I'm Aisha Roscoe, and this is the Sunday story from up first.
Way out in the Pacific Ocean, there are tiny islands known as Atos that few people have ever seen.
“They're home to some of the most pristine ecosystems in the world.”
These islands and Atos are U.S. territories, but no one lives there permanently. Really, they belong to the wildlife, like big colonies of seabirds, rising coral reefs. And farther off shore, pods of melon-headed whales. The waters around these Atos are protected as U.S. Marine National Monuments.
Together, they cover more than a million square miles of ocean.
They're the country's largest fully protected conservation areas. Now, the subject administration is trying to change that. President Trump is opening some of these protected waters to commercial fishing. And this is reigniting a battle between the fishing industry and conservationist, as well as native Hawaiians.
NPR's Lauren Summer got some special permission to visit one of these Atos. Today on the show, she takes us to this wild remote place. Superports on what's at stake and what it means for conservation across the U.S. Stay with us.
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Do we matter? Do we matter? Listen to NPR's codeswitch podcast and the NPR app or wherever you get your podcasts. We're back with this Sunday's story. I'm with reporter Lauren Summer, who recently traveled to one of the world's most remote ocean
at tolls. Hi, Lauren. Hey, are you sure? So you took this trip to the middle of the Pacific Ocean. Describe where you went and how you got there.
Yeah, so I went to Paul Myra at toll. It's about a thousand miles south of Hawaii. It's about as far from a continent that you can get on the planet. And it's definitely not a place where you can go like book a ticket online to get there. It took months for me to get permissions to go.
Because it's a national wildlife refuge that's off limits to the general public. And you know, even packing took me some extra work, which actually started in my kitchen. Okay, so yeah, my clothes, my shoes, everything is bags. So I had to dig through my freezer, you know, make some space full of all that old like crusty ice cream.
Because everything I was bringing with me needed to be frozen in advance for 48 hours. No, I can't close the freezer.
Yeah, I mean, our freezer is always jam packed with like, you know, pizza bites and pizza
“bagels for the kids. So I understand that, but why in the world did you have to freeze your clothes?”
Yeah, so the idea is to kill off any hitchhiker. So these are like bugs or seeds that might actually get brought with me that are not supposed to be on Pomira Atoll. So, you know, I had all my ziplock stuff all frozen. And then I took a flight to Honolulu and then I got on a small charter jet
that makes the two hour flight to Paul Myra, you know, one search twice a month at most. You know, as it came into land, I could see this bright turquoise water surrounded by this deep blue Pacific ocean. The Atoll is actually a ring of low-lying islands and it's small. It's only a little more than four square miles. And right when I got off the plane,
They changed the sign that said what the local population is.
He's updating the population sign for the station, so from 21 to 22.
“This is Chris Ryan. He's the Paul Myra Atoll Preserve Manager.”
The lowest I've seen is seven, which was very nice, but very quiet. I mean, that does sound like a very peaceful and quiet place with that few people. But who exactly is at this, you know, station? Yes, so the research station is run by the Nature Conservancy, which is a conservation on profit. They have some staff there and then there's also a folks from the U.S. Fish and Wildlife
Service. And they do, you know, wildlife monitoring, scientific research, and they're also helping restore the Atoll. And people tend to kind of come in and they rotate in for three to six months at a time. When the space station was going overhead, that was our closest human neighbor for a little while. That was Virginia. That is pretty neat. You really have to like isolation. I would think to take that job. Oh, yeah. I mean, it's kind of a prerequisite. It's like a personality type.
But Ryan said, you know, that's solitude. It gives you this window into a natural world that you
never would get otherwise. It's just watching nature do its thing without people interfering.
