Cosmetic Office Treatments: Should you be collagen banking? Don't get a laser before doing this first. Over 35? You need a different approach.

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Details are in the show notes, so hit subscribe, start listening, and thanks for being in it with us. Most women getting in office commitments are skipping the one thing that makes those treatments work. This episode gives you the right order of operations from your daily routine, all the way up to lasers, and how to find a provider who will tell you no when no is the right answer. Your skin will thank you for this episode. Let's get in it.

This is the podcast for women in their 30s and 40s who are building, raising, and evolving all at the same time. This isn't a highlight reel or hustle culture or toxic optimism, and it's definitely not a quick fix. It's honest conversations about your health, relationships, and ambition, and what it actually takes to live this chapter of your life well. If you're a woman who is building something, raising someone, or searching for something you can't

quite name yet, and trying to take care of yourself in the middle of it all, you are in it. This podcast is for you. Less noise, better information. If you've listened before,

welcome back, and if this is your first time, welcome.

I'm Ashley Buckler, and let me give you a little life hack. Get a best friend who is also a skin care expert. My co-host Jordan Harper is my bestie. She's on speed dial for all things skin care in office treatments. Should I get this laser? Do I need Botox in my chin? Do I need Botox in my traps? She is my go-to for everything. She is a world-class expert in all things skin care in office treatments. I'm happy to be your little guru for skin care in office

treatments, because my co-host, Ashley Buckler, is kind of like my therapist, and she can literally turn, and she goes deep into processing like our feelings. I also call her like my brine Brown, and you know, she's probably the most expensive therapist I've ever had, but I'm happy to have her. She pays me to be her friend. Okay, something that I've heard about, and I'm curious if you've heard about this. I just keep seeing it all over TikTok, so I want to know if you've heard of this.

It's something that I've seen. It's just called collagen banking. No, you have not. Wow, and this girl's, this girl's on the TikToks. I don't want to talk it. I know what's up. Yeah, I will send Jordan opens up when we get together. I'm like, oh, there's really funny TikToks in our DMs. She'll pull it up. There's like 50 messages. I've said, hasn't said me one. Yeah, really get content to be honest. I know, and TikTok stuff from me.

I need to, it's actually one of my goals to get better at it this year. So collagen banking,

feel like you're going to be excited about this. So first of all, I want you to guess, do you think

it's good or bad? Yeah, which one is the spot girl? Good thing I have no problem being wrong. I think that it's good. Yes, you're in fact correct. So this is a TikTok trend that I want to talk about that is actually good. It's not new, but collagen banking is something I love, and I feel like as a nurse practitioner, as a person who's been in the aesthetic cosmetic dermatology space for a decade. I have seen a lot, and the good thing is is that there's not much new under the sun. That's

“it. And honestly, that should be really like encouraging, because I think every other day there's”

like another TikTok trend. There's another like treatment coming out. There's another skincare product that like we're ingredient that we need to be using. I'm not saying progress is not happening because it surely is, but there's a lot of tried and true principles, whether it's from skincare or office treatments, that you can utilize to make your life easier. And what I saw time and time again, with patients coming in, or even just friends, everyone wants to look and feel their best.

I would say the majority of people just want to feel like themselves. The themselves met 2% better. Yeah, yeah, but okay, before I get into college and baking. So what I see time and time again, whether it was like an office or even just like online now, like things that want to be trending, right? Because like we've got to bring new like hype and energy into things, but the good thing is, and honestly, like I find this really reassuring is like tried and true principles, whether it's

from skincare or office treatments, they are still true. They are still true, and you can still

“utilize them in your day to day. So you should be able to like take away from this episode,”

as clarity around where and how to build your skincare routine. And then also know how to approach

getting an office treatment, if that's something that you need. Here's the thing. I have done in

office treatments for years as a provider and then I've also taken part of them as a patient. I probably started getting them way younger because I was working in office and inevitably it's like, should we get Botox at 24? I mean, probably not necessary, but if it's free, why not? So anyways, we'll get to how to select a provider too, because if you start getting treatments and you start looking a little bizarre, that's another set of concerns that I personally have. I feel like as a provider

and getting treatments or as a patient getting treatments, I want to make sure that I'm doing things that are going to be promoting long-term skin health. This is the only skin that we get. And so

routine and set up a treatment plan with a provider that is going to give you like beautiful results.

