Giannis & Bucks At Odds Again & Wemby Makes Claim For MVP + Evaluating Tatum

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Hello and welcome to the Who Collective podcast. We talk about the NBA, which we are doing on Tuesday evening. Joining us from Madison Square Garden. Sitting in the Mike Brown Sea. But I actually, you know, he kind of, with that face he's got on there.

He looks like Tom Tibodow.

It's Tim Botems. Hello everybody. The pelicans in Nick's game is going on right now as we, as we take this. So we'll see what happens there. The nicks are going for seven and a row.

Joining us from down the street here in Los Angeles. His band, McMahon. Howdy partners. Supples you to get dinner with the windy last night. Even though we made this put the check bomb tips.

Well, let's see what happens tonight. That is a nice amount of learning behavior. It's a point. By the way, today, McMahon and I were on NBA today. And during one of the blocks of the show,

McMahon and I were off. I believe that was about WNBA. It was a WNBA segment. Great. So we're also on miced up.

And you know, what's this doing interview? What? This was, this was during the commercial break. Just go on. You can continue.

But I want that fact out now. Okay, fine. Was there in the commercial break? Did it was I saying it differently? You were acting as if it was mid show.

Go on.

“Anyway, we stay wired up even though we're not on the air, right?”

So Botems were sitting there and the break and all of a sudden we, we started hearing water running and the sound of paper towels being dispensed. The producer, Jaren goes, I think we're hearing McMahon and the bathroom.

It was a fast ball not a curve ball, but it relaxed. Anyway, okay, speaking of fast balls, the players union issued a few edicts on Tuesday. A little brushback pitch. Yeah.

Which, you know, this doesn't happen often. Bottoms.

So the first one was in relation to Yannes Tenakumpo.

And as was been out there reported over the last few days, Yannes, he's coming back. He's dealing with the knee injury right now. The bucks out of about 10 or 11 games left. And Yannes would like to play when he saw Fee and the bucks do not want him to play.

And there was a statement made by the Players Association. Now, part of the statement is about tanking and I'm going to ignore those things about the tanking, because we don't talk about tanking here. However, this part is relevant. Quote.

The player participation policy was designed by the league to hold teams accountable. And ensure that when an all star like Yannes Tenakumpo is healthy and ready to play, he is on the court. Unfortunately, anti-tanking policies are only as effective in there as their enforcement. Fans, project partners and the integrity of the game will continue to suffer as long as ownership goes unchecked. Bottoms.

As long as ownership goes unchecked, that is an interesting word ownership. This, to me, is a sign of a player and a team. Not only not on the same page, but not communicating, because they are now communicating through the lawyers. And I don't think this is a good sign in any way shape or form. And I do not think that this season has been an exemplary way of handling business by the box organization, including Mr. Tenakumpo.

Yeah, I mean, I don't really have a lot else to add. I mean, this, what has changed about the situation in months? I really anything, right? There's been a lack of communication. There's been a lack of mutual trust. I would say there's been a lack of organizational alignment.

I mean, they're just, it's just a complete mess. And it's been a complete mess for months and months and months. And, you know, I don't think that's going to change in the next three weeks. You know, I would say to Janis, I think there's, he should take the next three weeks and not play. This is a guy who's had, I think, four different cast trains.

“Over the last year and a half for two years, you should get his body right.”

But the part of the problem here is I think the box have not really had an ability to sit down with Janis and have Frank productive conversations with him for an extended period. Now, and I think that's part of why the situation is where it is.

and to send you to another place where you have a chance to win.

“And we could turn the page and what's been an incredible run.”

But the best player we've ever had here in Milwaukee and we'll celebrate you then. We'll celebrate you after that and there'll be a statue and there'll be a jersey in the rafters.

And you brought us our first title of 50 years and it was an incredible thing.

Put up a 50 piece in this side in game at home. It was one of the great finals close out games we've seen in the very long time. And all that will be celebrated. But right now, we're in a position where we're trying to maximize our future over the next three weeks. And we need to maximize your future over the next three weeks.

And I think the ultimate problem with everything that's gone on in Milwaukee for months now is an inability to have that kind of conversation.

And that's why statements are being made.

“That's why this thing has been so messy and it's why I think I speak for everybody when we're all just pretty tired of it.”

Like it's just the story is beyond played out and the team isn't going anywhere. And you know, I think sometimes there is a bit of a rush for people to try to get guys out of town and to change teams and go somewhere new. But the way this thing is played out. I think it's going to be best for everybody to just start fresh next season with Janice somewhere else. And a whole bunch of assets coming back to the box for them to start a new era of their franchise.

