S2E34: We Are Here to Learn From | Talk Tracks

Today we're spending time with Gavin Shaltz and his mother Cindy.

“Gavin is differently verbal, a phrase he chose himself.”

When he was a young child, Gavin stopped talking and was diagnosed with autism. He went through years of therapy and then at the age of nine, Gavin began spelling to communicate by pointing to letters on a letterboard. He now has been typing to communicate for more than a decade. And through that process, he shared a rich and deeply thoughtful inner world

shaped by theology and profound sense of purpose. Today we'll be asking Gavin some of the questions submitted by our backstage past community. Our subscriber platform where listeners can access ad free episodes, connect with other community members, and submit questions for guests who've been on the show. So thank you to everyone who sent in questions.

So Cindy, Gavin, welcome! Hi everyone, I'm Kiddickens, and welcome to the talk tracks.

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In this series, we explore the threads that we've together our understanding of reality. Science, spirituality, consciousness, and yes. Even unexplained phenomena like probabilities. We examine the mysteries that sit just beyond the edge of what science can currently explain. Alongside researchers, thinkers, families, and experiences.

If you haven't yet listened to the telepathy tapes, I encourage you to start there. It lays the foundation for everything that we'll be exploring. Because every era has ideas once dismissed as impossible until someone was willing to investigate them seriously. And on this show, we do just that.

Why don't you Cindy start by introducing yourself? My name is Cindy Schultz, and I've been married to my husband, Randy, for almost 48 years. I live in Racine, Wisconsin. I am a mom of five awesome children. The oldest is 46.

Then we have our youngest on Gavin, who is 28. And Gavin, it's a pleasure to have you here. To begin, is there anything you'd like to share with us? Yeah, not yet. I'm great, okay.

Well, one thing I thought was helpful was that in our email correspondence prior to this. Gavin let us know that he does not like to be referred to as non-verbal.

“And I think it's so important to use the language that people are comfortable with.”

So Gavin, how would you like to be referred to? What do you think? If Gavin is failing to communicate and for the sake of brevity, we'll skip to the end of the sentence. They're frankly verbal. Well, Cindy, why don't you start off by telling us a bit about Gavin's early years?

I had Gavin, but 39. He, you know, progressed. I thought, you know, meeting milestones and things like that. He didn't crawl though. He was talking and he used to say, you know, mommy, daddy,

but by up-down birdie, things like that. And at the age of two, all of a sudden, all that went away. And he would just scream or temper tantrum or rocking and toe-walking and banging. And lining his toys up. And he just like would go and bang his head.

I said, okay, this is way more than terrible twos. I didn't know if that time did it was autism, but the neighbor next door that was a nurse had said, you know, my think he might have autism. And then at the age of three, then we did get the diagnosis.

“And I remember feeling, you know, relieved, but yet I still cried.”

Because, you know, it's hard, you know, it's really hard. But then I just dove right in and I do a lot of research and I thought, nothing's going to stop me from helping him and finding the best therapies available and all that other stuff, right, Gavin? So we did it, didn't we?

And so I understand that Gavin was an ABA therapy for many years. And for listeners who might not know, ABA stands for Applied Behavior Analysis Therapy. And it's often the most recommended therapy for individuals with autism. And when Gavin was nine, he learned to communicate by pointing to letters on a letterboard. So Cindy, prior to Gavin learning to communicate, what did you believe or

understand about Gavin's in our world? You know, I didn't really know what he knew. I remember sitting and he used to play with ABC toys that would spell, you know, A for Apple B for Ball C for Cat. And he had that with him.

And I said to him, oh, spell daddy your name. And he spelled G A V I N S C H U L T Z. And I thought, I didn't even know you knew your last name or how to spell it. So that gave me a little inkling into, wow, he's really smart. Or he's really picked up on things.

I love that.

That the toy letterboard kind of served as your first window into using a board

with letters to spell the communicate. So then you're probably thinking, okay, maybe he knows more than you previously thought. And then how did you first even come to know that there was something like RPM or the rapid prompting method, right? That could teach him to actually learn the motor control of the spell his thoughts.

