Best Of: Laverne Cox /Comic Ali Siddiq

Sometimes it's about really big things, but most times, the little mysteries are the best.

“Our lost and found is currently filled with pants. I don't know what I've never seen this happen, this is true.”

Mysteries have every size each week, this American life, wherever you get your podcasts. From WHY and Philadelphia, this is fresh air weekend, I'm Tanya Mosley in Los Angeles. Today, LeVern Cox, for over a decade, she's been one of the most visible trans women in America, and her new memoir Transcendent. She writes about growing up in Mobile, Alabama, and the bullying and harassment she faced is a feminine child who could not conform to what

was expected of her. She writes about how she got through it. I, in a way, leaving her body

and going somewhere else in her mind. A lot of the time, that place was music and dance.

I just love pushing the grocery cart and then dancing with the grocery cart as if it was like a

“partner. Did you have headphones on, Walkman? No darling, the music within my head, and the groove”

is in the heart. Also, we hear from comedian Ali Sadik. He served six years in a Texas prison, and turned his life into some of the most watched storytelling in comedy. This message comes from the podcast, Five Miles From Home. When a high school student disappears from a small Nevada town, a story of betrayal and shocking confessions emerges, hosted by Dateline's Keith Morrison, search Five Miles From Home to follow now.

This week on the NPR politics podcast, we're digging into the massive wave of tech money flooding the midterms, with a growing appetite and DC to regulate AI. AI companies and AI interests really want to be involved in picking who is going to write that kind of legislation. We break down a proxy battle over the future of AI regulation. This week on the NPR politics podcast. There have been some fantastic movies released this year, and we know you can't see them all.

So we're recommending some great films that might have flown under the radar, add to your watch list. Listen to pop culture happy hour via the NPR app or wherever you get your podcasts. Every episode of its been a minute, NPR is what's happening in culture podcast. Starts by asking three questions. Who? How? Why now? If the culture is asking it, we're talking about it. At NPR, we stand for your right to be curious and indulge your cultural

curiosity. Follow its been a minute wherever you get your podcasts and we'll break down the zeitgeist topics that are filling your feed. This is Fresh Share Weekend. I'm Tanya Mosley, and my guest today is Laverne Cox. Chances are, you met her the way most of the world did, as a transgender woman in prison, doing hair and fighting for her right to gender affirming care in the Netflix series Orange is the new black. Listen to what I need my dosage. I've given

“five years, $80,000 in my freedom for this. I'm finally home supposed to be. Do you understand?”

I can't go back. I'd like to help you. Unfortunately, you have elevated levels of AST and ALT, which could mean liver damage. That's both that could mean anything. We're going to take you off your hormones entirely, until we can schedule an ultrasound, get a clean read. But that could take months. I can offer you an antidepressant. That's Laverne Cox is Sophia Versett in 2014. The role made her the first openly transgender

person nominated for a prime time Emmy in an acting category and put her on the cover of time magazine next to the words, "The transgender tipping point." For decade now, she's been one of the most visible trans women in America. But the woman on that magazine cover was carrying

things she'd never told anyone, not even her therapist. She's written a new memoir,

titled Transcendent, and it arrives at a moment when her right to simply exist is being debated in state houses across the country. But the book makes clear that for Cox, none of this is new. Long before she had the words for it, she was bullied for who she was. Her very existence, as she writes, was in a front to the order of things. And she's been fighting for the right to simply be her entire life. Laverne Cox, welcome to Fresh Air. It's such an honor to have you. Thank you so

much for having me. I have not heard. It's rare that I just hear the clip from Orange and it's been so long and I got it brings back memories and it's really what's interesting is even for actors

immediately in the character again and I'm in the emotion of the scene and so I'm immediately like feeling what I was feeling. When we shot this, this is 2012, that we shot it. It was funny. I was just like, yeah, did you laugh? What did you make you laugh? No, with the end, when I'm in the writing is so fantastic, I maybe I can offer you an antidepressant, it's hilarious. Well Orange is a new

black was revolutionary for the time and your character, I was very surprised to learn from the book

that you weren't a regular reoccurring character, you were guest star. Yes, and I mean, that's really a contractual thing. So I was in, I don't remember how many episodes I was in the first season, but I remember it was a day-to-day thing. I didn't have like a contract the first season. I was literally a day player, guest star, day player, but I was kind of making day player rates. I wasn't making like guest star rates. The second season I was, my salary was like a guest star rate and I had

