Carol Leonnig and Will Sommer: The Loons and the Loyalists Running the DOJ

Now there is a package of meat. The best one can be a gratis test. The people who have been in cheese, cheese, cheese, cheese. Now to the gratis test. Time for 18 years. The coffee and the coffee and the coffee are ready. The volume is 4.5. Only the amount of sugar.

The amount of sugar and cheese is minus action. Hello and welcome to the Bullet Podcast. I'm your host Tim Miller. We've got a double header for you today in segment 2. We go into Magistan with Will

Summer. He's got some fun newsletters. I want to share with you all, but first, delighted

to welcome back a senior investigative reporter at MSNow. She was previously at the Washington Post. A five time Pulitzer Prize winner. It's five more than me. Her latest book is in justice. How politics and fear of anguish to America's justice department. It's Carolina. How are you doing? I'm good. It's really nice to see you. Good to see you as well. Man, a lot of happening on your beat. The Justice Department

B. You've also written about the Secret Service a bunch in the past as well. And so I kind of want to start just, like talking about what happened at the Correspondence Center to the Secret Service lens. I see a lot of folks out there critiquing and catastrophizing what happened. Obviously, the Trump administration is talking about how this justifies the illegal ballroom they're trying to build. You tell me, I feel crazy

kind of, because I look at this story and I'm like, things seem to work. We're in a crazy country where we have too many guns and people bring guns into hotels now, which we'd like to fix that part of the problem. But the guy didn't even get on to the floor that President was on. And so I'm a little bit confused by why everybody is acting like this is a big failure of the Secret Service. I'm wondering what you're perspective is on that.

“So I'm with you. I think that, obviously, the protective multiple protective circles that”

they draw around the president, the president first and foremost, right? Outer perimeter

layers fail. An important one failed. And that is what is such a big deal. The magnetometers where this guy bum rush, right? Sped right through. We're not hard to pierce. If you can look at those surveillance videos. And that is while the Secret Service is delighted that they, the guy fell, they tackled him. He didn't make it down to the ballroom door. It's no small thing that he made it inside the site. So to speak, two feet, let's be fair,

inside the site. It's no small thing. And they're going to be investigating that internally because they want to fix that. And, you know, let's also be clear about something to him. Laura Trump said it best the other day. The guy, meaning Donald Trump, has had three untrained people try to kill him and get pretty damn close. One of them shooting him in the ear. How many more chances does he have?

Look, I understand that. I just, you know, we're in a dangerous world. Every president of the dangerous world, I don't mean to minimize this. Obviously, it's very serious. I just,

“I, when I'm trying to understand his on the secret service side of it, I thought there”

seems like an obvious failure as far as I could tell. Just like just a clear fuck up. The golf course, there's a lot of different reporting on that. But it was kind of like, my understanding was that it was like Trump didn't want, you know, the degree of protection that the Secret Service could have provided on the golf course because of very, you know, way, so what effect that you can tell me if that's wrong. And in this case, again, he gets

two feet inside the perimeter and he gets grabbed before he even goes down the escalator. We fall, then you and I, and I guess we have nothing. God willing, some of the listeners haven't suffered through the White House course, but it's brutal. But if you have, it's down the escalator. The guy's still had to go down a whole other floor. You know, so anyway, I don't know. If you're like, look at all those things together. Obviously, the

Butler thing is just like a massive shocking failure. And so I just kind of wonder how you see it all, you know, if you put it all together. You know, it's funny. You didn't write about the Secret Service, like I did. You didn't write a book about it, so it is because zero fail is my book. And you, you nailed all three of those. I would underline it by with this. Butler was a colossal failure of brand new agent in charge of making the

advanced security plan and forgetting Secret Service 101 from 1963. Hey, we look at high

“buildings because that's how John of Kennedy got killed, right? That boom done. Okay, huge”

failure ever. There were several other small failures, but when you can't remember the lesson from 60 years before, that's a problem. And you can't remember it because you're

not experienced, right? You didn't get training. You, your first advanced security plan

at that time. Number two, the golf course, to me, the golf course is an amazing success. The

“screw up was Donald Trump insisting that he has to play at his own golf courses, which makes”

him a sitting duck. And he's been warned about that. John Kelly, as Chief of Staff said, dude, you keep going to the same place on good weather days on Saturday. People know if it's Sunday on Saturday, and it's springtime, you're at this club in Florida. And they know if it's, you know, summertime, and it's a nice day. You're at Virginia. And they know when you're going to be there. And we have pictures of photographer long range lenses taking

pictures of your face on the golf course. So we know someone can shoot you. So the screw

up is Trump insisting on golfing. The way he always has amazing hats off to the agents

who, the one particular agent who found that guy long before Trump got anywhere near. Number three, we're still in the middle of reporting out what happened at the White House correspondence dinner. But it seems to me that the real problem is going to be the Hilton presents unique challenges. And the guys at the mags weren't paying close attention. And the suspect got through. And the site is not as secure as you'd like. I don't know that that's a screw up

right now, but there's more to report. So I'm not going to, I'm not going to jump the gun,

but those are two biggies. Some Scott about about Susie Wiles getting some heat over this

and said, this is in her remit. I'm wondering if you've heard anything about that or have any thoughts on that? Susie Wiles was commissioning a very large review. She wants Sean

