Jen Aniston's Halted Wedding Plans, Jim Curtis' Hypnotism Hackery, and Friendship Breakups

another stacked and packed show awaits we will begin with self-help guru hack and Jennifer

Aniston's parasitic life partner will see for how much longer Jim Curtis this guy is out here still fling in his new book I'm sorry I should not call this a book like physically it's a book intellectually it's an insult to what books are should be and do he's been promoted this thing is an out till September and this this is this is how he's getting booked on the today show and now on Kelly Clarkson is because he's fucking Jennifer Aniston that's it this guy took himself over the

today show sat there and confidently told Craig Melvin that the way to get yourself to a

“better life is to and I am not exaggerating for comic effect I'm not editing for comic effect”

to look for yellow butterflies no matter the environment in which you live no matter the weather in whatever country you may be living in right now it's winter in Australia now look for yellow butterflies Craig Melvin looked like he wanted to leave his body so we're going to take Jim apart some more you know and if Jennifer Aniston does cancel this wedding the nurse is going to take the nurse is going to take a little bit of a victory lap we are and then you know I came across this

really fascinating piece in Vogue Singapore it was like in my Instagram feed and I sent it to Marlena and we talked about it and we were like we should do a chat about this on the nerve it's about

the ways in which levels of envy can invest friendships particularly female friendships it always reminds

“me of there was this very famous scene on signfeld where George Jerry and Elaine I believe are”

talking about the differences between the way men resolve conflict in their friendships or arguments and the way women do and George and Jerry are just sort of talking about the way men can really say ugly stuff to each other or even get into a fist fight but then when it's done it's done and it's in the past and it's never to be revisited and Jerry says something like why what a women do and and Elaine says oh we just believe each other until someone develops an eating disorder

so that's going to be a very very fun conversation and so we ask are you ready are you ready let's go does doing your makeup feel like a heavy lift does it feel complicated does it take a long time to

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troublemakers a repeat offender is still making the rounds unfettered unbothered it's the nerve's job to bother the sky until he leaves our lives completely we speak of Jennifer Aniston's celebrity hypnotist slash self-help guru boyfriend who is getting booked over at the today's show in January now nerve HQ caught him over on

the book of possibility I don't know what that means I don't know what is contained within

“those pages again to you it's a lot of worship also the cover should tell you everything because”

the cover of this book is a close-up of Jim Curtis's face here's a possibility Jim is with Jen for her bank account here's another possibility Jim is a malignant narcissist another possibility Jim needs a lot of attention and approbation and Jim needs everyone to join his cult so he can feel smart which he is not I know the guy worked on Wall Street I don't know at what level

I have no idea I have never ever ever heard of a guy in finance going you know what I should do

give up making all this money shut it all and become a self-help guru and tell people to go look

“for yellow butterflies which shocked really much when we told him that shocked as it should as it”

should now before we get into Jim's appearance such as it was on Kelly Clarkson the guy lasted like four minutes okay a conversationalist he is not an intellectual he is not in Kelly Clarkson could pretty much carry on a conversation with a wall and even Kelly Clarkson the unfailingly polite exceedingly likable Kelly Clarkson you can see on her face when this guy starts sling in his bullshit that she's like I can't I will keep it together but please we will go through it together

not to worry now this is the cover of star magazine June 15th 2026 Jen's broken wedding dream

with a report that Jim has ripped up the 320 million dollar preenup that Jen has proposed again this is

just star magazines reporting now they quote Jim on in the spread inside oh sorry it's four pages okay Jim talks a lot about executing what he calls repair when he has a disagreement with Jen a fight that they then go in and do the repair and this reminded me I made a note this is now this is this is infesting reality television and and those who appear on reality television your bravo smoke um it is now become fashionable to say were you able to reach a resolve

were you did resolve results after that disagreement not a verb and now resolve it's resolution it's not resolved stop it stop bastardizing the word resolve you resolved to do something like I resolved to be a fucking asteroid that destroys this ungromatic bullshit English is an elastic language and we love it for that reason but just stop and then we get an asshole like this out on these mean streets trying to infest the culture trying to take our money

“I think he's a con man I really do I think he's a fucking con man and uh and he's using words like”

let's do the repair repair my vehicle okay repair repair my broken sink do not stop okay you know where I'm going now according to this piece this sourced piece from it looks like people inside Jen's camp uh right now there's no room in her schedule for a wedding that is what we call at the nerve let or shit you want to get married you get married that's it all adjusted to the piece haven't come to your house do it in the backyard like Megan said she and Harry did and then

turned out like the the vicar or whoever who she said married them secretly before the big wedding came out publicly and said uh uh no I didn't marry them secretly I wouldn't do such a thing you know I'm saying now under a segment of this all of this piece called time to reflect time to reflect is the subhead got uh the slow down as theorized on an earlier nerve which the nerve is going to take a little bit of credit for it okay because while Jim Curtis is going and you know

spreading his horse manure over at the today's show and entertainment tonight so the world's the

fucking con man and he's a moron and he's telling people that the cure for what else that for excuse me what else them spiritually and intellectually economically romantically whatever is too look for yellow butterflies I am not exaggerating for comic effect I am not flattening that out for comic effect that is his advice and we will we will roll that tape we will roll that tape under the time to reflect the reflects section this slow down has reassured some in gen circle and

I quote it's actually come as a relief to a lot of her friends I'm going to guess the Jason Bateman's and the Jimmy Kimmel's and her circle and her counts and managers and lawyers who believed she was moving way too fast and needed to pump the brakes for her own good says the source

