Set Money Goals Your Future Will Thank You For

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From the Ramsey Network and the Fair Wins Credit Union Studio, this is the Ramsey Show. Rachel Cruz, number one bestselling author co-host of the smart money happy hour and Ramsey personality and my daughter is our co-host today.

Open phones, a triple eight, eight, two, five, two, five, Jennifer is at New York City. Hi, Jennifer, how are you? >> Hi, how are you? >> Great, how can we help?

>> I am feeling very overwhelmed right now. I have a daughter going into her senior year of high school. Another one going into her tenth grade of high school. And I, over the last year or two, have been trying to tackle our bills while also saving for college.

So right now, I don't know what I should be tackling first.

I have $8,000 that I owe to the IRS. $25,000 in credit card debt. And I am putting away about $200 a month for their college.

“>> And how much do you have safe for their college?”

>> Almost nothing because I just started. So I opened up $5,29 a year ago. >> Okay, so $200 a month for one year is $2,400. >> Yes, but. >> And where is your senior in high school planning to go to college?

>> We're looking at SUNY schools because we're trying to stick to $20,000 a year. >> You're looking at what schools? >> City. >> That's SUNY State of New York school. >> Oh, okay.

>> Yeah, yeah, they're affordable, so. >> Yeah, in-state tuition, yeah, for sure. >> How much do you guys make a year, Jennifer, or you make? >> Sure, we, my husband and I both work full time, and we both also have second jobs.

And our combined income is about $267,000 a year. >> Okay.

“So you're just kind of getting started on this paying attention to money thing?”

>> Well, we've been, yeah, well, not, yes.

>> When you make a quarter of a million dollars a year in your broke,

so explain that, why? >> We have a lot of expenses within sending our kids to private school and- >> Instead of college. >> Yeah, well, the idea was that they were going to get college scholarships from the school that they're attending.

>> Well, that happens at any level. >> I mean, I think so, yeah, but in case it doesn't right now we're still focusing on SUNY schools, but even still, we'd like to use the scholarship towards that. Also, we do live in New York.

So, I know $267,000 sounds like it's a shame amount of money, but New York is probably one of the most expensive places to live, so everything is just a lot more elevated in class. Yes, we do live a very comfortable life. We are not holding back.

We outfrequently, I have started changing those habits recently, but I fear it's too late, and I just don't know- >> It is too late for a senior in college. >> Okay. >> Because you're current pattern,

you're not going to have money for the first year's tuition.

>> Okay, what do I do? >> Well, I mean, you don't. I mean, you tell me, you're going to save $2,000, and it's $20,000. That you need, right? >> We're all going to try to cash flow any level of it, Jennifer.

If it's 10 per semester with what you, is that part of the plan, thinking through that, or- >> I mean, in a perfect world, I'd find a way to pay off the bills, right, the credit cards and the IRS within the next 12 months. >> Okay, so what you're going to have to do is you're all going to have to decide

what's important.

“Is it important for your daughter to go to college?”

And if it is, then you're going to have to stop doing a whole other stupid butt stuff you've been doing today. >> Yes, for sure. >> You don't have a choice. The arithmetic tells you that.

Okay, and so you're not eating it. You're not going out to eat, you're going to be on beans and rice. You're going to be living like you make $50,000 a year, so you can put your kid into school. Or she's not going.

>> For a community college for the first year.

>> For a community college. >> Yeah, or the scholarship. >> Something that you're not going to have the money otherwise. >> I'm going to, I'm calling because I want to try and have the money. >> Yeah, well, what I'm saying is is that all the stuff you're telling me that, you know,

the excuses you made about where to earn $60,000 a month. >> So Jennifer, but I would say the baby steps, you're new to this. So the order of importance for anyone starting this, really regardless of kids and circumstances, it really is getting yourself in a place where you're debt free. You and your husband have a fully funded emergency fund of 36 months of expenses.

And then you guys start at that point then investing in retirement and kids college.

“So that is the baby steps if you want to look at the plan.”

So that would mean that if you follow that plan, there's probably going to be some different courses of action in the next two years with not only your expenses, but maybe her school

choice for the first two years, you know, if that's what you guys stick to.

And if you and your husband sit down and decide no college is more important and we want to cash flow of that first before we put, if you want to do the baby steps out of order, you won't be doing the baby steps, sorry, I'll be doing your own plan, but the fastest way that we have seen for people to get control of their money is for you guys as a household to be stable and to get the spending under control, to get the debt paid off because you're

feeling like you're trying to do 18 things at once and you just don't get a lot of traction when you do that. But when you focus in on one thing at a time, again, it's not ideal timeline wise with your stage of life with kids. I totally hear that, but it is the fastest way from point A to point B to actually have some control over your money, long term and building those habits. But that that would mean college may look a little different

for your daughter, the senior, for the maybe the first year or two of her college. Thank you and your husband need to sit down and say we're going to clear the IRS, we're going to clear the credit cards now, and post college and post college. And she goes and don't put anything in college. And then she's not, you're not going to have the private school tuition when she leaves that. So you've got that freed up in your budget to put

towards college once she goes and you put her in a community college and she applies for 73,000 scholarships. Okay, we had a lady that was a personality for a while and Christina Ellis. And she had a number one best selling book called How I Got A Half a Million Dollars and Free Money for College. And she went on and got her master's degree in business from Vanderbilt all paid for. Single mom's daughter, single mom came and said,

“"I don't have the money. The only way you're going is if you go get scholarships." And”

she sat, she had to sit and apply for scholarships like two hours a day. Like it was her part-time job, but it worked. She got hundreds of thousands of dollars and you can look to book up on Amazon. How I got a half million dollars in scholarships and Christina still

out there teaching people this stuff. She's incredible. And so that's one thing. The second thing

is choose a college and sit down the three of you right now. You're senior, your husband and you and say that we cannot afford for you to go anywhere except here first year. And a community college for free or almost free is not a bad thing. All those credits will transfer. You get a lot of your basics out of the way if you're going for a four year degree. And the kid is not, you know, no one knows where you went to school. All they

know is where you graduated from. And even then they don't really know that they don't care. And that's going to be a hit to the ego in a sense of going from private school and Manhattan to a community college. But it's long term. It's the smart decision for for her long term as well. So you don't rack up student loans. Yeah, but your family's going to have to change your priorities. Is y'all are way out of whack.

As a dad of young kids, I'm starting to think a lot more about the world of growing

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Well, surprise, here you are. You'll be okay. We've never lost a patient. What's up?

I want what day being to you, Jamie?

“Well, I just recently finished listening to the total money makeover and then listening”

to Georgia's books. And it's really got me motivated to make changes. Good. And I just kind of want to keep that motivation going. We've already like eliminated $200 worth of subscriptions we've had. Good.

We do live on one income. And I'm just, you know, it's giving us higher aspirations for

the future. But I'm just wondering how we keep those motivations going and keeping that larger goal from kind of demotivating us in our current situation. Feedback loop. The psychologists tell us that if we can see and feel traction towards our goals, we can keep going. When you don't feel like you're getting anywhere, when you feel like they only light at the end of the tunnel as an oncoming train, everyone quits.

So you can go through a long journey as long as you can measure your progress. And sense it with a feedback loop. And so that's one of the reasons we want to do something like a debt snowball, where we list our debts smallest to largest. And we attack the smallest one with the vengeance. Because when we knock that one out, it gives us positive feedback. Oh, this might work. And then you knock another one out. You're like your hope level continues

to increase. And as your hope level increases, your sacrifice is you're willing to sacrifice deeper because it's starting to work. And things are starting to move in the right direction.

“Yep. Absolutely. What is your situation? You keep saying that. How much debt do you guys have?”

So we're married and we have four kids. And we live on about $55,000 a year. And we're currently about $23,000 a day. Okay. Well, that's tough but doable. But two things tell me immediately when I hear those situation. One is a detailed budget in every dollar. You're going to feel like you've got a raise. Because you've got a large enough family that there's a level of chaos. Yes. Yeah. That's just normal. I mean, you would be weird

if you didn't. If they're all regimented little stepford children or something, you'd have a weird bunch of kids. Right? No, there's a chaos level when you got four kids. And so you go through the territory. And so you guys have to force some order and some organization to the money side of the equation. And that's also going to add some order to the rest

of the thing. Well, you're doing it. You can't keep from doing that. And then the second

thing that comes to mind is 55,000 is low. What's your career and what's your aspirations there? We need to get your income up, man. I am a exploring scholar. Mm-hmm. How old are you? Apparently works for I'm 34. Okay, when you're 44, what are you going to be? Probably the same thing. Probably not a good plan. Yeah. Nothing wrong with being a floor installer. But

“maybe you need to own a floor installing contracting company. And they work for you. Or”

you're the leader of the division of the company who is doing it. You know what I mean? Like, yeah, what are the climbing the ladder? So to speak of how do you want to keep advancing? It's going to be big, Jamie. And I'm 65. Your knees are going to be hurting when you get there. Yeah. Nope. I totally agree. Yeah. Well, Jamie, for you guys, I'm just curious the the debt that you have. What it was a 25,000, 22,000. What is the smallest debt there?

Uh, it's primarily just one. It's, it's, it's, it's the work saying that I have the, the what? The work saying that I have a work van. I'm gonna search for you. Okay. So you, um, so you do, do you run your own company? No, it's just a private company. It's just me and another guy. So, so I mean, there is growth. Okay. I mean, you and the other guy do installing together

Why do you have, why do you have a van? Why do you have the van? Why do you have the van?

“Uh, because, um, so. I'm sorry. I, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just have bad decision.”