I had heard a little bit about it.

And then we met with Soma when Gavin was nine. She mentioned Soma here and she's the founder of the RPM method. She's an incredible force in the world of spelling to communicate. And she really innovated the technique for her San Tito who is now one of the most incredible quickest typeers I've ever witnessed.

Soma came to Chicago and we had a bunch of other families that all met down there at this hotel for the weekend. And then she would work back to back to back two sessions each day. All these parents were sitting in a room watching her working with these individuals. And we were just odd, my mouth was like to the floor.

She was so super calm with them, never raised her voice.

Just kept going no matter what they were doing. And Gavin did really well with her. And she even had him doing math, which I didn't even know that he knew math. And he's getting all the answers correct. And I remember when he was in elementary school, they were teaching him words like

captain, dog and up and down and working with Soma. He was spelling words like elephant and tevernacle and things like that.

“And I'm like, how do you even know how to spell this kind of stuff?”

Yeah, incredible. I mean, learning to communicate changes so many people's lives. And I know we sent a question to Gavin and asking about this experience.

Can you read what he spelled?

All right, so the question was, what was it like for you prior to RPM? And he spelled life for me before RPM was more frustrating. Because the people around me had no idea how intelligent I was. I felt locked inside waiting for someone to let me out. Thank God, Soma had the key for learning the RPM method has changed my life.

Yeah, beautiful. The next question said, how did it feel when you were able to communicate? And you said being able to learn through RPM lessons led to my ability to communicate. That was the happiest day of my life. I knew after meeting Soma and working with her, my life was going to change for the better.

Soma believes in her students because RPM works for all ages.

Do you have anything else to say about that, yeah? Okay, so Gavin is typing. Everyone needs to try RPM. Everyone needs to try it. Yep, it doesn't hurt to try, does it? Gosh, I mean, I'm just so glad you found what works for you Gavin.

“And so as he began typing more, did anything change in your lives or what started to unfold?”

It wasn't until I homeschooled him for middle school and high school. You know, I really noticed that he knew things that I didn't, you know? I'm teaching of things, but it seemed like he already knew it. I would be doing something with him a lesson or whatever, and he'd answer all these questions, right? And then all of a sudden he would want to write a writing, you know, like we had music appreciation.

He likes Pete Sieger, which is a very old folk singer, you know? And then he would write a really nice poem, a tribute to him. And like, wow, you know, I'm like holding the board and back then I didn't even have the laptop up here. I'm like writing everything down that he's spelling and then I'm typing it and the laptop. I was just like, odd.

Did you ask him, you know, where he was learning the stuff from? Yes, we did. You know, I was like hoping he'd say that I was his best teacher. And he spelled, God is my greatest teacher or other theologians he spelled one day. And I'm like, theologians, I'm like, well, and I'm like looking it up and he spelled it correctly. And I'm like, wow, how do you even know that word?

Where did that come from? I'm like, how do you know this, you know? But you just said that God and other theologians are your teachers.

“So that's why you are taught from a much higher power than Cindy Scholls sitting here in”

Caledonian Wisconsin. So interesting. So I'm so curious, Gavin, when those teachings come in from theologians, like how are you interfacing with them? You know, what does that experience look like? I whisper to me, I feel the Holy Spirit speaks to me. Wow. Yeah, so he swears about it. It's the Holy Spirit telling him what to say right, Gav. But I like that you've got that kind of connection. A friend of his bought him for his birthday,

something about I get my downloads from Moses or something. But I'm like, oh my goodness, yeah, that's Gavin. He gets the downloads from Moses, don't you? And so this connection to what Gavin calls the Holy Spirit. You know, we've actually talked to many differently verbal individuals who say that they get information or downloads from different teachers. Sometimes they call them masters. Sometimes they do reference different

from non-speakers they meet on the hill. And for those of you who did not listen to season one, the hill is what many spellers call a realm that they, you know, travel to with their consciousness or astral travel to to connect with others like themselves. And many said there are beings there who are passed on. So anyway, it's really interesting and very cool. You've got that connection, Gavin.

