Jayson Tatum is Back! Plus, the Players We Love to Watch and a Raptors Check-In.

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becomes 10% of her school on Tamara's.com. Perfect for you. And now for you. Tamara is. Coming up on the Zach Low Show, the great Chris Ryan is here.

It's CR month on the rewatchable. So, we have them on here. CR Day on the Zach Low Show. Jason Tatum is back. Right in the nick of time before we recorded.

So, we talk all about the implications for the Celtics.

What Tatum will look like, what role he'll fill and all of that.

“Then, remember the Marcus Old All Stars, a column I used to write for Grandland and other”

places. They've replaced the watch. That's it. Chris and I both picked a starting five of our favorite players to watch and the couple anti-Marcus Old All Stars guys that we may be hate watch.

And all of that got us talking about a lot of different stuff. Nick Stunder, Mike Brown lashing out at the officiating. These are the thunder joining a growing chorus of coaches who were doing that. The calves and the calves, recent shirts, the rockets, the spurs, lots of other stuff. Of course, we talked about Jared McCain and the sixers and the thunder.

Chris is here. We talked about Luke Kornet versus Magic City. Not so much nuggets talk, but exciting announcement. The Zach Low Show is coming live to Denver, Colorado. That's right.

Denver, we're bringing the show to you at the Fillmore Auditorium on April 13th. Tickets go on sale March 9th Monday, March 9th at 10 a.m. Mountain Time. Come join the Zach Low Show and special guests at the Fillmore Auditorium in Denver. April 13th right before the playoffs.

“And again, tickets go on sale the ringer dot com slash events, March 9th 10 a.m.”

Check out the ringer dot com slash events or more details. Zach Low Show coming live to Denver. Zach Low Show coming into your ears with Chris Ryan and Jack Armstrong. Hello, to talk about the Raptors right after this. The Zach Low Show is brought to you by Fandole.

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CR month and the rewatchables and so it has to be CR week on the Zach Low Show. The podcast needs a dose of the great Chris Ryan. How you doing bud? Good band. Good to see you.

Thanks for having me on on CR month. You know, I am stretched thin. I got, you know, press box. I got to do bachelor next. You know, I'm just doing every show.

We got. Look, someone has to be the MPP is this thing and my, it might as well be you. We're going to do some fun stuff and we plan that out and before that we have to get to about five minutes ago, Shams tweeted Jason Tatum is going to return this season. Perhaps as early as this Friday or this is whatever day it is March 10th against the Dallas

Mavericks, do you have any reaction to this other than have you checked on Bill is, is Bill stressed? Is he happy? I'm sure he's very happy. Take.

I haven't checked on him. I'm sure he's going to go live any minute now. Personally, you know, I'm glad my prayers have been answered. Let's meet over there. Is it God?

I've just been just hoping and praying for JT to get back on the court. You know, that JT size hole in the Celtics was really bothering me. I'm, honestly, I wish him the best. I, this will be a really interesting test of, I guess, the 26th and that's what a killies injuries are, are a nine month injury now.

My experience and in all of our lifetime, this was a at least year long thing, plus a year of not looking quite like yourself, but they're going to throw him right back into the fire. Do you think that he's going to be a role player on this team or like he says in the documentary that I've seen clips of he's not coming back to be a role player doc?

Well, I think he's, I think it's good minutes wise.

“I think it will be role player issue at least to start, right?”

That's the most important thing.

Did you stick them in for whatever amount of minute to give you is what he gives you? Takes a little slice of like the Hugo Gonzalez, Shireman, Walshmen, it's all of those guys are playing well. And I think with the A team on the floor, I think he, he veers a little bit more into not

It's all the stuff that you can do and he's very good at. And then I'm really interested to see when Jalen Brown is off the floor, where the Celtics have an amazing, the entire year with Jalen Brown off the floor, but the offense becomes just like a blur of screens and passes and cuts in a more system based offense was worked really well.

“I think that's when he'll get some time to cook.”

To me, I've always, like, I know people are worried about the chemistry and disrupting

the rhythm this team has and they are, they are the feel good story of the season. They are the biggest surprise of the season. Joe Masula is my coach to the year at the three quarter mark. They've just been a delight to watch. I just didn't think there was any chance that they were a championship team as is.

And so if there's any chance that Jason Tatum can help raise your ceiling, I see, like, no harm, no fall in this if it's not working, you got to pivot. But to me, huge win for the Celtics, awesome for Jason Tatum, who was an all time gamer, like just never missed games and now he's back and we'll see, we'll see, I'm, like, you I'm fascinated to see how it looks, I don't remember a situation quite analogous to this

of, like, star player on a top three seed missing 60 to 65 games and coming back right away for a high stakes. And lastly, I do think it's important. He comes back with a nice buffer before the playoffs. That would have scared me right into the playoffs.

It's strange. It's just like everything we've been talking about this season. One of the narratives about it is it's just been the increased intensity, full body intensity the NBA players experience and today's game and how they're expected to cover more ground and its corner to corner.

So I'll be fascinated to see a guy coming off of Killies immediately get thrown into that fire and to what extent his defensive responsibilities are maybe, you know, changed, mitigated by his, his, his sort of, like, re-emergence on this, and this rotation. I, I'm just kind of like, if you told me in, like, five years that a Killies is going to be like the NBA version of Tommy John, where they're just like, yeah, we're going to do

the Achilles so that his cap stops bothering him. I don't know. I mean, is that where we're going? Oh, I haven't thought about it like that. Um, yeah, it's a quick turnaround.

I think there was a bill was on this right away, like the rapidity with which they did the surgery. Yeah. I think was helpful in terms of, like, whatever was going on inside there, inflamed less scar tissue, whatever it was.

“And this is like, when that injury happened, I'll never forget.”

It was the same night as the draft lottery. It was like an earthquake night in the NBA Cooper flag is going to Dallas, Jason Tatams out for, like, not just this playoff run as brief as it looks like it was going to be. But like, you kind of wrote off the following season this season in your head. And now the Celtics are 41 and 21 second in the East, couple game cushion for number two in

the Eastern. They're getting Jason Tatum, bad luck to me. I just don't see any world in which you cut any world. Like, there'll be some.

There's always hiccups introducing a big piece like that to a team that's played a lot

of games without them, but I just don't really see much of a downside. Like, that's on him and Joe Mizula and everyone else to mitigate whatever instinct you might have to be like, no, now I'm playing 38 minutes at it's my team again. Like, that's just not realistic. I think everyone probably understands it.

Well, they got boat race by the Hornets last night. So I guess there's a, I guess that, that, like, paved the way a little bit. It was like, you know, like we were, we're getting smoked by by La Mello. We need, we need a little help here.

“Yeah, I think that, you know, paved the way is the right phrasing for it.”

I think it was a reminder of this team is at 41 and 21 has enjoyed other than Tatum. 100% perfect health for the most part, like no setbacks. And even as is, has pretty much no margin between what they are and, and, you know, a worse version of themselves, like everything's got to go right to be where they are right now. And everything doesn't go right.

Um, wow, that's a big, that's a big bomb to drop right before we get on CR. That's fun. Yeah. He's tall when he can shoot those are two very important things. He's not quite as tall as Kevin Durant and he doesn't shoot as well as Kevin Durant.

But like, that was the, that was why there was all the optimism for Durant's return from the Achilles because at the very least, you take away whatever he's, he's, he's going

to be missing for the first few months and he's not going to be chasing Tatum right

away. So I think he needs to be ready. Like, it's not going to look like Jason Tatum because he's going to work his way back when he's tall and he can shoot and those things don't go away. So that's exciting.

Times and Eastern conference. All right. Um, so if dating back to it, Grandland website, you and I both worked at, you were more of a founder. I was just glumman on midway through.

I used to write a column called the Mark Kassol all stars and the premise was just simple. My favorite players to watch just that, that's it. And, and I tried to veer away from like super duper stars is like Wemby, duh. Like we all love Wemby. That's a pretty easy choice, right?

Like you'll catch the same thing. Yeah. But you can pick stars. You can pick any role players. You can pick any one you want.

Just the only criteria I love watching this dude play basketball. Maybe I'll write it again someday.

We'll see. TBD on that one. Let's think of your fingers.

“Have you entered into the Bill Simmons Rehab plan for finger restruction?”

No. I was going to write this season and then I decided, let me, let me feel the new, the new place out before I overextend myself or extend myself to where it was before. So I'm still filling up, but they're, they're, they're frisky. They have, like, by reflex, they still shake a little bit like this.

So we said, let's pick five, starting line up of Marcus Ols stars, had to, the great Marcus Ol, one of my favorite players of all time. And I will let you go first and then we'll just talk about these guys. So I don't know, name, name your first, do you have a captain with Team Captain? I know the team captain, but this is probably my number one option.

This is the guy we're looking for down the court every time.

And just to put a little bit of a context around my picks, this, I always love this column

back at Grailin and what I try to do is, it's a numbers free evaluation for the most part. So it's aesthetics, it's competitive fire, it's two way play, but it's guys who my eyes gravitate towards when I'm watching a screen. And if you took away all the numbers, the score, their stat line for the season, whatever their efficiency numbers are across the year.

Like I just like watching these dudes on a nightly basis and since we mentioned the Hornets, I'll, I'll do a Hornet that I feel like doesn't get as much gap here because La Melo gets a lot of highlight reels and concuniple gets Uber rides from our boss, but Brandon Miller is a sicko. And I love watching them play offense and just, I really enjoy first of all the shoulder

thing. So whether he is fighting a war in the future in the Terminator movie or what, but it's a very cool look, I'm sure it's medically needed, but it, it is starting to feel kind of like cyborg like I have come to save you Sarah Connor and I'd take it like he should do the rip Hamilton where he just keeps it forever.