“open quote nobody's telling her to break up with Jim because you have to you have to do these”

interventions and stages okay and you have to help the person get to the point where they feel like they've made the discovery they've had the epiphany it's their choice baby steps okay so nobody's telling her to break up with him not yet but rushing down the aisle after barely a year of dating doesn't make sense to a lot of folks in gen orbit that is rarified air

when we are worth conservatively three hundred and twenty million dollars that is rarified air

when this guy's got a one point five million dollar apartment that he's missed payments on the HOA fees and the comment charges it is a blazing red flag and so now if you notice Jen has been

“making the rounds promoting the imminent return of the morning show on Apple and she's making the”

rounds with Reese with her spoon cling to her like she is the door that Kate Winslet is floating on at the end of titanic where's Jim where's Jim why are we not getting asked questions about Jim I mean if we're in love and we're about to get married and everything's great and we found our person like why are we not talking about Jim back to Jim on Kelly Clarkson and this guy better enjoy his time and spotlight because I am here to tell him it's coming to an end sir sooner than later

I would put money on it Kelly asks Jim how he got started with his method by which she means hypnotizing people and as I said when this when this relationship went public Jen how do you know the guy didn't hypnotize you into thinking he's the greatest fucking thing going greatest fucking future husband since Brad Pitt you know what I'm saying here we go I was on the more in public show and this hypnotist Dr. Brian Weiss had hypnotized me but yeah and I said wow this is

something interesting but it was my own illness that I realized as I was going around the world working with grandmasters of Kung Fu Ecuadorian Shaman I realized that hypnosis speaking to your subconscious

mind was the most powerful thing that you could do and I saw incredible benefits from I released

my chronic pain yeah I stepped into a life of possibility this is not an intellectual notice he's not saying you know what I did I began really immersing myself in the writings of Carliel who wrote about the shadow self and the subconscious and no this guy's in the remainder been at Barnes and Noble looking at the likes of other charlatans charlatans and this is his self report like I don't have chronic pain anymore well that you can't prove an negative you can't prove

“that that's what he says do I believe him now because I think he's a charlatan I think he's a”

con man a life of possibility your life of possibility sure those doors blow wide fucking open when Jennifer Aniston says to you you know what you're having trouble making the $800

common charge per month on your apartment that is worth about a million and a half we should go shopping

you know what let me take you shopping let's go shopping in New York City you know we should be looking at 25 million dollar penthouses and luxury apartment buildings who do you think is paying for that I don't understand why I understand why it's because he's fucking Jennifer Aniston

fucking real are you for fucking real my man they have to be polite I don't understand though they

“don't have to book him that they do not have to do and that that stink winds up on your brand”

Kelly I know you're leaving soon but like that stink winds up clinging to your show now as for that apartment shopping that luxury apartment shopping in New York City it looks like that's another thing Jenna has put on hold a new report this week texted to me in a 911 by Marlena from market watch published Tuesday June 9th the headline Jennifer Aniston's boyfriend

Jim Curtis takes $1.5 million New York City home off the market

Jen has rethought or her accountant drummed it into her head do not buy this guy an apartment okay don't do it I'm not you're not approved obviously it's your money you can do what you want with it but a 25 million dollar purchase for a guy you've known for maybe about a year it's a little

“much so I think Jim not smack down now according to this report in market watch Jim Curtis”

purchased this 1200 square foot condominium for just under 1.3 million in 2015 and it's only worth 1.5 11 years later that means that place is a not good shape he said no repairs no renovations trust me it should be worth more than that it absolutely should it's not he can't find a buyer but I don't even think it was on the market that long I think it's only been on the market a few months now he's put it back on the market for rent he's gonna try to rent it so he's still

spending most of his time I'm gonna guess with Jen in California we've been it this I my hand's gonna go like spin off my neck okay he put it back on the rental part market with an asking price of 89 50 a month that's 9000 dollars a month the extra we see you Jim 9k a month for 1200 square foot apartment it's a shoe box only for both listings to be taken down hours later okay that means Jen has said to Jim do not get too comfortable here my man don't acclimate yourself to this

level of living it's mine it ain't yours let's go back to Jim on Kelly Clarkson here we go what are some basic things that you tell people when they're in a freight in a moment

when you're freight in a moment first we can ask is this 100% true right what is happening

is it 100% true this fear that's coming up right is it possible that could be another positive thing could it the opposite be true right this is fairly basic stuff this is very very very basic stuff Kelly is struggling look at her body language Mark Bowden would have a field day she is angled away from him she's got her arms in front of her torso as if to form a barrier her head is tilted like she's skeptical of what he's saying and her expression is almost deliberately unreadable

but you can detect in there you can detect in there that she much like Craig Melvin when Jim be found studio one a it's like with a fuck is this what are you doing on my couch you know what are you talking about this what anybody does when they're confronted with some kind of news that they find disturbing or unsettling you let it metabolize and you save yourself okay I need to like get through my emotions gear and then really think this through rationally Jim in this moment

“and this is why I think he's a very what I say he's an effective con man no I would not”

would I say that he is an intuitive guy who senses when he's losing somebody yes yes I would and I do he senses in that moment that he's losing Kelly and so like any good con man he pivots are we using the ridiculous phrase particular or regular system no we are not we are not we have maybe learned from that today show appearance because the nerve really went in on that more than once but he pivots and he's going to and you can tell he's lost her because he poses a question to her

she's like oh wait sorry was that question directed it me like her she's already thinking about like

