Did We All Underestimate Remco? | TdF 2026 Stage 16 | THEMOVE+

Also, you know, we could not see Ramco finishing on the podium. And now he's in second place. So, you know, of course, you know, we don't want it to happen.

“But if you're in second place and you're solidly in second, you know, there are two different finishes in Paris, right?”

We saw what happened yesterday to Jonas. So, I mean, today is obviously, you know, great by kind-ler. But, you know, if something happens to the favorite man, you're in poor position. Everybody welcome back to the move plus. I'm Spencer Martin, I'm here with Johan Bernille. We're breaking down stage 16 of the tour to France at 26 kilometer time trial.

In the avion, just delicious, delicious water coming out of that lake Johan. And I was, I was thirsty the entire stage. One by Ramco Avenue pole ahead of Tetta Pagachar and Matthias Schelmoza surprised third place with Paul success in fourth, Isaac Del Toro fifth. Those guys separated by just five seconds of the battle for the final podium spot.

And the white is still on. We'll also take a few listener questions or read them and then we'll preview tomorrow's stage 17. But Johan, just right off the top here, I mean, you must be buzzing. And Ramco said something about it being Belgium day, he wins on Belgium day. He's now in second.

Yeah. Second question for me. I'll show you a second.

“It's not a single day of Belgium, so basically, I think it's, what is today the 21st?”

So the 21st of July 1831, I think, was when Belgium became a kingdom. I think it's, I think the 21st of July 1831 was when King Leopold got sworn in as the first official king of Belgium. Before that, there's been, there have been a civil revolution and we actually belong to the Netherlands. And so yeah, the Belgian national day to day victory of the Belgian rider by excellence, I would say. Impressive victory, I mean, we did expect him to win right yesterday.

Our prediction was Ramco even approved wins. I think I said about 30 seconds on today. Turned out to be 28 seconds, I think.

But, you know, there was never a doubt from the start.

Actually, I think we saw the split time straightaway in. Ramco, even the pool has been in the lead to a whole race. So amazing for him, you know, two stage wins in a row. He's definitely in, you know, the right form for the steward. He's sitting in seconds, now comfortably in seconds after the abandon of Fiona's finger yard.

“And I think it's the best possible scenario for him.”

Yeah, it's a great, it's actually a great scenario. Couldn't be better scenario for him because he's got a strong red ball team. They're, they are down a rider because foreign Leopold, who is on an amazing ride, crashed and look like he broke his collarbone. Separated his AC joint, something bad with the soldier, sorry, shoulder.

It looked like a terrible crash, but other than being down Leopold, the team does look pretty strong and they will, I assume, defend second. So fiercely, it's actually perfect for Pagatcha. Now he has a lone team that's also going to want to control the race. Couldn't be better for those two guys in first and second.

Also pretty good for Del Toro because now he just has to hold off six us and fourth, and he has two teams basically working to control the race for him.

But man, this is an amazing, we should just say like amazing two days from Rimko,

Evan, a pole to win the mountain stage. When the time trial, it's impressive what he's doing. And especially in Spencer before the two or you know, all the doctors, we were part of them also. You know, we could not see Rimko finishing on the podium.

And now he's in second place. So, you know, of course, you know, we don't want it to happen. But if you're in second place and you're sonnately in second, you know, the two different finishes in Paris, right? We saw what happened yesterday to Jonas.

So, I mean, today is obviously, you know, great bike handler. But, you know, if something happens to the favorite man, you're in pole position. Well, yeah, it's a super important point. If you don't wish to happen, and you know, I think I think nobody would want to win the two of the France in these circumstances.

But I always say, you know, if something happens to the favorites,

somebody else is going to win. Yes. And there's nothing wrong with racing that way, especially if you're Rimko right now, you're not as strong. You're not going to be tatted in the mountains.

And there's only mountains in Paris left between now and then. So it's probably not going to happen. Positioning yourself second.

I would be so sad if this happened. But of course, yeah. Yesterday, Pagotra almost went down with Jonas. And today, you almost stacked it in that corner, like Lippewitz. Yeah.

So being in second, it is a big deal, because you are one mistake from the leader away from being in first.

And he's two, basically two and a half minutes up on Del Toro. So it kind of looks like he's going to stay in that position. Yeah, well, I mean, we'll see. I mean, if we could say we could also say, well, you know, in the past, he has cracked in real mountains days, but you know, in the last week.

And the way he won yesterday, first of all, it shows that he is in on really good form. He climbs really well. His form is on the up, kind of especially his morale is really on the up. The last week, it's, it's a mental struggle also. It looks really good.

Looks skinny. Looks powerful.

“I don't see him losing that second spot anymore, honestly.”

I mean, yeah. Watch it. I'm just now worried that we were really hammering on this guy. And then now we'll say there's no way he loses second. And then he's going to lose second and we're like, well, I think we're on the right side of this.

