#330 Dr. Craig Koniver - The Godfather of Peptides

I'm excited to talk to you. I'm excited that you're here too, and so I guess we've known each other for two years already.

“I think about two years. Yeah, it feels like six months. Yeah, now what time is a crazy thing, right? It is.”

It is. Yeah, now I think it's been about two years. We've been working together. Wow. Well, my health has gotten a lot better in the last two years. Yeah, so thank you for that. Yeah, you're welcome. And it's an honor to work with you. Yep. Likewise. Likewise. Yes. So, Andrew Huberman. We found out to Andrew. Connected us, right, and we've been working together ever since, throughout together. I've been, even my doctor ever since. So it's a extreme pleasure and honor. Likewise. Likewise. But, um, well, I'm going to go ahead and give you an introduction. We've got a lot of stuff to talk about today. So here we go.

Craig Coniver, 20 years ago, you walked away from the disease-based model of medicine and founded Coniver Wellness in Charleston, South Carolina. A science-driven practice focused on performance optimization and longevity. Since then, you've administered more than 50,000 peptide treatments giving you what many consider the most extensive clinical experience in biological optimization in the country. In addition, include Navy SEALs, Hall of Fame athletes, Fortune 100 executives and members of Congress.

It 46, a near-fatal blood clot nearly took your life, changing not only your health, but the way you viewed medicine and performance overall. Once again, welcome to the show. Thank you for having me. So before we get to, I've got a couple things to knock out here.

One, everybody gets a gift. Amazing. That's definitely not going to help with your longevity, but they too taste everything. I love gummy bears.

Literally perfect for me. Seriously. Right on. Thank you. Right on. And then, I got a Patreon account and that is, that's just, we've grown into one hell of a community. I think we're like 200,000 strong on there now. And so, honestly, you know, they are, when I started this thing, I couldn't get anybody. I had no advertisers, nobody wanted to do business with me. Right. And so, we started a Patreon account and they've grown it into one hell of a community. So they've been, a lot of these people have been with me since I was in the attic of my house. And then you see what it's grown into today, and that's all because of these guys.

So, one of the things I give them to give back is they get the opportunity to ask every single guest a question. Okay. So this is from Eric Algar. If you had a healthy 45-year-old guy in your office who wanted to be a strong, healthy, and mentally sharp as possible for the next 40 years, what are the top five things you'd tell him to do? That's a good question. Yeah. I mean, I still think the, I think there's, I'd mash it some basics and then some things that probably aren't basic.

“So I think everyone's familiar with sleep and how important sleep is, right? I think sleep is really challenging for people, particularly in the modern day.”

I think the trouble is, is, you know, from my perspective, people have sleep attachments. So they're very worried about going to sleep and if they get enough sleep, you know, what does it mean the next day if they only get four hours or six hours. And so then people end up turning to pharmaceuticals, for example, right, and now they're taking ambient. And I have plenty of patients who, you know, maintain good sleep on these drugs. However, we just have to wonder, what is that doing to them, long-term, and even more than I don't, I don't know if they're getting to the deep restorative sleep phases from these drugs that help them fall asleep.

So first thing is, you know, kind of lose a sleep attachment, but find some things that you can take intermittently for sleep.

Look at sleep is, like, some nights I'll take the Indian and a big fan of the Indian right now. Some nights, social, and some nights, glycine, different compounds that are natural.

“We can get into pet pads for sure that help promote not only falling asleep, but staying asleep. I think that's number one. I think we'll get into further in the show about how important rest is, you know, for optimization and whatever that means.”

That would be number one, number two. I think the most important thing for people, once you can sleep and have that foundation is changing, you know, what happens between your ears, you know, and changing your thought process understanding that. Not every thought you think has to be true and forming more of an empowerment type of approach and being positive. I think I want to talk to you more about that, because I think positivity is such a powerful tool.

I think there's a few supplements that I think stand out to me that really help people. Number one is coq10, coNZMQ10, it's a fat, soluble vitamin, coNZM works in the mitochondria.

Really helps our mitochondria work more efficiently, which is the battery of the cell, as people get older, or certainly someone who's in their 40s is, you know, tends to be more in the kind of decline, starting to decline, starting to be more in the degenerative phase. We're hoping to change people into the regenerative phase, which is possible. But coq10 stands out, you know, that if anyone's going to take one supplement, that's the one I promote. I think that's the one I'm talking about. I'm talking about coq10. That'd be three things. For, you know, I get their hormones tested.

You know, I think the most tangible aspect to human health as we age is hormonal decline, meaning once we get hormones balanced and optimized, it becomes more tangible.

“We demand testosterone, testosterone is a big deal. And, you know, kind of optimizing and replacing testosterone is so important for women. I think the most important hormone is thyroid and making sure they're thyroid is optimized.”

So that's number four. Number five, just because I believe in them so much is figuring out, you know, peptides. There's such safe safe safe compounds and utilize correctly and judiciously and individualizing that and figuring out what that is, can accelerate kind of getting into that regeneration phase. Okay, this five things I'd say. There's a follow on here. Okay, I like this one. In what popular treatments or supplements would you tell him not to waste his money on? That's a good question too. You know, the way I hit. It's a good question because you, I mean, everybody's promote something these days. You don't, you just, you don't know.

You don't know. I think, you know, the thing, and I know we'll talk about it more. The thing that bothers me about whether you call it longevity or optimization performance medicine is kind of this model. Maybe we call it the biohacker influence or model, which is screaming at people to do everything and the idea is if you don't do everything, you don't do anything. And from where I sit, that's very stressful. And so I people come into my office every day taking 47 supplements, doing sauna, cold plunge every single day, taking 16 peptides, you know what I mean.

“All these things, it's almost if there becomes so fragile that they can't even lead their life. And so getting away from that mindset, I think is the most important thing.”

There's not just everyone's so different, right? Like every certain people go through phases where they have to work on their liver detox, that to work on figuring out their gut. It's work on hormones. It's the work on their mind at contra. So it's hard to answer that, but I think from a mindset perspective, I'd encourage people not to get caught up in like, if you're not doing all these things that people are yelling at you, or people are yelling at you to do, that's a better place to be. Okay, is the, you brought it up, cold plunge sauna.

Yeah, is it overhyped? I think it's good. I think, again, to me, everyone's got to figure it out themselves, right? Like I think there's good research on both, right? I'm personally not a fan of cold plunge. I don't like cold. So, I just don't. So is there health benefits from doing cold plunge for sure?

“I think it's overdone in the sense that you have to cold plunge every day, you have to reach a certain temperature of a certain time period for it to count.”

You know, I'm a big fan of people, you know, helping shepherd people to make decisions and try things out, because to me direct experiences, the only thing that matters. So I want people to try it out, right? Like try out during the sauna. How does it feel? Be really honest with yourself. I tend to like sauna. We have an infrared song used to do it all the time, and I do it a couple times a week. I like how I feel, but I don't feel like I need to do it as much anymore.

Cold plunge. I've lots of patients to do it religiously, you know, and I would just always ask the question, "Are you doing it because you're seeking alignment within yourself?

Are you doing it because you're seeking permission? Are you getting allowance to do it?" And I think there's a big differentiator there. Same thing with diet. I mean, diet's very personal to people. You know what's the best diet? I don't know. I want you to try different diets, whether it's carnivore, vegan, vegetarian, Mediterranean, paleo, keto, and see how you feel. Right? And you're going to gravitate towards some, at different points in your life, and depending on what you're working on. I think that's great, you know, but there's whatever.

16 different diet books written every year telling people how to eat. I think it's overdone.

What about water? Water is complicated, yeah? I think water can get deep, you can go into lots of different fats. I think first and foremost what you said, people need to filter their water.

I go to the restaurant and if it's tap water, I'm not, I don't think it's healthy for people to drink. If we look at and analyze it, what's in that watch? It's getting worse. You used to take a probably throw a picture up here right now, but we got, you know, my wife got a water filtration system for the first time. I don't know, three or four years ago.

Yeah. And it used to take, the first thing goes into is this clear filter that it goes through these huge tanks of reverse osmosis or something. And actually it's not reverse osmosis.

So it's not, no, but supposedly it's better than that. But I don't know if there is. But I like it. And I can tell a huge difference. But it goes through this clear thing. First, I used to take a couple of months to get it used to take a couple months for it to get gunked like nasty looking. It's like two, three weeks now. And the tank, the tank is brown. It just shows you. I mean, there's there's particles floating in it. Yeah, I mean, if you think about there's chlorine and fluorines and bromines, there's heavy metals, there's pharmaceuticals, right? Like where does it go? Where people excrete all these pharmaceuticals are taking into our water supply.

There's fluoride, I said, I mean, there's so much junk and toxins and pesticides glyphosate, it's all in there. Yeah. And so I think to your point, filtering water, you know, but then you got to re mineralize the water, you do need to breathe mineralize.

“Yeah. I think that's, I think that's the best way to get minerals is from the water.”

So you can either use a water filter and re mineralize. You could drink sparkling natural water, you know, that has minerals in it. But without those minerals, you know, you could make an argument when there's several ways you could do this. You can make an argument that the client of the human population of the last 60 years mirrors the loss of minerals from the soil from our food. The human population is declining for sure, when we were devolving as a, you know, I think for sure we're devolving. We're not, we're not evolving, we're devolving.

Yeah, our health and chronic disease and like, is that the whole world? I think so. If you did you ever, I'm these curious, if you ever seen that documentary, I think it's called something like live to a hundred or something like that and they go to all these zones. This is the blues zones. Yeah, I know what you're talking about. There's like seven or nine blues zones around the, around the world. Yeah, that's like Japan, Japan. They tried Italy's one of what they're one in Italy. Yeah.

“What are those people doing? I think they're doing many things, right? I think they're trying to do now is trying to say, what are what exactly are those people doing to let them lead long lives.”

Obviously, there's going to be genetic contribution, but I think if I had to pick one thing that those communities do is they are community, like they have strong connection and ties as a community. They also tend to walk after eating, I mean, it's subtle. So I think it's little things, you know, but it's hard to extract and say, okay, what can I do here where I live to be like them.

I mean, the reality is you're not, I don't think it's necessarily good goal. It seems like they have a lot less stress.

I think they handle stress differently, you know, I think stress is such an interesting topic, you know, that comes up usually when I meet a client for the first time, I want to really understand how they're handling stress. Now, just being like, what do you think about stress? We tend to, we like to do this urine and saliva hormone tests to see how there are adrenal glands, which is the triangular shape glands, so on top of our kidneys that processes and metabolizes and excretes cortisol, which is our main stress hormone. And I put a lot of value and understanding, you know, because there's a, we're hard wired for a cortisol response.

Literally, it's hard wired into us. And once you start escaping that rhythm, that things start to happen to people. So I'm kind of fascinated with it. I put a lot of value in understanding, like, what are the biological mechanisms to how someone thinks and handle stress in that room? You guys did that on me, I think. I did that early with you, yeah.

Your facility office down there is, we, you've just done an incredible job, your team. Well, thank you so amazing.

I mean, it was, we're talking right before the show started, it was like, you've, you've really created, it feels like you're on a family. Everybody gets along, everybody knows each other, everybody takes their job very seriously. Everybody loves their job and wants to be there.

“You see that for many places. Well, it's important, you know, I think that we get to work with a lot of people.”

And I really want to instill, like, we really want the customer service to be an attiist, you know, because we get to, people are vulnerable with us.

I'm so grateful for my team. Like, they are just, they always show up. They want to work hard and they're really dedicated to helping the people we work with. So I appreciate you saying that.

Well, they're awesome. So kudos to the connoisseurs. Seriously, you guys are awesome. I appreciate that. You're doing amazing work. Well, thank you. I love grilling in the summer, but once you move past burgers and steaks, it gets frustrating fast. Vegetables fall through the grates, fishball support, food sticks, and clean up takes forever.

“That's why I've been using Hexclad's barbecue collection. Hexclad took the hybrid technology they're known for and built it for the grill.”

Their barbecue grill pan gives you stainless steel searing power, cast iron durability, and non-stick convenience in one pan. The perforated design lets heat and smoke flow through. So vegetables, seafood, fish, and kebabs still get that grill flavor without falling apart or disappearing through the grates. They've also got the barbecue grill topper, which gives you more control with delicate foods or multiple portions at once. Clean up is easy. It's dishwasher safe, easy to wipe down, heat safe up to 900 degrees, and the terabon ceramic non-stick coating is free from forever chemicals.

With over 1 million customers, and more than 50,000 five-star reviews, people clearly love cooking with Hexclad.

