Paramount Merger Pause, Meta AI Optimism, and the Peptide Boom

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try it for free for one month at news.apple/learn terms apply. Recommendations can be amazing. I mean maybe someone recommended that TV show you've been obsessed with lately, but when it comes to home projects, it's different. If you don't like a show, you might lose a few minutes. If you hire a friend, a friend, a friend, a friend to fix a leaky ceiling, you could end up with a flooded kitchen. Maybe I know a guy just isn't enough for your home.

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Hi everyone. This is Pivot from New York Magazine in the box media podcast network. I'm Cara Swisher. And I'm Scott Galloway. Where are you, Scott? Los Angeles? I'm still in Los Angeles where it is 70 degrees in spectacular. I turned the camera around. I'd love you to see the Hollywood Hills here, but it's fantastic. Yeah, actually it's nice here in New York. I have to tell you. It's lovely. Yeah, I heard it's great. Really beautiful weather. I did a lot of stuff

here in New York. Tell me about it. I went to see jellicle ball cats. The first time I've

ever liked cats in my life, which I do not like cats. It's yes, they set it at a drag show,

“essentially. And now it works. Cats now works perfectly. Wasn't it always a drag show?”

No, it was like a bunch of people wandering around being cat-like, you know, with makeup, a lot of makeup situation. They were playing cats. They were actually playing cats. But in this case, it was a drag show and it makes total sense. And you're like, "Ah, I see." Yes, it's like, you know, vogueing and doing all the stuff you've seen in the films and stuff like that in the documentaries. It was wonderful. And it was beautiful. It was joyful. The crowd was packed. Now,

this show is closing because of the high costs, Broadway. But I have to tell you, it was absolutely packed and absolutely people. It was such a joyful experience. It was just a lot of fun. Nice. And what else? I can't be yet. No, I went and visited an ex-president and an ex-secretary of state at their home this weekend. Oh, you're so cool because you're so important.

I'm not important. I just don't visit any of those. So I can't mention who it is. I went, I'm curious which one.

I never named her off. I can't say why. I don't like to keep people anonymous when it's

obvious who they are and it's the old name drop. No, I went and visited Hillary Clinton and Bill Clinton at their home, but I was visiting Hillary on something helping her with. Love it, guests. There's a runway with podcasts. I don't know. We'll see. I don't know.

Can I, can I give you and her some advice? We have, please, too. She should pick the half dozen or dozen or three to six podcasts that she really enjoys it a little bit unexpected and be a regular guest. She shouldn't do her own podcasts. Oh, well. Well, too bad. Why is that? Why is that Mr. 500 podcasts and

will stop making them? Well, yeah, but Scott Galloway needs the relevance in the money. She doesn't. She is secretary Clinton first off at this point in her life and I'm projecting

“out enough this. I think she should be just doing whatever the fuck she wants and enjoying herself.”

And the thing is, you know, maybe this is what the fuck she wants, but go ahead. Yeah, maybe I think she would have more flexibility, more relevance and be less of the, I mean, there's just a lot of downside risk to her starting her own podcasts with her name on it quite frankly. And I think she can have her cake and eat it too and have as much relevance and impact by being a guest on various podcasts. But that's just my view.

I think she's going to regret it if she starts and not that I know her, but I think year and a half in, like, you know what this is like. I mean, you're a workaholic. But so is she. Is that our worker? Yeah, I can't. I can't. I can't see that. That woman is like, I woman could like, instantly tell you, like, a very detailed

It's she's really quite a brilliant person.

“Agreed. Agreed. I think it's just a format in the cadence of which she wants to demonstrate”

that excellence. I hope she does something. I just think she should be appearing on yours and some other people. Yeah. Yeah. Well, we'll see. I think she still has a lot to say and actually people have not met her yet in a way that I know her and others do. And so, you know, a lot of people

a lot of people still have a lot to say and she's incredible shape and so sharp and she looks great.

Yeah, she's very vibrant. Very vibrant. And so, we'll see how it goes. You know, it's interesting because YouTube just signed Becky Kennedy's doctor very popular on social for a show. There's a whole renaissance of things happening now again in terms of sort of reformulating television and everything else that I think is really interesting at this moment. And I think we were very early to it and have done a very nice job.

I'm here. We're true of what it is. We're true of lasers. We made it out of wood. Where the innovators are seven seconds for the finally happening.

“You know, but that's what I mean. I think it's just a really interesting time for substantive”

voices. I think post-Trump, there's a real market for smarts, experts, smarts, scientists, things like that. Well, I mean, there's any one thing. It's these institutions in these middle middleware is going away. Yeah. And great talent bubbles through. I mean, that's the most positive thing I think you can say about these platforms and social media is that people no longer need to give money to the DNC. They just give money to John Ossoff. Right exactly. Yeah. And people

don't need to go kiss the ass of some executive on the 45th floor at the Rockefeller Center to try and get on MS now. They can just, you know, they can just go live on sub-stack. Yeah, it's an exciting time. It's an exciting time. It isn't exciting time. Especially with the reinvention of that iconic piece of culture cats. Jesus Christ, talk about something I'm definitely

not going to say. I'm telling you, it's been I did not want to see cats and it's amazing. Everyone who

“doesn't like cats loves this and I'm telling you it was it was joyful. It would be like anything”

cultural though, but you know, you're not yet come on. That's not true. That is not true. The Odyssey will be the most cultural thing I've done in the years. The Odyssey will cut. That's it. Yeah, my funny is one for the Odyssey. There's this continuing discussion of it and what it means and everything else when all these sort of knock-on effects and when it sits, it's a movie about a man who finally faces consequences. Anyway, there's a lot of really interesting

discussion. I love all the discussion around the Odyssey. It's all interesting in different ways. And people are having a good time talking about mythology. They're having a good time talking about literature about the movie making itself. Some of the stuff the stuff he did around the themes around the arguments about the themes. I just love it. I love the whole thing. People are yeah, I'm going to see it. I'm going to see it on Thursday with my son. I'm excited for what you think.