I mean, this has been a saga that's played out for over eight years, right? Like literally you go back to when the matrix drafted lukin.

“The last pick of that draft, they took coasts in a kupo because they were among the several teams trying to line up to land Janice and free aid and see when he left Milwaukee.”

Now, to the bucks credit, that time with the drew holiday trade and on multiple other occasions, they were able to make moves to get Janice to extend get Janice to commit. You know, and the draw they move in particular was a move that was able to bump them into being a real championship, not just container, but a championship team. So, but there's no more moves to make that are going to make the bucks a championship team. There's just no more moves to make that are going to make the bucks relevant in terms of like anything right now.

In the NBA, they're not a good team. They are way underwater in terms of assets. They still not only owe Damien Lillard a ton of money after stretch and wave them, but they owe Portland all the draft capital for that deal.

They have to finally trade Janice, not because he wants out, which obviously he does, he just isn't willing to come to them and say that.

That's he traded them because they're in progress right now. They're only chance to dig out is to get real value for him, which means it is in their best interest to shut Janice down for the season, not to tank to protect him from catastrophic injury, which is clearly the concern with these repeated calf strains. The guy needs some real significant time off to rest and fully recover and to if not eliminate the risk at least really drop the risk, but like the tanking thing. That's a completely disingenuous mention of tanking because it's a hot bun issue because really if the bucks tank the rest of the season, there's barely any benefit.

Oh, whoa, the instead of being 10th, there'll be nights, they're tied right now for nights with the bowls. The team they would catch possibly would be the pelicans, which by the way, the bucks get the worst of those two picks anyway. And let me just also add the bucks stink with Janice on the court. The bucks are a bad team that lasts nine to twelve with Janice on the floor. It's not like, oh my gosh, if the honest came back, the bucks wouldn't have bunch of games. No, they wouldn't. It's a bad team that needs to move on, despite in their bad despite the fact that they've got an all time great.

He needs to move on, they need to move on and we can talk again about the bucks when they become relevant in like 2032. Last week, from one of Shellburn published a story where she interviewed bucks governor West Eden's, where he said quote, "The honest is going into the last year of his contract, so one of two things will happen. Either he will be extended or he'll be traded." The likelihood that you'll let him play out the last year, we can't afford that. It's not consistent with what's good for the organization.

That's not a honest issue, that's any player that's in their last year of their contract. This is an elementary statement. It's not like a hot take or whatever. It's how any team would treat this. But Bondsem struck me about that quote and which I will bring come back to it now that Janice is communicating with the bucks through the players union. Wouldn't they have a good idea whether Janice was going to extend or not? Like they would, you know, like you just ask him, are you going to extend?

It's just not been a lot of communication, I think, between Janice and the bucks.

“And I think that's where, you know, going into this off season, I think that's what has to start to change.”

Like they've got to sit down and probably should start today. Like, should sit down and have real honest conversations about where this thing is going and what they're doing and what the plan is because like I said, the best thing for Janice is to get himself healthy. I want to see Janice out on the court doing awesome stuff and playing at the highest level, which he showed this year when he was on the court again. He's still one of the five best players on the planet. He's still an unstoppable force with the ball and in transition.

He still is a guy who can make game changing plays on the defensive end. He's still a guy that can be a massively important piece of a championship level team in the league. But that situation is not going to be in Milwaukee. It's not going to be in the final 10 games of the season when they have no chance to do anything. And I also think like, yeah, it stinks in general that the tanking conversation includes things like it's not good for the bucks to have a guy like Janice play in a vacuum. Like, yeah, that's true. But right now, for where the bucks are at, the goal for everybody involved should be for Janice to be 1,000 percent healthy going into the off season.

And it should be for the bucks to be able to start to re-orient this franchise about the next era of its existence.

Because the bottom line is they've been on borrow time the last couple of years trying to drag the thing out.

And as the band laid out before, there's just no path to this team having a chance to be competitive in the east. Not right now and not as we move forward with some of these young teams continuing to get better and it's just time for everybody to move on and again. That conversation about that has to start now and it has to start with, you know, like you said, go right back to what was seen inside last week. Get any answer to that question and then move forward.

“You know, the only thing I would say is why do you need to answer that question?”

Because I don't think extending Janice is in the bucks' best interest. So you can do what? Is that being the mediocre? Well, if Janice said a couple announced, I want to spend my whole career in Milwaukee. I would understand if the Milwaukee buck said, okay, we're going to have Janice send a couple of spend as a tire career in Milwaukee.

