Wise Money Decisions Start With Clear Priorities

Normal is broken, common sense is weird, so we're here to help you transform your life.

From the Ramsey Network and the Fair Wins Credit Union Studio, this is the Ramsey Show. With your cruise, Ramsey personality, number one best selling offer, co-host, smart money happy hour, my daughter is my co-host today.

“Open phones, a AAA-825-5225, fill-up is in Los Angeles, high fill-up, how are you?”

Hello, I'm okay, how are you? Better than I deserve, what's up? I'm having difficulty staying away from new debt, and I'm on babysitter number two, and I'm having difficulty with budgeting. Those would go together, would that make sense?

Yeah, is it any, any type of like business that are all consumer debt in your household, but you're trying to stay away from them? Consumer. Okay. Any specific type that you find yourself in a lot?

Credit cards and medical.

Medical and credit cards, what's going on with the medical? Oh my, well, just having difficulty with the co-pays and doctors and dentists and things like that. Okay, more just routine type medical things, or is there ongoing sickness or concern? Routine.

Routine. Okay, okay. How old are you? 49. 49.

How many kids you got? 0. Okay, you single? I'm married. Okay.

And what's your household income?

I would guess 40, 45,000 dollars a year. What do you all do for a living? My wife is in clerical and I work in a grocery store as a courtesy clerk. Okay. It doesn't sound like you guys are peaking out on your careers.

Correct. Yeah. I'm not. My wife is okay. But 45,000 dollars in Southern California.

For two people working 40 hours, that's not your not working 40 hours. Yeah, I'm not working 40 hours a week. That's right. I'm a programmer. Yeah.

Why? Just the way the company does it. No, why are you working not working 40 hours doing something? I'm looking for 40-hour week job and it's hard right now for me. Have you ever had one a different type of career?

I've done other things with cashiering and with driving. Okay. Yeah. Okay. Is there something that you are facing or that you're trying to work your way through

that we're not understanding here that's keeping a 49-year-old man from getting a job and holding it down? Yeah, a little bit of emotional stuff, a little baggage because I have the long history here. Okay. And so that's also playing into the medical bills, right?

Right. Okay. Now, that makes more sense. Okay. A little more mercy then.

All right.

“So here's the thing, there's a connecting line here between these things.”

So let me kind of walk through it, so the emotional healing produces a version of Philip that allows him to work more and earn more, which allows him to have more money to budget. And so the actual cause of some of the things you called about goes all the way back to you completing your healing journey. Is that logical to you?

Yeah. And so in other words, the stronger version of Philip we have, that's got the scars of the past healed enough to function at a full capacity. And then that version of Philip works 60 hours, two jobs, three jobs. And that version of Philip brings him a lot more money than $45,000 in Los Angeles.

Yeah. And that changes the whole budget transaction. It does. You have Dr. John Deloni in my head, Philip, where he is, he leans into, you have to have action as well.

I'm all about you healing from, you know, what it is, but there's been a pattern. It sounds like most of your adult life where you haven't gone beyond what you're doing now. And I think I would, it's a both hands. Yes.

I do agree.

“But you, you have to action in the he wants to go up.”

And the action of getting up at 6 a.m. going to a job, getting dressed, getting up the

yourself till 5 p.m. 6 p.m.

For dinner and you leave and go home, there's like, there's a confidence in a rhythm.

That'll double your income. That is good for you, Philip, paired with being able to, you know, unpack what you need to unpack and understand yourself and not have high levels of anxiety, all of that. But I, I think it's a both hands. And so if I, I think it's, I think it's part of your healing journey to go and be productive

because I think that's going to give you some confidence. And when you get paychecks in that are double what it is now and you can sustain and sustain you in your wife and you're not behind and you're not so stressed and bogged down and feeling like, oh my gosh, I don't know how we're going to make the next paycheck. Some of that confidence of, hey, look, we're literally bringing in tangible money, double what

we were and that, not that money brings you confidence. But you know what I'm saying, like, it will, it will give you a sense of pride and dignity. Yeah.

But I think it's really good for you.

Yeah. Swaggerty wall versus sleep. I mean, versus being home to 11, work in a half day or dinner, do you know what I mean? Yeah. I think there's a level of that business and productivity that's going to be really good

“for you, Philip and you have to to just say current on your bills.”

Yeah. There's a point that, yeah, there's not, there's not going to be much of a choice. So you guys are going to get behind and live off credit cards for the rest of your life. And that's going to cause more stress and anxiety. So what I would do that will help push you into that is to go back all the way to the beginning

of the call and answer your actual question was, okay, I'm struggling with budgeting and I'm struggling with debt staying away from debt.

And so the way you fix both of those things is the same way we're talking about this

other issue with great intentionality and action. So the intentionality is I'm going to ask you to pretend that someone is paying you $100,000 a year to manage this couple's budget in Los Angeles. And this couple's budget has a husband named Philip. And if you were paid to do that, you could do it.

And you could sit down, you talked to you, you're an intelligent guy. You can sit down and do a budget and we'll hook you up with every dollar. The budgeting happened. You and your wife sit down and you say, "We're going to tell every dollar before it gets here what to do and then we're going to stick to that."

That's intentionality. Then when you're doing that and there's a problem, then you've got to say, "Well, the reason we're doing all of this is to get out of that and stay out of that." So we're not going to use debt to fix our problems anymore or in-person or whatever. But the reason that is popping up is you don't have a good solid detailed plan.

Because if you got a good solid detailed plan, it's going to point out that you need more income and you're going to go get the income. Well, and I would assume you're rent and Los Angeles has got to be most of your page. I mean, if you're bringing home fourth, four grand a month.

Not even.

“I mean, yeah, I mean, two grand a month, I mean, I don't know, I just, I think that”

there's, when you start to look at the math and see, you guys will probably be, I mean, you're probably already cutting back, but I would cut up the credit cards and not make it an option and that will force the math to show you that the income really is the major problem here. Exactly.

Exactly. So there's two sides of the equation, folks, the income side and the output side, and you want to win, you've got to be both of them. Yeah, but increase in your income, constantly thinking about long-term and short-term, what kind of do you get the income up and what kind of do long-term and short-term to get

the output down? So, stupid car, sell the boat, I don't know, what is it, what's in your way? What's keeping you from winning? When I'm done talking to you, you're still going to be okay and I'm still going to be okay, but what's keeping you from winning?

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They do it on purpose, no one accidentally is married for 45 years, sharing our getting ready

to hit 44. It's not accidental. No one accidentally raises great kids. It's a lot of work and a lot of intentionality. No one accidentally stays in shape.

Donuts accidentally happen, not staying in shape. Okay? And so you've got to do everything intentionally and when you're doing intentionally with money, it means you're working some kind of a system, some kind of a plan to build wealth.

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or Google Play. Jackson, Tampa, how jack are you? I'm all right, are you better than I deserve, what's up? Um, so I've got a couple of questions. I am fresh out of school.

I just graduated from the University of Tennessee last year. Go for all of them. Go for all. Yeah, what's your question? I got a degree in supply,

chain management. Oh, good for you. Keller, you landed the first big job. I did well.

It's actually construction jobs and not exactly what I studied, but yeah, so what do you make up? I got a pretty pretty good job. I'm making 80 grand a year straight out of school. That's sweet. Good for you. Yes, sir. Thank you. So I guess the

“main, main question I have is my girlfriend is still in school and she is, she does not”

have an income right now. She's in school to get her D.P.T. So Dr. Daphysical Therapy. Um, and then at which point she will be in debt at around 70, she'll be around 70 grand a debt after getting out of school. Um, I currently am saving for a ring. I don't have any debt to the moment. Good. Um, I just don't have a ton in my savings and I'm worried that once that 70 grand hits, I mean, assuming things go

well with my girlfriend, which I fully do plan on, I plan on getting engaged in all that stuff. Um, but I'm just kind of looking at that. And it's a little nerve wrecking to have that kind of head over my head. Well, you're a supply chain guy. You're looking down the field down the line and seeing what's coming. Way to go, man. Yes, sir. Like, like, actually, like you were trying to do, congratulations. So you worry

that you won't be able to make the payment or clear it up. I'm just not, I'm worried

“that I won't be able to clear it up. When does she graduate? I think she'll graduate”

in about a year, but she won't start having a job until I think she said a October. Well, um, not as next. I think it just takes a little bit of time. They've got to pass a couple certifications outside of school. So through the summer, she'll do that. Okay. Yeah, so she's got to pass her board. And then when she gets a job in October of next year, what will she be making with starting salary for her? 60, 90. Uh, it's a look. Yeah,

it's looking like around 80 to 90. Okay. No, why don't you just live off your, assuming you guys get married in that time period? Why don't you guys, yeah, live off your income, which will probably be up a little bit more of 80 and then throw her income at her dead. And you guys are out in the year. Okay. Um, but I'm looking, I'm just looking at my savings. I've currently got around three grand in the high yield savings account, like two hundred

two grand. But you've been working a whole month. Okay. And she's going to have, she's going to have, she's going to have an income jack. She'll have an income. Right. So, you know, you, if you save like a crazy man between now and the time you get married, when would you think you get married before October of next year? No, definitely not. Probably in like two to three years. So why? He's like, whoa, whoa, I'm saving everything. Mary's is rings. I don't think

that's a lot coming down the pike. And I'm sort of, she doesn't live with me, but um, we do do hang out a lot. I live with my brother, but we kind of, I pay for most pretty much everything, which I'm comfortable doing. And you don't need to be paying for anything, if you're a married and you need to be piling up cash by ringing cash. I have an emergency fund in cash and

need to get married sooner than you're thinking. But by the time you get married, you'll, you'll

probably have enough to pay it off or almost pay it off. And then the two of you'll be making 200,000 between the two of you by then. My gosh, man, you'll be able to knock it up no time. Okay. Well, and Jack, it's not your responsibility to pay on her debt until you are married. Exactly. Do not pay a dime up. Yeah. So if you did your way and you guys got married in three years, though, then you shouldn't be stressed about it because she, yeah, that's her problem, not yours at that

point. But if you're getting married, you know, she passes her boards. She gets a job knocked over.

