The Primaries Will Continue Until Morale Improves

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“Welcome to Pledge Day of America. I'm John Faber. I'm John Mavit.”

Tom Muthor. On today's show we'll talk about the war with Iran which claimed more American lives over the weekend in wounded dozens, which the Pentagon is trying to hide. We'll also talk about ice being back in the headlines after killing people in Texas and Maine. It's like I have the administration is responding and what we know about how Trump's deportation agenda is playing with voters, Latino voters, in particular. We also have a bunch

of news from the world of Democratic primary campaigns, former Maine Senate President Troy Jackson, is all but certain to be the Democratic nominee to take on Susan Collins in Maine. There's more chaos in the Wisconsin governor's race and AOC and Bernie rallied for Abdul-Elsaid in Michigan as his primary against Haley Stevens heats up. Well, let's start with some big news from the weekend. Spain's 1-0 win over Argentina in

the World Cup final in the metal lands, a capping off, an incredible tournament. No one

is sadder about it ending the Donald Trump who wasn't about to let a return to full on war with Iran's stop him from inserting himself into the closing ceremony. The President of the United States on the field is now, so they get me out of that. I was really in broadcaster at the end there. You guys see the caption of the picture in the Guardian where in Fintino is with Trump and

it's just the two of them and the caption is Johnny Infantino carefully explains to Donald Trump that he is not part of the Spanish national team. They're like, the energy of accidently realizing you're in the money shot of a beach wedding, you know? That is what I remind you of. They're about to do it. Get the fuck out of the way.

You see the team at the players were doing the Trump dance and therefore really appreciating his involvement because Trump did this to one of them and looking confused. He just was like, "Yeah, I'm going to milk a cow back to you." My guess is they're just happy because they won the World Cup and this is the best day of their life. That would be my guess as to why they're happy.

For sure, but if a monkey did a gesture to me at the zoo, I'd do it back. It wouldn't be a show of support for his politics. I might not throw my poo back at him, but it's like, "Yeah, it's like it's cool to go to the game. I'd go if I could go. It's cool to present the trophy." But like, get out of the way, dude. And you also do this at the FIFA World Cup final in like 2025. And like,

you can see Infantino trying to get him to leave the stage and you just won't do it. He just basks in the glory of the cheering like he genuinely believes it's for him. I would

“feel like imposter syndrome and run off there. I think he also believes he's wanted”

there. Like, like, I'm Donald Trump. Everybody loves when I'm part of their stuff. I'd feel imposter syndrome if I was the president of the United States and the U.S. one, right? I would still say something and be like extra proud, but I wouldn't get in the fucking picture. And especially with Spain, like the NATO summit a couple weeks ago, he said, quote, "I don't want anything to do with Spain. They're hopeless. Bad people."

He said, "Come on, bad people." Because they like didn't support the war with Iran and didn't want us to use their bases. Do you see the U.S. A today did a piece on the Trump curse? The call on it at the Trump curse. So awesome. So I didn't know about all of these, but so Trump said before the the World Cup final, he didn't pick a side, but he said, it's hard to bet against Messi. Yeah, Argentina loses. Trump intervenes to get the red card

the next lose. In 2025, Trump goes to the Washington Commander's Game. They lose to the Lions for 2022. That same year he goes to the Ryder Cup, the U.S. loses. They're calling it the Trump curse. It's so funny. The other thing about that Commander's game is, so you go to the Commander's game. The Commander's gets stomped by the Lions. And then at that same game, a Lions receiving a name. I'm enrossing Brown. Did the Trump

“dance and then the Lions lose five of eight games and miss the playoffs? I think it's”

like basically there's there's three possibilities. Okay. One is that it's luck. The other

is that he brings a terrible energy everywhere he goes, right? That he and that his that's documented. Right. For sure. I think I'm that that that like corrupts anyone who seem to be rooting for you can't help us. Someone playing, knowing that Trump is on your side, allowed to infect you with the kind of negativity and failure that surrounds him. I do think it's worth considering the third possibility, which is much like Odysseus discovering

the Cyclops on his way home. God. Due to his failure to observe morality and the conflict in Troy, Trump is being punished everywhere he goes. Why are we all catching strays, yeah. Well, that's that's take it up with Zeus, my friend. We are the ones being sacrificed. I'm not saying it's a the punishment is it's not clean, you know. Can I tell you my my favorite Trump sports story from over the weekend is there's a golfer named

Bryson D Shambod. Did you guys go across this? Are you tweeting about this? Get a meltdown

“at the open championship. You got a penalty for like I think just stepping in tall grass that”

would have gotten the way of his swing and he got a two stroke penalty. So it's worth it. He deserved. He totally deserved. He deserves. He throws a hiss, he bit niece sucks.

He's annoying anyway. He throws his hiss, he threatens to not play the next day, basically

quit the tournament and take his ball and go home. He takes all these rules of officials, makes them visit the site and then he goes back in the midst of it, he threatens to call Trump and tattle on the mean rules of officials if they don't give him this way. He also shut down the whole tournament too, right? They were all to wait for this and they all had to wait for him to be done with his his fit and even the other players who were watching

a real like that. Yeah, come on, man. Yeah, come on. I mean, this is what Trump has created. You know, it's like everyone knows if they're friends with Trump or they like up to Trump, they can just tattle and get what they want or at least try to do that. Everybody's calling the manager. Right. I want a table. You get over speeding. You know Trump. But sir, you don't have a reservation. I know the owner of the German broadcast of the World Cup

final. So they cut to infinity now and trump in the box. They show them getting presented to the trophy and the dancers go, well, that's a violation of all the rules. Those two were made for each other, fascinated by power and by themselves, too. Good stuff hit. It's

“good stuff. Tough, tough to hear from Germans. Yeah, like the cool part of the story, right?”

That sort of suggests the Spanish team would not like Trump's politics is one of the players guy named Nico Williams. His mom and dad walked 2,000 miles from Ghana to Spain. She was pregnant with his older brother at the time. Like across this Sahara Desert barefoot managed to get into this tiny bit of Spanish territory to become citizens and then he's playing on the national team. That's probably why he wouldn't like Trump's immigration. Yeah, wouldn't like his politics.

He wouldn't be possible with Trump politics. So unfortunately, Trump trying to make the world cup about Trump did steal the spotlight from the tournament's real hero. Let's play it. We put on the largest sporting events in the world. Everybody good at beef in the White House looks like the FBI, Dorian or agency partners, the DHS, the state locals, to everybody to figure out

how to get six and a half million people until you ascend into these games without a single major

security incident. We have lived up to that measure because you guys have put in the time. It's truly truly incredible. We just can't say enough about the preparation and the execution has been long. He's in every shot. I thought what this was going to like, you know, thinking like all the law enforcement officials who pulled this off, it's like whatever it's fine, every single shot of that video is cash betell. Imagine if we had a crooked all hands to celebrate a year of making

great content and through it, we played a montage of just our headshots known to be surprised. Yeah, and when I got to laugh, lean with the G. I got to say what my, so I didn't watch that video before as we could see it live. My reaction to that video is who is this for? You know what I mean? Like who's getting jacked up to watch cash betell? Is it for Donald Trump? Because he wants to be wearing a suit, not like the weird Finn hoodie t-shirt thing. I think it's it's probably

for Trump. It's also he's just in super defensive mode now. Cash betell. Because he thinks everyone does it in my favor. Right. But it's like, you know, you think I'm a drunk and you think I fucked this up and I tweet the middle of investigations just because I tried to, you know, before before it. It's like, I think he's just like, I'm going to, we got one. We did want okay. It's

let's just take it a face value. Let's just not even forget the aesthetics of it, which are ridiculous.