“like I think a seven episode guarantee and I ended up using me for nine episodes. So I was there a lot”

and they wrote generously for me. I think because that my backstory episode came, it was the third

episode of the show that people thought. I felt like you were a cast member. Yes. Yeah. I think people think because so much of the work that you have done feel so true to life, it's so much of that show might be your life. And I think it's part of what makes this book really eye-opening because we're learning things about you that we didn't know. I want to start with the beginning of your book. Okay. Because your eight years old, you decide to start at a moment when you're eight

years old. You are at a park near your family's apartment in Mobile, Alabama. You're doing your kid thing and just playing out and there are these boys that come up to you, the caro way boys. And

“they begin teasing you and then it gets violent. Can I have you pick up the story from there?”

During one of these teasing sessions, why you talk like that? One of the caro way boys shoved me. I don't even remember which one. They were interchangeably menacing figures. This time, I couldn't keep my balance and found myself falling, hitting the gravel of the playground.

I scowled annoyed at first. But then, looking up at them, I saw the switch flip in their eyes.

I saw that flicker of threat. The way their stances shifted into those of aggression that made the hairs on my arm stand on end. They were disgusted by me. I was no longer a friend, up here. Someone to play with. I was an easy target. I was praying. Their fist landed in unison on my face, my chest. You see this f*ck? Look at this sissy, like a girl. One of them sneered. Half laughing and glee as they

punched me. Their voices blended into one, as they pelted me. Hurling every name they could think of, and my instinct. From this far back, as the days of daycare bullying took over, rolling me onto my side and into a ball. The words rang in my ears. Those from the past intermingling with those of the careway boys. I'd heard these words before. At first, I'd not know what they meant. But now,

after years of it, I recognize them. Words that meant I was different from the other kids. A girl, when I should have acted, like a boy. Lover, and thank you for reading that passage. You go on to say that you curl up in a ball and it doesn't stop. They get energized. And finally, you're able to make it home. And you get into your apartment and your mom sees you. And she doesn't say what happened to you. She immediately says, "You let them beat you up like this.

“Did you do to make them do this to you?" Why did you want to start the book off with that particular story?”

I don't know. It was my life. I think that was like the physical violence of the other children that I was persistent throughout my childhood. And then,

if I was okay, she made it my fault. And it just, in a way, it sort of epitomizes that kind of feeling,

“of not feeling protected, not feeling safe. You're sort of encapsulates a lot of childhood.”

I'm reading that again. I have to say, it's still difficult to read. It's still difficult to yeah. You grew up inside of people's reactions to you and a feminine child, a gender non-conforming teenager, a trans woman. And everything that you, you received, it was like race, gender, and class

converging into one person. What really struck me from that very first story throughout the entire

book is the shame and hatred that people carried, they took it out on you. And it even happened in your home. Mm-hmm. Yes. Whew. I'm just trying to gather my resilience. And like, I guess I'm like having, there's like reading that. I'm just like, I'm emotional. I'm angry. It's like it's hard to read that. Um, obviously, I lived it, but it's hard to read about it again. Um, I guess I understand as an adult. Um, like, I'm angry at the boys. I'm angry at my mother. I'm,

“I want to protect that little child. Um, I'm just so, I'm so angry. And I think like, um,”

yeah, I don't know if I can, I can be able to read exes in this book again. We'll see. I'm just,

I'm so pissed. Um, I'm so angry. And I'm so hurt. And I'm so, um, what are the words? What, the anger comes from you having to experience it. And it's, um, there's also like the anger of, um, all the kids that I've met who were trans or queer, who are still experiencing this. And the anger of knowing that, um, in states that have, um, passed, um, anti-trans laws that the bullying, um, percentage of bullying is like skyrocketing in those states. You are a lot of

story. I agree. A lot of stories, but that's actually those are statistics. Like, there's the