“what she's going to do when she wraps for the day trust me here we go you want to do this exercise for”

20 seconds me right now yes we do this exercise for 20 seconds it's mostly meditation right and we're not going to meditate okay so he says we're going to do a meditation exercise but we are not going to

meditate had I been in Kelly's chair which I would never be because that kind of media would never

have me just great we have each other we're all here together over in this lane I would say wait wait wait one moment sir you are saying as a self help guru and celebrity hypnotist I would be I would be using those credentials every second I got you are saying sir that we are going to do a meditation exercise but we are not going to meditate square that circle square it can you make that math work the way like you can't make your own math work in your own bank account where you seem to be operating

at a deficit even though you come we are told from the world of Wall Street so I would think that your facility with money would be greater than the average bear my crazy my crazy let's go back to jam on Kelly here we go and everybody here can do it too and just start to feel your breath rising up and down right and as you feel your breath rising up down just put your tongue on your back molar stretch out your vagus nerve and now focus on your hands now you're right hand and see if

your fingertips can tingle now your left hand see if your fingertips can tingle Kelly's quiet she's not saying oh yeah I feel my fingertips tingling she's not saying that you know if I had a gym Curtis in front of me knowing what we know now I would Marlena would do this backdrop

“maybe we'll do it in effigy for the nerve awards twenty twenty six do you remember the original”

movie poster for silence of the lambs and it was the moth right that was over jodie fosters mouth and it was like the moths that were pinned back I would have a series of yellow butterflies since deceased a various sizes pinned on a large frame the the biggest on top and the smallest

on bottom and that would be the backdrop as jim sat and slung his bullshit he would never see it

but it would be there nonetheless Kelly is like I'm engaging in this bullshit exercise to slow down my breathing and put one hand on each thigh and that's going to completely re-regulate me she's dying here okay she's like somebody's had his rolling after this here we go right and then all of a sudden with your breath in the back molar and your focus on your hands do you feel calmer yes yes it will immediately take you into a calm state because you're

no longer in that crazy thinking over thinking mind also your voice is very calming yeah

“yeah you should have an app I do yeah come good the book okay and for sure getting that because”

I guess I would be yeah that's that's exactly what we're doing here jim's like get the book and get the app don't buy the book don't buy the app around here in in the nerve studio I've got the the first book I believe the first and only book I could be wrong that jim self published this was before he met Jennifer and when your book is self published it means that there was no publisher that would buy your proposal and it's a workbook it's about the size of a post

age stamp and it's got things like right down your five crazed wishes because we can never

nerve hall of fame again when the nerve gets swing in the Smithsonian this will be on a loop Craig Melvin asking jim Curtis exactly how it works for one to look for yellow butterflies in order to self actualize here we go last but not least the yellow flag manifestation the yellow butterfly manifestation I challenge most of the people that work with them my groups this is an easy one to start with the yellow butterfly manifestation challenge or subconscious mind to find a yellow

on your bedside table when you wake up in the morning say I'm so grateful for all the yellow

“butterflies that I'm going to see today and in the middle of the day say I wonder where these yellow”

butterflies are and then let us know let me know when you start to see them everywhere in your life what is that work Craig Melvin Marlena and I are forming a theory of the case that Craig Melvin may be an insurgent he may potentially be a trouble maker and we're working on this for all of you in the meantime I was compelled to dig out my dead it's not a yellow butterfly but it's a psychedelic

butterfly the kind that Marlena likes to secrete into you know she'll she'll sneak them into

one of my hand bags or one of my tote bags so that when I go to open them these things they fly out of you like that and you're like holy shit you know I can tell Jim Curtis right now like it's not a pleasant experience you know it's really shocking yellow butterfly that does it that does it Jennifer Aniston do not marry this man okay if you wind up going through with it just do what you do with Justin throw okay do a commitment ceremony nothing legal about it

nothing on paper and he should be incentivized to keep that apartment in New York City no claim to your fortune what so ever and remember the guy is obsessed with yellow butterflies as the ways and means to self-actualize Jen you are his yellow butterfly and butterflies only live six weeks so I would run the other way don't walk run coming up producer Marlena is going to join us for a discussion about friendship and what to do

when you think you might be losing a close friend a friend of very long standing the sands are shifting it's often very difficult and it's now becoming it's sort of an open

“topic of conversation in the culture which I think is great we will be back in a minute”

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that's code nerve after you sign up they will ask you how you heard about them do me a favor if you would tell them that you are a trouble maker and support the show tell them the nerve sent you so this article found its way into my Instagram feed and it grabbed me immediately because one of my favorite topics is um I don't know if it's topics so much as like it's kind of a mystery to me

“and it's something that I think all women deal with from a very early age when it comes to”

the dynamics of female friendships and this particular piece was published in Vogue Singapore on June

4th 2026 the author is event king the headline we're finally talking about envy in friendships now

I think this headline is a little bit lazy because envy in friendships has been discussed I mean can you enable where brothers one murdered the other out of envy and resentment you know I'm

we had Billy Bush on the show recently and he was talking about back when he was at NBC and he was brought

on by the then head of NBC and was told this in just hang tight we're going to get rid of Al Roker and replace him with you and then other shit happened but you know Billy was like I'm over there reminding my business just trying to get along with everybody Al Roker told a little bit to Billy Bush Matt Lauer told a fucking asshole to Billy Bush these guys were trying to sabotage him Billy says they you know you can tell why and Billy was like you know people liked me he's a

likable guy anyway we'll talk about a little bit of that before we bring in our friend my friend friend of the troublemakers Marlena to discuss this I want to show this clip of I know it's Oprah it's Oprah with me okay now we showed this clip on a very early nerf