Yeah, I'm excited to see it. Yeah, because you're not part of the cultural conversation if you haven't seen it. Anyway, it's sold out here in New York at the IMAX until like late August of this point, which is really interesting. Anyway, I recommend highly recommend it. And I was either going to go see the Odyssey. I was going to go see fan of the opera performed by I'm trying to think of a politically correct term for someone who's incredibly woke. I can't go

there anyways. All right. In any case, I'm having a great time in New York. New York is very exciting. I have lots of fun things to do this week. Anyway, we've got a lot to get to today. Speaking of Hollywood, Paramount's guidance is pausing and Warner Bros. Discovery Merger until legal challenges are resolved or until June 1st, 2027. That's like a long time from now folks, whichever happens first. The decision comes after a federal court granted a temporary restraining owner preventing the

merger from closing for at least 28 days. Paramount is calling the pause a significant win, which is not saying it provides a direct path to a trial based on evidence, but investors do not agree. Neither just Kara Swisher. Paramount shares hit a 52 week low on the news

that a lay could get costly $650 million per quarter, ticking fee begins in October and up the

deal falls apart entirely. Paramount would owe $7 billion break up fee. By the way, Paramount just just brought on Beth Wilkinson. Someone I know pretty well as it's lead attorney. Very good attorney. She successfully defended Microsoft's Activision Acquisition. She's also representing next star in its anti-trust case. The company you keep. She's going to win so well. We'll see. We'll see. What's winning at this point? So talk a little bit about what you think

I have thoughts on it, but I'd love to hear yours first. Well, I don't think they have a legal leg to stand on what they have as delay and delay costs shareholders and employees. It's effective and they'll probably extract a pound of flesh because in order to win the deal, one of the things that Paramount Skydance offered in the purchase agreement was a ticking fee of $650

Democratic AGs who were probably sick of a Republican weaponized DOJ have said fine,

what's good for the goose is good for the gander and they'll probably be able to extract something, whether it's guarantees of certain shooting within their state or spinning a certain thing, they're going to, and you know, no one, all of a sudden less than no one is going to know who the California AG is going to be, right? They'll start getting a lot of time on MSNow.

“So this is political to get some awareness and might get a pound of flesh, but I think ultimately”

Beth will show we'll bring up a bunch of expert witnesses in the form of economists who will say emerge Warner Bros. Skydance is 8% or 6% of all viewing time versus Netflix at nine. YouTube at 13. The market is already voted. Paramount as you reference hit a 52-week

low after celebrating what management called a legal win. This was such a Trump thing,

trying to pretend this is anything but bad news. And investors understand something executives often don't, and that is winning a court can still mean losing economically. So again, the real competitor here is in Skydance of Warner Bros. It's YouTube Netflix TikTok and increasingly probably a I generated entertainment. And as usual, legacy media is fighting yesterday's war. Well, you know, tomorrow's competitors are scaling. But this is again,

this seed's economic value and advantage from the legacy players to the new guys who aren't caught up in court right now and YouTube can just scale. Yeah, that's absolutely true. I don't think she's going to win at all actually. I think they, yes, they don't. And right, look at right now, the price of Warner shares $25. The Delta between the 31 and 25 as Bill Cohen actually point out is quite high. It's supposed to be about 4%. It's a lot. That's a lot. The investors have decided

“this deal isn't happening. That's what I think is exactly what it's a premium. So what you're referring”

to is merger arbitrage. There's a whole class of investors who went to deals announced at say, I think this announced at 31 bucks a share, whatever it is. If it's trading at 25, what is that? That's about a 22 or 23% premium. They don't think the deal is happening. That's right. But what merger arbitrage do is they say, okay, I think it's going to close. I buy the stock now when it closes. I got my 31. And it's hard to find 22 or 23%, returned. But what you're saying

is to your point, the market is saying there's now approximately, if I'm doing my math correctly, a one in four chance this deal doesn't happen. That's correct. And what would be interesting,

is what happens to the stock if it doesn't close. Collapse. Collapse. Here's what I think. This is

what I think. All right. Let me go. This is someone sent me a very interesting legal document. I thought it was great. They chose financial hemorrhage over legal precedent. This tells you everything about how they assessed their chances on August 3rd. They were going to lose on the preliminary injunction. They were absolutely going to lose on that. And that would have devastated the stock, devastated the stock. And it was, you couldn't overturn it on a peel. This is called something

called abuse of discretion standard. And the merger would have been over if they lost on August 3rd. So they're pushed. This, this, the slower they had a guy named Kessler in hiring bath. It's a great hire. She's great. She's terrific. I don't really care how terrific she is. This is they have, I think they have decided. This is, let me read you this. Paramount Blank. They looked at August 3rd hearing, two PI motions, two markets, a list, writer, declarations, a judge who already tipped

your hand, and decided that no ruling was better than another bad ruling. That's a rational litigation decision and a catastrophic business signal. Peace guy isn't just scared. They've entered a survival mode and they're trying to control the bleeding. The question is whether the patient can survive long enough to reach the operating room. And as you said, other competitors are scaling, including all these tech competitors and also Disney and others. They have all kinds of freedom to do

things. They have this ticking fee that's very expensive. And at some point, the savings that they were going to recognize in this deal are going to disappear, right, that they were going to do through the coordination. And so Oracle stock is way off. This is what's paying for part of this. This is delay.

“You don't have to win litigation here. You have to delay the litigation. And bath can push for”

and she's going to try to do this in court, a shorter time span in between what's happening here. But it's frozen. It's really pretty much frozen. So she can say, let's try a scheduling. It's on July 31st. They want to get it this fall. It's not going to get happened this fall. And the judge is going to set this schedule. And this judge doesn't seem in any rush. Now they've also forgotten the appeal into the ninth circuit. That's going to take until the trials over said,

you know the California and the group is going to appeal if they lose. It just keeps dragging and dragging on. And so I don't see how I don't see how they get this out the door. I don't less

And they said, these are the most likely ones. One, states win it trial. Permanent Junction merger blocks, guidance walks, paramount restructures are finds a new buyer's settlement, possible. Paramount offers structural remedies, divest the studio, sell cable networks, states accept their reject. Deal collapses economically, also possible. Ticking fees exceed value of Warner Brothers' guidance, invokes determination, clause, merger dies without a verdict.

And then if paramount wins it trial, merger closes after more than $1 billion in ticking views

in severe reputational damage near certain appeal by states. I just don't, I got to say, I don't know. She's a talented lady, but it's not that time is not on the side of paramount here. And that's regard. So again, as I often do here, I'm just sort of flying an instruments and thinking out loud, but I wonder if the folk from here. So economically, if this goes on long enough, it will, it will close because it will close the deal. If it goes on long enough, but, and there's a

“big butt here, the data, the only way this legally doesn't close when they chase it all down,”

and they've had a chance to actually evaluate it, is to prove it's an monopoly. And I don't,