“Cash betell. And what ways are you responsible for the world cup going well? Just walk me through”

some of them. Well, you think he's responsible for the world cup, not going badly. But that requires are you? But that requires people wanting it to go badly that he's stymied. Right? Like, are you? Right. Like, what are you talking about? I'm sure he's feeling like there was, you know, a planned attack on the UFC fight at the White House and they foiled that. And so he's probably think of himself like, I didn't get enough credit. I need to put out videos from hell on when

there's no attacks. Not enough likes and faves for that foiled plot. It's just amazing. Like,

here's me waving, getting out of my G5 private jet, man of the people. Cash betell. The also the one thing we know the cash betell is the interagency partners. Cash betell has been working hard on trying to arrest New York Times reporters who reported on Trump's Air Force One. Did you see today that the FBI or the DOJ is subpoenaed records, not only from these journalists, but from their spouses and one reporter's mother? Yes. Got the mother's phone records. I wonder if

they'll bring that up to Trump, any of the reporters in the White House correspondence association when he's on the day, a super correspondence dinner. Maybe the mentalist can, maybe Dr. Rose, can, or whatever his name is, those, those man, whatever his name is. It's a night where we're putting politics aside and the fact that you're snooping on our report. Oh, my mom's, yeah. That's which was going to put it aside for the night to just sort of honor you to be in the same room.

I think O's could guess them off. Yeah. It's like like, yeah. Well, yeah. Why don't they just ask him for the fucking later? I forgot it's fucking O's. Yeah. I know. I learned that. I learned that from a

“magician. Yeah. I really did. But yeah. Like, we ask him. He'll know. You should just do that.”

Mentalize that. And mentalist did. Anyway, enough of that. Trump, who just last month told reporters he was skipping his son's wedding because of, quote, a thing called Iran did not feel the same way about attending the World Cup. Probably because according to the White House, Iran is no longer much of a threat. They have been literally obliterated. Never in the history of warfare has an enemy suffered such clear and devastating large-scale losses in a matter of weeks. Iran has no

air defenses. Iran has no air force. Iran has no navy. Operation epic fury was a historic and overwhelming victory on the battlefield. The United States has all the cards. The Straits are now open. The Iranian military is now destroyed. We've won. Let me say we won. You

never like to say too early you won. We won. We won the best in the first hour it was over.

Well, apparently someone forgot to tell the Iranians because they've been attacking U.S. forces all over the Middle East for the last nine days straight. They've killed at least three Americans. And likely a fourth of that soldier is still officially considered missing. The Iranian attacks in Jordan have also reportedly injured dozens of American troops and damaged helicopters. News that the Pentagon has just decided not to report according to the New York Times. And if you're wondering

how it's possible that Iran can still pull off these kinds of attacks, you're not alone. Here's Fox News's Maria Barteromo. I don't understand how it's possible that Iran has the capability is to fight this way and continue to try to lash out at Gulf countries in U.S. military bases. Because the U.S. has obliterated Iran's military and the president continues to reiterate that. I'm reading these talking points. And for some reason, they're not true. I love the idea of

her hold on a second. And we just the camera follows her out down the stairs to another room with a white board and she starts doing the math on the white board trying to figure out how the thing is like, I don't think they're, I don't think they're telling the truth. The president keeps reading it. The president would not iterate, let alone reiterate. If something

not true like this, he would never say that. Maybe I just haven't been asking my questions.

Trump doesn't have a good answer or really any answer to Maria Barteromo's question. He threatened revenge on truth social and sent commonouts more strikes in retaliation. But this is all he said after the world cup when reporters asked about the Americans who were killed. We feel very badly, but you know, those great people, those great patriots throughout the fighting that Iran cannot have a nuclear weapon. This is a far bigger job that we're doing.

We were doing a little job, stopping them from having a certain capability. Now we're just ending it. Why don't you tell me, would you make a Trump's answer there? It's a little confusing and just the general developments over the weekend? Well, clearly he's pulling from a deep

“well with empathy at the top there. But, but on the bigger job part, it's like, there's, I think there's”

two ways you interpret it. One is like his factory setting is stuck on bullshit, right? So he's like, now we're reopening the straight. And that's an even bigger message. He's just does hyperbole with all things. But maybe it is the beginning of a bigger mission that could include like a permanent escort mission with an AV or taking territory on the coast to try to permanently claim the straightaway. I don't think we know. I don't think he knows yet. Probably what he wants to do.

gas prices right now in advance of the midterms. But the weekends event show how dangerous the

“status quo is and that Iran is learning, the journal had a piece about how they've adapted their”

missiles to move in the sort of like terminal part of the flight where they're coming down, they get a vaid-art air defenses. And we sell tens of thousands of service members in the Middle East that seem like they're not well defended at all. And so, like either way, like the reporting, it makes it sound like he wants to not go back to a full-scale war. But as you know, did Iran has been hitting targets all over the Middle East and the Pentagon has put out statements

that they've hit targets in Iran for the last 10 nights in a row. So that's not a war war war war. I was like, what is it? We are, the war is restarted. It's whether he, whether we, whether Trump wants to go so far as to acknowledge that the ceasefire that has failed has failed. Which he sort of has. I mean, he's like the MOU is done who cares. But then, and they've told Congress they're officially back in war. I guess that the other distinction would be,

there would be some explanation for what this strategy is behind what they're hitting other than

“as tit for tat decorating. Yeah, degrading capabilities generally. Yeah, this is, I mean,”

Trump very well may not want a return to full-scale war for all the reasons you outlined. But this is the problem with escalation. It's like it's unpredictable and they strike and then we have to strike back and then they strike back again. And so suddenly the space for diplomacy becomes very, very small. And they just keep going after each other. Well, it also, Americans are dying. They're a group of, like he's at the World Cup. They're group of

families that are having the worst experience of their lives. Their lives are being ripped apart because Trump doesn't want the war to escalate because of his political reasons. This is just a blip. He's very sorry. It's very bad. It's so glib. But you know that if what he wanted to do was escalate, right? If Americans had been killed and he was aiming to start the war or he would just declare it the greatest violence against the United States, right? Like the, the American

service member in harm way being being hurt by this are purely just sort of ponds, either to be like either to downplay or lie about what's happening to them. If it doesn't suit your story about how much we're decimating the military or he can use it as an argument for why we need to escalate if he so chooses. This episode is sponsored by BetterHouse. We're finally talking about mental health openly,

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the President of the United States and his entire administration have said the Iran is obliterated. We have won the mission. Like, not just mission accomplished. Like, oops, there was a banner behind Bush. This was like every day. They're saying that their military is destroyed, decimated. We can join the sky. We control the skies. The straight is open. And also, for nothing, the stated objectives, like they haven't done, they haven't achieved anything. They didn't

destroy the regime. They didn't get the, they didn't make any progress on their nuclear program. They didn't destroy their ballistic missile program. They didn't destroy the proxies.