Spencer, you know, we've been critical of him.

But I think I think you did most of the hammering. I thought I'd try to stay more of, you know, like, I think you did most of the hammering. But, you know, I mean, listen, I mean, have also, you know what I also want to, with a point out Spencer about Ram Gov in a pool. Something that we, you know, constantly forget.

Is that it's been a long time since he had a clean run at an objective. You know, he has been struggling with crashes and injuries. And, you know, he was also in the, he was also in the crash in, in the bus country, then in the winter. The winter after he got hit by a car could only start his season last year, very late. Didn't, you know, didn't have an ideal preparation.

And this year, he started, if you look at his season, right?

“So he started in my, your car, he was flying, he's basically playing with the competition.”

You could say, okay, it's my, yeah. Then he did vertivalenciana, one there, like no, no discussion. You know, he could say, okay, it's only vertivalenciana. Then he did vertacataluña and he did show weakness on the climbs. But let's not forget that he crashed on stage one.

When he was away with you on us. Yeah. Right? And he looked, and then he, and then he goes and wins. I'm still golf.

Let's not forget that. Well, he, he did not podium it to a flander somewhere one there. He podium, right? He podium at two or flanders. Yeah.

His first ever participation into a flander's podium. That that was amazing. I did not expect that at all. I said before, I said on beforehand, there's no way where I'm cooking beyond the podium. He has no experience.

This is not a race for him. Proof me wrong. I'm still, he was the best. There was no discussion. And then he, a little bit of, you know, disappointment in performance wise.

In Leasbaton Leach, where he was definitely no match for today and for success. But not a great performance, but he got away with third, third place. He fought back and he sprinted very dominantly to third. And then surprisingly, he and the team make the decision that he's, not an eraser anymore. He didn't race for 64 days before the two in the France.

And, you know, they must have been doing something right. Because he showed up in great shape, lighter than before. And now, I mean, started the tour. It was not definitely at the beginning of the tour. It was not in the form he is now.

So he, he built up. And he said today that, you know, he needed like, he needed the first week to get back and to the rhythm. And so it looks like, looks like they knew what they were doing, man. And of course, you know, he had all the circumstances in his favor now also. But there he is in second place in great form, great morale.

“And, yeah, I mean, I think Remko is one of those writers.”

And, you know, sometimes I think he kind of, you know,

he leads people on to be critical because of certain, you know, declarations or interviews.

But what a writer, man. What a Paul Morris. If you look at what he has accomplished until now. And he's still not an old writer. I think it's his seven or his eight year professional, no.

But he's still young. He, I guess, too, in an era where if you think about it, the top writers on this never miss, you know, Jonas doesn't win all the time, but he's always good. And Remko is this rare writer like he could lose 20 minutes at this race.

And we wouldn't be that shocked.

He's always on the edge.

You never know what's going to happen.

I would say, I do think he's going to get second in that super impressive. Yeah.

“The one stage I think will test him is stage 20.”

I didn't quite realize how hard this stage was until I went through the. It's incredibly hard. It's incredibly hard. I mean, this, you know, what did they do the, they do the the telegraph is CBA. So they start. No, they do the the crowd of fair crowd of fair.

Yeah, yes, but a fair telegraph, Galibia and then. All the rest from from the saran side. So which is hard. And then there's what is it like 5,000 meters of climbing more. And I didn't realize that Galibia is high man 26, 31 meters.

Yeah, I mean, it's always the, it's almost always the roof of the tour. Yeah, that is. And you're going from these valley floors are not that high. So that's a lot of climbing. If he makes it through that, it's super impressive. You think even just mathematics without light.

He is in the power he can put out. He should be fine, especially with.

“You know, I think I think at this point, and especially in the third week, you know, it's a different.”

It's a survival race now. Okay. So nobody is except for they can still do whatever he wants, because he's been doing some stages where he didn't go full gas. But everybody else is in survival mode. There are, this is their limit and they know where they can go. And there's not, there's not like there's no accelerations anymore.

That's, so Ramko at this point, even if he gets in trouble, he's gotten a really, really good at riding his pace. And that pace is still very high and won't lose a lot of time. You know, compared to obviously also riders who are also super tired. You know, I mean, like the performance of sexists and their total,

which our main ride for the podium, is also not fresh anymore. Right? And said, they're also getting tired. So I think Ramko can stay in second. I tend to agree. I think it's style of riding is perfect for holding second. Do you think he's going to drop a Gacha on when the two are friends in the third week?

Absolutely not. No chance. Okay. Zero percent chance. So now that we've established that, was the money worth it for Red Bull? We have to revisit this question.

We did, we did question that decision, right?

And you know, you never know,

you never know how it's going to turn out. I would say for the moment that's, you know, I mean, if he's second in the tour and wins two stages, definitely, you know, the best possible transfer that was available on the market. I would say in terms of results, because who else were they going to sign if it was not,

it was not today. You know, the total is at best going to be third, I think. And when the white jersey may be, if he keeps ace us in front of him, that was the only other rider. I would say attractive rider and potential.