“and we showed this clip and I distinctly remember saying I don't know that I agree with her I think”

that she is being a little too her thinking is a little too black and white it's not nuanced and now I actually think she really may be on to something this is Oprah on my god of all people Melinda Gates's podcast her ex-husband's in the hot seat right now anyway Melinda Gates has a podcast Oprah went on it this is from July 24th 2024 and Oprah on weather you can actually maintain friendships with friends who may be jealous of you here we go you can't really be friends with anybody who has

a hint of jealousy about anything that you're doing certainly about your success or your you know being celebrated or you cannot or anything that you have or anything that you have you cannot you cannot be friends if you see that in somebody I say those little whispers or somebody is like hmm well okay well look at you you you cannot and the cut recently did a piece called

why friendship betrayal feels impossible to get over and it was basically about

“and I I believe this I was I was talking to more we'll we'll talk to Marlene about it but”

you know a friendship breakup especially a female friendship breakup can be as bad or feel even worse than like romantic heartbreak um here is I I caught this on the today show on Thursday morning doing my regular patrol my patrols of the of the studio one a but this was a segment I was actually interested in uh Chrissy Everett and uh Martina Novartilova are the the great tennis rivals back in the 70s um and 80s are the subject of a new documentary

which I'm very excited to watch um it's it's it's like it's like a beyond board and John McEnroe who were also the subject of a documentary I believe it was board the McEnroe anyway these storied rivals in a sport that is a one-on-one sport and you know just they were completely you know coming up and they were there were fierce competitors and decades go by and later in life they are true friends true true friends um and they both uh have been in their own battles with cancer

and they were both diagnosed around the same time and they talked very um there were no fake

“tears you know which I really appreciate they just talked very honestly about how each one of them”

has been there for the other um and how each one of them was one of the others first calls upon getting their diagnosis and Chrissy Everett said something that I found very revealing definitely worth talking about she talked about why she found it difficult to make friends with other girls and women uh from a very young age here we go I wasn't encouraged it

in my upbringing to have um female friends for some reason females girls were always competition

so there's a lot to discuss here a lot to get into and of course we thought who better

truly are on the same wavelength we're both in similar polar palates today you know summer blazers feeling professional trying to keep it light and easy um so let's get into this let's get into this because you were saying to me that you you feel that you really haven't had much experience and I'm wondering even even in sort of among like a mom click because I have friends who have definitely felt frozen out amongst mom clicks uh with their children of school age

“well you have to define what friendship is so I have friends life time friends they have stood”

course of time I mean I trust these people with my life to in particular that are my closest

friends they're like siblings to me and they have never betrayed me at all so I know what a real

friendship looks like so anybody can pair to these two individuals you know there's a high bar there right so I think friendships come in waves they're more like acquaintance ships you know and even if you do feel close to people or you feel like you can hang out with people there's always going to be a limitation to what that friendship really how how deep that friendship actually is but when you talk about mom groups it's a totally different realm right like you basically get

push together with a bunch of people who you maybe would never have ever crossed paths with

and even if you did you may never have chosen them to be your friend outside of this sort of like

motherhood clan and um yeah I mean it's it's very gossipy right it's a very gossipy circle of people but you know it also comes down to where they are in their lives and if they're happy or not right so I feel like the happier the person the less gossipy the less worried they are about what other people are thinking about them they're less worried about what other people are doing what other people have they're just kind of living their own lives and they're not really um worried

“about the external um and so and that's what I have with my real friends right so yes um I do know”

what you mean where I don't know so much that I've been pushed out but I definitely have been talked about a lot for different reasons um and I see a lot of um a lot of infighting with a lot of the I have two girls with the boy moms there's a lot of competition when it comes to sports I don't have that let me ask you this because um I you know I think when you're young like elementary school age even high school we all tend to think because girls can really be vicious really ruthless and like I

remember I was saying to you earlier that um I remember my first friendship breakup and I was in

elementary school I think and I had this best friend who I was very close to and I really loved and it was like one day like a switch went off and she was like this is my new best friend and they were all about not just this is my new best friend but I'm excluding you and you and I are no longer friends

“and I really couldn't understand it and it was so painful you know um and I think when you as”

you age you you you you think surely when I get to adulthood women won't behave this way and then you get to adulthood and you see that women will behave this way I mean I can think of you know um someone outside my social circle but with whom we share a friend and common and um I don't know why but this individual made it her mission to try to metal in my pre-existing separate relationship with said friend actually wanted to destroy it you know and so I just sort of sat back

and watched it I couldn't figure out and did your other friend notice this was happening not at the time does that friend now know what was happening yes did does that friend did that friend accept that person into your or her circle ever since or are they or they still that's that's that's a that's a sort of that I can't answer that question okay it's um I think that I think that I think that the way it shook out is is very fair okay you know um and this is a friend who

to me is like a sister I mean she's a sister so it it doesn't matter but um it was it was very very interesting and um I thought you know this person for whatever their mission is in trying to destroy this friendship and really trying to hurt me um it doesn't have anything to do with me

think that at the heart of this this is just my theory of the crime at the heart of it was this individual felt that there was a competition for who mattered more to this friend right yeah

most important and this person felt that like I was I was more important and needed to be dethroned