“And I think that it's a very unique opportunity to observe that. That's that's to me the most”
important part about Palmyra. So Palmyra is densely vegetated. You know, lots of tropical forest and a lot of humidity. I mean, it rained a ton when I was there. I mean, you know, humidity could be a lot, you know. It could be so because it gives humid here in D.C. I would imagine this is probably a bit more. It was a level that I've never experienced. I mean, I was soaked pretty much the entire time I was there. I got to ask you this because I don't know much about this. What makes it an atoll
instead of an island. It's a basic question, right? So an atoll is a ring of islands. Because
it actually formed from an ancient volcano that was surrounded by a coral reef. And this kind of
volcanic island in the middle, it eroded away under the sea. But the coral reef around it continues to grow. So everything that we're on here, everything that we stand on here is on a base of dead
“coral, like coral skeletons. And then the fringing reef continues to expand out.”
Palmyra Atoll was actually one part of the kingdom of Hawaii. So when the US annexed Hawaii, Palmyra came with it. And, you know, walking around, you can kind of see the evidence of that history. There are these old concrete bunkers around, which are actually from World War II when the US military was here. So, I mean, obviously, the Pacific was a big part of World War II. Were there battles on Palmyra? No. The military, they built roads and bunkers and they had some
troops stationed there on the islands. There was a lot of preparations here. But Ryan says it was actually pretty quiet during the war. Fortunately, they didn't get a lot of action. Aside from that, Palmyra Atoll has had private owners. You know, it was considered for a destination resort. The government looked at it for a dump site for nuclear waste at one time, which, you know, did happen on some other Pacific islands. So, Palmyra Atoll could have looked very
different today. How did it get preserved? So, in 2000, the Nature Conservancy bought it, and then the US bought most of it to turn into a national wildlife refuge. And now, there's just wildlife everywhere you look. Okay. Don't sound like birds. And, um, I'm not a fan of birds, so they... We talked about the situation. I know. And I know, Palmyra kind of may not be the place for you, right? They were so many birds. It's like a snowstorm in birds. There's this birds everywhere
you see. This is Alex Wegman, who's a Nature Conservancy's lead scientist for island resilience. There are probably about 20 to 30,000 birds in front of us right here. The birds are actually city turns. It's a black and white seabird, and the sky was filled with them. Some of them were sitting on eggs. Some of them were like feeding their little fuzzy chicks. They spend most of our time at sea. They catch fish and squid. Um, because, you know, the ocean
is really what connects everything here. It's where a lot of the action is. So I went off shore and in the water there, they were just huge coral reefs. Under water, it's just a six-glozen of color. You know, it's purples and yellows and oranges. They're these kind of very delicate branching corals that are besides of city buses,
Then schools of fish are just darting in and out.
Which is one of the most stunning, beautiful reefs you could ever imagine.
I was snarkling with Joe Pollock, who works on coral science and restoration for the nature conservancy. It will last for what it's on the sea.
“Lorna, I know you've traveled to coral reefs before, but have you ever seen anything like this?”
I mean, no, definitely not. Because, you know, a lot of what I cover as a climate reporter or things that are in trouble, right, or in bad shape, and I've seen a lot of reefs and bad shapes. So this one for me kind of just redefined what a healthy reef should look like. Because it's had really minimal human impacts, you know, no pollution, no development. That doesn't mean it's untouched though, you know, even all the way out there, because
as the climate gets hotter, the oceans are heating up, and corals are very sensitive to that. You know, they bleach. They turn this white color. And Pollock saw that happen a few years ago when there was a marine heat wave, and the water was hot for months. And so when we came out here in late 2023, and it was just stark white, it was devastating.
“I honestly didn't think, I didn't know that it would bounce back.”
And, you know, bleaching doesn't mean the corals are automatically dead. They can recover. And as we swim around, we did see that the reef was bouncing back. You know, some corals were regrowing. There were new baby corals around. Pollock says the healthier reef is the faster it recovers. And one of the signs this reef is really healthy is actually all the sharks around us. What that you were snorkeling with sharks all around? There's a lot. Yeah, it was a lot of sharks.