I guess I want to do so. No, no, it's not, it's not. I used to definitely not the same category rider as a brand. But he, he was like available, right? Yeah, I could have spent a lot of that.

Yeah. I mean, there you could also question, you know, that transfer, you know, I mean, if the rumors are true, I mean,

and see even see even the more expensive transfer, because apparently it was 10 million,

they paid. I don't know if it's true, actually. I mean, I, I really struggle to believe that's true. But, you know, still, when I used to for the moment is sitting in fifth place.

You know, we said a few times a few days ago that, you know, being in the top five to top 10, you have to be a good, really good, background of being top five in the tour. I mean, look at all the competition, you know, I mean, that's definitely the best possible place for our use of,

you know, if you look Pogacha Rambcoev in the pool del Toro and sex sauce, these guys are better than him, end of the story. Yeah. And we should say, I still know if it's worth it, but if he gets second, if he gets second, as we said, he could win because you're in second,

if something happens, you could win. So maybe it is worth it. Also, Red Bull would be in a bit of trouble if not for Rambco right now. If Lipwood's crashes out and that's all on your eggs or in the lipwood's basket, yeah, it's huge to have a second leader.

“That's what that's what happens to Vispon right now, right?”

Yep. So, I mean, plus plus also, I mean, another added factor to the transfer of Rambco, even if I still think it's extremely expensive. But, you know, if he gets second now in the tour, you could say, you know what, you know, it's worth it.

We can build on that, you know, as a strong leader, but also as a personality, he is quite outspoken and he doesn't leave anybody in different. You can do something as a brand with the name Rambco, even a poor, with the personality,

There are not many really good cyclists that are super marketable. That's true.

For example, I don't know the guy, he never spoke with the him,

Florian Lipowitz, he's a good bike rider. It's completely the opposite.

“There's nothing marketable there except good performances, right?”

And German. And he's German, yeah. Yeah, that's a very good example. I would even say that, I mean, as a whole package, in terms of marketability,

I would dare to say, and I don't think I'm mistaken, that Rambco, even a poor, for a sponsor, is a lot more attractive than you and I think you are. Yeah, I think you are right, probably, because it's not in different personalities, right?

But, and there you go. It's just, I think I would prefer Rambco to be my spokesperson and promoter and ambassador than Jonas. Who would you rather be the director of? I mean, I'd love to be the director of Rambco,

but I don't know if, I don't know if you would listen. I don't think so.

“Yeah, I think he honest, I don't think he would.”

I don't think he would take any of any. I don't know, I don't know. I mean, seems that they have, you know, the right people around him. He's very happy with the staff. He's very happy with the coaching, the trainers, the engineers.

They have a really incredible resources to put people around a project.

And today he was very appreciative and grateful towards the team and the staff. So I think he's super happy. And how would you rate Tadipagatra's performance today? I did expect it this size. I mean, I said 30 seconds.

I think he, I mean, I think he was, I mean, I did not expect him to win against Rambco. But, yeah, very solid. Didn't need to do anything, anything else. You know, if it would be one minute, for example, I'd say,

you know, not a great performance. He would still have been second in the race. It's crazy in today's stage. But I think he did a really good time trial. And I mean, he was solid.

You know, obviously, for sure, Rambco took more risks than today. For sure. Just that corner, that specific corner where Lipwitz crashed. Rambco must also have had the information. But if you see the difference in speed, I mean,

today came out of that corner like almost standing still. You know, he had to break and correct and try to stay upright. So that was a bit of a scary moment.

Although I have to say Spencer, it always looks a lot scary when you look at it.

I'm sure that today was like, OK, shit. That was, that was not good, but just, you know, get going on.

“It's a very good point, but you should also say, so he's 14 seconds down at the top of the climb at the T2.”

So his land said it makes sense. Said he would say, well, I'm not going to make up 14 seconds on Rambco. I'm mind as well. Just limit. Just be safe.

Finish 20 seconds back. That's, I think, a great ride. Just to give you a feeling for how far ahead Rambco and Pugachar. So they were 50, Pugachar was 52 seconds ahead of success in Del Toro. Who had the same time at the top of the climb, by the way.

But he was 52 seconds faster than them. Like that's pretty impressive at the midway point. On a climb down, on a climb. On a climb. So, and I think we've seen maybe Rambco is a very good time trial climber for reasons unknown.

It doesn't totally transfer over to the road. But like, I think that these are the bubbles we are starting to see. Pugachar and have an Ebola probably close shish to each other. And then you have the next bubbleback is success in Del Toro. And then the bubble behind them is I use so it's the little check guys.

I use so shish comes. Even though scum as it was really good today in the climb. But the day that was, the scale most did a really, really good time trial today. And really. And also success.