Yeah, I think so, honestly like if he's having this kind of season with it, my favorite move from him is when he just kind of slingshots out of the corner and then gets a handoff out of like, you know, there's running some action at the top of key and he gets a handoff and then it's just like that moment when he's deciding, do I want to take a top of the corner three, do I want to dive into the lane, do I want to put this guy on my hip and get contact

at feel like I am watching kind of what you were leading to that early version of Kevin Durant where it's kind of all it's there's a learning process happening, but he's also like there's really nothing I can't do.

“The only thing that like he's had some in and out like injury that look, but on a nightly”

basis when I'm watching the hornets and like for as much as Con is the reincarnation of Clay Thompson, it will mellow so fun. I really, really find myself focusing on, on Brandon he does a little bit of everything

and their surge basically corresponds almost exactly to him getting healthy and having

the best stretch of his the best sustained stretch of his career, the best stretch of his career period, he's awesome, he's up to 38% from threes and when the playmaking comes with him and you can see him like he kind of sees it sometimes he sees it late, sometimes he he telegraphs it a little bit, sometimes he's a little laborious, but he sees it and he's trying to level up in that sense and when that comes, look out, it's a great pick.

I'm just going to let you keep rolling. Okay, um, here's the fun one, which is specifically Timber Wolf, I owe it to Sunboot. So I needed apparently Nikhil Alexander Walker methadone when watching the wolves, like I needed something that was two way, little paceier, little bit more aggressive and it was really fun just the other night, they had a great post game clip with aunt and he was like,

I owe Kurt came in and now like I have to like run because he just takes off with the ball and he's like, I like to play slow, but it is fun to get like a little bit more of a brisk pace back and just watching him out there, the two way play is awesome, but this is like, this is a example of a guy who I feel like has like helped me rediscover the Timber wolves when I'm watching them because this is a version of the Timber wolves that I feel

like I was maybe missing for the first half of the season.

He was my number one trade target for them.

“I said it over and over, I can't believe that I think I manifested it.”

I held manifest it, he's a perfect fit and like look, as much as they work, they have been my sort of sneaky title contender pretty much all season. I had come to grips with the fact that that was contingent on them getting one more guy off the bench 20 to 28 more minutes of productive perimeter play off the bench. It just didn't have enough and he's the perfect guy.

They got him. It's great. It's a small fight Chicago, I have to say, no, I'm just not, I know. But it's just like, most Chicago bulls wind up getting treated to the kings. They spend their entire careers in this sort of like two team purgatory of failure and this

I think they're like five or six and two since they got him and he seems to be growing into the role there and I really enjoy watching him and and specifically play together.

I'm like it, I'm going to give me your third starter.

Okay, this is, this was my actually number one draft pick when you gave me this assignment. This is a, it's the fine castle. Our first commonality. The fine castle is on my team, too. So, I wanted you to keep going.

“I'm like, do I bet we're going to get a match somewhere?”

In my extensive college basketball viewing, I have over the last couple of years which is really, like, I'm lying. I don't watch a lot of college troops, but Castle was a guy I did watch at Yukon and was like, this guy's going to be really good. He's awesome.

It turns out, I was right, it turns out the people like the Santa and your spurs were right. I have really loved watching him blossom as a playmaker, which has been kind of surprising given the depth they have at guard, but, you know, his assist numbers are up. I love his little lobs.

He always seems to be looking for a lob.

He is like a panther when it comes to any loose ball. It seems like it shows up in his hands and it's an immediate break. I love watching his two man game with Wemby. It seems like also this is my favorite period of time in a guard's career where like everything they do seems to happen in the lane.

“I love when he just is like getting in there and he's got shooters, but he's like, I might”

just to hand dunk this thing, you know, and that is, you know, he's not going to have that forever. I watch guards all the time just be like, I'm done with that. We're not trying that anymore, but I'm loving it while it's happening. He is so fucking powerful going to the basket that almost no matter what you do, you're

going to go under a screen because you don't, you're going to dare me to shoot, you're going to meet me on the other side. He's so fast that he often beats that guy to the spot and if it's a tie, the tie goes to stuff on Castle. He's just going to overpower you and jump and I've said this before, he does the thing that

not a lot of guards, not a lot of perimeter players have where you jump simultaneously with him to try to block his shot and he's still going up when you start coming down. It's like uncanny. And you mentioned the passing, he's been the best lob passer on the spurs since he walked into door.

I don't know how he got so good at lobs if he just immediately recognized that dude so tall. I can just throw it anywhere.

But they have incredible timing and chemistry on their lob plays.

And he's starting to do the manipulative pick and roll thing where he uses his eyes and his head to trick defenders into like, oh, he's going to pass to the roll man. You come in and sink on the roll man. He hits the guy in the corner instead or the other way around. He's just and you said the most exciting part of a guards career is that the paint attacking

stuff. I just feel like we're seeing that in the sense of every game feels like he's discovering something about NBA patterns, NBA defenses, how they work, how to manipulate them, how to exploit them and like stuff that he maybe was like, oh, I can do that, I can throw that pass.

So defensively he and Dylan Harper are just huge and competitive and tough and like that

“game where he guarded Durant and just body them up and Durant was like, what, what is this?”

I don't want any like, this is broken in the wing, aren't these fouls? They're not fouls? What's happening to me? It was like a landmark game. So he was on my list too.

So we have a commonality at all A plus season for Stepankas. All right, fourth starter. Okay, VJ, he was on my, he was on my last cuts and so now I will seed the floor to you to talk about VJ edge comb, but also I know that you probably have some Jared McCain feelings to get off your chest.

I do, you know, I don't think that the Sixers fan base is taking this one well. I have to admit that I will, I would almost consider myself at this point a centrist when it comes to the Jared McCain trade and I'm pretty upset. There is a very vocal online presence that is treating this like we sent Mike Schmidt to the to the, to the Orioles in 1980 in the middle of the season or something.

It is pretty frustrating to watch him so easily slide into the exact role that the Sixers could have used him in on the thunder and him hitting big threes in like big moments with Shay right next to him is pretty galling. I understand that like, you know, there were reasons for getting off of him and that maybe there is, I saw that there was this, the story about like, they were, they were trying

to get coi-liner at the, at the deadline and that would have been part of it. They would have needed the picks, but man, it is, it has been pretty stomach turning to watch. I don't know if Jared McCain is going to be a big part of the thunder playoff rotation or how big that rotation is going to be. Do you think he's going to play like crunchy, big

minutes in playoff series? I mean, he has shown out to a degree in Oklahoma City already where I think that's much

I thought when the trade happened, this is great for now when all of these guys are injured and they're going to load manage Kuroso and load managed door and on and on and on and on. And in the playoffs, I thought, you know, he'll be a guy that, you know, the offense

needs a little juice in the second quarter, throw him in, he'll swing a quarter, he'll

swing a game, crunch time, I don't know, I mean, you got Mitchell coming back Kuroso on and on.

“Now I think it'll obviously be more competitive for him to get minutes.”

He sticks out like a sore thumb in that every other player on the team is like an AA plus defense player and McCain gets out there and the other team is like, all right, we got to hunt him because he's just okay, but just okay on the thunder is like, is a pigeon for us? And he works hard and he sticks out like a sore thumb in that sense and so it'll be

interesting to see what diagonal it does in real games, but I think he's going to be part of the rotation and it would not surprise me if he earns actual real minutes in like fourth quarters of playoff games, if they need offense and that's just going to infuriate six or six, it looked like I do think to your point about centrism at the time

of the trade he had played like what 55 games in his NBA career, 30 of them this season and

which he had been kind of buried, kind of disappointing, which I think his fans are using to turn on Nicknors. No, yes. Yes. And right, the scrutiny is on the coach, not the front office, right, because I was sitting

here and we didn't use them. And by the way, now Paul George is suspended and like guys are hurt, we can really fucking use Jared McCain. Yeah, and Maxie's playing 42 minutes a game leads league in minutes by a lot. Yeah, the way 38 last night against the jazz in Philadelphia, which is not great.

Yeah, and they got what they got a bunch of seconds for him to. I mean, it's it's a fascinating move for the thunder who are going to have a lot of tricky financial waters to navigate the past the next few years and he helps them. But it just, you know, you think I got you think we hit it out of the park with the 16th pick and he's going to be part of our team for a long time and now he's not part of

the team. Yeah, I mean, the mathematics or I look. Straight might feel much, much differently if Mori hadn't had the we feel like we sold high on this player quote, which can't help he can help him.

“So he got really, really, I don't know if I would say manipulated, but like I think it”

was robbed of the essence or like what he was sort of meaning. And he was also very complimentary to McCain in that press conference, but he just, that's going to follow him around every time that guy hits a three pointer. It's going to be like, Oh, it looks like they sold high on this guy, you know what I mean? Like, and in meanwhile, I think it's been an interesting microscope to put nurse under

because if this guy immediately starts playing for the defending champions, what was he doing and practiced that nurse was like this, he's in and out of the rotation and going to play for the blue coat coats, you know, from for every other week. It's going to be interesting and I forgot to even mention Jalen Williams among the Thunder guys that are going back like, there is a world in which he's the 11th guy and this is

no longer a thing, but also, by the way, I forgot to say this during the Brandon Miller section, so I'll just say it now a couple of weeks ago on this pot I had Rob Mahoney on. And I said something to the effect of, I think this is before Charlotte is one, I think five in a row and I said, I think Charlotte is the fifth best team in Eastern conference when you account for like actual, if they get in the playoffs, could they make the conference

finals and make a real run? And they were like 11th or 10th at that, probably 10th at that point, they're only nice now.

