Jason Calacanis: The Silicon Valley Vibes Are Still Pro-Trump

A few years ago, the customer's work and the specialised object is perfect.

My role is "Shoppy-Fi" because "Shoppy-Fi" is the other platform I tested with at the start of the first time.

I've been waiting for all the seconds. All tools that are important for the development of the company are, for example, from "Laga" to "Direct" in the dashboard. Now, your cost is only on "Shoppy-Fi.com" now. On and on, there are about 2,013.

We've made a comparison. The biggest advantage of "Shoppy-Fi" for me is that we don't need a technical advantage for the company. We all know about the back end and the front end.

“And that's how it was in the beginning of the online shop.”

Our "Shoppy-Fi-Fi-Fi-Fi-Fi" is the platform that's actually "Shoppy-Fi-Fi". It's actually the main reason. Our whole business is "Shoppy-Fi". Now, let's start our test of "Shoppy-Fi.com". Hey, everybody, if you notes before the pod today,

I taped yesterday afternoon with Jason Calacanis, because I'm about to hit a plane to my father's retirement parties. We're excited about for the newbies. Jason is a little bit of a departure from our usual material. Here on the "Volour-Podcast".

He is a podcast with his own called "The All-In-Podcast". And his colleagues, two of them were very active down Trump supporters. One of them David Ballsaxx ended up going into the administration. And then another one, it was Trump curious. Jason was the most middle of the road of the crew.

And we did our first interview.

God, a couple of years ago now, before the 2024 election. And it's done a check-in every, you know, 6, 9, 12 months. So we did one of those check-ins today. We talked a bunch about the stuff that he really knows about, which is Silicon Valley and VC world.

And then talked about what the vibe shift is looking like on Trump.

“It's not shifting as much as we would like, a little spoiler alert.”

So that's what's on this podcast. We also have the next level podcast. So if you're looking for just a politics fix, you can just pop on over to the next level feed. Me, Sarah, and JVL as we do every Tuesday.

So go give that a listen. Download it if you're not subscribed to the next level feed. I guess one more thing before we get to this show, Jason's a big next fan. So we discussed the potential of a Trump curse. And he was worried about a Trump curse.

And it turned out that he was right. Trump showed up to the game, made a massive hassle for everybody in mid-town New York, salted the vibes, fell asleep. Trump actually fell asleep for a little while. He rested his eyes, lengthy rest.

About a 22-second eye rest during the third quarter in the last early.

So as a result, the next 13-game winning streak is over. Don't know who else to point to on that, except for Donald Trump. It would really be something if the whole series, the whole vibe in New York, the whole,

you know, the whole trajectory of society shifts,

“because Donald Trump decided he was a 12-year-old”

and wanted to do what is Jay Mark calling it, to make a wish presidency the big presidency. You guys remember the big presidency. Where he gets to be a little boy that does fun stuff with all the grown-ups.

So that's what happened last night. I'm enjoying it. I've got some buddies who are listeners or next fans. I'm sorry, that Trump hates you, but hard not to enjoy it.

So anyway, stick around for me and Jay Cow. It gets a little hot in the second half, so hopefully that'll give you something to get your dandruff. And if an actor checks out on the next level, and we'll be back tomorrow,

with our regular scheduled programming. Appreciate you. [Music] Hello, welcome to the Bullard Podcast. I'm your host Tim Miller.

Happy to welcome back to the show. A journalist and entrepreneur turned angel in Vester. He's the co-host of the All-In Podcast. He's the best of a full of the four, not really a competitive category.

He just chose to be liquidity summit. He's private. Investors summit for LPs, fund managers, and elite entrepreneurs. That's fancy.

Isn't Jason Calacanis? How are you doing, brother? Big fan of the show. Nice to be here for my second appearance. After five, you get the blazer.

Yeah, isn't it third? I think it's third? I don't know. I think you should make it five. No, it's your third appearance.

Is it my third? Yes. Well, you know, I'm a big fan. I look back and check the archive. Your last appearance is at the six month mark of Trump's turn.

Okay. And we did a little check in. Now, like a year and six months, almost hasn't quite a year. We'll do a fun day.

We'll get to that. But first, I just for civil now. We're taping this Monday afternoon. And so this will, this is the Tuesday show. So we don't know if the next of one game three tonight.

I'm surprised to see you at your home studio because I've seen you. Not quite court side, like, you know, row two, row three, semi court side.

the massacre. Yep. And I flew there at my brother.

“I went to Philly with Ben Stiller, my friend.”

And we were court side for the Philly game. They tried to block us. I was at two of the MSG games, but like you're said,

they're row because even with my incredible micro celebrity,

and you understand micro podcast celebrity. You did a little better than me. You're shamelessness. I have to give you. You're out there on X just being like,

who has court side for me? I don't have the, I don't know. Well, I'm going to pay for them to be honest. But I can even still. Yeah.

But I do use the power. I mean, if you, what's the point of having with a million followers on Twitter? If you can't just use it for customer support. I agree with that.

Yeah. Like if something's not right. And then Cleveland, they blocked us from getting court side. So I had third row.

And I went to the spurs, both games. I am going to predict tonight. The next are going to win.

And I think they're going to demolish them by.

15 points, 20 points. Why are you not going? You're scared of Donald Trump. You don't want to do it. There's already texting your squad.

There's some bad juju here with Trump going. There's some bad juju. It's bad juju. He should not have done this.

“You should not make the fans show up three hours early.”

And he got rid of the watch party, which has become this huge tradition. Yeah. So listen, he's the president. He can do what he wants.

But I would have preferred to do it. I was going to come in for it. But I've decided I'll just come in for game four. And if kind of a different move. Yeah.

I mean, and he's even a fail. Like you think he can name anyone for the 1999 team. I mean, I guess you. He used to go to games. But I don't know if he went to the games primarily because he was friends with J.D.

Or if he went because it was a celebrity thing to do. But he has not been going since. So I don't put him in the Timothy Shalame. No. Spike Lee.

He's not part of our group. And I put myself into that group. Just based on fandom. Not celebrity. Well, I have big based on your starting prediction on the next.

I'm going to fade you based on some of the predictions you've made. And we're going to get into from the Trump. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

I'm betting on the next one. I'm going to be a pelicans. I'm not going to get them nuggets. I'm not going to get them nuggets. I'm not going to get them nuggets.

Yeah. And yeah, rough ploughs for us.

But I'll bet on this first.

Tonight, modest wager on draft jings. And we'll see. The listeners on the his right. Before we get to Trump. Yeah.

You know, because who knows how that'll go. I want to kind of get into your main area of expertise first. We'll talk kind of what's happening. And so you're value world AI. I don't know if you'll take this as a compliment or an insult.

I feel like you're a fair arbiter of conventional wisdom on like where the valley investor classes on things like how things are going. Yeah. And so rather than putting on your Jason hat. I just want to start there. Like where is the valley right now on the economy, broadly, and also the AI stuff in particular.

I'll start with AI. Okay. AI is like every previous technology wave put together. And then times 10 in terms of the impact of the opportunity. And just the capabilities of what's happening.