So if you're planning on spending time behind the grill this summer, don't make it harder than it needs to be. Stop losing food through the grates, stop fighting clean up, and upgrade your backyard cooking set up with Hexclad's barbecue collection. For a limited time only, our listeners get 10% off your order, with our exclusive link, just head to Hexclad.com/SRS. A lot of people want to talk about tradecraft, how to hide, how to conceal yourself, how to escape, how to evade.

“But here's the thing, the true professional, that's not the guy that's always on the run.”

It's the guy who never shows up on the map to be good weather, which brings me to my next point.

Your phone is talking. It's talking through apps. You may or may not use. A lot of them you probably never use. Talking to servers that you've never even heard of, that are telling them where you've been, where you are, what you buy, and all kinds of other information that you don't want out. And that's where Glacier comes in, with secure DNS. You hit a button, close the app, you never have to open it, ever again. That's concealment. It's been a long time building this app almost a year.

“It's the perfect app to conceal yourself. You can get it on the Apple App Store, where you can go to the Glacier App.com/Remember.”

Privacy isn't paranoia. It's protection. The Glacier App. So let's dive into your story a little bit here. And so you had a death sentence at age 46. It sounded like I did. I did. Yeah. So we're friends in Hawaii who we'd see once or twice a year and we'd come back. It was August of 2020. And soon after we got back, I started having a abdominal pain. It tried to dismiss it and not think much about it, but it persisted. It got worse. So I was like, "Well, let me figure this out myself." So I did testing on myself.

And from what I could see from the lab results, maybe I had a gut infection. So I said, "Okay, I'm going to take some antibiotics. I'm going to take some steroids because calm down the inflammation. I did that, seemed to get better." And then I remember I was playing tennis with my wife. It was Labor Day of that year. And I had to stop playing. And the pain was so intense. So I have a friend who's a radiologist. I got in touch with him.

Went and had a CAT scan. Then I remember driving back from my office. This was the day after Labor Day.

“And he said, "You need to go to the emergency room right now. This is a very serious situation.”

You have what's called a portal vein thrombosis. So this is a blood clot of the vein that kind of comes up from the lower extremities into the liver. So it's the main vein coming to the liver. If you lose that, you die. And so I stopped at the office, picked up my wife. Didn't really know it was going on. But I knew I was in a lot of pain. And honestly, I don't know if I'd ever heard of a portal vein thrombosis. Certainly heard of a deep venous thrombosis, which is what a lot of people have heard of a DBT.

And I'd heard of a pulmonary embolism, which happens in the lung, blood clots in the lung. But this was in between. I don't think I'd ever heard of a portal vein thrombosis. We got the emergency room. They started me on a blood thinner heparin. And I remember the ER doctor walked in and he said, "Hey, did you see the actual radiology report of what was diagnosed?" I said, "I didn't, so I handed to me and I read about the blood clot."

But I also read that I had a mass in the head of my pancreas. And I turned to him and I said, "My wife was sitting there and I said, "I can't tell her this." And so he told her, "And I can still hear the shriek." That's 46 years old. I'm obviously aware that if I had pancreatic cancer, that's almost a death sentence. Yeah.

So it was during COVID. So she had to leave, you know, it couldn't stay in the hospital. And they said, "We want to do an MRI of your liver. Just look at this more in-depth."

“And I remember they took me up to the MRI suite, but for whatever reason, Sean, they left me there for a while.”

Like there was a delay or something. And I had the most amazing experience, maybe, of my life, where I was with God.

And just received tremendous peace, like knowing that everything's okay. And it was an amazing moment. And all I can tell, it's hard to articulate, but all I can tell you is, it's all okay. You felt it peace. I felt it, total peace. And knowing that you, I just felt total peace. It doesn't move. And just knew it was okay. I just, I, for sure, you were going to die.

I can't say that. I, you know, made a mass on your pancreasers. It's pretty close to a death sentence. So the next morning, I got through the night. Next morning, that same ER doctor comes in. I mean, that hold on. That just came over you. I lost track of time, but it was probably over two hour time period.

And let me back up. I've always had a close relationship with God.

It's always been foundational for me. I've always felt connected to God. It wasn't new per se, like this feeling and what that feels like. It was new and how far it went. It was new and like, wow, this is, it's all okay. Like it's all okay. God told me he's got my back, regardless of the outcome. Wow, regardless.

So the next morning that same ER doctor came in and he said, hey, I was thinking about you overnight. Did you see your MRI results? That said no. He said, you don't have cancer. Yeah. What did you have? So I can't tell you that I didn't have a miracle healing. It was gone. Or, I mean, I'm pragmatic. I'm practical. Maybe it was an overreed by the radiologist. I don't know, but he saw something.

He saw something or wouldn't put it on the report. And my research after that is that a portal vein from both is like all the time occurs in the setting a cancer. So maybe I did have a miracle. Seriously. And I've witnessed other patients have miracle healing. I have. It's possible.

“I don't doubt it. And for your listeners, like, and this is an important point.”

Like anything is possible. Anything is possible. And for me, it was such a pivotal moment in my life.

And even though it was that it's potentially darkest hour, I would never trade that.

I would never do it differently. Ever.

Wow. And I'm so thankful for that. That's powerful.

“So thankful. And that's why I just know it's all okay.”

No matter what, you know, and I think when people, because people a lot of time, they want to separate out. Hey, is this disease? How is this relate to God? And it's all the same. It's all linked up. It's all synchronized. Obviously depending on what people believe. But for me, so transformative.

And I'm unbelievably transformative. And then, you know, it was very confusing time being a patient. I had doctors and know what to do with me. Well, don't worry. How did, so, then your wife comes back. What, how did she? Yeah. And then I, so, yeah, sorry. So she comes back that morning and, you know, literally crying together.

Like, she spent the whole night upset. I mean, I get upset thinking about it. Like, she thought she was going to lose me. Man. And comes back and I get to give her the good news. You know, and I followed up on this. I've done several scans since then. It's, this isn't a flu. Like, I don't have it.

Wow. And, you know, and then being able to, you know, I'm very grateful for my wife, because she's been in my rock and I love these kind of stories. We're talking about some of this kind of stuff at breakfast. Yeah. Yeah. And this is where it gets really real.

This was 2020. This was 2020. This was 2020. And, you know, it just affected me personally. It affected me professionally, you know, because I still have the blood clot. But they didn't know what to do with me, right? It was such a fluky thing.

They, you know, I know we're going to talk about a lot about peptides and kind of more outside the box. Therapies, but I want to make the point like they put me on a blood thinner that I take to this day.

“I believe that pharmaceuticals are here to help us.”

You know, do I have to take it probably not, but it gives me a peace of mind. You know, and for me, that's very important. Very important. I got a lot of life left. You know, I got a lot that I want to help people. And so, you know, taking that blood thinner every evening, easy. And I believe in it. I believe in it.

Wow. But I mean, being in the hospital is so interesting, because I was the patient. You know, and I, what happened was, is they, they released me the next day with on a blood thinner. It was probably too soon. And by the end of the week, I had worsening pain. I'd go back to the emergency room and they scanned me again and said, "Now the blood caught it extended."

And it was now affecting my colon and my large intestine, and that they had to figure this out even further. They couldn't figure it out. I had every test under the sun.

Never could find anything that said it was this or that.

Very, I'm very strange. So they switched on my blood thinner. I was in the hospital for another almost a week. And, you know, I met several doctors and it really was profound for me.

“I'd been on this path of, like, I think we're all in a path like, "What are we doing here? What is the purpose?"”

And for me, that's both personally and professionally, and being a doctor and knowing what I know. And then being treated as a patient by doctors. Well, instead of my hematologist, my hematologist is amazing. I still work with him today. These doctors were not very helpful. I remember, you know, I was in a lot of pain.

And I remember saying, "Hey, can I get a conversation? I remember this conversation. Can I get a prescription for pain medicine for when I leave? You don't need to give me a lot." But just, I'm still in some pain. I'm not asking for a ton, but they told me no. I could give you any pain medicine.

And I was like, "I don't understand." Like, I'm really confused. Like, I have a legitimate pain.

I've been in the hospital almost a week with a portal ban thermos that you guys have never seen.

The 46 years old, and you refuse to give me pain medicine. What is going on with the healthcare industry? I mean, you can't get in, I don't know what it's like everywhere. You can't get in a point, but anywhere. It's like a six-month wait. I mean, you go there. They spend 30 seconds with you.

All your bloodbore works. Looks great. They don't go through shit with you. You know? And I mean, did they just change the mammogram thing, too? Or did they just change the mammogram thing, too?

Well, they've spurred it out. I don't know. I don't know. My wife knows. We were just talking about this. But they used to be every six months, and now they've up to two a year.

“And they've, I think they raised the age, I thought.”

And she's like, "What is this?" So it's just all the good doctors are now out of insurance networks. They're all gone. You know? And what happened? Well, we go to private health. I mean, yep, you can see me. I think it's worth, like, and this was a kind of inflection point for me having this experience.

You know, I've always kind of been trying to understand how do we get here.

And really then I kind of dove into it. And if we go back and then I want to express to your listeners, the healthcare system's actually working perfectly, because the healthcare system treats us as customers, not patients. So it's working just fine. Did you know? It's the largest employer in almost every state. I didn't know that. In many states, it's the fastest growing industry. Many states.

So we have a system that's working super well as a business. And what I learned from researching it, it goes back deep, right? So in 1910, there was something called the Flexner Report, which was kind of created by John D. Rockefeller,

an Andrew Carnegie, right, to the biggest wealthiest families in America.

And what the Flexner Report did was to look at medical education and decide what should go forward and be allowed and focused on, and what should be excluded. And it's hard for us to understand this because we live in 2026, where everything is dominated by pharmaceuticals and randomized controlled studies and surgeries. But if you go back to before the 1900s, other types of health modalities were flourishing,

“that we now, in very real sense, consider rogue, right?”

So I'm talking about acupuncture, chiropractic, naturopathy, herbalism, hydro therapy, fitness, nutrition. What they did literally was say medical education can't focus on those. And I lived it, right? I went to medical, I graduated in 2000. And the model that I came up from, which I'm sure is teaching today, is when a patient walks in the room, you're immediately thinking, what medicine am I prescribing?

You're not thinking what's going on with the patient, what's the story, how did they get here, what are they feeling, everything, what diagnosis can I come up with to give them a medicine or three medicines? And that system works very well in this system. And so for a lot of people talking about, oh, peptides, right? Well, there's no studies, because we've been trained to think that it doesn't count unless there's a study.

But if we go back and look, for example, Oswaganda is a botanical herb in used in the Ayurvedic system. It's been in the historical record for thousands of years. Thousands of years. And I remember I gave a talk many, many years ago at this power company in Charleston. We're talking about sleep. We're talking about different natural options, and I said, well, Oswaganda actually is great.

It helping clear out cortisol receptors and people, you know, observing them, sleep better.

“Over time taking Oswaganda, it's very safe, and a gentleman raised his sanity because, but has it been studied?”

I said, well, it's been studied in the historical record for thousands of years because that doesn't matter. What do you mean that doesn't matter? But that's where we are, right? We have, we've been trained, we've been programmed, that we have to look at anything like we do pharmaceuticals.

But the reality is we can't, right? The pharmaceutical testing is very expensive.

I mean, everyone knows that. Exorbitantly expensive. And it's also very biased, right? I don't put a lot of weight on that. Like when I'm sitting in front of a patient, I'm interested in them. I don't know what works for them. I'm not interested in the study that says, hey, if you're 45, I don't even know what that means. Most of it's done in artificial settings. They certainly can't control for the things they say they can control for.

Rarely do they control for all the variables of being human, sleep, diet, movement, thought process just doesn't happen. Now again, I'm not saying pharmaceuticals are bad. I don't think that pharmaceutical companies are evil. I think they're playing perfectly into the industrial medical complex perfectly. And I point that out to your listeners because we don't talk about this enough, right? We talk about it as there's one way to do this, right? And if you look at statistically,

Yet the majority of Americans are overweight tired and depressed as well.

“Very true. And it's challenging. It's challenging for listeners to know what to do. Where to turn?”

I've been a feel like a lot of people are kind of waking up to those. I do too. I'm hope to be sure so. And I actually think that COVID in the pandemic as bad as it was. There was a silver lining there. I think doctors lost a lot of faith in trust from people and for good reason. Yeah, for good reason. But I think it helps spur on for people. I want to take care of myself. You know, I got COVID the next year after I got that portal vein from both.

It was August of 2021. I got COVID. I think it was the Delta variant. That was died again.

I've never been as sick as that. I mean, I was out of commission for three weeks at home on oxygen.