Palmyra actually has one of the highest entities of sharks in the world, and the farther you go out into deeper water, the bigger the sharks get. Pacific turtles also attract a lot of big species of fish that swim hundreds of miles, like, you know, tuna and marlin. Alex Wegman says that's because they're kind of like cafeterias, you know, adults are like these busy cafes of the Pacific Ocean. And that is why adults are so important because they are nutrient concentrators.
They're Oasis in this vast ocean scape. And by studying Palmyra at all, scientists have figured out, you know, just how connected this whole ecosystem is. So all the sea birds there, they actually were lie on the tuna and other large predators because, you know, tuna go after small schools of fish and they corral them near the surface. And that puts them in reach for the birds because the birds hunt from above. And then the birds go back to the islands and the trees where they do something
important, which is poop. Poop. What, why is that important? Yeah, here's Wegman explaining why. Poops called Guano. Guano falls to the forest floor. In the Guano is nitrogen and phosphorus. The nitrogen and phosphorus are fertilizers for the actual islands. So the trees get healthier from that fertilizer rate, the poop. And then when it rains, it also runs off into the ocean where researchers have found the nutrients feed the whole
ocean ecosystem. You know, it makes the coral reef healthier. So I mean, this is like a big loop then, or I mean, not to be cliche, but the circle of life. Like everything kind of depends on each other. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. And it's taken a lot of work to make sure that loop is working, okay. Like, you know, there used to be rats on Palmyra at all, which were accidentally introduced. And they seabird eggs and chicks. So there was a big effort to eradicate rats. And there are still
invasive palm trees there. And those trees crowd out the native trees at the seabirds nested. So there's ongoing work to get rid of those. But Wegman told me, you know, it's been really
amazing to see how fast things have rebounded. The one where that captures my feeling when I come
to Palmyra really is hope. It's, oh, yeah, nature's still got it. Like, we maybe messing things up in some places or in a lot of places. But it just still has it. Even with the ways that humans have changed Pacific adults, these ecosystems are so healthy. It's one of the reasons they were protected.
“Regulators wanted to keep them as pristine as they are. And, you know, that's why”
what's happening with those protections right now is such a big debate. We'll be right back. Fall is right around the corner. That means the midterms. Hey, it's Miles Parks from the Empire Politics podcast. Now is the perfect time to calibrate your news diet for the fall. Follow our show for short daily episodes that will help you stay ahead
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wherever you get your podcasts. The day's top headlines, local stories from your community, your next podcast binge listen. You can have it all in one place, your pocket, download the NPR app today. I'm Ayisha Roscoe. This is the Sunday Story. So Lauren, you've been describing Palmyra atoll in the middle of the Pacific Ocean. It's part of this huge US Marine National Monument. And parts of the monument may lose protections. What's
going on with that? So back in the 2000s, President George W. Bush established four National Marine monuments in the Pacific Ocean, including the one that Palmyra atoll is part of. Some of those monuments were later expanded by President Obama. And those protections banned commercial fishing in these waters, including in areas where the US fishing fleet likes to catch tuna. So, you know, the fleet has been pushing to reverse the protections for years. And Trump took
up their cause when he came into office for his second term. These people were left to fish.
“Can you imagine that? Did you ever think that was going to happen as you grew up?”
In June, Trump started the process to open the waters of three of the Pacific Marine monuments to commercial fishing. If he succeeds, fishing will be allowed as close as 50 nautical miles from shore. Whereas before, the closest they could get to shore for most of these monuments was
200 nautical miles. The Americans' fishermen have never had a better ally at the White House
in Donald Trump. Okay, I mean, I'm sure this has been probably welcome news to the fishing industry what's been their reaction? Yeah, so I went to the Hawaiian island of Oahu to find out. So, the tuna fishing boats all come into a pier in Honolulu. Basically we're offloading anywhere from 60 to 100,000 pounds of fish a day. This is Eric Kingma, he's the executive director of the Hawaii Long Line Association, which represents the tuna fleet here.