I think they're kind of a very difficult time. The AG is proving that because, essentially,

a combined, the combined Warner Bros. in Paramount would represent about 12% of total U.S. TV watch time in YouTube currently stands at 13, and in terms of box office sales, a combined Paramount in Warner Bros. represent roughly 25% of the domestic box office. Now, having said that, if the fees, if this becomes economically untenable because of delay and ticking fees, they might just say, throw up their arms and blame Democrats. And by the way, this is political,

all 12 AG's falling cases are Democrats here. The judge has decided this was a Biden appointing, but what's good again? What's good for the two? But the Trump administration waved it through

when lawyers of Justice Department didn't want to. What's good for the goose is good for the

gander. This is, if you're going to weaponize the DOG against us, whether it's cutting off fees to our greatest research universities with no legal precedent, if it's, if it's ram, if it's carving up TikTok like a political give back to your Republican donors find, you want, you want to go that way or waving this deal through when lawyers of the Justice Department did not want it to go through seven, many. Or the, I mean, there's a ton of examples. The FTC going after the view, I mean,

it's just, if you're going to be ridiculous, folks, I actually like Democrats punching back at some point, I do think the merits of this case of the lack thereof will result in a judge saying,

“okay, this is going to close. The full Chrome, I want to get your view on this. I think the thing,”

if this dies, I think the reason it will die is if open AI continues to have negative momentum. Why is that? Oracle stock for a while about, I think it was nine or 12 months ago, Larry else, and became the wealthiest man in the world because they announced a deal for something like a trillion dollars in CapEx commitment from open AI to build out, help build out their infrastructure around compute and inference. Oracle stock is dramatically off. And if, if open AI begins or the

cracks continue to widen it open AI, Oracle has now become a tracking, a public tracking stock for open AI. And I got to think that the dad's piggy bank, which is Oracle shares are quite frankly, that's where this check gets cached. And if Oracle shares come under enough pressure and dad goes, you know what? All of a sudden, this went from five or 10% of my network to 20 or 30% and it's going to quite frankly, you know, I'm going to wake up in a suit that's uncomfortable for me at this age

in terms of finance and dad. He might decide, sorry, son. I don't, I can't refill your green-line credit card as I do because the delivery room in the Uber has become too expensive. I'm not using a medical fee. Yeah, it's down 52% in the past year. 52%. That really is striking. You're today, 39%. Six months, 32% one month, you know, it's just, you're right. I mean, this is what I had said. Remember I'd said this a couple of this Oracle stock thing that I was

“paying attention to, that's besides the point. I think that they just over indexed on their”

confidence. They were like, well, we got the Trump administration a roll over. We gave the EU some stuff they wanted. And then they were like, China said yes. I'm like, what's the difference? It doesn't really matter because these guys have what I've bonded it very smartly. And I agree with you, it's a different market, but the judge is also calling that a relevant, the streaming market

And I thought they were overly confident. They did not think bond to would be quite so controlled,

because he could have done a get rid of CNN. Thank how horrible CBS they did none of that. They did only a very specific small discrete lawsuit that will move will delay this just enough. They don't have to win. They really don't have to win here. They just have to delay it. And the question is, how much will the Ellison's put up with to own this? That's the thing. How much

“they're rich enough to do it. It's just a question of how much how much they want it, right?”

I guess on some level. And again, delays in deal making for Warner Brothers delays, I mean, the asset becomes less valuable. They can't make any major deals. Now, they can't do any major things. And the other people will benefit. It's not a good situation. But I think we're in violent

agreement here. And that is the legal merits here are important. But I would argue the legal merits

all point to eventually this would close. But they can they can get in the way of the closing and force the Ellison's to perhaps walk away if they may getting to closing to expensive for them. And it's not only a function of the price and the expense. It's a function of how much money the Ellison's have. In some, if with articles down another 50%, I don't think there's still closes. If it's up 20 or 30%. I think they have the staying power to wait. These guys out and hire your

hire your very talented friend who, by the way, has a very handsome trophy husband. I just want to point that out. He's, he's, he's dreamy. He's dreamy. She's going to be mad at us, you know. Oh, really? Yeah, every now and then. A ball woman have like a trophy, the trophy has now.

He's a, he's a very talented person. Well, we've been doing that shit for everyone. Why should

“I'm going to get the only one with a trophy, a trophy husband. She thinks we've gone too woke, I think.”

I think she does think we've gone too. Oh, well, let me, word, word to your mother's sister. A lot of people think that anyways. We're woken Jason. We're woken Jason. We're woken Jason. We were one Birkenstock. We wonder, listen, this is a devastating business problem. It's really bad. It's not good. You know, this is, look, it's just, this is to me. They were too arrogant. They were too arrogant. They did it. They did it. They did it. It's going to, it's going to, media's obsessed with

itself. They're going to constantly report about it. Come on. It's an interesting case. It is interesting. Come, it's all the tech people. It's media. It's tech. It's Larry Ellison. The satanic looking Larry Ellison. It's so much good stuff here. Come on. It's a great story. It's a great story. It's a great story. And now the broad and Beth Wilkins said, the stop, the little data. I had, I had a drink with the guy who runs Warner Brothers movies or one of the co, and he's just like the

the lovely sky of this guy, Jess. Oh, there's a man. Yeah, there's a man. He's just so nice and I'm like, what's going on there? He's like, I just, I just show up and I do my work. You know, just like, I don't know, I'm just showing up trying to find good ideas to turn into movies that people want to see. Yeah, I just, I don't know. I think, I'm going, I'm going to go on and say this deal doesn't happen. The steel doesn't happen. But again, I'm going to, I agree with you.

“I agree with you on the, on the market, but I don't think that's what it's going to get judged”

on this judge has already signaled that. No, no, no, no, no, no, no. There's, there's no, I mean. Winning is a winning winning. Yeah, but we're saying the same thing. This isn't about the legal argument. It's about the, it's about the prospects. It's about Oracle stock price, which is directly linked to the prospects of open AI at this point. Yeah. Yeah. So if you want to know whether this deal's going to close or not, tell me what the narrative is in the value of open AI is in six months.

Yeah. Well, we'll see. We'll see. We'll see if they've got the same power you Allison's boy. They weren't expecting this. I don't think. And also, let me just put it through in one last thing. Guess what's happened in November, the midterms. This family does not look good during the midterms given all the crap they were doing at CBS and all the, the statements about what they were going to do. Seeing on, they are going to run into a buzz saw of Democrats

on top of this, like, by the way. So just all all down into the right. So to the right, to the right. To the right, to the right, to the right. And they shouldn't have done the CBS mess. They brought ridiculous attention to a very small part of its business. It was stupid. I think that's accurate. I think that's accurate. I think they created this smoke where they didn't need to. They could have just let it run quietly and then done all their nasty stuff later, but they

didn't, they couldn't resist. Anyway, the rescheduled White House correspondent's dinner took place over. Jesus Christ, this thing, speaking of media. What a story. Three months after a government forced the original net to be cut short, Trump opened by saying the show must go on in condemning political violence. That was good. But quickly shifted to an hour of attacks on Democrats, celebrities and journalists, many of his jokes falling flat. And even Republicans didn't think

it was good. Those attacks include personal jobs at CNN's Caitlin Collins. How dare he, who was accepting an award for her White House coverage? Trump was also sat there as the Wall Street

greeting thing with the ladies vagina. I, you know how I feel about this correspondence dinner.