“anecdotes, but those are the stats from the Trevor Project, um, because to manufacture the consent”

to pass, um, anti-trans laws that would ban gender-forming care for kids and, and the, all the minutes of trans girls and sports, all like two of them. Um, there's the, the rhetorical piece that happens in the media that is dehumanizing and stigmatizing trans people. And it creates a permission structure. If like your, you know, governor and your state legislators are doing, if you're, um, you know, teachers and, you know, pundits on TV are doing it, then like, of course,

kids are in bold and to do it. And that makes me so angry. Um, and, you know, it's like the, the sadness is like, you know, it's just the loneliness and I couldn't process it fully at the child. And I don't know. It just really sucked. Um, this was so, it was torture to write this. And the reason I wrote it is to, um, to tell the truth, I'm like, I just don't think it's, it makes any sense to write a book and like to clean stuff up and to like not be honest and not be,

Rob. Our guest today is Loverne Cox. Her new memoir is called Transcendent, more of our conversation after a short break. I'm Tony Mosley and this is Fresh Air Weekend. This message comes from the podcast, five miles from home. When a high school student disappears from a small Nevada town, a story of betrayal and shocking confessions emerges, hosted by Dateline's Keith Morrison, search five miles from home to follow now. Each story you hear on planet money starts with a question.

What happens if we refund tariffs? Why are grocery so expensive? An NPR we stand for your right to be curious because the forces shaping our world can be hard to see. Follow NPR's planet money wherever you get your podcasts and start seeing how the economy really works. For instant clarity on world events in just five minutes, listen to NPR news now, new episodes drop every hour with the latest on US politics, international news, the economy, health, science, technology and more, five minutes

I want to go back to your home and your mom and your decision to write all of this down because the majority of the book takes place in your childhood. Tell me about Mobile Alabama and that home that you grew up in. How would you describe it? Mobile is interesting. I go back now and I find it quaint and way too hot in the summer, but like the Israelis, they would like some beautiful things about in all these anti-bellum homes that still exist on their government street and there's something

quaint about parts of it and there's just a lot of trauma though, literally on the streets. If you're going to the neighborhood where my mom still lives, there's trauma on those streets for me. Is that a part of town? What part of town is that? We would call it down the bay. Down above and it's where most of the black people in Mobile live and yeah and it's downtown, it's downtown Mobile

“which I think is fantastic, but because it be in full square and like the monograph parades,”

monograph started in Mobile in this country, not in New Orleans, some people might think into the monograph parades or have been downtown and I love it. And you grew up with your mother and your twin brother? And my twin brother, yes. Yeah, Mobile though, when I was growing up there, I was just, I just, I needed to get out. It was awful. It felt repressive and I just knew I needed to be,

the second I discovered there was New York. I knew I had to be there. And so most of my childhood,

I was in Mobile but I was in my imagination, I was in New York or I was on a TV screen or I was on a movie screen or I was on a Broadway stage. Yeah, it's interesting the book is called Transcendent and in a way, it sounds like dissociating was your way to transcend as a child. What were some of the ways

“that you would try to transcend? I always had, it was always music in my head which is”

such a wonderful gift and so I just, from the second I was walking, I was dancing and I was dancing I danced everywhere and it just kind of like, it just took me away, it took me away from like so it was because from me when I danced, it was music but then there was like a character, there was a person that I could play. So I was like in a character and then I was, it would be a new setting and so like all the times this movie would be at the supermarket and the grocery store.

I just love pushing the grocery cart and then dancing with the grocery cart as if it was like a partner. Did you have headphones on? Walkman? No darling, the music groove is in the heart. A Walkman, this is like, I mean, I was five years old, it would have been 1977, did Walkman's even exist? We couldn't afford one if it did. The music within my head and the groove is in the heart and actually in the supermarket they would play music and I remember loving

TV show themes. I would learn the worst of TV show themes and like sing along and dance to them.

So there was always like a song and a rhythm and then a character and movement and it was

it was so amazing that I got to do that I had that, that I could go there and then when I discovered that you could study dance. So I'm going to take dance classes, I'm going to take dance classes, I five years old and I won't give away that moment from the book. It's a little of humorous moment about that, but finally in third grade I got to start studying dance and that really

