went. Like, there were a lot of them. And it was very exciting. And one of the reasons I sold my tiny little site to Vox, many years ago, recode was because they were ridiculously priced. And we're sort of pricing me out. I was even a

smaller minnow. And so when I got to Vox, I understood the ad market was really a problem here,

“although we did great. Let me just, the only thing you're leaving me out is so much great journalism”

by so many of these sites. And then so much really interesting independent media. Absolutely. All the verge, either, you know, all of them in New York magazine just want to, and the national, the general excellence award in the national magazine awards. Wonderful, under David. It was punches above a toy class. Yes. In fact, the HP of magazines is the way I would describe it.

Right, exactly. It's amazing. So anyway, so it's, it's, it's really nice parts.

There really is parts, but what happened was exactly what Scott said and what I thought, which is one of the reasons I went to gym 12 years ago and said, I'm going to start this little podcast called, was recode decode at the time, or I'm going to have been something else. I don't remember what it was. And because I really did have an interest in this area and felt that was shifting and then they added on the Ezra was on there. There's a whole bunch to

“explain a bunch of things. And would essentially happen after that, after that, I met Scott Galloway”

in the rest of his history, like we've done really well. Well, man, with the wrecked out of this function, James Murdock. It just all makes sense. In the Murdox. In Murdox. And I worked for his program. Right. I know. Right. I know. People are thinking it's very funny for me, especially because I knew James for a million years ago. When he was actually around for digital stuff, very early when I was covering the early digital industry. And he tried very hard to move his

family's company digitally. But Rupert always did something idiotic, like whether it was

the way they handled my space or, but there was so many. I can't even tell you. Like Disney, they had 19 of these things. And especially the iPad news thing that I thought was ridiculous. And so we left the Murdox Empire, largely over Rupert, over problems. He was doing all sorts of nefarious things. And we wanted to come out on our own and then ended up selling a box. And so everything comes around. Essentially, I met Scott. We built Pivot. And we built each of our

other stuff on and all the Proof G stuff, which is wonderful. And over time, in our recent renegotiation, we became partners with Vox. And they sell our advertising. They help us mount the events, which they're excellent at. And Scott has his, has his own way of doing things. He just started a great subject. And so it's a really, actually fertile time. And but there's all these different configurations. And I would say for people to understand, they are, we, I have met

with James Murdox and his wife, Catherine, who is also very involved in this. I have nothing but good feelings for them. I don't have good feelings for his father and either to see, which has been well documented. And so we have complete freedom to do what we want. We own these podcasts that we have. Scott, I don't say as I own mine. And we own Pivot together in a, in a, in a death grip to the end for whoever, which one of us survives. And, and so we'll be

keep doing what we want. And we really like working with Jim. We, and now this other Jim and, and the rest of it. And we hope they'll be more, you know, synergies between them. We're not, like a total believer in all synergy, but they've got some cool things like art, basil, and a number

there's lots of opportunities here. But mostly it's not going to change. From, you know, not going to change our deal. We like the deal. We got, um, we again own our things. And so, we're happy to take suggestions from, you know, the same thing like Jim will suggest up, mainly their normal or will not. Like he might have a, he just had a great idea to this morning

for me. Um, and I'll take it. So, and I really do think of James Maran, because always been very

smart digitally, I think. I, I like him. He's not, you can't just put Murdoch on it and say, they suck. I, I would agree about the report Murdoch. I would not be owned by Murdoch and, uh,

“and we're not owned by anyone. So I think that's it. What do anything else?”

Well, when Reuters called me, I said, look, we like the gyms. And we have, you know, we have a lot of power here. And we didn't ask for anything. We just asked for everything to stay the same. I saw pivot as a joint venture between Swisher Gallo and Vox. You own on, I own Prop G, but both on and Prop G uses Vox for, we do a revenue display where they sell our ads. And if we could, I mean, this is going to sound self-absorbed. We could have killed this deal. And we didn't. And we just,

we didn't ask for anything extra. We just said, yeah, we just want things to stay the way they are.

And Jim Bangkok has never once asked me to tone it down, to stop the dick jokes, to reconsider.

I have, but doesn't know you have, but you're, you're trying to save me from myself, and you're also posing for your woke friends. Oh, stop it. You're so much younger than I know. Anyways,

“I'm so much younger than you. I'm the woke guy. You can't. But let me go to just some of the,”

the learnings here. And it's basically the business model for tech has been, find, have great technology, find a very compelling leadership team that's able to craft an narrative to raise more capital than anyone else, deliver an unbelievable product at below price. And then consolidate the market and then start sucking the oxygen out of the entire ecosystem. So let me give you an example. And then everybody else gets crushed. Google and meta have an increasingly pushing users away from

external sites in, in favor of their AI over views, which they can monetize. So Huff Poe,

between 2022 and 2025. So basically the last three years that we have data on this,

Huff Poe's organic search traffic has been cut in half. The Washington Post, down by nearly half business insider has seen their organic traffic cut in half. NYT organic search is as a share of their total traffic fell from roughly 44% to 36.5%. And the Wall Street Journal's organic search is as a share of their total traffic fell from 29% to 24%. And let me just go back in history and pat my self on the back. In 2006, when I joined

at the board of the New York Times, and literally my first meeting, I said, "Okay, you're the digital guy, which we do." I'm like, "Shut off Google, don't let them crawl your content." Because eventually, they're going to commoditize your content, stop driving traffic to us, and all you're doing is building them into the ultimate toll booth. And Martinisan holds his very smart guy, said, "Well, if we can't figure out a way to compete against Google and we're making money from the traffic,

they send us and shame on us." I'm like, "Yeah, go to Murdock, go to the new houses, go to the financial times, and consolidate, and turn off Google, and then licens your content to the highest bidder." And at that point, Microsoft had Bing, and we would have been able to get a lot of money

“and say, "Look, if you want to crawl this gorgeous content from Thomas Friedman and from Vogue”

and from the FT, you got to pay us." But instead they said, "No, we like the traffic. They were pursuing this eye-ballsening, and now it's way too late." And these companies are the internet. And very few people go directly to NY Times to come. They get served stuff on meta. That's how they decide where they're going, or the Google is now entirely, they don't take it to the best place, they take you to a place they can further monetize. And Jim is managed to get on the last helicopter

out of Saigon. But wait, do you want to hear some of the threads I thought of? I was stuck. I'll test the limits of our new ownership. I was walking around Lisbon, yesterday it was beautiful and I was bored. So as soon as I saw the announcement at that, I'm going to test the limits of my freedom. My first thread was alternative media is like a vegan restaurant, virtue signaling loses money and a billionaire bills you out. That was my first one. My second one

was that picture of Jim Bangkok and James Murdoch, where it looks like the 30 year reunion of Abercrombian fish, they're both very handsome. And I wrote Romeo Michelle's high school reunion too, post-transition. That one I'm especially proud of. Okay, last one. What was my third one?

and then I started doing it and I'm sitting on the park and I'm like, do I really need to be an asshole? Don't not today. Did you like give them their moments? Give them their moments before we an asshole. Before we start making their lives typical. No, you know, let me let me just add this to get in this. So two things. Jim back, as he said, we don't, we can say whatever we want. I don't see that problem from James Murdoch or Gavodok at all. They might be irritated by us,

but there's no going to be no change in that. And let me be, I hate to say this, but Rubber Murdoch never

asked me to change a thing. Like that is one thing. I never experienced what I worked at the walls.