Last time I was on the show. Or maybe it was two times ago. We had a clip go viral where I said listen. Amazon is going to be lights out in their factories. It's going to be robotics.

And they have zooms. So they're going to be delivering packages. And the idea that a human would touch a package. Between like you clicking order on Amazon and he's showing up your doorstep will be insane or phasical in but, you know, three, four or five years.

That one crazy. Shortly after that, Andy Jassie wrote a memo saying, hey, we're going to be going wall in on an AI. We're going to have a different staffing level. He laid off a bunch of people.

“And then the secret memo got leaked that they weren't going to hire 600,000 jobs.”

And the PR team is like, how do we deal with the fact that we're not going to be hiring humans anymore? Maybe we should give money to toys for tots. I don't know if you saw this. Not cars for kids.

No, the boy. Given. No. So they're baggage. There it could be.

Yeah. And then if you watched there, there was the figure robot a company also doing humanoid robots. Had like a telephone where they had one of their robots sort packages. And so this timeline is increasing. So it is a huge opportunity.

And the tokens, which equal intelligence, are so compelling for people to use. That people are spending too much money on them. They're like going crazy using them. And you've had to rain in employees.

For every story you hear that this technology is going to change everything. You'll have people who don't know how to apply it. But we use two terms in the industry. AGI and then super intelligence. To keep it super simple.

AGI means the artificial intelligence is a smart as a smart as human being. Super intelligence means it's smarter than all collective human intelligence for all time. And it will solve problems we can't even think about.

The race is really for super intelligence.

“AGI is this is like a little way point in a long way.”

And that way point prints money. It prints money. And we have this grand debate on all in all the time. We have it publicly about job displacement. Job destruction, universal basic income.

And people in our industry have delusions of grandeur. Because we've done big things, right? So you do have this God complex amongst the anthropic people. Or, you know, Sam, I mean, Elon. The whole group really has done some things that have changed the world dramatically.

And then some of them are drama queens. And both. And some are both. Some are both. Yeah.

Some some fit both. Okay. So I was listening to one of your debates. Maybe two weeks ago on the show where you were more concerned about job displacement than some of your coping most.

I was talking a little bit of Derek Thompson last week. Smart cat. Yeah, really smart.

What he was basically saying is like, I don't know.

He's like, I know that's not what I'm supposed to do. Because I'm supposed to do an explainer podcast. And he's like, I hear compelling arguments for the fact that, you know, AI is going to, you know, actually create so many efficiencies. And so many potential opportunities that they'll be job growth.

And he's like, I see the apocalyptic version as well. You know, whether she used displacement. Obviously the displacement in certain types of industries no matter what.

“But, you know, the question is, how is it on balance?”

I find it interesting that, like, there was a lot of, I feel like conversation about this over the last year. There continues to be. But, like, feeling like it was imminent. And I don't know, I sense a little bit of a vibe shift where, like, maybe it's,

maybe this stuff isn't happening is intimately as people thought. What do you make of that? Yeah. So multiple things can be occurring like a storm, right? You can have multiple components of this weather pattern.

And some people, it's going to flood here. Their neighborhood and other people. It's going to. The weather in San Francisco might be more like Los Angeles eventually, right? And LA might turn into a house cave would be like far too hot.

So the weather system is very complex. And so directs right, hard to predict. So what do we know? What are CEOs of companies? And what's their behavior?

“It's always helpful to just look from first principles like a game on the field.”

You had Jack at square block, just cut the team in half.

Now, in technology, we always bloated these companies.

Why? There were two reasons. One of them strategic, one of them sinister. The strategic reason was let's hire people because we're continuing to grow for a year or two from now. If we hire ahead, then we'll be able to move faster.

That's strategic. Every company's been doing it for 30 years. The sinister one is what Google did early in the day is. And I literally have this conversation with the principles there, surge in Larry many times. They would hire people based on intelligence, pedigree, Stanford, Harvard, MIT.

Horde them. And they would hoard talent. But it was not just so they could use it. It was so those people didn't create a competitive company to Google. Right.

So it was a block or strategy in addition to, hey, we have this natural resource. Pretty sinister. Now, with AI, you can get rid of middle management. What is the job of middle management? It's to set up meetings, keep people on track, provide TPS reports, project updates.

All that stuff is being done perfectly and better and more consistently by AI. The number of note takers that pop off when you start a meeting on zoom now. Like, notion has one, zoom has one, granola. It's like how many versions of this meeting do we have to, you know, have records of. So that whole job slice is going to be gone.

Then you take sub-driving. That's going to be gone truck driving. That's going to be gone factory workers. That's going to be gone. You know, simple food production, making bowls, Slop bowls at whatever bowl place you like to order from.

That's going to be a robotic. The writing is on the wall. The Starbucks has come back. Starbucks. Yes.

And the countervailing story to that narrative. There is going to be, yeah. What makes us uniquely human, we might drive more human experiences. So that would be the addition. So, hey, this thing is so profitable.

Maybe we should add some services or add some people. There's nothing more compelling to achieve operating office or a VP of ops. Then the ability to replace humans with technology. They love it. They love it.

How do I know this? Because for the past ten years, I have invested in and been pitched on companies. Explicitly, explicitly, to our company gives you the ability to get rid of all cashiers at your quick service run. Our technology allows you to get rid of the person making franchise at your restaurant over and over again.

And it has increased massively. So when technology people say it's not happening or they say all jobs are going away. They're talking about two different things. One is trying to protect Donald Trump from supporting AI relentlessly and that job displacement happening,

which liberals and America first people are not buying for good reason.

And on the other side, it's unrealistic to think that an AI first employee can't get a job. If you're an AI first employee and you know how to deploy these tools, you will get many jobs.

“So long term, I think will be okay. Short term, you could see a lot of blue collar jobs, a lot of middle management jobs get retired.”

And that's going to cost chaos. Okay, well, I think that's the other thing that people worry about is the new jobs, like new out of college. I know that you, you have a big internship program. I was just talking with some interns here about this question as funny. I saw this bill mark clip.

I kind of hated to hate to hand it to Bill Mark as, you know, he said, he's had some misses lately, particularly in the war. But he had this funny bit about what's happening in colleges right now, which is that like college papers have just become a circle jerk. It's like a computer circle jerk, the circle jerk of nonsense, where they're like the AI is writing the paper and then AI is grading the paper. So it's like two computers talking to each other. No one's actually learning anything.

No one's getting real feedback. It's a very dystopian concept. You made the joke, it's I asked a couple, you know, read the college grads about it and they were like, yeah, oh yeah, that's exactly what's happening. And this is why they're booing at commencement speeches when you evoke AI.

This is the first generation that hacked their way through school and felt like they didn't learn anything because they were just using AI tools.

And they felt their teachers were using the same AI tools to teach our lesson plans. And so they're like, yeah, my whole college experience was AI Slop. They got a reason to boo. And if you're running a company right now, the concept of training somebody for two years to be productive or a year to be productive eventually. When you could train an AI to do that, Toby from Shopify is a good friend said, any time anybody wants to do a hire and they put it in request. They have to prove that they haven't tried to do that job with AI first.