“Yeah, I think we're in a situation where it feels frustrating and unsatisfying because they”

don't care about getting caught in those lies by the mainstream press. It's the way every other President in history has. But when you look at the polling, like, this is the most unpopular, war in modern American history. Yeah. It's going to get worse as gas prices tick back up. And there's just no endgame here. Like, the Iranians want to control the straight of Formus. Trump can't let that happen. How do you sort that out? And you want to talk about the

Houthis now? Yeah. But they announced there's a blockade of Saudi Arabia. Yeah. So the Houthis, so back in 2015, the Saudis launched this disastrous war on the Houthis rebels in Yemen. 100,000 people died because of it, mostly because of famine. In 2022, they announced the ceasefire that it's a peace talk. So Ben and I were talking about last week, this kind of fragile ceasefire kind of erupted because the Saudis bombed the Sennat airport. I think they were trying to stop

in IRGC plane from landing back in Yemen that had been at the Supreme Leader's funeral in Yemen.

“We were kind of like, oh, that's ominous. Why are we kicking back up this conflict? And so today,”

on Monday, the Houthis announced that they're going to embargo Saudi ships in the Red Sea, via the Babelman website. So that's the choke point out of the Red Sea to the East, where a lot of oil and gas flows. And so I don't know how this would work or how they would implement it. But if you have the straight of Formus closed and then access to the Red Sea shutoff,

that chokes off like another 5 percent of the world's oil and reform petroleum products,

the past through that straight. And so the Saudis, the way the Saudis have been getting around the straight of Formus being shut is they have a pipeline that goes west and south and they've been pumping oil and gas out and getting it out through the Red Sea. If they can no longer do that, it's a huge reduction in supply. At the same time, you have the Russians, Russian oil refinery capacities been cut in half to the Ukrainian strikes. You have all the oil

reserves depleted because the war, because we all just spent it down to try to keep costs low.

“And then China had been limiting imports during the conflict. Now they're ramping them back up.”

So you could really see a serious supply shock in price increase. So one to watch. I mean, maybe the hoothees are not actually going to go through with this and they'll try to like com things down with the Saudis. But this is kind of like the nightmare scenario in terms of energy price. And oil went over $90 a barrel briefly over the weekend. It's now in the 80s. But gas is up to $4 a gallon again. And this is right at the beginning of this new phase of the war.

And the hoothees don't have to completely control this waterway to create a bunch of fear and four ships to either delay, go around, raise the cost of insurance, what have you, yeah, right? And you know, having Iran and Iranian proxies in charge of these two choke points through a quarter or more of the the world oil goes through is really sort of once again,

showing how much more powerful Iran has gotten because of this conflict. Even the language

the hoothees use was just basically, well, this is Trump is doing a blockade on a blockade in the straight of our moves. We're going to do a blockade on a blockade on this side, too. That's just how it goes. Meanwhile, the Republican Congress has done absolutely nothing to rain him in on this. You have a few voted for like a war powers resolution and that's about it. And now, you know, they have a week before they all go on break until mid-September and the house is

trying to pass the NDAA, also the supplemental. Yeah, extra like billions and billions and billions and billions of dollars more, which is just absolutely fucking crazy, nuts, billions of dollars. So ice is back in the news for all the wrong reasons after agent shot and killed one unarmed man in Houston, Texas and another in Betterford Maine, both men were fathers and husbands who had been living and working in America for years, both were driving at the time and both were victims

of mistaken identity by ice. After the shooting in Maine, DHS Secretary Mark Wayne Mullen, ordered a temporary pause on vehicle stops by ice officers, a pause that Susan Collins quickly took credit for, which was then overturned by Trump in less than 48 hours after an intense right-wing backlash to Mullen. Despite the fact that ice has arrested a record number of people since Mullen's been confirmed, even hitting Stephen Miller's 2,000 arrest per day,

quota a few times this month. This is of course thanks to the $170 billion that Susan Collins and her

fellow Republicans funnel to ice, which seems to be giving badges and guns to anyone who wants them, the ex-wife of the agent who killed the person in Maine told the AP that because her ex-husband

him, quote, "She thought he was having a mental health episode and didn't believe him." Jesus,

“this is the guy who killed the person in Maine. And now according to the New York Times, federal”

agents recently received a written notice that the FBI would quote, "no longer investigate confrontations with immigration agents," supposed to be handled now internally through DHS. This is a report that's been denied by both the Department of Justice and the Department of Homeland Security. So I feel like after Minnesota and Nome's firing, we were all worried that nothing would actually get better, it would just get quieter. Sure enough, even Trump's approval

on immigration has sort of crept back up, though it's still slightly underwater. What do you make of the administration response to the killings in Texas in Maine? So yeah, that that home in was going

to be some kind of a step-up from Bavino and from Kristy Nome. The fear was they would continue

doing what they were doing, but not as ostentatious. I do think like the fact that they determined that these ceases upon cities were counterproductive, politically, was a win that continued,

“but that doesn't mean they haven't been more competently and quietly aggressive. And they”

have continued to put people like this out into the field. We already know they reduced the amount of time these people are trained. They lowered their standards. They've been desperate to recruit. So this is a direct result. Not just about the Trump administration is doing, but what Congress has done to fund and give them the resources to rapidly hire people who have no business using a gun, let alone using a gun as law enforcement as part of the federal government.

You read about this guy's background before he's in ice. This is just a fucking troubled guy.

It's like a terrible head injury. He was doing door dash. He was doing correction. He's just as all the way to his kids. I thought that the blowback to Mullin was very telling to on the right, because it kind of goes to the point that he's not running the department really. This is just like Miller's policies and he tries to do something on his own to pause and then Trump immediately just backs off. Yeah, I wonder if Mullin got a call from Susan Collins directly because they're

Senate colleagues. They probably know each other. But yeah, I mean, this ice officer in Maine, he's shot and killed a man in front of his three-year-old daughter. You know, it's fucking evil. And it shows that the policy is not changed much, but the PR strategy has. I mean, gnome and bovino, like you said, like they were being pressured to make 3,000 arrests a day and they would to do that. They would have border patrol in Vade City like an army and occupy it in the flashiest way possible. That included flying black cock helicopters over Chicago or having like

little social media people filming all the people stuff they were doing and then releasing it because they were proud of it. And Mullin is still trying to hit 2,000 arrests a day, but the arrester spread out all over the country and he's less thirsty for press attention than gnome was, although probably doesn't want it low bar. Yeah, DHS is still lying about all these incidents. They're de facto covering up for all these officers, but they're doing it in a slightly less gratuitous way. They're not, it's not like Minnesota where they're saying we're not good in