But especially also Del Toro. I expected that Toro to lose more time on success. And he only lost five seconds. Because Del Toro is, you know, it's a strong rider. He's not known to be a really, really good time trialist.

And he did really well. And he looked good on the bike and was very solid. You know, so Del Toro did a great ride today. But it's just one of the only time trials I've ever watched where I'm like, "Everybody did great.

Everybody did great.

But pretty good ride actually. I used to didn't do it with time trial. No.

“No. He's 222 back and then the issue he's having is he's not as a good of a climber.”

There's a lot of these guys. So if you're any time in the time trial. He lost a minute, a minute, 20 on on his teammates kill Moza. And a minute on success and the Toro. So that's too much.

Not great at all. But you know, on how are these guys? These guys who are, they're flying on the bikes. Is there something they could be doing? Some sort of supplement.

They could be helping to go so fast. Definitely. That's, I mean, they all, they all, all the two the France riders are, we, it's very well documented. They can keep on.

So we are lucky to have Keaton 8 as a new sponsor of the podcast.

Keaton 8 was one of the first companies to put a pure Keaton Esther on the market.

It's very well known by the professional riders. You know, it's great to have him finally as a efficient sponsor on the, on the podcast, but it's something that I've known. It's a brand that I've known for the last five, six years. I have recommended it to certain people and teams.

They are also the official team sponsor of Sudok. Quickstep and XDS Estana two teams that are using it. In this two different, so last year, I don't know what Red Bull is using now. They have not been public about it, but last year,

the Remko was on Keaton 8, the little bottle that you see. Very often after the finish, so you just pay some in. This is a little bottle is 25 grams of pure Keaton Esther. So you can just take a little sip. This has 10 servings by the way.

So you can use the, I mean, professional riders obviously use more, more quantity of Keaton Esther.

“But so this is an Esther. This is very, very important to know the difference between Keaton Esther”

and many other products that are in the market and sometimes very popular. There are either Keaton salts or Keaton dials, which don't work as good as the Keaton Esther. Now, there's also a part of Keaton's. There's also, if you've seen Spencer, there's a lot of talks about this new gel that riders and teams are using the lactate gel. I've done some research. I've asked Keaton 8.

So Keaton 8 is actually working on producing one of those lactate products.

But you hear this first here, it's not on the market yet, it's coming.

This is going to be a lactate Esther. So it's not nothing compared to the same thing, lactate salts are now also being used or, you know, not as effective, it has limitations. The intake is more different and more difficult. So there is a lactate Esther coming. You heard this here first. Anyways, so for our, the move listeners and viewers, there's a special action during the tour de France.

You go to ketone8.com or you scan the flow code here on the screen. And you use the code to move a checkout for 15% off until the end of the tour de France. 15% off for at ketone8.com/demove. I mean, everyone's using these lactate gels. Now, these guys going under two hours in the marathon.

And apparently a lot of other sea, we'll see what the science is, but apparently it's the same, same difference with, as with the ketone. There is there are ketone salts and dials with these lactate gels, it's the same thing. So apparently it also needs to be an Esther, which is pure concentration of lactate and the study showed that you can apparently use more energy and more glucose. Can you take these lactate supplements? Fascinating stuff.

Someone who probably forgot their ketone esters this morning. Why do you so? We mentioned these is 222 in the race. This is pretty stunning. You said this fact earlier.

So one of you says fifth overall in the tour.

Third in the white jersey classification and kind of out of it at 231 back.

Have you ever seen anything like this? This is what we're seeing in this modern cycling. You know, so third and fourth and fifth are in competition for the white jersey. And all of them are extremely young. You know, there's none of these who are over 23.

No. He's 23. Well, he's 23. He just turned 23. Okay, okay.

“So, you know, I mean, it's for the moment it's 125, right?”

The limit for the.

Two years left. Yeah.

I mean, last year, Remko was still in the running for the white jersey, by the way.

I mean, two years ago, Tate won it. Yeah. What do they want it like four times, no? In the road or something? Oh, I mean, he must have wanted every year between 2020 and 2024.

Yeah. So five times. Yeah. Yeah. Do you run over the last fresh rider to win?

The last fresh rider to win the white jersey is a tricky little question here. The last French rider to win the white jersey. Uh. Shh. Shh.

“I think I know, but I forgot his name now.”

Is it your guess too? Yeah. Yeah. 2018. And you know who he'd be?

Yeah, a lot to her. He'd be. He can burn all. He can burn all. He can burn all.

He can burn all. Who won the tour the next year? Oh, wow. Okay. Like, what the heck happened to pier the tour?

Yeah. Yeah.

To come back on Remko, Spencer, and his amazing track records.

Uh, I've seen a stats somewhere. Um. If you take out team time trials and pure uphill time trials. For example, last year's time trial in the tour was, you know, to pay a good. That was more amount in stage in a time trial, right?

