Master and Commander: The Far Side of the World with John Hodgman

April 1805. Napoleon is Master of Europe. Only the British fleets stands before him. Podcasts are now podcasts. Podcasts are now podcasts are now podcasts.

“No, I think it has got to be podcasts are now battlefields.”

Or oceans are now podcasts. Which one hasn't got oceans are now podcasts? You can't put podcasts for both. Doesn't, yeah. But there is a lot you could do.

Like one must always choose the lesser of two podcasts.

You just said there's only one thing I do. I think that's the thing. And I try to throw you off the hump by putting podcasts into places to make you annoyed. Joe Rogan is master of podcast. I like to at the start of this episode ask you to try and not make me annoyed on this episode.

Please, that's a sincere request for me. Okay. I am not intending to make you annoyed on this episode. Okay. Well, I want to make that sincere request. This is a movie that really matters to me and I don't want you to be here. I'm very angry.

I'll be very angry. Okay. There is a real man. I want to say, right on the record to start this episode. I'm not trying to do any nagging.

You just said he tried to make me a joke. We don't have a word. We're doing him, hobbies man. The one thing. You said there's only one thing I could do.

Well, I mean, I do feel like I'm wearing it right now. I feel like that is because it's the opening. It's like it's the most. But then I was, I was like, but of course, there are so many great lines. And I didn't want to just have that.

I love your admiral hat. There are no admirals in this movie, Baton. Oh boy, here we go.

“Is this one of your 10 favorite movies of all time?”

Yes, I think it is. And I think I should just like next time I do sight and sound. Stop being like, I love you. Why is this not an important movie?

It is. This is what I'm saying.

Before we started recording, you said maybe this is the most important movie to me.

Last night, you texted like the best movie ever. This isn't it. Is it not? Are you trying to me? Yeah.

I'm very self-conscious about being here. I must say. Oh, you're worried because you're like, I don't, you know. You don't want to worry. I had a lot of work done.

I had a lot of work done. I had a lot of work done. I had a lot of work done. I had a lot of work done. I had a lot of work done.

I had a lot of work done. I had a lot of work done. I had a lot of work done. I had a lot of work done. I had a lot of work done.

I had a lot of work done. I had a lot of work done.

I had a lot of work done.

Oh, actually, you know what embarrassing for you. Made a learning grow go. It's in the place. So get there. It was right.

But it changed. I regret to inform you. It is, in fact, the Mandalorian and grow go. So I, really? I was justoring to grow go somewhere.

Yeah. In this down there. In this palace of secrets and delight. I'm sure we got to grow go somewhere. You got to get a grow go in here somewhere.

It's got to be a grow go. You know, there isn't. And I've actually, I've been surveying the landscape recently.

“I'm, like, does there need to be some grow gooh representation in this office?”

And if there is, what's the one? I don't know if you know this. It's a very merchandise character. Oh, you're kidding. There's too many grow gooh items.

So I'm trying to pick the one. But I'm sorry. You were getting lunch with J.D. I'm out of a lot of things. And I mentioned, I'm excited about this Peter weir thing.

Yeah. Because I love Peter weir. Yeah. I haven't seen all the movies. Yeah.

But I mean, and a lot of them, I hadn't seen since they came out because I'm elderly. And I'm, I was a weird, I'm realizing now is quite a weird child. Mm-hmm. I remember seeing Gallipoli when it came out. Yeah.

Or maybe a couple of years later would have been a teenager. I would have been like 12 or 13. Right. But this is a man who's a man who feels aligned with your sensibilities and makes movies that are aligned with your interests. Is that fair to say?

My interest as a 12 year old was definitely Sigourney Weaver. Right. But I mean, the code is the one I want to show you. You're also, you know, a bit of a weird, a nerdy fella. I said to J.D.

I'm out of, I can't wait till they get to master and commander. And I wonder who the guest will be. And J.D. said, I don't know if anyone will because it's, it may be David's favorite movie. It's one of David's favorite movies. We did see, so we did spurred it away.

Yeah. That's, that's in that conversation. Mm-hmm. This is the exercise I want to do. We've done Alien, but we did on Patreon.

We did on Patreon. We did on Patreon. I was thinking through our respective 10 favorite movies of all time. And I feel like we have covered most of our list, the majority. And then the question is, what are the outliers?

We haven't covered a lot of what I would call my favorite. What would you put in your tent? Speared it away. Alien, master commander.

Uh-huh. Uh-huh. We both hope to do that chunking express, which I, you know, another one on the floor for some day. One car, why?

Of course. We done more on drive. We have. Never done yee yee. No.

But in all words, we've been thrown out a lot. Okay, so four at a 10 right now. Let's lunter. Malibu's most wanted. Malibu's most wanted.

Malibu's most wanted. Projection. Uh, the Malibu's most wanted speck sequel that I wrote in the series. No.

Malibu's second most wanted.

Isn't it nice when a title just gives you a lay-up on the sequel like that? I know the total miracle. Uh, you know, there's probably others. I'm not thinking of. Yeah, I don't know.

I think we've done it. We've done the way you've often referred to as being way up there. Dream acquire. Well, we did that. And that is true.

Right. They've sort of like, like, dream acquire I've seen 40 times. Master commander. Right.

“Do I think like late spring is one of the greatest movies every day?”

Yes. Yeah. I've seen it like like the two or three times max. You know, the big 10. I'm because I put this movie onto.

Yeah. It's like, I was just watching the pit last night. Pip an hour. Yeah. Anyone watch?

No. Push master and commander to get my BP down, right? I'm coming in in crisis. Like Dr. Robbie would be like, get master and commander in the DVD right now. It'll come and Donald Bell.

I'll get his sats where they need to be. Right. I have done that many times in my relationship with my wife. Like, not like, you know, like, I've been like stressed out when I put it on. And then like 20 minutes.

And she's like, that really, that really does settle your mood. Yeah. I'm like, yeah. Ship is England. Yeah.

We have a movie coming up in a couple of weeks that is one of those for me. Right. But I was thinking, uh, because like, toy story two Edward. Yes. On by our current gas.

I think that was the first time I ever appeared on the show.

It's not right. Yeah. I think so. Gosh. Broadcast news is probably in my 10.

Good one.

“I was going to say that that sort of the Griffin episode two where you're just kind of like,”

You're Kobe. You're just like, let me have a ball. Like it's 48 minutes. I want to be clear because I, I know your sensitivity and I want to be very clear. This is your episode.

The way you talk about like, it'd be great if we did them up. It's so I could take two months off. I want to watch you two. We'll go off a bit. This is the thing.

It is David's episode. It is. And so, and I, and when JD told me that, I was like, No, great. I can't wait to hear it.

Oh, sure. Right. And then, you know, I'm also a side from being a weird only child, even to this day. I'm also a great insinuator. But I promise you.

I insinuate myself into things that I love. Yeah. And I promise you, though, that I was not trying to, like, I texted you guys after I listened to the Galipoli episode with Jennifer Kent. It was great.

Thank you. And I revisit Galipoli. She's the coolest. She's the coolest movies amazing. Is that right?

Oh, it's journey. And I couldn't help myself. Wait, do you guys get to master and commander? And then David goes, do you want to be on it? Well, I'll give you a little behind the scenes here.

We had been going back and forth on. Is this a classic guess? Yeah. Do we do no guess? Which is fine.

Sometimes there is a movie, like, like, Robocop. You know, where it's just, like, this means so much to one of us. Do we need another voice in the room?

And then when we get into those hypotheticals, there's always a, like,

if it was the right person, it could add even more to the episode. It could be cheese on top of the bird. But it wasn't going to say, you know, because I love this movie. But at the same time, I feel self-conscious because I haven't. I just want to say this to you.

I don't know what qualifies me to be here other than I have been on a boat. And I'm very happy to talk about boat. You've been on any boat. Your boats, man. I want to share with listeners that when Mr. Hodgman was doing his levels.

He was going through different kinds of wind. This is true. You know more about the high seas than I. He's wearing a hat which has very helpful. Why not?

And has a drawing of a knot. Yeah. This is our no tea. It's a pink trucker hat. Yeah.

But to my point, I'm sorry.

“I'm not sure, Griffin, but I think he might have drawn that on there.”

Not sure that that was known. No, I had a commission. I had a, it was not commission. It's not, it's not the spoke. I bought it off the rack.

Really? At the general store in the unnamed coastal town in Maine where I spend some time. It was created by the daughter of our friend Molly Lola Blake 13 year old Lola Blake. You're going to like this, Ben. She makes t-shirts and hats where she draws nautical shit on it.

And the name of the line is ship happens this. Oh, that's good. This is really good. It's great. And if you, and if you wish to inquire, I've just received an email from her mom.

Hey, ship happens Brooklyn at gmail.com. That's PR. Oh, okay. Oh, I want to order. Okay.

If you want to. She's not she's 13 years old. Okay. Yeah. Let's kind of warmer.

I'm sorry. Well, you can fire. Yeah. But we had gone back and forth. We were like, maybe this guest.

If the time and work down, there were a couple options. But we kept being like, but also David, it could be guestless. I think that's a strong move if it's guestless.

I feel like Hodgman loves that. Beyond just being a man of the low seas.

“I think he specifically loves that movie.”

You sent the text. I signed text David. I go. I didn't think in Hodgman for M&C. And immediately David was like, yeah, that makes sense.

Yeah. There was no argument about it. It was a absolutely. I like it. I like a comforting guest.

Well, I'm a real friend. I aim to be a comfort to you here. I feel sometimes I push my way through into into podcasts and sort of try to wrestle control. I'm mutiny. Do you know what I mean?

Today, you are all captain of my captain. Relax, everyone. I am your midshipman to Harlem. It's just a shameful. I was going to say, but that's not the guy you want to be a shameful.

And he's worse than the books. Imposter syndrome guy. And at any point, I'm going to jump off this ship with a cannonball. He's worse than the book. Yeah.

His character is less sympathetic in the books. But we don't have to get into that because this is not the books. How hard have you gone on the books? Not as hard as I could because there's so many of them. We're okay.

Wait, what's this podcast? This podcast is called Blank Check with Griffin David. My name is Griffin. I am David. Let's put down our violence for a moment and get to podcast.

Which is playing like a Tars. Yes. It is a cool moment. It's the greatest ending in a movie ever. This movie is the fucking greatest shit that's ever happened.

It does not mean as much to me as it does to you. But I cannot deny that ending for a millisecond. It's like the greatest ending line. It's a perfect ending line. You're like, oh, I'm so happy.

And then they're like, let's fucking have sex. Okay. Play our stringed instruments together. And you're like wonderful. They're doing it.

And you're like, this is great. And then he does a little violent on the side. And he's like, oh, this is so saucy.

And then you're like, they're going to have a million more ventures.

Like, where else, where else can this go?

“Are you going to tell me that the vision is now picking up his cello and playing that like a guitar?”

He is the vision. Like in this perfect scene, how could it get better and he does? But that's the final scene. My father owned all of these books. He was very, very into these books.

And so I have them all in my house. I have read, I would say, I think six of them. I have, they are. They are something that dads especially are. Yeah, they're easy.

There's 20 books. There was a 21. There's a 21 at the time of his own. That is unfit. Yeah.

And I think this is by who? The author's name is Patrick O'Brien. I think it's a student. And he wrote them. The first one's 1969.

The last one came out 30 years later. So you're 20 books and 30 years.

And master commander is the first one.

The name of the first one is master and commander. Okay. And the name of the last. The name of the 10th one is the far side of the world. But this one, this book, the movie.

It's pulling. It pulls from various things. Yeah.

“They are, I think, our guest John Hodgman, who we have.”

We have an introduced. Oh, I also haven't finished the intro. But yes. The books. They are very heavy on the particulars of naval life.

And Napoleonic procedure. And all of the stuff that goes into being on a fucking boat. Site on stacks. Certainly the poop. That is exactly what I imagined.

The ropes. The nines. Lines. Lines. Lines.

Lines. We all know this line. They're called lines. Not ropes on a ship. They're very interesting.

What's crazy is that the first book master and commander is, you know, what you think it is. It's Aubrey's only a. He's just become master and commander. He used to be a lieutenant. Master and commander is like a naval rank.

It'd be clear. It sort of like a captain basically. And it's like him meeting matern and all that. The second book is called post captain and it's mostly about them on shore. While they're like various shit is happening like he's lost money.

Because like the debt court is dealing with his seizure assets. And it's kind of like a Jane Austen novel and it's kind of about them both falling in love. You know, it's just crazy that that was the second book. And then the third book, like they get the HMS surprise. They're back on the seas.

Like the books actually do defy what you think of them as just like dad shit. They are really, really awesome and interesting. But I am no expert on them. I'm not. I'm like not an expert on the book.

I'm certainly less of an expert than I read the first one you said. I read about like six of them. Oh, you're about half of the first one and I realize.

If I go down this road, I will never get on.

Maybe you should read the moment. You got up to the ampere sand and then you give up. I read the master part. This is a podcast about filmographies. Directors who have massive success early on in their careers and are given a series of blank checks to make whatever crazy

passion projects they want. Sometimes those checks clear and sometimes they bounce baby. This is a mini series on the film to Peter Weir. I tried to call it. Podster and cast man or the pod side of the cast, but instead it is called

Podnic at hanging cast. Today we are talking about his penultimate film.

Which is fascinating only because it is 23 years ago. The man is still alive. And this has now become at the top tier of the film. That he is known for. For sure.

But I wonder if he is even known for the film.

“In other words, I think that people who idolize this film in its reassessment that's been going on over the past half a decade or so or decade.”

Think of it as a Peter Weir film or just think of it as a master and commander. It's certainly a question we've been interrogating in doing this series is how many people put these movies together under the vision of one person. And how they are filed in their mind. It feels like there are few people who have enough films that loomed this large in the culture that the public doesn't really have a sense of. Well, as I've been watching them over the course of listening to you guys doing so far.

And reminded like he doesn't have a genre. No. He doesn't have a, it doesn't have like a through line. His defining style is very subtle and is malleable. Yeah, and he's not showy right even though he is probably the one of the most showy not telly directors. Yes, that I can think of off the top.

But but in a very elegant quiet way. Yeah, I also think kind of disappears. It is interesting to me even just in going through these movies. How few of them at the time were really sold as from the director of Blank and Blank. You couldn't do that with him because I feel like it would just look weird right for this poster with Russell Crowes.

Right to them be like from the director of the Truman Show people like, well, I like the Truman Show. Right, that doesn't affect one of how he can make the beat. Well, the book about. That's true. That's a good point.

Do both have sailing scenes. Yeah, but like let me just say the Truman Show sailing scene, not very realistic.

First of all, it's inside a dump.

Well, the very rare point. The film one might call science fiction. I think about it a little bit.

“Is it the shared thing we've been talking about with him, though?”

Is that his films cover small communities? I was about this. Yes. And that's very insightful. There's so many boat movies.

There are so many other boat movies. And I feel like there are so few that are about like the ecosystem of life on the boat that like versus this. Obviously, parts of the Caribbean. The same stand that they have. It's fascinating.

The tentacles. Yeah. Possibly and have been cursed. And we do get into that life. Yes.

But do we hear about saluting day? Okay. No. No. Does, you know, I mean, like, does, is there a killer type?

No, there's not. No, well, because Jack Sparrow has a $40,000 month rum budget. He does. He's staying up all night with his Hollywood vampire friends. Much, much new towing.

Riffing. Yeah.

The first made Alice Cooper.

I wonder, yeah, what Aubrey would make of Captain Jack Sparrow. If you would like the cut of his gym, I feel like maybe not. But it is funny that, right, the same year, you have parts of the Caribbean and all the British Naval officers in that, which I think is great. Are these prigs? Right.

Are these like stuffy? Sort of great. They're Star Wars and carry love. Right. You know, I know Jack Devin for as a little more flair.

And then he gets sexy in the second one. And then he's sort of back to being regular narrative. He's got a good arc in those movies. You're good. The first three.

Yeah. Parts of Caribbean did kind of fuck this movie. Right. I mean, obviously this film was well reviewed. Got a ton of Oscar nominations.

It did all right. I don't think was super expensive. And obviously the ambition was to launch a friend of this that didn't happen. This movie is a miracle. This movie is a miracle.

It's a miracle. It's incredible. It exists. It's incredible. It was made.

It was an Oscar contender. It was like, yes, should there have been sequels certainly? Yeah. If 20th Century Fox had just, you know, had a stiff back about it. Yeah.

Just fucking done it. Because like, it's a movie that had such a long life. Yeah. Has such a long term. And they could have just seen that come.

And they could have just been like, look, crow. He's going to fit into these, you know, breaches for another six, seven years max. Like, let's, let's try to get another two.

Well, but we always point to Robin Hood.

Robin Hood is seven years later. You wouldn't even look, I mean, all respect to Crow's performance. Yes, movie, which is good. Like, it didn't even tempt someone to go. Why don't we do a young Jack Aubrey.

There have been threats recently. I don't know if you saw this. Yes. But then someone stops and things about it and goes, oh, shit. We'd have to film it on a boat.

“I think that's what ought to be hard on it.”

It is. How do you achieve it? I mean, I couldn't even, I, even though I've seen this movie a couple of times rewatching it. Yeah.

For this, the first thing I thought of this movie is a miracle in the sense that I can't believe it existed and it will never exist again. Yeah. In part because those boats are, it's nuts what they did. I also think, and it would be CGI now, and it would not.

You could do it, but it probably a little bit.

But through the credit of the, the, the people run in 20th century films now.

“Don't you think they know if they made a young Aubrey prequel that was shot in the volume?”

Yeah. People would revolt. They, they know they can't do that. They, there's a immunity. I, I, I don't think they're going to do that.

What do you want to say? Jonathan to speak. Please. Our guest today is John Hodgman. By the way, John, John Hodgman.

How many episodes have you been on? One, two, three, four, five, six. Sorry, as you're seventh episode. Not including voicemails. You've done some favors.

Thank you. The, the day, live subliminal cuts. That's right. You were inside the little door in the core line episode. You did the source.

Watch infinity war with us on Patreon. You didn't watch the movie the night before. I didn't realize we were going to watch a live show or two. Hey, but I'm a, I'm, I'm much more of an able seeming now. You're dear friend of the show.

You've always delivered in the dialogue of the show.

I started out as a Lansman as a lover. You're a pretty. And that became a normal seeming. You're an able seeming consistent kind of one a year on blank check. I will say, looking at your record here.

Any time you wish, I will be here. Well, you're busy, man. Hmm. All right. Take it back. Let's maintain that fiction.

I'm going to make a, I'm going to make this case. Yeah. If someone at 20th pictures, like, let's do another mastering commander. Hmm. It would be a failure.

And here's why David put his, his, his masterly and commanderly finger on it. This is Dad shit. And the thing is, this came out in my thoughts. In kind of the last time, dads were going to movies. So many dads were seeing Peter, we are movies.

There are a lot about thatism just to get this out of the way. What would happen is a show, not a movie. They would do a streaming series. Yes. Well, that's the thing. Now, dads, but they are still, and I'm speaking to this from personal experience.

Dads are definitely watching YouTube's about sleeper cars on trains across. Oh, I'm trying to mostly watch one of those. Right. Gondola is in finnic killers. And I would say less so for that.

Dad empires. Yeah. And you think for the hit. It's up to, tell me. Exactly.

And you think I haven't been going to sleep watching YouTube videos with 3D models of the HMS victory, breaking down a classic British ship of the line of 1805, of course. And that's what I'm doing at home. Dads are not going to go to see dads. Dads stay at home and watch the goat.

See that each of us victory. I swear I hear. You should go. Wait a minute. Sportsman.

Sportsman's new hamster. Unfortunately, my friend, no, it's in the original. On top of the way to Maine. Yeah. It's kind of in the UK.

Yeah. Well, it's a little easier. This is the point. A lot more dads would stay at home and watch a streaming master in commander than they would go to sportsmith to stand on the street.