Alex, pretty worth domestic terrorists, or that, you know, Freddie was trying to massacre police, right? That was the intention to massacre police was like the line afterwards. And so Trump, though, is still making it clear that he doesn't care if innocent people are killed. He wants the dangerous practices like the vehicle stop arrest to continue if it means more deportations. So it is like, they've definitely put a less flashy shine on their policies, but it is still very much the same

dangerous abusive practice. And then you can't give into the lives, right? Like, you can't, if something terrible happens and there's a call from your enemies to be restraint to show any kind of restraint, you can't give into that because that is what let us hear, right? That's the problem. We have to prove we're really tough. Well, the posts have a good story on this about the sort of the blowback to Mullin and, you know, it came from all the usual sort of right-wing media online spaces,

but also the heritage foundation. And there's people in the heritage foundation, making the point that Tommy did, which is, they're all saying, like, oh, Collins probably called Mullin because there's Senate colleagues. And this is the problem with having someone at DHS from the Senate because you're trying to please all those people who are too moderate. And we have to just put, you know, foot on the gas for the deportation agenda. And it doesn't matter.

It doesn't, like, we're just going to keep going. Like, Steven Miller doesn't care if it's on popular, he doesn't care if people get killed, he doesn't care if what the detention center conditions are, he doesn't care what, he just wants to do it. He just wants to get it done.

“And things that he is, like, and the only thing that's going to stop him is”

tremendous public pressure, like the kind of we saw after Minneapolis or Democrats winning Congress and being able to rein Trump in that way with the power of the person. Well, look, he's in terms of immigration ratings. We're in the drop precipitously around the time of the killings in Minnesota. They have slowly, but surely ticked it back up. They're not above

off of it, it kind of reverts to a mean. And the baked in assumption, I think on their part, is people know that even if he goes too far, he is strong on this issue, it is symbol of how he is strong as a president. Right. I think that is the deeper reason he can justify politically continuing to do this. Yeah. And I think that because it's not in the news, and people don't aren't seeing the excesses of the deportation project, Trump's deportation project,

it's like they want most people want border security. And unfortunately, most people want, like, approve of deportations in general. They just think that it's, you know, when they don't see the excesses in the news, they think, well, they're deporting all the right people. Right. They're deporting the violent criminals. And that's that. And they forget about what happened

“in Minnesota and stuff like that. And you've got to, that's what you're going to just got to”

keep reminding people. And my people, you know, coming out and in Maine and Texas, to protest, this is important to keep it in the news. Yeah. There's also just a, like, a fundamental problem in, when there is a mass shooting, and 12 people are killed in one place that it's national news. If there are 12 heinous murders committed by people who should not have access to guns, that does not get the same coverage because they are distributed, even though it

is the same level of, of harm. And so, yes, they are, they are not wrong, right, that just people do not pay as much attention when these, like, sort of injustices are distributed. And I know, there's no good answer for that other than continue to talk about it. Pot to America is brought you by him's. ED is more common than guys talk about the good news. We're talking about talking about all the time. Yeah, you can't stop talking about it.

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“Pots in America is brought to you by Cook Unity. How did today?”

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to get 50% off your first order. That's 50% off your first order by using code cricket or going to cookunity.com/kirkut. One big question about the political impact is how this plays with

Latino voters in the mid-terms and beyond our friend Carlos Odio at ex-research always reminds us that

you know, the economy, not immigration is still the top concern for Latino voters. In fact,

time since last summer, mainly because his ratings on the economy in cost of living have collapsed.

Dan talked with Carlos for this week, polar coaster, which you can listen to if you're a friend of the pod subscriber. If you're not, please consider [email protected]/friend so you can get subscriber only shows like Policoster along with ad-reversions of your favorite cricket shows, now including runway country with Alex Wagner. That's that. Carlos and Eki also found that around two-thirds of Latinos think Trump has gone too far on enforcement and deportation

and among Trump-2024 voters, who are Latino, who regret their vote, immigration overreach was one of the top reasons cited. Would you guys make of all that polling in terms of how

“Democrats should handle this issue from now into the mid-terms? I mean, I think the takeaway is”

their Trump's approvals down, many Latinos now regret voting for Trump, but Democratic approvals not necessarily up. So we need to treat Latino voters like their swing voters, which they are, they have been. We're so away behind where we were with Latino voters in 2018. Carlos had a

good message, which was basically like, don't scold people for voting for Trump. You just say,

you were lied to. Trump promised you a bunch of stuff. He didn't deliver your welcome back in the Democratic Party. I think that sounds exactly right, but I do think it's like the thing you hear from a lot of activist groups is that Democrats only show up in the last month of the election. It's all GOTV messaging. Turn on messaging. It's not persuasion messaging. It's not early enough. I think that's like a lesson we need to learn this time. Yeah. Yeah, I'm getting an immigration

specifically. I just think you can, like, reflect what is true and also comes across in the polling. You know, Democrats, I think, really did have their respect for a long time. Had their heads in the sand around the difference between believing in immigration and opposing a lawless border,

“right? Like, there was just a difference. And there was kind of a, I think like a treating”

people like they were pretty stupid about it. But now, I don't think it's very hard to say, like, we believe in controlling the border, but they're terrorizing communities, they're terrorizing families. You can enforce our immigration laws in a way that is not a cruel and capricious and violence and chaotic. And in the same way, he has failed to, like, because of his incompetence and chaos, like failed to address like the reason so many people gave him a chance, cost of living is up,

gas is up, everything is up. He's focused on all the wrong things on immigration. We have seen so much chaos and so much violence. And none of it was necessary. He was elected to do to bring down the cost of living and bring some order to places where people felt as though there wasn't enforcement at the border. Now it's time to have, like, responsible adults who are going to make good policy and do it in a way that, like, reflects what people want out of their government

without being so incompetent and cruel. Yeah, he, I think the polling was interesting in that,

“you know, Latino voters like most voters, they care about cost of living more than anything.”

Also, that's like the lead message. But, you know, sometimes it's framed as a choice between, like, do we talk about that or do we talk about what ICE is doing? And, you know, Carlos and Eki say that, like, Democrats should lift up the stories of the people who've been killed by ICE. And then, but then makes the point, not just their wrongful deaths, but also the stories of their families and contributions to their communities. The data shows that among Latinos who believe Trump's

gone to foreign immigration, most say it's because of the impact as policies have had on families, children, US citizens, and legal immigrants. So there is, you know, the stories in the way that we would tell the stories anyway is what Democrats should be doing. Speaking of the midterms, one Republican who should be especially vulnerable on her unqualified support for ICE is Susan Collins, who is now likely to face Democrat Troy Jackson in November. Jackson is Maine's former

state Senate president who just lost the 26th primary for governor. He's also a fifth generation logger from about as far north and rural as Maine gets, it's on the border of Canada where he's worked with Jackson's from. Jackson won officially be nominated to replace Graham Platner until the party convention this weekend, but he ran the table at the county level meetings where delegates were chosen to the point where all of his major competitors have now dropped out.