“I think that's like indisputably true now.”

I think there's a cool, it's crazy. I think they're indisputably the fifth best team in Eastern conference. There are only three games behind your sixers in the race for the sixth seed. And they're just qualitatively like, I think they're better than, I think they're better than Toronto.

I think they're the fifth best team in Eastern conference, the record will not show it because they got off to such a bad start. And if I were any of these top four teams, any of them, I would be scared to death to play

the hornets in the first round, they're, they're probably wouldn't lose that series.

Like the top four teams will all beat the hornets or should all beat the hornets, but it's going to be competitive and scary and they're going to be games where I mean, like, they just to your point last night, the Celtics were like, what is this? What are we supposed to do with this team? That's a VJ, VJ, yeah, speaking of my sixers.

So what am I last cuts? One of the reasons why the sixers are maybe have a weight tied to their foot right now is obviously in Beats got the oblique and VJ hurt his back. The other day, he also his biggest highlight of the week was probably Kungfu kicking a woman in the front row of the stands.

But before that, what a delightful work he sees in what a, like, immediately, like, put him up on a mural, like I will watch Maxi and Edgecom for hopefully years to come. The reason why I was so into him aside from his athleticism and his willingness to make

game, when he is not feeling it, when it's not flowing through him, when he is maybe off ball a little bit more, he still finds ways to contribute. He's not a role player in the sense where he's like, I'll stay on the corner. And then I will guard my man on the other. He is in and around the ball.

He is diving and crashing the offensive boards. He's getting put back and tap in or keeping plays alive by like getting second chance rebounds or something like that. And it's just that little extra, is that little extra 10% that you're just like, oh,

“that's what, that's actually is what changes games is us getting another look at the basket.”

This guy actually deem somebody up and making it uncomfortable for their number one score. He's just been such a breath of fresh air and a team that really, really needed it.

He is absolutely ferocious constantly, like he is never not ferocious.

He's super competitive. And if you look at the guys, I picked for my team. That's a common ingredient in at least three of them. And if not all of them, but definitely three of them, including Stefan Castle. Castle, Castle will do something so wonderful on a basketball court and just look like the

guy on the other team just kicked his sister's shin. He's just so pissed and it's just like clearly as like this competitive fire on a night tonight basis. And VJ has it too. VJ is also a lot of fun and you can tell how much the other guys are keyed off of him.

I think it honestly like, you know, and VJ is obviously up and down in terms of his physical health, but I feel like guys like VJ are I've like revived in beads. I don't know, like, love of the game, frankly. Yeah, I mean, we talked the last time you were on about sort of meeting in the middle between those two styles, the embed style and the super speed demon guard style.

“I think they've met in the middle about as well as could be hope for and they all need”

each other. Like the team isn't isn't good enough with just the guards in like a replacement level center and embeds place and vice versa, the team has been dramatically better with them beat on the floor despite his physical limitations. All right, last last starter on the CR assault team.

So this one is more weighted towards the beginning of the season.

The first half of the season because this post all star break in the last couple of weeks

have been trending in the wrong direction for Derek Queen, but I will stand up for the multiplicity of play styles in this league and I don't want to see everybody be six, nine, able to shoot and staying out of the land, doing like exactly the same thing. I hate the hegemonia and I love, you know, what do we ever decide? Is it cage and yoke it?

Is it dairy queen? Like, do we ever give them a nickname? I don't want to get too deep in the nicknames because we just talked about VJ at the bottom and I'm still upset.

“I just, I'm almost supposed to throw on yoke it's around in any nicknames.”

Okay, discount, yokeage diet yokeage, there's been a couple of diet yokeaches around the league in the last few years. Sure. I want to leave him out to the outside, Derek Queen, we can workshop it. DQ is good.

I like he's pretty good. He has since been benched for DeAndre Jordan, so it's not, it's not looking great with my Derek Queen holdings, but for those brief glorious weeks and months in the beginning part

of the season where he was just basically playing YMCA pickup basketball against NBA players

and winning individual battles, not necessarily pelicans games. I just loved it. I love his court vision as a big man and I love his ball handling and he's just such an interesting player to watch because it shouldn't work in it does. I agree with you.

He also has kind of hit the rookie wall a little bit, which is, which is predictable and so that's it. That's a little bit too. A little bit. Pelicans are kind of the sneaky interesting watch right now because they clearly don't

know exactly sort of how they want to structure their team and I talked about this last week with Zion who feels almost like as out of places at 20 to 25 point against score can feel on a team and then boom, against the lake or the other, I know they lost. They suddenly start Zion at center. Two games after starting Zion at small forward, next to two centers and for sure, part

of this is because they know the Zion queen four or five combo just can't survive defensively. It's just not, it's not workable. But all of a sudden there are playing Zion at the five and I thought that game was really interesting for a couple of results. I'm going to nerd out for one minute.

Please, Zion set 19 ball screens of that game and was just destroying the Andre and the pick and roll. The Andre and would drop in drop coverage. Zion would catch a pocket pass. The job they Murray's back by the way, that's helpful.

Yeah. And Zion wanted to explode by him for lay up after lay up. That's the most screens he's set in any game this season. It was like point Zion was dead and buried and pick and rolls Zion was like the Zion that was left over.

On the other side of the floor, just just note it, just note it.

There were eight Luka Lebron pick and rolls in that game with Lebron as a screener.

“That's the most they've had in any game since the trade at the century that brought”

Luka to LA. And I thought Zion actually defended well in that game too. So couple just ran the pelicans notes, I like watching Derek Queen. Okay, let's take a quick break and then I'll run through my my starting five and then we'll get a little meaner.

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is their thinking partner. Alright, it's time I'm going to run through my mark a soul all stars we already got to find castle so about a month and a half ago I did like a five minute thing on this on Amazon Prime a TV version of it and not so I'm disqualifying the five guys that I picked for that they're all to the side but those guys were just for the record done of an

Mitchell Isaiah Stewart and I said when I picked them I was like this guy is ready to start a fight and then I just came back last night I'm in Thompson obvious choice shade and sharp kind of my NBA white whale like I just want him I want him to be good because he's so crazy to watch and then Moosa de about they just because he's the hardest playing dude in the entire NBA.

Yes. So those guys are out I had castle I see who I want to start with. Alright, this is a Bill Simmons produced partly podcast so I will start with the Celtic Derek White is just you know Derek White is he's just a fucking awesome basketball player he's he and he just plays all the time he's seven to the league and minutes he plays

every game he does everything well he is relentless as a competitor on both ends of the floor defensively chased down blocks steals and just just a super super duper smart player getting more aggressive as a score he's got a nice floater now takes ton of zardatious threes and just plays to win he's just a winning player and he's just so goddamn smart that Hornets came last night the only Celtic's highlight of the whole game was Derek

White chasing Brandon Miller around like three consecutive screens on a pick and roll his friend and Miller was trying to just get away from him and he couldn't really do

it and then he finally went around to screen started dribbling to the right wing on a

pick and roll and Derek White was trailing him except Derek White read exactly what Brandon Miller was going to do he peeled out to the shooter on the right wing and the guy on that

“shooter I think it was Sheirman peeled in and took Brandon Miller and Brandon Miller was like”

what's happening why are these guys changing this and pass to the shooter and Derek White just yunked it out of the air and went the other way he sees every opportunity on both ends of the floor he sees the extra pass that's going to be two passes away before even gets the ball he sees the driving alley that's going to open for him when the ball swings his way before anyone else does he is maybe like my favorite basketball players

basketball player in the NBA Derek White any comments or should I just keep going I also enjoyed him last day is the only real like Celtics like highlighted last night's game against the Hornets just an awesome play I actually nominated him as an all-star and then he went into like a three week shooting something maybe look like an idiot I think he had a real all-star case this year all right so he's in I talked about Castle this is going to be

almost too predictable did you consider Josh Hart at all I didn't I did not consider any next but this is worthwhile I don't know when you want to talk about the thunder but it was very interesting to watch that that thunder next game last night to go ahead with Josh Hart just the same you know when I used to play pick up basketball now and then I used to like to play fast I like I just it was just more fun to play fast and it was more fun to play with other players who

wanted to play that way Josh Hart would just be a delight to play with he he looked he plays like a guy who's a he wants to win badly but b's just like I love basketball let's run and pass to

it's just fun to do that now I'll work people he plays hard every second he's on the floor

everyone knows about the crazy end-to-end transition rushes that sometimes I'm with him falling out of bounds and that kind of hurts the next good pass or good pass or in any situation like good good he doesn't think in transition where he dribbles really hard to the rim knowing everyone's coming at me and then I know where my trailers are he's a good passer in the half court he's also one of the most interesting pivot points in the league for a contending team and last

night's thunder next game which we cannot talk about was an interesting example of that so the next every other game are going to face this strategy where the other team puts their center on Josh Hart and puts a wing on cat to the point for the simple reason of we're going to switch every cat pick and roll so he can't pop for three and we're going to let Josh Hart's guy be our shop blocker who roams around and on some nights the nicks have figured that out pretty well

there was a recent game I talked about in regards to that and on other nights it gums him up and last night was and it gums him up night and the nicks not only did the thunder started too big men and they didn't put either of them on Carl Anthony town's hard-nesting guarded Josh Hart and Chad Homer and guarded a combination of and Adobe and bridges sometimes and Lou Dort

guarded cat and we're going to do our anti-gossol all stars in a second two great candidates

for the anti-gossol all stars and when both of them are together it's like a lurchfest just just the Frankenstein lurchfest but then I wish we could have said those guys to like battle world from X-Men where I would just like it's just the two of them like working their dark art someone another and the nicks couldn't quite find the right combination of sets and plays and screens to to sus that defense out and ended up limiting Josh Hart's minutes for the

guts of the game and putting shim it in his place which is a version of like the doosmic bribe