“I think it's just repulsive. And I had offered to pay for the scholarships because I hated it so”

much. But I covered it as a young reporter. I thought it was terrible 20 years ago. This was just bad. And you know, don't come for Caitlin Collins, my friend. I thought she acted rather well, although I suspect nobody should have been there at the first place. But that's just me. Well, let's bring this back to me. I need your advice. All right. So this is a picture I'm holding this up for our viewers on YouTube. You in Caitlin. This is me in Caitlin. Notice what she's

doing here. Smiling. She's smiling. She's in addition to being a very talented journalist. She's also a lovely person who smiles when appropriate. She smiles when appropriate. And I saw this thing. I'm in the clips everywhere. And I just thought, I think about our brand. Right. The US brand. There are a few things that have been worse for the brand than the White

House correspondent. It's dinner. Never. If the worst. The worst. Well, first off, what better

marks America than an event with our, you know, technically our most iconic journalist and the president and a mentally old man with guns manages to interrupt the whole thing. And then we reschedule it. And we have this 80 year old man making the creep. This wasn't even about insults. It's like, this dude is just so fucking creepy. It's like your grandfather who's dodging shows up and won't stop talking about his grandson's girlfriend in a very uncomfortable way. It's like,

you just take your limp dick and just take it somewhere. Oh, it's so the air. I don't know

“of the clip. The air in that room was like, oh, fuck. God. This is just the worst thing.”

And let's go macro. The White House correspondent's dinner is like Blockbuster holding an award show for US the best DVD. No one gives a shit. It's, it's a come on. The institutions here. There's a theme across all of this. The through line is the institutions are seating power to to individuals and to individual journalists who go on social media. This shit, this thing needs to be buried or at a minimum don't invite the president. This thing just was so awkward. Just have a nice

dinner with you. I'm not a big awards person. I hate awards. I don't go to them anymore. Because I hate, I hate them in the first place. And now I've said, you know, I actually hate the boy. I'm

going. I have, I have never, I've only covered this as a young reporter. I never went. I've gone to the parties.

This little like ha ha laugh laugh with the cabinet members. Whether it's Obama people or whether it's Trump people, it's gross. It's gross in a way that really makes people hate journalists. And that was always my issue with it. It's fine for those cabinet people to go. It's like whatever they get to like influence journalists. But just dressing up and my issue, the whole thing was, I knew he was going to do this. Everyone knew he was going to do this. So what's your choice? Not

“showing up, which I think is the best choice. The second one is, what if walking out in a Tuxedo,”

how dare you sir? Look, makes you look idiotic and sitting there makes you look. There's no winning for the journalism. Yeah. But yes, exactly. And that's another one that should have done a nice dinner or something for the winners. And the scholarship there and have him hand out at a ward of the Wall Street Journal. The whole thing, it's like, we have lost so much standing globally. Everybody has. We just look like it. Oh, wait. They had to reschedule it because a mentally

old person with access to firearms interrupted it. So they'd read the thing and this president had to sit there and then make a stupid, creepy comment. It's like, how could we, how could we damage the brand and just look like a more a more strange weird nation? I agree. And then laughing with him and then then incoming president of a Jackie Heinrich from Fox, like laughed and joked it up with him after he did the creepy. I mean, seriously, it's like the whole thing is like, I don't

Jackie, I don't care if you're at Fox and you're conservative. That was gross. That was gross from a conservative or a liberal point of view. And not just Caitlyn, like, and then using Dylan Mulvaney. Oh, anyway, please don't do this anymore. I, when I said don't do this anymore after the after the shooting, I got so many like press people like, Cara, that's really unfair. I was like, oh, fuck yourself. This is bullshit. We shouldn't be doing this. It should be over. So folks, just

in terms of of how precious broadcaster and let's think they are, podcast reach exponentially more people. Do we have an award show giving each other a little trophy? There is one. Did we go?

Oh, wait, we go. Never mind. I take it back. Yeah, but we don't, it's fun. Like, it's there's no

president there. There was the webbies. We go one at the webbies. That was fun as fuck. That was a really

It was fun. I don't, and I, that's the only one I like, because I think it's an actually fun party. But mostly, no, right? There's no. There's no president. We're not going to shake hands with a

“president. That's what we're definitely not doing anyway. Anyway, folks, Caitlyn Collins, we love you.”

You did a great, let me tell you, she acted with a lot of dignity. She's a young woman and she acted. I would have been like slap in him silly, but of course you would have been arrested. But anyway, it's, it's just terrible to put people in that situation and they, and putting themselves in that situation is off the best thing either. Anyway, let's go on a quick break when we come back, meta pushes AI optimism. Support for this show comes from Delete Me. Most people's personal

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no spreadsheets. Stop managing software and start managing your business with one unified system. Try for free today at odu.com/box. That's oduo.com/box. Wow, I'm so glad I took calculus in high school and not personal finance, said nobody ever, figuring it all out for yourself when you're fresh out of school can not only be daunting, it can literally cost you. I'm Vivian 2, Yeridge BFF, and on this episode of Network and Chill,

we're rewinding a decade to when I was first at a college and learning to care for my own finances the hard way, with plenty of slip ups and face plants. But since I already made those

“mistakes, I get to share them with you so you don't have to, if you want to swore of all of the”

pot holes I fell into, give the episode a listen wherever you get your podcasts or watch on youtube.com/yourrichbf. Scott, we're back. Meta just launched a new campaign and making a case for AI optimism with an ad showing Meta products as tools for human connection. The video is set to David Bowie's five years, which is the song about the end of the world. Now, let me be fair. Bowie did say later

that he wrote it in hopes people would be optimistic just so you know, just so you know, I want to correct that a lot of people were like, it was it was about the end of the world, but he was hoping to turn that around. But let's listen to a clip first. Some people will have he believe AI will make us less connected that it's going to leave us behind. We couldn't disagree more. Call us optimists. Call us dreamers.

Just as we've always done, we're betting on people.

Make it stop. This is right. Make it seriously. Make it stop. The Mark Zuckerey shared the Adam Facebook writing. As we enter the next wave of AI, we continue to believe the future is for everyone. The message because months after Meta told staff was getting 10% of its work force in scrapping 6,000 open roles to offset AI spending. I would like your marketing. Let me just tell you, I'm just telling you, this says midterms all over it.