I'm kind of okay. I just did it so that I could try to make more money. Okay. Okay. Uh, because I would have my own vehicle. Uh, and I would also help with making more progress for the company. There's two of you. Yeah. Yeah. So, um, okay. So, rule number one is we don't buy vehicles on debt. Rule number two is we don't buy vehicle's period for someone else's company. We buy them for our own company. So, I want you to take this van and start doing some

side hustle work that doesn't compete with your current boss, but that allows you to make some extra money here and there. You're utilizing the skills that you have and let's take this van and

start talking about how someday you're going to be self-employed and make a whole lot more than you

make now. Um, but let's start moving that direction because this van is a big, big debt with your income and with four kids. If you know that van payment, you probably wouldn't even been calling. But the good news is you're learning. You're growing. You've already gone through a couple of audio books. You're calling us on the air asking you're open. You're not being belligerent and prideful about this. You're saying I want to learn. I want to learn and you're the kind of

guy we help all the time and we love helping you. We're glad you're here. Proud of you for taking those steps. Those are big steps. 34 years old for kids, van payment and you go, I got to learn something new. This isn't working. Good for you. Good for you. Because you do it. If you keep doing the same thing over and over, you keep getting the same result. And, you know, it's pretty predictable. So, you know, so what we got to do is we got to think about how your career unfolds over the next

10 years and how this van fits into that and how we get the van paid off. And I do think a budget honestly, Jamie and your situation. And for you and your wife to be on the same page and you guys have a plan going forward of where the income is going. Because that will be tight with four kids

“to be on that. And so I think it's even more important for you guys to be looking at every single”

dollar and you've already cut $200 of subscriptions, which is amazing. And so, you know, just continuing to look at that lifestyle and just say, okay, where can we pull back to throw extra money at this van? Because if you, if you didn't have the van payment to your point, I'm like that margin. Yeah, the margin helps so much when you look at the monthly numbers. But well, done, Jamie and you and your wife get on the same page. You guys do this together. Jamie, if you've

made mistakes with money, that makes you over 12 years old. Every walking person has made mistakes with money. I have a PhD into UMB. I've done things that make what dumb things you've ever done look horrendously smart. I mean, I have done some stupid stuff in my life. The trick

we all have to learn is to not do the same dumb thing. You know, figure out what's dumb, never do

that one again. Figure out what's dumb, never do that one again. Figure out what's dumb, never do that one again. And if you keep doing that when you get to be my age, they call you wise. Because you've quit doing so many dumb things. So there's not much left to do. But some smart things. And you really do get a whole pile of that behind you. And so if you've made a mistake, there's no reason to shame yourself about it. You know, just go, hey, I made a mistake. I didn't know. I was a dumb thing.

Doing a dumb thing doesn't make you dumb. Doing a dumb thing three times in a row makes you dumb. And you know what I think, Jamie? Because you, you started the call, which is like, gosh, it could feel discouraging as we start climbing this mountain. How do you not be discouraged? Just knowing the season of life you guys are. And I'm just assuming because of your age and the four kids, you guys got little kids at home. And it's just, there's a lot happening. And you're in the

“day today so much that grind. Well, that's how I feel. Sometimes I'm like, it's just one day at a time,”

one day at a time. And for you and your wife to go out once and I do this once a year, we call it our dream date. It sounds kind of cheesy. But we just say, we put money off to say, we've done this for years. And we just look ahead. We usually do like a 10 year look ahead. And we say out loud that how old our kids are going to be in 10 years. How old we're going to be. And what do we want to do within those 10 years when we get to that age? What kind of house do we want to live in? Where do we

want to live? Where are kids going to be in school? What kind of bucket list trips? Maybe we've checked off big financial goals like just dream. Like get out of the day today, get out of the overwhelming numbers. And you guys together just start this like refreshed looking at the future together and just dream and have fun. Okay guys, let me ask you something. What would it take for you to switch your bank? Because if you're

And I know what you're thinking it might sound like a hassle moving your direct deposit updating

“bills getting a new debit card feels like a lot. But here's what most people don't realize.”

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David is in Phoenix. I David, how are you? I'm doing well. I love you guys. Thank you. You too. How can we help? I spent the first two decades of my adult life. I'm pretty

income driven in terms of my lifestyle. I'm married. I've got four kids, but we never really

saved or invested too much. And I was also kind of in living for me mode and some knuckle hetery and personal sin led to us needing to sell our house and use the equity that we have built to pay off some of the consequences of my actions. And here in the last two years or so, the Lord has given me a second chance in a lot of ways. It really is. And so now for the last, I don't know, 18 months or so, we've been renting, so we're not home owners anymore.

But I've got a small business that is doing increasingly well. My income is doing well. And we're, you know, our mindset is now very much shifted and we're trying to very much aggressively save and invest and stop away for retirement. But you know, certainly with an eye towards some of what we're talking away right now, being a nest egg to help us enter the home ownership market again. However, I guess my question is, you know, we've talked about kind of a plan here

of in the next 18 to 24 months, maybe maybe purchasing a home again. But we would be using most of the investment in savings that we have set aside as the down payment probably for something like that. We're fairly comfortable in our renting situation. And so, I guess my question is with as aggressively as I'm able to sock money away right now, does it maybe make sense for us to post home that decision for a few years and not purchase a home in the next, you know, one and a half

to two years, but maybe six or seven years down the road? I'd love your thoughts. Congratulations on the turn you've made. Thank you. Obviously, a complete 180 in your whole life. And I can just tell from a quick version of your story and very, very cool. Rent is patience and then the question is, what are we being

“patient for and your question, the way you posed it is the right way of looking at it, I think.”

And that is, you know, is it worth it to delay until we can do this with even more down stroke?

And at some point, that becomes a personal choice. Okay. A first-time home buyer,

we tell folks, you know, when you're out of debt, are you guys David out of debt? We're getting close. I owe my parents 10,000, which we should be knocked out here in the next couple months. Okay. And what are you making in the small business? Well, it's hard to put my finger on it because it's only been around for 18 months and it continues to grow. In 2025, the growth revenue was about 320 and my overhead was about 8%.

What is it for the day? Year-to-day, it's about 200. It's about 300, and over it's month of the year.

Yeah. Okay. And so you're, yeah, good for you. Congratulations.

“Obviously, the Lord is blessing the new direction of your life. That's cool.”

Well, with again, but with a new home buyer, you know, we just say, put 5% down whatever or more. As much as you can put down as a better, anything that's not in retirement savings is your down payment, though it added, and 15 year fixed were the payments no more than a fourth of your take on pay. You've got a couple of moving targets here. One is you've got the moving target of Phoenix Real Estate, which has a tendency to shoot up. We've had a couple times in my memory of Phoenix having a bit of

a bubble. It got really, really hot there, no pun intended. And it may again, and you know,

I wouldn't want to be on the other side of that. I'd want to be riding that up if that were happening.

So that's variable number one. Variable number two is you've got this hockey stick business. It's going up into the right, in the right direction, and you're going to be able to do a completely different house two years from now what you could do today. If that thing continues to grow that at that rate, and and do so reasonably. So you might choose a completely different house. So I'm going to try to balance those two things against each other. How fast is the market increasing? How fast is my

business growing, and then and and so how long am I going to have patience with this good situation with rent and a stack cash? I'll give you a guess. I would not be outside a three-year window to buy if I were in your shoes. Now I pay cash or I can't buy. So I couldn't do any of this, but I'm talking about the things that we recommend here on the air 15-year fixes. The only death that we don't yell at people for is a house. It's the only one. And a 15-year fix for the payments no more than

fourth-year take-home pay and you put as much as you can put down. So just past the entry level,

first-time home buyer is someone probably in your situation where I'd love to see you have at least 20

percent down because you could avoid private mortgage insurance, which is about 75 dollars per month, per hundred thousand borrowed. It's a lot. It's a lot. It's a lot. And so avoiding that and then beyond that, everything we're doing is okay, we're either increasing the price of the house because we've got more and more and more money or we're decreasing the debt on the house that we buy because we've got more and more and more money or some of each. How old are you guys David? I'm 41. Okay, so yeah, you guys,

I didn't know, yeah, I was going to say if you're getting close to that point of retirement,

“then investing was going to be important, but you guys have plenty of time. So that's great.”

I would say come on. Do you sound more mature than a 41 year old? I don't know why, David. It's the mileage in the story. Yeah. I've been through refining fire. Yeah, there you go. There you go. But yeah, I was I had two to three years in my head to rent and then to buy. So yeah, I would not recommend a five-year play in your situation with the variables you gave me. And it feels like one year feels a little desperate. Okay. Does that make any sense? Yeah, I mean, we've we've got we've probably

got about 200 set aside right now in investments and in a set. We're not using a set. We're not using a set. No, no, I would be not touching that. So primarily the brokerage accounts. How much is in the brokerage account? Between the I probably got about 130 in there right now. Okay. So if you took 24 months and added

“to that, that's not a bad plan. Yeah. That's what it feels like to me. But long, you know,”

but renting in the interim is just patience. You know, it's just we've got to get a couple of these changes have to have time to cook up in your life. Your life is completely changed. And in every segment of your life is changed, every compartment, department of your life is changed. So holistically, your life, your life, that is changed. Yeah. And so awesome. That's power. And I want some time for those seeds to germinate and sprout and take advantage of them. If I'm in your shoes. So

yeah, I have some settling. Yeah. What I don't want people to do is wait too long because you're lacking in hope or go too fast because you're somehow desperate and you're like freaked out about real estate. And so those aren't, neither one of those are good motivators. So instead just a wise, you know, I'm the tortoise. I'm plotting and I'm plotting while I'm plotting on how I'm going to pull this off. And I think you're going to be just fine David. I think the house is going

I think you've got to, you know, you're like me. You've got a lot of your bad decisions in your

“rearview mirror. And that's a good thing. I put you in a good place. Well done, David.”