And do you don't have to worry about what you say? Actually, there's just confusing. There's just

“so much out there that's just noise that the thing is, honestly, like you don't even have to listen to it.”

So tell her about the, tell her about the text message that you got, that with all the list of questions. So I texted my friend Lindsay. Lindsay is a researcher and so when she wants to know about something like she's going to go deep and hard and long on it to figure it out and she's very into an office treatment and keeping up with her skin health and yet again. So I texted her last night, what are your questions about an office treatments or skin care for Jordan? She sends me back

a list like I hadn't heard of some of these words, metamorphosis, morphitis, like BL to do to do.

And I don't know all those things, but I haven't researched them, but like she had all these

questions about very specific and office treatments, but Jordan, what I'll tell you. So on our side, not having a medical background. The reason we feel like we have to go so deep into the knowledge of the space is because there's a lack I think of trust and also just not knowing what to ask for. Like I don't know where to start. If I were to go into an office treatment and I'm talking like lasers, facials, I have no idea how many facials I should be getting. I couldn't understand.

A great. I understand skin care now very thoroughly, obviously, but like when it comes to an office, I wouldn't even know what to ask, what I need, whatever. So the fear is, as the person who doesn't have this background on like what all these treatments are, is that they're just going to sell me something that I don't actually need. It's going to cost me $1,500. And I'm going to barely see right a difference. Right. That's the fear. So like I get that we approach that as the patient

without the medical because you having all that in your back pocket is very helpful because you can quickly sit through like, yes, this, know that. Like I'm filtering like okay, thanks a lot.

“Like I'm not going to be doing that. Yeah. So here's what I would say. The very first thing you should do”

and before you even consider getting an office treatment, you have got to get your skin care routine on lock and that's actually very simple. It's not hard because and I use this analogy all the time, but people a lot of times think that you can go and get an office treatment one to two times a year

and then like you're good and you don't have to do anything else. And I always think of the example

of okay, if you're going to the dentist, one to two times a year, but you are not brushing your teeth in between a day to day, right? Like morning and you grow. Yeah. And also okay. What do you think you're like mouth in your oral health is going to be? It's not going to be good. These same thing applies with your skin. You have to be doing morning and evening skincare every single day and then you treat your office treatment as like an icing on the cake. So I think a lot of times

we get and it's probably like celebrity culture where like we think that, oh, why is going to be getting these office treatments? And it's like no one wants to do the boring work. I get it. I understand. Like skincare isn't that fun. And I think skincare that works also is actually not that fun. It's boring, but the thing is, is once you get it down, you only have to think about it. So you can like have a very simplified routine that's results driven that's meant to protect, prevent,

repair, and correct. And then you just go and live in your life. And do you mean it's boring because it's just the same thing every day? Yes, you're not changing it. Yes, it's just simple. And I think people from social media, people are trying to make skincare fun, but it's like skincare doesn't work overnight. And a lot of these like fun things, these fun treatments that you're seeing, you might have a temporary result. They're not doing anything for your skin long term.

I really like the collagen sleep masks. They give you a really nice glow that is not really doing anything for my skin long term. That's nice pre-event or pre-like photoshoot or something like that. But if that's all I do with my skincare, it's just not going to work. I mean, boring is kind of nice in this phase. I know. The mental load that we're carrying every day of decisions and also just remembering to even just reorder the day in products. It's one

more thing on the to-do list. In this society, we want this like instant gratification. And we also

“want this new experience. That's why I think all of these drop-sell up brands like that's so fun.”