Same thing with the Monaco one or he can't even Monica the nieces amount in time trial. Yes. Yes. Yes. So take those out.

The pure time trials. Remko has won 19 of the 19 last individual pure time trials in his career. Crazy. 19 times. Yeah.

Well, I set on the shows.

“Like, can you guys remember the last time he didn't win a time trial?”

And if you thought you were the right, but if you filter out those amount ones. Yeah. It is a long time ago. A long time ago. Yeah.

Have we ever seen anyone this dominant?

Like was my gal under in like this? No. I mean, it was different. It was different. Um, I mean, and also Miguel was more of, you know, pure to the France rider, you know,

and so it is. Yeah. Yeah. The time trials were 50 or 60 kilometers. You know, not the same sport.

I remember Miguel losing time to us in other races. So sometimes even in the zero, he sometimes he won the time trial. Sometimes he didn't win the time trial. Um, no, that's not that's different. I mean, Remko is a pure pure time trialist, you know, that position.

I mean, Miguel was the strongest guy, but his position was just awful. I mean, imagine that guy would have had a good aerodynamic time trial position. That was, would have been crazy. Well, same thing with the honor. We went through some of his pictures.

Yeah. Man, I mean, Remko's position is unbelievable. Just to be a fraction. It's, it's, it's perfection. It's, it's, it's, it's as close as the perfection as it can be.

Yes. Which, you know, then you look, for example, Taday has improved a lot. Uh, the Toro also has been, I mean, they obviously worked a lot on it. But it's not as perfect as a rampals position.

Well, that's the difference. Those guys are improving and working on positions that you would say were almost quite poor. But Remko just naturally, it's perfect. Because his body can get in, because anyone can, like, get aeros, right? But can you produce power and staying in position?

Yeah. But I know how much work do you put in, how obsessed are you about it? I mean, Remko is obsessed about, I mean, I don't, I don't think, Yeah, he does have the best position, but I, I would dare to say that there's nobody in the peloton who has worked so hard on the time drop position.

That's why he's the best. I mean, then if you have the power, if you can produce that power in that position, you're unbeatable.

“And there you go, folks, that's all you have to do.”

Just work hard. Your position. Well, you know, let's take a, let's take a quick break. And then I have a question for you about some jerseys. And then we can preview tomorrow stage.

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Prescription required, see website for full details, restrictions, and important safety information. Individual results may vary based on studies of topical and oral monoxidil and finasteride. So Yohan, we are back. You pointed this out to me before we started the show. So UAE, probably going to win the overall.

They could win KOM with Tate Pagachar. I think he will accidentally win this. They could win youth with Del Toro. And today, they're now within 23 seconds of the team's classification. Are they going for this? Is this a surprise?

Yeah, it's clear. It's obvious Spencer, otherwise they would not care. Of course, they had Pagachar and Del Toro doing a great time.

But they, on purpose, had the third guy go full gas, which normally would be

not necessary. Which I've seen these interviews of Tim Wellens and Julia Vermeer, who said probably that they would love to be on the podium at the Tour de France with team. I mean, especially with the stages we still have ahead.

“I mean, it's little trekking in the lead now, right?”

So tomorrow's going to be a tricky stage for that because if there's a breakaway, little trek is going to have several riders in there. So UAE would have to have several riders also otherwise they can take a long time. But they definitely go for team GC, which now starts to make sense when we go back to when we question certain actions of UAE, why are they riding so hard?

Why are they keeping it so close? First they say, "Hi, it's just to stay together." But then these interviews of Frodo Vermeer and Tim Wellens were quite revealing that they were going for team GC. And I actually also saw one rider, I don't remember who it was.

I think it was a guy from Jacob. When he was asked the question, it was a stage seven or eight that I'll remember. Why did UAE say, "Hey, it's very simple, Team GC." So UAE is a strong team. You can say the strongest team in the race.

That brings me into a question. I have for you. From both, let's do the reader question. Listener question and then I'm going to add to it with the question somebody else asked me. So this question is, with vinegar dropping out,

there's no one on Taday's level and they said even with him in the race. There's probably no one on Taday's level. Hypothetically, if the other seven riders on UAE had some American lettuce and had to drop out of the race, could Taday still win on his own. How many teammates does he really need?

Because if he's working for Del Toro, he clearly doesn't need all seven. Do you think he could win this with no teammates? By himself, it would be a big challenge. I'm going to say difficult, but then again. Would it be a challenge?

Well, you want to just be close to everybody? Well, especially with the hard stages, his best strategy would be okay.

“I'm just going to go hard on the first climb and that it's just the race between five or six guys, right?”

You're rolling. If you're controlling that, five more stages without any teammate, that's not easy. Because they would like juicy guys we get in the early break away. Is that the concern? Well, I mean, it also changes because now for example, if lip of its would still be in the race,

and Red Bull has two guys, it's not easy, but still, it's still doable.

he could use certain dynamics that are proper to the two of the friends, because everything in the last week becomes so important, you know, top 10, top 5.