You get married knocked over. You might not have 70 by then stored up, but you might. You really

might. That's 18 months from now. You're making 80, 90 K and you don't have any expenses. So what's the difference? You're going to be with all that money. Well, it's 70,000. I don't know. He's making 18 months. Yeah. So I mean, he's going to probably say for the wedding, say for ring. Yeah, there's some stuff, but all that to say, you guys together, once you're married, yes, you'll be fine. I appreciate the caution and a little bit of that, and he's because if

because if I am Jack, and I'm like, okay, I'm debt free. I'm now going above my net worth and saving, and then I'm going to have this massive debt entering my life once I get married. That can feel weighty for sure. But that's just so emotional. It's not logical when you look at both of the numbers of what you guys are making, you'll be fine. And you know, I'm bragging on your Jack about getting your degree and supply chain. Your decision-making paradigm that you're taught,

your method of thinking that you're taught in order to get that degree can work against you as you're planning this marriage, and you'll get paralysis of the analysis and go, we'll get married

“in eight years. No, you need to, you need to just, oh, man, the young man get married. If she's the one,”

yes, if this, if you're going to get engaged, don't we don't need 73-month engagements. Good Lord, all because you overanalyze stuff. So don't analyze it, get done, get it done, man. And, you know, you're going to be okay. Both of you got great careers. Both of you, you neither want to be a stupid degrees and left-handed puppetry or something. You both got the ability to step out of school into 80 grand. Nope. I mean, not many degrees do that. So pretty strong. Pretty strong.

You guys are going to be fine. And don't, don't use your training and over-analyze getting married. Just do it. Jeff is in, Raleigh. Hey, Jeff, what's up?

Hey, you guys, thanks so much for taking my call. Long time listener. Thanks. First time calling. So I

essentially completed baby steps one, two and three. I got rid of the state of the truck,

“$60,000 truck, $200,000 payment, that's gone enough. How painful was that?”

Oh, it's still hurt. What kind of truck was it? And $35,00 silver out of $1,00. All over the country. So that was hard to say. That's a great truck. Good for you. You manned up at the right thing. You're acting like a grown-up. Boy to go. If I could have bit one out of built that one. So it's like, but it was the right thing to do. Yep. According to you, it seems to be. It is the right thing to do. But I hate, I'm who I'm with.

Yeah, I hate it. How can we help Jeff? So I'm 29. I'm married to kids. We have essentially eliminated our debt to this point outside of our home. And she locked that we took out on the home to help eliminate that debt. We had almost $80,000 in credit card debt that the heat lock paid off, which the interest down to 6% with the heat lock over 20 years versus, you know, $3,000. I think credit card bills that we were paying. Well, you're not enslaved after three then. You didn't

eliminate the debt. You moved it. So that was kind of my question. It should my next step be pay off the heat lock. Yes. Okay. Yes. You didn't get out of that. Yeah, you just moved your debt.

“And you can't hide from it. It's still there. So you need to, you need drawback and punch that”

thing in the nose and finish it up.

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Wi-Refi.com/Ramsy. That's the letter Wi-R-E-F-Y.com/Ramsy might not be in all states. Today's question comes from Lewis and Connecticut. How should interest from high yield savings

accounts be handled? I've so far ignored the accumulating interest because of baby steps six and seven

still feel very surreal. Should I be entering the interest as income on the every dollar app to include it into paying more on the house giving and investing or should I leave it in savings and let it continue to grow? I probably, it's funny. We actually have our interest as income. The every dollar app on our high yield savings just to be like, hey, we're making this. You don't have a mortgage. It's available. Do I know? But I'm just saying in general,

if you have a lot of money in savings, that high yield, it's wild what it can produce. Year after year. So it is a real thing that if you're on a baby step six, you should not have a lot of money in savings. It should be. You should have your emergency plan out. But I just don't mean. And the amount of high yield savings that that is producing should be minimal. And so what that tells me is you got a whole big chunk of money sitting in high yield savings.

“You should have thrown it to mortgage. That's what I think is going on Lewis.”

It's going to be really money to fit in something else. Yeah. I mean, 3% on 30,000 bucks is nine hundred dollars a year. That's not enough. That's not enough to ask this question over. Okay. You would throw that up and throw it at the mortgage. It's a no-brainer. But you got a bunch of money in there. You've been saving money over there and you've not, you've not applied your, you got all this high yield savings. It's going to put in on your

mortgage and you need to take your dead gum mortgage and get rid of it. Unless they are saving for something specific that they're going to use that money for. Again, it shouldn't be $200,000 for something. No. I mean, it should be the amount you should have. I mean, you're saving for Christmas or saving for replacing a car or something like that. A vacation. Okay, fair. Okay. It shouldn't be that much money. I know. But when he said that, I was like, oh my gosh.

“That's what you do. Yeah. But you have a lot in high yield savings because you're all”

doing other things with that and you're on a mortgage. Yeah. Yeah. So do I. But yeah. But in that case, you would just take that interest and do exactly what you said and add it to your income. Sir. Andrews and Little Rock, I endrew. How are you? I'm doing well. How are you? Better than I deserve. What's up? Yeah. Thank you so much for taking my call. I'm going to listen to this and we are flying real very big and tired of being sick and tired

and we are trying to figure out how to best go about getting out of death. We currently have two junk cars that we are driving. Good. Have a lot of issues. However, and we trying to figure out if we should fix them or if we should buy another one or in what would be a fair safe amount to put to us them. How much other repairs costing you guys?

80 problems we have in batteries. What is the car worth? It's worth 3000.

“Oh, no, you don't spend three grand on a 3000 dollar car. That's a net zero. So you don't”

fix these suspension and the suspension is the big number. They're all you want to fix the AC and you got to put a battery in it, right? Yeah. Yeah, I don't fix the suspension on a 3000 dollar car. It's gone. Okay. I mean, if the suspension has completely gone out to where the car is sitting on this sitting on its belly on the road, which didn't happen, this is just a mechanic that looked and said, oh, you're suspensions loose. Well, so what? Guess what? It's a tragedy car.

Of course, the suspension's loose is worn out. That as long as the car will drive, will it drive?

It does drive. Good. It's just loosey goosey, right? Yeah. I mean, you run, you run fine for the

most quality doesn't make a lot of squeaky sound. Yeah, here's one. We just come to about 60. Yeah, I was driving a car that's probably worth 400 dollars after I went broke. The main color of it was Bondo. Okay. And it had 418,000 actual miles on it. It was an absolute piece of crap. And I drove that car for what felt like 10 years, one, three month period. And during that three months, I all I thought about was how about I hate this car? And I spend all my waking hours working

to put money together to move up a little bit in car and pay cash. And then move up a little bit of

“car and pay cash. And that's why today, when someone gripes about Dave Ramsey bought a nice car,”

will kiss my butt. I know what it feels like to have been there. And I'm not going to drive that anymore. I don't have to. I worked my way out of that hole. So what I want you to do is get really, really mad about being here. And don't call me back in four years and say, I listen to you all the time on driving during cars. You need to go get out of that junk car by getting this mess cleaned up in your finances and work your butt off. Get mad about driving something that, and realistically,

Andrew, it may only last you guys another four to five months. Yeah. And then if it's Dave, I'll let it slide. Yes. Throw it away and buy another three thousand dollar car, but don't spend $3,000 on three thousand dollar car. Yeah. Yeah. Those are throw away cars. And let me tell you guys, if you're at that level, okay, this car that I'm talking about was loaned to me. It wasn't even my car, which is even worse. And like the cops are following me around because they're like, what are you

doing driving this car in this end of town? You know, and it's like, are you here to rob something? You know, and so I was being profiled based on my car and it says, you don't know what Bondo is? Well, I think so. Bondo is the filler you put in when you have a car wreck, used to. They don't do it anymore. Oh, or it's, okay. It's showing on hardwoods. Well, yeah, it's a filler. Okay. If like if you had a dent, you would throw it into it. I got the joke now. Yeah. Okay. So the predominant color

was dent was Bond. It was dent filler. Okay. And make sense. I always pictured like a red door and

a thank you Google image. Yeah. There we go. Well done. All right. Yeah. You sand that stuff. Oh, I see. Yeah. Fill it in and then you paint over it. Yeah. All right. All right. So I had less and learn. All right.

“So here's the thing though. Guys, if you're, if you are in that market for a short period of time,”

it should be for a short period of time because you're so pissed off that you're willing to do anything to never drive like that again. I'm going to drive like no one else so that I never have to drive like no one else again. I'm going to pay a price to get out of this mess. And part of it is I'm going to drive a car that we have to give it a name because it's pitiful. Old blue, big bestie. Whatever it is, right? And you have to have a little yacht horn going to burn. So go,

if you want to buy one of those, here's where you get them. Grudge sales. This is a $1,000, $2,000 car. Facebook Marketplace. And this is Facebook Marketplace, too. This is a dog ugly car. No car dealer would even put this on their lot. It's ancient, but it has not many miles and has a lot of life left in it, but you couldn't tell it cosmetically. That's what you're looking for when you're buying a tourist $3,000, $4,000 a car. It's zero sex appeal and you will get no

dates if you're single based on your car. And this is what you're looking for for short period of time. And you go bananas on that because a car is the thing that kills your finances. And I love cars. I've got nice cars now, but they kill your finances. And if this is going on year after year after year after year after year, I'm not saying drive that kind of car for three years. I'm saying do it for three months, five months, eight months, whatever. And we're just going absolutely

crazy. Be sure you take pictures of it. And you can put them, you know, you can light around, you can

we drove this car. And that's why you ain't poor, no more kid. You can do the grandpa thing, right? You know, we changed our family tree back in all 26, you know. And because that's the stuff you're doing right now, Andrew. I'm proud of you. Now, but you're going to have to suck it up and knock it in the face. You got to get after it. You got to get pissed off. I'm not living like this.

I've never been poor. I've only been broke. Poor is a state of mind.

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Justin's in Chicago. Hey Justin, what's up in your world? Hi, Steve. How are you guys?

Better than we deserve. How can we help? Okay, I think this is like a really good question for you and your daughter. How should you set up hate in a family business? That is my basic question. Like market value. You pay? No, like I can I can like go into it. So I make $120,000 a year working for my dad and I'm asked for a raise and he just acts like acts like I'm capped out and there's like no other way to advance in a family business and I'm wondering if you're

working towards shares or what you feel that way or that was told to you. I feel that way. Like I haven't had a rate of 10 years of my dad says I'm capped out. Like that was much as we can pay you for your job. Okay, so the answer to your question overall is what Rachel said

“and that is that what you should be paid in a family business is what the job pays.”

And so it's the job you're in is capped out. That's fine. But if you weren't there and your dad had to hire someone else to do that job, what would he have to pay in the market? How do we now about 120,000? And what do you make? About 120,000. Okay, then why would you make more than he would have to pay to replace you? Well, that's kind of my question that like it's a generational family business and that's not how my grandpa did it. He paid his kids way more.

So they could save him by more locations. It's a very large business. Yeah. So what I would do in that case is not to pay you more for your job but I would give you some percentage of profits as a family member and treat you like an owner. Okay, whether you got percentage actual of actual ownership

“or whether you got paid as an owner. So what you should do in this situation or in this”

thing is to say, all right, let me ask you this. If you went and got a job doing what you do somewhere else, what could you get paid? So for the industry, it's got a little bigger about after a couple years probably about what I've had right now, about 120. But I've been working for my dad 20. Doesn't matter how long you've been working there. What matters is what the job is

what you're being paid. You're not being underpaid. Correct. Okay. And you're not being overpaid. Now, so then you separate the being paid for the job with being an owner. So you've got employee and you've got owner and you can wear both hats. But just not, you just don't confuse them and convolut them. And so if you're dad wanted to be like your granddad and move some dollars your way out as an ownership position, even if it wasn't an actual stock. But instead, I'm going

“to give you some percentage like Grandpa, you should say, what is the profit of the company each”

year? Not profit. Not profit, about 8 to 10 million. Okay. Do you have other siblings in the business?

