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“If you go, there are clearly scenes where there were gods,”
are moon, a great god of Karnak. Thebes, his wife, the god of Smoot, and the figure of ramassies has been inserted as an afterthought. So it's not part of the original scheme. Someone has had the thought.
Actually, we'll put the king here. So that, I mean, it's rare you can say you can see a developing theology. But that is something where the idea of ramassies a god has not been originally planned,
but developed with the building.
Because you also see, in that first room as you enter,
I'd be simple, don't you? You see, it's him and his chariots. He's very much him, he was a military figure as well. So it's not just promoting him as divine. You know, that's a key part of it.
And there's colossal statues of him seated. If he stood up, he would tower above the template itself. But it's still harking back to him also as a successful military figure. And, you know, the head of this royal family as well. Yeah, he must be proud of the military.
“I'll be it. We might consider it a draw now.”
But it's kind of a challenge. And we know other earlier kings did this. A challenge to his successors to maintain his boundaries and maintain his sphere of influence. If we want to call it that.
And because he lived so long, we know this in various instances throughout history. If you spend a long time on the throne, it is more difficult for the eventual successor. Especially if like ramassies, you have 50 sons.
And sure, many of them died. He was eventually succeeded by his 13th son, Minimita. But there are other sons. I mean, the fourth son is especially interesting to me. Prince Kai Moiset.
He is credited by some
with being the first Egyptologist.
Because he is the one who goes around labeling the pyramids. So he's the high priest of the god Pita at Memphis or near modern Cairo. And in that role, he is very aware of the sacred landscape, which is, you know,
littered with massive pyramids. But to a son of ramassies,
“the second to go out into the desert and to see,”
not that far into the desert, still visible from the floodplain. But to see a monument that so vast, so impressive, so pristine, without any hydroglyphs on it. Telling you who the king is, this seems crazy.
The son of a Meglamaniaclyte ramassies second. So he goes along and inscribes. Very deep elaborate inscriptions. What's been called by one great Scottish Egyptologist, Kenneth Kitchen is the largest museum label in the world.
Telling future generations, this is the pyramid of Kufu. This is the pyramid of Unas. This is the pyramid of Joseph. And I Prince Kai Moiset have restored the name of this king,
because it was not found on the surface of his monument,
and I'm the son of the great king, Ramsi's second.
So Ramsi's the second gets his name, put on all of these ancient monuments. So he's not just in the hypostartholic Khanak. It's not just the great Templar Abou symbol. It's also on the pyramids.
On the pyramid he has ramassies his name as well. Yes. And do we get a sense with, you know, his many children, his many sons? We have any sense if he had any favorites.
Oh, I would, it difficult to say based on the evidence as it survives. Prince Kai Moiset is interesting,
Because he helps organize his fathers,
he besaid Jubilee festivals. And so he is often shown in association with the father. So in a cynical way, it's a great way for Kai Moiset, who maybe thinks is dad's going to live forever.
And best to make the most of his lot.
Now, it's not a million miles away from the Prince of Wales.
Thinking as Charles Prince of Wales did, I've got to make the most of this, because it's what I'm going to be doing for most of my life. But whether Kai Moiset expected to be the next Pharaoh is difficult to say, as I said,
I mean, obviously if someone dies, that removes them from the line of succession,
“but I think they had to be very careful.”
Yeah, careful planning for a smooth transition of power. And I think the best evidence that Ramsey's liked, one of his sons, was that he would designate him as the heir. So eventually the heir, Meren Bata,
must have been favored. Absolutely, because go back to have a simple once again. Just because he haven't been there recently. When you get close to the colossal statues of Ramsey's, as he's smaller, depictions of a few of his wives,
and a few of his children believed as well. So yeah, as far as the ones that, I know you're not supposed to have favorites, but as the King did there are a few that he picked to place alongside him on this temple to himself.