“to serve their own ego that's just what I think but that to me that's a perfect example of how”

this shit this woman is in hurt mid she's in midlife let me just say that okay well okay so going back to the friend in elementary school I can imagine I mean obviously when you're young and you know people have like deregulated emotions right when you're very very young and so you're gonna feel things a lot harder when you're young but I had a friend who I met in middle school who had a similar experience actually a way worse experience than you you're talking about

where she was completely bullied for her entire I think like fifth and sixth grade and like everybody followed the person that was bullying her right so she had no friends at one point and she was just like alone so this moment in her life defined the rest of her life it really did because I became friends with her and we we had a whole other group of friends that we were all friends

and friends but you she never really had a best friend right like she never had that one person

that she could always rely on she would sort of best friend hop a little bit she would say I'm trying to say best friend and so on so it's like whoever was really paying her the most attention at the time interesting she herself was not a malicious person but she was very

“damaged by what happened to her and I think at that point she never really learned how to”

connect with people probably because there was a trust issue right like if I get closer to personally because the initial bully was her friend oh no like for a very short period of time but then this person decided that she was gonna turn the entire grade against her and this this just became the theme of her entire the rest of her life to this day so I absolutely believe that and I know it goes to the letter that we read on the nerve from the childhood friend of

Michael Hutchins who was like I was bullied I I had no friends I would go home every night and cry myself to sleep I dreaded going to school and then I met Michael you know and I don't understand because this goes on I'm sure you know it firsthand I certainly know it firsthand I don't understand in this day and age how schools allow for bullying I don't understand how in this day and age spent given your the person you know has suffered a lifelong trauma because

nobody intervened I do not understand how it is that schools do not have like a three strikes

in your out policy when it comes to bullies and then the third strike kid you are out of here you

are somebody else's problem but this echo system will not be poisoned by the likes of you because it does carry into adulthood it does and I know they try to put systems in place in schools as I see it and I've seen it in my kid's school where they have like these seminars and the only two days attention in a seminar come on trust me I know but it also comes down to the parents you know there was an incident that didn't happen that happened not too long ago in in the school where my

kids are where these kids like created a file on their Chromebooks which is a school issued computer right and no one caught it right until one teacher just so happened to over look over this kid's shoulder and be like what is this and then it turns out it was like this slideshow of insults per kid you know in that great and of course then they were you know dealt with by the principal

“and but what happened to the child and well they got I think one day in school suspension in”

two days outside of school some version of three days of suspension in or out but you know the rumblings from some parents who were incensed you know by this basically we're saying like the parents of these kids really didn't I mean maybe they just didn't want to fuel the fire and talk about it publicly and maybe they were embarrassed I don't know but it doesn't seem from other people's perspectives that they were really intervening and trying to you know apologize to the

parents or have any kind of like real dialogue about what happened and so you know it's there's so many layers there's just so many layers to it but but yeah in terms of like friends that I have like I can't even imagine any but like I can't imagine the friends that I have betraying me in any real way and I do think that if they did it would definitely be worse than

than any relationships I ever had I always put my friends on a much higher pedestal than anyone I

“was in a relationship with and that's just me and and the thing you talk about about like edging”

people out like I don't even understand what that is because I have my best friend from like fifth grade right and then I met my friend from college when I was 18 who is again in that category these two women right we just so happened to be we went to school in New York we just so happened to be from the same area growing up in New Jersey and so I integrated my friends you know at summer breaks and we would all get together and and then to the point where they had their own independent

really like they didn't need me as the buff interesting as that bother you at all oh my god no I was in heaven because I'm like this person I love these people I love and now they all get together as a matter of fact just this past March because we're all having milestone birthdays

“we were supposed to go on vacation you know four of us and it was my friend from college the”

one who's friends with my friends from home and two of my friends from home and it was at a point where I just I was like guys I really can't go I just can't just I was talking to me about this yeah I was like we'll do it later I'll come later but but don't let me stop you and they went away

for like a four day trip and they had did best time and I was like this is amazing you know because

now they can just they're just all integrated and it's I don't know no it doesn't bother me no I love it that would get that's very interesting I would die actually if they were just like don't let your friends know and so like that that would be that right right yeah right laundry is one of those chores that usually doesn't get much thought until something comes along

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maker and that the nerve sent you it's time to make laundry day the best day of the week so let's pivot to envy and jealousy in female friendships and that clip we played from Oprah in which she said it it it it can't exist in a friendship like if if if and if you have a friend who is jealous you either have to create distance or cut that person out tell me your thoughts on that she is not wrong now I I haven't had this in my personal relationships right so

but I mean in my like close friendships but I know I talked to you a little bit about this like my work friendships right so that's where I saw people being more competitive right so you don't really have a history with these people but you become friends with a lot of the people you work with because you're with them all the time and you're out of stage in your life where everybody's sort of in the same place in their life right so you see them out socially and you become friends outside

of the office and so it's both professional and personal but when it came to certain I guess assignments you know if I've noticed one person in particular who would be in rage like her attitude would completely change if she thought that she should have been assigned something that

you were assigned or someone else was assigned and there was plenty to go around I've always said this

there's room for everybody you know if everybody could just get along you know and and look I'll say this if someone in any capacity is more talented or better at what they do or get along better with somebody who is assigning them I mean that's something that just can't not be helped right and this person needs to just kind of like you know take inventory and figure out you know where

and you might get better recognition somewhere else where you would thrive you know that instead of taking it personally roominating and then acting out you know do something about it and that's actually in that vote or Vogue article there was some there was some she talked about envy being a motivator right like if right someone's getting something that you don't have or that you think you might want don't turn it into anger like turn it into like the thing that will push you toward

what you want and recalibrate how you go about doing it don't take it out I should said Marlene how much of that do you think is nature versus nurture right because I