It's like now we believe in people before we believed in giving Donald Trump money. But now people thoughts marketing professor put your hat on it. Tell me what works and doesn't work here. I know exactly what's going on here. Somebody really attractive who wears black has shown up and talk about entanglement associations and emotion. And they have so much fucking money. And then Mark and that CMO there has convinced themselves. This was a good idea. Discuss back to the notion of,

don't these people have friends? Mark, can you tell us how connecting people fits into teen girls self-harming or you hiding evidence that one in a British teen site Instagram is a

she tweeted the thing and said, "It's always been about connecting people, call us,

“optimists." And the only thing I could think of was sit down. I'm an AI optimist.”

I mean, come on Mark, I'm a professor. Yeah. Met is a new ad. It has this incredible soft focus family using AI glasses to connect more meaningfully. This talker glasses. Yeah, okay, nothing says intimacy. Like a $300 pair of glasses, beam your kids birthday party back to a fucking server farm. So I can serve the moment back to you as a Nissan ad. It's just, this is so cynical. They are the last people to be talking about the upside of the AI. They're going to

invite so much criticism. I don't know who the CMO of Met is. You're a fucking idiot for approving this thing. What would you do here? Because they have other ones. They have another video I saw about data centers. They're trying to turn that idea around that it does help people create jobs, etc. They're now moving. And again, that's a good one. Data ad is smart. PR and talent is very a joy. No ethnically ambiguous people pretending they're happy wearing these glasses. None of

that shit just communications around what is trying to call balls and strikes. They're program around occasional training and investing in vocational training. That is a great program that is great branding. It shouldn't be an ad. It should be their PR team, which is some of the most talented people in the world getting that thing placed everywhere. But not running ads on it. This thing is so tough. It's going to invite so much scrutiny around, okay. This is Jeffrey

Dommer running a jack in the box commercial. It's just, you just don't do this. What are you thinking of proving an ad saying that your AI optimists and you're connecting? What the hell? They also cursed in it. I don't like when they curse an ads. I don't like it. Yeah. So I don't, I find, and

I just when Dina, she seemed like a lovely woman and she put out the ad. I just the first thing

I thought of, I can't do this because she spends a carrot thought. Sit down. You're the last

“people that you should be claiming that you're AI. But what do you do if you're trying to get back the,”

you know, look, I'm telling you, this is so motivated by what's coming in November and the payback? What do you mean by that? Because I think they're all, like let me just tell you, I, there isn't a tech company that suddenly hasn't hey, girled me recently. All of them. All of them. They're like, Cara, we haven't talked in a while. Like after the Trump things, I'm like, you fuckers for like throwing in with Trump. You corrupt pieces of shit, like essentially. And now they're

like, we need to talk because we believe in safety. Like I'm getting a lot of safety. We should have a meeting, you know, what you've been saying is really resonated with us. Like what you're saying about like corruption. I was like, aren't you paying the brides? Like it's really, I just feel like there's an understanding that there's going to be payback right now. That's one. Two, what would you do? Like at some point, like, I know people hate when I say this, but, you know,

how do you turn it around? Is there a world in which Marys Zuckerberg could do something to not seem like so villainous or maybe not? Maybe not. I don't know. I mean, I recall when Gates was villainous. And then until the Epstein stuff, he was non villainous, right? So what does he, what do they have to do to get what would you, what would the ad that you would do here? Let's help them. Let's help them in their things. They're genuinely saying we made a mistake. We want back into humanity.

What would, or they can't be? Or they can't come in back into humanity because they're doing all this other damage? I hate to say it, but it's the Rupert Murdoch branch strategy. Rupert just owns it. He's like, I am who I am. I work behind the scenes. He doesn't run ads trying to make the Murdoch's more likeable. He doesn't run ads trying to say Fox. We're good for America. Well, they were fair and balanced if you recall. But they just, quite frankly, they just, they just own it. And

the reality is is that the Zuckerberg brand in the meta brand is for the most part, a very strong

brand for the following reason. America has opted for Shareholder value over confidence and the well-being of the Commonwealth. We really respect and admire a company that's able to create this sort of shareholder value. Their products are amazing. I, I hate to admit this. I am addicted to Instagram

“Reels. I think it is incredible. I think it's incredible. Yeah, I like that. As you know,”

their performance, their shareholder returns, the fact that they have they hire a ton of talented people and create economic security for them, the fact that housing prices are up 28 percent, large large part because meta's making so many people wealthy. A lot of people have registered enormous shareholder gains. Do your thing, go on background, trying to defend yourself, find this.

ad where the tagline is presence reimagined, that to me feels like them saying, we already have your face, your friends, and your location. Now we'd like to own your depth perception. I mean, I don't want, they should not bring the passion. They have a need to be liked. They do, you know, falls down these ads. Yeah, they have a need to like, we're not villains. And I don't know what they could do. I mean, do, you know, admit to some of their big problems, admit to it.

“If they want to be liked, like, that's what I mean. If I think wanting to be liked is part of this.”

And look at, like, look at that interview Elon did with, with the financial, with the, um, economist, the economist, uh, they kind of look better. They feel like they're misunderstood. If they don't have a chance, I kept thinking, stop talking. You are like, you know, and she's

so adab, she's amazing. And I was like, stop talking. Oh my god, like stop talking. At some point,

I was like wanting to get him off the stage, because I thought he doesn't even know how awful he is, right, at some point. I think in the case of men, I think they do want, they do understand. There's a shift happening, a vibe shift, rather significant. And they're trying to figure out how to be liked again. I'm not sure they're ever going to be liked. I think you're right. I don't, I don't know. The advice, the advice is the same. They should take the advice from Albert Brooks to William

hurt when William hurts is what happens when you're out exceed your wildest dreams. And Albert Brooks says, keep it to yourself. They should just continue to perform, continue to add shareholder value, go on background when they feel they're being treated unfairly. But to run this like sugary ad of we're here to connect people. No, you're not. That's not your aim. That's not what you're trying to do. You just put wins on the board on things. They can put wins on the board and like helping

people get jobs, maybe giving money to like, you see teen girls like, we don't want their money, right? Like, you're the ones that caused the problem or what part of the problem, not all of it.

But the economic growth, economic engine, incredible products, incredible shareholder value,

I personally think would be a good move at this point for these guys to selfage gay.

“Say, we're not wanting anyone on the platform. I mean, I think they're going to do that.”

And they're going to start. They're going to do it the night before it's about to pass and conquer. This one. Yeah. I think they're going to move into that space. I think. But then there's the beef with Apple and Google over that, who decides age verification. That's another fight. By the way, Apple and Google aren't distinguishing themselves in that fight either. Anyway, it's a really, it was not a great hat. It's not a stick with the simple ads. We're

providing jobs. We care about people's, you know, we're going to help this. You know, it's interesting because Mark does switch between, I want to be like, Dan fuck you. And I think fuck you is probably where he mostly lives. And he must, he has to become comfortable in that spot.