Very logical approach for a company, but devastating for those first two or three runs of the latter.

“That's why this feels a lot different than, you know, minimum wage debates, which we can get into.”

This feels a lot different than immigration and people working illegally because elite people who racked up 150, 250k in debt now can't get the first run of the latter. That's going to cause a whole different level of handling here. Yeah, their parents are going to be mad. Talk about who do you know who votes? The 55 year old parent of a 22 year old who just spent $150,000 on college and they can't get a job. I'm furious. That is a person that fucking votes and donates and who's vocal.

Yeah, and who's vocal. That'll be interesting to see that all that play out. I guess one more thing on this on the politics, speaking about the vocal, push back the other areas, the data centers. Where do you fall down on this on the great data center debate? I'm just so people understand my politics, my contemporaries on the podcast like to pay me as a livedard. And it's kind of like a straw in there.

But you voted for Trump this last time.

I never said why voted for it because I'm trying to remain independent.

And I strongly alluded to the fact that you're interested. You're Trump curious. So you're the live on the pot and you're Trump curious for work. I'm a moderate and have always been an independent moderate. I voted 60% Democrat and 40% Republican in my career. I just vote for the best person.

If you were to tell me I could vote for who is the private equity of Republican that everybody hated. They're so long. I don't like voting for Romney and the hard people. I might even vote for Pence to have a right wing conservative, but who's normal. I would I'm voting for normal.

That's what I would like to have. So just so people understand my politics coming into this. I'm an independent and pick people generally that way. But your question is. Obviously the big tech people are, you know,

make very passionate arguments on all these data centers are needed. They're needed to fund all that compute that you're talking about. There's high demand for these tokens. You know, that they are creating jobs and community. So within the communities themselves, there's just been a lot of pushback about, you know,

that the environmental concerns, just placement, electrical costs, etc. Yeah, I'm just wondering where you think that's headed. It's a great debate filled with a lot of fun. Fear uncertainty and doubt by one side.

“And then, you know, it is essential for our industry to get these things up and running.”

And to get them up quick, because it turns out when you put a lot of this hardware on a problem, it can, in fact, solve it. So sometimes the brute force of it does work and the demand is off the charts for access to more tokens

As you know, everybody talks about Jevon's paradox, which basically means if you make something cheaper,

people use it more. If you want an example of that, like you expand the 405 freeway by two lanes, all of a sudden traffic, moves quicker for like two months. And then people move a little further out and it gets in, it induces more traffic. On the data center side, my politics are very much in favor of state rights and local rights.

I like the fact that if people in Maine or New Hampshire have a problem with this, the folks in Pennsylvania might seize that opportunity or Texas. Texas wants every data center you can build. We have the largest install base of solar and wind outside of China. I mean, this place loves energy.

And they don't care where it comes from oil, knack gas. They're in different solar, as long as it makes a buck.

“That's what they care about is this is a unique economic positive.”

The thing about water is a fake news story. The thing about energy in fact in the grid is a real story in some cases. So you have to kind of parse that. The water thing is fake because all these systems use closed loop, which basically means the water goes in a pipe and it evaporates a little bit.

But it uses much less than the almonds or golf courses in the country. Yeah. The fucking almonds. It's a mid-not anyway. I go this actually a while a day.

I mean, who's eating all these cashews?

Oh, cashews are incredible.

You put a cashew with the date you're in good shape. But anyways, the water is a fake issue. I like the fact that people are competing for these. Let the states and the people who don't want it ban it. Let the states that do want it benefit from it.

That's one of the great reasons why the United States is. So successful is because we have an AB testing process. We can multi-variate test something. And what they're doing now is the data center folks are chasing power. And they're chasing power that doesn't impact locals.

So if you go to the Permian Basin and you get some not gas there and some solar and battery, you're not harming anybody. And great. You can build it to the cows, come home and put them in space. The next thing.

The third one you haven't heard about, but that you will, is people are going to start giving free batteries and solar to people's homes. And then in the rack where the batteries are, they're going to put 10 of these Nvidia servers. So imagine I offer you for your home.

Hey, would you like solar and would you like battery? And would you like a free electricity bill? And you'd be like, yeah, what's the catch? And it's like the catch is reporting a mini data center on the side of your house. It's the same size as your, you know, existing HVAT.

And that's going to be a real thing. And I think that'll be the bridge between now and space. So it's kind of a, it's kind of a non-issue. Interesting flag. That's a little dystopian to be continued.

A state planning. Not that fun to think about. And easy to put off.

“You need to be able to lawyers and think about what would happen.”

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I've never really got podcasts stuff through about the rest of life stuff.

You know, it just realizes matter. Fact that had only booked me and my husbands took it for this flight. But I'm about to get on in one hour. Realize that yesterday. I did manage to squeeze my child in there.

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That's Trust and Will dot com slash bull work. To get your 20% off trust and will dot com slash bull work. I want to do even on stuff for you into Trump. Yeah, you're on buddy or relatively buddy just in this. You have to transfer.

Yeah, very close friends for a very long period of time. So there's been a lot of critiques here at the bull work over the man or in which the space X. IPOs going to happen in part because of the fast tracking of the NASDAQ. Breaking the traditional rules of how, you know, a new IPO gets into the NASDAQ. Also, I mean, Kara, your friend Kara Swisher was on lab.

To come loose ago. She hates me. Karen Swisher is very easy. She is so angry.

“But I think on this case, right was kind of the valuation of the company being kind of absurd.”

You know, there's like really one good company, which is satellite business. And then you have like two not that profitable companies.

And it's sort of absurd with the valuation is like, what? What's the case for? So the Elon NASDAQ.

Case one is never bad against Elon, because he manifests things in the world.

We're talking pretty well about against him on the process of cutting government funding to the dose. Sure. Because he totally failed at that. And has inspired another round of it that looks like it's going to be quite successful. I don't think you like it.

For all of government cuts everywhere. He's the program that he was trying to finance and put it in front of him.

“I did it work perfectly. But I think he inspired people to make it to him personally.”

He was talking about this 30 years ago, so I don't you know. And did they make any progress? I guess is the question. But now you have people taking it up realising. It's an important issue to Americans. Okay.

But anyway, let's put that aside. Your question is about SpaceX. Yeah. There is an incredible business in Starlink. Starlink has over 10 million people subscribing.

That will wind up being the largest subscription business in the history of humanity. Probably double what you see from Netflix. Why?

Because they're going to go directly to your phone eventually.

If you've seen the Starlink many. If you've seen the progress, they're putting it on boats. Most people are putting it on their houses. Who can afford to as a backup to their cable modem. Like if you're a broadcaster from home, you might have Starlink as your backup.

I assume you do. I doubt that I've been considering it. You grew up like that. Well, think about this. For a thousand dollars or less, you can have a backup.

“And you make 20, 30, 40,000 dollars per podcast.”

How could you not have it as a backup? And you can get this router for an unify that just automatically switches over. Putting that aside. No, I'm at Hurricane Country. So it would be wise.

It would be very wise for you to get a battery pack in that. I'll send you a link to the router that does the hot swapping. Okay. Thank you. Do you have a promo code at Jason?