“I just don't, I think he's a heinous piece of shit. Well, I think he's heinous the way he's done”

Fox News and the other stuff, but and has degraded democracy quite a bit, but he's not James is not him. And so, but that's that Murdoch never metled in my stuff, and he certainly could have for my entire time there. I just like him. But one of the things we had to say, we get to do we want, we will do, we want, and also just, I know Scott was sort of putting a sort of ugly picture on it, but actually New York Magazine is profitable. So where the podcast networks are doing great,

and they're profitable, a lot of these websites are. So it's not, like it's just not a crazy business, but it's not these are not suffering properties. And last of all, many of the most of them provide

amazing journalism. And I think David Haskell deserves all to credit for New York Magazine winning

that award. And awards are one thing, but they certainly, they're up against some amazing journalism

“this year from the Atlantic and from Republican-wired. So they're very good properties. He's bought”

some good properties here in that regard. It's not, they're not falling knife properties. They make money, but the, the crown jewel, shockingly of all this, is the podcast. New York Magazine is a vanity asset. It is, but it does okay. It doesn't, it's not, it does fall. You become one of the sexiest men in Soho when your rap is I own New York Magazine. You're going to step. It's a very, it's just a great journalism team. Okay, that's great. So

is NPR. It doesn't make any money. Yeah, but this one does. So anyway, let's begin of not make any money. Let's talk about some IPO news. Some really not in any money. Space

axis filed an IPO prospectus. And it is revealing, while the company brought in $791 million

in profit in 2024. It swung back to $4.9 billion in losses in 2025. For context, 200 companies

“in the S&P 500 are more revenue than SpaceX last year, including Tesla, also revealed in the,”

by the way, they buy a lot of stuff from Tesla. There's a lot of round trip and happen at these, these companies all controlled by Elon Musk. They also revealed in the filing anthropics paying SpaceX and thank God for $1.25 billion per month through May, 2020. Nine is part of the compute deal the two sign, meaning growth will not be using that space and colossus one and two. SpaceX is reportedly targeting $1.7 trillion valuation. I mean, it goes on and on and on a lot of things.

A lot of words like human, I don't know, like connection. I mentioned a lot. Just it's this business, not economically and mass-speaking. It's not worth $1.7. I mean, it's just the Elon. That guy gets a lot of the credit for using this number because even the stuff they're promising seems problematic. But he hasn't done it before. He just moves from one lily pet to the other in terms of, from Tesla to this. But the big, the big winner in this that I read is Starlink does great. The

others grow and the rocket company is not so much. Go for it. I got a lot. Okay. Good. I can't wait. I'm excited. Yeah. What was been it out? At 3M. I was reading the US. I know what we're doing. So first off, I have some notes here. The first 14 pages of the S1 are pictures of rockets. AI is mentioned 1200 times in the S1. There are 277 pages of the perspective for context. It's longer than the great Gatsby and the catch in the Rye. And some direct quotes from the filing. These are direct quotes.

We do not want humans to have the same fate as dinosaurs. Thank God you're here, Elon. For decades, a reality where humanity travels between the planets and the stars has felt tantalizingly close, but still. Would you mind if I ate my protein ball where you do this? Because I'm hungry and I also fascinated people. For decades, a reality where humanity travels between the planets and the stars has felt tantalizingly close, but still locked in the pages and screens of

science fiction. The Sun contains approximately 99.8% of the solar system of energy and as result, we believe it is the only truly scalable solution to terrestrial energy constraints in the age of

is the creation of a resilient, perpetually expanding space-faring civilization. Ultimately, that is sexy voice, please. Ultimately, preparing us to Kardashev type two status, defined in the

“filing itself as a civilization that harnesses the full energy output of the Sun. Remember, we work,”

its mission was to elevate the world's consciousness. That sounded grounded. Yes, no, this seems like it sounds like a Mayan. He sounds like a Mayan, but go ahead. So let's talk about the numbers here. Headline valuation, 1.8 trillion, they're whispering, they can go out at two. That's roughly the GDP of Canada. So let that marinate. The core business is generally an excellent business. Starlink generated 3.26 billion in revenue in a single quarter with 1.2 billion in operating income.

That's 36% operating margin on a monopoly satellite in our business, internet business with no serious competitors in sight. It's a great business. If this were the whole company, it would be one of

the great businesses of our era. And then what the problem is, it's not staple to this rocket ship

“is XAI. A business that is clinically speaking, a money furnace. In 2024, XAI lost 1.6 billion”

on 2.6 billion in revenues by 2025, losses ballooned to 6.5 billion on 3.2 billion in revenue. So revenue, revenue went up 20%, but losses went up 310%. Can I ask you quickly? These revenues don't seem like killer. It's 30%. It's not like, wow, they're not wow growth, right? It's sort of good. Solid. Am I wrong there? No, it's, well, let's just, let's just talk about SpaceX, the best business. It's growing 20% a year. And it's trying to go out at 100 times revenue. When Google went public,

it was growing 240% a year and went out of 10 times revenues. So just back to, back to XAI, XI is losing money on the way to losing more money. And in Q1226 alone, the net loss of 4.3 billion on 4.7 billion in revenue. Total capex, 10.1 billion in 90 days, 7.8 billion of that for AI, cash on the balance sheet, um, created from 25 billion to 16 billion in just 3 months. They burned 9 billion in cash in a single quarter. That's 100 million dollars a day. That's not investing

in the future. It's, it's the future building you in advance. Right, can I, this is anthropic thing.

It's critical. Do you think he's moving into being the infrastructure player rather than the AI player here?