Like, I get it. Like, I'm sold the hype, too, whereas like a lot of times things that you're doing day in a day out, whether it's exercise, in skincare, and oral care. They're all very similar. They need to be done consistently. They're like a long-term game. And so that's really where you need to start to see results. So you are right. Collagen-baking is good. Collagen-baking isn't new, and that's what I was saying. It's like, it's not a new concept. It's the same thing as building

muscle. And we can only build and increase collagen at certain amounts. Like, the younger we are, the more collagen we're going to produce. And over 20, we're losing about 1% of collagen every year. So, if we can do things, 20s and 30s, early 40s, to boost our collagen production, then we are going to have more collagen as we age. And the more that we can have,

what our skin structure looks like. So the bouncyness of the skin, the structure of the skin.

Once you start to lose collagen, that's when you start to see more like sagging. When you start to see it, like volume loss and volume shifts in the skin. Are you following? Just as baking sense. So collagen, it's very trendy in skin care words. Like, the collagen mask that I just mentioned, collagen in your skin care will not boost collagen. It's a word that people love and it's like a marketing word, but it's doing anything for your collagen. No, it's not doing anything for your

collagen, but it is hydrating the skin. Collagen is very hydrating, winnably. Okay, so these masks that say collagen mask, it's actually boosting hydration, which is making your skin look more plump and they're attributing that to like a collagen. It looks like you have healthy collagen or more collagen, but it's not actually boosting your collagen. Yeah, it's not doing anything

“for your collagen. Okay, so that's scammy. I know, but kind of, but I think it, it's also not”

scammy if you know what collagen does for the skin. It's very hydrating. Well, we don't have what it does. I know, playing on that. I know. Now, I mentioned that collagen is the most abundant protein in the body. So yes, it's seen in the skin, but it's also seen like in the joints. So when you're talking about should we be eating our skin care? For a long time, I said that there wasn't enough research to show that intake, consuming collagen would actually be beneficial

for the skin. There's recent studies that are showing hydrolyzed collagen, taking that can have benefits on hair skin nails. It's just hard to say like when you're consuming something exactly where it's going because if you've got like joint issues and if your body's like, hey, I need this collagen here, it's going to pull it and use it. Is this an ingredient we're looking for? Hydrolyzed hydrolyzed collagen. I actually really like the blender bombs one. It's um,

wild marine, which it's like snappers. I mean, it doesn't, I have it in my coffee as we speak,

“and it doesn't taste like fishery thing, which is disgusting. Not really into fish coffee, right?”

Not my favorite. So, but I really like it, but yes, hydrolyzed collagen has been shown. And I think there's so many ways lifestyle to support the skin. And so, yes, like skin care is a piece, office treatments or a piece, your lifestyle is a piece. All of it works together, like sleep. That's just a free piece that no one seems to get enough of myself included. And so, all of these things work together to help our body to function properly and the same goes with our skin.

So, with hydrolyzed collagen, the same thing. It's like, it's just another tool in your toolbox. I don't think that any of the stuff that we're going to talk about today, one doesn't replace the other. They're all tools. And unfortunately, one thing cannot do everything. So, it's like, you can't just consume hydrolyzed collagen and expect for your skin to be perfect enough to do anything. You still need to use the skincare routine. So, collagen banking is just

the term that they're using to boost your collagen production. You want to build up your collagen reservoir. So, you can have a lot of collagen to pull from. So, then, as you age, you have more collagen so that your skin structure and your skin firmness will be as optimal for as long as it can. The same thing goes, I don't know if you've heard of this, but it's called like muscle banking. Women over 30 should all be doing strength training in resistance training because we are

one from our bone density, but also muscle is like the insurance that we have on our health.

“You need to build as much muscle as you can. Obviously, we're not trying to be bodybuilders,”

but like, you need to build as much muscle as you can. Now, the older we get, the harder it is to build muscle. So, you're banking all that muscles, so then like, your body has it for years to come. That's the only way that I ask this. They're they're lost with me.