And so as this spelling journey continued, you know, often times families will say first their

child starts spelling and then they realized all the snalves they had and then other gifts started to appear. And so we had some questions for Gavin and if you wouldn't mind reading those and his responses. Let's see, Gavin, how do you experience connections or awareness beyond spoken language if at all? And you said, I can read people very well. I feel their energy if they are happy or sad or concerned. I know it. God has given me special gifts to understand people. Thanks to him

for believing in me to use them properly. So yeah, we've had therapists come and work with him. And he would just sense that, you know, something was wrong or something happened or whatever. And then, you know, he says, oh, you're sad. And then they would say, well, yeah, so and so passed away. And I'm feeling down or whatever. And even in last month when we did the RPM session, the very first thing he sat down, he started spelling and he was spelling to the practitioner lady

about things. She's like, how did you know that I needed to hear that? And he says, I could just feel that things were bothering you. And he just gave her hope and comfort. And it was so so sweet. Yeah. And then the next question, Gavin, it says, do you call it telephi and you said, I call it hearing from the Holy Spirit from God himself. He often tells me what to type and share with the world. Telephi is real. And I believe in it. However, I am not getting into all the hype of it.

“I feel you have to have discernment about certain things in life. And this is one of them.”

Yeah. And you know, it's just funny. Because a few weeks ago, another man we interviewed Peter Kane spelled that, you know, telephi can be misused. So I think discernment is a really great quality to bring to it. But, you know, is telephi something you two have experienced together? Why? A. So Gavin is typing. Yes, for sure. A connection is like peanut butter and jelly. That's funny. Peanut butter and jelly. I love it. We have a connection like peanut butter and jelly.

Don't you know? So amazing. Such a good response. That's so funny. Yeah. He definitely has the sense of humor.

So how did mine to mine to communication or telephi start for you both? One of the teachers said, oh, yeah, I thought of five words the other day. And I wrote him down. And I didn't show my kid down. But he wrote him in order. I thought, well, let me try that. Sure. Yeah, he did it. And then just the other night I said, okay, I'm not going to write these words down. I'm just going to think of something. And sure enough, he spelled everything I thought of. Come on, Gavin. How do you

do that? You know, even my husband's in the room and he's like, how do you do that? So Gavin is this something more recent? And just so people know, he's typing his answer. No, I have had this

“talent, but keep it under wraps. Wow. Okay. And so for you, Cindy, what did you make of all this?”

I tried to, I don't know. Okay, because you know, it's just like voodoo, voodoo, you know, or are you just like you think like, oh my goodness, you know, is this really, you know, true or whatever? And so yeah, we've been very discerning about it because like he says, I do not want to do anything that would ever jeopardize anyone ever thinking that he did not write everyone of his writings because he did write every one of his writings because he spells words,

I don't even know much less how to spell them. You know, I'm like, check in words and you always

spell them right. I'm like, how do you know this? To let the sea has a time in place or not when I am spelling. There you go. And yeah, on that note, I mean, that's a question we send ahead of time wanting to know what Gavin feels about skeptics who say spellers are not authoring their own words. And for people new to this show or even to this world, typing to communicate almost always involves a regulation partner, especially in the beginning. When someone needs the most support with motor planning

and regulation and critics sometimes argue that that means the communication is not fully independent, which too many people care is a bit of an air of ableism because if you cannot control your body and you need support to communicate, why does their communication not count? But one of the most

“important distinctions to make here is that telepathy, according to many non-speakers themselves,”

is something separate entirely. It's a skill set innate to many, if not all of us, and it gets heightened

need their communication partners to clear their minds while spelling, so they can focus on their

“own thoughts without distraction. Okay, so I digress, why don't you go ahead and read Gavin's answer?”