I don't. I don't. I have a promo code at Jason. I don't. I have a promo code.

If you want to do it. If you want to do it at GLP. Yes. Here's the good news. That business alone will support the valuation.

The second business is. It's about the $2 trillion valuation. Yeah, 1.75 for sure for sure. Yeah, it's it's not inconceivable.

“500 million to a billion people will have one of those.”

In other words, they'll be one for every 10 people on the planet. Ballpark.

That gets you to 700 million subscriptions.

If you think that's crazy. Just look at Netflix. They provide a service Verizon gets past 100 million. And it's quite disruptive when it starts going to your phone. I don't know if you've ever had to use the satellite.

Yeah. Version that's in the iPhone and you can get text messages. They're a version of that's going to be much better. Much, much better. And it's going to be sold to every phone.

Every phone on the planet will wind up paying a dollar a month. Just give baseline. I hear you. It starts great business. I agree.

But just give a baseline on your honesty. Do you think that Tesla is appropriately value? All of Elon's companies get valued like venture capital businesses. Venture capital is invest in like what is the next business that's going to drop five years out. Six years out, seven years out.

Most public companies get valued on their existing performance. How much did you sell this quarter, etc. So if you look at Palantir, if you look at SpaceX and you look at Tesla, yes, they're essentially valued like a VC business, which means they're fully valued. And you can wait.

You don't have to buy these stocks in the public market. You can short them. There are many devices for you to not participate in this. The reason why Tesla is doing particularly well in this kept its value is because of Optimus and full self-driving.

Optimus will be what that company will be remembered for huge opportunity. So what he keeps doing is he keeps building the future. And then people value it as a venture business. So you're right. As a public company, the valuation doesn't match.

For venture capitalists, it does match. It matches what we do. What about the NASDAQ fast track part of us? Because this is, of course. And those of us who invested in the index funds, like we're forced to support Elon's grip.

We don't like you do not need to be in index funds. And if it is unsustainable. A lot of people in index funds. Well, I mean, if people really do have a problem with it, you could make a synthetic index fund without them in it.

And if people do feel that way, Vanguard will take them out. It's still unfair, though. I mean, if you and I were starting a business and did an IPO, as Jack Witton changed the rules for us. I'd be totally honest. I don't know exactly how it came about.

But I do think it's a distinct possibility that the company will trade at 2.5 trillion. And then come back down to 1.2 trillion. Many people I talk to say it's undervalued at a trillion. They say it's overvalued at 2 trillion.

So we're in the general neighborhood of where this will be valued properly. If it trades at 1 trillion, it's undervalued. If it trades at 2 trillion, most sharps. People who are in this business, who I talked to. We mentioned the liquidity conference.

Most folks believe 2 trillion would be overvalued. 1.4, 1.5, like probably appropriately valued.

I want to talk about X and the kind of echo chamber that has gotten created there. We have this very pretty example of it this week with the Spencer Pratt. May erase everybody on X. Yes. That's very clear.

That's crazy. They all paid for it. Like this I said enough is because the original critique of X.

“I think from Elon part of it was a free speech element that like people were getting silenced.”

And then another part of it was that like it was this liberal echo chamber. It was not really the public square. And when he took it over a lot of people like yourself and others. Like we're arguing for it because we want. I could a public square that is without influence.

And now it kind of feels like we've just depend on the switch the other way. And now we have kind of a right a central right echo chamber to right echo chamber to depend on the topic. And I think the Spencer Pratt cases like a prime example. That's like if you only consume that racer Twitter.

You just thought he ran the best campaign that's ever been right in the history of politics. He ends up underperforming Trump in Los Angeles. And now everybody on there is like thinking that's a conspiracy there. That he lost when he just lost. Yeah, so two separate issues on the issue of the breakup of X where blue sky is falling threads

and the lips all went, you know, to those places.

And then what remains is anonymous based right mag America first and then business leaders.

I would say is the other piece that's still very tied over there. It's kind of a bummer. It was kind of magical to have everybody sparring in one arena. I suppose to multiple rena's I go over to blue sky.

“And like, you know, it's kind of the opposite mirror world, right?”

Two bizarre worlds over there. They think like Trump's about to get arrested for, you know, some grand conspiracy. And he's dying. And he's going to have this like heart attack any day now. Like it is very weird.

And yeah, kind of just when everybody was on one platform. You could have a more reasonable discussion. I mean, before you pages the thumbs on the scale, though. I mean, obviously for you page. I can just look at the data about like which it can be the only person.

He's the only person who has open source the algorithm. And so you can go load the algorithm. You can point to the GitHub where it is. And you can say, please tell me how to perform better with this. I did it.

My team did it. And it will explain to you exactly how to do it. I think what it is is, and when you proceed the thumb on the scale, is that if you take out all the Libs and Karen swishers not there and proff G's given up on it. And, you know, they don't want to participate.

Well, then what is the algorithm have left? It's only got the Spencer Pratt. Like, you know, they're got homeless people who were given crack and meth to. I mean, I mean, is, is elevated.

Well, he, he was always the number one or number two user.

Him and Obama, where they're neck and neck for the number one and two. Well, this is my one compliment of the new 40 page is if you get out of politics space,

“where I think it's pretty obvious that they're, they thought this on the scale.”

And what, which kind of stuff's being elevated. I'm trying to think about an example of something recently where I was, I was interested in a niche topic as a foreign something that's having overseas, I forgot it was and I searched for a couple things. And I clicked on it.

And the 40 page also started giving me quite valuable stuff. Yeah, it is, it is quite good on that. It's almost two powerful. I, I find like, you know, you're like, oh, I'm interested in this gel and broncin.

You know, and then all you're getting is just. I'm like, okay. I do want to know outside of the mix. What's going on in the world? Like, I could use 15% non-nix content or whatever.

But it is pretty powerful. But, you know, I wish everybody tick-tock in Facebook, Instagram, would release their algos as well. And eventually, and I've talked to Elon about this a bunch. And I think he's probably going to go on this direction, which is BYOA,

bring your own algorithm and an algorithm store. So imagine when you loaded it, it's at, hey, you're currently using the default algo. Would you like an algo that is 50%.

You know, the most important news in the world as determined by this

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And how you are a representative of the change in the email. And I'll go. And after that, it was pretty compelling multiple screenshots. So I'm going to give you a chance to weigh in.

The first post was a tweet you sent.

I don't know what that six years ago. Take the R pledge, please. I know it's going to be a word from our childhood. But it causes folks a lot of pain. And we need to retire it.

That was September 2020. I lost that argument between six Jason posted the following. Stop being retarded. Start retard maxing being retarded means you are illuminating and overthinking. Retard maxing means you're making decisions based on your gut instinct.

Stop being retarded. Start retard maxing. So in six years, you went from saying take the R pledge. Don't say this to doing a post that has the word in like nine times.

“Do you feel like you've been manipulated by the algorithm?”

No.

When I grew up in Brooklyn, that's all we call each other.

There. Sure. Then for a period of time, it was like, it was hurting people's feelings. And I felt like maybe this is probably not a good idea to do this because I have a friend who's got a mentally challenged brother. And I felt bad about doing it.