But I don't think he is. I felt like, I felt like, okay, damn spending $100 million

to try and say we're likable and we're cool again. It's like your uncle's showing up with a Ferrari that convinced everyone he doesn't miss his acts. It's just, it doesn't ring true. I don't know. They're trying to make surveillance capitalism seem aspiration. Yes, I know. They can get rid of the creepy glasses or lean into the creepy glasses or something. Like, I just, it's really interesting. And I think they're going to, I think ultimately,

he's going to have to live with the fact, and this movie's coming out, the social reckoning, which I think is not going to look, make him look very good. So, I don't know. I can't, I just hope a lot of the creators do like, what if ads were honest because this would be, we're bringing people together, usually to sell them creatine that they talked about within your shot of a phone. I mean, that would be the real ad, right? Or to suggest, or to suggest,

“innovative ways of self-harm or how many pounds and five ten is normal. That's how we're”

bringing people together. It's not funny. It's like my laughing. That's not funny. You know what they should do is, you don't like us. We know, but we have some good stuff, like we're not so, we're not, what can we say? We're not Elon Musk. We're not Elon Musk. We're bringing people together by elevating your ants' conspiracy theories. I mean, I just can't, I can't wait for, for that. We should go in there and do a presentation.

I think we're not Elon Musk, is there a best guy? Anyway, I, to be fair, the song is fun. I know people made a big thing of it. Actually, he was talking about a better future than that song, too. I mean, I got another one. If you have to explain your joke, it's not funny. I got another one. Herr Metta, where you found your college roommate. Now, it's where you share your roommate's dad's post at Michelle Obama. It's secretly a linebacker.

I mean, I, I, bring me a coat. Let's go in there. Let's go in help them. Let's help them.

He's not gonna laugh at me. We're gonna try. I tried. Metta, we're gonna try and sell you something

you searched about at 2 am six months ago. Okay, stop. All right. We're moving on. This Trump administration, moving on. Sorry, Mark. We apologize. Not really. I got one more. Okay, it's down my feed. The future is AI generated. Jesus holding six puppies while giving away free RVs. Literally, that if you have any sense of humor, you will run my ads. I have to do this on AI.

“Can't you create ads using AI now? Maybe. Yeah. Yeah. Okay, I think this is genius.”

I should start a podcast on ads from Metta. I've got one. Metta, fucking election since 2006. There you go. Nice. Anyway, all right, moving on. Donald Trump, we have to stop making these up.

Donald Trump says administration is launching a trade investigation at your opinion after a hit

Google with a $1 billion anti-trust fine. In a true social post, Trump accused the EU of robbing American tech companies. Trump claimed the latest fine was issued without explanation, even though the EU regulators said it's stemmed from failure to comply with the digital market sector, which we've known about for a long time. Regardless, Trump said the US is not a piggy bank for Europe and is threatening to hit the EU with substantial tariffs. What is usual, go to, is his tariffs.

Because those just expired and he's trying all manner of ways to put new tariffs on. Listen, Obama released a similar thing at the time of the original digital market sector and the

other act. So, you know, a lot of presidents do this. But, you know, the tariff, you never did anything

about it. Obama complained about it, as I recall. But, and was a bit defending US tech companies. But, thoughts on this? I'm so exhausted by all of it, because I have trouble understanding it, and usually the stuff that's boring is the important stuff. So, like, two decisions, half a billion fine for self-preferencing its own search. The EU has essentially become the de facto regulator for American tech, because America won't do it itself. So, I'm a little bit,

I'm up two minds here, and that is when the primary form of tech innovation coming out of the EU is regulation. That's not a great sign. It reflects poorly on both of us, quite frankly. I don't have a lot to say here, care. What do your thoughts? By the way, I do have the new meta-tagline. We're not the same Facebook that ruined Thanksgiving. It's time. We'll break this time. We're all sucked into it. I got a new job as an agent.

I'm literally starting the new meta-agency. Where did that like to earn on? I'm the new meta-agency, bring us in, Mark, bring us in. We can help you. Put us in, put us in, put us in bands enormous amounts of money to insult you. I'm a meta-agency. We're not just ruining Thanksgiving anymore. If you talk to your drunk uncle, practice in karate, Thanksgiving was creepy. Wait to see what Willie Alder and I'm going to feed you.

All right. I'm going to very quickly dispense of this, and I'm going to say one thing.

“Let me just tell you, Meta, you really should have a sin. You should 100 percent have it. That would”

show you understand the problem that you have. I think it would be really good to have your Hey girls. You know what I get? I don't know. Hey girl. I get hey. Hey. And by the way, they don't call me. They're PR representatives. Combs person to shout out to them. Hey, so-and-so it's going to be in town. Would love to grab a drink with you. Everyone thinks that if anyone offering me a drink, I'm there. Yes. He shows up. He's an alcoholic. I'm not for drinks. I'm like the lesson,

the lesson, television, Christopher Hitchens. I'll tell you what I do when I get the Hey girls. I go. Because I'm like, okay. Sure. I'm happy to re-engage with you, given I was accurate. No, I want to find it out. Would you talk to them? Will you talk to them? I think that's- I love that case. It's my credibility, right here. I think she works hard. I really like it because with the U thing, this has been going on forever. We don't do any regulation. They may be guilty of

doing too much, but too bad. Y'all knew the vines that we're going to be here. Do something about

“our tech industry in a way that satisfies your pain regulation. If you want to operate there,”

you live by their worlds. I'm sorry. And the Trump can complain about it, but hitting with tariffs, his old trick is ridiculous. Tariffs are bad for the economy. They cause inflation. They're stupid way to hit back, and it's not going to work. So it doesn't matter. So I think it's just a wash in that regard. You can keep making jokes all the rest of the show. All right. Let's go on a quick break. We come back. The FDA loosens restrictions on peptides. Ooh,

Scott, we're back, and talking about the latest buzzword and wellness peptides. I'm so tired of

“hearing about peptides from people after my show. People take them for everything from weight loss”

into aging to muscle growth. They're the miracle drug. By the way, geolp1s are peptides. Right now, people are getting on these so-called gray market online through longevity clinics, even TikTok outside of the FDA approval process. But last week, a panel of doctors and pharmacists, all of whom are in the tank, voted to recommend the FDA's access to several peptides that are popular with influencers, celebrities, and RFK Jr. That's in spite of government

scientists warning about the lack of data showing these drugs are safe or effective. It's like nuts. The FDA isn't saying that drugs are dangerous. They're saying they don't have enough information,

which they should get, and maybe not a good enough reason to restrict access. But approval

would benefit telehealth companies, compounding pharmacies, and frankly RFK's agenda. I will say one quick thing, since I didn't cover them in my show, but the gray market is so dangerous, and they are mostly made in China. It's a very dangerous thing to be putting in your body, and they're still a very unclear studies on whether these things work, and there should be. By the way, there should be studies paid for by the government, which we used to fund these scientists

to do these things. But just letting them out there among the people is such a mistake if we don't have. And I understand slowing things down is a problem, but sometimes it's for the best, and these things can be very, very dangerous without in terms of where they're coming from, and whether they're safe for use, Scott, go ahead, peptides. Well, peptides and over-use term GOP, if you want it's a peptide.