You said, I rather not waste time worrying about naysayers who doubt things. Everyone has their own opinion and they can be stubborn. I prefer to move forward and continue to

do what works for me and countless others. I will always be a strong advocate for rapid prompting

method. Anything else on that one? People would think they know better should not be such any other mention. Negative Nancy. And so what are your thoughts on the backlash against letterboards to communicate? Or does it even just the fact that telepathy means someone's not authoring their own words? Do you ever think about that or have you encountered any pushback personally? I have not too much, no, because I even bought a board that's clear, you know,

and I am like, okay, I'm holding this. This is my arm here, and he's pointing and his other hand is over there. And it's like, how can it not be him doing this, you know? Gosh, it's so funny that you said that because, you know, and I want to be kind here, but I have no other way to explain

this, that one of the biggest like trolls around spelling on the internet who's always like bashing

it and insulting typeers and saying it's not real. Once was talking to a scientist who is researching and she communicate and she said to the scientist, have you seen it with your own eyes and the scientist said, yes, and then she goes, okay, you're a lost cause, because once you see it, then you believe it. And it's kind of like, what? Anyway, okay, go on. Right. Yeah, and even with the whole telepathy stuff. Yeah, it was funny because we were out to lunch with a friend of ours.

And the mom said to Gavin, could you please tell him not to read my mind? Because she had said

“something about, you know, I think blank blank blank and he smells blank blank blank and it was funny”

because then Gavin even said, just clear your mind. Oh, that's funny. Okay, so she was thinking blank blank blank and he wrote it. And I've actually heard teachers who say that they'll start to think of a word over and over again, like pumpkin pumpkin pumpkin and the type of right stop saying pumpkin over and over again. But really what I've heard from so many typeers at this point is that you literally just have to clear your mind. Like clear your mind of all thoughts. Yeah, well, Gavin

says literally, this is what he type, come on now. I can read my mom's mind too, but face it, we are more intelligent than both of their minds together. So, you know, it gets down to it has nothing to do with, oh, you're reading my mind. I'm reading your mind or whatever. It's, it's their intelligence. You know, I really try to not have anything going on. He said something about, you know, being way smarter. And by the time I would think of something for him to write in my mind,

he's already got it written. And yeah, or whatever. So it's like, don't even go there, Mom,

you know. That's great. And I mean, obviously, Gavin, you're so smart. It's always so uplifting.

“I mean, I think to all of us, you know, how smart and competent so many individuals who've been”

dismissed as differently able to are. And so, you know, I guess beyond connecting with the Holy Spirit, are there any other spiritual gifts, Gavin experiences or insights he wants to share about the world and about consciousness. Gavin said, I have the gift of seeing angels. And that is a beautiful gift. So many times, people are too busy with life. And they miss the gift, God puts right in front of them. My senses are heightened, so I notice things others may not. Be still with

God, and he will show you remarkable things. I see oras around people. I can feel strong energy if a person is good or bad. Of course, being around lots of people at one time can be difficult. I am grateful that the people I hang out with are good energy. Consciousness is taking the time to be more aware of every single thing. This whole angel thing, you know, he had, um, what was it? Grand Maul seizure in 2020. And they would not let my husband or I stay that night at the hospital.

And I'm like, are you kidding me? This is, you know, I probably said it, Gavin. I'm not verbal. I'm just a person. And you're not letting me stay. Oh, no, no, because we don't, you know, he has a high fever and we, you know, he could have COVID. I said he doesn't have COVID. He's got a high fever because he just had the seizure, you know, or whatever, but they wouldn't let me stay. And I didn't sleep at all that night, but the next morning they let me come in.

And he later spelled that there was nothing to worry about, mom, because every room I was in.

two throughout the years. And, you know, one time he'd look in the corner and he'd start

giggling and smiling and we're like, what, what are you doing? And he was, oh, never mind me.

I'm just noticing the angel, you know, by the lamp. And we're like, what? And Gavin, can I ask what that experience is like for you, when you see angels? And it's something I have to, you know, say, like a lot of non-speakers have shared. And I, you know, I guess it is always the same,

“or do you have to be in a certain state to see or access them? And like, what do they look like?”