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Thinking about our last call or getting back into the real estate market after a life change situation, you for sure in any situation. If you're in the real estate market, want to have a pro in your corner. Someone that's high octane high protein and knows what the flip they're doing. Didn't just get their license three weeks ago and they're at your church or wherever you met. I'm no, no, no, no, no, no. We, nothing are all in being in church, but they

need to actually be selling a lot of houses or they don't need to be listing yours. Okay? We do not endorse real estate agents unless they're high octane high protein high volume

“producers. And they get it done and they do it the Ramsey way. That's why we call them Ramsey”

trusted because we vet them and we obviously don't let everyone into that recommendation program. If you want to find a Ramsey trusted real estate agent that has your best interest at heart and you can find them for free. Go to RamseySolutions.com/agent or click the link in the description. Rose is in Austin. Hi. Rose. How are you? I'm doing good. Thank you for taking my call. Sure. What's up? So I'm almost done with baby stepsory and I'm looking for any tips on how

to move from gazelle intensity that taking my foot off the break. You mean, do you just move to intentionality from intensity? Yeah. I'm just, I'm just a little concerned on going back backwards if I, you know, take my foot off the break. So fear is the number one thing you would use. You may put off the accelerator. Yes. Okay. We're going to try to break a little bit. Now we need to break. What was your situation Rose before you started doing all of this? The

gazelle intensity is being off debt and everything. Yeah. So I actually have been able to move out on my own. Get my own place before I was living with roommates. So I'm in so forth. I paid off about $23,000 with a consumer debt. And now I'm finishing up that emergency fund. I do currently work seven days a week between my primary job and my side hustle. So I'm concerned on it. If I take away that side hustle, if I don't have any margin in my budget, you know, what does the math?

What does the math tell you? If you take away the side hustle, what does your budget look like?

“I can do it, but it's going to be a little tight. Okay. Do you have to take away”

all of the side hustle, can you take away half of it? I could. My side hustle is waitressing. So

And then give yourself a comfortable margin until your budget gets to where you're really comfortable

with it. So you don't have to go from zero to hero. You can just go from or hero to zero. You can just go from, you know, gazelle and dial it back and go. Okay. Instead of full on sprint, we're going to go to a jog. Okay. And then if that works, you could slow down drop the side hustle all together if you want. I mean, but if you want some, if you want some emotional proof that this is okay, they just back off your number shifts. Yeah. And do you see your

primary job rows going up at all that income over time? Like I just wonder in two years, if that margin is filled with just your career versus the side hustle. Yeah, definitely. I'm currently the company I'm with. I do see a career with them. So since I've been with them, I've seen growth in my income. So I don't see that being an issue. Okay. Yeah, because that would be ideal, right? That you work in your 40 hour week job and that's the standard lifestyle. You don't have to

have that second job. But maybe for a season still, why you're transitioning baby steps and just

“for your comfort level? Yeah. I mean, I think that's what Dave said earlier was great. Just”

if you're going super, super fast down the interstate, like, you know, 130 miles an hour or something, those white lines are coming at you really, really fast. And then if you slow down to the speed limit, it feels like you're crawling. And so that's kind of what that's kind of the emotion that you're feeling when you do this because you've been busted in it. I mean, you've been going 80 hours a week and just just to go down to 60 is going to feel like you like you quit emotionally. And that's

so, you know, that's different than the math. So Dr. Deloni always talks about John always talks about

when we're dealing with something like this where there's a fear facts are your friends. And so let the math calm your soul. Yeah, and Rose, your money habits are different today than they were when you started this. You're not the same person. And so I would start leaning in and trusting the Rose that has created great habits that has found herself on her own. She's budgeting. She's paid off debt. Like, she knows what to do. She knows how to live unless then she makes. I mean, all of

“that that's who you've become and being confidence in that part of you. I think it's important to”

and you have to have the numbers work, right? So yes, I would say for a season, if you still need some margin, keep part of that side hustle going just to give you some comfort there. But ideally, you can face that out as your main career goes up. David's an Indianapolis. I'd David, how are you? I'm doing well. Thanks for taking my call, Dave. Sure. What's up? So my question, my wife and I have been together for six years and we've over those six

years. I've always been comfortably financially, but we've talked a lot about budgeting pretty much

once every six months or so. We have a discussion on, we should sit down and really budget. But we never get to the actual budget part that allows us to track moving forward. We kind of look in the rear view and say, okay, we're doing all right. And then, you know, talk about, we should try to cut back here, try to cut back there. But it never actually revered never meet the road, so to speak, where we have a budget that we execute against moving forward. So I wanted to get

your thoughts on any practical tips to kind of implement that and move forward in a way that makes it effective for us. You know, you're battling one of the hardest things that I think Americans battle. And that is doing nothing or handling money poorly, you could still have a pretty

“dead gum good life. And you know, it's it's almost like you need to have a crisis to wake your”

butt up, you know, because everything's just kind of going okay. There's nothing, nothing to kick you off the road. Yeah. And so when I'm facing something like that, I just try to look at in the mirror and sit down and share and I sit down and go, okay, there's not a crisis here, but we're going to create one. We're going to emotionally decide that we're pissed about this. We're not living like this anymore. You know, you don't have to have a heart attack to decide it's good I did to get in shape.

You could just look in the mirror and go, hey, no more donuts, Baba. You know, that might be me talking to me, by the way. But you know, you know, I mean that, right? Yeah, that, okay. So I, yes, yes, the name and Dave gets pissed. I was thinking on the other end. Instead of, because for a lot of people, yes, they have this like crisis moment and their past catches up with them and they have to change immediately or it's going to continue what it's been doing, right? Your past isn't necessarily

caught up with you, right? You know, have great money habits, but it is what it is. So I would say let the motivator be your future and you and your wife sit down and be like, the money we are letting out of

the six-year-old version of us is going to be so pissed at the third version of us. Shoot.

Dang it. I'm more like you than I want to admit. No, okay. So yeah, the future, we want to be able to do X, Y and C in the future. Like, this is where we want to be and let the future be the motivator of your goals, right? So you guys have to look ahead and say, what do we want our life to look like in five years and three years and ten years regret is not nasty to you. And all of that. Yes. And David, seriously, the every dollar budget is going to be everything for you guys. I literally just

tracked my transactions this morning and when it's in an eye, we talked about our July budget, but it takes us five minutes now when we talk about it because we've been doing it for 16 years. So what I would say to you guys is what we used to do is literally put it in your calendar on your phones or set one of those reminders on your iPhones and just say 830 tonight and we're having a 20 minute discussion about the budget and do that two or three times a week,

seriously, I do it a lot at the beginning. So you guys get in the rhythm of just looking

“and talking and looking and talking and sticking to it. Yes, but you have to you have to change”

that habit and then as it goes on, you don't have to do that as much curious. Like your household income. So basis around 2016 and now usually around another. So I would ask the question to myself, I would say if I had somebody working for me that made two 15 in the handle money the way this guy does what I fire him. Well, please don't ask God to bless you if you're going to be mediocre in the handling of your money. He wants excellence. So be excellent. You know, treat this

like it's your job and you guys are not dumb people. So sit down and put it all in the budget. Y'all all talk about it and then I got stick to it and then you're going to go through about 90 days of back and forth to get it all figured out and get the rough edges out. And you're doing something. Yes, and you do all of this for the goal. One of the biggest myths about money is

that if you're winning with money, you're never supposed to spend any. That's not true. Some

“of the best money you'll spend is making memories with the people you love. That's why I was”

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pay for the first month on their own. Celebrate America's 250th with a great movie this July 4th and a great deal. Sign up at Angel.com/Ramsy. That's Angel.com/Ramsy. Welcome back to the Ramsey Show in the Fair Wins Credit Union Studio. Adam is in Syracuse, New York.

“Hi Adam, what's up? Hey, Dave and Richard, how are you guys doing? Better than we deserve. What's up? How come you?”

So, a little bit of background on 26, my fiance is 27. About two years ago, we bought a house from my grandfather. Got a pretty good discount on it. Two years has passed. Now, we have about $200,000 in equity in the house. We're planning on getting married soon. We've been thinking about just a low thing and then we have a wedding day already set for an November 5th of 2027. I have $55,000 worth of debt currently. She doesn't have any debt right now

and we're thinking that if we get married soon, that we just sell the house, possibly pay off my debt, and then either rent for a little while or buy a well or price house. And I'm just trying to, I feel like I'm more on the sense of actually doing the renting. And I feel like she's just not. She's a little more on the other side of it. What do you make and what does she make? So, I just got a paying increase of about $20,000. I'll be making $70,000 now. She makes

mid 80s, probably about 86. Okay, so you have how much debt $50,000? $55. $50,000. What's it on Adam? So, $26 on a

that you all get married this weekend. And then this is what I would do. But I would not do anything

else together until you're married. Okay. You quit paying people's bills that are your roommates. And I don't care if it's your fiance or not. I still your freaking roommate. Because you don't have any legal ties whatsoever. And one of you just walks off or one of you something happens to one of you or something like that. And those things happen in life. Yeah, there's no repercussions. There's

“no protection. So, you're just, you're very, very vulnerable. So, yeah, if you want to do a celebration”

in November of 27, that's fine. But I'd be married by the end of the weekend, happy 4th of July, who fireworks. Okay. And so your marriage is birthday and Adam's anniversary. On the 250th anniversary, we got married. And so, yeah. And who's cars the 26,000? It's my truck. Yeah. I saw your truck. I would show your house. Okay. To give a little more background in the house, the house was built in 1918. You don't like the house? We love the area and the property that we have. But we're not

huge fans of the house itself. Okay. So, if you were going to move anyways, that's one discussion. I would not move because of the debt. But if you guys don't like the house and you want to do something living wise differently, regardless of the debt, then that's a totally different discussion. Yeah, but in that case, I would sell the house and buy different house. And it's still sell the truck. And I'd still live on one of your incomes for the next year after you get married and just pay off

the pay off the debt or sell the truck and then live off one of your income. I want to keep the truck.