No, it's, it's him having spent too much capex thinking that XAI, his AI would need it and he woke up and realized he didn't. It's like, this has happened to me a million every time I start a company, I raise too much fucking money, I go get a giant off the space and so on before I know it,

“I'm writing it out to a bunch of shitty startups to try and recoup some of the capital. That's what”

he'll happen here. Total debt on the bank. Thank goodness for that, right? Presumably, for the. Yeah, total debt on the balance sheet is 29 billion. Um, so just for context, that's more debt than it's on the Delta Airlines, United Airlines and American Airlines combined with all their planes. And, and those, they carry passengers. SpaceX has starship, which has cost over 15 billion

in development and is still on its 12th test mission. So, look, the bottom line, you're being asked to pay

1.75 trillion for a great satellite internet company, a rocket business that loses money, an AI product losing six billion a year and falling further behind its competitors that has 29 billion in debt and a CEO who, in this is my favorite part of the filing, purchased $131 million of his own recalled cyber trucks with company cash. He's propping up Tesla, propping up Tesla. That's right. So, in sum, Starlink is the golden goose,

an amazing company. Everything else is Elon's hobbies and a disvaluation, you're paying full price for all of them. So, you know, snow white is fucking hot, but you gotta, if you marry her, you're taking on these little non-value ad weirdos. This is, so this company, you have an amazing company buried in all of these other money furnaces. Right. And he's asking you to pay essentially 100 times revenue. And people will, so talk about that because, look, it is not, I read it. I'm like,

wow, this is not it. There's one good business in there, right? Really good business. And by the way, easy to disrupt that business, by the people will come into this business and they'll be more competitors. And so that's my worry about Starlink. It's like, we sure he has the win for today. It doesn't

people will just buy into this and run it up because it's him and that these promises that you

would you left out a little bit here is, there's going to be all these robots in your home. There's going to be, he made a lot of promises in this, in this perspective, too, about the future. Like,

“you have to assume he's going to kill it in robots. And by the way, I have heard from many people,”

his robot technologies really advance. But it has to get to people, right? It's got to get to people. It's got to become a product. And so just, it feels very hand-weighty, this entire thing, but I don't think it's going to matter. I mean, be a Wall Street person and say, you know, what would you do as an investor? You might want to play for the pop, but I actually think that there's going to be a ton of people and analysts that will look at this thing. The more scrutiny on this thing, the worse

it's going to be for the IPO. And does it go out at 1.8 trillion? I wouldn't be surprised that the bankers try and manufacture scarcity and it gets a small pop. But I think by the end of the year, it's well below a trillion dollars. There's just no, there's no way to justify this thing as a cash and senator. And also certain components of the business feel very we work in the fact that as they grow they burn more cash. There's no operating leverage. Even with this anthropic deal,

“because that's all he can sell. That's right. So he's selling the chairs or something, right?”

Yeah. He built out infrastructure for that he doesn't need because his, his AI is not growing the way it thought. Right. Exactly. And he's got it. He's got this colossus. And of course, he's facing lawsuits all over the place because he's going to buy more of these methane engines that's going to trust me that they're going to put a stop to that eventually. So, so what would you, how would you do it here? People are listening. What would you do here? I want to know what to do because I have

been wrong about Tesla. I thought Tesla was a sell in 2017 and it's gone up eight accidents. So you were right, but you were wrong about the people I do. I think we have to squarely say I was wrong. So the, what I'm going to do is if someone called me and no one's going to call me. But if you're on Musk called me and said do you want allocation the IPO, I would probably say sure and I'd sell it on the first trade. They will manufacture scarcity. Goldman and everybody will tell

him, okay, this is what it looks like. Put out press releases saying you're 30 times ever subscribed.

It'll get a pop and then get out because again, and amazing business can be a shitty investment

even at some valuation and a shitty business can be an amazing investment at a certain valuation. This is an amazing business surrounded by businesses that are not scaling where he's trying to play catch up and at a valuation that makes just absolute no sense. Glamming X AI in here was a way to save his ass his own ass correct. So it's, it's the cheapest form of capital he could find by attaching it to an amazing business such that he could try and catch up and even the business, even the amazing

business on its own, which is doing 16 billion in top line revenue and 8 billion in EBITDA. This is Starlink. Yeah, give it 25, give it 100 times EBITDA. It's worth 800 billion. 100 times EBITDA is no one trades at that. But you not only are trying to get it out at 1.72 trillion, you've attached onto it all of these businesses that look to have negative leverage. And he's using the business to help Tesla out by buying shitty cyber trucks. Well, that was the most, that was the most

eye popping thing in the whole thing. I agree. Was that it reminded me of, and this is the argument against when corporate or when governments decide to start caused playing business, the Irish government or the UK government said Delorean is the future and they gave them a bunch of loans. And then these pictures came out of a ton of Delorean sitting in a warehouse in Ireland, unsold. So the worst product, the, arguably the worst tech product out there, maybe then the Oculus or Siri, the worst

tech product of the last decade is hand-stound the cyber truck. So he went out of much recalled and he used money from this organization to buy back cyber trucks. You're not supposed to do that.

You're supposed to say, okay, Tesla, Tesla has a, a, a, a, a third of a product and we're going to take a

right down and you just take your, you know, you take your pain. This is Elon brings a level of awareness, magic. People have done investing with him. He is an unbelievable visionary, but, you know, this

“goes to something broader and that is this is all part of an entity that will cement where I believe”

we are now and that is I finally believe we are squarely in 1999. Yeah, I would agree with you. That's what I felt after looking at, I didn't look at it over as carefully as I thought. Oh, no, no, no,

and flying to the stars and the sun is going to power our world. Like, that's all. I, I, I've had to listen that nonsense from him for many years and great. I'm glad you think that. I mean,

“I don't really care if everyone, if that's what turns him on, that's great. But it was the Tesla”

thing. There was several things in here that were very, it's speaking of late stage capitalism. I felt it was late stage Elon, right? That's what, that's what it felt like to me. Look, it, his job is to get capital as cheaply as possible. He's going to do that. I think it's smart for him to do this. But I think investors, in some, if you look at what happened, so there was a really interesting analysis done in the FT and that is at the peak of the

dot com boom, about 60% of GDP growth was coming from capax related to telco infrastructure and the internet. It's now 93% is coming from AI, including, I'm loosely, and also these companies will be grouped into that. In addition, the total capax inflation adjusted was about

850 billion in 99 up until that point, now we're at about 1.5 trillion. And every time you have

over 2 or 3% of GDP going into the build out of capax of something, whether it's railroads or highways or the telco infrastructure of the late 90s, two years later there's a crash, two to three years later there's a crash, railroads all of it. We are there. And in one of these companies or more of them is going to experience whatever big tech companies experienced when they're get out over their skis. And that is, you're going to see a 70 to 95% decline in the value of

one or more of these companies. In video, I mean, all these companies are there's the expectation of they're increasing their capax 20% a year while increasing their revenues optimistically 15% a year. That's negative operating leverage. And eventually, the music's going to stop here. Yeah, I felt drunk and sailors had a feel of this. I don't know. Just like that.