And I couldn't get better. Like it was one of the weirdest times. I just, and I finally had to be hospitalized and I didn't want to go to the hospital. Because I was afraid if, if my blood, I would measure my blood. So that's my oxygen saturation. It was in the 80s. Right. It should be 95 or higher. Certainly 93 or higher. My was in the 80s and I'd be at oxygen. How am I new if I went in? They'd want to put people on ventilators and I was killing people.

Because we didn't know. Yeah, crazy time. And so I was reluctant to seek help for sure.

“Wow. But then eventually I had to go to the hospital and I did fine. But how long were you in there?”

I think so I went for a wee reason. So I developed, I think pneumonia on top of the COVID.

And I was taking in a biotic. But because I was on a blood thinning medicine, the antibiotic made my blood thinner, made my blood super thin. There was an interaction there. And I remember waking up, I was sleeping on the couch. I couldn't even sleep in bed with my wife. Because I, it was so uncomfortable and I was on oxygen. I didn't want to disturb her. I remember I was middle of the night woke up and I started urinating Frank blood.

Because my blood had gotten so thin that I was literally urinating blood. I woke her up and I was like, I got to go now. And I went and it all worked out okay. I mean, and I only had to stay there. I think it was either one or two nights.

I'd stay in the emergency and there wasn't even the hospital was packed. It was totally full.

Geez. But I think there's some silver lining. I think that, you know, people to your point are waking up saying I want more than just taking a pill. I sure was all dead. Everybody I know has. Yeah, I mean, and I don't know. I feel like there's like two healthcare systems down. There's the private healthcare system that everybody seems to be gravitating towards.

And then there's the traditional one, the traditional American one. Yeah, that, that maybe North American one. I don't know, but there's, there's the in network and out now. Out of that work and I think it's accurate and nobody wants to be in that work anymore. Well, I think, I think, especially, especially people, my age and older.

You know, I'll let think a lot of young people don't really carry that, but I should. Well, I think, I think we have, I think it's time for evolution of it, right? I think that if we look at the history of it and people are saying, well, I have health insurance. Health insurance is not for the healthy, right? Like it's a disease-based approach. And I think it does a good job, right? When I was really sick, as much as I questioned, I still was there to help me.

If you fracture your leg, it's there to help you. If you're in a cute situation, it's there to help you. But that's not how we get healthy, and that's not how we optimize.

“And I think that's why people are getting disgruntled.”

Is there any, what do you think about the eye of a mapped thing? I have a big fan of eye of a mapped thing. I think this is an anti-cancer drug too. Yeah, I think it can be used for that. How do you use it for that? I think it depends, right? So they're looking at it more and more in terms of how to dose it.

I learned about it during COVID, right? And we learned about, you know, people doing research in terms of clinical research in terms of weight-basing eye for mectin. We would use a dose of 0.2 milligrams per kilogram, and you find out the patient's weight, and then you do a calculation. So this is how much they need, and you either give it to them, you know, again, for COVID symptoms. Even though it got such a terrible wrap, you know, after Joe Rogan said he was using eye for mectin, and then the road came down and saying, "How dare you?" Even though it's been used for decades, safely worldwide.

I mean, eye for mectin is an inexpensive, valuable medicine.

The focus was not on treatment, and that's still probably true to this day, or there's still promoting COVID vaccines, which is crazy to me.

“But if we remember it was all about, you need to get your vaccine, not that, what do you do if you get COVID?”

And eye for mectin seemed to be for a lot of people, again, just clinically away out in a quick way out. And so since that time, people have been exploring, can we use it for other inflammatory conditions, whether it's viral illness, whether it's cancer, cancer is complicated, but I'll tell you, you know, an interesting thing. To this day, if I were to call in, send in, eye for mectin for a patient to a pharmacy, they wouldn't feel it. Why? Why?

Yeah. And I'm not going to say, that's every pharmacy, because it's not true, but it's most. And they say, "What is the diagnosis code?" And now, that doesn't matter, right? If I see you as a patient, and I decide, "Hey, this is an appropriate drug, and I want to make a point to patients,

because this always comes up, well, it's off-label."

90% of medicine that's prescribed is off-label, by the way. Meaning, we use it outside of the indication that the FDA approved it, right? So the best example is antibiotics. And antibiotics tend to have a very narrow classification, right? Meaning, I'll take penicillin for a type of bacteria.

However, people use penicillin for lots of different bacteria. We don't actually test the bacteria anymore in many ways, because that's inefficient. Most medicine is prescribed off-label. And so what they're saying, and so the FDA approved for livermectin has nothing to do with a viral illness, has nothing to do with cancer.

So this is happened to me so many times where I thought it was appropriate because of the safety profile number one. It's super safe. We don't see side effects from livermectin. And to my clinical observation and working with patients and having a relationship in prescribing is

they seem to get better faster than ones using livermectin, not always.

And so if I send that into a pharmacy, I've spoken to so many pharmacists who say, "Well, we need the diagnosis, couldn't it?" "Well, here's the diagnosis. That doesn't qualify. We can't prescribe it. We're not filling it." What was it originally used for? I feel like it was, I don't really remember at this point.

It was like something along the lines of like skabies or something like that,

“like small, yeah, that's what it's used for worldwide. We'll call it a parasite, not sure.”

Like a type of parasite. So if you tell the pharmacy, "Oh, it's a viral illness because there's a diagnosis code for that." They'll say, "That doesn't qualify, so we're not filling it." And I'd say, "Well, so you're going to stand in the way of the patient gain a mess and say, "Well, we don't feel comfortable filling it."

I mean, this is a real thing. Very strange.

And I think it's a huge disservice.

It's because again, I'm trying to talk to, we've all heard of the Hippocraticos. Why have they, I think, got politicized. That's it. It got politicized. It was determined. Again, if I, I don't know, this is just my observation. We go back to COVID. We're more interested in the COVID vaccine and, you know,

giving everyone a vaccine, then actually coming up with solutions to help them when they got COVID. And I think it's a remnant of that.

“And people were taking over Macdon having success and that was like, "How dare you?”

You should be vaccinated." Yeah, and it became this, you know, lying in the sand, which I think is unfortunate. Yeah, I just, I was just a Mexico, bought a ton of I were Macdon, because I was worrying about the,

Yeah, the anti-cancer. It could be an anti-cancer. I think there's a lot of this. I mean, there's a, there's a big push. I don't do it, because I don't really work with cancer, but there's a big push from doctors to work with cancer,

repurposing drugs to help with cancer, you know. So there's different clinical scenarios I've heard of patients using doxycycline, Ivory Macdon, Mabendis alls, and other anti-paracitic medicine, methyling blue, which we'll talk about to another one of these agents,

which can be helpful metformins and another one. I mean, there's a whole host of them that we can actually be smart about. Doxycycline now. Doxycycline seems to kill cancer stem cells, so it's, it's not lying in this cancer stem cells to grow.

Again, cancer is very complicated. I'm not an expert by any means, but I think, you know, I think if, I try to answer questions what would I do. If I develop cancer,

I would want every option on the table. Yeah, me too. And unfortunately in the United States, I'm very limited. And state of California, interestingly enough,

I've been in this recently because I talked to a doctor.

but it was true. If they see a patient as cancer, and you recommend something that's not a pharmaceutical, they'll come after your medical license. Not surprising at all.

Yeah, and it's, this is not how we make progress, right? I think one of the challenges we live in such a dogmatic society, they're bad or good. This is evil.

“This is, then the truth is usually somewhere in the middle.”

And it's hard. It's hard for people to know what's real. Let's take a break real quick, sure.

I'm always listening to something.

On the road, working out, walking around the house, traveling, whatever it is. And what I like about Amazon Music is it puts music, podcast, and audio books all in one app. So now with Amazon Music Unlimited, you're not just getting music in podcasts.

Your subscription also includes access to audio books, which makes it easy to keep something good going no matter what you're doing. I've been listening to Project Hail Mary, and that's the kind of audio book that really works in this format.

Hearing the story and the narrator's voice pulls you in differently. You get the pacing, the tension, the personality of the characters, and it makes it easy to stay locked in, whether you're driving, training, or knocking things out around the house.

With Amazon Music, you get music, podcast, and audio books,

all in one app. Try it today.

“Do you ever wonder what it takes to make an episode of the Sean Ryan Show?”

In this exclusive studio tour, I'm taking you behind the scenes for an in-depth look at every part of the operation, from the editing room in the main studio to the spaces where we film range day, content, and more. You'll see how the show comes together, meet some of the people behind it,

and get a closer look at the work that happens off camera. When you become a paid member of the SRS Patreon community, you get more than just the podcast. Watch new episodes early alongside other members. Join monthly live shows with guests, Q&As,

and submit questions just like you see on the show

for upcoming guests on the protector tier.

You'll also unlock exclusive range day videos behind the scenes content in premium ambience videos that you're not going to find anywhere else. Join the Patreon community today and get access to the full experience.

All right, Doc, before we move on to the outer and the inner war, I forgot to bring up some of this ancient medicine stuff. Native American Egyptian Greek.

“Yeah, I mean, I think for me, yeah, first of all,”

whatever reason I've been fascinated with ancient history, I remember being Israel is five years old, or six years old reading about ancient world. I actually, in college, I majored in something called old world archeology and art, I've been archeological takes.

Some of us had this fascination with what happened in the ancient world. And then I go to medical school, and then learning about kind of just changing how I think in terms of, I learned that the medical model was really two things. Either going to take a medicine or multiple medicine,

or we're going to have surgery. And when I kind of started thinking about what do people do, 100, 200, 300,000, 2,000 years ago, they seemed to me more connected one to God and two were trying to articulate systems for human health,

but they just didn't have the vocabulary to describe that. We would, you know, term that and modern terms. And I find this fascinating, you know, because I really do think that many ways as a society may be across the world, we're devolving.

We're going the wrong direction. You know, and I think some of that is our knowledge, but certainly the wisdom that's applied we're totally disconnected from nature. You know, what do you mean devolving, like we're getting sicker?

We're getting sicker, dumber, and less connected. Mm-hmm. I think most people could recognize that. Oh, yeah, I mean. I was, I was watching a document.

I can't remember the document. I'm trying to think of the name, but it's not going to come to me. But it was talking about all these diseases that we have today are not even organic diseases that are made diseases like cancer.

That's what I'm talking about. I'm talking about the pollutants and microplastics, and fucking smog and you name it. It's all the shit, the soil, all the chemicals, all everything.

if we wouldn't have destroyed the planet.

100% and so tying it back to this, what I call the, that's the outer war, right? That's what we're being poisoned. And it's very real. Um, you know, for example, men with testosterone today.

Yeah. It's like 50% less than our grandparents. Yeah. It's a real thing. Why is it, why is what happened?

I think it's what you've just said, right?

“I think if we look at what the environmental toxins, right?”

Like for example, microplastics. We look at even just the things that people probably don't take seriously, but the Wi-Fi, all the invisible waves. Um, we're so connected these phones and screen time and changing our physiology.

You think the, you think the MF stuff is, is, and it's very real. I think it's very real. What do you do about that? I, again, I'm, I try to be practical, right?

There's some people who are saying never use yourself

and that seems stupid to me, right? Like it's such a convenience and such a tool. Um, but I, and I struggle with it. Like I, I should put my phone down more. For sure.

Um, I struggle with this. Um, so, so what do I do? I try to limit it, right? I certainly don't, um, I try to keep it off me as much as I can, right? So I'm not, I used to have it in my pocket all the time.

I think that's probably bad, right? It's a antenna. Um, so if I'm sitting anywhere, I have it put down. Um, and then, um, something that I found to be really good is this device called blue shield, BLU shield, blue shield.

Yeah, it's a company called blue shield. And they make this device, um, and I've got to know the guy who runs it really well, Brandon, who's super smart. Um, they make it this cube that I put in our bedroom. And it helps to mitigate the incoherent effect of Wi-Fi.

Now, this is not my territory. I don't understand this well, but the way he explained it is, with all these waves coming at us, which, you know, they decynchronize our own physiology, our own biochemistry, the rhythms of our body, and something like this, this cube,

it helps to get them back in sync. That's the best I can understand. Interesting. Uh, I was going to paint. Yeah.

Oh, it's the fur of the EMF paint. Yeah, I, you know, I was going to do that. And then I read the, you don't want to do that.

“Because then, yeah, I think I read that if it is in there,”

they're about to just bounce around and it's actually worse. I think that's right. And so, you know, I think, you know, one thing I'm excited about for our new office is, and I think the kind of the next phase and wellness is

how do we deal with this, this energy, what does energy? You know what I mean?

And so we're going to be setting up the first of its kind,

uh, with the help of Brandon, you know, different modalities such as PEMF, which is post-electrical magnetic field therapy. People are pretty familiar with that. We're not just electrical beings, but we're magnetic beings.