I do not, but I have cousins in the business. So that's where my dad has five business partners. And are the cousins paid just for their jobs as well? Or are they getting just for their jobs? But they're paid just as much as me. Like, it doesn't make any sense how they set up the pay structure. Okay. That's kind of, so I guess my dad's right. Like, I can't separate the job. I know, yeah. And that overpaid are underpaid. I know I'm getting what I give my job. But my question

more is like, my dad had told me at one point, you know, give me a hundred thousand dollars and I'll sell you my shares of this and I had the money to do it. Then he re-nigged on that and then he took that. But that's a different

discussion. Wait, wait. So I'm dead or I just don't know how most families do it. Most families do it,

but they don't re-nig. Yeah. But just to the diabetes, we're willing to sell the shares to be something gifted. I mean, for that ownership. Either one's okay. There's not an ethical construct on that. Lots of those small business owners we work with sell their shares to the next generation. That's not unusual at all. Some of them allow them to participate in profits to buy out. The percentage is over time, quickly. Some of them gift them and just gift them. And so it's not a

“thing. So, you know, but there's not a, you know, your dad's not, no, the only thing he's done that I've”

heard so far in this whole conversation this wrong is re-nigging. Yeah. And so when was that? Oh, that was maybe about two years ago. And his reasoning was he wouldn't be able to be the president of the corporation because he got it washed shares and some of his brothers and some alternative ice. I don't know. So. So, would you be, some of his shares or all of his shares when that was. No, it was a small poor like a hundred thousand dollars from like maybe like a one percent

stake of his shares just for me. You know, like just to give your kid to have some, like he just doesn't want to give me something, which I understand. You don't want to. So how many brothers are in the deal? Uh, he has three brothers and two cousins in the deal. So. Okay. And you've got cousins in the deal also. Yeah. I'm all kind of trying to figure out how to get away. It's like my grandpa set up more simply because he was one person and, you know, put a cap on all of the stories

to get a rent check and then gave like a 10 percent profit sharing. So my dad was making way more

than a job entailed. But, and then my great grandpa actually just sold because it was just that allowed them to pay him with the profits over the years from business. So it's a bunch of different

“ways and I don't. Well, here's what I think should happen for the good of the business. And all the”

people that we're talking about brothers and cousins and everything else, you guys do not, your dad and his generation does not have a plan. Correct. And that is, that's my whole issue. It's going to run off all the family members that are talented because they're going to go do something else with their life. And it's also, you know, they're holding on so tightly, "Oh God, I won't be the president." And there's no succession planning. There's no general, there's no generational agreement

on what we're going to do. There may not even be good partnership agreements between him and his brothers. I don't know. Correct. But, if they want to save this business generationally, they need to sit down starting next week and put together a partnership agreement that they all agree to and then be, it needs to include a succession plan of what to do with you and your generation and how to make the transition and ownership and how to make the transitions and profits.

So an example would be with what you've told me about this that would be healthy from a mental health and a relational health standpoint. I don't know if your bunch can pull it off, but a good thing would be that you guys sit down and the brothers come up with an operating agreement that that says your dad is the president until such time regardless of his ownership position. And that allows him then to begin to transfer some of the ownership position without losing the presidency.

Because eventually he won't happen. Yeah. Yeah. And because he can't, if he can't do good

then you guys are going to die. The business is not going to make it. You guys are going to fight with each other and the enemy is within. The enemy is in the building. It's no longer competition. It's no longer trying to serve the marketplace. You guys are all just scrambling for all the crumbs inside the building. That is not healthy. It's going to blow up relationships and it's going to end the business. We see it all the time. We coach family businesses that do stupid but

“stuff like this all the time. And so you guys have got your dad has to sit down if you want to save it.”

And if he wants to save the relationship with his kids and his brothers, they need to sit down and develop an operating agreement for today that includes him continuing to be president in my opinion based on what you told me for x period of time and begin to transfer shares into the other generation and that generation also has an operating agreement as to how these things run after a succession. It could be that you split the business up and each of you take your store and go on

your way like your grandpa used to do and that might be the healthiest thing of all. But you guys not having a plan and you know and then reneging on stuff to stay president is a good way to screw up the whole thing. And staying so consistent for 10 years of your income and not moving one inch is deflating. So he either was overpaid 10 years ago. Yeah. And it is what it is but there's no

“movement in that there's no debt or no there's not and not that you have to move up outside of”

market value. I'm not saying that but to not have a raise for 10 years. Well that something's wrong there. Yeah. They either started too high or something's weird about this position or something. Yeah. But again that can be solved for sure. By just saying we're going to leave that income there because it's market value but we're going to add some percentages of ownership over here and let you share in the profits and all of a sudden you get to raise. Yeah.

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That's GuardianLIT.com/RAMSI. It's earning advertising results may vary in no specific outcome is guaranteed. Welcome back to the Ramsey Show in the Fair Wins Credit Union Studio. Rachel Cruz is my co-host today. We're going to take an hour and do something that we haven't done in a long time. We're going to do a theme hour. And we're going to talk about real estate. And to do that, I brought in one of my good friends for many, many years. One of the top real estate mines in real estate

coaches in America, Brian Buffini, flew in from his home in California to hang out with us. We've been hanging out for a couple of days, having all kinds of discussions. We get to do all kinds of fun stuff together. But we thought, hey, we better get him here on the air while he's here. And we better mine this mine. He knows more about this real estate stuff than anybody moving around

out there and have a really good discussion. Welcome, my friend. It is always a pleasure and we've

had a great week and I'm looking forward to it today. If you've been listening to show for a while, you've heard Brian on here a couple of different times. We're promoting his book, The Immigrant Advantage, and which is a best seller years ago when that came out three years ago. Maybe five. Maybe five. Yeah, I'll tell you. It's a way. Yeah, okay. And it's not going to be Southern accents this hour either. No, no. We'll have, I love listening to you. It's a Southern Ireland,

that's it. I just like the Irish accent. You know, we are, we're big in the real estate Ireland, you know what I mean? The potato famine and all that good stuff. All right, let's get to this. The real estate market is a problem. We've talked about a lot here on the air that the shortage of inventory and the weird blip on the radar car called COVID drove prices up unbelievably.

in that that we're currently at the oldest median age for a first-time home buyer, right? Yeah,

“40 years of age. So median half above and half below. So how old were you when you bought your first”

house? Uh, 22. Yeah. We drove by one of the original houses. That was a flipper out of the one. Last night we're going to dinner. We drove by one of those rehabs. Yeah, that's good. Yeah, I was 23. Yeah. So Brian, this is the pain point. I feel like we hear so much. I mean, housing and buying a home is a financial goal from a majority of people as it should be. But it's just they're feeling this tension and this point and it starts to feel hopeless, right? And we're talking

about something out of reach. Yeah. We're talking about social media earlier. But I get in that algorithm and you just see people. And in it's some complaining, which I'm like, listen, I get it. That it is hard. But then also it starts to feel as people start throwing facts and figures, which why I love that you're on, because you can maybe combat some of that or affirm some of it. But it just feels like today more than ever than any time in the home buying process, it's harder

with just the price of homes and common all of that. What would you say to someone that just well, yes, the answer is correct. But if you've talked to, you know, people from the 60s and they bought a house for eight grand, they thought their arms and legs were going to fall off and they ate spaghetti for three years. You know, everybody feels that way. Yeah. Everybody also does, oh, do you see that property over there? I could have bought that in 1979 for $8 in the packet of peanuts.

And now it's worth 20 minutes, 20 million, but I didn't buy it. So, you know, that that's never going

to change what we have is what I call an anaconda's meal. Okay. You know, the anaconda, yeah, it eats like a sheep. Only from the dinner for lunch, eight months to digest it. And that's kind of where we are with real estate, right? Let's say that COVID, free money, you know, 2% loans,

“everything jumped up, COVID people were living in small houses. Remember, I remember there was”

the tiny house movement, remember the tape? Well, when we were all living together for 10 months, locked up, nobody wanted a tiny house. I don't want to see you. I want an office. I want to school. Yeah. I want a gym. So, now people got bigger houses, lower interest rates. And you had this massive jump in the market. When the Fed adjusted the rates, because they overcooked it, it was the fastest rise in rates in 120 years. Since the Federal Reserve existed, they intentionally

stall the market like stalling that airplane. So, they intentionally put the brakes on and the brakes have kind of been on ever since. Yeah. So, to backtrack a little bit, 10 years ago, the median age of a first-time home bar was what? 30 years old. And so, in 10 years, it went from 30 to 40. Yeah. And this is the highest median age since we've kept records. Since we kept records, go back to 1908, the most in a decade was two years to change. That was a great depression.

And then the next great change was during the war. And then we had the baby boomers and, you know, America exploded in the housing after that. Yes. And so, this is, it's, so that's, it is a shock. It is a shock to the system. And, and, and what I do here is that people don't feel crazy. If people are feeling this, they're not crazy. No. It is, there's a reality to it. And, but they're losing hope. And that's the danger. You can't lose hope. That's right. That's right.

That's about to dig in. We're not going to get in the loss of hope business or the sanctioning of a victim. But there's also the reality of the numbers. Yeah. And so, based on that reality, then you've got a solution. We have to come up with a solution. So, we'll work on that throughout this time we've got together. I want to do that. And so, rates are pretty much just date the same. Yeah. For, what, three years? Yeah. I mean, look, we were heading on a nice path.

And I was, I thought we'd be at between five eight to six to this year. And then we got a

“ran. You got oil. You got all that stuff, which is another blip in the screen. But I think what's”

going to happen is it's, it's, we might even have a slight rate hike before the end of the year. Eventually, rates are going to settle around six. Six percent's a healthy, inches right by a thing. You know, we remember how much of it's going to show a fire. Don't just say, well, then that's perspective, too, right? Because you have, you know, my age group that we don't remember the Carter years, right? Or the, you know what I mean? Like,

when the Oliver's selling houses. 1989, I was in a real estate office. And we had a 10 percent party. We were stirring the porridge. We were dancing it up. Pizza was in the music was playing because the rates had come down to 10 percent. Yeah. So yeah, historically the rates were ridiculously low. I mean, 2 percent and 3 percent mortgages are artificially governmentally created. So for a government to loan a bank money at 0 percent is not sustainable, especially when the

government's paying 5 percent to the people who loaned it the money. Yes. So it's artificial. And I saw this on one of these slides that you gave us, which I thought was fascinating is that,

yeah, the median age for the first time home buyer is 40. But 25 percent of single women

are outpacing men. Yeah. Two and a half to one. And buy and buy homes. All the single ladies are

“all single ladies. Yeah. So men are feeling the need to hit the home run is what I can see. Okay.”