“I would describe as, I think in video as a casino, and we're all drunk people to blackjack”

table asking for a very good business. And then along with the tariffs and all the other

corruption around Trump, it just gets to be a real problem. And videos an amazing business,

space x is an amazing business. They should, oh my god, they should be worth, they should be worth a trillion dollars and 300 billion respectively. So down about 50 to 80%. And the technology, I think the technology will live up to exact expectations more on the optimistic side than the pessimistic side, but the valuation's wrong. All right. Well, speaking of which OpenA is preparing to confidently file a draft of it's IPO perspective, as soon as Friday, I expect you to read

over the weekend and tell me about it next week. As you're listening to this, the company is validated over $850 billion by private investors. The things I'm looking at there is all the cross investments with Altman involved. I'm probably interested in that where the trends are in terms

“of their subscriptions and where their spend is. I think those are the things I'm looking at.”

What are you looking at there? Very briefly. Well, just to distill it, to justify the $1 trillion

valuation that OpenA is pursuing at its IPO, it needs to grow from $13 billion revenue to the

size of today's Microsoft in four years. So they're saying they're going to be the size of Microsoft in four years. And I just don't think revenue did triple the $13 billion, but the company burned nine billion. And right now, it has negative momentum relative to anthropic. And what they have said is get out right away. We need the perception that we're the leader and also Sam Aldman looks at SpaceX and says there's not room for there's only so much retail money that's

going to come into the ecosystem. Get out because it's going to dry up because of SpaceX goes out of pop and comes down. Retail investors are going to start to get queasy. And then when you have these enormous IPOs, in other words, at some point retail investors are going to run out of money to invest in these things. So he's like, get out in the CFO, Sarah Fire, who I'm shocked still has a job, because she's not towing the company line. She worked at Goldman and McKinsey has reported previously

to colleagues at OpenAI saying, we're not ready for an IPO because the risk from its spending commitments. And the company is committed to spending $600 billion. I know her. She's a very, she's like that. She's like a Ruth Paratch. She's an adult. The company is committed to spending $600 billion over the five years across vendors and their Oracle Deal alone requires $60 billion a year starting in 2027 nearly five times OpenAI's entire 2025 revenue. Again, this is, we are squarely

in 99. 99. All right. Well, we'll go with that. All right, Scott. Let's take a quick break when we come back. Jeff Bezos has so good. God speaking of billionaires, behaving badly, speaks out on all sorts of things.

smart as how you use it and real breakthroughs happen when the AI is built to tackle specific problems.

“That's why Ship Station's AI isn't a general purpose tool. It's specialized trained on”

decades of real shipping data and billions of actual orders. Ship Station is an end-to-end order for filament platform for e-commerce businesses powered by AI. Ship Station is trained on decades of data from billions of shipments across the world. Ship Station adapts to your unique business, learning you, when stock is low, recommending the best carrier selections and rates and automating tasks to save you time, so you can stay one step ahead. With features like inventory

sinking across your sales channels, a branded returns portal that helps transform returns into revenue, automatic rate shopping, and integrations with accounting and CRM software, Ship Station eliminates the need for multiple tools in your workflow. The sooner you switch, the sooner you start saving time and money, get started with Ship Station today and get 60

“days free at shipstation.com with the code pivot, at shipstation.com code pivot,”

shipstation.com code pivot taxes and fees apply. Today's show is brought to you by Vanguard. To all the financial advisors listening, let's talk about bonds for a minute. Capturing value and fixed income is not easy. Bond markets are massive, murky, and let's be real. Lots of firms show a couple flashy funds your way and call it a day, but not Vanguard. Vanguard bonds are institutional quality. Institutional quality is

in a tagline, it's a commitment to your clients, it means top-grade products across the board. The lineup includes over 80 bond funds, they're actively managed by a 200-person global squad of sectors specialists, analysts, and traders. A lot of firms love to highlight their star portfolio managers, like it's all about that one brilliant mind making the magic happen. Vanguard's philosophy is a little different, they believe the best active strategy shouldn't be

locked away with one person, they should be shared across the team. So, if you're looking to give your clients consistent results here in a year out, go see the record for yourself at vanguard.com/Audio. That's vanguard.com/Audio. All investing is subject to risk vanguard marketing corporation distributor. Support for the show comes from Odo. Running a business is hard enough, so why make it harder with it doesn't different apps that don't talk to each other. Introducing Odo, it's the only

business software you'll ever need. It's an all-in-one fully integrated platform that makes your work easier. CRM, accounting, inventory, e-commerce, and more. And the best part, Odo replaces

“multiple expensive platforms for a fraction of the cost. That's why over thousands of businesses”

have made the switch, so why not you? Try Odo for free at Odo.com. That's OdoOo.com. Scott, we're back just based on sat down for an interview with Andrew Ross Sork on our favorite

Canadian and Wednesday, let's talk about some of the things he said. First up,

based on said that Trump was more mature and more disciplined in his second term, a Washington Post owner defended massive cuts he made to the news from earlier this year saying he doesn't want to post to be a charity. I have some things to say about that because I think he's the one that drove it into a wall. Based also back the idea of eliminating income taxes for the bottom half of U.S. earners, let's hear what he said to say about his own taxes.