Well, that there would always be somebody coming to the rescue to defend their position.

Well, what we see normally even when he has a team, we see that sometimes they don't have to work, because there's a guy like Pogache's in the break and plates the seventh spot is only threat, for example. And by the end comes to the front, right? For example. So, things like that could be used to do his advantage. I mean, one thing is for sure, Hunter, he would not win Team GC.

[laughter] And somebody else asked me, they're like, "Well, why doesn't Red Bull decathlon little track all team up on him?" But it's because of what you just said, A, A, they're not going to do that. They're just not going to do it, because they are competing against each other,

but now you have decathlon and Red Bull are competing against each other and little for the podium. And then that's more important than Pogacheer, because Pogacheer is untouchable in the mountains, what's even the point.

“So, I think if he had no teammates tomorrow,”

he almost would not affect him, because he just would follow Red Bull. Yeah, because they're going to control the race. And he's still followed two guys, two guys.

You know, so basically, Ramco and six us, because the total would be alt, right?

Yeah. So, it would not matter. Because the thing is also that all the other guys can't win anymore anyways. And Ramco and six us are going to race against each other. So, these teams cannot win with somebody else. They only only have one car to play.

So, he could still win it. Yeah. I mean, also, too, but just imagine Lippewitz and Ramco are both in this race. Okay, let's say Lippewitz gets in the breakaway. But then when Pogacheer just jumped, he would just bridge across the gap, right?

Yeah, there's not many. There's not many guys to supervise, you know, so... Yeah. But let's say he goes in. It would be interesting, actually.

It would actually be, they should think about implementing this. Let's say Lippewitz takes the takes 10 minutes and then what he's up by two minutes, three minutes. So, stage 20 rolls around. It starts on an HC climb, 24k long. If Pogacheer really wanted to, he could have it whittled down to just himself

by the top of the colded aquafer. And then he's doing the Galibia, the telegraph, the Galibia, and up to out to us.

“He could put 10 minutes into someone like Lippewitz, right?”

Especially when Lippewitz had been in the breakaway. No, really. Not really. I don't know, man. It's a bit too much of a playstation theory that's Spencer.

Do you think if Pogacheer was mandimanding us these guys? I think he would. Yeah, I think it would be ugly. No, he wouldn't put 10 minutes in. No, 10 minutes.

No, I don't. He's putting him, he put a minute into these guys on stage. What was that on stage? 14. He attacked one cave from the top and he put a minute into them.

I don't know. Like, think about stage six. He puts how much time does he put? He puts three minutes in these guys. You know, that's not even a really hard funnel climb.

Like, 10 minutes is a lot, but you wouldn't want to see him. I don't think that's wrong with him having to see him. If he by himself, he could still win.

“I think you're better off with him having a team, actually.”

Because I mean, it's not going to take. Here's my next question. There with Remco del Toro, it's del Toro, Pagachar, Remco. Remco drops del Toro. What does Pagachar do?

Is he a full-on domestic at this point? To see stay with del Toro. If Remco drops del Toro, Pagachar stays with Remco. There's no way, he waits for del Toro.

No way. Johan, Johan, you. I mean, I would say no way, you stay with number two, man. Come on. That's enough of this bullshit, you know?

If I wasn't working at Lequi, but I'd be cooking up. I'd be sharpening the knives. I'd be ready for this, because then you can say, look at this terrible teammate. He's awful. He left del Toro on his own.

Does he care? He showed already enough loyalty and, and, you know, favor, favor's to, you know, I mean, as long as there's nothing happening, I think. I mean, if you look at it now, the situation for del Toro, is actually not too bad, because if Remco wants to,

first of all, Pagachar doesn't have to attack at all, okay?

He probably will. I hope so, but he doesn't have to. So, basically, the race is Remco. And if Remco is feeling good and he sets a tempo, that's good for del Toro.

Preserve his third place and his white jersey. Yeah, just like stay with Remco.

He's never going to change space.

Like they hear you guy. But, yeah, I don't know. The media, like, if when you work in the media, though, your mind isn't what makes sense. What should the writers do?

It's what can I write? That's that will get people interested.

“And I can basically, can I warp reality to what I want to be with my right?”

And so, I would be exploring the possibility of, like, now that Pagachar has, it's a really weird situation, which should say, because Johan, what is Pagachar getting out of this situation? Del Toro is not really working for him. How many minutes has he pulled for him?

Two minutes in this entire race? And Pagachar pulled for... No, no, no, no, no.

Del Toro, I think the second.

Yeah, the second. Thirty seconds. So on Turumale, no, that's it. Yeah. Yeah, and so, well, exactly.

What exactly has... Well, I guess he pulled back the attacks on stage two. So, let's talk at, let's say a minute, a minute total. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

“On the last climb, he also did the lead out.”