“You need to pay it off inside of a year and a half and the other debt too and keep the house.”

And then when that's done, then we'll talk about selling the house and moving to a different house with the equity. But selling the house to get out of debt is, um, we rarely recommend that.

No, almost never. Only an extreme situations where somebody's really going to be broke.

But there doesn't need to be an hour house. And an hour hour anything, because you're not married. It's very, very dangerous. Don't do this, folks. So, yeah, you do what you want to do. But if I were you, I'd be married by the end of the weekend and have a wonderful anniversary that we can always remember was the 250th anniversary of the United States of America. And there we go. He ha. And you know, you can make jokes about fireworks on your honeymoon, the rest of your

friends. Anyway, the, uh, have some fun with it. Uh, but yeah, I'm, because do y'all have been everything but married for a very long time. You talk like an old married guy. I mean, you don't even sound like, you know, so you'd really do need to get the stuff in the right order, so that you don't get somebody that didn't get burned here. Christina is in Cincinnati, Hi, Christina. How are you? Hi, I'm good. How are you all better than we deserve? What's up?

I'm pretty slow for that. Um, so my husband and I are working baby steps four through six. And we were just curious on balancing, working the steps at the same time. So we have a plan, built, like, a plan built as we work all three, but we were just curious if we should be prioritizing

working one more aggressively than the other. Well, four is set. It's 15 percent before you move on.

15 percent of your household income going into retirement. That one's set. And then the only isolation is between things that we want to do in the household, because we're at the intentional rather than intensity stage. Or do we need to save up and move up in car? Do we need to be saving up for a vacation? Uh, those are kinds of competing things, right? And then, um, you know, age and aspirations of the kids for college, you know, it's a completely different discussion about

baby step five if you have two people in high school versus two two-year-olds or two-three year-olds or something, right? So it's just- How old are your kids? Uh, we have just one daughter in season one. Okay. Well, there's no panic about baby step five. And so if you in that situation wanted to just do something that was representative of having touched that base, meaning we're going to put $100 a month or $200 a month or something in a five twenty nine, just to get started on it.

It's not really enough, but it'll get us started. And then we're going to concentrate on not

“going out the house. That's what a lot of people do in your situation. Yeah. Or you look up and”

when the kids seven eight, I'm like, okay, what's tuition looking like now? And what how aggressively do we need to be saving for this? Then, but yeah, I wouldn't be concerned, but I would open one

and you know, I put in a lot in there, and then to tack the house, that's what most people do. What are you all trying to do? What are you thinking, Christina? Well, so we do invest currently in a five twenty nine. We opened it pretty much after she was born like the next month. And I think I'm in a unique situation where planning for life, but I actually work at a university in one of the benefits that we receive is that dependence can attend for free. Right. Um, now I have to

“be employed at the time of attendance. So that's why we're kind of planning for life. But I think”

that's kind of what we're trying to balance. And then I know you guys talked about the 15 percent

for baby step four, but with raw IRAs, we're actually coming in closer to 19 percent of our helpful in that. I wouldn't do that. Okay. So we should kind of readjust that to 15 percent to apply your to five or six until your house is paid off. Yeah. Okay. Perfect. Yeah. And I wouldn't, um, I think you said it, Christina, but I agree with you on planning more of life happening because I don't want you feel like you have to be stuck in a job for 18 years. Right. If you just for your

kids to get free tuition, right, Christina in five or six years, it may look different. So when you

do say, if I fired me when they were 17, yeah. Yeah. That's right. No, if I should have gotten that call,

uh, man. Wow. The good job, you guys. Yeah, you're doing great. Yeah, you're doing great. You're going to be a such good shape. You really are doing great. Well done. Let me tell you what I get asked all the time. When should I get term life insurance? How much do I need? Is it affordable? Those are the right questions to be asking. So let's take a quick review.

“The fact is term life isn't a baby step. So if anyone is dependent on your income, you need to”

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“If your private student loans are into fault, that means you fall and so far behind that the loan is”

considered unpaid, why refie might be able to help? Why refie helps borrowers in tough situations explore low, fix rate refinancing options that fit their budget, go to why refie.com/RAMSI. That's the letter why REFY.com/RAMSI might not be in all states. Today's question comes from Brett in Kansas. My wife and I are currently paying off $80,000 of debt. At what point can we start to budget for a little bit of fun? We have been working nonstop to pay the soft and want to add some

fun money to the budget. Oh, it's a great question. In $80,000, that's a long track, right? Depending on what you guys make could be a couple of years. And so, you know, one thing that we have found that helps a lot of families when there's a lot of debt, a massive amount of debt is after certain debts are paid and you guys look up and say, okay, after we climb this mountain or after we do this, when it comes to the numbers, just to have like a breather to find something that you're not

expensive and not, you know, that's going to cost you guys a lot. But like what's one thing we can do to enjoy ourselves that we can look forward to. And sometimes that's like something for free, right, that you just plan and you're going to make this thing special. But I would say to be able to piece it out. When you look at the whole thing, I feel like it can be very overwhelming. But when you find these milestones within the $80,000 journey, that's helpful. But also the math

is the math and the deeper you sacrifice, the more money that goes to this debt, the faster you are going to pay it off. So if you go and take a trip or something or maybe pay off a debt,

that's not going to work, not going to work. I can never tell when someone asks a question this way,

going like 100 hours a week and they really haven't even bought a jar of mustard. I mean, you know?

Oh, like what? What part of the texture? What is cream are they on? Right, if you're on the whining side and you're just, "Oh, grow up, shut up. Fun is not defined by spending." If you're on the other side, yeah, do what Rachel said, set yourself a milestone and go, "Okay, we're going to go by Chick-fil-A with coupons." And that's our big woohoo. When we knock out that particular debt. Okay, because we've not been out to eat, but we're going to go do that. But you know what's

interesting is is that we define fun as with money. When can we do something fun? When you do something

“fun, it just doesn't necessarily require money. But it's like the only way we can have fun”

is if we have money spending going on. Well, that's not true. We all know that shallow and not accurate. So don't define fun as necessarily spending. So let's go throw the Frisbee in the park. That's fun. The one we've already got. You don't go by one. The Frisbee. Okay? And whatever, I don't care, but you know, but we define fun as I want to go on a cruise, you know? And no, you can't do that. You're broken 80,000 dollars in debt. If that's what you're talking about, no. But if you're talking

about, I'm going to-- Well, you have to get creative. Because I do know, you know, we have fun is going to the movies. It's going to the zoo with the kid. Like all of this cost money to go and do experiences or just go do something for a lot of things. But what you're saying is exactly right, find the joy in life. Like when you can do that, contentment starts to build and that, it's magnified as you build wealth too, which is an amazing characteristic to have. So yeah,

what are the things that you can do? Is a game night. You know, as a family, is it going on, walks like, oh, go do something, go live your life and have a great life. It doesn't have to

cost a lot. Yeah. I mean, think about families that never that lived in a time when you could not

purchase fun. I mean, you were stuck with family monopoly. You had to play monopoly with your family.

“There was the only thing you could do because I mean, the jigsaw puzzles, you were stuck with that.”

Remember COVID when you were stuck in there with your family, you couldn't do anything. There's people found ways to spend money then anyway. Yeah. Because I like shopping when stacks of the stacks of one bottles outside their doorway. But anyway, yeah. So, but be careful how you define fun. It's a good point. Yeah. Eva is in Memphis. Hi, Eva. How are you? I think if you're taking my call. Sure. What's up?

So does the background. My husband and I we have been in education for years. I mean, our own education and have followed unpredictable work moving internationally and really genuine and not having a saving margin for a lot of our adult life. And so we don't really have a habit for that. And I'm we're wanting to get on the same page for that. But I grew up watching my dad go bankrupt twice from day trading on borrowed house equity. And that makes me scary, wherever else. And my

husband had the opposite background of, you know, growing up pretty humbly and family saving in very, you know, boring savings accounts and bonds. And I feel like now he's going in the up direction. He was drawn to crypto and ideas. And he feels like he's older and he's had to wait so long to have the margin to invest that he wants to foster time. And he has reasonable, but like we're both scientists. We'd like to see the full picture and get a full understanding and I feel like

I'm lost with trying to figure out everything. And with his hours, he doesn't have time to like sit down with people. Yeah. So, you know, I think it's a good idea with his hours that he's just down with you and he sits down with people because he's getting ready to make some huge mistakes. Yeah, I just feel like when I do the research myself, he he listens, but like I'm not confident enough to explain it back to him clearly. He wants to like, I think. Okay. Well, so yeah, let's pretend

for a second. Let's pretend that we actually, because you sit down across the table from both of you

and say, hey, husband, your parents had it wrong. They never invested. They only saved.

“You have to invest. And by the way, Eve's parents obviously had it wrong.”

They day-traded into bankruptcy twice with a home equity. And both of those things are influencing these decisions in a toxic way. And then you add to that, he's decided he's going to be desperate and rash, which when I'm desperate and rash because it's coming at me, I don't want to, I'm late. I'm late to the game. I'm late to the game. So I have to play catch-ups. I'm going to swing for the fence. I'm going to try to hit home runs only, you're going to strike out. As soon as

getting stupid. Crypto-stupid. It's a stupid swing for the fence. Okay, day trading, stupid.

It's a swing for the fence. But also not investing. And instead just saving, like his parents is stupid. So Rachel, your book, we've got to send it to him. Know yourself, know your money. Because their family of origins are really impacting this. Yeah, of the fear and the motivation of what's going on. But then you got to get beyond that Eve. And I would want to know from him, like, what is that motivation? Like, I know I understand

that he feels, well, that he feels like he doesn't have enough time. But if you guys ran out

“numbers in an S&P 500, to see where you guys would be. Because how old are you all?”