We'll try to be as competitive as possible. I don't think that would be a bad thing for Janice or the NBA or the bucks. I think to your point, though, McMahon, everybody's been dancing around the idea that Janice is not thrilled to be in Milwaukee for a long time. And that is where it's a problem. Right.

If Janice was going to stand up and say, hey, listen, I'm going to be in Milwaukee in the whole career.

I'm happy like dirt did basically.

Like, yeah, it was clear dirt, similar careers, right? One title. It's not like he has to go try to chase or ring somewhere because he hasn't done that. If he just stood up and said, hey, listen, I love my time in Milwaukee. I want to spend my whole career with one team.

I want to try to be as competitive as we possibly can be. You know, let's, let's just go forward and try to be competitive and see what we can do. That would at least be a clear direction for the franchise going forward. I get all that. But we're not hearing that.

I just, it's more to me about what the lack of communication shows about the underlying situation there. That's what I'm taking away from today. Yes. I agree.

“Do you think her money will remember her conversation with the West Edience?”

I know those tend to be forgettable according to some folks. The, the reference that big man is making there is it at the beginning of the season.

Eden said he had this very crucial conversation with Janice last spring after the season.

And then when Jan's was asked about it, he said he had no recollection. So, all right. The union made a second statement on Tuesday on usual to get two statements at a day. This one is wrote in reference to Cade Cunningham. Cade Cunningham is potential in eligibility for postseason awards after a career defining season is a clear indictment of the 65 game role.

And yet another example of why it must be abolished a reform to create an exception for significant injuries. It went on, but I'm going to cut it short. Also, Jeff Schwartz gave the following quote, Jeff Schwartz is the power agent represents Cade. This is said to Shams, Cade has delivered a first team all in BAC season. If he follows short of an arbitrary games played threshold due to a due to a legitimate injury,

that should not just qualify him from recognition he has clearly earned over the course of the season, et cetera, et cetera. He finishes with an exception needs to be made. Okay, I just want to say a couple of things here. I am bummed that Cade potential will miss out on these awards. Don't think he's going to play in the regular season.

He's very obvious he's not going to play. Yeah. He's played, let's just be honest. These statements are not becoming out if Cade was going to play. Correct.

He has played 61 games. However, the 61st game he played for minutes. I don't know if they would count that because it was the threshold. I can tell you they would not count it. He's a 60 games played for awards.

So there is a specification in the CBA where if you suffer a season ending injury and

Yeah.

I don't he doesn't qualify.

“So I mean, that's the exception that could be made, I guess.”

Well, that is, I mean, the thing about this that I would say is silly is one. The player association collectively bargained this rule. Correct. Yes, several years ago in the last CBA. So they agreed to the rules.

Two, there is literally a carve out in the rules for an injury like this. It's a few play 62 games and this happens. If Cade had played two more games, he would have been eligible for awards. Now, I agree with you. It's very unfortunate that Cade has had this tremendous season and is going to miss out

on getting on to one of the all NBA teams and to be on MVP bowels. Because he would have been on MVP bowels.

And he's going to be there been the top of the second team or first team on be a player.

He's out of phenomenal season. But the rule exists because the NBA put the rule in with the PA's approval several years ago. And no, they're not going to create an exception for it. Just like they didn't create an exception for it to give Victor defense player the year last year. Just like they're not going to give an exception.

If Nicole Yoche misses two more games and falls below 65 games like the rule exists. And like we could sit here and say it's dumb that we have to decide. We get it decided for us who we can vote for as opposed to be able to decide if we're going to vote for Cade or not. But the rule is what it is. And the idea that you're just going to arbitrarily create a rule because Cade had an unfortunate a change in the rule is Cade had an unfortunate injury.

It's just not how reality works. This unfortunately is completely out of the spirit of the rules. The spirit of the rules that load management had become such an issue for the league and a public relations issue. A, honestly, a disservice to fans issue. This is not a load management issue. I was Cade clearly. Also like when you're the primary reason that your team is the number one seed in these conference like this it's a tough total swallow.

Under the rule though, there's like there's no wiggle room. You know, Mark Falwell who's the long time mass play by play guys doing some play by play with NBC and peacock. He's been on a, on a little rampages too strong, but you know, he's made the point several times on social media. Hey, the cut off for league leaders, you know, the scoring title, you know, assist title rebound title, etc. This is the game is 58 games. Why is his 65 games for awards, but 58 games to very sickle entire season because the NBA fought to put this rule in because they wanted to start players to play in more games.

And guess what, the harsh truth of the rule and the dirty secret of it is it's working.

“The rule is working. Guys are playing in more games. That's why it's not changing. It's why it exists like I don't think I think we'd all agree.”