So I pretended to be a dermatologist and I gave him a sort of head to toe mold check and he's clear. So no moles and nothing else. So I just, I had to, you know, put on the stat this goat, that whole thing. You know, he kept on his underwear. I'm not talking about not a fucking maniac.

Early thoughts on Troy Jackson, who's always been our favorite in this race. We always thought would be

the, I have no thoughts on Troy Jackson. I'm just spent a little more time looking. I thought on huge credits of the Maine Democratic Party for throwing together a process this quickly. That must be hard. I like if Jackson gets it, hopefully that will go a long way towards bringing along the Platner voters who are probably pretty pissed off and the volunteers who were left hanging when he would throw. We're still in the tough spot. He's, you know, the Platner left us a mess.

There's, we're behind the fundraising, we're behind in the name ID. Hopefully now this can become a referendum on Donald Trump and how voting for Susan Collins is a vote for the Donald

Collins and, and it's, what could have been a very contentious couple of weeks here? Yeah, they figured it up.

“They figured it out, like, credit to the Maine Democratic Party, credit to all of Troy Jackson's”

challengers to who, like, instead of hanging into the convention, have all dropped out and are all supporting him now, which is great. Just so people know who Troy Jackson is. He, so he was state senate president. He was re-elected in last in 2022 and one of the redist redist parts of

Maine. I looked up there in the first district, the state senate district. Registration there is

36% Republican, 19% Democrat, 45% no party preference. Okay. So that is independent. That is an achievement winning, winning that district. Internal polls, there's only been a few internal polls with him in Collins. They have him tied or slightly ahead. So it's too early for that. He's got pretty much all of Graham Platner's positions. He doesn't, maybe, well, John Tom is older positions. Sort of just more recent political ones, I'd say, probably. Yes, political positions, political

positions. Maybe, maybe not as, maybe not quite as charismatic as, you know, he's a little, he's a little gruffer. Yeah, what? I'll say. It came in third for governor and, uh, used to be very conservative on abortion and gay rights and over the years is now, now it gets like 100% ratings from abortion and gay rights groups. Right. So he sort of changed over time. I realize our process is not ideal, but in South Carolina Republicans are like, "Hey, Lindsey Graham,

you're dead. What if your sister just takes over that?" Hey, that's weird. Hey, we're in the market for Lindsey Graham in a wig. So here, we're just handing a Senate seat to Lindsey Graham's sister. Yeah, and there, so, there hasn't been a lot of, like, you didn't give us a process. Why did you give us

“this guy? I think for Troy Jackson, it's like, it's name ID, right? Like, people don't.”

We don't know who he is. I don't think even people in Maine, right? Like, you're the state Senate. Do they even know the state Senate president? No, I don't even know the, no, but I don't even know how the legislature is here and the assembly isn't California. Do you guys gonna be very complicated? I'm not doing pop quizzes today. I just don't know. It's not just Lindsey Graham's sister is finishing out the seat. She's announcing she's going to run for it. And I just want to be clear,

we don't know, you know, maybe she has great and interested, like, she works with the blind. I don't

know, got a, there's a chance. Let's just, let's just be cool. We've, we always thought Lindsey Graham's

sister was a reasonable person who could have a conversation with. Let's give her a chance before she, if you discover that she makes Lauren, Bobert, look like a team Jeffries. Unfortunately, Nancy may have dropped out of that race. We'll be running now. It's so funny. She'll continue to shit post. It's not literally said that. That's great. She posted, I just when I thought I was out, they pulled me back in from Godfather part three. Never, like, the least requested person ever

being like, I'll find. I'll do it. They being yourself. Right. Hold me back in the voices. Turns out, Maine isn't the only speed bump on the road to a blue wave. There was constant gubernatorial primary. Just got a little jolt over the weekend when Lieutenant Governor Sarah Rodriguez ended her campaign after revealing serious financial mismanagement by her campaign manager. She was, you know, one of the leading candidates and the polls, her dropping out said off a

panic among the states more moderate and establishment Democrats for worried that Francesca Hong, the DSA backed candidate who's leading in the polls, won't be able to win in November. So even though former Lieutenant Governor and Senate candidate Mandela Barnes is still close to Hong in the polls, Wisconsin Democrats convinced Milwaukee County executive David Crowley, who'd ended his own campaign a week earlier to get back in the race. And then Governor Tony

Evers, who had been staying out of the primary endorsed Crowley. Seems like they got everything under control of their Wisconsin, huh? I like I keyed into this because when I saw the Sarah Rodriguez press conference video. And I was like watching this video and I really hadn't been paying close attention to this primary to be honest. But then I watched the video and just someone at the putting it being like, here is when I found out we were being robbed. Here is when I found out

there was not enough money here and there. Then I realized there was a problem over here and I was like, oh boy, I mean, I guess it's good to get ahead of this, but I don't know how you can win a campaign for governor when you're just getting when your finances are so fucked. I still feel like I'm missing something in the Sarah Rodriguez story. The campaign manager double counted donations that they'd less money than expected. Then that same staffer puts out a press release that's like we're doing

a million dollar ad buy. The candidate is like, hey, where's our ads? I don't ever see them on TV.

Turns out the ad buy was fake because again, they didn't have the money. They put out their

“filing and she has like 35 grand on hand. Yeah. So that's obviously bad, but you have to drop out for”

that. Well, like, I mean, couldn't have stuck it out. I just think that if you're running to be the chief. Something, something else. I get the argument. Like, you know, in the competent, you can't manage your own campaign, can't manage your own finances, but it's like, I don't know, the primary is August 11th. Like, I feel like there must be more we're going to learn that way. By the way, like, when I say Rob, I have no idea. Just sounded like someone at least insinuating that money

This is an important race. Don't want to Republican as Governor and Wisconsin in 2028 when

“there will be a presidential election to certify. And so, really important that we placed replace Tony”

Yves with the Democrat, I'm kind of confused why they didn't rally around Mandela Barnes. So Mandela Barnes who we known Mandela for a while. He also ran in 2022 for Senate. He came like 26,000 votes shy of winning in a year where it was a 2022 midterms. It was more Republican leaning year. And he's close to Hong in all the polls. He was probably like a head of Rodriguez in some polls. Several polls show him ahead of the Republican candidate, Representative Tom Tiffany. And Crowley

who I don't know much about David Crowley, but when he suspended his campaign, he never got

more than 5% of the vote. I mean, any of the polls. He never hit beyond 5%. And so, and then somehow Yves went out and endorsed him and not Barnes. I don't understand it either. Other than he lost before, they could use that same play. But again, if he lost around Johnson, he's going to lose again. It's almost confusing. Like 20% of primary voters have already cast their ballots. It's almost impossible that David Crowley is going to win this. What him getting back into the race may do is

assure that Hong is going to win. Yeah. I mean, all the whispering in those articles is they think they end all of Barnes. It's basically just as progressive as Hong and therefore have all the same

“problems. I think they're all kind of whispering about bad polling. I have no idea if that's”

true, but that's when like political reports on this and stuff. Yeah, the strategy is baffling. But it's so funny because it's one thing to think Barnes is also too progressive, just like Hong. And so Crowley would be the most electable candidate. Like, I get that argument. I mean, I don't agree with it, but I get his legitimate argument. But then saying, okay, so we'll put him

in the primary with two weeks left. He never hit 5%. And somehow he'll vault ahead of the other two

candidates. I'm just hoping that the Tony Evers endorsement will do it. It seems. Well, that's also to be. Yeah, even with like, there has been a lot of great polling, but also the polling has them all pretty low too. So like, maybe they're hoping there's just a lot of people that have made up their minds or didn't wait. Yeah, the other, I also just to say like Barnes was the tenant governor of the state. He's not like coming from nowhere, right? Like, I'll just say this.