And now I should call the brother the R word. No, obviously not. Now I think it's now people have put the word into the proper context. That like we're not talking about people who have Down syndrome. We're just talking about the actual inherent nature of the word.

And then on top of that, there's a new trend which is retarded maxing, which means just going with their instinct. And if you haven't seen the guy who does these, he sits on his back deck and smokes cigar. And just talks about using your instinct to enjoy life and not ruminate. Which I kind of believe rumination is the path to unhappiness in life. Like too much rumination, not good. So I'm a big fan of the retard maxing.

Well balance and all things.

“I think zero rumination is maybe the path.”

Intersection, okay. Intersection, okay on the margins. But rumination is when you just take introspection to a level of like, OCD is I think. But yeah, sure, I've changed my position on it three times in my life. Just culturally, though, like, I don't know.

I don't actually care that much about the specific of this word. I think the people should use words, speaking of using the hard word. I think that like voting for Donald Trump to be the president of the United States, because you wanted to say retarded has to be the most retarded thing that a person could possibly do. Yes, that is convincing.

The United States has all of these like very important goals and like whether or not you can say a word with that being precise is really not that important. I think it was more symbolism of like, of the overreach of cancel culture would be how they would say it is like word policing. I think it's just a overall debate about the overtaken window. Like, are we allowed to talk about certain topics or not? I mean, I look at the 2020 Jason and I don't know.

You're showing empathy. Like, other, someone in your life has, I do have that feeling pain and you don't want them to feel pain. Yes.

“And like, don't you think that's a good instinct, isn't it?”

Bad that now we've gone to a place where people are like, oh, it's cocked if you care about somebody else's pain. It's based to just make fun of people and be a dick as much as possible. I can hold, right? Yeah, I can hold these conflicting thoughts in my mind, which is one, I'm not responsible for the overtaken window opening and closing. And if people want to say that's gay to mean like, that's dumb or they want to say that's retarded.

That's out of my control team. I don't know what to do. You can say as in your control, though. It is in my control. And I think if the public vernacular is, we can separate the intent of the word retarded and say like that means you're,

that means you're not thinking in a crisp way. And people say it in a jovial way. I think we can separate that from the use of it. Like, I would like to make fun of this person went down syndrome. Like, and make them feel as bad as possible.

Speaking of the R word, let's get to Donald Trump's management of the economy and country.

When you're on with your six month assessment, when we're on last. Yes. What prompted our last visit, just kind of set the parameters of the conversation. Was there was a video that had been posted on the acts that was of your colleague on the all in podcast, David Friedberg talking positively about the Trump administration to date. And you kind of jibbing him a little bit giving him a little trouble.

And then you posted the link to that video by saying, You know, we're six months in and your assessment is that that he's been pretty solid. He still has worked to do. I want to listen to the original video just so he can have a base on what's up. Tim's got receipts.

But what better team has ever been put together? It is a cabinet of CEO's. It is a cabinet of managers and people who are having it done. And every time I go there, I'm impressed by this cabinet. I pull my hair out when I'm so.

You're pro Trump. I support my president. I support the president. Okay. So you voted for him.

You voted for him and you love Trump. I love what he's doing. Okay. Your colleague. He's in the administration.

He's in that science group. That's axe is running out of got the name of the PK. So freedberg said I love what Trump's doing. You said at the time he was pretty solid. You both agreed that the cabinet was strong.

Sure. How do you feel, year later? There are a series of things that are complete unmitigated disasters. And there is consensus.

“I think from all Americans when you look at his historically low popularity.”

That none of us wanted to get into an endless war. In the Middle East. That was like top of the reasons to vote for Trump. And now that has made it. If you wanted to be due to I mean.

I have to say, you know, he made a pretty convincing argument because he didn't start

anywhere as in his first term.

Because you had people who were hawks on both sides who very much wanted to engage in, you know, maybe being a little more active in Ukraine and a lot more active in the Middle East on both sides, right? Whether it was Nikki Hally or was Hillary Clinton. They wanted to go hardcore into Iran. So he actually made a very convincing argument.

Now, why did he switch his position completely? I think Marco Rubio said it the first time and the first time was the correct take. They got dragged into it by Israel because they said they're going to go anyway. And he decided to do it. Huge mistake.

Terrible decision.

“I think the ice stuff was incomprehensibly cruel and poorly executed.”

And you heard me give JD events when he was a candidate a hard time about that at one of our events.

I said to him, hey, you can't drag 20 million hard working Americans who just happened to not be legal yet out of this country.

People are going to take their phones up and record you dragging their nanny, their handyman, the dishwasher. Americans are not going to go for that and I was exactly right about that one. He plummeted in his approval rating because of those two things. The tariff stuff was poorly executed, but the right idea. We should rebalance trade like that.

He just did it in his normal Yolo nature. So if I were to put together the biggest disasters since we've last spoken, Iran is just an unmitigated disaster. And it's going to kill his presidency. I think there's consensus about that right. I'm not like in politics all day long, but there is strong consensus that that was the biggest mistake he could possibly have made. He cannot get out of it reasonably.

And he lost Tucker, Meghan Calle, Steve Bannon, everybody in his group. Because of it. Yeah. Yeah, I mean, I guess I do wonder what, and this is something we spent a lot of time on last time is like,

what I never understood about why CEOs got behind him in the first place and why and why smart people would get behind him is that it's just the risk.

He was erratic. His whole career has been erratic. He bankrupted casinos. He bankrupted an airline.

“He's posting late into the night. I think what we did last time we're on is also like if you're if you're doing a VC that of a CEO.”

He would never invest in a company that had this person as a CEO because he's just a total like erratic shit show. But it's a binary choice. And if the choice was Kamala after what Biden did to the economy and after what Biden did to M&A. If you talk to any CEO, they need to have, you know, low taxes and high M&A and they are pragmatists. They represent their shareholders, their employees, et cetera. And they looked at the option of Kamala.

They do risk versus Trump as well, right? They're aware of risk. And I believe. I mean, one of the sounds like that they do perfectly say I was ridiculous if they came on it. I was like, I don't know, Trump could get us into a nuclear war. And like, here we are, like, I don't know if we're not on the customer nuclear war. But like, what do you do business predict your disaster that, like, is way worse.

So what, I mean, Kamala would never have done anything that still would have been just. Kamala started the war for the Iran.

Absolutely 100 percent. 100 percent. I'm Nikki Halley Kamala all of them at the same.

Kamala's a Democrat, Nikki Hilly's a Neocon Hawk Republican. They both are very pro. You think the Harris wall administration was going to do a war of choice in Iran. Yeah, I mean, Joe Biden didn't go to war in Iran. Barack Obama didn't go to war in Iran.

Bill Clinton didn't. Why would Kamala Harris have?

“I think because the timing was there and Israel was going to do it anyway,”

which is what they said, the reason they did it. Oh, I think if Israel was going to do it, they would have followed them. That's just my gut. And I had to go to war to support Israel. Oh, God, I filled Gordon on this pot. I asked him how to exact thing.