Sometimes say that I don't pay taxes, so true, I pay billions of dollars in taxes. And it's a pertinent. Again, if people want me to pay more billions, right, then let's have that debate, but don't pretend that that's going to solve the problem. You could double the taxes I pay and it's not going to help that teacher in Queens. I promise you. Let's try. Let's try. Let's see what happens. Let's see what happens. If we take his effective tax rate from 16 or 17 percent to 32 or

34 like the rest of us, let's just give it a whirl. Let's see what happens. So disingenuous in the suit would happen. Let me start and then I'll let you go. First up, the more mature. Come on Jeff, like seriously. Like I get that there's a lot of face we're going on and a lot of other enhancements, but it's gone to your fucking head. Like I get what he means. It's good for me. Instead of saying "Marmature or Discipline" is more focused on giving me the shit I want. I would just prefer that

if he wouldn't mind. Like saying that. Whatever, he can say what he wants. He's never been

particularly liberal person, but now he's just now being just disingenuous. The Washington Post saying drove me crazy because he's the one who kept the same management in place than hired an incompetent, like Willu, as did nothing that the New York Times took moves after Trump left office to do something. He created all manner of situations where people just left, cut their subscriptions, which was

fingers in the editorial process, he messed it up. A huge exodus of talent blaming the talent,

“which led in the went to successful properties, like the Atlantic and many other in the Wall Street Journal,”

and other places, which are doing okay. They're doing their making businesses, New York Times, Wall Street Journal, the Atlantic, everything else. So every time he says this, I'm like, "Why don't you look over at Lorraine Powell Jobs?" He was managed to do a very nice job over there. They're the Atlantic by not meddling and supporting and not losing money. The income tax thing, I'll let you take, but it was so full of disingenuous stuff. And again, let's try Jeff,

even if you pay billions, you have billions. And you pay the fact that I pay more of a percentage of my taxes than you. And then the court, I don't even get me started with corporations. So anyway, the whole thing was, and also he didn't look well in my opinion. And since he spent so much time on cosmetic stuff, I feel like I can comment upon this. Go ahead. Jeff Bezos pays himself $82, $2,000 just enough such that he can claim a child tax credit, which by the way, he takes.

And then he puts all of his additional money and such that the value of his shares go up. He borrows against those shares, not triggering a taxable event. Like that's a lot of those shares in a trust. And then after leveraging the unbelievable infrastructure and culture of the great

state of Washington, he then takes his $120 billion in shares and moves to Florida to spend

more time with his father and then starts selling shares. Now, granted, just as every prisoner has

“an obligation to escape, I think every individual has an obligation to avoid taxes. I don't blame”

him for tax evasion. I blame our government for letting him engage in it. But quite frankly, Jeff, when you start trying to wallpaper over the tax avoidance of billionaires by claiming you care about nurses. Sit the fuck down. Just sit down. This is a misdirect. And it's like when Jensen talks about, yes, tax me more. Okay. Thanks, guys. But I just don't think they're in a position. When a guy has, when a guy has so optimized the dynamics of supply and demand of labor such that his delivery

drivers have to pee in bottles to make their quotas, you're just not the person to pretend to have empathy for that nursing Queens. So I'm not even going to, I'll talk about his idea, but give me the mother of all I roles when Jeff Bezos claims to be concerned about the tax rates of the nurse in Brooklyn. What, when I've advised or when I was talking to Andrew Yang when he was running for President Mayor, I said you fucked up. It shouldn't be universal basic income. It should

be basic income and to get Republicans on board. You need different frame it. Don't call it universal basic income because it sounds like socialism, quality, negative income tax. Republicans love tax breaks. I do believe there's something to the notion of saying anyone who makes below $50,000 should not only not get taxed, but maybe get a tax credit in the form of services or maybe just cash quite frankly because most of the studies show that when you create a government infrastructure

to deploy social programs, they're inefficient and never go away. Skip the money. Just give them

the money. Just cut them a check. You're in a household, you have kids, whatever. They did a bunch of studies in Africa and quite frankly, I'm going to be a sexist here when they give money to the men, the prostitutes and the bars do well when they give money to the women, the kids get tolerant fatter. You couldn't do that in America and just give money to single mothers, which is what I would like to see happen. But if you gave just gave money, nationalized health care, there's a lot

of good taxation ideas. What he said was very accurate is that if you had a tax holiday for people under the age of 30, he didn't say this. But if you gave a tax holiday, which is what he's saying or cut the taxes of people making less than $75,000, you don't lose that much tax revenue. Because it is true that only 1%, the top 1% and in New York pay 48% of the taxes in the bottom 25% really don't pay much. So he's right, they wouldn't be giving up much. But he is just not,

“we need an alternative minimum tax on people like Jeff Bezos of I believe 60%.”

Because the earner that's making 2 million bucks working her ass off is a baller partner at

Skadden Arps and Manhattan is paying 54. And fine, maybe she pays maybe the person making 10 million or 10 million here pays 60% because here's the whole objective of taxation. You want the least taxing tax. If you start a taxing education and food and housing, you end up with homelessness, less educated people, people who put off their mammogram and die of metastatic breast cancer, those are taxes that are too taxing. An alternative minimum tax on corporations making

The Bezos and also do away with the estate tax exemption. If the Bezos children in here at 20

billion instead of 30, no loss in happiness. But that 10 billion that could potentially be divided

amongst the 10,000 dollars to the million poorest households, a lot of incremental happiness. You know what the contrast was, is ex-wife. Like, she doesn't say a word. My hero. She doesn't do an interview. She gives no rib and cutting. No rib and cuttings, no cost playing, no whatever weirdness you're doing, your body, Jeff, just and doesn't lecture us. That's the tone was what was crazy. I know I got like Ben and I say about the post stuff, but all of it

had this tone. The post stuff was disingenuous in the extreme. He's the worst media owner of any media owner and it's a low fucking bar. Let me tell you. I take Rupert Muradach twice every day of the week and twice on Sunday to Jeff Bezos. At least he understands media and likes it. The tone was so obnoxious. And this is why this general, he talked about people demonizing

“billionaires. We'll stop talking, stop appearing. Like, I honestly, the damage these people are doing”

to the brand of capitalism, brand capitalism and brand AI and brand tech is so vast that you can see why these polls are showing up this way. I know my own son who both are incredibly hard workers has nothing to do with me. They often don't listen to me. They don't listen to anything I do at least. And I'm fine with that. But they have these feelings, right? It's just, I don't know. It's just and then it gives rise to too much demonization, right? Because of the way these people behave.