“I think one day, more dads would even go to sportsmith to stand on the deck.”

Of the shipward, Lord Nelson died. The HMS victory. Yes, he did die there. Great. Then then go to a cinema to watch a master in commander movie.

I just think it's where we're at. And this is like the dad shit in this movie is obviously obsession with boats and procedure and all male worlds. But it's also about the dadly relationship that he has with the young officers. It's all dadism all the way down.

I just want to you know who her Asian Nelson is obviously. Sure. Okay. Only you know a little bit. Yeah.

Even you guys don't know who Nelson is. Yeah. You guys don't know who Nelson is, right? No. You guys don't know who Nelson is.

You guys don't know who Nelson is. No. You guys don't know who Nelson is. You guys don't know who Nelson is. Yeah.

The guy who stands on the column and trifalling his hair. Yeah. That's how I often will. Like, because my wife is watching this movie with me multiple times.

“And every time I'm like, you get who Nelson is, right?”

She's like, no, don't know where you're talking about. Like, whatever you told me last time it's gone again.

But like, and I keep going to be like, he is the most important British person who ever lived.

And it's kind of crazy that like, probably. And like, it's crazy. A part of Churchill, I would say is the other. Yeah. That feels like the obvious between the two of them.

Yeah. But certainly, obviously, he's, you know, he's, he's pretty cool, like, or whatever. But he's a pretty complicated figure. Yeah. You know, he has some, some failures.

Gullipoli among them in his ledger, you know, he, you know, guy like the Scrock. Yeah. He did like it. I mean, but in the morning he'll be sober and you'll still be ugly. But like, Nelson is fucking five. Nelson's the guy who beat Nelson.

Something nasty, sitting a circle with these guys. And it's like, one of those things are like, right, like, only British, every British child knows who Admiral Nelson is. But like, no, passing. No, other person really outside of Britain wouldn't care too much.

Who is he equivalent to even in, like, America? His power, I guess. Like, who's the most famous settler? No, he's a settler. Crank.

Yeah. Who's the most famous American military leader? It's one of those guys. Yeah. Eisenhower Patton.

Yeah. Brand. Someone like that.

Nelson is the other ship captain they're talking about, right? Yeah.

“And that's kind of the beauty of all of Peter.”

We're storytelling, which in my opinion, he'll drop esoteric shit. But he contextual, well, I mean, if you're an American, but it's contextualized enough for an American and for a blavier that, uh, you know, this is like the greatest dude that's ever lived in their all excited just.

But you do know that he sat at a table with him. It's crazy. Right. You do know that there's the big column in Trafalgar Square in London. Like, there's a big column in America.

He's the guy on top of it. Oh, shit. Because he beat Napoleon. Right. Right.

Which we kind of, which we, you know, British people were really like to bring up.

You know, like that we, I mean, he beat Napoleon the second time.

Well,ington also beat. Bonaparte. Yeah, Napoleon Bonaparte. Oh, okay. I was wondering.

Uh, you, but, but the guy from the water park. Yeah. I mean, sorry. He, he, his was the first time wellington is the second. Yeah, wellington is water.

Uh, there are two things I want to, uh, say. One about the death of dad cinema, right? It does feel like that is an audience that was lost permanently in the pandemic. That those are people who are just like, I just got used to watching things this way. It is just not a thing I even consider going to theater to see stuff.

Right. And I can surround myself with all my dadly comforts. Yeah.

“And I think even through the late 2010s, there would be dad hits that would punch through.”

And it feels like those things go straight to string now. And one that's really emblematic and feels like a counterpoint of the miracle of this movie being made at this scale by a major studio, this seriousness close to 25 years ago. This is like, I think still one of the most watch streaming movies of all time, certainly the number one movie in the history of Apple Plus is Tom Hanks's Greyhound movie, which was meant to be a theatrical movie. Right.

It was a COVID shuttle to Apple TV and he just finished filming a second one. Like he has made this a franchise for him. And they are movies that just like, unless you are the target audience, you are in a where this exists. I would say here are some examples of dad movies recently, and I think succeed it. Okay, talk I'm average, but that doesn't totally count, but it's still count.

The magic of that is that dad movies are part of the slice versus the whole pie. Four versus Ferrari, I think dad movie was a big part of the pie. That's a 2019 though. That's perfect example for me. But not dad.

Sully, you know, these are movies that still like made a hundred million domestic.

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Post COVID, if the oldies aren't shown up and we got them to show up, we got to get them to show up. But that's not going to make Russell Crow 40 years old again. There's no sequel. There's no perfect sequel to Master and Commander by Peter Wear with Russell Crow and Paul but neither will ever get.

But that's okay because we have this movie. And it ends so perfectly.

This is the second thing I want.

It's a say to this point. This movie is a miracle. How is it exist? Tom Rothman, who was pretty infamous at this point of being like a pretty brutal kind of mercenary. Sort of hears the future of studios.

He's not too precious about art. He wants to make entertainment. He's noting everything to death. Now he's in charge of Sony Columbia. And he feels like the throwback he got.

Who's going out to send him a Kylie Jenner like we got to make original movies. You know? But he's just sending him a con just like last week. Stop having so many fucking ads in front of everything. And all the AMC people are shifting and they're seeing windows need to be three or four months.

Yeah, right. You know, we need to make things for like different audiences.

“In the 2000s he was seen as like, is this guy too crafts a business man?”

And now he feels like one of the last guys fighting for. The last guy is fighting for integrity, but was just sort of a brass tax guy.

But he's like, my job is to like run this like a business. This was a fucking passion project for him. He was not applying the usual checks and balances in his head to this movie. Because it was like from the moment he fucking got that seat at Fox.

He was like, I'm going to be the guy who's finally going to get the fucking Aubrey movies off the ground.

On onto, see, and can I say something? Yeah. Looking at his biography here, I can tell you that when this movie finally came out, he was 48 years old. And real dad territory is the dad to two daughters. Yep. He was into his dad.

He was into his dad shit. He's into his dad shit. Now here's the weird parallel I was going to say. When the story came out a couple of years ago, that. Foxes may be a 20th century is maybe noodling with a master and commander reboot.

There's no writer or there was a writer attached, no director attached, young Aubrey, whatever it is. The reason that was happening was not just because this movie has gained such a reputation and a cult. It is because Jason is Belle who is now the head of 20th century. His first movie as a junior exec.

“You're right. You're right. Jason is Belle is a musician. I believe a different guy.”

Okay. I was going to. I mean, like a male musician. He cares it up online with right wing weirdos. This was the first movie he ever worked on.

And so he has some weird romanticism and nostalgia for this as well. I don't think he gets it over the finish line, but it's the only reason we're even talking. But let's move off of that. Because we're not talking about that.

We're talking about a master and commander.

We're talking about Peter Weir's film, Master and Commander. When did you see this film, Griffin? I saw this in theaters. Sure. I believe if not even opening weekend.

I want to say there was maybe even like a preview possible. Weekend a week or two early. Maybe. Here's my relationship to this movie. Came out in November.

Right before Thanksgiving. Who doesn't three makes obviously perfect sense for it. I went to see this with the off-in-voked Derek Simon. My childhood friend. My oldest friend.

I dare. We went to see it open weekend. The movie starts. And like three minutes and I was like,

“"Oh, right. I don't like this kind of movie."”

Sure. I sat there. You're a young man. 14. Yeah.

This is not my kind of thing. I sat there. I respect the craft of it. But there was a little bit of, "Oh, I just signed up for a class." Yeah.

In a subject, I'm not interested in. Right. What kind of movie was it to you at that time? What kind of movie was it to you? When you say, "I don't like this kind of movie."

It's like a history movie. It's a bunch of boys. It's a war movie. Yeah. You know, like this is not a Griffin movie.

Especially not teen Griffin. No. There's no monsters or puppets. No. There's no cartoon characters.

I don't want to, let's not make it sound like that's the only kind of thing I like. I think it's a very stoic film. It's a very emotional movie. It's a very emotional movie. I don't like it.

It's a very emotional movie. It's a very emotional movie. It's a very emotional movie. It's a very emotional movie. It's a very honest, double.

Right. Pretty honest. Right. I was not a fan of history in a general sense. It's just one thing after another.

You might have said that's a James Corridor. That's the story books. Yeah. The history boys.

Didn't, never rewatch this movie because I was just sort of like, I respect it but

it's not my kind of movie. But you've slowly over the years, like anyone you've noticed. Yeah. That movie gets talked about a lot. 100%.

It's got kind of a culture out of it. Beyond this point is sort of like revered or whatever. When we become friends and you tell me this is one of your favorite movies. I'm like, that makes perfect sense. Best movie of 20.

It both perfectly aligns with everything. I know about you at that point and helps me understand you further. Six or seven years ago, Derek, who I'd seen it with and we walked out at the same reaction was like, have you ever seen Master in Commander? And I was like, yeah, we saw it together.

We were both bored. And he's like, I've seen it like 20 times now. Clearly it just bounced off me at the time. I rediscovered it. I'm now obsessed with it.

I watch it all the time. I'm like, huh, I do need to reassess this movie. But also Peter Wears pinned to the board as an inevitable. So I just have kind of held off rewatching it. And also the 4K only came out recently.

There wasn't a good version of it for a while. What have you. So I like set it up for this moment. And I, I will say, like simultaneously, I rewatch this and I was like, I totally get this. I completely get this.

It makes perfect sense to me. I understand the value of this movie. It isn't mainly not my kind of film. But I was not disengaged from it. And the way I was as a 14-0.

But it's the best movie I've ever made. Ben David.

“Oh, sorry, Mr Simps. That's how you do it.”

You've missed her. Yeah, exactly. Um, had you seen this film? Uh, yes. Okay.

Because of the time, but I probably... Man, two or three years ago. I threw it on. Yes. And I got to tell you.

I had a big old smile on me. Yes. Loved it. It is so comforting. Really one of the most likable movies.

It is incredibly likable.

Various people die. There's war.

“There's no women like, and I love women.”

Yeah.

And this is a womanless movie.

I was gonna say consciously, you know. Like, that's the thing. I saw the Wikipedia noting that people vaguely complain about it at the time. Only because there are characters in the books. They're women.

I mean, like, yes. They're not on the boats, usually, but like, there's female characters. Yeah. They have lives at home. Because the whole thing is you go away, and then you come back.

It's the naval life of like someone has to wait for your ass. Like, if you like get got engaged to them. Yeah. Anyway, I gotta go. You got Laura Lening on the phone.

They don't have phones. Oh, right. They don't have phone. They don't have the telephone. They don't even have the mail.

Wait, Ben, you're picking this up. Oh, no. Oh, well. No. Don't look at it.

Don't look at it. Don't look at it. Ben, I gotta say this is unrelated. This chair. So squeaky now.

I need one to chair, I think. I know we got to do chair. squeaky ass chair. What I was going to need in the Wi-Fi network name. Yeah.

This movie taught me what bad about the hatches means. Okay. It literally means there's a lot of hammer. The hatches. Oh, so the water doesn't kind of be raining down.

Met them down. My whole life going through just not even really recognizing what that meant. And I was going to talk about being in daily borders. We're going to talk about shall we be to quarters?

We're going to talk about giving leeway. All these phrases come from the HMS. We should have started this episode by beating to quarters. That is true. Sam's see this immediately and love it.

I saw it at the Odin Lester Square with Howard A. I'm a shout out Howard wherever you are. Probably Scotland where you live. My friend. We were about 17 years old.

It was. I think it must have been. Well, it wasn't winter break yet.

“I think it came out and Britain in the same time.”

But now I want to find out. Seeing the same thing. It wasn't always that. It must have been a very specific. Well, but like fucking insane.

I was 17 years old. So I am not yet dead. Right. And I am not surrounded by. Oh, sure.

It was a big deal. Yeah. No, it came out the same. Same we can Britain. Yeah.

Yeah. It's mid November. It's on November 17th or whatever is or for whatever. That sort of like mid November wheel. And of course we'll do the box.

This is not like a west-to-ro-sea fantasy world. No. But it was to American audience. Sure. Yes.

No, no. It's you're right. It's a much shorter thing to walk. And like we all had watched Cornglower on TV in the 90s. Right.

You like, and of course. Cornglower. Oh, man. You'd love it. Cornglower is a series of TV movies based on books.

Very popular books. George Lucas, a big fan of Cornglower. Don't you watch the Cornglower once a year? No. It's probably once every sort of five, six months with Lea and Marie.

Yeah. David and Alyssa. David are like in his wife. Uh-huh. And of course, David Bartysolina's who flucking.

He might be the biggest fan of the world. It's very unsuppressed. And this is about a jazzman. It's only. Yeah.

It's about. It's about a young. It's about a young. It's about a young. It's about a young.

Uh, Nevy Lieutenant. Lieutenant called Horatio Hornbauer.

Uh, who, you know, the first one he's like low on the totem.

Paul, but he rises over the series. And it happened because of Lisa. David Rolex wife texted me like, I want to watch. Like a master and commander thing, but not master and commander. Oh, no.

Interesting. Commander. Okay. And I was like, uh, there's not much. But he's hornblower.

Yeah. He's like, what's that? And I was like, it's this British TV thing. Yeah. And she was like, it's not streaming.

And I was like, all right. Well, I'm buying the fucking boxet. I have it. Yeah. I bought it now.

And uh, we're watching them. So we all watch that. We blow the horn. We say, does this? Is this really like the only modern version of this.

Executed at this level of quality in movies? Yeah. And when I say modern, I say like anything post 1950. There's got to be some other like, you know, there's other stuff. There's a family, family, family ships at sea doing.

And then play with each other.

“Like, here's the thing I felt getting feisty with the 25 boundaries past the opening”

title cards, the moment this movie started. I had a very clear thought. Oh, yeah. This is the only movie that gets right. What it's like to have been on a ship in this time period.

So. And then I step back and I go, I don't fucking know that I have no lived experience. No, I mean, I'm looking at like list of Napoleon. It's like, there's not much. There was more back in the day back in the sort of 456.

Yeah. But I think most of the Napoleonic stuff back then it's more the land. Like, there's that movie Waterloo. But that's about, you know, okay. Well, you should.

Do you know what I'm talking about though? Yes.

That's been very hard of seeing something in a movie that you have no first hand experience of.

Right. And the creaks in you're just like, yeah, I feel like they got this right. This feels accurate to something I don't know shit about.

I'm like, this is what it feels like to live in a spaceship for a couple of years. And I just, I have no knowledge. I can't speak to that with any authority. But I feel the same way about this.

“I think that one of the things, it's, I mean, look, I did not live during the Napoleonic war era.”

I saw this movie for the first time after I had spent a week with my family. I believe in a 90-foot wooden, two-masted scooner, sailing scooner on a course that I took on Scooner navigation specifically. Yeah, because, you know, it's something that comes up a lot. You'd be surprised at how often you want to know how to sail a scooner.

Mm-hmm. But the wooden boat school in Brooklyn Maine offered this week on the Mary Day. And so I had spent time on a wooden boat and learning the pin rail and then sails and all this stuff. And when we got back, I was like, I'm on more of that. What year is this?

This would have been recently. I didn't see this movie when it came out. Wow. This would have been 2018 or 2019. Okay.

When I was like, you know, I never saw a master in command.

You're in a boat head space, right? And you're like, what are the boat movies in this? Yeah, only so many. So at that time, I am a dad. At that time, our son was not yet an adult, but was living with us.

He had been on the boat. I was like, let's watch some boat shit. Does your son care about this boat stuff? It might not. I mean, I think he thinks of it relatively fondly.

But he didn't get into it necessarily.

“And I want to remember that your son went to a boat school.”

It's cool on a boat. You know, look, I've been cool away about this town. Sure. But I've already mentioned a twice. Yeah, Brooklyn Maine.

Yes. You're your loads to mention it. And there are, well, I mean, it's just, you know, it's kind of a long running joke. Yes. Because E.B. White had lived there and he didn't reveal where he lived.

Did I always say I live somewhere on the coast of the United States

between New Brunswick, Canada, and Cuba. And vacation lands only available on hardcover, right? No, it's available now on paper. Oh, that's thanks. That's helpful.

I think I'm going to start talking about my experiencing the movie again. I feel like we got off the rails. No, no, no. I'm driving towards a specific point. I just remember when I first met your son.

That he was very interested in boating. Yeah, they built. So there's a lot of wooden boat building in that community. Yes. And there was for local kids and summer kids.

They all built a wooden skiff. This is a family interest that runs deep. I understand. But I was, it kind of wasn't okay. Yeah.

David. Yeah. So I saw it with Howard. I thought it was great.

I've been saw it on a date.

It's a bad idea. Was it disastrous date? Movie is quite long. It's not that long, really. It's two hours, 20 minutes.

And it's about what it's about. Boys on a boat. And did not, it did not. My date was not excited by a mastering commander. I.

Probably. Don't worry. 17. I mean, you know, saw.

“What did, what did you deem skippable enough for a quick make out sash?”

Oh, during the movie? No. No. Okay. Okay.

After. Yeah. Because I was confused by. Yeah. The idea that you would look away from this.

No. I'm not dreaming. Yeah. - I'm like, oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. - Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah

- Yeah, yeah, she's just leaning in, but I'm sorry, I'm sorry, my dear, I must watch. - I really like this movie, but when I was like 17, I might favorite movies of that year. We're elephant, which was a big movie for me then. - That was a big one for me, just wild elephant.

- Yeah, trying to think, like David Gordon-Greetings, all the real girls, like that was a big movie for me. - Yeah, David. - Obviously I enjoyed the Lord of the Rings, his epic engine, and X-Men too, and that was a way up there.

- 28 days later, kill Bill, volume one, right? - Yes, with a big movie. - I was at the time foolishly disappointed by the Matrix sequels, and Hulk, I would. - Right, you know, I would mature.

- You'd get there, right, right. - But master current was a movie I really liked. And I, you know, my dad liked it, obviously, as a big fan of the books, he enjoyed it. I bought it on DVD right away,

but it was not an immediate, this is one of my favorite movies ever. - No, and then it just, I think, as it was for a lot of people, I just kept going back to it, and they kept making movies that weren't like it,

which they have consistently done to this day. - Yeah. - Hollywood just keeps making zero movies in which Paul Betney in a house coat, angrily yells at the captain of his ship that he can't go on the Galapagos Islands

to look at comrades, because the ship has to go like, fight, you know, the friend. - This is an interesting point. Is this movie is rising cult, also a byproduct of, a kind of like, the longer time goes on,

it is one stop shopping. This is the only place you can go to this. - Paul Betney's performance in this film is the greatest. - I think he's the greatest performance ever captured by a camera. - Kind of the greatest performance too, the best everything.

Like, from moment one, like, just like the gravitas, just steadiness, right, you know, like, Aubrey's got more bluster and materns, like, very calm, and then like, just for an hour into the movie, for him to just show up in that coat with the hat,

right, ready to go, ready with his wooden cages

to capture some iguanas, and finally, finally, admit to,

you know, like, you know, show some vulnerability with, when Aubrey's like, "We got a fucking go," and he's like, "You promised me I could look at Perk." I need to look at the birds right now. - It may not surprise you to hear.

The Paul Betney's characters,

“the one thing I remember connecting with.”

- Of course, seeing it as a 14. - I mean, he actually got a fever buzz. - Like, I mean, that was, he was in the mix. - I was just like, I get this guy. - This is the closest analogue to what I would feel like,

in this experience, I loved him. I was like, all in a while, Betney at the time. - Yeah, exactly. - He was like an exciting young actor at the time. - He's so fucking good in beautiful mind.

I feel like with great distance, he's arguably the best performance in that movie. - You know what, I, that's a movie, I've not seen it in 25. - A little bit terrified to rewatch, but I remember my mom and I,

walking out being like, who the fuck is that? - Right, he was, he was brand new. - Yeah, very excited. He'd obviously been in night's tail that year too. - Yeah, yeah.