At my understanding, it's peptide, it's just a series of molecules. The I agree with you that the, again, it's the same to reline. It's a lack of trust in our institutions. We used to trust our institutions to tell us what we should put into our body, or what we shouldn't, or that we had a smart FDA, or a smart CDC, that would help protect us.

“I had dinner with two actors on, I wasn't Thursday, I think, or Saturday. Anyways,”

and they're both on this Wolverine stack peptide. And I like this stuff. I like, I take supplements, I'm on testosterone therapy, I was doing NAD for a while, I'm absolutely, I like to be out. I do believe there's something to this stuff, but I, I wait till there's a decent amount, I guess NAD is the most, and I also do creatine. But as someone who does a decent amount of research, the peptide jury is not in, or these peptides, I should say. Yeah.

To help you one, they are. They, or they're getting able to help you one is, it's FDA approved. I mean, most, the many of these geo, P1s are FDA approved. And by the way, every piece of research that comes out, the externalities are positive, which is the most unique thing about that. And we're getting real time data with people using them, usually they're now done by doctors, much more so than at the beginning, but go ahead. By the way, the same ad agency that's helping

MEDA is rebranding Marlboro as a wellness startup, just so you know. Anyway, so finish your thought,

“your peptide thought. I, I like, again, I think that's this people deciding to do their own”

medical research and come to their own conclusions, because an influencer tells them that, you know, Leo is on this thing, and I actually don't know if he is or isn't. And I do think there's something,

I have never done all the stuff I've done. I have never done it without medical supervision,

meaning I, I have my blood drawn all the time now and I do all these crazy analyses of it. And they'll say, you are low on these Omega's, take fish oils. Fine. You know, I'm a fan of intervention and being thoughtful about, about plusing up the gaps in your nutrition or whatever it might be, especially as you get older. And my view is between the ages of 20 and 50, your body's pretty God damn good at figuring out what it needs. Unfortunately, it starts to die because the

majority of us are supposed to be dead by now. So some intervention, I think makes sense. This stuff feels cutting edge to the point of buyer but where I don't. Yeah, I would agree. I have a lot of people that are like, it works. I'm like, does it? Do you know? Do you know there's there are studies and like actually now? No, there aren't. Like, they're, they're not, they're very inconclusive. And my worry about them and they should be studied. Absolutely is where they're coming from and where

you're getting those things. And you wouldn't, like, it's sort of like getting like, here's some milk from a guy on the corner. Like, it might be good. It might be bad. And so a lot of it does come from China, especially as compound agencies. And there are no strictures on how they are. It's like eating poop lettuce. Like, you might have a good meal. You might have exploding diarrhea. And it's, it's, I just, it's too dangerous to do it. But everybody, every, I get so yelled at. That's the one thing

do they also are describing far too many. Like, it's a solution for everything, which is all these supplements. They're not. Sometimes they're very small, little addition to your life. Sometimes, like, GLP ones, they are truly groundbreaking. But to say they do everything is just unproven.

“And you have to stop pretending. So every person who comes up to me, I'm sorry, you're incorrect.”

But, and you shouldn't be putting things like this in your body without medical supervision or or scientific proof, sorry. I'm, I'm on the scientific proof. Anyway, that's the way it is. That's the way it is. But, you know, meta now with more peptides. All right, Scott, one more correct. Hold on. New tab line. Facebook. We're new and scows to get beaten to death with a folding chair. Oh, I feel so bad. But it's a little, isn't it sad? God isn't essentially this ad,

just the broadcast embodiment of an abusive ex-husband Zuckerberg singing when whispering in your air.

They've changed. They've changed. They've changed. Here's the thing. Why don't our listeners

write in their tag lines for mad off to help them? Well, it's also, you know, it's a game. As a brand guy. These, yeah. These ads are absolutely beautiful. But the thing is, their actual product in terms of design, it feels like Craigslist fucked QAnne and it's like, QAnne, QAnne, QAnne, QAnne, QAnne, let's read your cash. Baby, I changed. I'm a new man. Baby, I've changed. Take me back, baby. I just love you so much. You forced me into it too. I just love you so much.

“You should not be laughing at that. Yeah, it's terrible. You're terrible. You're terrible.”

Anyway, I'm sure we'll get lots of letters. Anyway, what are you all writing and tell us what you think the tag lines for mad off should date? And then we will read them. Anyway, see if you can do better than Scott who just doesn't seem to stop. All right, guys, look at him. The marketer and him is just energized. All right. One more quick break. We'll be back for wins and fails.

Okay, Scott, let's hear some wins and fails. I think I'll go first. I first fail was the story came

on the post, which I was supposed to some, the post news side is doing a great job. I have to say, this is the headline. Police vetted dubious allegation only after Buttigieg was separated from children. The people, this is the Pete Buttigieg kids who were taken away from for a time and questioned in a really unterrible way by authorities. They were investigating these allegations made and the former cabinet secretary was separated from his four-year-old twins. And now the

mission attorney general is investigating how the accusation led to it. It turns out that the post talked to the woman who did it and she seems unhinged from what I can tell from the interview

“and didn't really understand it. And basically, I think made it up. And nobody was like the”

I think it started Indiana and then he was supposed to be an Alabama. But none of the authorities before they took the kids away checked on the source of the information. I have said this again and again, Chaston and Pete should sue these people for what they did. And the damage is done to their kids, like unnecessarily without any checking because of these ideas around gay parenting, which you know was part of it, because this woman essentially did not think gay people should be

parents from what I can tell from this interview. And I have to say it's just, it's mind-boggling that are a thought. I get it. One crazy lady is going to make some allegations that happens all the time in this world. Now, that fact that the police and others didn't vet it is really,

it's just such a incredible indictment of Michigan authorities. So I just, it's such a fail,

such a massive enormous repulsive fail, I have to say. And my win is, I have to, this beautiful show, this cat's jellicle ball. It's closing soon. I recommend people to see it. Just beautiful. It's so kind and human-forward, speaking of something that is human-forward, and funny, and just everything broadways great at. And I just, Claire addressed herself up in this beautiful spangled fear stress, and this wonderful fascinator hat, and it was just a wonderful thing. So I just love when people are

out at the theater and in theater, in movie theaters and things like that. And so I can't recommend these lovely, joyful, beautiful artistic, human-centered stuff that's coming out lately. And it's really, it does, there seems to be a shift where people just want to get together or celebrate real humanity, not in meta-ads, but in that way. So I would, I would say, get out and do something