I've always been sort of wired this way like if I see something that I don't have that somebody else

has now that could be a thing it could be a quality it could whatever it is I've always sort of observed it a bit almost from a distance within myself and it's and I and I'll say to myself oh this is interesting this is like I wasn't maybe dialed in to necessarily wanting that but now I know I I probably do this is great information to have about myself how do I go about trying to get that right I think that's partly the way I'm just wired as a person and I think

part of it's nurture because my parents were always very much like don't worry about anybody else

“with anybody else is doing worry about yourself let's see only person you need to worry about”

and be concerned about is yourself and and there will always be somebody ahead of you in line

somebody better smarter prettier whatever it is more popular that's just life so don't even eyes on your own paper and I've never understood I I kind of just wish there were like classes in in like the American curriculum on like emotional regulation right how to regulate yourself because these people go out into the world and they're like the people you're describing just balls of anger and resentment just spewing it out doing nothing productive but being like

destroyers right they're like they're in their own head and they and it doesn't move their needle right just it moves their mouth but I do think that when people are happy they have the ability to be happy for other people and so therefore even though they might oh my god that's so great you have this thing that you know is bigger and better and better and whatever but if you're happy with

“your own life like it doesn't become a comparison it's like okay well like I remember a time when like”

you know um people were getting engaged like my friends were all getting engaged getting engaged and I remember this one girl who I went to school with who was obsessed obsessed with finding someone like she had to be engaged by a certain age like she had all these like goofy thresholds for herself or like these milestones for herself instead of just living and figuring it out as she went she just it's the typical like oh I she's getting them engaged well what about me you know and like

whatever and um and so she had that like thing right and I remember thinking god why do you care like I couldn't have cared less about who was getting where you know you know I mean who was getting engaged I would get excited about like please tell me they're gonna have a destination wedding because I'm really wanting to go to look for Vivian like you know like that was my take on

people getting married or you know if I was asked to be in the wedding like that was always fun

at that age right I was in a ton of what I was just talking to myself like I was in a ton of weddings okay that's this is a great place to this is a great place to stop for a second because you're what you're describing your wiring is much like my wiring right like happy for you great that's your life your decision whatever maybe not right for me right now you know not right now right why what do you attribute that to Marlena do you think it's nurture do you think it's

nature oh a little bit of both that's a good question um I mean I guess my parents were very similar

“to yours where they said you know don't worry about what other people are doing I mean I think it's”

a typical message from most parents right like just where I don't think so I don't think so I don't think so well it depends I mean I yeah I mean look I did have one friend who um you know uh played a certain sport and her parents were very very pushy about her being the best at the sport and wanting her to you know qualify for all of these different levels you know um and within that sport right and so she definitely felt like a lot of pressure and therefore I think that was

nurture they were nurturing her to be competitive and to be jealous of what other people were doing and what place they were in and and and and constantly like compared to spare right like so yes there

so perhaps it's part in nurture I guess maybe some of its nature I now do think some of these external

“experiences which would be nurture would inform that right so I I didn't have thank god like I didn't”

really have any issues with friends right and anybody that did have an attitude or wasn't

very nice or whatever like never was worth my time like I I'm repelled by that type of negativity

just naturally so like I wouldn't like try to then prove my worth to right one right so right and you know so that you probably generate you probably people read that force field around you that and we're like like a bully it's not gonna be worth it with a person like you if you're not going to care but I really felt for Chris Chris Everett when she said that that she had she had not been encouraged to form female friendships and to to to to to distrust other females and and she she

seemed a little quizzical about that now even today and I would my supposition is that her parents were so hell bent on making her a tennis star that they they bread this in her they planted

those seeds and they watered them and they let it grow into a poisonous root that said to Chris Everett

if you make friends on your tour among your cohort you will go soft you won't want to beat one of your best right now you got to win it all costs and friendship isn't worth it and you know it's like what's that saying like you know a good friend is worth like you know they're waiting you know it's I don't know what they're saying is but it's sort of like the friends you're describing like some of my friends it's like they're worth their weight and gold like they're very rare

they're very rare it's very rare to have a friend who's like cheering you on when things are going good you know it's it's it's and and and and you really do learn who your friends are when things are going bad when you're really up against it you really learn who your friends are um yeah I had one experience of a friend that surprised me a friend from college who I stayed friends with after college I thought this was one of the friendships that you know we were very different in a lot of ways

but I just thought it's so the test of distance and time so right we go on forever but then 2020 hit and we had and this is not a new story right we've heard all the stories about friends that friendships that got strained or right ended all together because of like different views about the pandemic or whatever or politics right the politics is connected to it or just the habits of people