- And getting to number one was a couple years before that. But when this, seeing this, I was like, well, this clearly feels like an anointment moment where they're gonna give him a kind of star as born, Jude Lawn, talented, Mr. Ripley,

best supporting actor, Nom, you've proven yourself and now you're a leading man. And instead his career, like, kind of, immediately gets way late after this. - Well, that's a time I was writing

for men's journal magazine, which is a very famous, national magazine covering the trend of men keeping journals. - Yep, of course. - And I pitched a profile of Paul Betten. Having not seen the movie, just liking the art.

- But you're like, this character is gonna pop. - I'm like, yeah. - And they said, no, not that nerd. - Well, can I tell you then? - Then, seeing the thing to say about the man

who is married to Jennifer Connelly. - Oh, he wasn't yet, right? They were together. - They may have been together. - 'Cause they met on beautiful minds?

- Yeah. - Even though he's a thickman of someone's imagination in that movie. So how could they, he's a man? - They also don't have right.

- And he seems together what they did. - 'Cause he's a thickman. - Yeah. - He has no scenes with anyone, but Russell Krappard.

“- I believe the story is that they had a flirtation”

and maybe a hookup during the filming of beautiful minds. - Well, well. - Then, the movie's obviously done, and 9/11 happens.

And as he tells the story, when he sees the news on TV, he's like, all I wanna do is call Jennifer Connelly. - Right, that is on his Wikipedia. - And he called her and was like,

should we fucking give this a go? And they were married like six months later, right? - They've been married ever since? - Yeah. - Paul Betney, the Oscar nominees

that you're for supporting actor were Tim Robbins for Mr. Kriver, who wins. - Well, not my opinion, not a very bad one. - Yeah, so I'm kind of a bad one. - Good actor, not a good performer.

- Bad one. - Alec Baldwin in the cooler. It was the Alec Baldwin moment. - Yes. - But in retrospect, you're just like,

that movie doesn't exist. It is so weird that it's only Oscar now. - It's not a bad movie, but it doesn't really exist. - Yes. - I remember him being good, not.

- He's really good. - But it also was, it was just the moment he was doing the character actor thing. - Everyone liked him being the bear.

- Benicio in 21 grams, he's amazing in that.

- What I have often contended if he hadn't won for traffic, he would have won this year. - Amazing performance. - Yeah, yeah. - And Docship movie, but he's phenomenal.

- Not a very well-remembered movie. - Jiam and Honesu in America, a performance I really like, a nom, I kind of love, same. - But another one that you're kind of like, huh, like another performance over the really talks about.

- Kind of a nomination morning surprise. I forget he was a bunch out, but he was not as much in the front of him. - Getting too. - And then Ken Watsonabe, in last samurai,

which is a movie I don't love, but a performance I adore. - Yeah. - And that was kind of a nice, you know, that was a nice. - Yeah. - The globes hit right.

So like Peter SARS-Gard and Shattered Glass, who cleaned up the other things. - Right. - Amazing performance, got snuped, rude. - Albert Finney and Big Fish got the globes and baffed anoth,

seemingly an obvious nom there, real lifetime chase. - And then the Oscars just like spurned to Big Fish, generally. - But it was just kind of like not for us. - The baffed anomalies were at Robbins?

- Yeah. - That's the only one it shares with the Oscars. - He was inevitable that season.

- He was always in the ocean, you know.

- It also felt like he's had a really big 80s and 90s and here's the anointment moment from the moment he gets that Oscar, his careers basically. - They were like never employed this mannequin.

- Right. Tim Robbins Mystic River. Ian McCell and Return of the King.

“- I think that's a bit of a softball now,”

but whatever. - And the thing I find very funny is that Ian McCell and Often and Interviews will say, I believe I'm the only actor to be nominated twice for playing the same character,

which is both wrong in that other people have done it and he didn't get the Oscar nomination, but he thinks he did because of the baffed. - 'Cause of the baffed. - He'll cite it all the time.

- Kind of the white and kind of the grayer, kind of different characters. - In a way, sure. - Yes, so one of them doesn't even remember his own name. - Yeah.

- Yeah. - Bill Nayy, who won for Love Actually, which is a little bit

“of a moment, I think the Brits getting a little too”

coffee on their own paint. - They do this. - I mean, he's so fun in that movie and I don't like that where we would obviously. And it was the Nayy moment.

We were all like, this also like my beloved, like Den on Elliot, winning best supporting actor for trading places. - And Paul Beton was nominated. - Okay, baffed us.

- It was the one he did get the novel. But no, yeah, after this, he did Wimbledon and it killed his career, it's insane. - It's kind of wild. - Like when he gets the Iron Man job,

you know, to be the voice of Jarvis. - Yeah. - It's kind of like, you don't have any, any fucking other shit going on, do you buddy? - Well, that's because it's Favro in Wimbledon.

They were friends. - Yeah, right. - I think Favro's in Wimbledon's an actor. - I mean, obviously he's like the villain in Da Vinci code. Like he was working.

- This is what I was gonna say. - Da Vinci in another universe, you're like, if this movie isn't repellent dog shit, is this an opportunity for like a fucking John Malkovich and in the line of fire moment?

And instead, it feels like there's six years where he's either just doing true paycheck shit, like he's the villain in firewall. - Yep. - Or, there's like, right.

In carts and other things that you're, - I'm a guy in young Victoria. Or it's stuff like Legion where it's like, he is on the poster, but that's like a really hot,

just like a 15 million dollar screen gem movie,

wasn't pretty, pretty supposed to be the guy. I like both of those movies too. - Very odd in stylish. - I like both of those movies. - But it was like, okay.

So this guy's neither seen as a serious actor, nor a major movie star. And then he just has a run of being like Johnny Demp's Journal wouldn't profile him. - Yes.

- Probably was like, yeah, I guess we gotta take the message this guy's not. - It's so strange. - I'm gonna break through. - And then he has three consecutive Johnny Demp's

best friend performances. - Mordekai and transcendence, I'm not sure the other one.

“- And also, why am I blanking on the other one here?”

- Oh no. - There is a third one. - I believe you. - It's the tourist. - Oh right, he's in the tourist.

- Maybe he's a villain in the tourist. - He's good in margin call. - But that's a small movie. - He's really good. - But that would be the thing.

He'd pop up as like seventh build in a movie. I mean, like a good dramatic scene. He'd be like, why is no one fucking using this? - He says when he got to be vision that he really was, like, like, just his career was his agent was kind of like,

it's just not happening for anybody. - He directed a film starring his wife, Jennifer Connelly, nice work if you can get it. An Anthony Mackie called Shelter about a homeless romance. And he was like, I needed to tell this story.

And I turned down a lot of jobs. And I focused on this for like three or four years. And it went to festivals. And everyone was like, why the fuck did you make this? And then he tells the story of his reps being like,

we're dropping you. Like, you're just, you fucked it up, man. And he's like literally the same day, Favro called me and was like, - Oh, we didn't.

- We didn't call him. - Is he the first one? - He's in Ironman, but like the voice,

“but like, Shelter came out in 2014, right?”

- We didn't stand like, hey, by the way, like, I have this fun idea of like vision. - You're the voice of Jarvis and I'll make you vision. - And he's like, well, that sounds good. Is that good?

- We didn't. - Yeah, like that's like good idea. - It's the image. - He just fucked it up. - Yeah, this is purely speculative,

but he's been married to Jennifer Connelly for a long time.

First person he thought of when the twin towers came down.

- Yeah. - They seem to have a real marriage. - He said he's like, he had a crush on her from like, Labyrinth, which we've got in line. - Yeah, I thought it was the only one.

But like, I hear that story and I'm like, maybe I should have called Jennifer Connelly on 9/11. - Hey, can I haul or hit you Jennifer? I'm 13 years old, but. - I'm not, I'm not saying that the vicissitudes

of Hollywood were not unkind to him, et cetera, et cetera. Obviously, men's general, really fucking blackballed him, but sometimes I feel like when someone is in a good marriage, that maybe his priorities are different. - Oh, the she also has had an odd career.

- Say it again. - I know, and maybe that's because they love each other and loves spending time with each other and they're not chasing the way that a single hungry or person would be like, I'm not gonna say that.

- And they're dad's and moms too, right? - Connelly, yes, Connelly obviously wins the Oscar for the movie they did together at the very beginning of their relationship. And then it feels like she has continued to be

for the last 25 years, one of these people, where I'm just like, why is everyone fucking taking her for granted every four or five years? - Right, pop up again in a way, and everyone's like, right, Jennifer Connelly still looks great

is always good, and then she goes back

to being ignored for another four or five years. - So is she being an order? Is she making a choice to just-- - I don't know, I don't know. - I don't know, I don't know.

- Maybe like fucking for life. - Five seasons of Snoop here. - So there's not a piece of show to not work. - But it just feels like the stuff isn't sticky and then she'll be in like fucking top on maverick.

- Which is great, she's luminous. - Yes, and she's got incredible chemistry at Tom Cruise and that movie, sexual chemistry. - I actually think it is the most successfully a woman has conveyed.

- She's so good. - Yes, she's actually an actress. - Yeah, she's a little uncomfortable, but she's so good.

in how to make you buy their relationship

“and what they show you and the things they're just like,”

we're not even gonna attempt to show you this. - I'm going to open the dossier, and then I'm gonna talk about it. - Let's drop out of here, yeah, okay. - And pop open that dossier.

- All right, in 2000, here's a curious note from a, from, this is not related to Sebastian Krander, but in 2000, Peter Weir Wolfgang Peterson, Rob Reiner, Jonathan Demi, the great bad Brad Silverling, director of your favorite Casper,

a participate in a creative bake-off to pitch themselves as the director of Harry Potter. - Okay, they were all part of I assume Warner Brothers was essentially like all a bunch of kind of a steamed dish directors who've done big production.

- Can you run that list again quickly? - Wolfgang Peterson, so obviously, he's a big director. - It's a lot of stuff for Warner Brothers. - Rob Reiner, I mean, at that point,

he's starting to lose his Lester, but he's still, he's made huge movies. Demi, Demi's kind of a, Demi's wild choice. - Yeah, I mean, that would have been very interesting. - This is like who does post-belove it?

- Right. - But he's still fucking John of the Netherlands. - He's like, you know, and Brad Silverling, who, you know, is he's kind of like a, I mean, they've got Krone Columbus, right?

It's like Chris Columbus is more proven than him, really. - Right. - Well, I'm not a more emotional, but I'm just a little more technical. - But it's also like Columbus has just made two

of the biggest movies ever with like kids in them. - I mean, also, the other famous story is that like, J.K. Rowling said my first choice is Terry Gilliam, and Warner Brothers said that's not a conversation. - Yeah, Warner Brothers is like,

- Oh, exactly. - Okay, I mean, like, there was like, there were the deal, they were births. - Nift.

“- And, uh, the only thing to do is tell me Joel.”

- Right, and Rowling was like, I'm not doing like American Harry Potter. I'm not like, you know, she knew that he would box her out.

Like, he's more powerful.

- Yeah, he also was like, I'd want to make some changes. And Warner Brothers was like, your job is to adapt the books, Harry Potter, and what it means. - I mean, it's nice to a lot of kids.

- And my shaman supposedly was also like, given a phone call, I've heard that, you know, and like, you know, whatever. - But that doesn't seem to look like a very successful. - Yes.

- We're would have been, uh, possibly interesting. - We're as fast as you. - Yeah. - Instead, though, we are just not win this bake off, obviously. He gets attached to an adaptation of Master and Commander

for 20th Century Fox. Tom Rothman, uh, back when he was president of production at Samuel Goldman Company in the '90s, read an Aubrey matern book, and loved it, and asked Samuel Goldman up, acquired the film right to please.

So that's in 1993. - Right. - Then cycle between Goldman and Touchstone, which is, of course, a Disney subsidiary. - Yes.

“- John McMovie has three studios attached to it.”

It has near-max, Fox, and Universal. - Yeah. - Right here, Nen, at one point was attached to direct an adaptation for Touchstone. - Make a perfect sense.

- Absolutely. - Yeah. - At one point, Goldwyn asked, we're to do it in some time in the '90s, and he says he turned it down, because they wanted to do the first book in the series,

which is like, more of a young Aubrey, like, got Aubrey has just gotten his first command. - By '98, Goldwyn has the rights again, and he has a new home at 20th Century Fox. - And it's right, Rothman has brought it again.

- Yeah, and, and, and, and Rothman's at 20th Century Fox. And then Fox, he becomes president in CEO in 2000, and it is his passion project. It is like, you know, his, like, as you're saying, Griffin, like, this is the one I'm gonna be remembered for.

- And I'm going to ignore the usual studio-noty kind of like, well, you know, kind of, you know, anywhere. - This is the one for him.

- Where is always his top choice?

- Yeah. - He's been his top choice since the mid '90s, and since the mid '90s, he's only, like, he's only got more obsessed with the books. He's now read, you know, the entire opus.

- We are his, you're saying. - No, or Rothman, Rothman, yes. - Yeah, Patrick O'Brien dies at the age of 85, January 2000. - Okay. - Where is he new to the, to tower stood forever?

He's lucky in that. - He's lucky. - We're still hesitant to sign on, but I mean, it just seems like Rothman was basically like, well, here's, here's the story.

They'd have a meeting, and Rothman says, what I really think you should do, and then he pulls out a captain's sword. - My hands it to him. - He says, is take command of the HMS surprise,

and Peter Weir is like, gonna keep the sword, I mean, I'm like, yeah, you can have the sword, what, go ahead. - You also have to imagine the Rothman's basically saying

to him, like, I'm gonna give you full support to make the best version of this movie. - You're not gonna deal with dumb fucking notes. - This is exactly what Weir says. - Yeah.

- Not have made this without a studio executive at the top of the tree who loves the material. Like, you need Rothman at the top every time someone's like,

hey, Peter, we were just bought up million more gallons

of water, right? - Right. - When someone's like, approved? - Right, so you have another million. - The guy with the stamp, the rubber stamp needs to be someone who understands exactly what these books are

and has no temptation to be like, could we add a romantic cell plot? Could we do this? Could we do that kind of bullshit? - Yeah, there's a talking parrot.

- That was my main note at the time. - Yeah.

“- Then the name of the boat is the HMS surprise.”

Just so you know, okay. So if you wanna know, if you wanna know how to drop anchor, I'll tell you some time. I would, okay, put a pin in it. - Great.

- So we're still like, I don't wanna do the first book,

which is still mostly been every attempt to adapt to has been working. He's like, I want it to be on the friendship of Aubrey Return. I want it to be on their longer voyage.

You know, like, if we're doing a essentially an arch in store, we won't really have that. His favorite inspiration is in 1994, it's the far side of the world, the 10th book. It's where they get the subtitle,

but it is not a strict adaptation. They have some of the first book in there. They have some original stuff. John Colley, a Scottish born physician and professor who is medical travels are taking across the world

before he settled in Australia. He's brought in, he's like a novelist in the screenwriter as well. He's brought in to help. I don't really know John Colley.

What are his other credits? - Happy feet. - Really? - Yes, here? - Why?

- He wrote happy feet. - I mean, one of the several writers. - Yeah, happy feet. - Along with the lady from the plot. - But this is his first.

This is essentially his first movie apart from a movie called Paper Mask, which is based on a bookie wrote. - Okay.

“- And three episodes of StarCops on these BBC 2”

in 1987. - What is StarCops? Do you have any familiar with StarCops? - I don't know. - It's cool.

It's a British sci-fi song. The thing from the 90s can't say I know this one. I was a bugs guy. If I don't watch bugs, let me out. It was another BBC, like kind of sci-fi cop show.

It was really cool. It was set in like the near future 'cause they would computer bugs. They would do like hacking shit. - StarCops is set in a time when space travels become common.

And kind of is in the process exploiting colonizing solar system. They need cops. It takes place in the 20, 20-- - Do they need cops?

- Yeah, I got to say, got on hips. - Yeah, I'm gonna, yeah, a scab. All space cops are bad. - Yeah. Love that.

So, the breakthrough is for them.

- The breakthrough is, according to Collie, sings the film as a dialogue about what it is to be a man. We're really writing about a family in which Jack is the dad. Steven is the mom, Blake knee, Max Perkis.

Is the kid, the rest of the crew are the teenagers, right?

“You know, like that's how they think about it.”

And like, I think the Max Perkis character is so vital. The boy who loses his art. - Yeah. - Yeah. - Because, I mean, because it's a really good performance.

That kid's great. He had up on Rome. I don't know what happened to him after that. - Yeah. - But, you know, he was sort of around, you know what?

In 2016, he was appointed head of acquisitions and distribution at embankment films. So it sounds cool. So he's just like, into the artificial industry. - Yeah, that's great.

- Yeah. - Because it just rocks that you're like, this is this tender relationship, but it's also a military relationship. Both Aubrey and Maturen have like separate relationships

to him, you know, like Aubrey has the, you know, navel and talking about Nelson stuff. But then he likes all the bugs and the stuff he does with Maturen. And then at the end, Aubrey's like,

you're in charge of the ship and then he is. And then he's like, we need to fucking storm them and he's got a gun and he's got one hand. - And you know what? - You know what? - You know what?

- Cool. - It rocks. - When he walks through the hole in the other shit. - And he's just like, where the gun in one hand. - He's not, and no hand in the other hand.

- It's crazy. - It's the greatest. - Ah. - Just do a show about him. - I can't, I could do a show about anyone.

Killik is my favorite. My favorite is when he says, my favorite moment in mastering commander. - Yeah. - Is when he says an extra rock or, you know,

an extra ration of ration around for the two guys. - And Killik's like, was saving the rum for saluting day. And he's like, we'll drink wine and the whole will drink wine and saluting. They're like, what the fuck is saluting day?

- And they never, it's like, you don't have to know.

- It's the captain's steward. - He's the only guy who talks back to like, apart from him. - It's her and does it like in a very formal way. - Killik is the one guy who's like,

I'm just saving the rum around this loopen day I was. - Which is, it will be done when it's done. - So he's starting to say, - Which is his house hugs face, sir. - And love when he says, "South hogs face,"

and Aubrey is like, yeah, that's my favorite. I love his house, hogs face. - My mom. - My mother loves you. - My mother loves you.

- Your hog face and you're like, "I fucking hog face, we come." - When I was a kid in my parents like, "Pring it on." - When my parents said,

"What are we having tonight?" "Hogs face, I don't feel like I can." - It sounds disgusting but what it is is, you boil a hog's head. - The hat.

- You take off all the meat and then you put it into a mold and all the gelatin that's come out of the skull bones turns it into a terrain and you slice it. - Yes, it's a wholeed. - You spread it like on toe.

- Yeah. - And my mom would eat it by the slice. - I personally, I love a paté.

- It doesn't sound like the greatest thing in the world.

- And there were a lot of jelly things.

“- See for me, when it was Monday at the school”

cafeteria and they served just hogs head, I was excited. But then later in the week when you're like, "Oh, it's like hogs head, low, if it's hogs head." - You're right right there.

- They're using every part of it with their bones. - I'll take tacos, I feel like I'm tired of it by Friday. (upbeat music) - David? - Yes.

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What's your favorite flavor right now?

“- Right now, I'm actually really big into Barry.”

I've been cycling through them and I've been, I've really been enjoying this Barry phase. I will say this as well, David. You said it wherever you are. I'm about to go away for six weeks

and you better believe I just ordered a whole box of travel packs so that I don't have to travel unarmed. - I had no doubt. So visit drinkag1.com/check to get your free morning person hat and free AG1 flavor sampler for that hat.

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- Gia of Worte for the E. Streaming was not so great. (upbeat music) - All right, so the beauty of Collie says, beauty of the books is the richness of the technical detail,

the correctness of the dialogue. The plots are good, but the incidents,

“the little stuff, that's why people love these books.”