Well, I think it was a coincidence to call the old coach came back from this bone bruise. I don't know. After missing 16 games, it's not a, you know, Victor Webinar has played in dozens of games in a row now and hasn't missed any games because he's three or four games away from when we didn't miss one game. Yeah, but they know exactly where he is. He knows when he has come out and said he doesn't want to miss any games for the award. That's right, but these guys want and look, I'm not saying, I'm not talking about whether I think the rule should exist. I made my points on that in the past. I think the media has always done a very good job of deciding where the line is and how much guys have played.

I don't think we need a rule to decide that. However, that's why the NBA fought for this rule. They fought for it to be 65 games. They fought to put it in because they wanted to have incentive for guys to be playing their stock, the star players to play more. And the star players are playing more and it is very unfortunate for Kate and frankly, I'm really happy that this is not a year ago when Kate qualified for the supermax and it would have been extremely unfortunate. If something like this happened and it cost him tens of millions of dollars, like that, I would have really felt bad if that happened.

But look, we also saw Tyre's algorithm two years ago, limp through the second half of the season playing 22 minutes a game and a bunch of games to be eligible to get his own supermax. Oh, by the way, when we when when we came back from his extended apps and sorely the season, his men's limit was 20. That was not good enough. The reason why that's the number is because that's the limit they've set for the game to count for towards the 65 games.

“Speaking of that, you may remember that kid, kind of him did sign a contract extension a couple years ago.”

He did hit the supermax provision. He made 30 more NBA last year, got a $45 million bonus.

So while he wants this because he's he feels and he's correct. He is earned first team all NBA.

More who collective podcast after this.

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Dr. Wimbinyama, he controlled the discourse of the NBA on Tuesday because he went on. I mean, he didn't grab the microphone and announce the reasons why he should be MVP. He was asked a question why what his case was from VP, but he had answers ready.

And he, you know, as we've talked about with Victor, not afraid to.

“He stole his own virtue, is that is that artfully said enough?”

Or, or, ruffle some feathers. He stole his own virtue and take a little jab at a team and a franchise and a player that could be a decade plus long rival of the spurs. Well, it wasn't just him. He definitely is, you know, sort of trolling. I guess you could say. Shake your cell examiner by saying that they went foreign one against him during the season.

But he's trolling. I mean, I mean, I, I, is that part, is that part trolling? It's, it's, it's truthful. It's truthful. Yeah, I mean, that, I mean, all the same.

I mean, he's also, as I've said many times, Victor is not afraid to be wildly arrogant in a matter of fact way. That's just being very matter of fact that they won four out of five against it. Like, if you are, if it does get down to a Victor versus Shay one and two, like,

“Yeah, I think, an argument in his corners, they won four out of the five games.”

Yeah, it's just, it takes you back a little bit to hear guy be that blunt and pointed it out. Like, well, what's I saying? Yeah, as I said to somebody last night, as the person who has done the straw poll now for several years, there are all sorts of people who lobby about MVP awards and awards in general. We just, the last segment we talked about this whole thing with Kate Gunningham. I very rarely do you see someone on camera on the record completely lay out their position? Well, normally that's done earlier this year.

Yeah, I'm the best player in the league. Jalen did that, but that it's, it's rare. Usually this is done in a little more subtle manner, but Victor, Victor doesn't do a lot of things subtle either on the court or off the court. And this is the latest example of that. I will say this, don't you think that this will, like, you're not going to do the straw poll for a little bit here, but it would be fascinating. If you did the straw poll two days ago, then you did another one today.

I don't think I don't think I'm changing. I don't think I'm changing. I don't think I'm changing. I don't think Victor giving a post game speech is changing a lot of a lot. I wish you were wrong, but I mean, I wish you were right, but I'm afraid you're wrong. You know, they're like, listen, none of this matters if Wimby's not just absolutely dominating. And he absolutely dominated the Miami 83 years and a complete blowout win.

But seriously, like the guy, okay, let's just, let's look at what he says. The most dominant defense player by far, there's no question. The gap between Wimby and the next best defensive player is much more significant than the gap between the best offensive player and number two. Is he trolling, is he trolling Shay saying shit doesn't defend or is he saying that about Luka and Yoke? On that one, I think I take that one at face value. Hey, defense is half the game and I'm okay.

And he's by far the most dominant against him. Yeah, what he's trolling everybody because I don't think he's. I don't think he's cool. I think that's fine. Use a different verb. I'm just don't think he's taken a certain argument.

“It's a valuable defensively that you have to consider that as half of that.”

In reference to the other MVP candidates, that's the current of what he's saying.