And then they all said, I just don't know why you wouldn't take them at their word. I don't know why you wouldn't take them at their word. So back to your question about CEOs, though. And why would they pick this person? If their main goal was to do commerce.

Do they have access to this administration?

Yes. Do they have lower taxes? Yes. Are there stocks at record highs? Yes.

So in their minds, as hard as it is for you to believe, this has worked out perfectly on those three things. M&A is back on the menu after years. IPOs are going to be happening. Lower tax, lower regulation and the stock markets at an all-time.

Hi.

“And I'm, oh, I mean, is that an all-time low for all lifetime?”

So they're looking at that business game on the field. And they're not thinking about ice. They're not thinking about the conflict in Iran. Yes. Sure.

Well, what about the tariffs, though?

And you say their taxes are down, but most of those companies are on all of them. So they're in constant control. Some of them down Trump stole from. He stole from them. How is that?

And what led more in consequential than their person? Well, not as corporate. They already are straight into the tax code anyway. Capital gains. Everything.

The corporate tax rate went down a couple of points. You asked me why they would make this decision. They make it. They're making it. They're making it.

No, I just don't want to disagree in the counterpoint. And this is what the Democrats need to learn for the next cycle is to embrace. Well, business leaders and to bring them into that. Okay. Let me know about countertake.

This is how they think. And they've won big. I understand. I understand. But I understand.

This is where I think the Democrats are in a real conundrum. Because I want to give you a counterfactual. Kamal Harris did win. Okay. She gets in there.

And she puts in a legal tax on the Silicon Valley companies. Unilateral. It doesn't go through Congress puts a tax on them. It's not legal. But she just does it.

She says it's an emergency. I've decided I've the right to do whatever win fall profits. Yeah. And all of these companies. She's going to do that.

And then she garnishes money from the CEOs. She makes them come to her and beg her for. Absolution to get around it. Sometimes she grants it sometimes. She doesn't kind of based on whim kind of based on whether Doug is friends with the person.

Kind of based on whether they've given money to her. And then the Supreme Court comes back and says, no, actually, you've got to give them money back to the company. And she says, no, actually, don't want to. I'm not going to do that. In fact, I'm going to threaten them.

And maybe I might actually take a percentage Donald Trump just so just you might. I might take a percentage of the company for the government. I think if Kamal Harris had said that, you and all your Silicon Valley bodies and the Wall Street Journal would be losing their minds. And it would come. You're making this analogy to tariffs office.

This is what Trump's is doing with tariffs and with taking a percentage of intel, taking the suggestions going to take a percentage of AI companies. He tarved them illegally. He made them come in and beg for their lunch. Yes. That's like that's left wing autocratic politics as what he's doing.

Yeah, I can educate you as to why they don't have a problem with it. And why you do. Okay. You are looking at it from a moral perspective and from a logic perspective. Of like, well, if you were okay with one side doing it and not okay with the other side doing this doesn't make intellectual sense to you.

Totally understand where Tim Miller is coming from this intellectually does not make sense. Let me tell you on a business level what this means. The tariffs were when they're under 15% when they actually hit are easily absorbed in one side or the other. The folks who are selling items or the folks who are, you know, providing those they each make a bit of a concession. And maybe you raise, you know, the cost of something a little bit, but it's not as dramatic as the left feels it is.

It was chaotic, but when it actually hit the ground, it made no difference to these businesses. So the lot of hand ringing for not a lot of impact and you find it offensive reasonably so that people have to go bend the knee and bring a go bar and wait and line south park, you know, did a whole send up of it.

“That you have to bend the knee and make your donation.”

That's what business people like. Transactions, you may not like it. You may think it's from business people love like to have a clean operated situation.

He didn't even raise taxes on them, Trump has raised taxes. You can tell me that find the tear of things in consequential, it's fine. But the last federal corporate tax like was in 93, all they've gotten is cuts from Obama from Biden. Like they haven't faced the fact that it's like in in 30 years more. Yeah, why are they so upset about the Biden such a wish?

Because Biden didn't return all their calls. So the tear off isn't a big deal. The phone call is that's not right. Actually it is. You're brushing that off and this is where you have a blind spot Tim respectfully. You have a blind spot. If you can get in the room with the person, if you can get in the room with the administration and then you can shape policy.

And you can say, hey, here's what we're trying to accomplish.

And hey, can you help us with this and this regulation doesn't make sense. That actually is a preferable situation to not getting your phone call returned.

“And if what you have to pay for it, I'm not saying this is my belief.”

You have me on here to explain. So look at the value in the business side. I'm explaining it to you. Yeah, no, I hear you much prefer. Beending the knee, having to show up for the Melania documentary. Tim cooks like, I got to show up for a documentary that sucks. I got to bring a goal bar.

I'll do whatever it takes to keep selling iPhones. I got to keep the supply chain open. Yeah, okay. But he just retired. I will see how that goes.

If president off gets in there and he decides that he wants to. Yeah, he's decided he's going to put an actual tax hike on these guys. But he's going to return their calls. We'll see what they say about that.

Yeah, I don't think that they'll be that happy.

I think there's going to be balance. Oh no, there's only 2,310. We're standing in front of the building. The biggest advantage of Shopify is that we don't need any technical information for myself. We can all go over the back end and the front end of the building.

“And as soon as they go in front of the building, the online shop will be there.”

We're going to buy Shopify, then we're going to buy the platform, the real farm. They're simply the main thing. Our whole business is going on over Shopify. Start to yet, stay in customers and test of Shopify.com. I want to play Howard Lutnik with your colleague.

Okay. Another thing that's like, you guys just keep being wrong about how good Trump has to be. I mean, not you personally. That's been the people that make the case that Trump was going to be better. Well, which part of the economy is the question?

Yeah. Jamoth interviewed for your show. Howard Lutnik. This was January of this year. I wasn't on this one.

You were not on it. It's an interesting time capsule from January this year. Let's listen. You're going to see five in the greatest economy in the world. You're going to see five.

And people think you can't. You can't. Five percent GDP on a base this big is just it's. We have a $30 trillion. So five percent is 1.5 trillion in growth.

And if we cut rates, you'll see six.

And people do not would never be for Donald Trump walked into that office.

They would don't think that's possible. Yeah. We wouldn't think that fast looks. I was insane. We're looking at maybe 2% economic growth GDP growth this year.

They were close to those numbers, by the way. If they hadn't done the year on more, they would have hit 4%. And they would have had potentially some cuts. But if you start a war and you do a supply chain shock with energy. You essentially take the Trump 2.0 agenda and you torture.

Correct. Which is what's happened. Why haven't more people come around on that? And again, I would think that Jamoth, for example. I know you don't like to speak because when it's in theory.

If you had a VC and you brought a CEO in. And then I came in. You invested me right now. You get behind me. We're going to have 6% growth this year.

And then for six months later. Yeah. They like stuck their dick in the fax machine. And like screwed everything up. And now they're at 2% growth with maybe negative with maybe going down.

It might be visual. Yeah. You'd be like, okay. Well, it turns out we need a new, we need some leadership. I'm calling the board here.