Yeah, I think those must be as far as the, we know that ones that are inscribed, or identified by inscription, they are the more senior ones. And you wonder, because he lived so long,
but some of those had already died. So this was a way of commemorating them. He had a special tomb of vast tomb built in the, the valley of the King's cavey five, for the children for the sons.
“But then it's also a thing about the psychology of Ramsey's”
the second, because he lives along life.
He's on the throne six to six years. So assuming he comes to the throne say at 24, he's 90 by the time. He died. We're chilling.
Very good going. For an ancient ruler, albeit he had the best doctors and lived of life of great luxury. But you could imagine, you know, as you see,
your children die, your waves die, your grandchildren die. Maybe you, Ramsey's thought, I am a god, I'm not going to die. And I must also ask, obviously that thing, the beating heart of Egypt is the Nile.
And if every year you have the annual floods don't you, which determines the, the great, well, how successful the agricultural year would be the next year. And like if the flooding is too low,
then it could lead to famine. Do we get a sense? I mean, is there any surviving archaeology, that hints that there were times in Ramsey's is rain where they had a lot of trouble?
For a long time. For a long time. And stuff like that, or was it, was he just in a,
“of every good century where everything worked his way?”
And that would be nice. I mean, a good question. I mean, we do have Nile flood heights levels from different King's reigns. But I don't think anything was,
particularly cast catastrophically low or high, of course, it's too much. It's a bad thing as well. It spells bad news. But I think looked at another way you write.
It could be that he was just doing well.
Whereas later King's like Ramsey's the third,
you know, just happened to get a bad run. And ruled under some more economically straight in times. Well, I could ask so many more questions about Ramsey's, but I know we've got to move on. So let's go to nearing the end of Ramsey's's reigns.
So it's called those children. He's outlived. Many of them by this time as well. Many of his wives are dead as well. Yeah.
It's time Nefertari certainly asks the picture. Yeah. Nefertari to whom he dedicated that smaller template. It seems to be the first senior wife. That's clear.
That's clear. But then there is a second senior wife. Is it not for it who's the mother of Kaimasa, and also of Merimpata. Right.
So she's important. Probably buried someone at Sikara. And yes, eventually her son, the 13th son. Merimpata becomes King. And he was so sorry.
I must've also mentioned the Ramsey him. Because we have read times. Yes. And this is, it's named after himself. But what is it?
Well, we nowadays call it the Ramsey him. That's house. We're called a few visit Egypt today. For. Yeah.
More recent times. It was called the Memnonium. Because it was associated with Memnon, which is actually. And then given to the Klausai.
The Klausai. The Klausai. Memnon. Which are associated with Ammonhood at the third. But in ancient times,
it was known as a mansion of millions of years. So this is a little hobby horse of mine. I don't like referring to these as funerary temples,
Or marchary temples.
Because this over-emphasizes death. It's not a bit death. It's not about, you know, mourning the king.
“It's about the king becoming united with the gods.”
And so Ramsey's the second temple really is vast.
And it's one of the first, if not the first, that has the outer pile on gateway, made of stone. Previous temples had the made of mud brick,
and they simply haven't survived. But now I know that the colleagues in Egypt are working on the restoration of the pile on. So it should be more visible and more visible. In future,
it really wasn't impressive structure. And it was the direct inspiration for one of Ramsey's successors. Ramsey's the third. So basically his temple,
what's now called Medina Tabu, is not a carbon copy, but a normage
to the mansion of millions of years of Ramsey's the second,
called the Ramsey him today. And was that where Ramsey wanted to be buried? No, this is an important point. It's willfully, consciously,
at a distance from the tomb. And that's from the valley of the king. The valley of the king is the cemetery, that's where the royal sample curves are, which is, you know, over a kilometer away.
But the temple is for people to visit, to leave offerings and to celebrate the eternal. Palt of the king, the union of the king with various gods. And that will be where many, many, many centuries later, Bellzoni will find that colossal statue,
the head of witches in the British Museum today. Indeed. The younger men on, yes. That's inspired a piece of poetry. Oh, they don't get to you in a bit later, yes, absolutely.