Leave us a note if you got it the first time or the second because I'm curious. So, just building

up your collagen in any way. Yes, so there's like several things that you can do to boost your collagen reduction. The four that I want to talk about that I think are really impactful skincare. We talked about skincare a little bit. I believe that everyone needs to be using the core four. When I say the core four, I'm thinking of these as like the four products that are going to like truly like get your skin functioning optimally. Obviously, you need a cleanser and you need

a moisturizer. But they're like supporting actors. The core four is the things that you're going to like see transformation in the skin. And then you build your routine based on your skin type and your skin concerns. But it all kind of like is rooted around that concept. And so, I think we're skincare gets really overwhelming. It's like that that you're saying. There's Korean skincare. There's serums. There's peptides. And the thing is is like none of that is bad. But if your skin

is not functioning optimally, then you're not going to see the benefits of any of that in the foundation of a long-term skin health starts with the core four. And that goes hand in hand with

like building and boosting your collagen, which is essential to have healthy looking skin. So,

and then the hydrolyzed collagen has been really controversial. So, if you had asked me 10 years ago, there wasn't really any studies supporting, consuming, ingesting, hydrolyzed collagen to, like say, "Oh, this is going to directly support your hair skin and nails." And there's still not that

and knowing, and I mentioned this earlier, but knowing that collagen is the most abundant protein in the body. Like it's not going to hurt you to support it, especially knowing that it's going to be depleting around a percent every year over the age of 20. And that's for, that's going to

benefit. Joints that's going to benefit. Hair skin nails. So, you know, why not? I would say 80 percent

of your results are going to be from your daily at home skin care routine. And then 20 percent are going to be from things like office treatments and additional things. Now, is there one step in the skin care routine that is best for collagen? Or are they all work together to boost the collagen? Well, yes, glad you asked that. So, truly, and this is an answer that no one ever wants. But SPF is like number one, because UV exposure causes collagen degradation. So, I mean,

absolutely not guessed that product. You would it? No. Well, that is why SPF is so impactful, because 90 percent of skin aging is caused from the sun. Like, if you, who cares if you're using overachiever, who cares if you're using vitamin C, if you're not using SPF, your skin is like right, because the side is just damaging all of that. Yeah. And then outside of that,

“outside of sunscreen, the second most well-researched product is a retinoid. That's why”

love retinal skin therapy, because it's so well-tolerated, because the key with retinoids is that consistent use. But let's talk about office treatments. So, even if you decide, okay, I'm using skin care, I want to get an office treatment. My recommendation would be one, make sure you're using a result-driven skin care routine for at least eight weeks, ideally even more, to prep the skin before you even consider an office treatment. There are a couple of office

treatments that I really like to boost collagen, but you have to prep the skin properly first, and then you also need post care and like post treatment, take care of your skin in a way. So, it's really like the whole picture. It's not just the treatment itself, and a lot of people want office treatments to do everything. So, the two office treatments I would say,

you've never gotten off of treatment. Have you ever gotten migraineally? No. You're probably good now.

What's your age? 33. This would be a good time to collagen-bake for you. I'm about to get my collagen-baking game. That's right. Okay, so I would say the two things like in office that are really, really great to boost collagen production are treatments that are going to resurface the skin. So, think about a lawn, aerating the lawn, puncturing tiny little holes into the tissue. You can do that with several different modalities. There are two that I really like, and I feel like

you can generally, obviously, you go to see a provider for this, and so they're going to provide more guidance. But generally, if you're like 35 in under, micro-needling can be a really impactful treatment because it's mechanical. So, it's like tiny little needles going into the skin, puncturing little wounds, essentially, and then new collagen and new skin is growing from that. So, you can enhance that treatment with things like PRP, PRFM, PDGF, a lot of peas, but all of these are

like places where I have so lost. And we don't have to worry about this. But anyways, there's basically there's ways to enhance the micro-needling, and with micro-needling, if you're just doing it for like collagen boosting, you want to do a series of three, and you space them out between like four to six weeks. And you could do that once every like couple years. If you're doing it for like scoring, that's a whole different thing because that's damage skin. But if we're purely talking

about like boosting and improving the skin quality, micro-needling is great. What kind of change am I going to, should I expect to see in my skin? That's a good question. So, I know you're