So I have stories about McKenzie Scott and Melinda French Gates. I'm involved in two non-profits. I'm involved in something called the Jet Foundation that tries to train high schools around how do I identify what is kind of normal strange out of less in behavior and out of less in behavior that should raise red flags around depression and suicide. And they leverage the infrastructure

of public schools and educate them. And they are amazing. We started by a couple that lost their

son, Jed. It's run by this wonderful management team. They do a great job. I got right after I started out involved. They called me and said, they did a big thing event. They got, they know, we got great news. I'm like, what's that? And it goes, we got a $10 million wire yesterday. And we're trying to figure out who it's from. McKenzie Scott didn't want an RFP, didn't want to meet with them, didn't want a name on anything. She just wired 10 million bucks. And then another association,

I love the American Institute for Boys and Men, which focuses on the struggles and mental health of young men and boys run by my role models, Richard Reeves, Melinda French

Gates, $10 million. Recognizing the majority of her funds are focused on the struggles

and gender equality and struggles of young women. But she, she said, without thriving young men, women aren't going to continue to flourish. And she just sensed 10 million bucks. And then someone who shall remain nameless, contacted the firm. And I get it. He's trying to be or contact one of these companies and said, can I meet with so and so and Scott, I want to hear about the strategy. And I'm like, typical fucking rich dude, we got to go sing for our supper. We got to like,

right, go talk to him as if it's a business and return on investment. Whereas these women are just like you're doing good work. Yeah, X. Here you go. Get back to work. You don't hear from them. God be with you. They definitely check you out, but it's not, it is. It's such a different way of giving. I couldn't dislike Jeff Bezos more after this interview. He was dumb to do the interview.

“I thought I honestly thought Sorkin could have, I could have pressed him harder. I didn't”

think Sorkin pressed him hard enough on the stuff and let him get away with some stuff that I wish he had, but that said, we got to see him the way he is and that is the way he is folks. And let me go to the, let me make the conservative or at least give some sunshine to conservative part of this. I can't stand on what people on the far left say Jeff Bezos didn't earn his money. Oh, he did. Because he was born with single mother at the age when she was 17,

I believe he deserves to have earned $120 billion. I think we deserve to elect people who have the backbone to tax him at 60 or 80%. Yep. But don't slow him down. Right. He's not a bad person. He's doing, he's doing what we all do. He's optimizing for his own self interest. You may say he's more self interested than some people. Fine. We're not doing our job. Elizabeth, Elizabeth Warren and Bernie Sanders, you've been in Congress for fucking ever and the taxes keep going down under your

“watch. Yeah. Let's do something. You want to demonize him? No. Tax him. Tax him. That's the best way.”

I like to take look. You, whatever you want to do. Now, let me switch to another billionaire because

to like what I have to say here. And I don't really care, but I do care, but I don't care.

Unexpected sighting in DC this week, Mark Cuban standing alongside President Trump. Cuban endorsed Kamala Harris was a big supporter in 2024. It's been one of Trump's most vocal critics, but the two appeared together as a Trump announced a major expansion of Trump RX's administration's online drugstore. The site is adding more than 600 low-cost generic medications through partnerships with Cubans' cost plus drugs, Amazon Pharmacy, and Good RX.

At this event, Trump was asked about his new alliance with Cuban. It's only on this issue, just for people to be clear. Let's listen. It's pretty remarkable seeing you and Mark Cuban up there, and the fact that, obviously, Mark can do his Kamala Harris back in 2020.

“Well, he made a mistake. Who's it thing? What does this say about when you two are building here?”

The umbrella says we love people. We love our country. He wants to, he's got a

good company, and he's going to do a lot of business with this. And I'm going to get drugs out through Amazon, through the whole group, and we're going to get drugs out, and Mark wanted to be a part of it. And I think Mark was very gracious. He said, this is something that really works. Cuban later posted on X. If anyone thinks I'm going to look politics ahead of helping Americans reduce their cost of healthcare and pharmaceuticals, they're fucking idiot. He took that down

because he thought swearing under cut his argument. He's probably right. Let me just say a few things. The stuff out there about him making a bank, or he's mobbing up with Trump is just not true. You don't have to like that he stood there. I get it. I get it. I get it. But this business is to get drug prices down. He does not make a ton of money here. This is more, it's not a charity either. He's trying to build a business. But the stuff that's out there about what he's doing is just inaccurate.

And it's not, if you don't like him standing there and you think he betrayed you, and I saw a lot of these, I now can't like him. I thought he was a good guy. He is a good guy. He is doing something that I'm sure makes him deeply uncomfortable for a very good thing, which is to bring lower prices. He's got to get in this Trump arcs. He essentially took the control of Trump Rx in a weird way, because you've got to get these things. If Trump is doing this site, and I hate that Trump's

name is on it, I hate it. But look, he's an ego man and puts his name on every fucking thing. And there's nothing we can do about it. And if he stopped there with Biden, you'd love him for it,

“or whoever, a Democratic president, he would sit up with anyone. The only thing I would say was that”

I'm not sure, he got scratched. I sent him a note as it just got scratched. When he, when he first

he started talking about this, this 1.776 trillion dollar slush fund for people who are criminals who attack the capital. I don't know, he got scratched. He was sitting there when Trump was going on about something that's obviously illegal or, and also a slush fund. I don't know what he, should he walk out? Should he leave? I don't know. He did laugh at the you voted for Kamala Harris. I'm not sure what you do in situ. Should he have sat there and said I still would?

I don't know. He would have gotten lost out this deal. I don't know. And it's not great to have to stand with Trump. We get it. We get it. I wouldn't do it. But if I had something that mattered a lot, I might. And the only other thing I would say is Zorin Mondon, me went there and stood right next to Trump and everyone praised that. And the difference was is, but he didn't insult Trump and he didn't like slap them or do anything rude. He also didn't say much and he didn't get scratched. And so

he needed something for New York and he got it from Trump. And so I'm not quite sure what the

“difference here is because that's what I think was happening here with Mark. And you could”

hate on me all you want saying, I love the billionaires. But I think what he's doing is an important thing for bringing drug prices online. And you cannot wait for three years to do so. Your thoughts, Scott. If you're emotions and political partisanship, Trump, the health of Americans and the problem is you, no, Mark Cuban. Yeah. The partnership between Trump, our ex and Cubans, cost plus drugs will unlock cheaper prices for millions of Americans. This week's expansion at 600

generics, nearly seven times the previous catalog, they'll be available to anyone regardless of insurance status. And in many cases, the cash price through cost plus is actually lower than what ensured people pay at the pharmacy counter after copays. Cost plus drugs sells the cancer drug. I believe it's called a tantaminnab for $17. The same drug runs over $2,000 to conventional pharmacies. Three PBMs, OptMRX, CVS caremark and express scripts control roughly 80% of the U.S.

drug access and are untouched by this deal. It looks something has to change. And I respect and

good for America, the requires that scale in that capital, you act like an adult and you go there. You know, if you think that Mark Cuban sold out, then all right, you go buy people's cancer drugs. I can't imagine Mark enjoyed this, but helping people get access to life-saving drugs