“during that time right and that's what broke her on me I was the line cited I did not see this”

coming because to be honest she and I have always been different in a lot of ways in terms of

opinions and there's never been a problem it should never be a problem if your friends you shouldn't be identical you know it's not semi twins right so it it was never an issue and then this became an issue and um I mean it was very um abrupt where she just and she did a very publicly like on social media like in comments just absolute venom what did she say about you oh man she she called me up like a puppet um she it was a lot of political stuff it was a lot of like okay basically

saying that um I was part of the problem and that I was um I was disgusting she called me disgusting on social media yes because of like an opinion I had on a ruling that's a matter it's it's that

“she called you disgusting is what matters she called you disgusting and now that is adult bullying”

that is bullying you on social media and that is trying to make you a pariah and it's trying to make her a hero a hero and a martyr of a morally perfect there no none of us are perfect none of us are perfect but like so what did you do when you saw that did you call her did you text her or did you just Irish goodbye now now I I responded to the but calmly not with the venom that she had I mean I wasn't name calling I find that so juvenile and I was like you did you really read

did you understand the comparison I was even making and whatever and then she just kind of went silent and so I was like okay but it signal to me like okay well this this friendship clearly had a shelf life that I was not aware of it is not unconditional um and but it also made me think wow like this person is like pretty pretty liberal right but um was such a hypocrite because like liberals are like living let live right but no but not a few disagree then it's you live my way or um you are

quote unquote disgusting so um that was one that did blind side me so when something like this happens

recent experience with something like this where I was describing it to someone as it's not like

the loss of this friend and I would put friending quotes now that I know better really wounds me this friend this this this wasn't an incredibly deep friendship but what is upsetting to me is I'm angry at myself because I misjudged this person right like I'm like wait you got fooled you your radar is usually pretty good for this stuff in fact there are people who all say to you like oh I really I like that person you'll be like no no no no right you'll see you'll see through

them in in some kind of ways where I kind of want to I I feel like I have a pretty good bullshit detector but I also kind of really want to believe that when people are coming at you with good

“intentions or they seem that that they're genuine you know and um yeah so that's how I would”

describe it just sort of like just frustration with myself like shit like you really should have seen that one for what it was I can see that I can see that and as you get older and I feel like the more people you meet and the more people you interact with you really can start to kind of like see the science you know there's only so many different personality types right and so you can sort of say although I've grown in the opposite direction with people too where like I um I made assumptions

you know just based on very very little information and then realized um that I was wrong you know that not that I was um but these are people that I like I was meeting for the first time and like getting right know and some questions yeah and just kind of thinking like you know you know

“whatever you know they they weren't blowing my mind but then as time went on I was like you know what”

I would have never seen this friendship coming you know and so you know you can go in either direction

so there are always pleasant surprises you know in in prepping for this segment I um I was reading obviously that Vogue piece and she talked about two very interesting phenomena that have have sort of now they have like they're not diagnostic labels but they're colloquial labels she quotes a psychologist called Dr. Christy Ferrari who has coined something called status borrowing and this is a friend who's coming at you you you may not realize it but they are looking at you

and they want to use you to sort of get to where they want to go like you're just a stepping stone for them then she also talks about the identity thief and I feel like this person is you're more likely to meet probably in your 20s I certainly met one or two um who you who you realize very slow it's like it's like a horror movie you realize slowly and like you're then and then you're in it and you got to get out of this friendship that they want they they want to have your life

they want to the guy you're dating they they're going to go after him the look that you've got they're going to start copying your look the life that you've got going on they're actively trying to get that and I was thinking about like the best films that have been made about this

stuff because they're always horror films now single white female obviously single white female

which had a psychosexual element to it so I don't fully count that I'm just talking like pure platonic friendships um okay okay all about Eve okay number one um of of of the recent era of the social media era era excuse me I sound like Ted Kennedy era and have you seen Ingrid goes west with Aubrey Plaza now and Elizabeth Olson great film it falls apart in like the last third but Aubrey Plaza plays this young woman who is completely adrift whose mother

has just died and she she begins obsessively following this influencer who lives in Los Angeles late by Elizabeth Olson and she decides the answer to her problems is to go to Los Angeles running to this girl figure out a way to befriended her and warm her way into her life and it it on it goes from there and it's it's again it falls apart towards the end but it's a great examination of it and then somebody else mentioned um and I wouldn't have

necessarily thought of this but um the talented mr Ripley in terms of the buffalo bill

“skinning remember there's there's an original french version with Elaine Delon which I love it's”

called purple noon and then the Matt Damon version made by Anthony Manguella in the 90s and um I that also made me think of the conversation that we were having with Billy Bush

Lauer and Al Roker are these little bitch like no Matt Lauer was a dangerous dangerous guy my opinion but Al Roker is such a fucking asshole you know America's favorite weatherman is he's like Billy's like he was so mean to me and trying to sabotage me all the time and he's also completely unprepared all the time I know I like although it doesn't now now that we did the commencement mini where yeah Matt Lauer is just like you know I will be your worst nightmare

telling us exactly who he is going I mean I'm petty I'm arrogant if you're in my way get the fuck out of my way I'm gonna make you hurt right like it's like like the crowd wants to believe

this is played for laughs no no no no no like we always say at the nerve these people tell us

who they are do not be full fold but I was like wow like Billy Bush as a mill aged man working with other middle aged men was subject to the kind of bullying that we typically think of is the province of mean girls mean girls another movie about jealousy and female bullying you know it's it's true and when he was talking about it I was like oh my god Al Roker is hitting all of the bullet points that are in that probe article about envy Al Roker is a mean frustrated

“15-year-old girl at heart right that's what it sounds like you would never guess it I mean”