“skin very well because I see you all the time. So, I would say honestly, like, I don't think you're”

going to notice this dramatic result in your skin. I think you will feel like your skin looks a little healthier. I think it would be really nice any the area around the eyes. That's like the skin is so thin. It's going to help thicken and improve that skin quality. I don't think you will notice anything dramatic if I'm being honest. I think it's more of a knowing that this is going to help boost my collagen. But I think it'll look better and look lower, yes, but it's not

going to be this dramatic change. Does it help with redness? I wouldn't say. I would do more like an IPL or like a, I would do a laser more for that. Okay. But because micro-needling does improve the skin quality depending on what's causing the redness, sure. You know what I'm saying? Like, if you need to like improve and strengthen your skin barrier or like then sure, like the micro-needling could help with that. But it's not really primarily going to help with redness and it's also not going

to really help with dark spots. It's really more like a collagen boosting treatment is how I would

“approach it. Now is this what you've got done underneath your eyes? Oh no. That's what I'm about to get”

into. Okay. Okay. So I'm past the 35 mark. So the nice thing about micro-needling too, very little downtime. It's also really good if you're like a afraid of procedures. I'm not afraid of procedures.

I've seen a million just like I've had several obviously like skin stuff, but I've also seen

so many just working in plastics. So I'm not scared of seeing someone like Facebook or like that doesn't scare me. But I know like I have good friends that like they only want to do micro-needling in their like in their 40s because they don't want the downtime or they just like are afraid of the healing in their recovery. Which is reasonable. I get it. You know it's like everyone has exposure

over 35. I love like CO2 lasers. Halo BBL. That's what I had and then I also got this treatment

called TRL and I got that around my eyes. So let's talk about TRL second because that's the most

intense. I mean you saw my face as psychos. It was wild. It was terrifying. Okay. So with the lasers like CO2. They do the same thing. The concept of what micro-needling does and CO2 does. It's the same. It's more intense. There's heat involved with lasers. There's not with micro-needling. It's a more intense treatment. You can control a lot more because you're getting deeper into the tissue.

“It is awesome. And so that's why I say like if you're over 35 you need a little bit more”

of an intense treatment and you're going to see a little more of a dramatic result. But even still I would say if you're using good skincare and your skin is like I feel like my skin's pretty good. Your Lord, I hope it is. I only do this for living to call up this. This girl looks not a day of or 26. What pain level are we talking about here? It's not so much pain. I mean we've given birth. So it's like it's uncomfortable. It's uncomfortable. Like I would say

micro-needling I don't even feel it's like a little uncomfortable because you're numbing before. Okay. CO2 can be a lot more uncomfortable. Actually, I'm actually like it's not painful. It's like a six. Okay. And then six out of 10. And then afterwards your face is extremely hot for like a couple hours. That's really it's not painful. It's just like it feels like you got to suffer so hot. So hot. Like a really really bad sunburn. Like the worst sunburn ever. And then you put ice on it

and like won't calm down. It's like your face is in a fire. It's not great. It sounds amazing.

You are going to love it. So I love it. I love it. I love it. Especially if you got like the older we get the eye area becomes more problematic and then like around the mouth. So I love CO2. And I love halo BBL. That combos really nice because it's going to target brown, red and skin resurfacing. I've done halo BBL the past like several years and this is the first year where I incorporated the TRL. This is where it gets crazy. The TRL is what I did around the eyes. And the difference is

So I talked about aerating a lawn. Do you follow that concept like poking little holes? Okay. TRL is mowing the lawn. Okay. So we've got wrinkles. The wrinkles are like ridges. And if you can't see me, I'm doing some really clear hand ridges. But you would know exactly what she's talking about if you could see. Yeah, if you could see. So think about wrinkles on the skin. They're like ridges, right? So if you mow all that down, you're kind of like resetting the skin. Right? But that makes

it very raw. And so I'm 38. So I did that around my eyes. Now my mom. She's doing the full face because at a certain point like that's going to help like resurface the whole skin. That recovery is a very intense. And I would say like if you're wanting to target the eyes and you feel like skincare and like aggressive laser hasn't worked. I've done halo BBL like I said several years. And I still felt like my eyes. I was just like, I'm just frustrated by them. So the TRL is

very intense. And I was using pro nox, which is like makes you a little like loopy. I had they did injectable numbing. I had the eye ocular shields. I was awake during it. But my mom for the full face, they're going to put her under anesthesia. Like that's on 10s. Wow. But anyways, that's a really good treatment. And so we could talk about treatments all day. But I would say the biggest thing is there's a lot of treatments. And you don't have to know all of them. I'm naming out

several ones. There's a lot of different names. There's like moxie and morpheus and clear and brilliant. And all these different ones. That's fine. We don't need to go over all these. But I think the biggest thing to know if you are wanting to get an office treatment before you don't worry about the treatment,