When you see them, and do they talk to you? And can you hear them? A lot of beautiful beings, not always, no, I see them, but I feel God says, then when we need the most. Yeah. And there was one time too when we were at the other day program that he was with, and the woman that created that program was on the phone with the hospital or a doctor for her daughter at the time. And we were all in the gym class. We were sitting and doing exercises in the chair

and Gavin kept looking over by her. And he spelled there's an angel by a net shoulder right now. So after she got off the phone, then we went over there and said that there was an angel by you Gavin said it was like a tough time for her. So God knew that she needed an angel by her, right? Yeah, it's beautiful. Okay, so Cindy, I know we sent you a question for Gavin, which was,

“what are your desires for yourself and humanity? So how did Gavin answer that one?”

This was cute. I'm not sure if I will get married, but I do have a special girl

that has my heart. Being best friends is great. I will always continue to learn new things

with an open mind. I would like to accomplish getting RPM spellers, unite activities set up in the future. And you said my desires are to be a published author of my book. I also want to live someday with my friends Matthias, a academy home. I pray that humanity can become loving and kind and stop being so hateful. And a lot of his writings too are about being kind, showing kindness, you know, how hard is it to do one kind act every day, you know, where things like that? Wow,

that's awesome. And Gavin, you mentioned your book just now. And in the emails you shared, Cindy, you said that you've been collecting his writings and are compiling them into a book. Can you tell us, you know, a little bit about what inspired that? Gavin has just been spelling for

well over a decade. And he just always wants his writings out there and wanting people to know

how intelligent they are and that just because their voices don't work. And oftentimes it is the

“apraxia with him that just it doesn't connect, you know, the body with the with the mind, right?”

It makes it hard to do that. And so he felt that it was important to let other people know that he's in there, they all are in there and they need to be heard and appreciated for everything that they do know. So great. And Gavin, in your words, what would you say the book is about? Gavin said my book is about hope and encouragement for readers to believe in the one true God. It will help those who read it, realize to never underestimate a special needs individual's ability. We are

remarkable in so many ways. Telling what you did today Gavin, it was so exciting. I signed a contract and my books also want to be published. Okay, so Gavin spelled, I signed the contract for my book, the hopeful one to be published. You was so excited. Congratulations. I mean, it's a huge deal. So awesome. So as I mentioned, we have a bunch of questions from our backstage past subscribers. And a lot of these

questions cover a lot of ground, but maybe Cindy, you could read the ones that you've chosen to answer and then read his responses. The first question was, what makes you most happy about the world and what makes you most frustrated and use that, Gavin? What makes me most happy with the world is having family and friends to hang out with and having a good time. I am happy surrounding myself with like-minded people who have a positive outlook on life and love the Lord. My frustration

with the world is too many people are negative and so hateful in their actions towards each other. I want kindness and love-shone, not hate. Together, if we all show love and do acts of kindness daily, think of what a difference that would make in the world. Yeah, it's so beautiful. And that, too,

oh, mom's always depressed, you know, or this is going on and that's going on, or she's thinking,

“that it really makes you as a parent more aware that you want to be happy and more positive because”

it's not good to always feel those kind of negative thoughts totally. It's a great reminder. All right. The next question is, can non-speaking autistic people connect telepathically with a severe down syndrome people? Are they also in there and can they learn to communicate through spelling or any other method? And you said, first of all, I do not like to be called non-speaking autistic person. How about calling us differently speaking? Yep, and he does have a shirt that says

everyone communicates differently. A friend of his got for him. We can have connections with everyone even severe down syndrome people. I have down friends and we communicate very well together.