“Karen, the Secret Service Director later this week to give her a blow by blow about how they're”

going to address security for Trump going forward. And she's definitely sharing and feeling what Lara Trump is feeling. Like how many more times can we have an assassination attempt by untrained armed individuals? And the guy still meaning Trump still be alive. I'm not trying to be flim, but we do live in a crazy world, but this is not good. Are we going to have to have to have to have him in the White House at all times? It's starting to look that way

and Susie Wiles doesn't want that. She's in the middle of a campaign. You're an interesting just kind of reporting on. There are a bunch of conspiracy theories floating around about all of this and everybody's been listened to too many true crime podcasts and analyzing the different videos that they see. And one of the things that was going around was like, why was Vance evacuated before Trump? And you explained that and I thought it was kind of interesting if they

made it to share it with the listeners. So you know what? I feel bad about this. I'm going to let you into my reporting world. So you know, lots of times you hear something official and it sounds super sketch and suspicious. And then you realize two things can be true at the same time. So in this instance, a senior official told me that the reason Vance got moved so quickly and Trump just ever so slightly less quickly was because agents all clambering around him and mostly his detail,

the shift. They were trying to make sure on their radios. Do we have the presidential walk as hardened and all the post-standards agents protecting that at all of the junctures where someone could

“get in? Do we have that hardened before we take Trump back through that walk to a holding room?”

Then the president himself said yesterday that it was a little bit his fault that he got removed a little later because he had a couple of questions like what's going on and that that may have delayed things. Both things I think are true. I think that Trump doesn't like the optics of looking like he's being taken to the bunker. You know how I agree he gets around that. He doesn't want to look weak. But I think both things are true. This one maybe is going to end up being more of a comment than

a question. Well, we're doing the conspiracy theories. The suspect has been now detained. We have him. We've got the suspect, right? He's alive and in custody. So the idea that he was an agent of cash for tell, this was a false flag, the Trump wanted this, it breaks down a little bit when he's in custody, right? Because it's like he's going to about to go to jail for life and it seems like

Cash, I was drunk one night and cash offered, it told me to do this and I did it on a large

“and then I could get out. Like that it seems like a weakness of the false flag. They're again,”

more of a comment than a question. I don't know. Yeah, you know, the problem with you Tim is you're so logical. You know, it's hard to talk to such logical people. Yeah, this is not a false flag. This was not staged. Let me repeat. This guy, we don't know his mental health status, but I will tell you every single person who tries to kill a president has usually suffered a mental health devolution, challenge and has started getting angry or an angry or their rhetoric is ramping up and

they believe that they have been anointed to solve this problem and solve it by killing someone.

We'll see what happens with Cole Allen and what we learn about him, but I'll tell you what I'm

hearing this morning, which is that his family is cooperating with investigators and they are sharing with the FBI that they had seen some signs of him coming unhinged about Trump and his rhetoric getting very scary and strange. It is just funny. I mean, you're logical, but also funny. It is just funny that he says in his letter writing that the one person he doesn't want to kill in the administration is casualty. I assume that's because casualty tells a very high profile figure.

He read a lot of stories about him and for some reason fixated on that. Maybe things cash is so incompetent. That's not worth it. He's too drunk to kill. Are you commenting again?

I'm commenting again. I'm just suggesting. I don't know. We're moving this statement.

“Maybe his family's in on it. I don't know. I'm just joking. This is it's silly. I think it's important”

to just kind of it's one thing. I think for people to watch all this stuff and look at it and say, that looks suspicious. That looks weird. I read this and this looks a lot. It just seems logical. It's not what I would write if I was going to write a manifesto. You're not an insane person that wants to kill the president. So, yeah. So, your manifesto would be like that. Mother's Day is coming up and if you're looking to upgrade your mom's gift from the usual card

or flowers, our friends at aura frames are here to help. Let me tell you, as out of Jan's, that's this weekend, was waiting in line for, what was I waiting in line for? Maybe a shrimp pickleys or maybe it was the crawfish struttle. I can't remember. But a young man came out to me in line and he said, yeah, well, I just want to thank you. I got my mom and aura frame for a birthday.

“That was a good gift. I used your code and that is probably the best thing that you can”

say to me. If you see me at a concert. I appreciate anything that you guys want to say to me, but the best thing you can say is that you are using my promo code and that you're not only using the promo code, but that you are feeling fulfilled and happy with the purchase following the promo code. Shout out to that bro. aura frames have free unlimited storage, told us many photos and videos as you want. My favorite part is that it's the kind of gifts that you can keep

updating all year round. You can keep refreshing it, putting new stuff in there. I put more photos into frames for my family members and friends who have gotten the aura frame. The kid has done something new and cute boom, pop it in there. They don't even know what's happened. Just one day they're walking by, they're living room table where they have the aura frame or the desk in their office. Like, oh, look at that. Look at that cute new photo. That's fun. You can update it all year round.