Like, they love the detail. And it's perfect for us because we can just, you know, achieve all this verse of melody just by using the books. Like it's all in there already.

You don't need to do a, he did all the research for you. The whole point of those books is they are very accurate. Like they are really striving for like this is life. - But and, but and here is particularly good capturing the minutia of worlds of communities and worlds.

- It he always is. - So, you know, it's a, it's a perfect match. - Take some to your side of satisfactory screenplay. - And then he stops, right? That's my, that's my work ethic.

- Is it satisfactory? - Russell Crow comes aboard and he wanted to beef up their maturin and Aubrey relationship a little bit more. So, Akiva Goldsmith, who of course,

I've just written a beautiful mind on Alaska, does summary rights, which is interesting because I think of Akiva Goldsmith, of course, as a master of trash. But he's also been involved in things I like.

- Yeah. - And at this moment, he will sign up hyper legit. - This is true. - Yeah. - We are says his ideal choice would have been Richard Burton.

Unfortunately, he was very dead. - Quite dead. And also, before he died, had been a little bit of a handful in those last 20 to 30 years of his career. I would go as far as to say that at this point in time,

Richard Burton was extremely dead, more dead than most, and that the last 20 years in which he was alive, were also kind of deathlike. - Exactly. I don't think Richard Burton would have maybe had his sea legs,

what might say. But anyway, he turns to also Crow who correctly is the closest thing you're gonna get to a Richard Burton type in 2000. - Yeah.

- Yeah, right? - A big, burly fucking man who is a great actor and a movie star, but who embodies a kind of masculinity that a lot of guys don't. - I was listening to the Lex Street podcast yesterday.

- Love the Lex Street podcast. - The greatest. - The name of it? - It's called the Lex Street podcast. - Got it.

The world's greatest commenter has this on movie podcast.

roundup and doing this sort of like,

“"Why do I even see these movies anymore?”

"Why do I still feel this compulsion?" - And he just goes. - This seems to me that the constant, the consistent price is ready. - Why am I ready?

- You're not too opening weekend, whatever. And then he was saying like, I'm really trying to like watch more old movies and I'd love to make the podcast more about old movies but I feel like people won't listen,

but I've been watching Ben Hurk, 'cause the 4K just came out, and he was just kind of waxing about Ben Hurk and he was like, and fucking trolling the Heston. Like, we don't have anyone who can do this today.

Like no one acts like this anymore. No one can hold a movie like this and sort of know how to be larger than life, but also just steady at the center. And I was thinking, hearing this right before,

doing the rewatch. Crow's career has been weird. Like 2001, right? You're like, this guy's the top of the fucking world. - And always will be.

- He had three consecutive Oscar names.

“He won the middle one, gladiator was a massive block”

buster, beautiful man was a massive block buster, and it was like, if this guy can do fucking big epics and intimate dramas, then he's everything. This guy's like Mel Gibson and Gregory Peck and Charlton has to in the same time,

and then he has gone off in a thousand weird directions. There is the consistency of like, this was a reasonable hit, although obviously did not make as much as they wanted relative to the budget. And then you could basically say the same about Robin Hood

and Noah were like, people went to see them. - Yes, they did, and I get this the dad thing. We're talking about just that audience.

- He never hit the gladiator thing quite as big,

but you were like, this is the only guy I would argue for the last 25 years who people buy doing this type of movie. And when they try to put someone else into this, even when it is a proven actor,

like you get fucking exodus gods and kings with Christian bail as Moses. - And everyone's like, not buying. - It's the point. - You know, and then like Russell Crowe will hire a trainer and be like, I'm gonna try to look like a person again

for this one, and everyone's like, yeah, sure, yeah. He's the one guy who can pull this shit off in our modern era. - Crowe and we're obviously are both from Australia, but they never worked together. But obviously, Crowe's at this point,

a gigantic movie star. He has made gladiator when he gets signs on here. Beautiful mind is about to come out. He's committed to Cinderella man, which is going at that point to be made

by Lossa Halstrom. One Howard eventually makes that. That is the movie that comes, that's 2005. So that's his next movie after Mastering Commander. He wants to be a Mastering Commander,

and he says, can you wait?

“Well, I do Cinderella man, like can you wait a year?”

And we are says, the ship sales with the tide. Nope, not waiting. So Crowe decides to postpone Cinderella man. - Yeah. - And instead boards the surprise. And that's probably tough on him,

because like Cinderella man, he's playing a boxer. Like he's gotta have the physique and all that. And you probably would want to do that. I mean, how old is Crowe? How old is Crowe when he makes this movie?

- That's a great question. I'm gonna guess 30, are we gonna realize that Crowe is significantly younger than I am right now in this film? - Yeah, Rossa Crowe is significantly younger

than you are right now. He is 39 when this film comes out.

So Crowe is basically just like,

I could not stop thinking about it. Like, and he says, like, did I want to give out a chance to work with Peter Weir? I dreamed about working with Peter Weir in my whole career. Like, he immerses himself. He loves the books.

He finds that the later books turn off Aubrey into a bit of a buffoon, which he doesn't like. But he, you know, he loves the character generally. He loves the teacher student thing with the kids. He wanted to show the responsibility

that Aubrey has having these kids on board. Because like, to be clear, the officer class, as I'm sure you know, these are the young boys of like aristocracy. - Yes. - Who, like, it's usually,

if you're like the fourth son, right? Like, son, one, you're going to inherit the land. Son, two, you're the backup. Stick around. Son, three, maybe you marry next to a neighbor

who's going to inherit their land. Son, four, we don't know what to do with you. - He sounds like a girl with an extra sons. - Yeah. - You send them to be midshipmen in the Royal Navy.

- And it's learned to be officer. - And if they'll rise and all that. - Yeah. - And just, they're so young. - But the, exactly, Ben, the absolute madness of like a 12-year-old outranking,

these like salty asssy dogs. - Yeah. - And the, and the way, the whole like, microcosm of British class happening on this ship. Like that there's no, you know, like the, and we said the great subplot

of where that, that does start to get fucked with a little bit with the Jonah. But generally, that like those lines don't get crossed. And like the boys do get to sit at the front, essentially, and you know, hoarder everyone around.

- And like it's where there's little hats. And everyone's gonna touch their hats. And Blakeney and Calamie, well Blakeney's got to be 12 or 13. Calamies may be 16. - Adam is older. - He's a midshipmen.

- Yeah, he's a real loser. - He says he's 36 or something. - Yeah, he's just, he's like, you know, his, his, his rating mate are all 16, 15, 14, 13 years old.

He's just never, he's never gotten to jump right

- A number of historians hired to consult in the movie. So the Crow could actually use his Australian accent

without basically be acceptable,

considering like what British people talk like at the time and things like that. - Crow doesn't, 'cause the Australian accent is sort of a throwback to sometimes.

“- I think that's sort of the idea, right?”

Like it's like, you know, that's around when we're starting to fucking send British people out to Australia anyway. - And it ain't when stop putting shrimps on the barbie. - They call them prawns in England. - They do an Australian, they do an Australian.

- So Crow decides that'll just feel unnatural. So he goes to this kind of British accent. This like solid up her class, you know. - That does feel like a fascinating version of even if it's accurate, 99% of the audience

is gonna go, oh, so Russell Crow was too lazy to do a British accent. - I may be, you're not gonna be able to fight the notion of like, is this guy cheating by using whole real voice? - I feel like he was pretty well regarded for his accent.

- Yes, that's like the elephant. - That's the other four months is so good. - I'm sure like he, that's part of the juice for him. - Yeah. He's at this point a very like studious obsessive actor.

- It was 2003, so not as many people were eating shit online.

- There weren't that many commenters. - Whoa, they've got to get up and then start. - Like he was starting, creating an narrative saying that he was too lazy or whatever. But it's still, I gotta say, I'll hate this phrase,

but it would've taken me out of it. - Yeah, I would've been wondering why he's talking. - You've got a question. - They made the right call. - Yeah.

“- Where is initially resistant to betney”

because of the beautiful mind thing? - Oh, sure. - He's like, is that too obvious? Do we need like a fresh combo? - He also thinks betney is too tall.

Like he's like maternity's supposed to be the physical opposite of Aubrey, like betney's pretty early. - I was looking at the Wikipedia and the sort of people complaining,

the book fans complaining at his casting at the time. And the other thing that in the books, he's a spy, and they don't remove that element. - Well, they don't remove it because they, they nod to it.

- There's a moment early on when he says, like they have their spies everywhere and obviously, because yes, often maternity goes on spy missions. Because yes, the greatest. - Right spy?

- Chalice? - Natureist? - Urgent? - You don't gotta sell me on virgin. - You don't gotta sell me on virgin?

- Yeah. - Autosturgeon. - But it sounds like in the books, he is described as looking like Timothy Spall. (laughs)

That he's a little gargoyle-esque.

“- Obviously that was never gonna happen.”

He fledger was considered, which makes a lot of sense. - It does. - Oh, but then you got double laws. - Double burly. - Yeah, do I think.

- Yeah. - Betney though, obviously. - Because even though, even though betney's kind of a bigger guy than you think of in the face,

he's got a fine, a fine bone-structured face. - You're right. - Compared to the big hunk of Easter hand. - You're right. - Uh, that the crow has for his head.

- Everyone in the cast does a boot camp, right? They do a sort of like, you're gonna learn how to sail. Betney is like, no thank you. And instead, learns about like, amputations and how to call it fish.

Russell Crow says that everyone in every actor should sell their characters name into their t-shirts, according to color, according to rank, you know, as part of like a sort of, you know, like, let's get onto the experience.

- Right. - Betney refuses to do it. Betney, he's consciously like, I want to feel apart from everyone. I want everyone to feel a little weirded out by me.

You know, because maturing is kind of an oddity on the boat. Betney says like, nonetheless, like, we all bonded, you know, not in a testosterone anyway, but you're really looking after each other.

It's like 20 actors. They shoot this mostly in Mexico, or off the coast of like Baja California, and stuff like that. - For the tank was.

- Right. - Yeah. - Max Perkis was founded Eaton College, Britain's fanciest school. - He's a fancy lad.

- He's a fancy fancy lad. - Playing a fancy lad, and he invites fancy. - I was curious, Sims. He doesn't seem to still be working for embankment, but I was like, what films has he worked on?

And that announcement of embankment hired to Malibu's most wanted. Okay, so he's hired in 2016,

do you know what the first film embankment does

under his watches, David? - Which is that? - The wife. - Oh, what if there was one? - One of our greatest running bits.

- He was the one who asked the question, what if we bankrolled the life? - I mean, that's one of those movies where the product, there's like 14 production companies, like that's a classic Tiff movie,

where you're like, I can arrive 10 minutes like D. You know, various logos will still be playing. That's like, Jim's film. - That's a great way of putting it. - Jim's films.

- If you're at the premiere, there's like 10 people who like, "Hey, you're jealous, yeah, whatever." - I found the screen in daily screen international news item about him getting hired at embankment,

and it has this whole thing. We nabbed one of the brightest where it convinces industry star of the future. Embankment co-founder Hugo Grumbar, and I vividly recall first meeting him

and thinking, we've seen that guy before somewhere. Turns out he was amongst the lead actors and Peter Wears Master Commander. - Sure, what? And what is otherwise a pretty stayed kind of press release

to be like, and we were thinking,

(laughing) - I got to say, when you google him, he's got the same fit. - He's got a baby face, yeah. - Yeah, he still looks like he's got the same fit. - Did he grow his arm back?

- Yeah, he did. - I mean, the cast, he's got three arms. - The cast is, I mean, James Darcy, who I adore is a great, like, British actor. - Yeah, but the way I get it.

- I just gotta say with regard to that, then I mentioned to you, the load is called the HMS surprise. Okay, it's a smaller boat of the ships of the line. The victory, which was the flagship Admiral Nelson's boat,

was about 250 feet long. Now, the surprise, which was a real boat, 120, 126 feet long. Now, I don't know if that's the length of the hull then, or if that includes the bow sprit,

the big long thing on the front. But it's much shorter boat, you see what I mean? It's beam is only 31 feet. It's got a draft of 14, a feet and a half inch. - You are reading music, I'll figure Peter.

- If you're smaller, I know it's for all of the jump. Okay, his eyes are blown to his head. I'm going to can't let Henderson do that.

“- What's surprising about the surprise for a boat that size?”

It's got not one, but two Jarvis is on it. - It's a good point, thank you for setting that up. - I was gonna James Darcy, it's the original Jarvis. - It was kind of beautiful the whole wide up and the Jarvis. - I mean, how are I gonna go to Jarvis?

- I'm ready to go. - And you know what? He's really fun in that show. - He is. - You know what else James Darcy is fun in?

Pretty much everything. - He's on that guy's show. - He's on the spot at least. - Yeah, he's on the spot at least. - But yes, he was a original human Jarvis, an Asian Carter,

and then they brought him back in end game. - He was recently an open primer as the guy who's not nice to open hymer and open hymer, almost poisons his apple. - Right, which is an open primer really did. - It is this funny thing of like,

I think of him as a guy who did not emerge until the 2010s, and I feel like you often have these discoveries watching movies where like the young supporting cast of recent drama school graduates or guys who are a decade away from finally breaking

through. - He's a classic for all coronation streets or neighbors, but like Andrew Scott being in like band of brothers or you're like, isn't this way too early for Andrew Scott to be anything?

“- But they do a lot of BBC costume dramas and stuff.”

And like Darcy, I feel like is also one of those guys

who was always on the Doctor Who List.

- Oh, sure. - Like every time it came up like the ton of sounds. - He rocks obviously it's so nice to see Billy Boyd. I feel like this is Billy Boyd's like other big movie basically.

- Yeah, so I remember, Dominic Moynihan doing an interview saying that this was like the peak of his depression and I think his drinking? - Boyd or Monahan. - Monahan.

- Right. - Because he was like, I have this like double act with Boyd, you make these three movies together. And then I couldn't book a gig for two years. So the movies are coming out, winning Oscars,

making tons of money, and Boyd's often a fucking pirate ship. - Not a pirate ship, it's a pirate ship. - Ship of the lines. - Yes, but he was like, I was like, he's gonna keep booking and I'm stuck.

And then basically right after this, it flips and boyd's. A little disappears, a little bit, and then yeah, Moynihan's all lost. - Yeah, I mean, it's all like Boyd's stops having credits, but I do feel like, you know, you don't really see.

- I got as much. - I got to say it was hard. This was a thing that took me out of the movie. - You kept seeing him steering that ship. - What's Mary doing?

- He did a terrific job. - He's gonna do anything.

“- I disagree with you, and I think you should apologize to him.”

- Sure, okay. - All right, thank you. - I don't wanna get blocked. The great Robert Pue, who's the, you know, who's Alan, you know, one of the other officers.

Like, there's just Lee Engelby is really good. Like all the, all the, these are all British guys. Who's the guy who jumps? - Oh, the Jonah. - Yes.

- That the guy's name is Lee Engelby. - Yeah, it's Engelby. - Oh, that's the angle. - Okay, okay, so he's in, he's in one of that. Oh yeah, he's in as Kabam.

- I have a lot of personal ask him, and he's the guy who drives the night bus. - Or is he the guy driver or the conductor? - Yeah, he's right in somebody. - Yeah, yeah, not really wreck his detrivers.

I can't remember his detrivers. - Yeah, yeah.

Peter we are made his first four films,

or no, four of his early films that would Russell Boyd. - Mm-hm. - Pegnik, uh, way, globally, dangerous thing. Then John Ciel has been his guy for a while, right? I forget who shoots Truman Show.

Who shot Truman Show? - That's a really good question. - Thank you. - It's such a good question, baby. Peter B. B. Zoo.

- Interesting. - Who shot life of Brian? And a lot of, yeah, oh, that's the thing that kept striking you all watching this movie. One of the guys on the boat looks so much like Eric Idol,

and look like Eric Idol in makeup, playing an older. - Yeah, get it, get it, get it, get it. - You're talking about, yeah, get it, get it, get it, get it. - David Brell fall. - Okay, you know who he is?

- So, he is William H. Macy in the original, British shameless. - Uh-huh. - Which back, the British one is about, he's set Manchester and is also about a loudish father

who can't stop drinking and his four billion children.

- Right. - And every time like one of the kids ages up and it's like, I want to be a movie star and leaves the show. They're like, we found another fucking kid.

There's so many kids under couched cushions in this house. - But he's the, yeah, he's a great British actor.

- He looks a lot like Eric Idol in this. He looks like Eric Idol. - Like he's expecting him. - In, in his get. - And then at the end of this movie,

when they come across the French,

“I was like, this really feels like the rude taunting”

French man from, I mean, he's weird. - And he's weird. - And he's on his head. - Yeah, comedic. - Yeah.

- One day, purely back. And Russell Boyd is on an airplane going to Los Angeles. - Okay. - And they sit side by side. Peter Weirnhee, they hadn't worked together in many years.

He wonders if we arranged it. He didn't realize it was going to happen. And he starts saying like on the plane. - Yeah. - Yeah.

- Now he starts saying we've got making this boat movie at five or nine eleven. So you can bring, you could bring your naval cutless on the plane at the time. - It's Master and Commander.

He starts explaining it, you know, seen by scene and Boyd's like, that sounds like great. And he's like, let's get dinner tomorrow. I'll drop you to the script.

And then like, you know, Boyd comes back on board.

Is the first time they worked together

and of course, Russell Boyd won the ice. - There've been an astrangement thing. - I don't think so. It's just like he started using John Seale who was the assistant on some of the earlier stuff.

And then like, you know, he went to Hollywood. - Russell Boyd takes good pictures. - Russell. - I'm looking at Russell Boyd's 90s.

And it's like, white man can't jump. Operation Dumbo drop, tin cup, liar, liar, doctor, do little. None of those movies are poorly shot.

“- No, but I could see that guy being like,”

this, I've won a fucking challenge. - Not known for their visual beauty. - No, no. - And then probably there's right. - Cool stuff to see if you were to rewatch them.

- And the only weird films were challenging productions that totally. - That can make the guy like this. - Exactly, that's like, you hear about picking a hangar off

and some of him like figuring out how to do stuff with no money. - Right, yeah. - Okay, well, I just watched that last night in advance of this.

And I was like, one of them is visually interesting. - Is that ever seen? - It's so gorgeous. - And then you're loving dangerously is one of the most completely different

but so spectacularly shot. - The air, you know, you know, any movie that can make me feel air. - The air, the air, the air. - Yeah.

- Peter originally wants to do a water world thing. - He wants to, like, roll out. - He also wants to, one of his trees, wetest directors. - Peter Bear.

- He is true. - Yeah. - He gave us the last way. - Truman Show. - Yeah.

- Yeah.

- They ultimately, the rain and the green card

apartment. - True, depot society's set entirely underwater. - Kelly McGill is taking a bath. - Yeah. - That's true.

- That's true. - Yeah, I mean, she's, you know, gotta take a bath. - They ended up running around all day. - 10 days on the actual seas.

- Well, here we go. So I'm gonna tell you. Like, he wants to shoot entirely on the water and they're like, look, that's water world. We need a floating ship trailing with you.

- Right. - If you're gonna do her first shot, everyone's gotta wait while the ship moves. - Right, you know, like it's like, the entire industry burned our lesson on that move.

Like, everyone took notes from that color. - And so we're like, fine, maybe we should build a set, you know, in a tank. And like, I wonder who would know anything about that. - Games.

- This is the thing, the other kind of miracle of this movie is just being close enough to Titanic that James Cameron had done the legwork to build out the system to be able to basically shoot this on a gimbal in a tank.

- Ridley of a proper shot. - Scott had made both 1492 and white squall. I think in a tank in Gibraltar, but that tank was in disrepair. Like, it only a few years between Titanic

and white squall, but like, it's enough. - Yes. - Fucked up. - Then they're like, are we gonna have to build a tank? And we're like, I don't wanna build a tank

and then James Cameron's like, we, Mexico. - Yeah. - Titanic. - Titanic.