Sure, that his value on defense way, basically his case is my value on defense way out ways.

The difference in any of these guys value offensively versus mine. And he's, you know, his thing on offense is it's not just scoring points. Basically talking about his gravity and some of the other things he does. And then the stuff about we beat the thunder four out of five. Basically, he's a basis for three times at full strength. That's that is him saying.

But when we played, I'm up the floor with it with Shane and the defendant champions. And that's him trying to make up for the biggest thing that I think is going to prevent him from moaning the award, which is that the thunder, who we'll talk about later, have gone 15 in one since the all star break with a bunch of guys out. And if state ahead of the 16 and two spurs since the all star break,

I've kept this three game lead and are now very likely to have the best record in the league and the best record in the Western Conference. And as we said the whole time, if Victor and the spurs were able to get ahead of the thunder and finish the season, the best record in the Western Conference, I think there was a very real chance Victor was going to be the MVP of the league.

I think if Shane stays ahead and the thunder win the west, particularly with the amount of injuries the thunder have had in the season.

I think Shane's had, I think Shane's went in a second straight. And when he says the part where Victor is trying

to take out just the wind up. This is Dr. and Peter McMahon speaking. But I agree. I can't say something real quick. I believe Dr. MVP there said when the before the last straw poll came out,

“I think when Benjamin Yamma was 35 to one on draft Kings, is that correct?”

I believe that was right. And I said at the time that that was a ridiculous line and people should bet it was down 18 to one now also. That's great. I still think 18 to one is pretty good on drafts. I would have him second on my ballot behind Shay. I would have Luka third when be you had Joker third, but whatever.

Wait a second. Wait a second. Put a pin in that for a second. So you have Yokech out of the top three? Yes, because honestly dude, if we're going to value winning, then it's hard for me to make a case for Joker over Luka, when Luka is leading the league in school with remarkable efficiency, filling out the box score, holding it up frankly pretty well,

defensively making it plays defensively, holding a much better defensively. You can joke ways if we want to be win horse. What is happening here? Dude guys, the guy's got, we got some Luka pom-poms out here. There's no hits in pom-poms.

I've still got half of Slovenia and certain say where Los Angeles and Dallas got a book in this frame. But no, but seriously, the wonder boy, go buy it.

“But my point is like, if his team's third in the standings and he's got that kind of statistical case,”

and Joker's team is, you know, what I might end up for. But there's significantly, you know, there's a significant gap. And Joker has not played his typical level of basketball since coming back from the injury. So he remains leading the league and reinforcing.

He's a first team all in being no brainer. He's an absolutely historically dominant player.

But we're talking about, you know, we're splitting hairs here. And I, again, you asked me what my ballot would be. I would have, Shae, Wimbie, Luka, Joker in that order and fifth at this point by pitching it for now. To this moment, updated draft King's line, Shae is minus 1,000. No, there's been some, okay.

Luka plus 1,000. That's 10 to 1. That's Luka, that's Luka fans are there. Those odds are poor. Wimbie plus 1,300, so 13 to 1.

No, plus 4,500. Yeah. But so Wimbie says. I think a bed on, I don't think a bed on Luka or Yokech, especially Luka at that number is enough. He's a good bed.

Right.

But what he could still, I still think Shae is going to win.

But Wimbie could overtake. They could have a bed 10 days. And I could have. I think right now, there is a debate. There should be, even though I think I should lead the race.

I'm trying to make sure that at the end of the season, there's no debate. That's what Wimbie said. Frankly, it's not within his power to make sure there's no debate.

“Because the only way there's, I think you can make a reasonable case that there's not a debate,”

is if the spurs overtake the thunder in the standings. And that means the thunder have to lose a few games. Even like the spurs winning out. The thunder still has a few games. And they're not at the thunder.

Or. They are. They don't have a lot of season. And I haven't been losing anyway. No.

Well, I'll tell you what. I like the fact that it's late March and this is still up in the air. And it could still go each way at the end of the day. That's what I really like more than anything. And I'd love that Wimbie is.

That's so damn entertaining. I tell you guys, he makes me crack up laughing multiple times of game just because he does things are so ridiculous. And then it's willing to grab the microphone and very eloquently beat his chest and say, I'm the baddest belief on the in a damn league.

More who collected podcast after this. OK, so the Denver nuggets over the weekend, they put it Portland Trail Blazers. Their injury report was empty. That's right.

Fully healthy. As we record this, they play Phoenix Tuesday night. He paid Watson is sitting out of that game because they have a back to back. And he's not going to play him back to backs coming off the hamstring. Additionally, over the weekend, where I guess was on Monday, Jalen Williams in Oklahoma City returned.