And so they're like, I don't feel like there's a 25 to 35 year old man. Yeah, 25, 30. Well,

we know that exact demographic because online gambling has gone from 5 billion a year,

250 billion a year in three years. Thank you, draft king. Thank you, draft kings. And you want to know why men aren't buying houses? Yeah, draft kings. Yeah. And remember, you couldn't have a sports team in Vegas and you couldn't have an advertiser. And now because they all own a piece of the action, young men are buying the lakers and the Celtics and the the sooner's because they don't think, you know, save 300 bucks a month. It's not going to do me anything. Let me put it all on the

lakers. And so they're hoping for the big win. And with the big win, they're hoping the number one question of the online gambling bros is what would you do with the monies if you had a huge thing they'd set up by house. So it's that lack of hope. And you look, what happens is when you have a lack of hope. As soon as I get desperate, I get stupid. Yeah. And you're not swinging, you're not swinging to hit singles and doubles. You're swinging for the fence. And every time you swing for the fence,

“you strike out. And that's what brought the crypto bros up too. Yep. They're looking for a”

dad gum easy money. And well, the ladies, I never can make him wise. Well, when are just there?

They're just going, we're just going to put some money away. Yeah. Yeah. The house is a bigger deal. Wow. Well, I can't go easy to keep talking about this because there is a plan in a great way for people to be homeowners. And so yeah, and you're part of that. I wouldn't be here without us. It's great. Brian Buffini is with us. We're talking real estate this hour. What you guys all want to talk about and we're going to help you with it. We're also going to talk about the realities of what you're

doing out there. Hey, guys, George Campbell here. Two things you should know about me. I love a good movie, and I hate overpaying for things. An angel just checked both boxes. They've got a new movie called Young Washington, the story of George Washington's early life as a soldier

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agents than anyone else in America. So he's really got his finger on the pulse of what's going on in the real estate world. And he and I've been talking offline about this because we've been friends for years. And the the the thing, one of the conclusions I've come to Brian is that there's not a that the people who are feeling hopeless and and are just screaming and throwing a fit on social media and yelling at boomers. You bought your house for a bite, basket of strawberries,

thing, are really too simplistic at how they're looking at this because instead of looking for a solution, they're just laying in the floor, fumbling at the mouth and having a fit. Because there's a lot of different problems. Let's go back to one thing and then I want to take this down a couple of that ways. One thing you were talking about was the number of houses

sold this year. Yeah. Four million and it'll be this year. It was like 4.1 last year. Right.

And the last time we got about a million houses on the market in the market. Yeah. And that's been that way for about four years. Yeah, almost for. And the last time we had that few homes sold was in 1995 when there were 80 million less people living in the country. So you have big population increase. All economics to play in demand. So you have 80 million more people, which is why prices are continuing to go up and will continue to go up. If you are watching YouTube,

It is not true. It is clickbait. It's unfortunate that people are going to make it about. The

“prices are going up because there's a inventory shortage, supply and demand. Supply and demand.”

You've got 100 million more people chasing the same number of sales. Yeah. And so we've got a

supply problem. We continue to have a supply problem. And that is due to several things. So there's a bill sitting on the president's desk for him to sign. He just pushed it aside a few minutes ago as we're recording this or broadcasting this. I don't know when you folks are going to be listening to this, but something else may have happened by then. But for right now, he pushed it to the side. So you're not signing it to let you get some other political favors on some other stuff.

He's working on it. But that bill is called the Road Act. And it was, it had good intention. You and I agree, it's full of a bunch of pork and crap. But Congress can screw up Christmas, but the idea is the idea was that they're going to limit corporate hedge fund buyers and Chinese foreign nationals and so forth from buying thousands of single family homes and starving that supply we're talking about. Yeah, allegedly. They're going to limit the idea of limiting

it as a good idea. Yeah, it was, I proposed it to the president of all the air and I said, President Trump, if you're listening. Yeah. And apparently he was or somebody was, because I put the bill out like 60 days later in January. They got the bill passed. But by the time they got it through Congress, they screwed it up, putting all his crap in it. Yeah. And they, you know, what was initially proposed was a great bill? Limit to 350 homes, single family homes. Yeah. That a corporation can

own because they're stealing them from first time home buyers. 100%. So, first time buyers. And by the

way, they get, they get tax advantages. So, a giant, you know, multi-billion dollar company gets

all of these tax advantages that a single family that's, you know, eaten spaghetti, saving their money can't. And so, that was the intent. Now, it's gotten politicized and all of a sudden, it's like, wow, we're concerned about access to capital and things like that. And you know, it's a black rock. Yeah. Yes. Because I also got a giant contribution to my campaign right now. So, right. So, they gave 10 million and Mary can give 10 bucks. So, yeah. So, it is the deal. It's brutal.

You know, one thing, one thing we could do is if you really did do it, and this bill really doesn't. Yeah. If you really did do, limit the number of the Chinese buying 5,000 houses in Memphis, Tennessee, or our black rock doing the same thing and taking them off the market. That's the last thing, one thing. Two, you've suggested, and I like this even more, it is to get the market moving just due away with capital gains, tax completely on single family personal residences.

Yeah. Our personal residence period. Sure. And they can do this in a periodic way, they can

“do it in this structured way, right now it's 500 grand. But that's, that's a 25-year-old law, isn't it?”

Yeah. And it's, it's 500 grand and 500 grand was different 25 years ago than it is today. It was different five years ago. So, if you moved that to a million. So, if you went from 500 grand to a

million. So, that first million, you would stimulate sales like crazy. Here's what would happen.

The baby boomers, who are sitting on 89 trillion dollars worth of assets. The baby boomers are willing to go, okay, you know what I might do? You'd actually have a temporary dip in prices because they go, guess what? I'm going to make a mill on this. Maybe I'll take 50 grand off the house to sell it quick because I want to do it while the capital gains law has changed. They might take 50, they might take 70 off the price. They might take 100 off the price. You might have, oh,

this guy took 50 now they have, so prices might take a little something from supply and a more lot of supply and a market. Because your median seller right now is in their 60s, right?

“median seller is 64 years of age, I like. As a capital gains, is there or is it right to buy the next home?”

That's stopping people or both. I just know what the motivation is. Baby boomers are sitting on, their houses are paid for. They're paid for, they got a bunch of air. Yeah, they weren't buying them. Some, you know, some people say that the greatest generation, they're, they're, they're borderline. I'm going to create some tension here for you. But their borderline being called a greedy generation. Well, we were, we're the 80s. Yeah. Go go, baby. Yeah. Go get it. Go get it. Go get it. Go get your garden.

Go get your garden. Go get your garden. Go get your garden. Go get the air back. It's so important. The baby boom generation was the first historical generation to buy real estate, not just for a primary residents. Baby boomers bought rental properties. Baby boomers bought vacation properties. Baby boomers bought and built eight unit apartment buildings. So brilliant. They made, they sacrificed, they made their money and they've done well. They've been slow to hand that over. So the two things

we could do from a macro perspective. And usually you and I don't reach for Washington to do anything. No, because they screw it up and they have in this case too. But would be the limit corporate buying and just do away with or raise the capital gains to a million. Yeah, capital, you sell your home

If you just did away with it, you could increase your inventory substantially, which would increase

“the flow of houses. And we get back up above a four million transaction rate. And you get the”

inventory going. And the third thing is we've got to have some federal help, probably, pouncing on people like these idiots in California that have still not issued building permits two and a half years later on, Palisades. My people, my people, I'm from the people's Republic of California. Look, it's more homes were built in Dallas for worth last year than in the state of

California and the entire state. Then the entire state, which is 40 million dollars of regulations

are building permit costs for them in all the fees fees fees, and more, they got more fees than a French puddle, fee fee fee fee fee. Very good. 167 grand in the average fees for housing just to break ground. So the fact of the matter is there are governmental things that can happen. There are some things they're trying to do. They're trying to, they're actually the one thing this current legislation

“does does a lot of reducing requirements and restrictions and regulations on housing. They're reducing”

the federal regulations on housing. So that, that will help some things. They're going to expand you know, the developed property. So like, you know, the delivered mobile home, right? So that's like you can build it the suit, which is a little more manufactured and they're a little more structured than they used to. So there are some things that they're doing that will help some things. Okay. So let's switch gears there. That's stuff that we can't control if 35. But we can control

if we're given all of our money to crypto or draft king. Yeah. We can control if we go into debt to Ford Motor Company for a $90,000 pickup. And so we don't have any money to save for a house. We can control if we don't let city bank what's in your wallet. Screw me over with Samuel L. Jackson telling me to do it. We can control if we get deeply in debt with student loans. Yeah. These are controllables. Yeah. That the that the individual can do to put themselves in a position where they

have disposable income to start moving doors buying. Dave Ramsey has a lot of answers to the real state business. You know, if I want to somebody said, if I really hated a real estate agent and I wanted to just really screw him up, I'd refer him a couple of kids who wanted to buy a house and tell

them to buy a truck first. If I really hated that realtor, okay, here they go. And what happens is

psychologically, their first major purchase is a car and then they got a loan and now they feel like in buy a house. It's it's insanity. And you've just you just had to screw up the whole thing. You screwed up the deal. Still in the way to get married. Yeah. There's a good one. Cohabitating doesn't get

“you towards buying a house. The occupation that needs stuff you talk about is one, that's why I was”

the Dave Ramsey fan of my whole real estate career. Because I'd have my clients listen to your stuff. So I can have them get a down payment to buy a house. Yeah. It opens up margin when you don't have debt and then and then patients also. I just want more to add to this when we come back in them. We'll take some calls. Great. If you've had your phone two or three years, there's a chance it's unlocked. So bringing your own phone

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We're talking about real estate. The median age of the first-time home buyer has gone up

from 30 years old to 40 years old in the last 10 years. We're have a shortage of inventory. We talked about there's three things that the government can do. One is lower regulations. They get home building going again. Two is due with capital gains. And three is limit corporate buying thousands of single-family homes and starving that inventory. As an individual, what can

kings and crypto. Quit buying crap. You can't afford and letting these companies screw you like Lexus. And you've got a car you can't afford for $1250. And then you wind because you can't buy a house. It's your fault you did that. So you've got to stay out of the stupid, you've got to get the stupid student loan paid off. Like it's some kind of pet in your house. You've got to get that credit card's cut up and get Samuel L. Jackson out of your life.