- I have a tank. - It has a deep channel where they could put the set on a big gimbal so you can like move the boat around. It has shallow water so you could put people waste deep.

“If you need to, in Titanic, when the ship sinks”

nose first, that was on a gimbal. - That's a spoiler. So they had to fuck with things because of the way the Mexican tank was built for Titanic. - But to your point, David, these things need a lot of maintenance

and studios are not making like seven boat pictures a year. - Maybe they should. - Maybe just to keep these tanks use the bowl, they should just make a boat picture every year. - But probably because there's perfect storm.

- Yeah, it's the best crazy tank stuff. - Yeah. - Yeah, but that was a lot of CGI waves. I remember when that came out. They're great waves, but I remember talking to a visual effects guy

before that came out saying waves are the thing

when we can do waves that would be the most amazing thing.

- And then they cracked that. - And then they cracked it and that's all I could see. - Shooting, shooting inside the ship, right? - Yeah, I'm just gonna say, okay. - Sorry.

- Yeah, but I just think it's interesting hypothetical to entertain. Had the order flipped and Russell Crow did beautiful, or did a surrealist man first. They probably would not have had a workable tank. - Possibly?

- Might have gotten all the time. - Like the difference of being who knows. - You know? - Yeah, I don't. But I will tell you that.

- Would it just come of algae on the top of that? - They didn't want to remove ceilings and walls. - Okay, I wanted to use these cramps that's to their advantage. Like let's actually have it be like, let's just shoot inside the ship.

They moved it out of a bridge port where it had been a tourist attraction. It had been designed to fight in the seven years where it was in a few existing vessels that they could use.

Then they make it over new engine sales, rigging decks. Then they build a full size replica in the tank. - So like they have the real ship on the water that you have the replica in the tank. - The real ship I understand to be the rose.

- That's the rose, yeah.

- Yeah, 1.5 million dollars.

- Do you have 1.5 million dollars? - No, I don't, but you know, I just learned. - I just learned that the Mary Day, the two-master wooden sales scooner that I trained on as a midshipman.

- Is up for? - Is it for sale for $550,000? - But then it's like, you got a parkit. It's like, oh, you don't just buy a boat and then you're like, great, I have a boat.

They're making some costs associated from retaining an old wooden boat. - I mean, I was gonna say like, if you bought a fucking plastic speed boat, even that,

“it's like you got to fucking put it somewhere, right?”

- Very common, but I don't have a plastic speed boat either, but, yeah, the good news is the gas is cheap 'cause it doesn't have it. - Sure, you got the only gas you need. - You got the air gas.

I think this movie was a little bit hard to make. - Yeah, what? I just wanna follow up quickly

and you saying that if John had 1.5 million dollars

in 2003 money he could own the rose. Do you know where the rose is today? was purchased in 2007 by the Maritime Museum of San Diego and officially re-registered as the HMS surprise. So it exists permanently as the surprise. Oh, you can fuck, I got to get to San Diego. Oh, my man. I'm going to tell you. I think that Patrick O'Brien, I had read somewhere,

had been on the rose and he said this is essentially the same ship as the surprise. Both historically scanned in his novels because it was a real ship that he sort of adopted to put into the novels.

“And they immediately, he said the only thing different is a his coat of paint. It doesn't”

immediately repaint it as to look like the surprise back then. It does say on the Wikipedia by 2024, the ship was in a worn condition with deteriorating paint and timbers. Well, we go there goes for stuff. Yeah. Also, they cast the ship in Pirates' Caribbean fort. But it's probably like some fucked up. The HMS Providence. Yeah. But otherwise, that's the museum. I'll film my 700% has 700 plus effects shop. A Peter weird did not want the film to look like the perfect storm.

He wanted to use minatures and stuff mostly for the you know storms and all that, wet a bill to a big attire, right? Like a giant minature ship. I believe. I saw the wet a that sounds awesome. I can tell you, according to Nathan McGillett, McGinnis from asylum, another VFX company. There's not one piece of ocean in that storm sequence that isn't real. Wow. CGI waters obviously more controllable, but I thought, you know, this is the more

believable solution. So while they're in post production, fear begins to circulate around the studios, they realize the film has no villain. They realize the film has no romance. They could have read the script. Those are usually things that are in a movie. It is fair to say that this film begins with them getting their ship rocked. Then lots of things happen, but there is no more real action. The storm in the middle is an action sequence, but there's no real battles. And at the end,

there's an awesome battle. But it is like, it is defying, I would say, some hollywood, you know, kind of like plotting sort of mechanics. It also feels like Tom Rothman may be consciously played goalily to prevent people from noticing this early. Right, right? Then like the movies like deep and post production, the bills are getting sent. And they're like, you're telling me there's no woman at all in the movies. He's so resiliently, he has an umbrella for five seconds. Yeah, and

and they say hi to her. Yeah, he smiles. He's like, she smiled at me. That shot is in the trailer, which is hysterical. Yes, like they clearly were like any player. There's there's there's going to be a colonial romance. The film was going to come out in June. Yeah, you're one member this. We're wanting more time for effects. So they push it to November. That does mean that their lunch gets eaten by pride to the Caribbean or whatever, which comes out in July. Although that was

obviously another film that the studio was like, why the fuck did we make this boat movie? We're

“about to be in so much trouble. Like, there was this, I remember in the lead up to that movie.”

It pirates? Yes. There was a curse of pirate movies. Well, beyond just, are they really fucking going to make movies at a ride now? We had no idea how bad things were going to get. Yeah, right. That things would be based off of the movie. The movie's the way best of things that had events, and if he about shit at the time. Right. But there was also this like Disney

spending $150 million on a pirate movie. Every pirate movie has flopped for the last 40 years.

And I remember trend pieces that were like, here's everyone who has tried and failed to make a

Caribbean, this is where I argue the movie got a little fucked by it, is that the fact that pirates the Caribbean overperformed so wildly, then made people go like, oh, the boat curse has gone.

“Right. Yeah. I mean, but a rising tide did not raise all this in this case. Right. I think this”

movie would have been viewed as more successful had pirates the Caribbean, not raised the tight, the stranger type. Definitely because it makes 93 domestic to 11 worldwide. And it gets 10 Oscar nominations. Yeah. I'm sure Fox was fairly happy about it wins best director at the Baptist. Is that right? Is that where why? Yeah. He beat Jack. I'm not steeped in the financial business of Hollywood, but I would imagine that at that Fox office, given the amount of investment

and the difficulty of making the movie. Everyone except Tom Rothen felt like, fuck, we just escaped by the skin of our teeth. I think a little bit. I think the Oscar nomination. We did it. Let's move along. I think the Oscar nomination made it kind of like, well, look, we made a prestigious well received movie. So like, okay. But no, no one is like, yeah, you're right. He wins best director. I was surprised to see that. Yeah. This movie also had like an incredibly well-selling DVD.

No, that's the thing that's really cool. Screw over time. No, no, no. There was that like a made immediate two-disc kind of, this is one of those film school in a box DVD releases with every detail about

“the making of the movie that's sold incredibly well. But I think yes, it was sort of like Tom,”

we let you do this one time. It did not make fuck you money where the argument is over. It would have taken fuck you money to continue making these movies. The other part of it is right. Everyone had a different time making it. And Peter, we in Russell Crowe, notoriously,

we're always kind of budding heads. I think, I mean, there's nothing in the research about that,

but I have heard occasionally that Russell Crowe has a bit of a strong person out. Yes. And of course, right, Hawk, even Hawk did say later in like, like, I think working with Jim Kerry and Russell Crowe like really like, Pro Peter's back a little bit. And Johnny Depp's the other on Shantaram, which doesn't happen. Right. But that he did two years development on Shantaram. Oh, that even Hawk was Jantaram. Yes. So the years, I'll say, no, a couple of people who've worked

on this movie have off the record sent DMs to myself and other people involved at the podcast. And if shared Russell Crowe anecdotes that I'm not going to share here, but just a lot of like, have you heard that story about this fight they got on? It feels like they were just constantly locking horns. And this is a moment where Russell Crowe feels unstoppable. This is apex in terms of that power. Yeah. Because like, this movie, like, beautiful mind doing so well. Yeah. It's like,

wow, can this guy do anything? Did he almost win two best actors in a well-must it? Yeah. And then, like, mastering commander does like good, but, okay, because, and like, the posters is face. Yeah. You know, men's Cinderella man similarly was like, definitely a hit,

but not a mega thing on it. He also never gets an Oscar nominee for the again. And this

year, people were like, he's on the bubble. He might make it to the five on the strength of the movie, didn't happen. Cinderella man, it was like, he maybe gets in there just because everyone

“loves Russell Crowe. I think that all these posters doesn't get it. Never gets close to an Oscar.”

I would say he never got even close again. I mean, his best performance after this is obviously nice guys. Yeah. So incredible. But it's also the turn of point where you look and it's like, Noah's 2014 and 2016, he shows up in the nice guy looking like a grizzly bear. And it's like, this is him now. That's who he is. Noah is 2014, 2014. I know it so much later than I remember. That's his last earlier than I remember. Proper, like, Russell Crowe starring in a big hit movie.

And it's the end of the four of what we're talking about of him being the last of kind of the old school epic movie star. Because like, the year after nice guys is the mummy where it's like,

you are second banana to cruise here. Like, it passed. And then, like, he just enters the

phase he's in now, which begins really when he plays JRL in Manistio. Which is the year before to know it. Yeah. But like, of like, yeah, you play dad's mentors, villains. If you're the lead, it's a trashy movie like on his shirt, the fucking exorcist one. Yeah. The other exorcist one. All the other public sexorcists. Yeah, the Pope. Yeah. I figure he probably hires a good one. He's low. That's too little different. It's kind of like when the Pope needs a really, really nasty

exorcist. Is the other one called the last exorcist? It's just called the exorcist. He did another exorcist movie like within two years of the Pope's exorcist. That's about him playing a guy who plays an exorcist in movies and actor. Correct. And then gets drawn into a real exorcist. So he needs to make a third now. He can't just stop it, too. He's not the same character though. It's no, it's not really different. Relatively forgotten movies. Uh, he's a guy who works all the damn time.

Yep. It's like it's not like probably what's forgotten about Crow and it's not like

It still kind of means something to be like and the Russell Crow in a movie. Right. Shall we set the sales? Yeah. No. Okay. So the year is 1805. I'm going to pull in his master of Europe. Only the British fleets stands before him motions are now battlefields. This is not

“important to the movie really, but like this is set basically at the sort of peak of Napolionic”

power. 1805. Like it is possible that Napolian is going to conquer essentially the world. If you know what I mean? Like, you know, the end of the battle of your family or colonial extension in the world. Right. Like this is Napolian being like, I'm going to conquer the United Kingdom. And he loses at the battle of Troyehawk, Troyehawk, Troyehawk, or that sort of like kind of his water loop, right? Well, his water loop is actually the battle of water loop. That's the joke that

he said later. I've just bought some credit for Scotty Pippening you on that one. Great joke. Thank you. Um, the Napoleon of course continued for 10 years. Like they keep fighting all that, but like this is sort of the moment where it's kind of like, is this it? Yeah. It's Britain.

Finally, I can conquer, so Britain had stood on conquered for 700 years, basically.

We're on about 28 guns, 197 souls. This is true. They are in the northern coast of Brazil. They sure are. It sounds like a lot of guns and souls, Ben. It's actually kind of a small ship. It's a surprise, obviously, is supposed to uh, is pursuing the Previteer Accharone, the French Previteer. The Previteers are kind of shady. They're pirates, basically. They've been contracted by their license pirates, fortunately. I think I might have been the

Previteer if I was alive in these days. I have to admit it. I think John with all respect to your skills and your experience such as they are as a boat's man as a as an able seamen. I do think Ben would do the best of the four of us if dropped into this time. Oh, I agree. Oh, yeah. I mean, I'd be, what do we, what do we, I'd be, I'd be grabbing a cannibal and cannonball and running

to the side immediately. Right. I would know immediately. I'm, I'm thinking a little kid for always

“being nice to me and then jumping off the side of a ship. That's what I'm doing. I'm like immediately.”

I'm like point me in the direction of the fucking cannon. Yeah. I'm ready to go. Right. Right. I would not want to see your job you would want cannon man. Yeah. Cannonman, would you like, you want to light it or do you want to shove the things down? I want to light that fucker. Yeah. Right. Yeah. I think if a warm hole opens and Ben gets dropped onto a ship in this era, he is within six months, the King of a country. Probably so. Probably so. Oh, you think

he would rally the man? I think he could rally any. I think he would know how to talk to these people in a way that we would fail. We're on the boat. Just throw a dirty joke. I just want to say something like we see Killick getting an egg out of like these little pens that clearly have the chickens in them. Well, this is what Peter weird does. It's what I'm talking about. We see two boys. Let some fucking tables in his movies. You know, it's the middle of the night. So the midshipmen

are in charge of like your Aubrey's taking, you know, taking some rest. You know, so we've got Harlem and Killick and the, you know, the kids. Can we talk about the creeks and grounds? The sound of the film is unbelievable. Mr. Hodgman, this film gets 10 Academy Award nominations. Yeah. Unfortunately, this is the same year as Lord of the Rings, we're turning the King. Yeah.

Which was just everyone basically decided. That's right. We have to reward the trilogy. We're

giving this. They spilled their evil seamen over that. It's a clean sweep. Right. Steven Spielberg's. Yeah. It dominates basically all categories. I had luck for the surprise. There's a Jonah. Well, this wins cinematography and sound mixing because those are two of the only categories Lord of the Rings isn't nominated. Yeah. Oh, really. Yes. I still don't know why it wasn't nominated for sound editing because there's a rings has very good sound editing. I don't really know the answer to

that question. Yeah. But this did win that. The sounding this is unbelievable. Yeah. It jumped out to

“me really fucking hard watching at this time vital. Well, one of the reasons I think it is so”

impressive and in the sense that it leaves an impression is that these boats have no engines and so it is the balance of silence and sound and the alien feeling of hearing those sounds because it is not something that most people have experienced being on a ship of that size. It is also those little sounds. It is also very important because the reason hallam is being summoned to, you know, front of the ship at the start of the movie is the watchman is like, I think I

heard a bell. Right. He thinks he heard a ship's bell. He didn't even see a ship. Right. He just heard

what's the lead? So then the lead is literally a big hunk of lead at the end of a very long line

and there's a depression in the bottom of it. So imagine like, um, it looks like this kind of pulver coffee and there's a little depression in the bottom of it. And when you want to know what the surface below you is like, you drop the lead. It hits the bottom of the ocean floor wherever you are. It tells you how deep it is and when you pull it up, the condition of the floor is like it picks up dirt. Right. You like dirt, right? Sure. This ocean dirt. Wow. And it might be gravel. It might be mud

“and shells. This is when you're anchoring. You need to know what the condition of the floor is.”

So that you know, first of all, how deep it is. So you know, how much anchor road to pay out?

The answer is five fathoms. Just five fathoms in this case. And a fathom, I think, is six feet.

I couldn't tell you. I mean, I love that they show you them calculating knots later on, like, with knots. So fucked up way they had to do that where it's like, there's three, there's the, the, the, the rope with the knots tied in and then the guide doing this and the guide work in this movie is crazy. It's best. It's incredible. It is perhaps the most impressive rope work guys ever done. What's the left and what's the right important Starbird? Excuse me. At this time, it would have been

Starbird and lard bird. Oh, is that so? Yeah. That's kind. That's kind. They changed it to port because they're like, we don't know what we can't hear. And help me out here. For Castle, but how did this if Foxle? Foxle, Foxle. Like the way, like what, what, why, why they, why they do it? Why they do it? I do not know. But yes, the, the front of the boat is called the Forecastle, but you spell it, F-O, apostrophe C, apostrophe S, apostrophe Ellie, right, which is sort of pronounced foxle or, or sometimes they spell it Forecastle,

but you still pronounce it foxle and the top and the top top mast is called the top gallant, but they call it the to gallant. Now, is the front tail is called a stencil? Is the proof tech, what I think it is? No, it's one of my favorite Simpson's lines. When when Homer joins, he's like in a

“submarine, remember that episode? It's kind of like, when the Simpson's is starting to get stupid. Right.”

Oh, you can do anything. Right. Exactly. And what he says is the proof tech, what I think it is, I'm like the admiral guy is like, I like the cut of your gym. It almost looks like that's a jiff. May I say a thing about the sound? Of course. When when Ben Marie and I went to Los Angeles last summer for the American cinema tech friend at the fast, we went to the Academy Museum, that has a room to try to explain to you the art of sound in movies, where they show you like a 15-minute feature at

with Peter Weir shot like two or three years ago. It's using behind the scenes footage from the time of filming, but it's him speaking more recently and all of his team explaining the art of sound designed in a movie using this film. It is a thing that I think is exclusive to the Academy Museum was made for them and they have all these signs saying like, you can only see this gear. But the thing he said that has stuck with me was he had his team, you know, they went to the

“books, they looked through all the books and anytime a sound was described and said like that's what”

we got to replicate. Right. Let's really get into the specifics of what he is trying to evoke of these noises. They sort of put together a test sample kind of here's sort of what we're thinking is the soundscape for this movie and they show it to him and he's like that's fucking great. I love that keep going awesome and then they work on it and they refine it and they bring it back to him and they show it to him and he's like I think the last version was better and he said the realization

he made was that they had with the extra time and giving it you know doing the real version had worked really hard to justify every single specific sound. They looked at every element on screen and they were like we have to account for that and that and this and the timing and this and that versus the rough past version they did was just sort of like these are the kind of sounds we want to have like circulating around and he was like when it became too justified and you were trying to account for

everything it was a confidence and it didn't work. Right there was something kind of expressionistic

to the feeling of what they showed me the first time and I was like literally just go back to that

version. The lead this new file, go back to that and do the rest of the movie that way. So it's kind of freestyle a little bit as much as it's like based in a lot of research and with intentionality he was like don't worry about completely matching on screen action. Yeah and you know like again this is a completely world that's pretty alien to our experience in this year and in a sense you have to be in freshness because a lot of the sounds that they might have been loading up the

the soundtrack with would be sounds that the sailors had stopped hearing long ago because it's

one of the things. He comes out, Holland can't defend himself. He's in the early example of him

“not having a bit of a backbone where he's like well it's all shaped maybe over there and Aubrey's”

like okay well you did you beat to quarters but did the right thing everyone's winding down and then like Aubrey does the one last look you know right you know like he's almost done and he's like and then you just see the sail for like one second because it's being lit up by the cannon

and it's like you don't fear the cannon. No it's such an incredible that's in the books a lot. He

really talks about like the in the books like the sound the way the sound would hit after like cannon fire. Hence to travel faster than sound. See the muzzle flash in the fog and it's just so it's such an incredible way to open a movie where you're learning so much in such a in such a let's see them all good action now. Yeah and you know you're learning so much about how this world works in a completely non-interest of a non-screen playy way. Not only learning about who

“Harlem is immediately the the efficiency in the economy which we are introduces and guides the”

eye in a way that is not to give you an example of some things it is really sweet. You see guys

start to man the cannons right you get that you see the guys in red coats now Ben you have you

noticed that there are some guys and and Griffin everyone you know in red coats on the ship that's the army they live on the ship too okay but they're not in the navy they're kind of their own thing wrong the sins they're right Marines yeah you know what I mean like they're for for fucking invading shit you know for the battle so most of the crew on a ship like this would be gunners your pals because it takes three or four guys to operate a single cannon and there are