“It does not. All have to be done telepathically, but it can for sure happen that way for everyone's”

information. God created us all in there. I so believe that now because back in the day, so many people, well, they don't know anything. They would talk in front of him and it's like, he's hearing you, he's listening and it just drives you crazy, Gavin. We all have the ability to learn and with love and patience, the other disability can learn to communicate. It is all about

never giving up on us and believing in our abilities. Look past the diagnosis and do not let it

define you. I use my weaknesses to be my strongest strengths and he does at the day program that he goes to there's all different disabilities there and he's got several downstrends and the one that was doing bowling with us or whatever he was just like so excited to, you know, communicate back and forth with Gavin and oftentimes I would show him photos or whatever and then I said, what do you think of that? Or do you want to write anything about this and then he would write

something really cool and there was a photo one of your friends was holding another girl in a wheelchairs hand and he wrote this beautiful writing about they don't have to talk to be connected which then also made me think what are they talking about? Yes, I love that. All right, the next question was, do you think non-speakers are experiencing this physical lifetime here in order to teach others to help us evolve? And you said, absolutely, God had a plan when he sent me here. We are

here to learn from. We are the gentle souls of love and peace that he wants the world to hear from. Our minds are not filled with the noise of this world. Our minds are filled with God's knowledge to spread the light of God on this dark world is what I do to give hope to everyone. Too many are depressed and having anxiety. They need to know God is there for them. I feel we were sent to save the world from despair. People can learn a tremendous amount from us if they only take

the time to listen. The next question is, do you find it insulting to be asked to do these tests

“and card identifications on what color is on cards 100 times to prove that you have these skills?”

And for listeners, this is a reference to some of the tests and studies that were being done to try to test or prove that's luck at these occurring. We did a lot of those in season one of the top of the tapes and there's more tests in the top of the tapes forthcoming film and a bunch of tests

on our backstage past. So, okay, so Gavin, what did you say? He said, I personally was never asked

a hundred times a question. However, I feel it takes the average person that many times to finally realize how intelligent we really are. We have remarkable skills everyone needs to believe in us. The next question is, what are the challenges you would prefer to have to optimize your skills? For helping people and you said, I would rather people take the time to spend with me, get to know me, see how I interact, listen to my words, to learn from me that way. We are not lab rats

to be used but intelligent human beings brought here by God for a purpose. This world would freak out

the last question that the listeners were asking were, I would love to ask a non-speaker,

“have they been able to communicate telepathically in the womb and as babies and that I never”

ever thought of even asking him. So, I was excited to hear what he said and he said, maybe some have

but I never did. Telepathy is a gift that happened later on for me when I started noticing

other gifts God was blessing me with, like seeing angels. I started to feel strong energy of people's emotions and could at times read their minds. Like I said before, I am careful to not

“overuse this gift. It is something I worry about getting out of control. That's what he said about”

all the questions sent in and what you guys wanted. Thank you so much, Gavin. For these just thoughtful

responses and Cindy for reading them, Gavin, is there anything else you want to mention before we end? Thank you for taking this time with me. Say hi to everyone from the hopeful one, Gavin shall love to you all. Love to you all from everyone listening and our entire team and thank you so much for sharing your story and insights. Thank you. It was good to see you take care. All right, thanks again. Bye, bye, bye. That's it for this episode of the talk tracks. But new

episodes will be released every Wednesday. So stay tuned. As we work to unravel all the threads,

“even the veiled ones that knit together are reality. And please remember to stay kind,”

stay curious and that being a true skeptic requires an open mind. To dive in deeper, subscribe to our backstage pass by visiting our website with it. You'll unlock access to bonus content like telepathy tests, ask me anything interviews with myself and guests. You'll be able to enjoy the podcast ad free, connect with other members on our telepathy tribe discord, and here and see exclusive content from the telepathy tapes vault. Visit our website at the telepathytapes.com

for more info on how to subscribe to our backstage pass. Thank you to my amazing collaborators,

producers Katherine Ellis and Selena Kennedy, technical directing audio mix and finishing by Jeremy Cole, opening and closing music by Elizabeth P.W. and original logo and cover art by Ben Condor Design. I'm Kai Dickens, your executive producer, writer, and host.