Well, okay, 66 years on, I do know much about the end of Ramsey's is rain and the state of Egypt at that time. Is there almost a decline in his power, or is Egypt declining as he's getting older? Do we know anything?
It's difficult to have a reliable index of, you know, GDP for ancient ages or the equivalent. But suffice it to say, I mean, he would have been the only king, almost everyone had ever known.
“So I think when he did eventually shuffle off this mortal coil,”
the would have been a lot of head scratching about how to actually do a ferocious funeral. But you can tell that there are problems set up in store for his eventual successor, Minimitar. And he seems to have made a pretty good goal.
We have a kind of uptick then in an evidence of, of foreign interactions and foreign policy. Because he has to deal with active, yeah, pressing issues from the west, from the Libbyans, issues in the north,
in the Levant and then back to the south of the newbies. [MUSIC] What started the Civil War? What ended the conflict in Vietnam? Who was Paul Revere?
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So, Marampita, let's focus on these threats that he faces, because he is not a name anywhere as recognizable
and around the seas the second.
So, to all because we should shine a light on this figure, like we did with Ramsey's The First and Seti.
“Marampita, what do we know about the struggles that he faces?”
Well, we've got quite a bit of historical information. Almost like he makes an effort to put his stamp on history. And again, older king coming to the throne, he maybe is in his 60s. If not 70, when he comes to the throne.
So there's a sort of a Charles III thing. There's a 13th sonl so it runs his 70s. Well, and maybe, well, exactly he wasn't preparing to be the king throughout his whole life. He had all the brothers.
He clearly wants to record his own
Active engagement with these foreign powers.
So there are sources like the so-called Israel stealer.
“So this is a re-used monument of an earlier king of Aminut at the third,”
where the back of it is inscribed with various campaigns. And there are lots of these things actually, relatively speaking.
And it's the first historic mention of the people of Israel.
As a people, as a people, so historically very, very interesting. But also, men and men go around again, you get the sense, maybe reading a little bit between the lines, that he thinks he doesn't have long, because he's quite old already. And he does rule for almost 10 years.
So you know, he does okay. And he puts his name on wherever there is a nifty space, because he doesn't have the time to commission new monuments. He just waps his name on whether it's statues of older kings, whether it's columns, we have an example in Manchester Museum,
where it's an older middle kingdom column of granite, ramassies the second has his name and image, worshipping a god on it. And then Miram Patah has had his name added as well. So there's this sense of, you know,
yeah, fighting against time.
“But I think the real success of Miram Patah,”
and it's a shame he's not better known, is that he actively manages to campaign quite actively against power from the east and the west and the south. With time, the dynasty, there's lots of internal struggles for a few generations.
But then by the time of ramassies the third,
you get active incursions. You get the sea peoples, this kind of motley crew of people from the Mediterranean. You get the Libions actively coming over and being quite threatening.
And all of this seems to be held at bay by Miram Patah. So he maybe gets undeservedly short-shrift because he's overshadowed by his father, and people often say ramassies. The third is the last great king of Ancient Egypt,
but Miram Patah must have had a pretty, you know, involved training in his youth. So maybe he's in his 60s not actively going out, fading, but he's able to, I guess, reflect on his experience
of being the son of ramassies the second,
and strategize to head off problems which become serious problems in the decades after a journey. So those military problems that he faces during his own only a decade or so on the throne, it's quite interesting how you have,
you know, Ramsey's the second ruling for so long, then almost as soon as he dies. Libions, the emojis, the sea peoples, you have the new beans revolting as well, and Miram Patah almost is one heat.
He has to deal with it. Do we think as potentially a feeling that enemies were circling, they see the death of a ferro, they see Miram Patah come to the throne quite elderly, they feel that there's an opportunity here?
Yes, absolutely.