Uh-huh. We're going to combine that with vibrational therapy, you know? What is that? vibrational is where there's like these big plates, and it basically just vibrates you.

Uh, because the mechanical force on your body, right? This is one of the reasons that's not spoken about, but exercise is so important, because you're changing the mechanical force on yourselves. And again, tying it back to what did people use to do

thousands of years ago, right? They do things like a lot of walking. They had to lift heavy stuff. They had to sprint every now and again. They were in touch with nature in ways that we don't.

Now, not saying don't go to a gym, because we have to work out, and we have to take care of ourselves.

“But most of us, you know, work out under artificial lights, right?”

We don't take our time when we work out. We're rushing through. We're certainly not focused on the work out. We're thinking about, what do I got to do next? You know?

And I think, just trying to tie it all together to answer question about ancient, it's very hard for us to understand what people did in ancient world, because we think that we are evolving and that everything is getting better. Certainly, technology is better. But I don't think we know how to use it appropriately.

The electromagnetic, it's called electromagnetic therapy. Have you heard of a rife machine? Yeah, for sure. Is that real? I think it's very real.

I think it's very real. Again, you have to explain it. I'm not the expert, but here's all I think. I think that we are all frequency-based, right? We are energy.

We are different. We're operating at different energy spectrums, which has to come down with different frequency. People can understand this. The best analogy I've heard is a radio, right? You turn the dial the radio to pick up what's coming in from different sources,

different towers, shooting out the different, whether it's AM or FM. And when you get to the one that becomes crystal clear, right? Well, I think of us as the same way. We're in Tana for what's going on in our environment, particularly our brains are, I think.

That's how we pick up thoughts, that's how we pick up on stuff, is because either you're either dialed into the wrong station, right?

“And we talked about that before this podcast, and some of that's how that happens.”

And so, I think one of the cool things that we're going to be able to use with technology is to help us become more coherent, so that we can then receive messages and a more coherent way, that we can be more attuned, lined up. And to me, that's really important. Unfortunately, this outer war, right, is all of these, right?

We're basically our plan that's being mythrowed, right?

If you look at all of the satellites circulating above the earth, right? And all this neural link stuff that's coming, and all the stars, I mean, it's a lot. We're basically microwaving ourselves in an environment which is already polluted with pesticides, herbicides, glyphosate, toxicities, heavy metals. I just tell people, think about all the airplane flying over us every single day.

The amount of jet fuel, which has a ton of heavy metals, is pouring down on us. Every day. To your point, this is all new. Last 50, 100 years. All of it's new, and so our lens, we're told to believe that this is natural.

It's natural to have heart disease and cancer and autoimmune disease.

By the way, there's more autoimmune disease and cancer and heart disease combined. More neurodegenerative disease. People are concerned about dementia, Alzheimer's dementia, Parkinson's. You know, it's very real. And so we're being attacked.

I mean, you know, I think all of that's real. And so a lot of the work we can do, which I'll get into, which I think is the inner world, which is working on ourselves. So the inner, you think there's there's two wars, the inner world and the outer world. I think most people pay attention to the wrong things. They most people are paying attention.

What's going on in the media? What's going on in politics? It's going on people out to get us, right? And they don't take the time to actually work on themselves. They don't actually take the time to do it.

I'm definitely going to do that. We're all guilty of it.

“You know, and I think that it's hard because we're told that what matters more is what's going on the outside.”

But if you think about it, I mean, I can tell you for me a non-negotiable for me in the morning is I get up every morning early. Excuse me if these two little dogs were obsessed with and take them out, feed them. And then that's when I'm total silence, praying, meditating, journaling, that's a non-negotiable for me. Because when I do that, I don't care what happens to rest of the day. We're all busy, things are coming at us, people needing stuff, got to do this, got to accomplish that.

But to me, that, and then the end of the day when I connect with my wife, I mean, catch up and kind of share what happened to two non-negotiables. You know what I mean? Most people would say, well, I got to get to the gym, I got to work out, I got to, you know, be whatever, you know. To me, it's about the internal conversation more than the external conversation. Now, that's just me, but to give you an example, I mean, I work with one of the, just thinking this, one of the most famous actors on the planet, recognize both across the world.

Not going to name names. By all intent, you look at him, leading best life. And he is, no doubt, very successful, all facets of his life, great family. But this part of his life, when we started working, wasn't as developed as he wanted it to be. And I helped him kind of get that back for himself about what it is to wake up and have that silence and work on yourself.

You know, the introspective work, which I call contemplative introspective or, you know, being contemplative, I think is really important. And, and the silence, and, you know, over the whatever year and a half almost two years, I've been working with him, you know, he shared with me recently, because he had some big movies come out that he's really bound his purpose. And more importantly, his peace. And that peace, like I told you about what I was able to find in that hospital, I think once you find it, changes everything.

“And that, to me, is what the center word about, and that's why I think, not to overstate, I think we've gotten lost.”

And I think that people think, particularly with health and longevity, that's a destination. I don't think it is. I think we're already here. I think it's just a directional change. And I really see, we love to talk more about all these different therapies, they're a bridge, not to get us anywhere, but to get us back to ourselves. That's what's so cool. They're literally a bridge to help us find ourselves again.

And that to me is fascinating. And that's how I look at that. I really think whether it peptides or nutrients or hormones, they're a bridge.

Because ultimately, what I want for all my patients, all the people I care about, not to need me anymore, it's figured out.

But that's a very contrast to the medical model, where if you're not a customer, you're not paying in, they don't need you, you know what I mean?

I think about two totally different things. Interesting. What do we go from here? I think we've described the outer world pretty well. I think it's the things external. I think it's also our attention. And we're paying attention to social media feeds and the algorithms that are being presented to you and picking aside.

“And that's how you're defining your life. You're not paying attention to yourself.”

A lot of distractions. A lot of distractions. I think those phones are super helpful. But they're also a huge distraction. Again, I think you can use them well. I'm not saying to put down your phone or ignore it or turn off social media. I mean, you need to find everyone's got to figure out what we're doing. And I turned off social media. We were talking about that.

A breakfast. It's been gone for over a month now. Everything gone.

Yeah. It's amazing. Yeah. It really is. You get more clarity. Yeah. And again, I don't want to keep harping on this, but what do people do?

I mean, social media's new phones are not even 20 years old. It's crazy. But we think this is how life has been lived. It's not even close. So what do people do? 100, 200, 1,000 years ago.

They were with each other. They were finding things to eat. They were taking care of each other. Yeah. There was a lot more purpose.

And to me, it's about finding your own who you are again to find that awareness to find that vitality.

“Right? So when I think about how can I help someone lead their best life”

from a health perspective. It's tapping into that vitality. I just read it. The last book I read, which I think you're probably a lot of your listeners now. And by Dan Milman, the way of the peaceful warrior. Wonderful book. I mean, it's wonderful to about this gymnast back in the 60s.

You know, super awesome college gymnast who's from a physical perspective. I mean, he's got it. It becomes qualified for the Olympics. And he meets this kind of crazy old man who takes him under his wing and teaches him about how to find purpose and attention again in his life. So it just doesn't pass him by.

And there's so many little valuable things that came from reading that book. Because I think, you know, he talks about what he thinks is that his mentor is the goal is becoming a warrior, peaceful warrior, and the job of peaceful warriors to find unreasonable happiness. And he's reasonable happiness. Meaning, he says the fool uses things to, he does to take them to happiness.

Whereas the warrior can be happy at any moment, in any time. And I would take that a step further and say, "What I'm hoping for people is to find unreasonable joy."

“And I think we'll talk about it a little bit.”

But for me, it's the best analogy. I didn't come up with it as being a warrior in a garden. Meaning, you're strong. You take care of yourself and your family. But you also know how to cultivate peace and love and compassion.

When you're building a business, nobody tells you how much time gets eaten up by the back end. Payroll, onboarding benefits, tax filings, and HR questions. It's not optional, and if it's messy, it creates problems fast. That's why I like Gusto. Gusto is online payroll and benefits software built for small businesses.

It's all in one remote friendly and incredibly easy to use. So you can pay higher onboard and support your team from anywhere. What I like is that Gusto keeps the important stuff in one place. Payroll, onboarding benefits, taxes, HR, it's all organized. So you're not wasting time chasing admin work.

Gusto is trusted by over 500,000 small businesses. And gives you unlimited payroll runs for one monthly price with no hidden fees or surprises. Try Gusto today at Gusto.com/SRS and get three months free when you run your first payroll. That's three months of free payroll at Gusto.com/SRS. One more time, Gusto.com/SRS.

We talk a lot on this show about performance. Recovery and trying to stay ahead of all the stuff in the modern world.

In the reality is, we're constantly surrounded by things our biology was never really designed for.

EMFs, artificial light, processed foods, microplastics, stress, you name it.

That's one of the reasons I started using Armora Colostrum.

“What interested me is it works at the cellular level to support your body from within.”

And this isn't just another supplement. It's a bioactive whole food with over 400 bioactive nutrients that support gut health, immune health, recovery and performance. I've been using Armora Colostrum and I've noticed a difference in recovery and overall energy, especially during high stress work weeks or hard training blocks. I've also noticed less bloating and just feeling better overall throughout the day and it's clean too.

Sustainably sourced, physician-founded and easy to work into your routine. We've worked out a special offer from my audience.

Receive 30% off your first subscription order.

Go to armora.com/SRS or enter SRS to get 30% off your first subscription order. That's ARMRA.com/SRS. I like to what you said this morning, that quote. About the game? Yeah.

One of my favorite quotes, yeah. You want to win the game? Stop playing. Yep. Yep.

Yeah, and that's what this is.

“That's what I'm saying with this outer war.”

People are playing that game and we're being played and it's very real. But if you want the most biological sovereignty, you've got to focus on yourself. Yes, stop playing that game. Play your own game. Yeah.

It's all possible. Yeah. It's killing us. It is. It is.

I think it's taking away our attention. I think it's taking away our ability to know what's real and what's not real. I mean, and that's real for people. They don't know where to get reliable information. You know, one of the things I wanted to talk to you about is, you know, one of the problems with

the current medical models, what I call the three traps. The first is what I call the pill push. Right. This is what most people are used to where we've talked about it. It's giving people pharmaceuticals and more pharmaceuticals and more pharmaceuticals and more pharmaceuticals.

And again, I don't think doctors mean poorly. I don't think doctors are out to get you. It's just they don't know any better. You know, one of the things I take pride in what I enjoy doing is we train other doctors and providers. And I love it. I love the collegial aspect, but I also love because I didn't have someone to help me get to where I am.

I had to make a lot of mistakes and most of itself learn through experience working with great patients. But I want to help them start to think differently. I mean, it's obvious that you're not against. I'm not a pills because we just talked to you. You're on a blood that are sick.

I take the past what's six years. Yeah, I take so I'm not against medicine. But that's one of the traps. The next trap is the supplement shuffle. We have these all these functional medicine doctors who basically changed pharmaceuticals for neutraciricals.

And this is very common neutraciricals I've never heard that term.

Yeah, like supplements that I have fancy word for supplement. I have so many patients who come into my office and they're in 47 supplements. And this is common. Well, it's natural. Well, that doesn't mean it works. Can be safe, right?

Insurpations are taken and they're vitamin D, the official or their probiotics on and on and on. They don't even know what they're taking anymore. And then they get thrown into this loop where there's constant testing testing testing and the kind of the paradigm is take this for that. And I don't have a problem with that. And then the last trap that we're most familiar with, which is the biohacker influencer, which is all in, right?

And promoting all of this testing, like crazy. You know, now this full body MRI scan is becoming so popular. Works out bad? I think, again, I don't know if it's bad, I just can get to be careful. You're basically looking for things we don't necessarily have.

And I think it can create a lot of anxiety and stress.

And here's what it's hell you.

And I think this is hard for people to get to because they say, well, I want to find it. So I can do something about it. Well, how do you know your body wouldn't have done something about it anyway? Right? So to give you just modern day examples, and this is real. They've recently looked at, I think it was an article in Jamma, one of the big medical journals.

I think it was 2022. They found that CT scans would likely contribute or cause 5% of cancers annually.

“Over, I think it was like 100,000 plus cancers would come from CT scanning alone, right?”

mammography, which we had touched upon. They've done studies to show that mammography does not change mortality. Meaning, we have plenty more women diagnosed with breast cancer, yet women are not living longer because of that. Colonoscopy, same thing.

But then we're creating problems, right? I mean, I've had patients who diagnosed from a mammogram with breast cancer. And again, I'm not saying they shouldn't do so. It's an individual choice. But then they go down the chemo path.

They go down the radiation path. And that can be ultimately what kills them, not the cancer. And this is a complicated, and it's also a very touchy subject. And I'm not speaking out against these therapies.