“in all shooting lineup that allowed an experience of clamored force I think he's interesting”

in lots of different ways but obviously the big event of that game was she guiltous Alexander

committing what should have been his third foul on a charge on Jalen Brunson who always gets the

benefit of the doubt on block charge calls and I guess the two colliding benefits of the doubt ended up going she's way Mike Brown goes bananas because it would have taken she out of the game for a long time gets his only technical this season and then afterwards becomes the latest coach in his post game press conference to basically be like yeah shake it's all the calls you can't touch them it's really frustrating and just like Bill and I have been talking about this it's this

it's this bubbling sensation around the league that like other teams are rooting against the thunder for like 10 12 different reasons like when a coach says something like that I get messages from teams around the league and like all kudos to Mike Brown right what a crazy night I thought that the they're definitely seems to have been a group chat between these guys for it's just like we're going to turn up the heat because it feels like the thunder on national

television a lot right now going down the stretch I feel like there's more attention being paid to this these big crunch time games that feel like there's so much scrutiny and that it's just it's one thing for the thunder to get this reputation as not getting any you know to to be

“having a really like tight whistle foreshay I think the flip side of it is the aggression”

of their defenders on the other end of the floor so either one would be enough but the fact that it there is this perception that the thunder have all the all the leniency in the world to bear hug guys and it it's funny I know you don't have all the Premier League but this is really reminding me of what's happening with Arsenal right now in the Premier League so Arsenal used to be incredibly beautiful high quality passing possession football club and over the years have

basically populated the roster with giants and have decided that what they are going to do is exploit this inefficiency of if we put 10 six foot two guys in the penalty box on every set piece on every corner kick the percentages say we're going to score and they are basically I'm going to get some heat from this but they are corner kicking their way to a Premier League title right now they're going to probably win the title and people are losing their minds about it it's unfair

it's shit house football they're cheating we're not allowed to do this if you touch Arsenal they fall in the ground but Arsenal grapples everybody in the box and they it is a not diseler from the way that the thunder went from what a cute story to oh these guys are absolute

“shooters on every aspect of the of the court and I think if they just if it wasn't for the fact”

that nobody seems to be able to touch she but dork seems to be able to muscle guys off the floor it might be a different thing but it definitely feels like there's like a it's it's gone out the

Arsenal one of my good buddies Jimmy shout out Jimmy is a huge arsenal fan Jimmy is not going to

like my my characterization of what I said that is Liverpool fans what are you going to do he's pretty

“even killed and and I think he'd be like you know what he's probably right I think you apps this”

look this is about a lot of things right it's about envy for sure it's about style of play like people just don't think the thunder that thunder watch on offense it's it's like a it's robotic and it's efficiency the way shape plays you get that everyone's lying I talked about this before Christmas with Howard Beck and I even used the word villain about the thunder but I think it's it's about the idea that they are tattling on the jazz for tanking when they themselves

also have tanked in the past and I've said repeatedly like no one from the I mean this and I would

say it if it were true no one from the thunder is called me about Utah and being the Utah police so

there may be calling other people but they're not calling me so I can't speak to it but I think more than anything else it's about their defense and you just nailed it they are very quietly they have the 11th lowest opponent free throw rate in the NBA this year as fouls have been called more and free throws are going up it's affected everybody but the thunder it's like last year they found a lot and they had a high opponent free throw rate and that makes sense considering the

physicality which they play with now it's like the rising tide of fouls have lifted all boats

“that they're all they're on the same level as everybody else and I think that really more than”

Shay who's free throws are really not out of whack for a guy who has the ball as much as he does and is his craft the S.E. is I think it's about about their defense so that's it's a great call all right I got two more guys to get to I think right I'll just do it fast nobs read just big jelly doesn't even need to be explained he had back to back transition baskets like coast to coast baskets against I don't even remember who they played I might have been Portland that were just outrageous for a large person

to be able to do them one of them was a right to left crossover in the lane and lefty flick hook that literally they could have done the loony tunes like twinkle toes sound effect as he did it and it would have been fitting it was so like balletic and and and artful and then my last one is read shepherd wow yeah I just like he he's a pretty audacious shooter and pastor like he'll throw these like a lefty 30 foot bullets to guys under the rim no look and he's obviously like a great

great great pull-up shooter the percentage seven born it out but the to shots he takes are pretty outrageous in a fun way and he's just like oxygen for the rockets offense like he's just every it's like everyone is crammed in a tight room and then someone opens the door to another room and the

“whole crowd can spread out into two rooms that's what read shepherd feels like to the rockets”

offense just oxygen and defensively the dude makes plays like people pick on him but he blocks shots he's getting in there for rebounds he swept it for steals so that's my other starting five after my initial starting five on Amazon and I have a lot of honorable mentions but no one that I really really hurt me can I ask you a quick question conference vibe check question yeah

do you feel like so do you feel like that first of all that the rockets have kind of steadyed

the boat from whatever rocky waters they were on a couple weeks ago and it am I wrong to get beginning excited about this tea wolf surge because I feel like this is this is again these guys are like rounding into shape right when they need to be rounding into shape that are playing their best ball right when they need to be playing their best ball. So you're asking the wrong guy about the tea wolves because I've been almost unreasonably

high on them all season and I just think anti-end words is just a specimen of basketball scoring greatness and defensive greatness when he locks in and so I'm not surprising I think the wolves are doing you're not wrong to be excited about them I think they have the third they are they play the it's like them I put them behind the full strength nuggets if we ever see them again in a thunder but they play both those teams pretty well I love the wolves.

The rockets I guess have have studied a little bit not in a way that makes me more confident than them than the other teams that we just named. I don't really know why that is I've watched a lot of the recent games they've had some good wins. I don't know if they seem to have gotten past the text thread thing. They have good for them I mean they just seems like the story their season is going to be a

team that was missing a point card you know he look man I know friend groups were one text gone a ride has messed up the friend group forever so who goes to the maturity now those friend groups don't like have mandated hangouts 82 times a year but still okay we also chose for fun anti-gasal all stars you chose a coach I think a good-gasal coach I didn't pick a coach

A obviously like he is concacting like a phenomenal season out of what most teams would have

“considered. All right off you know if you would told me that the Celtics were closer to the”

Pacers this season I would have believed it in terms of like what their outlook might have been without Tatum now obviously have brown and like the way that he has been able to construct this team which to me has actually been and don't tell do I said this slightly more entertaining than in previous iterations of the Celtics to watch this year's Celtics and also just on a content level

is reliably I just have never I never have any idea about what he's going to say when he gets asked

the most vanilla question Joe would you see out there he could say nothing I saw nothing my eyes were closed or he could start talking about Samurize you know what I mean like he basically was work or pub exactly and I knew that we were in for something special when he did the the infamous coaches versus journalist pick up game at the beginning of the year I was like this guy is now we're in performance art territory this is really like he's got to ring

and now he's playing around a little bit it's really exciting to see yeah you don't like I know Joe do you suddenly well and sometimes I still I feel like maybe now I don't like

is this an Andy Kaufman kind of thing going on right now like I'm not really but it is it is

fascinating and he is indisputably a great coach and they're getting Jason Tatum back and that to me does nothing more than raise their ceiling and I'll say this Missua would either be the best podcaster in America like if you had a pod it would just be absolute must here 60 minutes every episode or absolutely the worst it would either be like Joe knows selling things and you know you're like hey Joe what do you think about this to help tank you be like don't care

don't care just play and then the pod would be over after three minutes I was gonna say could be a pre-minute pod or it would well and if it was a three-minute pod it might be like the short form

content that we all crave and it would be amazing but he also has in him like you can just tell like

his his amount of interest do we ever get to the bottom of whether or not he was actually entering judo tournaments under a different name is that true I don't even know about this was a thing

“I think this was a story a year or two ago where he was like what did you do in your”

office season and it was like he was going to Florida and entering more sports tournaments for another family and if that's not true don't tell me because I want to believe it I mean I I'm obsessed with this I mean the amount of Missua stories that are out there is just endless and none of them would would surprise me so he's your coach I think that's a great choice if I had to choose a coach and I couldn't choose Joe Missua for just now we're talking fun

style team play how does the team play and I can't choose Missua I think I think I might have to go Mitch Johnson just because the spurs are so fun to watch I don't know the pistons are fun to watch but not that fun but that would be I don't have a good choice all right so now let's get a little a little not nice anti anti gossol all stars guys that we hate watch we don't have to double the labor this because you've spent a lot of time in the last couple episodes you talked about it

with Mo I'm just like kind of how I'm watching Luca I I as a as a Los Angel Plino resident Los Angel's resident he is on a lot he I've I've flipped channels there's Luca and there's Luca yelling it riffs and there's Luca having just all time bad body language I get it I know why my buddy Jason Gallagher is such a huge fan I know why people worship him I know why he saved the Dallas Mavericks and why if you were Lakers fan you'd be like oh my god we got so lucky 10 more years

of relevance with another all-time great player but it's just not for me man I just can't watch it the style of play is not my favorite but it's also the the vibe I just I just don't like guys screaming