“And I think there was always that looking for an opportunity”
when religiously, theologically, it's a very vulnerable time for the country between the change of monarch. I mean, there is something without forcing modern parallels on it. There was something about the death of Elizabeth II, where people were really kind of shaken by it,
and you feel like it's kind of a cosmic whether you're a great monarchist or not. There is some kind of cosmic shift, and for the ancient Egyptians that really was a cosmic shift, so you would take the chance if you're going to make trouble for the Egyptian state,
you will wait until one of these kind of transitional moments. This one was a bit like Edward VII, after Queen Victoria, or something like that. Yes, but it doesn't rain too long. Yes, but you don't associate the complete crumbling of a dynasty,
I guess, with him following. I mean, I'm not an expert on that. No, I think the parallels is justified. And so you get Marmbita for a decade or so, and he is successful in beating off the sea peoples.
The first emergence of the sea peoples on the sea. Yes, I mean, we don't have many records from his own mansion of millions of years, because it's not terribly well preserved, but there are other bits of historical accounts that really make it clear that the sea peoples and other non-egyptian threats are serious.
And so maybe we know, in the case of Zawaii Timorakam, on the north coast of the Mediterranean coast of the fort, that's the fortress and the north west. But things are happening. You know, there is a tangible threat from the people to the west.
And eventually, you know, with time, a few, a couple of hundred years later, there will be Libyan kings of Egypt.
It will go so far as to be, you know,
a Libyan hero in the throne. But Menophtar is the accepted ruler, but of course, there are all these other prince's things about. And that creates rivals for the throne, for sure. So Marmbita dies, after some 10 years or so,
what happens following that?
“Does it all go to pieces quite quickly after he dies?”
It must be around 80 years old by that time. Yeah, I think there is a sense in which things do fall apart, historically speaking pretty quickly. The 19th dynasty only is a couple of decades left to go. There are a series of short-lived kings.
This is the end of the 19th dynasty. And then you get to a young king called Siptar, who has a female regent called Tauzret. And she is really the end. She's a female hero, end of the line.
She rules quite effectively, it seems for a few years. But then there's this shadowy figure, this high-ranking court here, called Bai, who is like a 19th dynasty equivalent of the much loved in my case,
character of Sennon-Mirth, the right-hand man to match up certain dynasty 18. So Tauzret is ruling the last of the host of Ramses. And then you get this new guy, a guy called Siph-Nacht.
And he comes on the scene and he who serves Tauzret's tomb in the valley of the kings, still one of the most interesting tombs in the valley of the kings at Thieves. So the dynasty shifts then, and there's new blood comes in, and we begin dynasty 20, with Siph-Nacht,
and then his successor at Ramses III.
Do you think Tauzret's reign as Ferre was always destined
“to end that way because just how they viewed a woman as a Ferre?”
This is tricky, this is really tricky, and it's something I've thought about, a bit. She does get mentioned in an official list of kings, a document that you're in a canon, so it's acceptable that there is this woman in a sense.
And so she rules fairly successfully for a few years. She builds things, and there are foundation deposits attesting to her building works. But she only rules for a handful of years, and then is succeeded by someone called Seth Nacht,
and he is a new guy. So that is the time of the 19th-thinsties up by that point, and it's a new bloodline. But the fact that there is this character, this chancellor, by who, and it's a very rare case,
we have evidence of him being put to death, so there is a mention of execution of this guy, which backstabbing must have gone on. We know about it at the toldomies,
“but it must have gone on throughout Ferrening history.”
But this is a very rare insight into a very, what must have been not uncommon, but it's unusual, it's recorded. And then she is succeeded by this man, this new guy, set Nacht,
and he has a successor, who's Ramsey's the third.
So all of this happens from the death of Mirambita, to the succession of Ramsey's, the third and a few decades. So within, yes, like, three or four decades, after the death of Ramsey's, the second. Yeah, his dynasty has come crashing down.