“I think there's, again, like we've said, if I was diagnosed with cancer, I want all options on the table.”

The problem is we're being pushed in coercion, a certain direction that if you don't screen for it, you're doing something wrong.

I have an innate trust in the human body that God created to figure things out. So you don't get screened. I don't do those screenings. No, I don't. You don't do the MRI. No.

I've had too many patients who, and I understand, they say, well, I want to know. I say, but the problem once you know is you can't unknown. And you're going to be anxious every day till you do something about it. And they said, no, I'll be fine. And that's not what happens because now you diagnosed with something in your liver.

I mean, I just had it. I just had this conversation with the patient this past week. One of the common tests that men get done is what's called a PSA, prostate-specific anogen. It's not a good test, but it's a blood test to look for prostate cancer. And so, it's not a good test.

It's not a good test because there's a lot of inconsistency with it.

And so, the majority of men, like the vast majority of men in my practice, who I've taken care of over the last 25 years, who have had an elevated PSA greater than four, has nothing to do with cancer. This is why it's a bad test.

“So, anyway, he, we do routine, I believe in blood work.”

That's different than screening per save. But I do routine blood work. And for our patients, we do a lot of blood work, depending on what they're working on. And he had a PSA and it was elevated higher than four. Okay?

Well, he was concerned. I got it. And so, eventually, we did an MRI of his pelvis. So, look at his prostate. Nothing there.

Maybe his prostate was enlarged. So, the PSA can elevate from an enlarged prostate.

The PSA can elevate from a prostate infection.

Lots of other things. So, we repeated the blood test over time. Totally fine. So, last week, he sends me that he did a full body MRI. And that full body MRI is not very.

It's not the visualization's way worse than a dedicated MRI if that makes sense. So, the image quality is way worse. Okay. So, he did a full body MRI. And he sent it to me and said, "We need to talk because they see something in my prostate."

Now, six months ago, he did a dedicated MRI of his pelvis. Nothing. So, again, we're going to have to repeat that now. He's going to have to have a dedicated MRI of his pelvis. I'm confident that maybe his anatomy is a little bit different.

Maybe his prostate's a little bit enlarged. But I don't think he has prostate cancer. But what he's created for himself is a lot of anxiety. Yep. And it's a slippery slope.

When you've got that anxiety, what do people do? Well, now they're drinking more. Now, they're taking, you know, whatever it is. Now, they need more benzos. It's a slippery.

That anxiety, not stress. Not a where you out.

“What do you recommend if somebody gets diagnosed with cancer?”

This one, your patients. You have places that you recommend to them. I do. There they are in the US. No.

The number one place, there's a couple of things. I just met a patient. And his wife is dealing with non-small cell lung cancer, which is aggressive. She's doing a case.

She's in the conventional route to tell you what I told him. I'm going to meet with her when I get back next week. There's a place that I learned have been Thailand, called the Bangkok Stem Cell Center, where they're able to do things that we can't do in this country.

For example, I have a friend who lives in Bali who introduced me to them. And he was introduced, and it's already. Last year he got diagnosed with this very rare type of fibrosarcoma. Just like a connective tissue, soft tissue, type of cancer, super rare, but it contend historically to metastasize or grow.

Who had the biopsies, all that he had, so he went to this place, and they measured something called natural killer cells in his blood. Now, the natural killer cells seem to be the type of white blood cell that attacks the cancer in the blood. This is an oversimplification.

So, when they tested his natural killer cells, they were really weak. And they were saying, "I'm going to make this up." Less than 5% kill rate. Again, I'm messing up the details.

how those natural killer cells grow.

They retest them now, he's greater than 60%. And then they're giving him back his natural killer cells. As an infusion into the five-to-cancer, correct. And it worked. It's working.

Wow. And that's just one example. The other thing I tell people to do, I told this patient, and this is going to confuse you brought up water. And again, not the expert.

But people are familiar with hydrogen.

“Hydrogens, the first element in the periodic table, right?”

It's got one electron, one proton. Hydrogen over time morphs into something called heavy water, which has, we call it, "Dutarium." One electron, one proton, one neutron. Now, the problem with "Dutarium"

is that it's a little bit heavier. And so, our bodies and ourselves can't use it as efficiently. And then we're going to get into the mitochondria. This might be a good time. I might have conjured the batteries of the cell

when we know that people stress themselves out, working late hours out of sync with natural world. We get tired. As we get older, we get tired more and more. We don't have that energy to do all the things we want to do.

A lot of that academic research comes back to the mitochondria, not working well. The mitochondria take our fuel. Things we eat, bats, proteins, carbohydrates. And through a series of steps, turns it into energy.

Water, by the way, it's due to teary and depleted water. I'll get back to that in oxygen. And the main way this works, and why I want to talk about it, is there's five hubs that sit on this mitochondrial membrane. We'll come five hubs that come side of crumbs.

The first hub is where NAD is used.

NAD is a chemical cousin, a niacin. So chemical cousin, a vitamin B3. And what the mitochondrial membrane is supposed to do is we're exposed to exchange electrons for protons down these different hubs. So you can just think of it like a conveyor belt.

And so we're moving these electrons and protons to eventually get to hub five, where we spin this wheel to make ATP oxygen and water. Again, oversimplification. Hub one is where NAD operates.

“And this is where I think most people get stuck.”

I think this is where we form a traffic jam. And so that exchange of electrons and protons slows, just like a people familiar with the traffic jam. You get stuck in traffic can't go anywhere. So we can't make as much energy.

This is very real. This is why I'm a big believer in NAD therapy. You know, I think I've overseen more NAD treatments than anyone on the planet. We got into it 12, 14 years ago before it was popular or anything. Very impressed without NAD works.

Very impressed. Doesn't work for everybody. There's a lot of holes. We can't measure NAD levels. But clinically observing people who before they start NAD

to after they go through NAD treatments, it's transformational for most people. Interesting. Yeah. And so that's part of that mitochondria.

That's hub one. Hub two has to do something called riboflavin. Succinic acid. Hub three is where that co-cutan I talked about is utilized. Hub four is also called cytochromcy oxidase is where methylene blue can bind.

Methylene blue basically if which has become super popular.

People can take methylene blue and basically jump start their mitochondria because we can jump over these other hubs. So we can get these again conveyor belt works.

“This is that stuff you'll I think you injected it in me.”

Yeah, you took it as an IV. Yeah. And people eat it too. You can take it orally. People take it under the tongue.

Turns out they're mouth blue. Yeah, that's that methylene blue stuff. Fascinating compound. You show I think you show me of ourselves under a microscope out for them. We did live blood analysis.

Yeah, good memory. Yeah. Yeah. So what is it doing? So it's basically allowing for more efficient transmission of electrons

for protons so you can turn that wheel. That last wheel is what's important. So you're making more energy, right? Because that energy stored in this ATP molecule. Uh-huh.

Adenosine triphosphate. And we want more of that because that is the potential to have energy to go in your nervous system. Help you think of thought. Help you move. Help you throw a ball.

Help you shoot a gun. Whatever you want to do. Help you train. Right. You need ATP.

Doesn't need water. You know, the the largest substance in our body is water. And you need oxygen, right? To live your life. So I mean, you showed me when I want there.

You showed, I think there was a I think there was a before and after comparison of what the cells look like before you gave it to me. Yep. What they look like after. How long does that last?

Probably not. I don't know per se because we haven't tested it out kind of longitudeingly. And what we're talking about for your listeners is live blood analysis, right?

And then days later that blood is tested for a volume of a hormone or a cholesterol level.

Looking in real time, we prick your finger. We put your blood on a slide and look at that slide under the microscope. And we can see how your red blood cells are moving, how your white blood cells are aggregating or congregating. And what we've seen over and over and over and while you remember it is before people do treatments

like this, it tends to move very slowly and be kind of sludgy. This is representing this is what's happening in your bloodstream. And then you do a treatment like methylene blue. You look under the same microscope, hour later. And now the red blood cells are moving.

They're cruising along. It's fascinating. It's fascinating. So what is it doing? Well, there's electrical charge and again, this is over my pay grade.

But that methylene blue is helping the electrical components of the cell. And helping us make more ATP also more water and more oxygen. So should we be taking that every day? I don't know if you need it every day, but a couple of times a week is probably a good thing. Yeah.

A couple times a week. It tends to be long, I think. Again, it's gotten very popular. People are talking about it.

“People can take it every day, but I don't think you need to.”

I think it, you know, again, for me it's least effective of a dose for the maximum result. I think we want to be a reasonable about it. But yeah, I think it's a fabulous for the mitochondria. Also seems to be a great cognitive enhancer. So methylene blue can, what's called a mild MAI inhibitor.

So it keeps your dopamine and serotonin in your nervous system a little bit longer. So people will report back and say a little bit sharper. And then we talked about a little bit earlier, kind of repurposing drugs in terms of cancer. There'd be, I think, methylene blue is utilized in that scenario as well. So it's versatile therapy.

Yeah, yeah, for sure. And keep talking about the mitochondria. I can talk about this to cheer me if you want. Sure, sure. Yeah, good back to the to cheer you.

So again, you asked me what, what would I tell people what I do with cancer, right? Go to that place in Thailand if I could. And then I'd work on the water.

“Water we talked about, you know, you have to filter it.”

You have to remineralize it. But water over time becomes heavy water. That's just from being on the earth. That's by no fault of anyone's. It's been shown.

So I'm going to make up numbers here,

but most people have a due chain level about 150 parts per million.

Okay. There was many, many years ago, they found a group. We talked about, you know, the blue zones. They found a group of people living in Siberia region. No cancer.

And when they measure zero, zero, they're due terium levels were in the 80s. What is the terium? So due terium is hydrogen that's morphed into essentially heavy hydrogen. So it's got now one electron, one proton, one neutron,

whereas hydrogen itself just says one electron, one proton. So there's going to be, we're going to see more and more talk about this, because I think it matters. How do you delete your due terium levels? Okay.

Does that make sense? Because if you just eat the regular food you're not going to do it. If you just drink the regular water you're doing, you can't do it. So there's one way to do it. Well, there's multiple ways.

But the most practical way is you actually have to drink something called deuterium depleted water. So it's a fancy and complicated process where they're taking that deuterium and removing it from the water. Okay.

So it's supposed to be 150 parts per million.

You can get it down to five. So if you consume one consumes, deuterium depleted water over and over and over again. Over time they're going to deplete the deuterium. Now there's a lot of work to be done.

But it resonates to me that if one has cancer, that's the perfect scenario for one working to deplete the deuterium. Because based off that cohort of those people living in some Siberia region, where there was no cancer and their deuterium levels were way lower than the average person. So the idea is oversimplification.

“Water is the most abundant compound in our body, right?”

And the everyone's familiar with that. Most of it's, you know, the stuff we make by our mitochondria is deuterium depleted. That's the best kind. The stuff that's around ourselves has a lot of deuterium. If we can convert and make it to lower deuterium levels,

it makes it easier to use for our body. And again, I'm not an expert on this. This is an oversimplification.

So we need hydrogenated water.

You know what you're saying? Deuterium depleted water. But isn't that the one in the same? They're similar. But they're not the same.

Deuterium is a kind of isotope of hydrogen. So how do you get deuterium depleted water? There's a couple companies worldwide who make it. That's expensive. You have to order it.

You do. Sound like a filter or something you have not. You're saying there. And I know the guys who started the company in America. They don't make it here.

It's too expensive. It's called drink, light water. L-I-T-E. Water. So drink L-I-T-E water.

That's where people can order it. It's expensive. I'm going to get very expensive. If that's the only water you drink. So I don't think that that's practical for most people.

If you had cancer, though. That would be something that's very high on the list of what I would recommend and do. I would try to get your deuterium level as low as possible. What do you think about hydrogenated water? Is it a gimmick?

Is it real? I don't think it's gimmick.

“I think that better is hydrogenated gasubreeth.”

Okay. Yeah. And so different devices make different things. The problem with water is complicated. So I think that the hydrogen water is not going to move the needle much.

This is even like we saw this with alkaline water. People say if it's alkaline, is it alkalizing? Meaning does it make your water? You know, we're talking about pH scale, right? And they're talking about acid and alkaline.

And people thought, well, if I drink more alkaline water, I'll become more alkaline because cancer grows in an acid environment. That's not totally true. Same thing with hydrogen rich water. One of the things we got for our new office though is we're going to have a, you know,

hydrogen generator. So while people are doing IVs and stuff for different treatments, they're going to be breathing in hydrogen gas. Because I think that makes more sense. Okay.

Complicated. Lots of different tools here. Sounds like it. I know. I know.