28 of them so they're all sleeping in those hammocks above their cabinets because the ship is just packed with these guys and then they're the sailors and they're not like deal with the sales yeah they're in the navy but they're they're not trained hand-to-hand combatants necessarily the Marine of the Royal Marines are the guys who have to you know bayonets and you're they're the yeah and then and they're the ones who literally beat to quarters when you call

beat to quarters one of the Royal Marines bangs a drum he beats the drum and quarters describes the rhythm that he beats which alerts the whole ship that they're going to battle stations Aubrey you know he's like run up her colors one of the kids like yes sir yes sir you know they're putting up a and then kill like I love this gives it his hat yeah where it's like okay we're going from like we heard a sound mode to hat mode yeah you got to put hat on now it's fucked up

my relationship yeah ship happens and then the guy goes like this and what's on his hands so the oh the dad's fast what is that what's that guy that he's the guy that gets the dent in his head and then gets a coin and becomes the the dreaded prophet of the ship correct what's his name I forget his name he's obviously my husband and best friend but I don't know his name but why don't you get that tattooed on your fingers Dave that's a really good question hold

“that's your first tattoo if you were ever going to get to tattoo I feel like I think it might”

be a little bit stolen baller giving that I am not a naval person this hey I don't think I really have enough of a sort of sea you know history you can get a little saltier you can just say I like hold things quickly you know I'm going to scam you up to main one of these days about the point is the the ocean is a metaphor I'm trying to well this is England of course and I also heard that oceans are now battlefields I think the ship is England is technically a metonym

right right I'm out so they get their ship rocked and it's like very their ship and their ship rocked and it's very intense battle sequence people get bloody people die obviously you know boy loses a limb all this right all this insane stuff happens uh we're introduced to matern

where he basically like clears all this shit off the table because it's like I'm going to be

operating a people put sand on the floor you're not slipping around on the blood so fuck and also the water and yet there's also this kind of like everyone's kind of calm like you know it like it's you know what I mean like until yeah I was not calm I mean this is just their this is their daily life they've trained for this moment this is bad it's not their daily life but it's about they're trained for this or maybe they're monthly or maybe they're yearly life

and one of the things that I love about this movie is that unlike any other ship movie that I've ever seen whether that is a sailing ship or a motor ship or a spaceship or friendship when you're in space or at sea in that ship the world is small you're constantly running into other ships

vastness of the ocean and frankly the absurdity of their mission and that a lot of times it's just gonna be another day on a creek in ship it like their mission is to find that actually what do they call it an English like acaron yeah and then it's ashiron friendship whatever but it's like this this brought french private here has been harassing ships go get them yeah basically off and down the coast like that right yeah you know how big the Atlantic ocean is

out of like 20 to 30 feet it's like yeah maybe maybe 50 the idea that you're gonna find this thing is in itself insane and if it turns out that the ashiron hadn't been looking for them too apparently or at least spotting them and wanting to get them the idea is that as they sort of allude to it's like the ashiron knew where they were gonna be essentially right they go to their kind of guessing and these like they came upon us in the fog right right it's incredible and the idea that they're

even gonna find each other never to even bother to having this battle is like it could take

weeks or months before it ever happened and those slow speed chases it's like it conveys

“not only the size and the isolation of this wooden world they live on but also I think”

all of this humanity this is what I was thinking of as those cannonballs were coming through right all of this human ingenuity that goes into building the ship and manning the ship and sailing the ship and every it's all packed into this microscopic dot on the ocean the way they portray the maintenance of it too yeah no it's so interesting and not a thing I've really have ever thought of it and you look at this ship and it's like every every inch of it is this amazing piece of human

craft work the molding in the captain's day cabin it's like it's all getting blasted to ship by these cannons really really all this work is going to making you know yes it's only in fact human ingenuity and murders intent British maybe watch it away could you please stop

and people would you know they never fired cannons of anybody I was to get this during

Galipoli too the nine dead twenty seven just to tell you is the is the camp what happens in Galipoli no just that that like with the the senior officers who you see like the top of the hill watching the young boys do the basic training you're like the ornateness of their uniforms this sort of like loss notion of the military has to look really fucking fancy sure like there's there's the battle we're waging but also it's like we want to impress people with our class yes you got to have nice

you know we want to beat their asses while also seeming more sophisticated and cultured place the the whole past guys name is place uh because it's when they're looking at the casualties after you know you know we're in casualty mode now they dragged the boat essentially away with robots what what what is casualty mode man I just mean like it's just like after the fact like they're they're they're counting you know you see the guy who's like pumping water out

they're counting the casualties yeah nine people are dead mature and locksawbre around and he's like you know places got a fucking skull fracture or whatever you probably will die turns out he doesn't they go see Blake me uh Max Perkis who's who's who's hand is arm is messed up and matern says like I know you know this boy's father right like I'm doing everything I can like I don't does this character show up in the books later is it so a character from the books like me

in your memory I do not want to mess up anything here I know I'm sure there are and there isn't there is of course a mature and I have Aubrey and matern wiki that I can consult for this so let me check William Blake me yes he is in uh the movie that's it he's

“creative for the movie he's creative I mean I think there's a lot of characters like this”

well good job I don't know the full extent I think the O'Brien fans generally think positively of this movie because imagine how bad an innovation could have been yeah but I'm sure if you are ner you know intensely nerdy about the books the movie is it only can do so much for you

matern is never doesn't he spy stuff in it blah blah blah you know they never go to sure you never

understand the complex nature of being in the Navy and how your your money the money you made was based on like the boats you captured in the treasure you got based by they keep talking about the prize yeah the prize that we're gonna get if we click it's not about like making a salary it's all that you earn your keep by like fucking up other shifts and stuff like it's such a crazy system you're canning on commission then um but yeah but you know why they drink rum

because they get fucked up oh that's true it's fucking boring because like you could keep

“through in it and stuff so like it would be you know it's sort of nutritionally good but I think also”

like it would last right like isn't that isn't that the whole thing with rum not a rum guy I will say I'm really getting a rum yeah yeah yeah yeah I'm the time to time but I'm not seem like content yeah I'm kind of the same who is the ships mixologist on the surprise I mean it was the guy

if you imagine if you were like what's your drink and you were like rum like I would just be like what do you mean rub right like yeah what do you get right rum on the rock that's a good one the coke

“sure so that's like that's like sugar it's what that's what I was gonna say it's the same”

with Tiki drink and like he's drinking rum is combating rum with so much sugar and fruit right I mean

like if I'm a poolside I guess I'll take a rum drink but do people I'm sure the answer is someone

yes yeah like how many people sit at a bar and go like can I have four fingers of rum neat I mean there's a huge difference you would have to be straight rum and there's like spice rum and all that stuff that's like that stuff so that's what we should of course prepare so we're to sunken harbour after this and just a little bit they certainly they got the car it's easy to go go home mode over there the sunken harbour club so then everyone gathers and it's

basically like look we rock we love you know we love to be on the edge of my surprise but like the ship that just beat us is a better ship it's bigger it's faster it's more powerful like we cannot try to like engage this ship it's very important I think to this movie because

it like lays out Aubrey and matern's relationship immediately where matern's the only one who's

kind of like I mean pardon me but like are we not on something of an aged ship and what is Russell Crowe get mad at that it is the best it should be a crow's Oscar clip for the Oscar he should have won for this film because obviously this film should have won every single Oscar including best actress yeah they should have given it to the Brazilian umbrella lady well in a pack when whose role isn't packed for even though she doesn't speak or the boats right

or the but the hms surprise who in you know he says would you call me an age man of war doctor and matern's like oh he's like surprise is not old no we'll call her old she has a bluff bow lovely lines she's a fine sea boat I want to say all this weatherly stiff and fast very fast if she's well handled then he touches it touches the boat says no she's not old she's in her prime it's the best line ever delivered by an actor is this your version of the

he loves to pull the cork model absolutely yeah just like the love crit that he like touches like a sort of mantle and then he kind of picks it one of the wounds well that's the thing there's like the fire pass is you shattered the car rental piece has been just had a fucking cannonball shoved through it but it's just like where everyone's kind of like I think we need to refit I think we need to go to a port and chill out and Aubrey's like yeah I mean matern's

like yeah isn't this boat old and Aubrey's like this boat is not old at neither am I like on we can do whatever we need and he's worked on this boat for many years the you see that he caught carved his name into it when he was a midshipman or whatever and he says when he was probably the 14 or 14 right yeah the idea would have been like he's been on other boats he's like served other commands and all that stuff and he's but he's come back to it because yes he loves

“this boat in the books I believe that's how it goes so the HMS surprised this is main boat it's”

not the only boat that he's on uh then really he's got a couple side boats yeah that's right well you know and sometimes you'll like capture a foreign boat and then he has to run that boat for a bit really yeah I mean that happens in this movie where like they capture the acaron and then James Darcy gets put in charge of it because then you would just be like now we're going to call it the fucking HMS British sausage yeah you could just change it yeah it just feels like it's our boat

now bitch all of the bangers exactly the HMS pie and mash should people be allowed to do that with chipilata or should people be allowed to do that with cars now HMS bavril okay with cars what do

you mean you beat someone in a fight you get your car then you're just like he's the first

surprise yeah and you get to call it you get to rename it whatever you want people just be fight each other all the time yeah better than what we have right now is it maybe uh I guess I'm just describing a uh madmax wasteland so it would be real my versus right situation break out pretty so out of me to suggest this the main one without a driver's license why am I trying to wheel this into existence I don't know you want all of America's bullies to get car yeah

then you have uh like these arm getting it tough stuff yeah I get the bravest patient I've ever had I love that and I just love that it is routine yeah it sucks but it's like Nelson you know it's part of the thing where they keep talking about Nelson Nelson didn't have one of his arms

“and I think one of his legs like Nelson he got to do that he beat Napoleon I think with one arm”

in one leg and a peg leg and then the other arm was just this you know the the snake hook maybe he had a hook for you know eating I'd get a hook I would have like a fork not only did Nelson defeat Napoleon with one arm but he kept the arm that had been amputated and tied it to his back is that true so he defeated him with one arm tied behind his back okay there we go I'm just

it up with a grain as the punchline came in but I was really buying the performance at first I kept

thinking about just because of my broken brain uh Hodgman do you remember these Steve Martin medieval barber SNL sketch oh very very vaguely yeah the door of York maybe is what's called you to funny haircut yes he had a funny haircut and the bit is that no one fucking understood medicine in the medieval England right and so he's the barber but he's also the doctor and people come over and he's like time to amputate you know there are some leeches on it's the same four things

someone's like I got a headache and I got the sniffles let's say time to amputate and I was thinking about this during this movie but especially in this amputation scene where I think they do such a good job of characterizing and a lot of its embattiness performance as well that this guy is a very good doctor this is the best guy you could possibly have I mean tending to you even at a time where so much as unknown and this neurology is limited because Griffin the following scene is the the

brain surgery yes and that's when all of the you guys are gathered and they say like he wouldn't look at you front or ten kidneys on land like this is right we got a real guy here he's not some

“surgeon but isn't he of an event well and if you should know he's a natureist okay so he's a surgeon”

but also he's very into Charles Darwin and stuff you know type stuff of like cataloging animal yeah species that's separate hop i don't know who he is in the books he's also like probably got he speaks like every language yeah the the impression that I got from his character in the movie is that he's a naturalist and he is using this opportunity to travel the world yeah and his relationship into cattle and that it's how the sort of earns his keep on the ship

that's the the core tension between him and Aubrey and it comes up in the movie over his Aubrey's like I'm here to the fucking king yeah but it's like I'm you know it is majesty's navy my turn it's like yeah yeah when can I please look at more beetles and I just like our

orders you're to kill the French he's like that's always be Frenchman to kill but this beetle is

only here yeah but maternity does also make the case that it's like well yeah but maybe you shouldn't do this anyway not just because I want to go see stick bugs and no I mean there's a crucial moment because we're gonna get where he says like are you being too prideful and that's the classic you know any fucking Star Trek has that too of like there's the one guy who can say like captain right we all follow your ring we'll do whatever you ask

but like are you being you know you taking this to personal here but there's a relationship between maternity and Aubrey that is different from Kirk and Bones it's different for anyone else on this ship they had a marriage they have a marriage and that's when they're playing the cello and violin together that's there you know that's there whatever love making you know what's really interesting about you making that comparison point uh Nicholas all of it yes Nicholas all of

the San Francisco Chronicle at that time gave this film one of its most negative reviews because it was pretty widely claimed his whole angle was on his protectiveness of the book's shirt record and specifically like by removing the matern spy thing or not making it deeply

“specializing him I think is I read that review too well and beyond the same the same”

conclusion I think that you're getting this was his exact wording their interaction takes on a preening quality reminiscent of the interaction of the Star Trek characters four or five movies down the line yeah did I take that to me a little bit sort of like two cutesy like when Scotty is speaking into the Macintosh mouse and he goes computer like that well that is one defy thing I agree but I just kind of feel like yeah how does he say nuclear again what is it

oh Jesus he says it funny yeah uh and he doesn't matter don't worry about it that is Voyage home is a movie I showed it to a friend race nuclear nuclear nuclear it's a lot of dubious sorry Voyage home no I want to look it up yeah I'll look it up with yours no it's right nuclear vessels it's a vessel I knew there was a dubious uh that's just one of those you you show to a friend who's like seen Star Trek but maybe not and you're like yeah I mean like and what's this

one about oh there is well actually no not really they're on a cling on ship what do they

“travel through time oh okay to fight cling on's fight oh you have to say the way”

needle lady and save somewhere but mainly we're going to get these characters back to vibe with each other and that's about the end of the movie like you know I mean we did these on Patreon and Deepa Stark is pandemic but it is fasting to look at the box office spike on four because it was the one movie where they could just market it and be like you don't need to have seen any fucking Star Trek don't you get it you know the culturals as most of these character and you get a

fish out of water thing and if they show up in San Francisco in the 80 comedies in a comedy well I literally fish out of water because they allow that whale up this is true okay so you see like

there's all this stuff that you have to watch the movie a million times to really care about but like

you see Killic also cooking he's making these like kind of grilled cheesy things look really nice

“they look really good it's got that chafing dish right uh and he goes like they go scrape scrap”

scrape you know but like that to me is like like basically him acknowledging like all right they've made

up like there and then the boat is the boat is the sales are fixed the boat starts moving again the statue has repaired the statue has repaired uh Blake knee he gives he he's survived the reputation he gives in the book with the Nelson stuff and he's like I fought in one of these you know order has been restored right and you see Aubrey writing a letter to his bride fiancé Josephine you know like somebody you see a little right they've got lady

core ongoing love interest in the boat right you know you see a little picture yeah uh it's not really marked one after that that's when the boys come in and say we saw the Ashron being built we've knocked together a little model for you and what a knocked together model that is pretty good

they get next for Ashron even though it was intended for saluting day it's fine we'll drink the wine

“for saluting all right we'll drink wine do you guys have saluting day plans this year or do you”

try to just kind of play it because I don't want to have to drink wine if Trump was like bringing back saluting day not enough saluting in America these days David the chances and we're not recording this episode very far in advance the chances that will happen before this episode is released 50 50 just so mainstream why are you saluting all the time are gonna make go she's battle this is when the film's incredibly compelling Oscar winning actress lady with umbrella

that makes her appearance is really has woman we all ask who is woman that really awesome it is a cool sequence though where it's like right they're kind of in paradise like there is South America people are like paddling up and trading like mangoes they're like the coast of Brazil like I would be one hundred percent but you would do this you would buy a monkey yeah right like some trader comes up he's like I would have been like how much for the monkey definitely

I'll give you you know what do you want like a bag of rice like what do you know what have we got around here what I don't know what they he has a little vest right because monkeys have a little vest give him a little vest that might have been pre-vests that's the story of the you know the bounty right the HMS bounty is like they reach they reach to the South Pacific Island they're like what the fuck are we doing on this boat like we're so and you know we're so far away from everything we know

of civilization why should we continue to follow these horrible rules and be flagged and that's the other reason that there were royal marines on the boat too which was to prevent unites Ben sent us there were six saluting days a year at least at this time it seems for the Queen's birthday to to mark the restoration so the King Charles II so the you know the resumption of the British monarchy the King's birthday to mark the King's coronation Jesus to mark the King's a session Jesus

and then just for November the fifth remember remember the fifth November gunpowder plot yeah after this after the trading you have in my opinion the greatest sequence in any film I've ever shot except for it's tied with all the other sequences in this film right number one

to wives and sweet hearts may they never meet it's the dinner they're having dinner

just just just what movie does this lesser of the dinner scene every just oh it's my dinner with Andre yeah through houseman to actually has because he's a chef there's a good one that's a pretty gross dinner is a cockroach in it this streffy rewatch mouse on recently and not recently but I

“remember that scene is burned on my brain because it's a kid I was so grossed out by it wow it's good I”

mean it's a great scene yeah yeah that's my green card too with BB viewers we definitely have seen green card that's a really good thing yeah yeah it's what I'm saying oh right you're saying just create something very beautiful about this dinner scene just just be what about this movie they have big battle sequence then they play the chill in the violin and then I feel like Hollywood would be like all right can there be a swordfight or something is like no shush they're

gonna tell jokes it dinner Aubrey's gonna make a check-off joke exactly well I mean I think it also speaks to the fact that in their their the pace of their lives was very different than we could ever possibly imagine now which was there's a lot of time sitting around they can't even been for watch they can't they can't Netflix and chill at all they don't have a single streaming service no wait wait they don't well no no no pick up no they don't want to pick up don't even have

peacock without they couldn't even dream of getting the super sized fan edition episodes of the office and they watch the town on the moon no John no it's a land they could right I hate to tell you this they couldn't and this is this it's gonna scare you even more what's that they didn't have the option to read or listen to vacation land in e-me format not even a paper not even horrible no David they know far back they didn't have fucking medallion status what about the audio book

no that's why I said more listen to but what if they opened a time tunnel and John read them the

for a time tunnel uh this is when the youngest you know because like basically it's like hold

was packed with copies of vacation land in paper briefs said to Blake me I served with Nelson right so then the second youngest boy you know I forget his name is like can you please tell me about that and uh I just think crow rocks this so hard the way he like you know says like the first time

“he spoke to me I'll never forget his words you need to say you know he like builds it up and he says”

he leans across the table and he says can I trouble you for the butter or whatever the site the salt yeah Aubrey mad trouble you for the salt so funny they all love it I love it I'm sitting here laughing I'm gonna say something the date I'm on she's probably like you know put a blanket on she's just got a sleeping cap she's asleep I'm fucking Nelson in the Simpsons watching Hank Williams right I do genuinely love how long of a walk it is to lesser of two weafles it's such a long one because

then he tells the serious Nelson story about like how Nelson said like the zeal of you know service kept him warm on a cold night and you see maturing going like give me a fucking break and he's like I know I know it sounds absurd you know from another man you would call it pitiful stuff but like with him I believed it you know what to Nelson to Nelson to Nelson to Nelson the greatest hot I feel like you're about to say well I was just gonna say the lesser of two weavals joke

deserves it's own conversation and then he's like that's a long walk then he's like weavals in the stop in the style of two charges and maturing like they're the same they're a fucking weevil

“as he's a frigid door that gives the glad name for the music you have to choose”

curly Q for curly Q for curly Q yes and then and then maturing puts on his legendary conty little glasses perhaps the conty is little glasses ever wanted in a movie ever if you're originated he might have they're so small they're like comically times yeah they're so good and he's like all the time I get small I take the big one and it's just I mean the way if you watch crow you this scene should be just studied second by second yeah is laughing like because he's like