“And for the thunder's game on Wednesday, I can't remember who they're playing.”

They're in Boston. Play the cell phone. Oh, that's right, big game. There you go. Clean injury report.

I mean relative of a clean injury report in terms of the rotation players.

Their rotation players are all available for one of the first times the season.

I think it might be the. It's under five times they've had their top nine players all available. I mean they're starting line up. They've had six times all season. Right.

What's that? I was doing it. I was at this game last night. I wrote a story about Jalen Williams coming back, which I'll get to the overall number about it in a second. But, but band indicated something to me while we were, was getting ready for the.

It's a right to story that I wanted to just highlight. So I'm a man to set this up. How many times did the thunder starting five that started last night, which is. Chagos Alexander, who doored. Jalen Williams as a hard to shine and chat home.

How many times did they play together last season?

Believe it was 14 was 14 times. Plus the play last year. 14 times. Just to say about the regular season. So last season.

The Oklahoma City Thunder had their preferred starting line up. Start 14 times. They went 68 and 14 this year. They've had their preferred starting line up. They're like if everybody's healthy, here's where they're starting.

Play six times all season. They're combined record. Over those two seasons together. When you add it up is 125 and 29. And that's with having massive health issues both seasons.

And last year last year. Chet missed over half the season. These are max players. They've had key.

“They've had several key rotation players out for stretches of time of both last season.”

And this season. And there have won over 80% of their games. It's just a it's unbelievable. And I do think speaks to the fact that going into the playoffs. We just got done talking about Victor.

Victor is amazing. The spurs of that unbelievable season. The thunder planned Boston. Jason Tayden's back. We're going to talk about him.

They're having a great season. There's all these interesting teams at the top to east. We'll see what happens with the lakers and their late surge. You'll see what happens with Denver to coioca. You'll see what absolutely at the Edwards and the wolves.

The Oklahoma City Thunder. If they're healthy in the playoffs. Should be the gigantic favorites to win the title again. And it's going to be a huge disappointment if they don't. Because this team is the deepest team in the league.

“I think they have the best player in the league.”

And again, they have won 80% of their games last two years with all these injuries. So we haven't had a repeat title team in eight years. And that streak should end this spring. And if it doesn't, the thunder will have given it away in some former fish. I agree with everything until you said they will give it away.

Because listen, the nuggets who are also healthy. Damn you took it from him last year. It went to seven and seven. Aaron Gordon was playing on a hamstring that I can't believe he played on. It was a blowout in game seven, but still, they push from seven games. And listen, man, I know this bird's don't have a single second of playoff experience as a group. But as Victor women, you almost said, San Antonio dominated that season series.

And when be is a problem that I don't care who it is. Oklahoma City, Denver, Lakers. When be is a problem that's going to be hard to solve in a seven game series. That's fair. I was just quick to put out two things before Brian jumps in. I thought it was really interesting last night here in Jalen Williams talk after the game.

And he got asked about what's the difference between this year and last year for them. And he talked about their experience and he said,

I thought it was always kind of silly in the past when people talked about you feel different after you won.

But I could tell you this year after we won were a lot more confident. And it's really a real thing. And we feel it's a much different feeling having gone through it. And the other thing I'll say is he and you've chronicled this all year, man. He was adamant. His wrist is 100% and is totally back to normal.

And he's totally healthy. And you know, I had somebody a few weeks ago, compared this year's thunder team to last year's pacers team, which had sort of a similar path of season where they had all these injuries. And they never had anybody healthy until right about now. And they got in the playoffs and they were fully healthy when it mattered and they took off.

And I just think if this thunder team is fully healthy, they should beat everybody.

But I think we'll look back on them losing if they're healthy as them giving games away rather than somebody taking it from them based off to me, the talent advantage they should have in everybody else. There is things a big deal.

Because he missed the first 19 games.

We all remember he put off the surgery until after the playoffs. He missed the first 19 games. And then he shot it really poorly because he's still going to have full range of motion coming back off of that. And when he came back, he was just really all strawberry. He came for the game here in LA when he came back.

And he said that night, he was like, my wrist feels much better just because I was able to do things with it. Not playing games for covering from this hamstring injury that just helped a lot. And in the next game in Phoenix, he made his first 11 shots from the floor. 20 to 20 minutes 20 to 20 minutes 20 to 20 minutes and then he heard his hamstring and missed it another six weeks. Right.