Name number one by wire cutter. You can save on the gifts, moms love by visiting auraframes.com. For limited time, listeners can get 25 bucks off their best-selling carver matte frame with code, the bowlwork that's AURA frames.com, promo code, the bowlwork support the show by mentioning us at checkout terms and conditions apply. I want to talk about some of your other stories. We have several recently on the prosecutor firing, so to the O.J., I appreciate you're still

on this beat because there's a little bit of a dog bites man element to this at this point, where people are like, oh, the Trump administration is firing good people in the government for corrupt reasons. But a couple of them that you mentioned, Maria Long, she was a prosecutor and the Southern District of Florida, she told colleagues that there was not ample justification to bring criminal charges against John Brennan, like the administration wanted and she was fired,

some other prosecutor firings were prosecutors that went after anti-bortion protesters in the past of administration. It's going to talk about what is there a new uptake of this when Blanche is

looking for people that they don't think are on board. First, thank you for focusing on this

“because you're right. We can all start to get numb to like, oh, another firing arrow, another”

demotion, another removal in Maria Medeta's long case. She was a very senior prosecutor in the Southern District of Florida who just to correct was removed from being the head of that investigative team. And my sources have told me that basically what she was doing was the job. Like, look, you want to investigate John Brennan. There was a referral from Chairman Jim Jordan claiming the former CIA director John Brennan had, you know, lied to Congress in a 2023 interview about the Russian

interference investigation that Donald Trump is so hacked off about. Maria's like, okay, I'll

investigate that. I'll look into that. I'll do the job. And ultimately, she told her colleagues

who who later relayed to me that she had said, there's just no evidence to claim or to even go to a grand jury and claim that he lied to Congress. We don't see any evidence of that. We don't have a case. And then off with their heads, she's removed from being in charge of that case. And instead, they bring in Joe DeGenteva, who is 81, I don't think his process is called for the call for Chris Krebs to be. That Chris goes as a traitor and, you know, he's got a 2020 election.

And represented Demetri Fertas, you know, deep in the, in the Ukraine conspiracies that Donald Trump was drumming up, you know, I don't know how he resolved that conflict, you know, he 's mocked up in that Russian interference investigation himself in some ways. But he's also, somebody who hasn't prosecuted, it hasn't prosecuted in Florida. I would, I would estimate 40 years, so it's an interesting choice. But you asked about Todd Tim. Yeah. Todd Blanche, the acting attorney

general, he knows from his boss being removed, Pampani, he knows what the assignment is, right? Which is line up every single person Donald Trump wants lined up and charge him. And so we are hearing from sources inside DOJ that Blanche is working really hard, triple time to audition for this job permanently and, and is trying to complete that assignment. Yeah. We have breaking from the New York post this morning and you haven't confirmed it yet, but it's just interesting on this same topic

that they're, and Diding Fauci advisor, David Marens for FOIA of Asian related to COVID. It's not clear to me that this administration is really crossing their teas and doting their eyes

“on all the FOIA requests that they're getting. So I think we can maybe put a pin in this now that”

we know the DOJ can go after people for FOIA, but it's just another example of kind of what you're talking about assuming that reporting is true, right? Well Fauci, you know, I mean, I'll repeat the obvious, but you know, you know it well, Fauci is such a hot button for Trump. The president views him as an absolute enemy who embarrassed him about his handling of COVID and he wants to

blame Fauci for a lot of things, including supporting research that ultimately led to the

Wuhan virus that became a worldwide pandemic. And, and ultimately really cost Donald Trump his reelection Bill Barr former attorney general told Trump in, I think it was May of 2020. I think you're going to lose this election if you don't get it together about the wacky things you're saying about COVID. I paraphrase, right? But back to indicting people, Trump doesn't like and FOIA evasion. I mean, the Justice Department just and I mean headquarters just responded

to a FOIA and said that they didn't believe there was any public interest. So they were not going to expedite this FOIA. Now I just forgot what is about and but trust me, I was interested. Sorry. This is one more I'm being inside that building in justice. You reported recently the Pan Bondi's portrait was thrown in the trash. After she left, now a lot of love there. You know, because we can all speculate on what that is, but was it about management style or

“like what is your sense for what was? I think because I don't I don't see much difference between”

Bondi and Blanche, but that's an outsider's perspective. You know, there are levels of disdain and hatred within the career prosecutor and career agent world towards Bondi and Blanche. The frustration with Bondi was that people didn't think she really understood how the

feel like he's such a traitor. He actually worked in the Southern District of New York,

“worked his way through night school, paralegal, and knew the firmament and now their angry”

they sort of turned on it and it has not, in their view, again, stressing, quoting them. He has not complied with sort of the procedures and manuals that prosecutors swear by, including, you know, investigating people without having evidence of a crime at the start. The trash, I'll just quickly tell you a funny story, funny to me. The day that Bondi was removed by the president and he drove with her up to the Supreme Court and notified her, essentially in the car, look your, your days are

over. I got a message from a source who was hearing that Bondi was going to be removed and said,

"They better take her picture down." People do not forget when she fired a person in the National Security Division who ran that division because Bondi was walking through offices ends up in a skiff for the National Security Division and, you know, the janitorial team hasn't come to replace the pictures and there's still pictures of Biden and Harris up and she rips them down, bosom in the trash and fires the guy who runs that division. Memories are long and so,

I don't know, it must have been a couple hours after that person said, "They better take her picture

down that we started, Ken Delaney and I started getting pictures sent to us of trash cans with

her picture in it." Well, that's rough. I wonder if that's going to happen to Cash? What's do you have any reporting on the latest is with Cash? Is the pictures of Cash in the Correspondent Center just kind of sitting there in the chair? I thought we're pretty damning and obviously the Atlantic's reporting and others have been, which we've been talking about, but he's not giving off the energy of somebody who's confident about his place and who's in charge of the bureau.