“riffs all the time he was on my long list for all those reasons and I across them off because I think”

it's so much in the discourse now that it's it's it's just out there and also he just has a baseline level of genius as a passer that is still I can I can on the right night weighed through the rest of it to see 15 passes that are going to blow my mind or or look simple but the timing and precision of them is not simple at all and more than the scoring

more than the step back threes that on the right night it's a show and on the wrong night you're like

can you maybe pass now like that was like five step back threes and eight possessions yeah it's the passing that I can't I can't I can't quit and that was your that was your one guy right yeah that's my my anticus all so he was on my list I ended up picking three because that was that was my goal bank hero is on there and it's it's more an indictment on the team than him personally although someone shooting 37% on midrange shots should not be taking nearly as many did you see the bank

hero mostly tetat that happened it was after the Detroit game that they they lost by a lot on sunday I think and uh bank hero said the following in his post game press conference

“teams a lot of times adjusted half time and I think that's why we struggle a lot in second half”

just because we don't really adjust to their adjustments not great not great last time I remember a player talking about his coach not making any adjustments was Anthony Davis with Darvin Hamm and Darvin Hamm was not the coach of the lakeers for much longer that's right I remember that and then Jamal Mosley the next day it shoot around or at practice rather said the one adjustment that Detroit made last night they just played a little harder there was no schematic adjustment that

they made this does not seem to be going great for anyone in the franchise and I've said it before if they don't salvage this season and I don't think they're going to I don't know what the changes are going to be I could we can just predict like who's under the most pressure what trades are possible this and that but this is ain't working and that is and you can try to clean that up and say like Luca and JJ are edited with like an in-game thing like that heated the moment I'm more

liable to believe JJ when he says like that's just something happens we have a good relationship that is post game you've had a chance to calm down a little bit and you decide to go into a microphone and pretty much throw your coach under the bus and then the coach the next day

gets the microphone in front of him and he's like no you simply aren't basically yeah not great

I you know tomorrow to Rosen used to be one of my favorite guys to watch in the NBA I'm 48 I'm the right age to get seduced by mid-range artistry when you watch the kings and I get it it's not about him it's the young guys let Maxine Maximer in the let Maximer in the take all the shots he wants let me Clifford take all the shots he wants tomorrow's just like going through the motions is almost generous it's it's just like he's out there jogging and like oh I got a shoot this time because okay

I'll shoot fine like then you look at the box where it's like 32 minutes three of five six points like what

“tomorrow to Rosen took five shots in a game is there is there buy up potential for tomorrow I think”

he has a his contract for next season is very partially guaranteed so yes and and and or trade him to a relevant team for a good swan song by the way I mean we all said it as the season was going on and now he's playing on a team in Cleveland that is playing really really well the fact that the kings had Keyon Ellis yes could have extended Keyon Ellis and didn't even play him and thought so lonely of him that hey where's the worst team in the NBA and you can't even

get on the floor for us why are 29 other teams calling us all the time about this guy don't you realize he's he can't even play for us and now he's helping the calves who are playing like the best team in the east for the last three weeks and had a proof of concept when to meet again to the next last week that was a very important game for the calves I've thought about it before just preposterous should I just read a list of guys who were on my antagon solace

okay but some of them I don't it's just mean I don't want to just be mean

I mean Russ is always on there for me yaka birdle oh what are you doing here what are you yaka

why are you just never playing uh Patrick Williams just just potential unrealized just like your high school friend who was captain of the team had you know good grades and is now pumping gas at the gas station because he couldn't stop drinking not always said he had the email too early when he's like you guys coming back for Thanksgiving he's a fierce no I mean dominate and nirkage I put the asses on just for fun like okay just sit down man like it's like you're not the

captain just just sit down my old's turner just yeah like we did all we did all this for you yeah

“then I got some like I have the beholder guys like I think Julius Randall's an eye of the”

beholder guy like some people might hate watching them some people might like watching them who's the pro Julius Randall guy like give me give me what's his mindset when he's watching Julius Randall

he also has nights where he just I mean talk about NBA bullies where he just fucking trucks people

and they are legitimately like there's no flopping at all he legitimately just threw you into the basket's tension and dunked you know on the similar to Luca I haven't really enjoyed the Denny Obdi a show this year it's it's a lot of free throw baiting not baiting it's just so he gets fouled a lot and he's whining all the time to the refs he's on my list and then there's like

“I like do you like watching Jail and Bronson I do but I think he's an eye of the beholder guy”

I don't love it I don't I honestly like I have scar tissue from playoff series is and you know it's I think if you go through cheering against Bronson in a playoff series it's hard to come out on the other side and be like that man has my respect you know like it's it's a tough it's a tough little swallow Joll and beat I have the whole by the by the and I and I'm willing I'm willing to to to offer that grace to anyone who wants to say that I bet you all it's gotta be tough. I the skill

level is still so crazy to me that I can I can stomach the rip through moves and the falling over and then there's some other guys by the way I'll also be big enough to throw Paul George in there

I need just I crossed off the guys who are all basically like out like Jordan pool was on my list so

I think Jordan pool one of only two or three guys who have gotten called for flopping this year the

“age like the NBA kind of forgot that that's a rule and it got so bad one game that the entire”

opposing bench was doing the flop thing or like the fourth time and the rep was like fine you're you're flopping. By the way just for you I will say that on my honorable mention pro Gosol all stars Kelly Brudoner just playing hard all the time. I'm glad we kept them before I let you go the other hot controversy this year and this week in the NBA was Luke Cornet versus Magic City. Do you have any do you have a ruling judgment in the Luke Cornet versus Magic City controversy the

Hawks for people who don't know are holding a Magic City night honoring the what they describe is the local landmark institution Magic City which is also strip club and they're going to serve the wings that they're famous for. They're going to have hoodies that the Hawks have branded it made before they're going to have the club's DJ play the music at the game T.I. is going to perform and Luke Cornet wrote a statement objecting to this and saying that the NBA should strive to

esteem women and this is the opposite of that and it sparked a lot of country among green

is waiting out for this waiting what is Chris Ryan think of this? Well first of all I want to say

shout out to Jamie Gertz, a star of lost boys and twister who is apparently a huge proponent of this Magic City honorarium. I spent some time on Luke Cornet's blog this morning which I had not done so first of all shout out to Luke Cornet for staying on medium the ringer originally published on

“medium you can still do highlights I think it's got a fun that like there's a guy out there is like”

I'm going to write a blog post every six months and just kind of let people know how I'm feeling if you go back and read other Luke Cornet missives he is a very spiritually guided person the his anti magic city stance is pretty in line with his one religious beliefs and if you look at it in that context it's not that surprising I did really enjoy the anecdote I believe I heard about Cornet like blogging in the locker room after the game and like getting

getting an under the deadline and posting um yeah I guess I'm broadly pro magic city as a guy of sports small businesses you know but you know I I think that this is one where it's a slow news week somehow even though we've got an arm conflict going on in the middle east we're talking about what we're going at this one yeah true fair I hate to break it to Luke Cornet I checked in with the Hawks shortly before this podcast did Magic City night is on course to occur on March 16th

there no there there is no going back apparently from Magic City night despite the Luke Cornet led I would imagine they were like Luke Cornet thank you for the publicity and and the person I was talking with the Hawks was like what kind of like like what trying to suck out why I was asking whether it was still going on and why I was like what what is your interest in this and I texted back I was like I just think Luke Cornet versus Magic City is objectively a funny thing to talk about

I wish it was a cream court case yeah it's a basketball Supreme Court is there a Christmas CR what's the we're having a tournament right to decide which is your last for you? Yeah this was exciting because like in while doing the secario pod we were finishing it up we were talking about what should be the fifth movie I think we've got four of the Marty planned and we had so many

Bill's like bird mastermind activate where it's like we're gonna do an 80's an 80's region an action region and it was just really fun so that's on the rewatchable to Instagram you can go

“vote I think Goonies Goonies might be like the runaway champ but there's some nice guys fans out”

there's some sorcerer fans out there I'm happy to do anything nice guys is Gosling Russell Crowe detectives super fun movie yeah super fun movie what's up with your what's up with your your watching up with movies while walking things so Pat Peloton movies although because I've decided I've decided A there's just a lot of holes in my movie movie dumb and I like movies I don't have a lot of free time I used to use my Peloton time to listen NBA podcast because I learned

that way and I decided it's healthier from my brain to set the NBA aside for a little bit in catch up I'm not an ideal way to watch movies like 45 minute chunks not a great way to watch movies I realize but what else am I gonna do so here are some that I have done I did Zodiac in conjunction with you guys I had seen Zodiac in the theater and loved it but I had not rewatched it I did that I just did the trial of the Chicago 7 which is relatively new okay