You know, you, just a little earlier, you would mention, people coming in with 40, 50 supplements. Yeah, they're taking 40, 50 supplements. And we don't need that, but then, but we're also talking about all the nutrition that's been depleted out of the fruits and vegetables.

“So how are we supposed to replace that if we're not doing all these supplements?”

So we like to test. Right? And so, again, if people needed, I'm not against it. I'm in favor of whatever works. I just think that the paradigm.

And, and I get it, people listen to a podcast and then they buy three things based on it.

And they add and they're never subtracting.

And so they're medicine cabinet grows to these. Now they're just taking and they don't know why they're taking it. So if you're taking it for a particular reason, great, right? You have a goal, great. But most people aren't, they've gotten over the goal, right?

Whether they're tired, whether they're low mood, whether they want to lose weight, they're pain. I'm not saying don't take the supplements. I think because you're right, they can be valuable tools. But if you're just taking blindly and you just added it and you've amassed now,

all these supplements, you don't even know what they're doing. Just because they're natural and safe, doesn't make them affected by any means. And so I'm a big favor of doing this for the long term. You know, making it reasonable for people. And I think there's some things that we should focus on.

And then, again, my view, lens of the world is, it's not destination based. It's directional change, meaning, oh, now you spraying your knee. Now you've, you know, now we've got to work on the knee. Now you want to be a better golfer. Now we've got to work on that.

Now you have a test coming up your student, you want to be a better focuser. There's lots of things we can do in a goal-directed manner, which are great. But then once you get to the goal, I think you probably back off them. You know, you don't need to keep amassing them. And that's what people tend to do.

That's just my observation. Was there anything left on the mitochondria when needed to cover? Yeah, I mean, the mitochondria. So for me, I tie in the mitochondria.

“I think, again, simplification just helps me of energy, right?”

I think what most people are looking for is energy. And I talk to people, what is the number one thing they want? More energy, right? People are tired now. People are stressed out.

People wake up. They don't feel good. They have to caffeinate stimuli. People get a second wins. Now they don't sleep.

People can't turn on the energy. I think of like a little child, right? They can turn off and on that energy when that wheel. I think that's the goal, right? It's not just having energy.

It's having energy when you want it when you need it. And I think it's fascinating. So I, to me, there's seven different energy circuits, essentially, right? The mitochondria, one of them. We can talk about the others.

But the mitochondria are powerful on this, like the cellular circuitry.

And, you know, it's very real for people. When, you know, we give them mitochondrial enhancing nutrients like NAD. Like methylene blue, like co-q 10, and watch what happens. I'm a strict clinician. I'm not an academic.

And I have the fortune of being able to observe people who do these therapies

And it's a game changer for a lot of them.

“You know, we talked about before, you know, you had Pete Scabellon, right?”

Great, amazing podcast, amazing, great American. I got to know Pete, like a decade ago. And he stands out in my mind when I got to know him. He was complaining that he couldn't read his eyes would go all over the place. Chronic daily headaches and he was depressed.

And he'd been through the VA system left and right upside down. They weren't helping him. You're more familiar with this than I am. Working with a lot of veterans. And so he was living in Aspen at the time.

Went out to Aspen, and we gave him NAD by V. And again, this is like 2016. This before it was any bit popular. After two treatments, Pete Symptoms were gone. After two treatments.

Wow. And maybe talk to him about it. Still say it was an impactful part of his life. And I still work with Pete. And that is indicative of how other people respond

to NAD. And that's when the mitochondria has been damaged. You know, he told me he was blown up 50 plus time. He had 50 plus traumatic brain injuries, right?

NAD works first on the nervous system.

And if your nervous system is in disarray and been harmed by blasts, we get energy into that nervous system. It can start to heal. Okay. So, yeah, I mean, the mitochondria is very well studied from an academic perspective.

I think it's part of how people, you know, whether it's taking NAD or these NAD precursors, I find NAD itself to be the best. Again, that's just my experience overseeing tons and tons and tons of NAD treatments. Now we have methylene blue. And then there's certain mitochondrial nutrients.

What are the three keys? The three keys.

“This is where I think of as like three paradoxes, right?”

That this is just my take on it from working with people and fascinating with human health and progress. The first is energy comes from rest. That's number one. And I think, you know, we live in a time where people beat themselves up.

You know, workouts become mature. We have to put our foot on the gas more and more and more. And people don't value downtime and recovery time. So, that's the first. The second is symptoms or signals.

The conventional medicine, modern medicine says, if you've got this, something's wrong. I look at it and say, actually, that's your body healing. Right? You've got knee pain. You've got a headache.

You've got fatigue. You're out of alignment. So, we need to honor those signals and understand them. As opposed to giving you band aids, I mean, band aids are appropriate every now and then. Let's figure it out to get to the root cause.

The last is strength comes from coherence. Right?

“And the way I think about this, I just read this.”

I didn't come up with this. If you were to hold water in your hand, then you squeeze it. What happens? It goes between your fingers. What happens if you hold it with your open palm.

It stays. Right? So, we've become more still a more coherent. Think about your body. We already talked about waters, the most dominant substance in the body.

If you're squeezing and tight and understress all the time, you're not very fluid. If you're not very fluid, you know. And you know that's better than I am from your training, like working with people.

It's not just not having big biceps. It's about how can you be coherent. So, those I think are the three keys. Let's take a quick break. With some travel, even learning a few real phrases can completely change the experience.

You're not just pointing at a menu or hoping someone speaks English. You can order food, ask for directions, and actually connect with people a little more when you're there. That's why I like Babble. Me and the team have been using it for travel because it's built for real-life conversations. Not just memorizing random vocabulary or staring at grammar charts.

The lessons are quick, practical, and built by more than 200 language experts. So, your learning phrases you'll actually use. And even just 10 minutes a day with Babble can help you start having real conversations in as little as three weeks. They've got interactive dialogue, personalized reviews, and even podcasts. So, you can work it into your day whether you're traveling, driving, or just trying to get a few minutes in before bed.

Babble's award-winning app is sold over 25 million subscriptions.

And it's backed by a 14-day money-back guarantee. If you've got some travel coming up, now's the time to start. So, you can actually use what you learn on the trip.

Go to Babble.com/SRS.

That's Babble, B-A-B-E-L, dot com/SRS for up to 60% off.

Rules and restrictions may apply. The internet wasn't built with your privacy in mind. But Glacier was, open the app, tap connect, done. You're protected. Remember, privacy isn't paranoia.

It's protection. Take your privacy back. Download Glacier today. All right, Doc, we're back from the break, so I just went and looked up to light water. Spensive, right?

Yeah. I just, but I ordered it. But it's, we're trying. It is expensive. It is expensive, but like we were just saying it.

“I think it tastes like the cleanest water you've ever had.”

Wow. Yeah. I mean, there's something to it. It's expensive water, but I like people to try stuff. You know, I think that it's, you just don't know what'll click.

Do they expect, do they expect people to drink this all the time? Again, it depends, right? So like we're talking about in the context of you've got active cancer. No, I don't know of another way. What they say is a higher saturated fat diet has the least amount of deterioration.

But I think that takes a while, right? So if you've got, and the guys I know who started the company, one of the name Robert the other's Victor, they would say if you've got active cancer, you don't necessarily want to lower it too quickly. Because you could have a tumor crisis is what's called like a tumor.

If it can kind of lice, and I don't want to say explode that implode, and that can cause some problems. You can get blood clots, things like that. So you want to do it in a gradual way. But the idea is if you've got cancer,

I don't know of a more practical thing when can do than to lower their deterring. Wow. Knowing what I know, I mean, there's lots of protocol supplements. People talking about baking soda, green tea extract.

I mean, on and on, removing toxicity. Stop using a microwave. You know, only using stainless steel or glass to cook things like that to remove toxicity and talk about very basic stuff. They need to be teaching the shit in school.

But I don't want down. I just watch this documentary. I'm actually going to try to get this one. Okay. And she was talking about the fertility crisis because of the microplastics.

Have you seen this? I've seen it, but I, you know, it's been interesting topic because it's become normal for couples to jump right into and veto fertilization. This is all new.

This is all new. She brought on. I know it's a small sample size. And she says that in the documentary.

“But she brings on, I believe it's six couples.”

We're trying to get pregnant. Young couples. One of them had been trying to get pregnant for 10 years. And she brings these people in. And I mean, I'm not an doctor.

I don't know the test. But she tests them, you know, to see. She tests the sperm count and each one of the males. And then she tests the, I don't know, the microplastics. Yeah.

And I guess she can test for those. How many microplastics he's one of them had it. And so she, she does the test. And then they go and she's there for 90 days. And they go through.

And they just wipe out everybody's, you know, What are you wearing? What are you drinking? What are you cooking your food in? What are you buying your food in?

You know how, basically, like,

How, what are you drinking your water out of? What do you, you know, all the shit. And it's, it's like everything we have. Everything. Oh, is, I didn't realize.

I guess skin absorbs 40% of everything you put on it. I mean, depends on for different statistics, but yeah. Anyways. I mean, you think about, she does this thing for these people. You know, and then, and then, you know,

They do like the revamp. Like, alright, now you're going to buy berries from this place. Let's do this and that and the other thing.

“I think every one of these couples got pregnant after the 90 days.”

I mean, it's, again, you said they should teach us in school, but no, that's not the goal. Sean, you know that. Cutting boards. No, everything.

I know, but the goal is to keep people as customers, right? Keep us, our, our energy's dim. So we keep coming back to the trough for more medicines, more testing. And then more diseases. And we've normalized it.

We've completely normalized, chronic disease. And I think that this is, I don't think it's a normal at all. I don't think it's how people lived. I don't think it's supposed to help. We supposed to be vital, strong, immersed.

I always think of like children who are fascinating,

because children don't know what temperature it is, what time it is. They are absolutely immersed in what they're doing. You know, you say to a kid, come back before dark.

But we can't do that as adults.

We can't be present. Yeah, I know you're right. So I like to live on the woods. I don't, I mean, I think that's such a healthy choice. I think it's awesome of you.

And they've shown them. You can speed up and go to the technology side of being in the forest in the woods. It's very healing. Just being out in nature is very healing. I tell people because we talked about a little bit earlier about circadian rhythm

and kind of how people handle the corridors all in the fastest way.

“I tell people if you want to get yourself back and sink, go camping for three days.”

Don't take your phone or leave it in the car or whatever. Don't check it and sleep on the earth. You will get back and sink. Your body knows. It's not interesting.

Yeah, yeah.

We've gotten so disconnected.

And again, I'm not out. I can't people want to go do that full-time great. I think most of us are looking for mitigation strategies. Yeah. Yeah.

You know, like how can we have a little bit of boats? That's fine. Let's talk about protocols. Yeah. Start with peptides.

Perfect. There we go. Yeah, peptides. Right. 2025 became the year of the peptide.

You know, I've been fortunate.

“I think, you know, I don't know the number, but I've probably ever seen more peptide treatments.”

And anyone probably in this country may be on the planet. I've been in the right place at the right time. What I research you on anthropics clouded. It says you are the godfather of the peptide. Right.

We'll get. We'll leave it at that. But, um, I, you know, to be really on the very, very elemental level peptides are changed with amino acids. We call it a peptide.

If it's 40 amino acids in length or shorter. We call it approaching. If it's 41 amino acids in length or longer. By definition, these are small molecules. They're signaling molecules.

And I've been super impressed with peptides. Um, because they're very, very safe.

You know, and to me, it always got to be safety first.

And so I think of them to make a distinction for people. I think a peptide is like whispering to yourselves. And from circles like a sledgehammer. Yeah. I mean, that's just a good analogy.

And so the sledgehammer is we're going to take the same dose. Give it the same to everyone. We're going to have side effects. But by dolly, you're going to feel something. And peptides are working with your biology.

You know, signaling. So there's lots of different categories of peptides. There's the growth hormone releasing peptides. Things like epidermoroone, tessermoroone, cermoroone. And these by and large, all the peptides we're talking about are injected.

So they're injected under the skin. In the case of the growth hormone releasing peptides, travel up to the part of the brain that releases growth hormone. Binds of growth hormone receptor and puts out some growth hormone. Well, as we know, as people get older stress out their bodies,

we put out less growth hormone. Growth hormone is an antibody hormone like testosterone. And it's in charge of helping us mend heel recover, rejuvenate ourselves or tissues. It's why it's banned in professional sports. Right? If you're a pitcher and you injure your elbow,

you want to be back in two weeks, not two months. Well, growth hormone will do that. And so I still use a lot of growth hormone when appropriate with my patients. But we've replaced a lot of that with these peptides. Because it gets you most of the way there.