The I'm 40, he's 48. Okay. So I'm just curious to say, like, yeah, in the next 20 years, if you did, the safe route get pretty much guaranteed. What are we going to have? So income and like net take home right now is about 11,000 a month. Okay. And so what if we put away $2,000 a month? That's got what I kind of want to do. And I think where I think he's, like, we could, we need to re-run some numbers of budgets. We've got some money getting freed up now. We have a kid

who was in private school who's going to a public high school. You know, so we have margin.

I can see the margin coming. We've agreed. We're going to say about the emergency fund first.

Yeah, if you put $2,000 a month in just the S&P 500, which is an investment in the stock market, but it's not a day trade. And it's not crypto. Okay. The average annual rate of return of the stock market in the United States since it began is 11.8%. If it averaged 11%, and you put $2,000

“away from age 40 to age 67, you'd have $4 million. That's what you should be doing.”

So you can say about as well. So I think, you know, we haven't been saying for the college yet. I think we, we kind of need to look, we need a six things. We're relatively succinct way to see what are the investment strategies, what are the ways to to do this and what point we should think about. And that requires sitting down with someone that knows something that you all don't know. Yeah, check out SmartFester at ramseeslutions.com and set down with a financial planner who gets excited

about watching your money grow, right? They're not anti that kind of thing. They're pro all of that. And look at the big picture and it's wisdom. And I, and I feel like that's what's scaring me about as decisions as it feels immature. It does not feel wives. And listen, everything changes this time of year. The kids are at a school. The routines go out the window. You're traveling more. You're for sure sleeping less. And if you're not careful,

you and your family can end up running on fumes. Here's the truth. If you don't slow down this summer and take care of yourself, all that stress is not just going to disappear. It's going to show up in your body and your work and your relationships, your patience. It's going to show up everywhere. This is why I'm a big fan of better help. Better help is an online therapy platform that matches you with the license therapist based on your goals and preferences. All of their therapist follow a

strict code of conduct and you can message your therapist or schedule sessions right in the better help app. If it's not the right fit, you can switch therapists at any time for no extra cost. Listen, you don't have to carry everything all by yourself this summer. Go to betterhelp.com/raims you to get 10% off. That's better help. H-E-L-P.com/raimsie Bill is an Austin Texas. Hey, Bill, what's up? Hey, Mr. Ramsey and Ms. Cruz. I appreciate you guys

taking my call. Sure. How can we help? So I'm trying to get on the same page with my girlfriend here and we're trying to start saving money. I want to obviously start planning for our future. I think we just can't go on the same page every time I bring up finances. It often turns into

“a confrontation. So I'm just trying to figure out the best way to go about it and show her”

what we're looking at financially because we really never sat down together and looked at it as a whole.

I just want to see what you guys. How long have you all been there?

Okay, how do you guys? I'm 26 and she's 28. Okay. And so when you start talking about, you know, someday when we're married, we're going to combine finances and this is what it looks like. It turns into a confrontation.

What does that mean? So basically, like I obviously want to start planning for our future

and stuff like that and I've told her that and she doesn't want to obviously take any steps to start planning for our future because we're not married. Now I know obviously she's not to you know get on houses and cars and stuff together until you're married and I've already made that mistake.

“But I've already made that mistake. You bought a house together?”

Yes, I've worked for a home builder. I don't care. You bought a house together. Make sure to understand what you're saying. Yes, sir. And you bought cars together. I own mine outright and then I'm on hers as well. And so and you're shocked that this woman doesn't want to talk to you about money anymore until you marry her. Of course she doesn't. Well, yeah, I just, you know, she's tired of waving all of you. I know, I just want to feel like it's

going to be you bought a house. I think that marriage flips the switch, you know, and then it's like, all right, well, now we have to, you're buying a house. That's not like a little small step. Like this isn't like we share coupons at Costco. You bought a freaking house, man. Okay, so then you bought a car for her and it's in your name and she feels insecure about you talking

“about the future without a ring on her finger. Well, no kidding, dude.”

This is you. I've been thinking about, you know, yeah, I know. I would think about obviously

marriage and stuff. It just scares me because I'm like, I mean, we've been basically married, but how

do you scare it about marriage after you bought a house together? Because a house is not a life. Why don't you want to show? I know. Yeah, I just don't want to feel like that's the mortgage company. You're going to put this switch in her, you know, in her. Yes, and remind that, wow, okay, now we're married, now we need to save money. It's like, why don't we saving money right now? Okay, so is the saving the money, the tension point that you're wanting to put money away and she just wants to spend?

What is that one of the future points? Yes, it's a tension point on that. She owes money back to the IRS. So I'm trying to tell her, hey, you know, this, this can really screw us, you know, in the long run, if they start garnishing her wages and everything like that. So like, we got to get on top of that. She's making them on payments, but like we need to start, you know, taking it more serious. And okay. You know, I'm trying to. All right, I'm going to put a quick

“bait on you. What would I do if I were in your shoes? The two of you need to schedule a meeting”

with a marriage counselor this week. And I want you to begin pre-marriage counseling and decide if you're going to get married and if you can align enough on your finances in order to spend your life together. And then you either need to pull the plug on this thing and sell the house in the car and go on your merry way. Or you need to get married as soon as you can get aligned. And I'm talking a month from now. You're going to make a decision. Okay. Because you're trying

to handle all of this while she feels like she's dangling on the end of a hook, like a warm over a bass. And she's hard to admit because yeah, she's tired of it. And she doesn't know how to open. You're not in a set to tell her what to do about anything. You're just the boyfriend. Yeah. So you guys cannot, you know, you can't go. If it's your wife, the two of you can sit down and go, hey, the two of us, we're going to attack this IRS thing because this is going to screw us.

So your statement would be correct to then. They were trying to make a statement from a position of the power that you don't have. Yeah, a seat that you're not sitting in. Yeah. I'm just trying to I know, you want everybody to be on the same page. I pay for everything. You know, for the house, I pay for the house, I pay for my car, water trash, and you know, everything that comes to the house, I pay for our auto turns. Why should we do everything? What does she make? So she makes $3,000 per

month and then she makes commission depending on, you know, skills that she makes. So in your pre marriage counseling, if you're going to go do what I tell you to do, you guys need to sit down and do a mock budget that says, if we were married, we would put all of our money on the table.

And here's what we would do with our our money. We would pay the house payment. We pay the car

payment. We pay the IRS. We would eat. And our money would be shared. And we would make decisions

resent her for not carrying her half of the load and yet you signed this deal up. You made this mess. And Bill, I would also, and leave with a lot of humility too. Yeah. I feel like, you know, your point at her, you're going to screw this up. If you're just doing minimal payments and it felt a little, I understand what you're saying. You have an urgency, but the urgency can come off is very shameful and downputting. And you have it figured out and she doesn't. And you didn't

“mean like the, the emotional intelligence of, I think a healthy marriage is both sitting down and”

I'm like, okay, what's your desire? Here's my desire. Here's what I'm thinking. Here's the story

that I've made up in my head, Bill, is that you think I suck with money. And I have to get this right for you to marry me to make me worthy of marriage. Am I not worthy now? I don't know. Like, there could be so many things attached to this. And you guys kind of, you got to walk through all of that. I would before you get married. So I would go to a pre-marriage counselor today and I would get these get to the, get to the down to the roof. Get to the roof at all. Yep. And let's see if we can

get aligned and then very, very quickly get married. Or let's start taking this thing apart. Because if I'm her, my car is attached to the sky. Yep. My home is attached to the sky. Yep. I make 3,000 a month. Yep. And here he is. Oh, they are rich. Here he is telling me what I need to do. And he not, after he signed me up for all this, he still resents me because he has to pay for everything.

“Yep. And I do, and if I, I don't know, there, there would be a lot, I think there, that she”

made uneven realize. I don't know. But she feels, she feels hung out to dry. You know, and no, she don't want to talk about the future with you because the, the present with you sucks. Of course not. I mean, it's not good. But it's all good and dope. But Bill, Bill is dry here. You Bill. Like, because because we have some people that they're so hardcore with, I mean, obviously not our principals because he went and bought a house. And people are so,

good. I mean, their motivation is good. I want to save money. I want to be responsible and I want these things. But you end up coming off very unattractive, very controlling, kind of shameful. When you do it out of order, particularly. Yeah. Yeah. So there has to be a lot of humility in this. Yeah. And and you guys need to get on the same page. And she's going to be different than

YouTube, when it comes to money. She might be a Spender. Always. And you may be the saver.

Always. And that is the dynamic, which is beautiful. And in marriage, you need each other. So that's a good thing. She doesn't need to turn into you. But she doesn't need to be a responsible adult too. So I hear, I hear that's it. That side of it. Oh, man. Bill. Yeah. What are we on? If she's the one, if she's the only shot you've got at this, is not continuing like it is. And it's not just go get married this weekend either because

you've got a mask, you don't know what you're getting into. So you guys need to get some good coaching, some good counseling from a good marriage counselor, and settle in and get married very quickly as soon as you can. Yeah. Make a decision. You guys are 22 to 27. And so she's dangling

“on the end of a hook and she's tired of it. I promise you. That's what's going on.”

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I'm doing all right. Thanks so much for taking my call. Sure. How can we help?

So my husband was recently his position was eliminated after several years with a Christian organization. And so we are he's actively looking for a job. But we have some medical debt. I have a child that has a chronic illness. So we have monthly bills for his care. And so I have a little less than $3,000 in medical debt right now. We have four months reserves. We do not have any debt

“except our home. But what is how much is the hormones reserve? How much money is that?”

I have about 15,000. Okay. Right now. And then how long ago was your husband light off? He was he was let know in April. His kind of contract ended this last month. And now he's been given two and a half months reference. And so he's known about this for months upon months upon months. What type of boy was he doing in the ministry? Christian education. So he he's been actively looking and applying for jobs. So hopefully in there are a few things that he's got on the horizon.