“that was the best thing ever for me. This disassociation, this going to all of these different”

places. I mean this would happen to you everywhere at home at school and there's a particular moment in school where you've got your little fan and you're in your classroom and something happens that kind of stays with you for the rest of your life. That was certainly a moment. So we had gone to six flags in a church trip and I had some spending money and bought a handheld fan at the GIF shop at six flags and as the women in church with band themselves and his Scarlet or Hera

would fan herself at single with the wind on television. It seemed like it was always on an Alabama

go figure and I was having a Scarlet or Hera moment fanning myself in the beginning of the day and third grade and my third grade teacher Miss Ridge Wang says you they are come here and bring that thing with you and she marches me down the hall to the fourth grade teacher and tells me to show her what I was doing with my fan and so I proceed to fan myself the way I had in class and she

marches me down the hall to the fifth grade teacher and tells me to do it again and I was like well maybe

“I didn't do it you know it's maybe I didn't fully commit it so I committed more and really”

really dropped into Scarlet and then later that day my mother comes in and and told tells me she got Nicole from the school from Miss Ridge Way and Miss Ridge Way said that that I would end up in New Orleans wearing a dress if we didn't get me into therapy right away and to stand now is what some people would refer to as conversion therapy I guess there's different kinds but at the time after three sessions with the therapist the solution or the you know the thing that they

suggested what we do was inject me with testosterone and that the idea was that that was supposed to

make me more masculine and I would not that there was a hormone issue this was this would have been 1980

yeah right in 1981 I was eight nine years old I hadn't even started going through pre relays so they were suggesting injecting an eight nine year old with testosterone which sounds insane to me my mother thank God said no to that and so it was I just felt relief that that didn't happen to me it's so fascinating to read about your early days in New York and it sounds like you were pretty discerning about what seemed you were part of because you didn't see yourself fitting into the

drag queen world you understood and appreciated what they did and you understood with these other groups like there were all these other groups and you were part of a club kid group I was so so there was a very like in the early 90s there was this kind of there was a downtown kid so with the uptown kids like I was a downtown girl I was East Village really East Village because the gender non-conforming thing that androgynous thing that I was doing when I moved to New York

in 1993 fit better in the East Village but the time I made it to New York I was I was wearing

“dresses lots of vintage things I remember had a black lame vintage dress that I would wear and then I”

would incorporate dancewear so I could go out and dance and and really do my thing so a good chunky heel platform heel and my head was shaved and I shaped my trousers and drew them on and a lot of people and I thought Grace Jones because if they look because look was her age in draw tennis the drag scene I wasn't in but I also like I had I had internalized transphobia and like for me there was because by this time by the time I made it to New York I had also

red bell hooks and so I had and I'd read other feminist writers who were very skeptical of drag and this performance of womanhood that was sort of seen as mockery by some feminist and so I was sort of contending with that and trying to navigate my newfound feminist politics with like my gender and not wanting to sort of like feed into some sort of retrograde idea of womanhood so there was also that with introduced in college but the underneath all of that was like a deep deep

transphobia that I didn't realize that red is discernment but really it was it was a lot of it was like

“I was terrified of ending up in New Orleans wearing a dress because I think in my mind too if I”

embraced the womanhood the girlhood that I knew I I was and in my mind I thought that like on top of like you know all the stigma that you are a degenerator something that I think I didn't turn lights about trans people it's also that I didn't think I could be smart even though I loved

smart women there was something I think there was just something about I was never presented with

images of drag performers or trans women on television if I ever even saw trans women on television at the time that were articulate and intellectual and and even as I introduced the club scene there was so many really really smart drag performers who were just brilliant artists but I needed I needed time to like let all that stuff go and I just needed time. Lover and Cox it's been such a pleasure to meet you and thank you for this conversation. Thank you this has really been wonderful.

Lover and Cox's new memoir is called Transcendent. My next guest is Ali Sadik he's a comedian but that word undersells it what he really does is tell stories true ones from his own life and he's told so many of them that while watching his specials I realized Sadik is giving us a memoir delivered one set at a time. For instance a few years back he went viral with the story about surviving a prison riot Sadik served six years for cocaine trafficking arrested four days after his

than a dozen specials most of them independent on YouTube with millions of views and his 2022 series

“domino effect. He traces his life growing up in Houston starting at 10 the year he went to live”

with his father and first got into trouble all the way through the choices that landed him in prison. This month he has a new special called My Father. It's about everything that passed between Sadik and his dad before his father died in 2018. It premieres on YouTube June 21st. Here's a clip.

My dad had a thing about how he dressed. My dad always wore tailor-made suits. This is when

he was when he was on his note when he was on his note because he was a it's not a lot of me can say how they how they felt about the pop. I really wanted to look like this man. He was tall, tall, jet black, had a lot of charisma by himself but he just wasn't an ideal father.