And it's working with your enviology. It's giving you a push. So that's a big category. Another big category is the anti-inflammatory peptides like BPC-157. That's the one I was talking about earlier. Yeah, the one that you said you'd think of too. Yeah, we have you on a combination of which includes the BPC.

It's, I have a torn rotator cuff. I don't know what's going on with the other shoulder. But yeah, usually I can't live my shoulder over 98 degrees.

“And I think I was on that from, I don't know, two weeks, maybe a month.”

Yeah, and bull rotation. Yeah. And that's your experience. So what is it doing? Yeah, it's very anti-inflammatory to the soft tissue. So the tendons and ligaments, you know.

It comes from, again, our stomach juices. This particular peptide stands for body protection compound. So your experience is what a lot of people experience with BPC. A lot of people experience eye to patient in the office this week. And he plays guitar and does a lot of yard work and he messed up his forearm.

And we actually gave him intravenous BPC. He could be used some of these peptides intravenously. And he said he had two treatments. They said I'm 100% better. Service is a go away.

It heals, right? So I think a lot of it with the inflammation is you're getting, like we talked about it or you're getting aggregation of inflammatory cells. You know, that sit in the tissue, sit in the extra cellular space, and they may hit nerves, right? They may cause nerve irritation, which is then sending a signal to your brain pain.

And what they do is they help facilitate the removal of these inflammatory cytokines and this cascade so that you don't have it aggregated there.

Now the challenge is, is for people, is once you're healed, don't re-insure.

Right? And people of a hard time is like, you know, my patients tend to be the peak performers of the world, right? They don't want to take any time off. And that's a challenge. And I get it.

And so as we get older, we're in this degenerative state, you know, we're very focused on lifting weights and getting strong. But we also get tight. We get firm. What tends to happen to people is firm breaks. That's just a reality.

So I think, including peptides, you could argue that one who works out a lot should be on BPC-157. You know, and we were talking about earlier, interesting day because today and tomorrow's the day the FDA is discussing if these peptides will still be allowed to be compounded.

Compounded means made by a pharmacy.

And that's how we do it. We don't use any research chemicals. They're all individually made. They're all the best sourcing, highest potency. They're all tested analyzed.

Made by pharmacies who are FDA registered to state board, you know, inspected.

“Best of the best we do it all the best way.”

What happened a couple years ago is the FDA removed them. They said they can't be compounded anymore. This is why these gray market of peptides took off. So people can go online and get their own peptides with no oversight from sources that are, you know, probably contaminated or illegitimate. I'm not saying they're all bad.

That's not the way it works. But we don't have any oversight. When they're when we're allowed to use them, like hopefully we will be able to, you know, then. And we can't now and hopefully that continues. Well, then we can continue to compound them in a very safe manner.

And that's what I'm looking for. What's the argument? The argument I do understand it, right? The argument is that the compound didn't go through the FDA approval process, right? So if we look at drugs pharmaceuticals.

A lot of money, a lot of research following the hoops at the FDA wants you to jump through, including safety studies. And certainly, you know, testing on people and looking at, you know, what goes wrong, what goes right? We don't have that for these compounds. Lots of things are. But to your point of the FDA.

Exactly. Now the challenging part with this is they sit in a gray area because they're most of them are injected. Right?

If we take something like a nutritional supplement like vitamin C, never FDA approved on the counter.

You can get vitamin C, take it as much as little as you want. Well, people would argue well, that's because you take it orally, like it's very, very safe. Now what I would argue and I've actually spoken people in the Trump administration about this a little while ago, maybe a year ago,

“is I think we need to evolve where we are how the FDA works, right?”

My argument to them was what we saw with the COVID vaccine was that the FDA was going to expedite, pushing through a vaccine that was never tested. We know that's true now. It was never tested as a big experiment. The testing came after it was released not before using these mRNA, whatever you want to call them.

That was the testing, right? It wasn't that they were tested beforehand and said, oh, they were tested while we used them. That's a big problem. But since they're able to do that and now a lot of that's become the norm, right? These pharmaceutical companies are seeking fast approval process based on something like the COVID vaccine,

saying there's such a need and such an urgency, people can argue that. What I said to them, I think there also needs to be a place for compounds to be evaluated, which are proven to be very safe. I don't think that's happening, right? Again, I've just seen, again, I think that I don't think people at the FDA are out to harm us. I don't think pharmaceutical companies are out to harm us, but it's a business.

“That's what I mean, I think the business.”

It's pretty much been established. Yeah, we need a lobbying firm. I don't know. So my hope is today and tomorrow, they meet and they say, hey, it seems safe.

We're not hearing of adverse reactions, which there aren't. We're not hearing of, you know, I want to remind people, minimal, minimal, 7,000 deaths a year from medicines. That's just the lowest number possible. At least 200,000 adverse reactions that are reported a year from just medicines being prescribed.

These are big numbers. So this happens every day with a pharmaceutical. Yet there's so many pharmaceuticals that are still, you know, yet peptides. Because they don't fit into this category or that, we have to be, I can't use. I mean, there is a narrative out there that somebody on the show that I should brought it up that said that they think that the use of peptides will create an uptick in the cancer.

Is it already true to that? I don't think so at all.

And I think the challenge is this is, and this is just my observation.

“We have a lot of people reading about what a peptide does.”

And then, from my perspective, I see what it does to people clinically. I am biased. I'm going to be on the clinical side. I take care of a lot of people over the years. And we're talking 10 plus years of using peptides.

Is it perfect now? Has I ever seen cancer develop now? You know? And we're talking big numbers of people now. I don't know.

Have I seen blood clots, heart, none of it. Have I seen a rash from an injection? Sure. Have I seen it not work? Sure.

And I know what they're talking about with BPC causing angiogenesis. But we can't.

That's where you develop new blood vessels.

For cancer to say, "Oh, well, the cancer, which is now developing new blood vessel, has a blood supply, so it's going to feed on its own." Right? And the BPC could be making that worse. That's one theoretical.

Two, I could argue, that's a really healthy thing with heart disease. Right? And this happens already naturally. If someone's got an artery that's feeding their heart muscle, and it's becoming full of plaque,

the body is intelligent enough to make new blood vessels to fulfill where those tissues need to be supplied by oxygen. That's angiogenesis, too. You see what I'm saying? Uh-huh.

So I don't know, right? And so some people would come at this. Like we've been talking about and say, "Well, we need to do longitudinal study." That's probably a good thing, right?

But you have to do it clinically. And the trouble with doing clinically, we've touched upon this. Unless we're doing some sort of live real-time analysis, how do we really know, right? And it gets tricky and it's hard to do.

“And it's harder to do than I think we've been led to believe.”

I'm all in favor of learning, but I'm not in favor of dismissing anecdotal data as BS, because it doesn't count because it wasn't done by a proper study. I'm just not because my experience is the anecdotal data. Data is super viable.

I'm interested in people sitting in front of me. What are some other things that you would use peptides for? So there's peptides for inflammation, right? So BPC-157, TB-500. They have these weird names.

KPV, GHK-CU, which is GHK copper. All of these are very anti-inflammatory, right? They're promoting anti-inflammatory mechanism, not pro-inflammatory mechanism. There's peptides for the nervous system. One called CMax, which was developed in Russia many decades ago,

tell people how to stroke. People have had a traumatic brain injury. CMax and its cousins selenke, selenke taps into the GABA system, which is our calming system. That's the same receptors that alcohol and benzos tap into.

Well, selenke is very calming for some people. In fact, the combination of CMax and selenke is like a natural adorone. And so we make that into an nasal spray. I have a lot of patients who try that because I like the nasal spray

because it's kind of a quick hit to the nervous system and they can redose it. I'm not going to say it's perfect and certainly not for everybody. But one of my problems with mainstream medicine is that a lot of doctors act like KPV,

like no, you can't do it. Why should it be up to them? Like if it's safe, why can't the patient try? I'm a big believer. Let people try and explore as long as we're doing it safely.

And for my perspective, I have more experience with stuff than most. We're going to start there, right? We're going to start as a reference point. I only want you to try it if it's safe.

We're never going to recommend things that are out of bounds, ever.

“And I recognize that doctors don't know either, right?”

We train a lot of doctors. They're interested in learning, but to your point, we need to teach this stuff. That's not coming from conventional medical education. That's not part of their model.

So, I want to help these providers, these physicians, learn how to use these tools. So, other peptides good for the nervous system. Seemax, the length, cerebrolycin. We've had great success.

So, cerebrolycin's this neuropeptide. Patients have had a stroke. You know, my nurse practitioner, her dad had a stroke. He did so well using cerebrolycin. Just subcutaneously, injecting himself.

She said he made such an amazing recovery. And she used to work in a kind of stroke rehab center. So, she has a lot of experience with it. So, cerebrolycin's another one that we can use. There's mitochondrial peptides, peptides like MOTC.

Which I think of as the stronger fit or faster peptide. Helps with body composition and energy, humanin, which is like the DNA repair peptide. One called SS-31, which we talked about the mitochondria.

We talked about where methylene blue binds on that fourth hub. Well, that's where SS-31 binds to help keep the shape and architecture of the mitochondria intact.

A lot of different peptides.

How do we know what to use? Well, the way I do it is I want to understand patients' motivation, understand their story, understand their goals. And then we start. And then I want feedback. How's it working?

Are you experienced like with you? My shoulder's feeling better. We're on the right track. I have more energy. I'm sleeping better. There's peptides for circadian rhythm. One called epitalin.

There's one called pinealon, which helps us release more melatonin.

“I can go on and on, but I think you get the gist.”

What other type of protocols? Hormones are big deal. I think understanding we touched upon this a little bit. As people age, I think the most tangible thing that happens is that their hormones decline. There's a lot of hormones. Hormones, by definition, are just message or molecules. So, we have adrenal hormones, cortisol, DHA, pregnant melanin.

There's thyroid hormone, which works with metabolism.

There's insulin as signaling hormone to help get glucose utilized. There's growth hormone, which is an antibody hormone, testosterone. Another antibody hormone, probably the biggest deal for men. There's estrogen, or gestorone. You can see there's a lot.

And so, what we like to do is understand someone's where they are. And if clinically and in the lab, they're low. Or they're exhibiting signs of deficiencies. We may consider replacing those deficiencies with biodynamic hormones. So, for men, testosterone is the first and obvious place to look.

Most men don't realize that low testosterone in a man is the number one risk factor for heart disease stroke, depression, and dementia. Is it really? Yeah, it's a big deal. Big deal. As well as if you look at the study's clinical studies,

men who replace their testosterone report a higher quality of life across the board. So, again, the goal is not to manipulate the goal is not to make your arms as big as your legs unless your bodybuilder you want to do that.

We never want to manipulate the hormones.

We want to help you get back. And we want to trial taking this hormone or those hormones and see how you feel. See how you respond. For most people, it's a very positive experience. The goal is never to make someone younger.

I think that's a silly, silly goal. The goal is to help people feel their best so they can perform their best at any age. And what level T should somebody have? Are we shooting for it's relative? We had it when we were 21.

Some people say that. So here's how I look at it. You know, we want to go to the regular doctor and it's like, "Oh, you're great for your age." Yeah, so let's talk about that.

I agree. So let's talk about where do reference ranges come from? Reference ranges come from what's in the population. And as we've talked about, the majority of people in the population were talking about adults, overweight, tired, depressed,

and taking it at this point multiple pharmaceuticals. So just being in that range to me is mediocre. I don't want anyone to be mediocre, life too short to be mediocre. So when we're looking at the ranges, we want it to be on the upper end of the range.

Right? And so it doesn't mean, like, for example, testosterone range, most labs, normal is going to be somewhere between 200 and we'll say 1500. Some labs, it's more or some labs it's less.

“It doesn't mean you have to be 1500 to feel your best.”

By no means. Again, it's expiration. Everyone's different. Everyone has different stories of the tell. The stories they experience life that they live.

So if we do a trial of testosterone over time, we find, "Hey, I'm feeling great." And we draw their blood and it's 800. Great. Doesn't mean we have to shoot for the moon.

And it certainly doesn't mean we want to manipulate it and get superficial logic. You know? Because any kind of thing you do the body is going to be other things that it affects when men take more testosterone.

They're going to make more estrogen. Sometimes that's good. But they're making too much estrogen. They feel bloated swollen. They gain water weight.

They get really emotional.

“Some of these hormones, I think of like kids in a playground.”

Some of them, like, testosterone is a fun, happy kid. Everyone wants more testosterone. Other hormones like cortisol or stress hormones, like the big bed bully. Too much cortisol, too little cortisol, has a negative impact on other hormones. In terms of testosterone, because this is a great question.

If we start and someone is low, I just want them to be higher associated with how they feel. Now, does that mean that if we measure and they say, "Hey, I think I could sleep better that we can't try going a little higher. Sure, if it's appropriate." But I think there's an interesting book that's called "The Trouble with testosterone."