What's in your wallet? All of your money, apparently. But yeah. So you know, we've got to fix all of that. And then the one last thing I wanted to bring up. And I want your input on this. Because you want to know about the same age. And I've been hammered negatively on this subject because and I was on Fox yesterday talking about his matter of fact. And the anchor John on there's about our age. And he said, "What'd you pay for your first house, Dave?" And I went $675.

“"What'd you pay for yours, 88,000?" What'd you do that on $18,000 a year?”

Okay. Well, wages have not kept up with house prices because house prices shot up in the last 10 years due to inventory shortage and COVID garbage. And so wages have not kept up.

That is real. However, the other thing we've never adjusted for in our psyche out there in the

in the land of TikTok, where you're 27 years old living in your mother's basement, bitch in about this is you've never adjusted your entitled viewpoint. Because let me tell you what's in that $67,000 house. No stove. No refrigerator had to go buy them used. No washer and dryer. No dishwasher. No microwave. No disposal. Roll out vinyl floor on the kitchen. Come on. And for micotop, a shipped up sink that had little chips in the ceramic.

There were carpet. You had to mow it because it was seven inches tall. It was copper, shagged. Yeah, shagged. Yeah, one bathroom. And it had one and a half baths. And it was 1200 square feet with one car garage. So you can't compare that house to your little mic mention that you're bitching about that you can't afford. So you don't compare that. I grew up in a 1000 square foot house with an unfinished basement. We had no living room furniture until I was 13. And the living room

wasn't enough, wasn't as big as this desk. Yeah. And so, you know, you had just all of that before you say, "Well, you're a bummer. You had it big good." And it was easy for you. No, we didn't. I mean, I had one and a half cars. You guys got three. You know. And so you really got to adjust for that

“in your expectations. And then lastly, you need to think about where you're buying and in most markets.”

And you know this is better than anybody probably. The urban basic urban growth is if you go out of town away. Yep. As we say in Tennessee out in the country, you get cheaper the further from downtown you move. Yep. Yeah. And it look, I mean, the average home used to be 1210 square feet. And now the average home is 2900 square feet. And so, it's much bigger. And this difference in those is not necessity. It's luxury. It's, you know, it's 12 people were buying and the prices

in the market in the way it went. And all that kind of stuff. Here's the bottom line. You know,

the first house I bought, it looked like it had been in a drive by shooting. Okay. And I was a house a person, you know. And I, I fixed it up and has a thing called sweat equity. And everybody watches the homes and garden show. The truth of the matter is, you know, I was out here in Tennessee there. They're just looking at stuff. And I was looking at the model homes and they have a model tricked out. And they're lined up out the door and everybody's buying the model homes. The money

is not in the model home and the new construction. The money's in the old beater down the street without, you know, it looks like it needs a coat of paint. Because it does. Because it does. Yeah. You, you know, you make money and real estate when you solve somebody's problem.

“That's how you buy, though, people. Yeah. You, you, you stay out of the traps and you set”

yourself up and you adjust your expectations and act like a first-time home buyer,

quit acting like you've been saving money for 25 or 30 years. You haven't your 27 years old. Look, you, how bad do you want us? Yeah. And, you know, I hear a lot of the younger folks. You know, the math isn't math thing. And I'm a lifestyle person. Also, the average homeowner has 44 times the network through the average renter. And if you want to get on the right side of the network equation, the number one way people make money in America and all over the world

is housing. And so I've, I've trained in 47 countries and housing is the same all over the world. Food shelter clothing, the three necessities. And so you, you got a fight and grind to do it. And again, I know, I think you're very fortunate. People have losing hope. But people are also listening to all this garbage out there. Hundred percent. You can buy it. I'm an immigrant. Came to America. Got run over by a car. I've 250 grand in medical bills in 1986.

I don't know what 250 grand is worth today. It'll be a fortune. And I bought my first house. And I, I thought, like, the Dickens for it. And I, I literally didn't eat a meal that I didn't

The next one I bought was 220. And I fixed it up. And I sold it for 394. And then I bought the next one on a bottom for 900. And then I bought the next one was one eight. And I bought the next one.

And that one eight now turned into four. And the next one four turned into seven and a half million.

And so here's a house painter son with not a dime goes from in 22 years from zero to seven and a half million. That doesn't happen by Renton. And that doesn't happen with crypto. And it doesn't happen with

“draft games. Yeah. Very good. Chuck is in Milwaukee. Let me get that line going. Chuck, how are you?”

Good. How are you doing? Great. Man, enter into the conversation. How can we help? Hey, so I'm a long time listener. I'm a baby step worker. And so my question is, so my wife and I worked through most of the baby steps except for the latter ones. And we are at the point now where we want. We're thinking about selling our house in order to be mortgage free. I'm just wondering is that mustable. That makes you move down then, right?

What's that? You would move down in house. We don't say, yep, okay. Other than to be mortgage free, why would you do that? That's the only reason I would. What's your, what's your house worth? $447,000. And what do you owe on it? $192,000. What do you guys make here? You're going to buy $150,000 from a $500,000 house from a $500,000 house? Yeah, that doesn't make sense. Are you married? Yeah, don't do this.

He just saved you two hundred fifty granted marriage counseling right there, buddy. Chuck, do you want to do this? What is your wife saying? I am curious. Our goal is to, yeah, our goal was to work that baby step and be mortgage free. But personally, personally, no, I like where we live. I'd rather just buckle down, pay it off. We've got eight or nine years so we could pay it off.

“That's what you should do. Yeah, I'm going to show you as make a year of Chuck.”

So I can tell you, I'm self, I've been self-employed for 25 years. I'm a harbored foreign contractor and I work alone and do you want to like the business grossing? I'm asking what your household income, what do you pay taxes on is? Okay, I made $151,000. She made $64,000. Great, good. So two and a quarter and you've got to pay off. You need to pay off $192 and you're going to do that in four or five years. And then if you want to save up and move up, I would. But I don't know. I would not sell

this and move down to be debt free. Right. I think you're going to be debt free soon enough. You

got a good plan. Would you, right? Well, I'm a house painter, son Chuck. So here's what we would do.

We do call a Saturday money. So we take what was called a side job. Do a little, do a little work on the side and every dollar I made on the Saturday job, you used to pay down the debt. And so you do that. Here's what you can be. You could be debt free in five years not eight and you get to live in the same house. And you know what? Your wife thinks you're even cuter than you are right now. But no mortgage is amazing how people's looks changed.

I don't know. Beautiful thing. My wife thinks I'm gorgeous. Oh my goodness. Grand Baphini is with us real estate coach and expert. We're going to come back in the last segment of the shower and take your fall. Yeah. And I'll throw out two. You know, there was some hope

interjected there at the beginning about hey, get in. Like this is like you're having amazing.

“And so if you want to check out and find a great agent, go to ramsysolutions.com/age and we'll”

put a link in the show notes. Yeah. We'll hook you up with a Ramsey trusted agent that knows what they're doing and they can help you really do this. It's possible folks. Ramsysolutions.com/age [Music] If you've worked hard to keep your car running, the last thing you want is stress when you're running the kids all over to summer activities or loading up the family for a well earned vacation.

That's why I trust Christian brothers automotive. Listen, most people don't worry about their car just because it's older. They worry because they don't feel confident about what's happening under the hood or who's working on it. And that kind of uncertainty can turn a simple trip into a stressful one real fast. But Christian brothers is different. They use digital vehicle inspections so you can see what your technician sees. Know what needs attention now and what can

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take care of the car that's taking care of you. Go to cbac.com/ramsy to schedule your service and get 10% off your visit. That's cbac.com/ramsy. 10% off up to a $250 value. See stores for details. [Music] Our guest is real estate expert and world-renowned coach Brian Buffini coaches more real estate agents than anyone else in America today, especially the high performing ones. We're talking

real estate. We're talking about it is possible. It is definitely harder. It's definitely different than it was 10 years ago. And it's definitely way different than it was 30 years ago. No question. That is not in question, but the question is you can control only the things you can

“control and that's what you should control. If you control the controllable, you can put yourself”

in a position to buy. Carter is with us in Columbus, Ohio. High Carter, you're a question for Brian and the panel here. Hey guys, how can we help? I just wanted to call in and just say my wife and I are

expecting with our first child and we are currently thinking that home buying is our next thing

that God wants us to do. We are both in full-time ministry. So with that, obviously it's not like an extravagant paychecks that we get, but we're not in it for the money. I just wanted to know like how we can go from the jump. We're renting right now. How we go from the jump of we have everything budgeted with our rent to our mortgage payment, everything that was built and like that. Congratulations on the baby. How old are you guys? 22 and 23. Okay, and how old is I mean, I'm sorry,

“what is your household income today? Um, yearly we both combined to 60,000. Okay, you have a bunch of”

that. Nope, we my wife has no debt whatsoever. The only debt I have is being alone, but I'm working

through a public student loan forgiveness because I work for a church. So 10 years is not a plan to get out of debt honey. Yeah. Okay, Brian, what do you think? Yeah, how much is on the student loan by the way? 21,000. Okay. And after your bills come in and your money comes in, how much left over, you have anything left at the end of the month? So with all bills aside and I was offering aside and everything that we have about 1,600 left to spend not including food or anything like that.

Okay, you got any money saved? Uh, we have 13,000 including a thousand dollars in emergency funds. Great. Fantastic. Wow, you're way ahead of what I thought. Yeah, 22 and 23. We got a winner here. Just hope for America. Okay. What's the average sales price in Columbus, Ohio? We're looking, we got pre-approved for 228, but I was doing the math and just looking what our mortgage would be. I just don't know how that would be possible to, we just kind of be making

a pre-approved only means that the mortgage company has brain damage. Okay. But you're no possible

“way you should do that. Yeah. You know that. When you looked at the payment, you bought choke, didn't you?”

Yeah. Yeah. Good for you. It's about 220, 220,000. Okay. All right. Just curious. Well, with 220, get you in Columbus, Ohio. Like, bedroom's in, and take a, yeah. Well, three beds too fast. Nice. Wow. Nice. I know. We're not living in San Diego, baby. It's a whole life. 2000 square feet, huh? Like 1500. Yeah. Yeah. Wow. Yeah. Come on. Well, Carter, I would, I would take that 13,000 that you have throw it at the student loans. You

guys, you may want to work a part-time job for just a season. And we'll win your winter wife do, wins the baby coming. And it's end of September, early October. Okay. Between now and then, Carter, if I were you, I would be stacking cash. And I would go work extra, weekends and nights. And, and you guys, yeah, pile up some cash, get the student loan knocked out, save some more, back to that emergency fund, and then make it a big goal. Yeah. Of, and knowing that you're on a

$60,000 income. Okay. So it's going to, it's going to take you guys a couple of years to say for that down payment. But it is totally possible. So let me, let me tell you this, I have completely affirm God's call on your life to be in ministry. And I want you to keep doing that. And here's

Go talk to some 65-year-old pastors and ask them how many of them when they were 22

“worked a side hustle. When we're, we work with 50,000 churches in America. And what we found”

is that 88% of pastors are by vocational. They have a side gig. 88% and they call that full-time ministry of my pastor that led me to the Lord and baptized me is with the Lord today. And back in the day, he delivered bread at a bread truck and he was a full-time pastor. And he tells us, "Tell that story from the pulpit a thousand times to where we all could visualize the bread truck. We heard it so much." But it was a perfect. So you're 22 and 23. You're just beginning. You've

got time. You don't need to buy a house today to be rich. You don't need to buy a house today. And money's not your motivator anyway, but you do need to buy a home. It's going to be good for your family. But it may be five years. So what? Clear the student loans. You pile up some cash. You work some side hustles. And you're ministry continues to grow. And maybe you move into a senior pastor role at some point where you actually can just do that and make enough money to

afford a home. So if you buy a house at 27 or 28 years old and you put down a good solid down payment and you stay out of debt and you're a good dad and a good pastor, I would call you a phenomenal success in America. Yes sir. And by the way, being a pastor can also be your side hustle. I had a buddy of mine and he was in the same spot. And again, sometimes you can be so heavenly minded you know, Earthly good. I'm here to be a minister and I'm trying to help.