I've got he turns to someone he's I mean he's like there I have you you're completely dished I could say that to you all the time please lead dish and I know in the service you must

one must always choose that's for something from our community of listeners of course

can someone please make a super cut of this lesser of two weavals scene with the crowd response from Bernie Max definitely I mean everyone also got to break cut it into uh uh when when Anthony Mackie shows up in uh in game yes you know when everyone starts when he says Avengers is assembled but I want the raucous laughter when he sets the glasses on they start ordering but it doesn't explode until you know we must always choose the lesser of two weavals what is the

preparation on these weavals they just they're in the best sure yeah they're not being so bug is that what you mean yeah yes the biscuits I guess I or what I'm kind of fixated the hard tack yes tell me about this it's basically flour and water and salt and it's dehydrated

and it lasts forever it looks aggressive up for the pie yeah I would say hard tack I've never had

hard tack I feel like sometimes if you go to those like naval museums or whatever they'll be like you can try hard tack have you ever had hard tack I've never had hard tack it kind of makes lots of look you know like very moist you know what I mean I hear it's a little more palatable when topped with some weavals oh sure and then soaked in some rum yeah I share your admiration for the scene David and I would say if I were to be watching Rustcros performance

I would say to myself I'm glad Richard Burton's dead 100% yes I mean I mean I've seen many Britain he's good he doesn't quite have the humor like he doesn't have the humor bro is such a sweetie in this movie but not in a way that feels like too cute see or anything do you what else I would say if I were watching a scene be shot I'd say Jesus cock that's a hot hard tack hey thanks for the call back welcome I mean he's the humor is exactly right in the warmth

and the and the childishness right he's a 40-year-old man there's old a bunch of boys but he's still a child yeah he's a true bleeder all I do is fucking hang out these boys they got an entertaining show because all they do is fucking hang out they don't fuck and hang out no they're

“I mean there's I think they did a lot of that I mean famously now so Nelson died at the”

battle of Jeff out you shot by a sniper he was oh I thought he was fucking well famously maybe you don't know this his last words were kismit Alfred kismit of course being the word for you know love more fate I would say right fainted love um but most people think that he actually sorry

most people think he said kiss me Hardy oh and that was why Alfred was so mad because he wanted to

“kiss him no that that like that the words got changed to kismit because at the time no one wanted”

to know it's that of course all you know I was thinking very like these these relationships whether we're or someone put in the picture that moment when when Aubrey is writing to his female acquaintance when they show the picture just to sort of in a backward way tell the audience don't worry this guy's not gay their relationship with his relationship with the turn is not a real marriage it's a sea marriage but sea marriages were real and they were often quite intimate

and again it speaks to the isolation of the wooden world that they were in because they were beyond

this is why there was so many superstitions because it was so dangerous to be on board but also

you were moving I just read uh little novel called moby dick and that good that novel really conveys how the crew of the piquad which is a much smaller crew because they don't have gunners on it it's a wailing boat and they'll be out for years and they are so far beyond the reach of civilization they're outside of the eyes of God and they become a society that is completely different and so all kinds of taboos on land were were broken at necessity or pleasure whether it was just

em or male into the sea imagine yeah you're sleeping in the hammock yeah with for the other guys cool having a jacket the socks do you think they just had like a jacket corner jack and boof yeah

I would hate to be the bottom bunk yeah they called it the head or hate to be like the the 24th

guy in the jack and boof that oh sure it's like waiting your turn to get in the jack and boof the boof is like filled to the brim uh come on aim out to the sea Jesus fill it have a little windowers of that I don't

“know go mid style you know run into the shower yeah and I think that the real and I think the clear”

marriage that is very coded you know sort of hyper traditionally heteronormatively you know husband and wife between the two of them you know Aubrey's the warrior and matured's the caring nurture of the sun and blah blah blah I think it could have made a if not the chronicle reviewer but other reviewers a little confused and uneasy and I'm not saying that that's a reaction that I had or sure but I came in to focus a little bit more like why those some of the people who love

the books feel like you gotta have that guy do a spycraft because otherwise you just have to be like a nagging wife and I need to know that he docks and when he docks he docks right exactly but I think it's such a beautifully portrayed relationship I agree of of friendship and something deeper than friendship I mean you just invoked a great novel that you've been reading and how it um do you missiah well I I'm gonna be Dick is the one specifically I was talking about um and and how it

kind of illustrates the way these ships become their own contained worlds where the rules of the social interaction are rewritten it reminds me of another serious sober work of sea fairing that I look too often up at treasure island in which they are on the ship for so long they catch cabin fever yeah and it forces them to do like a single song flamingo number right they all suddenly get like um that is all my song theaters yeah I don't think I've seen since great what I do remember

ever cabin if you are a number I'm sorry I can't play with you this road to two weevils that are taking me are you gonna be left out of shipping ship releases up cabin boy another example highly realistic yeah capture it we have studied it a lot in addition to the like 12 13 year old officer cadets that were the midship and they also had literal chill which job boys well that's the

“joke of cabin boy how much like get a life is like what if an adult man was doing this thing right”

uh I didn't see them in this I don't think no it seems what were you about to ask can't remember the acarons surprise is them they don't it's fine uh and uh you know so they they get sent it it's sort of you know and but in a way they can surprise he doesn't like that but then they they pull them over the irony no it doesn't no the astronauts like the river of whoa or whatever it's like from antiquity I don't know you know but then like then they kind of maneuver around they do the

thing where they they put the little fake boat out they create the illusion with yeah with the manager version using the the lantern right you know you know they're separate in the right distance right yep and even though they're both moving probably at about 10 miles per hour would be the top speed that they could get uh 10 knots 11 miles per hour they get up there they're inexorably gonna catch up the astronaut has longer guns it can shoot farther right and so they're

further back than it is good shit that's good shit from the tip deck and then they have them then they

“have them then they have the drop on the astronaut and they're gonna get them but they get then the”

storm happens which like I guess this is the other major action sequence of the movie and it is awesome and super intense just has no gun work it's all waves and also to your earlier point this movie doesn't have a villain nothing like an abstracted way a sense of like I got to get revenge on this guy which I love because that's life it's like they wouldn't really know who were on these ships I mean I do like that Aubrey has that moment where he's like did I kill this guy's kid or something

like why does he hate me sure but like but he's obviously just imagining he's like I don't know to me you're sorry about people were complaining or nervous about the fact that there wasn't an antagonist and what makes this movie special is that the antagonist is a complete mystery yeah and it's like it's it's accurate to like the idea there's a bit of a big twist at the end there's a nice what's I was hit's a little twist it's a saucy little twist it's a saucy it's a cheeky little

little twist it's a it's a sourced but geez of a twist there's this moment which it is how sourced hoax faceer there's a moment where a matern says like he fights like you jack a kind of like you're not so different moment right but obviously like when they're they're pursuing him the storm gets them they have to give up because they have like the fucking mask gets strut you know like they have to cut the mask off because it's like turning into an anchor

really there's the whole sequence there right you know well yeah because uh all right they well that's where we're at I know okay the guy dies he can't swim back yeah what's his name again rollie or something he's that beautiful guy he's one of the two guys who pop in and get the extra rations of rum for showing the the model of the asheron and uh he is he is in charge of the of the top misnmasts yes you see the other it's warly I think is this name or see the other guy

crying and like putting away this stuff on that but so then the top misnmasts so there are three masks on this boat to three mastered sailing ship square rigged not for an aft been it only

really gets speed when it's directly the wind is directly behind you and their first mass is the

formass the the middle mass is the main mass the aft most mass is the misnmast he's on the top misnmast he's standing on what's called the fighting top or maybe he's talking on the the cross rails but he's on a platform way up there and he's trying to bring in the sail because that sail is how you move the ship but in bad winds that becomes dangerous and he can't get it up so to speak

“and that's why Harlem has to climb up and help him and fails to do so and does he is he kind of”

he's cowardly does he sabotage in really actually lead to that the sailor's death he thinks he's responsible I guess so I mean he didn't sap like he should have been up there right scared to get up there and you know what it's scary it's fucking scary I would go up there I have not I did not this time quickly I wash out of the British Navy like right welcome you're the fourth son of some lord I'm like oh and they're like go up that thing and I'm like I'm not growing

up there when he talking yeah do you have like a chair I can see I mean conceitably if he had gotten up there he would have he would have been able to help what's his name again Worley yeah sure help Worley furl get you know get rid of that sail and so the wind couldn't take it and pull the master part right what a sense of math the master so after that is when matern sits down with Aubrey and it's like are you are you being too intense and I felt then one more thing about

the mask yes I still really get you to think by the way deliver all this to Ben I think it's really smart thank you it's like you're trying to sell Ben on going on a boat what's the only one of the two of the three of you that I could probably you know question press gang into coming to Maine because you've got these children and you've got this life you've got a life you've got a life I do you but but I'm up my way often yeah yeah with my wife's family there we go yeah

I would love to come visit you the boat the boats may be the bigger ass you climb up to climb up you climb up you know that thing looks like a ladder that's you know so the the mask is held up and held in place by stays so two long lines that go from the top to the front and back to the

“stern and the bow and then shrouds which are lines that come down to the sides that's how it stays”

up in tension and the and the shrouds on the sides are they've ladders built into them called rat lines because you climb up like a little rat and then you get to the fighting top which is a platform about two thirds up the way of the mask where the sharpshooters would stand and shoot but to get on to that platform you have to climb around it and sometimes the boat is tipped over

and you're basically upside down is really dangerous there's a trap door to go through

more safely which is called the lovers hole and if you climb up to that yeah I'm telling you I love boats I like being on the water I'm not a pose it's just I'm more of a sort of like

I do not like being on boats and I do like portals there's a reason to make drinks for people

“yeah that's why that's why kill a kill it yeah that's why he's one of your favorite characters right”

look at that guy a varies he's like a joke he's in south house thugs face so then like matern calls Aubrey out Aubrey admits like I have at this point exceeded my orders my orders we're trying to catch the thing off because to preserve we've you know we've been chasing it longer than I need to and then he's like all right you know what kill it make it delicious map of the Galapagos Islands out of jelly or whatever the fuck what is it who knows

yeah I mean it's some kind of old jelly yeah it's like a jelly and essentially it's like we're gonna we can go to the Galapagos Islands we have a wailing fleet there I think the French will be heading there anyway we can try to regroup and good news see you mister matern maybe you can look at some animals that's all the Galapagos Islands why he's in the business there's a lead wins in shit this is alluded to in the movie but I'll ask Ben do you know why

wailing ships and uh and ships of the line and warships love to go to the Galapagos something to do with the stream well you could get fresh water there for sure you could re-provision there or I guess I'm saying the like oh the stream of the ocean no they wanted to go there there's a specific reason which is um tortoises tortoises were good food on these ships so sure yeah because you could you could keep you could take a bunch of tortoises off an island

I guess they don't spoil they don't spoil and they don't drink water and they don't eat okay and so unlike that goat and cow you have on board got her milk you saw that in the table setting the beginning you could take a stack of tortoises and put them down there and just kill them as you as you went and they're kind of less than the taste they're like funny more that they're just less annoying too I personally didn't eat up your resources yeah I personally think that 100

year old tortoises taste great but that's just kind of my taste and I think I should be allowed to

“eat as many as I want too that's why you're constantly fasting yeah but no no it's true you're right”

I mean that's why that's why the wailing fleet would go by there they were not ecologically conscious and then the privateers would we're going after the wailing fleet because they were packed up with very very valuable sperm which is the moment I already alluded to it they're about like maturine is dolled up he's got his house go he's got his straw hat he's got his little like for my nests like that for Halloween I know I probably should although I think I might just be you

know escorted to an insane we really David does dress like that for sleep those are his first

types of pajamas he's the first he's the first he's the first he's the next man maybe and they pick up some guys right who are like you know who have information right like they be they're wailers they're wailers in a wailing ship that was captured by the usher on they albatross and jack's like we got a fucking go let's go get it and they have this fight which I really like because like maturine's sort of right of like you're you know you're you're you're too crazy you know

you're you're you're your tubes has to be accurate and we don't need to do this but maturine's also totally selfishly like I want to stay on the galapca's islands and want to look at penguins and stuff and it's very emotional and well played it is maturine kind of it he does kind of act like his wife is yelling at him like it is kind of the vibe where he's like you know duty please you know we must um and so uh that's but he does get to all right right that's when Blake Neek

gets in the beetle he's like if nothing else I found a cool beetle can we like kind of like and that's sort of the beginning of their bond yes I like all the uh shots where it's the perspective of the telescope yes and seeing the different animals and the discovery of the iguana that can

swim the way that all just plays out basically looting to evolution yeah it's awesome right

“and iguan is the swimming iguana where he's like they don't swim all these fucking iguan I think”

is one of the few non documentary films to ever shoot at the galapca indeed they shot at the galapca's which have a very weird terrain that I wouldn't know because I've only ever seen it in the movies and this is like oh yeah I remember in the movies used to take you places yeah that's true well maybe we should go but you can come to Maine and now you're pitching a galapca's expedition oh you can go to Maine get on your boat sail the galapca's where are they and oh you got to go

all the way around America the look here the captain I get a requirement to the service it's just but then we have the then we have the Jonah plot right then they are their their wind is gone it's hot they're not moving they can't get into action and the boys start being mean to

been directly responsible for the death of Warley the and it's the Warley's best friend who particularly takes a hatred to Holland and refuses to salute him and at one point you know Aubrey like punishes someone who's not nice to Holland right does that guy is that guy doesn't

order that he kind of checks him and first where they're at the storm was around the horn yes they've

gone around South America they're on the other side they really are they're they're now on the other side the world there because the North Coast islands are off the coast of Ecuador other by off the coast of the hundreds of miles off the coast of Ecuador there's this great fight that he has with the turn and love their fights we're obviously like I have to preserve against the mutiny and the turns like he's fucking guys are in this like wooden prison they've been like pressed against

their homes and he's like you can talk to me that way but I really hate it when you talk about the service then we're like Aubrey's like you know I really like being in the Navy I know you think it sucks and just want to look at birds but like it does rock and they're both right and they're both wrong yes he is absolutely chasing the ashron for pride men must be governed often not well

“I you know admit but like they must be governed in materns like you know that's what every sort of”

you know dictator says it's a great fight I just love that the movie has room for all of this yeah

the the Jonah subplot like is the first thing and you'd be told to lose I feel like you're telling

the movie stops to birds of the way like the action stops and we just focus on like a side character having like a psychodrama basically like yeah it becomes a psychological thriller and it ends like so perfectly and so sadly with him just like does he grab a cannon ball to go down yeah and just holds it all he's been nice to me anyway I find it emotionally affecting yeah things sucked so hard in this time that basically you would learn to become the best doctor alive

in order to get on a boat in the hopes that like once a year right they'd let you go look at lizards for two hours and the fact that he does become this good of a doctor and clearly takes so much pride in it I mean who was the fucking order no no he's got he's he's but I'm saying that the the the naturist thing feels like his real driving passion totally yes yeah but me invoking the fucking SNL sketch earlier it was the the thing in the in the amputation scene is without acting

“like meta-textual or like he's a fucking time traveler I think Betney somehow”

portrays the delicacy of like looking at this kid and being like it sucks that this is the only way I can do this it sucks that all I can offer you was a stick to bite on you know I'm kind of

the best there is none of these options are great yeah this is always gonna hurt and if I see like

plenty of my men injured I might only save three of them and that's a pretty good ratio yeah yeah yeah then Jonathan's okay time for action to begin again right no turn gets shot yeah by a guy trying to shoot an album and accident truly and kind of an I mean I hope he did eventually shoot that albatross and put it around because yeah it's kind of a dick-chainy situation right or he's a fucking mean to shoot you it's embarrassing and and worst of all a little bit of shirt got stuck in the wound that's the

fucked up part there's this great moment when Aubrey's like you know because they spot the the acronym they could try to catch it and Aubrey makes the decision like no we're gonna stay here we have taken to the stable ground to the surgery but he's staring at the cello like there's a shot where he just looks at the the cello standing there it's like he can't operate without maturing like he knows like I am not going to survive if he dies like essentially like I need my other half I need my

sort of better temper all that stuff I would and then I would argue that the you know I don't think this is primary motivation but the crew kind of also need a doctor too well this is the thing because the other guy the assistant is basically like yeah I'm pretty good at operating I do bar fit the side of open wounds and stuff but like you know the fact of maturing it's actually pretty shaky hands

“please check in watching the YouTube about how to perform search maturing those the only way to”

remove bullets with with shirt with shirt maturing those the only way he's gonna survive is for him to do the procedure himself and no one fights him on it the fact that he says it and everyone's like yeah you're right this is the I can't believe Betney was an Oscar nominee thing where it's like you're telling me in the middle of the movie he does surgery on himself with a mirror right like like but it's put it out this was a weird supporting it was like the Oscars were also just

dumber back then I feel like they they they're more lenient to newer actors and perform you know I don't know yeah but good news what does this mean John oh he's good to go out there on the fucking island he gives him the gift and that's a really beautiful scene of Crow fucking trying to act

right I just chose to tell them I didn't actually want to capture the bringing you out in a fucking stretcher and walk you around one time good talk yes you think that all we got a little pissed off like three days after they we'll stop chasing the asheron and he's just got into a bullet out of his own belly that he's getting up and walking around all the time so you may be like okay maybe we should get back on the ship I wouldn't have done this whole ceremony but it's so you're injured it's the

“weird fate of it though because that's how he finds the aircraft right because he's on the go”

up against such an amazing measuring tortoises and he's got he's like I like he has this like

box that he looks into the ocean with right like the sort of like spy box that he can use to look at fish and shit this is I've got the time quick to an hour forty like what what fox support rough when I assume is watching again like me like Nelson watch it like stretch it out can we make another text like do we need the iguana measuring sequence like they're not a boat for them to fight well I mean and I hear the Jack Sparrow like fences with every member of gas required to the

Caribbean and also like well certainly you know it's a slow burn but it's gonna lead much like the weevils walk into an awesome showdown with him and the other captain no he boards the ship the guys but he's not oh sure but yes no you're right I mean like the final sequence is very intense and rocks in a theater and all that but like it is not right aha like can you captain Frenchman

and then like a big for like I mean finally deck of a boat or whatever and all that for us I mean I'll

just say this real quick about you know and and revisiting Peter we're another sorry one more thing oh yeah in the glass because they find the acron what else do they find John a stick insect

“oh yeah which gives Aubrey the idea to disguise his boat and that's how they capture the”

acron so they get him see it all like you need this is this is a this is a breathing organism this the ship all these people with these different needs and it's not a prison it's a world he wasn't listening to all of them he wouldn't be making like the ball of decisions because they're private tears and they're greedy because they're not just engaging with other you know naval shifts they're also going after private citizens a hundred percent the rate anything that looks like a

price right one of the things I've noticed what rewatching some of these weird movies and seeing some of them for the first time that he isn't so like it's yeah Tom Rothman is like yeah more more galopago's please or whatever right but Peter we're is so patient as a director in all his phone yeah just and and there are definitely moments in witness certainly in hanging rock where you're just like oh yeah I guess nothing's gonna happen right and then all of a sudden

something will happen and you're involved and again the beauty of it is that he's not sitting there and all of a sudden the acron comes around the corner and it's huge sure he sees it and it's tiny but it's close enough and that he can go into battle here mode that's right oh look at that mmm let the locks flow you bring up the patience it is one of those things that I often think about and we are choosing to kind of just like step away right and even that his last film

becomes an independent film and one where he needs foreign financing this last time he works with the studios is I think he just sort of saw like they're not gonna let me do this anymore even if it's

not I'm making a hundred million dollar epic which he was one of these guys who liked being able

to level up and work with those resources it's also just like no one let's studio films have this kind of patience anymore is a patience that runs across his small intimate dramas to his giant epics and maybe one of the reasons that people don't think about oh Peter we're all the time or like the Peter we are style movie is and this is not a discredit to his talents but he wasn't all that uncommon in commercial filmmaking at the time sure like the opening

sequence of you haven't covered well you have covered green card by the time this is out yep yeah yeah but you know like that opening sequence with the kid drumming in the in the subway yeah has nothing to do with the plot yeah it's just a creation of a mood in a world he does it