And so I'm not surprised to hear him say that the wrist feels as good as it has. And you know, if he shoot in the ball well and he's back to being that big time. Number two offensive option, that's huge. And don't tell him, I don't want to hear how good the thunder's record is without Jay the willings is if that's some kind of knock against him. If you watch the playoffs last year, I don't need to sit here and tell you how important he is to their hopes for one in the championship.

“Yes, and this is a thing, I don't know where to put the line because I want to honor what I think is an incredible phenomenon happening with Victor Wimbiniama.”

And that he can be the type of player who can overcome. I mean, really one of the definitions of superstar for me is can you lead your team to a series where you don't have the better team, which is what LeBron did early in his career. It's what Luca did early in his career in 2011. Absolutely, it's like, you know, that's not the only definition of superstar, but it's one of them. And so I want to honor what I think is that power Victor, but also don't want to just respect what you are describing about temps,

which is a absolute growling powerhouse that is, you know, fully healthy. I want to point something out about Denver though, and we'll see what happens in tonight's game because I don't, you know, guaranteed jinx. After tonight when they play in Phoenix, they have nine games left. Seven of those nine games are at home, fully healthy. Also, they finish the season playing Oklahoma City and San Antonio.

I think in that order, the last two games of the season.

Now, it's possible that those games will not matter that the first and second seed will be established as possible that they will matter, we just don't know yet,

but the quote unquote hard games that Denver has left might not see their best teams, you know, they may not play their best team.

“So I would just say that Denver is in position to get that fourth seed, I think, if they panel their business and avoid injury.”

And I'll say something else, with the Lakers, they play the, the Pacers on Wednesday. I don't know if they win that game, the Pacers of lost 16 to 17. But the, I've got to guess. Look at Holland. The Lakers. Next three games are Pacers.

That's wizards. If they speed the tankers, it puts, it puts the Lakers in very strong position to get that three. So what I'm saying to you is the Nuggets and Lakers are in position to take seeds three and four. Whether or not they actually do, I don't know. But we will, we will definitely see.

Bon times, you had a story that's publishing on Wednesday about Jason Tatum. One of the more interesting things happening in the league right now.

There was a topic on first take when I was on there today about whether or not Tatum's return is cost.

The Celtics in some way, their offensive numbers are down. His shooting numbers are not great.

“I think it was spurred by Tracy McGrady.”

They were broadcasting a game in Boston on NBC the other night. And he was, you know, speculating that Tatum was having a negative effect. That may be some truth to that. In their terms, they're offensive production. Even though Jalen Brown's numbers are still.

He's still giving the same numbers shots. It's not like he came in and Jalen Brown is not getting the ball. As you guys know, before Tatum even came back, I said, I don't care what it looks like in March. I don't really care much.

I would look like an April. Like, here we look like on May 1st. I stand by it. But Bon times, you did a piece on Tatum and how he's looking. And I will hand the floor to you.

Yeah. I mean, I would say that was generally the opinion of everybody I talked to as well. Like, I think everybody agrees that based off Tatum's timeline for return, being 10 months out from attorney, attorney killies.

And the question is, how is he going to look in two months or in six weeks? And nobody can tell you really for sure, right? Like, nobody's got a crystal ball to know exactly how that's going to go.

“I think it's interesting in doing the story and looking at some stats and sort of analyzing how he's been.”

His usage rate going into this game on Wednesday is 30.8. He's had a usage rate somewhere between 30 and 32. Each of the last five years running. So his usage is right back to where it was before he got hurt. Now, is that the most optimal thing?

I would say probably not. However, Jason Tatum was probably going to come back and play like Jason Tatum whenever he came back. And to your point about, you know, is this hurting the Celtics or not? I mean, I'm sorry. I think this entire conversation is idiotic.

And I thought so from the moment it was brought up before he even came back, because look, Jordan Walls just had a really nice year. He's a good young player. Jason Tatum is essentially replaced Jordan Walls in the Celtics rotation. There is no world where the Celtics are worse off with Jordan Walls playing instead of Jason Tatum. Now, perhaps Jason Tatum will not get back to being Jason Tatum between now and the end of their season,

whether it's in the finals or the first round or the conference finals or whenever.

But what's undoubtedly true is the Celtics have a dramatically higher ceiling to try to win a championship. If they have Jason Tatum in the lineup, whether Jason Tatum is an okay player, a good player, or something close to the first team all in the A player he was each of the past four seasons. So, of course, it's a good thing for the Celtics that Jason Tatum is back. Now, he's not shooting the ball well.

He looks a little bit sluggish with the ball, which is, again, all normal stuff. His first step looks a little slow, that's all true. However, he remains a great rebounder. He's still a very good team defender. He still can make plays.