It's got a watch behind you. There's a pallet being moved around a fish. She's kind of a watch behind. We went into this huge refrigerated warehouse where there were dozens of silvery blue tuna kind of laid out on ice. These fish have already been sold. These were big gaituna and yellow fin tuna and each one is auctioned off individually to the highest bidder.
No, this is higher grade fish. So it's never frozen and most of it is eaten in Hawaii,
in sushi or poke. And the boats here go out hundreds of miles to find tuna, which they catch these hooks that dangle in deep water of thousands of hooks, which is why they're called long lineers. The whole fishery is worth more than $100 million. But Kingma says the economics of their trips is getting tougher. The industry has been grinding along, but the profitability side hasn't been all I grade, and you add basically a doubling of fuel prices. He says they're also facing
more competition from foreign fishing fleets like from Asian countries. So opening the marine monument waters would give them more options about where to fish since foreign boats wouldn't be allowed there based on Trump's proclamation. Kingma says their fishery is closely regulated, and he doesn't think fishing would harm the marine monuments. But really our view is we can have both. We can have very high levels of protection and allow sustainable fishing in the same
place. And those places are huge areas. So what do conservation groups have to say about that idea
“that that you can have both the fishing and protections that's not an idea they agree with?”
No, you can't have it both ways. Some places are just so special and so unique that they really shouldn't have human extraction taking place in them. This is Alan Friedlander. He's an affiliate researcher at the Hawaii Institute of Marine Biology, and he specializes in Pacific Atles. He says when researchers have studied the impacts of fishing, they've looked at a Pacific Monument near Hawaii. It's called Papa Hanau Mokuokaia, and it's the largest of the former marine monuments. It stretches
out from the main chain of the Hawaiian Islands. Before Obama expanded the protections zone, there was some commercial fishing near Papa Hanau Mokuokaia. And Friedlander says when that was
Happening, there was a lot of buy catch.
than the ones that they're targeting. And in 2015, the last year fishing was allowed around Papa
Hanau Mokuokaia, the longline fishery caught more than 7,000 sharks. The sharks do get released back into the water, but some of them don't survive. And so I would assume that's a concern for
“the bigger ecosystem, because as we heard before, all of these species are interconnected, right?”
Yeah, that's the concern. And Friedlander says oceans will keep getting warmer with climate change. So these atoles need all the protections they can get now. They are remote, but represent some of the last pristine ecosystems on the planet. These are the jewels in the crown, not only for the US, but they're globally significant. And there is one more thing here that gets a lot of attention.
Scientists have found that in some places, closing parts of the ocean to fishing can actually
help fishermen. That's because protected areas allow more fish to breed, which increases the population. Then some of those fish, they spread out. They swim into areas where fishing is allowed. And that's known as spillover. So by spillover, it's like the population grows and then they spread out. Yeah, that's the idea. And it's really changed the way people think about marine conservation. You know, conservation doesn't just have to be this kind of old idea that it hurts industries
to protect natural places. There are times when it can be helpful to industry. But the big question here is whether this spillover effect happens with these highly
migratory fish like tuna, because they swim in and out of the protected areas a lot.
And so that's something scientists are still trying to figure out. Well, what does the commercial tuna industry think? They told me they're really skeptical that they will see these benefits of spillover. So we've talked about the fishing industry, the conservationists. Who else and Hawaii has a stake in this debate? Yeah, so another
“important voice here is Native Hawaiians and Pacific Islanders.”
I start to kick away with a Kiki Loi who's an associate professor of Hawaiian studies at the University of Hawaii at Manoa. You know, about what these marine monuments mean to them. Our ancestors are going up here for hundreds of years. Continuously a huge part of that story was, you know, traditional navigation and voicing, which was really the hallmark of ancient Pacific Polynesians Society. He says Papa Hanau Mokuoka is especially important to Native Hawaiians
because it's considered a sacred place. That region is sort of thought to be like a region of our spirit school after we pass and we're all life originated from. And so when you read our traditional stories, it's sort of like these rights of passages that people would go up there and interact with those places and spaces. So for them, this is really sacred ground and to open it up to commercial activity, must feel like a kind of desecration. Yeah, yeah. And there are
“other marine monuments that are important to other indigenous communities like in American Samoa.”