Fargo which I know is near and dear to your heart I did not rewatch but I bring that up because what's the the ball guy's name is John Carroll Lynch I think who's a commonality between all

of these movies I hope that guy has like a billion dollars everything that he's in he's

absolutely incredible and I want him to be the wealthiest like character actor whatever he's just in a movie earlier this year called or last year called sorry babies he's awesome and yeah he's a John John Carroll Lynch I think I'm getting his name right you're awesome you're like my favorite actor now let's I did a complete unknown before still in movie I did Dune I got to Dune to now should I be Dune it maybe want to read Dune I haven't read Dune I think that it are you

is a fantasy sci-fi big book like I can be with limits like I'm never gonna read Game of Thrones and I don't quite understand I just it seems like too much okay I Dune I would probably I would

“probably wait for the third one to come out this year and then decide if you want to continue because”

it gets pretty weird after the second one it starts to get pretty strange yeah a movie I had never

seen before the conversation with Gene Akman was recommended to language now brother yeah I tried the rip this Netflix madame and been athletic thing not a fan okay not just like I just feel like I've seen how many of this movie can I see of potentially already comes with the plot twist Zodiac in the conversation like you're in a little bit of a 70s conspiracy thriller zone that's a good zone for me have you done all the president's men I have many times did you ever do the parallax view with

Warren Bady no it's a good one okay that same director is all the president's been and this one you're going to be shocked that I have not seen this as a media person and I finally saw a broadcast news oh yeah really good time really good time do you find that the tone of the film affects your workout no I'm just I'm just a mediocre it's just mediocre across the board there are sometimes where I have to pay more attention and so I probably slow down on the bike because I'm super into

a scene and I pay attention so it's probably not it's not a good way to watch movies I get that this the the cinema the cinema people will be like no you're supposed to sit in it theater for the entire two and a half hours I get it I should and now I am doing in honor of CR month I'm rewatching

“Cicario which is even better than I remember yes Cicario has just only like grown in my”

estimation over the years yeah it was really awesome to do that pod to to be able to get into it with my own choice all right see you are you got a lot of stuff to do thanks for lending us some time and good luck for having me man good luck to your sexer and bad luck to your feelings but what I want to do is not want to get a lot of the studio masterfighter laptop weeks soft behind the internet as a master I tell you that you can do the

zurück you have a story you don't know but you don't do anything egal

it's all about for the first time you want to work with this story and when you then work

you're watching save this story you have a lot of money now that you have a lot of money all right let's bring in one of my favorite people in the NBA to talk about one of my NBA homes away from home a team I haven't talked about so much this year at least in a deep dive sense because they entered the year as the weirdest team in the NBA to me I've spent I don't know five months trying to figure them out they're still kind of weird they're clearly good they're

fifth in these they are yours and my Toronto Raptors and the one and only jackarm strong

excited a channel rap is with you can you just give me a hello just just just give me one hello here we go hello yes one of it when I I say this with full love there are people in life that you may only see two three four times a year you may only see them for five minutes at a time in those times did just make you feel good about yourself about life about what you've done what you're doing and jackarm strong is one of those people so it's wonderful to have you on

back thank you so much to checks in the mail that's good I like that there you go how many years you're like you're you go are you you're not year one Raptors but you're close right

I'm in my 28th year as a boycast for the Raptors my first game was Vince caught his first

game in Boston and the guy and the other team making his debut was Paul Pierce so to hold the famous and I actually coach against Paul Pierce when I was a head coach in the ag we played Kansas at Allen Fieldhouse Needless to say we got a rest kick but it was pretty cool to watch those two guys start into career and obviously been with the Raptors that that first year with

“Vince the Raptors the first three years had a tough time as a franchise but he honestly put”

Toronto on the map it was literally like traveling with you know the beetles or Elvis so whatever whatever way you want to describe it it it got to a point like when he won the dunk dunk

contest and those first few years it just absolutely took off and it was just so so I'm very

fortunate that I kind of hitchhawed to that wagon we were kind of a start-up company at that point and so I hitched on at the right time and here I am 28 years later and I love it I still enjoy it every day it's a joy Jack and Matt Devlin on play web play one of the iconic broadcast duo in the league they play off of each other very well they make me laugh they go on tangents it's all a delight the Raptors Jack Armstrong you were there I was there it's been seven

years almost since the Toronto Raptors won their first NBA title their only NBA title the last pre-COVID NBA title hard to believe about that and it has been a would you say a wayward sometimes rocky sometimes unpredictable journey in those last seven years yeah I mean considering the fact that they had made the playoffs the last three years had four the last five years and they were they were the ones most affected by the COVID crisis because they had to relocate

“the Tampa and everyone else was able at least playing their home venues so I think things kind”

of got thrown out of whack and and you know you look at that team in 2019-20 the year after the NBA title they had the third best record in the NBA when the league shut down they were fabulous and that's without quiet at and any green and a mock a soul who was another year older and kind

of really starting to show the effects but that team had such incredible chemistry I really thought

if COVID didn't happen I thought that team even without the break while I let it could have gotten back to the NBA finals I don't know if they were good enough to win it but they could have maybe gotten back and I think with COVID they would have been back in the finals and theoretically could have won it again so it was so unfortunate that things shut down and from that point on it became a really difficult journey for the franchise I mean the two years later they made the

playoffs when 48 games and lost at a six is at six but beyond that it's been a tough road. So that 2020 team the year after team is one of my all-time favorite sort of sub finals NBA teams I thought they played a beautiful brand of basketball they all lifted each other up they were greater than the sum of their parts and they really responded from what should have been a gut punch for agent departure by playing beautiful and inspired basketball and like

objectively absolutely they could have made the finals they lost in the second round to Boston in seven games that's a series or OG and it'll be hits that crazy shot at the buzzer to keep

“them all at what was that game three I think to keep them alive in the series and Boston then”

loses to Miami who did everyone the favor of eliminating the number one seed Milwaukee in the first round they could have absolutely made the finals it's also the only raptor team in these seven years it is one a playoff series that was their one playoff series win over Brooklyn I think and I'm just gonna read you some of the things that have happened to Toronto some of the moves made not made it just sort of illustrating how crazy this has been so the

gradual breakup of that team I'm gonna be out of order on some of these but just bear with sure Kyle Lauer you get straighted for precious issue and gore and drag it Fred Van Vlee walks in

running out the string with Fred Van Vlee arguably waited a beat too long to trade both Pascal

Siakum and OG and Anobi got okay we got okay returns from both of them and in both of those trades kind of aimed at well in the Anobi trade clearly aimed at like we want the middle ground build kind of players slightly younger slightly cheaper not dramatically so neither case but

“Emmanuel quickly who I think on balance has been a little worse than they expected when they got”

him and RJ Barrett who I think on balance has been probably a little better than expected when they got him Siakum they trade for Bruce Brown at a bunch of picks that in a round about way kind of becomes Brandon Ingram who they then pay right away a big extension that is both big and short he's lived up to it but it's got a player option coming up pretty soon there is the controversial yaka fertile trade where they go semi all in on a 500 middleing team and it costs

them the number eight pick in the draft the next year which is Rob Dillingham and then they extend a hurdle last summer on a big money contracting extension with Mr. Jack Armstrong I called the most inexplicable move he said when I was giving out my off season awards the draft not been super kind to them since the Tampa tank for Scotty Barnes which was a great inspired pick they picked Scotty Barnes over jail and sucks and as much as their actors like to talk about sort of building up from

the middle which is what they've been trying to do when you look at their win totals from the last five years it really all started with all right this Tampa thing this is a law season for us we're going to use it to rebuild we had some injuries and they get Scotty Barnes out of it grading dick is currently out of the rotation the Malachi Flynn picked didn't work out

“Jacoby Walters are right mobile is all right I think Murray Boyle says a chance”

and if he just would he he's do you notice does it drive you crazy Jaclyn he'll get the ball under the rim and sometimes like not even look at the rim I say that all the time by Frank yes the thing I love

about him is he's so selfless he thinks past first and I think he's just trying to fit in

with his teammates and I hope as he gets a little older he gets a little more selfish and a little more greedy when the ball gets to him in the post but he is a fabulous pastor out of there so I do think that that'll come but I think he's got a chance to be a plus defender I think he already is one very much he can go on multiple positions he's got great strength he's got tremendous lateral quickness he covers a lot of ground and I tell you what when you put him in Scotty Barnes on the floor

this switchability and range of coverage is as good as it gets I would say two names I don't want to just mention here I know one of them for sure I know one of them for sure is going to be Jamal Shed oh no I'm actually you talk about the moves they made one that you missed was dorm pal Gary Trent Jr. that's on my list I was going to bring that one up people for people forget about that one go ahead norm pal I love norm pal and I thought he did a great job

year and year out growing as a player he's a gym rat and when they made the move to get a little