“in this movie too where it's just like little you building moments of like here's what life is like”

in little tiny five to seven second vignettes and they're really we used to see that kind of stuff in movies all the time he was able like there would just be a sequence of like here's New York city here's a guy hell in a cab I mean you're seeing a dog day exactly but right and now it's the Netflix thing of like every movie has to open with a helicopter overhead shot of the city and then immediately into either an action sequence or some kind of big comedic set piece or the

beginning of the plot you know that I mean they have all this fucking data that's like if something huge doesn't happen within the first 90 seconds everyone's gonna flip away and even in theaters where it's not like the risk is someone walking out of the fucking theaters the thing they're concerned about you do feel like that concern dictating the edits of these

not is he was he less unique in the moment than it feels like he was now he's a master of that

“I think also because I don't think it was not unusual no his uniqueness was his consistency I would say”

yeah and also the versatility of genre of size of tone yeah there are very few people who I think

made this transition into the studio system and just basically stayed true to their standards

and their ethos and didn't slip because you compare it to like Wolfgang Peterson who like goes from making like his very serious movies to making like top level popcorn to then making shitty popcorn like the arc from like dust boot to perfect storm to Poseidon is what often happens to these guys at some point they're just fucking picking up the tracks yeah we were maybe saw it coming and got out of the way maybe to tie it back to a moment to a master and

commander movie that I believe David likes yeah I've heard that I think that what's one of the things it's very beautiful that it is that the natural patient pace of the Peter rear movie Mary so quickly with the necessary patient pace of sailing a ship and Napoleon but like it has a completely different mood than we would think what happens when the engage in battle ship pops off it's what I like the craziest part of all this it's like so much of your life

is what you're talking about is the careful I had we maneuvered and then it's like when we're next to them everyone has to go insane right get you see killick going insane like during the battle like there's one of the other ships is like beating someone up with a pot like he didn't someone over the head with a pot obviously already mentioned yeah you know you see Blake knee

little 12 year old Blake me just boarding with a gun well isn't his vision to first he's in the

“wheelers yeah but first he's in charge of the boat remember he's like oh I don't get to be in the”

boarding party he's like no you're going to be like in charge of the surprise because we're all which is an honor but then there's that moment where they're so close and they both start pointing like both boats are pointing to cannon right at each other and Blakely's like we have to fire first like you know we you know they're going to blow our whole and us he's a good commander of the surprise and then he says arm yourself we must board them he's a little child

and you see materna like grab a gun and cock it and I'm watching it right now it's so exciting and I love what I love like he says that because hey he appreciates that it's necessary because he's smart yeah but he gets what he wants to do anyways like you know what I am gonna fucking board that but uh the the assistant doctor guy the coward he he's not a coward but the gross doubt uh he has that moment where he stops a cannon from being fired by putting his hand in between

the fuse and the like the trigger oh it hurts that's so it's only like like he's like almost lapsed the key moment we're like oh good matern picks up was sword and starts fucking with it's so exciting it's the greatest thing that's ever happened like I said it's tied with all the other scenes for Greta scene in a movie but yeah howl me is sent is is tasked with going and uh uh rescuing yeah can any other way there's other members of the aldeys that will put the odds in their favor it

gets more guys on their side and that's when it's over and then Aubrey sees the surgeon who is actually the captain pretending to be the surgeon operating on the captain who probably just some dead guy they put a coat on and he says he told me to give you this sword

“that he's got me yeah that's what happens uh and it's great you don't know the twist for a while”

obviously there's the what's his pants dies the sweet boy howl me dies and he doesn't so through the nose for him because he's asked for that or remember the Blake he asked Blake right or Blake he asked him or look it's so they get sewn up in their own hammocks also the guy who looks like a blobfish dies love that guy so much the master oh yeah you know he gets shot out the master real love him it's great it's just you know just the right balance of like triumphant misery right

like it's sort of like this is life at sea they bury everyone they say their names they sing a little song right all that stuff would you want to be buried at sea no okay fine uh he gives James Darcy okay great really Ben free time yeah he's decided we're deciding for all of us yeah yeah we all know we all have to do it we're giving Ben power of attorney uh that he gives James Darcy the the acaron right he's like take that to port his Jarvis take the acaron to

Valpari so and then we'll have there the momentary freaked out about which is Aubrey realizes like oh shit no the captain's still on the ship right we have to go get them we can't stay the glaupe go sorry sorry once again I'm not going anywhere funny line right

billion dollar gross right yeah the the greatest thing that's ever happened and then they they

there it's gonna take time I was gonna make a joke that the the mid credit tease was that they're

“building a white matern and then I remember that in this section where he's been shot he basically”

does he does he gets he gets yeah great team mode yeah funny thank you David how do you feel better this movie it's my favorite movie ever I love to watch it I try not to watch it too much because I do as with all my favorite movies I try to kind of like let it be special yeah so it's like every year so how many times do you think you've seen it like 20 sure 15 20 yeah right like you don't amount you don't ever put it into an assassins Creed style rotation I don't think I do that

that's a Ben I was hearing about that in college I did that in college I would have the movies to fall asleep to a little bit more I don't know if you do this as well it sounds like you didn't with this but certainly in the same way that I like held off on rewatching this because I was like I should make it fresh for a while too that's right yeah yeah there were certain movies I look at where I'm like I'd love to watch that but there's a good chance we cover that in the next

“two years I definitely do that and it would be nice to make that feel a little more special I'm never”

gonna be arrived as Griffin finished watching the movie I look my memory at this point you're fresh I'm fucking dory you're usually trying to do it for these years you said my brain so quickly right that I feel like the specificity of thought I need to be as as close to have just finishing

the movie as I now we mentioned the box office we did the play the game in a second can I

talk a review a question before the box office came I know you're going somewhere no I'm going to the box and you're leading and you're capitalizing the ship so I don't want to take us off now what's your question my galopico silence the overall question is what's the new thing you've seen in it since you've seen it so many times and then the the prompt might be like how does this depiction of war compared to the depiction of war and gullipoli that's interesting

it's got the similar thing in gullipoli of it's about like a brotherhood of man a little bit right and then you don't really know or see your anime but like right but in gullipoli I feel like it's a little bit more like you know watching it if you have even the bareest understanding of history like these boys have no idea what they are in for they have been drafted into a war that is pointless they are being drafted into a you know battle that is the famously worst thing

that anyone ever tried in world world one basically right like one of the biggest disasters right

so you kind of have this kind of like innocence is dying here I don't find that with master commander oh you're not like all I mean this is like you know it's not something maybe something to be proud of but like this is part of the lifeblood of this you know of this empire right it's like obviously world war one was a not it was a particularly modern war in a way the people didn't understand even when they were joining it because of the kinds of guns they were using

basically it was just much more fatal war even though this the brutality of war is depicted to a degree in this movie as well but it's also like the as you mentioned the triumph is there too so it's kind of it's a romantic film when it comes to this hugely romantic and in that way there is no reason to necessarily go after the etchron after it no what this is not some movie about like when he gets a great speech where he's like do you want to pull you to be

your king like where they're all fired up about and it's like yeah sure in the broad sense Britain didn't want to lose to France yeah but this isn't even in French on this naval ship this is a this is a they're contractors yeah you know they're not going to invade but not going to invade England the astronauts not going to invade England nor are they going to continue hunting for the surprise necessarily unless they skies themselves uh uh hija got a question for you

turn about his fair play I know you've done a great job of explaining and selling ban on the specifics of life on this piece and and boating yeah um and obviously you're expect a experiences with voting are different than what is depicted in this film are they're likely are there specific things in this movie that you feel like wow this gets it right in a way I haven't seen before I mean no way it truly able seeming not even like on technical details but like your feelings and experiential

“and yeah I mean I think that um it is profoundly creepy to be sleeping on about the makes no”

motor noise this is a reason I don't trust both that I think it captures very well I mean the depiction of what you do in order to make a boat like this go yeah is to the best of my understanding experience and reading very accurate I think that's very cool um because it required a lot of intelligence and ingenuity and that sort of thing that thing where they have to escape into the fog and they don't have enough wind so they get out the boats and they pull you've been

that was how you would know but that is how you would be new to those boats you know like particularly

clean and we got to play the pie understand thank you for thank you for letting me talk a little bit

“but if I may please we've reached the end of our discussion of this film oh yes oh Jesus”

I forgot to help you prepare to honor yeah it's appropriately safe and sounded home again let the waters roar jack safe and sounded home again let the waters roar jack long we've tossed on the rolling main now we're safe a shore jack uh don't forget your old ship mate follow your ready ready ready ready are you taking solo david be no no no no no no it's got your name I don't that's pretty good but we were not prepared for that there was no

editing we just jumped into it did they save this other part I don't remember this other part oh yeah it goes on the self-same gun quarterback division spongeer I and loader you through the whole commission long we've tossed on the rolling main now we're safe a shore jack don't forget your old ship mate follow your ready ready ready are you did you look this up this is it's called don't forget your old ship mate this uh naval song do you know what makes Ben best in the

biz I mean everything but go ahead nine nine hundred producers wouldn't just text it that to us and Ben printed it out we did we locked in right away absolutely yeah you think it's mean

“when they're a little mean about uh the nice singing voice of Harlem yeah I think it's mean when”

they're mean I feel like it's a little mean I mean they're not like that mean but they're kind of like there's a moment before he's saying so this is when he joins in on uh farewell and uh do your old sketch ladies and they go your little pitchy dog yeah but right before that the the the crew is saying before he joins in you see him sort of kindly tapping his his hand to the beat and he's really off the beat and it's so touching and just yeah anyway all of the characters are real people

oh no I don't know what that's the next drag ration of rock frog for Ben yeah it's November 14

2003 yes master granders opening to twenty five million dollars number two at the box now

I do know what is number one because the Wikipedia entry there's a sub entry of accolades and awards received by master and commander I was just trying to look up the the award situation in the opening paragraph it says the movie was considered disappointment coming in number two behind elf is it's the second weekend of elf how much is elf dropped from his first weekend it went up did it not did not go up okay at least according to the numbers which everything feels a little unreliable

“I remember it having a a minuscule on well I remember to going up but uh it goes up and it's four”

there we go I knew it was dropped 15 percent yeah crazy so elf is number one at the box office with 26 mil mastering around right behind it 25 mil right behind that is a movie that has dropped drastically also is a movie we've covered on this show uh it's dropped drastically it opened against elf yeah elf has now taken number one it has dropped to number three it opens number one it is an action sci-fi sequel oh it's the matrix uh revolution yes where is re-loaded it had done so well

revolutions opens big but drops out very fast elf was so fucking huge there's something that feels uh representative of it being like the thing that master commander has to open against in that that was just like we got Russell Crowe doing gladiator on a boat isn't that like automatic

40 million opening weekend like adult fucking entertainment and it came in soft at the same time

that elf came in so much hotter than anyone was predicting I'll say I first watch master and commander with our son I don't know if he remembers ever seeing the movie but our son and my wife is the whole human in her own right we'll watch elf every day together if they're allowed to yeah I mean elf is a I watch it every year movie it has stood the test of time every day I'm saying yeah yeah it's it's the only I would argue it's the last holiday film that basically has been canonized

uh yeah absolutely it's right it's good it's excellent movie and now John Favros bringing us the Mandalorian in Grogu and I cannot wait to meet those two guys the number three is mentioned

solutions number four is a Disney animated film I've never seen three oh it's brother bear

brother bear it's one of only two I haven't seen brother bear and wish right number five and is we may return to this box of his game one day it's a film we will cover it is new this week

in action I could have gotten with you or clues is this where to put this movie feels like a summer none of November yeah yes they're hoping for a Thanksgiving family thing but like yeah it just

“kind of feels like everyone's like we'll just see elf right I think they had no idea elf was”

going to be that big no it is crazy that it's also elf was new line and this is Warner Brothers like they opened against themselves I just think the expectations for elf were really low where it was

like if that movie makes fifty million dollars we're going to be thrilled and instead it opened to

forty and then had like those those tight spandex legs because elf ends up at like one 70 180 yeah yeah no I think they fucked up on the release of this but it also like Warner Brothers treated that movie with resentment well yeah for mastering commander had a Joan on board let's just say yes truly it was it was short it's so termed but it is so cursed so Dante has talked about this where like he would get into studio like note meetings on the Lutin's movie and they'd be like now bugs says this line

what's up doc what does that mean but does he need to say that oh boy where he was like getting noted by people who didn't understand why they were even bothering to make his way to creativity than people justifying their jobs the movie is kind of about that and a lot of ways it's like a movie of like development execs being like does this suck now do we fucking hate the movie to now

I will never see it no it's really good it's him I will not let's pick the movie about movies ever

again it is a movie made mental value is the one exception it is a movie made with contempt for an industry that is overthinking everything and not understand the value of these characters I'm officially

“in my weird dad phase of it's not about sleeper trains I think you would love back an action”

they go to area 51 and it's Joan Q sack and she has all the great road losses on the back number six of the box up is his love actually a movie that is a worker it's not good but that is a movie that our daughter it makes us watch every Christmas yeah she is extremely good taste and movies and television that is emotional abuse she really loves that movie a lot of people love that movie a lot of people love that movie a lot of people vote for Trump not accusing your

daughter of vote infrastructure oh no she's she's a magma yeah maga and magha oh thank god number seven of the box office is scary movie three oh it was a big hit yep number eight is the definitely not embarrassing movie radio no whoa everyone walked out of that with their heads held high number nine is new this week is the two-poch resurrection movie which is a sort of like let's do the documentary yeah right you know I I think briefly had the highest grossing documentary crowner was close to it

and then obviously the next year fair high nine eleven comes out hey then yeah he's just went to the bathroom and then from the back of the bathroom I'm going to teach him how to anchor number 10 of the box well he's about to anchor in that toilet right this misty rip my daughter wrong this degree of rent or so oh which is made forty five million dollars on its way to ninety yeah so here that's a real quick film yeah like that's it will the thing about it is they save everything for the

blooper real but they are great oh my god all those seats are so funny is that my daughter in there I fall over I don't know yeah that's the box office we will at guests yeah do this again one day when we do Joe Dante uh because right that's it we gotta do it I'm that he he'll hold my David but I just gotta say this one thing please I'm now I'm done so you guys can just chat just what we don't have a better answer for you vis-a-vis my what's the experience on the sea sure

“and what I think that this movie captures and the thing is part of what the movie is all about”

is the powerlessness literal and figurative of being on a sailing totally right you have some control but you have a lot of no control how much control is over compensated and in you know uniform and in ritual and everything else because they know that it will fall apart if there isn't discipline right but also you are at the mercy of truly unseen forces the wind yeah and if someone else has the wind advantage they're gonna wind the battle and if it dies

you're becombed and it's you it's this collision of a sense of control and complete lack of control it is very tense even if there isn't a love interest or an antagonist traditional antagonist does an excellent point beautifully expressed and you have finally given me words to explain why I don't like being on a boat you just described exactly why I don't like it powerful and powerless in that you have a bunch of fucking responsibilities and rituals to maintain which to me

sounds like a nightmare and also you don't ultimately have a lot to say you never wanted and Ben I'm

inviting you as well yeah the wonderful comedic actor and improviser and just straight up great actor Mark Evan Jackson he also has the the same bug oh sure the boating bug the boating bug and he and he is a partner in another 120 year old wooden sailing scooter called the Grace Bailey

sailing crew's truly it's I think sold out but okay but the Grace Bailey is an amazing experience

this is interesting to sail on mark is on it sometimes you'll be going back on it eventually I'm not refusing the experience to be really really great and you know I would invite David

“if you want to have some mastering commander type experience this would be a really fun experience”

the Grace Bailey sail Grace Bailey yeah now Ben here's what you do what's that they've canons they do not have canons they still go though but you'll like this because the these scooters particularly the Mary Day is a was purpose built for passenger travel in the sixties but the Grace Bailey and a bunch and five or six other ones they date back to the late 19th century when scooters were the tractor trailers of these coast there were no roads there were no railroads

so you wanted cargo moved around you would fill up a scooter and move it along the coast up and down etc so carry tar room a coal a payback copies of vacation land or whatever and if you want

to stop the scooter here's what you do any kind of boat first of all you drop the lead to see

what the quality of the sea bed is then you drop the anchor right and if you know that it's five phathoms deep for example you're going to want to let out at least three times and up to seven times that amount of what's called anchor road the closest to the anchor it's all heavy chain because it's not the anchor that keeps you down it's the chain but you got to pay it out longer because there are times because if it was too short it would potentially it would break you would there would

be too much tension it's you put the anchor down and then you lay essentially you're laying the chain down along the sea bed for a length of time and it's that way to the keeps you if you were just holding onto the anchor and pull right out that makes total sense yeah but yeah I love when you see there's like one in in Long Island city there's a huge anchor but then there's also the chain

“which is so impressive that it's a checking mass yes and that's how you do it then so cool”

what's a cock swing cock swing sits when you're it's a rowing thing that's right the cock swing is the little guy who sits at the front of the boat so I could be a cock swing yes you right you are the actual perfect bill for a cock swing you have to be really loud you have to yell family I can't see that I mean you can do it Billy boy he's the cock is the cocks that makes sense it's also the steer the steersman of the boat and like a like a cocks in and in uh when you're

rowing when you're you know what what is it crew I mean they usually choose little you know smaller people yeah just in the back of the boat and call out the strokes that's what a cocks and is in a row and so and similarly in a polyonic wartime you wanted a smaller cocks and to steer the boat and that's why they had had hobbits do it got it okay so I'll be your cocks and sometime I definitely think the worst job is the crank guys well the worst job is peg boy but

we're not even gonna get into it's kind of that's there's not even an argument there Ben the other way they would move the boat if they didn't have wind you're gonna love this they had a smaller anchor and they would put it in one of their sideboats and they would row it way out in front of the uh ship and then they would drop that anchor way out in front of the ship and then the ship they would those crank boys would crank the captain around and pull the ship to that anchor

“that was another way you would move if you had no wind sure which they I think at one point”

have to do that at the first battle scene yeah they they have the boats tell it but in this case it's like it would be like throwing a grappling hook and then pulling yourself along right or they would tie themselves to a tree and then pull themselves up if they were they're near land or whatever so cool you understand how foreign aft sales work what thank you for listening please remember to write review and subscribe hodgeman anything you want to plug well the foreign aft

sale as something I'd like to plug it's an incredible means of propulsion that uses the Bernoulli

principle of differentiating the air vacuum essentially it works like an air foil so it's never

mind also I would recommend plugging any leaks in the hull of your ship there you go there we go I'll tell you what I will plug my sub-stack hodgeman dot sub-stack dot com we'll look at that because you get news and little musings for me but you also get me reading mobile dick allowed in a terrible main accent chapter by chapter I've been going I'm only about halfway through so the good stuff is yet to come and if and obviously you know I don't want to get people's

hopes up too high for something that may never happen but if for example vacation land ever were released in paperback I soon that sub-stack is somewhere where it might be announced yeah you would learn about that probably at hodgeman dot sub-stack dot com great you also get to listen to me read mobile dick allowed in a terrible main accent it's not a joke perfect it's a long project that I enjoy

who comes in calm civil balanced I honestly I remember that being a fun episode but can't

“say I remember what what happened I I can't remember any yeah yeah I mean I guess we probably”

litigate a bunch of stuff with Alex cuz like yeah right he explains how they're only ever been

too good movies in history and they're both super Mario galaxy god he was coming in hot with those

“down he really was like yeah he was yeah I mean you was trying a little hard but no I think it was natural”

was easy and organic anyway tune in for that next week and there's always what's the number one

boat fact that you didn't get to share that you came in locked and loaded with today john

“I talked about catching that talk about anchoring catching is when you like get really close”

to steering the ship but you'd better I cool it's uh there's a nozzle term called gooning yeah sure I'm blazing yeah and uh only the ablifts of seamen are capable of all three and I create some more seamen in the process yep that's how it happens that's how it happens