And so his side hustle was Mary Barry and baptize. And so he said, I'm Mary Barry and baptize and he put a little service out there and he made enough money to go buy a house. So you're your ministry could be your side hustle too. I love it. Daniel is in Des Moines. Hi, Daniel.

“You're a question for the panel. Where's it going? Good. How can we help?”

So my husband and I were in our mid 20s and thinking about starting a family soon. So we're looking at buying a house maybe in the next year or two and we're just wondering what we

should be prioritizing in our first house for our family like should be location, size, the cheapest

thing possible and we're trying to put down 20%. Wow, that's great. That's unusual for a first-time home buyer. That's good though if you could do it. So what do you think the leading indicator of a home you want to get in? Yeah, but you're not going to live there forever. So how many kids you have again, Daniel? Oh, we don't have any right now. We're hoping it was the next year. Well, so you plan for that. Here's the big tip I give people all time. You'd live in the floor plan

not the square footage. People got caught up in square footage. So sometimes older houses have smaller square footage and better floor plans. You'll see this like you can see a town home or a condo has lots of square footage, but it's all cut up and chased up or it's a two-story. So you live in the floor plan not the square footage. So start thinking about, okay, hat lord, well, and if we had a couple of kids, what would that look like? So to me,

you want to make sure that you got the best floor plan that's open as possible. And then, you know, I have six kids. Me and my bride would seem like a great idea at the time. And we prioritize having yard over everything else. You know, we're going to have those chrome snatchers out there catching balls and running around. And we live where it was a little bit sunny. So to me, again, it's your priorities. So floor plan is key over, over square footage,

and typically the older houses of the better floor plans. And then a little bit of yard if you're

going to have kids, those to be the first two for me. Yeah, very good. Very cool. All right, well done,

sure. So Brian Buffini has been our guest this hour, Brian. If people want to learn about Buffini and company, the leading real estate coaching company in the world, how do they do that? Well, like I said, we have Buffini and company.com. Just check us out. We're if they're interested and if they're in real estate, that's our specialty. We do real well. We have thousands of clients.

“We really teach people to take care of their customers. That's what we're all about. And so we”

help real estate agents do well. And a lot of our agents that we coach are in your program helping folks out. Yeah, there's a lot of our Ramsey Trust that agents are coached by Buffini and company. So that's absolutely perfect. Well, so I want to give you hope. And we don't want, there's a whole industry that makes a living telling you that there's a bubble and there's a crash coming and the world is coming to an end and chicken little of

we sell. You can never be a homeowner. You'll never make it. America is dead. There's people

make a living off of that. And that's a lie. Is it different? Yes. Is it hard? Yes. Has it always been some form of hard? Yes. Yes. But can you do it? You control the controllables. You stay out of crypto and draft kings and get out, get yourself out of debt. And then adjust your

do it. We love you. We want you to win. Right, Brian. Thanks for being here. It's so true. I love you,

guys. Love your family. Love helping people today. It was a treasure. Thank you. Please check out

“our agents at RamseySolutions.com/agent. If you want to Ramsey Trust that agent, I'll be”

doing it the way we teach you. Welcome back to the Ramsey show in the Fair Wins Credit Union studio. Rachel Cruz. Ramsey personality. My daughter is my co-host today. Mary's in Dallas. Hey, Mary, how can we help? Hi. Hey, how are you? Better than I deserve. How can we help? Well, Dave, my husband and I have been married 19 years. We're approaching retirement. We've

always managed our finances separately. We're a blended family. We don't have a will. And we're

struggling to move from talking about major financial decisions to actually making them. We cannot get on the same page. I just don't know how to get there. What's the biggest difference, Mary, if you could explain what is kind of his mindset with things, what's yours, where is that conflict? Come in. So, she has a lack of trust about he kind of holds most of the liquid assets. I have the tyrant assets, but he has more liquid assets. We kind of have always split bills. And I tend to

carry that and then pay it off to carry it. That kind of borrowed money against savings and paid him back. And so his concern is that if we combine finances, then he's not been able to protect our future from you. Come in. Yes. That's valid. You keep borrowing money and paying it off with his money and then pay him back. And that scares him. Well, of course it does. It should. Well, we both work. And I have to return. He's observing a pattern that scares him that is a valid thing.

“So, you have to remove that, you know, that pattern in order for him to be comfortable combining”

finances because he's conservative. Could he, if you guys agreed on the value system of if we combine finances debt is no longer part of our family. We are not going to use debt. Would you be okay with that? Absolutely. Absolutely. I've suggested that we sit down and we sit down and over our debts, go over our assets, look at everything together. Pay off what needs to be paid off creating a household account and I held me accountable, hold him accountable. That's healthy. I'm with

you on that. But, you know, if someone observes a behavior pattern and that behavior pattern breaks trust, that's valid. So, we've got to solve for that emotionally. He's got to have a reason to believe that you're not going to do this again. And you're saying, I'm, as a friend of mine said the other day, he said, I had to submit myself to the system. Yep. I have to say, the system says we don't borrow money. The system says we have a budget that we both agree on. And I had to submit

myself to that. In other words, my little ones are the impulses were subject to my agreement with

my spouse. And if he believes that, and, okay, I will never spend another dime again that we have

not both agreed on. Oh, and by the way, neither will you. If he really believes that that's going to happen, then there's no possible way you could go in debt, right? Correct. And I think that I think that where we haven't gotten on the same page, that way is that I think he's too frugal. He thinks I'm too liberal. And so you do need each other in that regard in general. If one of you's not over the top, but here's what I would suggest y'all do. Let's try combining

the budget, the monthly income budget. And work out of one first. And, and, and, and if we do that,

“then that addresses. Now, and then both of you need to hear this part, okay? The saver needs a”

spender in his life. So he has a life. Okay? Correct. Because the people that are like him will live in a cave, collect lent and only come out on triple coupon Thursday, right? And that's not, you know, and the saver, him, the spender, you, needs a saver in his life in your life. So you don't have to retire in eat dog food. Correct. Because you spend everything. So you can't,

budget where there's some fun. And in our case, that'd be Rachel. And there's a portion of the your husband, which is Rachel's husband, Winston is more like your husband, is conservative, and very, but, but he allows for fun. And she allows for savings because we agree that both of those things are necessary to have a quality life. Yeah. Absolutely. Mary, I want to fall back, when you mentioned the trust aspect of the beginning of the call, because you said he has a lot of liquid assets.

“Is he, did you mean trust was like the market or you? I think with me. Okay. So it's a relational trust.”

Okay. Yeah. Yeah. He has two big things. So one thing we have a franchise and we invested a lot of money into that and we're not going to come out full on the other end of that. So he feels very protective of the liquid assets and retirement that he has, which is fine. And then I, at one point, because I handled separate finances, made a decision to do some cosmetic dentistry for one of our children that was substantial and he felt that was a major financial decision. I didn't discuss

with him, but we handled our finances separately. I have substantial retirement assets, but I really

don't have very much liquid at all. So what is your retirement asset base? I'll let it over a million.

Okay. And what's the, is the franchise as a business? One of you are running? It's, it is a business and I mean we both own it, but I'm running it in this two years left on the franchise. What do you

“mean? And it's going to, you're just going to close it. I believe so. Yeah. And so you've been responsible”

for that, let me say this carefully. It does, he says, in his mind, does he feel like you're responsible for that failure? I don't think so. I don't think so. What we've talked about, he said we own that together. Okay. And we made the decision together and it failed and we did that together. Yes, sir. Yeah. So I would probably sit down, Mary. And you guys need to have a discussion for, to your point today's point earlier that maybe some valid, maybe some valid concerns that he

may have. And what does he need to see within you to get any level of that trust back on your side? Because you guys, as a couple are going to function better when you see yourselves as a unit.

You guys have been married 19 years and you've never combined this part of your life. And so that is a

desire of yours. And so there, that question, I would, I would want to know from him,

“"Hey, what are the things that you need to see?" And I am willing to make some changes when it comes”

to the way I handle money or communicate about money. But I do desire that we are seen as one in all of this, right? And what are those steps you don't get there? Because I would be curious what he would want to see from you. And if it's ridiculous and it's crazy and it's controlling it, it's super, you know, all of this, if I don't want you to ever spend money on avocados or something just crazy, then there's going to be some of his issues that are in this as well and not just you.

And so, but if you have a reasonable acceptance of his need to save, he has a reasonable acceptance of yours to enjoy money. Yes. That's a good, healthy balance inside your budget. And that should be there. That's, that's accurate. We're building trust. Henry Henry Cloud's book trust and it gives you a great way to do that. And I think a good entry point is just first start budgeting together. If you budget together for 90 days, the amount of discussions you're going to have to get

on the same page is going to be amazing. You work your butt off for your money, but your money's

never going to return the favor if all you do is hope for the best. If you're ready to learn

how to make your money work for you, check out the smart vester program. Smart vester can help you find advisors who specialize in retirement planning, charitable giving, advanced investing strategies and more. Whatever your goals your pro will take the time to explain your options. So you never have to invest in anything you don't understand. Head the Ramsey Solutions dot com slash smart vester. The guide connected. Ramsey Solutions is a paid non-client promoter

of participating pros learn more at Ramsey Solutions dot com slash smart vester. Alex Alexis, I'm sorry, is in Fort Wayne, Indiana, I Alexis, how are you?

if we just all, we've under home for a little over a year now and we renovated our entire home.