Yes, yeah, yeah, yeah, he might have planned, and did his father and grandfather planned, and initiated this great sweep of history, and thought their successors would keep going into the future. But in real terms, in terms of blood relations, pure blood relations,
the dynasty fizzles out and dies. When Seth Nacht and eventually, Ramsey's the third come along, they offer the appearance of stability, which is fine, but the economic and social changes within Egypt are real, as are the foreign threats, the non-injection, the outsider threats.
As we were discussing before, the geopolitics,
even between Seth, the first and Ramsey's second, which isn't a long time.
There's lots of shifts there. Fast forward to the reign of Ramsey's, the third. And I mean, he claims various victories in his well-recorded accounts in his mansion of millions of years, but this really heralds the end of the new kingdom,
and the rise of other powers in the ancient world. It is to interest in Campbell how, you know, it's still a long time, I guess in the grand scheme of things between Ramsey's and second, and then Ramsey's the third, which she says, another of those kind of big name figures.
The strength of Ramsey's the second, is it more just a personal image
That dies out soon after his death,
and actually he doesn't really leave anything that can endure for a long, long time. He doesn't build anything with an idea that he plans for it to endure for hundreds of years. Is it very much, it's just an image of his strength during his reign,
and then that just disappears, and the solidity that he thought he'd created evaporates, rather than him actually wanting to create something stable, for well, maybe in his eyes at Melania.
“I think with the legacy of Ramsey's the second, in parts,”
I mean, his own reign is a lot about spin, and he focuses a lot on his own personality, and divine personality when he's alive. This is something again in terms of size. The cult of the king through these statues, these cult colossus,
I'll tell them. Only a really supercharged with the divine power during his lifetime, they kind of fade into the background after his death.
So to be fair to the successes of Ramsey's the second,
I have to deal with other challenges, which Ramsey's second, didn't have to deal with. There's another practical thing though, the great city that he embellished paramsis, suffers because the branch of the Nile, it's on,
silt's up, so it's not functional. So it's unforeseen, you know, future events. You know, kind of really hinders legacy. Right, not actually paying attention to it.
“Yeah, so I think that's fair to be fair to Ramsey's the second,”
who must have been quite a dynamic guy to give him his fair to you. I think, yeah, his successors had to deal with with things, which yeah, totally unforeseen on his part. It does make a question.
Is Ramsey's the second, is he really the great,
or is he just the absolute master of spin? I mean, he's the greatest in the sense that he had most time to tell us he was great. Yeah, he's the loudest rule he's the loudest. Yeah, I mean, if Hatchepsut had been a man and a drooled for 60 years, we would have no doubt about her, his greatness.
And I mean, it's true though we do have evidence of, you know, like the cult of Ramsey's the second, persisting in places like Abados, you know, there is evidence of the worship of Ramsey's the second in certain places. And then his body, of course, survives.
He's buried in the Valley of the Kings. The body is moved to the Royal Mummy Cash in Dioro Bakri, DB 320. And then when that's discovered, officially in 1881, that starts a whole new weird afterlife,
Ramsey's the second, where his body seems as so well preserved, he's assumed to be the fear of the exodus. So we do have the actual body of Ramsey. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. He goes a bit moldy in the 1970s and there's sent a Paris for defungal treatment.
So having the face of this man, so it's not just the statues. Of course the statues don't look anything like he would have done when he was alive. And people tried to extrapolate from his mummified body,
what he might have looked like will never really know.
Just to be clear, that's another hobby horse of mine. But having the body, and especially when it was unwrapped in the 1880s, was shocking and surprising and thrilling. So in popular culture, you know, there are, that's one of the most popular postcards you could buy.
And the late 1800s was the mummified face of Ramsey's the second. So he gains a totally unexpected popularity. The cover of Nyan Maiden, Al-Bum, is inspired by Abusembal. You know, things like that, he speaks to, he speaks to modernity in our experience of tyrants and autocrats and dictators.
Because I don't imagine Ramsey's the second presided over a democracy. So there's something about his character. We still are kind of seduced by, even though he was probably pretty autocratic. He built so many statues, he had so many battles, he had so many children. You know, we can't help but have this grudging respect.