But we have these medical bills. I'm trying to figure out how to pay those off the best. I understand like the snowball method and I was going to start doing more. None of that work. Right now everything. Okay. Right now everything's all whole till he gets a job. Right. Are you working outside the home? I do. I just I work with the same organization. And so I'm looking for some other

“options. I think it's possible that my my position feels a little precarious right now as well.”

That's probable. Right. So so yeah we're just trying to figure out I've called the medical I've called the link for all of these matters. It doesn't matter. It's only $3,000. Right. They could write you could write a check today, but I'm not going to. Right. That's my question. How do we move on from here? We wait and we go get income. Both of us go get income now. Okay. Now is he a was he teaching or was he in administration?

He was in administration. Does he have a the ability to start doing online teaching as a side hustle starting tonight? Ready set go? Sure. Sure. Yeah. I mean I think sign up start for start being Professor to some online glasses tonight. You can you can sign up for those immediately. And come we'll start coming immediately. I want him to load up on that. Well he's looking. And turn the television off or throw a brick through it. No wasting time right now.

There. Okay. No wasting time income. I want some interim income until he lands the next gig. Because until they were in limbo and limbo is scariest crud isn't it page? Indeed. So what's what yeah because he he was laid off in April right and he said they all had two months of severance. No. Okay. So so you're ending. Yes. So you're calling at the end of at the beginning of July. The severances is you know he was paid out. So he was paid out through his contract, which was the end of June.

severance. Which the way I look at that is if he lands something this week that's two and a

half months signing bonus to the next gig. Great. Great. Great. It's flush money. It's gravy money. It's extra money and we ride a check payoff. And but so what you what you're dealing with and it's a fair thing that you're dealing with though is my child has an illness and I've got this financial stress and we've all or you know he's lost his income I'm probably going to. So you've got a lot of angst in the air and what I'm trying to do is get the. Get something controlled. The faster some

kind of money starts coming in. Okay. Even if it's not the permanent solution the lower your anxiety goes. Okay. Yeah. And we have we've met our out of pocket deductible for the year. Yeah. So

and that is part of his severance. He'll be they're going to cover cobra for us through the end of the year.

So we have like we're not going to incur any more medical bills. Well you're probably going to get a package at the next place and he's probably going to land that next 30 days. Wait. And he's working hard to do so. It's just a tricky time. Yeah. It's just scary until. Yeah. Yeah. We're walking the walk on the Grand Canyon on a freaking tight rope. I mean this is scary. Yeah. Yeah. And so I think you're going to be okay. I don't hear anything that panics me

but I can relate to your anxiety and I think your anxiety is valid. Right. But I don't I don't want it to be my activator. And so what we're going to do is we're going to

protect the 15,000. Yeah. But the answer is we don't pay the $3,000 a day. Protect the 15,000,

protect the severance. Cut everything out of your budget. Go to beans and rice rice and beans. You're not going out to eat. We're not going to celebrate the severance check. You know unless it's with water and cereal. Right. I mean. So we're going to we're going to the storm is here. We're putting plywood on the windows. And when the storm passes, we'll take the plywood down.

“There. That's what we're doing. And we feel like we've kind of we've been taking those steps.”

I think it's just a matter of do I call these medical? Yeah. Then say I can't do it. Just let it run. They're useless. They don't care. That's what I'm finding. It's been really frustrating. Yeah. You're not. You're not talking to intelligent life. So we just let it sit until something lands. And then pay it off. They'll use the fact that you called and try to turn on your honor and turn on everything else to get you to go ahead and pay it. They'll shame you. Won't they?

100%. Yeah. That's what they do. We've had. I mean, I ready. Somebody say, well, we won't make another appointment until you pay this bill. And I said that I am pet like I have been making. We've been making. Well, I won't make another appointment with you anyway. I'm tired of these people. I think we'll go somewhere else. So I can handle that. It's just a treat. We just feel like we've been in this tricky place. And so I don't know what medical professional actually said that. Was that a

collect or the actual administrator in the office? It was the know as a billing department. Yeah. That's cool. They don't have control of the appointments. So that was complete. So it's something we are just

“the best thing is to hold tight. Exactly. Really. And I'm just trying to give you some information”

that that make that normalizes where you are to where it doesn't feel quite so sketchy. Yeah. So the billing department doesn't make appointments. They're full of crap. They were just trying to collect a bill and they make up stories and they shame and they do whatever else to heck with that. And yeah, he gets a job. But he's got a game on. I mean, get part time income, short term income, long term income income income income income income, both of you. Like your hairs on fire.

Because the faster you stack cash, the lower your stress goes and the better he interviews. When you walk into interview and you're scared to death for your house being foreclosed on, you don't interview as well as when you walk in with cash stacked in the bedroom. You walk different and you talk different. Your octave is different in your voice. Everything changes. You got you have zero swagger when you're desperate and you don't want to do that. You're not attractive higher at that

“point. Scares people when you're scared. So you got, that's why I'm telling you, go get some income”

and it'll help him close the deal on the permanent upgrade and you'll probably get an upgrade and his job. Wow. Sorry, you guys are facing that. We're on your team, though. We're here to help you. If you need us again, you call anytime.

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$1 per month trial at Shopify.com/Ramsy. That's Shopify.com/Ramsy. Shopify.com/Ramsy. Welcome back to the Ramsey Show in the Fairwins Credit Union Studio. I'm Dave Ramsey your host, Rachel Cruz, Ramsey personality, my daughter is my co-host today. Johans is calling us from Australia. Hey Johans, what's up? Hello, Dave. What's the number yourself?

Better than I deserve sir. How can we help? That's great. Dave, I have a basic question here for you. I'm a carpenter apprentice and I have a female wife, a yearly income of $1,000 and $1,500. We are struggling to make ends meet at this stage, which we've been over the last 12 months, we've been dipping into our savings just to try and stay afloat.

One of my concerns is involving car insurance, so I have for my youth and if I invest it prematurely. So, do you have debt?

Yes, that I'm on and when I called first, I said no, and then after thinking about it, I do.

I have a state payer account with Cornwell, which is a small credit credit card. It has about $400 on it. I mainly use it for fuel. The reason I opened it up is to pay electricity bill. And then I have a personal loan for my dad of $3,000. And then I got a month, a month's phone plan, playing my wife's phone.

That's your future utilities, all right, and so $71,000, $72,000 coming in.

“So, $6,000 a month and how much is your rent or your mortgage?”

We're renting it for 40 a week, sir. So, 1,800 bucks a month, is that sound right? Great, that's great. Okay, and what is it? I don't know the tax rates and so forth in Australia, out of $72,000 a year, how much do you get taxed?

So, that's the net income, the tax, the tax, the tax, the tax. Oh, that's the net of tax, that's net. Oh, good. Okay, all right, so we've got $6,000 a month to operate from. We've got about 2,000 going out in rent. And she leaves us 4,000 to do everything else with. Does that sound correct?

Yes, sir. Okay. Where would you say it's going? Is there a one big expense or is it a bunch of little things? For the majority, there's a bunch of little things. The biggest expenses here is obviously groceries, which are counting up the average groceries. We spent the last few months on a month to month basis about $1,700 bucks.

That's because we've got two kids as well as three pets.

“So, that's why we're watching stuff like that.”

I think it's quite pricey here. And then for work, because I have to travel out of town quite often,

And then utilities are the other big one.

It's about $600 every three months for power and about $200. Every three months for water. That's $800.

“So what has changed dramatically in the last year that put the pension?”

So we were living in Stanton, but it's a small country town. And we moved about 13 months ago. We moved to a bigger city, which was for my job, which increased rent and just about everything else to do on us. Yeah, cost, cost a living is higher there than it is out in the country. Yeah, that makes sense.

Did your income go up for the move?

It did, but my wife isn't currently working, she's got a bunch of undiagnosed medical issues that we have to try to sort out. I'm working in the other place. No, sir. So that did change. Well, she receives a, um, like a, a state income, like I know in payments, right? So with my, with my pay going up her pay from the state to end down dramatically.

So did you, you ended up netting less by moving or netting more between her going down. We ended up netting slightly less by moving. And then your cost and your cost all went up.

“So the lot cost of living went up dramatically is, can you move back?”

Can you go back to where you are? You were better off before the move.

I was, I was definitely, unfortunately, that's not really an option for us at this stage. Because of your job? Yes, yes, because of my job, I'm, I'm doing, I'm, I'm doing, sorry. I'm doing a, uh, a cop in the apprenticeship, uh, which is a four year based, uh, job. How far into the fire, or are you? I mean, just over a year now, sir. Okay. To get three more years of that. And what What does life look like after that? Well life lasts after that. I'll always be the qualified, and I want to get a few more building certificates behind my mind so I can eventually grow up and place it like eventually move on to my career. Okay.

But after three years, it's just your income jump. Yeah, after I've finished my apprenticeship this is a jump to what about estimation about 25 to 30 years. Okay. So you almost, it's like you guys have three years of this way of life. Yeah, which I, yeah, no, you're good, you're good, you're good, which is a good thing because at least you have an end date that you're like, okay. Hang on.

The 1700 if we can cut that to 1300. Like, right, if you can just find these small cuts and it's going to strain, it's going to strain you guys. It's not going to be fun. Yeah, maybe even rent something cheaper than what you are. I mean, I don't know. Yeah, you can do to get closer to balance.

Nothing you're describing. Your current situation is a difficult situation to prosper in, but it is an okay situation to hang out until we finish the apprenticeship. It's like we're saying, you know, in the states, we say you're in college for three years more. And when you get out of college, well, then you go, then your income goes up. Now we go into prosperity mode. Mm-hmm.

But right now, you're just paying a price to go win with this apprenticeship.