“My dad asked me one time. I'm seeing at his house and my dad is seeing it.”

I mean why you don't never see them bad about your mom on stage. Ali Sadik, welcome to fresh air. Thank you for everything. Then your timing is great and I was thinking when I was watching this that there is really nothing like remembering something funny about somebody after their gone. It's like the truest way the most purest way to grieve them. But I was just wondering, watching this, if your dad felt some

kind of way about being in your act, what do you think he'd say about you doing this entire

special about him? He never actually felt any type of way about being in my act. He just wanted to know

when I was going to say something negative about somebody else and I just him. I get a lot of views but it's definitely 10 views, 15 views that I missed because my dad will go to the library and he would look me up on the computer and watch all of my stuff and he would call them tell me. I just seen something that I watched about 15 times. I'm always missing those 10 or 15 views that I know that I would get from him. He left when you were three but you'd see him every

blue moon but then around 10 he comes back into your life. You went to live with him and it's seems like he was very much due as I say, not as I do. When did you first understand that contradiction? I mean, probably the first year I lived with him. Like go, my dad was, my dad was like I say, I don't think he was ready. I don't think he was ready to have his son with him. But yes, he asked for you to live with him. He asked, but I don't think he was ready. You know,

people ask for a lot of things they're not ready for. And I'm like not a human though. I didn't think

“I think a human was a part of that but he definitely wasn't ready yet. You know, because he”

couldn't have been. When I looked back at him, it's no way that you was ready for me to come live with you. Because you hadn't calm down yet. You know, just the story of him waking me up saying that he was getting ready to go to San Antonio. And I'm 10 and I got to go to school. The more like you know, bro. Like, what am I supposed to do? Did you even go to San Antonio? He's like, you know what you mean? No, you just said, well, get ready to go to school. You know how to

Abraham, that's not how it is going, man. I've never been in the house by myself before. That's

all too. Ali, I mean, is it true that, okay, you tell this story about him putting cocaine on a sore wisdom tooth? And I was wondering, is this true or is this just for less than 100% true? That's why I describe it so vividly. See, that's the thing about when I tell a story, I want people to understand. I, I, I, I describe all the even little things. So people understand that this is a true story because you can't, it's hard to make up little things. You know, you can make up big things.

But little intricate details about something like, you know who was there? James and Ivory and James was the one that saw me sitting on the step. And he's like, what's up? Because my dad name is Lember

two. And then my daddy called me over in the music and put that cocaine on my own my two. I said,

“this man, I didn't even know that's what it was. And for I just know it was the stuff that was in”

the cool, the cool whip tub that was in the refrigerator. Wait, he kept the cocaine in a cool whip tub in the refrigerator. And yeah, the big cool whip thing, you know, our cool whip is coming in a little container. Oh, yeah. And you reuse them. Yeah. And he put it in, that's what the cocaine

was inside the fridge. And then as I thought about that earlier, like I told the story and I never

even realized how super irresponsible he was. I am 10. You don't think I like cool whip. But things that could happen, you know, the things that could happen, if I would have, because he always had strawberries, my dad loves strawberries, right? So he always had strawberries in the house. And I was like, y'all, what I thought about, if I would have just took one of his strawberries and put it in that cool whip, both thing and it was cool whip. Because I still

would have ate it even though I would have thought the cool whip was bad. I don't know how the

“cool, it's, it's, it's fizzing out. And then I'm like, that's what it would have looked like to me.”

I said, he, he was so, so irresponsible. It's crazy. Okay, he, he, he dips, he dips a little cocaine

on that sore wisdom tooth. What, what happened to you? Never had a problem that wasn't tooth

can't. Never even needed to have it taken out, huh? Never, I, I probably still got that tooth in my mind right now. It's never had a problem. I, I don't even remember getting my wisdom tooth taken out ever. Um, luckily, I was, I never, I don't have an addictive personality. I can just stop doing stuff like, hopefully that was it because my dad was insane. And I had told that story before before, before I ever, before I ever aired on anything. And I remember he was at the show