Without commenting on competence, I will say that the disdain and hatred for bonding and blanch, pale, like a white hot sun compared to the way agents feel about Cash Patel. I had a source, I reached out to to ask a little bit about a subject I'm not going to raise here and the source

“said that the place is a disaster because of Cash Patel. That was their language. That's how”

vitriolic the feeling is, I don't know what's going to happen with Cash. I mean, we've been hearing rumors since the fall, right? And then again, in January, that the president and Susie Wiles were like, we got to change up in the FBI because his flights and then this hockey trip with the drinking in Milan with the US men's ice hockey league. We got to make a change, but that hasn't happened and we'll see. I do wonder, on that point, you mentioned the blanch getting the job

permanently. It's not like the clock is ticking on that. Really, you have a certain number of whenever it is a couple hundred days that he can be there as acting, but it's kind of ticking with or goes to the Senate confirmation process. It's possible that Democrats take the Senate and so it does feel like that to decision that has to come by the fall. I don't know if you're hearing anything about that. That's definitely a worry for White House AIDS. They're eyeing the same

polls you're eyeing. They're looking at the same information you are studying and Senators have been squawking like crazy to Susie Wiles. I guess the most strident moment for that was when Alex Pretty was shot and killed by an ice actually a custom and border patrol agent in Minnesota Senators were like, we're going to lose the Senate if you don't address this right now. So there's anxiety about that as for whether or not there's going to be a nomination next week

four weeks from now. I don't have any good reporting for you. If I do, I'll let you know everything

“else you're working on. I mean, this shooting is pretty important understanding what happened with”

the suspect, understanding how this individual got through that important final checkpoint and what we're hearing is that there was nobody manning the stairwells outside the mags, outside the magnettometer checkpoint and the stairwell happened to be right at that right place and he made it through in part because of that and that he was sprinting through fell down wasn't tackled right away

on the stairwell because if he hadn't fallen down he was going too fast actually make the steps so it's very unlikely he would have gotten to the ballroom but we're also hearing that the

“secret service has launched a mission assurance review internally to figure out what went wrong”

and what they can fix and that started yesterday. All right, that's Carolina. We appreciate your wisdom

as always. We'll see you on Nicole or something or the next time you're on the show. Say hi to the

Sam Stein for me and up next we got Will Summer. Thanks, go. Thank you Tim. All right, and we're back. He is a senior reporter here at the bowlwork here. It's the false flag newsletter and he was the author of Trust to Play on the Rise of Q and A and the conspiracy that unhinged America. It's well summer. I was going on, bro. Hey, thanks for having me back on. Of course, of course, if people aren't signed up for the false flag newsletter this

point literally what are you doing? What are you going to go to thebork.com and subscribe right now. We just had Carolina going and obviously her remet is kind of DOJ FBI secret service. She was talking

about just the loading that agents have for cash betel. Basically, she said that people hated

Pam Bondy so much that as soon as she was fired, they threw her portrait in the trash can and like the hatred for her pales. They barely said to that for cash betel. And so I'm just kind of interested in your perspective on that, especially in the context of some reporting you did recently about how cash betel ordered FBI agents to chase down a story that came from the blaze about who potentially had the bombs outside of the capital on January 6th and it leads to a rate

in actual raid. So real resources are pushed to this cock and maybe theory. Well, why don't you talk to us a little bit about that and what you've been hearing from your friend, Carl Serif, and another. Yeah, sure. I mean, this is the back story here is that a few months ago in early November the blaze, which was Glenn Beck's outlet, they came up with this idea that by the way, one of their reporters is a January 6th defendant involved in this case. So he may have a some other

motives here. But they came up with this idea that this capital police officer named Shani Kerkoff was also secretly the pipe bomber who put the bombs outside the Democratic and the public and

“headquarters on January 6th. And this is a case that is really important to the right because they”

think it was like a false flag operation to sort of ratchet up tensions and lead to the riot. Mm-hmm. So they think it's a false flag operation, you say. Yes, you know, and that's I feel like that's a phrase we're hearing more and more. You know what they're doing too. You know, it's assassination attempts. And so, but their evidence here was really thin. I mean, as I wrote

at the time, basically, they looked at the way she walked, for example, on January 6th, by the way,

in full tactical gear, which might kind of affect your walk. And then they said, well, now, look at yours, the pipe bomber on this surveillance video. And we found this guy who has a like a video game avatar, this anonymous guy on Twitter who says it matches. So I think that's case close. But she ended up being a security guard at the CIA after leaving Capitol Police. So in the days right before publication, the blazer reporter goes around to Tulsi Gabbard's office.