And now we have we in suspect like 70,000 or more inequities. And then we're expecting our first

baby here in July. So he's been working really, really hard to make like smart financial decisions. Our question for you is would it be wise to refinance our home and use the equity to put it towards an investment property. Most likely it would be farmland that we could later build on. Or should we wait at least one more year and then sell the house after like we don't have to pay capital gains. You should wait and sell the house and not buy something unless you're

going to move into it. Okay. Because you don't you can't afford investment property. You're going to be money. Okay. If you go into debt to buy a piece of land that's just sitting there and you're

paying payments on it. That de-stabilizes your home where your new baby is. No, we don't do that.

“Okay. Yeah. I think the goal would be to continue to farm that land. Yeah. Well, so what?”

Make some money out of that. You're not farming at now. What do you guys do for a living Alexis? My husband is he works at a steel mill and then I stay at home mom. Okay. How much do you guys make a year? We make anywhere from 5,500 to 7,000 a month. Yeah. So, so the land is how much land? It would be a acres. Eight acres. What would you farm on it? Corn beans. That's my place. Okay. You can't make the payments on that amount of money with

farm and beans on eight acres. Okay. The numbers don't work. And so it's like he's got a dream of ownership. Yeah. He's going to ask is that like a passion kind of thing for you guys or what causes you to do that? Yeah. I think the goal would be right now. We have a small house that we own. And so the goal would be to eventually build on that property. There we go. There we go. Okay.

So, now here's what I would do. That makes more sense than I'm going to farm this and call it an

investment on eight acres. Okay. That's not enough to spit on. So, no. What I would do is have your baby, you guys live your life, stack some cash and say all right, the goal to use your phrase, the dream is to buy a piece of property and build a home on it and sell hours and move into the new home on the piece of property. And that piece of property and home after construction are still a reasonable part of our budget. No more than 25% of your take home pay on a 15 year

fixed. And then if he wants to have a gentleman farm on it and have a little bit of a side hustle, that doesn't kill me. Okay. And that's kind of fun for him, apparently. And so on. Right.

“Yeah. But I would say truly gentleman farming. Yeah. And your life is about to be so different.”

Now, being there being parents and so, and yeah, I think you did say you're say don't want to say you guys have other kids. But I would take this slow. I would not be in a rush to to make these big decisions. I mean, honestly, I think a few years of saving is going to be just fine. And then you guys may sell that house, go rent somewhere, to be able to put down a good down payment, construction like all of that. Yeah. You know, there may be a problem. The reason

you are framing this poorly as an investment idea is because you're in a hurry. And you have to borrowing your primary residence. Exactly. If you slow down and make this deal your primary residence later after the babies come here and you've got some money saved and you make a good solid purchase. And you think about building a home on there and selling this home and putting all of the equity into the new purchase. And again, then it becomes a wise thing. But all of that

is slows down your excitement level that caused you to move too fast and move into a bad idea.

“Julian is in Baltimore. Hi, Julian. How are you? Good. Are you better than I deserve? How can I help?”

Yeah. So, I mean, baby step number two, and I'm working on paying off my student loans. And I have a little bit of credit card debt left. How much down? I, there's $3,800 on it. I'm a credit card. How much on the student loan? Oh. Yeah. 70,000 on the student loans. And what do you make today's long? Right now, I just graduated college in May. So, I'm doing 35 hours a week, that's $17 an hour. So, my take home is right around 500. Um, which, why did you go to college? What do you make?

I mean, what do you do? That's, that's awful. Yeah. Well, that was just my job was in college.

Well, you just graduated. I know. What's your degree in environmental science and policy? Okay. So, how's the new, how's the big boy job hunt going? Well, I have my resume started telling my resume. Um, I have also applied for the, again,

more than within parliamentary sources. Um, which is my, my second choice. And that would be

during 80,000 year. Um, for that. Okay. And your degree does somewhat prepare you for that. Okay. Yes. That makes sense. All right. So, yeah. So, uh, I, not now I'm caught up. Okay. So,

“but you, you need to be in the big boy job quick. Yes. Okay. All right. All right. The way you”

presented this is like 17 hours. It's been three weeks. I know, but there's 17 dollars an hour. It was like success or something. It's not success. It's no. We're not doing that. Okay. Anyway, how can I, how can we help? What's your question? Yes. So, um, once I get that big boy job,

um, and like I said, I'm on babysat to, um, but once I get that big boy job, I want to pay off my loans,

but I also want to shave up to buy a ring to a person and go for it. Yay. I love it. Thank you. Um, we've been dating for three years. And I really want to take the next step with her. And um, I've, I've talked to her family. And um, and I just was, was curious, um, what, how you would do that. You know, because I have such a big payment in my student loans, um, should I, you know, hold off on that?

“No, no. I, I think you, I think you get rid of the credit card debt, and then you save up some money for a ring,”

and then you get back on the, uh, student loans. Okay. So, if you got it, have you got a budget in mind?

On the ring? Um, yes. We're on two thousand, two to three thousand. That fits. Good. Good.

Yeah, and you may just be working three jobs to get their faster, too, you know. Yeah, and two, and two, hopefully you get the 80,000. If you get the 80,000, that's it. So a good rule of thumb for those listening, not for you, because I like your 2000. Okay. But the, a good rule of thumb is a maximum of one month's pay for your ring. jewelry store in the mall will tell you three months, but they sell rings. It's like I was going to dog if it's hungry. Okay. So of course they,

they're going to do that. But the, uh, uh, so one month, and so in your situation, that 2000 is very reasonable given that you're going to have to stop paying on your debt, but, um, and, uh,

“as I think you're very wise, and yes, I would do all of that as soon as you possibly can.”

Okay. Yeah. The, uh, the credit card should be pay off by the end of July. Um, I also, uh, am a little crosscoach. Um, so I run multiple exams and do individual lessons. Um, so I'm kind of already doing side house on top of that. And that will stay good. Um, once I get that career pass. Good. But yes. So I was, yeah, you'll be able to attack the 70, but, um, and is she out of school too? Yes. And, and what's her career? She's, uh, she's a nurse.

And she got the, uh, pastor bars and got the job. She's finishing up nursing school. So this, this semester, it will be here last semester. Good. So you guys are ready for December. Uh, will she have debt? A little bit, uh, well, yeah. Yeah. So when you combine incomes and combine those two student loan debts, and you guys have a wonderful life starting off, and you attack those

student loans get rid of them, and then you go be millionaires. We're going to be so proud of you. All right. Thank you. Go do it. And go do it. Well done. Very well done. It's good stuff. Good stuff. That's cool. Well, fresh off the grad stage days like what? What are you doing? I don't know. I'm working 35 hours. I heard 35 hours a week at 17 dollars. What do you mean? I heard that too. And that's the definition of socks right there. But he also sounds a little crosscoach.

He's killing it. Tell you, you didn't, that varied that lead. . Hey, what's up, guys? It's Jade Worsha. Listen, summer spending adds up so fast between vacations and road trips and camp fees and events. And all the extra gas and grocery runs, money can get tight before you know it to really get your money under control and keep it that way. You're going to need a plan. And that's what you'll get with the every dollar budget app.

simplest way to make a plan for your money before the month begins. So no more wondering where your money's going, you're telling it where to go. Download every dollar in the app store or Google Play and start for free today. In the lobby of Ramsey Solutions on the debt free stage, Austin and Mackenzie are with us.

“Hey, guys, how are you? I'm pretty good. How are you? Welcome, welcome. Where do you all live?”

Mount Pleasant, Michigan. Oh, okay. Where's that near? Like in the middle.

Okay, right in the middle. I love Michigan. People always put it there.

I'll pick a hand out. Yes. Talk to the hand. Yeah, good. Very cool. Well, welcome to Nashville. And you're here to do a debt free scream. How much debt have you paid off? We paid off 117,000 and 417 dollars. Love it. And how long did that take? 19 months. Good for you. And you're a range of income during that two years? We started at 100,000 and then we ended at 200 and 3,000. Well, that's a little job. Not only only for a living. I am a health insurance agent,

I'm a broker. And I'm a stay at home, Mom. Okay. So how did you double your income in 18 months, dude? Well, we actually, once we had our first child, I realized we weren't sure if she was going to stay home or continue to work. And when I was holding her, I realized we have to keep her home with her mom. And that just really set a fire to pick things up for me. Yes, so he just

“worked really hard to up the sales. Wow. Kali. Baby will motivate you. Oh, yeah, that's what she did”

a lot. Yeah, you're holding that child. You're like, this just got real. Oh, my gosh. Wow. Very cool. So what was the 117,000 in debt? What kind of debt? Credit cards, two cars. Student loans, personal loan, heli medical, and our house. Wow, we bet up your house. We sure did. Yes, there's a lot to house worth. It is worth 135,000. Very cool. Good for you, guys. And Mount Pleasant, Michigan. What does that buy? How many square feet is that? How many

bedrooms? It's about a little over a thousand square feet and it's a three-bed one bath. Wow, very cool. And how old are you, too? 27. And you have a paid for house in Michigan. Yeah. That's pretty

amazing. It feels good. It feels great. A bed. Pretty good. What year did you guys buy the house?

Two years? Yeah, two years ago. So 22 years ago? Yeah. Yeah. Amazing. So we were just talking last hour about people getting in the market and doing all of this and getting out of debt and all of it. And you guys did all of it in 18 months, two years basically. Yeah. Not only did they buy a home in their 20s. Yes. They paid it off in their 20s. Well, guess what? They bought a 1000, what do you say? How many square feet? 1000, about a thousand. About a thousand square feet. Yeah. Well done, guys.

That's amazing. This is not going to be on the land of the rich and famous, but it is a great starter house. But the land of the rich, because you guys are going to start. You're going to be millionaires. Yeah. And hey, it's a roof over. I love it. Yeah. I love it. I'm so proud of you. Way to go. So did you sell anything like the cars or anything? No, actually we just we kept the cars that we currently have. And during the process, I actually called into the show to ask if I

should buy a 1976 Corvette. And yeah, it was it was interesting. Yeah, told me, you know, not necessarily something that you would have done at that time, but to keep it based off the income and where I was at during the baby steps. Uh-huh. So probably would have maybe been a little bit sooner if I hadn't done that. But you kept the car. Yeah, we kept we kept it. Because we told you too. That we don't leave the car. Yes. Now, Rachel, you gave me a little more trouble than Dave did

surprisingly. So surprisingly. We were looking at it. Yes, it's funny. I probably was like,

“sell it. Oh, I think I do remember that. So I was like, I don't get it. But it wasn't. But how much money was it?”

It was 7700. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Oh, so right. So what happened 19 months ago that you said, okay, we're going to start this journey. It's a payoff. All. I mean, that's a long list of debt. Yeah, I mean, in the house. Yeah, I don't think it was anything one big thing in particular. I think

it was just a bunch of little small things. But I think definitely our first order being born. We were like,

yeah, we got a, you know, leading up to that. We were like, we got to get serious about this. Yeah, tell people the key to doing this. I would say at least for me and the people that I talk to the ones that don't really make it or get anywhere, the ones that say that it's impossible to do, or they just can't do it. And like, for us, we asked how can we do this? What do we need to do? Exactly.