“when I did it. And he was like, I can't believe you remember that. We're listening to my conversation”

with comedian Ali Sadik. We'll hear more after a short break. This is fresh air weekend. This message comes from the podcast five miles from home. When a high school student disappears from a small Nevada town, a story of betrayal and shocking confessions emerges, hosted by Dateline's Keith Morrison, search five miles from home to follow now. On consider this NPR's afternoon news podcast, we cover everything from politics to the economy to the

world, but every story starts with a question. And NPR, we stand for your right to be curious. It makes sense of the biggest story of the day and what it means for you. Follow consider this wherever you get your podcasts. Interesting the world gets. Let's go back to to young Ali Sadik before the comedy. You are 14 years old. You start selling drugs. You like to joke on stage. You say I was a pharmaceutical

sales rep. By the time though that the feds got you, you were 19. You were in college at Texas Southern University. And this is the ironic part. You were actually planning to stop selling drugs when you were caught. How close were you to quitting? I had stopped actually. I was done. I was wrapped up. And I got a phone call to come help assist you know. And I went out of me feeling obligated to, okay, I, you know, I hold your back. But I was, I was done. It was, it would have become

like what am I doing? You know, because you started in the first place because you, you wanted money.

You wanted to, you wanted your own money. Yeah. And I think I, I fight so hard now to explain that it was a character flaw. It was like no manhood of responsibility in that because I could have just worked for money. You know, I could have just did something else. I could have, it's, it's so many things that I could have done versus being so destructive to a community. And I'm going to be an asked. Ali, what do you think that you're going to blow up? And my honest answer was when I pay back

of that harm you did. That's interesting. When I pay back society for the, for the destruction,

“and I think that when you are a person that has really done things and you have really changed”

your life and you, you think back on these things, you can't help but to have a heavy heart. I remember, I was in San Francisco, the, the homeless population is so crazy and I met this comedy central festival as a comedy festival and I'm walking from a hotel to the festival and I'm there

for days and I keep trying to find different ways to get that not to run into homeless people

and I didn't walk five blocks down, 10 blocks down, 10 blocks this way, I walked every which way and couldn't and I remember it was in the morning and I was on my way to prayer and I just stopped in the streets and I just started sobbing and I remember saying how much of this is my fault because I have been so destructive and reckless in my behavior. I just don't understand, like, obviously this is not the first generation, this is the generation that was affected by the first

generation of what I did. You can't conceive the magnitude of destruction that you do when you

sell drugs in a community. You know, as people doing things that they would probably never do

“in order that that's ruining relationships that's that's what child didn't get fed because they”

they mam and they father decided to do this and what what uncle or aunt stole something like what did I do? Did you and your dad ever talk about this because you know, I mean he sold drugs and then you went on to sell drugs. We never talked about it because my dad ended up using drugs. That was the the the lick that society took back. I remember a story that I told about some young guys that I come on to come on the blocking there and told me they robbed

these old guys and I looked at the stuff that they had and and I made them put it in the bag because I recognized the stuff and then I went and took my dad and his friend and stuff back and I said man what the what were you doing over there and my dad blamed on his friend and I'm over there with him he got me robbed and my mom I told my mom about it later and my mom said

“he's probably using drugs and I said now he told me he wasn't using drugs and that's what she told me”

why didn't put to that and we had twice since we've been apart and so I went back and told him I said hey I thought you said you weren't just using drugs and mom and he said told you that your mom when your mom was um my my my my hip or my hip or right this man is nuts like he's so even when he's doing something crazy he's still funny he's so crazy so the unfortunately the rumor around on my dad is going as is an overdose and I don't believe that I think that that's

what people want to say but I don't not believe either the rumor that he died because of an overdose yeah yeah yeah yeah I know he hadn't been so if you hadn't been doing something and then you decide I'm gonna do it one time you know you don't know what you're all can take on that so my dad just had a heart attack I don't know well you said it's a rumor do you believe that it might be true um I'll leave it to not wanting to know if it is not I don't it doesn't change the

I'd rather live in the hour last days of you know we played chess about six hours against each other we played chess so long that I stayed overnight another day and then went right back of his house and started we started playing chess again and it's my dad was a great chess player

and I've never I beat him twice and since I've learned you know six years old he told me it's six