Like, if Hong wins the primary and loses the general, it is not, this is not like let's blame DSA. This is the establishment decided to put in someone else potentially split the vote with Barnes. And that's where we ended up where we did after Sarah Rodriguez had to end her campaign. Right. I mean, he started to blame out coming. I think everyone was constantly just like,

“Jesus Christ, what do we do? Right. Scrambleing. Right. But that's what I'm saying. The Crowley”

thing is the weird part. It's not like no one could have seen the Sarah Rodriguez thing coming, but the Crowley thing is just a weird thing to do.

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Chime is a fin tech, not a bank banking services and Chime card provided by Chime's bank partners qualifying direct deposits required. Terms and limits apply. Go to chime dot com slash disclosures for details. All right, let's end with Michigan where there's a a very chill congenial senate primary between former Crooked Host Abdul Alsayed, who the three of us are supporting in Congresswoman Haley Stevens, who we're hoping to have on the show as soon as she

can make it work. The polling is relatively sparse and a bit all over the place in a race where the biggest issue dividing the candidates is Israel, Abdul wants to end all USA to Israel. Stevens does not and has the support of APAC who's spending heavily in this race. Abdul is also in favor of more progressive policies like abolishing ice and Medicare for all, which is one reason he's been endorsed by AOC and Bernie Sanders who are in the state this weekend campaigning with them.

Here's a clip from one event. They want us to think that these forces are too powerful for us to overcome that this is just how things are. There's $50 million in this race because they're expecting

call somebody who looks like me with a name like mine, dangerous. If you're a corporation wanting

to buy a politician with their pack, I'm dangerous. If you're a pack and want to send

“our money abroad, you damn well, but I believe I'm dangerous. If you're somebody who wants”

government to work for you, I'm not dangerous. I might just be the one person running for US Senate who actually wants to serve you. Thoughts on one of the last and maybe most contentious Democratic primary of the year? I mean, I hate that this has gotten jammed into the Graham Plattener discourse frame, at least on social media because I do all in Graham Plattener are absolutely nothing alike and anyone suggesting otherwise is trying to smear Abdul in a really

disgusting way and just clock that when you read these tweets and judge them accordingly.

Some of the issues in the race are nationalized. There is frustration at the establishment

in Chuck Schumer for picking candidates. That's part of the race. There's Gaza. There's Apex spending. But if you watch the debates or watch them on the stump, it is very local. It's a lot of auto industry talk. There's a lot of anger at shitty utility companies. Everyone in the race made a video about a bridge from Detroit to Canada that the Trump was shutting down. They're talking about healthcare premiums. So, look, I'm supporting Abdul because I consider him a friend

at the East really smart and he's going to the stump. He's taken principal positions on stuff. I really care about. I think he'd be a good senator. It's like it's no deeper than that. I'm not a Haley Stevens hater in any way shape or form. If she wins the primary, I will wholeheartedly support her. No matter who wins, this is going to be a really tough race. My Roger's a good,

“strong Republican opponent. We barely beat him last time. So, I think what's most important is”

whatever happens, come August 5th. Everybody's got to put down the little Twitter knives, stop nursing your little grudges and making this about some bigger things, some factional intraparty thing. Let's come together and win this race. We got to do a little faster than people have been doing it up in Maine because there's a lot of lingering bullshit happening. You know, debate about Medicare for all, which is largely a symbolic debate, even if you support

Medicare for all, the next Democratic Congress, if we're so lucky to have a Democratic Congress, we'll have Trump as president. There's no hope of passing Medicare for all, but it is a symbol of a willingness to go bigger, go against the establishment, be willing to say something that may not be as popular broadly, but shows that you're willing to fight. Now, you know, what AOC says there, like, oh, they're buying, they're buying the sea. It's pretty clear. Like,

Hayley Stevens has said she will support military aid and aid to Israel. Abdul will not, right? They're investing to get behind a candidate who will support continuing to give military aid to Israel. Other than, but like, that is a symbol of what happens if either one of them is in the Senate. And put the, like, big kind of, for the ideological distinctions between the side. Hayley Stevens is a reliable Democratic vote. She doesn't have

a particularly strong, like, ideological point of view. You go to her website. It's a lot of nuts and bolts bringing money home to Michigan policies. She supports a public option. She supports reforming ice. She's just a reliable Democratic vote. Abdul is someone who will push on the party

“from the left. That is what he would do in the Senate. Now, I think that's a good thing. I think”

it's good to have, like, people that have a strong point of view and want the Democratic party to stand for something clear, right? But in the end, either way, like, neither one of them is going to be able to enact any kind of specific agenda. So it's a question of what you want and what do you believe a Democratic Senate should look like, which why it becomes a proxy between Bernie and Schumer and all the rest? I do think with the Senate race, because you're there for

six years. Ideally, this person is there for a Democratic president and a Democratic Congress, and then hopefully, the next Democratic president does make a move to expand healthcare, who knows how far they'll be able to go, but ideally. And so, you know, they will get to do,

they will get to set the agenda, hopefully, in some ways. But to your point, I mean, this always

happens with primaries, right, which is because the candidates are generally similar on their policy platforms. You try to find differences that then become magnified in the heat of a race, that then make it seem like it is this mannequin struggle between good and evil for the supporters on either side. And, look, I think in this one, Israel is a clear dividing line. That is where they're policy. I mean, she supports a to Israel with no conditions whatsoever, and he wants to cut it off,

and even some of the other races where APEC has played, and I think the difference hasn't been so clear, or she has. She's on the right edge of a dwindling minority of Democrats who are

are closer to a Google's position now than they are to hate the defense. And so then the other