“But I think I'm going to look around and go, you know, finish up her diagnosis so that you can figure out what she's struggling with.”

And then what opportunity she's got to create some kind of income that might be better than the state income. That's probably not hard to do. And what she's making. When she's got some health, her health back. And then anything you're allowed to do while in the apprenticeship as a side hustle, I'd be picking up.

Mm-hmm. And anything I can do to cut my expenses, like rent and other things, I'm going to do that. But if you don't do much, if you don't have much progress, as long as you don't go backwards. Yes. The dipping into savings is where I think it would make it a goal to don't do that.

Right? From an income expenses, and it's just for three years, right? For three years, this is what this has to look like. And then, oh my gosh, it opens up. 30 grand changes your life.

It sure does.

But it's also a good idea to put in the work searching for the right insurance coverage.

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Ramsey Trusted Providers have been coached and vetted to serve you like we would. Find what you need at RamseySolutions.com/insurance. [Music] Nick is with us in New York, how are you? Hi, guys.

Thanks in advance for your help. Sure. What's up? Okay, so here's my problem. My wife, she's into a number of different tactics, so it's been an evolving problem.

We shouldn't be using the same diagnosis for a number of years, but we haven't really known what to do it. Do about it.

Basically, we've seen a few benefits that have also had the same thing.

She needs to have like a total health reconstruction, and it's phenomenally expensive.

“We don't have dental insurance to out of pocket.”

The quotes are from like 70,000 to 150,000 dollars. I mean, I don't know what to do about it. I mean, technically, I could take money out of my retirement, and pay for it. We do have quite a big emergency funds that could probably pay for it, but that leaves us like a lifetime. My sort of preference is to figure out a way to pay it incrementally, like, you know, 20,000 years, something like that.

But I don't know, I just don't know how to go about it. I'm not really sure. You know, my inclination would be to get a bunch of credit cards. Don't know how much is in your emergency fund. Like 80 grand.

Okay. All right. So I think how urgent is the surgery? Well, what is the, I mean, this obviously a tremendously painful thing. It's going to be awful.

No, I mean, currently she's in pain, right? Well, yeah.

And like basically her bite has collapsed, so her teeth hit each other, and the animal wears away.

So she gets a lot of cavities. Her teeth are all loose from sort of hitting each other incorrectly. Oh, gosh. So it's not fun. Now, she can't bear the idea of spending all this money on the telepocket on.

I want her to get it done because I want her to be happy and healthy. But also it's what is she, she also holds in on money. She doesn't work. And I'm a freelancer in her varies. It varies from about 140 to $200,000 a year.

So I mean, theoretically, we could pay it in the belt and probably pay for it this year. But that would be really, really. Could you, could you pay for it?

“Can you cash with some of it and take some out of the emergency fund?”

Yeah. Yeah. Well, I could take for the whole thing out of the emergency fund. Sure. But then that emergency fund is zero, which I understand is the point of the emergency fund.

Or cash with some of it and take it down to 20,000, right? Cash for the rest of the surgery. When I run into something like this, the biggest problem is that I feel like I don't know what's going on. And I've got to figure out enough of what's going on to make a wise decision. It's so far you've gotten this wide variety of solutions from 70 to 150,000, right?

And so that alone, if I'm in your shoes, that throws up red flags for me. And I says, okay, I've got to understand what the difference in 70 and 150,000. Why is that there? Is it because the dentist is, you know, one of them is a Bentley salesman and one of them is a Chevrolet salesman. Why is that?

Because that's true in dentistry. There's a wide variety of the way people approach things. The techniques that they use, the machinery that they have, the equipment that they have, how much they think of themselves, how much practice management has gone into jack and you up.

And it's all over the place in the world. And they're quite there. Yeah. Exactly. So I'm going to, I mean, on something like this,

you know, it could be that she goes to Kansas City to get the work done.

Yeah, it's a good point. Super dentist in a smaller market. And it's not cheaper in quality, but it's just someone that has a more common sense. It's a more approach to the New York City. You know, because this is a big enough thing that it's worth a few plain tickets.

Mm-hmm. And a few hotel stays. If you say, what if you saved 100 bucks?

I've always had that Nick.

“For as an option, did you price out other areas of the country?”

I have. I mean, I haven't taken it to like going to going to demoying yet. But, but like I have, you know, like I've looked in a bunch of different places. And one of the cheaper ones we found is in Florida, Miami. Mm-hmm.

That's the $70,000. Okay. Then I want to know why it's cheaper. And I want to learn enough about this to do this. So, you know, like one of my buddies about two years ago was diagnosed with cancer.

And the good news is he's doing great. But he didn't know anything about cancer. And now he's a good-gum cancer expert. Right now, because he's just studied it. Because he had to just stay alive, you know?

And to understand the treatment options and the protocols and the prognosis. And when someone says stage two or three, what do they really mean? And we hear all this stuff.

But you suddenly matter as when it's you.

Like, you know, the definition of major surgery is surgery on me. You know, that's that right. And so this is all of the sudden it matters. So I'm going to learn a lot more. And I'm going to do that because I want to gather enough information to make an intelligent decision. And also to not get screwed over by an industry that doesn't mind over charging.

Right. And the industry has a component to it. Not everyone, but there are members of it that don't mind over charging. Right. And so I'm going to learn about all of that.

And you know what? I'm going to put you on hold. I have been endorsing a dental operation in Dallas, Texas. Just outside Dallas, Texas and Grandberry, Grandberry dental for almost 20 years. On a local Dallas radio station endorsement.

And I know those guys and I'm going to put you on hold and we're going to connect you with them. And just let them teach you and let them put in a bid.

“God help us if that's what we want to call it.”

Right. Yeah.

Or at least I don't give you advice.

Yeah. I do trust those. Mm hmm. I've known them a long time. Right.

And if I had to do something like that, that'd be one of the people I would talk to. Anyway, so. Okay. Just made a national ad out of a local. But anyway, hang on and we'll get you set up with that.

So I want to learn because I until I understand enough of the basic components of this. I am cynical and I worry about getting screwed. Me too. Yeah. Once you get that settled, you write the check out the emergency fund and you get your wife's health back.

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“Little little basic on the estate planning stuff.”

Take a start at $199 get yours today at Ramsey Solutions.com. Slash events or click the link in the show notes. If you're listening on podcast or YouTube. Kim is in Dallas. Hi, Kim. How are you?

Hey, how are you? I'm good. Good. What's up? This is quick question. I'm in a program to purchase a home. It's no down payment.

No clothes and calls. No PMI. The catch is there is a lean on the home for five years. And each year, you're in the house. He goes down. But I'm completely dead free.

I have about six at a month of savings. Did I focus more on building up my retirement? Or getting a conventional loan? A go and continue the route that I'm home.

Is this a some kind of a government first time?

Home buyer program or what? No, it's a legitimate program. No, it is. Is it a government first time home? It's a private company.

It's a private company. I guess you can call it private.

“No, it feels like a government first time home buyer program.”

No, it's I don't want to say the name, but it's. They help a lot of people get into homes. It's a nationwide program. Yeah, and it's. Yeah, it's an actual program.

It's been pretty successful. From what I've been seeing. Okay. Well, it doesn't. It feels risky.

No, it's risky. Just say the name. It's Maca and ACA. In ACA. Okay.

Not familiar with them. Okay. All right. All right. Leans on homes and nothing down.

Nothing down. No PMI. All this scares me. Okay. And it scares me because there's something happens during the five years.

You could really end up seriously trapped here. And the other thing that I don't know the program. So I don't know details. Neighborhood. That's just a corporation of America.

It's a nonprofit. To help. Yeah.

“But anything that sounds too good to be true.”

Usually is, is my experience. And this sounds a little wacky. Agreed. Hmm. I really don't agree because I know someone is in one of their homes.

So. That's highly unusual.

Well, through a point. But they used to have the PMI. And then they removed PMI and put the lean. Put this a lean requirement. And what it is, it's a $25,000 lean.

It's a $25,000.

“So you have to be there at least five years.”

What price range? And I'm looking at probably about up to 250 in my area. And they're taking a two. They're only taking a 10% lean. Hmm.

What does this just mean?

You know the areas you could be a million.

It just depends on where you're at. Hmm. Hmm. I don't. I'm not going to say things disparaging about them because I don't know anything about them.

And I don't. I don't know enough to tell you to do it or to not do it. My tendency in general is to say. I'm going to buy. If I don't have any money, I probably shouldn't be buying a home.

Because that's going to put you into a pinch. Because home ownership on a monthly basis is more expensive. And then renting like your air conditioner breaks. And you don't have a landlord to fix it. You be the landlord.

Your roof goes out. And you got to put a roof on the thing.

You know the hot water here blows.

The stove goes out. And welcome to owning a house.

“The more stuff you own the more repairman you have to know.”

And so if you're moving to this, you don't have any money. And no, I would not be investing while I'm doing nothing down home deal. Absolutely not. I'd be stacking cash as high as I could stack it. Did a big emergency fund.

To make sure I had a massive emergency fund. And in general, and again, I don't know enough about this to tell you not to do it. It sounds like you're going to do it. No matter what I say. So I don't know exactly why you're calling.

But in general, I'm going to say get a 15 year fixed rate conventional. If you don't have to save 20% to buy. And if you don't have the money to start working towards that, you probably don't have the money to own a house yet. And it's time to do something with your career.

Right. That's where I would be more nervous. From what I can tell, it sounds like it takes months and months and months of documentation. I've to even apply to be part of it. I think they do their work on the front ends to make sure that whoever's applying.

You know, so there's probably a legitimate case for a count. But getting into the home isn't what I'm as worried about for you. It's more maintaining it and not letting your home keep you grow. You know, keep you grow. That's what we don't want either.