“younger with Gary Trent I think sometimes y'all think yourself and you start putting the numbers in”

and the salaries and ages and upside and all these things and you don't appreciate what you have there you know it's when they say you can't be a prophet in your own village right and I think sometimes you take the people that are there for granted and I think norm pal was one of those people

and then the second name you mentioned Jacobi Walter I think he has a chance to be a little

better than you said he's got to get strong of them I think he shoots the three pretty good I think he covers well you know we had a game in Oklahoma City back in January I thought he did a fabulous job going shank you'll just Alexander who obviously is a great great player so he showed me a lot and he's a little tougher than he looks he's just got to get strong he has a really difficult time with physicality playing through physicality but I think it's he gets stronger and I think he's got

a chance to be pretty good but the norm pal one I know you had mentioned it but the norm pal one to me is very subtle but you know you look at where Gary Trent is right now from Milwaukee and he has even play and Gary was Gary was a decent player for the raptors but nonetheless I think when you look

money right I think they were afraid that his next contract was going to be much bigger than Gary's

and sometimes you make decisions for that and as is they're basically at the tax the next the next two

seasons and by the way when I go through the draft fix like it's so easy to do this like Malachi Flynn was what twenty nine grady dick was thirteen and you can go nitpick low a kyante George was couple picks after a grady dick but like so was Kobe Buffkin like above and below all of these guys you can find good players and guys who kind of washed out and did nothing so it's you can't just bring up the the good what if she got to bring up the bad what ifs as well and Murray Boyle's

will be interesting one because there are some really good players central cowards right behind him Derek weans right behind him the Carter Bryant kid in San Antonio has a chance to be a three and D monster but I like CMB the whole point of this is it's just been sometimes you can tell what the Raptors are aiming for sometimes it's a little confusing what the Raptors are aiming for but either way they have aimed and they have produced a team that is nine games over five hundred

solidly number five in the east um and just sort of I just kind of still don't really know what this team is particularly offensively I I've when I watched them I focus mostly on the offense because they're defense to me is legit they're long they're ranging they play super hard they close out

“like maniacs I think I looked up some stat were there opponents half court possessions are the”

longest in the NBA because they just make you make so many passes and so many drives Pertal is back his room protection hasn't nothing about him has been the same with all these back injuries but you know you hope that his room protection sort of studies that part of their defense their defense to me is like I don't I don't worry too much about it it's it's pretty solid offensively I got to give Darko Reak of it's credit and that's like another thing that happened in all of this time

they moved on from Nick Nerson they moved on from Masayo Jiri like franchise icons and Darko has made the most out of the strange brew of offense of players whose skill sets don't really on paper fit all that well they are only 16th in offense that's actually maybe a hair better than I thought they were going to be but they they just find ways to squeeze out points so teach us what are they doing that works on offense because on paper they don't have a lot of

shooting they don't have a lot of threes they have guys like RJ ingram barns all quote unquote need the ball so does Emmanuel quickly like how have they been and and their screen setting sort of rock in the middle of it Pertal has missed most of the season so how have they made this work coach

I'm calling you coach it's called your coach once the coach always a coach

a few things first of all turn over margin is a huge factor for them they have to they have to win that they have to create pace they have to create man advantage opportunities in transition they got to get out in the break they got to you know beat you by 10 12 14 points in terms of as break points they must get opportunities before you set your defense

“and I think to your point about their defense I think scheme wise I think they've done as good”

a job as you possibly can with the personnel that they have and they have a few guys that definitely are not plus defenders that aren't even neutral defenders that they've tried to hide and scramble and gamble and they're active and they find a way so that's helped their offense it's

propped it up but his his the most important thing about playoff basketball as you know the game slows

down and and you can look at certain numbers and say well it doesn't but the the possessions that really matter when push comes to shove you're going five on six man you're going a lot of times against the shock lock that's the sixth defender and you're going deep into the clock and now can you grind out something in a half court setting against a set defense that knows what you're running as well as what you're as well as you do and I think that's where

their problems are at right now you look at how they played Tuesday night against the next you look at their games against top 10 competition there's the thing I you probably know the

“record off the top of your head this is big I think it's four 14 if I'm not mistaken big picture”

like zooming way out and we'll go back to this but big picture you're hitting on the most important thing which is like good team yeah I'm not sure if even if this course stays together and grows together for two years after this I'm not sure I really see the road map to a great team with this group and and it's because I just don't know what unlocks a really truly good offense and and their record against the best teams and even their under five hundred against teams above

easy pathway other than they have all their picks they have everything to trade they'd get in on

Janus maybe they'd get they were you know they would they were a team to monitor for sure and they'll be a team to monitor for that player other players in the future but it's it's a tell talk about the the record the latest one being the nicks and they play the wolves tonight against what what's going on in those games well Zach a few things they play the wolves tonight and you know my amy and Orlando have easier games tonight let's say Toronto loses and those other two win

suddenly things get really interesting five through eight in the conference and now you look at what Charlotte's doing and even Atlanta starting with so I look at I looked this up today

just to prepare for this and now let you go all the so there's these fancy projection systems

that slot teams into their most likely seeds most of them have Toronto about 40% chance to be the fifth seed 20 to 25% chance to be the sixth seed so there's and like a tiny percent chance to be the fourth seed so that leaves like 25 30% of what you're talking about like you they got a like they got a lock-in because the play-in is is looming there as a realistic thing and you're hitting the danger zone correct and that's and that's my point and now you have another game on the road

tonight the raptors have been a much better team on the road that nineteen and ten on the road they're five hundred at home which is really odd so maybe no home tonight but the the issue is

would and and look I've always done this my whole coaching and now broadcast always evaluating

how are you against the top four teams in each conference even the top eight if you're not a play off team had you do against the top eight and in Toronto's case is a five seed you go okay

“you know you I think there'll be eleven best team in the league so you look at the ten teams”

north of you and how do you stack up what are you doing and the thing that jumps off the page at me to your point is from a roster perspective they have some challenges when the game slows down when the game is at a nice pace they're fine they're they're fine and this coaching staff coach doc on a step have done a really good job trying to play to those positives and camouflage the weaknesses but good teams could competition expose you they make you play the way they want to

play they dictate terms and that's play all basketball and that what comes down to is now you got to play five on five you're best stuff against your best stuff and the game's going to be slowed out and the other team's going to be telling you where to go when you're running your own

“plays that's how well they know you and do you play with force and I think beyond like guys”

slot it in and maybe not great fits this team in the half court plays on its heels right on on its toes they don't play with enough force I think I got like a manual quickly at times he's more of a combo than a pure one scoring mind to point good he has played really well in the last two months for the raptors he had a tough start he's more of a combo combo but when you get up under him and really get into the ball you know who are the other people that now can counter

I think Scotty Barnes probably has the best playmaking chops within that group you can run a lot of midscreen roll actions through portal even columnary boils but branded ingrams and outstanding mid post type of player get it he can get his own and bail you out in the back end of the shot clock RJ Barrett has been he's played really well early he's he's strummed a little bit of late it pretty good game two say night against the next but he's strummed since coming back

from injury so some of the fits are a little walking and and kind of how do they generate offense how do they get into offense and you know beyond be I at the back end of the shot clock where are you running your stuff to and where are you getting easy shots against Detroit who fouls you on every play where are you getting shots against the next and Boston who are in your you know what like so that is the next step for them some of that schematic some of

“that's personal ones but I think ultimately I like what Bobby Webster did to trade deadline”

and that was he he let it breathe let it marinate and to me I think he knows exactly what you've said that this roster maybe isn't necessarily as fluid and as tight chemistry while I mean I think the chemistry is great I mean the coaches that and the players there are great group of guys

like the thing I've always learned is don't rush and build on a foundation that maybe isn't the

“right foundation so I think if you try to do a lot this trade deadline on a foundation that maybe”

you're not sold on would be rushing into something that maybe it ends up making it worse I think when you get through this playoff process these final 21 games and you find out who you play the playoffs and how you play then and only then now you have an opportunity say okay I have all my picks I can do some things some I can't all right who's here who do I throw over board and I mean ultimately that's that's the decision that they're going to have to make but I'd rather you make

that decision when you truly know what you've got I think you know a lot of good things like Scotty Ponds is taking the next step this year you've got a lot of nice pieces there but in in other ways they're just pieces and now you've got to make it work what's the old line you've got to play your five best or your best five and I still think they haven't come to that

“connection yet that road where it all meets and I think they're working through that right now”

and to me personally if you're an executive I think this is the great thing that it's happening because you are getting exposed to what you're good at and what you're not good at and you have greater clarity when you sit around the room and you knock it around and to me I think that's going to help them going forward all right to some of your earlier points fourth and

forcing turnovers first in transition frequency aka the number of possessions that they get

in transition which is a must for them given their spacing issues their shooting issues and honestly like I think they've squeezed a lot out of parts that don't make super duper good sense together and a lot of it is just like the interchangeability of those parts so quickly will be as much of a ball screen or as he is a ball handler and they'll switch up they use the corners very well like they'll put in the corner and Scotty in the corner and they'll run plays up from the corners they have

a lot of off ball stuff and they just mix and match and make the best of it and make it work and and all that but it's still kind of clunky they still have some clunky because a lot of clunky

“possessions and I think you know the Scotty Ingram thing is so interesting they also stagger”

them a lot so that each one will play with four bench guys because they know they have overlapping skill sets the Scotty Ingram thing is so interesting Ingram I think from their perspective is almost like a free shot at okay if Scotty is not a sort of traditional number one ball handler score but he does all these other things playmaking defense I think he has a great first team all defense case this year you know posting up mismatches all that he fills in all the gaps on offense what we

need something like a go to score this is a free shot at somebody who may not be like a great go to score but he's you know borderline all start let's take a shot at and see how that just Scotty with that kind of player works and I'm gonna read you some stats I looked up on the tracking data that are super interesting to me Scotty Barnes this season Jack he is running we see if I can find it nine picking rolls per 100 possessions as the ball handler nine last year that number

was 20 so they clearly have taken a lot of the shot creation duties traditional number one alpha kind of scoring duties out of his hands his screening as the ball screener is up pretty significantly so they've kind of switched his role in a way that kind of just says like you may not be that guy in terms of a traditional like hey yeah we're gonna hand the whole offense you know you get it in another way you get it in a transition you get it in the post but I just thought that number

was very stark his efficiency on picking rolls is not very good but that's fine and you saw you've been against the next like when they have him and mom who is at the five they'll put centers on Scotty Barnes and just go under screens against him and dare him to shoot jumpers like that's still a thing that's kind of happening too and this is not a slide on Scotty Barnes he's a really interesting player but they have changed his role a lot with quickly and with Ingram and even Barrett is sort of

always the forgotten man I kind of like our jay barrett he's like yeah he hasn't been the same

since the injury but he's like one of those connector pieces that's just coming off a handoff making the next pass set in the screen here and there connecting the offense he knows how to play he's the ball player you know he's a guy you you go in the school yard and you say I want that guy in my team all the numbers finite and up you know there are holes that are there there are areas he could be better in but nonetheless his team wins you know he said guy that's on the floor like

so I think is awareness level he's cut in per play on what has to happen he obviously he has