Kiki Loi told me they're not against fissing in general. They just don't want to see it in monument waters. And Native Hawaiian groups fought for decades to get these protections for Papa Hanau Mokuoka. Now those cultural groups also help oversee its along with the state and federal government. So it's this pretty rare example of indigenous co-management with the US. It's not just about the ecology and the plants and the animals. Yes, that is absolutely important. But the living
systems of human communities that evolve with those resources are just as important. Kiki Loi says, you know, that's been hard recognition for them to get and they're fine the Trump administration to preserve it. So what's next for these Pacific marine monuments and and what will determine if the protections remain in place? So in June, Trump announced he'll be allowing commercial fishing in three marine monuments. Conservation groups say they plan to file a lawsuit soon
to try to stop that from happening. But remember, there are four Pacific marine monuments involved here and the last one was actually opened by Trump last year. Conservation groups have already sued over that one and a judge rule that the federal government needs to do a full environmental review before changing the fishing rules. So you know, that's underway by federal fisheries regulators right now. So even though Trump wants these waters to be open for fishers, we don't know yet
if they will be. It's possible that these lawsuits will succeed in preserving protections. But you know, the bigger picture question here is just how much one presidential administration can do. Trump has shrunken and rolled back protections for other monuments around the U.S.
Including, you know, on land and these monuments are created by past presidents.
scholars argue that a current president doesn't have the power to undo them. That's a question
“that's definitely going to be taken up in the courts and it has huge consequences. You know,”
not just for these Pacific marine monuments, but for other public lands in the U.S. So Lauren, obviously, there are a lot of big questions about the future here. But in the meantime, can you take us back to Paul Myra? Is there one moment that will stay with you from your time there? Yeah. I mean, there was a lot that was memorable. But one
thing I haven't mentioned is the crabs. There are a lot of crabs on the at all, including the
largest land crabs that exist. They're called coconut crabs. They're actually like the size of small dogs like Chihuahua's. But one evening, we were actually out on the beach and we saw something
“kind of amazing. So that's kind of quiet. But if you listen really closely, that kind of like”
blinking sounds, it's more than a hundred comet crabs gathering together in a huge group. They're strawberry hermit crabs. And Alex, I've been told me that pretty reliably, these crabs get together every evening. Why are they all together? We don't exactly know, but we think this is a social gathering. There's no real food for them here. But they come together. Maybe they want to do some shell swapping. Maybe they want to make some crab babies. Or maybe they just want to
talk to each other. So it's like a like a hermit crab, a networking event, a cocktail party, just to get together. Yeah, that's pretty much it. And to see this big group of crabs, you know, covering the beach, it's kind of like this normal routine thing there. But it really was just a reminder for me of how wild the place is and how unique that is in the world. Thank you so much for taking us to this place that we would not get to experience otherwise.
Yeah, yeah, thanks for having me. That was Lauren Summer for NPR. Lauren's reporting was supported by a grant from the Pulitzer Center. If you'd like to see photos from Lauren's trip, you can find a link to the digital story in our show notes. This week's episode of the Sunday story was produced by Sharon Maschihi, an edited by Jenny Schmidt, fact checking by Aida Porosad, an engineering by Anlie Huang, special thanks to Joe Pollock for his recording of the melon-headed
whales. The rest of the Sunday story team includes Andrew Lambo and Ben Rappaport, our supervising senior producer is Leanna Symstrom and our executive producer is Irene Naguchi.
“Anlie Sharasko and up first will be back tomorrow with all the news you need to start your week”
until then have a great rest of your weekend. This week on sources and methods 260 days at sea. We're learning more about the conditions aboard the USS Abraham Lincoln, which President Trump says hasn't been deployed long enough.
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