I have some concerns. Yeah. Why isn't that happening? Why are people like we're calling the board here? Yeah.

Very simple. Trump demands complete fidelity. I'm not speaking about Jamoth here or anybody specific. But we all know in order to be in the Trump circle.

“You have to have complete utter fidelity to him.”

He's a genius. So it's North Korea. We're in North Korea. Basically. I think he's.

It doesn't feel like a capitalist system.

Yeah. Well, it's. I can't predict the president. Capitalist. Yeah.

Slash.

“You know, if you told a bunch of business leaders,”

this could become oligarchic. They'd be like sign me up. Hell yeah. Sounds great. Oligarchic sounds pretty great to a cat.

And this is why we're fucked. For a short period of time.

Can we agree for a second?

That's why we're fucked. This is why we're not going to get. No, you said you want to normal. I'm sure you and I disagree on the margins of what the marginal tax rates should be for the top tax bracket or whatever, but like maybe not. We're not.

We're not. But we're not going to get normal. Because these guys have decided that they want to go on with oligarchy. They decided that it's cool for Elon to become a trillionaire. They decided that they can't abide any even tiny tax hike on capital gains rates or corporate.

So what they're going to get is pitch works and socialism. That's what they're going to get now. I do think they're driving the socialist movement. And I've talked very broadly about how to reverse that.

“I think we need to have a very open discussion about minimum wage and a fair free market version of minimum wage for a long time.”

But then I started studying what happened in New Zealand, Australia and Norway, Denmark. You know, these are obviously slightly different than the United States. But if we want to correct the socialist movement, which is gaining steam and someone like Bernie Sanders saying, Hey, listen, they stole the content from us and the knowledge and then we should get half the company. I mean, they did.

They did. Yes, of course. And some of it is legal. Some of it's not legal. If you buy the book, you're actually allowed to train on and according to the courts.

But if you steal the book, you're not putting all that aside. It is a great sales pitch from Bernie. When I saw that, I was like, oh man, this is going to play. This will play in 2026 and into 2028. What I think we need to do as a society is look at that k-shaped recovery.

And it's like a, you know, one group's going down, one group's going up. Invest America. The Trump accounts is a great step in the right direction. Adding a dollar to the minimum wage for each of the next seven years and getting it to $15. It might seem performative, but it would actually be performative in a good way.

It would say, hey, everybody on the top is doing really well with equities. Let's get these people to move up. And let's look at that.

“I think universal healthcare is like another easy way to kind of bridge this gap between capitalism and socialism.”

And we do have to have, you know, some kind of grand bargain that occurs. Because I do think the countries on the verge of just splitting into states that are going to be like Nevada. Texas and Florida and states that are going to be like New York and California. Maybe, yeah, I don't know, I think that. And so I like having this discussion and I wish some of them would come on and we could talk about it.

But this is what I think that the CEO class and the elite VC class and Silicon Valley needs to realize if they don't change the way they talk about this stuff and change the way that these things are regulated that the pitchforks are coming for them hard. I mean, there's a lot of this will pivot. Not really. It's pivot that continues in Trump 2.0 about like, oh, giving money away is for suckers like the whole like the whole bill gates vision. He's got his own issues vision of the world is like different.

We want, we want no regulation. We want to stop, you know, doing charity. All that stuff has happened. People are aware of this issue. You know, when Sam Waltman's house got fire bombed and then shot up by two different people in a 10 day period.

Trust me, that was talked about a lot by the same CEO as an elite venture capitalist you're talking about. Then there's the folks at Anthropic who are saying, like, all jobs are going to go away. We need to contain this. So the industry has done a terrible job of communicating why AI is good for society and the good that could come out of it. And we have not done productive things like say the giving pledge. The giving pledge, again, super performative when it came out, but saying, hey, the majority of my wealth is going to be given away upon my dad.

The first thing doing is good, though. It made people feel like, hey, we're all on this together. And what Michael Dell did when he gave seven billion dollars or whatever it was, is invest America accounts. That means to happen 10 more times. Yeah, that's maybe next time without getting a nine nine billion dollar deal from the department of war two weeks later.

And this is the thing. Like, these guys, here you're saying that they like it. They're happy with all the garky. They're they're happy to deal with the Trump, but like,

some on the left, listening this will probably be like, look, capitalism has always been fake.

It's all there's always been, you know, crony capitalism, like Tim, you are sold a bill of goods, maybe. But like, when there's a period of time where people did the performative part of it, whether it was the giving pledge, whether it was like actually committing to a real free market where there's competition. That created an environment, you know, where the capitalist system could thrive. And they have now gone all in with somebody, no pun intended. That is an assault on it. He's like, I'm just going to do deals with rich people to find me off.

And then the Democratic class, the reaction is we're going to do the same thing. We're going to use our power to bully these guys the way he did and you're not going to like it. That's what's going to happen. That is concerning the law fair that, you know, keeps getting escalated. What we really need to start thinking about is, you know, the Democrats winning the midterms. And I guess if they win the house, they get subpoena power back. They win the Senate, then they can do hearings and a little bit more.

And stop the appointments. Yeah. So some of these appointments were ludicrous, you know, Pam Bondi, Christy Neum, Pete Higgseth, no, yeah. Yeah. I mean, some of these are quite embarrassing. And, you know, he's given them promotions, I guess.

Can never make a mistake. I could promote them. Give them a better window seat.

There needs to be checks and balances. That's the other thing that's kind of broken here, both on the Republican side. And I guess they did break the Republicans brains with this slush fund for the 1.7 billion. So maybe that's a sign that the Trump era is ending and Republicans are going to take the party back.

“Either way, this thing's over in a two years, right?”

So we're going to have to start thinking about a post-Trump world and hopefully having more money. You're skiing, buddy. Tucker might run. I think he's probably more interested in getting ratings for the show. I think he likes doing his show. Yeah. If you look at all of those performative folks, I think it's just about ratings.

Whether it's him or Karen Swisher or... You're really going after him or Karen. I think they just want ratings, you know. I think they just want ratings, you know.

I think it's called "Maldonado", and I'm the founder of Yawi.

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What way? We're six months in. You did a six month drop assessment. I look at Zoran and I think he kept the police chief, crime rates are down in New York. People are worried that he would go in and it would be on the side of the criminals. They would give up hugs instead of having cops in the subway and none of that happened.

He's gotten rid of some of the red tape around building, they're planning to build. The budget they got balanced, they had to deal with how cool to deal with that. If you did the kind of performative populace left thing going after your boy at Citadel, for having to pay out a tear in New York? Yeah, that was not good.

That's going to find populism. That's fine. This is where you should pay more.

“If you don't live in New York, you have to pay out a tear.”

Totally fine with the pay out a tear tax. If you want to do that, it's fine. Like I said, local communities can do it. Local communities want to do it. If they want flock because they want to have a secure community, they don't want flock and they want to ban it.

That's like a local community decision. Let them do it. What is and you should be appalled by and you should speak out about is when he picks a specific person and puts a target on their back. We just talk about Sam Altman having a fire bomb and they shoot in his house with his kids in the house. Then you do this to the Citadel founder.