And it was written by this guy. He's a sociologist at Stanford called his name's Robert Sapolsky. And he studies by boons in the wild. He also wrote another book called "Why Zebra's Don't Get Olesers." Fascinating guy.

I talked about stress. But the trouble with testosterone to summarize is he found that in the Bible and population.

And then he had the number five in the pecking order with the lowest level of testosterone. No, no, shit.

“Both of those had the shortest lifespan.”

Number one, number five had the shortest lifespan. The longest lifespan was number three, right in the middle.

And his theory was, if you're number one, you're always trying to stay number one.

That's very stressful. If you're number five, you're always trying to get to the top. That's very stressful. If you're number three, you're good. But you don't have to be too good.

And I think that applies to the side of the thing that applies to a lot of things in life. So, to answer your question, I just want people to be in the closer to the top, but based on how they feel. The more stuff we use, the more side effects we're going to have. So hormones, I think talking about protocols, they're foundational, right? For a female, it's thyroid hormone.

It used to be progesterine, it's a thyroid hormone. Low thyroid and women's become an epidemic. Most women, if they're 40s and 50s, are going to have some thyroid problems. Not a pessimist and just a realist. What do you think about GLP-Lon?

Great question. I think by and large, they're great tool. And I've seen this, right? I think we've been using some of the GLP-Lon titers up to type for almost six years now, maybe seven years. And I think they work.

If I am looking at a weight loss tool, I think it's the most reliable right now.

“Now, I think you have to use it judiciously.”

I think that helping people start at a low dose, take their time, go slowly.

There's never urgency to me to lose weight.

You know, I hear from people, I need to lose weight in a month. You know, I remember some of these supermodels I work with, "Hey, I'm doing a shoot in two weeks. Can we get any season?" Yeah, like can we get it? We've got to have good expectations. But for most people, the vast majority is there's no urgency, right? If you want to take our time.

And the way they work is they are, it's a signaling molecule. So it's slowing down gastric emptying. So your food as it goes through your stomach and your digestive tract is going to be slowed down. So you're going to feel full faster. As you feel full faster, you're not going to eat as much.

If you don't eat as much, you're going to lose weight. But you're going to do so when you're not going to feel cranky. I think that can be very effective that way. I really do. And by and large, if we use them judiciously and take our time,

we really don't see a lot of side effects. The trouble, seemingly, that we have now, and it's not really trouble is people don't want to come off of them. And so people want to stay on them because they're like, "I'm afraid I'm going to lose the weight back." And I understand that.

“And again, I think if we're using low dose or checking in on a”

monitoring, we're probably good. What I'm starting to see is that higher dose, whatever that is, but higher dose, people are experiencing an hedonia. They're coming back and they don't find pleasure anymore. They don't enjoy sex.

They don't want to drink coffee. To kill it doesn't taste good. They're just not as satisfied. And so I think it's showing that it doesn't just work on the food pathways. It's working on pleasure pathways.

And it's going to be interesting to see how it plays out. But as a tool, I think they can be very effectively. We've also learned that a lot of people with autoimmune disease and chronic inflammation can benefit from low dose TLP ones. So I'm a fan of used appropriately.

You know, we monitor. I do have some people who overshoot. You know, had a patient just a couple months ago. I'd call her out and say, "Hey, I think this is, this is your going too far too fast." You know, you're not looking healthy.

You've lost weight. I get it. But we've got to dial that back. And she appreciated it.

Like everything goes, there's always going to be bad apples, too.

What about ozone? What about ozone? Which is technically O3. You can kind of fall in this category of like oxygen therapies. Traditionally, it's been used for many decades primarily for wound healing.

Right? And so the idea and still is. Because the more we need to heal a wound, we need more oxygen in that environment. This is why hyperbaric oxygen in the setting of wound healing is very powerful.

Very powerful. My wife just had this complicated nose surgery. And the surgeon has part of the recovery. How to go into hyperbaric oxygen after the treatments for days upon days. Because he found that after having a surgery, you can accelerate the healing.

And she's found that. She's really enjoyed the hyperbaric oxygen. And that, you know, the trouble with oxygen not to get too far out to path is to get oxygen into our system. This is what happens with CPAP.

We have to pressurize it. Right? And so the idea with people having sleep apnea, if they have a decreased airway and they're not getting enough oxygen to their brain, you can't just have them breathe in oxygen.

So you have to pressurize it.

So then we have these devices that sit on the side of the bed. There's no one likes, but it allows for more oxygen to get to the brain. So they don't have apnic events where they're blood, you know, oxygen dropping too low. Ozone, tying it back in, is another one of these therapies

that helps oxygenate our tissues. And so what we do in our officers, different ways to do ozone is we'll start an IV. And then we'll draw the blood out into a bag. It's a pump system.

So it draws the blood out into a bag. We take oxygen gas. We turn it into ozone, which is O3s. We're taking O2 to O3. Putting that in the blood, mixing it.

And then we're turning the bag over and running that blood back in. We run it through a UV light to essentially clean it. And we're kind of oxygenating their system.

Now, industrially ozone gas is used to clean out huge cars.

It has a disinfected effect. So we think of that happening in the body. So we've seen it with people who have chronic, not necessarily chronic, but things going in their gut or post viral, where they're coming down with an infection.

They have a bacterial infection, a viral infection, a yeast infection. You can use ozone successfully to help clean out that system. And then it allows them their own innate immune system to strengthen and work.

“So I think it works well for that, but it also works as an oxygenator,”

which just helps people have more energy. How often should somebody be doing that? It's variable. I think it depends on what they're working on. If just from a pure, you know,

preventive, I want to be my best. I want people to try it. If they feel good from it, maybe once a month. I don't know, so I think more than that. Maybe once every couple months. If they're working on stuff, we've had people who,

whether it's post COVID or some other viral thing, they're doing it twice a week. So it just depends. Twice a week. Yeah, yeah. It's very safe.

And again, it has a long history. Have you seen these? I can't remember what they call it. I think I know you're trying to review about the bags of yellow. It looks like they've pissed in a bag.

Yeah, what is that? Plasma for recess.

“Yeah, so what they're doing is like dialysis, right?”

And so their idea is, is we're going to clean the blood really, really well.

And so their plasma exchange is basically what it is.

So they're drawing their blood out. They're separating the components, the plasma serum is the fluid. They take the red blood cells out. And they run it through filters or something. And then they run it back in.

And the stuff that they're holding is kind of the what they call the debris. Now, I think it's more hype than anything. And the reason I say that is I've known several people to do this treatment. And they're like, eh, didn't notice much. The other thing I think about maybe I'm thinking the wrong way.

And I know is dialysis, they don't get better. Or someone has chronic kidney disease in their own dialysis. That doesn't get better because they're doing dialysis. Dialysis is filtering their blood so they can remain healthy, you know, alive, essentially. So I think it's a bit of a stretch to say, we're just going to clean your blood.

And you're going to be even healthier. I'm not saying it's bad, but it tends to be very expensive. And I've heard it's very uncomfortable. So when I try to evaluate therapies, I don't want to do things that are hurting people, per se. And there has to be some efficacy.

In fact, a lot of efficacy. So you're kind of on the fronts about this. I'm not on the fence. I don't recommend it. You don't recommend it.

That plasma for instance. No. I don't recommend it at all. I looked into offering it and training and the training was exorbitantly expensive. The business model didn't make sense to me.

And people are immediate to charge people.

“I mean, I think people are paying 15, 20,000 per cent.”

I looked at it per session. Yeah, per one. I can't make sense of that. I have a hard time understanding that. Particularly when people tell me directly multiple people did it.

Didn't notice anything. You're going to spend that much money. I would hope you noticed something with like peptides. A little bit off time. If you're injecting yourself with something on a regular basis, I hope you're feeling it.

I don't want it to be that people are just injecting well. I think it's working. Uh-uh. I want you to feel it. So I'm not a fan of plasma for Jesus.

I understand why people would do it, right? Again, it's all contextual. If someone had cancer, if someone had some grave disease, why not? Again, why not try everything? But I want to go back to the light plasma.

The say that again, light plasma. PMF light plasma. Yeah, the PMF with the magnetic therapy. So what is that doing? I'm not, this is not my subject matter.

The way I think about what has been explained to me were electrical beings. Right? And so electricity is kind of how we had electricity before we had chemicals.

There was voltage.

We know that, for example, our mitochondria maintain our cells maintain a voltage

to exchange ions or exchange different minerals to allow cellular processes to continue. Gross oversimplification. That electricity also creates a magnetic current. And that magnetic current can get incoherent. And what the PMF does is essentially lines up.

Just people are familiar with magnetic therapy, right? We're trying to get our cells lined up so there's coherence again. So why would someone want to do that? Well, a lot of people are living with pain, inflammation. My wife's got a lot of kind of stored up tension, pain in her muscles.

She's done a lot of that PMF and really finds it to make a difference. Wow. And it's non-invasive. And you're looking at 15/20 minute sessions, sometimes longer. But in the terms of looking at the body, contextually, you know, more holistically,

is more than just chemicals.

“And so that's why I'm excited about incorporating some of these energy devices from PMF”

to hydrogen gas inhalation, vibrational plate. We're also looking at vibroacoustic therapy, which is sound as, you know, mechanical therapy. I don't understand. Yeah. So there's this, there's this pod.

I just tried, um, it's called solo dome, S-O-L-O-G-O-M-E.

And, um, basically, sit in it.

And there's different frequencies. You can apply different songs, but it's basically helping your cells get tuned. Again, a lot of people say, oh, that's a quackery, that's woo-woo. I don't think so. You know, our physical being is both mechanical, it's electrical, it's magnetic.

It's chemicals, all of the above. These therapies that, you know, are non-invasive. Um, again, going back to ancient traditions, drumming, drumming, sir. I mean, this says a very profound impact on people. rhythm.

Sound. Um, different frequency. It's a big deal. So we're just trying to understand it. You know, how do you create an environment for the human to thrive?

Not just be mediocre. Any other protocols. I think for people to do it home, um, is, you know, there's a lot of talk about HRB therapy, or HRB understanding, right, heart rate variability.

And what that means is like the, in-between the beats of the heart beating, um, we should have coherence, I've said that word a lot, in-sinkness. It should be in-sink. Um, so people are using their loop, or their orring, or their apple watch, and trying to get an HRB reading, which ties into their readiness score, their sleep score.

And I think that's fine. I think those are probably not the best ways.

“I think the, the best way is to get, um,”

like Garmin makes a chest strap called the polar device. You just put it on. There's an app. And you can do HRB testing. And I think it makes sense for people to do this at home,

when you wake up in the afternoon and understand your baseline, and then examine what you do, whether it's behavior or your things you take, and see how your HRB is affected. The higher the HRB has been associated with better health outcomes.

So that's something I think is important for people to consider. Uh-huh. Easy, right, not complicated. You don't have to do it every day, but just try to get a baseline. Understand yourself.

I think what's missing for people isn't, you know, as self-awareness. And, you know, for better or for worse, people are looking for permission for people to do things. You know, that's become very popular.

Listen to that podcast. They said to do that. We'll try it out. See how it works for you. You know what I mean?

I'm a big fan of exploring that. And wanting people to explore it. Everyone's different. Yeah, I, I commonly hear particularly peptides. My brother or my cousin was doing this peptide.

They're doing amazing. Why are I? Well, you're very different than your brother and your cousin. You know, doesn't mean it can't work for you, but maybe you need a different dose.

Maybe you need different dosing. Maybe you need twice a day instead of once a day.

“That's what we like trying to help people do.”

It's figure out that individualization. What am I missing? I don't know. I think we've got it. Yeah, this is awesome.

Doc.

I just want to say, Sean, you're doing amazing work.

You've had an amazing life. God's really chosen you to do some heavy lifting. You know, you're selfless. You sacrifice throughout your life. It means a lot that I get to know you.

And just want you to know speaking for the rest of your audience,

“how grateful we are for someone like you.”

I know it's not easy.

When you do have to sacrifice and you do have to do heavy lifting.

But I can tell you it's noticed.

“And for my vantage point, it's very much appreciated.”

Thank you. Thank you. Thank you for coming.

Thank you for saying that.

“And I hope to see open an officer of mental Tennessee.”

But I'll keep going to South Carolina at the meantime. I appreciate it. All right, Doc. It was an honor. Thank you.

No matter where you're watching the Sean Ryan Show from, if you get anything out of this at all, anything. Please like, comment, and subscribe. And most importantly, share this everywhere you possibly can. And if you're feeling extra generous,

head to Apple Podcasts and Spotify, and leave us a review.