And he says, you got to look at this stuff. This makes it's way to the FBI. And then the FBI raids this woman's house or boyfriend also a Capitol Police officer, totally tossed the house that bomb dogs helicopter all this crazy stuff. Helicopter Helicopter. Yeah. So she's the, she's outside her house and FBI is like, hey, we're going to come interview you and she said, okay. And then suddenly the helicopter comes in the bug like the guys with the swapping with the guns

“pile out. I think in like her suburban northern Virginia home. And she's like, what is happening here?”

I'm sorry. That's not funny. That's horrible. I knew terrorizing this poor woman. And you see all that are capital police officers that were attacked for ugly. By the people that are accusing them, they had to go through that. And now like, what do your neighbors think? I don't know if you're pretty embarrassing. Oh, yeah. I mean, it's traumatizing really. There was a high ranking FBI official on the scene and she said

to him, what are you doing here? Like why this, it's odd that you're here for like a search warrant. And he said, look, this is all orders from higher up. So, you know, this is a cash but tell we don't know. But I mean, certainly pretty high up in the FBI. And you know, it's like you need to in any other organization. I'm sure there are some agents who are like gung-ho about the sort of

I mean, you're making us go after this poor lady's house based on a gate analysis by some random

blogger, you know, far right blogger. I mean, among the many other, you know, things about cash, these like kind of complaints do seem to be bubbling up from a particularly among the ex agents set. Yeah, I mean, look, I mean, I think there's clearly a lot of internal criticism of him, you know, this is how the New York Times presumably found out that cash, you know, they were investigating any York Times reporter for stalking for, you know, knowing that his girlfriend uses all these FBI

resources. So, I mean, yeah, I think there's a lot of turmoil there. You also have to figure in the case of the pipe bombing a month later, they arrested the person I say is the actual suspect. So they were probably FBI agents who were like, well, I know what you heard from the blaze,

“but there's kind of a guy we've been reviewing his Amazon purchases. But I guess if you want to”

toss this house, I guess we have no choice insane, actually insane that this is the folks in charge of

government. I want to like broaden it out and touch you a little bit about, you know, the ongoing podcast to stand wars, you know, between Ben and Megan and Candison Laura and you know, we'll get through it all. And there's a period of time, a couple months ago, we're like my view on it was it's funny to watch, you know, we can get some entertainment about it. Like there are some features there that

are real, you know, but it's kind of helping all of them. Really, like there are all boats are being raised by, you know, the sort of fudes, like I was joking for a while that I need somebody to fude with, like I need to fake fude with someone in order to help, you know, get attention

for oneself and sets out things working podcast world. Like, if you want that, it's starting to change.

“Like, and I think that as the Iran war drags on, I think that potentially we're seeing”

features that are so deep that it causes real damage to some of these political figures, some of the podcast figures, some of the institutions. I mean, it's not, it's just one thing, but like the empty turning point event at UGA, to me, says something about the fact that like, you know, Candison attacks on them or that American memes or who know, some combination of everything has created, you know, a little bit less excitement around everything. Anyway, I just

wondering how you kind of adjudicate that as you watch all of this, like, you know, the difference between kind of these fake fudes in order to get attention and what seemed to be like some real potential fissures that could be hurting the, the negative movement. Yeah, you know, it's interesting, um, political, had an article recently saying that some Republicans are really pinning their midterm hopes on Erica Kirk and hoping that Erica Kirk can unite the party of these units that's kind of

“rally and kicker, um, and you know, good luck with that. But yeah, I mean, I think you're right,”

I think there has been this question like how much is this is sort of drama to drama clicks and views and whatever, but I think it is just that the feelings are so bad out there and in particular, when you start talking about, let's say, turning point USA, when organization that's a big kind of get out the vote machine for the Republicans, it's kind of a key part of their effort. And then you have people saying, you know, they murdered Charlie Kirk, all those crazy stuff. And look, I mean,

I think we're, we, we've seen at least two chapters disaffiliate themselves now. I think the, the sense is that like the turning point brand is just kind of weird. I mean, they're saying, you know, this isn't what the students are saying, this isn't what Charlie Kirk would have wanted. And I think a lot of that is being driven by this podcast fighting, obviously, a particularly by Candice Owens. I think, you know, let's say you go to the turning point

America fest conference and you're expecting to hear about, you know, these darn liberals and get fired up and then Ben Shapiro and Megan Kelly get up and they start saying, you know, you, you little pit squeak, you know, you don't talk that way about Tucker Carl said, you know, and I think the reaction is from the average person's like, what, you know, why am I in this kind of like, you know, net blood sport? You know, one thing I was thinking about this morning,

I was watching some of the clips from Fox over the fast few hours, you know, from this morning, when they're covering and the propaganda machine, you can see how it works when it's well-oiled. And around the ballroom question, right, this like, oh, a shooter coming to get Trump and almost getting down the escalator, you know, is shows why we need this ballroom. And like that message is, I just pervasive Fox this morning. It's like every guest has come, my governor of Louisiana,