That's the kind of stuff that gets people killed. And it's not cool to do that for a politician to say, hey, this person is the reason why the city sucks. This person owns a penthouse, you don't. That's going to get him shot because there's a lot of crazy people out there. Mondami should have apologized for that.

He should have said, this is a great New Yorker.

“I think he did say he's like, we want him here or whatever.”

But that was completely discrecieot. And it's discrecieot if you don't call it out. I mean, I call him out anytime you single one of these people. I call out violence, but I don't know, man. I think that's okay.

You don't see the problem in saying, can't you hear him? You're talking about the point into his house. I don't think I would have done it in front of his house. That you're a decent human. And I don't think Mondami would.

I think that it's fair to do some popularity, eat the rich stuff. I mean, people are mad for good reason, right? Be careful. You can't even can afford it. Yeah, but you don't want to be sent.

Yeah. So again, two different topics.

I don't want to do that. I've heard of them. Obviously. No. And obviously.

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“Does that the Epstein thing reveal that like maybe we should all be a little more judicious about all this rather than the opposite?”

Trust me. I've thought about it since this happened and like oh my god is there anybody else in my circle who has this going on or like even when I take selfies now like you know you get stop now for selfies. You on your tour probably took a thousand selfies. One of them is a serial killer Tim. Do you endorse serial killing?

No. And so the Epstein story was a lot of people that were like going to if this isn't you but it was a lot of people going to fancy going to these dinners. And it's like hey, do you want to come to this dinner?

Do you want to come? And there's this instinct that people have like hell yeah.

“I want to go on a network and shouldn't we be trying to model?”

Yeah. Maybe I should value character more. Maybe I should value virtue more. Maybe I should be doing business.

I mean I've always character I've always valued these things so you're preaching to the choir on this.

Do you think I want to have walked away from any of the social media and I'm looking for you. I mean every time I'm doing this. You're saying long thing. What is your mind thing? I don't know what you guys think.

What is your mind thing? What is your mind thing? Yeah. Elon is like it is a walking vice signal. He basically makes fun of anybody that tries to to offer that to care about having on the program.

And you can go through is 40. Do you want to come? You don't need to come. He's 40 tweets every day. I don't know which one you're referring to.

All I know is you don't think this is any credible business person. But I don't have like every mistake he's made. You don't think this is a cultural problem. The like people are culture. I think the I think you know if we do have a cultural problem right now is that we don't have people working together.

We're working together collaboratively in our government anymore. And that that needs to come back and more moderation and working together. I hope that when Trump is out of office and in this midterm we can return some balance to the various branches of government and get out of this partisanship. That's what I hope. Yeah.

Well I agree with that. Nathan four or five six. I'm really concerned about this president Trump juju. You know I'm like a pretty superstitious guy when it comes to the nicks because I've suffered for since the 90s over this team. I'm a little worried about him showing up and then the chaos that's going to ensue.

I don't know why he's doing this. But I still think my original prediction was nicks and six. And having been at the first two of the aims I'm now at nicks and five. I do think it'll be a gentleman's week. Didn't see an Antonio would be convenient for me.

How do you how do you recover if you're Wendy?

“I mean that game to that was about the worst thing I've seen since Chris Weber called the time out in Kyle.”

When he throws the ball in his back, but you know the nicks built up a 12.0 lead.

They have an incredible young swad.

Their guards have been incredible on gel and bronze and they're beating the hell out of them. And they're letting them play. So you can't argue about calls here, but the nicks are a team of destiny. And it shows what happens when you just have a very deep team that's healthy going into the playoffs. Last couple of years we weren't healthy.

Tips didn't develop the bench at all. And now you just look at like bridges and do's and heart and Jose like we have this long. Okay. Tell of incredible players and everybody's healthy. It really is like getting to the finals and winning is about how healthy your squad is at this elite level.

But yeah, when B is not ready for it, he will be, but he's not ready for it now. And man, the fact that Carl Anthony towns owns him and then, you know, Mitch Robinson has been doing a tremendous job on him. I kind of feel like he's on par with Mitch and I think cats dominating him. So total advantage gone. The guards have been playing great.

What do you think? Which is a prediction six. I mean, the next even in the next we're losing in the first quarter of the game on game two. I was texting my friends and I was like, they just seem better. I think they're getting better shots.

They just weren't, you know, just took a little bit for them to get in. So it's kind of hard for me to see the next losing the series. But there's a part of me with my Trump arrangement syndrome. It does want to see four straight spurs wins. Like just to have the Jews who get totally stopped.

I can't do it. I can't do it. I can't do it. And I do love dealing Harper. I bought my daughter, Dylan Harper Jersey during Game One because he did that.

Guys, such an all because I'm believe he's 20 years old. 20 years old on the second best player on the team. I think he's just incredible. I see so fun to watch. That's where I forgot.

I forgot to ask you about crypto stuff. So we'll have to do it again another time. I'll come on again. I'll come on again. I'll come on again.

And tell your call, you know, tell your mouth and freebrew. You have, you keep taking it for the team. Okay. No, I can't. But tell them to get out of their cozy little bubble.

You know, I don't buy anything.

“You, you, you have to understand, like I said earlier, like,”

if you're, it's a tribal sport now. You cannot break when you join the team. Yeah. Whether it's Trump or the other side. If you have Trump derangement syndrome.

You can't break from the team. If you have Trump dedication syndrome. You cannot break from the team.

I've never joined either team.

I had the opportunity to be on both teams. I have a lightly declined. I like to end it. You have, what, what do we have? Two years and seven months left to just fully come on board.

Which group? Much for mine.

There's no hope to go on to the Trump dedication team.

It's all getting worse from here.

“So if one morning you wake up and you're like, you know what?”

This is this little tinkerbell inside me, the whole time that new, that wanted to be with him, that new Trump was terrible. But I just, I couldn't quite imagine all the way there. I like ramen man. Yeah.

There you go. You like ramen.

I've been texting with ramen man.

You know, I like Josh Shapiro. Yeah.

“Well, I think the ramen manials message would go over a lot better.”

If it was coming out of the body of someone besides ramen man. Cool. It was good. I don't have anything against personally.

But I think that the Democrats are going to be desperate for somebody outside of there.

There's not the part of the kind of Clinton Biden Harris era. I just think they're ready to move forward. You think they're going to just go full AOC Monday. I don't know. It could be AOC.

It could be somebody else from the center. I just think that like it's more like they don't want the baggage.

“I don't think I think the voters want to move forward and wash away”

this 12 years, this 12 year horror show that they've gone through. And I just find it very hard to imagine that the voters are like, you know what? Let's give somebody from the Clinton era a try. I think they want to fresh start. So that's nice.

I think he's super competent. That's he didn't like about it. I mean, super competent. I would like to have a competent moderate on either side. All right, brother.

I'll tell you what. I'll tell you what. That's Jason Kelkin. I said everybody else will see you back here tomorrow for another edition of podcast. Peace.

[ Music ] The board podcast is brought to you thanks to the work of lead producer Katie Cooper, associate producer Ansley Skipper and with video editing by Katie Lutz, an audio engineering in editing by Jason Brown. [ Music ]