And his name is everywhere on so many of the great monuments, whether it's all made so Carnac or Abusembal. If there's one name to learn, one cartoon to learn. It's Ramsey's the second Usur-Mart Ra set up in Ra. If you learn those hieroglyphs, you will see them all over each of them. Well, that was the one, the first, did not, the first that Shampooly on figured out.
Indeed.
“So because it was so, when he went there, I think he was amazed just at how common it was.”
Well, I'm glad you mentioned the 19th century, because I have a copy here of the famous Percy Shelley. Oh, him was Emandius and Emandius. He's a Greek rendering for the name "Emandius". He's a poem that alerts the inevitable decline of rulers and the hubris. So I read it out now, because it's a thriller must.
I met a traveler from an antique land who said,
"Two vast and truncless legs of stone, sand in the desert. Near them on the sand, half sunk, a shattered visage lies, whose frown and wrinkled lip and sneer of cold command, tell that it sculpted well those passions read which yet survive, stamped on these lifeless things, the hand that mocks them and the heart that's fed,
and on the pedestal these words appear. My name is Ozymandius, king of kings. Look on my works, ye mighty and despair. No thing beside remains, round the decay of that colossal wreck, boundless and bare, the lone and level sand stretch far away.
Interesting, isn't it? Very far away. Not one for poems, and I've probably butched the reading of that. I must admit, I didn't do enough English literature growing up. But it's interesting how in Victorian times they have that idea of ramassies,
even back then.
“Yeah, and I think what really inspired that poem was a kind of frenzy,”
surrounding the arrival in London of that colossal sculpture, fragment you mentioned before, at the so-called younger Memnon, which is known the British Museum. Yeah, in 1816 it was moved by Bill Zoni, and it eventually, a couple of years later, it arrived in London.
And it wasn't an interest in ramassies the second,
it was just in the size of the statue. It's interesting, Shelley talks about ramassie, Ozymandius, king of kings. That is one of the names of the colossal statues that I see. It's the worshiped.
Ramassie's ruler of rulers, Heke in Hekeau. So there's this reverberation of this character for He must have been an impressive character. Yes, he had the opportunity to build, to battle, to marry, to procreate, over 66 years.
But there's something about the brokenness of the monuments of him and other kings that does appeal as quite romantic, it's almost like briff, especially for Christian people, that these pagan kings were cut down to size by the true goal.
This idea that no matter how powerful and brilliant he was in his prime,
how quickly that legacy can shatter in the years following and in the case of ramassies and his successes, it shatters pretty quickly and did. How about this, I mean, absolutely fantastic. I mean, there's so much we could talk about with the real reign of ramassies
and Merempatar as well, and what happens all the way down to Taoist ret. But it's a fascinating time period.
“Is there anything else you'd like to mention about ramassies?”
Well, how we should view this figure going forwards? I think in some ways he gets a bad press, because it's all one, bam, thank you, Ram. But I think ramassies, I mean, he does have a legacy and that he gives his name to so many others.
So many others. Something back to ramassies to say. Yes, and I think if you asked a king 500 years later, who was the greatest fear of ancient Egypt, it would be difficult for them to choose between two more and the third,
and ramassies to second. So that's a terrible idea. How many ramassies are there in total? So there are eleven, called ramassies, but later kings, even then ramassies, the 11th,
take the throne name, Usur Matra.
“So there is clearly an homage going on there.”
Campbell, always a pleasure.
Thank you so much for taking the time to come back on the show. Thank you for having me. Well, there you go. There was Dr Campbell's prize continuing the story of the ramassied dynasty, the 19th dynasty,
defined a pitomised by the legendary Thero ramassies, the second ramassies, the great I hope you enjoyed the episode. Thank you so much for listening. Now, if you enjoyed the episode, if you enjoyed the show, please make sure to follow the ancients on Spotify,
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Thank you.