I'd definitely ask yourself how and start from there. Also just like being honest with yourself

and like putting the numbers in your face, because it took him, I won't say nagging. But persistently being like, hey, let's add up what you spent while on this month. You know, when all this stuff in it took me sitting down and looking at the number that I was spending on fast food to be like, actually, you know what, I can afford to put more money towards my debts. Like, there's no reason that I should only be making minimum payments on everything.

Wow. So the, I mean, the budget and the revealing of, hey, this is what's going on. And here's what we have to change from a lifestyle perspective, even. Absolutely to be honest with yourself. Yes.

“Yeah. So good. Yeah. People live in a little bit of that denial. I think at times, right?”

Where you're like, it's not a big deal. It's not a big deal. And then, yeah, you had it up, you're like,

oh, man, this could be going toward something great. Yeah. Absolutely. Well done, you guys. So you guys are content today with a, uh, an inexpensive home and some inexpensive cars, so that you're 100% debt-free. And I've often taught in Rachel has, too, that their, that contentment is not on the same spectrum with ambition, because you're very ambitious at the same time, uh, in that you leaned into this, you've worked your tail off. That was great.

That was great. You cleaned up the mess, you paid it all off in 18 months house and everything. Oh, my gosh. Um, where does that contentment come from? Uh, I would say we, we just have a lot of peace knowing that, you know, if something were to happen to me tomorrow, that the girls will be okay, that they're not going to drown in debt. We put a lot of things in place that you guys have recommended to give us that peace.

And I'll say I know people that have much nicer cars and much nicer homes, but have a lot more stress on their shoulders. And that's just not something that I wish for myself,

“for my family. Yeah. Again, I think, I mean, I'm content with food in the fridge and roof over our”

head and happy daughters, you know, and, you know, just giving it up to God and he's provided what we need. And we don't need anything else. That's, I guess that's where the contentment comes from. Yes. We complicate our lives so much. Right. And we, and we do it to ourselves. Yeah, chasing after the next big things. Right. Absolutely. And that keeps you in a broke cycle for so many people. Yeah. And they don't even realize it. Right. And you guys are just a beautiful

example of what that looks like. Because you're exactly right. I think trading the peace over the stress any day. Yes. And people crave it. They don't know what to do. So absolutely. Yeah, we'll be saving up. We're currently saving up for our next house. So we can catch. Yes. Absolutely. So it'll take some time. But that's, that's the next goal for us. Yeah. You guys are awesome. Yeah, you're going to be able to do it. I mean, if you're making a couple of hundred, you're going to be able to do

whatever you want to do in very short order. Yes. Because you got this stuff in the right order, you didn't go, you know, acting like you were richer than you are. And so, and it's going to set you up to build incredible wealth and generosity. In the meantime, you've got the peace of going, hey, this house, we got no payments. And I'll tell you something else. How long has the house been, how long has the debt been paid off? How long, how many months ago was that? February is when we

paid off. Have you noticed yet a difference in your sales? Well, I noticed there's definitely a difference in everything that I do knowing that it's paid off. I mean, we've cash flowed three vacations since then as a little celebration. Yeah. Including this one, this will be our last one

for a while. But there's definitely a different, there's a call in the air that we've never felt

before. Yeah. I've always cooked small business owners and sales teams as well, that when you don't have a single debt in the world, you don't have to make a sale in people can smell it. Yeah. And you end up increasing your income. Yeah. Because they don't think you, you don't smell needy. Yeah. You know, a needy sales person, you know, you can smell it. The commission breath. Exactly. And how old are the kids? We have a, she just turned 19 months old and she just turned five months old.

Okay. Is he bringing them or are they at home? Yeah, they're here. You want to put them in the debt free

“screen? Yeah. Yeah. So that was bringing them up then. That's perfect. And what are their names?”

This one's Harlan. Mm-hmm. So great. Little Harlan. How cute. And the little baby is Maggie. Oh my gosh. So sweet. All right. She's coming. Robin Dad changed their family tree. All right. Count it down. Oh, no. 117,000 paid off in 19 months, debt free house and everything at 26. Let's Sarah, here's that free screen. One, two, three. We're debt free. Yeah.

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possible. And suddenly you are doing the impossible. People always want to know how I handle my

investments and a couple of years ago we decided to open Dave's investing playbook on real estate

“and on other things and that includes what I don't invest in and why. And we called it investing”

essentials in George Camo and I did a virtual event for two nights. We've only done that two times. We're going to do it again one more time and we're going to change up a little bit of the content and get a little bit into building a lasting legacy and dealing with the issues of wealth inside your family and looking at wills and estate planning just a little bit as well. So we're going

to get into all of that. It's two nights. It's a virtual event September 1st and 2nd me and George

Camo. Take it start at $199. You can get them at ramsysolutions.com/events. Jasmine is with us in Baltimore. Hi Jasmine. How are you? Hey I'm really curious how this is going to go. Thanks for taking my call. Sure. What's up? So I went into some get the time I wasn't super familiar with your baby steps but I'm in the baby step number two now building a homeschool app and I'm thinking about taking some certificates paying to take some AI product management certificates to put me

in a different tax bracket entry level is like a hundred k can be like anywhere between a hundred k and 200 k starting k and I'm wondering is it like it's such a competitive field? Is it worth me paying in to take those certificates and putting that time in to come out the other side

“hoping to put that money back into my business? Are you already in the technological field?”

Well I'm the product manager for the app that I built like I built this app from scratch for home schoolers. That means you did it by yourself at your kitchen table? No, no. I hired a web development company but like I chose like how everything's supposed to function like where the buttons are supposed to be what needs to connect to what like I designed it completely from that. And that's what a product manager does. I know what a product manager does. I have a bunch of works for me, okay?

What? I'm sorry. That's okay. So I, but I just didn't visualize how you're doing. So but you've got no software engineering experience at all? No. Okay. All right. Well, and what would the courses, is it the what's you're going to get and learn in those for the app? Or you said it's going to put you in a different tax bracket like what? She just makes you going to make more money. How though? Make more money so I can move the business faster.

With the day job, make more money in what you're currently doing or with the app. Make more money with getting the project management AI project management certificates to get a different job. Okay. So do you go on to the field or do it about 60? I gotcha. I gotcha. And the field at which you're looking to get in. Is that a problem? Yes. I know. Thank you. I, yes. But I'm asking, is that is the type of online course that you're taking? Do they see that

as, because it's kind of, it's all pretty new? Do they need that as a standard? Are they looking for something else? I just want to make sure you don't get in this and get something that people like, I don't even know what this is and it does, it really doesn't do much for you. You know, the course there are certificates that you can get are specialized for

pay like $300 you get access to like 10,000 different courses, I only need maybe four different

certificates. And I'm really burnt out at my job that I'm at and it's not moving the meat or fast enough for me. Okay. And yes, I would spend $300 on continuing education. Yes, I would pursue your dream where I've got a disconnect is that someone told you this guarantees and

“opens these doors and I'm not sure it does. Right. That's why I'm like, should I? Okay. So,”

yes, do it. But I don't know that I'll get a job doing it. But I know that I have it in me to do that job if I were to get that job. Yes, have you talked to people though that are that the job is out there and you could apply for it and they're saying, hey, you do need these courses and then you could be in the right order. Have you already got any search and project management not counting AI? No, I don't. I just have proof that I can like that I can do the job because of

the what I've already built. The app that you did. Yeah, too. Okay. Yeah. Okay. So, I'll be here. Here's what's

running through in my mind. All right. We have 400 people of our 1000 people that are in the technology side of things. Obviously we're leaning heavily into AI and obviously we have several project managers and lots of product squads working on things that are being led by different people. And I'm trying to think through if this would cause us to consider hiring you the fact that you built an app for your home school thing. I don't know if that qualifies you to be a project manager,

even though you actually did manage a project. I'm not arguing that. I'm not sure we would hire you and I'm not sure we would hire you because you had a certificate on the Cesar and AI project manager

“that cost you $300 to go through course course air. I think we would talk to you. That's why”

I'm asking the companies that you're wanting to work for, Jasmine. What are they saying? It's not a golden key that opens the door. Yeah, but it's not Ramsey, she's asking. Yeah, but if she's want to get a job, I'm going to $100,000 a year. I know, but in technology companies, trust me, I got some friends working on those. Plenty of money there. It's crazy. So, I was wondering, like, as she talked, like when she's looking at these jobs, are they saying this is a whole that

has to be filled and this is a way to fill that hole or is it work experience? I'm trying to figure out what it is for that next step and is it courses or is it not? Yeah, there is plenty of money in technology companies and we pay a lot of money to the technology team here. That's true. All of those are true. The only question I've got is whether this actually is the golden key that opens the door and I'm not sure it is. And so what would be the next step for her to get on that path? I think I

would talk to someone who's actually doing the job that she wants to do. Talk to the company she's applying for. Yeah, it finds someone that is doing AI project management and say, okay, what would qualify? What would make me get an interview and possibly get hired? Would this certificate help or is it a slam dunk if I've got their certificate or nobody gives a crap if I've got their certificate. That's true. And talk to somebody who's actually doing that. And I think you're going to

“find that they're going to want some, if you want to be a project manager and you want to be an AI,”

both are cutting edge situations, you probably are going to have to have something more than what I'm hearing here. But I might be wrong. So I do want you to discover all of that. I don't want you to

spend $300 and then be vastly disappointed that you didn't walk into the first place and they went,

"Oh, we have to have you." You got to coarser certificate, which I pretty sure is not going to happen. So, and you suddenly go make $100,000 a year. I just, it's no. I don't believe that's going to happen. But I do believe that you're on the right track and I want you to continue. Yeah, I wish I could use King Coleman's principle, the proximity principle. Go talk to people and not feel Jasmine and again to those companies that you're looking at to apply for.

And it go out to coffee with some of them. Like, "Hey, what are the first four things I need to be doing to get myself in the running for this?" Because this is a passion of yours. You're obviously somewhat educated in it because you built an app and you're actually in that world doing it. You're pressing the buttons. You're talking to the people develop. Like, you are in this world. And so what's the next formality to actually make you in the running for it? And it may be

this certificate. It may not. We don't know. But I would go talk to people in that field. Folks, the danger I want everybody out there to look for is this. Don't, when someone tells you to trade school or a certificate program or a four-year education, that this is going to be the magic pill that makes your life all good. It's not. You're the secret sauce. Not the education

we'll put you in a higher tax bracket." That sounds like a sales pitch from a trade school to me.

And so I don't want you to fall for that. I want you to have good solid information to make these decisions.

That puts us out of the Ramsey Show in the books. We'll be back with you before you know it.

“And the meantime, remember, there's ultimately only one way to financial peace. And that's to”

walk daily with the Prince of Peace. Christ Jesus.