Jeff Landry, you know, we're last in the country and everything, but he's on Fox this morning,

everybody's on. And that efficiency, I really helped Trump over the last decade, right,

that like he could like put out some cock and Amy nonsense, and everybody would just echo it, and no matter how silly it was. And while that is still working in the Fox world, it does feel like that's broken down completely in the online echo chamber. And obviously there are some people tweeting about the ballroom, and like that there are some people echoing him, and, you know, he's got an air authority or Benny Johnson or whatever, they'll say whatever Mr. Trump wants. But like,

a bunch of these other associated kind of big foot shows are just like, maybe they'll say something about it, but it's like, they have other business that they care about more, whether it's a rot war, whether it's obscene, whether it's costs, whether it's, you know, whatever, like you're just seeing

a lot more of the kind of right wing propaganda figures starting to kind of break off. And like,

you know, I'm not going to just, I'm not just about the party line today. I do think that's a

“note where the change. Yeah, I think that's a good insight. I mean, I think we're seeing, like,”

in a way, I mean, it's just more competition. I think among these figures, this idea that like, I'm not going to talk about what the Trump line is. You know, I think back to when Charlie Kirk got a call from Trump and he said, stop talking about Epstein and he said, okay, you've got it. Yeah. And now I think that would be less likely to happen because I mean, Trump is, is less popular. You know, and to be frank, I think the emergence of these figures, whether it's, you know,

Nick Fuentes, Megan Kelly, these people who were more willing can't have someone's obviously

more willing to break with Trump. And in a lot of cases, really directly go on the attack against

Trump. I mean, Tucker's saying Trump is the anti-Christ. I think that makes people like Benny Johnson Erick Dorety. It just makes them look lame when you have another option. But one of these kind of great for guys calls these people like take sellers because there's this idea that these guys are just like, here's your slop today. You know, you know, here you go. And like people like Jack Pacific, for example. And when you have that, when you see that coordinated messaging,

and then on the other hand, you have these kind of wild and woolly things coming out from

“Candace Owens or whoever like Alperjit McCron did, did what? You know, I think that, you know,”

unfortunately, I think the audience is, is flocking a lot more to that kind of like innovative crazy stuff rather than the old tired crazy stuff. Another signal that is being sent is that you can succeed by doing crazy stuff that that separates you from Trump. Just remember what happened after the 2020 election, where Fox was not going as full bore for the stop-to-steel stuff as Trump wanted, right? And then Trump started attacking them. And Fox's ratings goes crash,

and newsmax's ratings skyrocket like there's that period of time where newsmax is almost catching up to Fox in the rankings for like two weeks or on Christmas, you know, before the January 6th insurrection, you're not seeing that now. Like I just, I just pulled up the podcast rankings right now. It's Megan Kelly Tucker, like they're at the top, Candace, Spears also still there. But it's like, they don't seem to be suffering that in any way audience was for their apostasy. And that

like sends an incentive out there that says, hey, yeah, we don't have to do this anymore if we don't,

“you know, if we don't want to. Yeah, and I think because these figures are so big, that also”

ripples out in the Congress potentially. I mean, these various Republicans, I mean, people like Megan Kelly, and that is someone who, you know, she, she's going to stay on the right side. She's going to go with where wherever the audience is going. And I think it's telling that she's saying, like, you know, I need to be saying, you know, I'm just sick of these dumb Trump tweets. Why doesn't he shut up, you know, as she said about Iran? So I think when you start having

people break ranks, I mean, obviously that I think encourages more people to do the same. One of my favorite parts of the podcast to stand wars has been Laura Lumer versus Candace Owens. Laura Lumer is more on the pro Israel side, pro Ron War for Trump no matter what, you know, I'll go down with the Trump ship. So to speak, Candace is more on the history of the recent lawsuit thrown out about, you know, because Candace obviously, not on that

bow tie has been attacked by Trump recently, you know, called it stupid. He put this picture up of her, did feel kind of racist to me. I don't know, like it was like about his ugly of a picture, as you could possibly find about Candace trying to make her look like she was to get out of thought or whatever. So anyway, so Candace and Laura on opposite sides of this, Lumer unleashed this week. I thought was interesting. And I want to play a couple of clips from Lumer unleashed.

She gave you a sense of how things are going in the real housewives of Magistan. Let's listen. And one time when we were hanging out and I was sleeping over at her house, she was wearing these really short shorts and she had this like crop top on and she leaned over to pick something up. And she had a Trump stamp. She actually had a Trump stamp on her like lower back above her butt. And I was like, oh, wow, yeah, but Trump stamp. I was kind of like

all of a sudden is like talking about how, oh, Milo is a credible source. And oh, Milo says this

out, Laura Milo says that he allegedly had sex with Candace's husband. Candace says that Milo's vindictive, Milo says that she's so stupid. And let's show the other post that he said too.