“at a reasonable value is more important than him getting dragged by a bunch of bots and people”

virtue signaling and applying purity tests from their keyboard. I would agree. You just didn't

have the right information. The inaccuracy is always an accuracy. And to say that he's going to

make bank at this is just not true. It's just absolutely not true. And you again, I wouldn't want to have to do this. I don't know if I could stand next to him, but he's there for the next three years. And if someone needs these drugs now and if he has to take the reputational hit, that's fine. I guess that's fine. The fact that you're dragging him is I understand the, and I don't want it. In this case, for the first time, I thought derangement. Don't be so fucking derange that

you don't understand what Mark just did, which is he had to put his ego in his pocket. He remains. By the way, Mark is not, I would say he's liberal or conservative. He's quite, it can vary all over the place. But there is absolutely no way Mark Cuban would vote for Trump that this moment time or support Trump in it politically. So I don't know what you want from him, but to me, I thought it was just a bad, a bad look for the left. I really didn't. I just was sort of disappointed.

Very disappointed. So, but they're going to drag us for it. It's a too bad out here. All right, Scott, let's go on a quick break. We come back. We'll talk about Nvidia's latest earnings. Support for the show comes from NPR. NPR understands your curiosity is boundless, but your

“time isn't. That's why they made up first. A first is a podcast that covers the three biggest”

news stories of the day with reporting on analysis to understand them in under 15 minutes.

Look, there's no short of news right now, but up first doesn't just give you the headlines. It gives

you the context. Recent episodes cover how American citizens are getting caught in ISIS growing surveillance web and what the Iran War means for the U.S. economy and why Attorney General Pam Bondi's exit is bigger than it looks. Three stories fully reported every morning in under 15 minutes. Up first does something most dealing news shows don't. It asks better questions to get better answers. Not just what happened, but how it came about, why it's a big deal and what happens next.

That's difference between knowing the news and understanding it. Follow NPR's up first podcast so you can understand what matters and what happens next. It's hard news through a human lens and while you're at it, give money to NPR. They're fantastic and everything they do is something I hugely admire as a journalist. Support for the show comes from Odo. Running a business is hard enough, so why make it harder with it doesn't different apps that don't talk to each other.

Introducing Odo, it's the only business software you'll ever need. It's an all-in-one fully integrated platform that makes your work easier. CRM, accounting, inventory, e-commerce, and more. And the best part, Odo replaces multiple expensive platforms for a fraction of the cost.

“That's why over thousands of businesses have made the switch. So why not you? Try Odo for free.”

At Odo.com. That's OdoO.com. Did you know sales teams spend about 50% of their time on admin work instead of selling? That's where pipe drive can help. A simple intelligence CRM tool for small and medium businesses. Smart automation strip away manual work, so you can focus on selling, while AI features flags, stall deals, and tell your team one needs attention. Switch to a CRM built by sales people,

four sales people, and join the over 100,000 companies already using pipe drive. No credit card or payment needed. Just head to pipedrive.com/vox to get an exclusive 30 days free instead of the usual 14-day trial. That's pipedrive.com/vox. Scott, we're back with more news. Let's talk about NVIDIA's latest nerdenings.

You just call them a casino. The company's profit for the quarter was over 58 billion.

They're benefiting from what's happening now, which is up to 11% from a year earlier. That is a number. It's not 30%. It's a lot of three years ago. Profit was 2 billion. NVIDIA projected sales in the current quarter would reach 91 billion

But like you said, they're benefiting from this huge spend by all these other companies. Thoughts very quickly. Well, not a casino. They're the house.

“Okay. All of these companies spending just crazy amount of money on 1.6 trillion on”

capbacks are kind of drunk gamblers as well as I would describe it. They're benefiting from it. They're the house. They're the house when billionaire show up sharks who are drunk and have unlimited credit at the casino. That's the way I would describe it.

But just in terms of the earnings, the revenue was 81 billion up 85% year on year, which was a

beat. earnings for share was a beat. Data Center revenue is 75 billion up 92% as you said year on year. Economic for 92% of total revenue again a beat. They're cheat you guidance 91 billion above the 86 billion expectations and other beat. And their shareholder returns. dividend was raised 25 acts from 1 cent to 25 cents per share 80 billion a new buybacks authorized. And I mean, the reason he's on that plane to China is there's no shipments right now and he's

like, he really looks at the stock price and things. I have got to continue to beat.

“And the only thing that's I found really interesting here was despite beating on every”

every conceivable metric. The stock was flat, which says to me that some, the expectations of the stock price are so enormous now that they don't, people don't expect in pity to beat. They expect on a massively beat, which says to me that the first time in video even whispers things might be slowing down, it, it craters. So unbelievable company 15th beat in a row, but I just think the expectations that are built into this valuation. I think it's the most

valuable coming in the world now are pretty significant. As evidenced by the fact that it beat on every conceivable metric, mistocked and moved. Right. Right. That's interesting. That's a really good point. Anyway, we'll see. We'll see what happens. There's a lot. It's precarious. It feels precarious is what I feel. Right. It starts off 2% today. Yeah, but let me say a lot. Several different Wall Street will call them and they said everything feels so fragile. So we'll see. All right,

Scott, one more quick break will be back from predictions. Support for the show comes from Core Weave. Everywhere you look, AI is expanding what we thought was possible, and at the center of it all is Core Weave. Medical research and diagnosis, education, complex visual effects for movies, science and technology break-throughs. Core Weave

powers AI pioneers around the world with purpose-built tech, building what's never been built

“before. Core Weave is the essential cloud for AI. Ready for anything? Ready for AI. To learn more about”

how Core Weave powers the world's best AI, go to CoreWeave.com/ready for anything. Support for the show comes from SoFi. Let's face it. College is expensive, and how you pay for it really matters. That's where SoFi comes in. SoFi helps you refinance at rates as low as 4.24% APR, potentially saving big by lowering your monthly payment. You can even customize variable rates to meet your financial goals, all with no penalties or fees required. Check your rate in 2 minutes

with no impact to your credit score. Over 580,000 members have already refinanced more than 50

billion dollars with SoFi. Visit SoFi.com/boxpod to see how much you could save. That's SoFi.com/boxpod.