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. What's he getting out of this? Well, I mean, it's, listen, it's great for the team atmosphere. They get a long, really well.

They have the same agent. For Pagachar, it's great to keep this young upcoming talent super happy. Yeah. Because he will still need him for a few years. So, I think it's fine.

I think it's fine, you know. But I don't expect if the Toro cannot follow Ramco, there is no way that Pagachar is going to wait for the Toro. If you're leading and the number two goes ahead, you stay with the number two. That's the mean, it's very, I mean, that's the one or one, you know.

I want to see it. I want to see him hang him back, working for Del Toro. So, stage 17 tomorrow. Hundreds, that is a really weird stage. 175 K long.

Four categorized four categorized climbs in the first 60 kilometers. Then a long, hilly, bumpy stage, like they start in Shambari. They do a loop, end up back in Shambari with around a hundred K to go. And then they go out. And then the countryside rolling bumps sprint point 147 K into the race,

which could be really important. And then there's a finish, but there's a climb. 2.5 K at 4% that tops out around 4K from the finish line. How does this stage play out? Is this breakaway?

What is this? It's a tricky one, Spencer. You would say normally this is ideal terrain for a breakaway. I mean, this three, four category climbs. And then one third category climbs.

So this is at the beginning. So that's ideal terrain for groups. It's going to be very aggressive during the first 50 kilometers. I would say at the first 50 K, the first, yeah, 50 at 9K. To be in the break.

Add to that that little track will want a breakaway up the road with much better than in it. Or if he can't be in it, some other teammates in it. Because their main goal is the green jersey.

Tomorrow is a crucial day for the green jersey.

If much better than tomorrow gets that sprint, which comes very late in the race, actually, after 147 kilometers. If tomorrow much better than the break and gets that sprint, you would think that normally on that terrain in the first 50 K, it's in favor of much better than to be able to be in the break.

And normally both Philipsen and Gira Mai will struggle to be in the break. They will try to be in it, but they will struggle. So then it's just a question of how can... Opposite and NSN get organized.

“Can they keep the guys together and bring the breakaway back?”

It's going to be an interesting stage. Now, I would say, normally it's a breakaway stage, especially because we're now in week 3. 85% of the Peloton is cooked, really dead, and also has no more goal, other than getting to Paris.

Now, the teams, of course, the team directors will have plans. And it's one of the last stages left to be in the break, and try to have a stage victory. So it will be difficult at the same time having a break go up the road. It's also difficult to be in there.

and this is almost the same stage as last year's tour of Spain.

“Finished in the same town, similar final,”

and also the beginning of the stage was hilly, but it was actually a harder stage.

They did three climbs, one third cutting climb,

and two second cut with climbs. They did a motion ever, and called a lotare, which is the back side of the Galibier. And that stage had 3,000 meters of climbing. Tomorrow's stage only has 2,300 meters of climbing,

and stage 4, but it was stage 4, so the first week. It was a bunch of friends. One by Ben Turner. The second was Jasper Phillips. So I would say, I don't know.

I would say advantage break away because it's in week 3, and there's not enough resources left for teams to get organized and to bring it back. But very similar stage, actually harder stage, same final stage for last year was the break away in the Volta Spania.

Also, Volta Spania into the France, it's not the same. It's a different, different competition. What happened? It could go both ways. It takes a long time for the break to form.

They get back to Shambari.

There's no break. With the Sprinter's teams, they can't, I mean, this is probably their last chance.

“Would they go all out to control it and it's a sprint?”

I think, for example, Alpsen will definitely, and even NSN, I think they will. I think they will. I think they will. And a stana.

And a stana. A stana is probably. Yeah, yeah. It's tricky. So, and if you, this is going to, this can blow your mind.

These odds. So if you want to bet on this, we have a deal with next bets to go to nxtbetts.com/betoutcums. You'll see exactly where you can bet the best prices. For example, actually, there's a really interesting one.

margin of victory. We can sort through here. 3 to 5 minutes is plus 130. 5 to 7 minutes plus 133. I kind of like that one.

I don't think it's going to be more. Is that for GC? Yeah, for final GC. I don't think it's going to. It's going to, in fact, to 7.

You don't think more than 7, right? That's minus 15. Could be. Could be. Yeah.

Yeah, could be. I could see five to seven here. So, well, I mean, there's two stages where I forgot child will take more time. So, yeah.

It would be what he takes a minute each stage. We're pushing up to seven already. That's the problem. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. That is an issue. You still have sparrows. You still have sparrows. But I don't think I don't think that booger can.

We'll drop Remko on on the Paris stage. Well, what if Remko sits up? What if they neutralize the time again? They're not going to neutralize it. If it's not okay.

If it doesn't rain, if it doesn't rain, they're not going to neutralize it. And Remko has won the Olympic Games there on that circuit. True, I'll raise that. Okay. All right.

And this year also, I mean, we're going to talk about it the day before. But this year, the course is different. The climb is further from the finish.