“Because you have to understand like how Candace operates, right? I don't know if she's being”

blackmailed by Milo or what it is, but you can't go from saying that somebody is a vindictive liar and a sociopath to then saying, oh, Milo said this about Laura and Milo wrote this fan fiction about Laura that's already been debunked by Laura's family. And Milo is credible when Milo's on the record literally, this is like two years ago saying less than two years ago actually saying I want to make something very clear Candace. When I said your husband was gay,

I wasn't looking at him, I was looking at you. Well, I've been flirting around with various things like, you know, I think like, do I mention John Fabro's Trump stamp? Or do I not as part of a feud? Do I? Do I out any of the podcasts being lesbian? Um, but no, that's it. That's and, you know, that's where they're going at this point. Laura is like Candace's husband is gay and she has a Trump stamp. Yeah, I mean, you know, they are first of all, Lumor unleashed.

I mean, famously the show where she ate dog food. As you said, there's always something

exciting going on there. I mean, so in what happened when she ate dog food? I believe it was sponsored by her, her YouTube knockoff channel. They had a brand of dog food. And so she said, "Hmm, this is good." You know, I didn't see Lumor unleashed very high in the rankings. X seems to be more her natural platform than audiences. I think so. I think it's an acquired

“taste. You know, I do think she gets paid, you know, a good amount from it. So I think that's why”

she keeps doing it. So, you know, in this case, you can see how bad the, the personal it is, where she's saying, like, we were having a sleepover and I saw your Trump stamp, you know, I mean, it's the, or in this case, you know, I mean, you know, she and Milo, of course,

they, Milo once dressed up as her in drag and they did a rally together. Oh, they were the best

of friends and now they turned on each other. So, you know, the knives are really out. And they know all the dirt on one another. Yeah. I mean, Laura did famously save me from Carrie Lake because she had a bone to pick with a different homosexual and that was Milo. And then they went and screamed at each other outside of bar and Phoenix. So I just been kind of a long time beef between Luma at Luma and Milo. Before you get to your news, whatever did I do of any,

is there any favorite beef that you're monitoring? You know, oh, my beef season two and Netflix right now. So I just, oh, my God, they should do beef season three about something like this. That would be a good idea. Yeah, I do agree. Oh, no, you know, I mean, it is, it's just sort of an all-fronts war. I mean, you know, people will, there is kind of like a general alliance, but then they'll, you know,

“Nick Fwantizate Candace and, you know, vice versa and then they'll go at each other. So I think there's a lot”

to watch for. I mean, you know, Laura, you know, as I mentioned, she just got her defamation suit against Bill Marthrow now. So, you know, maybe there's room for another lawsuit on the plate. I'm intrigued. Okay. You're a news alert today. Is about my friend, Klovik killer. I assume everyone at this point I've seen this podcast has been briefed on Klovik killer. One of our colleagues posted into our Slack at a text from somebody whose mom had been talking to them about Klovik killer. They're like,

how do you know who Klovik killer is? Like, I listen to Tim Norris podcast, obviously. So in case you're not like that mom and you've missed it, is he looks max or has bone smashing on his face and dabble the little bit in right wing politics, but kind of has been more, I just I think generally, you know, kind of a force for, you know, trying to get young men to pretty themselves as much as possible. I don't know, you can maybe expand on that. Well, that I'm curious what you're reporting

in the newsletter and what we're learning about the latest from Klovik killer. Yeah. So as we dive in here, you know, I want to stress this is real. You know, everyone I've told this story to has said, this can't be real. You're making this up somehow. Or this is a rumor. Now, this is real. It's backed by federal documents. So here's the deal. You're sure. Oh, it's real. Okay. Well, this is a big windup. Well, you better deliver now. The State Department, the DEA, US attorney. So anyways,

here's the deal. So Klovik killer, obviously, overdosed about two weeks ago. He does enormous amounts of drugs. There is a lot of, you know, this create a shake up in his organization, various people were purged over allegedly giving him the drugs. And as a result, there's kind of a power vacuum over who controls Klovik killer. It's kind of like an Iran situation. Yeah. That's kind of like an Iran.

And now there's the fight between the Revolutionary Guard. Yeah. One of the plans that there was a

threat to call ice on one of the, the Australian influencers and blah. So it has now emerged that Klovik killer has incredibly close ties and has gone into business with a man who's very close with Israeli organized crime and is sort of seen as according to an indictment dropped last year. As arguably the most fearsome Israeli organized crime associate in the United States. So the Tony, the Tony soprano of the Israeli mob is back. Yeah. I mean, the Tony soprano, the lucky Lucian.

I mean, we're talking big, big, big, big. Okay. So so this guy's name is high walkneed. And you know, we have to keep in mind, right? Klovik killer used to hang out with all the anti-Semites. He was doing high alert in the club with Nick Fuentes. Now he's hanging out with this guy with like a

Hebrew letter on a chain. So the deal is, Klovik killer in this guy have invested in Klovik

together called Klovikerah. And this is, because Klovikerah was banned from all the night clubs after the hail Hitler thing. Yeah. And obviously a lot of his content revolves around kind of making out with random women and clubs live streaming in it. So he had to get a club. And so now they have a club, the issue is where Klovik killer in Miami, in Miami Beach. It's called Baklava. Baklava. And the club was the night after the overdose. So Klovik killer literally pulled the IVs out.