SoFi student loans are originated by SoFi Bank and a member FDIC, additional terms and conditions apply, and I'm a last 696-891. Whatever your thing, it could be anything. Canva helps you make that thing a thing. Canva is a simple online tool thing. It's a way to design with our magic AI tool things. You can social media your thing. Generate images or videos of your thing. Make decks for presentations to show your thing. Whatever needs to be done for your thing,

canva can make it even better and bigger thing. Canva, the thing that makes anything a thing. Okay, Scott's bringing predictions in a second. We're going to be off on Memorial Day for Tuesday. We'll not be taping a show on Memorial Day for Tuesday, but we'll talk about these laws banning prediction markets and the Trump administration is suing Minnesota after Minnesota became the first law banning prediction markets from operating in the state. But we'll talk about that

on next week. Go ahead. We talked about late state or 99, but I just can't help it. I don't think SpaceX is going to price near $2 trillion. Okay. The financial suggests otherwise. Like that you're going for it. Well, you're going to have so many people pouring over this S1. And it's just pretty

Aira Wasca. It's just, it's a lot. And if you take each of the three business lines, space,

connectivity and AI and apply a comparable price to sales multiple to each rocket lab for space, VSAT for connectivity and anthropic for AI, which are very generous, you know, healthy valuations and you add them up. You end up with a valuation of $547 billion. My hero on this stuff, asks what to motor and value the thing at 1.1 trillion. And if you double each of those price to sales multiples, you assume that each business will command a valuation that is two times as typical

market rate. You are still about $750 billion away from SpaceX's projected valuation. Yeah, that's being kind, you're saying. If you just get very aggressive and value every piece of this as a leader in its respective field and add the Elon plus. You add you get 600 billion and then you go,

okay, Elon effect, double it 1.2 trillion. So I've always been wrong around Elon, but I'm saying,

“I think it's going to, I think 2 trillion is a real stretch for here and it's going to price below that.”

All right, and then the other one is just boring one. There's, I think you can expect a deal between US and Cuba in the coming months. Cuba is currently in a full-blown crisis. I absolutely think the smartest thing we could do is be providing humanitarian aid and let people decide that they want to be the 50 for state or at least get along with us. Yeah, I agree. The collapse is comparable. It's not getting any news because of everything else going on, but the collapse is literally

comparable to the 1990s crash that followed the Soviet Union between December of 2025 and April of 2006. Cuba seemed just one of the eight monthly fuel shipments. It's economies required requires to function and blackouts are now at this 20 hours a day. I mean, it's crazy. No, we should just help them become part of the world again. 100%. But there's going to be a deal here because Rubio is reportedly having secret talks with Rao Castro's grandson by passing official

“Cuban channels. Trump told reporters in February. Cuba wants to make a deal. Just yesterday Rubio”

sent video message to the Cuban people proposing 100 million in aid and blaming Cuba's leaders for shortages of electricity, few to fuel. Rubio was born to two Cuban immigrants and this is a deal that he has personal investment and he sees this as his Ron is next. His next ticket on his run for president. It will win back all the people. That's him up well for a 2028 Ron. Cuba is in a deep dark corner and also Trump. He doesn't want another military excursion. There's just

no fucking way. There's a way to do this. Just let it fall apart and we come in and help pick up the news. It's already, well, it's fallen apart. Right. What do you know what I mean? It's like, you know, interestingly, I agree with you here because I do think it should be welcomed back

into the nations. It's always wanted to go there. You know, my actually, everyone of my family has

been there, but me, which is interesting. I've been there, it's great. Yeah, that's, I just feel like it's a wonderful people and it'll help Rubio immeasurably. This is at the heart of his presidential campaign. You understand that. It's very clear for at least for Florida. And one of the things that's speaking of collapse, I heard from so many foreign affairs people who I really trust and think or smart that Russia is very in much distress, Putin is under much stress right now

because of the situation in Ukraine, the economy, everything else and that they thought this is the first time they see a light at the end of the tunnel. Putin's rule just saying that. Just put

“that out there. I don't say it's light at the end of the tunnel. I think the end is nigh. And it's nigh.”

Yes, whatever. Anyway, so it's just interesting. And we should do this, you know, let me, let me quote that more on Brandon Carr. We can do this the easy, the hard way or the easy way. Let's do it with the easy way with the coupons, right? Let's show them the bigness of the United States and really help them. And then it's gotten I will open our hotel there. Okay. Okay, uh, okay. Great Mojito's great cigar. Mojito's great cigars, everything else. In any case, we want to hear

from you. Send us your questions about business, check out whatever's on your mind. Go to nmymag.com/pivot to submit a question for the show or call 8555-5-1-pivot. Okay, that's the show. Thanks for listening to Pivot and be sure to like and subscribe to our YouTube channel. We'll be back next week, actually on Friday as we do not have a live Memorial Day show the day after Memorial Day. Thanks for listening to Pivot, be sure to like and subscribe to our YouTube channel. We, as I said,

we'll be back next week. Today's show is produced by Laren Amenzili, Marcus Taylor Griffin, and Todd Wiseman. Brandon McFarlane engineered this episode. Thanks all sort of Drew Burroughs, Mr. Vera, on Dan Chilon, and Chuck Burroughs, Clark's media executive producer podcast. Make sure to follow Pivot on your favorite podcast platform. Thank you, for listening to Pivot from New York Magazine, Vox Media. We'll be back next week for another

breakdown of all things tech and business. Support for the show comes from Odo. Running a business is hard enough,

it's the only business software you'll ever need. It's an all-in-one fully integrated platform

that makes your work easier. CRM accounting inventory, e-commerce, and more. And the best part, Odo replaces multiple expensive platforms for a fraction of the cost.

“That's why over thousands of businesses have made the switch. So why not you?”

Try Odo for free at Odo.com. That's OdoO.com.

Support for the show comes from Odo. Running a business is hard enough, so why make it harder with it doesn't different apps that don't talk to each other. Introducing Odo, it's the only business software you'll ever need. It's an all-in-one fully integrated platform that makes your work easier. CRM accounting inventory, e-commerce, and more. And the best part, Odo replaces multiple expensive

“platforms for a fraction of the cost. That's why over thousands of businesses have made the switch.”

So why not you? Try Odo for free at Odo.com. That's OdoO.com.

Support for the show comes from retail. Too many companies run critical operations on

duct tape spreadsheets, Slack workflows, and whatever else they could couple together. Not because

“they want to, but because building internal tools means weeks of waiting on someone else's”

backlog. That's where retail comes in. Build custom internal tools just by describing what you need. Prompt something like, build me a revenue dashboard on our sales force data, and retail actually builds it. On your company's data, in your cloud, with enterprise security built-in, go to retool.com/vox. We all need to retool how we build software.