And he's still a guy who fills and gaps across the board, which is why he's always been a very positive player that's lifted up.

Whatever group of players is basically ever been out there with his entire crew with the Celtics. So, the biggest thing that the biggest message I got from basically everybody I talked to was, it's just going to be a matter of time to see how he looks over the next six weeks or so. And it's impossible to know where it lands, but it, you know, credit to him for being back. And, you know, we'll see how he can develop both between now and then.

But the idea that there's somehow worse off with him playing, I just, it's just a ridiculous conversation for anybody to have. Well, Jason Tatum's return is not going to cost the Boston Celtics championship. Jason Tatum's return raises the ceiling to a championship possibility. Right, it gives a chance to win one as opposed to not having one. Now, the doesn't mean it's going to happen, but like, to, it's pretty ridiculous to jump to any kind of knee jerk reactions based on.

Two weeks of, you know, shooting numbers essentially from a guy coming back off of the 10 month rehab.

“Like, did you think Tatum was just going to hit the ground running at an all NBA level?”

I'll fill it off of the killies. I mean, and the thing that spurred this story was Sunday night after said game that Jason, Tracy McGrady and the NBC crew is at against the wolves without anything yet. Words in Boston were the Celtics couldn't hit a shot and we would lead in lost. Tatum was had a pretty frank post game interview about all this stuff.

And at one point, he got asked about, you know, how have you sort of handled the ups and downs of trying to come back. And he said, quote, I didn't know how this blank was going to be. It's tough. In the moment you're trying to think about it, you just want to be Jason Tatum and feel like yourself again. But I'm not super man, so it's obviously going to take some time.

And it is obviously going to take some time.

He wasn't going to come back and meet with the B first team, I'll be a player.

And that's just the question is, can that ramp up period happen, fast enough for him to get back to being in all star, all NBA caliber player. By the time the playoffs come around, but I will say when the Celtics have struggled in the past, it's been when they've tended to hold the ball more rely on their three point shooting. And sometimes the three is going to look great. Sometimes the three is going to look bad. And with Tatum back, the one thing that does happen is they lean a little bit more into that and a little bit less into the helter sculptor fly around, you know, also play stuff that they've been doing around jail and brown this season.

But newsflash people who think that's a bad thing, that also gives the Celtics movement, again said, an actual championship ceiling, which is why this has been something we've talked about all season. It's why it matters, it's why it's great Jason Tamis back and we'll see what the next few weeks look like.

“Very important calves corner update before we go.”

Good. Jared Allen, Kenny Aconcens, as Jared Allen, you missed his ninth straight game on Tuesday night, is ramping up key piece of information on Eastern Conference playoff race, just set out a few minutes ago.

And you've got the pistons with Kate cutting him out the collapsed lung, sitting in first and holding on eight and two when Kate didn't play.

That's not a nice thing.

“The one seed between the Celtics losing that game to the wolves on Sunday night and then the pistons coming back and beating the lakers the next night without without Kate, I would say with five five losses up with.”

A handful of games to go. Yeah, they're going to be they're going to be the ones.

But I mean, even if they went under five hundred and the Celtics one out, I'm not sure that it would, I mean, if they would make five and six, I'm not sure.

The calves, the calves have the calves have the magic in the heat right now while we're doing this pod Tuesday night to play the magic then they play the heat Wednesday night to second night of it back to back. Here is state of Florida 10 game losing streak, by the way, go on, it's right. As of now, the the calves schedule in in April is the following at Warriors home for Pacers at Grizzlies, a home in home with the Hawks in home for the wizards. So you've got four automatic tankers in there and those two games against the Hawks are going to be fascinating because the Warriors are tankers at a stank.

Come on.

Well, the Warriors are the Warriors are very banged up with injuries.

Obviously, I was as booty at a really unfortunate injury towards Patela on Monday, staff probably could still be out then.

“The point is those two games against the Hawks are going to be super interesting, I think.”

The last week of the season because that could be an opportunity for the calves potentially manipulate their way into whatever. See they want from two to four and it also could be the difference between the Hawks being in the play in or being fifth or six because that whole group of teams from five to ten is three or four games apart and total. Yes, so those games on Wednesday and Friday, that final week of the season are going to be once to watch. Anyway, Jared Allen might be coming back soon. All right, thank you so much.

“To make man and bond them, thank you to Jackson and the rest of our producers, thank you for listening and watching to who collected.”

Talk to you later this week. Adios Migos. At tab, we're on for the NBA News by one. On any Thursday or Friday NBA matchup, if you'll play a points like Mrs. by one, tab will still pay it out as a winner. Now that's something to shout about.

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