“to challenge is sometimes defensively but to me I agree I think there are times again that you”

look at him and statistically there are times you looking you say ah you know that's missing that's missing that's missing and then when you watch him play to your point there's a lot of good things

he does on the floor his floor game makes sense yeah he's always cast is like the guy they got

a throw into a trade to make the salaries work and like the other guy and the quickly trade and like I like find quickly he's been like you said very good the last two months I've always been a fan of his I think he's an interesting creative player who can do a lot of different things on offense his decision making he'll just have five minutes stretchers or his decision making goes hey wire like he just runs up and takes the 30 foot three and transition like what was that like

what was that actually just tried to make from under the hoop but I you know look his contract

“is pretty hefty and I think has neutral to negative value probably right now quickly but the”

just assuming out thing is like the way they've run their offense this year at least suggests to me that they they have decided or they envision Scotty as sort of a jack of all trades rather than a traditional number one option and are searching for something like a more traditional number one option and I think it's not controversial to say that if you actually want to become a great team Scotty has to evolve into a little bit more of a reliable score pass or traditional number

one option type he's never going to be that the way like the the super duper stars are like a

Tatum or a Luca pick your different variety of that kind of player but a little bit more of that and if he doesn't evolve that way then they've got to get someone a little bit more like that who's just better than Brandon and Nick or like Brandon and he's a very good player but I don't think but so that's the mystery to me like I think I don't know man look at this team and I'm like I'm just not sure how much better of these guys can really really get particularly since I don't look

at any of the I like Jacobi Walter but I don't see any of the him or gritty dick or shed's a great backup point guard yeah I don't see like big leaps huge leaps coming from those guys Murray Boyle's a bit of a wild guard so that's just my it's just a confusing brew am I too pessimistic though I I think a Scotty right now is a one B and he's not at a one A level yet I think his defense and rebounding on nights that he's really dialed in is one A plus absolutely

first remote defense candidate for sure absolutely uh the the offensive stuff has to I think

some of that has to do like I don't know if he'll ever be a great great shooter at a terrific start to the season shooting the three and now it's gone the other way again and you have hurdle in the lineup you know obviously when he's healthy and you don't have a ton of great shooting so for a guy like Scotty bonds to maybe truly be uh that next level guy some of it's spacing too where you know when you have more space to operate he's a tough cover because he's got great

great scores and size and you know so the guy that's really impacting their development you mentioned Grady Dick and look I watch Grady Dick sometimes people chase him off the line and like he's very comfortable putting it to the deck and attacking the basket I think right now I think he's more comfortable being that I think when he was drafted I think they saw it you know JJ Reddick Kyle Corver Yada Yada Yada he's got a ton of open shots and not made them

you know and the reality that's when Jamison battles get minutes now and he's not you know and that that's the reality of the business your pay to make open shots and and to me you know back into the shot clock the ball you know if he had made that he hasn't yet and I hope he does he's a great kid he works his tail off and he does he does the things they want him to do he's

“trying to guard that that's what they need this offense needs a guy that the ball can swing to”

those second side and now drill a shot and it opens things up a little bit and you're kidding yeah and can they play through physicality and to me I think that's where if I'm Bobby Webster I'm just taking it all in and then I start to make my moves in this springtime in terms of what you want to do in July first and all that kind of stuff to me I think that is the truth I think they they're taking it to where they they better that honestly exact nine games

here 28 years have watched all the ups and downs of the raptors I'm very pleased with what they've done

“and I think they've gotten as much as they can out of this group and I hope in the last 21 games”

they can find another notch but I personally think the last notch for this group that if they're going to win some games in the playoffs if they're going to be the fifth or sixth seed they have got to get better in their half-court offense when the chips are down and you've got guys holding you and beating you up and they're letting them play because we know that happens you know you play the Celtics they're going to be they're in you and and too bad you better figure it

I'd say what raptors this year when they play Charlotte they struggle against them I mean Charlotte you know coach me worked as a Celtic assistant don't a great job with those guys those dudes get into you man and you got to be a run your stuff through all that and to me that's

ultimately what it's all about these final 21 games and postseason can they figure that out

I work for a guy when I was an assistant at four of my name Tom Penders is in the college basketball fame universe a guy named to a guy named Tom Penders he's a great he was a great coach and one of my mentors he's to talk all the time about offensive toughness in the final five minutes of a game you know and the game slows down well we're going to be able to generate a high percentage shot you know and had against a defense that's into you and he he's to do some really cool we

would go three on four in practice or five in practice five on six it's like it's like a quarter back and you're sending and not only one or two more guys that your line can protect and you know you're trying to call off coverage and who's blocking schemes and all that and you know can you can you make decisions rapid fire decisions what you know I play off basketball is in chess it's turbo chess and it's it's a next level and and when the next level happens and it's

in confined space how do you do it and and to me you got to have a guy to bring to the ball

and now the ball's got to get out of there quick and you got to find a guy on the second side

“or even a third side and you got to make a shot and and put but the other challenge I think for”

the Raptors is they don't break the defense down enough off the bounce you know when you have that water bug point guard who can get into the heart of the defense and bring two or three guys to the ball and I think bang bang now things are happening and again that's that's another element like quickly it is very capable but does he hit that paint does he hit the rim is he getting deep is he just went in his personal matchup and just stroined his opponent off the bounce and said

right now you can go under that ball screen on him he he's not a consistent three point shooter so where where are you getting guys going down hill went in there matchup to create that stuff therefore a lot of times you kind of have to go east west and your structure your your screening your actions have to create the shot and again when your opponent knows what your actions are and they're blowing them up now what do you get what where's your creativity and again

“that's part of it you need to see it you need to live it and say okay those are my issues”

this is what I need to do to fix it but and they do they do go east west a lot and that's why these the corners and coming up for the corners very well but to your point about the spacing when you go east west and you're trying to swing the ball second side third side those gaps open up those like diagonal alleys to the rim but when no one respects your shooting those gaps are smaller and they close faster for the ball handlers than they do for teams where the shooters

are respected look about what is this and that was that was my point about great yeah because if you have you know if he is a young guy in his third year who takes that next step and he's shooting 38 39 percent and he's a MF for when the ball comes to him and it finds them free on the shot clock bang and you have that guy that now that defense has to loosen up a little bit and go geez I got I got to keep a guy he's got to stay on that guy now you're playing a four or four

this face opens up a little bit and they they need that and and hopefully one of those kids

pops and if they don't they got to find it here's the bottom line to me when the raptors talk

about build from the middle post the Tampa tank this is what they talked about we had it we had to move

little older than they're two three years older than the guys they got back for them but older and

“more expensive that we didn't think was going to go anywhere but we don't want to bottom out while”

doing it we want to stay relevant they've succeeded in doing that they're relevant they're fifth they're solid I just don't know or see the road map to something much better than this but I amage to see how the last one year's so games uh go and how the playoffs go assuming they get there

and by the way tiebreaker wise they've lost the tiebreaker to fill me already it's one one with one

game left against Orlando that's a big one jack arm shun and uh they are up two oh against Miami

“but they have two games left so that will still be in play and you'll I got it isn't uh aren't”

Toronto it's silly two two if I'm not mistaken two two but division record is the next tiebreaker after that in Philadelphia has an insurmountable got me jack arm shun just the best in the business such a delight uh he and Matt Devlin have been steering their after ship for a long time on the broadcast it's great to see you thanks for taking a little time and I look forward to maybe a playoff trip up to see the in-laws in Toronto jack we'd love to have

him buy then they'll actually you'll be able to see the concrete and you'll be able to walk around there'll be no snow left so uh we had a rough winter this year's act so uh get so to have it yeah and you can you can come to a game a wrapped a playoff game maybe hit a jays game as well and uh well tell you what else is I'll tell you what else is going on in Tio the raptors are going to be long gone by this point in fact the NBA season will be over but June 23rd in Tio

Croatia is playing in the world cup in Toronto we might see you might see the low family up there uh jack arm shun you're the man thank you sir you got it Zach all right that's it for the Zach low show today barring some major news we will be back on Tuesday per usual and we'll be on Sunday

“the Bill Simmons podcast Sunday night I think rocket spurs play will be on right after that is the”

plan uh thank you to the great Chris Ryan thank you to the great jack arm shun thanks as always

to Mike Billy and Jonathan on production and thanks to all of you for listening to and or watching the Zach low show season 21 over in president select states for Kansas and affiliation with Kansas star casino or 18 and over in president and DC can tuck your Wyoming gambling problem co 1 800 gambler or 1 800 my reset call 1 888 789 777 777 or visit ccpg.org/chat in Connecticut or visit mdgambling help.org and Maryland hope is here visit gambling help line m8.org or call 800

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