“It's 12k, whereas last year, I think it was five or six k from the finish.”

Yeah. Yeah. So, there are people who say that bunch print is not impossible. Yeah. Yeah.

No. Or some sprinters might make over it. Might make it over to over. Yeah. More of a classic style.

Yeah. Probably not a bunch sprint. Because you can't get your lead out. That's so narrow. You can't get your lead out over that thing.

No. Right? Yeah. I still don't think the sprinters are making it. Because the GC guys are going to go for it.

Yes. Okay. So, if I click through to the stage, stage 17, these are the odds and draftings. Mads Patterson plus 350 makes sense. Second place.

Jasper Phillips and plus 450. Oh, of course, plus 650. Matthew Vanderpool plus 650. Benjamin and my plus 1400. Flipogana plus 2200.

Quinn Simmons plus 2800. So, the book thinks it's a mix of bunch sprint or breakaway.

I mean, the fact that soon it's in the second favorite.

That means that break that that. I mean, Phillips can also be in the break, you know. But who would work with them? A bunch sprint is not is not impossible. I kind of think it's going to be bunch sprint.

And why I look at this.

I'm going to take Matthew on the board, man. Plus 650.

“I think that would be more likely than I just can't imagine.”

If Phillips isn't a breakaway, he might as well just sit upright. What have we been here? I don't know if I'd want to work with him to take him to the line. I'm going to go. I'm going to go.

I can't believe I'm doing this. Quinn Simmons plus 200. Quinn Simmons from the breakaway. Mm-hmm. Over Vanderpool.

I mean, realistically Vanderpool probably wins that duel. But just with the price, Quinn Simmons plus 200. But if you really think about stage 15, how strong he was, he might be one of the strongest riders in this race. He's in great interest.

He's on incredible good form.

Today, look at these young purpose. So because who was the third guy from Little Trek who went fast today then? Because they had to have three guys to go fast. Let's see. It's a good question, actually.

Little Trek. They had Derek G. Derek G.

“That's why you're bringing them for these days when you need it.”

You see guys in a sound trial. But like Quinn Simmons, what I don't like about this, he probably went quite fast. Because he finishes 47th on the day. Hmm. But like he didn't even like he was pushing it.

Maybe we like where is Vanderpool? You know who would like to say something? 96. That's what I want to see. Yep.

That's a guy who's getting ready to win the stage tomorrow. Interesting. Okay. So I'm going to go Quinn Simmons, you go Vanderpool. And are we ready for Ventum Trivia?

Yeah. Bring it on. Alright. Well, if you want to play, go to VentumRacing.com/TheMove. Enter your answer there and you'll be entered to win.

$5,000 toward a bike if your choice could be an NS1. The road bike just brand new redesign that GS1, the gravel bike, also been redesigned. It takes massive tires now. But it is also light and fast like a road bike. So VentumRacing.com/TheMove to play that.

So the last question we had was who won on the summit finish at the tour of Verna, Roan Alps, just a few weeks before the tour. The summit finish we had on Sunday, Stage 15. And the answer was Ezek Del Toro. Interestingly, he rode quite a bit faster on the tour, did not win.

And looked like he was in trouble.

But that was basically our eyes lying to us because he was almost a minute faster than he was,

at the Dofen A, when he won the, when the overall on won the race. So it shows you how much the tour is at a higher level than these other races. Yeah. So today's question is Stage 16 was an individual time trial, Bradley Wiggins. One of the best of all time.

One, the 2012 tour of France. And then went on to win the Olympic gold in the time trial, just a couple days later. What made that feat historically unique? So if you know the answer to that, go to VentumRacing.com/TheMove and enter your answer. You can also use code the move 10 for 10% off while you're there to buy anything you want.

Do you know the answer you want? Don't say it, but do you know it? Hmm. I didn't know it until I saw this. So he won the time trial.

And the tour, what was it? Or he won the tour and the Olympic time trial. Why is that unique? To win the tour of France and the Olympic time trial in the same year. But it's Bradley pointed out.

Yeah. For a prose could not contest the Olympics until 1996, which I also kind of forgot about. But anything else you'll have before we take off?

You know who was the first professional rider who had to win the Olympic.

And trial. Miguel Andrane, right? Yeah. Atlanta. Yeah.

“Did Frankie and Jerry or something finish on the podium of that road race?”

I think you remember that, right? For fourth. I think. Yeah. The podium was Pascal Rishard, Machiaburi and Wolf Sernson.

Man, Machiaburi. That was a big result. Holy smokes. Jeez. Pascal Rishard is from Switzerland, correct?

Yeah. Yeah. Man, the Atlanta Olympics were big for cycling. The first. And it was Barcelona.

It was Amateurs. The cyclophony too. Yeah. Yeah. All right.

Well, we will speak tomorrow, Johan. And have a good evening. [BLANK_AUDIO]