I beat him twice ever so I'd rather stay in that lane of me and him play chess for I was only in versus if he overdosed enough I'll leave thank you for sharing this and and that guilt you feel about selling drugs that you carry that because I feel like I I kind of feel like I feel it when I watch you especially in this this documentary really that you did called Ali Sadik from inside it's this real conversation filmed inside of a Texas County jail and I actually want to

play a clip of it because it is not a comedy special it's you and a room within mates and you are

standing in front of them talking to them telling them stories for almost two hours straight about your experience being locked up and in this clip you're talking about the psychological effects of being locked up which included you remembering your inmate number which you call a spin number

“let's listen as the only as they've been here before as we do they remember they were original”

spin number this is that hearts me I've been out for twenty five years almost twenty six years

sixty seven ninety three forty six I can't forget this number it's engraving my head

like my so security number this my slavery number sixty seven ninety three forty six that's my guest Ali Sadik and his YouTube special from inside a conversation within mates and what goes on to happen after you rattle off your number the guys start blurting out their numbers two what does a signify that you can remember your spin number thirty years after your out of prison that you did not get out of this situation unscathed you may have survived it

but you still have wounds I've been out twenty nine years at this point even if I'm at home by myself I'm a locked bearer on door I still know this number so it still things that you may survive but you don't get out unscathed you're going to lose

“some skin in this game and I think that these psychological wounds are different than my physical”

wounds my physical wounds start to fade why haven't these wounds faded yet I read that you know as you're doing your time that's when you start to think when I get out of here I could probably have my hand in comedy and I was wondering where they're where their people that you were also like watching or studying or thinking about as you were thinking about what type of comic you want it to be I don't know what I thought was standing up I actually didn't even know how to even start it's like

when I think about this journey I literally started from a place of zero like I had zero information on how to become a comic zero information of where to go zero like I was at scratch

“and so when I think about like I don't ever not feel successful because of like yo I”

I did what I said I was going to do when I got out I was going to become a comic not knowing how to do it I want to talk to you briefly about parenthood about you being a father you telling me earlier

I mean you joke about this a lot but your kids are getting a very different father than you got which

“I actually want to play a clip from your latest special where you talk about”

taking your son Hassan to a concert to the elements earth wind and fire when he's 11 let's listen I know that I am a better father than my father was and I'm supposed to be I'm supposed to be

just by my son's first concert and my first concert with my father

my son Hassan he's 11 his first concert was earth wind and fire and he asked to go he asked go my my son came in to me and said father because he's very up across

“he said I would like to attend the concert I said Hassan what concert would you like to attend”

he said I would like to go see the elements and I tear it up I tear it up if I want to go see the elements and I say wait who all the elements Hassan is it's a little white internet group that you've been listening to Hassan said no father they're falling down on this earth wind and fire I immediately ran and got them tickets I wanted to get them tickets in my son me and my son going to see earth wind and fire he is 11

he's 11 is oh we went to this first concert me and him we go we get to the concert

Hassan is the youngest person in his whole entire concert and I know that for facts because I am the second youngest person that was my guest today in his latest special my father and I'll leave that whole special you marveling at your boozy kid you know you have built a soft life for him on purpose but I wonder this because I mean as a parent who also grew up a certain way do you ever look at your

son and worry that the thing that made you some of the positive things you know not all that that challenging stuff you went through but like the positive stuff might also be the thing like

“you're keeping from him too I know I don't I think that the soft the softness of his life now”

I hope that he continues to desire that and you know he goes to his own certain struggles you know because it's a certain struggle that happens in softness as well but you know whether he won't oyster the crab you know it's the limbo form so he got the you know you know choices choices but yeah he I I love how he's living I love the way that he lives I I applaud him and I just hope

that you know he comes I don't know other side and always this like this and and

loves being a kid and being gives his children the opportunity to be a kid and I always have a softness for me I need some of my role me around when I get old so hopefully hopefully he's there you know taking me to go eat oysters and you know asking me do I want to go to a bonnet James concert or something you know I just I just love him I just love the softness of his life I'll use a dig it has been such a pleasure to talk with you thank you so much for this special

and your time pleasure is all mine I thank you very very much I'll use a digs new special is called my father fresh air weekend is produced by Teresa Madden fresh air executive producer is Sam Brigger our technical director and engineer is Audrey Bentham our interviews and reviews are produced and edited by Philis Myers Roberta Chorock and Marie Baldonato, Lauren Crinsle, Lonek Nazareth,

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