And they said, no, don't leave the hospital. And he said, I gotta go to Baklava. You know, and satisfy high here. I can't miss my appointment. So the issue for Klovik killer is, that high has a history. Let's say he's been tied to several murders. He's pleaded guilty to extortion related to money laundering efforts, regarding Israel, threatening, you know, allegedly threatening to kill people's children and wife to get the money back. And I think what's

maybe most interesting is that he supposedly, he has boasted on Israeli television. He had a kidnapping

for ransom thing that he eventually got out of because of what this never showed. That he has boasted

about cutting his victims ear. Now the documents are my clear if he cut it off or kind of just cut it a little bit. But either way, if you're a guy who wants to look good, that's not maybe

“who you should be hanging out with. Looks maxing. Well, you know, maybe Klovik killer could be,”

you know, sort of a trend setter on that front where he just maybe kind of like a little ear knick, you know, kind of becomes, you know, kind of like, what was Cindy Crawford in the mall. Or like a dueling scar in, you know, pre-war Germany where, you know, maybe it shows that you have a little bit of organized crime connection. Yeah. Like a dueling scar. Yeah. If I could make just one more point here, Tim, but before we move on. Yeah. Hi, walkin'ine also a group of moving on.

According to an indictment, I get dropped against his brother last year. His brother has been accused of involvement in or at least using some extortion schemes around fire bombings of celebrity poker games and Los Angeles. And so that high is also involved in kind of threatening shaking down operations. And these witnesses were talked to, in a read by the FBI and they were like, I can't even say high's name, government alleges he uses the Mexican mafia and the crypts that's his enforcers.

“So, you know, these are, you know, clicker, what's he getting into? What is he getting into?”

I seems like he's making some bad choices, like with the meth and the boat and smashing and doing a Paul with the Israeli mob. What does he Israeli mob want to do with Clivicular? I want to. You know, it's a good question. I could imagine a couple things. They certainly high is certainly overseeing Clivicular signing a lot of contracts that he may be is not ready for. Interestingly, high actually previously took a football player under his wing

and provided him with a lot of money. But then when that guy failed to make it to the NFL, that guy's the football player started packing an assault rifle saying that he was afraid for his life. So, there's kind of a history here of young men being sucked into this guy's orbit in, you know, potentially perilous ways. Oh, boy, poor Cliv, I heard some, something was going around that said that Cliv was going to be a father. Is that true? Is he in probably maybe a woman?

“You know, it's a good question. I think there was this video. Yes, so this this gal he met”

10 days earlier and, you know, I mean, not to get into it. I think the math wouldn't exactly work out there for them to know within 10 days whether she was pregnant. On the other hand, I do know that Andrew Tate did a sort of intervention for Clivicular. And he said, you know, you gotta have kids, man, and Clivicular said, well, I gotta have kids. And so, you know, I like I don't think he's really in a state right now to do that. But it seems like it's maybe

something is pursuing. I'm kind of torn. You know, it doesn't really seem ready to be a father on the other hand as a native list. I do think it's important that people procreate and continue the species. And, you know, maybe fatherhood was exactly what he needs to kind of bring him back to reality. You know, once he has to care for a vulnerable little baby, maybe he'll decide that the math and fatamine is not really maximizing or maxing. You know,

max. What do you think about that? There is a little kid who's been in some of his videos lately,

“kind of hanging around. And it's my understanding that he's maybe babysitting a friend's kid”

to get used to parenthood. And so, you know, he may be, he may be paternity-mogging soon enough. Well, thank you for this. We need a little break. I heard some feedback from the audience

that the Correspondent Center story is not really everybody's favorite. Okay, you know, it's just

it's a drag. All right. It's a drag. Anything else? Anybody else you're monitoring? And the other

“fun gossip you have? Oh my gosh. Anything that you think we should be keeping our eye on?”

Yeah, you know, I think let's say. You know, I just think that the feuds are going are going great.

I think there's a lot of beef. I mean, I like couldn't even pack in all of these different things

fighting over particular, you know, supposedly over some tire cleaner that was ordered off of Amazon and maybe what did that lead to? So, you know, there's a lot of drama out there in the right

“wing internet. And yeah, I'll be following it. I'm happy you're monitoring for us. That's”

well, Summer. We appreciate him. We also appreciate the seriousness of Carolina. Not that you're reporting as serious. You know, obviously you're covering some lady matters, like the Israeli mob in the bones smashing, but we do appreciate the Pulitzer Prize reporting of Carol. A landing is, well, I don't know. The way the world is going, you might be your particular reporting could be a Pulitzer. I want my particular nightlife underworld reporting Pulitzer. Yes, it could happen for you.

Everybody else, I want the next level today. So we get some more politics coming your way. We're going to talk about JD Vance, quitting Twitter for Lent. We're going to discuss other political matters. So check us out on the next level. And we'll be back here tomorrow for another edition of the podcast. We'll see you all then, peace. The board podcast is brought to you. Thanks to the work of lead producer Katie Cooper.

Associate producer Ansley Skipper, and with video editing by Katie Loots, an audio engineering in editing by Jason Brown.