“you look at and finding providers. And this is where I think it's so and so important because”

ideally you find a provider that you connect with that you trust. And then you can let them like create a treatment plan. And so I want to feel comfortable asking questions too. This is where like the magic happens because so many people make the mistake of jumping providers. And that's when you start to look weird. Or so many people make the mistake of trying to dictate the treatments that they get. Because you're like, well, I want my lips done. Or I want this. It's like,

well, but that's where it really goes back to like you really finding that provider that you trust because they're going to tell you like, I'm not going to do that because that's not the right thing for you. And so if like someone's not telling you, no, ever like, that's a concern. I think that is the absolute hardest part about anything is finding the provider. And then once you have that,

whether they're doing your Botox for the first time or lasers or they're guiding that treatment

“plan, that's the most important part. And I think it's the hardest part. Because I remember when”

I was trying to find a provider in Atlanta, you told me, look for someone who's interested in treating your whole face. You don't just go and say, I want some Botox. And then they're like, okay, being being being, they look at the whole face. They recommend where to place it. I mean, I've gotten Botox in my chin. I even know that. Yeah, it's a thing. You know what Valeria said?

treatment that I think I want. And I will see what they say. Maybe not so off the wall, but like

something like, I really want to get, I don't even know, she was like the example that she said, but like, I thought that was kind of smart because they should know when to tell you, no, and they should know, you know, whatever. I thought that was a good little tip. But I would say if you're like looking for a provider in your area, there's a couple of the ways that can like eliminate and then like have a couple that you test out. You don't want someone that looks weird. That's concern,

you know. If you're looking at someone and you're like, I don't want to look like you, then you don't need to go to them. So this is also where I think it's helpful because

“I've said to you before I like, I think you need to get my lifts down like they're too,”

like you see yourself every single day. So it's helpful to have an external opinion or professional one. Yes. And that's why going back to like having a provider that you see regularly because they know your face. They are learning your face. Like a provider's learning your face. And so if you keep jumping around, that's when they're like, oh, yeah, sure. Like they've injected you before. They've done treatments on you before. Like they know. Okay. So these are really good because

I feel like these are very tangible things to know when you're looking for someone. So the first thing

you would say is someone who you trust based on how they look. Well, I would say you don't know what you trust that. But yes, but you, but you look at them and say, okay, they don't look over done. I don't personally want to look over done. I just want to look like a version of myself that I like connect. I want to look like me a better version, right? Or like I just want to look continue to look like myself. And I feel like as I get older, I just want to look like

how I feel. I want the way I look to represent how I feel, how I am. You know, the person that I feel like I look at myself in the mirror. I want to be like, oh, I know that person. And I think you like stop recognizing that person sometimes. I don't know if you ever got that point yet. You're like, wait, I saw a picture of yourself. That's not me. Well, I definitely think it changes in my face right now that I'm like, oh, gosh, like that's new. Like this. Yeah, for me around the mouth, the muscles,

they're just starting to show in a new way. And I'm like, oh, interest in the back. Okay, then. So Olivia Salman, who did my laser, she said something and I thought it was such a good thing to say. She was like, when I have patients come in, they're wanting these treatments done. And it's not that they want to look like a different version of themselves. They want to look like the version of themselves that they know. And the person that they know is the person that they've been.

So when they see this group, yeah, it's like, so when you're looking at yourself and you're seeing maybe these different aspects of aging, like you don't relate to that person. Because you're like, that's not me. I'm that person. And you're looking at yourself from like 10 years ago or the person that you were for the past 15, 20 years. So it's like, I need to go back to that person.