“thing you would do is you'd make it about electability. And I do think it's been hard to make”

this race about electability grounded in a lot of firm data because, look, the polls that we've had have been from not really high quality pollsters. There's been a lot of internal polling from both sides. We don't have like a New York Times CNN poll, or a lot of really good polling. And so, and in the polling that we have, you know, at the beginning of the race, it seemed like Stevens was performed slightly better against Mike Rogers than a dual. Now, it seems like a dual

has like a pointer to honor, or they're tied. So it's really hard to make an electability arguments. And therefore, now you're just fighting over. Well, of course, now they're really fighting about, is like, they're, they're hand waving at the policy shit, but they're like, his name's a dual. I'll say it. There's a lot of that. That is what is happening. It is, I mean, I'm not saying Haley Stevens specifically, saying that, but a lot of,

of duals opponents are, when they say it electability, that is what they mean. And that is what has gotten a little ugly. Well, into into your earlier point. And now they're doing the, well, he's got a sum of the same consultants. And so, Graham Platner wasn't vetted. We don't want another, and it's like, Abdul has been vetted because he ran for governor of Michigan. And that's

why he's name ID is so high in the first place. And he's been like, you know, he's just, he's, he's

served in public office. He's very, he's been like, clocked out of him. And like, the big controversy was about whether or not after he got his MD PhD, he technically did a residency. It's like, that's like, it's, it's very different than a Nazi tattoo and a sexual assault allegations. But is it like, both candidates now are, I've seen them in interviews, be like, well, this race isn't really about Israel. And everyone else wants to make it about Israel and Gaza, but we

want to make it about Michigan. But even there, there's not a lot of like, there's not a fight about healthcare. Like, you're for Medicare for all. And I'm from the public option. Let's, let's do get out. You're for abolishing it. I sound for reforming it. Let's do get out of that. It's, there's, there's surprisingly little attacks from both of the supporters at least on the policy

issues and more on. It's more like, it's more like money driven policy issues. It's like, you've

taken all this money from corporation for eight back or others. Therefore, you're beholden to them. That is kind of the proxy for a lot of political fights. And then for, but for Haley, it's like, there's a similarly weird thing happening online with her, which is like, a lot of people are plucking up speeches where they think she looks goofy and sharing them. And then it turns out maybe people like those speeches. We don't really know. Well, I was, I was into like, there,

like, there's moments where she's kind of goofy and, like, kind of, she's like, got it. We got a letter ripped. We got a stick to them. And like, it's kind of sweet. And there's this kind of aesthetics where if someone who is seen as centrist or pro Israel does something that is slightly cringe, that it, or it happened about Mallory McMurdo too, when she was in the kind of Elizabeth Warren role to Abdul and they were mad at her. Like, this is so embarrassing. You're so embarrassing. It's cringe.

Like, this is the problem. This is the problem. You don't understand real people because you don't understand what broken brained online people think is funny anymore. But if a Abdul has made plenty of cringy content. And but his, he's, you know, he's good for the movement. And so those things aren't his bad. And I was thinking about when, like, Schumer farted on the Senate floor. And I do think

“he did not make the most of it. I think he should have done it. About how we were having a gas crisis.”

He, what happened to the man? The Schumer used to be the guy at the gas station. There was a moment where he could have made news about it. He thought, sorry. I was just unblocking the straight form of it. Exactly. Exactly. Not the only, not the only waterway that we're having trouble getting things through these days at my age. But so, but, but I know, but it's like, Mom Donnie farted during press conference. There would be stories about how like man, everybody's farting again.

You know, he's so good at this. He's so good at that. This is a master at where a generation of such a Joe mass. This is why we need Medicare for All. He'd say or something. I don't know. How do we get the farting? Because, oh, because there's a lot of advice because it's a stick to him. But, but at the same time, it's like, okay, you want to be this sort of like hard scrabble kind of salt to the earth campaigner. But also, your campaign is propped up by tens of millions of

dollars of outside money. And, Don, to your point, like one of the reasons that the debate is about that outside money and about Israel is because she has an establishment figure. Doesn't have, like, a clear other than just bringing money home for vision. They'll auto bail it. Like, what's the policy place where she feels so strongly? She wants to pick a fight with a duel over. This is, yes. And, I know this is naive of me, but, like, as we head into a presidential primary season,

like, my wish is that the, the factional war within the Democratic Party is fought over different policy positions. Because there are plenty of differences between the left and the

“center left. And I think sometimes with the establishment center left, whatever we want to call them,”

more moderate Democrats does is they look at the progressive movement, progressive candidates, and they either take Umbridge or dismiss them or, say, or just, like, attack attack attack. And it's like, try to, you got to be for something. Yes, you got to be excited about your candidates, and you got to run candidates who are exciting and charismatic, and have something that they

and I'm not saying Stevens does this, but some of her supporters are always like,

but she works so hard. And she's just, she's got her head down and she works hard. And that's like, that's like the thing for all the establishment candidates, it's like, they just, they're servant. They're public servants and they're working hard. It's like, yeah, everyone's, everyone in public life who's running for offices, working hard and doing a lot of good stuff. Well, she, she's sort of a throwback. It's sort of a throwback campaign. Like, there was a,

not that long ago, most campaigns were like, I'm going to deliver for my state. I'm going to bring home the bacon. I'm going to get earmarks and pork barrel and just like build a fucking airport

“over here. And you know what if Susan Collins wins? That's why. And then, Haley, it's like,”

it sounds like that's the kind of camp you know, she's running. Now somewhere along the way we work, we found this desire where we also want people to be national figures and have national profiles and see value in that too. There's a bit of a race here. On the, on the, on the, the goofy content thing, like Abdulaz put out videos that were so cringy that I sent them to his consultants and I said no more of this. I've got right. Was he in a hat? I don't remember which one it was. It might have been

more than one, but like he's put on a lot of corny shit. Now I think there are people rightly pointing out that I think Haley is treated differently because she is a woman. There's a lot of misogyny in sexism in the messaging you'll see on Twitter about these videos. They're also just kind of cringy videos at times. And like sometimes she's a goofy messenger and sometimes she's a goofy

fucking messenger. It's not always loaded to say that, too. Like that's the other part of this.

Well, that's it. This is where, like, the attention economy has made people do crazy things. Yes. Like there's a whole range of issues that are just not really that much of part of the Democrats. You've made education. One of the most important issues where Democrats have lost ground for the last 10 years, or five years, or really six years. And like I'll say something that would like, this is one of the reasons why if Rom runs for president, like it will be good because he will be the

person that picked up. Shut up, shut up, shut up, fuck. Right, it will be good. It will be, it will be awesome. Send it. He will, he will, he will, he will, he will have that kind of old school Democratic politics where he, like, he's not now starring on the side. He's like, your next street is how Ari gets it back on the survivor too, fuck. Because he will force debates about these questions on his road to not being the nominee and, like, on a broad range of issues that

will, like, kind of, like, in the way that Hayley seems is not causing, not kind of forcing questions

“back over to a duel on policy questions. I think you need center left figures who do that,”

because we need to have those big debates. That's all. Well, Hayley's big attack on a duel in debate was, like, you haven't released your tax returns yet. And I just wonder, like, there was another, kind of, like, it felt like an old school criticism of someone. Yeah. It feels like he's attacking her on money, right? Like, you've got all this money right. Right. And you're happy. So she's like, I want to do a money thing. It's not like getting it. I'm just wondering a voter's

care. I don't know who we'll find out. Who knows? Speaking of Bernie, uh, seeing and reported over the week in the back in March, um, when he backed a challenger to a Democratic housing company in North Carolina, who came Jeffree's called him and warned him against meddling in house primaries, arguing that it's divisive and a drain on limited resources that could go to beating Republicans. Um, another member who was on the call said Sanders quote, seemed not to care.