Billy Bush didn't come out with that story I don't know I would I would never have been

where is a decent mask Al Roker I mean as I said to Billy I kind of have always detected

rage like just underneath that surface my surface my theory is that any public figure and they're often men not always but like is my theory about Tom Hanks anybody who needs to be known as the best nicest guy in all the land they're probably a nightmare in real life just be nice it shouldn't be your central preoccupation treat people with decency it should be the matter of doing business throughout your days it shouldn't be like your central defining I'm I'm a really virtuous person

it's always it's always the Bible thumbers it's always the openly virtuous people who get caught with their pants down in bathroom stalls getting blown by sex work I don't say you know what you're

“saying and honestly I knew a girl who was like that in a lot of ways like where she would just”

she needed I hate people like this we're going to talk to Sam Vaughn about it it's the whole other conversation go on but I don't okay but it's like she needed people to like her it was at her central like goal in life and it drove me up a wall it's actually the same person I mentioned the last time we were talking um the one that was like I really would like you know to me to guy that has your personality but in a guy oh that one but she needed I mean she would talk so much

shit about people and she was I mean she was venomous you know like I don't think she had one core friend in her life from her former life where she came from before New York major red flag

yeah like I don't think like I never heard of anybody I don't remember anybody like that but

but she would have um she would basically perform in a way with all different people so that everybody would think that she was like the nicest and friendly as and it worked and she would you know she would send gift baskets to people like just random contacts like so how did she get outed I don't think she ever got outed I just knew who she was and I was very um undone by it like I remember just being very turned off by it and I mean I knew what level of friendship we had

and it was fine I didn't take it personally but I just I remember I remember thinking this is such a terrible quality like you it's bad it's it's it's it's a warning sign for sure because you're if you need everybody to like you you've got big problems right you need so much validation but it's all fake well and you and your shapeshifting she's an emotional psychological shapeshifter right to fit like whatever person she's in front of who you know I don't want you're not going to

like everybody it's kind of a healthy reaction you know right you're not going to like everybody I mean it's just it's just not the way you know I'll say this my five well when my oldest daughter was five

“she said it perfectly I'll never forget this because it blew my mind and I was like I'm not”

responsible for what she just said she did this on her own she I asked her about this one kid because I just kind of noticed like yeah this one doesn't really pay her much attention anyway okay she said I said to someone so you know talk to you um do you guys like hang out at school do you see each other on the playground what do you what goes on and she said not really she doesn't really say much to me um but you know not everybody can be friends

with everybody it's not the way the world works you know what I love this and I wanted to end

to me about going to an event a thing like like like like a one-on-one thing with another friend

“of hers and her mom overheard the conversation and said wait I didn't I didn't think you guys”

were friends anymore that you really don't get along anymore and my god daughter said no we're still friends we're just not like deep friends anymore and I was like this is amazing like she at a very young age recognizes that you can have friends at all different levels of depth of importance that other that friendships often serve different friendships serve you in different ways some are going to be inherently limited and that is okay and that things and people shift and

I just I thought it was such a mature response yeah so Marlene in your in your estimation I know you say you don't really you've been lucky enough to not experience this but if if let's say one of

“your ride or die friends at some point expressed some kind of resentment towards you for say”

anything that's just like a part of you that's beyond your control you know maybe maybe you land billmark okay and off you go to Hollywood and you leave me and that's it but let's say and then you and I have to go to life what is it a plenty of counseling or whatever life like it's not a life partner counseling but what what what what would you what would you your response be do you believe in Oprah's dictum that like you cannot have a friend in your life

if they are jealous of you yeah oh god I mean there's two different levels here right so it's one thing you're saying jealousy if you're not saying betrayal because betrayal that is a betrayal

“I think it's a betrayal I would be I would lose my I think I would lose my faith in all”

humanity because to me like these individuals are I mean I don't even know what I would do it to be honest with you I I think it would just like completely like the earth would shift from underneath me yes I don't know it would be I would be in mourning you know it would really it would bring me grief because it's that deep yeah yeah yeah yeah I agree but this is a I you know

people you know like knock on wood you know hopefully it never does happen to you but I think

I think that part of the reason it cuts is that female friendships go very very very deep you know I was talking to you about my favorite example of this there was a sign-felt episode in which there was a there was one scene it was in it was in the diner where they were talking about how men and women resolve difficulties differently in friendship and a lane was kind of you know they were talking about the way in which men will really get into it and have it out and it can

even come to physical blows but when it's over it's over and they make up and they go back to being

friends and whatever that event was is in the past never to be exhumed and she was exce was marveling

at this and one of them says to her why like what do women do and Elaine says we just bully each other until someone develops an eating disorder I mean it's it's so funny it's hard for me to wrap my head around because I just I don't have that kind of experience and I hope my kids don't to be honest with you but I just feel like I know you don't believe in like girls girls because when people say it they don't really mean it but if you say you are you're not you're you're either

are you aren't you know Taylor Swift example number one yeah but she's that's she's an alley and I just

mean like I actually I don't know another term for it but I've always been team girl I don't really

understand the idea of cutting other women down I don't understand the idea of cutting people down right I agree with you but hey I don't know well you know it's what makes you a trouble maker you know we cause trouble for the right people but we're really deep inside we mean we mean only good things thanks Marlene for coming on the nerve and he talked about complicated female friendships. Anytime Marlene talk to you later okay like in the second bye that's it that's it

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