“Like, that is me. This is the newest version of you. And so you still have to like, you have to,”

I mean, a part of us, we have to accept that version, right? But I thought that was a really good way to say it because you're not feeling connected to like the person that you're looking at in the mirror, which is weird to say, yeah, feel. Yeah. I think this is all part of aging gracefully. It's like, you're not talking to completely look that different. Yeah. And also like, that's where I think if if getting treatments is like, not a thing you want to do, like, don't do it. But I just think that,

like, that's where a lot of people feel like maybe shame in getting treatments. Like, I'm not trying to be, I'm not feeling like I'm like, so vain. And I just want to be me and feel like me. Let's not like shame people for the things that they want to do and the things that they don't want to do. Let's just like stop that novel concept. Let's let's let people be who they want to be. Exactly. The second thing is you can ask your friends who you also think are like, if they've

gotten things done, if you think that they look good, that's a really good way. It's like a, you know,

you're in referral. And then you can always look at someone's Instagram, they're before and

afters, that's really important. Seeing people's before and afters is very, very important. And then I would then, you know, go in and talk to this person. If you're in the room with them and you

“feel weird or pressured, that's not a good feeling. You shouldn't feel like that. And you should”

feel very comfortable asking questions. And you mentioned this earlier, but you want to have agency over what you do. And you want to feel comfortable asking questions and like understanding why it is your recommending this because I think it's so easy to feel soul to. And there's some people in the medical profession that I've experienced, where it's almost like when you ask questions, they almost get defensive. And they kind of shut you down. They almost take it as if you're

questioning them. Yeah. And I can't see people like that. Or they kind of make you feel like silly for asking, yes, I'm not investing time or many here. That's right, going to work. Right. Yeah, there's so many different ways that I feel like it's such a miss. And you can kind of get a quick sense. I think of people. And if they're trying to sell and if they're trying to make a quick sale, but what I don't understand why this happens because if you just like do what you believe

is best, if you're like a provider, I think of myself. I think we do this with their face with was skincare, but I also do this in practice. If you just do a treatment plan that you believe is the best treatment plan for that patient, they're going to keep coming back. You don't have to sell them on anything. You're not just getting that one time sale. You're getting that recurring,

just do it in the right way, LTV, lifetime value, baby, time value. Yeah, like I don't

“have their terms. I mean, it's like, I think people get so, so blind to the fact that it's like,”

I got, I don't know. I don't understand that. That's something I've never understood. It's like,

you just tell people and we do this like what's skincare to. If we don't feel like we have a product that's going to be helpful for you, then I'm not going to try to sell to you. That doesn't make any sense. It's like, you just do the right thing. And like, obviously, sometimes this is practicing

medicine. Sometimes you do a treatment. And like, the result isn't what the patient expected.

And then you like have to rework and then you reset expectations and whatever. But yeah, if you

“feel like you're being sold to, then bye, you should feel like have an ally. I do believe that”

you should feel like your provider is like your ally and you're like working together and not that

it's like they're selling to you. Right. And that's it. Yeah, they're very, very God, Mother, just

guiding you along the way, very gently. Right. You should trust that also like a good provider's getting constant education. They're learning about this stuff. So they want you to ask questions. And there's so much going on like social too. Like they should be pretty educated on the things that are going on so that they can help kind of guide you through that. So I would say we're talking about collagen making. We want to do that with skincare. We want to do that from a lifestyle,

whether that's hydrolyzed collagen exercise. I mean, all these things work together. And then if you

“really want to boost skin quality further, office treatments are your, are your friend. I think we”

need to do a whole other episode on like different office treatments. We could talk all day about skincare and office treatments. Yeah, polite. It's going to be an all-nighter. I can't wait. It sounds accelerating. It's going to be fun. Okay, that was such a helpful conversation. Thank you so much for listening and tuning in. If you have any follow-up questions about this episode, please leave them on the comments in the podcast episode. And then that way we can be sure to answer them in our next

skincare chat because this is a subject we could just go deep on and we want to. So we'll be sure to answer those and can't wait to chat. See ya. See you next time.