Guys, they're like, it was, seems absolutely by that. The most jolene phone call. Like, please, please, you could, I know you can take these districts. Please stop. Please stop. He's my man.

“It's like, I get why hockey and Jeffree's would not want divisive primaries. I can't imagine any”

scenario where he thought Bernie Sanders would care. I can't, I'd target to imagine a conversation Bernie Sanders would care about less. Other than the debate, the interview, I had with him where he tried to get out of a few minutes or like, where he did this. That's tough. This is tough. This is tough. This is tough. This is tough. This is tough.

Another problem with like the establishment argument is that the response is always like,

no, no, no, these primaries shouldn't happen or these can't, I guess what? The candidates are going to run. People are going to sign up and they're going to run for office and they're going to be from all political persuasions. And doing the whole and, and Hillary started this in 2016 with Bernie, right? It's like the, they're not real Democrats. And they're not, they don't respect the Democratic Party's institutions. Like, you know who doesn't respect the Democratic

Party's institution? America. And actually, and more specifically, Democrats. So it's like, not the greatest argument to be like, how dare you run? And how dare you upset our primaries? It's like, go beat them. Beat them with better ideas. Beat them by saying that like their ideas are bad, or their ideas aren't going to resonate with most American people. Like, there's plenty to go after before just being like, don't run. Yeah, it's a, you know, these are people trying to do a

hostile takeover of a failing enterprise. You know, they're, if you think they're not the right people to lead, you got to make a much better case to the shareholders because they're looking at your record or nothing, I'm going to kind of take a shot on these people. Yeah, let's look at the Republican Party did that work really well for them for all the establishment figures in the Republican Party when they're like, no, Donald Trump can't be it. Right. Good point.

But, and also, they're facing their own version of this, like an Arizona Andy Biggs is probably going to be the Republican gubernatorial nominee. He's a lunatic. In Iowa, my buddy Rob Sand is up against this complete unknown dude who's primary work background was like working for the

There's that Kansas. That's Colorado guy. That's like, yeah, when I was a kid, I killed people.

What up? What up? What up? What up? We all do it. It's like, wait, what? No back.

“You know, that's one of the all-time interviews. Like, so I killed someone, what up it?”

Yeah. Yeah, no, they've nominated this lunatic in Iowa who wants to like band MRNA vaccine. He wants COVID vaccines off the shelf. He wants me. Marxist hijacked the curriculum in Iowa. There was a decade of a Republican rule, but they're not backing away from him. The RGA is going to put tens of millions of dollars on air behind this guy. So it's at anyway. Yeah. Well, like you said, I think it's going to be a bumpy couple weeks in these primaries, but once August comes

and goes, we're all behind the nominee. Is that all or whoever it may be? Yeah. Did you see that on the sidelines of one of the events with a dual political asked AOC about running for president? And she said, I can't say that I've ruled it out. She also talked about her own definition of what big tent means. General thoughts on how she's preparing for the possibility of a run in 28. We've talked so much about elections that are happening in November.

We get a little treat to talk to do just a tiny bit of speculation before we, uh, before we end the pod. Yeah. There's a little bit of like a, there's like an axio's story about like about AOC embracing kind of Obama style, hope and change, just sort of some, as a, as like evidence of her shift in preparation for running. And I don't really think it, like reflects a, like if you go, I think AOC has evolved as a public figure. And I think she has learned a lot since she's been

in Congress. But I think part of what her appeal has always been is that, you know, she's, there's

some, she's asked and she says, I don't, I don't come from a, I come from a working class family. I didn't come from a militant, leftist family. Right? Like, Isaac, that's just right, like this reading the stage directions a little bit. Uh, but her appeal has always been that she hasn't sounded like what Republicans want her to sound like. She sounded so much more optimistic and hopeful. And she's also, by the way, said something similar about not ruling out. Like, I think a

month ago, like, this is going to be something that keeps happening. But whether she runs for Senate or President or neither, uh, like, she's going to use the power she has. And she is,

“I think, a more important and, uh, attention worthy figure, as long as the possibility of”

running for President's out there. The single best way to get media coverage is to suggest that you're going to run for President. She's smart. She knows that. This will get her attention for her ideas. I don't know if she's going to run or not. It feels like she might. I, like, the, the, the

only size tent we are allowed to have is circus. It's like never, our tent has got to be gigantic

at this point. Yeah. We need to fit a lot of people underneath this thing. So I'm glad she's saying that. I will say that, um, she, if, if I were her and I were thinking of running for President, she is, and, and, and, and she's probably being told and, and knows herself because she's very, very smart that like, you know, her risk is that she's seen as too left and too extreme and she's seen all the polling data. I'm sure. And if you're going to run for President

and you at least want to prepare for the possibility that you might, I think she's doing all the right things that you would do. How's that, which is that, it may be less than her answers, right, about like, are you running or not? Like, the, the way that, um, she's endorsing or not endorsing, sort of, she's in endorsed Graham Platner, uh, she has an endorsed this, um, this progressive challenger and Michigan and a house seat and then wasn't on stage for the, like, she's like being

very careful. She's being very careful, um, but not in a way that seems like cautious, like she's just being, and, and, and her rhetoric, right? Like, she said, you know, you can have a clear vision for what we're trying to accomplish as a country and also include everyone in it and show that everyone has a place on that as well. Um, it's just, it's not, it's at the same as you hear from, many of the DSA candidates today. I accept my, except my, I'm done. Yeah, I take her also out

our word when she was asked about this preview, like what she's looking for sort of outcomes, right? She's not just that her and her position. And if you think in 2020, there's obviously

“going to be a big, contentious and very important primary. Some, either the vote of the left will”

be divided or it will be united behind one figure. If it is her, she knows that as that person, she trusts, like, she knows how responsible and capable, uh, and careful, she will be in deliberate about how to, to hold that position, whether it is as the nominee or as the person who helps you unite the party behind whoever the nominee. Right. And that is like, the, the, the, the, the figure who is right to, like, represent, like, what comes after Bernie is someone who age as

truly believes in this fight and representing it as persuasively as possible, but also like Bernie and AOC understand that if the moderate, more moderate candidate wins, it is just as important to get, get behind them. She, she comes across a someone who takes very seriously her role in the party wherever it, whatever it may be and her role in politics, um, which is a good thing to see. All right. That's our show for today. Dan and I will be back with a new show on Friday.

Positive America is a crooked media production. Our show is produced by Austin Fisher, Saul Rubin, McKenna Roberts, and Ferris Safari, with Reacherland, Elijah Cone, and Adrian Hill.

Carol Pelevieve, David Tolz, Mia Kalman, Ryan Young, and Naomi Single. Our staff is probably unionized with the writer's guild of America East.