You want your home to be a blessing and not a curse. So I would just keep it. You don't want to be a blessing and not a curse. You don't want to be a blessing and not a curse. You don't want to be a blessing and not a curse.

You don't want to be a blessing and not a curse. You don't want to be a blessing and not a curse. You don't want to be a blessing and not a curse. You don't want to be a blessing and not a curse. You don't want to be a blessing and not a curse.

You don't want to be a blessing and not a curse. And they've had a problem with people. Get into a home and they go buy a big screen for the wall. And then they go buy something else for the house. And they go buy something else for the house.

And they've got payments all around them then that they wouldn't have had had they not bought the home. Right. And so they've had some issues with people actually losing their habitat for humanity home because they didn't have good healthy financial habits when they went in.

But habitat does a good job. There are good organizations. So if it's modeled after that, I was thinking that's what she was going to say. But, and then I could have at least more intelligently done. Because we've done all kinds of stuff with habitat helping them.

Well, and I just want to, yeah, and it sounds like too.

There's always a time limit to this.

Whenever you get boxed into a time limit, that's like student loan forgiveness. If you go work for ten, you know, it's all these, these things that are long term of what you're committing to. You have to keep that in mind because I don't know what it looks like.

“If can you have to sell three years and get out of the program?”

What does that mean? You know, so I would know all of that information as well. Sounds like it's, it sounds like it's pro radar forgiven. You know, 5,000 of your for five years on the 25,000 is what you sounded like. If that's what the way it really works.

And then at least you know what you're up against. And you hope the house goes up and value that much. Right, right. And you hope you don't have a bunch of repairs that you can't afford to do. But get that emergency fund come in place.

You got to have the emergency fund in place and no, you don't need to be thinking about investing until this deals settled. Get a six month emergency pile pile pile money up and have a nice, fat juicy pile of money to offset the fact that you've not anticipated what all this entails and what you're getting yourself into.

here's the weird thing, Rachel.

“You know, five years like that, if you don't have that lean,”

that five years goes by so fast. If you do have that lean, 73,000 things happened during that five years. It's just like it's like a trap stress. It slows down the calendar.

Yep. You know, it goes real fast if it's, if it's free. And there's no, no constraints and no leans. But but man, when you're trapped in there, it just doesn't.

It doesn't feel that way. Wow, I hope it works out for you come though because we do. We want everyone to be a homeowner. But again, we want it to be a blessing, not a curse. So having some cash for when things go wrong,

it's really important in your situation. [Music] Dave Ramsey here for more than 30 years. I've been talking to folks on the air, and I can tell you that most people are broke,

not because they don't make enough money, but because they don't have a plan.

“You need to give every dollar you earn a job,”

because when you do that, something changes. You stop guessing. You stop worrying. You stop stressing. Our every dollar budgeting app will show you how to find extra cash,

pay off debt, and finally start winning with money.

But most people won't do it. They'll keep living paycheck to paycheck. Keep hoping things will change without making a change. It's time to say enough is enough. It's time to take control of your money.

It's time to start your every dollar budget for free today. Go download it in the app store or Google Play. [Music] Our scripture that I Philippians 317, joining,

joined together in following my example brothers and sisters.

“And just as you have us as a model, keep your eyes on those who live as we do.”

Margaret Thatcher said, "Don't follow the crowd. Let the crowd follow you." Karen is in Cleveland, Ohio. Hi, Karen. How are you? Good. How are you doing? Thanks for taking my call.

Sure. What's up? I recently found, I'm 65 years old, and I recently found out that my husband lost all of our retirement and all of our money.

And I ultimately ended up getting a dissolution

because he gave me the house. I have no debt, basically, but I have a $300,000 house. I had to get a job and have a little bit of money, a little bit of social security. I have about $70,000 from money that my mom left me,

and I'm just wondering how to move forward. I saw the house and the money. Wow. Oh, Karen, I'm so sorry. Yeah.

You said you're, you said you're how old? 65. How long were you married? 15 years, he's 59. What did he do with the money?

He retired at 54 and took a lump sum, and then because he dabbled in the market, he decided to do that full time. And I managed to daily budget and he managed the retirement money, and what I did not know is that he moved to his retirement money

into his trading account. And last year he went all in on something. Oh, my God. A lot lost about 500,000. Wow.

And so he lost and then he came back. And when I found out we were lost the rest of it, I told him to get a job and he left again. Oh, Karen. So what do you make at your career?

I'm tired a while back many years ago. So I've got, because I'm 65. I don't want to start a career again. So I'm a receptionist. And I'm bringing in about 25.

Well, about 1600. I mean, yeah, 1600 a month. Other than your broken heart, how's your health? It's okay. So far, I mean, my plan is to maybe work for another 10 years.

Okay. Is that how I pay for Karen? It is. It's okay.

“He had me take my social security early.”

So I don't get as much there. And my 401k's gone. So that was part of what he lost. Well, we lived off of it for a while. He was investing.

Because I was older. And I was 59 and a half. So you could take it without penalty, yeah. Yeah. So you got 70 grand and 300 grand and a 25,000-hour-year job.

Okay. Yeah. How we got here doesn't change the answer. Although it just, it adds to the emotion of everything for sure. But I'm still going to say,

I'm going to set 20,000 of the 70s out of your emergency fund. I'm going to sit down with this Mark Vester Pro and invest the 50. And do you sell the 300 out? What's the history on the house? The history?

I mean, do you how long you owned it or? Yeah, we've owned it 14 years. It's been pretty good shape. Okay. All right.

“I mean, if you, if you, if you're only doing math,”

and all we're trying to just maximize everything, regardless of the emotion or regardless of just quality of life, you know, you go buy 150,000-dollar condo and you take another 150 of that house and you put it in good mutual funds.

Now you got 220 at 65, now it's 70, that 220 will be a half million if you don't add anything to it.

So yeah, I'm probably doing that. Go get a condo or something. And then the second thing I'm going to do is I'm going to reset your narrative in your head of, I'm 65, I don't have time for another career. Yeah, you do.

You got plenty of time. In the world we live in today, things, things spin up so fast and make so much money so quickly. I would not take somebody as bright as I'm talking to and make them only a receptionist, because I'm 65 for the next 10 years and I'm like nothing. Instead, I try to figure out why I go make some money.

And I think you got shops girl. I think there's some stuff you can do. Yeah. What was your former career? I was a medical lab technician making about 50,000.

Okay. Which is pretty intense of a job and hard to start over in. Okay. Okay. He's supposed to be giving me a thousand dollars alimony.

But that's not going to change your life. I don't know if it's going to be. Besides that, he's not going to be there. Yeah, he's not comfortable. He's not.

You can't. Can't project where you're going to end up with that. So if I rent, I mean the alimony. I wouldn't rent in my room. I'd go buy something.

I don't think that's too much cash for 150,000 or condo. Yeah. And the condo fees. Yeah. Yeah.

But you've got 150,000 freed up when you do that. And that's at the end of the 50. That's, you know, then you've got 200.

And that'll be, that will grow to a half million dollars by the time you're 75.

And so that's 72, 72. So, and you'll be adding to it during that time. And so you could retire in a very good shape, you know, in your early 70s. But the variable is if we could triple your income. Right.

And that changes. That changes the math on this. Be it up dramatically. And increases the probability of a good outcome. And the bad news is you're by yourself.

The great news is you're by yourself. You don't have to convince anybody to do this. But you. And you, you know, all the baggage is in the rear view mirror. That's why they call them an X.

Wow. I'm so sorry. I know Karen. That's horrible. That's horrible thing to go through.

So, yeah, gang, we talk about this all the time. Combining your finances and having full transparency and full decision making as a paired thing. Both of us know everything that's going on, both of us know. And so that gives us checks and balances. And we do that.

Yeah. And I can hear. And my other year, people are like, this is why you don't combine. Yeah. But here's exactly why you do combine.

Because you got you're looking over his shoulder and the first time he day trades, you shut the whole thing.

Yeah. Well, if you're looking at the details, what you're saying. But he took her. They had money combined. And he took her 401. Yeah.

But they weren't combined in their operating of their household. Okay, 100%.

“That's why I'm saying is I can hear someone say, oh, my gosh, that scares me.”

I want to keep my stuff over here to protect it to make sure that he doesn't touch it. But what I'm saying is, Then you should have to, that's it.

That too. Yes.

“If you can't sit down together and both of you talk about everything and going on with your money,”

you shouldn't get married in the first place.

And I'm talking about her. I'm just talking about her. I don't know. Yes. And it's easy in a marriage.

Just to let one person you do this, I do this. And it's kind of what she said. I did the monthly budget. He did the investing. And you both have to be doing both as well.

But George just did fresh research.

And it was amazing. It used to be a lower number.

“But he found that if a person day trades”

for consecutively for 24 months, 97% lose money. Mm. I believe it. That's all of you.

That's stupid. And all eggs in one basket.

He put everything in one thing.

And every single time I drive down that road, a kid throws a rocket my car. You know, I'm not driving down that road anymore. I mean, 97%. That's not even a statistic.

That's just a fact. Now. So just day trading is stupid is what that means. And so soon somebody says that. All of your bells, whistles and alarms need to be going off and going.

No, no, no, no, no, no. No with the capital H, no. We're not doing this. No. Wow.

I'm sorry. I'm sorry, Karen. I'm sorry you went through this. I'm not, we're not preaching at you. No, no.

No, no, no. That just to be aware of that. These are the reasons. The situations like yours are while we get so hyped up, against some of the things that happen to you.

Yep. That's what it amounts to. Wow. Karen calls back if you need us, though. We don't need you.

You want to be on. Anyway, we can't. Yeah. Wow. Absolutely.

I put this out of the Ramsay show in the books. We'll be back with you before you know it.

“In the meantime, remember, there's ultimately only one way”

to financial peace. And that's to walk daily. With the Prince of Peace, Christ Jesus.