Well, my, we lost as the White House correspondent center. It should be canceled, or they should

“they need to reinvent it. It's, it was the one I'd built to fake a truth and it couldn't hold”

for two hours. So it hasn't been able to hold for two hours. And the, the tell here was during this ridiculous, weird, creepy rant on, on a, on respect to journalists, the whole room just went, so silent. It felt like you could cut the air with just itk. And terrible, terrible for a brand, anyways, we covered that, that's my loss. White House correspondent center, whoever the governing organization has has to realize, like, this is over. It should be canceled. They're not done

for a couple of years. And they need to reinvent something else. My win is, it's not getting very much coverage, but what's gotten a decent amount of coverage is, is you crane with their incredible supply chain and drone and AI technology has been going after oil infrastructure. What they've done, which I thought was genius is they've gone after something that is hit Russia perhaps even harder and that is they blew up the wildberry's factory. And it ends up basically wildberries is the

Amazon of Russia. And this supposedly has caused more rage about the war than a million deaths and

casualties. Because the reality is the majority of the soldiers and the fatalities of our, that, that

toll on families has been levied against kids and families from Black with that term rural Russia. And the, the elites don't really care, but you start fucking, you start fucking with their ability to sell their fashion into people and saying, Peter's were, especially this is just outraged all these creators and all these small business people. And also has had an impact on the front lines because a lot of people were buying kind of basic military equipment and gear. And I thought

it was just so interesting that, and whose on the run it looks like he looks like he's hiding away to look at the same time. People, well, A, especially his paranoid and B, he's very, he's very scared. This is so, I thought this was so interesting. They want, what are they doing? They're saying, okay, we've shown we can kill a thousand people a day. Russians don't seem to care. The

Russia's arguably Russia's core competence. It's, it's an incredibly important, an incredible,

incredible appreciation of culture in the arts and technology. A lot of very redeeming qualities about the, about Russian culture, but their core competence quite frankly is they're willing to endure more suffering than any, than any society in history. We lost 400,000 people in World War II, they lost 20 million and they were ready to keep fighting. And, but what they've said is, okay, we're going to hit you where we think it hurts most for you, and that is going after

“your ability to order shit overnight. And I thought it was just such genius there, and I think”

Ukraine is not only showing, I mean, they're, they're essentially they said, okay, we're bringing the war to you. And it's just interesting how they decided to bring it to the Russian populace. So, instant visible pain versus sanctions kind of year long, you know, year long impact, if you will, or year long impact. I thought it was very innovative. Anyways, my, my fail, you know, this would happen. This would be like, if we, we declared war on Canada, they would

get us eventually. You know what I mean? Like, they're right, right next to each other, they've proven very strong. Although there's, you know, there's been some back and forth with they, he fired, fired one guy, one different, their own guy, and then everyone got mad about that, then he ended up firing another defense minister in Ukraine. There's a little bit of back and forth there. But can I note something else that he was doing that I thought was a rather clever.

So, he's now going to the maga right to talk to people. Do you see Laura Lumer, who was so anti-Ukraine and pro Putin went there and interviewed him is suddenly his biggest follower. Like, he's so great,

“kind of thing. I think that's also very clever. Even though he has his own issues internally”

with corruption and everything else, he's been very adept. It also appealing to the maga base here, which I think is probably very smart. Yeah. It's, I mean, you have mixed emotions. You're like, why should anyone care at Laura Lumer? Thanks, but at the same time, anything that gets pressed at highlights, even the craziest have recognized that it's in our best interest to support Ukraine. I'm here for. Yeah. So, yeah, have out at Laura. And next, maybe next, you can do a segment

on how the greatest innovation in history is vaccines. Absolutely. I'm waiting for it. Well, she suddenly is going to be pro-vaccine. Anyway, those are those are good ones. Those are excellent. Oh, by the way, I have one more quick win. Everybody go see Ryder die with Octavia Spencer and Hannah Waddingham. Oh, my God. It's what's on? It's a show on Amazon and it's hysterical. It's

But these two couldn't be the best pair and they look so different and they're so different in general. And I have to say it's hysterical. Ryder die. Ryder die. And I love Hannah and I love Octavia.

I think she's one of my favorites. It's Hannah from Ted Lazo. And she's amazing. She's amazing.

She's, I love her. I love the one, the Hannah that was in Game of Thrones. Yes, she was in Game of Thrones too. Yes, that's right. Yeah. She's amazing. She's a tall drink of water. And David is

“incredible too. They just incredible. Go see it if you want to enjoy yourself all at all day long”

and twice on Sunday. You'd like it, Scott. Anyway, we want to hear from you, send us your questions about business checker. Whatever's on your mind, go to NYMag.com/pivot. Just a minute, a question for the show. We're called 85-551 Pivot. Elsewhere in the carrot and Scott universe, this week on on. I'm talking to actor and comedian Jeff Heller. He's in two of the busiest TV shows in the last year. Pillar of this where he just got an Emmy nomination for just a guest role.

He's amazing in it. And widows Bay. He talked about why people are drawn to these shows. Let's

“listen to a clip. These are dark worlds, but it's not, it's not like our dark world.”

You know, it's like we can figure it out. We can pull it, pull apart the lore and figure out this mystery, whereas we don't have that kind of control in our own life because there's, I mean, every time you open the New York Times, it's like, "What? That happened!" Anyway, he's a really great guy. He's a sort of a character actor and I love character. There's so many great characters and all these shows include in also severance, same thing.

Just really nice to see all these shows do so well and he's terrific. Okay, that's the show.

“Thanks for listening to Pivot. Be sure to like and subscribe to our YouTube channel.”

We'll be back on Friday. Today's show was produced by Larry and Amen Sewie Marcus, Taylor Griffin, Todd Wiseman and Christine Driscoll. Additional assistance from Kate Gallagher and Brad Sylvester, and either Todd Anthony at this episode. Thanks also to DeGibros, Mr. Vera, and Dan Shalon, the shot-core as Voxemeter's executive producer podcast. Make sure to follow Pivot on your favorite podcast platform. Thanks for listening to Pivot

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